Author Topic: Seneca College Pilot Program ( CEOTP )  (Read 368157 times)

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Offline ringo_mountbatten

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Seneca College Pilot Program ( CEOTP )
« on: July 25, 2003, 07:24:00 »
I was just wondering if anybody had any info on the CEOTP entry plan that isn‘t otherwise posted on the recruiting website.  I am going to make a trip to the recruiting centre soon, but any info I can have before hand would be appreciated. Thanks for any help.

Offline jovi

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CEOTP (i searched)
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2004, 15:12:00 »
How challenging is it to get in CEOTP? I wanted to try to get in MARS. Anyone have insight on this program. I checked DND sites also. I have pretty good high school grades(high 80s).

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks!
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Offline Ditch

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CEOTP is back!
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2005, 20:45:54 »
New CANFORGEN that directs CFRC to recruit non-degreed Officer applicants for unspecified MOSID's:

================================================== =====

FM NDHQ OTTAWA//ADM(HR-MIL)//
TO CANFORGEN
BT
UNCLAS CANFORGEN 156/05 ADM(HR-MIL)076
SIC WAS
BILINGUAL MESSAGE / MESSAGE BILINGUE
SUBJECT: CONTINUING EDUCATION OFFICER TRAINING PLAN - (CEOTP)
REFS: A. ADM(HR-MIL) INSTRUCTION 01/00
B. MND 10 (REVISED 16 AUGUST 2005)
C. ADM(HR-MIL) INSTRUCTION 09/05 CONTINUING EDUCATION OFFICER
TRAINING PLAN
1. THE ADM(HR-MIL) IS PLEASED TO ANNOUNCE THE INTRODUCTION OF A NEW
OFFICER PRODUCTION PLAN THAT WILL ASSIST IN FORCE EXPANSION AND THE
ALLEVIATION OF OFFICER SHORTAGES IN SOME OCCUPATIONS
2. ADM(HR-MIL) INSTRUCTION 09/05 CONTINUING EDUCATION OFFICER
TRAINING PLAN (CEOTP), WILL BE IN EFFECT ON 12 OCTOBER 2005. THIS
INSTRUCTION SUPERSEDES REF A, AND APPLIES TO CIVILIAN CANDIDATES FOR
THE CF, REG F NCM, AND MEMBERS OF THE P RES THROUGH COMPONENT
TRANSFER



PAGE 2 RCCPJAW4005 UNCLAS CANFORGEN 156/05
3. THE CEOTP PROVIDES AN OFFICER ENROLMENT/TRANSFER PLAN FOR
CANDIDATES WHO, WHILE OTHERWISE SUITABLE FOR SERVICE AS OFFICERS IN
THE CF, DO NOT POSSESS A UNIVERSITY DEGREE. REF B HAS BEEN REVISED
TO PERMIT THE COMMISSIONING OF OFFICERS WITHOUT A DEGREE PROVIDED
THAT THEY COMPLETE A DEGREE WITHIN THEIR INITIAL ENGAGEMENT
4. THIS PROGRAM PROVIDES FOR STRONG CF SUPPORT FOR CANDIDATES TO
ACHIEVE A DEGREE WITHIN THE REQUISITE TIME. THE CANADIAN DEFENCE
ACADEMY (CDA) WILL WORK WITH EACH CANDIDATE TO DEVELOP AN ACHIEVABLE
INDIVIDUAL LEARNING PLAN (ILP), WILL PROVIDE OVERSIGHT OF ACADEMIC
PROGRAMS, AND WILL ACT AS ACADEMIC ADVISOR TO ALL CANDIDATES.
DIRECTOR GENERAL MILITARY CARREER (DGMC) WILL PROVIDE THE PROGRAM
MANAGEMENT ASPECTS OF THE CEOTP. THIS IS A SHARED RESPONSIBILITY OF
THE CHAIN OF COMMAND AND THE INDIVIDUAL MEMBER
5. CF MEMBERS ARE STRONGLY ENCOURAGED TO FAMILIARIZE THEMSELVES
WITH REF C
6. [REMOVED FOR PERSEC ISSUES]
END OF ENGLISH TEXT / LE TEXTE FRANCAIS SUIT
OBJET: PROGRAMME DE FORMATION DES OFFICIERS - EDUCATION PERMANENTE
(PFOEP)



