Author Topic: BMQ Failure Rate  (Read 30846 times)

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stivic923

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BMQ Failure Rate
« on: March 01, 2003, 14:20:00 »
What is the failure rate in Basic Training?

Does anyone know?
« Last Edit: October 02, 2004, 22:54:57 by Bruce Monkhouse »

Offline Marti

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #1 on: March 01, 2003, 18:34:00 »
it‘s pretty low, i‘m pretty sure there were only 3 failures on my BMQ, and that‘s out of an original 56 (i think). a few more people had to leave for medical reasons and one guy quit.

stivic923

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2003, 11:16:00 »
Do you think that quitting Basic Training would stick with you for the rest of your life?
I think it would with me. Wondering if you could have made it through if you would have stuck with it.
What about the leaving cause of medical problems? Maybe they made themselves think about it too much and actually brainwashed themselves into thinking they had a medical problem and couldnt go through with it.

Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2003, 13:27:00 »
A retarded number of people fake injuries to get out of PT or to get some kind of special treatment. I think anyone caught faking should be kicked out.

If you quit your basic training because you don‘t like it then why would you wonder if you coulddo it or not? Who cares. You didn‘t want to do it. I‘m sure i can shoot myself in the foot but i don‘t want to. I don‘t wonder if i could actually go through doing it   ;)  

I‘ve met some people who suffered all through basic training from day one. They wanted to quit but their buddies got them to "stick it out". They passed their training and quit the minute they got home.  Maybe a few of them felt like the accomplished something suffering for a month or two months but most of them felt like they just wasted a summer.
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stivic923

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2003, 16:16:00 »
Ghost...you probably did shoot yourself in the foot!! haha  ;)  

But i do agree with you on what you mentioned. I think those people that come in there, and then dont want to be there are the type of people that obviously didnt think the decision all the way through, and end up wasting time and government money, while there is more than likely someone else who would be more than willing to fill that spot at BT.
I dont see how it could be a waste of a summer though. You actually just learned something!
Idiots i tell ya!

Veteran`s son

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2003, 16:57:00 »
It is encouraging then that most people do complete Basic Training successfully!

I know that if I am accepted into the Reserves, that I will work very hard and do my very best to complete the BMQ expected of me by the Canadian Forces!

Already, I can do the required number of pushups(14) but I am not doing as well with the situps. But if I keep practising, I am sure that I will do better with the situps!

Offline kurokaze

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2003, 09:05:00 »
Veteran‘s Son: I believe the required number of
pushups is 19.  Or has it changed again?

I almost quit basic.  Not because of PT or anything
but because it was mentally exhausting.. but I‘m
sticking with it.

If you‘re thinking about quitting basic because its
just too "hard" just remember to stick with it and
you‘ll be twice the person when you graduate than
you were then you first joined up.  My 2 cents.

Veteran`s son

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2003, 17:58:00 »
Do many recruits fail Basic Training?

I have no doubt that Basic Training would be very challenging and physically exhausting(I‘m speaking as someone who has not been in the CF, however).

I wonder what percentage of recruits successfully complete Basic Training? Would the percentage be 90-95%, for example?

Again, your information and opinions would be helpful!   :D

Offline Bert

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2003, 10:47:00 »
The recruiter told me about 96% of BMQ recruits pass the course.  The 4% he told me either drop out voluntarily or leave because of medical reasons.

I had a friend that went through basic last summer and said the same thing.  A couple of people decided that the military wasn‘t for them and someone broke a leg.  Another was diagnosed for a disease and had to leave.

He found the course mentally taxing, you don‘t get much sleep, and he suggested to take it easy on or protect your knees and feet as much as possible.  The later weeks of BMQ need your knees and feet to be in good condition.  Insoles are a must apparently.

This post relates to the Regs.

311

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2003, 11:11:00 »
In the BMQ I am in, we started with 18, and with 3 weeks left we have 13.The people who dropped out though, did it because of a schedule conflict like a hockey tournament.

Offline ProPatria05

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2003, 12:28:00 »
I think a distinction needs to be made here between Reg Force BMQ and Reserve BMQ. Not in terms of level of difficulty (I am not in a position to comment), but in terms of the difference in commitment between the two.

Anyone can walk away from the Reserves at any time (unless on emergency call-up). The catalyst for this is often, as is said, conflicts with civvy-life. When you‘re trying to fit 2 lives into one schedule, decisions have to be made. In addition, given that it is so easy to quit, anyone who has not personally committed themselves will quit the first time they have second thoughts.

