Author Topic: Infantry Officer Career Progression  (Read 3855 times)

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Offline Mike Bobbitt

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Infantry Officer Career Progression
« on: February 22, 2017, 19:42:40 »
All,

Looking for some guidance on how things are supposed to progress for a PRes Infantry Officer. The courses and prerequisites have changed so much since I went through, I am not sure I can adequately guide company officers on what they need to do next.

I have attached a diagram I am building based on various source material (which seems outdated and in conflict, for the most part).

I know there are inaccuracies and errors in what I have so far, so I am looking for corrections. For example, I know there is a time limit for becoming qualified (DP 1) but I am not sure what it is.

Any feedback is appreciated. I'll post the final version as a PowerPoint in case it is of use to others.


Cheers
Mike
« Last Edit: April 19, 2017, 11:24:42 by Mike Bobbitt »

Offline jeffb

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2017, 07:02:42 »
Isn't AJSO and CAFJOD DP 2? I'm pretty sure it is for Reg Force.
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Offline Mike Bobbitt

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2017, 09:26:22 »
Thanks, you are correct! Updated diagram is attached to the original post.

I could not find pre-reqs for CAFJOD though and I *believe* you can start that in DP1 so I left shifted it a bit.

Offline RCPalmer

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2017, 14:50:30 »
A few things, and this is definitely a moving target.  I calculated a lot of these numbers when researching this article for the Infantry Bulletin:
(http://www.ducimus.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/Infantry-Corps-Newsletter-Volume-2-Issue-2-final.pdf), and some things have changed since then.

-PRes BMQ (20 Days ) + PRes BMOQ 2 (10 days) = 30 Days for PRes BMOQ

-BMOQ-A was 50 days in its 2016 iteration, but the course has been de-modularized, and extended from 10 weeks to 11 for this summer. So, now I would say 55 trg days.

-DP 1.1 was 65 trg days when I last checked when researching the article above.

-The DL for PRes ATOC when I took it (2007) was 6 weeks of part time study, while the RegF variant conducted a 5 day full time DL at their home units.  Perhaps someone with more recent experience can comment. 

-IDCC is part of DP3 as I understand it, though AOC is not a pre-requisite. There was a period a few years ago where it was.

-The Joint Reserve Command and Staff Programme consists of 1 year of DL and 2 weeks of residency.  Those who stay on to complete the full JCSP program (along with their RegF brethren) complete a second year of DL and a second 2 week residency for a total of 2 years of DL and 4 weeks of residency.  I am on year 2 of JCSP right now, and only a handful of PRes officers pulled pin at the end of year 1, though you must apply and "compete" for the second year separately.  JCSP in any form is not a pre-requisite for promotion to LCol for the PRes at this time, so I am not sure how you would want to represent that.

I hope this helps. 
« Last Edit: February 23, 2017, 15:26:33 by RCPalmer »

Offline Mike Bobbitt

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2017, 08:34:37 »
Thank-you, it does help. I will make a few more adjustments and post the corrected version shortly.

WRT IDCCC, I believe you can take it in late DP2 or early DP3, which is why it straddles them in the diagram. I tried to show that only ATOC is a pre-req by the yellow line, though I admit it's not very clear.

Offline Ayrsayle

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2017, 21:52:36 »
For all CAFJOD modules - there are no prereqs (though AJSO is advised).  You absolutely can complete CAFJOD modules (and AJSO) during DP 1 (I managed to get most of it completed as an Lt) - though your odds of being picked to be loaded on them are less then someone in DP2. We've had success with members at the DP 1 level getting on both.

For PRes AOC, All CAFJOD and AJSO must be completed (the latest I've heard from Bde is that in the very near future all CAFJOD and AJSO must be completed prior to attending ATOC as well).  Having had to fill a wavier out for someone missing one CAFJOD module, I can confirm this is the case.

Having taken IDCCC out of interest last year - there was no DL (I believe it was only two weeks total - we were expected to arrive with a strong knowledge of ATOC material, etc), everything was done in Gagetown.  The only requirement to attend is ATOC.  Candidates were about half and half (Capt/Maj).

As I tell all new officers - get AJSO and CAFJODs done early before you end up being too busy to complete them.  It pays off when the later career courses come up and the Units are trying to send people.

