On Training Army Formations (Split from: BP & OPP)

[aesop081]

value in getting the entire formation out in the rhubarb.

Of course there is. In the end you have to go out and see if it works where the metal meets the meat. That being said, there has to be, IMHO anyways, intensive use of simulation before taking a formation out for real. This , i think, helps avoid alot of wasted time and resources.

I know that for us, there is a huge ammount of simulation before we are let loose to play with a surface action group. That way we dont arrive to the exercise with below standard procedures and are not wasting a ton of money and time with large fleets of warships. I have no doubt that the same principle applies to training army formations.

 

[George Wallace]

If 1 CMBG HQ & Sigs needs to practice putting the HQ together in the field, thats unit level training and they can do that without putting the whole brigade out in Wainwright. To do so would be a foolish use of resources.

People are talking about HHQ staff training and you are talking about immersion heaters..........

I agree.  (Don't focus on my comments on immersion heaters, as it is only tiny part of the whole.)

Yes, you can have the HQ & Sigs practice putting the HQ together as part of unit trg.  We however have STOPPED having those major EXs where the whole Bde/Div is brought together to work out and fine tune the coordination between the numerous units as Tango2Bravo points out.  I am not saying we have to deploy everyone every three months, but at the very least every two to three years on the grand scale. 

In Gagetown, C Sqn RCD usually had an annual Live Fire EX with 2 RCR and 22 Fd Sqn to train as a Cbt Team.  This gave them experience that was quite obviously lacking in the other Bdes when watching them operate at RVs in Wainwright and Suffield.  Small things like where the Inf followed the tanks, movement, spacing, etc.  I watched the other Armoured Reg'ts move across the open plains of Suffield with their tanks basically bumper to bumper as if they were Cougars on a Pde Sq, as opposed to spreading a Troop out over a km plus in the Advance.  Simulation doesn't give the CC of a veh the proper perspective, nor did using a "Tank Trainer" in a parking lot.

 

[Petard]

Odd, because the Brits used to run very ,very large scale CPXs based on a large, well staffed 'simulator.'

There were, of course, thousands and thousands of "troops in the field" because a good CPX needs a "live" signals system, that moves realistically, with all of its limitations. .

For the development of new TTPs or concepts of Ops, I believe this point highlights the benefits and limitations of simulators, and is why there needs to be some troop deployment involved, and at some point, as much as practical. Simulation is only as good as the practical experience that is used as the basis for its design, and this I would say goes in stages. Eventually any new concept will need more and more actual deployed troops, in order to see how even those much smaller parts might actually affect the whole.

We need a start point, to at least get an idea of the theoretically possible. Certainly here simulation alone can be a great help in getting a feel of the procedures involved, without having to torment troops on the ground with a lot of wasted effort from big mistakes. But those type of simulations are usually based on some pretty big assumptions. To try and make those simulations more realistic at some point you need to whittle those assumptions down by moving into the area of actual Troop deployments and operational research. That way the simulation becomes based on at least some empirical data, and not some subjective opinion. This is especially true in the area of operating networked comm's and logistics within a coalition.

As we push the network operations idea along, I see this need for actual troop deployments becoming not only a good to do, but an essential thing to do.

At the link is a story on a recent experiment conducted at White Sands New Mexico involving ABCA countries, with a few troops deployed, and mobile, feeding simulated transmissions and positional awareness data from Coy all the way up to Bde and Div level. This was done to see how well each of their comm's systems can operate within the context of a multi national Div deployment. Do you not think at some point its worthwile to see how that might work with actual Pls etc are also filling up the airways?   
http://www.defencetalk.com/multinational-communications-test-held-at-white-sands-30193/