Author Topic: "Toronto 18" terrorists: Arrest/court/aftermath  (Read 105883 times)

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Offline MarkOttawa

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #75 on: June 07, 2006, 12:07:53 »
TMM:
http://www.tvo.org/TVOsites/WebObjects/TvoMicrosite.woa/wo/ebAdWshCA4Mb2WYVxnxog0/2.0.0.79.45.26.1.13.1.1

"Also tonight, reaction from the Muslim community with Irshad Manji, author of The Trouble with Islam Today; Tarek Fatah of the Muslim Canadian Congress; Ali Hindy from Scarborough's Salaheddin Islamic Centre; and Zafar Bangash, director of the Institute of Contemporary Islamic Thought."

Mark
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Offline dapaterson

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #76 on: June 07, 2006, 12:27:50 »
This problem originates in the Muslim community, why is that community not speaking up about it.

A bit of research would show that there are significant voices in the Muslim community supporting the government's actions:

http://www.caircan.ca/itn_more.php?id=2506_0_2_0_C'

Quote
Canadian Muslims relieved alleged terrorist attack averted
Saturday, June 03, 2006 3:45 pm

For immediate release

CAIR-CAN joins all Canadians in expressing relief that a potential terrorist attack in Toronto has been averted and applauds the efforts by Canadian security forces to combat terrorism and other criminal activities. CAIR-CAN stands with all Canadians in the pursuit of safety and security for the residents of our country.

“As Canadian Muslims we unequivocally condemn terrorism in all of its forms. Canada is our home and we are deeply concerned about the safety of our country,” says Karl Nickner, CAIR-CAN’s Executive Director.

Security officials held a news conference Saturday morning to announce the arrest of an alleged terrorist cell in Toronto. According to reports, about 17 individuals, most of whom are Canadian citizens, have been arrested for allegedly plotting a terrorist attack.

“We stand behind our security forces and the Canadian government in their desire to protect Canada. We also have confidence that our justice system will accord these individuals transparency, due process and the presumption of innocence,” he added.

CAIR-CAN is also asking Canadian Muslims to cooperate with Canadian security agencies in order to combat any terrorist or other criminal activities.

To read the national statement by 120 Canadian Imams condemning terrorism and extremism, released last summer, please see: http://www.caircan.ca/ps_more.php?id=2004_0_6_0_M
This posting made in accordance with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, section 2(b):
Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms: freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication
http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/charter/1.html

Offline Bobert

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #77 on: June 07, 2006, 14:32:25 »
Anyone see the CBC's Enemy Within.  They went to Amsterdam and Britain and interviewed both sides.  The Muslims were portrayed as being segrigated (by their own doing and their neighbours) and showed no attempt to become part of the nation they now lived in.  They also highlighted the response by the Danes and Brits.  It seems that the Danes have institued a policy of intergration whereby the muslims must right a test, speak the local dialect.  If any muslim commits a crime as small as shop lifting they are immediately deported.  Basically the premise was "Is Multi-culturalism Dead".

I saw that as well. I can't really say if what they are doing in the Neatherlands is worng. One thing I see why it is nessacry there as a result of the fact that they are a very liberal country and they want to defend thoise freedoms. However, haveing said that this would be right for sure in Canada. You have to look at our history as proof that multi-culturalism is nessacary. After all the British and the French were not the first people here. The aboriginals were. We have had many differnet groups of people since around the turn of the century. For example when the Pacific Railway had to be built we imported Chineese labour and forced them to live in horrible condition. Multi-culturalism is part of what we call Candian values and culture. We can't say that if you don't like bacon or hockey then you are not Canadian.

Offline Wizard of OZ

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #78 on: June 07, 2006, 14:47:09 »
We can't say that if you don't like bacon or hockey then you are not Canadian.

Sure we can, we just can't mean it.

Yes Canada is Multicultural.  But we did have internment camps for the Japanese in the Second world war a whole race put into camps because they could not be trusted.  Is this the direction that we are leaning in again?  I would hope not.  I think we (the public) need reassurance from the Muslim community that they themselves do not support this and not just on web pages but on nation TV come out and say it don't let the ones that defend these wacko's hog the light.  You wonder why you get little support or understanding on your culture or religion is because you only let those who don't speak for the majority talk. Or am a fool for thinking other wise?

MOO
You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war. Albert Einstein

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17thRecceSgt

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Re: National security forces arrest at least 8 in Toronto raids
« Reply #79 on: June 08, 2006, 11:04:26 »
If you want to see how delusional some people are just click on this link.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/viewpoint/yourspace/CSIS_terrorists.html

You can read letters people sent to the CBC about the comments Jack Hooper made before the Senate defence committee. You can read such gems as:

and:

Got enough proof now?  ::)

Good grief.  I read all the comments, the last one is from someone named Chris Brobeck...an 'artisit' from Halifax...check out his website, you can obviously see why he has so much knowledge and insight into international and domestic security/terrorist activities and the like... ::)

http://vans.ednet.ns.ca/artist pages/cbrobeck.html

I bet all these people tell pilots how to fly planes too...christ. ::)

Clueless.  Like a herd of cattle waiting at the gate...MOOOOOOOOOO

Offline MarkOttawa

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #80 on: June 08, 2006, 17:41:46 »
The key to the profile for finding "homegrown" terrorists, courtesy AP:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/1101AP_Canada_The_Suspects.html

"Most suspects in Canada plot from suburbs"

One supposes newly-immigrated potential terrorists, on the other hand, tend to congregate downtown.

Mark
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17thRecceSgt

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #81 on: June 08, 2006, 19:54:38 »
On a side note...

http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060608/funding_terror_060608

U.K. man lived alongside Canadian suspects: report
CTV.ca News Staff

The 21-year-old who was arrested at Manchester airport had spent time in Ontario, unbeknownst to his family, and even lived alongside some of the terror suspects who were arrested in a massive raid in Ontario last weekend, according to reports from the British media.

Abed Khan, and a 16-year-old youth who was arrested soon after, are both linked to the suspected terrorists in Ontario, according to the BBC and the Times of London newspaper. Both quoted unnamed security officials who made the connection.