I have a few "projected" career paths pushed out by 39 Bde for PRes Officers, if you wanted additional resources (When Reserve officers should be taking X courses, etc)
Leadership is understanding people and involving them to help you do a job. That takes all of the good characteristics, like integrity, dedication of purpose, selflessness, knowledge, skill, implacability, as well as determination not to accept failure. ~Admiral Arleigh A. Burke

"It takes 10 minutes to dress like an Infantryman, but it takes a few years to become a good one" - Jungle (Army.ca)

Offline Hound Dog

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2017, 13:22:23 »
As I can see this being a very useful reference for junior officers and those in the recruiting process, can someone perhaps post a list of all the course acronyms and what they are? I can't keep track anymore, not that I ever really knew in the first place; AOC, AJSO, IDCCC etc.

Offline Ayrsayle

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #7 on: February 26, 2017, 18:32:11 »
I can see that being difficult - half the acronyms in the army are known for what they are and represent, not what the acronym actually stands for!

DP (1,2,3) - Development Period - usually tied to a specific rank or period of ranks to demonstrate/highlight key skills and capabilities for a member at that rank/period in their career (or what they should attain during that period).

DP1 usually has the following (at least in the Army Officer stream):
BMOQ - Basic Military Officer Qualification (Also called Phase 1)
BMOQ-A - Basic Military Officer Qualification - Army (Replaced BMOQ-L, or previous to that - CAP).  Also called phase 2
Phase 3 and 4 go by a number of different names - they are specific Officer Trade training. (for the infantry, DP 1.1, 1.2, etc)

AJSO - Army Junior Staff Officer - consists of three Mods and replaced AJOSC
CAFJOD - Canadian Armed Forces Junior Officer Development (Programme) - has 7 Mods and replaced the old OPME program
ATOC - Army Tactical Operations Course
AOC - Army Operations Course (?)
IDCCC - Infantry Dismounted Company Commander's Course (typically for the PRes, CTCC - Combat Team Commander's Course is the Reg F, mechanized version).


Leadership is understanding people and involving them to help you do a job. That takes all of the good characteristics, like integrity, dedication of purpose, selflessness, knowledge, skill, implacability, as well as determination not to accept failure. ~Admiral Arleigh A. Burke

"It takes 10 minutes to dress like an Infantryman, but it takes a few years to become a good one" - Jungle (Army.ca)

Offline dapaterson

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #8 on: February 26, 2017, 19:04:50 »
JCSP = Joint Command and Staff Programme.  Either a one year residential course (full-time) or a two year Distance Learning (DL) course (part-time while holding down a full-time position elsewhere).

JRCSP - Joint Reserve Command and Staff Programme.  Year one of the JCSP DL programme, for some Reserve Force members who will not go on to do year two.


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Offline Mike Bobbitt

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2017, 11:26:09 »
I'd be kidding myself if I said this was the final update, but it is *for now*. I've also attached the PowerPoint version for easy editing.

Offline Ayrsayle

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2017, 20:46:02 »
Mike,

Not sure if it is just me, but I'm not seeing any updated files.
Leadership is understanding people and involving them to help you do a job. That takes all of the good characteristics, like integrity, dedication of purpose, selflessness, knowledge, skill, implacability, as well as determination not to accept failure. ~Admiral Arleigh A. Burke

"It takes 10 minutes to dress like an Infantryman, but it takes a few years to become a good one" - Jungle (Army.ca)

Offline Mike Bobbitt

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2017, 09:11:41 »
Some changes are subtle, and I probably still have not captured everything correctly. Bottom line, if you see "Mods 1-3" in yellow above CAFJOD (as a pre-req for ATOC), you're seeing the latest.

Corrections still welcome. :)

Offline Ayrsayle

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Re: Infantry Officer Career Progression
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2017, 17:58:43 »
Thanks for the clarification - I missed the changes to the original file.  It's a handy resource, thanks for sharing.
Leadership is understanding people and involving them to help you do a job. That takes all of the good characteristics, like integrity, dedication of purpose, selflessness, knowledge, skill, implacability, as well as determination not to accept failure. ~Admiral Arleigh A. Burke

"It takes 10 minutes to dress like an Infantryman, but it takes a few years to become a good one" - Jungle (Army.ca)