Author Topic: Canada-US Trade Relations  (Read 44449 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline George Wallace

  • Army.ca Fossil
  • *****
  • 436,375
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 31,578
  • Crewman
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #25 on: June 02, 2018, 09:21:11 »

I’m legitimatly interested in said clauses that seem to be the issue.  Do you happen to have a list I could look at. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/14/world/americas/canada-wants-a-new-nafta-to-include-gender-and-indigenous-rights.html

Quote
Canada recently added its first gender chapter in its 20-year-old free-trade deal with Chile, which called for both countries to apply a gender lens to trade. As for the “indigenous chapter,” Ms. Freeland told reporters it was a “fresh area” that came at the suggestion of Perry Bellegarde, who represents most of the country’s indigenous people.

..................

The Trudeau government has made gender equality, climate change and reconciliation with indigenous people central to its policies. The first thing Mr. Trudeau did as prime minister was to name the country’s first gender-balanced cabinet.

Among the six objectives laid out by Ms. Freeland, many were not surprising to Canadians, who have been deluged by panicky news reports since Mr. Trump first threatened to destroy the agreement. The government wants to safeguard the country’s culture, and protect portions of its tightly managed agricultural system, which Mr. Trump has called a disgrace and unfair to American farmers when it comes to dairy. The system limits dairy, poultry and egg production and assigns them quotas, and protects farmers from import competition by imposing tariffs of up to 300 percent on some products.


DISCLAIMER: The opinions and arguments of George Wallace posted on this Site are solely those of George Wallace and not the opinion of Army.ca and are posted for information purposes only.
Unless so stated, they are reflective of my opinion -- and my opinion only, a right that I enjoy along with every other Canadian citizen.

Offline Remius

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 96,560
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,042
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #26 on: June 02, 2018, 09:27:26 »
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/14/world/americas/canada-wants-a-new-nafta-to-include-gender-and-indigenous-rights.html

Ok.  Thanks for that ill take a read.  But specifically to NAFTA.  I haven’t found anything relating to that and how it seems to be a show stopper.   Everything seems to be about the three things I mentioned: sunset clause, supply management and dispute resolution.

That article seems to be about Chile...


Edit:  took a closer look.  Ok so they are taking or adding that to their approach but what clause exactly is causing the issue?  And how binding are they?  One would think it would be brought up?  The article was written before négociations began and is speculating.  Where do we currently stand?  What point are we at with that stuff in the nafta agreement?



« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 12:27:12 by Remius »
Optio

Offline tomahawk6

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 103,175
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 9,452
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #27 on: June 02, 2018, 09:45:39 »
China is the biggest producer of steel and aluminum.The US ranks fourth in the world for steel and 9th for aluminum produced.The US produced 81m metric tons of steel.China produces as much steel in a month as the US does in a year ,831.7 metric tons. Japan is number 2 at 6% of total world output followed by India at 6.2.



Offline Journeyman

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Legend
  • *
  • 533,895
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 12,851
  • Your example, not your opinion, can cause change
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #28 on: June 02, 2018, 10:13:28 »
China is the biggest producer of steel and aluminum......

a)  Still no answer to this, although I'm not surprised;  apparently proclaiming "fake news" is now a Pavlovian thing.

b)  So, by the diagram you chose to provide, why is Canada so deserving of steel/aluminum trade sanctions?
There’s nothing more maddening than debating someone who doesn’t know history, doesn’t read books, and frames their myopia as virtue. The level of unapologetic conjecture I’ve encountered lately isn’t just frustrating, it’s retrogressive, unprecedented, and absolutely terrifying.
~Chris Evans

Offline Remius

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 96,560
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 3,042
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #29 on: June 02, 2018, 10:21:19 »
a)  Still no answer to this, although I'm not surprised;  apparently proclaiming "fake news" is now a Pavlovian thing.

b)  So, by the diagram you chose to provide, why is Canada so deserving of steel/aluminum trade sanctions?

b) The official reason is “national security...”
Optio

Offline Journeyman

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Legend
  • *
  • 533,895
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 12,851
  • Your example, not your opinion, can cause change
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #30 on: June 02, 2018, 10:56:06 »
b) The official reason is “national security...”
Yes, so I've read; thank you.  I was hoping for a rational reason.

