Author Topic: EOD ?  (Read 27705 times)

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Offline naks

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EOD ?
« on: December 15, 2010, 17:32:18 »
Hi there, I have a question regarding Combat Engineers and they're trades.

On the Forces website, it states that Combat Engineers can get specific courses, such as combat diving, soils analysis and explosive ordnance disposal. My question has several parts and is as follows;

1. Would taking the EOD course cause you to become a EOD only personnel?
2. Is the Canadian EOD team the same as the American? As in do they perform the same duties overseas and such?
3. How long is this course?

It seems that in America, they have a EOD only trade, and for us Canadians, it seems to be incorporated into the Combat Engineer trade. Would this mean that our training would be less professional and less in depth about everything? I've been looking everywhere for information on this, and could not find much.

Thank you all for your time  :)  :cdn:  :salute:

Offline Capt. Happy

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2010, 18:28:42 »
1) No;

2) EOD teams vary between all countries. Each have their own methods of operations and SOPs, but they all accomplish the same mission;

3) Depends on which course you refer to. There are various EOD courses available to CF personnel, and they vary in length from 3 weeks to 5 months.

Yes, the US has an EOD trade. In Canada, EOD / IEDD duties are split between 4 different trades in the CF - Cbt Engr, Ammo Tech, AVN Tech, and Clearance Diver. Our training is no less professional than the US - the reason why their training is longer is that they incorporate all EOD training into one course, whereas the CF divides it up. FWIW, one of the EOD courses we take as a specialty course is the US course in Florida, so draw your conclusions from that with regards to levels of training. CF EOD Operators and our American counterparts have different methods of accomplishing the same tasks, however we all aim for the same indicator of competence - to safely RSP the item and come home with all the appendages we went to the task site with  :nod:

Offline MCG

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2010, 18:36:07 »
I have a question regarding Combat Engineers and they're trades.
Combat Engineer is a trade.   There is only one trade in the Combat Engineers.

1. Would taking the EOD course cause you to become a EOD only personnel?
No.

2. Is the Canadian EOD team the same as the American? As in do they perform the same duties overseas and such?
There is no such thing as "the Canadian EOD team."  4 ESR will have the task of forming an EOD squadron that will provide EOD teams to deployed operations.  What is it that you think the Americans do?  I could tell you about differences, but I don't know that you really know your chosen reference point.

3. How long is this course?
There are many different EOD courses.  They come in varing lengths and prepare individuals for different sorts of jobs within the EOD community.


Offline naks

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2010, 18:48:37 »
Awesome thank you for the solid replies. I was hopping to maybe become an Engineer and becoming an EOD only member, but as this is not possible, I will erase that from my options, thanks!  ;D

Offline Capt. Happy

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2010, 19:59:58 »
There is nothing saying you cannot take the courses and specialize later on in your career. And, ss MCG already pointed out, 4ESR is slated to get an EOD Sqn, so there is a very good chance they will required dedicated operators to fill those positions on a full time basis ;)

Offline naks

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2010, 00:05:09 »
There is nothing saying you cannot take the courses and specialize later on in your career. And, ss MCG already pointed out, 4ESR is slated to get an EOD Sqn, so there is a very good chance they will required dedicated operators to fill those positions on a full time basis ;)

Thanks, do you know any more information about this EOD Sqn? When it's planned on being created, ect...?

Offline Capt. Happy

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2010, 07:53:55 »
Nope. The word on the street is in the near future.

But before you get your hopes up, try taking it one step at a time and actually enlist and finish a DP1 course. I can guarantee that in itself will be challenging enough  >:D

Offline ezpkns

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2012, 13:13:45 »
I'm doing the "superman" course this summer to do my trade training, I'm interested in doing an EOD course after. Would you be able to elaborate on the different kinds of EOD training available to me or is this something I should be consulting my section commander about?

Offline MCG

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2012, 13:28:57 »
I'm doing the "superman" course this summer to do my trade training, ...
What is a "superman course"?

Offline Towards_the_gap

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2012, 13:39:18 »
Indeed, I too am curious as to this 'superman' course.


Offline MedCorps

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2012, 14:01:58 »
You might also want to look here: http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php/topic,103901.0.html

It provides a partial list of some of the EOD type course that Combat Engineers (and other selected MOS) can take.

MC

Offline MCG

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2012, 16:54:21 »
You might also want to look here: http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php/topic,103901.0.html

It provides a partial list of some of the EOD type course that Combat Engineers (and other selected MOS) can take.
Keep in mind that, while a course may show that it is offered to Combat Engineers that does not mean it is necessarily open to both Reg F and PRes.

Offline Capt. Happy

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2012, 17:24:30 »
I'm doing the "superman" course this summer to do my trade training, I'm interested in doing an EOD course after. Would you be able to elaborate on the different kinds of EOD training available to me or is this something I should be consulting my section commander about?

By "superman course", I assume you're referring to doing all the mods of your PRes DP1 Cbt Engr course?