The Times reported that Khan spent much of the past year in Ontario.

His uncle, Ismail Khan, however, told The Canadian Press his family has no relations in Canada and he has no knowledge of his nephew ever having visited the country, much less having lived there.

He did confirm his nephew was arrested on Tuesday after arriving at Manchester airport aboard a flight from Pakistan where he had been visiting his wife.

Police also searched several homes in Bradford, where the 21-year-old was from, in connection with his arrest.

"We're shocked," Khan told CP on Thursday from his home in Bradford, England.

He dismissed the notion that his nephew was linked to an alleged terror plot.

"He's a good lad, and I don't believe all the information about him or fabrication that they've put on him. It's all wrong."

Khan said police knocked down the door of his mother's home in Bradford, but found nothing when they searched the house.

On Wednesday a 16-year-old youth was taken into police custody, and police searched homes in Dewsbury, about 290 kilometres north of London.

Mohammad Sidique Khan, the leader of the July 7, 2005, bombings in London is also from Dewsbury.

Neither British police nor the RCMP has confirmed a connection exists between the Canadian and British arrests.

Terror legislation expected

Meanwhile, the federal government in Canada plans to introduce legislation this fall that is intended to help close off the cash pipeline to terrorists.

According to a report in Thursday's The Globe and Mail, the new legislation will incorporate some aspects of a consultation paper on the same topic that was put together last year.

One aspect of the legislation will give investigators the ability to closely monitor potentially suspicious business deals within Canada's diamond industry.

The document was drafted last year under the previous Liberal government, when Ralph Goodale held the post of finance minister.

"Police investigations indicate that organized crime groups are taking a growing interest in Canada's expanding diamond industry," said the white paper, as reported by the Globe.

"Unless preventative measures are taken, law enforcement authorities predict that the incidence of money laundering and terrorist activity financing in the sector will significantly increase in the future with the domestic expansion of the precious metals and jewelry industries."

The document suggests gems and precious metals are used almost as a form of international currency among terrorists because they are of high value, are easy to conceal, and are often difficult to trace.

Just last weekend, the RCMP arrested 17 people on terrorism charges, claiming the operation foiled a bomb plot against targets in southern Ontario.

And word of the new legislation comes just ahead of Finance Minister Jim Flaherty's trip to St. Petersburg, Russia this weekend, where he will meet with other finance officials from the Group of Eight industrialized nations.

One of the topics up for discussion is the financing of terrorism.

Money laundering legislation was introduced by the federal government in 2000, and was later updated after the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks.

A source told the Globe the government intends to move a Proceeds of Crime, Terrorists Financing Act in the fall, but no final decisions have been made on what the legislation will include.

If the legislation goes through, Canada will be following the lead of the Financial Action Task Force, an international organization that sets standards to combat money laundering.

Flaherty is next in line to take over the rotating presidency of FATF.

According to the Globe, the consultation paper looks at setting new reporting requirements for the diamond and precious metals industries -- similar to casinos, real estate agents and financial institutions that are required to report transactions of more than $10,000.

The paper also recommends closer scrutiny of money transfers, and changes to the Income Tax Act to allow information to be shared more easily.

Terrorists planned abductions

Meanwhile, reports say that court documents have revealed the alleged terrorists arrested last weekend had plans to take federal politicians hostage, then demand the withdrawal of Canadian troops from Afghanistan and the release of some prisoners in Canada.

The group also intended to decapitate hostages, according to the documents, but later became more focused on detonating bombs in several Toronto locations.

The documents also reveal one of the accused, Amin Mohamed Durrani, 19, enrolled in an aviation course at Toronto's Centennial College, though he did not take the course.

The revelations mark the first indication the men may have planned an attack from the air.

Other details of the group's alleged plans are included in the document, including some of the methods allegedly used to acquire three tons of ammonium nitrate -- fertilizer that can be used to build bombs.


Offline George Wallace

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #82 on: June 08, 2006, 20:05:56 »
http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060608/funding_terror_060608

U.K. man lived alongside Canadian suspects: report
CTV.ca News Staff

The 21-year-old who was arrested at Manchester airport had spent time in Ontario, unbeknownst to his family, and even lived alongside some of the terror suspects who were arrested in a massive raid in Ontario last weekend, according to reports from the British media.

Abed Khan, and a 16-year-old youth who was arrested soon after, are both linked to the suspected terrorists in Ontario, according to the BBC and the Times of London newspaper. Both quoted unnamed security officials who made the connection.

The Times reported that Khan spent much of the past year in Ontario.

His uncle, Ismail Khan, however, told The Canadian Press his family has no relations in Canada and he has no knowledge of his nephew ever having visited the country, much less having lived there.

He did confirm his nephew was arrested on Tuesday after arriving at Manchester airport aboard a flight from Pakistan where he had been visiting his wife.

That should be a relatively easy matter to prove one way or another, by confirming his Passport.  I am sure that it can be tracked.  Either he was in Canada for a period of time or he was in Pakistan for a period of time. 

On another tangent.....being in Pakistan will probably raise alarm flags on his file anyway.
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17thRecceSgt

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #83 on: June 08, 2006, 20:15:07 »
Staff

His uncle, Ismail Khan, however, told The Canadian Press his family has no relations in Canada and he has no knowledge of his nephew ever having visited the country, much less having lived there.

He did confirm his nephew was arrested on Tuesday after arriving at Manchester airport aboard a flight from Pakistan where he had been visiting his wife.

"We're shocked," Khan told CP on Thursday from his home in Bradford, England.

He dismissed the notion that his nephew was linked to an alleged terror plot.

"He's a good lad, and I don't believe all the information about him or fabrication that they've put on him. It's all wrong
."


Gee now here's a surprise...its all fabricated...he has no knowledge...yadda yadda yadda...I think its called the "standard party line" at this point in time...and close to the words of the familiies of the 17 terrorists arrested in the last week in Canada.

"The boy who cried wolf" comes to mind...