The Reg Force, on the other hand, is much more difficult to quit (although I won‘t pretend to know the process). So just because Johnny Bloggins had a bad day doesn‘t mean he can decide not to show up tomorrow. As well, the Army IS your life - you‘re not on a school soccer team, or taking violin lessons anymore - so priority conflicts simply do not exist.

For the reasons cited above, I expect that attrition rates on specific BMQ serials will be higher in the Reserves than in the Reg Force. Therefore, when discussing this topic it would be prudent to specify whether you‘re talking about Reg Force or Reserves.

Veteran`s son

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2003, 12:43:00 »
Thank you for the replies on this topic and any additional replies would be great also!

Murph

I was asking about the BMQ for Regular Force.   :)

Gelan

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #12 on: April 17, 2003, 20:19:00 »
BMQ is designed to give the recruit every possible opportunity to pass the course. The purpose of the course isn‘t to fail the recruits, it‘s meant to pass the recruits who do well to obey simple orders and instructions. You have to mess up bad(Like failing your C7 handling test multiple times) to be recoursed. It‘s meant as a stepping stone from civvie life to military life. The same goes for the Army SQ course, although that course is a little easier to get rid of people. When you get to your MOC training, that‘s usually where all the "weeding out" comes into play. I know for a fact that it‘s fairly easy to recourse people on the DP1 BIQ. 6 people have dropped off my course and it‘s only been 3 weeks(we haven‘t even hit the field portion yet!). Our instructors expect to graduate a course of about 20-25 of the original 40 soldiers.

Let me know if you want more info.

Offline WB

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #13 on: April 17, 2003, 23:13:00 »
More info would be appreciated. With luck, I‘ll be doing my BMQ and BIQ next fall.   :)

Offline portcullisguy

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2003, 14:21:00 »
I will be doing DP1 (Inf) this summer at LFCATC Meaford.  Hopefully, all 13 from my reg‘t will pass, and if motivation were the sole deciding factor, they will!

Sad to say, there are several from my SQ course (in other units) who I not only don‘t think will pass, I am hoping they don‘t!

Part of me really wants the bar to be raised on the next two courses... the remaining 3 weeks of SQ, and the DP1 Infantry this summer.  I see a lot of "max relax" attitudes after the BMQ and the three weekends of SQ I just did.  Especially from recruits who did their BMQ last summer.  Some people didn‘t even bother to get haircuts before showing up for weekend #1 of SQ, and their attitude needed serious adjustment on course.

If they go into the summer with the same attitude, and the course is NOT any harder, then I feel the instructors will be rewarding sloth and carelessness.

But from what I hear about Meaford, I don‘t think there will be any problems.   :)
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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2003, 13:42:00 »
Gotta agree 100% with Galen above. My BMQ has some really great motivated Troops   :cam:   , a group of reasonably well mannered "grey guys" :warstory:  and a small (thank god) subset of absolute goofs   :confused:  . It is not my place to say but these slack asses tend to drag the rest of us down. Given some of the idiocy I‘ve seen the course staff don‘t seem to be able to washout these leeches. I must assume that the decison to leave must be volentary as we grad in 2 days.

I am quite pleased with my own efforts on BMQ at age 35 and would be ashamed of myself if I gave less than my all. To see 18 year old little pumpkins without the simple IQ to tie thier own shoes and the physical conditioning to hump thier ruck a couple of Kms is somewhat bothersome.

I trust thier home units will get these individuals squared away.

Cpt. Kap

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2003, 13:14:00 »
Just a quick addition to the above - One Candidate was washed out after all   :crybaby:  
It was richly deserved and dispite the absolute best efforts of the staffers.

Point #2 Celebration of awards should be done after the parade in which you recieve them.
Grad parade was even more challenging than expected as the group had a collective brain ache
 -(but still bloody good fun)

Offline Sharpie

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2003, 13:21:00 »
Speaking only from the Reserve side, I beleive there should be a 0% failure rate on BMQ. Speaking with individuals who have taken the old school QL2‘s (one myself) and are or have taught on today‘s BMQ, say that it is now a walk in the park. If all goes well, I will be instructing on a BMQ, or SQ or whatever it‘s called now in the fall and I will find out for myself. But what happened to the approx. 8 weeks in Pet!! Those were courses!

