Author Topic: Seneca College Pilot Program ( CEOTP )  (Read 373388 times)

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Offline Lockwire

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Re: Seneca College Pilot Program ( CEOTP )
« Reply #550 on: June 14, 2018, 17:18:24 »
I guess if I fail PLT training while attending CEOTP in Seneca I'll just transfer whatever credits I have to another CEOTP program that would line up with an officer trade (if they offer it to me as opposed to going back to NCM life) or... compete for UTPNCM? Failing PLT training should not have effect on the application since it's not the studies you fail but practical component.

Is there anyone here who has first face experience with CEOTP through Seneca? I have some admin question about going there... restricted posting? Keep PLD and principal residence in Victoria, full posting and house buying benefits in Ontario?...


thanks ;)

Offline winnipegoo7

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Re: Seneca College Pilot Program ( CEOTP )
« Reply #551 on: June 14, 2018, 22:15:50 »
I doubt that you could compete for utpncm as it is a program for ncms, not officers (you’d be a 2lt).

Maybe they would let you switch to another ceotp trade (there are only 3 or 4 this year) but that would mean you have to do the “real” coetp program which is university on your own time (ie. Evenings and weekends)

All the reg f ncms (that I know of - only 2 people) who went ceotp as pilots and failed got returned to their ncm trade.

I recommend asking the pso these questions.

And I highly recommend doing utpncm. Why not get a degree and 4 years away from mil life. 

Offline Ct155hawk

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Re: Seneca Pilot Program Split from Jeans & mass punishment
« Reply #552 on: December 11, 2018, 22:17:39 »
I dont get the RMC reputation my english is not perfect can you explain is in other words please.

Offline KRY3132

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Re: Seneca College Pilot Program ( CEOTP )
« Reply #553 on: December 14, 2018, 12:17:25 »
I just got selected for the CEOTP - Pilot program, and was wondering which Seneca campus the academic portion would take place at. Does anyone know??

Offline kratz

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Re: Seneca College Pilot Program ( CEOTP )
« Reply #554 on: December 14, 2018, 12:52:07 »
I just got selected for the CEOTP - Pilot program, and was wondering which Seneca campus the academic portion would take place at. Does anyone know??

Newnham campus
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Offline lafftar

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Re: CEOTP-The Seneca College Pilot Program FAQs
« Reply #555 on: December 21, 2018, 03:10:31 »
Given the interest and confusion on the Seneca program in the RMC Jeans Debacle thread, I figured I'd summarize what I know over here.

Fair warning, I'm a 1st Year, and a 2Lt. My knowledge, experience, and seniority are all heavily limited.

  • What is the Seneca Program?

    The Seneca Program, also at various times known as the CEOTP-Pilot or AEAD (air environment affiliated degree) program is a 4 year combined school and flying program, designed to produce winged, degreed captains in 4 years vs. the normal 7. It combines 5 semesters of dumbed-down engineering courses with 3 Phases of flight training (delivered by the RCAF). It operates in parallel to the civilian FPR program at Seneca for the first year -classes are mixed civilian and military- but diverges after that point.

  • Entry into the Seneca Program:

    Entry into the program requires a high school degree, minimum 65% across the board. There are specific courses that you must have taken in high school; once you remind a recruiter of the program's existence, they should be able to look them up. Passing the CFAT and ACS is required, and exempts you from writing the Seneca entrance exam.

  • Year 1:

    This program (ideally) begins in January of the year you enroll, and finishes in December 4 years later. Your first year, you will do basic training and be commissioned as a 2Lt, then proceed on Phase I flight training in Portage in the summer. After completion of Ph I, you'll be posted to Toronto and start school in September with all the civilian students. Any spare time (ie if you do basic earlier) you will be sent on OJT, preferably near where you live.

    When you get to Toronto, you'll be strongly encouraged to live in residence. Res is expensive, and there is not a proper cafeteria, but the 2Lt. pay covers it quite nicely; books and tuition are paid by the military. Seneca insists that the Aviation program be uniformed to maintain a professional appearance. For military, this means 3Bs Monday and Tuesday, and flight suits the other 3 days (it was originally 3Bs 4 days a week, but people kept thinking we were bus drivers).

    This program is pre-planned, there are no electives. Classes will include Calculus, Statics, Chemistry, and a basic French course. The quality of instruction is considerably lower than a proper university, and you will pass half your courses despite your profs, not because of them. Keep in mind, a pass in this program is 65%. About 1/3rd of the civilians will fail to meet this and go home; traditionally no military students fail.

