Author Topic: How the Navy treats its kids ... er, sailors (From: Re-Royalization)  (Read 22223 times)

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Offline George Wallace

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Guess no one told you why boots are laced a certain way in jobs that may require cutting footwear off an injured foot/leg.
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jollyjacktar

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Guess no one told you why boots are laced a certain way in jobs that may require cutting footwear off an injured foot/leg.

Not to mention you better hope Ghurkhas aren't operating in your area as well if you X lace your boots.  I had an instructor in college who found out at first light, why, while operating in the same area of Aden many many moons ago.  One Aussie who refused to heed the warnings really found out the hard way.

jollyjacktar

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Spoken like a true engineer ;)   

That maxim is a misnomer because for a unit to go into combat it has to pass various readiness "inspections".  If I cant trust a Cpl to show up to work looking right dressed and well turned out how exactly can I expect his equipment to be in operational shape and well maintained ?

JJT like it or not part of our job is dress and deportment.  Why cant we have people that can make things happen and look presentable as well ? 

I get it, when your crawling around the bilges you are going to get dirty, to put it lightly.  But that does not mean that you cannot clean up and make yourself look presentable when you leave work. 

You know I love you JJT ;)

I know you do.   :nod:  But going out the gate looking like a bag of rags is one thing and fair game.  Nit picking is another.  I don't have patience for people with too much time on their hands.

Offline cupper

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You know I love you JJT ;)

I know you do.   :nod:

You Navy guys want some privacy or something? >:D
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Offline Brihard

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You Navy guys want some privacy or something? >:D

Reasonably sure that's a foreign concept to them. ;)
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 ;D

Offline Pusser

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Isn't there the maxim, "no inspection ready unit ever passed combat and no combat ready unit ever passed inspection?

Utter nonsense.

There are certainly "garret troopers" (as Barry Sadler referred to them) out there, but I've never met a "great field soldier" who looked like a bag of shyte in garrison.  As Halifax Tar said, if a guy can't get his act together to look presentable in garrison, he certainly cannot be trusted to look after his own or his unit's kit.  Keep in mind that the military obsession with cleaning, polishing, pressing, etc. actually has operational origins.  In days past, soldiers/sailors maintained their kit by cleaning it (polishing, oiling, etc).  A clean, well-maintained uniform was usually indicative of a clean, healthy soldier/sailor.

A well maintained, clean, polished, pressed uniform and combat skills are not mutually exclusive, but rather complimentary.  Those of us who believe in high standards for "buttons and bows" and drill and ceremonial do not also believe that combat skills are less important.  We want it all.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2015, 08:31:40 by Pusser »
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jollyjacktar

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 I am not suggesting that I want to be or see bags shyte walking around, but, I do care more about if you can do your job rather than if you look pretty.  How snappy a dresser you are means little if you are an idiot workwise.  Sure it's nice to have it all, however, I lean more on the ability side than pretty side. 

Offline Pusser

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  Sure it's nice to have it all, however, I lean more on the ability side than pretty side.

As do I.  As should we all.  However, I would question the ability of anyone who cannot achieve a "presentable" appearance (keeping also in mind that "presentable" may mean covered in grease/paint if one is actually greasing/painting at the time).
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Online Halifax Tar

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We keep forgetting that maintaining your uniform and looking sharp is as much part of your job as your technical aspects.

For the record I have yet to meet a bag-o-shyte that wasn't a bag-o-shyte all across the board. 
Lead me, follow me or get the hell out of my way

Offline George Wallace

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We keep forgetting that maintaining your uniform and looking sharp is as much part of your job as your technical aspects.

For the record I have yet to meet a bag-o-shyte that wasn't a bag-o-shyte all across the board.

I agree with you, however, I have run across the rare few in my time in service that, although good soldiers, just could not be dressed up to look sharp.  No matter how you (and they) tried, you could never make them look presentable in any uniform.  Even in Cbts they looked like "a bag-o-shyte".
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jollyjacktar

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I can think of one now retired stoker fromt the east coast in particular who is brilliant, but quite frankly a bit, well quite a bit of a savant.  I remember helping Danny put on his floater jacket at a Sea Survival Refresher as he was having some trouble making it happen.  He could at times not be expected to have all the buttons and bows correct, that did not detract from the good side of his abilities.  After all Einstine couldn't come to grips with driving a car, was famous for walking up to strangers in Princetown, introducing himself and asking if they knew where he lived as he was lost. 

Offline Ostrozac

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For the record I have yet to meet a bag-o-shyte that wasn't a bag-o-shyte all across the board.

I have served with quite a few people that seemed to have been born covered in dust, dirt and grease, but were still first rate soldiers, sailors and airmen. I also know plenty of people who where pretty enough to be on the cover of a magazine, but were completely useless professionally.

Clothes don't make the man.

Online Halifax Tar

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I have served with quite a few people that seemed to have been born covered in dust, dirt and grease, but were still first rate soldiers, sailors and airmen. I also know plenty of people who where pretty enough to be on the cover of a magazine, but were completely useless professionally.

Clothes don't make the man.

There is a big difference in someone who gets dirty doing a job and someone who cannot maintain or wear the uniform properly. 

Lead me, follow me or get the hell out of my way

Online mariomike

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There is a big difference in someone who gets dirty doing a job and someone who cannot maintain or wear the uniform properly.

 :goodpost:

I would say that applies to all Elements, and even outside the military.




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I remember in Shilo 20 years ago sorting out a young Bdr for being a walking sh!t show. I was PO1 a the time. I subsequently received a call from his Sgt asking me how dare I sort out one of his troops. My response: If you were doing your job, then I wouldn't have to do it for you.

Reinforcing good dress and deportment is a function of leadership of both the group and the self.
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Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Older people (like me) may remember this line from trading places:

"I have always said that religion is like everything else: It's OK when taken in moderation."

I think this is the same. Yes, we all passed a very high standard of dress in our basic training and we all know that level can be required of us for a parade for the Queen's Mother. But for the civilian's too, there is a difference between dressing up to be best man at a wedding and dressing to show up at the office on a weekday.

We must expect from our people a correct level of dress on an ordinary day, which means everything that should be worn is worn, in the right place and at the right "angle", but not so over pressed/starched/spit as may be required when on parade.

And the NCO's must be able to tell the difference. Best example (in my mind) has always been shoes. The regs state they must be "clean" and "polished black". It has never stated they must be "spit-shinned". If you shoes are clean and black with proper polish, the same way a clean and proper civilian working in an office's would be on an ordinary day, you meet the standard on an ordinary military working day. The spit shine can be kept for parade days or similar special days.

Anyone who can keep that standard up has no business being corrected.

Too often, the Dress Police goes around trying to enforce the "parade" level of dress instead of addressing failure to meet the "lower" ordinary day standard and they lose the respect they should have.  If you fail to meet that  "minimal" standard, however, yo deserve what you get.

jollyjacktar

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 :goodpost: