Author Topic: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)  (Read 217624 times)

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Offline Bzzliteyr

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #450 on: April 26, 2018, 15:04:59 »
I'm not quite sure I see the reason for wearing the uniform to the gym.

Why can't you just wear your gym clothes to the gym, shower then change into your uniform?

My question is, I am PRes and I sometimes want to time my commute so that I go to the public gym first and then to the armoury.

Would it be wrong to wear my Cadpat and Headdress into the gym, change and lock my uniform in a locker for an hour of exercise, complete my exercise and change back into uniform and continue with commute?
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Offline Remius

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #451 on: April 26, 2018, 15:15:39 »
Just put your gym clothes on and stuff your uniform in your issued day pack.   Make sure you are wearing a course t-shirt with dog tags out.  You'll still achieve letting everyone know you are in the military without having to wear your uniform.  No shaving required either until you report in.

 ;D

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Offline KMS081991

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #452 on: April 26, 2018, 15:47:46 »
I'm not quite sure I see the reason for wearing the uniform to the gym.

Why can't you just wear your gym clothes to the gym, shower then change into your uniform?

Well since the gym is along the way to the armoury, I thought it would be advantageous to just not carry so many different clothing articles around. I would be already in my uniform, change to my civilian gym clothes and work out, then change back into my uniform and head toward the armoury.

I understand your point as well.

Offline Bzzliteyr

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #453 on: April 26, 2018, 16:02:59 »
Well since the gym is along the way to the armoury, I thought it would be advantageous to just not carry so many different clothing articles around. I would be already in my uniform, change to my civilian gym clothes and work out, then change back into my uniform and head toward the armoury.

I understand your point as well.

I do that exact thing every morning. You're not carrying anything more if you head to the gym in your gym outfit, then change.

From the dress regs (http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dhh-dhp/pub/ins-265/index-eng.asp):

"19. “On duty”. As a general rule, for purposes of dress and appearance, a member is considered to be on duty:
a. when actively engaged in operations, training or administrative duties, either in accordance with specific orders or in accordance with established military routine or practice;
b. when attending a course or administrative function, either in accordance with specific orders or established routine or practice;
c. when participating in or attending any sport, recreational, social or other activity where military authorities require her/him to be there; or
d. when he/she is at a specific place, or doing a specific act, because of a military order.

37.Reserve Force (Class C excluded). Members of the Reserve Force shall not wear a uniform except when:
a.on duty, or proceeding to or from their place of duty;
b.attending a military function or ceremony at which the wearing of uniform is appropriate.
38.Proceeding to or from Place of Duty. Commanding Officers may order members of the Regular and Reserve Force to wear uniforms when proceeding to and from their place of duty where it is considered appropriate to do so in the circumstances, having regard to the custom and practice of the CAF."

I hope that helps with your decision.
Adsum

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Offline NFLD Sapper

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #454 on: April 26, 2018, 16:07:41 »
OP sounds like a Class A member so I would suggest that they do not wear the uniform prior to going to the gym as they are not really considered "on-duty" until they sign the pay sheet at the armoury.

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Offline Bzzliteyr

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #455 on: April 26, 2018, 16:15:04 »
OP sounds like a Class A member so I would suggest that they do not wear the uniform prior to going to the gym as they are not really considered "on-duty" until they sign the pay sheet at the armoury.



I would consider only the travel from the gym to the unit as "proceeding to or from their place of duty".
Adsum

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Offline Chief Engineer

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #456 on: April 26, 2018, 16:24:13 »
Well since the gym is along the way to the armoury, I thought it would be advantageous to just not carry so many different clothing articles around. I would be already in my uniform, change to my civilian gym clothes and work out, then change back into my uniform and head toward the armoury.

I understand your point as well.

Wear your uniform to the gym and don't worry about it. There's nothing wrong with that at all.
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All opinions stated are not official policy of the CF and of a private individual

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Offline KMS081991

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #457 on: April 27, 2018, 00:38:14 »
To close my issue, I decided if I do go to the gym, that I would not change into uniform until I was about to leave the gym and was enroute to the unit.

Thank you all for the assistance.

Offline ACE_Engineer

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #458 on: November 10, 2018, 15:30:42 »
I have two (pre-emptive) questions in the same vein.

