Author Topic: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months  (Read 10624 times)

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Offline Jarnhamar

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Pretty intense story.

12 boys and their coach decided to go exploring a cave in Thailand.  A flash rainstorm hit and blocked off the path out of the cave and it remains under water.

They were found after 9 days later by divers, stuck 3 kilometers inside the cave system (and 1km below the surface) on a little dirt mound.  Because of the high water lever and narrow passages, they may be stuck on that dirt mound for 4 months.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-44692813


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Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2018, 12:41:34 »
Get stuck or learn to scuba.I think the scuba option may be best.

Offline Remius

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2018, 14:15:57 »
A 2.5 kilometer swim in cramped space moving a meter every 5 mins or so is what they've been saying.  So about an 8 hour dive and none of these kids can swim.  There is no best option.
Optio

Offline Good2Golf

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2018, 15:05:21 »
How was the 3mm/sec swim rate determined?  Is there a strong current flowing into the cave? 

Offline Remius

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2018, 15:20:29 »
How was the 3mm/sec swim rate determined?  Is there a strong current flowing into the cave?

Not sure. Probably an estimate from the experts on the ground.

This article shows some of the challenges.  Experienced cave divers take three hours to get there.  Now add the fact that they might have to be tethered.  That might be the reason and I could see how it could significantly slow them down considering they can't swim or know how to dive at all.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-07-04/why-doesnt-the-thai-soccer-team-dive-out-of-the-cave/9938148     
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Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #5 on: July 04, 2018, 16:10:02 »
Here's a local to Thailand site that gives a reasonable running description of the search operation with some interesting graphics of the cave system.  http://www.chiangmaicitylife.com/news/live-updates-teenager-football-team-trapped-thai-cave/
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Offline Colin P

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2018, 16:53:05 »
One option is to widen some of the tight spots with hydraulic chisels. Right now they have the kids and a method to resupply. Time to slow down and think the next stage through and consider a variety of options. I suspect many countries are offering up specialty equipment, resource and personal. 

Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #7 on: July 05, 2018, 10:38:03 »
Dewatering is making another option possible- walking out. The rescuers claim to have pumped out 40% of the water.Maybe they could lower the water to use small boats ?

Offline Pusser

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #8 on: July 05, 2018, 14:48:45 »
I gather they're having difficulty pumping out the water fast enough and they're expecting massive amounts of rain, which will fill the caves up again.
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Offline Loachman

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #9 on: July 05, 2018, 15:45:46 »
One article that I read stated that the tunnel is so cramped in at least one area that tanks cannot be worn. That severely limits options.

Attempting to "widen", which would have to be both vertically and horizontally, has difficulties and risks - chiselling in such cramped quarters would be difficult to impossible, chiselled-off stone would have to be cleared out to have any benefit, and a cave-in would be lethal to rescuers and rescues.

Being stuck for a few months appears to be the least-sucky option, so far.

Offline Humphrey Bogart

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #10 on: July 05, 2018, 15:57:15 »
One article that I read stated that the tunnel is so cramped in at least one area that tanks cannot be worn. That severely limits options.

Attempting to "widen", which would have to be both vertically and horizontally, has difficulties and risks - chiselling in such cramped quarters would be difficult to impossible, chiselled-off stone would have to be cleared out to have any benefit, and a cave-in would be lethal to rescuers and rescues.

Being stuck for a few months appears to be the least-sucky option, so far.

Bring in a mine rescue team.  That option should be examined, they may be able to drill a rescue shaft to them. 

Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #11 on: July 05, 2018, 16:18:04 »
Read this on Wikipedia
Quote
Shaft sinking is one of the most difficult of all development methods: restricted space, gravity, groundwater and specialized procedures make the task quite formidable.[2]

Historically mine shaft sinking has been among the most dangerous of all the mining occupations and the preserve of mining contractors called sinkers.[3] Today shaft sinking contractors are concentrated in Canada, Germany and South Africa.

4 months on that little mound I'm guessing air would be a problem as well as sanitation.

Maybe Wainwright can send them all their shitter bags and we can shut down MR18 or MR19, you know to do our part.

