Author Topic: All things Health Care Admin/HCA (merged)  (Read 55687 times)

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Offline Rider Pride

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #50 on: September 03, 2012, 11:37:21 »
There are a couple HCAs on the boards to provide more details.

HCAs are not the "Log O" of the medical branch. That role is filled by Pharmacy Officers AKA pharmacists.

Health Care Admintration Officers are what the name suggests. They are the non-clinician entity which assist in the provision of health care by being the experts in areas other than those involving direct patient contact. HCAs are most often employed as platoon commanders, tng officers, clinic managers, and other staff officer roles.

Like I said in the opening, there are HCAs on the boards (MedCorps being the most experienced)who can answer more detailed questions.
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Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #51 on: September 03, 2012, 12:51:33 »
The medical world (actually everything in the military) runs on paper (or its present-day digital equivalent).  In the medical branch, most of that paper shuffling is done by HCAs.  It is expected that, because of their education, training and experience, they become the experts.  And to be brutally honest, the doctors often don't want to soil their hands with the mundane (even if you don't discount the fact that it is not cost effective to have clinicians do those tasks).  Newly minted HCAs (especially if they don't come into the branch the more traditional, old-fashioned way of CFR and OT) are the SLJOs of the CFMS.

MedCorps will probably be along to provide a more up-to-date tale of opportunities for HCAs.  However, during my time (I am retired from the CF) as an HCA, I had a number of interesting and challenging jobs that involved command, staff, administrative and financial tasks (and one job that overlapped into the logistics world) .  Did some of this mirror what Log Os do?  Yes, but it could be said the same about any officer of any classification (especially in field force units).

You may find that your education and work experience (especially if it is, as it appears, to be very HR centric) will not be directly relatable to HR functions in the CF as most of those processes are centrally done in a very, very large organization.

Yes, all HCAs start out as Lieutenants.  It's not a big deal, there are no Second Lieutenants in the (Reg Force) CFMS.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2012, 12:56:48 by Blackadder1916 »
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seawolf

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #52 on: September 03, 2012, 16:19:01 »
Thanks for the help and tips guys.

immediate promotion to Lt is a decent bonus/advantage of the trade. According to the pay scale on forces.ca that's about $300/month right away. Nothing to shake a stick at.

Offline HCA123

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #53 on: September 03, 2012, 16:33:17 »
During the recruiting process I too wrestled with going LOG O vs HCA. At the end of the day I ended up going HCA and am happy I did given my interests. If you have specific questions, feel free to drop me a PM, I've done a little bit of everything over the last few years (Field Ambulance, Clinic, overseas and now a posting to the US).

Offline MedCorps

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #54 on: September 03, 2012, 16:57:22 »
Just to fill out the above comments a little.

HCAs exist in the Regular Force from the rank of Lt to Major.  At the rank of Major they are eligible to complete for Voluntary Occupational Transfer to the Health Services Operations (HSO) Officer trade.  In fact, most of the HSOs are ex-HCAs. 

HCAs work in four main environments: 

1) Clinics
2) Field Units
3) Training Establishments 
4) HQ Staffs

In clinics they are the experts in health care administration as their name would imply. This includes working in junior leadership positions and dealing with human resources, business planning, finance, civilian labour relations, infrastructure, medical records, etc.

In field units (field ambulances / the Field Hospital) they often work as platoon commanders, company 2ICs, occasionally company commanders, operations officer, adjutant, admission & discharge officer, liaison officers,  and command post watch officers. They lead the field force at the platoon and company level.

In the Training Establishments they work as instructors teaching most of the topics above, as standards officers, and as Training Establishment key staff such as the service support officer, operations officer, adjutant, and company 2ICs. 

On HQ staffs they work in the field of medical regulating, operations and planning, research, administration & finance, desk officers, project officers, executive assistants / staff officers to Directors / Aide de Camp, and as general staff officers in all areas.

Lots of people around here with HCA experience / have worked with HCAs.  It is an interesting field, much different than the Log O occupation, IMHO.

Cheers,

MC

Offline Dimsum

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #55 on: September 03, 2012, 20:56:50 »
Just for curiosity's sake, what are the civilian prospects for HCAs?  Is there a civilian equivalent (bearing in mind that my medical knowledge extends to pretty much House Season 1)?

