Author Topic: HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London-area museum  (Read 48555 times)

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Offline Chief Stoker

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HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London-area museum
« on: November 11, 2007, 12:41:21 »
Chronicle Herald
BRIDGEWATER — A retired Canadian diving ship is at the centre of a nasty legal battle that includes allegations of an onboard drug lab and storage of toxic waste.

The case has just erupted with a multimillion-dollar lawsuit against the operator of the Bridgewater wharf where the Cormorant is tied up.

Dominion Shipping Inc. of Brownsville, Texas, owns the ship and it is docked behind the former HMCS Fraser, which is also the subject of a legal battle, involving tax assessments.

Dominion Shipping is suing the Artificial Reef Society of Nova Scotia for $1.7 million and society chairman Rick Welsford for $1.4 million, claiming they failed to ensure the ship was properly protected and cared for. The action is in response to a suit the Artificial Reef Society filed against the Cormorant’s owner for unpaid wharf fees.

The society claims in court documents that as of July 15, the Cormorant’s owner had failed to pay $22,800 in wharfage fees. That figure goes up by about $3,000 each month, Mr. Welsford said Friday.

He said he is not in the least concerned about Dominion Shipping’s lawsuit against the society or him personally. He said the society is caught in a dispute between Dominion Shipping and Dominion Diving, a Dartmouth company that once took care of the Cormorant.

Mr. Welsford said he has worked with both sides to sort things out and the lawsuit came out of the blue.

"We sure don’t understand where they’re coming from," he said, but the society will launch "a very aggressive response" in court in the coming days.

Dominion Shipping says in court documents that it bought the Cormorant, along with a deep-diving submersible, spare parts and equipment, in June 1998 and had it towed to Shelburne. The ship was moved to Bridgewater in the spring of 2002.

Dominion Shipping hired Dominion Diving to take care of the vessel, but the ship’s agent, Bill Kenney, has filed a detailed affidavit against Dominion Diving rife with allegations of unpaid invoices, overcharging of fees, inadequate protection and maintenance of the ship and an unexplained disappearance of fuel. He said he also found evidence of an illegal drug lab.

Mr. Kenney also alleges that many of the $2-million worth of spare parts for the Cormorant and parts for the deep-diving submersible were taken off the ship while it was under Dominion Diving’s care.

He said he became concerned about the Cormorant when he was repeatedly stonewalled in his efforts to inspect the ship. He said he finally got to do that inspection in October 2004 and wrote that he was "shocked and appalled by the condition in which I found her. It was filthy, had much of its equipment missing, and many systems were disassembled and left in a state of disarray all over the ship."

There were "active nests of vermin, mounds of bird feces and an assortment of animal and bird carcasses inside the engine room, galley and accommodations area," Mr. Kenney wrote.

Equipment was missing and the ship was not secured, he said, so he bought locks himself at a hardware store.

Mr. Kenney went back for three more days of inspection.

"During that time, I discovered the residuals of a drug manufacturing operation that had been cleaned up and left in boxes and trash bags located in the galley of the ship."

He said he told the RCMP and Bridgewater police of his findings.

Mr. Kenney said he also found that 177,000 litres of fuel was missing and "toxic liquid waste" was in the fuel cells.

He wrote in his affidavit that "certain illegal activities took place on board the ship" while it was under Dominion Diving’s management. "They included the manufacturing of drugs without knowledge or consent of the owners. It also included the depositing of toxic waste in the fuel tanks that will cost many thousands of dollars to clean up and remove."

Mr. Kenney also wrote that he found a number of items from the ship hanging in homes owned by friends of an officer of Dominion Diving, including military war plaques, porthole hatch interior cover plates, Defence Department bed linens, polished brass naval artifacts and diving equipment.

Other Cormorant items ended up at a diving institute in South Carolina, he alleges, including a diving bell, decompression chamber, gauges and valves.

Dominion Shipping says it owes nothing to the Artificial Reef Society for wharfage fees because the society failed to protect and secure the vessel. The company says the society was supposed to provide power, water and a night watchman and took no steps to stop equipment being taken from the vessel.

« Last Edit: June 07, 2012, 15:30:33 by milnews.ca »
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Offline geo

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2007, 17:17:34 »
A sad and sorry end for a fine ship.

Almost better off to have turned her into rasor blades & have done with it
Chimo!

Offline Colin P

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Re: (Final) Bye-bye Ex-HMCS Terra Nova, Gatineau
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2009, 10:18:22 »
Cormorant is still involved in a legal issue, the sub is still aboard her, but the last  I heard she was not in great shape.

NEWSFLASH: This just in:

Texan buys Cormorant for deepsea research

By BEVERLEY WARE South Shore Bureau
Tue. Sep 22 - 4:46 AM
BRIDGEWATER — A Texas businessman has bought the retired navy diving support ship that has been under arrest at the Port of Bridgewater for several years.

The former owner of the Cormorant is also a Texas company, but there is not believed to be any connection between the two.