Offline zipperhead_cop

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #84 on: June 09, 2006, 00:02:20 »
Now this is a little too much over the top........like ANY trade, there are good and bad.
I blame the system more than anything,....I doubt very few started law school thinking " Just think of all the dirtbags I can help walk the street".
Methinks a clarification/apology would be warrented to those who wish to serve the greater good also.....

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #85 on: June 09, 2006, 06:36:13 »
  http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1149803410365&call_pageid=968332188774&col=968350116467
Help us weed out extremists, Muslims tell governments
Politicians support idea of summit
Jun. 9, 2006. 01:00 AM
BRUCE CAMPION-SMITH
OTTAWA BUREAU

OTTAWA—Canada's Muslim community is asking for high-level political assistance, including the help of Prime Minister Stephen Harper, to weed out extremists who are preying on young people.

"We're not here to say we don't have an issue. Of course we have an issue, but we can't deal with it ourselves," social worker Shahina Siddiqui, president of the Islamic Social Services Association, told a news conference yesterday.
"We are part of the Canadian society and so we demand that the Canadian society come forward and help us to root out this."

Her group was among several organizations that called on Harper, Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty and Toronto Mayor David Miller to hold a summit by month's end to tackle the problem of marginalized youth in their community who are falling prey to the pull of radical elements.
Her group was joined by the Canadian Council on American-Islamic Relations, the Muslim Students Association, Canadian Muslim Civil Liberties Association and several other agencies.

Their call was motivated by the recent arrests of 17 people in the Toronto area — including five youths — on charges they were plotting a bomb attack on Canadian soil.
But Siddiqui, a social worker, warned that more and more Muslim youth feel "marginalized and isolated" by the "ongoing harassment" of their faith, and are open to the recruiting of extremists.

"I'm seeing the children feeling as if they don't belong because of the onslaught on Islam and Islamo-phobia, the anti-Islam tilt in the media," she said.
"They feel there is no venue where they can express that resentment."
Siddiqui is hoping the proposed summit would develop a "tool kit" that could help parents and community leaders detect the "telltale" signs when young people get involved with extremists.

In the meantime, she says, parents need to stay alert to the influences on their children.
"If your children are hanging out in the mosque and they're talking to someone that you don't know, it's your duty to find out who they are," she said.
The call for a political summit, which would also involve community groups and youth organizations, won Miller's immediate support.

"We think this has to be addressed," Miller spokesperson Don Wanagas said, noting that the mayor was in contact with local Muslim leaders following the weekend vandalism of a Toronto mosque.
Queen's Park also offered its backing. In Ottawa, Public Safety Minister Stockwell Day was in touch with Muslim leaders to ask for more information.

Opposition leaders urged the Conservatives to get involved.
"In this situation, discussion is absolutely vital. We welcome the initiative," NDP Leader Jack Layton said.
"It's clearly a very challenging issue. It's heartening to see leaders from the breadth of the community coming forward and saying, `We've got a problem, we've got to talk about it,'" Layton said.

Still, Karl Nickner, the executive director of the Canadian Council on American-Islamic Relations, said the problem of radicalization is "almost impossible" to detect.
"I go in mosques across the country, I meet Muslims across the country and I don't hear it — it's very hidden."

He said the dramatic news of the alleged terror cell was a "wake-up call."
"I think that the events of the last weekend (were) a surprise for all of us, a shock for the Muslim community," he said.
At the same time, Nickner sought to distance the Muslim community from an alleged terror plot, saying terrorism is "antithetical" to Islam.

"Whether people decide to act in a radical way or not is not our problem as Muslims," he said.
 
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Offline Carcharodon Carcharias

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #86 on: June 09, 2006, 06:53:17 »
You know, over the years I have gotten a bad taste in my mouth for the ethinc communities (and the rest)calling themselves such, and our governments doing the same to be PC. What about Canadians of an islamic heritage, etc. You don't hear American Canadians, or English Canadians, yet alone Australian Canadians  ;D.

Canadians are simply that, regardless of colour and religion, and we should strive to keep our own identities as who we are at large, rather than have it drowned out or at least watered down.

I believe one of the first step to total acceptance from outside the circle is to attempt some type of assimilation (of course never forget your roots) is to maybe do this, and help narrow the gap, instead of widening it.

Time to cut the apron strings, and venture out.

Just a thought anyways.

Wes
« Last Edit: June 09, 2006, 07:17:14 by Wesley "Down Under" »
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Offline Wizard of OZ

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #87 on: June 09, 2006, 10:48:24 »
Wes

Could not agree with you more on the Canadian sentiment.  We seem to have forgotten the country we know live in over the one we left.

back on the topic.

I have yet to see any real press on how the Muslim community themselves are looking at dealing with this.  I heard rumblings that they want to meet with all levels of government in order to better develop a system to keep their youth on track.  Sounds like asking for money to me.  We can't solve our own problem so we will make the government give us money to solve it.

HL  I don't think a program is going to help it will be used against us like everything else.  The radicals don't want to change.  They want us to change.

You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war. Albert Einstein

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Offline tomahawk6

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #88 on: June 09, 2006, 15:57:08 »
A bit off the topic but Zarqawi and friends were in the basement of a building with a double concrete roof. Based on the photo it looks to me like Zarqawi was killed by the concussion of the bomb blast.

Now on topic. The article below is about the fact that mosques seem to be the one link in all of these terror groups that are being rolled up. The fact that the government fails to characterize the threat from islamic extremists for fear of not being pc is absurd. If the terrorists were chrisitian's I bet the media would be all over that angle.

http://www.investors.com/editorial/IBDArticles.asp?artsec=20&artnum=1&issue=20060608

17thRecceSgt

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #89 on: June 10, 2006, 09:57:46 »
 ::)

http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060609/terrorism_poll_060609

71% believe terrorists will hit Canada: poll
CTV.ca News Staff

A survey of Canadians conducted following the arrests of 17 terror suspects in southern Ontario found a significant shift in attitudes toward terrorism.