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Offline MedCorps

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #56 on: September 03, 2012, 21:12:16 »
There are a number of civilian HCA positions in civilian hospitals / the civilian health care system. They range from people working in hospital billing, records, accreditation, human resources, marketing / donor coordination, emergency management, infrastructure, planning, quality improvement departments to those who are managers, VPs and CEOs.  Most have a Master in Health Administration (MHA) or an MBA with a health focus. Many also have the Certified Health Executive (CHE) designation that is offered by the Canadian College of Health Leaders.   

Some work in NGO / IGOs to keep the organization running. 

Some work in the civilian government at places like Health Canada or the Public Health Agency of Canada. Some work in the Provincial health care offices, some work in public health units or other health organizations like Community Care Access Centres or the Canadian Mental Health Association doing things like administration, policy, project management, team leaders, research, etc, etc.

MC

seawolf

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #57 on: September 04, 2012, 00:31:02 »
Man,

So much help! Thanks.

Seems like a really interesting trade. Don't know why I didn't look into it more before a week or so ago. Hopefully my medical file ever comes back from the RMO so I can interview for HCA and add it to my application along with LogO which is already there.

- Mike

seawolf

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #58 on: September 24, 2012, 20:51:22 »
Have an update interview next Tuesday to add HCA to my file along with LogO. I was merited for LogO last week.

Thanks for all the info.

seawolf

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #59 on: January 10, 2013, 23:14:11 »
Never ended up having my interview for HCA back in Sept, due to trade closing and unsure if it would re-open.


Well its open now for DEO and I have an interview on Monday.

Thanks again for all the info. Any final tidbits or facts i should bring up about HCA to wow the MCC?


One question - as an HCA - and say acting as a platoon commander in a field unit - are you commanding all the doctors and nurses, medtechs, etc? Who works under HCA's?

Offline MedCorps

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #60 on: January 10, 2013, 23:59:53 »
If you are the Pl Comd  / Coy Comd / Clinic CO you command whoever is placed under your command. Command is command. At the Platoon level this is mostly Med Techs and the odd Physician Assistant as your Platoon WO. Sometimes it might also have a Medical Officer in the mix.  Sometimes it is even the odd person from outside the Health Service like MSE Ops, RMS Clk, one of the various EME Techs, Supply Techs, Sig Ops (especially in the place like the Field Hospital).

For instance, if you were in a (doctrinal) Advanced Surgical Centre (ASC) as the Senior Admissions and Discharge Officer (Officer in Charge of the ASC HQ Section) as a Captain you would have a Jr HCA (who might be the same rank as you), a Sgt Med Tech, RMS Clk x 2, Med Tech x 2, and Sig Ops x2 working for you. 

As you move up, if you become a Company Commander or a Clinic CO, you could be in change of a whole range of CF Medical Service Officers (MO/NO/Pharm O/Physio Therapy O/Social Work O and NCMs, as well as civilian public servants and contractors under your command. 

Good luck on the interview. 

MC

seawolf

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #61 on: January 11, 2013, 00:30:05 »
Thanks for the quick response.

Exactly what I needed!

And thank you.

seawolf

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #62 on: January 14, 2013, 14:02:23 »
Had the interview this morning for HCA. Went great and I am merit listed.

Thanks for the help.

Mike

seawolf

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #63 on: January 20, 2013, 22:37:41 »
New question:

As an HCA does it really matter what colour your uniform is? I assume Air force HCA's are on army bases and Army HCA's are stationed to Navy bases, etc??

Do all HCA's do CAP or whatever it is called now?

Thanks again,

Mike

Offline MedCorps

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #64 on: January 20, 2013, 22:47:47 »
Uniform does not matter. It is really purple and you can go anywhere with any uniform. 

HCA's no longer do the CAP.  Sadly. 

MC


seawolf

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #65 on: January 21, 2013, 19:20:13 »
Thanks again MC!

Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #66 on: January 22, 2013, 16:59:27 »
. . . . .

HCA's no longer do the CAP.  Sadly. 


How does the occupation view itself today?

In years (long?) past the generation of HCAs (and their previous iterations) was primarily from within the CF (or the RCN, the Cdn Army and, to a lesser extent, the RCAF when they were separate services).  Almost everyone brought previous military or naval experience to the table whether they were CFR (at one time the main HCA generation program), OT (mostly from older and sometimes slightly broken combat arms types), UTPM or, if going back to separate service days, OCTP (in the old Cdn Army this was the primary commissioning plan for HCAs).  While these individuals had varying degrees of success (from the average to the outstanding) in their previous occupations they usually knew how the system worked outside the sometimes rather narrow viewpoint of the medical world and it was this knowledge that made them important.