The vessel has been the subject of court orders since before it was towed up the LaHave River to the Port of Bridgewater in 2002. But its owner finally paid bills that had accumulated while the ship was tied up in Shelburne, freeing the ship to be moved to Bridgewater seven years ago.

But unpaid bills and court judgments stacked up again. A number of court papers outlining claims against the former owners, Dominion Shipping, are taped to an inside window of the ship.

The Artificial Reef Society, which owns the Port of Bridgewater, pursued its case in Federal Court and received permission in July to sell the ship though a sheriff’s sale.

Halifax lawyer Bill MacInnes was appointed sheriff. He said in an interview Monday five bids came in by the close of auction at 4 p.m., Sept. 2.

"The highest bidder couldn’t come up with the deposit in time," he said.

But the second bidder did. Neil Hjelle came in with a bid of $199,000 and handed over the 25 per cent deposit in time. Mr. MacInnes didn’t know Mr. Hjelle’s exact plans, but said he is expected to set up a company and use the Cormorant on a research contract. Mr. Hjelle is having a new ship built to do the work, but will refurbish the Cormorant and use her until the new ship is ready.

Rick Welsford, chairman of the Artificial Reef Society, said he met Mr. Hjelle at the end of August when he came to inspect the ship.

"He said during the inspection that he was interested in using the vessel for deepsea research and was focused on a specific contract which involved work nearby to the Mediterranean. That’s fun because that’s where the ship came from."

The 2,131-tonne former navy diving support ship started life in Italy in 1965 as the trawler Aspa Quarto. The ship was sold to the Canadian navy in 1975 and converted to a diving support vessel.

The Cormorant was the first Canadian navy ship to have female personnel and one of her last missions before being put out of service in 1997 was to retrieve the bell of the Edmund Fitzgerald from the Great Lakes.

Though there is still quite a bit of paperwork to do, including the filing of more court documents, "we are targeting Oct. 1 for the closing," Mr. MacInnes said.

The sale price will satisfy most of the claims against Dominion Shipping. The biggest has been filed by the Artificial Reef Society. It says it is owed about $175,000 in unpaid wharfage fees and is also out court costs involved in getting permission to sell the ship, getting an appraisal and inspection and securing it against hurricane Bill.

All creditors were to have filed their claims against the ship by Aug. 30.

Mr. Welsford said the vessel was abandoned once the ship’s former agent Bill Kenny, who had lived on board for the vessel for a year, left Canada last year. Mr. Welsford claims the ship was left unattended, partially locked and improperly tied.

"Just before it was abandoned we had to ask the Bridgewater police to investigate what turned out to be blow dart attacks on other vessels located at the port."

No charges were laid.

Mr. Hjelle has spoken with some contractors in Bridgewater and Lunenburg about having some work completed here before the ship sails, though it is not known if contractors have been selected.

Mr. Welsford said he is thrilled a historic Canadian navy ship may have found a new life back at sea.

« Last Edit: September 23, 2009, 10:25:45 by Colin P »

Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #3 on: September 23, 2009, 12:40:03 »
Texan buys Cormorant for deepsea research

Quote
By BEVERLEY WARE The Chronicle Herald South Shore Bureau Tue. Sep 22 - 4:46 AM

BRIDGEWATER — A Texas businessman has bought the retired navy diving support ship that has been under arrest at the Port of Bridgewater for several years.

The former owner of the Cormorant is also a Texas company, but there is not believed to be any connection between the two.

The vessel has been the subject of court orders since before it was towed up the LaHave River to the Port of Bridgewater in 2002. But its owner finally paid bills that had accumulated while the ship was tied up in Shelburne, freeing the ship to be moved to Bridgewater seven years ago.

But unpaid bills and court judgments stacked up again. A number of court papers outlining claims against the former owners, Dominion Shipping, are taped to an inside window of the ship.

The Artificial Reef Society, which owns the Port of Bridgewater, pursued its case in Federal Court and received permission in July to sell the ship though a sheriff’s sale.

Halifax lawyer Bill MacInnes was appointed sheriff. He said in an interview Monday five bids came in by the close of auction at 4 p.m., Sept. 2.

"The highest bidder couldn’t come up with the deposit in time," he said.

But the second bidder did. Neil Hjelle came in with a bid of $199,000 and handed over the 25 per cent deposit in time. Mr. MacInnes didn’t know Mr. Hjelle’s exact plans, but said he is expected to set up a company and use the Cormorant on a research contract. Mr. Hjelle is having a new ship built to do the work, but will refurbish the Cormorant and use her until the new ship is ready.

Rick Welsford, chairman of the Artificial Reef Society, said he met Mr. Hjelle at the end of August when he came to inspect the ship.

"He said during the inspection that he was interested in using the vessel for deepsea research and was focused on a specific contract which involved work nearby to the Mediterranean. That’s fun because that’s where the ship came from."

