Author Topic: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com  (Read 19815 times)

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Offline Dimsum

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Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« on: February 20, 2014, 20:15:51 »
http://www.news.com.au/national/breaking-news/aust-to-buy-new-poseidon-aircraft/story-e6frfku9-1226833595123

"The federal government is set to spend up to $7 billion to buy eight Boeing P-8A Poseidon long range maritime patrol aircraft to replace the RAAF's ageing AP-3C Orion aircraft."

A move that surprised absolutely no one in the ADF.
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Offline Schindler's Lift

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2014, 20:20:34 »
"The RAAF operates 19 Lockheed AP-3C Orions which entered service in the mid-1980s."

Jeez, by Canadian standards their old planes are barely broken in yet.  I wonder if we can get a deal on these gently used Orions?

Offline Dimsum

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #2 on: May 23, 2015, 23:32:10 »
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-05-23/raaf-prepares-for-generation-change/6491084

Quote
Felix the Cat has been the mascot of the Royal Australian Air Force's 11 squadron, based at Edinburgh in northern Adelaide, for more than 70 years.

The feline cartoon character was adopted as the squadron's symbol during World War II, when pilots flew Catalina flying boats that were painted black and nicknamed "black cats".

Some will need no pilots at all, with the Defence Department awaiting confirmation from Canberra it will have a fleet of MQ-4C Triton drones.

The first of eight P-8A Poseidon maritime surveillance aircraft will also arrive in Australia this year, and RAAF pilots are already training for the aircraft in Florida.  A second fleet of Tritons is likely to follow.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2015, 03:04:59 »
"The RAAF operates 19 Lockheed AP-3C Orions which entered service in the mid-1980s."

Jeez, by Canadian standards their old planes are barely broken in yet.  I wonder if we can get a deal on these gently used Orions?

 ???

What are the total hours per airframe flown, what is their YFR, mid life upgrades etc.  There is more to it than when it entered service.

Our tails likely have close'ish birthdays to theirs.  I flew one recently on its 34th birthday.
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2015, 03:07:30 »
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-05-23/raaf-prepares-for-generation-change/6491084

Looks like they will be in decent shape ISR-wise.  Time to get those payloader slots away from those pesky ACSOs!   >:D
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Offline Dimsum

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2015, 01:18:54 »
Looks like they will be in decent shape ISR-wise.  Time to get those payloader slots away from those pesky ACSOs!   >:D

Not when most of the Payload Operators here are RAAF Air Combat Officer - Navs  ;)
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2015, 02:48:48 »
unsat!! ;D
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Offline Dolphin_Hunter

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2015, 04:14:02 »
They had to give the Navs something to do, they were replaced by a Garmin.  ;)

Who operates the camera on the P3/P8?

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2015, 05:29:14 »
They had to give the Navs something to do, they were replaced by a Garmin.  ;)

Well, it's not like toast makes itself.  There is always that crucial function available  >:D

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Offline Dimsum

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2015, 22:28:45 »
They had to give the Navs something to do, they were replaced by a Garmin.  ;)

Who operates the camera on the P3/P8?

AEAs - their version of AESOPs. 

There are 2 ACO-NAV equivalent to what we have, plus an ACO-SEM (Sensor Employment Manager, basically a commissioned AEA).  The RAAF lumps a bunch of things into the ACO category, including Air Battle Manager (Air Weapons Controller in the CF) and SEM, which I'm not really sure we have an equivalent. 
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #10 on: May 27, 2015, 15:49:05 »
The 30-year old P-3s cited in the article are only the P-3Cs. The Bs entered service late 60s/early 70s (I forget which) and paid-off when the second batch of Cs were delivered.

There are plenty of mixed feelings at RAAF Edinburgh about all this.........

BTW the eight P-8s on order are widely expected to be complimented by an additional four, to be announced in the forthcoming DCP.

Offline Dimsum

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #11 on: May 27, 2015, 22:46:54 »
The 30-year old P-3s cited in the article are only the P-3Cs. The Bs entered service late 60s/early 70s (I forget which) and paid-off when the second batch of Cs were delivered.

