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The Mess => Radio Chatter => Topic started by: dapaterson on January 08, 2020, 15:29:55

Title: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on January 08, 2020, 15:29:55
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-51040751
Title: Re: Harry and Meagan to step down as senior royals
Post by: CloudCover on January 08, 2020, 15:38:05
Good for them, I hope it works out especially for the sake of the little guy!!
Title: Re: Harry and Meagan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on January 08, 2020, 16:12:49
American Divorcées: 2
House of Windsor: 0

Title: Re: Harry and Meagan to step down as senior royals
Post by: FSTO on January 08, 2020, 16:15:21
Governor General of Canada?
Title: Re: Harry and Meagan to step down as senior royals
Post by: BeyondTheNow on January 08, 2020, 16:39:02
I can’t say I’m overly surprised. However, I think they, especially Meghan, will have a rather large uphill battle to climb in terms of staying away from the press and not allowing gossip to bother her, since they’ve already been having issues with being incessant British tabloid fodder since her introduction into the family. They can’t shield themselves entirely, regardless of where they move...unfortunately.

I’m pretty confident in assuming the hardcore, British royal family fans will now be dumping on her even more, and blaming her further for essentially splitting up the family/interfering with British monarchy traditions, common rolls and ‘turning’ Harry. Even though he was already much less into the whole shtick of it all while growing up, Meghan will be held responsible for officially veering him away. 

‘Can’t say I blame them though. It’s not a life I’d want to be born into, and the sensationalist articles/paparazzi over there are far more intrusive and constant than the typical US/North American culprits.
Title: Re: Harry and Meagan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Hamish Seggie on January 08, 2020, 16:41:31
Governor General of Canada?

I rather doubt that. Can you hear the voices "harummphhing we are turning into a colony again".
Title: Re: Harry and Meagan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Czech_pivo on January 08, 2020, 20:42:08
I rather doubt that. Can you hear the voices "harummphhing we are turning into a colony again".

I’d have no issue with it.

With that being said, I wish them nothing but happiness going forward and would be glad if they decided to settle here.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 08, 2020, 22:06:01
I think this is being done for Meghan so she could pursue her financial interests , she is I believe a millionaire with a cosmetics line which of course is frowned on for a Royal.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Retired AF Guy on January 08, 2020, 22:13:58
TMZ is saying that when they mean moving to North America they mean Canada (https://www.tmz.com/2020/01/08/prince-harry-meghan-markle-step-down-senior-royals/).
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: FJAG on January 08, 2020, 22:33:44
The Daily Mail is dumping all over them for this and making them out to be near to traitor status.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7866007/Harry-Meghan-step-senior-royals-financially-independent.html (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7866007/Harry-Meghan-step-senior-royals-financially-independent.html)

Personally, I think it's a brilliant move on their part. There is now a Queen and a whole chain of succession set up that doesn't include Harry. Why stay around and become like some of the other second, third and so on tiers of Royals occupying space in Kensington and other palaces without any real occupation of consequence other than chilling for some charities?

Harry does more with and for Invictus than most of the rest of them put together and Meghan has potential as well.

I wish the two of them the best and do hope they settle down in Canada for half their year and get out of the spotlight the way they hope to.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 08, 2020, 22:54:18
Maybe they could create the office of GG for BC.  ;D
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: FJAG on January 08, 2020, 23:03:36
Maybe they could create the office of GG for BC.  ;D

Provinces do have heads of state representing the crown for provincial legislation and other matters. They're called Lieutenant Governors.

 :cheers:
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Jarnhamar on January 09, 2020, 00:01:53
Harry should become the King of Canada.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Old Sweat on January 09, 2020, 00:58:59
I wonder if anyone remembers the pejorative "Remittance Man"?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remittance_man
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: CloudCover on January 09, 2020, 01:01:10
He can join the CScotR since they are likely to reside on the Island, where they were just house hunting ...
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 09, 2020, 08:07:06
I wonder if anyone remembers the pejorative "Remittance Man"?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remittance_man
:rofl:

You may be thinking of Prince Andrew down the road ...

Too soon?
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on January 09, 2020, 08:51:11
He can join the CScotR since they are likely to reside on the Island, where they were just house hunting ...
Real world military experience and cares deeply about soldiers.

Don't think he'd make the cut.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: BeyondTheNow on January 09, 2020, 12:18:18
...The Daily Mail is dumping all over them for this and making them out to be near to traitor status.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7866007/Harry-Meghan-step-senior-royals-financially-independent.html (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7866007/Harry-Meghan-step-senior-royals-financially-independent.html)
...

As I touched a bit on also—sad, and it’ll get much worse, especially if these reports are to be believed and the family itself didn’t have any (or very little) inclination of the plans to leave in their entirety. I’m not really a fan of this style of article, but multiple sources are reporting the same.

Quote
The statement from the Queen's office reads, "Discussions with The Duke and Duchess of Sussex are at an early stage. We understand their desire to take a different approach, but these are complicated issues that will take time to work through." It also just broke that no one in the Royal Family was consulted about the break and they are apparently "disappointed." ...

 https://www.oprahmag.com/entertainment/a30448022/queen-statement-harry-meghan-resignation/?utm_campaign=likeshopme&utm_medium=instagram&utm_source=dash%20hudson&utm_content=www.instagram.com/p/B7Gcg2zAMDV/ (https://www.oprahmag.com/entertainment/a30448022/queen-statement-harry-meghan-resignation/?utm_campaign=likeshopme&utm_medium=instagram&utm_source=dash%20hudson&utm_content=www.instagram.com/p/B7Gcg2zAMDV/)


 

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: FSTO on January 09, 2020, 12:28:19
As I touched on also—sad, and it’ll get much worse, especially if these reports are to be believed and the family itself didn’t have any (or very little) inclination of the plans to leave in their entirety. I’m not really a fan of this style of article, but multiple sources are reporting the same.

 https://www.oprahmag.com/entertainment/a30448022/queen-statement-harry-meghan-resignation/?utm_campaign=likeshopme&utm_medium=instagram&utm_source=dash%20hudson&utm_content=www.instagram.com/p/B7Gcg2zAMDV/ (https://www.oprahmag.com/entertainment/a30448022/queen-statement-harry-meghan-resignation/?utm_campaign=likeshopme&utm_medium=instagram&utm_source=dash%20hudson&utm_content=www.instagram.com/p/B7Gcg2zAMDV/)

Barring a tragedy to William and his family, its pretty safe to assume that Harry and his family can fade into the Commonwealth with little or no impact on the ongoings of "The Firm".
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Spencer100 on January 09, 2020, 12:36:34
Why be a Duchess when you can be a Queen

URGGH!


https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/01/09/a-woke-wallis-simpson/?

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: GAP on January 09, 2020, 12:38:04
Just more  immigrants......meh
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: BeyondTheNow on January 09, 2020, 12:41:26
Barring a tragedy to William and his family, its pretty safe to assume that Harry and his family can fade into the Commonwealth with little or no impact on the ongoings of "The Firm".

Yes...and the family will move on, but the tabloids will take much, much longer, drawing things out, not letting both sides have their peace, sadly.

I know they’re used to it to a degree, and I typically haven’t paid too much attention beyond knowing when a new little one was added to the brood. But when Harry started speaking more recently about the past and treatment of Diana, both within the family and from the press/paparazzi, I started reading a bit more here and there. (I still recall the day of Diana’s death well, and have often thought of the toll in must’ve taken on the boys. If Harry felt he was being constantly reminded of her fate and the circumstances surrounding when he began a formal relationship with Meghan, then I don’t fault him for wanting to take—what others may seem are—drastic steps.)

I hope they’re able to settle into a life better suited for themselves and the direction they’d like to take, apart from “The Firm”, (love that, btw) smoothly.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Czech_pivo on January 09, 2020, 15:05:42
Prince Harry the next GG?

60% of CDN's recently polled, said 'yes' to the idea.

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/a-majority-of-canadians-want-prince-harry-to-become-governor-general
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 09, 2020, 15:10:54
Prince Harry the next GG?

60% of CDN's recently polled, said 'yes' to the idea.

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/a-majority-of-canadians-want-prince-harry-to-become-governor-general

If their plan is to step away and do their own thing, being GG is likely not a good fit.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Good2Golf on January 09, 2020, 15:21:15
#brexitsquared  or  #rexit
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: FSTO on January 09, 2020, 18:29:29
Well if Harry became GG, at least he'd know how to properly wear a uniform! ;D
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Chris Pook on January 09, 2020, 18:46:02
As some have noted, I am a monarchist.  But that refers to governance and oaths and fealty and all that good stuff.  Kind of in the tradition of saluting the rank and not the individual.

I have no problem criticising the individuals.  In this instance I can't find myself criticizing Harry or Megan either in their desire to step away or their desire to promote their "brand".

Harry has had a problem with being "the spare" for some time now.  At least since his first deployment to Afghanistan was aborted and then his military career followed.  He was reduced to being in the background of shots with William and Kate or squiring Kate around when her husband wasn't available.  Now William has a brood Harry is legitimately surplus to requirement.  Godspeed.|

As to concerns about Harry and Meghan marketing "their brand" - the House of Windsor knows a thing or two about that as well. 

(https://www.royalwarrant.org/sites/default/themes/custom/rwha_zen/images/crests.png)

https://www.royalwarrant.org/

Quote

Prince Charles's green farming business reaps a £200m harvest
PRINCE Charles's upmarket organic food business is now a £200million brand, his supermarket partners revealed yesterday.
By JOHN INGHAM
PUBLISHED: 07:19, Mon, May 1, 2017 | UPDATED: 09:08, Mon, May 1, 2017


(https://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/106/590x/secondary/Duchy-Originals-918602.jpg)

The Firm won't want their brand diluted nor the competition.

And.... in light of the way that Andrew's kids have been treated, the way that Andrew and Fergie have been treated, and the sudden declaration of the slimming of the House to just those in the  line of succession, a decision made by Charles apparently, I don't see that Harry and Meghan would have been given much incentive to discuss matters.

(https://i.cbc.ca/1.5415388.1578177391!/cpImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/original_780/aptopix-britain-royals.jpg)




But that's just me


Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: FJAG on January 09, 2020, 20:01:28
The British press is just turning more rabid by the minute:

Meghan flees to Canada where she left baby Archie with nanny and leaves Harry to deal with fallout from 'abdication' crisis after spending just three days in the UK following holiday (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7870677/Prince-Harry-Meghan-Markle-left-young-Archie-Canada.html)
Quote
-Baby Archie was left behind in Canada with his nanny while Harry and Meghan flew back to the UK this week
-The Duke and Duchess of Sussex visited London on Tuesday before sensationally quitting the royal family
- As Prince Harry faces the wrath of the Queen and the royal family, Meghan has already flown back to Canada
-Meghan spent just three days in the UK, after the couple and Archie had enjoyed a seven-week break abroad
-She could now spend foreseeable future in North America, as Harry thrashes out their roles with his family
By REBECCA ENGLISH ROYAL CORRESPONDENT FOR THE DAILY MAIL

The Duchess of Sussex flew back to Canada yesterday, leaving Prince Harry to deal with the fallout over their 'abdication' crisis.

