Author Topic: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say  (Read 4139 times)

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Offline Fishbone Jones

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #25 on: December 16, 2018, 01:55:08 »
A guy I met earlier this year has 11 kids and a good job at a pulpmill in Northern BC. He was a very happy guy!
Of course. There's always exceptions and people that make it work.


Bingo.  And you don't even need to extend the thought experiment beyond 1 or 2 kids.  The answer is "won't", not "can't".
I always thought giving your kids better than you had was one of the goals of being a parent. 1 or 2 is all some can do without going backward. Maybe I'm old fashioned that way.
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Offline Furniture

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #26 on: December 16, 2018, 02:39:17 »
since 3 in 4 of the people categorized as migrants are also characterized as internal migrants- you know, like people who move back and forth from Fort McMurray to the Rock.

So that makes almost every one of us on this forum "migrants", which shows you how words and statistics can be used to make anything sound reasonable. Legal immigration selects the best from potential candidates, so they should out preform the local population. That's the goal of an immigration system, to draw the best and keep out dead weight. Nobody seems to have a real issue with legal immigration, people get upset by the way some people get to circumvent the system by just showing up at the border and getting special treatment.

Is there a valid comparison to be drawn between someone moving from rural PEI to Victoria, and someone from rural Syria to Toronto? More topically, is there a comparison between the aspiring actor moving to LA from the mid-west, and a migrant from Columbia?

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #27 on: December 16, 2018, 23:28:57 »
Is there a valid comparison to be drawn between someone moving from rural PEI to Victoria, and someone from rural Syria to Toronto? More topically, is there a comparison between the aspiring actor moving to LA from the mid-west, and a migrant from Columbia?

Fortunately, due to the cost of living, no one 'in-migrates' from PEI to Victoria :)
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Offline CountDC

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2018, 13:27:55 »
Exactly.  We have more than 2 because we decided we didn't need all the toys many feel they do need these days.
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Offline Remius

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #29 on: December 17, 2018, 13:48:01 »
Exactly.  We have more than 2 because we decided we didn't need all the toys many feel they do need these days.

In my parents' days clothes were passed down from one kid to the next, people and their kids knew how to sew and hem and repair, rooms were shared, mom stayed home, kids occupied themselves, older siblings became care givers, neighbours took kids in for meals, kids got jobs early, improvised, played kick the can and chased each other until it was dark.  No one played organised hockey they just played on the pond with whatever they could find.  No one had a finished basement, they had cellars.  The outdoors was your finished basement.

Now kids need their own bedrooms, x-box, phones, don't work until much later in life, organised sports costs way too much, have special diets etc etc.  Christ I know some kids that each have their own xbox in the same freaking house.

People could make it work but they can't do it while wanting a certain instant gratification and disposable lifestyle.
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Offline Fishbone Jones

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #30 on: December 17, 2018, 23:31:44 »
Some big broad brushes painting some broad antique strokes.

There's plenty of kids out there wearing hand me downs, that don't have any electronic gadgets.

Not all parents are financially capable of supporting a tribe.
To try compare things fifty years ago to today is pretty far fetched.

You can pine for those days of yesteryear, moan about spoiled kids,, selfish parents, whatever. They are gone. At least for most. Hungry then tastes the same as hungry now.

People will have as many kids as they want. Responsible people will limit that number to what is good for the family unit, whether one or ten.

It would almost appear to be shaming if you don't spit out kids like rabbits. You push the idea that if someone doesn't have the amount of children you think they should, then they're just shiftless and selfish. Thought China were the one that dictated what gender and how many kids you can have.

Condemn people for not having more kids than they can handle? Wait until you're done walking 10 miles each way to school all uphill both ways in three feet of snow and having to warm your shoeless feet in fresh cowpats.

Of course you won't have problems paying more and more taxes to pay for those third generation, 10 person welfare families. If they all have the ten kids you mandate in three generations you're supporting thousands, but you have the population you wanted.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2018, 23:37:28 by Fishbone Jones »
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Offline Remius

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #31 on: December 18, 2018, 10:33:19 »
Some big broad brushes painting some broad antique strokes.

There's plenty of kids out there wearing hand me downs, that don't have any electronic gadgets.

