Author Topic: Alleged Institutional Racism/solutions in CAF (merged)  (Read 125678 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline opcougar

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • -6,085
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 267
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #25 on: March 04, 2011, 11:34:30 »
I hear you an dthe US incentive you talk about is well known, there was a documentary on that on TV. You committed a cardinal sin in your post, refering to black Canadians as African Americans? A black in Canada might not have any connection to the US. Blacks in the US are called that because they were either born there and of African origin.

In Canada, it's Canadian African, Canadian Jew, Canadian Italian et al


You have to look at it from a census point of view. Vancouver has a Chinese Chief of Police, Toronto a black one, rest of Canada, not so much. Well, Canada is a pretty diverse country, but censuses show that in smaller provinces, there are not the largest concentrations of different ethnicities. I have a first-hand perspective on it. My wife is Latin American and I swear she's the only one in my city of 150 000 people. For African Americans, a very very small populations and an even smaller one with other ethnicities. We have had a Colin Powell like person already, Michaelle Jean is black, Haitian-descended and pretty much the highest power of our country and technically the 'Commander-in-Arms' of the Canadian Forces.

The difference between the US and Canada (in the Military sense), you have to be a citizen to fight for Canada, my wife is was born in the US and is a former Marine, and she informed me of the US Military incentive that if you're an immigrant, illegal or otherwise, you can join the military and earn your citizenship. Of course, this isn't publicly advertised. Think of how many people at that point join just for that? Look as well at the numbers of minorities in the US compared to here in Canada. Have you thought that maybe the reason we don't have a lot of 'minorities' in our Armed Forces is just because they don't want to be?

Offline Sapplicant

  • Spem Reduxit
  • Member
  • ****
  • 9,640
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 171
  • Don't you eat that yellow snow.
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #26 on: March 04, 2011, 11:40:06 »
In Canada, it's Canadian African, Canadian Jew, Canadian Italian et al

It's that need to seperate ones self from others that drives racism, you know. Why the hell can't we all just be Canadian? Who the frig cares what colour your skin is? Journeyman said it best, about bleeding the same colour. What does an abundance, or lack, of melanin REALLY have to do with anything? Seriously?
7 Blunders of the World, Mohandas Ghandi:
-Wealth without work
-Pleasure without conscience
-Knowledge without character
-Commerce without morality
-Science without humanity
-Worship without sacrifice
-Politics without principle

8th Blunder of the World, Arun Ghandi:
-Rights without responsibilities

Offline Michael O'Leary

  • The moral high ground cannot be dominated by fire alone, it must be occupied to be claimed as held.
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 294,045
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 9,645
    • The Regimental Rogue
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #27 on: March 04, 2011, 11:41:03 »
opcougar,

The irony here is that after decades of being told we shouldn't "see" colour when we deal with people, you can come here and expect that we can share detailed knowledge of who has received what and their ethnicity. I would suggest you start with an Access to Information Act request to DND to get your answer, and/or petition the GG website to add a "skin colour" field to their Honours and Awards page so that you can track the statistics you appear to be looking for.

Offline Mudshuvel

  • The only time I hear 'Hurry up and wait' is when I needed it yesterday.
  • Mentor
  • Member
  • *
  • 8,248
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 228
  • ATIS
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #28 on: March 04, 2011, 11:41:59 »
I hear you an dthe US incentive you talk about is well known, there was a documentary on that on TV. You committed a cardinal sin in your post, refering to black Canadians as African Americans? A black in Canada might not have any connection to the US. Blacks in the US are called that because they were either born there and of African origin.

In Canada, it's Canadian African, Canadian Jew, Canadian Italian et al



It can go either way, America is a continent, not a country.

I'm just going to assume a "well the United States has black people in power including a black president" post is going to come up at some point here.

In Milwaukee, black people aren't known to vote. They see a black candidate they are ALL going to vote. I'm going to put this as bluntly as I can, this is not my opinion, but the opinion of people who live in this situation. For a moment, its going to seem off-topic but its leading up to a point.

