• Thanks for stopping by. Logging in to a registered account will remove all generic ads. Please reach out with any questions or concerns.

Surface Warfare Officer badge

Humphrey Bogart

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Reaction score
4,938
Points
1,360
Oh no you miss the entire point. We bring our own ship and hunt down the pirates like privateers. Its no fun riding in someone else's ship shooting small arms.
There was an American Company that tried this called AdvanFort that had this setup. They made some booboos and got all their crap seized in India and all their operatives arrested :sneaky:
 

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,264
Points
1,260
Not a quandary at all. If a NWO is posted to CJOC, they are not under the RCN, and therefore RCN orders to RCN members under command if the RCN do not apply.

Half assed staff work by the RCN.

I bet you're tons of fun at parties.

Honestly, as much as I think the whole badge is silly; who cares ? You're picking fly shit out of pepper.

I have no doubt the proper regulations will be adjusted with time and you can untie your knotted knickers then.
 

dapaterson

Army.ca Relic
Subscriber
Donor
Reaction score
7,098
Points
1,090
Like the naval NCM ranks that the RCN hasn't sorted out yet?

There is a legal and regulatory framework that governs the CAF. Interesting, given your posting history, how lackadaisical your approach is to leaders telling people that the rules don't matter
 

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,264
Points
1,260
Like the naval NCM ranks that the RCN hasn't sorted out yet?

There is a legal and regulatory framework that governs the CAF. Interesting, given your posting history, how lackadaisical your approach is to leaders telling people that the rules don't matter

There has been a movement to change/adjust the RCN NCM ranks for years. Honestly I would love to see something more traditional but I'm not sure there is much traction for this ATM, and its not that huge a deal for me. Nor do I think the rest of the RCN NCMs care very much. I sit to be corrected though.

Absolutely there is regulatory framework that governs the CAF and I have no doubt the RCN received informal blessings, at least, from that framework to proceed. I would imagine it went something like this:

Requesting Authority:
"Hey, this badge is approved and stock is available, mind if we push it out for distribution and let the regulations catch up later ?"

Approving Authority:
"Sure, go ahead; make it happen."


Or are you proposing the RCN just went out and did this without the blessing or consolation of any dress committees or very senior leadership in the CAF ?

You will of course forgive me if I don't equate this NWO badge with our (CAF) issues involving sexual assault and other grievous abuses of power. This badge is really comical at its core and means very little to anyone with exception for those who may wear it. But hey if it works to improve the QoL for the NWOs, then more power to them.
 
Last edited:

KevinB

Army.ca Legend
Subscriber
Reaction score
8,182
Points
1,140
There has been a movement to change/adjust the RCN NCM ranks for years. Honestly I would love to see something more traditional but I'm not sure there is much traction for this ATM, and its not that huge a deal for me. Nor do I think the rest of the RCN NCMs care very much. I sit to be corrected though.

Absolutely there is regulatory framework that governs the CAF and I have no doubt the RCN received informal blessings, at least, from that framework to proceed. I would imagine it went something like this:

Requesting Authority:
"Hey, this badge is approved and stock is available, mind if we push it out for distribution and let the regulations catch up later ?"

Approving Authority:
"Sure, go ahead; make it happen."


Or are you proposing the RCN just went out and did this without the blessing or consolation of any dress committees or very senior leadership in the CAF ?

You will of course forgive me if I don't equate this NWO badge with our (CAF) issues involving sexual assault and other grievous abuses of power. This badge is really comical at its core and means very little to anyone with exception for those who may wear it. But hey if it works to improve the QoL for the NWOs, then more power to them.
I took it more as to your rather very starchy conformance to a rules based process to acquisitions etc - and your rather happy go lucky take on the badge.
There seem to be too very different approaches going in in your replies...
 

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,264
Points
1,260
I took it more as to your rather very starchy conformance to a rules based process to acquisitions etc - and your rather happy go lucky take on the badge.
There seem to be too very different approaches going in in your replies...

That's a fair critique. I guess I never conflated the two. But its a fair critique, ill take it.

I also refuse to believe the RCN pushed this out with out higher authority giving some sort of blessing, informal or formal.
 

Underway

Army.ca Veteran
Donor
Reaction score
3,064
Points
1,040
Same argument for Naval Trades working in an Army environment. Which combats do we wear? RCN says you don't put on CADPAT. Army CO says, get your ass to stores and draw some CADPAT. Stores says we don't have enough CADPAT for navy types so won't issue it on some logistic directive. Army CO says why didn't you get CADPAT when I ordered it... and round and round it goes.

Never have the same problem with Army types onboard ship. Are you posted to ship? Here's your pile of gear you have no idea how to wear. I've helped more than one purple trade figure out how to operate a floater jacket.
 

