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Logistics In War

Halifax Tar

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Found this site online.  Some good articles if you are inclined to ponder the dark art that is military logistics.

https://logisticsinwar.com/

https://www.facebook.com/logisticsinwar/?hc_ref=SEARCH&fref=nf

Just thought I would share.
 

Halifax Tar

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Interesting article from the website above:

Logistics In War

Military logistics and its impact on modern warfare.

https://logisticsinwar.com/2018/02/22/a-logistics-in-war-primer-logistics-and-the-art-of-command/

https://sway.com/kLNHZVmeNF0Ptdbm?ref=Link
 

Kirkhill

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Guns define soldiering (and sailoring for that matter)

If we didn't have to buy guns, and maintain them, and train people to operate them, what mayhem could be created?

Man Pack

PyrotechnicsC8Smoke - Coloured
PyrotechnicsL83A1Smoke - Screening
PyrotechnicsParaflare
PyrotechnicsC6Trip Flare
Demolition ChargesM2A4Cratering
Demolition ChargesM3A1Boring
Demolition ChargesC-126Cutting
EnergeticsC4
EnergeticsDet Cord
EnergeticsInitiators
MinesM15Anti-Tank
MinesM19Anti-Tank
MinesM21Anti-Tank
MinesL9Anti-Tank
MinesAnti-Tank - DLM - Bottom
MinesAnti-Tank - DLM - Top
MinesC19Claymore
MinesC14Anti-Tank - 84mm Off Route
GrenadesC13/M67Fragmentation
ProjectorsM72 E9HEAT - 66 MM
ProjectorsM72 E10HE - 66 mm
ProjectorsM72 E11Airburst - 66 mm
ProjectorsAT4HEAT - 84mm
ProjectorsAT4HEDP 502 - 84mm
ProjectorsAT4HP - 84mm
ProjectorsAT4HEAT-ER - 84mm
ProjectorsAT4HE - 84mm
ProjectorsSpike SRHEAT - 110mm
ProjectorsSpike SRFragmentation - 110mm
ProjectorsSpike SRASM-110mm
ProjectorsNLAWHEAT - 150 mm
DronesSUASVapor Helo
DronesSUASQuantix Recon
DronesSUASWASP AE
DronesSUASRAVEN B
DronesSUASPUMA 3 AE


Simple, reusable projectors

Shotguns
40mm grenade launchers
60mm grenade launchers
81mm grenade launchers

And then we have missiles of all sorts

Missiles that can be 3D printed



And while we are on the subject of 3D printing, and if we really wanted a gun, say, for example something equivalent to the WW2 vintage STEN gun (AKA the pipefitter's nightmare)




I'm willing to bet that all of the single-shot disposable munitions in the man pack section can also be locally 3D printed.


I suggest that one doesn't have to be a government to be well armed these days.


 

Colin Parkinson

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There are certain components of a SMG that require skill to get right to allow reliable function. You can 3D print a LP munition body, but not the propellant , primer or filler. You likley could design and print a fuze system.

Any modern CNC machine shop could churn out a dozen SMG a day, I am only surprised that more have not been made already.
 

Kirkhill

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There are certain components of a SMG that require skill to get right to allow reliable function. You can 3D print a LP munition body, but not the propellant , primer or filler. You likley could design and print a fuze system.

Any modern CNC machine shop could churn out a dozen SMG a day, I am only surprised that more have not been made already.

The Sten, reputedly, took one hour to make. I wonder how many Sterlings a CNC shop could turn out in an hour.

But given that, I come back to my original point. What can you do without those finicky guns and ammunition?

I note the absence of shrapnel, pellet and flechette APERS munitions in the list of readily available disposable munitions. Carl Gustaf has an 84mm APERS round that could be given the AT4 treatment. The 70 mm rocket has a Flechette round that in the APKWS mode could probably be matched with the Javeling-Stinger (70mm) CLU. And how about an M72 with a Flechette round?
 

Colin Parkinson

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516e31452281e.preview-300.jpg
 

Colin Parkinson

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What people and in particular politicians forget that guns and ammunition are late 19th and early 20th century tech and not that hard to mass produce, 3D printing is just a new way to do old things when it comes to guns.
 

Eaglelord17

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3D printing is slow and inefficient for any sort of mass production, there is a reason all sorts of other processes are used instead. What it is good for is making a one off of something or for a hobbiest to make a few different things for fun.

The Sten was about 5 hours to make one full SMG and that was the most basic version manufactured. Its main advantage was the fact it could be made very decentralized with a lot of off the shelf components. The PPSH was about 2.5 hours and was also a much better SMG than the Sten.

