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Sexual Misconduct Allegations in The CAF

OldSolduer

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The current crop of alternatives are nothing to write home about either though.

Choosing a politician to vote for is like trying to figure out which limb you want broken... all options suck. Some more than others. The sad part, is that for how corrupt and incompetent the current liberal government is, they will get re-elected because people don't believe they have a viable alternative at the moment; so they will put up with it instead of upsetting the apple cart.
Sometimes its the devil you know that's the best option.
 

Furniture

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If our system allowed more options that would be great
Our system allows pretty much any option, people choose the same old flavours every time.

Don't blame first past the post for people choosing politicians they know lie to them, blame the lazy, disinterested voters.
 

Jarnhamar

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Committee reverses itself on wrapping up investigation into military misconduct​

Link

However

But how much further the investigation will go was in doubt Friday as Liberal committee members launched a filibuster to avoid a vote on a Conservative motion to summon one more witness, a former senior adviser in the Prime Minister's Office.
 
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Messerschmitt

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MPs hear harrowing account of sexual assault in the military​


"I am here today to tell you that I was raped only one month into my basic training at St. Jean (Que.)
Raped! Not "he placed his hand on my leg so I feel sexually assaulted. "

Boland, a retired lieutenant-colonel, told MPs that he while worked at DND headquarters in Ottawa, he was singled out for retribution after reporting the harassment of a junior female colleague by a senior engineering manager.
If a Lt-Col goes through this, there is no hope for this institution.
 

Kilted

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Is it really wise to have members speaking publicly while there are ongoing investigations involving the alleged events that they are speaking about? Aren't there enough cases that have been resolved that they could have looked into?
 

MJP

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Is it really wise to have members speaking publicly while there are ongoing investigations involving the alleged events that they are speaking about? Aren't there enough cases that have been resolved that they could have looked into?
Did you read the article? She and the others didn't discuss their specific cases rather their loss of agency in the process and in some cases their fears over a culture that shields perpetrators and is not conducive to supporting folks in coming forward.

From the article:
The committee steered clear of the specifics of the assaults involving all three women; chair Marilyn Gladu noted that some of the cases "remain under investigation by military police."
 

Kilted

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Did you read the article? She and the others didn't discuss their specific cases rather their loss of agency in the process and in some cases their fears over a culture that shields perpetrators and is not conducive to supporting folks in coming forward.

From the article:
The committee steered clear of the specifics of the assaults involving all three women; chair Marilyn Gladu noted that some of the cases "remain under investigation by military police."
I did read the article, while they may have avoided specifics, they were still referencing events that are under investigation.
 

MJP

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I did read the article, while they may have avoided specifics, they were still referencing events that are under investigation.
So no one can ever reference things that are under investigation? They are after all trying to figure out why the CAF continues to fail at providing a safe environment for all employees. They do have to delve into areas and systemics faults that that have caused the issues.
 

TCM621

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MPs hear harrowing account of sexual assault in the military​



Raped! Not "he placed his hand on my leg so I feel sexually assaulted. "


If a Lt-Col goes through this, there is no hope for this institution.

As terrible as that was for that person, it is just an anecdote. All it proves is that the CAF is not immune to the evils of society anymore than any other institution. The article gives little information as to the response by the military other than. It was "terrible" and felt like an "interrogation". That could be a result of the fact that she was going through a terrible experience and being probed for details was pleasant which I think is a problem all sexual assault investigations face or it could be that the investigators had poor people skill. There is a reason most large police forces have special sexual assault sections. It is a difficult job that requires a blend of compassion and dispassion that is hard to master. Part of it is training but part of it is natural. Women tend to be better at it because they are seen as less threatening than males but even then it is a difficult line to show compassion while remaining detached enough to properly investigate it. Our MP Detachments tend to be small and, frankly, the people staffing them aren't very well trained and/or experienced. Maybe a regional team that can be dispatched or a specialty position could be created but the threshold to get that position would have to be quite high or it could end up being a disaster..

So no one can ever reference things that are under investigation? They are after all trying to figure out why the CAF continues to fail at providing a safe environment for all employees. They do have to delve into areas and systemics faults that that have caused the issues.

In general, it is better not to comment on things under investigation because it could cause issues with that investigation. For example, if the alleged victim is found to misrepresenting the incident publicly, it could damage her credibility and cause a charge to be dismissed. The same goes for the prosecution side.
 

