Author Topic: Special forces looks at recruiting off the street amid shifting demands  (Read 7422 times)

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Offline Good2Golf

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Units that “forget” to forward applications and generally place obstacles in front of soldiers who want to progress - or at least attempt - are doing a disservice to their troops and the nation. Such narrow minded thinking has to be trashed and - if it means a few heads roll - so be it.

Agree fully, Mr. Seggie!  COs of members who have attempted to apply to CANSOF yet whose efforts have been stymied by the unit, should be held to account.  Disservice is one thing, failing to support CoC direction and policy is another...and entirely unacceptable.

:2c:

Regards
G2G

Offline Simian Turner

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I know MR went into the OPS, but thought he started on patrol duties. A small number of members went into the OPS around that time. At least one is still serving as a sergeant.

I used to see my long-time acquaintance, MR, doing street traffic and arena patrol at the Corel Centre while I was an usher for events in 2000-2001, hardly a SWAT assignment.
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Offline mariomike

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I used to see my long-time acquaintance, MR, doing street traffic and arena patrol at the Corel Centre while I was an usher for events in 2000-2001, hardly a SWAT assignment.

Maybe it happens, but I have never heard of Direct Entry into Special Operations in Emergency Services.

Out of curiosity, I checked LAPD SWAT. Probably the most famous Tactical team in North America.

According to their website, you need to attain the rank of PO lll ( two chevrons ) to apply for SWAT. It takes at least three years as an LAPD Officer before eligibility for promotion to PO lll.

Not to say Direct Entry into CAF Special Operations is a good, or bad, idea.







« Last Edit: March 09, 2019, 21:17:59 by mariomike »

Offline sidemount

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Units that “forget” to forward applications and generally place obstacles in front of soldiers who want to progress - or at least attempt - are doing a disservice to their troops and the nation. Such narrow minded thinking has to be trashed and - if it means a few heads roll - so be it.
Absolutely!
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Offline Hamish Seggie

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Agree fully, Mr. Seggie!  COs of members who have attempted to apply to CANSOF yet whose efforts have been stymied by the unit, should be held to account.  Disservice is one thing, failing to support CoC direction and policy is another...and entirely unacceptable.

:2c:

Regards
G2G

And I do mean that heads should roll - figuratively- for the encouragement of the others. I know there’s a French saying that sums it up quite nearly.
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Offline daftandbarmy

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Maybe it happens, but I have never heard of Direct Entry into Special Operations in Emergency Services.

Out of curiosity, I checked LAPD SWAT. Probably the most famous Tactical team in North America.

According to their website, you need to attain the rank of PO lll ( two chevrons ) to apply for SWAT. It takes at least three years as an LAPD Officer before eligibility for promotion to PO lll.

Not to say Direct Entry into CAF Special Operations is a good, or bad, idea.

The cops wouldn't want the pay cut and the concurrently precipitous decline in their standard of living.
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Offline Jarnhamar

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What exactly are Emergency Services Special Operations?
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Online Remius

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They could create some sort of special forces operator entry program.  But you would need to staff it.  Back when I was a recruiter at a CFRC every second guy coming in wanted to be SF.  They just need to sift through the riff raff.

A unit like CSOR might be able to. The CJIRU or whatever they call themselves lately likely could also recruit off the street. 

They would likely need to modify their baseline training to include people off the street unless they send them on basic first.  Do sélection, then basic then SF training.

I know a good chunk of our Special Forces operators come from the combat arms but given that application is open to anyone in the CAF (clerks, cooks, stokers etc) then why not open it to the masses.  Just make sure you have the recruiting and training in structure to support it.  Right now we likely don’t.
Optio

Offline Ostrozac

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Units that “forget” to forward applications and generally place obstacles in front of soldiers who want to progress - or at least attempt - are doing a disservice to their troops and the nation. Such narrow minded thinking has to be trashed and - if it means a few heads roll - so be it.

You'll need more than a few heads rolling, you'll need more of a Stalinist purge, given the poor attention paid to administration of personnel throughout the CAF. I've seen some strangely incompetent stuff over the years that can't be explained simply by units hoarding soldiers, from lost promotion messages, to personnel being courseloaded through CFTPO but neglecting to inform the member in question, to a Career Manager issuing a backdated posting message (so the member was AWOL the instant it was printed, then had to request a 30 day extension of report date that was really a 20 day extension). All of this not to mention the hatchet job that has been done on some trades in the name of 'modernization' of career paths. We simply do not have a great organizational culture of personnel management and administration. And that's a shame -- our equipment and infrastructure situation is something we like to blame other departments for (TB and PWGSC) but messing around with our people? That's all on us.