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Offline tomahawk6

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Offline Colin P

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #13 on: July 05, 2018, 16:32:08 »
One article that I read stated that the tunnel is so cramped in at least one area that tanks cannot be worn. That severely limits options.

Attempting to "widen", which would have to be both vertically and horizontally, has difficulties and risks - chiselling in such cramped quarters would be difficult to impossible, chiselled-off stone would have to be cleared out to have any benefit, and a cave-in would be lethal to rescuers and rescues.

Being stuck for a few months appears to be the least-sucky option, so far.

Having been in some gold mines you be surprised how little room there is when they are following a vein in a drift. As for the mucking out, labour is cheap there. You be amazed how fast they can tunnel. Other Miners would be following right along to brace the wider opening.

Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2018, 16:46:52 »
Thai's are very resourceful.

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2018, 16:51:36 »
Thai's are very resourceful.

Like the quirky British volunteers who helped find them!
"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

Offline Good2Golf

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #16 on: July 05, 2018, 16:54:36 »
Like the quirky British volunteers who helped find them by taking just not enough rope...!

#whewthatworkedoutwell


The boys seemed in pretty good spirits all things told!

Offline Loachman

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #17 on: July 05, 2018, 17:18:02 »
As for the mucking out, labour is cheap there. You be amazed how fast they can tunnel. Other Miners would be following right along to brace the wider opening.

But can they do it under water, which I understand is somewhat muddy, in the dark, while wearing breathing apparatus?

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #18 on: July 05, 2018, 19:05:06 »
But can they do it under water, which I understand is somewhat muddy, in the dark, while wearing breathing apparatus?

If they were chubby, basement dwelling, entitled, first world nation millennials then no... not a chance :)
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Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #19 on: July 05, 2018, 19:17:28 »
I guess the rescuers are looking for a back way into the cave system.

Offline Colin P

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #20 on: July 05, 2018, 19:46:39 »
But can they do it under water, which I understand is somewhat muddy, in the dark, while wearing breathing apparatus?

Having watch 3rd worlders work in the mining business, I would say they could achieve more than you expect, because they are willing to take greater risks and do stuff most Canadians won't.

One thing they could do on the surface is attempt to figure out what are the major sources of water coming in and divert them away, meaning the pumps can achieve more impact.

Offline Remius

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #21 on: July 05, 2018, 20:35:08 »


One thing they could do on the surface is attempt to figure out what are the major sources of water coming in and divert them away, meaning the pumps can achieve more impact.

I believe torrential rain is one of those major sources.
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Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #22 on: July 05, 2018, 22:54:06 »
Having watch 3rd worlders work in the mining business, I would say they could achieve more than you expect, because they are willing to take greater risks and do stuff most Canadians won't.


And, sadly, one of them is now dead:

Thai cave rescuer dies from lack of oxygen

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/thai-cave-rescue-nave-seal-death-oxygen-1.4736079?cid=

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Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #23 on: July 06, 2018, 00:49:02 »
It's never too early to start capitalizing on disaster.  (That's sarcasm for those who can't pickup on the tone)


https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/asia/disaster-cave-slated-thailands-next-tourist-attraction.html
Quote
Disaster cave to be next tourist attraction

By Bangkok Post 4 July 2018

BANGKOK — The Tourism Authority of Thailand (TAT) plans to promote Tham Luang cave in Chiang Rai province as a key attraction after its time in the global spotlight, which climaxed with the missing soccer team of 13 being found alive on Monday night.

Karuna Dechatiwong, director of TAT’s Chiang Rai office, said the agency will work with local authorities and the private sector to promote the cave and other attractive nearby venues as it anticipates a number of tourists will flock to the area in the near future.

“After the rescue team found the 12 young soccer players and their coach on Monday night, the cave has become of interest for both local and foreign travelers,” Karuna said.

She said people may want travel and activity information before visiting the area, and the agency is ready to work out a route to the cave and other destinations in Chiang Rai.

The tranquil and beautiful cave in Khun Nam Nang Non Forest Park in Mae Sai district is suited to the summer season, but permission from authorities is needed before entering in the rainy season.

Initially, TAT is considering creating a new route not only to promote the cave but also nearby communities such as a village that makes mulberry tree paper, an Isan Lanna community, and a community that produces seed tea.