1. As a part-time reservist with a full-time civilian job, would it be permissible for me, as part of my civilian job, to wear my uniform when:
a) Visiting a Canadian Forces base
b) Meeting with military personnel
c) Meeting with government officials

2. Is it permissible for me to add my military rank to my civilian job signature, for example,
   2nd Lieutenant ABCD, PEng, PMP
   Systems Engineer
   XYZ Corporation

Thank you

Offline PuckChaser

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #459 on: November 10, 2018, 15:47:24 »
If you're not on the clock or representing the CAF, it's totally inappropriate for you to do either of those things. Keep your civilian job separate from the CAF.

Offline comfortablynumb

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #460 on: November 10, 2018, 15:49:51 »
I have two (pre-emptive) questions in the same vein.

1. As a part-time reservist with a full-time civilian job, would it be permissible for me, as part of my civilian job, to wear my uniform when:
a) Visiting a Canadian Forces base
b) Meeting with military personnel
c) Meeting with government officials

2. Is it permissible for me to add my military rank to my civilian job signature, for example,
   2nd Lieutenant ABCD, PEng, PMP
   Systems Engineer
   XYZ Corporation

Thank you

1. Are you on duty, going to clothing stores etc? If not, no!

2. I mean I’ve seen retired LCol (Retired) have that on their business card or profile, but no not in the way you seem to propose using it.

Also if I saw someone put on their civilian signature block that they were a 2Lt, I’d fall out of my chair laughing.

Hope that helps!

Offline JesseWZ

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #461 on: November 10, 2018, 15:50:20 »
I have two (pre-emptive) questions in the same vein.

1. As a part-time reservist with a full-time civilian job, would it be permissible for me, as part of my civilian job, to wear my uniform when:
a) Visiting a Canadian Forces base
b) Meeting with military personnel
c) Meeting with government officials

2. Is it permissible for me to add my military rank to my civilian job signature, for example,
   2nd Lieutenant ABCD, PEng, PMP
   Systems Engineer
   XYZ Corporation

Thank you

Oh God, please don't.

If you're not on the clock or representing the CAF, it's totally inappropriate for you to do either of those things. Keep your civilian job separate from the CAF.

Also, if you don a uniform as part of your civilian job, in order to meet with government officials or visit a base - but you are actually representing the private sector, you're now in a pretty big conflict of interest. That's the kind of thing that can get contracts scuttled. You can either represent the CAF or your employer... not both.

What he said. Adding 2Lt will not add any gravitas to your signature block, and if someone with some TI and experience sees that, not only are you going to be in some doo-doo, you're also going to be laughed at.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2018, 15:55:33 by JesseWZ »
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Offline ACE_Engineer

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #462 on: November 10, 2018, 15:53:29 »
Welp, good thing I asked then! Don't want to be laughingstock, or, more importantly, misrepresent the CAF.
I don't quite get why that would be funny, though. I mean, you can write "Dr." on your signature without issue.

Offline comfortablynumb

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #463 on: November 10, 2018, 15:58:53 »
Dr. and 2Lt are a far cry from each other.

Once you get some time in, you will realize why no one cares if you are a 2Lt.

Honestly, if you are a PEng, PMP Systems Eng I don't think need to inflate that anymore. Even if it were permitted, adding your very junior officer rank would only detract from your education and credentials.

Offline JesseWZ

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #464 on: November 10, 2018, 16:03:58 »
Welp, good thing I asked then! Don't want to be laughingstock, or, more importantly, misrepresent the CAF.
I don't quite get why that would be funny, though. I mean, you can write "Dr." on your signature without issue.

It's funny because Second Lieutenants are (usually) brand new officers with very little experience and training. It's like writing "bachelors student" on a business card as an official title.
I get being new and being proud of your position and your choice to serve. Its an honorable profession, but don't let your exuberance cloud your judgement or stain the reputation of the CF. Your rank should really only ever be used when you're doing something on behalf of the CF.

Adding your rank to your signature block or a business card also puts you in an awkward position regarding who you represent. Is your business card representing your company or the CF? If it's your company, then you are misrepresenting yourself by adding your rank.

My business cards for work have my rank on them - as I am representing my unit and the CF when I hand them out.

When I introduce myself to anyone outside of work (and even 95% of the people within my scope of work) I use my first name.