The 2,131-tonne former navy diving support ship started life in Italy in 1965 as the trawler Aspa Quarto. The ship was sold to the Canadian navy in 1975 and converted to a diving support vessel.

The Cormorant was the first Canadian navy ship to have female personnel and one of her last missions before being put out of service in 1997 was to retrieve the bell of the Edmund Fitzgerald from the Great Lakes.

Though there is still quite a bit of paperwork to do, including the filing of more court documents, "we are targeting Oct. 1 for the closing," Mr. MacInnes said.

The sale price will satisfy most of the claims against Dominion Shipping. The biggest has been filed by the Artificial Reef Society. It says it is owed about $175,000 in unpaid wharfage fees and is also out court costs involved in getting permission to sell the ship, getting an appraisal and inspection and securing it against hurricane Bill.

All creditors were to have filed their claims against the ship by Aug. 30.

Mr. Welsford said the vessel was abandoned once the ship’s former agent Bill Kenny, who had lived on board for the vessel for a year, left Canada last year. Mr. Welsford claims the ship was left unattended, partially locked and improperly tied.

"Just before it was abandoned we had to ask the Bridgewater police to investigate what turned out to be blow dart attacks on other vessels located at the port."

No charges were laid.

Mr. Hjelle has spoken with some contractors in Bridgewater and Lunenburg about having some work completed here before the ship sails, though it is not known if contractors have been selected.

Mr. Welsford said he is thrilled a historic Canadian navy ship may have found a new life back at sea.

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Offline Pat in Halifax

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2010, 14:05:27 »
Sorry for resurrecting this but I thought some on here would like to know. Just rec'd the following from a buddy in the Dkyd here. Another sad, sad day.....
"Ex-HMCS FRASER is presently berthed at jetty NA, Shearwater to facilitate final ITAR removals and tow preparations. She is under contract to SNC Lavalin and Marine Recycling Corporation (MRC) for final disposal and destruction. Her final tow out of Halifax harbour is scheduled depart jetty NA on Sunday morning, 29 August 2010 (weather permitting) and is tentatively scheduled to arrive at MRC's Port Colborne, Ontario facility on or around 11 September (McKeil Marine Limited from Hamilton, Ontario will be conducting the tow). All tow preparations have been conducted by the contractor and are IAW the recommendations and requirements of their marine surveyor and insurance carrier.

For those interested, this will be the very last opportunity to see a "steamer" in Halifax. "

Never sailed on her personally but I am pretty sure many on this site have.

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jollyjacktar

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2010, 16:48:36 »
Was on HALIFAX doing some work when she was taken to NA.  Boy did she look rough, although I never sailed on one of these girls it hurt to see her in such state.  Such a shame that one was not saved for future generations like SACKVILLE.

Offline Pusser

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2010, 20:24:11 »
Doubly sad for me as I sailed in both CORMORANT and FRASER.  Some of my best times in the Navy were in those two ships.
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Offline Occam

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2010, 11:38:15 »
It just keeps getting more interesting...



Original link

Diving group arrests former navy ship in battle with DND

By BEVERLEY WARE South Shore Bureau
Mon, Aug 30 - 4:53 AM

BRIDGEWATER — A former Canadian navy warship is under arrest in Halifax Harbour.

The former HMCS Fraser was placed under arrest Friday at the Shearwater jetty at CFB Halifax and is not allowed to move until a court case against it is cleared up.

The Federal Court of Canada issued the arrest warrant after the Bridgewater-based Artificial Reef Society of Nova Scotia filed a lawsuit Friday.

"This is the first time a civilian group has arrested a (former) Canadian navy ship," said society president Rick Welsford. "I’m more than ticked off about the attitude of the navy."

The society filed papers Friday suing the Defence Department for breach of contract. The society once owned the ship, which was tied up at the wharf in Bridgewater for 12 years. But it could never raise the money it needed to turn the vessel into a floating museum, so last summer the navy took back ownership of the former destroyer, the last of the St. Laurent-class vessels.

Two Defence Department tugs towed the Fraser to Dartmouth, where the navy said it would decide whether to preserve the ship, sink it as an artificial reef or scrap it.

But there is a clause in the December 2008 agreement between the society and the Defence Department that says if the department decides to scrap the ship, the society gets "first

consideration" in presenting a proposal to turn it into an artificial reef. The agreement says the department must find the proposal acceptable.

Welsford said Sunday he had been in discussions with the navy for months working out the terms for the society to take back ownership of the Fraser and sink it so that it can be used by divers. He has been in close contact with the Artificial Reef Society of British Columbia, which has seven artificial reefs, including five former navy ships, HMCS Cape Breton, HMCS Saskatchewan, HMCS Chaudiere, HMCS Columbia and HMCS Mackenzie.

Welsford said he had even created a team to create the reef that includes professional engineers and lawyers used by the navy.

Late last week, he learned the federal government had signed a contract with SNC-Lavalin for the ship to be sent to scrap. "That is not a fitting end for the ship," Welsford said.

