Author Topic: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)  (Read 74273 times)

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Offline Thucydides

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #925 on: July 15, 2017, 00:47:16 »
The Clinton campaign and the Democrats in general have left questions of epic proportions about everything from finances to domestic spying to just how the Federal bureaucracy has been politicized, so yes, it is of interest.

And bringing up the popular vote thing is like suggesting Wayne Gretzky was a great hockey player because of his RBI stats; it is a meaningless metric given how US elections are structured. But even that argument may fall apart, just looking at the irregularities uncovered when the Green Party managed to get recounts in 3 State and extrapolating across the United States suggests that Hillary may not have even won the popular vote.

Since the Dems refuse to accept the outcome of the election, one of the consequences is their actions keep coming to the surface for everyone to see.
Dagny, this is not a battle over material goods. It's a moral crisis, the greatest the world has ever faced and the last. Our age is the climax of centuries of evil. We must put an end to it, once and for all, or perish - we, the men of the mind. It was our own guilt. We produced the wealth of the world - but we let our enemies write its moral code.

Offline mariomike

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #926 on: July 15, 2017, 21:58:26 »
Since the Dems refuse to accept the outcome of the election, one of the consequences is their actions keep coming to the surface for everyone to see.

"Trump repeatedly refused to say that he would accept the result of the election."
"I will look at it at the time." "What I'm saying is that I will tell you at the time. I'll keep you in suspense,"
https://www.google.ca/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=asdqWZ_0NIGR8Qeg8KywCA&gws_rd=ssl#q=+%22look+at+it+at+the+time%22+%22keep+you+in+suspense%22&spf=1500170090438

“I would like to promise and pledge, to all of my voters and supporters and to all of the people of the United States, that I will totally accept the results of this great and historic presidential election — if I win,”
https://www.google.ca/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=yMRqWcbAD4yR8Qfd95PYDg&gws_rd=ssl#q=I+would+like+to+promise+and+pledge,+to+all+of+my+voters+and+supporters+and+to+all+of+the+people+of+the+United+States,+that+I+will+totally+accept+the+results+of+this+great+and+historic+presidential+election+%E2%80%94+if+I+win&spf=1500169415796

This 129 page thread is open for discussion of the 2016 US election,   
https://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=108210.2825

This  thread is for discussion of US politics in 2017.

« Last Edit: July 15, 2017, 22:51:53 by mariomike »
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Offline Thucydides

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #927 on: July 16, 2017, 00:31:49 »
Actions, however, speak far louder than words.
Dagny, this is not a battle over material goods. It's a moral crisis, the greatest the world has ever faced and the last. Our age is the climax of centuries of evil. We must put an end to it, once and for all, or perish - we, the men of the mind. It was our own guilt. We produced the wealth of the world - but we let our enemies write its moral code.

Offline mariomike

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« Last Edit: July 16, 2017, 12:09:05 by mariomike »
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Offline Rifleman62

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #929 on: July 16, 2017, 12:11:04 »
Pres Trump has stepped in it of course. When the MSM devotes the majority of its newscasts/print to relentlessly denigrating  him, not even PM Trudeau could possibly get a decent approval rating.
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Offline Loachman

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #930 on: July 16, 2017, 12:26:52 »
They are reflected in approval ratings,

The approval ratings are brought to you by the same people who produced all of the polls and predictions that he would never win the Republican nomination, and had almost no chance of winning the Presidency.

The vast bulk of the lamestream media is little more than a Democrat propaganda arm.

Offline jmt18325

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #931 on: July 16, 2017, 12:39:24 »
Pres Trump has stepped in it of course. When the MSM devotes the majority of its newscasts/print to relentlessly denigrating  him, not even PM Trudeau could possibly get a decent approval rating.

He denigrates himself.  The 'MSM' just report it.

Offline QV

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #932 on: July 16, 2017, 14:18:17 »
It is obvious to enough people the bulk of MSM are alarmingly bias.  Everyday this is demonstrated.  It is undemocratic and everyone should be seriously concerned. 




Offline SeaKingTacco

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #933 on: July 16, 2017, 14:26:07 »
What has democracy got to do with selling newspapers? It is a business. Period.