PAGE 3 RCCPJAW4005 UNCLAS CANFORGEN 156/05
REFS: A. INSTRUCTION DU SMA(RH-MIL) 01/00
B. MDN 10 (REVISE LE 16 AOUT 2005)
C. INSTRUCTION DU SMA(RH-MIL) 09/05 PROGRAMME DE FORMATION DES
OFFICIERS - EDUCATION PERMANENTE
1. LE SMA(RH-MIL) A LE PLAISIR D ANNONCER L INTRODUCTION D UN
NOUVEAU PLAN DE PRODUCTION D OFFICIERS. CE PLAN AIDERA A
L EXPANSION DES FC ET TENTERA D ATTENUER L INSUFFISANCE D OFFICIERS
DANS CERTAINES OCCUPATIONS
2. L INSTRUCTION 09/05 DU SMA(RH-MIL) PROGRAMME DE FORMATION DES
OFFICIERS - EDUCATION PERMANENTE (PFOEP) ENTRERA EN VIGEUR LE 12
OCTOBRE 2005. CETTE INSTRUCTION ANNULE LA REF A. ELLE S APPLIQUE
AUX CANDIDATS CIVILS QUI VEULENT S ENROLER DANS LES FC AINSI QU AUX
MR DE LA FORCE REGULIERE ET LES MEMBRES DE LA PREMIERE RESERVE
(P RES) VIA UNE MUTATION ENTRE ELEMENTS
3. LE PFOEP EST UN PLAN D ENROLEMENT/MUTATION A L INTENTION DES
CANDIDATS QUI SONT EN TOUS POINTS QUALIFIES POUR LE SERVICE EN TANT
QU OFFICIERS, MAIS NE POSSEDENT PAS UN DIPLOME UNIVERSITAIRE. LA
REFERENCE B A ETE MODIFIEE AFIN DE PERMETTRE LA NOMINATION DES
OFFICIERS SANS DIPLOME UNIVERSITAIRE, A CONDITION QU ILS COMPLETENT
CE DIPLOME A L INTERIEUR DE LEUR PERIODE INITIALE D ENGAGEMENT



PAGE 4 RCCPJAW4005 UNCLAS CANFORGEN 156/05
4. CE PLAN FOURNIT UN EXCELLENT SOUTIEN AUX CANDIDATS AFIN QU ILS
TERMINENT LEUR DIPLOME DANS LE TEMPS REQUIS. L ACADEMIE CANADIENNE
DE LA DEFENSE (ACD) AIDERA CHAQUE CANDIDAT A DEFINIR UN PROGRAMME
REALISTE D ENSEIGNEMENT INDIVIDUEL (PEI), SE CHARGERA DE SURVEILLER
LES PROGRAMMES ACADEMIQUES, ET ASSUMERA LE ROLE D AVISEUR ACADEMIQUE
AUPRES DE TOUS LES CANDIDATS DU PFOEP. LE DIRECTEUR GENERAL
CARRIERES MILITAIRES (DGCM) ASSUMERA LA GERANCE ADMINISTRATIVE DU
PFOEP. IL SAGIT D UNE RESPONSABILITE PARTAGEE ENTRE LA CHAINE DE
COMMANDEMENT ET LE MEMBRE
5. ON ENCOURAGE LES MEMBRES DES FC A PRENDRE CONNAISSANCE DE LA REF

6. [REMOVED FOR PERSEC ISSUES]
« Last Edit: October 17, 2005, 21:26:30 by Michael O'Leary »
Per Ardua Ad Astra

Offline kincanucks

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2005, 20:52:56 »
The two most prominent occupations are Pilot and MARS with limited positions in Combat Arms, ANAV, AEC and LOG.  There are not a lot of positions for any of the occupations so speed is of the essence here.  Remember you still have to meet the educational requirements, which are Gr 12 advanced courses that can get you into a university degree programme.
- Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.
- If we are the only intelligent life in the universe, at least there's a finite number of idiots.
- Just when you realize life's a *****, it has puppies.