A poll conducted by The Strategic Counsel for CTV and The Globe and Mail found that 71 per cent of respondents believe an act of terrorism will take place on Canadian soil within the next few years.

That number is up nine per cent from a similar poll conducted between Aug. 3-7, 2005.

When asked about the likelihood of Canada being a terror target because of its military presence in Afghanistan, 56 per cent said we are more likely to be attacked.

This represents an increase of 18 per cent compared to one year ago. Thirty-four per cent say the military presence has no bearing; while five per cent say having soldiers in Afghanistan make us less susceptible to an attack.

"Clearly, Canadians feel the whole initiative in Afghanistan is making us more susceptible to terrorist attacks," The Strategic Counsel's Managing Partner Tim Woolstencroft told CTV.ca.

"But support for Afghanistan is up in all regions," he added.

Indeed, total support for sending troops rose to 48 per cent, compared to 40 per cent in a similar poll conducted May 3-4.

Those opposed dropped 10 points to 44 per cent since May.

Woolstencroft says, however, that "evidence suggests if there are more Canadian deaths, support for the war will probably go south."

Interestingly, an increasing number of people believe Canada is well prepared to deal with a terror threat should one occur.

Thirty-seven per cent say we're well prepared -- up 12 points since August, 2005; while 56 per cent say the nation is not well prepared, down 11 per cent.

Woolstencroft warned, however, that public opinion is far from being set, and that evidence suggests Canadians have a great deal of ambivalence about the mission in Afghanistan.

While the recent arrests of terror suspects have increased the public's confidence in the authorities, he warned there are still significant percentages of the population who believe Canada is not well prepared.

Immigration

A whopping 87 per cent of Canadians believe there are likely more active terrorist cells operating in Canada despite the recent arrests, and that terrorism will continue to be a threat.

When asked what measure against the war on terrorism that Canadians would support, 41 per cent said they would agree to restrict the numbers of immigrants allowed into Canada from Muslim countries.

The number, however, is up just two per cent since Aug. 2005.

Woolstencroft points out that Canadians' basic assumptions about immigration and the diversity of this country "haven't been shaken at all by (these latest arrests)."

"Clearly, the results suggest a high degree of tolerance (for immigrants). This hasn't shifted Canadian attitudes toward immigration at all," he said.

When asked whether Canadians should be doing more to integrate immigrants into our culture, 37 per cent said we should be increasing our efforts, while 56 per cent said no new efforts are required.

Critics, however, wish Canada would speed up efforts to assimilate immigrant communities. They also contend that Canada lets in far too many immigrants without thorough screening.

While Washington has congratulated Canada for the recent arrest of terror suspects, some U.S. congressmen took the opportunity to criticize Canada's immigration laws.

Rep. Peter King, a New York Republican who chairs the House Homeland Security Committee, said Canada has "a disproportionate number of al Qaeda. ... because of their very liberal immigration laws (and) because of how political asylum is granted so easily."

Rep. John Hostettler of Indiana said many Canadian immigrants don't share "traditional Canadian values."

And David Harris, a former Canadian security official, suggested this week that Canada suspend its immigration and refugee program until it reduces security risks.

Wilson defended the system, saying Canada's ratio of accepting asylum-seekers was roughly the same as that of the U.S.

Canada's ambassador to the United States, however, says the accusations are off-base.

"Is the process perfect? No," Michael Wilson told The Associated Press on Friday. "But I think the results are pretty darned good. ... We have a reputation for fairness and compassion, but we've also got a very good system for screening every applicant."

Wilson noted that Canada tightened immigration procedures after the Sept. 11 attacks in the United States. But no further changes are planned because of the recent arrests.

Technical information

Interviews for this poll were conducted between June 7 and 8, 2006.

Nationally, 1,000 people were sampled. The sampling error is plus or minus 3.1 percentage points, 19 times out of 20.

With files from The Associated Press



Offline ACIGSkyler

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #90 on: June 10, 2006, 18:24:24 »
Quote
"Clearly, Canadians feel the whole initiative in Afghanistan is making us more susceptible to terrorist attacks," The Strategic Counsel's Managing Partner Tim Woolstencroft told CTV.ca.

Seems to me we were a target long before that.

Quote
Woolstencroft says, however, that "evidence suggests if there are more Canadian deaths, support for the war will probably go south."

I don't have any evidence, but don't think thats true. I could be fooling myself though.

Quote
Nationally, 1,000 people were sampled. The sampling error is plus or minus 3.1 percentage points, 19 times out of 20.

More indepth information on the sampling would be helpful: Political leanings, age, location, that sort of thing.

Court

17thRecceSgt

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #91 on: June 10, 2006, 20:54:54 »
Well, this could be some headway that has been mentioned more than once...

http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060609/muslim_leaders_060610

Muslim leaders want 'radical elements' removed
CTV.ca News Staff

Muslim religious leaders promise to report any suspicious behaviour from their followers to authorities and abide by a zero-tolerance policy against preaching hatred in the wake of last week's terror arrests.

Leaders representing more than 30 mosques and Muslim organizations throughout Canada gathered in Toronto Saturday to deliver the message, and remind Canadians not to discriminate against Muslims.

The leaders admitted there are pockets of radical fundamentalists within their community who believe in violence, but said co-operation by the Muslim community led to the arrests of 17 terror suspects.

The alleged bombing plot in southern Ontario was a wakeup call to Muslims who were shocked and appalled by the arrests, leaders said.

Ahmed Amiruddin taught at a Mississauga mosque where some of the accused worshipped.

"They would sometimes appear in the mosque with military fatigues, and there's more than one witness for this. Many people have seen them," Amiruddin said.

The alleged terror ringleader, 43-year-old Qayyum Abdul Jamal, was a role model for teenagers at the Al-Rahman Islamic Centre in Mississauga, which was also attended by six other detained terror suspects.

"Let's make sure that we take a second look at who we are allowing to come and preach, what books are allowed into our centres," said Asad Dean, of the Meadowvale Islamic Centre.

"We will have to become more vigilant as well in the Muslim community, that if we see any signs of this that we immediately pay attention and take action to address this issue."

