Author Topic: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???  (Read 30301 times)

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Offline tiger2099

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Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« on: June 18, 2007, 12:58:05 »
\Hey all,

I just got back from ACS in Trenton on Saturday, I passed CAPSS and the medicals in Toronto, I was very excited thinking that this meant I would recieve an offer, but I just spoke with my selection officer at my recruiting center and he told me that I probably wont get an offer because of how many people applied. I am going for ROTP, How does it work? Will I not get an offer even though i passed everything including air nav? I really had my hopes up for this. I dont understand why they sent me and spent so much money so I would get tested and not be willing to accept me if I passed. Did this happen to anyone else? Will I get an offer? Any experience with this? Thanks any help would be appreciated!
« Last Edit: June 18, 2007, 13:03:02 by tiger2099 »

Offline volition

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2007, 13:10:09 »
Welcome to the military, and your not even in it yet. Not everyone that passes the ASC gets an offer!
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Offline Moody

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2007, 13:32:47 »
You are not the first person who applied for Pilot and heard something they didn't want to hear.

All I can say is let the board decide whether you are in or not. Basically, you passed aircrew - that is another checkmark beside the long list of requirements to be considered for Pilot. Now it is a matter of how do you compare against all the other applicants...

Best wishes and good luck.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2007, 13:35:20 by MikeG »

Offline tiger2099

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2007, 13:40:22 »
Well thats definatly not something i would like to hear! Considering how I assumed that if I pass ASC that i would be in. Is there anything I can do at this point to increase my chances of being selected?? Should I send them all gift baskets of something? !!!

Offline ChrisG

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2007, 19:52:59 »
Speaking as the parent of an pilot  trainee and another applicant. . . .

You may not get an offer immediately, depends on the number of places available.  You may even get a "Sorry we don't need you"    However I know of people who have had both of those and then months later received an offer.

The Air Force still needs pilots.  It all depends on the number leaving after their term,  the number presently in the system, the number of  places available in courses and just where the backups in the process are.   The Forces are also entering a phase of new equipment and expanding roles, a much better time to be lining up that when they are reducing them.   Unfortunately I don't think it is the Forces practice to tell everyone the whys and wherefores and the uncertainty is rather stressful.

The benefit of your position at the moment is that you do know that when the Air Force needs pilot entrants you have already qualified. 

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2007, 19:56:19 »
Considering how I assumed that if I pass ASC that i would be in.

That's your first mistake

Offline Ditch

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2007, 20:28:17 »
I see that you have also applied for ROTP - if you want the military to foot the bill for University (be it RMC or civi-u) you need to compete for those positions.  Now that you have passed for Pilot, you must now compete on an equal field with everyone else that has applied to RMC - it is your marks and social interaction that is being looked at now.

If you had already obtained your degree and were applying under DEO - it would be a completely different story.  The CF needs pilots now, you would not be ready to be trained for pilot training until close to 5 years from now.

Good luck
Per Ardua Ad Astra

Offline tiger2099

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2007, 20:39:17 »
See I thought i was competitive becuase I have some Post secondary done. Well I guess ill do my Bach of Business in Aviation untill they pick me up..
So... If I continue my first year in University, can i apply for ROTP again next year so they pick up the last 3 years of my degree? That way I already have one year under my belt.

Offline zorro

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2007, 22:02:48 »
Yep you can.

Interesting that you applied rotp and have just finished asc....

I applied to the same entry plan earlier in the year, attended asc and passed everything. I didn't get an offer for my first choice (PLT). The rotp selections for PLT '06-'07 have already all been filled...and all officer candidates leave the Canada Day long weekend for IAP in St. Jean. They gave me an offer for Air LOG, while PLT was what I really wanted I still fly recreationally and hope that in the future I will have the opportunity to VOR or OT. Having school paid with a nice salary while your still finishing is a hard thing to turn down. Not to mention a great starting salary once you are commissioned 2LT, along with the benefits and everything else that goes with being part of the CF.

In your case, your file will probably be reactivated come next year when the 07-08 intake for rotp occurs. As far as I know, offers for PLT will now go out for CEOTP and DEO applicants, and ROTP PLT offers wont be going out until march '08.