Offline InterestedParty

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2005, 20:59:03 »
Kincanucks

Wonder if you had any sense in what's behind the restoration of this program? Has there been a shortage of University grads going DEO - or is this just a way to open up the talent pool?

cheers, mdh

Offline kincanucks

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2005, 21:02:38 »
It just makes sense.  We are having problems attracting suitable DEO applicants so why not give the university eligible applicants who can't afford to go to university right now the oportunity to get an occupation that they really want and want now.
- Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.
- If we are the only intelligent life in the universe, at least there's a finite number of idiots.
- Just when you realize life's a *****, it has puppies.

Offline aspiring officer

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2005, 21:05:17 »
Quote
PAGE 2 RCCPJAW4005 UNCLAS CANFORGEN 156/05
3. THE CEOTP PROVIDES AN OFFICER ENROLMENT/TRANSFER PLAN FOR
CANDIDATES WHO, WHILE OTHERWISE SUITABLE FOR SERVICE AS OFFICERS IN
THE CF, DO NOT POSSESS A UNIVERSITY DEGREE. REF B HAS BEEN REVISED
TO PERMIT THE COMMISSIONING OF OFFICERS WITHOUT A DEGREE PROVIDED
THAT THEY COMPLETE A DEGREE WITHIN THEIR INITIAL ENGAGEMENT
what is the difference between this and ROTP? I don't quite understand. Is this to say that if I graduated highschool with the required courses, I can be commissioned and then start my way to a degree?


Offline kincanucks

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2005, 21:07:28 »
what is the difference between this and ROTP? I don't quite understand. Is this to say that if I graduated highschool with the required courses, I can be commissioned and then start my way to a degree?

Wow.  With ROTP you go to school for four years right from the start and with this entry program you learn your job first then work on your degree within your initial engagement.  Clear as mud?
- Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.
- If we are the only intelligent life in the universe, at least there's a finite number of idiots.
- Just when you realize life's a *****, it has puppies.

Offline Moody

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2005, 12:30:49 »
Remember you still have to meet the educational requirements, which are Gr 12 advanced courses that can get you into a university degree programme.

Yep, found that out this morning. I have been going to University part time for a couple of years now while completing my Private Pilot's License hoping that CEOTP would open again or I might qualify for ROTP. I was not eligible because I was accepted to a civie U as a mature student. *Sigh*

BTW, I have never seen the CFRC so busy (yes I've been there a few times) and each person was there for the CEOTP for Pilots. Some interesting future Officers to say the least! SO - if you are qualified - DON'T WAIT!!!!! As Kincanucks mentioned - spots are limited and some people have been waiting years for this program to re-open.

Good luck to all those who are eligible!!

Thanks Zoomie and Kincanucks for all of the information you have provided through both this posting and all of your recruiting / 032 posts! Your information was truly invaluable.

Offline Bograt

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2005, 13:16:51 »
Silly Question Alert
Okay, in the example of a 32U. A member would be required to get a four year degree, 6 OPMEs, SLT plus get through flight training, all within the 9 year contract? Are you sure the member needs to get his wings, he must already have a cape.

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Offline sigpig

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2005, 13:19:05 »
Wow.  With ROTP you go to school for four years right from the start and with this entry program you learn your job first then work on your degree within your initial engagement.  Clear as mud?


I've been out for awhile so what I can't remember has probably changed anyway. Is an ie for officers 9 years? If so, that would mean while you are doing your normal job - courses, ex's, teaching, UN tours, OPDP's (still do those?), whatever replaced the FOE's, etc, that you would have to complete a 3 or four year degree in your 'spare time.'  :D

Is there a restriction on what degree you can pursue? As someone who entered in the old OCTP (that has been gone for awhile I believe?) I'm glad to see this come in. Although it will be interesting to see how it works in practice.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2005, 13:21:37 by sigpig »

Offline Moody

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2005, 13:43:16 »
Bograt, that was a good laugh. I like the marquee.

