Author Topic: Marks / Grades: School / GED or PLAR [MERGED]  (Read 271819 times)

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Offline Buck_HRA

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Re: Marks / Grades: School / GED or PLAR [MERGED]
« Reply #550 on: June 12, 2017, 09:07:55 »
Yes, I understand that. They also explained this. I just mean, even with meeting those requirements, would my HISTORY of missing school affect my chances?
As PuckChaser stated be prepared to explain.  If you missed/skipped school for a legitimate reason, or if it's been years and you've proven that you're more reliable now it likely won't have any impact or much of an impact.  If it's that you recently skipped school and it was because you were "sick of the system" (just an example); that wouldn't play well during your interview.
No matter the reason you will have to fill in the gap of that 1.5 years when you do your interview.

Offline rchapelas

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Enlisting & Education Req.
« Reply #551 on: February 03, 2018, 10:20:10 »
So my question here mainly is the Education Requirements for Enlisting, It says that to join you are required to have completed Grade 10 - 12 or GED Equivalent! What i don’t understand is why the requirements other than the simple fact that they do not want to recruit idiots? I feel as a Highschool Dropout that the requirements are unfair for “Mature Adults” who have spent most their Teenage / Adult Lives working for a living and self teaching themselves skills that are not taught by our Educational System.

I myself spent time with the Army Cadets and my future goal was to Enlist with the Forces at 18 but due to the fact that i never was any good at School or Books in general and was more of a Hands On Learner, That i did not reach the Educational Requirements that the Canadian Forces expect Recruits to have. I also don’t understand as to why it is required for jobs such as “Infantry” or “Mobile Support Operators” since they do what most Dropouts do on a regular basis in standard civilization who have excelled at those jobs better than most Graduates from Highschool, College, Operator Schools or avid Hunters or Competition Shooters. Also i have talked to many Ex Army in Canada and the U.S about how they got in without a Grade 10 and some were at one point Special Forces and they have all told me the same thing, You don’t need a Grade 10 and to just walk into a Recruiter’s and apply but i have talked to Recruiters and they tell me i need to pass the Educational Requirements.

So is Grade 10 absolute mandatory? Or is there other ways around it?
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 10:24:24 by rchapelas »

Online mariomike

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Re: Enlisting & Education Req.
« Reply #552 on: February 03, 2018, 10:29:18 »
So is Grade 10 absolute mandatory?

QUOTE

To start a full or part-time career in the Canadian Armed Forces (CAF) you must:

•have completed at least Grade 10 or Secondaire IV in Québec (some jobs need higher levels of education)
https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/services/caf-jobs/apply-now.html

END QUOTE

As always, Recruiting is your most trusted source of official, up to date information.

"Unofficial site, not associated with DND or the Canadian Armed Forces."

« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 10:32:27 by mariomike »
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Offline Pickle Rick

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Re: Enlisting & Education Req.
« Reply #553 on: February 03, 2018, 11:44:41 »

Also i have talked to many Ex Army in Canada and the U.S about how they got in without a Grade 10 and some were at one point Special Forces and they have all told me the same thing, You don’t need a Grade 10 and to just walk into a Recruiter’s and apply but i have talked to Recruiters and they tell me i need to pass the Educational Requirements.

So is Grade 10 absolute mandatory? Or is there other ways around it?

How long ago did these people you talked with claim they served? Also, are you sure they are legitimate?

Grade 10 is the minimum, no way around that.  The recruiter(s) you’ve spoken with told you that.

Some NCM trades(and all officer MOSIDS) require higher levels of education.  With only having grade 10, you probably won’t merit as well compared to someone who finished high school or has a higher level of education.

As well, the current US Military minimum for education is grade 12 or GED.


Lastly, there will be classroom learning within the Military, even in the Infantry.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 13:53:51 by Pickle Rick »

Offline EpicBeardedMan

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Re: Enlisting & Education Req.
« Reply #554 on: February 03, 2018, 13:20:44 »
You don’t need a Grade 10 and to just walk into a Recruiter’s and apply but i have talked to Recruiters and they tell me i need to pass the Educational Requirements.

So is Grade 10 absolute mandatory? Or is there other ways around it?