Media companies will print what sells ads. The "truth" or "defending democracy" has never been the primary consideration.



Offline QV

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #934 on: July 16, 2017, 14:39:35 »
Freedom of the press is protected in the constitution.  Therefore it shouldn't favour anyone person/party/government etc.  A free and unbiased press is essential to a western democracy.

The alternative is propaganda.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2017, 15:08:03 by QV »

Offline Loachman

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #935 on: July 16, 2017, 15:53:07 »
I watch a few online sources for decent coverage and interpretation, and much greater detail than one will find in any MSM coverage.

The Still Report https://www.youtube.com/user/bstill3/videos is very reliable. "Bill Still is a former newspaper editor and publisher. He has written for USA Today, The Saturday Evening Post, the Los Angeles Times Syndicate, OMNI magazine, and has also produced the syndicated radio program, Health News. He has written 22 books and two documentary videos and is the host of his wildly popular daily YouTube Channel the "Still Report", the quintessential report on the economy and Washington." He has a plain, no-frills style and, on the rare occasion where he gets something wrong, comes out and says so and why. He is a Republican and Donald Trump supporter, and was extremely accurate with commentary and predictions during the recent US election. He has large network of contacts and sources built up over many years of journalism.

Mark Steyn https://www.steynonline.com/

HA Goodman https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDB5XReUyyqt-FTNdkzFN-A/videos is a "progressive", supported Jill Stein and subsequently Bernie Sanders in the last US election, still believes that Bernie Sanders could have beaten Donald Trump, states regularly that Clinton was unelectable and says why, and points out the errors of both and details the Clinton crimes.

Scott Adams, creator of Dilbert https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-W_DvNZoIW1433DrLBQHUQ/videos. Scott Adams talks about Presidential approval https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ft1FV58D0Y. Dilbert Creator Scott Adams on Predicting Trump Winning in a Landslide https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-sBO6OppAc.

Tipping Point With Liz Wheeler on OAN https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMfKNuYXBc9bxb0fg2cGTBg/videos has some good material and commentary, but presentation (while scenic) can be overhyped and I've picked out a few inaccuracies.

Mark Dice https://www.youtube.com/user/MarkDice/videos is entertaining and enjoys skewering liberals and left-leaning media.

Steven Crowder https://www.youtube.com/user/StevenCrowder/videos is also very entertaining but also puts a lot of effort into some very good investigations, such as https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lq4WBOkFNtE

Tucker Carlson and Sean Hannity of Fox News on various Youtube channels.

I will occasionally look at some other pro-Republican/pro-Donald Trump sites, but most have more fluff and/or hype than solid content or are too whacko/conspiracy-theory-oriented.

I will still occasionally look at left-leaning sites just as I read loads of Soviet propaganda during the Cold War in order to understand my opponent, but both could/can only be taken in small doses and are normally wrong. There is some unintentional humour on those sites, however.

The MSM in the US are far more biased than the MSM here. Democrat shortcomings, mistakes, and crimes are glossed-over, ignored, or covered-up, yet they blow every minor Republican/Donald Trump error out of proportion, leap on every blatant falsehood such as the shabby "dossier" that claimed that Donald Trump hired hookers to urinate on a bed in a hotel in Russia in which the Obamas supposedly slept, invent BS, deliberately misrepresent and deceive, and are consistently wrong. CNN's audience has shrunk considerably.

Offline FJAG

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #936 on: July 16, 2017, 16:14:14 »
Freedom of the press is protected in the constitution.  Therefore it shouldn't favour anyone person/party/government etc.  A free and unbiased press is essential to a western democracy.

The alternative is propaganda.

Freedom means freedom regardless of whether it favours someone or even if it is propaganda.

I can't think of a time in US history (going right back to the revolution) where the press wasn't biased in favour of one side or cause in matters of political reporting. It's always been a matter of degrees.

The point is that we must assume that we are getting biased views and therefore read widely and make our own opinions based on the internal logic that is present or missing in the various reports. The trouble is that most people come with preconceptions and gravitate only to the viewpoints that they favour. This is why I force myself to read Fox as much as I read CNN as well as BBC, Spiegel and other foreign reports on North American events.