....or hell, even an unrational reason that attempts to explain how a tariff on Canadian steel and aluminum will eliminate some make-believe security gap -- if only for the inevitable humour and/or clutching at imaginary straws.
There’s nothing more maddening than debating someone who doesn’t know history, doesn’t read books, and frames their myopia as virtue. The level of unapologetic conjecture I’ve encountered lately isn’t just frustrating, it’s retrogressive, unprecedented, and absolutely terrifying.
~Chris Evans

Online SeaKingTacco

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 138,995
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 5,165
  • Door Gunnery- The Sport of Kings!
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #31 on: June 02, 2018, 11:25:16 »
Yes, so I've read; thank you.  I was hoping for a rational reason.

....or hell, even an unrational reason that attempts to explain how a tariff on Canadian steel and aluminum will eliminate some make-believe security gap -- if only for the inevitable humour and/or clutching at imaginary straws.

Not that I am defending Trump, but in some circles I am reading/hearing that China uses Canada to flow steel (and aluminum, i guess), by selling to Canadian companies who do minimal work with it and then re-export to the US.

What I am finding difficult is discovering if this is actually true, or just opinion.

Offline Rifleman62

    Retired.

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *
  • 91,760
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 2,995
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #32 on: June 02, 2018, 11:50:33 »
I read that also.

Somewhat along that line: https://globalnews.ca/news/4107759/steel-tariffs-chinese-dumping-justin-trudeau/

Canada targets dumped steel from countries like China with new measures - 28 Mar 18

Extract: In a statement shared with reporters Tuesday morning, the Prime Minister’s Office said the government is bringing forward new regulations to crack down on countries like China that dump their steel and aluminum in foreign markets at unfairly cheap prices.

“Canada is a trading nation, and we will not allow North American industries to be hurt or threatened by unfair trade practices, like the diversion of steel and aluminum,” said Trudeau in the statement.

....... 'Canada will not be used as a backdoor into other North American markets." .....

« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 11:59:26 by Rifleman62 »
Never Congratulate Yourself In Victory, Nor Blame Your Horses In Defeat - Old Cossack Expression

Offline tomahawk6

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 103,175
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 9,452
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #33 on: June 02, 2018, 12:01:08 »
I am confident that an agreement may be reached.We have too many other common areas except climate change,which I agree that its junk and unproven.

a)  Still no answer to this, although I'm not surprised;  apparently proclaiming "fake news" is now a Pavlovian thing.

b)  So, by the diagram you chose to provide, why is Canada so deserving of steel/aluminum trade sanctions?

Thats why I think there is a problem with Trudeau.According to the NY Times Obama wanted to make it hard for Trump to govern so wanted to sabotauge US-Canada relations.Since O and Trudeau are politically similar.

https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/07/americas/obama-trudeau-bromance-trnd/index.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/13/world/canada/justin-trudeau-donald-trump.html


Offline Dimsum

    West coast best coast.

  • Mentor
  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *
  • 164,340
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 4,846
  • I get paid to travel. I just don't pick where.
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #34 on: June 02, 2018, 12:12:22 »

Thats why I think there is a problem with Trudeau.According to the NY Times Obama wanted to make it hard for Trump to govern so wanted to sabotauge US-Canada relations.Since O and Trudeau are politically similar.

https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/07/americas/obama-trudeau-bromance-trnd/index.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/13/world/canada/justin-trudeau-donald-trump.html

I'm going to attribute it to early (for a Saturday) morning, but I'm not seeing from those two articles how the NYT is saying Obama wanted to sabotage US-Canada relations.  It's not really a secret, nor a surprise, that Obama and PMJT are close (at least politically shaped to look that way).
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline tomahawk6

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 103,175
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 9,452
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #35 on: June 02, 2018, 12:29:09 »
The only link I found a few days ago is behind a subscription wall at NYT.I dont even know if what they printed, is accurate.I will keep digging.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 14:17:18 by tomahawk6 »

Offline FJAG

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 173,215
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 1,993
  • Ex Gladio Justicia
    • WordPress Page
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #36 on: June 02, 2018, 14:10:13 »
An absolutely bang-on speech by Ronald Reagan back in 1988 that addresses the foolishness of the Trumpian view on world trade and the whole tariff issue.

Quote
This week, as we prepared for Thanksgiving, Canada held an important election, and I’m pleased to again send my congratulations to Prime Minister Mulroney. One of the important issues in the Canadian election was trade. And like our own citizens earlier this month, our neighbors have sent a strong message, rejecting protectionism and reaffirming that more trade, not less, is the wave of the future.

Over the past 200 years, not only has the argument against tariffs and trade barriers won nearly universal agreement among economists but it has also proven itself in the real world, where we have seen free-trading nations prosper while protectionist countries fall behind.