In a lot of States in the US, a lot of African Americans are on welfare, and they are pretty much born into it. A common mentality in some states (Wisconsin, for example) is that the government owes them. My sister-in-law, Mexican American, was told she only got financial assistance because her son was half-black. In some laws for businesses there, a business is supposed to have a certain percentage of whatever ethnicity to avoid the 'you don't hire me because I'm _______'. I'm not insinuating that they have generals or what have you that are black just for that reason, but look at the size of their military and look at the size of ours. They have more black people in their military than we have people in our military. Example: hypothetically we have 70 000 people in our military, lets say 10 people are black, and 3 of them are generals. Then WOW! 30% of all black people in the military are generals! Then we have 20 white generals out of 60 000 white people in the military, thats not good.. 3.3% of all white people are generals? Look at the military demographics. My above figures give it about 1/200 shot for a black person in the military to be promoted over a white guy, its not racism, but its just more white guys with the same qualifications applying for the same position or being given the promotion or whatever.
"Airplanes are interesting toys but of no military value."
- Marshal Ferdinand Foch [Professor of Strategy, Ecole Superieure de Guerre] (circa 1911)
He was Supreme Commander of Allied forces, 1918

If you have questions: go to Google, type  "Site:army.ca",  followed by a space any keywords related to what you're looking for.

Offline recceguy

    A Usual Suspect.

  • "Look, I don't know if shooting penguins will help the environment or not. But I do know that the decision shouldn't be in the hands of people who just wanna kill for fun."
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Myth
  • *
  • 228,707
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 17,256
  • doddering docent to the museum of misanthropy
    • Army.ca
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #29 on: March 04, 2011, 11:46:02 »
In Canada, it's Canadian African, Canadian Jew, Canadian Italian et al

Wrong again. Here you're just Canadian. Period.

As for the rest of this moronic thread, I'll also stand by my original comment, up top, from years ago, being as nothing has changed.

However, I'll reiterate just to be clear.

If you believe there is a problem, grow a pair and report it and get it dealt with. Don't come here crying in your skirt like a little girl and try stir up crap where none exists.
At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child – miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.
-P.J. O’Rouke-


DISCLAIMER - my opinion may cause manginal irritation.

Offline N. McKay

  • Mentor
  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *
  • 11,505
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 1,255
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #30 on: March 04, 2011, 11:48:51 »
Sure we would, but let's be serious here..........for the past god knows how many years, there hasn't been the odd black good enough to be a LCol, full Col or BGen?

I think the premise of your argument is nonsense and I'm not really interested in getting involved, but I will note that I have, in fact, met a black LCol.

Offline recceguy

    A Usual Suspect.

  • "Look, I don't know if shooting penguins will help the environment or not. But I do know that the decision shouldn't be in the hands of people who just wanna kill for fun."
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Myth
  • *
  • 228,707
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 17,256
  • doddering docent to the museum of misanthropy
    • Army.ca
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #31 on: March 04, 2011, 11:49:35 »
It can go either way, America is a continent, not a country.

I'm just going to assume a "well the United States has black people in power including a black president" post is going to come up at some point here.

In Milwaukee, black people aren't known to vote. They see a black candidate they are ALL going to vote. I'm going to put this as bluntly as I can, this is not my opinion, but the opinion of people who live in this situation. For a moment, its going to seem off-topic but its leading up to a point.

In a lot of States in the US, a lot of African Americans are on welfare, and they are pretty much born into it. A common mentality in some states (Wisconsin, for example) is that the government owes them. My sister-in-law, Mexican American, was told she only got financial assistance because her son was half-black. In some laws for businesses there, a business is supposed to have a certain percentage of whatever ethnicity to avoid the 'you don't hire me because I'm _______'. I'm not insinuating that they have generals or what have you that are black just for that reason, but look at the size of their military and look at the size of ours. They have more black people in their military than we have people in our military. Example: hypothetically we have 70 000 people in our military, lets say 10 people are black, and 3 of them are generals. Then WOW! 30% of all black people in the military are generals! Then we have 20 white generals out of 60 000 white people in the military, thats not good.. 3.3% of all white people are generals? Look at the military demographics. My above figures give it about 1/200 shot for a black person in the military to be promoted over a white guy, its not racism, but its just more white guys with the same qualifications applying for the same position or being given the promotion or whatever.

Drop the tangent. This topic is stupid enough already.

At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child – miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.
-P.J. O’Rouke-


DISCLAIMER - my opinion may cause manginal irritation.

Offline Brihard

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 118,885
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,492
  • Non-Electric Pop-Up Target
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #32 on: March 04, 2011, 11:50:11 »
I hear you an dthe US incentive you talk about is well known, there was a documentary on that on TV. You committed a cardinal sin in your post, refering to black Canadians as African Americans? A black in Canada might not have any connection to the US. Blacks in the US are called that because they were either born there and of African origin.