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Offline Brad Sallows

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #937 on: July 16, 2017, 18:36:56 »
The 2016 election is still relevant to politics in 2017.  Everything underhanded tactic that was used in 2016 (or earlier) will, if not punished sufficiently, be repeated in future.
That which does not kill me has made a grave tactical error.

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #938 on: July 16, 2017, 21:01:38 »
The approval ratings are brought to you by the same people who produced all of the polls and predictions that he would never win the Republican nomination, and had almost no chance of winning the Presidency.
And yet, if it helps the narrative ...  ;D

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Offline Loachman

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #939 on: July 16, 2017, 23:42:42 »
I just realized that I'd left Bombard's Body Language https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXG8i4PE6-mxh52nFKwMkcg/videos out. Mandy does not always understand the background to the clips that she analyzes or recognize all of the characters, as she accepts requests from her subscribers, but makes some interesting observations. One would have to view a few of her older videos to understand some of her techniques and terminology, as she does not explain them as much anymore. She's roasted the Sun King on several occasions - she doesn't like him much.

Offline Loachman

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #940 on: July 17, 2017, 07:48:19 »
Scott Adams laughs to tears at DNC panicking about Kid Rock running for the Senate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l47GcfA-gDA

Offline Journeyman

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #941 on: July 17, 2017, 08:51:47 »
The point is that we must assume that we are getting biased views and therefore read widely and make our own opinions based on the internal logic that is present or missing in the various reports.

The trouble is that most people come with preconceptions and gravitate only to the viewpoints that they favour.

No, I think the trouble lay in such people then coming here (both pro-right and pro-left) to repeat their same unsubstantiated 'my side is flawlessly awesome' dogma, while childishly -- and often illiterately -- name-calling any  opposition, over.... and over..... and over again -- turning every politics and politically-tinged thread here into the same mindless (and therefore of little value, beyond individual posters' intellectual masturbation) Tokyo Rose / Jihadi John garbage.   "A lie told often enough becomes the truth" playing out before us.

"Sad."


[Back to radio silence on the fatuous propaganda threads.  Enjoy  :salute:  ]

Offline Journeyman

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #942 on: July 17, 2017, 12:52:33 »
I try to keep this in mind when in Radio Chatter,
We have to remember to check if we are in RADIO CHATTER before we want to "seriously" comment on a less than "serious" thread.   

.....turning every politics and politically-tinged thread here into the same mindless (and therefore of little value, beyond individual posters' intellectual masturbation) Tokyo Rose / Jihadi John garbage.

In your leisure time, have a look through any number of topics within "Military Current Affairs & News," "International Defence and Security," "The Canadian Military," "VAC and other Soldiers' Benefits," "Canadian Politics"..... which are not  in Radio Chatter, yet meet the 'politically-tinged' term.

Sorry you failed to understand what I posted, but thank you for sharing the wisdom of George Wallace.

Offline Brad Sallows

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #943 on: July 18, 2017, 23:26:16 »
For reference,

US Election: 2016 
http://milnet.ca/forums/index.php/topic,108210.3200.html
129 pages,

If you need reminders to yourself where things are, just write them down.
That which does not kill me has made a grave tactical error.

Omnia praesidia vestra capta sunt nobis.

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Offline MCG

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #944 on: July 19, 2017, 01:26:39 »
No, I think the trouble lay in such people then coming here (both pro-right and pro-left) to repeat their same unsubstantiated 'my side is flawlessly awesome' dogma, while childishly -- and often illiterately -- name-calling any  opposition, over.... and over..... and over again -- turning every politics and politically-tinged thread here into the same mindless (and therefore of little value, beyond individual posters' intellectual masturbation) Tokyo Rose / Jihadi John garbage.   "A lie told often enough becomes the truth" playing out before us.

"Sad."


[Back to radio silence on the fatuous propaganda threads.  Enjoy  :salute:  ]

Like in the picture attached?
+900

Offline Lumber

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #945 on: July 19, 2017, 08:09:36 »
Like in the picture attached?

Amen. See my signature block.
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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #946 on: July 21, 2017, 12:17:53 »
Next!
Quote
White House Press Secretary Sean Spicer has quit, reportedly in protest at a shake-up of the communications team.

