Author Topic: Civilian Police to Military Police  (Read 36856 times)

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Offline LifeChanges

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Civilian Police to Military Police
« on: September 08, 2014, 00:19:35 »
I've been a police officer for six years.  While I love working in the law enforcement sector, I've started considering the possibility of applying to be an MP.  Would the army recognize my previous training?  Would I still have to take Basic Occupation Training in addition to Basic Training?  And, honestly, at 33 years old, is this a good option? 

Thanks

Offline Sheep Dog AT

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2014, 00:42:29 »
Who are you currently with?
Apparently infamous for his one liners.
Oh Giggity Well...........Giggity

Offline NinerSix

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2014, 00:49:14 »
I'm not sure if the trade has the signing bonus for applicants with required experience or education. Best call your recruiting center for that one. That would be about the only consideration your existing status might get you.

You will have to do the entire 6 month MP QL3 course.

Is this good for you? That all depends. Second hand, I can tell you that MPs generally spend far less time on patrol before moving on to specialty sections than all the municipal police forces I know. Older people have made it through just fine.

The process is not the mission.

Offline PMedMoe

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2014, 07:21:48 »
I'm not sure if the trade has the signing bonus for applicants with required experience or education. Best call your recruiting center for that one. That would be about the only consideration your existing status might get you.

The OP could probably submit a PLAR, but a CANFORGEN came out in June stating there were no recruitment allowances for any trade.
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Offline Hatchet Man

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2014, 13:19:41 »
A PLAR should be requested by whatever RC you end up dealing with, that said, make sure you have your graduation certificate from whatever police college you went to (OPC, Depot, JIBC, etc) and any course outlines you may have (as well as courses/training you have done on the job).  FYI there are components of an MPs job that are not similar to a civilian officer (dealing with POWs for instance), as well as things like arrest authority on/off base.  Much has been discussed here, about many of the differences.  So with that in mind, be prepared for the fact, that even if you go through the PLAR process, depending on how training in Borden is structured, you may not get to bypass initial trades training.

Offline Schindler's Lift

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2014, 22:26:21 »
I've worked with ex civvie cops from Newfoundland, the OPP, 2 ex-Mounties and an ex Niagara Regional cop.  One was an MPO and the rest were Cpls on up.  All of them who did not already have the required community college diploma had to submit their civilian qualifications and experience in order to be considered for employment without the diploma but that wasnt much of an issue given their experience and courses.  All were still required to complete recruit school and their QL3 or MPO course along with everyone else thought so they learned our directives, policies, orders, standards and duties.   They also entered at the entry ranks but because of their experience they tended to raise through the ranks a bit quicker but it was an individual thing.  Other then thzt your age wont be an issue.  The ex Newfoundland cop was in his late 30s when he joined and he had no issues.

Offline rocksteady

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2014, 12:02:18 »
Don't become an MP unless you want to be treated like a child, Period.

Offline Schindler's Lift

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2014, 18:26:57 »
Don't become an MP unless you want to be treated like a child, Period.

Looks like someone has issues.

Offline NinerSix

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2014, 18:38:59 »
Looks like someone has issues.

Gripes like those always make me question the individual before the situation.
The process is not the mission.

Offline Journeyman

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2014, 18:47:27 »
.....unless you want to be treated like a child.....
Like....naps?!  And....and....spankings?!!   WOOHOO!!   :nod:

Offline Shamrock

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2014, 21:02:07 »
And....and....spankings?!!   WOOHOO!!   :nod:

Receiving, not giving.  I live in slight fear you may have already known this.

I was going to add sandwiches without crusts and juice boxes, but then I realized... boxed lunches.

Offline rocksteady

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2015, 15:58:07 »
MPs do "Mickey Mouse" police work 95% of the time.  Your reports are then scrutinized by people that had minimal time on the road and minimal real policing experience.  A civilian police officer in a larger center will do more files and arrests in their first year of policing than an MP will do in their entire career.  That is fact.  MPs are glorified security guards that do minimal police work.