The Daily Mail has learnt that Meghan returned to North America, where their eight-month-old son, Archie, had been left with his nanny. She may stay there for the foreseeable future.

Sources said she 'hadn't planned' to remain in the UK for long, after arriving back in Britain on Monday at the end of the family's seven-week hiatus from royal duties in Vancouver. She spent just three days in Britain.

The remarkable development – described by one royal insider as 'simply astonishing' – came as the Queen last night ordered her warring family to hammer out a solution that will allow her grandson and his wife to quit frontline royal duties.

On a day of behind-the-scenes drama, the monarch convened an extraordinary series of calls between herself, the Prince of Wales, Prince William and Harry. She told them to come up with a 'workable solution' to the crisis within days, and tasked aides with presenting a series of options to put to the unhappy couple.

Insiders last night predicted that Harry, 35, and Meghan, 38, would be allowed to keep their royal titles and also enjoy a measure of the independence they have demanded.

But they added that the couple's string of demands had sparked a genuine crisis which will not be easy to solve.

As a sign of how serious and sensitive the issue has become, Home Secretary Priti Patel has been asked to take part in the negotiations.

She will be tasked with ensuring the couple's ongoing security is not compromised, but she also has to monitor the cost to taxpayers if they split their lives between the UK and North America ...

And on, and on, and on.

My sympathy for Harry and Meghan grows daily.

:cheers:

- mod edit to fix formatting/link -
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: BeyondTheNow on January 09, 2020, 20:24:15
Well sheesh, FJAG, I go to share one link... ;)

 The Royal Fallout From Meghan & Harry’s Decision Is Turning Nuclear

Quote
Yesterday, Prince Harry and Meghan Markle stunned the world with the sudden announcement that they decided to step back from their royal duties. Their statement, shared over social media to their millions of fans around the globe, came to the surprise to the Sussexes’ supporters — and the disappointment to the Firm itself...

...The radical move comes after a particularly rough year for Meghan, who was subjected to often derogatory scrutiny at the hands of the British tabloids. Harry has publicly addressed this harassment on multiple occasions, condemning the tabloids’ hounding of his wife and even comparing it to what his mother Princess Diana faced in the last years of her life. Many believe that the couple’s decision to distance themselves from the Firm is a means of creating a necessary boundary that would protect the prince and his family from going through that pain again...

Of course, there’re always endless tidbits of information coming from “the source” ::), but I read a very small headline or something about them splitting the day before it all broke, but tossed it aside thinking it was just baseless. Obviously something had gotten out though...

 https://www.refinery29.com/en-us/2020/01/9175677/meghan-markle-prince-harry-quit-royal-family-backlash-reactions (https://www.refinery29.com/en-us/2020/01/9175677/meghan-markle-prince-harry-quit-royal-family-backlash-reactions)

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Chris Pook on January 09, 2020, 20:25:40
Having been immersed in the British press over the last few Brexity years I was continually astounded by how much ink was spilled on Meghan's parents and whether she or Kate were more popular/worthy/matronly etc.

I am proud enough to be British but John Wilkes (https://www.britannica.com/biography/John-Wilkes) has a lot to answer for.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 09, 2020, 21:15:55
More scaling down in the U.K. (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-51055157) ...
Quote
Wax figures of the Duke and Duchess of Sussex have been moved from other members of the Royal Family at Madame Tussauds in London.

Prince Harry and Meghan had been placed next to the Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh.

The museum made the changes following the couple's statement that they are to "step back" as senior royals.

Steve Davies, general manager at the attraction, said the couple were two of their most popular figures.

"Alongside the rest of the world we are reacting to the surprising news that the Duke and Duchess of Sussex will be stepping back as senior royals," he said.

"From today Meghan and Harry's figures will no longer appear in our Royal Family set."

Mr Davies said the couple will remain an important feature at Madame Tussauds London, "as we watch to see what the next chapter holds for the them."

The museum did not say where the couple will be placed ...
The attached, from the museum's Twitter feed (https://twitter.com/MadameTussauds/status/1215338581042122754).
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: BeyondTheNow on January 09, 2020, 21:30:03
Unnecessarily hurtful and extremely passive-aggressive this early in the course of events. The family as a whole is still dealing with everything. Distasteful and downright disrespectful of everyone the situation is affecting at the moment. Honouring their wishes, my a$$—It was an extremely ill-timed move, IMO.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 09, 2020, 21:41:11
From what I have read the couple is stepping away for abit and not stepping down. Not informing Her Majesty first is bad form.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 09, 2020, 21:43:06
Unnecessarily hurtful and extremely passive-aggressive this early in the course of events. The family as a whole is still dealing with everything. Distasteful and downright disrespectful of everyone the situation is affecting at the moment. Honouring their wishes, my a$$—It was an extremely ill-timed move, IMO.
I thought the Twitter post was maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe more than just a bit much ...
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: ballz on January 10, 2020, 02:20:20
I really don't follow this stuff, but one thing I do remember is that they wanted to move out of Buckingham Palace and got told they couldn't. Now they're taking all sorts of measures to try and convince them to come back into the fold. The Royal family seems like a cult to me.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: BeyondTheNow on January 10, 2020, 02:49:47
Interesting article.

I remember that televised interview with Diana well. I watched it with a few friends. Even if one doesn’t follow the happenings of the Royal family closely, Diana’s clip from the interview saying, “...Well, there were three of us in the marriage, so it was a bit crowded...” and the pain in her eyes, especially during that segment, is familiar to most. She speaks openly of how poorly she was treated by the family.

Much seems to be the same with Meghan, and as the article points out, Meghan has ethnic differences, as well as societal/class comparisons compounding her clashes with other Royals. Her (basically) estranged family hasn’t helped matters either.

In any event, I agree with the article’s sentiment that Markle was an easy scapegoat to distract people from other issues involving Royals at different times. It seemed very coincidental that a couple of sources would report on a story (Prince Andrew’s purported affair, for example) and then all of a sudden there’d be a ton of sources reporting on something Meghan said or did to offend.

(I’ll be honest and say I’m personally not an overall fan of Meghan in terms of how she presents herself at times. Diana had a very unmistakable, heartfelt and relatable sincerity to her, which she exuded naturally in interviews, through social functions, galas and global outreach. She seemed to wear her heart on her sleeve at all times, which no doubt made many uncomfortable. On the contrary, I have difficulty gauging Markle. She always seems to be...performing? (And I’m very familiar with her through the series “Suits”, so that might not be helping.) But the same level of authenticity doesn’t seem to flow from her.

Anyway, I do think it’s very brave of them to unite and plot the path for themselves and the future of their own family. I can only imagine the coldness they’ll be facing for a while...

 The Sussexes’ refusal to submit to tradition was a long time coming, and it will shake up the royal family

Quote
... There was a moment that, in retrospect, was a turning point in our understanding of Markle’s strength. Back in October 2019, just five months after she gave birth, in an interview with reporter Tom Bradby for a documentary called Harry & Meghan: An African Journey, Meghan was fighting to hold back tears although the rest of her face confessed her despair. Bradby asked about Meghan’s wellbeing, and she frankly told him, “Not many people have asked if I’m okay … it’s a very real thing to be going through behind the scenes.” She pulled back the veil a little further when Bradby asked her if she’s not really okay and if it’s been a struggle, and she replied with a faint yet succinct, “Yes.” The short clip was a disgrace...

...The royal family still has not learned their lesson from another woman, who unlike Markle, was born into aristocracy and still struggled to exert her agency: Princess Diana. Twenty-five years ago, in 1995, Princess Diana did an interview with BBC in which she told reporter Martin Bashir that she doesn’t think she’ll be queen (even though she was still married to Prince Charles at the time) because the “establishment” that she married into wouldn’t want it. When Bashir asked why, Diana responded, “Because I’m a nonstarter. … Because I do things differently. Because I don’t go by a rulebook. I lead from the heart, not the head.” The stark difference between Meghan and Diana is that Diana’s rebellious nature is not compounded by her race. Because of Meghan’s Blackness, her controversy is attached to not only what she does but also by her being in the royal family at all...

... By Markle being an outsider, culturally, racially, and socioeconomically, she has been the royal family’s scapegoat through which they can shield other members’ indiscretions, like the pestering rumors about Prince William’s alleged affair with socialite Rose Hanbury, who runs in their same blue-blooded circles, or Prince Andrew’s friendship with Jeffrey Epstein and the underaged victims who were allegedly abused by both of them. This is a legacy of girls and women whose lives and bodies are no match for the ironclad protection of men, and Meghan, as a mixed-race woman, became a part of a perfect storm...

...BuzzFeed reporter Ellie Hall made a Twitter thread in which she’s said that out of all of her seven years of reporting on the royal family, Meghan is the only one who gets this intense amount of vitriol...

More at link:

 https://zora.medium.com/meghan-markle-defeated-the-british-monarchy-f536ae8c14f5?gi=82f703b41c95 (https://zora.medium.com/meghan-markle-defeated-the-british-monarchy-f536ae8c14f5?gi=82f703b41c95)
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 10, 2020, 04:35:44
I read an article today citing the number of Royals who had their own sources of income.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on January 10, 2020, 10:49:09
I'm waiting for someone to blame the drop out, draft dodging, slacker culture of Vancouver Island for infecting them to the point where they have decided to become Royal Hermits on the Left coast ;)
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Chris Pook on January 10, 2020, 11:28:11
This article is curious.

Quote
How Meghan Markle and Prince Harry were 'cornered' into making resignation announcement

MEGHAN MARKLE and Prince Harry may have hoped to leave the country quietly, but unfortunately for them, a royal “leak” decided to expose their US ambitions in an explosive interview with The Sun.

By HOLLY FLEET
PUBLISHED: 04:13, Fri, Jan 10, 2020 | UPDATED: 13:24, Fri, Jan 10, 2020

Senior aides have claimed that the royal couple has been diligently planning their escape to North America away from the monarchy for months. However, someone on the inside of their closest circle shared their plans with The Sun newspaper and left them feeling cornered. “It was a case of they act now or lose control of something they had spent a long time working on,” says a source close to the couple.