The Defence Department issued a news release late Friday saying the Fraser was to be towed from Shearwater to the Marine Recycling Corp.’s facility in Port Colborne, Ont., where it would be dismantled and scrapped.

Welsford said a tug was ready to begin towing the Fraser to Lake Erie on Sunday morning, so the society quickly filed its case Friday with the Federal Court in Halifax, claiming the Defence Department has breached its contract with the society.

Those documents claim the contract to scrap the ship is worth $2.6 million. Welsford said it would cost $1.5 million at most for the society to turn the ship into an artificial reef, but he expects that figure to be far less because of contributions from volunteers and donated services.

In its claim against the department, the society said the navy told the society via email that it was rejecting the society’s proposal. The department raised concerns with the proposal, but the society said it was not afforded the opportunity to address those concerns.

The society said in court papers it agreed to transfer the Fraser back to the navy because it believed the ship "would end its days as an artificial reef as a memorial to the Canadian navy."

The society asks for time to address the navy’s concerns or to be awarded damages for the alleged negligence and alleged breach of contract. The artificial reef society says its claim "exceeds $50,000" and does not include interest and court costs

The department has 30 days to file its defence. None of the allegations have been proven in court.

A department spokesman in Ottawa could not be reached for comment Sunday.

The Artificial Reef Society of Nova Scotia has a history of winning court actions it launches. It took the province to court over its property assessment involving the ship and after a lengthy court battle, the society won.

Last summer, the society got permission to sell the former naval diving support ship Cormorant after its owners had failed to pay bills and meet court judgments. The Cormorant had been under arrest in the Port of Bridgewater for several years.

Offline dapaterson

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2010, 11:50:53 »
Perhaps if the Artificial Reef Society deveoted more resources to fundraising and less to litigation they would have found the money to turn the ship into a museum.
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Offline Pusser

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2010, 13:14:05 »
I think a lot of their funds were being eaten up in property taxes in Bridgewater, so they had to go to court in order to fight the town's interpretation of tax law and recoup some of their losses.

I would rather something nice be done with FRASER than to see her cut up into razor blades.
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Offline drunknsubmrnr

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2010, 14:14:12 »
On a more cheerful note, it looks like Ojibwa is going to Port Burwell ON as an exhibit for the military museum.

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2010, 17:23:46 »
I was speaking with a Commissionaire this past weekend about OJIBWA.  He was over to NAD with a former Sailor who is from the Community where she will be going to and IIRC involved in the committee as well.  He said that yes, indeed she is going and the folks there are very excited about it.  They hope to do her up as nice as her Sister.  Although I am not a Submariner I am pleased as punch to see another old girl saved for future generations.  Wish FRASER was joining that club.

Offline Fred Herriot

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2010, 15:08:43 »
It would be interesting to see Fraser towed down the Welland Canal to Ramey's Bend (which is a partially-filled in branch of the old Third Welland Canal north of downtown Port Colborne) to be finally scrapped.  I'll see if I can get photos of the girl if she shows up there.
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Offline Pat in Halifax

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2010, 06:20:03 »
Latest (from yesterday`s Chronicle Herald) is the Judge sided with the Navy. She is at Jetty 6 though waiting out the hurricane and is leaving Monday I believe. The tug has been sitting at the pier down by Bishop`s Landing for a week now - That has to be pricy!
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Offline Fred Herriot

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2010, 17:29:44 »
Has Fraser finally left the harbour?  I passed down by Ramey's Bend yesterday and I didn't see anything there.
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Offline Newt

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #15 on: September 20, 2010, 17:49:35 »
http://picasaweb.google.com/DWKeoughan/20100918HMCSFraserBeingTowedOnLakeErie#

Fraser being towed on Lake Erie. Pictures are not mine, I found them link hopping.
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Offline Pusser

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2010, 19:22:22 »
I knew I shouldn't have looked.  A sad end for a proud ship.  The port-a-potty on the flight deck really says it all... :(
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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #17 on: September 20, 2010, 19:47:54 »
I knew I shouldn't have looked.  A sad end for a proud ship.  The port-a-potty on the flight deck really says it all... :(

Yes, definitely not the old girl I remember.  A rather undignified final chapter.

jollyjacktar

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2010, 06:19:46 »
Yes, she looked like she was being led like a sheep to the butcher.  It really made me feel down to see the pictures.

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Retired navy ship at centre of legal battle
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2010, 08:33:14 »
That is just no way for a warship to go.

Sorry Fraser, your country failed you.

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Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2011, 22:35:45 »
I asked today of the tug and barge company. The first decommissioned sub should arrive in Hamilton Harbour Thursday. Then they turn around and go pick up the other. There is an article in the Esquimalt Lookout today.

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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #21 on: July 29, 2011, 05:46:08 »
Submarine towed through Hamilton en route to wreckers


Submarine in Hamilton. The HMCS Olympus, a 2,500-ton de-commissioned Canadian submarine is docked in Hamilton Harbour at Heddle Marine Service Inc. Scott Gardner/The Hamilton SpectatorSource: The Hamilton Spectator
 Steve Arnold

 July 29, 2011



After training generations of Canadian submariners, a proud warrior is on her way to a new life as car parts or razor blades.
 