There is always merit in having some Machinists with some CNC or manual machines around for repair/fitting parts, but otherwise your much better off with modern production facilities. Technology has improved so much that it isn't even worth considering making parts on site (other than one offs), not to mention the increase in time to do so. One factory I worked at made high pressure tubing for oil rigs and such. That mill was built in the 1980s and can pump out pipe. Today there is a new factory made by the same company in the States which with the same amount of employees can produce 3 times the amount of pipe, just thanks to increases in technology (and the 1980s facility has been updated numerous times).

Figure out how to ship it to the customer, relying on production on site isn't a very viable option, not to mention the extra skill sets you would have to train and figure out (and need constant practice on to retain competency).
 

daftandbarmy

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Found this site online. Some good articles if you are inclined to ponder the dark art that is military logistics.



Just thought I would share.

The future of all logistics is automated, as per Amazon's example, IMHO:

Amazon to open new warehouse in Alberta that will use robotics to pick, pack, ship small items​


Amazon.com Inc. will turn to robots to help pick, pack and ship parcels at a new Canadian facility.

The Seattle-based e-commerce company said Monday that it will use robotics to put together small orders of books, electronics and toys at a new warehouse in Parkland County, Alta., west of Edmonton.


 

FJAG

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I'm with you on that completely.

Saw a video on that not too long ago and was especially amazed by one particular aspect of how they stock shelves.

No attempt is made to group items of one type close to each other as we would do in a human run warehouse. In fact various copies of one specific item are placed randomly all over the warehouse. The reason for this is that when the robot is picking up several items in one order it is routed to the closest copy of the item it needs and doesn't need to run over to the other side of the warehouse. The software simply figures out the shortest, fastest route to complete the order based on proximity. If shelf life is an issue then the software takes that into account as well.

I expect this is only a matter of time. These types of systems are so much superior to any manual ones that its silly.

But then again, one needs to remember that Target lost a couple of billion setting up in Canada because they muffed the stock management software issue big time.

🍻
 

GR66

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I'm with you on that completely.

Saw a video on that not too long ago and was especially amazed by one particular aspect of how they stock shelves.

No attempt is made to group items of one type close to each other as we would do in a human run warehouse. In fact various copies of one specific item are placed randomly all over the warehouse. The reason for this is that when the robot is picking up several items in one order it is routed to the closest copy of the item it needs and doesn't need to run over to the other side of the warehouse. The software simply figures out the shortest, fastest route to complete the order based on proximity. If shelf life is an issue then the software takes that into account as well.

I expect this is only a matter of time. These types of systems are so much superior to any manual ones that its silly.

But then again, one needs to remember that Target lost a couple of billion setting up in Canada because they muffed the stock management software issue big time.

🍻
Just hope that the Russians/Chinese/Iranians/North Koreans don't hack the system when we go to war. A huge warehouse with all the badly needed war stocks scattered randomly throughout the building!
 

FJAG

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Just hope that the Russians/Chinese/Iranians/North Koreans don't hack the system when we go to war. A huge warehouse with all the badly needed war stocks scattered randomly throughout the building!
Air gap and shield the warehouse system from the rest of the world.

🍻
 

MJP

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I'm with you on that completely.

Saw a video on that not too long ago and was especially amazed by one particular aspect of how they stock shelves.

No attempt is made to group items of one type close to each other as we would do in a human run warehouse. In fact various copies of one specific item are placed randomly all over the warehouse.
The future of all logistics is automated, as per Amazon's example, IMHO:

It will be interesting to see developments on the Defence Supply Chain's 3rd line warehouses and ammo depots over the coming years/decades. The problem is a good portion of the stock in those warehouses is pretty bulky and not conducive to robot picking in its current form. There is also lots stock in a number of pallets with a number of boxes where the end customers orders a number than means the box needs to be opened to be picked.

A huge warehouse with all the badly needed war stocks scattered randomly throughout the building!
Stock is in our 3rd line warehouses is largely scattered already and generally sorted by stock type vice grouping like items together (especially for smaller stocks). There are efficiencies like stocking all of an item together for example tires, IMPs or clothing together but the number of items where grouping is beneficial is small in the overall holding of actual line items.

Regardless every 3rd line warehouse has a daily download of their stock by bin so it really isn't hard to find.
 

FJAG

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... The problem is a good portion of the stock in those warehouses is pretty bulky and not conducive to robot picking in its current form. ...
Bigger robots?

https%3A%2F%2Fwinteriscoming.net%2Ffiles%2F2019%2F09%2FPacific-Rim-poster-850x560.jpg


:unsure:
 

Kirkhill

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Sometimes you don't want a pile of nuts. And getting a special nut from Montreal to a point 1500 miles west of the Azores may be a pain. It may be appropriate just to print out what you need when you need it.