Mr Spicer stepped down because he was unhappy with President Donald Trump's appointment of a new communications director, reports the New York Times.

Combative Wall Street financier Anthony Scaramucci has been picked for the role that Mr Spicer partially filled ...
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Offline Remius

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #947 on: July 21, 2017, 12:42:48 »
Not really all that surprised.
Optio

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #948 on: July 26, 2017, 10:48:32 »
Quote
“This is certainly different. It’s certainly new,” Nunberg said. “But it’s what people want.”

Chaos? All the time?
[/b][/color]

I was talking earlier about Politico's "500" or Lally somebody or other's guest list.

I'm guessing that those people believe that "order" is possible, or even that "ordnung muss sein".

But for the average person there is precious little evidence of order in the universe.  Most people spend their lives reacting to events.  And some of the greatest chaos inducing events are those that are caused by Lally's 500 attempting to impose order.  Mickey did as well as they have done.



Perhaps they needed to be disabused of their sense of being able to control events and discover the world everyone else lives in.



http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/07/26/for-america-it-looks-like-chaos-for-trump-its-just-tuesday-215421

Quote
To America, It Looks Like Chaos. For Trump, It’s Just Tuesday.
The president makes a mess, then makes it worse. It’s what he’s always done.
By MICHAEL KRUSE July 26, 2017

It started Monday morning with Donald Trump calling his own attorney general “beleaguered.” It continued with an Air Force One flight to West Virginia and a rambling, partisan speech to thousands of hollering Boy Scouts. And it kept going with another manic jag of tweets on Tuesday, as the president took a second shaming swipe at Jeff Sessions, delegitimized the acting director of the FBI, urged senators to “step up to the plate” on getting rid of Obamacare and railed away in his exclamation-laced syntax about Democrats who are “obstructionists” and the “Witch Hunt” of the Russia investigation. Meanwhile, his new communications director was threatening to fire his entire staff for leaking as rumors swirled about Cabinet-level departures. Chaos bordering on crisis.

This is how Trump ran his business, and it’s how he ran his campaign. For six months now, it’s how he’s run his White House. But within the whirl of these past two nonstop, dizzying days, it has reached blinking-red-light levels. To people who have been around him, and those who still are, from Trump Tower to the West Wing, this can be unnerving. To people across the country and the world, it can feel dismaying or disorienting or just plain insane.

For Trump, though, it feels like … the start to another week.

“This is Donald,” former Trump Organization Vice President Louise Sunshine told me Tuesday. “This is his style.”

“He’s operating just like he always has,” former Trump Shuttle President Bruce Nobles said in an interview.

“The prince of chaos,” said Trump biographer Gwenda Blair.

The spawn of Norman Vincent Peale and Roy Cohn, Trump has stomped through life armed with the obstinate, self-centered tenets of optimistic thinking and the sneering, deep-seated lessons of attack, attack, attack. He creates chaos, and then he responds to that chaos, withstanding it, even embracing it, feeding on it—and then he outlasts the outrage, emerging not only alive but emboldened.

“Hey, look, I had a cold spell from 1990 to ’91,” Trump said almost a quarter-century ago to a reporter from New York magazine, referring to the breakup of his marriage to the mother of his first three children, his affair with a busty, B-movie actress and the reckless spending and negligent management of his company that left him nearly a billion dollars in debt—all of which was covered breathlessly by the press. “I was beat up in business and in my personal life. But you learn that you’re either the toughest, meanest piece of crap in the world, or you just crawl into a corner, put your finger in your mouth, and say, ‘I want to go home.’ You never know until you’re under pressure how you’re gonna react.”

This crisis was formative, and Trump survived because of family money, permissive banks that were tied to him as much as he was tied to them, the Houdini-esque work of a lender-mandated financial rescue artist and far more than his fair share of chutzpah. The close scrape with personal bankruptcy and business ruin didn’t chasten Trump. It did the opposite. “The fact that he got through it,” former Trump Organization Vice President Barbara Res said, “made him believe he could accomplish anything, conquer anything.”

His path from The Art of the Deal to The Art of the Comeback to "The Apprentice" consisted of a media-stoked stew of self-promotion and provocation. WrestleMania antics and celebrity feuds were fuel. And he talked when he could about running for president. It was always a bluff. Until, of course, it wasn’t.