Just ask any MP who has spent some time in the trade that hasn't drank the Kool Aid...

jollyjacktar

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #12 on: June 01, 2015, 16:25:09 »
That is not necessarily correct, rocksteady.  Most police work is esoteric at the best of times.  You don't always see the results of your work as you might in other career paths.  Granted the pace of things were different in my personal experience between Army, Air Force and Navy bases but such is life.  Of course it's not fair to expect the job to be like a large metropolitan department, your community you police is smaller and more like small town work.  If your comments are to be taken at face value, then by your standards if I understand you correctly, means that all small town type policing isn't worth jack when set aside big city policing.  That, is a "Mickey Mouse" attitude.

As for the professionalism of your supervisors...  I worked with many when I was in the trade who were just as good as those I saw on the civilian side before I joined the CF.  And there also were those on both sides who were less than stellar.  That goes for anywhere or any trade. 

And, no.  I didn't drink the Kool-Aid either, so you can get that thought out of your head too.


Offline mariomike

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #13 on: June 01, 2015, 16:51:52 »
A civilian police officer in a larger center will do more files and arrests in their first year of policing than an MP will do in their entire career.  That is fact. 

MP versus city police Call Volumes were discussed here. ( I believe the OP was referring to Regular Force MP's. )

Call Volume
http://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=104516.0

"Just curious as to what would be the majority of calls an MP would receive, and what would they spend the most time on? Traffic? Assaults? Thefts etc. and does it vary from element to element i.e. army to navy to air force?
How many calls would you average in a shift?
Just a professional curiosity. In Toronto every division gets a little bit of everything, but the downtown divisions will get more drugs, edp's, homeless etc, and the burbs will get more domestics and b and e's.
Working in 52 Division you could answer 20 calls in a 10 hour shift but working in 33 Division you could answer 5-10.
Just looking for a little perspective."

Jim7966: "Judging by the event numbers issued for each call/arrest in Toronto we averaged 100,000.00 calls per month. That's city wide but only includes calls where a car was dispatched or an arrest made. It wouldn't include walk ins or things that were handled over the phone."



« Last Edit: June 01, 2015, 16:57:58 by mariomike »

Offline putz

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #14 on: June 04, 2015, 03:56:03 »
MPs do "Mickey Mouse" police work 95% of the time.  Your reports are then scrutinized by people that had minimal time on the road and minimal real policing experience.  A civilian police officer in a larger center will do more files and arrests in their first year of policing than an MP will do in their entire career.  That is fact.  MPs are glorified security guards that do minimal police work.

Just ask any MP who has spent some time in the trade that hasn't drank the Kool Aid...

Maybe where you are posted

Offline Schindler's Lift

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2015, 14:05:44 »
MPs do "Mickey Mouse" police work 95% of the time.  Your reports are then scrutinized by people that had minimal time on the road and minimal real policing experience.  A civilian police officer in a larger center will do more files and arrests in their first year of policing than an MP will do in their entire career.  That is fact.  MPs are glorified security guards that do minimal police work.

Just ask any MP who has spent some time in the trade that hasn't drank the Kool Aid...

"reports are then scrutinized by people that had minimal time on the road and minimal real policing experience".  Really? 

I am one of those you speak of and I'd put my 11 years on the road plus 9 years of Invest/CFNIS experience up against yours any day.  Reports get reviewed and approved in order to ensure completeness and to ensure patrol MPs and investigators have thoroughly examined the matter and done their job in a thorough manner.

Comments like the ones you make show either your inexperience in the trade or your personal bias.  If you had a problem with a particular supervisor then keep your comments in context.  If you had problems with multiple supervisors then perhaps the problem was you. 

Offline Humphrey Bogart

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #16 on: June 04, 2015, 18:43:16 »
"reports are then scrutinized by people that had minimal time on the road and minimal real policing experience".  Really? 