The Canadian Council of Ahl Sunna wal Jamaah (CCAS) blamed the Toronto terror plot, as well of terror attacks in London and Madrid, on a small minority of Muslims who subscribe to a "vile doctrine of literalistic ideology."

The group emphasized the "vast majority" of Canadian Muslims follow a moderate form of Islam.

"The (CCAS) is convinced that the time has come for Muslim Canadians to adopt a different approach in view of the reality it now finds itself in,'' said spokesman Akbar Khan.

Liberal MP Wajid Khan said he is tired of hearing Muslim speakers emphasizing that Islam is not to blame for the arrests.

"Nobody is saying it is (Islam)," he said. "Why are we talking about these 17 people based on faith?"

"Let's not take the temperature up so high," he said. "There is an issue and we have to address it as a nation."

With a report from CTV Toronto's Desmond Brown and files from The Canadian Press







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Offline Thucydides

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #93 on: June 11, 2006, 22:55:35 »
From Free Will, a nasty "sum up" for Eric Margolis:

http://www.freewillblog.com/ Sunday June 11 2006

Quote
Broad Strata Arrested

The Royal Canadian Mounted Police uncovers a plot to murder hordes of innocent Ontarians.

    From an unmarried computer programmer to a university health sciences graduate and the unemployed, the 17 suspects charged in a foiled terrorist plot represent a "broad strata'' of Canadian society.

    "Some are students, some are employed, some are unemployed,'' RCMP assistant Commissioner Mike McDonell said Saturday.

One might also take that to mean that they include both Sunnis and Shi'ites, since for such an diverse group, Michelle Malkin notes that they all seem to have something in common:

    1. Fahim Ahmad, 21, Toronto;
    2. Zakaria Amara, 20, Mississauga, Ont.;
    3. Asad Ansari, 21, Mississauga;
    4. Shareef Abdelhaleen, 30, Mississauga;
    5. Qayyum Abdul Jamal, 43, Mississauga;
    6. Mohammed Dirie, 22, Kingston, Ont.;
    7. Yasim Abdi Mohamed, 24, Kingston;
    8. Jahmaal James, 23, Toronto;
    9. Amin Mohamed Durrani, 19, Toronto;
    10. Steven Vikash Chand alias Abdul Shakur, 25, Toronto;
    11. Ahmad Mustafa Ghany, 21, Mississauga;
    12. Saad Khalid, 19, of Eclipse Avenue, Mississauga.

I'm sure this doesn't have anything to do with Islam. Indeed, four years ago, Tim Blair had already noted the poetry of Zakaria Amara:

    I'll always be a contender
    Yes, I know my bones are very tender
    And by Allah you won't see me surrender
    Look at my eyes? You'll see no butterflies
    My home is filled with cries... due to all the lost lives
    But I swear by Allah I'll never compromise
    I'll still throw the stones even with my broken bones
    Why can't I hear from you, don't you have any phones?
    Ya I forgot, your not on the chase, try it out and put your self in my place
    Soon I'll return to my lord, the one that deserves every grace
    Oh you don't have to worry cause of me you'll find no trace
    It really is too late, why did you wait?
    You could have sent me at least one dinner plate
    I guess it is my fate
    And La Ilaha Illa Allah is my mate.

Anybody who writes poetry that bad belongs in a prison cell. A similar argument can be made for anyone who has stockpiled three tons of explosives.

    The Canadian surveillance found members of the group on Jihadist sites "vowing to attack at home, in the name of oppressed Muslims here and abroad."

Sympathizing with this point of view is Toronto Sun columnist Eric Margolis, who shockingly declares that "Canada is a target", something Americans have been trying to explain to Canadians for years:

    Canadians got a taste of the real world over the past two days.

    The arrest Friday of 17 suspected terrorists is stark evidence Canadians can no longer expect to escape the private enterprise violence by small groups that we call "terrorism."

Note the obscure implication of the evils of capitalism: "Private enterprise violence". Sadly for Margolis, very rarely does terrorist activity come about through some effort at criminalistic enterprise, given that martyrdom eliminates the hope of escaping with the loot. Rather, it's almost always deliberately fomented, facilitated and supplied by national governments, whether it's the Soviets, the Libyans or the Iranians, even if it's indirectly through the establishment of wealthy and sympathetic mosques around the world.
(interpolation by me: Although this was very true in the past, I am not altogether certain this still applies today. Searching through historical analogies the closest that comes to mind is the nihilist/anarchist movements of the 1800s, where rather than a central motivating actor, anarchists and nihilists were motivated by a common set of ideas to attempt the assassinations of government leaders and so on.)

    Three weeks ago, I warned a conference of Department of National Defence staff and police officers that the greatest security threat to Canada would come not from the shadowy al-Qaida organization abroad, but from angry young Canadian Muslims opposed to Canada's presence in Afghanistan and its tacit support of U.S. policy in Iraq and Palestine.

This raises one of my favorite "Canadian stories", a conversation with a woman who was baffled at why we were attacking Iraq, a country that wasn't directly tied to Al Qaeda. The notion that there is a general "Islamic terror" problem completely paralyzed her sensibilities. Margolis, too, apparently feels that this was some kind of radical new idea.

    The previous terrorist bombings in London and Madrid were not conducted by al-Qaida operatives freelancing from Afghanistan or Pakistan.

    They were carried out by young British-born Muslim men and Spanish residents opposed to their nation's intervention in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    The 17 arrested men are all apparently Muslim, with one possible exception. The RCMP alleges the suspects planned to use three tons of fertilizer (ammonium nitrate) to build deadly truck bombs for use against targets in southern Ontario.

    This scenario is plausible.

Indeed it is. Canadians complain that Americans believe their country is being used as a base for Islamist terrorist cells, but ignore that the Canadian Intelligence Service said so way back in 2000.

    Radical Muslims around the world see western intervention in Iraq and Afghanistan as crimes against the Islamic world, part of a new anti-Muslim crusade directed from Washington.