I am well aware that an undergraduate degreed officer corps is now the goal, but (mainly from viewing topics on this site) I've gained the impression that HCA generation is these days focused more on acquiring individuals who have formal post-secondary education and that previous military experience at the officer or Snr NCO level is of secondary importance or maybe not even a consideration.

Am I off the mark here? Has the HCA of old, the unwashed professional soldier of the CFMS been replaced by a theory laden but inexperienced business graduate?  Is there adequate development of newly minted officers such that the branch can forego the already proven knowledge and skill base of CFRs and OTs?  I think back to my first posting as an HCA MAO-HCA.  It was an AIRCOM base hospital, busy enough for its size and had the added challenge of an operational tasking (MAJAID).  Like most BHosps of the time, there wasn't great depth of military experience among the majority of officers (primarily doctors and nurses).  As the sole HCA in the unit, I was usually the one that was expected to input the "military flavour" to our operation.  I was not unique among my MAO/HCA coursemates.  A lot of them also went to (sole HCA) base or RSS postings, some even went directly into staff postions.  Of course they (we) all had years of military experience (in the ranks and/or another officer classification) behind us.
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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #67 on: January 22, 2013, 17:15:58 »
Has the HCA of old, the unwashed professional soldier of the CFMS been replaced by a theory laden but inexperienced business graduate?

Yes

Quote
Is there adequate development of newly minted officers such that the branch can forego the already proven knowledge and skill base of CFRs and OTs?

No

Quote
I think back to my first posting as an HCA MAO-HCA.  It was an AIRCOM base hospital, busy enough for its size and had the added challenge of an operational tasking (MAJAID).  Like most BHosps of the time, there wasn't great depth of military experience among the majority of officers (primarily doctors and nurses).  As the sole HCA in the unit, I was usually the one that was expected to input the "military flavour" to our operation.  I was not unique among my MAO/HCA coursemates.  A lot of them also went to (sole HCA) base or RSS postings, some even went directly into staff postions.  Of course they (we) all had years of military experience (in the ranks and/or another officer classification) behind us.

Let me relate and example from 2006: in my unit we had 8 HCAs. One OT, no CFR, and 7 degreed officers - none of whom had commerce or admin as their area of study. Of the lot, I would say the OT was probably the best all round officer and HCA.
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Offline MedCorps

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Re: RegF HCA - The LogO of the Medical Branch?
« Reply #68 on: January 22, 2013, 18:17:03 »
Blackadder,

Because of the movement afoot to move toward the "civilian standard" (Accreditation Canada) within garrison clinics (the hospital are essentially gone) there has been pressure to "professionalize" the HCA MOS to bring it in line with civilian health care administrators. This is partially our own doing and partially a response to reports from the the Auditor General and Chief of Review Services. 

This has resulted in trying to recruit officers who have degrees in commerce, business, finance, health care management, industrial relations, etc, etc. For a while it was "any degree"... now it is much more selective for better or worse.  They are also expected as part of their basic HCA training to do a civilian health care management certificate (currently offered by the Canadian Healthcare Association as contracted training) and as they move toward the rank of Major and clinic command gain certification as a health care executive (CHE) with the Canadian College of Health Leaders (CCHL). 

See here: http://www.cchl-ccls.ca/default1.asp and here: http://www.cchl-ccls.ca/default_certification.asp?active_page_id=1727 to get a feel for these things. 

This has resulting in a new batch of young, bright, officers who are academically (theory) trained.  In the last batch of HCAs we even had 2-3 subalterns with MBAs.  It leaves a real gap in the skills we used to get with OT / UTPNCM / CFR / SCP, etc especially on the field side of the house where they have no experience in this area other then what they have gained via the CF training system.  HCAs are still being used as Platoon Commanders / Operations Officers / Adjutants / etc in field units  and other such field tasks including RSS Officers.  This has posed a bit of a challenge to say the least.

For FY 12/13 the target blend was 67% Direct Entry Officers, 20% Occupational Transfers - Officers, and 23% UTPNCM.  CFR is almost unheard of now in the CFMS/CFDS.  We have a few SCP but they are far and few between and there does not seem to be a stomach for this commissioning plan.

