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Naval Combat Systems Engineer ( NCSE )

tt

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Who knows the security clearance level of Naval Combat Systems Engineering(Officer)? Thanks!
 
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Hi guys this is my first Post!  :)


I was wondering about the Naval Combat Systems Officer (NCSO) I know the take care of the ships large guns and torpedos (spelling?) but in the event of an enemy ship/sub/plane etc, would the NCSO actually fire the gun at the ship? If the NCSO isn't the one fireing these, who is?

Thanks :snowman:
 

gcclarke

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Nope. Naval Combat Systems Engineering Officers are responsible for making sure the stuff works. The ones who fire the weapons are either Maritime Surface / Subsurface Officers (aka MARS Officers), and Naval Electronic Sensor Operators (For the guns and missiles), or Sonar Ops, for the Torps, and on occasion Naval Weapons Techs for the Close In Weapons System (CIWS).

When at action stations, the CSEO is in charge of the Emergency Response Team, whose primary role is emergency repairs to equipment, ensuring that the operators have the equipment available that they need to continue fighting the good fight.
 

Occam

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gcclarke said:
Nope. Naval Combat Systems Engineering Officers are responsible for making sure the technicians make sure the stuff works.

Fixed that for ya.  ;)

Wouldn't want to give the impression we trust you guys with tools or anything sharper than a pencil or sliderule.  ;D
 

gcclarke

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Occam said:
Fixed that for ya.  ;)

Wouldn't want to give the impression we trust you guys with tools or anything sharper than a pencil or sliderule.  ;D

To an extent, true. However, an Engineering Officer's tools are the members of his or her department. But yeah, definitely not trusted with a multimeter.
 

alejo

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Hey come on guys. Not all of us potential NCSEO have no idea how to handle tools!
  ???
 

Oldgateboatdriver

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Alejo:

Glad to see you caught on the lingo fast. Yes, it is NCSE O, sometimes referred to only as CSE O. An NCSO is a Naval Control of Shipping Officer, a specialty found only in the naval reserve (if any are left). They concerned themselves with the organization, coordination and control of merchant ship convoys.
 

Occam

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alejo said:
Hey come on guys. Not all of us potential NCSEO have no idea how to handle tools!
  ???

If I saw a CSE O with a screwdriver, it had better be for opening a can of beer!  ;D
 

gcclarke

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alejo said:
Hey come on guys. Not all of us potential NCSEO have no idea how to handle tools!
  ???

Well, it's not only a matter of whether or not you know how to handle tools in general. It's also whether or not you know how to use them on the kit in question. And more to the point, it's also not your job. Even former techs who joined the dark side generally aren't "allowed" to work hands on.
 

JMesh

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Oldgateboatdriver said:
An NCSO is a Naval Control of Shipping Officer, a specialty found only in the naval reserve (if any are left). They concerned themselves with the organization, coordination and control of merchant ship convoys.

Quick side note: There are no specific NCSOs left. This aspect (now Naval Cooperation and Guidance for Shipping - NCAGS) has become a part of the job of NAVRES Int Os.

[/tangent]
 

Navalsnpr

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alejo said:
Hey come on guys. Not all of us potential NCSEO have no idea how to handle tools!
  ???

This is true... but handle them at home.  ;D 

The NE/NWT's have training on the kit that you do not. Imagine this one... An Investigation is convened to examine why a high price piece was broken. They find out that an un-qualified personnel was maintaining the kit. I'm sure you can figure out the rest.
 

Edward Campbell

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gcclarke said:
Well, it's not only a matter of whether or not you know how to handle tools in general. It's also whether or not you know how to use them on the kit in question. And more to the point, it's also not your job. Even former techs who joined the dark side generally aren't "allowed" to work hands on.


This is a key point for all serving and aspiring CF members: each person has a job, (s)he is assigned to that job because (s)he has (someone hopes (s)he has) a suitable mix of skills and knowledge to do that job and, simultaneously, to learn from that job so as to prepare himself/herself for promotion - for harder, more demanding jobs.