Nevermind that these people didn't see the government of Afghanistan as crimes against the Islamic world, which makes their perverted version of Islam a bloodthirsty death cult which should be opposed and fought by all civilized and just people. What's really important here is how the intervention makes everybody feel, apparently.

    A small number of extremists may have decided to punish Canada for sending troops to fight in Afghanistan.

One of that small number of extremists? An obscure figure known as Osama bin Laden, who specifically named Canada and several other nations for daring to defy him, implying they'd face the same sort of wrath Australia faced in the Bali bombings for trying to save innocent people in East Timor.

Begin obligatory anti-American conspiracy theory:

    These raids by hundreds of Canadian security officers and police against a relatively small number of mostly young Muslim suspects in Mississauga, Toronto and Kingston suggest this high-profile operation may have been designed as much for public relations and diplomatic reasons as national security. No doubt, Washington will be very pleased with Prime Minister Stephen Harper.

    But not everyone accused is always guilty.

    It's possible that among the 12 adults and five minors charged, Canadian security organizations have rounded up some loud-mouthed teenagers who have been encouraged to sedition by government "agents provocateurs."

Look for this in the next Michael Moore movie: "Their poetry is so bad, they couldn't possibly have written it themselves. Besides, this could never happen in Canada!"

    In any event, by sending combat troops to Afghanistan, Canada has declared itself an active participant in the U.S.-led war against Islamic militancy.

Also, a country populated by "human beings". Of course, Afghanistan is a pretty low bar, since even the French went in on that one.

    As a result, Canadians must now expect what CIA veterans refer to as "blow-back."

    Once admired by all and hated by none, Canada has now made itself a terrorist target.

It always was, Eric, it always was, just like every other country that doesn't understand why voting is Satanic. You poor, naive soul.

Margolis is apparently warning that Canada should not use their power, such as it is, to help the innocent and do what's morally right, but instead only to avoid the slings and arrows of responsibility. He clearly believes that if Canada had never gone into Afghanistan, they would not be a terrorist target today. Unfortunately, Islamist "militants" themselves hold kafir nations to a rather higher standard, as Indonesian "spiritual leader" Abu Bakar Bashir explained from his prison cell:

    SA: What can the West, especially the US, do to make the world more peaceful?

    ABB: They have to stop fighting Islam. That's impossible because it is sunnatullah [destiny, a law of nature], as Allah has said in the Koran. If they want to have peace, they have to accept to be governed by Islam....We'll keep fighting them and they'll lose. The batil [falsehood] will lose sooner or later. I sent a letter to Bush. I said that you'll lose and there is no point for you [to fight us]. This [concept] is found in the Koran.

    SA: How can the American regime and its policies change?

    ABB: We'll see. As long as there is no intention to fight us and Islam continues to grow there can be peace. This is the doctrine of Islam. Islam can't be ruled by others. Allah's law must stand above human law. There is no [example] of Islam and infidels, the right and the wrong, living together in peace.

If Canada wants peace, they must abandon their ways and accept the rise and eventual global rule of Islamic law. Saudi Sheikh Muhammed Salih al-Munajjid concurs:

    If Islam was only spread by peaceful means, what would the kuffaar have to be afraid of? Of mere words spoken on the tongue?...Would the kuffaar be afraid of being told, "become Muslim, but if you do not then you are free to believe and do whatever you want"? or were they afraid of jihad and the imposition of the jizyah and being humiliated? That may make them enter Islam so that they may be spared this humiliation....

    This is something for which Islam deserves to be praised, not condemned. The defeatists should fear Allaah lest they distort this religion and cause it to become weak on the basis of the claim that it is a religion of peace. Yes, it is the religion of peace but in the sense of saving all of mankind from worshipping anything other than Allaah and submitting all of mankind to the rule of Allaah.

Next week, Margolis explains that Canada should've expected "blowback" for not executing women who wear miniskirts.

The interview with Abu Bakar Bashir is a very clear indication of the "Root Causetm" of terrorism; the desire to control the community through fear and force, rather than achieve leadership through consensual means. No amount of negotiation, dialogue or appeasment will stay their hands, we need to go about our day to day usiness as usual (our victory) and keep our eyes open for signs of trouble.
Dagny, this is not a battle over material goods. It's a moral crisis, the greatest the world has ever faced and the last. Our age is the climax of centuries of evil. We must put an end to it, once and for all, or perish - we, the men of the mind. It was our own guilt. We produced the wealth of the world - but we let our enemies write its moral code.

Offline zipperhead_cop

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #94 on: June 12, 2006, 15:24:18 »
This lawyer/clown needs to take a little "tour" of the middle east, much the same way Mr. Loney needs too. 

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/12062006/2/national-lawyers-say-terror-suspects-tortured-detention.html

Lawyers say some of the terror suspects are being tortured while in detention
1 hour, 35 minutes ago
By Gregory Bonnell
 
BRAMPTON, Ont. (CP) - Lawyers representing the terror suspects arrested in the Toronto area earlier this month say some of the men are being tortured and beaten while in detention.


Rocco Galati told reporters Monday that the men are being kept in isolation in rooms that are lit 24 hours a day and are woken up every half hour.


Another lawyer said his client was beaten by a guard after he giggled because he felt ticklish while being searched.


David Kolinsky said the guard pinned his client to the ground, drilled his knuckle into the man's cheek and said, "is this funny?"


"Under the convention against torture and other cruel and unusual punishment the instances of mistreatment that defence counsel have cited as going on at the jail constitute torture," Galati said outside the court where some of 17 men accused in an alleged terror plot appeared.


Galati said the men have been denied access to their lawyers and have been allowed no time outdoors for five straight days.


He said the accused are given only five minutes to eat their meals or else the food is taken away.


The men are not allowed to speak to anyone, including the guards, and are being forced to keep their eyes on the floor at all times.


"When they are escorted or walked from point A to point B, they must walk at a 90-degree angle with their legs upright and their torso across at a 90-degree angle with handcuffs stretched out and be escorted by three armed tactical members of the security forces," he said.


Galati called the treatment of the men and youths "unprecedented" and said the suspects have been publicly declared guilty by the prime minister, the mayor of Toronto and some Muslim community leaders.