Bundles of pipe are what you need for an XL pipeline. But storing bundles of pipe for years, rotting, while you wait for a pipe to burst somewhere other than your stockpile??

It feels kind of like what I was suggesting about bombing. The Air Force works with planned actions with hundreds of bombs. The Army wants the occasional bomb accurately delivered in a timely fashion.

Engineers buy nuts by the ton. Mechanics want the necessary nut in their hand.
 

daftandbarmy

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Sometimes you don't want a pile of nuts. And getting a special nut from Montreal to a point 1500 miles west of the Azores may be a pain. It may be appropriate just to print out what you need when you need it.

Bundles of pipe are what you need for an XL pipeline. But storing bundles of pipe for years, rotting, while you wait for a pipe to burst somewhere other than your stockpile??

It feels kind of like what I was suggesting about bombing. The Air Force works with planned actions with hundreds of bombs. The Army wants the occasional bomb accurately delivered in a timely fashion.

Engineers buy nuts by the ton. Mechanics want the necessary nut in their hand.

With productivity increases like this, it'll be hard to ignore the move to AI. And they'll figure it out....

The robots have raised the average picker’s productivity from around 100 items per hour to what Mr. Long and others have said is a target of around 300 or 400, though the numbers vary across teams and facilities. The robots help explain why Amazon managed to ship more items than ever during last year’s holiday season with about 20 percent fewer seasonal workers than the year before. (Amazon said another reason was that it was focused more on permanent hiring in 2018.)

 

Halifax Tar

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The future of all logistics is automated, as per Amazon's example, IMHO:

Amazon to open new warehouse in Alberta that will use robotics to pick, pack, ship small items​


Amazon.com Inc. will turn to robots to help pick, pack and ship parcels at a new Canadian facility.

The Seattle-based e-commerce company said Monday that it will use robotics to put together small orders of books, electronics and toys at a new warehouse in Parkland County, Alta., west of Edmonton.


I don't think there is any debate in this for 3rd and 4th line warehousing. Large warehouses, full of stock (A dream I know right) with a small cadre of people and AI doing all the picking.

It will be interesting to see what they come up with for the 1st and 2nd line by way of automation. And there is the whole movement to end user.
 

Kirkhill

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Amazon sites their warehouses to serve millions in the immediate area and to exploit secure supply lines.

The military mechanic looking for a nut is likely to be in an isolated location with spotty to non-existent supply lines. And she can't afford to carry every part she may need with her.
 

daftandbarmy

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I don't think there is any debate in this for 3rd and 4th line warehousing. Large warehouses, full of stock (A dream I know right) with a small cadre of people and AI doing all the picking.

It will be interesting to see what they come up with for the 1st and 2nd line by way of automation. And there is the whole movement to end user.

It's all about supply chain management, and other stuff like that I barely understand. It's interesting to see that the US has formed a joint organization to figure it out though: JAIC -

Artificial Intelligence for Military Logistics – Current Applications​



Although AI and ML could have great benefits for military logistics, the military has focused on AI and ML applications in other areas. The military has been slow on the uptake, and it often accepts an amber status for its logistics in active war zones.

However, integrating AI for logistics in the military comes with its attendant concerns, although they are not the same as those when using AI for surveillance, intelligence, or weapons. The issues with AI for logistics have to do with inherent unpredictability and vulnerability to exploitation.

Data scientists and engineers are making great progress in AI and ML with impressive results, but it is far from foolproof. This lack of certainty has until recently prevented more enthusiastic employment of available AI and ML solutions. A directive requiring all AI-based systems to have a human overseer or operator at all times should mitigate, but not eliminate, the specter of compromised and dangerous technology.

That said, the fact that the biggest adversaries of the US are aggressively pursuing the use of AI and ML in their own defense systems, and that these same systems face the same risks and vulnerabilities, might present unique opportunities for the Department of Defense (DoD) to level the playing field, so to speak.

Be that as it may, the DoD is addressing the issue of using AI for logistics in the US military, spearheaded by the newly formed Joint Artificial Intelligence Center (JAIC). The authors of the “Summary Of The 2018 Department Of Defense Artificial Intelligence Strategy” point out that “Other nations, particularly China and Russia, are making significant investments in AI for military purposes…The United States, together with its allies and partners, must adopt AI to maintain its strategic position, prevail on future battlefields, and safeguard this order.”

 
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