Poll

Is it Stolen Valour

Yes
3 (12%)
No
22 (88%)

Total Members Voted: 25

Author Topic: Is this Stolen Valour  (Read 7034 times)

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Offline Furniture

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2019, 16:11:14 »
i'm not an army.ca forum pro like you mate. don't have time to build my street cred on army.ca where it really matters

haha I am hardly a pro, just someone who gets bored at work or home on occasion.

Online JesseWZ

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2019, 16:22:15 »
i'm not an army.ca forum pro like you mate. don't have time to build my street cred on army.ca where it really matters

Nope, you're just someone from an identifiable unit, beaking off at people you don't know online.

You posted a question on a (mostly) military forum, which invited responses. Some of the responses were critical of the question - that's the risk you run when you ask a question. You seem upset that most of the responses you received weren't supportive of your position. That's also a risk you run when you ask a question.

If it really matters so much to you, why not put pen to paper (instead of anonymously slagging people online) and contact your chain of command to start a summary investigation.

That'll teach those meddling kids!
I will be seen and not heard... I will be seen and not heard... I will be seen and not heard...

Offline Good2Golf

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2019, 16:34:20 »
So real jumpers and real pilots here, as a representative sample of valid offendees, have given both works of art a ‘meh...’

Are those here who remain offended, also direct offendees (a jumper or pilot), or just don’t have anything better to do with their time?

Regards
G2G
(Potential offendee who is in fact not offended)

Offline toonietuesday

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2019, 16:46:23 »
So real jumpers and real pilots here, as a representative sample of valid offendees, have given both works of art a ‘meh...’

Are those here who remain offended, also direct offendees (a jumper or pilot), or just don’t have anything better to do with their time?

Regards
G2G
(Potential offendee who is in fact not offended)

weather day  :waiting:

Offline toonietuesday

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2019, 16:53:42 »
Nope, you're just someone from an identifiable unit, beaking off at people you don't know online.

You posted a question on a (mostly) military forum, which invited responses. Some of the responses were critical of the question - that's the risk you run when you ask a question. You seem upset that most of the responses you received weren't supportive of your position. That's also a risk you run when you ask a question.

If it really matters so much to you, why not put pen to paper (instead of anonymously slagging people online) and contact your chain of command to start a summary investigation.

That'll teach those meddling kids!

thanks for the tip CFNIS agent! i'll just put a Ranger tab on my next patch and tell them if CFNIS is not offended neither should anyone

Offline Haggis

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2019, 17:36:14 »
My feelings were hurt in places Cepacol can’t even reach.
That's where foot powder comes in.  Cepacol is only for injuries above the waist.
Train like your life depends on it.  Some day, it may.

Offline Lumber

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2019, 18:21:41 »
thanks for the tip CFNIS agent! i'll just put a Ranger tab on my next patch and tell them if CFNIS is not offended neither should anyone

Holy sh;t dude, who pissed in your cornflakes this morning? JesseWZ wasn't even bring flippant.
"Aboard his ship, there is nothing outside a captain's control." - Captain Sir Edward Pellew

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Offline BeyondTheNow

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #32 on: January 10, 2019, 18:24:40 »
To avoid possible dogpiling taking place, just a reminder to move forward with the discussion. DS has tended to issues raised.

Staff
« Last Edit: January 10, 2019, 18:28:57 by BeyondTheNow »

Offline toonietuesday

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #33 on: January 10, 2019, 20:58:12 »
Holy sh;t dude, who pissed in your cornflakes this morning? JesseWZ wasn't even bring flippant.

you teach a MARS course, day 1 of course your fresh off bmoq A/Slts put diver dolphins on their course t-shirts and go around chanting diver slogans, you tell them to stop and they write "this course is diver qualified no matter who asks" in the classroom. you good with it? yes or no

carry on

Offline Good2Golf

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #34 on: January 10, 2019, 21:18:51 »
you teach a MARS course, day 1 of course your fresh off bmoq A/Slts put diver dolphins on their course t-shirts and go around chanting diver slogans, you tell them to stop and they write "this course is diver qualified no matter who asks" in the classroom. you good with it? yes or no

carry on

So you’re a QFI who’s upset with how student pilots are conducting themselves?

Online JesseWZ

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #35 on: January 10, 2019, 22:09:13 »
thanks for the tip CFNIS agent! i'll just put a Ranger tab on my next patch and tell them if CFNIS is not offended neither should anyone

Toonie,

I'd like to further elaborate my post which you seem to have taken some offense to. When you originally posted your poll, there was very little information provided regarding the actions of the course. Despite this challenge, for the most part, the site membership mostly disagreed this constituted stolen valour. It, as described, certainly doesn't fall within the scheme of S. 419 of the Criminal Code. Is it in poor taste? Maybe. I'm neither pilot nor jumper so I really can't say.