There are plenty of mixed feelings at RAAF Edinburgh about all this.........

BTW the eight P-8s on order are widely expected to be complimented by an additional four, to be announced in the forthcoming DCP.

I'm sure some of those mixed feelings are from the SEMs who may or may not have a job once the P-8s are in.  There is no other airframe that has them in the RAAF either.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2016, 17:08:19 »
Pic attached of first RAAF P-8, in Seattle.

Just to update the thread, the DWP confirmed the 8 + 4 orders on the books, with three more to come.



Offline Dimsum

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2016, 17:16:11 »
Pic attached of first RAAF P-8, in Seattle.

Just to update the thread, the DWP confirmed the 8 + 4 orders on the books, with three more to come.

Nice looking bird with the 11 Sqn tail art.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2016, 21:02:58 »
Yup, they are purdy birds alright.  15 total...all stationed at the same field, no?
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Offline Dimsum

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2016, 22:07:47 »
Yup, they are purdy birds alright.  15 total...all stationed at the same field, no?

Should be - all of the RAAF MPA squadrons are in Adelaide.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2016, 17:14:00 »
Indeed.

The P-8 facilities at Edinburgh are optimised for 16 a/c. A good time to be a local building contractor......

A couple of new pics attached.

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #17 on: April 29, 2016, 10:30:17 »
Are they laid out inside similar to the USN P-8s?  I was on one of those with VP 8 last fall, very nice lay out.
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Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #18 on: April 29, 2016, 11:36:06 »
Internal layout is identical, as is the fit.

Only difference is the accents.  ;D

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #19 on: April 29, 2016, 11:41:03 »
And flight feeding?   ;D
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Offline Dolphin_Hunter

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #20 on: April 29, 2016, 12:49:03 »
A nice layout, but only 5 stations....

Offline Dimsum

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #21 on: May 01, 2016, 09:20:35 »
A nice layout, but only 5 stations....

Which stations do they have?
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

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Offline h3tacco

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #22 on: May 01, 2016, 15:26:57 »
"Mission systems include computing and display systems with dual 61cm (24in) screens at five operator stations - two acoustic stations, one non-acoustic station, one tactical co-ordination and one navigation and communications station. The P-8A stations will be completely interchangeable with respect to data. "With the P-8A, an operator can sit at any of the five stations and operate any system," says Sutorius."

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/cutaway-p-8a-poseidon-a-boeing-with-boost-of-bravado-340955/

Not sure if this info is still correct but it sounds like two ACSO equivalents and three AES Op equivalents (1 dry and two wet). 

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #23 on: September 28, 2016, 10:03:07 »
Roll-out of first RAAF P-8, with 11 Sqn insignia.  It looks shiny.

Quote

The first of twelve Australian P-8A Poseidon aircraft has been unveiled by Boeing at a roll-out ceremony in Seattle, Washington State, USA on September 27.

Chief of Air Force, Air Marshal Leo Davies, attended the ceremony and accepted into service the Royal Australian Air Force’s newest aircraft.

“It is a privilege to accept the first Australian P-8A Poseidon aircraft, said CAF AIRMSHL Davies.

“The P-8A is the latest in a pedigree of Boeing aircraft that have provided important and significant operational capability to Australia. This history includes the C-17A Globemaster, E-7A Wedgetail, F/A-18 Classic Hornet, F/A-18F Super Hornet, Helicopter Aircrew Training System and in the near future E/A-18G Growler.” CAF said.

Built from the ground up as a military aircraft, the P-8A is based on the proven commercial designs of Boeing’s 737-800 fuselage, but is substantially structurally modified to include a weapons bay, under wing and under fuselage hard points for weapons, as well as increased strengthening to allow for continued low level operations and high angle of bank turns.

Director Maritime Intelligence, Surveillance, Reconnaissance and Response Transition Office, GPCAPT Roger McCutcheon, said the P-8A was a fundamental element of Australia’s future maritime patrol and response strategy in replacing the current AP-3C Orion fleet - due for withdrawal in 2018-19.

