Author Topic: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test  (Read 31681 times)

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Offline machine463

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60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« on: October 09, 2007, 21:28:59 »
Yes that right, out of 2 platoons last weeks 60 candidates failed the PT test
So RFT will be busy coming up in the few weeks
To the future member which want to joined in, make sure you prepare yourself correctly coming down
Don't forget you will be representing the Canadian Forces and the our physical standard is not that hard to achieved (Which I think should be higher at least the same then RCMP)
So my 2 cents if you weight a lot a cannot run for 6 minutes and can't do 19 proper push ups stay home another 6 months before joining
Good night
« Last Edit: October 09, 2007, 21:47:22 by machine463 »

Offline Nerf herder

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2007, 22:08:22 »
Yes that right, out of 2 platoons last weeks 60 candidates failed the PT test
So RFT will be busy coming up in the few weeks
To the future member which want to joined in, make sure you prepare yourself correctly coming down
Don't forget you will be representing the Canadian Forces and the our physical standard is not that hard to achieved (Which I think should be higher at least the same then RCMP)
So my 2 cents if you weight a lot a cannot run for 6 minutes and can't do 19 proper push ups stay home another 6 months before joining
Good night

Hmmm....blank profile and a rant.

Nice.         ::)

I guess you'll be earning your pay in the RFT in the next few weeks.

Regards
Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who kept their swords.--Ben Franklin

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Offline airmich

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2007, 22:55:39 »
Hmmm....blank profile and a rant.

Nice.         ::)

I guess you'll be earning your pay in the RFT in the next few weeks.

Regards

Going by his other posts, he seems to be big on the rant thing.  Although this one states he is the instructor on RFT.  Maybe it's just me and my doubtfulness, but his posts seem to all be written more as a student that has gotten in heck a few too many times instead of an instructor that might have constructive criticism for future candidates.

RFT does not affect nothing what so ever in your carreer progression.  I am a instructor on RFT, the only thing it does it get you ready physically, mentally and prepare you very good for the BMQ/IAP.  There is no BOTP candidate on RFT anymore.  If you got question fell free to ask
So I'll raise a glass, not the first nor last, Come join me in this toast...Because the old black rum's got a hold on me ~ Great Big Sea

Offline 284_226

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2007, 23:06:02 »
Going by his other posts, he seems to be big on the rant thing.  Although this one states he is the instructor on RFT.  Maybe it's just me and my doubtfulness, but his posts seem to all be written more as a student that has gotten in heck a few too many times instead of an instructor that might have constructive criticism for future candidates.

I didn't see any rants in his other two posts, but I would hazard a guess that his first language is French.

Offline Breacher41

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2007, 23:09:01 »
Well it's definitely not HOW he is saying it, rather WHAT he is saying. The message conveys a sort of self-arrogance and righteousness that is often seen with candidates, rather then experienced staff.


Just my 0.02 rupees.


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Offline machine463

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #5 on: October 10, 2007, 06:19:12 »
I am not bitching but telling the truth, look like that the people getting now are even worst physical shape than ever
Yes I'm a Frenchmen and yes I am an instructor in St-Jean for more than 3 years now
In 3 Years those are the worst number that as seen so far
My thing is the Forces are getting deployed more and more but people are getting in terrible shape what do they expect ?
Have a good one

Offline GAP

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2007, 06:39:31 »
Why is everybody on machine463's case? There's so much focus on the how and why he said, than on the message. That's an awfully large amount of an intake to not be able to pass the test.

I noticed before it changed that there was much angst among people applying if they would pass the test, and it sounded like they were working at it. Now, however and with the exception of some, you would think they did away with the test.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2007, 06:51:01 by GAP »
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Offline Dolphin_Hunter

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #7 on: October 10, 2007, 06:48:57 »
So almost half failed.  Without a doubt that is awful, but those who failed have done nothing but make the course more difficult for themselves.  I think it will be a good test of character to see how many of those 60 are there on graduation day.  We will find out how much they want this, true they showed up in basic unprepared, but now its all on them to turn it around.
Hopefully machine463 can play a positive role in turning these marshmallows into fine Canadian soldiers. 