Is there a restriction on what degree you can pursue?

In the case of Pilot, no. Any BA will do. Some might help you more than others though.

I was sitting in the chair at the CFRC while it was being explained to me and realized (as Bograt mentioned) that I might have to clone myself in addition to upgrading my Gr.12's. Also, I wasn't sure how I felt about being an Officer Cadet for a long time. But I still I wish I had a shot...

Perhaps Kincanucks may be able to shed some light on how the Degree fits in with all of the training & courses that a Pilot must complete. I know my recruiter was not sure about this point when I asked.


Offline Matt_Fisher

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2005, 13:50:21 »
Is there any preference given to an applicant that already has completed a portion of their post-secondary education as opposed to an equally qualified candidate with the exception that they have not taken any post-secondary courses towards a degree?

Offline Moody

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2005, 14:00:40 »
Is there any preference given to an applicant that already has completed a portion of their post-secondary education as opposed to an equally qualified candidate with the exception that they have not taken any post-secondary courses towards a degree?

IF you have competitive grades in your Gr.12 subjects then yes. If not - no. (From what I was told this morning). As I mentioned, I am a part time University student with significant flight training under my belt and I don't qualify for CEOTP since my Gr.12 marks are not that great. I am doing really well in University, had a 92 average in College but, it does not matter. (You may not be applying for Pilot but I just wanted to give a scenario.) I was told that it is the highschool marks that matter and that you must be   UNCONDITIONALLY accepted or be able to be unconditionally accepted to university. Mature students, Special Students etc. do not qualify. I am a mature student so I don't qualify.

BUT I COULD BE WRONG. This is what I was told this a.m.

I'm hoping Kincanucks will add to this thread for everybody. He may be able to add to or correct what I have posted on the details of CEOTP. I am just adding what I was told during my session this morning. Your best bet is to talk to a Recruiter about your situation. Don't let my situation scare you from inquiring or applying...
« Last Edit: October 18, 2005, 14:18:45 by MG »

Offline Inch

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2005, 14:17:54 »
Silly Question Alert
Okay, in the example of a 32U. A member would be required to get a four year degree, 6 OPMEs, SLT plus get through flight training, all within the 9 year contract? Are you sure the member needs to get his wings, he must already have a cape.



A 3 year degree will suffice, 4 of the 6 OPMEs are university level courses and will count towards that degree. I was CEOTP, I have completed flight training, SLT, 2/3 of my degree and 4 of 6 OPMEs in 6 years. Plus 8 months of that was spent in Sault College completing my Aviation Technology Diploma, so it's entirely possible. You just have to manage your time, instead of screwing around while waiting for Moose Jaw, put your time to good use and get the majority, if not all, of your degree out of the way.
You sir are a moron!
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Offline kincanucks

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #15 on: October 18, 2005, 14:28:03 »
A 3 year degree will suffice, 4 of the 6 OPMEs are university level courses and will count towards that degree. I was CEOTP, I have completed flight training, SLT, 2/3 of my degree and 4 of 6 OPMEs in 6 years. Plus 8 months of that was spent in Sault College completing my Aviation Technology Diploma, so it's entirely possible. You just have to manage your time, instead of screwing around while waiting for Moose Jaw, put your time to good use and get the majority, if not all, of your degree out of the way.

In addition to this excellent post, I would like to add that if you become a fully trained pilot and have made a substantial effort toward the completion of your basket weaving, sorry music, degree I think they may rather hold on to a pilot then turf them for not finishing their degree in their initial engagement.  Just a thought.
- Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.
- If we are the only intelligent life in the universe, at least there's a finite number of idiots.
- Just when you realize life's a *****, it has puppies.

Offline Inch

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #16 on: October 18, 2005, 14:41:33 »
In addition to this excellent post, I would like to add that if you become a fully trained pilot and have made a substantial effort toward the completion of your basket weaving, sorry music, degree I think they may rather hold on to a pilot then turf them for not finishing their degree in their initial engagement.   Just a thought.