His campaign was a rolling crisis. Beset by backstabbing and infighting, careening from one five-alarm fire to the next, Trump’s unprecedented presidential bid seemed perpetually on the edge of political viability. And he won.

“Chaos creates drama, and drama gets ink,” former Trump campaign aide Sam Nunberg told me Tuesday. “This is a new kind of presidency. He’s followed the tabloid model, and it got him to where he is, and it’s the model that will be followed until it doesn’t work. And it has worked. He’s sitting in the Oval Office.”

On Monday, at the fairly standard hour of 6:40 a.m., he kickstarted a particularly agitated sequence of tweets by labeling Washington not a “Swamp” but a “Sewer” and yelling “Fake News!” He insisted there’s “Zero evidence” of his or his campaign’s collusion with Russian officials. Then he called Sessions, the first senator to endorse him and for a long period during the campaign his most credible surrogate, “beleaguered.” Then he called a member of Congress “Sleazy.” Then he poked Republicans about their “last chance” to “Repeal & Replace.” Then he boarded the presidential plane to go talk to the Boy Scouts.

In Glen Jean, West Virginia, at the National Scout Jamboree, at a gathering of “the nation’s foremost youth program of character development and values-based leadership training,” Trump pledged to the crowd of an estimated 40,000, mostly boys between 12 and 18 years old, that he wouldn’t talk about policy fights or political disagreements. “Who the hell wants to speak about politics when I’m in front of the Boy Scouts?” he said. He did. The president talked about Tuesday’s health care vote and called Obamacare “this horrible thing that’s really hurting us” and found ways to criticize Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton and told the amped-up teens stale stories about his big win of 2016. “USA!” they chanted back.

By Tuesday morning, he was back on Twitter, blasting the FBI boss and Sessions, too, for his “VERY weak position on Hillary Clinton crimes” and “leakers.” He also praised John McCain for being a “Brave” “American hero” after disparaging him for being captured in Vietnam not once but twice before. (Trump never apologized.)

This is not the way it’s supposed to work, or at least not how it has. “I have not seen any indication of a normal appreciation of the functioning of government coming from the president,” former Senate attorney and Watergate prosecutor Richard Ben-Veniste told POLITICO on Tuesday. But while members of Congress scrambled to respond, their assessments of the president’s latest behavior ranging from confusion to condemnation to twisted justification to tepid defense, the people who have watched Trump for a lot longer simply shook their heads.

“Typical Donald,” Sunshine said.

“I’m not surprised by anything I’m seeing,” said Nobles, the former Trump Shuttle boss. “He’s always liked chaos.”

“He’s spent his life creating and surrounding himself with chaos,” Res said, “so that he can be the one person who can emerge in charge. The winner. The guy on the top. It’s a way of slaying his enemies.”

“If you’ve ever been on a construction site, they’re always chaotic,” Billy Procida, another former Trump Organization vice president, told me Tuesday. “And he’s good at construction.”

But he’s no longer on a construction site. He’s the most powerful person in the world.

“This is certainly different. It’s certainly new,” Nunberg said. “But it’s what people want.”


Chaos? All the time?

“Entertainment,” Nunberg said. “Entertainment.”
"Wyrd bið ful aræd"

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Re: U.S. Politics 2017 (split fm US Election: 2016)
« Reply #949 on: July 27, 2017, 10:01:44 »
Ouch!
Quote
Kellyanne Conway, a senior adviser to President Donald Trump, on Thursday said it shouldn't be too difficult to smoke out the source of leaks out of the West Wing, as new communications director Anthony Scaramucci and others try to crack down on anonymously sourced stories.

"I will just tell you that leakers are easier to figure out than they may think. This West Wing is a very small place," Conway said on "Fox and Friends." "And I'll say, for me, I'm the jerk who hired a chief of staff, right? Because I thought we were supposed to work on policy, not free press or comms assistance, because we're not here to curate our images."

Conway admonished anyone who leaks information from the White House, and noted a difference between leaking and "using the press to shiv each other in the ribs."

"We are not here to read about ourselves," Conway said, "We are here for the forgotten men and forgotten women." ...
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