All the communities are located along the road in between Chiang Rai town and Mae Sai on the border with Myanmar.

TAT will ask local administrations to prepare tourism management, improve safety standards and upgrade services, she said.

The promotion of Chiang Rai province as an adventure destination was also floated by Tourism and Sports Minister Weerasak Kowsurat and Chiang Rai Governor Narongsak Osot-Thanakorn. The two also talked with hotels and transport companies in Chiang Rai to arrange an appreciation trip specifically for the rescue teams.

TAT Chiang Rai reported the province attracted 2.7 million tourists last year and generated tourism income of nearly 30 billion baht (US$905 million). The number of visitors is expected to increase gradually as the province also plans to promote elderly tourism along with adventure and cross-border tourism.

Earlier this year, the renovated river port in Chiang Saen was opened to serve higher demand from southern China.
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Offline mariomike

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #24 on: July 06, 2018, 07:49:32 »
It's never too early to start capitalizing on disaster. 

"Disaster cave to be next tourist attraction"

Reminds me of a cave incident years ago.

Media attention
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floyd_Collins#Media_attention
"Shortly after the media arrived, the publicity drew crowds of tourists to the site, at one point numbering in the tens of thousands. Vendors set up stalls to sell food and souvenirs, creating a circus-like atmosphere."

Exhibition of the body
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floyd_Collins#Burial_and_exhibition_of_body
"The new owner placed Collins' body in a glass-topped coffin and exhibited it in Crystal Cave for many years."
« Last Edit: July 06, 2018, 09:22:38 by mariomike »

Offline Jarnhamar

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Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #26 on: July 06, 2018, 23:44:16 »
At this point a successful egress from the cave is unlikely.The loss of some or all of the team is possible barring a miracle.If they get heavy rains just remaining in place may not be possible.

Offline CBH99

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #27 on: July 07, 2018, 16:38:37 »
My hat is truly off to the rescuers & all personnel involved in the rescue effort.  Talk about high stakes, high stress. 

Planning possibilities always seems easier when your not involved.  My initial thoughts were "can't they just hose oxygen into there steadily, deploy a guide rope with some lights on it, and relay them out from one diver to another?"  But then I realized if it were that easy, they probably would have done that already.  And then I learned more details about the situation.

Zero visibility water.  Inability of the boys to swim.  Unable to access certain parts without taking off their oxygen tanks.  Massive waters coming in.  Depleting oxygen levels.  Etc.

Regardless of the outcome, I think we need to recognize how hard these guys are working & how difficult of a job the leadership/rescuers have.  Sincere prayers coming from this end. 
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Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #28 on: July 07, 2018, 23:33:31 »
A rescue might be in the offing as authorities have cleared the area around the cave.Elon Musk seems to think a mini sub might work so he is having one flown in. I don't know if they have time.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/thai-rescuers-evacuate-cave-area-rescue-bid-for-trapped-boys-seen-imminent/ar-AAzII8g?ocid=spartanntp

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #29 on: July 08, 2018, 00:16:00 »
A rescue might be in the offing as authorities have cleared the area around the cave.Elon Musk seems to think a mini sub might work so he is having one flown in. I don't know if they have time.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/thai-rescuers-evacuate-cave-area-rescue-bid-for-trapped-boys-seen-imminent/ar-AAzII8g?ocid=spartanntp

Elon Musk is an idiot and, clearly, has never dived in a cave either. If you're having to squeeze sideways through two pieces of solid rock to move forward, in the dark at depth and under water, how will a sub get through?

This operation will be more difficult to complete without significant casualties than, say, Apollo 13. At least Lovell & Co. had access to air.

Gawd bless 'em... all
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Offline ballz

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #30 on: July 08, 2018, 00:21:58 »
My hat is truly off to the rescuers & all personnel involved in the rescue effort.  Talk about high stakes, high stress. 

Planning possibilities always seems easier when your not involved.  My initial thoughts were "can't they just hose oxygen into there steadily, deploy a guide rope with some lights on it, and relay them out from one diver to another?"  But then I realized if it were that easy, they probably would have done that already.  And then I learned more details about the situation.

Zero visibility water.  Inability of the boys to swim.  Unable to access certain parts without taking off their oxygen tanks.  Massive waters coming in.  Depleting oxygen levels.  Etc.