America’s most recent experiment with protectionism was a disaster for the working men and women of this country. When Congress passed the Smoot-Hawley tariff in 1930, we were told that it would protect America from foreign competition and save jobs in this country—the same line we hear today. The actual result was the Great Depression, the worst economic catastrophe in our history; one out of four Americans were thrown out of work. Two years later, when I cast my first ballot for President, I voted for Franklin Delano Roosevelt, who opposed protectionism and called for the repeal of that disastrous tariff.

Ever since that time, the American people have stayed true to our heritage by rejecting the siren song of protectionism.

Part of the difficulty in accepting the good news about trade is in our words. We too often talk about trade while using the vocabulary of war. In war, for one side to win, the other must lose. But commerce is not warfare. Trade is an economic alliance that benefits both countries. There are no losers, only winners. And trade helps strengthen the free world.

Yet today protectionism is being used by some American politicians as a cheap form of nationalism, a fig leaf for those unwilling to maintain America’s military strength and who lack the resolve to stand up to real enemies—countries that would use violence against us or our allies. Our peaceful trading partners are not our enemies; they are our allies. We should beware of the demagogues who are ready to declare a trade war against our friends—weakening our economy, our national security, and the entire free world—all while cynically waving the American flag. The expansion of the international economy is not a foreign invasion; it is an American triumph, one we worked hard to achieve, and something central to our vision of a peaceful and prosperous world of freedom.

https://www.macleans.ca/news/world/ronald-reagan-had-a-message-about-free-trade-with-canada-that-donald-trump-needs-to-hear/

 :cheers:
Illegitimi non carborundum
Semper debeatis percutis ictu primo
Access my "Allies" book series at:
https://wolfriedel.wordpress.com

Offline PPCLI Guy

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 165,835
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 5,328
  • It's all good
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #37 on: June 02, 2018, 14:23:56 »
Not that I am defending Trump, but in some circles I am reading/hearing that China uses Canada to flow steel (and aluminum, i guess), by selling to Canadian companies who do minimal work with it and then re-export to the US.

What I am finding difficult is discovering if this is actually true, or just opinion.

As I have previously posted:

Quote
Quote from: recceguy on March 15, 2018, 17:30:54
Partly because of the steel we buy from China, then gets transshipped into the States.

A surplus that small is pocket change and not worth the discussion. Trump throws all kinds of stuff out there. He's a master negotiator. Besides, he's not really involved in them is he?

All this is just jockeying for position. The real negotiations are next month in the US.

Just my opinion, of course.

Just some facts from US government:

https://www.trade.gov/steel/countries/pdfs/imports-Canada.pdf


Quote
Steel Imports Report: Canada
Imports by Top Source
The top 5 source countries for Canada’s steel imports represented 79 percent of Canada’s total steel import volume in 2016 at 6.1 million
metrics tons (mmt).

The United States by far accounted for the largest share of Canada’s imports by source country at 5 percent (4.5 mmt), followed by China at 9 percent (0.7 mmt), South Korea at 5 percent (0.4 mmt), Japan at 3 percent (0.3 mmt), and Taiwan at 3 percent (0.2 mmt).

Notably, while Canada’s top source countries have shifted from year to year, the United States has ranked as Canada’s top import source for steel products for more than 20 years.

And the US Steel Report:

https://www.trade.gov/steel/countries/pdfs/imports-us.pdf

Quote
Quote
Imports by Top Source
The top 10 source countries for U.S. steel imports represented 78 percent of the total steel import volume in YTD 2017 at 21 million metrics tons (mmt).
Canada accounted for the largest share of U.S. imports by source country at 16 percent (4.3 mmt), followed by Brazil at 13 percent (3.6 mmt), South Korea at 10 percent (2.7 mmt), Mexico at 9 percent (2.4 mmt), and Russia at 9 percent (2.4 mmt).

While the rankings of the top 10 source countries for U.S. imports has fluctuated over time, Canada has retained the top spot

So Canada imports more steel from US than it exports (4.5 mmt vice 4.3 mmt).  Canada  only import 0.7 mmt from China.  The net delta then is 0,5 mmt.  Given that the government is NOT a significant consumer of steel in Canada, and that most steel companies in Canada are foreign owned, I do not see any likelihood that Canada is "buying Chinese steel and transhipping it into the States".
"The higher the rank, the more necessary it is that boldness should be accompanied by a reflective mind....for with increase in rank it becomes always a matter less of self-sacrifice and more a matter of the preservation of others, and the good of the whole."

Karl von Clausewitz

Online SeaKingTacco

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 138,995
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 5,165
  • Door Gunnery- The Sport of Kings!
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #38 on: June 02, 2018, 15:58:15 »
Thank-you!