HMCS Olympus, one of Canada’s four retired submarines, was floated by special barge into Hamilton Harbour Thursday morning on her way to a “ship breaking” yard on Lake Erie to be turned into scrap metal.
 
The sub’s journey from Halifax to Hamilton and on to Port Maitland was accomplished by two Hamilton companies, McKeil Marine and Heddle Marine Services Inc. Heddle provided a floating dry dock on which the sub was loaded while McKeil provided the tugboats that pushed and pulled the warship up the St. Lawrence River and across Lake Ontario.
 
Moving the sub called for some careful engineering work to ensure the 2,500-ton cargo remained stable during the 10-day voyage, explained Heddle Marine president Rick Heddle.
 
“We used enough cables and ridges and supports that it could never topple over,” he said. “It was a case of loading it, securing it and then watching our weather.”
 
Olympus is the first of three subs the companies are to move. Her sister ships, Okanagan and Ojibwa, will make the same voyage — Okanagan heading for the scrap yard and Ojibwa possibly to a new life as a museum in Port Burwell on Lake Erie. Onondaga became a museum in Quebec in 2008.

Every stage of the 1,200-nautical mile voyage was carefully planned to ensure the vessel and cargo were never too far from a safe port — a refuge they’d need whenever waves on the lake got higher than two metres or the wind blew faster than 25 knots.
 
The sub was moved in a process called dry towing — a Heddle-designed dry dock was submerged under the Olympus, then it lifted the boat out of the water. The alternative, a wet tow in which a tug simply hooks onto the retired vessels and pulls it along was rejected by the St. Lawrence Seaway.
 
“After sitting idle for almost 10 years these boats are in pretty rough shape,” Heddle said. “If one was to sink in a lock that could plug up the whole seaway system.”
 
Paulo Pessoa, McKeil’s vice-president for business development, said moving the submarines is only the latest in a number of challenges undertaken by the Hamilton company. In past efforts, it has been hired to recover a Second World War-era B-17 bomber that crashed in Greenland and to salvage the remains of a British aircraft that crashed into Lake Ontario during the CNE air show.
 
Pessoa said while foreign companies could have been hired to move and cut up the boats at lower costs, hiring Canadian firms ensured the work is done with the smallest environmental footprint.
 
“The (defence department) has a lot at stake here,” he said. “If they hired a company to recycle the submarine and then have it sink in the river, that would be a PR disaster.
 
“Paying the extra cost associated with doing it in the safest way possible is a no-brainer,” he added. “For us, redundancy was the name of the game.”
 
The actual destruction of the subs will handled by Marine Recovery Corp. of Port Colborne.
 
Olympus, Ojibwa, Okanagan and Onondaga were diesel-electric Oberon class submarines built in Britain in the 1960s. They served Canada’s navy for 30 years — Ojibwa, Okanagan and Onondaga doing Cold War-era surveillance patrols off the east coast while Olympus remained tethered as a training vessel. At the time they were built, the boats were the latest technology, according to the Canadian Naval Centennial Internet site. Between 1979 and 1981, they were upgraded, but by the late 1990s “Though respectable enough craft in their prime, the ‘O’ boats had long since reached the end of their useful lives and by July 1999, the three had been paid off and replaced by the Victoria class.”
 
The subs were “paid off” between 1998 and 2000.
 
When Okanagan is towed into Hamilton, it will actually be her second visit to the city. She was here in November 1990 as part of a good will tour of the Great Lakes — the first such voyage by a Canadian submarine.
 
sarnold@thespec.com

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #22 on: July 29, 2011, 08:13:55 »
Just a small point here, for historical accuracy's sake.

OLYMPUS was never commissioned in our Navy, nor sailed as a Canadian boat at any time.

HMS OLYMPUS was acquired towards the end of the "O" boats era, after she was decommissioned by the RN, so that she may be used as a harbour training submarine.

It does not detract from the fact that she was a "proud warrior", she just did not do the warring with us.

Offline N. McKay

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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #23 on: July 29, 2011, 13:02:09 »
HMS OLYMPUS was acquired towards the end of the "O" boats era, after she was decommissioned by the RN, so that she may be used as a harbour training submarine.

Somewhere I got the idea that OLYMPUS was acquired for spares -- or was there another O-boat that was?

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #24 on: July 29, 2011, 13:34:02 »
They certainly felt no shame in scrounging parts of her here and there that were not required for training.
 

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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #25 on: July 29, 2011, 14:38:47 »
Somewhere I got the idea that OLYMPUS was acquired for spares -- or was there another O-boat that was?

The CF bought OSIRIS for parts in the late 80s/early 90s, but only the parts were shipped to Canada.  The boat was stripped in the UK and the hull was scrapped over there.
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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #26 on: August 17, 2011, 21:04:23 »
Okanagan, high and dry on her barge, just went through the locks at St-Lambert this PM as she entered the St-Lawrence Seaway.