As I mentioned earlier, you posted the poll - which tells me you were seeking the opinion of the site membership whether you were barking up the right tree. Now that a cross section of site membership has weighed in - it seems the purpose of your poll is fulfilled. You have an idea about what a cross section of military members and civilians believe your situation to be about.

You've chosen to attack some of the membership for being members here - after coming here to seek their opinion. If you don't feel like participating on army.ca is worthwhile, then why post the poll in the first place?

I wasn't being tongue in cheek when I suggested if you feel as strongly as you do about the course - there are administrative options available to you. Clearly you orbit this course in some fashion (either as DS, another student or support staff at the school). If you aren't in a position to simply order the course to cease the behaviour, then there exists chains of command for a reason. Attacking everyone who disagrees with you on army.ca about what constitutes stolen valour helps no one, makes you look foolish and immature and will probably draw more attention to *your* behaviour then that of the offending students (being students and all). You're the adult in the room in this situation.

Lastly, no one here speaks for their entire unit, the CAF, their subunit, or anyone else but themselves. Implying that I or the CFNIS is ok with the behaviour is inaccurate. You asked if it's stolen valour - the site has answered resoundingly that it's not. Maybe it's in poor taste, maybe it's not - but it's not stolen valour. That's all anyone here can definitively say. By implying I'm ok with the behaviour, you've moved the goal posts of your argument to no longer being about stolen valour but instead whether me personally would be ok with the behaviour.

Would I be offended if you ran around with a ranger tab on a course t-shirt? Nope, I wouldn't care in the slightest. You might find your face repeatedly running into a rangers clenched hand for some reason, but as far as I'm concerned, wear what you want. If you're not breaching a law or regulation, it's not my problem.

...And while I love the idea of being an "agent" - we don't get the cool titles our American equivalents have.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2019, 22:36:56 by JesseWZ »
I will be seen and not heard... I will be seen and not heard... I will be seen and not heard...

Offline toonietuesday

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #36 on: January 10, 2019, 22:40:41 »
Toonie,

I'd like to further elaborate my post which you seem to have taken some offense to. When you originally posted your poll, there was very little information provided regarding the actions of the course. Despite this challenge, for the most part, the site membership mostly disagreed this constituted stolen valour. It, as described, certainly doesn't fall within the scheme of S. 419 of the Criminal Code. Is it in poor taste? Maybe. I'm neither pilot nor jumper so I really can't say.

As I mentioned earlier, you posted the poll - which tells me you were seeking the opinion of the site membership whether you were barking up the right tree. Now that a cross section of site membership has weighed in - it seems the purpose of your poll is fulfilled. You have an idea about what a cross section of military members and civilians believe your situation to be about.

You've chosen to attack some of the membership for being members here - after coming here to seek their opinion. If you don't feel like participating on army.ca is worthwhile, then why post the poll in the first place?

Finally, I wasn't being tongue in cheek when I suggested if you feel as strongly as you do about the course - there are administrative options available to you. Clearly you orbit this course in some fashion (either as DS, another student or support staff at the school). If you aren't in a position to simply order the course to cease the behaviour, then there exists chains of command for a reason. Attacking everyone who disagrees with you on army.ca about what constitutes stolen valour helps no one, makes you look foolish and immature and will probably draw more attention to *your* behaviour then that of the offending students (being students and all). You're the adult in the room in this situation.

Lastly, no one here speaks for their entire unit, the CAF, their subunit, or anyone else but themselves. Implying that I or the CFNIS is ok with the behaviour is inaccurate. You asked if it's stolen valour - the site has answered resoundingly that it's not. Maybe it's in poor taste, maybe it's not - but it's not stolen valour. That's all anyone here can definitively say. By implying I'm ok with the behaviour, you've moved the goal posts of your argument to no longer being about stolen valour but instead whether me personally would be ok with the behaviour.

Would I be offended if you ran around with a ranger tab on a course t-shirt? Nope, I wouldn't care in the slightest. You might find your face repeatedly running into a rangers clenched hand for some reason, but as far as I'm concerned, wear what you want. If you're not breaching a law or regulation, it's not my problem.

...And while I love the idea of being an "agent" - we don't get the cool titles our American equivalents have.

you're absolutely spot on mate. solid mature response, although i don't agree that i attacked anyone for having an opinion different from my own. sorry i was a bit bored today and got cheeky with some of your pals here.

 :-X

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Is this Stolen Valour
« Reply #37 on: January 11, 2019, 08:15:20 »
I'll add a short comment;  why not go see the School Warrant Officer?  I know one of the CFFTS School WOs;  he is aircrew who also wears white jump wings.  If it's a genuine "issue", he'd deal with it.
Everything happens for a reason.

Sometimes the reason is you're stupid and make bad decisions.