For officers, especially, this may be a bit frustrating - you may wish that you could be doing some of the "hands on" and "fun" stuff than the NCMs are doing, but that's their job, not yours. I watched this envy thing play out, over and over again, during a 35+ year career involving a few different cap badges - officers and senior NCMs who adjusted, quickly and easily, to the fact that they have their jobs and junior people have other jobs, got along fine; those who wanted to do someone else's job usually failed - often miserably - at both.

And don't get me started on officers, mid-ranked and senior, who come to Ottawa and want to do civil servants' jobs while ignoring their own, military, duties.
 

Mike5

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This is an interesting discussion of the role of a Naval Combat Systems Engineering Officer.  Can anyone describe a typical day in the life of an NCSEO ?  It sounds like the closest analogous civilian role would be the manager of a computer software / hardware support team?

I understand this is not a PRes role?

Thanks in advance for any discussion,

Mike
 

Occam

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Mike5 said:
This is an interesting discussion of the role of a Naval Combat Systems Engineering Officer.  Can anyone describe a typical day in the life of an NCSEO ?  It sounds like the closest analogous civilian role would be the manager of a computer software / hardware support team?

I understand this is not a PRes role?

Thanks in advance for any discussion,

Mike

Not just computer software/hardware, but manager to the technical support teams for Comm/Nav/Radar/Sonar/Weapons systems as well.
 

drunknsubmrnr

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Alejo,

I wouldn't want you to get the wrong idea. I once let a CSEO solder a switch, under close supervision. I was responsible to my CSE chief and the XO for the work being done right though, and it was a somewhat of a nerve-wracking experience. It's not something you would routinely expect.
 

gcclarke

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Mike5 said:
This is an interesting discussion of the role of a Naval Combat Systems Engineering Officer.  Can anyone describe a typical day in the life of an NCSEO ?  It sounds like the closest analogous civilian role would be the manager of a computer software / hardware support team?

I understand this is not a PRes role?

Thanks in advance for any discussion,

Mike

I wouldn't argue that you're far off the mark, at least not while posted to a ship, or a unit directly supporting ships (such as the flee maintenance facilities or the coast's J37s [engineering operations] organizations). In those roles, you're very much so involved in making sure that the work that needs to get done gets done. But certainly not in doing it yourself. Whether you're prioritizing work, or reporting back to shore authorities to make sure that your boss's boss's boss knows what is wrong with your stuff, it's all about doing your best to deliver capability to the fleet, be it your ship, or all of them that is your responsibility.

In other positions, it's often about doing your best to develop solutions for the future capability of the CF's navy. This may be about training personnel who will in the future fix things, or it may be about working on the project management team that helps guide the course of any future procurement for the fleet of the future.

As for my typical day, I spend a large portion of it dealing with paperwork, whether it be the messages we have to send off telling shore establishments that some of our stuff is broken, dealing with a guy who has failed on his EXPRES test, or making sure that a member gets a new Terms of Service offer for continued employment beyond their initial contract. And everything else in between. But again, a lot of that is due to where I am posted, and either won't happen or will be less likely to happen while posted ashore.
 

NavyShooter

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I'm a supervisor NE Tech....if I'm doing my job right, my guys do all the work, and I just back-stop them if they run out of ideas on a problem.  I shouldn't have too many tools in my hands either.

If a CSEO has tools in his hand, it'd best be to open up his desk drawer that he lost the key for, 'cause if it's for any of my kit, he's on his own, after being asked politely if he has anything else he should be doing...
 

ItsJustOscar

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E.R. Campbell said:
For officers, especially, this may be a bit frustrating - you may wish that you could be doing some of the "hands on" and "fun" stuff than the NCMs are doing, but that's their job, not yours.

Are all Officers positions aboard tedious and administrative (for the lack of better words), or are there some that include hands on work?

Or, do NCMs have all the fun?  :)

:cdn:
 

Navalsnpr

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ItsJustOscar said:
Are all Officers positions aboard tedious and administrative (for the lack of better words), or are there some that include hands on work?

Or, do NCMs have all the fun?  :)

:cdn:

If you want to be hands on, then the NCM side is better. CSEO's do administrative work. CSE NCM's do the hands on.
 
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