“Over the next three years the P-8A will replace our current fleet of AP-3C Orion aircraft currently based at RAAF Base Edinburgh, said GPCAPT McCutcheon.

The first aircraft will arrive in Australia on 15 November 2016, with the remaining 11 aircraft to be delivered by March 2020.”

Air Force aircrew and maintenance personnel have been busy training for the arrival of the P-8A since early 2015 - working side by side with the US Navy at Naval Air Station Jacksonville, Florida. The first P-8A Australian pilot flew a four-hour sortie around the Air Station on 14 April 2015.

CAF AIRMSHL Davies said that close cooperation with the US Navy to develop mission, system and training requirements for the P-8A was crucial and has helped strengthen an already close relationship.

“Speaking to my team today, it is obvious they have been the recipients of some of the best training in the world from the US Navy,” said CAF AIRMSHL Davies.

“The bilateral cooperative program for the P-8A between Australia and the United States has been very successful. It is now the model to which our other Air Force projects must aspire.”

“The passion, pride and dedication of the all the Boeing team is evident in every aircraft produced,said CAF AIRMSHL Davies.

“I have no doubt that the aircraft Boeing has proudly built here today, along with the collaborative input from both Australia and the United States, will serve our nation with consummate success. I congratulate Boeing on this significant occasion and I thank you for all for your work.”

For Boeing Mechanic Paul Lingenfelter - a Washington State native whose work on Sonobuoy structure rake installations directly resulted in zero manufacturing defects and improved time management for the P-8 program - CAF AIRMSHL Davieshad a more personal message.

“Paul you are a great asset to the P-8A program and I thank you for your work, but sorry mate - your aircraft is coming with me.”

http://www.airforce.gov.au/News/Roll-out-of-first-Australian-P-8A-Poseidon/?RAAF-/A8kQtTo3eUwo8X758YBvOig7r5XTABm

Pics on their FB page:  https://www.facebook.com/RoyalAustralianAirForce/posts/10154210405742639
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #24 on: September 28, 2016, 16:08:11 »
I'm anxiously awaiting the GoC announcement that we are getting some  ;D
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Offline CBH99

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #25 on: September 28, 2016, 16:58:57 »
Question for you Eye,

Does the P8 represent a huge leap in capability to what our currently upgraded Aurora fleet can do?

Obviously the air-frames are newer, and perhaps that alone is reason to look at replacing our Aurora fleet with the P8.  But in terms of the capability of our recently modernized Aurora, does the P8 offer something that we can't currently do?  (Honest question, and anybody else who is an actual SME like Eye is, feel free to chime in.)


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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #26 on: September 28, 2016, 17:08:16 »
I'd have to be honest;  while I've been on/in a USN P-8 before, I didn't see her in action so can't comment with any knowledge on the aircraft mission caps/lims.  I heard some neat things about their radar, I heard some things about bugs they are working out (nothing surprising, new fleet and all).  I heard its a gas pig down low compared to turbo-prop, but...there are arguments on both sides of that.  Quicker to get ONSTA, but not able to remain ONSTA...either way, you have a max weight for what you can carry in your fuel tanks.

And...if I did know any of the caps and lims compared to the Aurora...I wouldn't be able to say on here anyways.   ;)  I've done ops and exercises with them but they keep their hand close to their chest.  I'd have to bow to the front enders (pilots, fight engineers) to speak with knowledge on airframe and engine stuff.

Having said that...with newer aircraft, I'd expect better serviceability rates on the airframe, engines etc.  But...they aren't replacing 1 for 1 with the Orion fleet so...less airframes on the ramp to start off with.