These and other actions associated with the case call into question whether the accused could now get fair treatment by the justice system, the lawyer said.


"Within mere days of the arrests, the prime minister of Canada and the mayor of Toronto publicly declared the guilt of the accused," Galati said outside the courthouse.


"Some leaders of the opposition, MPs and senators have also declared their guilt," he said.


"Self-proclaimed leaders of the Muslim community, in a desperate attempt to distance themselves from the accused have declared them guilty as well."


Galati represents Ahmad Mustafa Ghany, a 21-year-old recent health sciences graduate of McMaster University in Hamilton. Ghany is the son of a doctor who immigrated to Canada from Trinidad and Tobago more than 40 years ago.


The 17 suspects face a variety of charges including knowingly participating in or contributing to terrorist activity, providing or receiving training for terrorist purposes and providing or making available property for a terrorist activity.


Weapons and explosives charges include committing indictable offences, in this case planning to cause an explosion and importing firearms and ammunition, to benefit a terrorist group.

The maximum sentences for participating in terrorism, training and making property available are 10 years in prison.

The weapons and explosives offences would be crimes in any case, but proof that they were linked to a terrorist objective would raise the maximum sentence to life in prison.

Galati also pointed to the heavy military force surrounding court proceedings last week, including the presence of SWAT team members inside the courtroom, saying it all leads to the denial of a fair bail hearing.

"The military show of force was oppressive and . . . included three outside perimeters with a tactical team with automatic assault rifles, rooftop snipers, helicopters and dogs," he said.

"It also included inside the courtroom armed SWAT team members with automatic assault rifles."

Media from around the world were at the courthouse, as they were last week when the men made their first appearance, but their families had no comment.

Several male family members or supporters held hands to form a protective ring around the women as they made their way from the parking lot into the courthouse.

Among those in attendance was Karim Khadr, the son of Ahmed Said Khadr, an associate of Osama bin Laden who was killed in a fire fight with Pakistani forces in 2003.


It is pretty hilarious/annoying how easy it is to throw around the "torture" label these days.  I imagine that not letting them have their favorite bankies and New Jihadists on the Block CD's is torture too.
God loves stupid people.  That's why He made so many of them.

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Offline van Gemeren

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #95 on: June 12, 2006, 17:52:42 »
Lawyers for bomb plot suspects upset over publication ban

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2006/06/12/galati-client.html

Last Updated Mon, 12 Jun 2006 16:45:53 EDT
CBC News
Lawyers for some of the suspects in the alleged plot to bomb high-profile sites in southern Ontario are upset that a judge has placed a publication ban on the proceedings.

 
Rocco Galati, the lawyer for two of the 17 bomb plot suspects, is angry over police leaks: 'There is no way, in my professional view, that these accused can now have a fair trial.' (CBC) 
Rocco Galati, who represents 21-year-old Ahmad Ghany, said he will appeal the ban, arguing it's unfair because of the damaging allegations that have been made in public against his clients.

Defence lawyer Arif Raza echoed Galati, saying he sees no need for a ban now.

"Rather than have speculation in the press, I think that justice would be better served by accurately reporting what precisely had happened in the court."

The 12 adults and five youths were arrested in southern Ontario on June 2-3 and charged under the federal Anti-terrorism Act. Fourteen appeared in court in Brampton, Ont., on Monday as a judge set out the terms for their bail hearings.

The ban, which applies to evidence heard in court, comes as lawyers for some of the suspects claim their clients are being mistreated while they are in custody.

David Kolinsky, a lawyer representing Zakaria Amara, said his client was assaulted by one of the guards. He claimed that as his client was being searched, the guard touched his ribs.

"He's ticklish. He giggled a bit," Kolinsky said. He said the guard then pinned Amara down to the ground and drilled his finger into his cheek "quite hard and said, 'Is this funny?'"

Kolinsky added that the guard also flicked him quite hard on the eye.

Galati said his clients were being kept in rooms that are lit 24 hours a day and were denied access to the outdoors for the first five days.

"They have five minutes to eat their meals or they are taken away," he said.

"The accused are not aliens from another planet. They are Canadians accused under the Criminal Code. No more, no less."

When being taken somewhere by guards, they must walk with their legs upright and torso at a 90-degree angle with their arms stretched out, he said.

Galati also claimed that security officials are leaking information, which could compromise a fair trial.

He alleged Monday that "confidential police sources" were feeding information to the news media while lawyers were being kept in the dark.

"There is no way, in my professional view, that these accused can now have a fair trial. How is that possible?" Galati said to reporters outside the courthouse.

"The politicians and select members of the media are given heads-up of investigations, given heads-up of arrests. It is unprecedented."

Meanwhile, Galati alleges that defence lawyers have not been provided with any evidence, only allegations.

Meant to influence MPs, lawyer alleges

The adult suspects — who range in age from 19 to 43 and are all residents of Ontario — have been charged with a variety of offences, including knowingly participating in a terrorist group and either receiving or providing terrorist training.

Investigators identified them as individuals who were "inspired by al-Qaeda," the militant Islamic group that took credit for the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the United States.

Galati called the timing of the arrests suspicious and accused security officials of trying to influence members of Parliament, who will soon vote on whether to extend the Anti-terrorism Act, which became part of the Criminal Code in December 2001.

The MPs will soon vote on extending the law, which gives police the power to arrest people and hold them without charge for up to 72 hours if they're suspected of planning a terrorist act. It also makes it easier for police to use electronic surveillance in their investigation of certain offences.

Galati also alleges that the arrests were meant to sway this week's planned Supreme Court hearings on the constitutionality of the legislation.

'The accused are not aliens from another planet. They are Canadians accused under the Criminal Code. No more, no less.'
-Rocco Galati, lawyer for a suspect in the alleged bomb plotPrior to these arrests, only one other person had been charged under the anti-terrorist provisions, which were introduced largely in response to the Sept. 11 attacks on the U.S.
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Offline Nerf herder

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #96 on: June 12, 2006, 18:05:21 »
Torture 'eh?      ::)

More accusations and heresay....anything to get a sound bite on the news IMHO.