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Offline PuckChaser

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #465 on: November 10, 2018, 16:46:54 »
Welp, good thing I asked then! Don't want to be laughingstock, or, more importantly, misrepresent the CAF.
I don't quite get why that would be funny, though. I mean, you can write "Dr." on your signature without issue.

That's because Dr. is an official recognized title that relates to an official post-nominal. Should you serve 12 years in the CAF and be awarded your Canadian Forces Decoration, you legimately can have "CD" after your name in your signature block at work and on your business cards in both the civilian and military world.

Here's a list in case you want to badge hunt: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_post-nominal_letters_in_Canada

Offline FJAG

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #466 on: November 10, 2018, 17:01:19 »
I have two (pre-emptive) questions in the same vein.

1. As a part-time reservist with a full-time civilian job, would it be permissible for me, as part of my civilian job, to wear my uniform when: . . .
a) Visiting a Canadian Forces base
. . .

Here's one more point that you should be aware of. The moment that you put on the uniform, regardless of where you are or whether you're on duty or not, you become subject to the Code of Service Discipline by virtue of s 60(1)(c)(ii) of the National Defence Act. Being on a defence establishment (whether in uniform or not) also makes you subject to the CSD by virtue of s 60(1)(c)(viii).

Quote
60 (1) The following persons are subject to the Code of Service Discipline:
. . .
(c) an officer or non-commissioned member of the reserve force when the officer or non-commissioned member is
. . .
(ii) in uniform
. . .
(viii) in or on any vessel, vehicle or aircraft of the Canadian Forces or in or on any defence establishment or work for defence,
. . .

https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/n-5/page-8.html#h-41

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Offline mariomike

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #467 on: November 10, 2018, 17:20:29 »
I mean, you can write "Dr." on your signature without issue.

More discussion here,

Proper Use of Post-Nominals 
https://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=113923.0

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #468 on: November 10, 2018, 17:26:32 »
I have two (pre-emptive) questions in the same vein.

1. As a part-time reservist with a full-time civilian job, would it be permissible for me, as part of my civilian job, to wear my uniform when:
a) Visiting a Canadian Forces base
b) Meeting with military personnel
c) Meeting with government officials


Have a read of post #453 on this page, a few up from yours...
Everything happens for a reason.

Sometimes the reason is you're stupid and make bad decisions.

Offline ACE_Engineer

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #469 on: November 10, 2018, 23:27:00 »
Thank you for the information, ladies and gentlemen. Obviously, I'm getting ahead of myself since I'm only just going through the recruitment process. If I do make it (hopefully), I will have to reign in my pride at being a member of the CAF, and not add my military credentials on my civilian signatures or business cards.

Offline Brihard

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #470 on: November 10, 2018, 23:57:56 »
General rule of thumb in a military career, when in doubt, ask yourself “would doing this thing that I’m considering doing make me ‘that guy’?” If you’re gonna do something that would be a hallmark move of ‘that guy’, generally it’s best to refrain from being ‘that guy’.
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Offline dapaterson

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #471 on: November 10, 2018, 23:59:34 »
Good judgement comes from experience.

Experience comes from bad judgement.
This posting made in accordance with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, section 2(b):
Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms: freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication
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Offline Calvillo

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #472 on: April 16, 2019, 12:47:00 »
The Dress Instructions say:

Quote
37. Reserve Force (Class C excluded). Members of the Reserve Force shall not wear a uniform except when:
a. on duty, or proceeding to or from their place of duty;
b. attending a military function or ceremony at which the wearing of uniform is appropriate.

With that, can a Reservist not go to a photo studio to have her photograph in uniform taken for personal use?

Offline mariomike

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #473 on: April 16, 2019, 12:57:42 »
The Dress Instructions say:

With that, can a Reservist not go to a photo studio to have her photograph in uniform taken for personal use?

As always, your Chain of Command is your most trusted source of information.

You may wish to carry your uniform in a garment bag to and from home and the photo studio.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 13:05:16 by mariomike »

Offline comfortablynumb

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Re: Wearing Uniform in Public (merged)
« Reply #474 on: April 16, 2019, 13:08:56 »
The Dress Instructions say:

With that, can a Reservist not go to a photo studio to have her photograph in uniform taken for personal use?

...what kind of "personal use" ?