I know these are not 100% feasable within the Reserves as I am unable to take off for a full summer, and I just finished a weekend course, so I don‘t mean to sound like a hipocrate. But these younger kids in or just out of highschool, I say take a summer course, they are more challenging and I feel mould a better Soldier.
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Offline Bert

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2003, 14:48:00 »
Hey Cpt. Kap.  

Who are the "grey guys" exactly?  Recruits who are older or those who may be borderline on pass\fail?

Any pointers for the older recruits?

Offline Sharpie

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2003, 15:37:00 »
Cpt Cap

Part of a Soldier‘s duty is to motivate Soldiers at or below their level. Perhaps your course‘s Staff was waiting for the Candidates to see if they would use their initiative and motivate these "slack asses" themselves. Builds teamwork. But, sometimes there is nothing you can do, some people just arn‘t cut out for the Military.
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Cpt. Kap

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #20 on: May 01, 2003, 13:26:00 »
Bert -- I appreciate being asked for advice, Just not sure I should be the one giving it. My advise is simple - give nothing other than 100%. I worked very hard each day and the course evaluation reflected a level of success I‘m pleased with. That level of success means alot when you are double the age of some of the recruits.

By "Grey Guy" I simply ment the group of soldiers in the middle of the group. Not excelling, Not failing - just average. A comfortable place to blend in but not a accurate reflection of what you can do.

Sharpey - I hear you my friend. The goofs I spoke of where those who remained sub-standard after the staff and troops did thier level best to help/motivate/put the fear of death into. Fortunately a very rare group. (2 out of 16)

Cameron_Highlander_Ottawa

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #21 on: May 08, 2004, 18:53:00 »
Quote
Originally posted by Veteran‘s son:
[qb] Do many recruits fail Basic Training?

I have no doubt that Basic Training would be very challenging and physically exhausting(I‘m speaking as someone who has not been in the CF, however).

I wonder what percentage of recruits successfully complete Basic Training? Would the percentage be 90-95%, for example?

Again, your information and opinions would be helpful!    :D  [/qb]
In my BMQ course, we started out at 46 and ended up at 32. I think good number of people that go for basic training aren‘t too sure of what they‘re really getting themselves into and aren‘t really prepared for it. If you are motivated though you will most likely pass BMQ, it‘s not all that hard a course, it just feels weird, but u get used to military life pretty quick.

Offline Pte.Nomercy

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #22 on: May 08, 2004, 19:29:00 »
Oh Geez,

I can‘t stand recruits who come off these weakened/weekend BMQ courses.

I‘m not saying they are poor soldiers or anything don‘t get me wrong, if a person wishes to be a good soldiers they will because they have the motivation, drive etc.

However, I find the weekend BMQ courses to be a joke, there is not enough discipline for one, not enough PT and certainly not enough time to teach the recruits everything they need to know, hence, I believe only giving them a negative/slack *** first time military experience, I also think it turns quite a bit of people off too.

A BMQ/QL2 course should be that way it used to be, HARD and in your face. Troops, I‘m referring to reserves, should be sent out to Meaford for the summer there so that it "sinks" into them that they are training to be soldiers and that they are stuck there for the next few weeks, instead of this "I‘m going home Sunday" attitude. I also believe that courses are too short, I do realize the reserves set out to meet people's schedules, but I believe a BMQ course should be more then what....TWENTY DAYS? Come on......

As for when I did my QL2, there was nearly 60 people in my platoon, YES that many! Meaford was overpopulated that year, and by the time the course was over we had some 30 people left. This was because we had good instructors, one of which was a PPCLI sergeant who was in the Yugoslavian conflict and engaged the Croatians and was shelled by artillery for two weeks, while the other was a RCR sergeant who also served in Yugoslavia, was wounded and had a huge scar on his forehead and was so hard his section dropped to 6 people from 15.

Despite this I still wasn't satisfied as I felt that there was still more to learn, I believe courses need to be the way they were, as described by other posts already, it's the only way we can weed out the people wasting our money and replace them with good motivated soldiers.

48Highlander

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #23 on: May 08, 2004, 19:44:00 »
There‘s nothing wrong with weekend QL2‘s/BMQ‘s.  The BMQ course is your initial course, it teaches you basic military skills such as marching and handling the C7 rifle.  None of those things need to be taught in a max-aggression environment.  The following QL3 or the new SQ/DP1 courses are different entirely, and those are NOT taught as weekend courses.

