Author Topic: Jeans & mass punishment? #2  (Read 20778 times)

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Offline MAJONES

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Re: Jeans & mass punishment? #2
« Reply #150 on: March 07, 2018, 11:40:54 »
Seneca Program and NCM pilot discussion now in separate thread.

RMC and dress code discussion in this thread.

Carry On.

Offline stellarpanther

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Re: Jeans & mass punishment? #2
« Reply #151 on: March 07, 2018, 12:08:01 »
It kind of seems like you actually do condone going to the media, as long as it is the course of last resort. In response to "the civilians you heard wonder out loud," the CF has nothing to be afraid of, but it expects people to follow the rules.

The problem with every Tom, Dick and Harry having the opportunity to jump in front of the camera is that many of them are misinformed, uninformed, or just have an axe to grind. Think of the membership on this board. If we take a cross section of board membership and give them media privileges - do you think accurate information is going to get out? Or will it be contradictory, poorly researched, or possibly even inflammatory?

In the CFNIS, we deal with sensitive often serious cases. Often, media lines need to be drafted and the PAO in consultation with the case manager is the vetting authority for those lines. Would I want every MP with access to the information to be able to speak to it in front of the camera? Absolutely not. Often they aren't privy to all the available information in order to make an informed opinion. As I've seen here, too many people have an axe to grind and come out swinging without all the information, or choose to release selective information in order to influence opinion.

If the OCdts are truly unable to effect change - to whit - jeans, in their institution, and they feel they need to use the media as a cudgel, I would suggest they instead take their release and give themselves the privilege of wearing jeans all day, everyday.

I posted what I've heard others or civilians comment on but it doesn't necessarily mean that I agree with the decision.  Sometimes trying to read between the lines doesn't work.  I am saying that I don't support going to the media.  If mbr's have concerns, there are other legal avenues that can be taken.  I'll say it one more time.  I don't support violating ANY regulations.

Offline Haggis

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Re: Jeans & mass punishment? #2
« Reply #152 on: March 20, 2018, 10:11:38 »
I'm assuming that Seneca students don't have compulsory language classes?

Bilingualism points make a big difference in career paths these days.

Indeed bilingualism is important, more so as one increases in rank.  It's quite probably much more difficult to find and fit in SLT in Toronto after school hours than it is to receive it at RMC.

Para 5.1 of CEOTP DAOD (5002-6) reads: "5.1 Professional development policy, which includes second language requirements, is set out in DAOD 5031-8, Canadian Forces Professional Development."  So, in very broad terms, the requirements to meet all other criteria of the Officer General Specifications (OGS) remain.

Like NCM SEP focuses on the Red Seal trades, the Seneca training seems to be focused solely on the technical skills of being a pilot. Everything else required by DAOD 5031-8 is left up to the individual, supported by his University Liaison Office.
Train like your life depends on it.  Some day, it may.

Offline BeyondTheNow

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Re: Jeans & mass punishment? #2
« Reply #153 on: March 20, 2018, 12:58:59 »
It kind of seems like you actually do condone going to the media, as long as it is the course of last resort. In response to "the civilians you heard wonder out loud," the CF has nothing to be afraid of, but it expects people to follow the rules.

The problem with every Tom, Dick and Harry having the opportunity to jump in front of the camera is that many of them are misinformed, uninformed, or just have an axe to grind. Think of the membership on this board. If we take a cross section of board membership and give them media privileges - do you think accurate information is going to get out? Or will it be contradictory, poorly researched, or possibly even inflammatory?

In the CFNIS, we deal with sensitive often serious cases. Often, media lines need to be drafted and the PAO in consultation with the case manager is the vetting authority for those lines. Would I want every MP with access to the information to be able to speak to it in front of the camera? Absolutely not. Often they aren't privy to all the available information in order to make an informed opinion. As I've seen here, too many people have an axe to grind and come out swinging without all the information, or choose to release selective information in order to influence opinion.

If the OCdts are truly unable to effect change - to whit - jeans, in their institution, and they feel they need to use the media as a cudgel, I would suggest they instead take their release and give themselves the privilege of wearing jeans all day, everyday.

And I guess RMC students simply don't get the same lecture they give in BMQ. Paraphrasing of course, "If you're not authorized, don't speak to the media about anything. And/but if they approach you, this is what you're allowed to say..." It was pretty clear.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2018, 13:01:53 by BeyondTheNow »
"Stop worrying about getting back to who you were before it all went wrong. To heal is to understand that the person you've since become is the one who's most capable of doing whatever it is you were put here to do."~SR

Offline mariomike

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Re: Jeans & mass punishment? #2
« Reply #154 on: March 20, 2018, 14:01:38 »
Paraphrasing of course, "If you're not authorized, don't speak to the media about anything. And/but if they approach you, this is what you're allowed to say..." It was pretty clear.

Sounds like good advice for anyone wishing to avoid career suicide.

Reminds me of something I read many years ago. ( The language could use modernization, but I believe the message is still true. )

"If you work for a man, in heaven's name work for him. If he pays you wages which supply you bread and butter, work for him; speak well of him; stand by him, and stand by the institution he represents. If put to a pinch, an ounce of loyalty is worth a pound of cleverness. If you must vilify, condemn, and eternally disparage, resign your position, and when you are outside, damn to your heart's content, but as long as you are part of the institution do not condemn it. If you do that, you are loosening the tendrils that are holding you to the institution, and at the first high wind that comes along, you will be uprooted and blown away, and will probably never know the reason why."
Elbert Hubbard

Offline X Royal

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Re: Jeans & mass punishment? #2
« Reply #155 on: March 21, 2018, 17:23:24 »
Just my opinion but when loyalty is earned it's precious.
When bought by a pay check it's not that valuable.
No value also leads to no guarantee it will last.