Offline ArmyVern

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #8 on: October 10, 2007, 07:33:54 »
I have no problem with machine463's post at all when reading it and realizing that English is not his mother-tongue.

The same thing would probably be mistaken for a post I made ... in the franco-forums. If I can only speak the language a little ... I can ONLY say it the best way I know HOW. Come on people. You are making a mountain out of a mole-hill.

He's said nothing that an instructor WOULD NOT recommend ...

As to his post, yep ... our recruits are indeed a reflection of Canadian society and overall physical health these days. What with a 45 minute "gym class" actually occuring 2 times per week in my son's high school.  ::)  (Oh ... and one of those "gym classes" is actually 45 minutes of "health class" -- sitting on his *** in the classroom.  :-\

It doesn't surprise me to see statistics like this -- it has become the norm & acceptable to be a lazy fuktard. There's a whole generation of them out there. Thankfully though, there are some who are exceptions to this. You'd think anyone joining the Military would be old enough & wise enough to realize that they need to get off their *** and do something about their level of fitness BEFORE reporting for Basic Trg ... but some aren't. They end up on RFT -- exactly where they deserve to be & should be -- and they have no one to blame for it but themselves.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2007, 07:37:07 by ArmyVern »
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If you or someone you love is having difficulty & would like to speak to someone who has been through a similar experience, who understands, & will respect your need for privacy and confidentiality, contact OSISS toll-free at 1-800-883-6094. You can locate the peer closest to you by logging on to www.osiss.ca, clicking on “Contact us” link & then choosing the “Peer” or “Family Support Network”. Help IS out there.

Offline karl28

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2007, 07:49:29 »
machine463 
 
           I think  you are  correct the level of fitness is not good in most new recruits . I was on BMQ 0146 in Wainright Alberta and I screwed up my knee running the staff out there was trying there own RFT program to help us stay with the course witch was great because there was 12 of us  including my self that failed the run part of the PT test .   I was still way to over weight ( 295 pounds at that time )  to be trying . I  should of stayed home a bit longer and focused more on the running and losing weight .    I tried for two months at St Jean to heal up but the rules where changed on how long you could stay in PAT while injured  due to high numbers that where in there .
           Right now my Knee is healing up pretty good I will be getting the MRI scans back this week to see how its doing but the knee feels 10x better almost perfect I have gotten my weight down from  325 pounds Sept 2006 to 260 that is today   Hopefully with some more hard work in the running and losing more weight  I will be able to reapply some time next Sept .   But to help the Canadian Forces and future recruits I personally think through my own experience the CF express  test should be brought back to the recruiting stage  it would be better for every one involved . It may mean that some of us take a bit longer in getting in to the Canadian Forces but at least you will be better prepared and be able to finish those 13 weeks of basic  and get a great career in the Canadian Forces .
« Last Edit: October 10, 2007, 07:52:15 by karl28 »

Offline geo

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2007, 08:06:53 »
Karl & all...
Yeah, it is a tough haul to bring yourself up to scratch.
In the past, people would show up at the recruiting centre, fail the PT test, get told to go home - get fit and to then come back..... I would fathom a guess that 75% + of those sent away never come back.  They are in the predicament because of their environment, nutrition and lack of motivation.  In the end, the CF ends up on the short end of the stick because the flow of recruits is inadequate for the needs of the CF.

So we take those moderately overweight (surprised by the 295 Lbs though) give them some instruction in nutrition with massive doses of physical conditioning.  These recruits are paid while they get fit.... so what... out of all those previously turned away, we have been enrolling and training more recruits than has been seen in 30-40 years.

We have no choice - a lot of people are near retirement age & the Afghan mission results in a lot of people bailing before AND after deployment ... so unless we want to have a smaller / older military, I don't see any aternative solution

Do you?
Chimo!