Jarnhamar

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I did read the article, while they may have avoided specifics, they were still referencing events that are under investigation.
I hate saying this but I feel like we're in a position in the CAF where in many cases the only way someone will see justice is to go to the media and essentially force the CAF to take something seriously and investigate.
 

PuckChaser

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I hate saying this but I feel like we're in a position in the CAF where in many cases the only way someone will see justice is to go to the media and essentially force the CAF to take something seriously and investigate.
I wonder if that'll work for trucks, chest rigs and service rifle upgrades?
 

OldSolduer

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I hate saying this but I feel like we're in a position in the CAF where in many cases the only way someone will see justice is to go to the media and essentially force the CAF to take something seriously and investigate.
That's exactly what we do in Corrections.
 

MilEME09

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I wonder if that'll work for trucks, chest rigs and service rifle upgrades?
So like the CBC investigation done back in the 80s that looked at the state of the CAF? Another in depth story like that might work.
 

Furniture

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As terrible as that was for that person, it is just an anecdote. All it proves is that the CAF is not immune to the evils of society anymore than any other institution. The article gives little information as to the response by the military other than. It was "terrible" and felt like an "interrogation". That could be a result of the fact that she was going through a terrible experience and being probed for details was pleasant which I think is a problem all sexual assault investigations face or it could be that the investigators had poor people skill. There is a reason most large police forces have special sexual assault sections. It is a difficult job that requires a blend of compassion and dispassion that is hard to master. Part of it is training but part of it is natural. Women tend to be better at it because they are seen as less threatening than males but even then it is a difficult line to show compassion while remaining detached enough to properly investigate it. Our MP Detachments tend to be small and, frankly, the people staffing them aren't very well trained and/or experienced. Maybe a regional team that can be dispatched or a specialty position could be created but the threshold to get that position would have to be quite high or it could end up being a disaster..
Perhaps the CAF should look at getting local police forces to investigate these sorts of crimes, as the local police are more likely to have the expertise and experience to handle the investigation, particularly in larger centers where they have specialized units for the task.
 

Good2Golf

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Perhaps the CAF should look at getting local police forces to investigate these sorts of crimes, as the local police are more likely to have the expertise and experience to handle the investigation, particularly in larger centers where they have specialized units for the task.
Wouldn’t it be better for provincial forces (SQ, OPP, RCMP under contract) than Muni forces? Direct accountability to provincial SolGens, thence to.... 🤷🏻‍♂️ (Hesitant to say MND, sadly, given how that worked out recently)
 

dapaterson

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One partial solution would be to amend NDA 18.3 to style the position of Provost Marshall as a mandatory GiC appointment (as the CDS, JAG and military judges are), removing the potential for inappropriate CDS influence on the appointment or, indeed, CDS refusal to appoint a PM.

Canadian Forces Provost Marshal​

Marginal note:Appointment

  • 18.3 (1) The Chief of the Defence Staff may appoint an officer who has been a member of the military police for at least 10 years to be the Canadian Forces Provost Marshal (in this Act referred to as the “Provost Marshal”).
  • Marginal note:Rank
    (2) The Provost Marshal holds a rank that is not less than colonel.
  • Marginal note:Tenure of office and removal
    (3) The Provost Marshal holds office during good behaviour for a term not exceeding four years. The Chief of the Defence Staff may remove the Provost Marshal from office for cause on the recommendation of an inquiry committee established under regulations made by the Governor in Council.
  • Marginal note:powers of inquiry committee
    (4) An inquiry committee has the same powers, rights and privileges — other than the power to punish for contempt — as are vested in a superior court of criminal jurisdiction with respect to
    • (a) the attendance, swearing and examination of witnesses;
    • (b) the production and inspection of documents;
    • (c) the enforcement of its orders; and
    • (d) all other matters necessary or proper for the due exercise of its jurisdiction.
  • Marginal note:Reappointment
    (5) The Provost Marshal is eligible to be reappointed on the expiry of a first or subsequent term of office.
 

OldSolduer

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Wouldn’t it be better for provincial forces (SQ, OPP, RCMP under contract) than Muni forces? Direct accountability to provincial SolGens, thence to.... 🤷🏻‍♂️ (Hesitant to say MND, sadly, given how that worked out recently)
I'd venture that the major centres - Toronto, Winnipeg, Vancouver etc etc Police forces have that sort of expertise. The smaller cities not so much.
 

MilEME09

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I'd venture that the major centres - Toronto, Winnipeg, Vancouver etc etc Police forces have that sort of expertise. The smaller cities not so much.
Perhaps each base should then have a partner police force who is selected by the provost Marshall for these situations
 
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