Regardless of the outcome, I think we need to recognize how hard these guys are working & how difficult of a job the leadership/rescuers have.  Sincere prayers coming from this end.

Agreed. I can't even wrap my head around the kinds of constraints they must be facing. When I heard about how they had to take their oxygen tank off in some places to squeeze through, just madness... I'm a strong swimmer and I got all f**ked up breathing through a snorkel on on a damn pleasure voyage... I'd be sick thinking about doing what they are about to do. I certainly can't imagine a 12 year old that can't swim / scuba dive doing it.

Paying attention to all this with bated breath.

And to the divers that are about to attempt whatever the hell they are going to attempt... no words for it.  :salute:
« Last Edit: July 08, 2018, 00:28:05 by ballz »
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Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #31 on: July 08, 2018, 01:48:40 »
Don't be Bill or Fred:

A deceptively easy way to die - Cave Diving 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1iaa04rCf0
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Offline winnipegoo7

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #32 on: July 08, 2018, 02:40:20 »
Elon Musk is an idiot ... how will a sub get through?

1. I think he’s brilliant
2. You obviously didn’t read anything that Elon Musk tweeted about rescue methods. (Hint - he made it very clear that he did not literally mean a submarine.
3. Apparently the final product ended up being a sort of body bag made by a company called Wing Inflatables:

http://madriverunion.com/arcatas-wing-inflatables-spacex-collaborate-on-thailand-cave-rescue/

Offline Remius

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #33 on: July 08, 2018, 08:47:14 »
Apparently the first two boys are out. 


Good job so far.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/thai-cave-rescue-navy-dive-operation-1.4738333
« Last Edit: July 08, 2018, 08:49:47 by Remius »
Optio

Offline tomahawk6

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Offline Loachman

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #35 on: July 09, 2018, 12:23:26 »
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/thai-cave-rescue-navy-dive-operation-1.4738771

8 boys brought out of flooded Thai cave in 'immense' rescue operation

1st group freed on Sunday said to be in good health

Thomson Reuters · Posted: Jul 09, 2018 1:54 AM ET | Last Updated: 24 minutes ago

The president of soccer's governing body, FIFA, has invited the boys to the World Cup final in Moscow on Sunday if they make it out in time.


Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #36 on: July 09, 2018, 12:25:28 »
5 are left to be evacuated next.

Offline Remius

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Offline tomahawk6

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« Last Edit: July 10, 2018, 08:43:40 by tomahawk6 »

Offline Remius

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #39 on: July 10, 2018, 09:28:16 »
All are out including the coach.The Thai Seals did it !!

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/all-13-rescued-from-flooded-thai-cave-navy-seal-unit/ar-AAzPcqJ?ocid=spartandhp

Awesome.

now comes the revisionist movie where some made up American hero saves the day!
Optio

Offline OldTanker

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #40 on: July 10, 2018, 09:59:18 »
Well done to all involved in the rescue. Its nice to see a story with a successful conclusion.

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #41 on: July 10, 2018, 11:57:17 »
BZ Thai Seals.  But do keep a good thought in your mind for the one who gave his life to make it happen. Raise a glass in  :salute:

Offline Chris Pook

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Fake News - Alternative Facts - Sensationalism - Opinion
« Reply #42 on: July 10, 2018, 12:20:55 »

"Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months"

The story broke on July 3, the day the team was found having been lost for 9 days.

The rescue was completed on July 10, a week after the team was located and 16 days after getting lost.

So, again, the headline:  Was it Fake News  or Alternative Facts or what we used to call Sensationalism?  Like any other Daily Mail headline?  Or was it just what we occasionally refer to as Opinion?

My money is on Opinion.   Speculation based on available information and personal filters.
"Wyrd bið ful aræd"

Offline Remius

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Re: Fake News - Alternative Facts - Sensationalism - Opinion
« Reply #43 on: July 10, 2018, 12:32:35 »
So most of the reports were discussing the options at the time.

Take this BBC report at the time.  2 options.  Teaching the kids how to dive or waiting out for four months. 

The BBC quoted the Thai military.

Not fake news nor opinion.  Just the options that were presented.  As things develop option can either become limited or impossible. 