.....

The most important new ruling that has come to light since the announcement of the Sussexes departure, is their wish to only work with a select group of journalists who will provide them with favourable coverage.

According to the royal couple’s new Sussex Royal website, they will be “adopting a revised media approach to ensure diverse and open access to their work."

Therefore parting ways with the Royal Rota, which is a select group of Britsh media organisations who have traditionally covered the royal news.

These outlets include The Daily Express, The Daily Mail, The Daily Mirror, The Evening Standard, The Telegraph, The Times, and The Sun.

Instead under their new self-flattering media plan, the pair will only

“Engage with grassroots media organisations and young, up-and-coming journalists “

“Invite specialist media to specific events/engagements to give greater access to their cause-driven activities, widening the spectrum of news coverage “

“Provide access to credible media outlets focused on objective news reporting to cover key moments and events; “

https://www.express.co.uk/news/royal/1226467/Meghan-Markle-news-Prince-Harry-latest-Duchess-Sussex-uk-departure

The tabloids' "Iron Rice Bowl" is threatened by Meghan and Harry adopting the new Public Relations strategy.  So the press has motive to resist the change and Fleet Street makes more money from Villains than Heroes.  Heroes are only useful as counter-points to Villains and until they can themselves be exposed as Villains.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: MarkOttawa on January 12, 2020, 14:33:50
Daily Mail having a field day with Canadian angles (with videos):

1)
Quote
The clue Justin Trudeau knew about Meghan Markle before the Queen: Canadian Prime Minister tweets Royal pair would 'ALWAYS be welcome' weeks before the couple's shock announcement

  Justin Trudeau wrote 'you're among friends' to the Duke and Duchess of Sussex
    He said they are 'always welcome here' on Twitter weeks before announcement
    Trudeau and his wife were allegedly consulted about the Canada move last year
    The Canadian government did not respond to claims and the Sussex's denied it

...
(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/01/11/21/23282520-7877129-image-a-5_1578778683790.jpg)
Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau (pictured with Prince Harry at a dinner during the Commonwealth Heads of Government Meeting in 2018) wrote 'You’re among friends, and always welcome here' on Twitter after hearing the news about the Sussex's spending Christmas in his native country. Mr Trudeau and his wife Sophie were consulted about the decision late last year, before members of the Royal family and even the Queen, according to diplomatic sources
...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7877129/Justin-Trudeau-known-Royals-Prince-Harry-Meghan-Markles-announcement.html

2)
Quote
Prince Harry and Meghan Markle face backlash in Canada over bill for Mountie guards as campaigners say there must be 'no blank cheque' for the couple's security

    Harry and Meghan to hold crisis summit with family over move to Canada
    Canadian taxpayers could be forced to pay for Harry and Meghan's security
    Country's Mounted Police told there must be no 'blank cheque' on costs
    In online statement the Sussexes said they would look to become 'financially independent' while stepping back as senior royals
    New poll suggests Canadians could approve of Harry taking Governor General role - which already offers incumbent security

...
(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/01/12/00/23287944-7877525-image-a-20_1578789660300.jpg)
The Duke and Duchess of Sussex could face a huge backlash from Canadian taxpayers if they are forced to pay for the couple's security if they decide to move there (Harry and Meghan are saluted by two officers of the Canadian Royal Mounted Police in London, March 2019)
...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7877525/Prince-Harry-Meghan-Markle-face-backlash-Canada-bill-Mountie-guards.html

Some more Canadian-angle stories here:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/royals/index.html

Mark
Ottawa
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Good2Golf on January 12, 2020, 14:45:55
Is the Daily Mail fabricating a “much ado about nothing” issue about the Sussexes security? ‘Backlash’?  Is the Daily Mail a proxy of ‘The Firm’, trying to sew, or at least fertilize the seeds of dissension against Harry and Meghan?

Regards
G2G
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on January 12, 2020, 14:51:43
What's in the back of Prince Charles' mind right now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nn5e7vq5bqk
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 13, 2020, 10:30:50
More (https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/william-harry-issue-statement-amid-royal-family-rift-1.4764379) - highlights mine ....
Quote
Princes William and Harry slammed a newspaper report Monday describing a severe strain in their relationship, calling the story offensive and potentially harmful as they embark on talks regarding the future of the British monarchy.

The two brothers issued the unusual statement even as Queen Elizabeth II was set to hold face-to-face talks with Prince Harry for the first time since he and his wife, Meghan, unveiled their controversial plan to walk away from royal roles. The dramatic family summit is meant to chart a future course for the couple.

Though the statement did not name the newspaper, the Times of London has a front page story about the crisis in which a source alleged that Harry and Meghan had been pushed away by the "bullying attitude from" William. The joint statement insisted that the story was "false."

"For brothers who care so deeply about the issues surrounding mental health, the use of inflammatory language in this way is offensive and potentially harmful," the statement said.

The meeting reflects the queen's desire to contain the fallout from Harry and Meghan's decision to "step back" as senior royals, work to become financially independent and split their time between Britain and North America. The couple, also known as the Duke and Duchess of Sussex, made the announcement Wednesday without telling the queen or other senior royals first.

The meeting at the monarch's private Sandringham estate in eastern England will also include Harry's father Prince Charles and his brother Prince William. It comes after days of intense news coverage, in which supporters of the royal family's feuding factions used the British media to paint conflicting pictures of who was to blame for the rift.

William is expected to travel to Sandringham from London and Harry from his home in Windsor, west of the British capital. Charles has flown back from the Gulf nation of Oman, where he attended a condolence ceremony Sunday following the death of Sultan Qaboos bin Said.

Meghan, who is in Canada with the couple's baby son Archie, is likely to join the meeting by phone.

Buckingham Palace said "a range of possibilities" would be discussed, but the queen was determined to resolve the situation within "days, not weeks." The goal was to agree on next steps at Monday's gathering, which follows days of talks among royal courtiers and officials from the U.K. and Canada. Buckingham Palace stressed, however, that "any decision will take time to be implemented." ...
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on January 13, 2020, 11:49:51
It's getting serious...


On Sunday it was believed that the Duke and Duchess of Sussex have moved their dogs to Canada, prompting speculation they intend to spend most of their time there.
They reportedly flew their beagle and Labrador out to their property in Vancouver Island in November during their six-week sabbatical from royal duties.
The Duchess brought her beagle, Guy, to the U.K. when the couple began dating. The couple later acquired the black Labrador, whose name has not been revealed.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: OldTanker on January 13, 2020, 12:10:44
I wasn't aware the Royals had property here on Vancouver Island. So far as I'm aware they were simply staying at a guest residence, albeit a very swank one. I hope your post was sarcasm, in which case well done. However, the last thing most of us who live here want is some bunch of poncy Royals flouncing about with their security and foreign media intruding on our solitude. As a young couple, they would be much happier living in a larger city like Vancouver or Toronto where there is action and a vibrant social life. Unlike life here in The Shire where a band of escaped chickens makes the front page of the local newspaper. Please, Royals, go somewhere else. Frankly, anywhere else.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 13, 2020, 13:23:02

Looks like the Queen is going to support their request.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-51099102

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 13, 2020, 13:31:30
Also some questions about who pays for their security...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-morneau-security-costs-harry-meghan-1.5424988
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on January 13, 2020, 14:20:10
I wasn't aware the Royals had property here on Vancouver Island. So far as I'm aware they were simply staying at a guest residence, albeit a very swank one. I hope your post was sarcasm, in which case well done. However, the last thing most of us who live here want is some bunch of poncy Royals flouncing about with their security and foreign media intruding on our solitude. As a young couple, they would be much happier living in a larger city like Vancouver or Toronto where there is action and a vibrant social life. Unlike life here in The Shire where a band of escaped chickens makes the front page of the local newspaper. Please, Royals, go somewhere else. Frankly, anywhere else.

Are you kidding? Half of Victoria think they're some kind of royalty already. This will just fulfill their self-important imperial delusions :)
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 13, 2020, 14:22:30
Also some questions about who pays for their security...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-morneau-security-costs-harry-meghan-1.5424988
Cue memes complaining about spending tax dollars on foreigners when there's other things to spend it on? :stirpot:
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 13, 2020, 15:04:49
Cue memes complaining about spending tax dollars on foreigners when there's other things to spend it on? :stirpot:
And The Beaverton strikes again!  "Unskilled foreigners seek move to Canada" (https://www.thebeaverton.com/2020/01/unskilled-foreigners-seek-move-to-canada/)
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 13, 2020, 15:15:15
And The Beaverton strikes again!  "Unskilled foreigners seek move to Canada" (https://www.thebeaverton.com/2020/01/unskilled-foreigners-seek-move-to-canada/)

That fits in with my personal experience when visiting BC. When I visited Toronto my experience was opposite, friendly folks even to americans.
I had related my experience to a Canadian that I had met and he essentially said something like no worries, people of BC/Vancouver look down their nose at Canadians in different parts of the country as well..
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 13, 2020, 15:20:37
When I visited Toronto my experience was opposite, friendly folks even to americans.

 :)

Quote
Toronto has the world's 3rd largest population of Americans living outside of the USA
https://dailyhive.com/toronto/toronto-us-expat-population


Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Blackadder1916 on January 13, 2020, 15:36:57
No meme, but a comment about the funding of security for the ginger-haired, now-excess-to-requirements spare.

The UK government currently pays for the security arrangements for members of the Royal  Family.  Though that comes from the public purse, the revenue from the Crown Estate that is surrendered to the UK government more than covers any of those expenses.  Canada has no similar arrangement.  The Queen (as the Sovereign, or as an individual person) does not own (personally or in right of position) any similar property holdings in Canada that could be used for funding Royal Family expenses.  As the Duke and Duchess of Sussex would be coming to Canada as private citizens and have no official function here or any constitutionally mandated position, they should be responsible for their personal security costs (just like everybody else).  If the UK government wants to continue the funding of routine personal security for the couple, fine (they probably have a legal obligation to do so); if they contract the RCMP to perform the function within Canada, even better.  But otherwise the couple should be treated just like any other wealthy, young, socially connected family.  Let them trade on their celebrity to become "financially independent"; the local social climbers and politicians can kiss their asses but the local cops should not be providing any more services than would be offered to any resident of whichever community in which they settle.


https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/sovereign-grant-act-2011-guidance/sovereign-grant-act-2011-guidance
Quote
Sovereign Grant Act 2011: guidance
Updated 5 November 2019

1. Sovereign Grant
The Sovereign Grant Act 2011 came into effect on 1 April 2012. It sets the single grant supporting the monarch’s official business, enabling The Queen to discharge her duties as Head of State. It meets the central staff costs and running expenses of Her Majesty’s official household – such things as official receptions, investitures, garden parties and so on. It also covers maintenance of the Royal Palaces in England and the cost of travel to carry out royal engagements such as opening buildings and other royal visits.