Not that some units aren't hoarding soldiers to keep them away from CANSOF, they certainly are, and I've seen it, it's just that it is sometimes hard to separate deliberate malice from general incompetence.

Offline mariomike

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What exactly are Emergency Services Special Operations?

Special Operations are tasked with the provision of emergency services in unusual circumstances.

I've been retired for ten years. But, some I remember,

Toronto Police
Emergency Task Force ( ETF ) Tactical
Marine
Mounted
Dogs

Toronto Fire
Marine
HAZMAT
Heavy Rescue and Technical
High Rise
Air / Light

Toronto Paramedic
Emergency Task Force ( ETF ) Tactical.
Marine
Heavy Urban Search and Rescue ( HUSAR ) Building collapse, confined space, trench, high-angle.
CBRNE ( Chemical, Biological, Radioactive, Nuclear & Explosive )
Critical Care Unit ( CCTU )
Emergency Response Unit ( ERU )
Emergency Support / Multi-Patient ( ESU / MPU ). Where I spent most of my career.

These teams recruited via internal Job Calls.  There was no Direct Entry.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2019, 13:19:32 by mariomike »

Offline Brihard

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What exactly are Emergency Services Special Operations?
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

Offline CTD

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Special Operations are tasked with the provision of emergency services in unusual circumstances.

I've been retired for ten years. But, some I remember,

Toronto Police
Emergency Task Force ( ETF ) Tactical
Marine
Mounted
Dogs

Toronto Fire
Marine
HAZMAT
Heavy Rescue and Technical
High Rise
Air / Light

Toronto Paramedic
Emergency Task Force ( ETF ) Tactical.
Marine
Heavy Urban Search and Rescue ( HUSAR ) Building collapse, confined space, trench, high-angle.
CBRNE ( Chemical, Biological, Radioactive, Nuclear & Explosive )
Critical Care Unit ( CCTU )
Emergency Response Unit ( ERU )
Emergency Support / Multi-Patient ( ESU / MPU ). Where I spent most of my career.

These teams recruited via internal Job Calls.  There was no Direct Entry.

Were these primary tasks or secondary?

Offline Brihard

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Were these primary tasks or secondary?

It’ll vary on the organization and the task. Some stuff like tactical teams / SWAT are generally full time in larger services, part time in others depending on resources and call volume. A lot of the search and rescue / public order type stuff will be side jobs- drop normal duties and go when called. CBRN also varies though in most police services it’s full time. I’m aware of a former Ammo Tech who was hired directly into a full time CBRN unit after requisite basic police training and the field training period all rookies do. I’m aware of a couple similar instances for direct entry into tactical teams immediately after recruit field training. You can probably surmise the CAF background of those individuals, and it’s a sort of special and rare case.
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

Offline mariomike

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Were these primary tasks or secondary?

Only task.

After 1980, I always worked a bus or truck.

Being an MSE Op did not get me special consideration for Special Operations. But, it helped prepare me.

Special Ops paid a $1000.00 ( pensionable ) annual premium. Not sure what it is now.



« Last Edit: March 12, 2019, 10:01:55 by mariomike »

Offline NaturalCory

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If I’m wrong correct me but I think the USN SEALs recruit off the street as well.

This is correct and the thing is about special forces is you have guys that join for this crap.
Instead of making them wait years to get in, this will allow them try to get in right away...

Friend of mine that did 10 years w/ the seals & is just in the reserves now while he attends university said this is the correct approach because he hated his time until he joined up w/ the seals and he was able to do that right off the street

Offline Dimsum

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Friend of mine that did 10 years w/ the seals & is just in the reserves now while he attends university said this is the correct approach because he hated his time until he joined up w/ the seals and he was able to do that right off the street

Wait, I'm confused.  So your friend hated his (military?) time, but was able to join the SEALS off the street? 
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Reply:  "If."

Offline GK .Dundas

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So just out of curiosity did your friend ever tell you the colour of the boathouse?
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