.50 Beowulf

[Mortar guy]

Check this action out: http://www.alexanderarms.com/website/id4.html

I read about this weapon in Janes IDR and thought it would be great for us for use in a FIBUA environment. We could buy the .50 Alexander Arms upper receivers and mate them with the C7A2 lowers for a simple breaching weapon. Apparently, it has about the same recoil as a 20 Gauge Shotgun and does not require much in the way of special training. Does anyone think this weapon would be better than out Shotguns?


MG

 

[KevinB]

No.

 

[big bad john]

Nothing IMHO is as intimadating at close range than a shotgun.  Shotguns with malaya loads are great for taking off door hinges too.

 

[MG34]

Malaya loads are not intended for breaching doors or anything for that matter.They are a mixture of buck shot and pellets that were effective in the jungles of Malaya during the communist insurrection in the 1950's.The use of any non frangible round in breaching operations is ill advised and dangerous,and quite stupid.If it is all you have like we were issued 00Buck in Afghanistan for breaching then precautions must be taken to ensure the safety of the breach team.Proper breaching techniques for a shotgun require the use of a frangible slug and a stand off device on the shotgun.

 

[big bad john]

Nice in theory, but the RM's, the SAS and the SBS have been using malaya loads for door breeching ops for the last 23 years that I have been serving.   Of course normal precautions are taken.   Using solid rounds in a shotgun is currently against the European Convention on Warfare, as are flechettes.
It is also not stupid to use what you have, when waiting will not give you what you want or need.  Please watch your remarks.

 

[Mortar guy]

Do you have a reason for saying no Kevin? The Beowulf can breach doors, destroy cinder block walls and penetrate vehicle engine blocks. Last I ckecked out SGs could not do all of that.

MG

 

[MG34]

Nice in theory, but the RM's, the SAS and the SBS have been using malaya loads for door breeching ops for the last 23 years that I have been serving.   Of course normal precautions are taken.   Using solid rounds in a shotgun is currently against the European Convention on Warfare, as are flechettes.
It is also not stupid to use what you have, when waiting will not give you what you want or need.   Please watch your remarks.

That's odd seeing as  the Hatton 12 ga Breaching Round is already used  with the Rem 870 in the SAS as well as police forces in the UK and is quite common in Eurpoean police and military counter terror units. One would think it would be included in the inventory of the SBS and RM's as opposed to using an ineffective and dangerous (to any hostages/civilians) non frangible round.

 

[big bad john]

I have seen a few, and I mean a few 870's in the service.  Many more Franchi SPAS 12's and Brownings.  IF you are specifically going in and taking a door Hatton rounds are used.  But in my experience in the field during DS1 you used what you had with you.  Solid rounds are prohibited against personnel by UK Forces.  So they remove temptation.  Usually time is also a factor.  The military is not a Police Force.

 

[MG34]

I realize that the military is not a police force (despite what the politicians think). I find it bizarre that the UK prohibits solid shotgun rounds to be used,when they are acepted as common place in the rest of the world as a vital tool if a shotgun is to be used.

 

[big bad john]

Politicians who knows what gives.

 

[BernDawg]

Exotics?  Stck with the tried and true.  Shotgun all the way.

 

[ArmyRick]

Interesting article and I agree, if the shotgun still works, keep using it.

Now if I understand, the .50 round they refer to in the article is not the same as what is used in a heavy machine gun? its a unique .50 round?

 

[BernDawg]

From what I read it is like a huge pistol round.

 

[MG34]

.50 Beowulf compared to a .223 Rem. It is a niche cartridge intended for hunting,it lacks the performance to be considered for any serious military application.