Sounds like you just answered your own question....
The military isn't really like a James Bond movie where you go for jet training in the morning and then underwater demolitions after lunch.

Offline Loachman

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Re: Enlisting & Education Req.
« Reply #555 on: February 03, 2018, 14:50:43 »
Welcome to Army.ca

Keep in mind that minimum standards  (which will not be waived) are exactly that - minimum. Many occupations are highly competitive, and education is an easily-measured factor by which prospective candidates are evaluated. Simply meeting standards may not suffice. One should always strive to exceed them.

The ability to learn is crucial, and that includes classroom learning. You need to demonstrate that capability. If you want this enough, you will do what is required and more. If you are not so willing, then this is not the career for you. We want, need, and expect excellence, not mediocrity. Lives - including yours - and expensive equipment depend upon topnotch performance.

Take some time to look around this Site. There is a ton of useful information and guidance here in a variety of threads. Reading through some of those would be a good start.

Qapla.

Offline Piece of Cake

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Re: Enlisting & Education Req.
« Reply #556 on: February 03, 2018, 16:51:21 »
So my question here mainly is the Education Requirements for Enlisting, It says that to join you are required to have completed Grade 10 - 12 or GED Equivalent! What i don’t understand is why the requirements other than the simple fact that they do not want to recruit idiots? I feel as a Highschool Dropout that the requirements are unfair for “Mature Adults” who have spent most their Teenage / Adult Lives working for a living and self teaching themselves skills that are not taught by our Educational System.

I myself spent time with the Army Cadets and my future goal was to Enlist with the Forces at 18 but due to the fact that i never was any good at School or Books in general and was more of a Hands On Learner, That i did not reach the Educational Requirements that the Canadian Forces expect Recruits to have. I also don’t understand as to why it is required for jobs such as “Infantry” or “Mobile Support Operators” since they do what most Dropouts do on a regular basis in standard civilization who have excelled at those jobs better than most Graduates from Highschool, College, Operator Schools or avid Hunters or Competition Shooters. Also i have talked to many Ex Army in Canada and the U.S about how they got in without a Grade 10 and some were at one point Special Forces and they have all told me the same thing, You don’t need a Grade 10 and to just walk into a Recruiter’s and apply but i have talked to Recruiters and they tell me i need to pass the Educational Requirements.

So is Grade 10 absolute mandatory? Or is there other ways around it?

rchapelas, could you please describe what you believe are the main duties of an infantry soldier and a mobile support operator.  Also, could you please explain the skills and traits required for the above mentioned trades.
Policy is more than black and white.  We need to not only understand the spirit of why a policy was written, but also how the policy affects people.

Offline EpicBeardedMan

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Re: Enlisting & Education Req.
« Reply #557 on: February 03, 2018, 21:00:32 »
I also don’t understand as to why it is required for jobs such as “Infantry” or “Mobile Support Operators” since they do what most Dropouts do on a regular basis in standard civilization

I don't know if you are purposely trying to come off as demeaning but I suggest you check yourself before you offend people on here from these trades that are apparently full of "high school dropouts". You'd be surprised at the quality of people in the CF...apparently.
The military isn't really like a James Bond movie where you go for jet training in the morning and then underwater demolitions after lunch.

Offline Loachman

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Re: Marks / Grades: School / GED or PLAR [MERGED]
« Reply #558 on: February 03, 2018, 22:22:25 »
Unless and until somebody has something excruciatingly constructive to add, there is no need to post anything further until rchapelas returns with additional questions.

Offline Xylric

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Business Background
« Reply #559 on: February 20, 2018, 02:19:43 »
I run a start-up company in which a plurality of staff have some significant neurological variations. For both legal and moral reasons, I can't really go into detail, but it has left me to wonder. Given that my administrative and managerial experience has involved ensuring that the staffers are able to put their skills to use in ways that complement each others' strengths while neutralizing weaknesses, giving full account to any specifics (with the understanding that I can't help people who aren't fully honest with me about their specific challenges and risks), how different would this be from being an officer in the Canadian Forces?

Given that the military is structurally more inherently hierarchical, it seems to me that the best managerial practices of the civilian world may prove insufficient. It's the difference between a group of sled dogs and a pack of wolves, in my estimation. One works together effortlessly in regards to a specific individual task, and the other is much more similar to a family group, working as a symbiotic whole in *all* regards.