As zoomie said, the ROTP entry plan is extremely competitive. That coupled with a competitive occupation means that you have an exceptional candidate pool to pull from and the CF can be picky because the shear volume of applications allows for this...

Try again next year, and in the meantime try to improve your application. Look at building some flying time privately at local flying clubs. While this is expensive and your civy credentials mean nothing to the CF, it shows that you have a genuine interest in aviation and makes you that much more of an edge over the hundreds of others that have the same dream.

Good luck.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke

Offline tiger2099

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2007, 13:56:04 »
Yeah i just got back on the 16th of June. I wonder why they would send me and others to CAPSS knowing we are ROTP and there are no spots left. Well Ill just keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best. I hear the CAPSS is on your file forever so once you do it its done. Persistence will pay off eventually. 

Offline PLT_Derek

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2007, 18:48:00 »
Hello,
I'm headed to Trenton this Saturday for Aircrew Selection!  Anyone else going to be there next week?
I actually have a couple questions related to this thread:

1. If I pass ASC, does anyone know when the board will be meeting next?  I'm DEO, so I'm hoping they are still accepting them this year.
2. Is there still quite a demand for pilots in the CF's? 

I actually did ASC about 2 years ago and didn't pass.  Unfortunately for me, I had a PPL at the time, but I still really wanted to get in so I went and got a CPL in order to retest.  I'm thinking I have what it takes this time... but I've learned once not to get too "attached" until you get that offer... I was pretty devastated when I read that piece of paper that said: PILOT___ NO____.

Anyway, I've been reading a lot of useful info on this board - thanks for all the great posts, and hopefully I'll be flying with some of you soon:)

Offline Quyen

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2007, 22:33:40 »
I think most of the offers for the DEO iap/botc starting aug 27 went out. You would prob get in Jan at the soonest.

Offline Astrodog

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2007, 22:52:50 »
Yeah i just got back on the 16th of June. I wonder why they would send me and others to CAPSS knowing we are ROTP and there are no spots left.
Quote
I hear the CAPSS is on your file forever so once you do it its done.
question answered?
Quote
Persistence will pay off eventually. 
Fact... I got a 2 Nos including a ROTP no before I got my offer for CEOTP last week. Thought it would never come, but if you want it bad enough it will come.
Aspiring Zoomie

Offline zorro

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2007, 01:05:10 »
I've heard mixed stories with respect to the CAPSS "checkout" being good for life...

Can anyone confirm this with certainty?
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #14 on: June 20, 2007, 22:53:06 »
Zorro, I heard 5 years.  Again, nothing from official sources.

Max

Offline zorro

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2007, 01:54:21 »
Yeah I've heard that as well, among other stories.

Although it wouldn't be too far fetched that CAPSS passes carry forward indefinately. A friend of mine just completed Civy-U and is now 2LT. He is in for ATC, and had originally applied PLT as his first choice. Unfortunately for him he failed CAPSS @ CFASC. The point of this story is that while he was still finishing university he had tried to transfer to PLT (according to him ROTP candidates that are still enrolled in university can apply for a reassignment at any time prior to their graduation). But his transfer was rejected on the basis that he had already attended ASC and failed CAPSS.

The fact that they still had this on record (I would assume) means that they track both candidate passes and fails. Makes sense,,,why spend the money on you to attend and just throw away the file?

Also, CFAO 10-1 under "Eligibility" states; "...Officers who previously attended the Canadian Forces Aircrew Selection Centre (CFASC) and did not attain a minimum pilot aptitude index (STANINE) of six (6) are not eligible for transfer to the Pilot MOC."

Again, why track only fails? Passes must be tracked, the question really becomes how long are they valid for?
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke

Offline Rowshambow

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2007, 11:50:41 »
You can fail it more than once, so why has your friend not tried again? I was talking to a guy here in Edmonton who failed it in Jan, and he is practicing (and getting his ppl) Apparently you have to show how you have improved to show you actually want the trade! He also said that there was a WO on his selection that failed it twice before, After the first failure, he got his ppl, and then failed and had to get his cpl.  He apparently passed last time (second hand info so not sure how legit it is, but the person I was talking to was pretty bang on!)
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Offline tiger2099

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2007, 13:43:10 »
So who makes the decision who gets in as ROTP?
Is it the officer that is handling my file at the recruiting center?