In Canada, it's Canadian African, Canadian Jew, Canadian Italian et al

I don't even think about it that way. I think a lot of us don't.

I mean, I am *aware* that one of my troops is Tamil, that another is Palestinian, that one of the other guys in the platoon is Korean, that one of my other buddies is black... I just don't care whatsoever, in that it in no way affects how I think about or interact with those people. It's of no more significance than knowing that so and so is francophone versus that other guy being of Italian descent. Maybe it's a generational thing, but I think more and more of us are growing up 'colour blind' as it regards working with people of other races.

So no, I don't think of my troops or peers as 'Tamil-Canadian', or 'Palestinian-Canadian'. Generally their first names suffice when I feel some pressing need to identify them. Or rank and last name if I'm angry about something or at least need to play that role.  >:D
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

Offline Rheostatic

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • 261,641
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 471
  • Don't shoot the messenger
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #33 on: March 04, 2011, 11:52:37 »
This thread needs some facts.
Based upon the data available,9 the recruitment pool for the CF traditionally has been fit young men between the ages of 17 and 24, coming from rural areas or from urban areas with a population of less than 100,000. Recruits generally have been white males with previous familial CF ties, possessing a high school education or less. Since the majority of MAs, which constitute the bulk of the Canadian population, are not the traditional recruitment bases for the CF, it is questionable whether the CF has ever been truly reflective of Canada, even if one were to leave the visible minority issue on the sidelines. Therefore, since it is unlikely that the demographics, and perhaps the values, of the CF were ever truly reflective of Canada, the suggestion that somehow visible minorities should be recruited in a manner that represents the Canadian diversity is highly contentious. It is likely that the only time the Canadian Forces ever truly ‘reflected’ Canada was when conscription was in force during the two great global conflicts of the 20th Century. Thus, within a professional and volunteer force such as the CF, it is questionable if the CF can truly ‘reflect’ Canada.

[Wow, it is not easy to post a table.]

Line 1: "If an army does not reflect the values and composition of the larger society that nurtures it, it invariably loses the support and allegiance of that society." Of course we must balance this need with "the right person for the right job" not through unearned promotions (as was suggested above) but by eliminating institutional barriers to advancement, if they exist.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2011, 12:04:10 by Rheostatic »

Online mariomike

  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 395,430
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 6,704
    • The job.
Get on the bus. Take a ride with us.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2lSGnPl-ww

Offline patienttaxreceipt

  • Guest
  • *
  • 15
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 1
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #35 on: March 04, 2011, 13:04:04 »
Patriot, nobody among CFs can afford to be racist. Aside from getting court-martialed, the alleged cannot escape civil liability if done in the presence of other people.. The cops will arrest him, criminally charge him, and impose civil liability on him. I know of one who was charged civilly, was forced to mortgage his house and pay 2 million dollars as exemplary and punitive damages. Not committing racism is like not crossing  the street when the lights are red or not passing a red light. Why are you making a big deal out of it? I would like to know..

Offline JesseWZ

  • Mentor
  • Full Member
  • *
  • 29,055
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 411
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #36 on: March 04, 2011, 13:06:45 »
Patriot, nobody among CFs can afford to be racist. Aside from getting court-martialed, the alleged cannot escape civil liability if done in the presence of other people.. The cops will arrest him, criminally charge him, and impose civil liability on him. I know of one who was charged civilly, was forced to mortgage his house and pay 2 million dollars as exemplary and punitive damages. Not committing racism is like not crossing  the street when the lights are red or not passing a red light. Why are you making a big deal out of it? I would like to know..

You're responding to a poster from 9 years ago... who is no longer even a part of this forum. Not to mention, I think your arc markers might be set a little wide.
I will be seen and not heard... I will be seen and not heard... I will be seen and not heard...

Offline recceguy

    A Usual Suspect.

  • "Look, I don't know if shooting penguins will help the environment or not. But I do know that the decision shouldn't be in the hands of people who just wanna kill for fun."
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Myth
  • *
  • 228,707
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 17,256
  • doddering docent to the museum of misanthropy
    • Army.ca
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #37 on: March 04, 2011, 13:08:45 »
Right. It died almost ten years ago, as it should have.

This is getting dangerously close to being moved to Radio Chatter, where it belongs, with all the other tin hat bullshit.
At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child – miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.
-P.J. O’Rouke-


DISCLAIMER - my opinion may cause manginal irritation.