You're not that far off base, I signed my IE last year. With the 7 years restricted release, they won't let you go when you hit the 9 year mark. It took me 5 years to get trained, and once you get your wings you owe 7 years, so do the math. They most likely will not release you at the 9 year mark if you have yet to complete your degree.
You sir are a moron!
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Offline Bograt

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #17 on: October 18, 2005, 14:42:29 »
A 3 year degree will suffice, 4 of the 6 OPMEs are university level courses and will count towards that degree. I was CEOTP, I have completed flight training, SLT, 2/3 of my degree and 4 of 6 OPMEs in 6 years. Plus 8 months of that was spent in Sault College completing my Aviation Technology Diploma, so it's entirely possible. You just have to manage your time, instead of screwing around while waiting for Moose Jaw, put your time to good use and get the majority, if not all, of your degree out of the way.

Always knew you had a cape.

You going to the mess diner on the 4th?
Hannah and Robbie's Dad

Offline Inch

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #18 on: October 18, 2005, 14:44:10 »
Always knew you had a cape.

You going to the mess diner on the 4th?


Ha!

I'm SDO and the last thing I want to be around is a bunch of guys that are into the sauce when I have to stay sober, so probably not unless I can find a sub for the night.
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Offline mbhabfan

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #19 on: October 18, 2005, 14:49:50 »
haven't been on in awhile...but here goes.  I am 32 and in June passed the cfat, physical, medical, and interviewing.  I was given an offer for AVN and turned it down.  I was initially trying for pilot at that time but did not meet the degree requirements.  My question is having turned down the AVN tech offer, are my chances even less now?  Pilot is what I have been wanting just didn't seem like it was going to work out.

Offline kincanucks

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #20 on: October 18, 2005, 15:09:59 »
haven't been on in awhile...but here goes.   I am 32 and in June passed the cfat, physical, medical, and interviewing.   I was given an offer for AVN and turned it down.   I was initially trying for pilot at that time but did not meet the degree requirements.   My question is having turned down the AVN tech offer, are my chances even less now?   Pilot is what I have been wanting just didn't seem like it was going to work out.

If AVN was your first choice then you have to wait until after Dec before they will reopen your file.  The turning down of an offer doesn't reflect well upon your motivation but if you excel in other areas it can be overlooked.  Good Luck.
- Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.
- If we are the only intelligent life in the universe, at least there's a finite number of idiots.
- Just when you realize life's a *****, it has puppies.

Offline Bograt

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #21 on: October 18, 2005, 15:13:27 »
Mhabfan,

It won't have any effect. Best thing to do is go to the CFRS and arrange a meeting with the Captain. Give it a shot and best of luck.

Inch,

I was wanting to go, but don't have a date (wife will be in Terra Nova). You know if the other Lts are going? Drinking alone is one of those boxes in the social worker questionnaire one does not what to check. :)
Hannah and Robbie's Dad

Offline mbhabfan

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #22 on: October 18, 2005, 15:25:21 »
I had chosen pilot as my first choice on my application, and AVN as second.  They would not accept the pilot as first choice due to the lack of degree. 

Offline kincanucks

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #23 on: October 18, 2005, 15:27:13 »
I had chosen pilot as my first choice on my application, and AVN as second.   They would not accept the pilot as first choice due to the lack of degree.  

Therefore, AVN was your first choice.  Discuss it with your CFRC/D.
- Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.
- If we are the only intelligent life in the universe, at least there's a finite number of idiots.
- Just when you realize life's a *****, it has puppies.

Offline mbhabfan

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Re: CEOTP is back!
« Reply #24 on: November 20, 2005, 21:33:34 »
can anyone answer if the ceotp is filled for pilot this time around? Also, I have been chosen for a second interview for pilot this time, does everyone make the interview stage or do they screen some out right off the bat?  Are the ceotp pilot positions for this coming January or when?  Thanks.