Prove the guards did it and have 'em charged.

As for the lights and getting checked up on....perhapse Bruce can shed some light on it.

Methinks it may be to prevent a suicide?

My $0.02 worth.

Regards


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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #97 on: June 12, 2006, 20:04:55 »
I know most of the CO's that are taking care of these lads..........and Mr-Lawyer man is just setting up for the "waaah" argument here.

Trust me, there are more sets of "eyes" on these guys and the area they are in than on tonight's hockey game.
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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #98 on: June 12, 2006, 23:26:38 »
I knew I remembered this POS from somewhere.  Apparantly...he has a new set of balls or a change of heart...or an empty bank account.

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1070625559684_109//

Terror suspect lawyer quits cases over threat
Updated Fri. Dec. 5 2003 7:50 AM ET

CTV.ca News Staff

A prominent Toronto lawyer known for defending national security cases says he won't be handling any more. Rocco Galati says he's heeding a frightening death threat over his handling the case of Abdul Rahman Khadr.

Galati says he received the threat on his answering machine the day after he held a news conference with Khadr, a Canadian citizen recently returned to Toronto after two years in a U.S.-run military prison in Cuba.

The short message from a man's voice says: "Well, Mr. Galati. What's this I hear about you working with the terrorist now, helping to get that (expletive) punk terrorist Khadr off. You a dead wop."

"I received the message. I take it seriously. And I am withdrawing from all my national security cases," Galati told reporters Thursday.

Galati says be believes the message was from someone involved with a U.S. intelligence agency. He says the voice is familiar to him and his counsel, Paul Slansky, from a previous case.

"This is serious. This is an institutional threat. It's not an individual threat," Galati said, with Slansky at his side.

"The voice is similar and likely the same as a voice of someone who threatened one of our former clients," he said, adding later that "in that case, our client disappeared."

"This message is different from the run-of-the-mill rantings and ravings that one as a lawyer will normally receive."

"Any lawyer call tell a serious threat from a loon, and this is a serious threat." ( I doubt this POS could tell time)
Galati says he went to local police and the RCMP requesting protection, but they refused. He says all they did was to put his house on alert for 911 emergency calls. He says he doesn't feel safe enough to continue handling national security cases.

As he spoke, he choked back tears but said it wasn't because he feared for his safety.

"I'm on the verge of tears because it means we now live in Colombia because the rule of law is meaningless. It means that lawyers cannot represent anyone even in what you profess to be a democracy here in Canada."

Steven Skurka, Canada AM's legal analyst, says he was shocked when he heard those comments.

"When you say something like that, your credibility with the public just goes down to zero. What may a real threat is to take that seriously -- this is not Colombia, I can tell you, and the rule of law still operates," Skurke said.

In Ottawa, the Canadian Security Intelligence Service (CSIS) called Galati's suggestion that intelligence agencies may have been behind the threat "absurd."

"The allegation that CSIS had any involvement in the death threat, that's absurd," spokesperson Nicole Currier told The Canadian Press.

Galati has represented many high-profile cases concerning allegations of terrorism and national security. But he says now, having been refused protection, he's dropping them all.

In his latest case, Galati, who was called to the bar in 1989, pressed Ottawa to help return Khadr to Canada. He has been a strong advocate for Khadr since his repatriation.

Khadr has insisted that neither he nor his family has any links to terrorism. He admitted to training at an "al Qaeda-related training camp" in Afghanistan in 1998, but denied his family has ties to Osama bin Laden.

Khadr's brother Omar remains in custody in Guantanamo Bay, the lone Canadian citizen there. Like the more than 660 other detainees, he has not been charged with any crime.

Galati's other clients have included accused Al Jihad member Mahmoud Jaballah, who was held in solitary confinement for more than two years without charge.

Before talking to the media Thursday, Galati also withdrew as lawyer for Abdellah Ouzghar, a Hamilton resident who is in the process of being deported to France based on a conviction of falsifying passports.




Offline FormerHorseGuard

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Re: National security forces arrest 17 in Toronto raids
« Reply #99 on: June 13, 2006, 00:18:14 »
I think the idea of being mistreated by the guards is a whole lot of white wash and bull crappies.

1) lights on all night, my reasoning for this and I did not give any long term thinking to the problem.

possible reasons for this are: a) sucide watch, no guard will want to have one of them do it on his shift, too hard to explain tot he media and lawyers why they did not see it happening and stop it.  some of them might try it to get more attention, become a martyr to their cause.
after all  if they die for their cause they get to go straight to their version of heaven and have a whole lot of virgins to do their bidding

b) the handcuff thing, I think all immates get that treatment and it is for the guards protection and other immates protection, if every one walks in the same manner, everyone can see where the immates hands are.

c) having to talk thru plexiglass walls, i see that in most jails on tv,  do not see a problem, comes into personal protection on both sides of the glass.

d) little or no privacy, they are in jail and what do you expect. it is not a hotel with personal room attendants to take care of every need and desire.

e) not being allowed outside, do these guys really want to risk being put out with other guests of the hotel, some of the other guests might not take to kindly to strangers wanting to blow up their city.

if they want to see torture and have something to complain about, let them go back to the country of their religion and see how well they are cared for over there.

I am sure there are some Canadians out there that could be selected for jury duty who could form their own opinions on a person's guilt or not guilty without having the government and the police and any one else tell them how to think on this matter.

I person think i could be a good juror and form my own ideas on if they are guilty or not. I do not need a Pm or police officer to help or guide me to that  idea. 

I do not understand why a lawyer would think that his fellow Canadians cannot or would think and form their own opinions on the matter.
I have formed my and I hope the jury forms their own opinions on the case when they hear it.
I do not think they are guilty of everything but they are guilty of something. what crimes they commited i do not know till i read the case as it comes to trial, and I am sure other people will keep an open mind to this fact too.

I hope they catch who ever called that lawyer and charge them with case tampering or what ever they get charged with, it is not legal they broke the law punish them too.