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C3 Grounding

TSM A

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with inspections now under way, is it safe to assume that a cause of the cradle failure has been determined?
also just curious as to what the inspections entail.
 

Petard

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The signs to look for are known, the complete cause, or other possible failure sites, is not, yet.
Age, a design/manufacture flaw, and excessive speed cross country, are all factors being considered, there may be others

The inspection is done using magnetic particle inspection, to locate any potential cracks forming on the cradle, and looking for anomalies in manufacture of the cradle where the raised portion supporting the recoil bearing surfaces taper and end (near the breech end just forward of trunnion's)
 

Old Sweat

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Petard

Could you elaborate on the excessive speed cross-country factor? I had never heard of such a restriction in my service and, if by cross-country you mean not on even range roads, I doubt that a gun tractor and gun could manage more than a "trot" without pitching stores, ammunition and the gun detachment around like ice cubes in a cocktail shaker. This also would tend to lead to severe physical damage to the driver at the earliest possible opportunity.
 

SeaKingTacco

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Old Sweat said:
Petard

Could you elaborate on the excessive speed cross-country factor? I had never heard of such a restriction in my service and, if by cross-country you mean not on even range roads, I doubt that a gun tractor and gun could manage more than a "trot" without pitching stores, ammunition and the gun detachment around like ice cubes in a cocktail shaker. This also would tend to lead to severe physical damage to the driver at the earliest possible opportunity.

During my Phase Training, circa 1988-89, it was a "custom", when coming out of action, to race to the RV point, as this determined the order of march.  If your Detachment was first, you did not have to eat dust all the way to the next gun position.  As a gun number on Phase two, I can clearly remember holding on for dear life, lying across cam nets, piled on gun stores, piled on ammo tubes (this was pre-MLVW Sev kit days) and watching the C1 Howitzer we were towing bouncing as high as 10 feet in the air as we smashed across country to get to the road.  That cannot have been good for the gun (it was no picnic for us).
 

Petard

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A very apt description by seaking, and its still going on
Some range roads, especially in the spring are no better than any rough cross country trail, but the gun does have limits
The gun does not have a suspension system, and because of that does have a relatively low max cross country speed; which is often exceeded coming out of action or during quick actions.
 

Old Sweat

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And I have seen guns moving like seaking describes, and it is not a pretty sight, even if I would swear I heard "The Duchess of Kent" being played by a giant band in the sky at the same time. I also have seen C1s bouncing in the air on long road moves on the Autobahn while travelling at 50-60 mph behind a trusty deuce-and-a-half.  Is there a published speed restriction and, if so, what is it? As you can deduce, I have never heard of one for the C1, as opposed to the L5.
 

Colin Parkinson

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Remember those days as well, mind you the C1 had more weight on the axle (shields) and less on the cradle.
 

Petard

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Turns out there is no C3 max cross country speed, but given what likely happened, there ought to be.

Inspections now going on in Shilo, Gagetown to follow.
 

Nfld Sapper

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Seems our guns are authorized to fire blanks but must be low beded to and from the saluting sites.....
 

Petard

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The risk is real to even the C1s, and the restriction remains until they're inspected, which cannot be done just visually.

While the inspections are going steady, the progress is slow. Priority is definitely going to those guns being pooled for summer training; hard to say when they might get to the salute ones.
 

Schütze

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How badly is this going to affect the DP1 courses in Meaford this summer?
 

Petard

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I don't know, the inspections are going at a slow rate, but my guess is the DP1 training will be unaffected
At least in LFCA they still have the 4 C1's at 30 Fd that were inspected and all passed. Might well be they'll have to take a step back and use them as well as C3s (they're not that different drill-wise)

A few of the guns may be taken off line permanently because of this problem, and so far there's only been 2 (the one in Gagetown and now another detected in Shilo, the C1 in Rogers pass failed for a problem unrelated to this crack issue).
So long as there are no significant delays in the inspections, there should be enough guns available for training; the real problem is going to be with reduced numbers post summer training.

 

PPCLI Guy

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The plan is to have all inspections done by 15 June.  LFWA guns have been inspected and are firing now in support of Ex WESTERN DEFENDER in Shilo.  Shilo Battle School and SQFT guns are up next
 

Fatalize

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CARPE_DIEM said:
I'm in Gagetown on my DP1 Mod 2 right now.We were 2 weeks into the course when the C3's were grounded. We had to switch to the LG1 which put us way behind. I got my posting message and I'm going to 1 horse on the 19th May. My question is, do they even use the LG1 in regiment? Am I going to be way behind or have to take a course as soon as I get posted? P.S. I CANT WAIT TO BE A GUNNER!!!

-BARBARIAN

B Battery in 1RCHA uses the LG1 mainly. Rumor is the m777's are coming by winter.
 

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PPCLI Guy said:
The plan is to have all inspections done by 15 June.  LFWA guns have been inspected and are firing now in support of Ex WESTERN DEFENDER in Shilo.  Shilo Battle School and SQFT guns are up next

Any idea when PRes guns will be inspected?
 

PPCLI Guy

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No distinction is being made - they are simply going wherever there is a concentration of guns right now - Ex WD is a PRes ex
 

TSM A

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how about unit held guns. Well i guess i should just cut to the chase when will my guns be inspected? and will they have to go to ASU Chilliwack to get done.
 

Matt_Ubbing

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In Shilo during WD11, there were 4 guns inspected right off the bat. As they passed, the one's we were dry training with were rotated out. We had at least 4 Serviceable guns to shoot. I believe they were all the ATG's guns, however I do know that 1 sent from 20 Fd passed as well as the 1 sent from 18 Ad Regt. So, by the sounds of things, it's not as bad as it sounded it was going to be.
 

Cardstonkid

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After the 18 AD Gun passed inspection it was sent back without its travel lights, cover and a missing breech mechanism. Not sure how that happened but we are still grounded as a result.

It is good to see we can still shoot, not sure how we are going to tow it with the new trucks but perhaps we can strap it down in the back of the MS and become self-propelled artillery?  ;)
 

Petard

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Cardstonkid said:
After the 18 AD Gun passed inspection it was sent back without its travel lights, cover and a missing breech mechanism. Not sure how that happened but we are still grounded as a result.

It is good to see we can still shoot...

So are they grounded or not?
Does sound kind of wonky them coming back robbed like that.

On another bizarre note, the next guns that are supposed to be inspected are the salute guns in St John's, well before any more of LFCA's or any of SQFT; not sure how/why they got to the front of the queue
 
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