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Sexual Misconduct Allegations in The CAF

SupersonicMax

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We are still subject to some of the same hiring practices as any other branch of the Public Service and still strive/struggle to meet EE and diversity targets. In that we don't do well in this regard may be why we are not truly reflective.
Better in the sense that we recruit, on average, people with a stronger moral fibre than average Canada.
 

Remius

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We are still subject to some of the same hiring practices as any other branch of the Public Service and still strive/struggle to meet EE and diversity targets. In that we don't do well in this regard may be why we are not truly reflective.
Agreed. Having worked at a CFRC the challenges to meet any “target” are stymied by people’s perception and yes, gender perceptions and traditional gender roles that still exist in people’s minds and society. The fact is that a lot of women do not want to play in the dirt or blow up stuff. Certain minorities don’t trust the military based in their own experiences and pre conceptions from their countries of origin.

But we should not kid ourselves that we are anything close to a reflection of our society, we should however seek out the best and attract them to us. Our current situation though has probably set that back by years.
 

SupersonicMax

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Agreed. Having worked at a CFRC the challenges to meet any “target” are stymied by people’s perception and yes, gender perceptions and traditional gender roles that still exist in people’s minds and society. The fact is that a lot of women do not want to play in the dirt or blow up stuff. Certain minorities don’t trust the military based in their own experiences and pre conceptions from their countries of origin.

But we should not kid ourselves that we are anything close to a reflection of our society, we should however seek out the best and attract them to us. Our current situation though has probably set that back by years.
Funny, the same kind of arguments was made back in the 1970s for French Canadians.
 

Bruce Monkhouse

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Our current situation though has probably set that back by years.
No it hasn't.......the only reason I give a flying frig about the CAF is because of this website. I've been a civilian for over 30 years and I can tell you my "not give a flying frig" is still light years above the average Canadian. I'd wager 99% of Canadians haven't even clicked on a headline link about this.
 

daftandbarmy

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Agreed. Having worked at a CFRC the challenges to meet any “target” are stymied by people’s perception and yes, gender perceptions and traditional gender roles that still exist in people’s minds and society. The fact is that a lot of women do not want to play in the dirt or blow up stuff. Certain minorities don’t trust the military based in their own experiences and pre conceptions from their countries of origin.

But we should not kid ourselves that we are anything close to a reflection of our society, we should however seek out the best and attract them to us. Our current situation though has probably set that back by years.

At least female troops are being treated the same as the male, in the US:

One of the Marine Corps' first women grunts might be booted out only two years after making history​


Cpl. Remedios Cruz, who was reduced in rank from sergeant, is facing discharge after pleading guilty to fraternization as part of a deal to avoid going to trial. According to the New York Times, in the Article 32 hearing —the military's version of a grand jury proceeding — the presiding official advised against a full-blown court-martial.

Cruz's battalion commander disagreed, and recommended she go to trial for all three charges brought against her, which included adultery, accessory to larceny and fraternization, the Times reported.

 

Kilted

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Agreed. Having worked at a CFRC the challenges to meet any “target” are stymied by people’s perception and yes, gender perceptions and traditional gender roles that still exist in people’s minds and society. The fact is that a lot of women do not want to play in the dirt or blow up stuff. Certain minorities don’t trust the military based in their own experiences and pre conceptions from their countries of origin.

But we should not kid ourselves that we are anything close to a reflection of our society, we should however seek out the best and attract them to us. Our current situation though has probably set that back by years.
Cultural approches to military service are also significant, regardless of past experiences. We do have a significant number of Sikh members for example. There are also religious bans in military service, for example Jehovah Witnesses and Amish/other Anabastist groups. I could comment on particular groups that I think are underrepresented, but that would be based solely on my own experiences.
 

daftandbarmy

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Can't hire those who don't apply...

:Tangent on:

Dude.... don't get me started. I failed, spectacularly, in trying to move our recruiting approaches away from the practises I had used in 1979. Well, at least in 1979 we didn't having spelling mistakes on the posters and brochures (that no one in the 2000s piad any attention to becasue they are on their phones etc). Viz:

Historical Trends Driving Current Practices

The services’ advisory group presentations discussed their tendency to focus recruiting efforts in areas where they have been successful in the past, such as regional markets or particular schools. While this approach is logical and has been relatively successful in meeting accession targets, Census information indicates ongoing changes in youth demographics, and youth interests and career plans have changed over the years, as reported by numerous sources. Such changes may make traditional approaches less successful in the future. The services also noted shifts in the population distribution from more-rural areas to urban and suburban centers. This geographical shift may most directly affect the reserve components (which recruit for local units) but ultimately could affect all components because relocation from more- to less-isolated areas may present more alternatives for youth to consider.


