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All things Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV)

Weinie

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milnews.ca said:

We (CAF members) on this site should be actively thanking all these folks, who are enabling us to be reasonably content, mostly reassured and able to meet our daily needs. Well done BZ to all the unforgotten folks who are helping us. I have four kids and am especially appreciative of all you do. I will remember your efforts going forward and will be an advocate for you in the future.
A very sincere THANK YOU
 

daftandbarmy

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garb811 said:
Call me jaded but...

How much of this is true altruism and how much is this insurance against a backlash when quarterly earnings are reported and people start to see how much profit these places have made off of the run on goods caused by the hoarders and their early failures to implement quantity control to stop it?

It's a retail apocalypse. No store, that was wholly self-interested, would keep an open shop front. Many will not survive:

“There was an erosion of physical retail to online, but it wasn’t as if Amazon came in and then overnight retail was gone. In Canadian grocery, for example, the percentage of people buying online was so very small. Single digit,” he said.  “And now a real virus has an excellent chance to leave behind a true ‘retail apocalypse’.”

https://www.retail-insider.com/retail-insider/2020/3/second-wave-of-retail-bankruptcies-expected-in-canada-amid-covid-19-pandemic-expert
 

garb811

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daftandbarmy said:
It's a retail apocalypse. No store, that was wholly self-interested, would keep an open shop front. Many will not survive:

“There was an erosion of physical retail to online, but it wasn’t as if Amazon came in and then overnight retail was gone. In Canadian grocery, for example, the percentage of people buying online was so very small. Single digit,” he said.  “And now a real virus has an excellent chance to leave behind a true ‘retail apocalypse’.”

https://www.retail-insider.com/retail-insider/2020/3/second-wave-of-retail-bankruptcies-expected-in-canada-amid-covid-19-pandemic-expert
I agree the consequences to the retail sector are going to be devastating; I'm not so sure that is going to be the case for the big name food chains though.
 

dapaterson

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I live just south of a main street in a quite gentrified area with a few chains, a number of restaurants, and a lot of small shops.  They're all closed indefinitely, and I fear that few will survive.  Part of the appeal of this area is the presence of so many unique places to shop and eat... which, come the summer, may well be papered over windows.
 

MilEME09

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My worry is that, it is the small independent retailers, especially niche businesses like hobby shops will close as they do more have the ability to weather the storm.
 

mariomike

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dapaterson said:
I live just south of a main street in a quite gentrified area with a few chains, a number of restaurants, and a lot of small shops.  They're all closed indefinitely, and I fear that few will survive.  Part of the appeal of this area is the presence of so many unique places to shop and eat... which, come the summer, may well be papered over windows.

Same may happen to our shopping district.  More than 400 shops, restaurants and services.
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22bloor+west+village%22&hl=en&sxsrf=ALeKk039nGgWY5cbddQxWSOh9PWYsMN3CQ:1585437425645&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjAtMbUpr7oAhVOWs0KHWBeAmQQ_AUoA3oECBgQBQ&biw=1280&bih=641

Been hosting North Americas largest Ukrainian festival for the last 24 years.  Also a summer festival. Halloween festival, and Christmas "Cavalcade of Lights".
 

Colin Parkinson

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Let's just say the appeal of heavy densification has had the shine taken off of it. There are going to be a lot of social and economic ramifications from this event.
 

Weinie

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Colin P said:
Let's just say the appeal of heavy densification has had the shine taken off of it. There are going to be a lot of social and economic ramifications from this event.
YUP Hard!!!!. My own ponderings for the last week.  Supply chain questions. Economic and employment ramifications. Political implications, my own personal head of family responsibility and implications, societal pathologies, societal resilience. Gas is under $.60 a litre (about freakin time). We are in a relatively good space, but that could change in an instant.

Not a chicken little guy, but not an ostrich either, Covid-19 will have vast societal ramifications.
 

Remius

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garb811 said:
Call me jaded but...

How much of this is true altruism and how much is this insurance against a backlash when quarterly earnings are reported and people start to see how much profit these places have made off of the run on goods caused by the hoarders and their early failures to implement quantity control to stop it?

Maybe.  But if you want to keep your employees working during this mess you need to compensate them. 

The grocery store I frequent now have their employees doing crowd control, extra sanitation and watching people for symptoms.  They also have to put up with frustrated customers who can’t get their toilet paper.

I don’t really care why they are doing it or their motivations behind it.  As long as the people working are getting a bump in pay that is all that matters. 

Good for them.
 

Weinie

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Remius said:
Maybe.  But if you want to keep your employees working during this mess you need to compensate them. 

The grocery store I frequent now have their employees doing crowd control, extra sanitation and watching people for symptoms.  They also have to put up with frustrated customers who can’t get their toilet paper.

I don’t really care why they are doing it or their motivations behind it.  As long as the people working are getting a bump in pay that is all that matters


Good for them.

Agreed good for them. Also calls into question the whole idea of "work valuation." We are likely to see a significant discussion on this in fall 2020
 

The Bread Guy

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garb811 said:
Call me jaded but...