My summer course was similar to yours, and we also lost nearly 50% of our initial number.  While this is good for turning out "hard", disciplined soldiers, it creates problems for recruiting, especially in the reserves.  If all courses were run the same way we would never be able to meet the numbers which are expected.  So instead of pushing the troops untill they fall apart in the summers, it‘s now left up to the units to sort out their troops once they‘re fully trained.  I‘m not saying I like it, but it is neccesary.

Offline Pte.Nomercy

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2004, 00:02:00 »
I agree with you 48Highlander,

I‘m not saying that troops should be trained till they fall apart, I‘m saying they should be disciplined and challenged both mentally and physically on these courses which doesn't really happen enough.

My complaint was that after seeing/working with many troops come of these weekend BMQ‘s that some don‘t have a certain level of professionalism that‘s all. I realize that this usually changes after the more difficult summer courses though.

I also know that the numbers are hard to keep and even harder to get, and realize that the recruit courses spaced out through the year prevent the old situation that took place with the QL2/QL3 summers, where troops would do 2 months training, waste $20,000 of tax payers money, and then just quit.

However, I do believe that the weekend courses have some bugs to iron out; I‘ve seen the way those courses are run, and they are getting better over time, so hopefully the stigma of "weekend BMQ" will change and I‘ll be proved wrong.

Offline Bert

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #25 on: May 09, 2004, 00:38:00 »
Sorry to break into the debate, and maybe I‘ve got the wrong perspective, but I think you may expect too much for the BMQ courses, regular or reserve.  In no way is recruit graduating BMQ a professional, useful, or trained to be anything yet.  The course contents like the C7, gas mask, drill, etc, are just MERE introductions.  The instructors have to be successful to instill a sense of professionalism, drive, and purpose.  The recruit has to be exposed to military life
for extended periods for it to rub off.
Given that reservists have to pay the bills, pay the rent, keep a full time job with obligations,
and be fresh to face civy life 06:00 AM Monday morning, you can really only do so much on weekend BMQs.  The Unit and future exercises the recruits return to are the opportunities to lead by example and mold the professionalism, drive, and purpose.  There they get the time to understand what drive, disipline, and purpose really are.

Offline Sigs Guy

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #26 on: February 13, 2005, 19:26:51 »
Well, I don't have much to comment on here since I don't have much experience in the army. But I am applying to the reserves, and have my fingers crossed hoping that my application goes smoothly and I can get into BMQ. Right now I'm trying to get as physically fit as possible so I can be all that I can be on the course. I kindof wish that I applied to the reserves when I was 16 when I look back at it. But the fact that some recruits don't give the instructors respect, and alot "quit" when they find out what the army is really about astonishes me. I'm thinking that when I do my BMQ I'll keep my mouth shut, and always listen to what those with above me tell me.
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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #27 on: February 14, 2005, 00:43:45 »
Those who fail are those who are poorly prepared or those who find out they aren't cut out for a military career.   :'(

Offline Armstrong

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #28 on: January 19, 2018, 03:47:42 »
Half of the people don't pass BMW the first time

Offline kratz

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2018, 06:59:54 »
Half of the people don't pass BMW the first time

Without ever having been to BMQ, you are starting as fact a 50% failure for first time students. Less posting and more reading, to avoid passing along rumour or uninformed opinion.
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Offline Armstrong

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #30 on: January 19, 2018, 14:22:45 »
I've completed bmq 5 years ago true story.
Good luck on your trade courses even harder to pass . makes bmq look like elementary school .

Offline BeyondTheNow

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #31 on: January 19, 2018, 17:25:11 »
I've completed bmq 5 years ago true story.
Good luck on your trade courses even harder to pass . makes bmq look like elementary school .