From what I have gathered through some recent discussions in the EOD community, PRes members fall under the current version of DAOD 8000-1 ( http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/dao-doa/8000/8000-1-eng.asp ) when it comes to employment in EOD operations:

Quote from: DAOD 8000-1
CF members of the Reserve Force who serve in a unit with an operational EOD role and in an authorized EOD military occupation may receive CF basic EOD training and basic IEDD training. Such CF members shall not conduct EOD or IEDD operations, but may assist a qualified Regular Force EOD technician in such operations. The chain of command is responsible and accountable for the selection of appropriate CF members of the Reserve Force to be trained and qualified to assist in EOD and IEDD operations.

However, that DAOD is in the process of being updated, and I was told this past week in no uncertain terms that PRes members will still be offered CMD courses, but their odds of receiving Adv CMD (HB course), BCMD (HX) or IEDD (HC or HL) courses will be extremely limited and given on a case-by-case basis for operational requirements.

So, in a nutshell, if you're looking for anything past basic conventional munitions disposal, the odds of you getting it as a reservist that is not occupying an EOD position number in a unit with that capability while on Cl B or C, will be extremely minimal.

Offline NFLD Sapper

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2012, 18:00:06 »
PRes Combat Engineers get the very first part of the CMD Course on the DP1 Course, but the way the 2I/C package is currently handled they do not get the last part of the CMD Course. Currently the only way to get the complete CMD Course is to do the stand alone package.

In order for us to wear the EOD badge, you must have 2 H courses (HA, HB, etc)
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Offline AmmoTech90

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #14 on: March 17, 2012, 18:07:28 »
In order for us to wear the EOD badge, you must have 2 H courses (HA, HB, etc)

Actually you have to have an "advanced" EOD course of some sort, and seeing as HA is pre-req for any other EOD course that means you will have 2 H courses.  There are "H" quals that don't confer it, for example Unit Ammo Rep is HR, and in theory IEDD Assistant would be an H course but would not award the badge (I hope), along with EOD Staff Officer.

If anyone is interested, off the top of my head, suitible courses would be.
-IEDD Operator (HA pre-req)
-BCMD Disposal (HA pre-req)
-NATO IEDD (IEDD Operator is pre-req, so this doesn't really count as you would have the badge already)
-EOD SURFACE (HB) (HA pre-req)
-NATO CMD Advanced (UK Course) (HA pre-req)
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Offline NFLD Sapper

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2012, 18:12:12 »
Guess I should have been more specific and said courses like HA, HB, HC, HX......

But thanks for the additional info AmmoTech!
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Offline MCG

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2012, 18:18:23 »
Of course, Canada doesn't have "H courses" anymore. 

Offline AmmoTech90

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #17 on: March 17, 2012, 19:12:26 »
No, we don't.  However it is a pretty well understood convention within the community and it works.
Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabris, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam.

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Offline ezpkns

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #18 on: January 19, 2013, 15:15:20 »
Alright, superman course (Mods 1-7) didn't work out so instead I finished my QL3 Alpha (Mods 1-4) and I'm slotted for my QL3 Bravo (Mods 5-7) and my QL5 this summer, does anyone know what the current version of the course for basic cmd is so I can get started on working towards EOD? Would I use the HA or whatever designation to request the course from my unit or would I need other details for my course request.

Offline NFLD Sapper

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #19 on: January 19, 2013, 16:35:43 »
You must complete the CMD basic course and for what I have heard for most reservists that is as far as you will go.
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Offline Capt. Happy

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #20 on: January 19, 2013, 19:20:58 »
You must complete the CMD basic course and for what I have heard for most reservists that is as far as you will go.

Yup - currently, unless there are operational circumstances dictating, PRes members will not be loaded onto any further EOD training past CMD(B). At the last CF EOD working group in Nov, all of the EOD teams across the CF had to vie for the limited amount of seats on courses this year, and they have an actual requirement to have qualified pers. CMD Advanced (commonly known as HB) seats are diminishing over the next year or so, and IEDD Operator and IEDD Assistant course prereqs specifically state "must be employed in or selected for IEDD duties", so unless the PRes member is currently employed in EOD duties with a RegF team, the chances of getting onto either of these is pretty small. Not nil, just pretty small.

In short, unless the OP wants to CT to RegF, the odds of getting any further EOD trg is pretty limited.

Offline Gunshark

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2015, 12:04:24 »
Is it still the case that EOD training in PRes is hard to come by?

Offline Teager

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2015, 12:30:11 »
Yes. PRes units don't have the equipment for EOD. It is a Reg Force job. It is something that requires constant training on a full time basis. If you want to go EOD you will have to go Reg Force.

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2015, 17:30:22 »
It just came out that PRes members will not get any more seats on the CMD Basic courses anymore.....
CHIMO!
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Offline PanaEng

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Re: EOD ?
« Reply #24 on: June 09, 2015, 11:28:16 »
It just came out that PRes members will not get any more seats on the CMD Basic courses anymore.....
now that is freaking ridiculous; pretty soon the only trg they'll receive is the tools package - pres units will be pick and shovel sqns...
Now I am SAS or SWAT dude ;-)
see:
Quote from: RHFC_piper ink=topic=51916.msg617784#msg617784 date=1190404708

The 'pana" is a play on the Greek 'pan' meaning 'all' or 'encompassing' - not quite but similar to UBIQUE
some think I just misspelled "para" :-)