Offline ModlrMike

    : Riding time again... woohooo!

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *
  • 188,484
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,306
    • Canadian Association of Physician Assistants
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #38 on: March 04, 2011, 13:27:56 »
Right. It died almost ten years ago, as it should have.

This is getting dangerously close to being moved to Radio Chatter, where it belongs, with all the other tin hat bullshit.

Agreed! I recommend we lock it.
WARNING: The consumption of alcohol may create the illusion that you are tougher,smarter, faster and better looking than most people.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. (H.L. Mencken 1919)
Zero tolerance is the politics of the lazy. All it requires is that you do nothing and ban everything.

Offline DirtyDog

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • 10,829
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 689
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #39 on: March 04, 2011, 13:48:56 »
This thread is completely ridiculous, yet I feel compelled to say a few things.

First off, if some people feel discriminated against, I would suggest that in some cases it has nothing to do with their skin colour or ethnicity but simply because they are whiny dolts.  As demonstrated by some in this thread.  I don't mean to downplay actual racial discrimination, which I've never  personally witnessed in the Forces, but I fully support discriminatory behaviour against idiots.

As far as representation....  If more minorities felt compelled to actually serve this country (as they are well under-represented in the CF), maybe we would see more of them in senior positions.  Unfortunately, this is not the case.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2011, 13:52:53 by DirtyDog »

Offline Black Betty

  • Guest
  • *
  • 1,637
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 19
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #40 on: March 04, 2011, 14:00:44 »
I am going to speak from a person of color perspective.

As a young cadet I was a witness/victim of said racism. The commanding officer at that time was a person of color such as myself. His advice was to suck it up and report it racism was something we were going to have to face throughout our lives.

Since then I have toyed with the idea of joining the CF. After experiencing said racism again as a civilian adult I decided I'm not getting paid enough in this life to handle this crap. I am now much more mature and I am hoping the individuals I come in contact with are the same (mature).

It is not that people of color don't want to join they either lack the confidence to pass the CFAT, have a total disregard for authority and/ or have no greater aspiration to better their own lives. Add a lack of information regarding the CF and you have the answer.

I saw lots of persons of color speaking with recruiting officers when I was applying. However I have read that Toronto seems to have a greater pool of visible minorities than other group and I believe that to be true.

The bottom line is our lives are in each others hands and if I feel your attitude towards another is questionable then I would advise anyone to report inappropriate behavior as we ALL have to trust each other.

As I would expect a non minority to report said racism and not laugh along or stay closed lips about the issue if they are  amongst an exclusive group when something is said.


As for the American way of doing things, they have so many other problems within their own system that it's difficult to comment. I have heard that immigrants are admitted to earn their citizenship. However, I have watched many a 20/20 and 60min programs regarding the USA army that I am speechless.
 
I know where I stand within the Canadian system that is all I need to know.
I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bee with an itch. You've got to go out and kick a**.
Maya Angelou

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vh9tU8O1LfY

Offline SevenSixTwo

    One foot in front of the other.

  • Full Member
  • *****
  • 110,627
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 254
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #41 on: March 04, 2011, 14:18:30 »
I haven't seen any racism in the CF. But then again I come from the most culturally diverse unit in Canada (Caucasian is the minority).

The only racism I have ever witnessed from possible members of the CF are on these boards where people can say things anonymously.

Offline DirtyDog

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • 10,829
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 689
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #42 on: March 04, 2011, 14:43:41 »
The only racism I have ever witnessed from possible members of the CF are on these boards where people can say things anonymously.
I've never seen it here and I know for a fact it wouldn't be tolerated.

As for being anonymous, I know I will choose my words much more carefully here then I would in the actual workplace since you are putting it as a matter of public record.  I may be a stranger to most people on here but it wouldn't take much to track me down in the system if I commit a serious infraction.

Offline recceguy

    A Usual Suspect.

  • "Look, I don't know if shooting penguins will help the environment or not. But I do know that the decision shouldn't be in the hands of people who just wanna kill for fun."
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Myth
  • *
  • 228,707
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 17,256
  • doddering docent to the museum of misanthropy
    • Army.ca
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #43 on: March 04, 2011, 14:55:25 »
I haven't seen any racism in the CF. But then again I come from the most culturally diverse unit in Canada (Caucasian is the minority).

The only racism I have ever witnessed from possible members of the CF are on these boards where people can say things anonymously.