Even so, the information you insist on sharing is neither helpful nor accurate. Perhaps you’ve had only rough experiences with your course/training the first time around and your PRes unit was struggling. Individual perspectives/experiences obviously vary, but your blanket statements are not welcome.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2018, 17:27:51 by BeyondTheNow »
"Stop worrying about getting back to who you were before it all went wrong. To heal is to understand that the person you've since become is the one who's most capable of doing whatever it is you were put here to do."~SR

Offline Mason Jar

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #32 on: January 20, 2018, 00:34:36 »
I've completed bmq 5 years ago true story.
Good luck on your trade courses even harder to pass . makes bmq look like elementary school .
In 2017 you said you were applying for armoured "recon". A couple of days ago you posted a rant about how long your enrollment process is taking, care to clear up on how you could have completed BMQ 5 years ago?
Recruiting Center: Toronto
Regular/Reserve: Reserves
Officer/ NCM: NCM
Trade Choice 1: Artillery Soldier
Trade Choice 2: Combat engineer
Trade Choice 3: Armoured Soldier
Application date: October 25, 2017
First Contact: October 26, 2017
Aptitude test: November 2, 2017 (passed)
FORCE test: November 2, 2017 (passed)
Medical: November 9, 2017
Interview: November 15, 2017 (passed)
Med approved: Pending

Offline mariomike

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #33 on: January 20, 2018, 00:39:14 »
A couple of days ago you posted a rant about how long your enrollment process is taking, care to clear up on how you could have completed BMQ 5 years ago?

I used to be ex CAF member back from 2011-2015 and did a Volunteer Release for 2-3 years.

Offline Mason Jar

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #34 on: January 20, 2018, 00:40:00 »
Oh my bad, I missed that part!
Recruiting Center: Toronto
Regular/Reserve: Reserves
Officer/ NCM: NCM
Trade Choice 1: Artillery Soldier
Trade Choice 2: Combat engineer
Trade Choice 3: Armoured Soldier
Application date: October 25, 2017
First Contact: October 26, 2017
Aptitude test: November 2, 2017 (passed)
FORCE test: November 2, 2017 (passed)
Medical: November 9, 2017
Interview: November 15, 2017 (passed)
Med approved: Pending

Offline IanLaw

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #35 on: February 23, 2018, 22:33:00 »
I am quite pleased with my own efforts on BMQ at age 35 and would be ashamed of myself if I gave less than my all. To see 18 year old little pumpkins without the simple IQ to tie thier own shoes and the physical conditioning to hump thier ruck a couple of Kms is somewhat bothersome.

I have been staff on several BMQ and DP1 courses. The 35-year-old candidates in my experience often have an advantage over their 18-year-old coursemates because the older candidates are often more resilient mentally.

One of the more recent changes to these courses that I can really get behind is the renewed focus on developing mental resiliency among our soldiers, sailors and aviators. 

angus555

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #36 on: February 23, 2018, 22:54:15 »
I have been staff on several BMQ and DP1 courses. The 35-year-old candidates in my experience often have an advantage over their 18-year-old coursemates because the older candidates are often more resilient mentally.

One of the more recent changes to these courses that I can really get behind is the renewed focus on developing mental resiliency among our soldiers, sailors and aviators.

I appreciate your thoughts on this, but I couldn't help but notice that you quoted a post from 2003.
I realized many of the kids starting BMQ soon would have been 3 years old when that post was made.
I feel like I need a drink now. ;D
« Last Edit: February 23, 2018, 23:02:35 by Til Valhall »

Offline BeyondTheNow

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #37 on: February 24, 2018, 08:55:55 »
I have been staff on several BMQ and DP1 courses. The 35-year-old candidates in my experience often have an advantage over their 18-year-old coursemates because the older candidates are often more resilient mentally.

One of the more recent changes to these courses that I can really get behind is the renewed focus on developing mental resiliency among our soldiers, sailors and aviators.

Yes.

On a side note, I’m curious as to which angle instructors find easier to instruct/which they’d prefer to instruct when it comes down to it—Candidates in peak physical condition able to handle any physical task put forth, or those who can simply do what’s required physically (nothing to exceptional standards though), but can handle the psychological aspect of training much more appropriately.
"Stop worrying about getting back to who you were before it all went wrong. To heal is to understand that the person you've since become is the one who's most capable of doing whatever it is you were put here to do."~SR

Offline CanexPlanIsATrap

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #38 on: February 24, 2018, 09:22:19 »
If I can add something to this point made. Being in my final week here in St.Jean i have noticed a lot in the past 12 weeks one being is that if you don't have drive or passion for being here then you won't pass. However Pass/Fail rate is specific for platoon, for example my BMQ Serial started with 4 full platoons all with 60 Candidates, as of our grad week our french sister platoon has 28 students left, our other 2 english platoons have above 40 still. Another very large factor is the staff you get, in St.Jean you can have either Hell Platoon, Hollywood Platoon, or Party Platoon. I think the names speak for themselves. The bottom line here is don't come to BMQ with the mentality of "Am I going to fail" come with the mentality of "This is a breeze" you will be fine. Final point is that your instructors aren't there to fail you, that want to see you pass!
Today I do what others won't, so tomorrow I can do what others can't.