In exchange for this public support, The Queen surrenders the revenue from The Crown Estate to the government which for 2017-18 was £329.4 million. The Sovereign Grant for 2019-20 is £82.4 million which is 25% of £329.4 million. Section 2 explains how this is calculated.

It was announced in November 2019 that the Sovereign Grant for 2020-21 will be £85.9 million. This is 25% of The Crown Estate’s revenue surplus in 2018-19 which was £343.5 million.

In accordance with the Civil List Act 1952, HRH Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh receives a Parliamentary annuity of £359,000. Although, the Duke of Edinburgh has stepped back from public official duties, he still requires office support for non-public official duties. The Duke of Edinburgh is Patron, President or a member of over 780 organisations, with which he continues to be associated, although he no longer plays an active role by attending engagements.

Visit the official website of the British Monarchy

2. Determination of the Sovereign Grant
Normally the size of Sovereign Grant for a given year is equal to a prescribed proportion (initially 15% and since 2017/18 25%) of The Crown Estate’s profit for the financial year two years prior to the year in question. This means that the Grant can be set firmly at the beginning of each financial year, e.g. the Grant for 2019-20 is linked to The Crown Estate profit for 2017-18.

The Crown Estate’s audited accounts are published in the summer. At the time of the Budget, the Royal Trustees (the Prime Minister, the Chancellor of the Exchequer and the Keeper of the Privy Purse) publish a formal report recommending the amount of the Sovereign Grant for the next financial year based on the formula described above.

If the whole of the Sovereign Grant is not spent in a given year, the surplus is paid into a Reserve Fund, controlled by the Royal Trustees. The amount that may accumulate in the Reserve Fund is limited in line with the provisions set out in the Sovereign Grant Act 2011. – this gives the Royal Trustees the power to set a lower level of Sovereign Grant than the formula would otherwise generate.

3. Accountability
The Royal Household is fully financially accountable. The Royal Household’s business accounts are audited by the National Audit Office (NAO) and laid before Parliament. The NAO may also undertake value for money reviews to scrutinise its use of public funds. The Public Accounts Committee (PAC) may in turn investigate these further.

4. Review of the formula for Sovereign Grant
The percentage used for calculating the Sovereign Grant is reviewed every five years. The first review began in April 2016 and assessed whether the 15% proportion value was appropriate. The Royal Trustees recommended an increase in the percentage to 25% from 17/18 to fund reservicing works at Buckingham Palace and Her Majesty’s official duties.
For more details, please read:

the Sovereign Grant Act 2011: Report of the Royal Trustees on the Sovereign Grant Review 2016
the Buckingham Palace Reservicing Programme Summary
5. Duchy of Cornwall
The Duchy of Cornwall is a private landed estate created by Charter in 1337 when Edward III granted it to his son and heir, Prince Edward (the Black Prince) and all his subsequent heirs. It provides each Duke with an income from its assets. The current Duke is the Heir to the Throne, HRH Prince Charles.

The estate comprises primarily agricultural, commercial and residential property, in addition to which the Duchy has a portfolio of financial investments. The Duchy consists of around 52,971 hectares of land in 23 counties, mostly in the South West of England. For more details, please visit the official website for the Duchy of Cornwall.

Under the Sovereign Grant Act:
a grant is to be paid to heirs to the throne who are not Dukes of Cornwall to put them in a similar financial position as if they were Dukes of Cornwall; this means that in future daughters of the monarch, as well as younger sons, could benefit

if the heir is not the Duke of Cornwall and is over 18, the heir is to receive a grant based on Duchy revenues; the Monarch (who in these circumstances becomes the Duke) receives the Duchy revenues, and the Sovereign Grant is reduced by an equal amount (so in effect, the heir would receive the Duchy income)

if the Duke of Cornwall is a minor, 90% of the revenues of the Duchy go to the monarch and the Sovereign Grant is reduced accordingly

6. Royal Palaces
The occupied Royal Palaces are held in trust for the nation by The Queen as Sovereign. Their maintenance and upkeep is one of the expenses met by the government in return for the surrender by the Sovereign of the hereditary revenues of the Crown (mainly the profit from the Crown Estate). The Sovereign Grant will allow the Royal Household to set its own priorities and thus generate economies.

The occupied Royal Palaces are:

Buckingham Palace
St James’s Palace
the residential and office areas of Kensington Palace
the Royal Mews and Royal Paddocks at Hampton Court
Windsor Castle and buildings in the Home and Great Parks at Windsor
7. Royal Travel
The Sovereign Grant covers the cost of The Queen’s travel on official engagements and travel by members of the royal family representing Her. Safety, security, presentation, the need to minimise disruption for others, the effective use of time, environmental impact and cost are taken into account when deciding on the most appropriate means of travel.

Where appropriate, The Queen and Other Members of the Royal Family use scheduled train services for their official journeys. In addition, The Queen, The Duke of Edinburgh and The Prince of Wales may use the Royal Train for longer journeys in the UK.

The Royal train enables members of the Royal Family to travel overnight and to work and hold meetings during lengthy journeys. It has modern office and communications facilities.

Journeys on the train are always organised so as not to interfere with scheduled services.

8. Tax
The Monarch is not legally liable to pay income tax, capital gains tax or inheritance tax because the relevant enactments do not apply to the Crown. The same is true for the income from the Duchy of Cornwall which is paid to The Prince of Wales. Since 1993, The Queen and the Prince of Wales have paid tax voluntarily in the same way as everyone else does. This is set out in a Memorandum of Understanding on Royal Taxation, updated March 2013.

The Queen is not liable to pay tax on the Sovereign Grant as it covers official expenditure only and, under the arrangements in the Memorandum, tax would not be due.

Other key points to note:

the Queen voluntary pays income and capital gains tax, alongside inheritance tax to the extent described in paragraphs 1.9 and 1.10 in the Memorandum. Tax is also paid on The Queen’s Privy Purse income (which includes income received from the Duchy of Lancaster) to the extent that it is not used for official purposes
other members of the Royal Family are fully liable to tax in the normal way. The cost of their official duties is allowed against tax
the Duke of Edinburgh pays tax on any part of the annuity that is not used wholly, exclusively and necessarily in the performance of his official duties. In practice the whole of the annuity is used for official business
9. The Crown Estate
The Crown Estate is the property of the Sovereign “in right of the Crown”, as found on the official website of The Crown Estate. Since 1760 each monarch has surrendered its revenue to the Exchequer in return for government support.

For more details, you can view financial information on this section of the official website of The Crown Estate.

The profit of the Crown Estate is a reference point for the calculation of Sovereign Grant. The Crown Estate does not pay the Sovereign Grant to the Monarch directly. It makes a payment each year to the Consolidated Fund and HM Treasury makes the payment to the Monarch.

10. Security costs
No breakdown of security costs is available as disclosure of such information could compromise the integrity of these arrangements and affect the security of the individuals protected. It is long established policy not to comment upon the protective security arrangements and their related costs for members of the Royal Family or their residences
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 13, 2020, 16:00:59
Thanks for that Blackadder 1916 - much appreciated.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on January 13, 2020, 16:23:15
Ginger Samson meets Neo-Delilah :)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delilah
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: CloudCover on January 13, 2020, 16:28:21
Meh.. I’ve got no issue paying for their reasonable security costs when they are in Canada. The feds waste far more money on more trivial things and nobody bats an eye.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 13, 2020, 17:01:21
Security ? I thought they wanted to be like regular folks on the dole ?  ;D
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Jarnhamar on January 13, 2020, 19:46:28
There's a net worth of $30 million between them both. Pretty sure they can pay for their own security.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 13, 2020, 20:16:18
She is being called the Duchess of Woke in the US.  ;D
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on January 13, 2020, 20:51:37
Break out the pay sheets, it's official, Harry is now a 'Class 'A' Royal :)


Queen gives reluctant blessing to Harry and Meghan's plans

She agreed to a ‘period of transition’ and stressed the couple remain ‘a valued part of my family’


The Queen has given her reluctant blessing to the Duke and Duchess of Sussex to split their time between the UK and Canada, making it clear that though she had wanted the couple to remain as full-time working royals, she supported their decision.

After a historic summit of senior royals at Sandringham, details over exactly how Harry and Meghan will carve out the new “progressive” roles they seek remained unclear. The Queen has, however, agreed to a “period of transition” and stressed the couple remain “a valued part of my family”.

But there were “complex matters” still to resolve, and “more work to be done” as she said she wants final decisions to be reached in the coming days.

The Queen’s statement came after 90 minutes of talks, which began against the backdrop of Prince William and Prince Harry attempting to stem rancorous speculation about their relationship in a joint statement.

Shortly after the Sandringham summit ended, the Queen issued a personal and informal statement in which she also struck a conciliatory tone.

“Today my family had very constructive discussions on the future of my grandson and his family.

“My family and I are entirely supportive of Harry and Meghan’s desire to create a new life as a young family. Although we would have preferred them to remain full-time working members of the royal family, we respect and understand their wish to live a more independent life as a family while remaining a valued part of my family”.

“Harry and Meghan have made clear that they do not want to be reliant on public funds in their new lives.

“It has therefore been agreed that there will be a period of transition in which the Sussexes will spend time in Canada and the UK.

“These are complex matters for my family to resolve, and there is some more work to be done, but I have asked for final decisions to be reached in the coming days”.

In a highly unusual move Harry and Meghan were not referred to as the duke and duchess in the statement, only as the Sussexes and by their first names, raising questions about whether they will retain their titles in the future.

Monday’s unprecedented summit was attended by the Queen, Charles, William and Harry, and was the first time the senior royals had met since the Sussexes made their shock statement last Wednesday. Meghan was due to join by conference call from Canada, where she has been since Friday, with the couple’s son, Archie, and their two dogs.

The couple want to “step back” as senior royals, perform royal duties “as called upon”, continue their charitable work and, crucially, be allowed to earn a income.

The palace had been blindsided by the timing of the couple’s announcement, made without warning, which left family members feeling “disappointed” and “hurt” according to sources.

Ahead of Monday’s meeting William and Harry broke their silence over the royal crisis to condemn speculation about their relationship as “offensive and potentially harmful”

In a show of unity, the brothers jointly attacked a UK newspaper report, thought to be in the Times, though senior aides did not specify. A statement, issued through the princes’ respective offices, said: “Despite clear denials, a false story ran in a UK newspaper today speculating about the relationship between the Duke of Sussex and the Duke of Cambridge”.