P-8 stuff:   http://www.boeing.com/defense/maritime-surveillance/p-8-poseidon/index.page#/facts and http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/mma/
P-8 Quick Facts

- For the P-8, Boeing uses a first-in-industry in-line production system that leverages the best of Boeing Commercial and Boeing Defense for development and production.
- The P-8 can fly up to 41,000 feet and travel up to 490 knots.
- P-8 offers higher reliability – the 737 has a 99.8 percent dispatch rate, with more than 4,000 aircraft flying, and 6,600+ orders.
- The P-8 is engineered for 25 years/25,000 hours in the harshest maritime flight regimes, including extended operations in icing environments.
- The P-8 can fly in all flight regimes, and can self-deploy up to 4,500 miles from base without refueling.
- Dual CFM-56B commercial engines each provide 27,000 pounds of thrust, greatly enhancing climb and flight characteristics over turboprop equipped aircraft.  (I don't buy this down low and slow where most ASW is likely to happen...but they appear to be spending money on GPS search and kills stores to negate the low/slow time)
- Each engine is equipped with a 180KVA engine driven generator.  Combined with the 90KVA commercial APU, this provides 450KVA of power. P-8 possesses significant growth capacity for equipment with excess onboard power and cooling capacity.
- P-8 has twice the sonobuoy processing capability and can carry 30 percent more sonobuoys than any maritime patrol and reconnaissance aircraft currently flying.  (AFIAK, they have the same acoustic suite as the modernized Aurora)
- P-8 has the ability to control unmanned air vehicles (level 2 control-receive) to extend sensor reach.
- P-8 offers commonality with 737 fleet and other military platforms that use the 737 airframe.

Block 3 Aurora stuff:  http://www.rcaf-arc.forces.gc.ca/en/aircraft-current/cp-140.page

Maximum speed 750 kilometres per hour (405 knots) 

Range  7,400 kilometres

Endurance  12 hours, with routine planning of 10 to 11 hours. The Aurora has, however, remained airborne for up to 17 hours


I notice its hard to find any info on endurance for the P-8 but...in general I'd say they can be quicker to get to a spot, but can't hang out there as long.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2016, 17:27:43 by Eye In The Sky »
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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #27 on: September 28, 2016, 21:51:16 »
Question for you Eye,

Does the P8 represent a huge leap in capability to what our currently upgraded Aurora fleet can do?

Obviously the air-frames are newer, and perhaps that alone is reason to look at replacing our Aurora fleet with the P8.  But in terms of the capability of our recently modernized Aurora, does the P8 offer something that we can't currently do?  (Honest question, and anybody else who is an actual SME like Eye is, feel free to chime in.)

Unless they somehow fixed the lag (however little) in thrust in a turbofan, I'd personally feel better zipping around at low level with turboprops.

I'm anxiously awaiting the GoC announcement that we are getting some  ;D

:rofl:
« Last Edit: September 29, 2016, 00:29:30 by Dimsum »
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline Dolphin_Hunter

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #28 on: September 29, 2016, 05:21:43 »
Unless they somehow fixed the lag (however little) in thrust in a turbofan, I'd personally feel better zipping around at low level with turboprops.

Isn't the USN planning on flying ASW missions at 1,500+?





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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #29 on: September 29, 2016, 09:53:20 »
Isn't the USN planning on flying ASW missions at 1,500+?

Maybe?  I guess without MAD, there's no real point going low.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline BurmaShave

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #30 on: September 29, 2016, 10:05:26 »
Maybe?  I guess without MAD, there's no real point going low.

Do you have to be low to deploy sonobuoys? Does the P-8 even have sonobuoys? (I don't know jack about ASW)
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Offline BobSlob

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #31 on: September 29, 2016, 10:31:10 »
Do you have to be low to deploy sonobuoys? Does the P-8 even have sonobuoys? (I don't know jack about ASW)

MAD aside, being down low is really only useful for knowing where the sonobuoys actually land. Shorter fall = greater accuracy. If you have buoys that reported back their GPS position... you could fly must higher and more comfortably. I assume the P8 is using the "new" GPS buoys.

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #32 on: September 29, 2016, 16:23:33 »
Isn't the USN planning on flying ASW missions at 1,500+?

I recall reading something about GPS fish and stuff like that, being dropped (deployed?) from altitude.  Not idea where that is at currently or headed in the future.

http://www.militaryaerospace.com/articles/2014/12/p8-high-altitude.html
« Last Edit: September 29, 2016, 16:37:15 by Eye In The Sky »
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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #33 on: September 29, 2016, 16:24:49 »
Maybe?  I guess without MAD, there's no real point going low.