I wrote the CFAT earlier this month at least partly out of the premise that I have a demonstrated ability to forge a stable team out of individuals with skills and backgrounds which do not blend naturally (given that the company has been in operation longer than five years). I have my suspicions that it's rather arrogant for me to believe that this skill alone is sufficient justification to seek a military career, but I'm glad to make the attempt.

Offline Xylric

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #560 on: February 21, 2018, 17:15:51 »
I should probably clarify what my question is, since my previous post read more like I'm making a statement rather than asking a question.

How useful would a background in business (with additional experience in special education) be for a serving officer in the Canadian Forces?

Offline Marchog

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #561 on: February 21, 2018, 18:28:04 »
I am not an officer, but I do know that different trades require different degrees from their officers. For example, it is doubtful (I'm going to go out on a limb and say impossible) for you to become a medical officer without a medicine-related degree, but someone with more knowledge might correct me. I can however, say rather certainly that combat arms trades such as artillery, infantry, and armoured, are somewhat less picky in terms of degrees (e.g., they'll take humanities).

Basically, it depends on what *kind* of officer you want to be. If you were to specify, I'm sure somewhat would be able to better help you.

Offline Xylric

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #562 on: February 21, 2018, 20:12:34 »
Well, I was originally looking at a Pilot role, but when they suggested that I look into Naval Warfare, it was something which seemed far more suitable. My background in business is experiential (though I do have a diploma from Sheridan College for Marketing), with my degree being in something else (History & Anthropology of Religion, in essence).

Offline Marchog

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #563 on: February 21, 2018, 20:38:09 »
In that case, take a look at the description for Naval Warfare Officer here: https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/services/caf-jobs/career-options/fields-work/air-ship-crew/naval-warfare-officer.html

Most of the descriptions for officer positions will tell you what degree you require.

Offline Xylric

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #564 on: February 21, 2018, 21:46:43 »
I think I'm in the odd situation where my supplementary education is far more applicable than my actual degree. We'll see what they say as things progress - I passed the CFAT, and am scheduled for medical in a few weeks.

Offline Roger123

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #565 on: February 22, 2018, 06:19:32 »
Well, I was originally looking at a Pilot role, but when they suggested that I look into Naval Warfare, it was something which seemed far more suitable. My background in business is experiential (though I do have a diploma from Sheridan College for Marketing), with my degree being in something else (History & Anthropology of Religion, in essence).
I may be understanding you incorrectly, but the impression I get is that you are trying to match your educational background/ experience to an officer position that is likely to benefit most from what you have to offer. Why not look through the different officer trades and find something that interests you and see if you meet the requirements.

Offline Buck_HRA

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #566 on: February 22, 2018, 10:02:55 »
When individuals are unsure about the various occupations in the CAF and whether they would be a good fit with their education I normally suggest going into a Recruiting Centre to speak with the staff there; this gives a better interaction and ability for you to ask follow up questions vice seeking advice online.

Offline Loachman

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #567 on: February 22, 2018, 13:05:15 »
Roger123's and Buck_HRA's advice is the best, and the latter is a Recruiter of solid repute.

What do you want to do?

Reading through older (but, in most cases, still active) threads will give you more insight.

Offline Xylric

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #568 on: February 22, 2018, 19:29:22 »
Oh, I'm *very* sure about what I'm after - my great-great grandfather was a shipwright who came to Nova Scotia after the shipyards he worked at in Scotland shut down in the late 19th century. When 1910 came around, he would've been one of the key factors in the construction of the first native ships of the Canadian Navy.

Becoming a Naval Warfare Officer would be a filial duty as a result, and one that I would proudly commit myself to (providing that I am deemed suitable, that is). My question was ultimately an academic one, because while I can see where my experience in business *could* be useful (in regards to nearly all administrative tasks), I'm simply unfamiliar with the differences that I'd need to adapt towards.

Offline Loachman

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #569 on: February 22, 2018, 20:17:42 »
That you will learn during your training, and for a long time afterwards.

It sounds like you have made a decision.

Congratulations.