“For brothers who care so deeply about the issues surrounding mental health, the use of such inflammatory language in this way is offensive and potentially harmful”.

Monday’s Times cited a source claiming Harry and Meghan regarded themselves as having been pushed away by what they saw as a “bullying” attitude from William. It reported the source, said to be close to the couple, as saying William was insufficiently welcoming to Meghan when she first started dating Harry. The source claimed that William’s attitude resulted from the competitive nature of his relationship with his younger brother.

The last year has seen repeated reports of a suspected rift between the brothers. Harry then appeared to confirm the speculation when he told an ITV documentary in October that the brothers, once so close, were on “different paths”.

It is unusual for palace aides to issue such vehement public denials on such personal matters. The fact they did so is indicative of just how sensitive feelings are within the family as they seek to reconcile differences and contain the crisis to prevent further damage to the monarchy. The palace is also desperate to avoid a repeat of any narrative such as the so-called “War of the Waleses”, which accompanied the breakdown of Charles and Diana’s marriage.

Final decisions yet to be made on the Sussex’s severance from full-time royal duties will have huge implications for the shape of the monarchy, and for the future roles of young royals including Princess Charlotte and Prince Louis, the youngest of the Cambridge’s three children.

No details were given of issues discussed, but they were likely to have included how much time the couple intend to spend in Canada, where their son will be raised, what royal duties they will still perform, and what commercial activities would it be feasible for them to undertake in order to become self-funding yet not risk tarnishing the royal brand.

One possible blueprint regarding how the couple could approach commercial enterprises are guidelines devised almost 20 years ago after the Countess of Wessex was accused of cashing in on her royal status in a bid to win business for her PR firm from a “fake sheikh” undercover reporter.

Those rules advise royals to first consult the Lord Chamberlain – the most senior official of the royal household – before taking on any new business activity. They also require that anyone connected with a business activity “should be carefully briefed not to try to exploit , either deliberately or inadvertently, the member of the royal family’s position, associations or access.”

Both Edward, who worked in television, and Sophie, who worked in PR, stepped down from their jobs after aides accepted they worked in areas prone to accusations of exploitation.

The move has raised questions over whether Canadian taxpayers would have to pay for the couple’s security costs during their time in North America but the country’s prime minister Justin Trudeau said no discussions had taken place.

Speaking to Canadian broadcaster Global News on Monday, he said: “There will be many discussions to come on how that works.

“But there’s still a lot of decisions to be taken by the royal family and by the Sussexes themselves as to what level of engagement they choose to have and these are things that we are supportive of.”

Earlier, Penny Junor, a royal biographer, said the Queen’s statement on Monday was “friendly and warm” and gave the couple space to find some perspective.

“I think it will take the pressure off them. I think they’re in a very vulnerable state at the moment. I think they’re unhappy, they feel isolated and unloved, unappreciated and they needed careful handling,” she said. “My reading from that statement is that the family has been sensitive to their vulnerability.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jan/13/queen-gives-reluctant-blessing-to-harry-and-meghans-plans
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Brihard on January 13, 2020, 21:09:29
There's a net worth of $30 million between them both. Pretty sure they can pay for their own security.

Given the particular threat that is ever-present to members of the Royal Family, they don't really have the choice of living a normal life. He's cursed by birth with that notoriety, and with that ever present need for at least some protection. It's properly a policing function. There's also an element of protecting whichever of the public might happen to be knowingly or unknowingly in his vicinity at any particular time. In the grand scheme of the RCMP's budget, these costs are pretty small. It would be reasonable for costs to be shared with the monarchy to some extent though.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Jarnhamar on January 13, 2020, 21:28:33
Given the particular threat that is ever-present to members of the Royal Family, they don't really have the choice of living a normal life. He's cursed by birth with that notoriety, and with that ever present need for at least some protection. It's properly a policing function. There's also an element of protecting whichever of the public might happen to be knowingly or unknowingly in his vicinity at any particular time. In the grand scheme of the RCMP's budget, these costs are pretty small. It would be reasonable for costs to be shared with the monarchy to some extent though.

I know in the greater scheme of things it's probably chump change but the optics of Canadian tax payers footing the bill for this couples perminant police protection? When they're deciding to move here on their own? Can see it being a hard sell if that's the route they take.

What kind of man power would we be looking at to cover off a couple? 4 officers working in shifts? 8?

Where ever the end up will be a dogs breakfast with media, Canadian and I bet British.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Brihard on January 13, 2020, 21:38:07
I know in the greater scheme of things it's probably chump change but the optics of Canadian tax payers footing the bill for this couples perminant police protection? When they're deciding to move here on their own? Can see it being a hard sell if that's the route they take.

What kind of man power would we be looking at to cover off a couple? 4 officers working in shifts? 8?

Where ever the end up will be a dogs breakfast with media, Canadian and I bet British.

I won't speak to the number of officers it would take; too close to OPSEC for my comfort. It wouldn't be cheap and I'm not pretending it is. Annual costs of a couple mil I think is safe to say.

I get the optics of it, and yeah it sucks. I don't really think it can be helped. Like I said, not his fault he happens to be the grandson of the head of state, and a part of a family that is permanently at significant risk. Ultimately it doesn't really need to be 'sold' to anyone; it just gets done out of whatever budget is appropriate and people can deal with it. There'd be a little bit of noise from a few advocacy groups like the CTF, and then people would move on to the next bit of media nonsense.

I would be surprised if some cost were not recouped from the Royal Family.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 13, 2020, 21:51:56
Quote
Cost of protecting the Duke and Duchess of Sussex has been pegged at $1.7 million a year
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-morneau-security-costs-harry-meghan-1.5424988
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: gryphonv on January 13, 2020, 21:57:55
Yeah like it or not, we are a commonwealth country. No matter how we feel about it, it is our Duty to ensure members of the Royal Family are protected while on our soil. Even if they are here in an unofficial capacity.

One of my biggest issues with our politics is we nickle and dime everything. At the end of the day, 2 mil is a rounding error for the budget.

But news will make this out to be bigger than it is.

I don't blame them for wanting out, the media in the UK is ruthless and crosses many lines. At least we are a bit more respectable in Canada.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Brihard on January 13, 2020, 22:04:04
Brain fart on my part; RCMP would of course only be responsible while they're on our soil. That would simultaneously ease some things, but also introduce additional complexity in scheduling full time VIP trained cops on an intermittent basis in an area where there's typically not much full time demand for VIP security, assuming they lived in BC.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Czech_pivo on January 13, 2020, 22:21:40
Yeah like it or not, we are a commonwealth country. No matter how we feel about it, it is our Duty to ensure members of the Royal Family are protected while on our soil. Even if they are here in an unofficial capacity.

One of my biggest issues with our politics is we nickle and dime everything. At the end of the day, 2 mil is a rounding error for the budget.

But news will make this out to be bigger than it is.

I don't blame them for wanting out, the media in the UK is ruthless and crosses many lines. At least we are a bit more respectable in Canada.

We Canadians are by far the most cheapest SOB’s that I’ve ever met in the world.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 13, 2020, 22:36:48
We Canadians are by far the most cheapest SOB’s that I’ve ever met in the world.

Quote
At this point, it’s unknown just how much security would be required to protect the royal couple and their child, but it would be defined by a threat assessment, said Joe Balz, ex-RCMP officer and president of GloProSec Preventative Services.

“There’s always going to be the odd idiot who causes some type of problem,” Balz said. He added that they would be safer in Canada than in the U.S., where gun laws are much less strict.
https://globalnews.ca/news/6393526/meghan-markle-prince-harry-canada-taxpayer-cost/
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: FSTO on January 13, 2020, 22:53:51
We Canadians are by far the most cheapest SOB’s that I’ve ever met in the world.

We hand wring about every dollar spent and our chicanery usually makes everything we do cost much more than it has to be.

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 14, 2020, 00:39:02
We hand wring about every dollar spent and our chicanery usually makes everything we do cost much more than it has to be.

Spencer Fernando ( don't know who he is, but see him quoted on here from time to time ) had this to say,

Quote
Harry & Meghan Should Pay For Their Own Security In Canada
https://www.spencerfernando.com/2020/01/13/harry-meghan-should-pay-for-their-own-security-in-canada/
Harry & Meghan must pay for their own security, and not one cent of Canadian taxpayer dollars should be spent on them.



Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Chris Pook on January 14, 2020, 02:42:34
The Swede's have blazed a trail that the Windsor's might want to consider

https://www.thelocal.se/20200113/could-the-british-royals-learn-anything-from-swedens-royal-family

Quote
the Swedish royal family underwent big changes of its own earlier this year.

This was a more controlled change, as the king removed five of his grandchildren from the Royal House in a move said to have been discussed among the family over a period of several years.

King Carl XVI Gustaf made the announcement that the two sons of his own son Prince Carl Philip, and the three children of Princess Madeleine would no longer perform the official duties of senior royals.

The five remained part of the royal family, a term used to refer to all the extended family of Sweden's reigning monarch, but will no longer be referred to as Royal Highness.

And none of them will benefit in the future from the income paid to members of the Royal House and funded by taxpayers, which is in return to performing official royal duties.

....

Quote
The UK's Prince Harry might find himself relating to Princess Madeleine's family in particular, for whom the change might well mean a long-term move to the US.

The princess currently lives in the US with her husband, a British-American financier who refused a royal title (and Swedish citizenship) upon his marriage, and the changed roles for their grandchildren make it easier for the family to stay in North America.

Princess Madeleine took to Instagram, the social media platform also favoured by the Sussexes, to share her positive reaction to the announcement about her family. "I believe it is good that our children will now have a greater opportunity in the future to form their own lives as private individuals," she wrote.

I wonder about the calibre of the Swedish King.  He seems to be managing change effectively.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Brihard on January 14, 2020, 06:59:23

I wonder about the calibre of the Swedish King.

84mm, I believe.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 14, 2020, 07:51:13
84mm, I believe.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: LoboCanada on January 14, 2020, 12:41:24
I'll preface this by saying i'm no Republican, if anything i'm more of an monarchist.

This isn't really anything to do about money... Queen costs us $40Mil/yr (2009 figure) comparatively, and she doesn't even live here (or visit anymore).

Make them the King/Queen of Canada - Canadianize them. Boot the GG, all Lt.Generals. Give them the existing infrastructure/costs/salary meant for the GG. Strong connection to the Queen/Windor family, with the distance from the racist UK press and their scrutiny they hate. People love them over here already, would be a good face for us internationally.

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 14, 2020, 13:04:49
I'll preface this by saying i'm no Republican, if anything i'm more of an monarchist.