:Tangent Off:
 

lenaitch

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and don’t get me started on “warrior culture”. I wish that would go away.

Tell me about it. We can “thank” Big Rick for that. 😐

A country bumpkin civilian asks the question: When the overall mandate of the organization is, if called upon, to commit violence on the country's behalf, why is a warrior culture a bad thing? Or does it mean something else 'on the inside'? Not that all CAF members are ultimately trigger-pullers by trade, others are ultimately enablers.
 

mariomike

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Warrior culture,

 

SeaKingTacco

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Better in the sense that we recruit, on average, people with a stronger moral fibre than average Canada.
See, I am not sure that is actually the case. We recruit what we recruit. Whether that makes a CAF recruit ”more moral” than the average Canadian- I am not sure.

In theory, we hold up a high standard and expect people to meet it. Despite our recent public travails, I actually think most people in the military are honest, decent, try hard and believe in what they do.
 

Weinie

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So, you expect everyone to air out everything they have done or that their community has done over the years to contribute to the environment we are in today? As I have said before several times, we all have biases that led to the environment we are living in today. That includes you, me, senior CAF leadership, junior leaders, etc. Because I have biases doesn’t mean I can’t bring others to realize they do as well. At least I realize I have them and the institution has issues rather than be blind to the problems the institution is facing.

Good on you for reporting this specific incident. Now, which of your behaviours contributed (in a big or small way) to the environment we live in today? Why did you behave in those ways? These are the questions we should all be asking ourselves to uncover both our personal biases and the institution’s. How many time have you given a PERX to someone on MATA despite having even 1 day of observable work? Why did you do so? Doesn’t that contribute to the marginalization of women in the grand scheme of things?
So you seem to waver between woke and whiny in your posts.

Along with your credentials as a fighter pilot, you seem to feel you are entitled to/imbued with psychiatric credentials as well. I will take your postings with the credence that they deserve.

edited to insert/delete words,
 

Brad Sallows

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Not sure what that means lol

It means the CAF isn't perfect, but it is better. Society at large will most likely re-elect those who experience things differently instead of setting them aside.
 

SupersonicMax

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So you seem to waver between woke and whiny in your posts.

Along with your credentials as a fighter pilot, you seem to feel you are entitled to/imbued with psychiatric credentials as well. I will take your postings with the credence that they deserve.

edited to insert/delete words,
Not sure what level you are in the CAF but if seems like you are, by virtue at least of your rank, a leader within the institution.

If leaders can’t at least put their beliefs aside and do a bit of introspection on their own behaviours and find ways to better themselves and, incidentally, their organization, I am not sure those they are worthy of leading. The first step to getting better is accepting we have issues.
 

Good2Golf

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Assuming you’re still serving and it seems a position of leadership, what short comings did you self-observe and how are you improving how you lead to address your privileges and biases that have disadvantaged women and minority groups in the CAF?
 

lenaitch

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Warrior culture,

Thanks for that. Good read (apparently a re-read; I don't remember it).
 

SupersonicMax

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Assuming you’re still serving and it seems a position of leadership, what short comings did you self-observe and how are you improving how you lead to address your privileges and biases that have disadvantaged women and minority groups in the CAF?
On a personal level, for example, I started using gender-neutral language, I stopped (a long time ago) using so-called fighter pilot speak (that tended exclude women, was crude and was full of sexual innuendos), and I am making an effort to minimize the effects of pregnancy on career development (like writing PERs, despite a short observation period). On a organizational level, in my previous unit, I set aside 2 hours a week on Fridays for my Branch to talk about issues in the unit and tried to incorporate inclusivity in the mix. I am also actively having small group, casual, discussions with peers and subordinates to try and make them view the world from women’s and minorities’ lens and try to foster ideas on how to combat it within the institution. I am a strong believer that if solutions come from the lowest levels, they tend to work better than if they are forced down the CoC.

The first step, however, was to acknowledge that some things I did contributed to the marginalization of women and visible minorities and that many of our own policies tend to favour the white, anglo-saxon male.
 

Good2Golf

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Very positive effort, I believe. Good on you. I actually grew up with many influential women and used neutral pronouns (they as singular neutral, not plural) literally decades before it became expected, particularly as a demonstration of more recent ‘wokeness’.

Arguably, empathy and respect should not be seen as recent developments; however, it would be entirely fair I think to note that empathy to our own has not been a strong suit in the CAF since as long as I can remember for the early/mid-80s.

I sincerely wish that empathy can be embraced within the CAF where appropriate, as it is not diametrically counter to capability to execute ones mission responsibly.
 
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