Just like COAs.  You look at them then you pick one.

Optio

Offline Altair

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Re: Fake News - Alternative Facts - Sensationalism - Opinion
« Reply #44 on: July 10, 2018, 12:45:02 »
So most of the reports were discussing the options at the time.

Take this BBC report at the time.  2 options.  Teaching the kids how to dive or waiting out for four months. 

The BBC quoted the Thai military.

Not fake news nor opinion.  Just the options that were presented.  As things develop option can either become limited or impossible. 

Just like COAs.  You look at them then you pick one.
Yup. The story was true at the time. They were debating whether it was too dangerous to teach the kids how to dive, and if that's what they decided, they "could " have been stuck in the cave for months.
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Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: Fake News - Alternative Facts - Sensationalism - Opinion
« Reply #45 on: July 10, 2018, 15:30:06 »
On seeing the topic title I was somewhat optimistic that a discussion about the use of "fake news et al" in threads would be forthcoming but then was deflated when I saw the story that was presented as the example.  While some media outlets undoubtedly presented the trapped kids in a cave story with as much hype as possible (after all, their business is to get as many eyeballs on them IOT increase revenue) most reported the facts as known or according to information released by authorities.  Their analyses (including that by "experts") mostly stayed in their lanes.

As to the variance between what was initially reported as the likely time before final rescue and when they actually were brought to the surface, probably the best and most recent similar example would be the Chilean miners.  They were trapped on 5 Aug 2010, contact made on 22 Aug and shortly after drilling of a rescue bore began (30 Aug) the "optimistic" opinion of those advising the government was that it could take up to four months to get them out.  The miners were extracted just shy of a month and a half later (13 Oct).  Was the government (and their experts) being cautious in using such a generous timeline.  Of course, but other than when announcing what something would cost when has a government ever deliberately set itself up to not make a deadline when lives are at stake.

"Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months"

. . . .

So, again, the headline:  Was it Fake News  or Alternative Facts or what we used to call Sensationalism?  Like any other Daily Mail headline?  Or was it just what we occasionally refer to as Opinion?


Headline?  Or the topic title made up by the OP for that particular thread?  If you clicked the link to the BBC article that the poster had in the initial post the headline was "Thailand cave: 'Zero risks' to be taken in rescue of boys" .  So whose sensationalism, opinion or alternative facts are you questioning?  The media, the government (or other group) or forum members who post it here?  In this instance, I see none at fault.  Now. if this thread dealt with subjects much more commonly posted in the political threads and well opined about, then yeah, there is more than enough being spread about and fertilizing unproductive fields (and minds).
« Last Edit: July 10, 2018, 15:53:57 by Blackadder1916 »
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #46 on: July 10, 2018, 17:52:10 »
"Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months"

The story broke on July 3, the day the team was found having been lost for 9 days.

The rescue was completed on July 10, a week after the team was located and 16 days after getting lost.

So, again, the headline:  Was it Fake News  or Alternative Facts or what we used to call Sensationalism?  Like any other Daily Mail headline?  Or was it just what we occasionally refer to as Opinion?

My money is on Opinion.   Speculation based on available information and personal filters.

Chris,

The title is paraphrased (pulled really) right in the article I posted.

Quote

Earlier, the Thai military said the boys would need to learn to dive - or wait up to four months for flooding to recede before they could get out of the caves,


Multiple news agencies reported the same thing.

To me the the kids possibly being stuck in the cave for four months was the most significant aspect of the story so that's why I used it as a title. If it was speculation or opinion then it's from rescue workers and Thai Navy divers on scene, not me.

They were still talking about the kids staying down there for months 2 days before the first boy was pulled out.

« Last Edit: July 10, 2018, 17:57:11 by Jarnhamar »
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Offline Colin P

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #47 on: July 10, 2018, 18:21:06 »
Could be a tactic by the Thai authorities to keep the media occupied and not harassing the team.

Offline JesseWZ

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #48 on: July 10, 2018, 22:16:55 »
4 months in the cave was likely the probable COA, however on completing some version of mission analysis, they realized the habitability of the cave was decreasing faster then allowable in the circumstances.