This isn't really anything to do about money... Queen costs us $40Mil/yr (2009 figure) comparatively, and she doesn't even live here (or visit anymore).

Make them the King/Queen of Canada - Canadianize them. Boot the GG, all Lt.Generals. Give them the existing infrastructure/costs/salary meant for the GG. Strong connection to the Queen/Windor family, with the distance from the racist UK press and their scrutiny they hate. People love them over here already, would be a good face for us internationally.

Not that easy or even possible.  The constitutional mess that would create because some people are infatuated with a celebrity royal couple is not worth it nor is it required.  Nothing is stopping them from being appointed GG if the PM is so inclined to do so but as I've mentioned these two want to go their own way.  Being GG of Canada does not further that goal for them. 

I have no issues with them moving part time to Canada.  I hope they do good things.  But in the end they are just going to become influential socialites lending their names to good causes. 

If we want to move to a truly Canadian Head of state why bother canadianizing two non Canadians and why not just pick/chose/vote for an actual Canadian?
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 14, 2020, 13:49:56
The Duchess wanted to move to the US as long as Trumpp isn't President. Maybe she can do that in 2024.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 14, 2020, 14:24:05
The Duchess wanted to move to the US as long as Trumpp isn't President.

She wouldn't be the only US citizen wanting to live in Canada after election night.  :)
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/canadas-immigration-web-site-crashed-after-2016-election/

Maybe she can do that in 2024.

He "jokes" about staying on longer than two terms.
https://www.newsweek.com/trump-jokes-he-wont-leave-presidency-after-8-years-its-not-bad-idea-1476178
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 14, 2020, 14:28:58
I recall after his election a number of Hollywood celebs vowed to move to Canada but I don't think any did much to my chagrin. I got through 8 years of Obama so they should too.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 14, 2020, 14:31:43
I recall after his election a number of Hollywood celebs vowed to move to Canada but I don't think any did much to my chagrin.

Just wanting to move to Canada isn't enough to get a visa.

I got through 8 years of Obama so they should too.

Going back to when he was pushing Birtherism, and even now in 2020, I'm not sure the current occupant of the White House has gotten over President Obama yet.

Edit spelling.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 14, 2020, 14:37:11
Meh, nothing new about Americans threatening to move North...

This article back in 2012 explains a bit of it.  although at that time it was more republican supporters worried about an Obama re-election.

https://www.cnn.com/2012/11/07/politics/us-election-bluster/index.html

Funny stuff every four years. 

Edit to add link
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 14, 2020, 14:38:53
This article back in 2012 explains a bit of it. 

Which article is that?
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 14, 2020, 14:47:45
Which article is that?

https://www.cnn.com/2012/11/07/politics/us-election-bluster/index.html

Sorry about that.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 14, 2020, 14:56:05
https://www.cnn.com/2012/11/07/politics/us-election-bluster/index.html

Sorry about that.

Quoting from your link,

Quote
More recently, after Tuesday's election results came in, real estate mogul and reality TV star Donald Trump called for "revolution!" and urged his 1.8 million Twitter followers to "march on Washington and stop this travesty."

He further called on them to "fight like hell and stop this great and disgusting injustice," while proclaiming the country was now in "serious and unprecedented trouble...like never before." Trump has since deleted the revolution missive.

Post noted that Trump was at the forefront of the so-called "birther movement," which falsely claims Obama wasn't born in the United States, so he wasn't surprised to see Trump sound off, but "the intensity of that was rather shocking."

The Duchess wanted to move to the US as long as Trumpp isn't President.

Good luck to Meghan and Harry wherever they end up.



Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Hamish Seggie on January 14, 2020, 18:06:27
I recall after his election a number of Hollywood celebs vowed to move to Canada but I don't think any did much to my chagrin. I got through 8 years of Obama so they should too.

Like we need any more useful fools.

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Jarnhamar on January 14, 2020, 18:42:00

I get the optics of it, and yeah it sucks. I don't really think it can be helped. Like I said, not his fault he happens to be the grandson of the head of state, and a part of a family that is permanently at significant risk. Ultimately it doesn't really need to be 'sold' to anyone; it just gets done out of whatever budget is appropriate and people can deal with it. There'd be a little bit of noise from a few advocacy groups like the CTF, and then people would move on to the next bit of media nonsense.

You're probably right my friend, it'll just get done.

I think if enough people get upset (like, livid as we seen in the case of Terri-Lynne McClintic getting sent to a being house) we might see the government backtracking and reversing a decision or going against policy. But this is hardly the same situation or cause to be so upset. Few million for security is a drop in the bucket.

I'm not sure of the police (probably RCMP?) would see this as a jammy go or not enjoy the job. It would doubly suck for an RCMP officer/s to have to uproot their family and move just to provide security for Harry and his wife I would think.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 14, 2020, 19:03:17
I'm not sure of the police (probably RCMP?) would see this as a jammy go or not enjoy the job.

You get to wear cool sunglasses.  8)
https://twitter.com/rcmp_nat_div/status/1185198715117674498

It would doubly suck for an RCMP officer/s to have to uproot their family and move just to provide security for Harry and his wife I would think.

And family.
https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ACYBGNQ_UI4iCyBVtUOVZcev9L-JSqUNVw%3A1579046911488&source=hp&ei=_1ceXri1G8_0swWdkZfABg&q=meghan+harry+children&oq=meghan+harry+children&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39.2243.8748..9253...1.0..0.237.2825.1j18j2......0....1..gws-wiz.......0i131j0j0i131i67j0i67j0i131i20i263j0i3j0i324j0i10j0i22i30j0i22i10i30.KyCHHfn7pJk&ved=0ahUKEwj4sPaRqITnAhVP-qwKHZ3IBWgQ4dUDCAs&uact=5#spf=1579046921671
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 14, 2020, 22:06:29
Sooooo, which is it, then?
:pop:
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Czech_pivo on January 14, 2020, 22:53:45

I'm not sure of the police (probably RCMP?) would see this as a jammy go or not enjoy the job. It would doubly suck for an RCMP officer/s to have to uproot their family and move just to provide security for Harry and his wife I would think.

Tough - RCMP candidates/officers are well aware that they can be posted to any area of Canada as they are needed. If a person took this job and didn’t realize those risks, too bad.

I didn’t pursue a career with a certain intelligence agency for that very reason. No way my spouse would have agreed to it.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 15, 2020, 10:41:56
Interesting side-by-side comparison (https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ellievhall/meghan-markle-kate-middleton-double-standards-royal) of how the different members of The Firm were dealt with by media on similar issues - a couple of examples attached.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 15, 2020, 11:18:05
Tough - RCMP candidates/officers are well aware that they can be posted to any area of Canada as they are needed. If a person took this job and didn’t realize those risks, too bad.

I didn’t pursue a career with a certain intelligence agency for that very reason. No way my spouse would have agreed to it.

Sure.  That does not mean they have to like it or enjoy it.  But hey, we can keep treating them like hot garbage and wonder why there might be a retention issue. 

Just like in the CAF. 

I'm willing to bet that a lot of guys that might get voluntold for that gig are guys that put in their time on less than glamourous or coveted posts to get to where they are.   
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Brihard on January 15, 2020, 11:45:27
Tough - RCMP candidates/officers are well aware that they can be posted to any area of Canada as they are needed. If a person took this job and didn’t realize those risks, too bad.

I didn’t pursue a career with a certain intelligence agency for that very reason. No way my spouse would have agreed to it.

Respectfully, I’m going to suggest you’re talking well outside of your arcs and without requisite knowledge of how the RCMP solves operational manpower needs both short and long term, or how specialty roles like VIP protection are handled- that’s not something that just any (or even most) RCMP members are qualified to do.

In this case, the decision to set up shop in Canada by the Sussexs will not happen overnight. In the interim if it were necessary to deploy some RCMP members who are VIP trained on essentially a TD task, that could be done, albeit at considerable expense. Longer term, establishing a dedicated protective unit would be a bit laborious but pretty straight forward. I expect this would be a desirable enough full time job that a competition for these roles would get a good number of applicants. Like any postings it takes time, but it would be pretty straightforward.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 15, 2020, 11:56:08
In today's news,
Quote
Meghan and Harry were forced to remove claims from website RoyalSussex.com that they are entitled to personal bodyguards due to their status, despite opting to 'quit' royal firm
https://www.google.com/search?biw=1280&bih=641&tbs=qdr%3Ad&sxsrf=ACYBGNQAUO_xASknygabqU-glZQXBJeFDw%3A1579103629986&ei=jTUfXqXVO6W0ggeIkrbgCw&q=%22internationally+protected+people%22+meghan+harry&oq=%22internationally+protected+people%22+meghan+harry&gs_l=psy-ab.12...3791.5233..7502...0.0..2.261.1540.0j5j3......0....1..gws-wiz.EukgTqTh1TE&ved=0ahUKEwjlz7a3-4XnAhUlmuAKHQiJDbwQ4dUDCAo#spf=1579103640312
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: CloudCover on January 15, 2020, 12:26:21
this whole thing is turning into a bit of an a$$.

https://modernfarmer.com/2014/06/modern-farmers-guide-guard-donkeys/

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Czech_pivo on January 15, 2020, 14:09:22
Sure.  That does not mean they have to like it or enjoy it.  But hey, we can keep treating them like hot garbage and wonder why there might be a retention issue. 

Just like in the CAF. 

I'm willing to bet that a lot of guys that might get voluntold for that gig are guys that put in their time on less than glamourous or coveted posts to get to where they are.   

If I was a newish RCMP officer and had the chance of Nunavut, Tuk or Vic Island, I easily know what I'd be taking.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 15, 2020, 14:33:37
Angus Reid

January 15, 2020
Quote
Royal Tab: Vast majority don’t want to pay costs associated with the Sussexes’ move to Canada
http://angusreid.org/harry-meghan-canada-monarchy/
Nor do Canadians care to pay for his and his wife’s security and other expenditures associated with their stated intention to spend at least part of the year in Canada, while “stepping back” from official duties. Nearly three-quarters (73%) of Canadians say “no thank you” to the prospect.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 15, 2020, 14:38:16
If I was a newish RCMP officer and had the chance of Nunavut, Tuk or Vic Island, I easily know what I'd be taking.

If you were a newish RCMP officer you would not be with Protective Services either.

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 15, 2020, 15:15:39
Private security will be bought by the Duke and Duchess. Hope reality sets in and they go back on the public purse. Their brand may not be worth as much as they expect.

The way forward ?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/royal-family/2020/01/13/prince-william-take-note-queen-kept-rebellious-sibling-side/
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 15, 2020, 16:28:01
Private security will be bought by the Duke and Duchess.