IIRC they were working on MAD "UAVs" being dropped from the plane/controlled from the plane or a surface asset.   :dunno:

http://www.militaryaerospace.com/articles/2015/01/bae-subhunting-drone.html
« Last Edit: September 29, 2016, 16:36:07 by Eye In The Sky »
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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #34 on: September 29, 2016, 16:32:06 »
MAD aside, being down low is really only useful for knowing where the sonobuoys actually land. Shorter fall = greater accuracy. If you have buoys that reported back their GPS position... you could fly must higher and more comfortably. I assume the P8 is using the "new" GPS buoys.

True for ASW...but I know the P-8s guys were doing some low level "VIS-ID" work in the obvious area after JW last year and were down at 200' in the muck like we were and recall a comment about gas guzzling or something along that line.   :nod: 

MAD...always a conversation piece on its worth.  I did one trip out of Sig on a SSN that convinced me 100% MAD is worth its weight.  Always nicer to have 1 extra tool than to be short one...
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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #35 on: September 30, 2016, 10:42:41 »
that's interesting getting the sub hunters onto a sub, good idea.

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #36 on: September 30, 2016, 15:38:22 »
Obviously the air-frames are newer, and perhaps that alone is reason to look at replacing our Aurora fleet with the P8. 

In all honesty, I doubt we'll see a P8 at any RCAF Sqn other than to pay a visit.  Whatever replaces the Aurora, I suspect I'll be CRA when it happens.  Not sure about the current CAS, but the one who brought us new mess kits and leather jackets didn't strike me as an individual that was too concerned about LRPA replacement. 
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Offline BobSlob

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #37 on: September 30, 2016, 15:57:17 »
In all honesty, I doubt we'll see a P8 at any RCAF Sqn other than to pay a visit.  Whatever replaces the Aurora, I suspect I'll be CRA when it happens.  Not sure about the current CAS, but the one who brought us new mess kits and leather jackets didn't strike me as an individual that was too concerned about LRPA replacement.

My guess... a Bombardier bail-out that'll come with years upon years of delays. But hey, it's made in QueCanada!

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #38 on: September 30, 2016, 16:00:13 »
My guess... a Bombardier bail-out that'll come with years upon years of delays. But hey, it's made in QueCanada!

They'll just use the same process at the Cyclone;  you know...streamlined and such.   ;D

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #39 on: October 01, 2016, 11:04:59 »
In all honesty, I doubt we'll see a P8 at any RCAF Sqn other than to pay a visit.  Whatever replaces the Aurora, I suspect I'll be CRA when it happens.  Not sure about the current CAS, but the one who brought us new mess kits and leather jackets didn't strike me as an individual that was too concerned about LRPA replacement.

Are there any service centres who repair 737's in Canada? We might not benefit from the airframe build, but possibly service contracts?

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #40 on: October 02, 2016, 08:35:22 »
I've no idea.  Anyone?
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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #42 on: October 07, 2016, 16:49:04 »
Re MAD boom question, see article below.

RAAF does not consider this much of an issue. If they did then the P-8s would have been fitted with booms, as per the Indian a/c.


BAE Systems to develop MAD ASW drone to help Navy P-8A find submarines from high altitudes


 ARLINGTON, Va., 14 Jan. 2015.

Anti-submarine warfare (ASW) experts at BAE Systems are developing an unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) sensor payload able to look for submerged enemy submarines by detecting small variations in the Earth's magnetic field.

Officials of the U.S. Office of Naval Research (ONR) in Arlington, Va., announced an $8.9 million contract this week to the BAE Systems Electronic Systems segment in Merrimack, N.H., for the High Altitude ASW (HAASW) Unmanned Targeting Air System (UTAS) program for the Navy Boeing P-8A Poseidon maritime patrol jet.

HAASW UTAS seeks to integrate a magnetic anomaly detector (MAD) and algorithms for use on an air-launched drone that the P-8A will use to detect and pinpoint enemy submarines.