Offline mariomike

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #39 on: February 24, 2018, 10:25:23 »
in St.Jean you can have either Hell Platoon, Hollywood Platoon, or Party Platoon.

 :rofl:

Our son told us he was in Hell Platoon, but maybe they all say that? I seem to recall my sister telling our parents something similar.

Congratulations Finn and good luck in your career. I hope you enjoy a long one!


« Last Edit: February 24, 2018, 10:45:36 by mariomike »

Offline CanexPlanIsATrap

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #40 on: February 24, 2018, 10:55:22 »
Ahahaha Thanks Mike! I can tell you one thing for free, I was in party platoon. 
Today I do what others won't, so tomorrow I can do what others can't.

Offline mariomike

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #41 on: February 24, 2018, 11:11:41 »
You know what, Finn? I believe you!  :)

Offline BeyondTheNow

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #42 on: February 24, 2018, 21:11:59 »
:rofl:

Our son told us he was in Hell Platoon, but maybe they all say that? I seem to recall my sister telling our parents something similar.

Congratulations Finn and good luck in your career. I hope you enjoy a long one!

Yup. All pl’s are not created equal. My 1st pl was Hollywood, as they say. ‘Average age was well into 20s and older, mostly comprised of support trades, jackings were rare, punishment PT (not referred to as that anymore) only happened once within a 7 week period, we were allowed trips to Canex and such during indoc, etc. It was a breeze compared to my 2nd. On my second pl we had punishment PT 3xs in one day, staff (mostly) only had one manner of speaking—yelling. Pl was almost totally comprised of combat arms, gym periods and overall daily dynamic was exceptionally more intense in all ways. That being said, as hard as the staff was, they were good.
"Stop worrying about getting back to who you were before it all went wrong. To heal is to understand that the person you've since become is the one who's most capable of doing whatever it is you were put here to do."~SR

Offline theprivate

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #43 on: September 28, 2018, 09:03:03 »
Yes.

On a side note, I’m curious as to which angle instructors find easier to instruct/which they’d prefer to instruct when it comes down to it—Candidates in peak physical condition able to handle any physical task put forth, or those who can simply do what’s required physically (nothing to exceptional standards though), but can handle the psychological aspect of training much more appropriately.

I did basic Nov 17-Feb 18

I was one of the latter. I couldn't do everything physically, but you'd have to shoot me before I would give up. I kept that attitude the whole way though, and it got the junior staff on my side, even if the PO1 and his 2IC didn't like me.

Unfortunately I was recoursed week 3 due to pneumonia (fever so bad I was wearing my ice jacket in the hottest room in the drill hall, feeling like I was freezing to death) and when I got the shitty news from the 2IC on that course, he told me I was his favourite type of candidate. The kind who would try their best at whatever was asked of them and even when they failed, they wouldn't quit.

Then I went on TRP for a week and joined a course with much harder staff of course  ::)

Offline theprivate

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #44 on: September 28, 2018, 09:10:33 »
If I can add something to this point made. Being in my final week here in St.Jean i have noticed a lot in the past 12 weeks one being is that if you don't have drive or passion for being here then you won't pass. However Pass/Fail rate is specific for platoon, for example my BMQ Serial started with 4 full platoons all with 60 Candidates, as of our grad week our french sister platoon has 28 students left, our other 2 english platoons have above 40 still. Another very large factor is the staff you get, in St.Jean you can have either Hell Platoon, Hollywood Platoon, or Party Platoon. I think the names speak for themselves. The bottom line here is don't come to BMQ with the mentality of "Am I going to fail" come with the mentality of "This is a breeze" you will be fine. Final point is that your instructors aren't there to fail you, that want to see you pass!

Hey man, I think we were on sister platoons. I was on the Hell one.

Most people dropped because they kept messing up over and over and weren't learning from it. I would screw something up, get yelled at, and not do it again. I finished the course with only 3 counsellings when the average was probably around 5, and that was entirely because the staff never had to talk to me about the same thing twice. Now I was no superstar, believe me, but I worked my butt of to make sure I didn't screw up repeatedly and it paid off.