Offline Marchog

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #570 on: February 23, 2018, 09:54:51 »
Oh, I'm *very* sure about what I'm after - my great-great grandfather was a shipwright who came to Nova Scotia after the shipyards he worked at in Scotland shut down in the late 19th century. When 1910 came around, he would've been one of the key factors in the construction of the first native ships of the Canadian Navy.

Becoming a Naval Warfare Officer would be a filial duty as a result, and one that I would proudly commit myself to (providing that I am deemed suitable, that is). My question was ultimately an academic one, because while I can see where my experience in business *could* be useful (in regards to nearly all administrative tasks), I'm simply unfamiliar with the differences that I'd need to adapt towards.

I suppose I can relate, since I accidentally picked the same trade as an ancestor of mine, without even knowing. Blood thicker than water, etc etc.

Good luck!

Offline Piece of Cake

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #571 on: February 25, 2018, 09:12:12 »
I run a start-up company in which a plurality of staff have some significant neurological variations. For both legal and moral reasons, I can't really go into detail, but it has left me to wonder. Given that my administrative and managerial experience has involved ensuring that the staffers are able to put their skills to use in ways that complement each others' strengths while neutralizing weaknesses, giving full account to any specifics (with the understanding that I can't help people who aren't fully honest with me about their specific challenges and risks), how different would this be from being an officer in the Canadian Forces?

Given that the military is structurally more inherently hierarchical, it seems to me that the best managerial practices of the civilian world may prove insufficient. It's the difference between a group of sled dogs and a pack of wolves, in my estimation. One works together effortlessly in regards to a specific individual task, and the other is much more similar to a family group, working as a symbiotic whole in *all* regards.

I wrote the CFAT earlier this month at least partly out of the premise that I have a demonstrated ability to forge a stable team out of individuals with skills and backgrounds which do not blend naturally (given that the company has been in operation longer than five years). I have my suspicions that it's rather arrogant for me to believe that this skill alone is sufficient justification to seek a military career, but I'm glad to make the attempt.

Hi Xylric,

Your questions are great and touch on several issues that were addressed in fall 2016 Auditor General's report.

5.67 The Canadian Armed Forces’ website is a key source of information for job seekers about the Canadian Armed Forces as an employer, as well as about its various occupations. We found that the website did not provide potential applicants with a tool to identify the occupations they were best suited or qualified for. The information was organized by occupation, but there was no way for job seekers to view job descriptions or educational requirements without clicking through many pages. As well, many occupations lacked civilian-equivalent titles. These issues may make it difficult for applicants who are unfamiliar with the Canadian Armed Forces to find the information they need.
Source: http://www.oag-bvg.gc.ca/internet/English/parl_oag_201611_05_e_41834.html#p51
Policy is more than black and white.  We need to not only understand the spirit of why a policy was written, but also how the policy affects people.

Offline Xylric

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #572 on: February 26, 2018, 02:27:09 »
Thanks to all who answered.

Offline Pusser

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Re: Business Background
« Reply #573 on: February 26, 2018, 12:32:00 »
The occupation most likely to want or take advantage of your business background would be Logistics.  However, in order to be enrolled as a Logistics Officer, you need to have formal education in the field (e.g. B Comm. CA, MBA, etc).  Experience can perhaps be considered, but it would have to be analyzed and I wouldn't be optimistic about that.  I my view, the Logistics Branch has taken a stupidly narrow view of life in recent years and although I have been a Logistics Officer for over 25 years, if I were applying to the Branch today, I would not even be considered with my BA in History (back when I entered, it was considered an "acceptable" albeit not "preferred" degree, but now it is not even "acceptable).

Having said that, for many officer occupations (Pilot and Naval Warfare Officer included), any degree will do.  As you progress in rank and assume more responsibility, you will become more involved in the "business" part of your unit and a background in business may be beneficial (but a lack of it won't necessarily hinder you either, as long as you can learn).
Sure, apes read Nietzsche.  They just don't understand it.

Offline Xylric

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Re: Marks / Grades: School / GED or PLAR [MERGED]
« Reply #574 on: March 02, 2018, 00:03:13 »
An interesting thought came to mind.

In the eyes of the military, what would be the core difference between a bachelor's degree (A B.Comm, for example) obtained at a college (such as Sheridan or Centennial), and a degree in the same subject obtained at a university?