A MAD instrument detects minute variations in the Earth's magnetic field. A submerged submarine represents a mass of ferromagnetic material that creates a detectable disturbance in the Earth's magnetic field.

The Navy's predecessor to the P-8A -- the Lockheed Martin P-3 Orion four-engine turboprop aircraft -- has a MAD sensor attached to the back that looks like a large stinger that protrudes backward from the plane's tail.


Whole article at the link, here - http://www.militaryaerospace.com/articles/2015/01/bae-subhunting-drone.html

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #43 on: October 07, 2016, 17:35:41 »
problem with a UAV is how many do you get to deploy, then what when you run out? The cost of a MAD search just jumped and likely there will never be enough UAV in the system to keep you stocked.

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #44 on: October 07, 2016, 18:28:35 »
I'll add...no one has ever used MAD this way so...I don't know how it will work out.  MAD isn't so much a search sensor as it is a confirmation one most of the time...but I've been hot on a SSN with MAD when the wetties had not so much luck.  As I've always said, better to have and not need...for the cost/weight of it...better to have it.  With you.  On a boom.   :2c:
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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #45 on: October 07, 2016, 18:54:04 »
most of the time...but I've been hot on a SSN with MAD when the wetties had not so much luck. 

It's all about buoy depths, SLD, ambient noise levels, and operator setup.  The one thing I will mention is that with a MAD UAV how would you use that information to setup for an attack?

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #46 on: October 31, 2016, 17:34:28 »
A chum at Edinburgh reports that first P-8 due there any time now.  :)

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #47 on: November 16, 2016, 16:58:15 »
Are they laid out inside similar to the USN P-8s?
Pic attached, taken yesterday when first RAAF P-8 got the VIP arrival in Oz.  8)

Report here - http://australianaviation.com.au/2016/11/first-raaf-p-8a-arrival-marks-beginning-of-a-5th-gen-maritime-surveillance-force/

BTW also to hand was RN 1SL Sir Philip Jones: amazing how many Brits have called and met Oz oppos since late June. For the past 43 years everyone's been wondering if they'd lost the phone number, or sumfink.....


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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #48 on: November 17, 2016, 01:33:21 »
If that view is from the main cabin door looking aft, port side then it looks the same.   Want those displays.   Wouldn't mind playing with the RADAR some either.
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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #49 on: November 29, 2016, 03:01:23 »
From the RAAF FB page:

Quote
In an Australian first, yesterday we captured a historical event - a Neptune, Catalina, AP-3C Orion and P-8A Poseidon aircraft - flew over Adelaide together to mark the start of a new era for your Air Force.

Representing four generations of aircraft flown by Number 11 Squadron, the flypast was to celebrate the arrival of the first P-8A Poseidon to RAAF Base Edinburgh.

During the Air Force’s transition to the P-8A Poseidon, the AP-3C Orion will continue to operate from RAAF Base Edinburgh, providing maritime surveillance operations across the globe.

By 2022, twelve aircraft will be based at RAAF Base Edinburgh, with an additional three to be acquired as part of the Government's 2016 Defence White Paper commitment.

https://www.facebook.com/RoyalAustralianAirForce/posts/10154388357752639
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #50 on: November 29, 2016, 10:19:08 »
So would the P-8 make a good platform for the EW/surveillance version of the Aurora, I am assuming they aren't dodging around at low altitude, that would free up those airframes to do ASW. 

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Re: Australia to buy P-8A Poseidon - News.com
« Reply #51 on: November 30, 2016, 12:29:56 »
I would say they are far too expensive for that alone.  If you have a MMA, make it a true MMA.   We don't have the funding or people for specialized single function things like Sentinels and Rivot Joints.  I will be CRA before the 140 is replaced, so i don't even dream of P8s.  Like we are being left behind in the fighter world, we are also starting to do so in the maritime domain.

Despite it having an ESM system, the Aurora is not an EW platform.  We do the surveillance/reconnaissance piece now in both overland and maritime mission profiles.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2016, 12:41:58 by Eye In The Sky »
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