Hopefully they will stay safe.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Czech_pivo on January 15, 2020, 16:44:36
If you were a newish RCMP officer you would not be with Protective Services either.

Touche!
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Jarnhamar on January 15, 2020, 17:12:54
Quote from: Czech_pivo


I didn’t pursue a career with a certain intelligence agency for that very reason. No way my spouse would have agreed to it.

Are you regular force military?
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Brihard on January 15, 2020, 18:57:45
If you were a newish RCMP officer you would not be with Protective Services either.

What's that assumption based on? What's your operating definition of 'newish'?
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on January 15, 2020, 19:08:12
I think that it's the law that for every jaded, grizzled veteran on the Protective detail who's a month away from retirement that there also be an idealistic young officer, who makes a critical mistake leading to the dramatic death of the grizzled old cop who, with his dying gasp, calls on the rookie to avenge his death.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vyANa71gvU
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 15, 2020, 22:27:45
Sooooo, which is it, then?
  • Attributed:  "Finance Minister Bill Morneau said today the federal government hasn't decided if Ottawa would help to cover the security costs associated with a move by Prince Harry and his wife Meghan to Canada ..." (https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-morneau-security-costs-harry-meghan-1.5424988) (CBC)
  • No mention of sourcing:  "Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has agreed taxpayers in his country should pick up the huge bill for the couple’s round-the-clock protection while they are in the country, the Evening Standard has learned.  Mr Trudeau — still dealing with the fall-out from the downing of a Ukrainian aircraft by the Iranian military which killed 57 Canadians  — has privately assured the Queen that Harry, Meghan and Archie’s safety will not be jeopardised while they reside there ..." (https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/canada-security-bill-harry-meghan-justin-trudeau-a4332906.html) (UK Evening Standard)
:pop:
Well, so far, fact checkers say no decision's been made yet (https://factcheck.afp.com/speculation-canada-agreed-cover-royal-couples-security-bill-false-government-sources-say) ...
Quote
... Trudeau told Canadian media Global News in an interview on January 13 that nothing had been settled in regards to the security bill for the royal family, which media estimated to be Can$1.7 million. “We’re not entirely sure what the final decisions will be, those are decisions for them (the royal couple),” Trudeau said.

A government source close to the matter told AFP that this had not changed as of the time of publication on January 15, adding that reports of Trudeau offering to the Queen to pay for Harry and Meghan’s protection are false ...
Brought to you by #NotBoughtMedia
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 15, 2020, 22:40:29
Private security will be bought by the Duke and Duchess.

Well, so far, fact checkers say no decision's been made yet (https://factcheck.afp.com/speculation-canada-agreed-cover-royal-couples-security-bill-false-government-sources-say)

Just have to wait and see!i

Some on the internet have described Canada as sort of a "halfway house" between the UK and LA,
https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ACYBGNTZ5MPdTAgJvufD5JKBavpyeme8Uw%3A1579142131044&source=hp&ei=88sfXpgRgqy1Bsv2nvAF&q=%22canada+is+not+a+halfway+house%22&oq=%22canada+is+not+a+halfway+house%22&gs_l=psy-ab.3..33i22i29i30l4.2715.13511..14026...1.0..2.481.5736.4j19j3j3j2......0....1..gws-wiz.......35i39j0i67j0j0i131i67j0i131j33i160.RvTF4qzrnJg&ved=0ahUKEwjY1pLuiofnAhUCVs0KHUu7B14Q4dUDCAs&uact=5#spf=1579142145615
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Brihard on January 15, 2020, 23:02:58
Private security will be bought by the Duke and Duchess. Hope reality sets in and they go back on the public purse. Their brand may not be worth as much as they expect.

The way forward ?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/royal-family/2020/01/13/prince-william-take-note-queen-kept-rebellious-sibling-side/

Something to bear in mind; private bodyguards in Canada would not be carrying firearms. Police can.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 15, 2020, 23:53:56
If private security isn't an option then they reimburse the RCMP or Vancouver police all this to keep Megan happy. William did advise his brother not to marry her. Love can be so blind.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 16, 2020, 00:10:40
Love can be so blind.

Marriage is the eye opener.  :)

Not everyone in B.C. is on board with paying,

Quote
Why pay security costs for Harry and Meghan?
https://theprovince.com/opinion/letters/letters-to-the-province-jan-16-2020-security-costs-for-harry-and-meghan

If a family wanted to migrate to Canada and a member had a medical condition that would cost Canadian taxpayers $1 million annually, their application would probably be refused.

When I heard that the Canadian government may foot the bill for their security while they wait for a government change in the U.S. so they can move to Los Angeles to be closer to Hollywood, it went from absurd to ridiculously surreal.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Hamish Seggie on January 16, 2020, 09:23:33
So Megan doesn't want to live in the US as long as Trump is President?

How about going back and living in the USA and campaign on behalf of Candidate (fill in the blank here) so maybe Trump won't get a second term.


Just a thought.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 16, 2020, 10:30:19
So Megan doesn't want to live in the US as long as Trump is President?

Quote
Meghan Markle plans to move to Los Angeles only after Trump leaves office, report
https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/meghan-markle-plans-move-los-angeles-after-trump-leaves-office-report



Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 16, 2020, 10:42:15
What's that assumption based on? What's your operating definition of 'newish'?

My assumption was that he was talking about someone right out of Depot.

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Remius on January 16, 2020, 10:43:53
Something to bear in mind; private bodyguards in Canada would not be carrying firearms. Police can.

Easy solution.  Build a giant mansion in the shape of a brinks truck.  All your limos are brinks trucks.  Put cash in both.  Problem solved.  Armed security.

 ;D
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 16, 2020, 10:52:10
My assumption was that he was talking about someone right out of Depot.

Without knowing if Canadians will be paying for security for Harry and family, or if it would be a permanent or temporary posting,  different organizations fill internal postings diferent ways. Perhaps using the senior qualified process, or the relative ability process.

It's up to who signs off on the posting.



eg: Police experience is not required to be a US Secret Service agent.
https://www.secretservice.gov/join/careers/agents/


Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 16, 2020, 11:00:18
All your limos are brinks trucks. 

By your emoji, I assume you are kidding.

But, I have heard / read of it being seriously suggested - and seriously refused - for other people in Toronto.

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: One-off on January 16, 2020, 11:27:27
William did advise his brother not to marry her. Love can be so blind.

Advised him not to marry her or to not get married at all?  :rofl:
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 17, 2020, 01:05:09


Arent the Royals supposed to be apolitical ?
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on January 17, 2020, 10:35:12
Arent the Royals supposed to be apolitical ?

From what I have read, "They are stepping back from their roles as 'senior' members of the royal family."

What are the roles of junior members?  :dunno:





Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 17, 2020, 16:36:36
I saw some discussion today that Harry and Megan could lose their titles ? I suppose that's up to Her Majesty. She is making a statement either today or Saturday so we shall see. I saw where their Frogmore House is being shuttered.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Retired AF Guy on January 17, 2020, 20:01:29
I was going to post in the Editorial Cartoon forum, but decided post here instead.

https://www.politico.com/gallery/2020/01/17/the-nations-cartoonists-on-the-week-in-politics-003690?slide=12
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on January 18, 2020, 16:54:14
They have lost their title HRH but retaitain their Dukedom. Anyone have further insight ?

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/prince-harry-meghan-markle-queen-announcement-royal
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on January 18, 2020, 17:01:46
I can totally imagine the Queen singing this song...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-qV8zy4b-Q
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 18, 2020, 17:52:53
They have lost their title HRH but retaitain their Dukedom. Anyone have further insight ?

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/prince-harry-meghan-markle-queen-announcement-royal
Here's a touch of analysis from the BBC (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-51163865?fbclid=IwAR1aopCwVQA8BxsbZDrF_m1YiTxPXEca89SW9G2IA6CNmXcFMGeDXz_PSw4) ...
Quote
... They will always be, the Queen writes, 'much loved members of my family'.

But that's about it. No royal title, no royal duties, no military appointments, no tours, most of their time spent in Canada, no public money.

It is harder to think of a much cleaner break than this. Harry and Meghan are still members of the Royal Family, but they are effectively no longer royal.

The early talk was of a much more mixed life - one where perhaps Harry and Meghan continued with some royal duties, dividing their time equally between the UK and Canada.

But the contradictions and conflicts of interest were too many.

There are still lots of details to thrash out.

And the whole thing will be reviewed after a year.

But a new life awaits Harry and Meghan - celebrities, certainly, but a different kind of royalty ...
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Bread Guy on January 19, 2020, 10:31:39
A little more from the Royal Info-machine (https://twitter.com/RoyalFamily/status/1218601524638732298) ...
Quote
Published 18 January 2020
Statement from HM The Queen.

Following many months of conversations and more recent discussions, I am pleased that together we have found a constructive and supportive way forward for my grandson and his family.

Harry, Meghan and Archie will always be much loved members of my family.

I recognise the challenges they have experienced as a result of intense scrutiny over the last two years and support their wish for a more independent life.

I want to thank them for all their dedicated work across this country, the Commonwealth and beyond, and am particularly proud of how Meghan has so quickly become one of the family.

It is my whole family’s hope that today’s agreement allows them to start building a happy and peaceful new life.

ENDS

Statement from Buckingham Palace

The Duke and Duchess of Sussex are grateful to Her Majesty and the Royal Family for their ongoing support as they embark on the next chapter of their lives.

As agreed in this new arrangement, they understand that they are required to step back from Royal duties, including official military appointments. They will no longer receive public funds for Royal duties. 

With The Queen’s blessing, the Sussexes will continue to maintain their private patronages and associations. While they can no longer formally represent The Queen, the Sussexes have made clear that everything they do will continue to uphold the values of Her Majesty.

The Sussexes will not use their HRH titles as they are no longer working members of the Royal Family.

The Duke and Duchess of Sussex have shared their wish to repay Sovereign Grant expenditure for the refurbishment of Frogmore Cottage, which will remain their UK family home.

Buckingham Palace does not comment on the details of security arrangements. There are well established independent processes to determine the need for publicly-funded security.

This new model will take effect in the Spring of 2020.

ENDS
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Blackadder1916 on January 21, 2020, 14:41:10
Apparently, moving to Canada does not provide a paparazzi-free environment.

https://theprovince.com/news/canada/prince-harry-arrives-in-canada-to-prepare-for-non-royal-life-2/wcm/c7388602-5483-49dd-9007-b391f0b24a2a
Quote
Day One in Canada: Harry, Meghan threaten legal action against paparazzi outside B.C. home

The Sussexes say paparazzi are permanently camped outside their home with long lenses trained at their B.C. residence

LONDON —  Prince Harry and his wife Meghan have issued a warning over harassment by paparazzi photographers in Canada after agreeing to give up their royal duties to start their new life outside Britain, according to Sky News.