Not all parents are financially capable of supporting a tribe.
To try compare things fifty years ago to today is pretty far fetched.

You can pine for those days of yesteryear, moan about spoiled kids,, selfish parents, whatever. They are gone. At least for most. Hungry then tastes the same as hungry now.

People will have as many kids as they want. Responsible people will limit that number to what is good for the family unit, whether one or ten.

It would almost appear to be shaming if you don't spit out kids like rabbits. You push the idea that if someone doesn't have the amount of children you think they should, then they're just shiftless and selfish. Thought China were the one that dictated what gender and how many kids you can have.

Condemn people for not having more kids than they can handle? Wait until you're done walking 10 miles each way to school all uphill both ways in three feet of snow and having to warm your shoeless feet in fresh cowpats.

Of course you won't have problems paying more and more taxes to pay for those third generation, 10 person welfare families. If they all have the ten kids you mandate in three generations you're supporting thousands, but you have the population you wanted.

Slow down tex.  That isn't what I was saying at all.  Society has changed.  Yes people can make it work.  I have one kid.  It works for me.  I could have two or three and still maintain a certain lifestyle.  But you have to make some sacrifices.  Some people are still today making those sacrifices.  Things are different.  My family all lived on the same block.  Grandparents uncles etc.  Not anymore.  families barely live in the same area codes anymore.

It was just a comment on today vs yesterday.

 ::)

 
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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #32 on: December 18, 2018, 11:47:49 »
And I'd add some [most] of those 7+ families wouldn't have been that big had the same level of NOT having to have 7+ kids was available then, like it is today.....
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Offline Brad Sallows

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #33 on: December 18, 2018, 20:28:07 »
People definitely would have had fewer children in the paste if they had more reliable methods of birth control.

The point about "can't" vs "won't" (in any context) is that the former mistakenly creates the impression that something is beyond the capacity of a person to address.  I don't expect people to live uncomfortably, but they don't get to pretend that the possible is impossible.
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Offline CountDC

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #34 on: December 19, 2018, 13:43:21 »
In my parents' days clothes were passed down from one kid to the next, people and their kids knew how to sew and hem and repair, rooms were shared, mom stayed home, kids occupied themselves, older siblings became care givers, neighbours took kids in for meals, kids got jobs early, improvised, played kick the can and chased each other until it was dark.  No one played organised hockey they just played on the pond with whatever they could find.  No one had a finished basement, they had cellars.  The outdoors was your finished basement.

Sound like their days and mine were the same ones.  Kick the can was fun.  Most families had cats to try and keep the rats away from the cellars.  Hockey on the pond/lake with a nice fire to warm yourself by. 
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Offline CountDC

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #35 on: December 19, 2018, 13:54:07 »
People definitely would have had fewer children in the paste if they had more reliable methods of birth control.

The point about "can't" vs "won't" (in any context) is that the former mistakenly creates the impression that something is beyond the capacity of a person to address.  I don't expect people to live uncomfortably, but they don't get to pretend that the possible is impossible.

Agreed.  Don't see anyone dictating what size anyone else should have. We are just pointing out there is a difference between can't and won't.   Give up that third pickup, speed boat, European vacation. etc and you can.  The fact that you won't though is totally up to you.  Saying can't makes it seem like a society issue of under paid over charged vice a life choice made.  My sister and her husband decided not to have any kids, their choice to live the life they wanted but they never said can't.  They made the choice, acknowledge it and lived it. 
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Online Blackadder1916

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Re: Report: Facts About Migrants Don't Always Match What The Headlines Say
« Reply #36 on: December 19, 2018, 14:11:41 »
Sound like their days and mine were the same ones.  Kick the can was fun.  Most families had cats to try and keep the rats away from the cellars.  Hockey on the pond/lake with a nice fire to warm yourself by.

Ah, isn't nostalgia grand.  Yes, we found our fun where we could and it wasn't reliant on technology.  Though there was no nearby "pond/lake" for hockey, there was always the street (and that unique Canadian official call to suspend play - Car).  I found this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McMmsczJQqI that gives a hint of my childhood.  The picture of the corner (with Pepsi sign), well that was our corner, and the narrator (yes, I knew him, though he was a few years older) would not have been particularly welcome on that side of the road.
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