Offline tomahawk6

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 103,175
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 9,452
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #39 on: June 02, 2018, 16:08:05 »
No tariff on oil imprts. :D

Offline Thucydides

  • Army.ca Legend
  • *****
  • 194,575
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 13,689
  • Freespeecher
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #40 on: June 02, 2018, 19:54:05 »
The question no one in the media seems to be asking is "what does the United States truly value in their bargaining position?" The tariffs were put in place for a reason, but the only reason the Canadian media and the Liberal government seem to have latched on to is "President Trump is a big meanie"

I had the pleasure of talking to Salim Mansur (former columnist for the Sun media chain) the other day, who suggested at the bottom is a very stark choice: is Canada going to throw in and become a North American nation, or are we going to stay coupled to Europe? (obviously he put it in much more eloquently). Logically, we should be closely aligned to the other nations in the North American continent, but ideologically, we have spent decades trying to be coupled to Europe (many of our foreign policy decisions, acceptance of ideas like multiculturalism and even adopting the metric system were driven by the desire to be more "European" than American).

While there are good arguments as to why we should attempt to build ties across both the Atlantic and Pacific, these need to be complimentary to our linkages to America, not antagonistic.

But now the choice will be "put up" or "shut up". The Liberal government and the "Laurentian Elites" will need to carefully consider and debate this choice, and be prepared to live with the consequences of whichever choice they make.
Dagny, this is not a battle over material goods. It's a moral crisis, the greatest the world has ever faced and the last. Our age is the climax of centuries of evil. We must put an end to it, once and for all, or perish - we, the men of the mind. It was our own guilt. We produced the wealth of the world - but we let our enemies write its moral code.

Offline daftandbarmy

  • Army.ca Legend
  • *****
  • 227,215
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 12,950
  • The Older I Get, The Better I Was
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #41 on: June 02, 2018, 20:08:04 »
The question no one in the media seems to be asking is "what does the United States truly value in their bargaining position?" The tariffs were put in place for a reason, but the only reason the Canadian media and the Liberal government seem to have latched on to is "President Trump is a big meanie"

I had the pleasure of talking to Salim Mansur (former columnist for the Sun media chain) the other day, who suggested at the bottom is a very stark choice: is Canada going to throw in and become a North American nation, or are we going to stay coupled to Europe? (obviously he put it in much more eloquently). Logically, we should be closely aligned to the other nations in the North American continent, but ideologically, we have spent decades trying to be coupled to Europe (many of our foreign policy decisions, acceptance of ideas like multiculturalism and even adopting the metric system were driven by the desire to be more "European" than American).

While there are good arguments as to why we should attempt to build ties across both the Atlantic and Pacific, these need to be complimentary to our linkages to America, not antagonistic.

But now the choice will be "put up" or "shut up". The Liberal government and the "Laurentian Elites" will need to carefully consider and debate this choice, and be prepared to live with the consequences of whichever choice they make.

Our Queen is European (but don't say that when you're face to face with a Limey :) ).
"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

Offline FJAG

  • Army.ca Veteran
  • *****
  • 173,215
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 1,993
  • Ex Gladio Justicia
    • WordPress Page
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #42 on: June 02, 2018, 20:28:25 »
The question no one in the media seems to be asking is "what does the United States truly value in their bargaining position?" The tariffs were put in place for a reason, but the only reason the Canadian media and the Liberal government seem to have latched on to is "President Trump is a big meanie"

I had the pleasure of talking to Salim Mansur (former columnist for the Sun media chain) the other day, who suggested at the bottom is a very stark choice: is Canada going to throw in and become a North American nation, or are we going to stay coupled to Europe? (obviously he put it in much more eloquently). Logically, we should be closely aligned to the other nations in the North American continent, but ideologically, we have spent decades trying to be coupled to Europe (many of our foreign policy decisions, acceptance of ideas like multiculturalism and even adopting the metric system were driven by the desire to be more "European" than American).

While there are good arguments as to why we should attempt to build ties across both the Atlantic and Pacific, these need to be complimentary to our linkages to America, not antagonistic.

But now the choice will be "put up" or "shut up". The Liberal government and the "Laurentian Elites" will need to carefully consider and debate this choice, and be prepared to live with the consequences of whichever choice they make.

Disregarding the non sequitur "Laurentian Elite" comment for a moment, there really isn't an "either or/us or them" issue to be addressed when it comes to Canada's international trade. Our North American trade is essential. Our European and Pacific trade connections are highly desirable. Better trade connections with Africa and South America are also something to strive for.