I'm pretty certain I read somewhere in the myriad of articles published that some unseasonably good weather arose and coupled with concerns about livability in the cave, the command team decided it was worth trying now. The other COA may have burned itself out once more information came to light about conditions in the cave.

 "Gain and maintain the initiative" is a *principle of battle is it not? It looks like they were able to make the call and the worlds collective hindsight will likely prove it to be the correct call at the time.

*Note: I'm probably calling it the wrong thing. Please correct me if my terminology is wrong or out of date.

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Offline Tango2Bravo

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #49 on: July 10, 2018, 22:44:36 »
Maybe we just recognize the skill, heroism and sacrifice of the rescue team?
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Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #50 on: July 11, 2018, 10:07:34 »
Maybe we just recognize the skill, heroism and sacrifice of the rescue team?

I agree.The Honors List will include some Australians that helped including a doctor who stayed with the boys and was among the last extracted.Thailand will probably present awards to the Thai SEALs and international participants.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/the-doctor-who-chose-to-stay-in-the-cave/ar-AAzUdU4?ocid=spartanntp
« Last Edit: July 11, 2018, 11:12:35 by tomahawk6 »

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Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #52 on: July 11, 2018, 14:19:41 »
https://www.nationalreview.com/photos/cartoons-of-the-day-july-11-2018/#slide-2

Since Saman was is a Buddhist, being comforted by a paternalistic old white guy is a little unrealistic.  But being a Buddhist and with his last thoughts and deeds to determine his next existence, he is well settled.

https://www.budsas.org/ebud/whatbudbeliev/303.htm
Quote
Buddhists believe that after death rebirth can take place in any one of a number of possible existences. This future existence is conditioned by the last thought-moment a person experiences at the point of death. This last thought which determines the next existence results from the past actions of a man either in this life or before that. Hence, if the predominant thought reflects meritorious action, then he will find his future existence in a happy state.
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Offline Colin P

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #53 on: July 11, 2018, 16:02:36 »
He was just visiting his US buddies up there as a pit stop to his next life....

Offline tomahawk6

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Offline Good2Golf

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #55 on: July 12, 2018, 06:52:58 »
https://www.stripes.com/news/air-force-rescue-specialist-details-once-in-a-lifetime-thai-cave-rescue-1.537066

Amazing rescue effort!  The details and scale of team in place to extract the boys is abosultey staggering.

Hats off to all who participated, including the USAF PJs!

Regards
G2G


Offline Haggis

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #56 on: July 12, 2018, 09:47:15 »
Since Saman was is a Buddhist, being comforted by a paternalistic old white guy is a little unrealistic.  But being a Buddhist and with his last thoughts and deeds to determine his next existence, he is well settled.

True, but the cartoon's intended audience is western Christians, some of whom take that paternalistic old white guy pretty seriously.
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Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #57 on: July 12, 2018, 13:38:29 »
The international workers are being given 5 year visa's and Thai airways is giving them a round trip ticket as a way to thank them.
and a week's all expense paid trip.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/stateless-boy-who-emerged-as-leader-in-thailand-cave-was-key-to-rescue/ar-AAzY7BC?ocid=spartanntp

Thai Airways is providing round-trip tickets and an all-expenses-paid weeklong trip for all of the international volunteers who worked on the rescue. The tourism authority is also giving them all a five-year visa.

Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #58 on: July 13, 2018, 16:54:33 »
A Canadian diver was part of the rescue effort Erik Brown.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/‘time-is-running-out’-inside-the-treacherous-rescue-of-boys-trapped-in-a-thai-cave/ar-AAA0K6Y?ocid=spartanntp

Offline Loachman

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #59 on: July 14, 2018, 01:21:03 »
Ozzy Man & Mozza On Thailand Cave Rescue https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JP-hhtb2UY

Offline Colin P

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #60 on: July 14, 2018, 12:56:25 »
The kids get released next week and apparently 4,000 people came out to restore the damage done by the rescue operation to the area outside the cave.

Offline Retired AF Guy

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #61 on: July 14, 2018, 15:19:58 »
Awesome.

now comes the revisionist movie where some made up American hero saves the day!

While nothing about a white American hero saving the day, at least two movies are apparently in the works. From Vox.com.

