Author Topic: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old  (Read 2538 times)

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Offline RN PRN

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Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« on: February 02, 2005, 19:19:09 »
I am not posting this as a jab against the US but simply because a friend of mine in the US Department of State sent it to me this morning.

I found it interesting

Subject: Breaking my SPAM rule...


...for this, because it came across my screen this morning.  Consider this
realism, not raining on parades.  Nor full agreement with the analogy.

Yrs.

Mike

U.S. Encouraged by Vietnam Vote : Officials Cite 83% Turnout Despite
Vietcong Terror

by Peter Grose, Special to the New York Times (9/4/1967: p. 2)

WASHINGTON, Sept. 3-- United States officials were surprised and heartened
today at the size of turnout in South Vietnam's presidential election
despite a Vietcong terrorist campaign to disrupt the voting.

According to reports from Saigon, 83 per cent of the 5.85 million
registered voters cast their ballots yesterday. Many of them risked
reprisals threatened by the Vietcong.

The size of the popular vote and the inability of the Vietcong to destroy
the election machinery were the two salient facts in a preliminary
assessment of the nation election based on the incomplete returns reaching
here.

Pending more detailed reports, neither the State Department nor the White
House would comment on the balloting or the victory of the military
candidates, Lieut. Gen. Nguyen Van Thieu, who was running for president, and
Premier Nguyen Cao Ky, the candidate for vice president.

A successful election has long been seen as the keystone in President
Johnson's policy of encouraging the growth of constitutional processes in
South Vietnam. The election was the culmination of a constitutional
development that began in January, 1966, to which President Johnson gave his
personal commitment when he met Premier Ky and General Thieu, the chief of
state, in Honolulu in February.

The purpose of the voting was to give legitimacy to the Saigon Government,
which has been founded only on coups and power plays since November, 1963,
when President Ngo Dinh Diem was overthrown by a military junta.

Few members of that junta are still around, most having been ousted or
exiled in subsequent shifts of power.

Significance Not Diminished

The fact that the backing of the electorate has gone to the generals who
have been ruling South Vietnam for the last two years does not, in the
Administration's view, diminish the significance of the constitutional step
that has been taken.

The hope here is that the new government will be able to maneuver with a
confidence and legitimacy long lacking in South Vietnamese politics. That
hope could have been dashed either by a small turnout, indicating widespread
scorn or a lack of interest in constitutional development, or by the
Vietcong's disruption of the balloting.

American officials had hoped for an 80d ΒΈΓΉ per cent turnout. That was the
figure in the election in September for the Constituent Assembly.
Seventy-eight per cent of the registered voters went to the polls in
elections for local officials last spring.

Before the results of the presidential election started to come in, the
American officials warned that the turnout might be less than 80 per cent
because the polling place would be open for two or three hours less than in
the election a year ago. The turnout of 83 per cent was a welcome surprise.
The turnout in the 1964 United States Presidential election was 62 per cent.

Captured documents and interrogations indicated in the last week a serious
concern among Vietcong leaders that a major effort would be required to
render the election meaningless. This effort has not succeeded, judging from
the reports from Saigon.

PS (not from the above poster)

 I understand that Bush saw his shadow during his state of the union
address and declared six more weeks of freedom.

I have spent my years under the world famous Physician Dr. Bin There-done-that and am now retired from the medical corps.
I have been to yougo as a combat engineer (CHIMO) and then another as a Critical Care RN at the role 3 MMU at KAF.

Offline Infanteer

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2005, 20:09:32 »
And, according to Snopes...it's true!

http://www.snopes.com/politics/ballot/vietnam.asp
"Overall it appears that much of the apparent complexity of modern war stems in practice from the self-imposed complexity of modern HQs" LCol J.P. Storr

Offline Brad Sallows

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2005, 20:30:44 »
Great; now if Iran ("the north") decides to invade Iraq ("the south") to unify the Shi'a it'll be just like VietNam all over again...won't it?
That which does not kill me has made a grave tactical error.

"It is a damned heavy blow; but whining don't help."

Despair is a sin.

Offline Infanteer

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2005, 20:32:09 »
 ;D

Of course, the Soviet Union will have to be backing North and South Shi'a with arms, material and training as well!

Analogy is always suspect.
"Overall it appears that much of the apparent complexity of modern war stems in practice from the self-imposed complexity of modern HQs" LCol J.P. Storr

Offline Britney Spears

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2005, 20:46:25 »
Now to involve both Canada and Anne Coulter! (Transcript, for those without broadband)
Those silly right wing nuts.....What do you think of Farehype 9/11 now?
« Last Edit: February 02, 2005, 20:56:29 by Britney Spears »
"I'd vote for you."
  -TCBF, whiskey601.

"Britney, if you wern't so young I would kiss you!"
  -a_majoor.

Offline Infanteer

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2005, 20:57:18 »
Oh, that was good Britney!  ;D

I've always thought that Coulter bag was a harpy anyways.  Now I know she is a dumb harpy to boot.  What the hell is her claim to fame anyways?  Why is she publishing the same crap (except from the other end) as Michael Moore.
"Overall it appears that much of the apparent complexity of modern war stems in practice from the self-imposed complexity of modern HQs" LCol J.P. Storr

Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2005, 23:20:45 »
The part not mentioned on the left wing web sites is that the RVN had the rug pulled out from under them by the democrat led Congress that voted in june 1973 prohibiting the US military from conducting operations in SE Asia. Then in 1974 they appropriated just $700 million in aid to the RVN, an amount far short of what they required to fight the NVA.

Offline 48Highlander

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2005, 23:52:46 »
Coulter is for the right wing what Moore is for the left.  I think they'd make a cute couple...

Offline tomahawk6

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2005, 00:10:14 »
It's been my experience that the military does better when the conservatives are in power than when the lib's are. The military was almost on life support during Carter/Clinton. In both cases it takes many years of conservative stewardship to bring the patient back to good health. The effect of Clinton was not as bad because of the strong showing by the republican's which blocked the deep cuts he tried to make.

Offline Wizard of OZ

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Re: Vietnam and Iraq Same old Same old
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2005, 12:07:19 »
Do you not think Iran is getting weapons right now from the west friendly Russians?  OF crse they are.  i will hunt down the article where they have been getting the shoulder fired missles from the Russians.

The more things change the more they stay the same.
You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war. Albert Einstein

The Americans will always do the right thing... After they've exhausted all the alternatives.Winston Churchill