The local CTV station did a nice piece on it in their news, with emphasis on all her years of service to the Navy, and mentioned (something I did not know) that the breakers plans include keeping her conning tower intact and setting it up in a local park in Port Maitland, ON. Nice touch I thought - considering the value of scrap metal they will forgo.

Offline Lex Parsimoniae

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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #27 on: August 17, 2011, 22:14:17 »
I believe they're keeping the whole Casing and Fin (which are mostly made of fibreglass) and not just the Conning Tower.  Scrap metal is pretty low value these days - the Crown is paying $4.5 million to have the two boats scrapped. 

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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #28 on: February 03, 2012, 20:36:20 »
Getting closer...
Quote
Saturday, September 8 should be a day to remember in Port Burwell, Ontario. That is the day the decommissioned submarine Ojibwa, Canada’s first Oberon Class submarine is set arrive at her new home to become the centerpiece of the Elgin Military Museum’s new naval museum. The decision to earmark September 8 as the day the sub will be brought ashore and placed on her new foundations was made at a meeting of the Ojibwa Project Team on January 30 ....
Cornwall Free News, 3 Feb 12
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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #29 on: February 04, 2012, 09:19:11 »
Getting closer...Cornwall Free News, 3 Feb 12
I'm glad to see she will have a useful purpose once again.  It's a shame we could not have saved a steamer as well.

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Re: Ojibwa sub for scrap, enroute to Hamilton area
« Reply #30 on: February 04, 2012, 10:54:39 »
Its wonderful that two out of three (sorry - I don't count OLYMPUS as a Canadian boat) could be saved for future generations.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 22:35:14 by milnews.ca »

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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #31 on: February 04, 2012, 11:03:49 »
I'm glad to see she will have a useful purpose once again.  It's a shame we could not have saved a steamer as well.

Not like there was no steamers available. No one stepped up unfortunately except for the Fraser and that turned out to be a train wreck.
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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #32 on: February 04, 2012, 11:34:18 »
 :highjack:

Not like there was no steamers available. No one stepped up unfortunately except for the Fraser and that turned out to be a train wreck.


Continuing the highjack ... I, too, am somewhat sad that at least one of those marvellous Cold War veterans could not find a "home" à la Haida and Sackville. I hope someone is making some provision for HMCS Iroquois or HMCS Athabaskan which saw considerable operational service in the 20th and 21st centuries. It is not too soon to be raising money and searching for sponsors ... are such projects already underway?

 
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Re: Submarines for scrap and enroute to Hamilton
« Reply #33 on: February 04, 2012, 11:56:10 »
:highjack:


Continuing the highjack ... I, too, am somewhat sad that at least one of those marvellous Cold War veterans could not find a "home" à la Haida and Sackville. I hope someone is making some provision for HMCS Iroquois or HMCS Athabaskan which saw considerable operational service in the 20th and 21st centuries. It is not too soon to be raising money and searching for sponsors ... are such projects already underway?
Not that I have heard, frankly have heard not a peep of interest.

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Re: Ojibwa sub for scrap, enroute to Hamilton area
« Reply #34 on: February 04, 2012, 13:05:08 »
Unfortunately, even if the ship is provided for free, the maintenance and operation costs of a museum ship can be horrendous.  Doing it strictly on admissions revenue is not practical and so without some form of public support, a project such as this is doomed to failure.  Furthermore, a lot of volunteer effort is also required.  Who is dedicated enough and has the time?

I too was sad to see the FRASER and CORMORANT fiasco unfold.  I actually gave money to the FRASER project.  Maybe when I retire, I will have time for such things
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 22:35:37 by milnews.ca »
Sure, apes read Nietzsche.  They just don't understand it.

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Re: Ojibwa sub for scrap, enroute to Hamilton area
« Reply #35 on: February 04, 2012, 13:35:27 »
Cormorant - meh.  Fraser, I'll shed real tears over as that was so unnecessary.  I'd say it was a shame we got rid of Anticosti and Morseby.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 22:35:48 by milnews.ca »

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Re: Ojibwa sub for scrap, enroute to Hamilton area
« Reply #36 on: February 04, 2012, 14:09:37 »
CORMORANT was a fantastic ship.  Very useful and at the time it was announced that she was to be paid off, the hardest working ship in the Navy.  While the rest of the Fleet was out on exercise, CORMORANT was actually doing real work (albeit for other government departments - RCMP, Coast Guard).
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 22:35:57 by milnews.ca »
Sure, apes read Nietzsche.  They just don't understand it.