I am one of those you speak of and I'd put my 11 years on the road plus 9 years of Invest/CFNIS experience up against yours any day.  Reports get reviewed and approved in order to ensure completeness and to ensure patrol MPs and investigators have thoroughly examined the matter and done their job in a thorough manner.

Comments like the ones you make show either your inexperience in the trade or your personal bias.  If you had a problem with a particular supervisor then keep your comments in context.  If you had problems with multiple supervisors then perhaps the problem was you.

I've got no problems with MPs on the NCM side of the house, in fact, all of my experiences with the rank and file MPs from Cpl all the way to MWO have been very good.  The same can't be said for the MP Officer Corps.  I think it's one of the few trades where Officers should probably come exclusively from the ranks, the fact it doesn't work that way is scary.  Not to say I haven't met some good ones but the vast majority of experiences have been negative. 

Offline ExRCDcpl

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #17 on: June 04, 2015, 18:52:21 »
Speaking as a police officer......it absolutely boggles my mind that the MP higher ups have never actually been police officers, or done the job of a police officer.

Astonishing really.

Offline Humphrey Bogart

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #18 on: June 04, 2015, 19:06:27 »
Speaking as a police officer......it absolutely boggles my mind that the MP higher ups have never actually been police officers, or done the job of a police officer.

Astonishing really.

My point exactly, and from what I have seen, this has a direct impact on their ability, or lack thereof, to make good judgement calls a seasoned police officer would make.   :2c:

jollyjacktar

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #19 on: June 04, 2015, 19:41:30 »
I knew several who spent time in harness, they were the exception, however, not the rule. 

I do like the RCMP way of things, they all start out from Depot first and have time on the street before they commission.  It was one of the major peeves of mine that most of my officers who were making the policy decisions on how I did my work and with what equipment etc had a minimal concept of what my work was really like as far as I could see (many were washouts from other trades too boot).  About as much sense as me dictating on how they would do their jobs without any real knowledge or experience of it.

Offline Dimsum

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #20 on: June 04, 2015, 19:48:23 »
I am one of those you speak of and I'd put my 11 years on the road plus 9 years of Invest/CFNIS experience up against yours any day. 

So....how many polyester suits do you own?   :D

And I agree re:  MPOs should be drawn exclusively from the MP NCM trade. 
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline Alberta Bound

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #21 on: June 04, 2015, 22:03:42 »
Rocksteady, every different type of policing has its ups and downs and you can't compare them. You simply have to find the policing that suits you.

All the cops I know that work in large city departments did high volume initial response for a number of years before they ever started actually carrying any reasonably important investigations. They couldn't release a person without a supervisors permission. Then they moved into whatever specialty but get little experience in files outside their area of responsibility.

I know people in small town policing who do the whole range of investigations. They carry their files from cradle to grave. But don't often see high volumes of stuff. Call volume is no measure of how busy or satisfying the police work is.

I know other people in major crimes who do nothing but track tasks, write up search warrants ( essentially take info and fill it in the blanks on a template) and do up spreadsheets and charts. Not very challenging in my mind.

I worked on a reserve of 950 people, 2500 prisoners per year, ( yes, theoretically every resident getting jailed more than 2.5 times per year), 8 members and we did everything from monitoring the Band election, to arresting drunks, to investigating everything in the criminal code.

Each of these can be satisfying depending on what you are looking for. Don't be bitter. Just find another form of policing you enjoy.

Online LunchMeat

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #22 on: June 04, 2015, 22:09:20 »
Plus as an MP you get to deploy on operations, be posted to an Embassy. That's pretty cool.
"The most important six inches on the battlefield is between your ears.” ~General James "Mad Dog" Mattis, USMC

Offline Alberta Bound

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2015, 23:02:06 »
It's what you make of it. 

Offline mariomike

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Re: Leaving local police service for MP
« Reply #24 on: June 05, 2015, 11:02:10 »
While I love working in the law enforcement sector, I've started considering the possibility of applying to be an MP. 

I was curious as to what the OP's decision was. But, there is not much to go by.

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« Last Edit: June 05, 2015, 11:33:11 by mariomike »