Anyone who argues that we have to choose sides has an agenda. For Trump (and his coterie of unofficial advisers) the position is that Canada must enter into a trade agreement that favors the US. The Republican party generally does not support the actions that he is taking now. American policy makers, economists, and business leaders (again in general) are of the view that Trump's actions, vis a vis Canada and Europe, are not for a legitimate purpose and are in fact counter-productive to US interests. It's not that Trump isn't a big meanie; he's playing a political game to arouse his base which is generally uninformed and unwilling to understand that the 1950's "Father Knows Best" economic structure of the US/world no longer exists and can't be brought back by nativism and protectionism.

e.g. http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-gop-tariffs-20180306-story.html
https://qz.com/1293821/trump-trade-war-146000-us-job-will-be-lost-to-steel-tariffs/

Canada's (or the Laurentian Elites' as you have called them) biggest economic challenge is how to endure the nonsense coming from the White House without crippling it's relationship with the US and the hard won connections that it has made to the East and West.

 :cheers:
« Last Edit: June 02, 2018, 20:35:25 by FJAG »
Illegitimi non carborundum
Semper debeatis percutis ictu primo
Access my "Allies" book series at:
https://wolfriedel.wordpress.com

Offline Jarnhamar

  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Legend
  • *
  • 273,846
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 10,416
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #43 on: June 02, 2018, 21:25:24 »
Who benifits the most from Trump's actions?
There are no wolves on Fenris

Offline mariomike

  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 490,640
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 8,954
    • The job.
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #44 on: June 02, 2018, 22:31:16 »
According to the NY Times Obama wanted to make it hard for Trump to govern so wanted to sabotauge US-Canada relations.
https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/07/americas/obama-trudeau-bromance-trnd/index.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/13/world/canada/justin-trudeau-donald-trump.html

I'm not seeing from those two articles how the NYT is saying Obama wanted to sabotage US-Canada relations. 

I do not see it, either.

What is the quote you are  linking to?
« Last Edit: June 03, 2018, 00:00:24 by mariomike »

Offline tomahawk6

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 103,175
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 9,452
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #45 on: June 03, 2018, 02:37:53 »
NY Times and now its vanished.Maybe it was fake news.NY Times isnt always honest.

Online E.R. Campbell

  • Retired, years ago
  • Army.ca Subscriber
  • Army.ca Myth
  • *
  • 479,055
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 18,339
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #46 on: June 03, 2018, 06:41:42 »
Who benifits the most from Trump's actions?

My personal opinion, only:

First and foremost: Xi Jinping's China ~ Trump appears to be, as John Ibbitson says in the Globe and Mail, "Attacking the West," even Australia, which has good reasons to worry about China, will turn, again, away from America, ditto Africa;

Second: the Arabs ~ the US led West is in disarray, Russia in on their side, no matter what they do, and China wants their oil; and

Third: Putin's Russia ~ see above ... US led West in disarray, resources, etc.
It is ill that men should kill one another in seditions, tumults and wars; but it is worse to bring nations to such misery, weakness and baseness
as to have neither strength nor courage to contend for anything; to have nothing left worth defending and to give the name of peace to desolation.
Algernon Sidney in Discourses Concerning Government, (1698)
----------
Like what you see/read here on Army.ca?  Subscribe, and help keep it "on the air!"

Offline mariomike

  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 490,640
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 8,954
    • The job.
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #47 on: June 03, 2018, 07:52:49 »
According to the NY Times Obama wanted to make it hard for Trump to govern so wanted to sabotauge US-Canada relations.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/13/world/canada/justin-trudeau-donald-trump.html

NY Times and now its vanished.

The New York Times link you posted yesterday is from 2017. It's still there.


Offline tomahawk6

  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *****
  • 103,175
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 9,452
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #48 on: June 03, 2018, 08:06:20 »
There is evidence that the UK spied on Trump.So if O asked Trudeu to not play nice with Trump,it would happen.

Offline mariomike

  • Directing Staff
  • Army.ca Fixture
  • *
  • 490,640
  • Rate Post
  • Posts: 8,954
    • The job.
Re: Canada-US Trade Relations
« Reply #49 on: June 03, 2018, 08:21:24 »
So if O asked Trudeu to not play nice with Trump,it would happen.

"If"s are always interesting in online discussions. But, not the same as,

According to the NY Times Obama wanted to make it hard for Trump to govern so wanted to sabotauge US-Canada relations.



« Last Edit: June 03, 2018, 08:28:58 by mariomike »