Offline beach_bum

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #18 on: June 21, 2007, 13:48:33 »
Your file was sent to Borden where a board looked at all of the files and decided who got offers.
Eddie would go!

Offline zorro

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2007, 21:49:48 »
Rowshambo,

I'm not sure about the specifics of the regulations. As far as I know, if you are already a member of the CF and you fail CAPSS, any subsequent applications for the PLT MOC are denied. At least thats the way it was explained to me, and thats what the "book" says.

I think what your referring to is Civy applicants. Its true that if you fail CAPSS the first time you can re-apply, as long as you have bettered yourself (ie. PPL, or CPL) from the previous time you had attended.

My friend did try to remuster the year after he was unsuccessful at CFASC but like I said his application was denied.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke

Offline Rowshambow

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #20 on: June 22, 2007, 12:32:23 »
Zorro, are you sure because I am sure the person I was talking about would not go out spend alot of money, let alone the time constaints to finish his PPL,  Maybe some of the pilots here could inform us? Maybe your friend was denied because he didn't do any "upgrading" from what he had before, or he was already in other training too deep! I do know an ex Strat officer that failed on Basic flight, was sent to the Armoured Corps, he (just last year) re-mustered back to pilot, but he didn't have to redo the CAPPS, as it was already done.
A pilot (I am currently working at a Tac Hel Sqn) just walked into my office (I knew him from before), we were talking about ASC, he was saying that you could be an awesome pilot, but you are "graded" on a learning curve, so if you fly the same every time (with no improvements) than you could fail, as you haven't improved in the computers eyes! He said he was talking to one of the computer gurus from the Atlantis corp (makers of the Capps) and he said the best marks (or perfect curve) was from the cleaning lady! They apparently threw her in there one day and she did awesome!?
So back to the topic at hand, I think it's like most people are saying, depends on alot of factors, why not also try to apply under different plans? (CEOTP) just to make your chances better?
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Offline zorro

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #21 on: June 22, 2007, 13:30:50 »
That would be a feasible option if your still civy.

I'm already in ROTP... and I'm still green so once I learn how the system works I'll figure out a way to get there sooner or later...
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #22 on: June 22, 2007, 17:08:25 »
You can do a PPL and re-do CAPPS, even once you've join and failed CAPPS once.  Many of my friends did it and are in the Jaw with me right now...

Max
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Offline volition

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #23 on: September 04, 2007, 13:56:31 »
Zorro, are you sure because I am sure the person I was talking about would not go out spend alot of money, let alone the time constaints to finish his PPL,  Maybe some of the pilots here could inform us? Maybe your friend was denied because he didn't do any "upgrading" from what he had before, or he was already in other training too deep! I do know an ex Strat officer that failed on Basic flight, was sent to the Armoured Corps, he (just last year) re-mustered back to pilot, but he didn't have to redo the CAPPS, as it was already done.
A pilot (I am currently working at a Tac Hel Sqn) just walked into my office (I knew him from before), we were talking about ASC, he was saying that you could be an awesome pilot, but you are "graded" on a learning curve, so if you fly the same every time (with no improvements) than you could fail, as you haven't improved in the computers eyes! He said he was talking to one of the computer gurus from the Atlantis corp (makers of the Capps) and he said the best marks (or perfect curve) was from the cleaning lady! They apparently threw her in there one day and she did awesome!?
So back to the topic at hand, I think it's like most people are saying, depends on alot of factors, why not also try to apply under different plans? (CEOTP) just to make your chances better?

So does that mean you fly horrible the first flights, then do that much better on your last ones?? Must be somebody here that can clearify this, who have worked there!!
You threat me right, I'll threat you better.
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Offline lotion

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Re: Done ACS and CAPSS, Will i not get an offer???
« Reply #24 on: September 07, 2007, 14:30:04 »
I've always wondered that.....I got a buddy of my that failed, and he did not crash the thing, or get any warnings, but others freezing the thing, multiple warnings, and they passed. Funny you should mention that!! ???