Quote
Competing movies about the Thai cave rescue are already in the works

The two productions raise issues of whitewashing and the complexity of getting rights to the story.

By Alissa Wilkinson@alissamariealissa@vox.com  Updated Jul 14, 2018, 1:29pm EDT

 
The story of the Thai cave rescue has already spawned a number of retellings, including two movie projects that have been announced.

Twelve Thai boys had scarcely been rescued from a flooded cave by divers and Thai Navy SEALS before the intention to shoot a movie adaptation was announced by Pure Flix, the production and distribution company that focuses on faith-market releases like the God’s Not Dead series and The Case for Christ.

A day later, a second film about the events was announced, this time helmed by Jon M. Chu (director of the upcoming Crazy Rich Asians) and produced by LA-based Ivanhoe Pictures. Ivanhoe’s president announced that the company had been selected by the Thai Navy and Thailand’s government to develop the film.

It’s not uncommon for multiple movies or TV shows about the same person or real event to come out around the same time. Think of 2006, when both Oliver Stone’s World Trade Center and Paul Greengrass’s United 93 came out. Or 2016, when the documentary O.J.: Made in America and the scripted TV show The People v. O.J. Simpson: American Crime Story were both released. It happens a lot.

And this rescue story, which garnered weeks of high-profile news coverage and captivated people around the world, will inspire more than just these two films. For instance, Deadline reported that Discovery Inc. ordered a documentary about the rescue mission to first air on Friday, July 13 — just days after the rescue — and the Wall Street Journal noted that books are likely on the way, too.

But these two “fiction” films attracted particular attention because of questions about how the story would be approached by the two companies, fueled partly by comments Chu made on Twitter about “whitewashing,” as well as competing efforts to obtain the rights to the story — and the realities about who owns those rights.

What does it mean to say the film could be “whitewashed”?

On Wednesday, Chu — who is Chinese-American — weighed in via Twitter, confirming his intention to make his own film in response. In his tweets, Chu suggested that Hollywood might “whitewash” the story.

“That won’t happen or we’ll give them hell,” he wrote, saying that “anyone thinking about the story better approach it right & respectfully.”

And though Chu didn’t name Pure Flix specifically in the tweets, the timing suggested it was in response to the company’s announcement about its intention to make the film.

Article link.
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Offline beirnini

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #62 on: July 14, 2018, 23:20:28 »
While nothing about a white American hero saving the day, at least two movies are apparently in the works. From Vox.com.
Yeah, about that;
Quote
Twelve Thai boys had scarcely been rescued from a flooded cave by divers and Thai Navy SEALS before the intention to shoot a movie adaptation was announced by Pure Flix, the production and distribution company that focuses on faith-market releases like the God’s Not Dead series and The Case for Christ.

Offline Remius

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #63 on: July 16, 2018, 12:19:33 »
Elon Musk is an idiot and, clearly, has never dived in a cave either. If you're having to squeeze sideways through two pieces of solid rock to move forward, in the dark at depth and under water, how will a sub get through?

This operation will be more difficult to complete without significant casualties than, say, Apollo 13. At least Lovell & Co. had access to air.

Gawd bless 'em... all

Seems like Mr. Musk didn't appreciate being called out for being a distraction.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/16/asia/thai-cave-soccer-musk-rescuer-tweet-intl/index.html

Optio

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #64 on: July 16, 2018, 12:22:18 »
Seems like Mr. Musk didn't appreciate being called out for being a distraction.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/16/asia/thai-cave-soccer-musk-rescuer-tweet-intl/index.html

Awesome... let the recriminations commence!  :rofl:
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Offline Humphrey Bogart

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #65 on: July 16, 2018, 12:36:41 »
Seems like Mr. Musk didn't appreciate being called out for being a distraction.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/16/asia/thai-cave-soccer-musk-rescuer-tweet-intl/index.html

He was a distraction and I can hardly wait until the day Tesla bombs.  This guy is a PR ***** and is only doing these things for his own personal benefit and to keep money rolling in to Tesla so they can stay afloat financially.

Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Kids football team could be stuck in cave for months
« Reply #66 on: July 16, 2018, 15:23:12 »
Musk better write that check quickly.His comments were unnecessary and uncharitable.