Offline GAP

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2007, 08:37:20 »
What about a nonjudgmental physical test prior to joining to give people a sense of what they are in for and what they have to achieve prior to being signed up. Probably not feasible, but a lot are going in all starry eyed about being a Canadian ninja sniper and forgetting that the ninja sniper had to run to get to the high ground....etc, etc...
Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I´m not so sure about the universe

Offline karl28

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2007, 08:48:16 »
geo  

        I completely understand your point on numbers and how important it is to get those number to help keep our current operation level and also agree that there may not be an alternative position to this problem at least one that I cant think of .  I just believe that the old CF Express test During the Recruiting Phase  would save the Canadian Forces money  and save recruits from any possible injuries that may come up from being over weight .       I can understand that  my old weight of 295 pounds surprised you but  I wasn't the only one  we are getting through the system I don't know how but it does happen  .  I myself  also have height on my side I am 6'3"  but still my weight at the time was really bad I thought cause I dropped from 325 I could handle the running part  .        I think if a  possible recruit wants  the Canadian Forces bad enough like my self you due what you have to get in.  Also like you said the diet is big part of losing weight and that was the hardest thing for me to learn but have learned and now being 260 my goal is to get to 240 an have my knee healed up before I reapply hopefully next Sept here is hoping .  Hope that you have a great day work cheers Geo

Offline BulletMagnet

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2007, 08:51:43 »
Though I disagree with the RFT programs existence, and believe we should not be recruiting those people who cannot already pass the fitness standard. What I can say is that with a properly motivated recruit that program works and works well. They do PT 2-3 times a day as well course lectures that allow them to move beyond week 0 and integrate into a course weeks 1-3 and the steady use of stress and pressure combines with the increase physical work outs seems to cut those not as dedicated to the CF as they thought they were.

I might not like why the system is there but I do like how it is run and the results it achieves.
"Often have I regretted my speech, never my silence" Cpl Jordan Anderson 1981-2007 RIP

When the going gets tough I take a nap...It's easier that way

Offline karl28

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2007, 08:58:17 »
GAP

     I could due that test but  I did it once as you know your self during basic you due it almost every day through morning PT  .  I am most definitely not pointing  blame at any one  my injury happened cause I was over weight plain and simple .  I was just pointing out that there should be a  Full PT test  done at your local recruiting center before you go I think it would save allot  time for both the CF and future recruits it is possible to lose weight before you go to Basic and that will make your time there a heck of allot easier .
          I also never had aspects of being a ninja sniper ,  My goal was to be a soldier plain and simple nothing fancy I just wanted to serve and in time I still  may be able to do that just going to take a bit longer no bigy  cheers man have a great day .

Offline geo

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2007, 09:01:18 »
All good points Karl & GAP,
I don't see an alternate solution... neither did the US military.  Our recruits reflect Canadian society & the population as a whole is going the way of the "pilsbury" doughboy.... (don't poke).
Would the CF Express test save the CF money... sure - we wouldn't have the warrior platoons - but then again, our recruiting system would atrophy again... and we don't want to go that route.
Chimo!

Offline GAP

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2007, 09:07:41 »
I was not commenting on you in particular karl28. I was commenting on the posts from the recruiting forum that I constantly read, and they "just don't get it.....you get physical!!"
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Offline GAP

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2007, 09:17:20 »
All good points Karl & GAP,
I don't see an alternate solution... neither did the US military.  Our recruits reflect Canadian society & the population as a whole is going the way of the "Pillsbury" doughboy.... (don't poke).
Would the CF Express test save the CF money... sure - we wouldn't have the warrior platoons - but then again, our recruiting system would atrophy again... and we don't want to go that route.

+1 on the doughboy comment.