Underway

Army.ca Veteran
Donor
Reaction score
3,064
Points
1,040
There was an American Company that tried this called AdvanFort that had this setup. They made some booboos and got all their crap seized in India and all their operatives arrested :sneaky:
We figured by the end of the third pitcher that there would be some legally sticky situations and then called some cabs and did a run ashore. Hence why you can't really be a mercenary group you have to have national backing from someone to fly their flag, thus be able to tote around 50 cals etc...
 

dimsum

Army.ca Legend
Mentor
Reaction score
4,071
Points
1,260
Nor do I think the rest of the RCN NCMs care very much. I sit to be corrected though.
More like "there will be a riot if replacing rank badges come up before housing" (to tack it onto the PLD, etc thread).

And frankly, I'd understand. I've always been a proponent that the CAF can advance multiple files at once, but unless the affected parties (NCMs in this case) really want it, replacing the current ranks seems like a waste of staff resources.
 

daftandbarmy

Army.ca Relic
Reaction score
11,362
Points
1,160
More like "there will be a riot if replacing rank badges come up before housing" (to tack it onto the PLD, etc thread).

And frankly, I'd understand. I've always been a proponent that the CAF can advance multiple files at once, but unless the affected parties (NCMs in this case) really want it, replacing the current ranks seems like a waste of staff resources.

I'm just delighted that the abbreviation for this thread is SWAB...

... you know, as in 'the deck'.

Taxi! ;)
 

btrudy

Member
Reaction score
189
Points
610
Same argument for Naval Trades working in an Army environment. Which combats do we wear? RCN says you don't put on CADPAT. Army CO says, get your ass to stores and draw some CADPAT. Stores says we don't have enough CADPAT for navy types so won't issue it on some logistic directive. Army CO says why didn't you get CADPAT when I ordered it... and round and round it goes.

Never have the same problem with Army types onboard ship. Are you posted to ship? Here's your pile of gear you have no idea how to wear. I've helped more than one purple trade figure out how to operate a floater jacket.

It's not just the RCN which says that. It's CANFORGEN 198/09 which says that. Army COs don't get to just ignore CANFORGENs because they feel like it. The regulation is quite clear, that naval pers are only allowed to wear CADPAT (and you're only allowed to direct them to do so) when there's a bone fide operational reason, such as conducting a field exercise.

Much like the same reason that Army pers on ship can be given NCDs; because being on ship they need to be wearing the uniform designed for fire protection.
 

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,264
Points
1,260
It's not just the RCN which says that. It's CANFORGEN 198/09 which says that. Army COs don't get to just ignore CANFORGENs because they feel like it. The regulation is quite clear, that naval pers are only allowed to wear CADPAT (and you're only allowed to direct them to do so) when there's a bone fide operational reason, such as conducting a field exercise.

Much like the same reason that Army pers on ship can be given NCDs; because being on ship they need to be wearing the uniform designed for fire protection.

I was posted with the Army when that CANFORGEN was released. It was disregarded. And I was most definitely not allowed to wear NCDs as my work dress.
 

dimsum

Army.ca Legend
Mentor
Reaction score
4,071
Points
1,260
I was posted with the Army when that CANFORGEN was released. It was disregarded. And I was most definitely not allowed to wear NCDs as my work dress.
That seems more like the local CoC disregarding orders.

Ya know...like the initial BEARDFORGEN roll-out.
 

Navy_Pete

Army.ca Veteran
Subscriber
Reaction score
1,630
Points
1,040
In my personal experience the RCN is pretty crap at getting official policy updated after a temporary order was issued. I doubt there will be any follow up, and if they really had higher order support this could have come out as a CANFORGEN authorizing it on all uniforms/elements for people with the qualification. 🤷‍♂️
 

Halifax Tar

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
2,264
Points
1,260
In my personal experience the RCN is pretty crap at getting official policy updated after a temporary order was issued. I doubt there will be any follow up, and if they really had higher order support this could have come out as a CANFORGEN authorizing it on all uniforms/elements for people with the qualification. 🤷‍♂️

If so I would hope the next higher command would come out and slap this down.

Let's also not forget it takes us decades to put in new uniform pieces. New NCDs I'm looking at you.
 

dimsum

Army.ca Legend
Mentor
Reaction score
4,071
Points
1,260
I was actually at the office today and saw the moustache in the wild.

Honestly, it looks fine.
 

Furniture

Army.ca Veteran
Reaction score
1,128
Points
1,110
Lol I know I'm in the minority but I like the current NCDs
I'm 100% with you on that, I don't understand why people pretend CADPAT is the pinnacle of comfort in uniforms. I'm glad the only time I ever have to put CADPAT on again is for my trips to Alert or the NWS.
 

Humphrey Bogart

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Reaction score
4,938
Points
1,360
I'm 100% with you on that, I don't understand why people pretend CADPAT is the pinnacle of comfort in uniforms. I'm glad the only time I ever have to put CADPAT on again is for my trips to Alert or the NWS.
Coveralls are my personal favorite. Better for Action/Emergency Stations as well, improves response/close up time 😎
 
Top