The warning comes after Meghan was photographed on Monday in North Hill Regional Park on Vancouver Island, carrying eight-month-old son Archie in a baby sling and walking her two dogs, Guy and Oz.

Lawyers say the pictures were taken by photographers hiding in bushes who did not obtain her consent, the BBC reported.

In addition, the Sussexes say paparazzi are permanently camped outside their home with long lenses trained at their residence, Sky said.

The couple have made some changes to the area to make it more secure. The property sits at the end of a private road, behind a gate. But since the royals moved in, a white tarp has been placed behind it to provide added privacy.

A temporary metal fence has also been erected along the edge of the property that leads down to a public beach, and a security camera and dog now keep watch.

The legal warning comes on Day One of the couple’s new life in Canada. Harry arrived in Canada early on Tuesday to join Meghan.

Harry was shown arriving on Vancouver Island by Sky News, just days after reaching an arrangement with Queen Elizabeth and senior royals that will see him and his wife Meghan leave behind their royal roles to seek an independent future.

The lack of photos has not been for want of trying. Earlier this month, Miles Arsenault, the owner and captain of Deep Cove’s Bay to Bay Charters, refused to take three people, including a cameraman out in his water taxi after he learned that his client, a Japanese television station, wanted to stake out Meghan’s address, which is secluded and best viewed from the water.

“It was a no-brainer for me to walk,” Arsenault said, despite the fact that the retired photographer only launched his water taxi business six months ago and could use the business.

“It’s just not the way that I wanted to be remembered — as carrying paparazzi around.”

. . . .

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: PuckChaser on January 21, 2020, 14:51:41
Paparazzi are such parasites. Only slightly worse than the masses that consume their content and fuel their ridiculous actions. Photographing someone on their private property without consent should be illegal.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: YZT580 on January 21, 2020, 18:02:23
Candid camera is illegal.  The difficulty is in fighting it.  The argument used by the press is one of the public's need to know overrides an individuals right to privacy when said individual is a public figure.  Harry has resigned and wishes to be eliminated from the public eye except for those occasions when family responsibilities bring him back to England or when he signals his intent to make a 'public' appearance.  Given the normal person's attention span, he should be allowed to sit back in about a week.  Give it a month before he can go into a pub
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on January 21, 2020, 23:10:47
Candid camera is illegal.  The difficulty is in fighting it.  The argument used by the press is one of the public's need to know overrides an individuals right to privacy when said individual is a public figure.  Harry has resigned and wishes to be eliminated from the public eye except for those occasions when family responsibilities bring him back to England or when he signals his intent to make a 'public' appearance.  Given the normal person's attention span, he should be allowed to sit back in about a week.  Give it a month before he can go into a pub

I seriously doubt that.

Like a straggling moose calf, breaking away from the main Royal 'herd' and leaving a country of 60 million for a tiny rural community like North Saanich will likely mean that they will be easier targets than ever to get picked off by the tabloid wolves.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on January 21, 2020, 23:51:05
I think they will be aggressively boring, forcing the press to return to the allegations against the man who doesn't sweat... which will end badly for a former Sea King pilot.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on January 27, 2020, 11:33:35
Now they're getting a real taste for what it's like to be a BC landowner/ settler :)

Royal rumble: Native band claims Harry's B.C. mansion on 'stolen land'

Some of Prince Harry and Meghan’s Markle’s new Vancouver Island neighbours aren’t quite ready to roll out the welcome wagon.
The Tseycum Nation claims the pair’s rented $18-million mansion is built on land “stolen” by British colonizers almost two centuries ago.
“We get no money from the land now, nothing. But for us, it’s just not right houses like that are built there,” Chief Tanya Jimmy told the Sunday Mirror.

https://vancouversun.com/news/national/royal-rumble-native-band-claims-harrys-b-c-mansion-on-stolen-land/wcm/a59f22e4-8921-4a29-b014-71fbe6966170
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: SeaKingTacco on January 27, 2020, 14:42:37
Uh-huh. Hey, I wonder what the Douglas Treaty says about all this...
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Blackadder1916 on January 27, 2020, 15:29:26
Uh-huh. Hey, I wonder what the Douglas Treaty says about all this...

Well, this is what the Tseycum First Nation has to say about the Douglas Treaty.

https://www.sct-trp.ca/apption/cms/UploadedDocuments/20187003/001-SCT-7003-18-Doc1.pdf
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Colin P on January 28, 2020, 01:57:37
Well if he gets bored and is reading this, he is more than welcome to inspect our Navy League Corp in North Van who will welcome him (and his wife) with open arms.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on January 28, 2020, 12:39:03
Well if he gets bored and is reading this, he is more than welcome to inspect our Navy League Corp in North Van who will welcome him (and his wife) with open arms.

Write the Queen and request a Royal Visit. Seriously. It's a thing.

https://www.royal.uk/contact

Don't specify that you want 'The Duke and Duchess of Such and Such' etc, as they'll put it in the hopper with the rest of their visit plans out this way and you could get any of 'The Firm' dropping in to see the kids.

I used to know one of the guys that managed these things and it's quite the operation. They were always disappointed that more people didn't write in....
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: BillN on January 28, 2020, 14:13:18
Well if he gets bored and is reading this, he is more than welcome to inspect our Navy League Corp in North Van who will welcome him (and his wife) with open arms.

Is it still the Hon. Clarence Wallace Corps?  Both my nephews were members of that corps....many years ago.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Colin P on January 28, 2020, 14:26:26
Is it still the Hon. Clarence Wallace Corps?  Both my nephews were members of that corps....many years ago.

Yes it is, we parade Tuesday nights 6;30 to 9:00pm, drop on by and say hello. Our FB site https://www.facebook.com/NLCC-Honourable-Clarence-Wallace-174880119252848/
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on February 01, 2020, 00:25:53
BREAKING: Harry and Meghan have reached out to the Winnipeg Jets and Vancouver Canucks for advice on living in Canada without a title.

https://twitter.com/Jonathan_Dunphy/status/1223253866139004930
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on February 02, 2020, 16:33:21
Quite... eh? ;)



https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/02/world/canada/harry-meghan-victoria-british-columbia.html

Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: tomahawk6 on February 07, 2020, 09:06:32
Haryy and Meg are house shopping in LA. She must crave the sun and warmth of LA. Its expensive but they might find something for a few million bucks.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/royals/meghan-markle-and-prince-harry-are-house-shopping-in-los-angeles/ar-BBZIQwE?ocid=spartanntp
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: suffolkowner on February 10, 2020, 18:30:22
this "article" says that they have 15 full time people in their protection detail. I wonder if that will continue

https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/you-wont-believe-how-many-security-officers-prince-harry-meghan-markle-have.html/
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on February 10, 2020, 18:46:06
I'm no security expert. But, I imagine they require three details, because they are pretty mobile, and not always together in the same place at the same time.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: dapaterson on February 10, 2020, 19:02:40
this "article" says that they have 15 full time people in their protection detail. I wonder if that will continue

https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/you-wont-believe-how-many-security-officers-prince-harry-meghan-markle-have.html/

A week is 168 hours.  That's 21 shifts of 8 hours, or four people full time for a single full time member of the detail If you assume 2-4 at all times (backup and they sometimes go to different places at different time) that averages out to 12 people full time, with 12 left over shifts.  Add in coverage for vacation / illness etc, and 15 full time is not an unreasonable size for round the clock coverage.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Jarnhamar on February 10, 2020, 19:08:35
Is the security detail RCMP officers?
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: daftandbarmy on February 10, 2020, 19:35:49
Understandable... the weather was pretty nice here last weekend :)


Meghan Markle and Prince Harry allegedly turned down Oscars invitation

Sunday evening's Academy Awards were filled with a year's worth of celebrity sightings -- from Bradley Cooper to Tom Hanks -- but the show's attendees could have also included the Duke and Duchess of Sussex.

According to new reports, the royal couple was invited to attend the annual awards show and were even approached by the academy to present the award for Best Picture.

"They were honoured by the request, but declined the invitation," said royal reporter Emily Nash of Hello! Magazine.

The couple's attendance at the Oscars would have been a surprise, but not entirely unusual for the couple, especially given Meghan's Hollywood roots.


https://www.aol.com/article/entertainment/2020/02/10/meghan-markle-and-prince-harry-allegedly-turned-down-oscars-invitation/23922945/
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: udtabn on February 11, 2020, 21:45:21
not sure how  they both can work in Canada ?  guess they had help with  work permits
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Spencer100 on February 14, 2020, 13:54:21
not sure how  they both can work in Canada ?  guess they had help with  work permits

Well Megan has not been gone too long hers maybe up to date. Or was it employer dependant?
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Czech_pivo on February 14, 2020, 14:58:02
Well Megan has not been gone too long hers maybe up to date. Or was it employer dependant?

She very well may have had Landed Immigrant status prior to her marriage.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: CloudCover on February 14, 2020, 15:12:48
These two will be just fine. They will be in the category of self employed business owners, who will create net jobs for others in Canada.
I will be interested to learn when or if they need a hospital, will they take a slab and bring their own pillow in the hallway like the rest of us, or will they check in to a 6 star hospital in LA.
These could be some interesting updates on SussexRoyal Instagram or Twitter:
- “We’re on the waiting list for a day family doctor”
- “Awaiting our MyCRA token in the mail”
- “Applied for B.C. Services card”
- “Go Leafs(?)”
- “What does “Givener” mean?”
Etc.
Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: mariomike on February 27, 2020, 18:41:02
Quote
Canada to cease security funding for Harry and Meghan

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/canada-cease-security-funding-harry-meghan-n1144381

"The assistance will cease in the coming weeks, in keeping with their change in status," the office of Public Safety Minister Bill Blair said.


Title: Re: Harry and Meghan to step down as senior royals
Post by: Spencer100 on May 08, 2020, 11:47:08
Well they're not in Canada any more

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/lifestyle/royals/meghan-markle-and-prince-harry-are-staying-at-tyler-perrys-beverly-hills-mansion/ar-BB13LOqe?ocid=spartanntp

Plus Harry has to give up his gun collection.

https://dailycaller.com/2020/05/06/prince-harry-rifles-sell-hunting-quit-meghan-markle-jane-goodall-report-private-deal/?fbclid=IwAR3w8XAJKPr9n8wp7xd0QN9mfeOP5T35Xdcg68eil87YBaI_k1GGeKdUK7k