    Another perk of the Seneca program (the best perk for me right now) is sim time. There is a B200 King Air simulator at the college, in the basement. It's a fixed-base, surround screen setup with a fully modeled cockpit. You will have free access to this throughout your time at the school (indeed, you will be required to do at least 1 hour per week), and you will also get 1 hour instruction a month from John and Adam, a pair of (downright excellent) Transat pilots. Conveniently, the King Air flies at effectively the same speeds as the Harvard, so it's fantastic practice. Seneca students start Ph II with 50 sim hours, which is huge when you've only got 20 hours from Ph I. You'll also have at least a foundation in IFR, radio chaos, terrible crosswinds, and just general "flying twice as fast"

  • Year 2:

    Year 2 begins with the winter semester, which builds on the material learned in the Fall. It's more difficult, but not substantially more so. This will get you to April, at which point the civvies head to Peterborough to fly Cessnas, and you go to Moose Jaw for Phase II. Before you can do Ph II, you need to complete AMT (folks who started basic before January already had time for this). This is a 2 day course in Winnipeg, and includes cheesy videos of things burning, sensory illusions, and fun with hypoxia. This marks the end of what I'm qualified to comment on in detail right now. After AMT, Phase II starts in June, and runs till February.

  • Year 3:

    At the beginning of Year 3, you'll be completing Ph II in Moose Jaw. At the end of Phase II, students are streamed 3 ways: Jets, Helo, and Multi. Before Phase III, everyone has to complete Land Survival and Sea Survival. All students then proceed on Ph III; Jets remain in Moose Jaw, Helo and Multi return to Portage. The Multi and Jets Ph IIIs are shorter (and ironically the jets one doesn't involve jets), while the Helo one is quite long. Upon completing your Ph III, you'll get your wings. Depending on timings, there may be time for follow-on courses (ie the Hawk conversion course), but you need to be done by December, for return to Seneca.

  • Year 4:

    It's now Year 4 (2022 if you start in 2019), and you're all reunited at Seneca in January, ready to resume academics. The civs are nowhere to be found (they're still in Peterborough), and the classes are less demanding, relatively, than 1st year. By all accounts from the departing senior course, it's a victory lap. Year 4 is made of 3 semesters, done back-to-back-to-back. At the end of these 3 semesters, it is December, and you're graduating, ready to proceed to operational flying. 4 years for a degree and wings.

  • Outcomes:

    This has to be one of the most heavily speculated things about the Seneca program: will it put a damper on your career advancement? The honest answer is "check back in a decade". Seneca graduates have just reached operational flying in the past two years, so there's no data. We're told that the program grants a bachelor's degree, and so it won't hold us back, but no-one knows. Give it 20 years, and we'll see if any graduates have made LCol.

    Certainly, it doesn't have SLT integrated with it. If you're after bilingualism, you'll have to do SLT after you're operational, or find some other means of exposure.

    The one outcome we do know, however, is Phase II performance. The majority of the preceding courses got the stream they wanted, and they generally outscored their peers. I can't say what drives that, but I'd wager the sim is instrumental.

This is just a rough summary of the program, E&OE. I'll try and update it as I see more.

This is just amazing man, thanks for detailing it like this. This really should be pinned, it answers all the questions I had...so naturally, I have followups:
  • Do I have to live on residence? You say 'strongly encouraged', do I have any reasonable choice in the matter?
  • How much time is spent on lectures/studies per day/week? Is there sufficient free time for frivolous interests, like, say...a girlfriend? Or more responsibly: Programming elective classes/hackathons/Part time startup work.
  • For the Jet/Multi/Heli streams, what % scores or GPA points do you need for each stream?

Thanks again.

Offline MKW

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Re: CEOTP-The Seneca College Pilot Program FAQs
« Reply #556 on: February 12, 2019, 22:23:45 »
This is just amazing man, thanks for detailing it like this. This really should be pinned, it answers all the questions I had...so naturally, I have followups:
  • Do I have to live on residence? You say 'strongly encouraged', do I have any reasonable choice in the matter?
  • How much time is spent on lectures/studies per day/week? Is there sufficient free time for frivolous interests, like, say...a girlfriend? Or more responsibly: Programming elective classes/hackathons/Part time startup work.
  • For the Jet/Multi/Heli streams, what % scores or GPA points do you need for each stream?

Thanks again.

1. You have a choice, they will not order you to live in residence. I lived off residence in my first year.

2. Depends on the person but personally I had quite a bit of extra time. Less than 20 hours of classes per week, so even if you need an hour of personal study each (a stretch in my opinion) it's still a 40 hour week.

3. Your Seneca marks are not considered at all in Jet-Multi-Helo. Your Phase II performance determines that alone. All you need is a pass in Seneca.