A couple people got recoursed for being sick, but most just did dumb crap. DON'T DO DUMB crap AND YOU'LL BE FINE.

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #45 on: September 28, 2018, 09:16:09 »
DON'T DO DUMB crap AND YOU'LL BE FINE.

This should be a t-shirt slogan :)
"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

Offline mariomike

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #46 on: September 28, 2018, 09:27:31 »
DON'T DO DUMB crap AND YOU'LL BE FINE.

See also,

What not to do - No excuse BMQ tips [Merged]
https://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=34712.0
29 pages.

Reasons for failing BMQ?
https://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=108377.0

"Ways to Fail Basic":
http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php/topic,1147.0/nowap.html

"Do many recruits fail Basic Training?":
 http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php/topic,12909.msg54977.html#msg54977

"Pass/Fail Tests":
http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=13585
 
"The best way to pass those tests is to pay attention in lectures, take good notes, study diligently when you have the time to do so (breaks, after meals and before bed), and learn drills exactly as your instructors teach them. Ask questions of your instructors at the time if you are unsure of anything. Practice drills and rehearse questions/answers with your peers throughout the course, not just the night before a written test. (And don‘t go in depending on half-remembered one liners from the net.)

The principal pass/fail tests are weapon checks where any safety infraction is an immediate fail. You will get retrained, refreshed and retested if you have difficulty, but repeated failures in one area or difficulty with multiple checks can lead to failure and recourse."

What happens if you fail BMQ?
https://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=57336.0

Is it possible to fail BMQ for PT reasons or because of injury?
https://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=97225.0

passing courses at BMQ 
https://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=94749.0

etc...


Offline ontheedge

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #47 on: October 20, 2018, 20:44:34 »
I posted a poll asking people to share injuries they acquired during BMQ. And whether the injuries were transient, long lasting or permanent. That poll seems to have been removed or put somewhere else.  If the mod or others can enlighten me that would be appreciated.

Offline garb811

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #48 on: October 21, 2018, 14:58:04 »
I didn't see the poll, but I am skeptical as to what you would be trying to achieve with it. Statistically, you're not going to get a proper sampling and the data is not actually going to be reflective on the actual situation. 

Therefore, unless the site owner or Chief of Staff deem otherwise, please do not post a poll of that nature.

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Offline ontheedge

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #49 on: October 21, 2018, 16:18:22 »
Wouldn’t that reasoning apply to all polling on this site?  In which case, why have the polling option at all?
« Last Edit: October 21, 2018, 16:23:13 by ontheedge »

Offline garb811

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #50 on: October 21, 2018, 18:02:51 »
Simply put, there is a difference between a, "Which pet do you like better? Puppies, Kitties or icky reptiles" type poll, and one that is asking for people to state if they have been injured on BMQ and the severity/duration of that injury. One is of no real consequence, the other can lead to people forming opinions that are not based on facts.

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Offline JesseWZ

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #51 on: October 21, 2018, 18:06:28 »
Wouldn’t that reasoning apply to all polling on this site?  In which case, why have the polling option at all?

Because other polls on this site are for opinions. You’re asking for unbiased fact which is not possible with an anonymous poll like this. A serious injury to one person may not be near the same to another.
I will be seen and not heard... I will be seen and not heard... I will be seen and not heard...

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #52 on: October 21, 2018, 18:11:24 »
What are you trying to achieve? People get hurt on BMQ. They also get hurt falling on their driveway in the winter. The best way to help prevent injuries is to show up in shape, but you're not going to stop all of them. Sometimes @#$@ just happens.

Offline ontheedge

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #53 on: October 21, 2018, 19:29:47 »
Okay thank you for the feedback. Duly noted

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #54 on: October 22, 2018, 00:32:09 »
From what I've seen, current basic training is wayyyy better at making sure people don't get injured than 20 + years  ago.

Just my $0.02 worth.
"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

Offline ontheedge

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Re: BMQ Failure Rate
« Reply #55 on: October 22, 2018, 00:38:15 »
From what I've seen, current basic training is wayyyy better at making sure people don't get injured than 20 + years  ago.

Just my $0.02 worth.

Yes after googling it further it seems the Forces made some changes with the ombudsman’s participation in 2000 after some dude seriously messed up his leg muscle. The report indicated the Forces were proactive and put systems in place to prevent needless injury. Good to hear.