That is the largest load of bovine scatology I've witnessed in ages. And here's a warning for being a crap disturbing idiot.

Milnet.ca Staff
At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child – miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.
-P.J. O’Rouke-


DISCLAIMER - my opinion may cause manginal irritation.

Offline Infanteer

  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Legend
  • *
  • 115,445
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 14,332
  • Honey Badger FTW!
Re: Institutional Racism In The Canadian Armed Forces?!
« Reply #44 on: March 04, 2011, 18:49:06 »
This thread needs some facts.

Important thing to note is that the information in those statistics is drawn from the CF Self-Identification Survey which was instituted in the early 00s (2002 I believe).  More importantly, Part A - which is basically your tombstone data - is the only mandatory part of the survey.  Part B, self-identification (ie: I'm a blind, one-legged green-skinned woman), is competely voluntary.

In essence, this data shouldn't be taken as 100% accurate.
"Overall it appears that much of the apparent complexity of modern war stems in practice from the self-imposed complexity of modern HQs" LCol J.P. Storr

Offline Halifax Tar

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 30,988
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 1,339
  • Ready Aye Ready
'Systemic' racism in Canadian Forces needs inquiry, veterans say
« Reply #45 on: March 22, 2012, 17:12:16 »
HALIFAX—In 2001, with a wife and her three children in tow, Private Wally Fowler, an African-Nova Scotian, was assigned to Traffic Tech training at Canadian Forces Base (CFB) Esquimalt, on Vancouver Island, British Columbia. It was not an auspicious match by any account, and since then Fowler has clung tirelessly to the assertion that he and his family were the frequent victims of racism and discrimination in Esquimalt.


More at link -> http://www.dominionpaper.ca/articles/4385

Its interesting that Mr. Fowler never seems to state he was the victim of racism by a CF member until he he cant get posted back to NS.

Then again he does make it sound as if his career shop was out to get him because of his race... I don't know what to make of this...
Lead me, follow me or get the hell out of my way

fraserdw

  • Guest
Re: The Case Of Wally Fowler
« Reply #46 on: March 22, 2012, 18:01:03 »
Sounds like it might be very much and it sounds like maybe members of the military covered something up with the removal of file documents although they failed to destroy the email trail which means the cover up was local and small time.  A good departmental wide cover up would have got those emails.  In these types of cover ups, with this much time passed, you will never know who really organized it or who participated.  Usually, the participants are willing dupes afraid of the rank and political power of the lead conspirator and just trying to hold on to their own careers.  I am sure everyone involved retired with honour and pension and a few medals to boot.  A man's life is destroyed because he really believed all that stuff about ethics and the fairness of our system.  Now he will most likely get a pension but that is little comfort.

Offline jollyjacktar

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 120,267
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 5,092
  • My uncle F/Sgt W.H.S. Buckwell KIA 14/05/43 22YOA
Re: The Case Of Wally Fowler
« Reply #47 on: March 22, 2012, 18:02:58 »
A strange tale indeed.  I'm not sure on how much of it is accurate, how much speculation, how much innuendo.  I have no doubt that circumstance became a vicious circle after time. There seems to be some indication that "something" was happening.  Don't know how or if it could get ironed out after all this time. 

Offline recceguy

    A Usual Suspect.

  • "Look, I don't know if shooting penguins will help the environment or not. But I do know that the decision shouldn't be in the hands of people who just wanna kill for fun."
  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Myth
  • *
  • 228,707
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 17,256
  • doddering docent to the museum of misanthropy
    • Army.ca
Re: The Case Of Wally Fowler
« Reply #48 on: March 22, 2012, 18:57:37 »
I won't speculate. I'll wait until the investigation is complete and all the details are released..........from both sides.
At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child – miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless. Liberalism is a philosophy of sniveling brats.
-P.J. O’Rouke-


DISCLAIMER - my opinion may cause manginal irritation.

Offline WeatherdoG

  • Member
  • ****
  • 14,207
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 175
Re: The Case Of Wally Fowler
« Reply #49 on: March 22, 2012, 19:03:00 »
Until they come up with something substantial from either side I'm going to have to say they system is likely correct. The people running the show aren't idiots (all the time), and given the sensitive nature of the situation I highly doubt that anybody in their right mind would actively block a legitimate investigation. I'm sure every one of us on here has dealt with missing paperwork from time to time, and I highly doubt our CoC is out to get all of us.