How much of this is true altruism and how much is this insurance against a backlash when quarterly earnings are reported and people start to see how much profit these places have made off of the run on goods caused by the hoarders and their early failures to implement quantity control to stop it?
Nobody can blame you for being jaded at all - after all, #BusinessGonnaBusiness.  That said, if they're worth this much now, the naive part of me thinks it maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay be tough to say, "thanks for coming out - back to minimum wage for you" once things calm down. 

And everyone goes back to forgetting people getting lowish wages often do valuable work.
 

mariomike

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Colin P said:
Let's just say the appeal of heavy densification has had the shine taken off of it.

I live in a low density residential neighbourhood of bungalows. I worked in the asphalt jungle. Doesn't mean I have to live in it.

CountDC said:
Swansea is also the only Toronto neighbourhood to have a lake, a river, and a pond as it's natural boundaries. Swansea's hilly terrain, winding roads and many mature trees accentuate the storybook houses that line the residential streets of this neighbourhood.

The shopping district is to the north.

Colin P said:
There are going to be a lot of social and economic ramifications from this event.

We were already getting our prescriptions and over the counter stuff online through Alliance Pharmacy Group ( APG ).

Glasses, and even toilet paper. My wife orders pretty well everything on line.

Except food. Until now.

When this thing started, our kids brought groceries over. But, now, we buy our groceries online through Walmart.
https://www.walmart.ca/en/online-grocery-shopping-pickup

Don't have to go inside. Don't even get out of the car. Just pop the trunk, and they load it in.

I think they have delivery service too, so we may look into that.


milnews.ca said:
That said, if they're worth this much now, the naive part of me thinks it maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay be tough to say, "thanks for coming out - back to minimum wage for you" once things calm down. 

And everyone goes back to forgetting people getting lowish wages often do valuable work.

Time for Tommy,

O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, go away";
But it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins," when the band begins to play—

The other thing I like about Walmart online groceries is the fact they come from Head Office - or whatever they call it.

So, the groceries have never been on retail shelves with the public coughing and touching it.
 

Underway

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There are a lot of potential changes coming:

-a true "guaranteed wage" experiment and an understanding governments can spend far more than we think they could, essentially austerity is an ideological choice, not a necessity
-many companies realize overstaffed are cleaning out the C employees and keeping the A employees with limited repercussions
-companies will have the bargaining power in many industries regarding wages
-inefficient office space usage is identified on a massive scale
-the idea we are incapable of making massive changes for climate action is demonstrably wrong
-a large number of new wars and conflicts as the west looks inwards and doesn't pay attention to the concerns of Syria etc...
-an emboldened working class in the US, this is the moment they realize who actually greases the wheels down there
 

MJP

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Underway said:
-an emboldened working class in the US, this is the moment they realize who actually greases the wheels down there

This is the biggest one IMHO, more basic workers rights (sick leave, mata/pata) plus the concept of medical care that is not tied to a job (ie: insurance) really seems to be percolating. I mean only every other western democracy has much of what Americans are lacking so it isn't like the concept doesn't work
 

dimsum

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MJP said:
This is the biggest one IMHO, more basic workers rights (sick leave, mata/pata) plus the concept of medical care that is not tied to a job (ie: insurance) really seems to be percolating. I mean only every other western democracy has much of what Americans are lacking so it isn't like the concept doesn't work

Like how the Black Plague ended up with more power to the serfs.
 

Brad Sallows

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The economic and fiscal situation is going to be so far away from anyone's ability to understand and manage it that everyone is going to race back to what they understand - ie. status quo c. Dec 2019 - as fast as they can.

"-the idea we are incapable of making massive changes for climate action is demonstrably wrong"

Highly unlikely.
 

FJAG

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Hopefully that will include either limiting ridiculous corporate CEO and Board salaries or taxing the crap out of them.

:cheers:
 

daftandbarmy

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Remius said:
Maybe.  But if you want to keep your employees working during this mess you need to compensate them. 

Who needs to keep all their employees working when the Prime Minster just announced a juicy EI package and some low interest loans, plus a 75% wage subsidy? You can ditch 90% of the staff, keep a skeleton crew on to make sure the place is in good shape, then staff up again when the restrictions come off.

Unless, of course, you care about your brand, which is another matter entirely....
 

mariomike

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Not good.

Due to shortages, FDNY has ordered their EMTs and paramedics to no longer use N95 masks, on any calls, unless an aerosol generating procedure is being performed.

They don't know what conditions exist when entering apartments, houses or commercial spaces.

This order is completely contrary to the order we received during SARS. N95 mask all the time at work – only exception if > 3 metres from others in station.

I'm not a doctor, but I can't see this ending well.
 

Colin Parkinson

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So how is that "Just in time" inventory system working for you? This is what happens when you allow accountants to have to much control or say. I hope some lessons on burn rates for PPE are learned from all of this, and not forgotten 3 years from now.
 
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