There are some things being done to try and sort this out (despite the fact that attending Common Army Phase - CAP would sort out some of these problems).  This has included a large revision of the Basic HCA Course and the replacement of the Basic Field Health Services Course with the Health Services Operations and Staff Officer Course which will be happening in near future it is rumoured.  I am still not sure it will fix all the problems, but it is a step in the right direction.

MC

Offline medic45

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Reserve HCA Course Stream
« Reply #69 on: January 05, 2015, 13:36:26 »
Hello,

Is anyone able to list the current course progression for reserve HCA as of summer 2015?  I have been in touch with a recruiter but there seems to be a bit of confusion.  Besides second language training, what is the training delta between regular and reserve HCA officers?  Thanks.

Offline GINge!

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Re: Reserve HCA Course Stream
« Reply #70 on: February 24, 2015, 19:07:52 »
Best bet is to contact your local reserve Fd Amb and speak to a HCA there who has recently gone through trg.

My info is a few years old, so may be out of date. PRes HCA had to do Common Army Phase (CAP) in Gagetown. I thought this was excellent, and regularly resulted in PRes HCA with a better grasp of leadership and mil skills than their RegF counterparts who were exempt CAP. There are many reg F HCA who would not be in uniform today if they had to complete CAP...but it was recognized as a double standard for the reservists, so I'm not sure if it is still a requirement.

Reg F will also do Basic HCA (not sure if PRes do this, but I can find out if you are still interested). Then they will do the newish Health Services Operations Staff Officer Course (HSOSOC). Not to be confused with the similarly named Health Services Operations Course, which is for HSO Maj.

There are no specific gateway trg quals between HCA Lt - Maj, though officers are encouraged to take AJOS, ATOC, and AOC, though the mosid only gets a couple seats a year on that course.
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Offline MedCorps

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Re: Reserve HCA Course Stream
« Reply #71 on: February 24, 2015, 20:20:02 »
Res F HCA's also do not complete the certificate in Health Services Management that is currently offered to the Reg F HCA's by the Canadian Hospital Association as part of their Developmental Period 1.

The best things to do, as mentioned, is call the local Res Fd Amb and ask to speak with an HCA. 

Good luck,

MC

Offline medic45

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Re: Reserve HCA Course Stream
« Reply #72 on: February 27, 2015, 22:17:05 »
Thanks. So far looking like CAP is not required.

Offline GINge!

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Re: Reserve HCA Course Stream
« Reply #73 on: March 09, 2015, 18:55:54 »
You're correct  - CAP was dropped a couple years ago. You will have to do the BHCA and HSOSOC. They used to run them back to back in the summer for reservists.

Reg F HCA are expected (but not mandated) to complete AJOSQ and ATOC. Some are selected for AOC, some for AMEDD (USA). There really isn't a lot of mandatory trg for HCA until they are promoted Maj and merit listed for O/T to HSO, after which they complete the HSO course in Borden.

There are still opportunities for deployment, with HCA Capt in Kuwait and Sierra Leone,  those its nowhere near the op temp of the Afg days.
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Health Care Administer (HCA)- ROTP or DEO or Education
« Reply #74 on: June 17, 2015, 19:55:07 »
Hi, new to the blog but have read a considerable amount regarding different entry plans but have yet to see my situation. I'm not naive to think my situation is specifically unique however it may be slightly different then others.

Here it goes:

I have recently applied to the CAF and have been processed rather quickly;however, there is a slight speed bump that I am looking to get over. The trades I applied for are: IntO(DEO), HCA(ROTP), Pilot (DEO) ( in that order).

I was told IntO had completed it's hiring process already for this upcoming year 2015 and would not open any further positions until January of 2016. This lead my file to get processed under my second option HCA (ROTP). This process has moved very quickly and it has made me rethink my entire status on joining through ROTP.

I am a recent graduate of Bishop's University where I received a BA History/Religion. I also am currently attending the University of Victoria in an attempt to finish a second degree BA Sociology. I am really interested in joining the CAF (for a multitude of reason that I don't really want to get into here) however; I would like to know if ROTP i(e: doing another 4 years of university) is really the best way of joining as an HCA. I understand that there are programs such as: Health Care Administration Post Graduate Certificates that are offered throughout different institutions in Canada. That are 2-3 year programs. Would one of these certificates supplement the lack of a Health Care Degree as it covers all the administrative and HR requirements. If someone could shine some light on this subject for me it would be a great help as my offer for ROTP should be in within the next few days and I would like to make the best decision while having all the intel.  Thanks in advance.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2015, 11:37:48 by Master Corporal Steven »