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Re: Ojibwa sub for scrap, enroute to Hamilton area
« Reply #37 on: February 04, 2012, 14:24:51 »
CORMORANT was a fantastic ship.  Very useful and at the time it was announced that she was to be paid off, the hardest working ship in the Navy.  While the rest of the Fleet was out on exercise, CORMORANT was actually doing real work (albeit for other government departments - RCMP, Coast Guard).
Those whom I knew who sailed her, loved her and it's crew I agree.  I was thinking more of her usefulness as a sub platform had been degraded as technology had evolved beyond that.  Mind it's not my part ship and perhaps the "official" word was just excuses when set against those in the know.  I do hate to see mostly any ship go away as it makes the fleet smaller with less opportunity to sail if there is no replacement for her.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 22:36:10 by milnews.ca »

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PROJECT OJIBWA MOVES FORWARD
« Reply #38 on: March 16, 2012, 00:28:27 »
PROJECT OJIBWA

Good Evening..... On behalf of the Board of Directors of The Elgin Military Museum I am pleased to announce that  this evening  The Township Council of Bayham voted to act as financial Guarantor for  the Museum with respect to a 6 Million dollar line of credit for the movement and set up of H.M.C.S. OJIBWA as a  permanent, shore  mounted, Naval Museum in Port Burwell Ont.. 
This was in response to a final phase requirement by The Minister of National Defence that the Museum provide substantive proof of secured funding for the Project.

OJIBWA is another  step closer towards arriving at her new home, (projected arrival date...8 Sept 2012),  in Port Burwell on the North Shore of Lake ERIE.

We at The MUSEUM are profoundly grateful to the people of Bayham Township for their overwhelming support
in this endeavour.

For further info or to see how you can assist the project please visit the Museum website....www.elginmilitarymuseum.ca   or   www.projectojibwa.ca

Jim Ziegler,   Board of  Directors,  The ELGIN MILITARY MUSEUM ST. Thomas Ont.





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Offline RemembranceDay

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Re: PROJECT OJIBWA MOVES FORWARD
« Reply #39 on: March 16, 2012, 00:38:02 »
I will be out to see this!

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Re: Ojibwa sub for scrap, enroute to Hamilton area
« Reply #40 on: March 16, 2012, 00:51:01 »
Gentlemen/Ladies.....The OJIBWA is NOT UP for Scrap!....See my 16 March post in Navy General re Project OJIBWA.
J. Ziegler,  The ELGIN MILITARY MUSEUM.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 22:36:28 by milnews.ca »
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Re: HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London area
« Reply #41 on: May 16, 2012, 16:16:40 »
Gentlemen/Ladies.....The OJIBWA is NOT UP for Scrap!....See my 16 March post in Navy General re Project OJIBWA.
J. Ziegler,  The ELGIN MILITARY MUSEUM.
That post's been merged into this unified thread with a new title.

Also, this just out from the CF Info-machine:
Quote
The Honourable Peter MacKay, Minister of National Defence, has signed an agreement that will allow the Elgin Military Museum in St. Thomas, Ontario, to take possession of one of the Royal Canadian Navy's decommissioned submarines - the former HMCS Ojibwa - for permanent, public display.

HMCS Ojibwa is an Oberon-class submarine, commissioned in 1965 and removed from operational service in 1998. Ojibwa was one of three Oberon-class diesel-electric submarines acquired in the 1960s by the RCN; the others being Onandaga and Okanagan. A fourth Oberon-class submarine, Olympus, was acquired in 1989 to serve as a stationary training vessel in Halifax.

(....)

The museum will fund the physical transfer of the 90-metre Ojibwa from Halifax Harbour, Nova Scotia, to a site at Port Burwell, Ontario, and Ojibwa's establishment as a museum open to the public.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 22:36:41 by milnews.ca »
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HMCS OJIBWA leaves for New Home this Month.
« Reply #42 on: May 17, 2012, 18:40:06 »
Hello Everyone... Well it is finally "OFFICIAL" .

 OJIBWA will be leaving Halifax  in the next week to 10 days to begin her voayage to her Permanent "Land Based"  Station with the Elgin Military Museum in Port Burwell Ontario situated on the North shore of Lake Erie.

All current info can be found at    www.projectojibwa.ca  or thru linking from the Museums website at  www.elginmilitarymuseum.ca 

 Any and All support, is greatly appreciated as the Museum has taken on this major project to Honour the Navy and its Vets.

Jim Ziegler
"Good people sleep soundly at night because Rough Men stand ready to do Violence in their name.
    George Orwell...."1984"

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Re: HMCS OJIBWA leaves for New Home this Month.
« Reply #43 on: May 18, 2012, 18:56:49 »
BZ to the Elgin Military Museum and communities of Port Burwell and St. Thomas, ON. The next time I'm lucky enough to be home in southern Ontario and pulling Perch out of the lake, I'll be sure to pay a visit.

Best wishes.
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HMCS OJIBWA...ON THE MOVE!!!!
« Reply #44 on: May 25, 2012, 21:26:33 »
Hello Everyone.    Happy to say OJIBWA is is on the move!   She was loaded Friday and will be commencing the voyage to her  new home Saturday 25 May.  She will lay over in Hamilton for the summer at HEDDLE MARINE as the site work in Port Burwell is completed. While in Hamilton we hope to clean her up so she will arrive "home" looking as she deserves.