 Even 35+ years ago when all the US forces were taking anybody that walked, talked(sorta), and was able to breathe, we still only lost about 3-4 per intake(for inability to complete PT- they went to the PAT platoon and were inserted into another rotation) in boot camp for the Marines. There's a lot of reasons for this and that, but I do remember, as scared as we were, there was no way we were going to let the Drill Instructor know we couldn't hack it. By the same token, the Drill Instructors did help some during our down time on the drill and proper push up technique. It wasn't all yelling and cussing', just when we got together for a big Ooorah fun time!!  :) (only 10 - 12 hrs of the 16 hour day- the DI's had to eat too!)
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Offline tomahawk6

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2007, 09:41:00 »
PT was an integral part of basic when I went through in 72. I joined at the tail end of the draft and there was no such thing as releasing a trainee due to poor fitness. You either ran or marched everywhere. Mistakes resulted in pushups. If a trainee wasnt cutting it he was sent to the special company that was surrounded by a fence topped with barbed wire, sort of like a prison, where trainee's received pretty harsh treatment, as soon as a man met the standards he was integrated into a training company. Others were simply recycled where they got to do much of basic over. No one was allowed to quit.Guys that held the platoon back due to poor performance received a blanket party.

Today there are stress cards,minimal drill and ceremony and soldiers can quit. Basic training for the non-combat arms has really been watered down.Now it looks like the Army wants to extend basic to 10 weeks. The Army isnt a stress free environment and the more pressure we put on a recruit the faster he will toughen up. I am old fashioned enough to want to hold a recruit to his contract. If he signed up for 3 years then thats what he must do. In our society today its way too easy to quit but we dont do anyone any good by letting them quit.

If a recruit cant pass a PT test then he should get remedial PT until he/she can pass the test. If they are physically unable to pass a PT test then there was a failure in the recruiting process.


Offline geo

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #19 on: October 10, 2007, 09:48:48 »
good points T6.
The "pens" won't fly anymore - fat prisons?... Ooooh though I "love" the thought of it - can't have that no more:P

Holding people to their contract?... yikes - what a novel thought! Way too easy for people to make excuses and "bail".
Chimo!

Offline GAP

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #20 on: October 10, 2007, 09:55:17 »
T6 good comments. I believe if I remember correctly, we knew we had basic, knew it involved PT, but there were few that had to train to pass the normal requirements. We were in generally good shape, and needed conditioning and toning, but the general state of the young guys going in was pretty good.

As for quiting, that did not enter the equation!! Yeah, we had the fat farm with the barbed wire fences, etc. and NOBODY wanted to go there. Everyday was spotted with remedial PT because of this or that, but you could always count on having it.
Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I´m not so sure about the universe

Offline geo

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2007, 10:17:46 »
T6, GAP & all,
Let us all remember that, since the 70s, society has been bombarded with fast food (fat food), we've been maximized, theatres have made their seats wider & airlines have toyed with the idea of charging overweight people the price of two seats, those people who occupy more than one seat. (fat groups have petitioned - saying it is a medical dissability :P )

Society as a whole will have to address the lousy physical condition of it's kids, turn off the TV, Nintendo & game cubes
Chimo!

Offline toughenough

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2007, 10:36:01 »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that the American's run morning PT at their recruiting centers to help people work up to basic? I think that this would go a long way to show the future recruits what will be expected of them, and how they can get from their current fitness level to their desired fitness level.

Offline geo

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #23 on: October 10, 2007, 11:04:45 »
Morning PT at the recruiting centres?
Hadn't heard of it & not sure how easy it would be to manage.
Had not heard of the US conducting such a thing.... how are they doing?
Chimo!

Offline Bert

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Re: 60 Failures out of 129 candidates failed PT test
« Reply #24 on: October 10, 2007, 11:17:38 »
Yes that right, out of 2 platoons last weeks 60 candidates failed the PT test
So RFT will be busy coming up in the few weeks...

Theres alot of information in various media about life in the Forces, basic training, and
whats expected of recruits.  More accessible information than there ever was.  The
fitness self-test is right in the application package and provides a decent assessment
if used you would think.

Not to get to involved in details, but the original post provides a amazing detail.  Sixty
recruits in two platoons failed the PT test.  Assuming a recruit platoon (when I went
through was about sixty members), thats a 50% failure per-centage give or take.  It would
be interesting to know why they failed.  Is this normal pass/fail for recruit platoons or an
anomaly for that week?