Please visit our website... www.elginmilitarymuseum.ca  and view all the latest pictures of her move and updates to the project.

We are honoured to give her a home and to salute our Naval Veterans.

Sweat, skinned knuckles, artifacts or cash donations will all be greatfully accepted to help us make this a Museum you can all be proud of.

HELL!!! I have goose bumps and I was just a dumb-*** infantry grunt. :army:

All the best Jim Ziegler
"Good people sleep soundly at night because Rough Men stand ready to do Violence in their name.
    George Orwell...."1984"

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Re: HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London-area museum
« Reply #45 on: August 12, 2012, 23:11:15 »
Having just returned from Australia, where I had the opportunity to visit HMAS Onslow (still in the water) in Sidney at the Australian National Maritime Museum.  I am glad that there is a chance  to see a Canadian example of an Oberon. The Australians seem to have done in right in having an example on both the East and West coasts (HMAS Ovens in Fremantle). I do of course recognize that it is easier to sail around Australia then Canada .

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London-area museum
« Reply #46 on: August 15, 2012, 10:21:39 »
Actually AJF, you don't have to wait.

HMCS ONONDAGA already is a museum that you can visit in Rimouski, Qc.

She has been hauled out of the water (a lot easier and cheaper to preserve) so you can actually enjoy studying all of the hull fittings at leisure. They then cut large side access to her main deck in places where the hull sides did not carry important equipment. It makes access much easier and the visit quite enjoyable. They even have arrangements for overnight sleepovers in the good ol' bunks. As a group, you can arrange "cold warrior" week ends of simulations.
 

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Re: HMCS OJIBWA...ON THE MOVE!!!!
« Reply #47 on: November 13, 2012, 21:34:56 »
Hello Everyone.    Happy to say OJIBWA is is on the move!   She was loaded Friday and will be commencing the voyage to her  new home Saturday 25 May.  She will lay over in Hamilton for the summer at HEDDLE MARINE as the site work in Port Burwell is completed. While in Hamilton we hope to clean her up so she will arrive "home" looking as she deserves. 

The work in Hamilton is finished and she is due to set out on her final voyage this week. 

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Re: HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London-area museum
« Reply #48 on: November 13, 2012, 21:59:19 »
Do you have any idea when she'll be passing through the Welland Canal?
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Re: HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London-area museum
« Reply #49 on: November 18, 2012, 10:25:49 »
And she arrives:


Source: Trident News
It is ill that men should kill one another in seditions, tumults and wars; but it is worse to bring nations to such misery, weakness and baseness
as to have neither strength nor courage to contend for anything; to have nothing left worth defending and to give the name of peace to desolation.
Algernon Sidney in Discourses Concerning Government, (1698)
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Almost parked....
« Reply #50 on: November 27, 2012, 22:13:42 »
Quote
The HMCS Ojibwa is nearly home.

Home, for the last of Canada’s Oberon class submarines, is the Elgin Military Museum in Port Burwell, Ontario on the north shore of Lake Erie.

When it was decommissioned from the Royal Canadian Navy in 1998, the vessel was destined to be scrapped, but a movement to save the ship resulted in it becoming the property of the museum. The plan is for the museum to turn the HMCS Ojibwa into a land-based historical artifact located next to the Elgin Military Museum of Naval History—a submarine interpretation centre—and now that plan is entering its final stage.

The sub arrived at the port November 27th. It was originally scheduled to have arrived the week before, but ongoing dredging work at the port proved insufficient to provide clearance for the sub and the barge that carried it from Hamilton, Ontario. With the work complete, and an obstruction (believed to be an old seawall) cleared, the barge and sub were free to dock.

On November 28th, 2012 the sub is to be lifted off the barge and placed into the concrete cradles that will be its permanent home ....
canadianmanufacturing.com, 27 Nov 12




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Re: HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London-area museum
« Reply #51 on: November 29, 2012, 06:49:14 »
Being hauled ashore:


Source: Brantford Expositor
It is ill that men should kill one another in seditions, tumults and wars; but it is worse to bring nations to such misery, weakness and baseness
as to have neither strength nor courage to contend for anything; to have nothing left worth defending and to give the name of peace to desolation.
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Re: HMCS Ojibwa sub enroute to London-area museum
« Reply #52 on: September 19, 2017, 23:32:36 »
I was finally able to visit this summer. What a great experience! It was a real treat to be able to take the kids aboard, and see some Canadian Maritime history. I look forward to the extended tour next time I'm able. This sailor says BZ to the Elgin Military Museum, what a hidden treasure. Port Burwell is well worth the visit: for OJIBWA; for the beach; and, for the fresh lake fish dinners. Thanks for a great day.
"They that go down to the sea in ships
and occupy their business in great waters;
these men see the works of the Lord and His wonders in the deep." Psalm 107, v. 23-24