Author Topic: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.  (Read 161654 times)

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Pte Lickers

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2003, 11:50:00 »
Yes homosexuals should be allowed in the Canadian Forces, Since as human beings and citizens they have the right of any other person. The only thing that should block them are the things that block eerybody (criminal record, citizenship medical ailments etc) Sexual preference is not and should not be guidelines for any sort of application to any job.
As for marriage, why not??? a stable loving and sexual relationship can exist between two people of the same or opposite sex so shinanagins on anything else.  BOO HOO its against god, well to bad yours isnt the only god or belief in this country.  
As for adopting children why not? If a stable supportive atmosphere can exist and be offered to a child in need then go ahead.
 
As for making the poor religious person uncomfortable in the next foxhole, he or she can go flock themself.  Your religious ideals are respected but dont except every commandement to be followed by every person in the army just cuz your there.

And as for the innapropriate and juvenile comment about sexual assault:  It was not uncommon in war for hetrosexual men to preform homosexual acts on each other to releive sexual tension particularly near thr front lines of WW1 and 2.  What im saying is homosexuals are just as capable of controlling urges the same as every other person on this earth.  I think every person who disagrees about race or sexual oreintation should wake up open their eyes and climb out of their petty small mind.

Pte Lickers

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #26 on: July 07, 2003, 11:57:00 »
Oh yeah MuayTye,  your right  you have every right to hold your opinion.  Every man women or child should be able to hold one.

Your opinion isnt wrong or evil.  Its just backward outdated and very very sad.  I actually sincerly feel sorry for you that you cannot see out of your little box.  Perhaps as time progresses and you begin to mature you will be able to make that big step and think for yourself.

Offline radiohead

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #27 on: July 07, 2003, 12:52:00 »
I‘m Catholic and in my bible it says homosexuality is a sin.My view has nothing to do with being backward,it all has to do with my religion

So what part of this catholic bible says homosexualoty is a sin?  People aways point to it as a sin, but never back it up with a passage.  The bibles says a lot of things, like you can keep slaves, stome your wife.... so what makes one part more important that others.  I have feeling you break the bible rules all the time, with you quest for hot women... and sex.  After all doesn‘t the bible say that‘s wrong.  I‘m sure the person next to you in that foxhole who is religious would be uncomfortable with you, knowing you seek out pre-marriage sex.  From my understanding of the Christian religion, sin is sin..it doesn‘t matter what the sin was.... it‘s all wrong in the eyes of GoD.  And if your catholic, I sure who you do use birth control... its a sin too if youy believe in the Pope.

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #28 on: July 07, 2003, 13:20:00 »
I have stayed out of this discussion because I refuse to believe MTF is being honest. I think he is just acting this way to cause trouble, as no one in this day and age, except for religous zealots could be this ignorant.

All I have to say is the following two things for people who use religion to justify disliking homosexuals:

1) Canada is a SECULAR country. This is why we don‘t learn from any religious documents in school (thank god), and we are not forced by law to attend temple services (thank allah). Furthermore our laws are not based of religous texts or edicts (eg. stoning a woman for comitting adultery, thank buddha).

2) Homosexuals don‘t choose to be homosexuals, they are born that way. They cannot turn ungay no matter how hard they try, it is rooted in their psyche, and possibly even their genetics. Religious people CHOOSE to participate in their religion. If you consider homosexuality a problem, and are intelligent enough to see that religion is a problem, then who has the problem that can be fixed?

Offline WB

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #29 on: July 07, 2003, 14:33:00 »
I honestly don‘t see the relevence of this conversation. It doesn‘t really matter what anyone thinks of homosexuals because the CF has a policy of non descrimination. If I wanted to work at McDonalds, does my opinion on the Bacon Double Cheeseburger matter? Of course not. If I didn‘t like it I wouldn‘t apply for the job. Its like complaining about the weather. You can cry all you want but it won‘t change anything. Just go with the flow or look for another line of work.  :rolleyes:

Offline Andyboy

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #30 on: June 27, 2000, 13:57:00 »
When I picked up my copy of the Globe And Mail from my porch yesterday I was somewhat irritated at seeing the large colour photo of a man dressed in what appears to be an Australian Flag dress during the Gay Pride Parade spread across the front page. Unfortunately when I turned to page two I was even more disappointed. Halfway down in a small black and white photo was a few of the veterans who were honored at the skydome commemerating the 50th anniversary of the Korean War. Does anyone else see the irony of the honour of the front page spread being given to someone, who without the likes of the veterans relegated to the second page, would not enjoy the freedom to enjoy his "lifestyle"?

I cancelled my subscription today.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2004, 19:10:31 by Bruce Monkhouse »
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Offline Gunner

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #31 on: June 27, 2000, 19:59:00 »
Andyboy, the National Post had a pretty good editorial today on the Korean War.  As well, they have had other articles over the last week including an article by Dr Bercuson.

Unfortunately, Canada does not do alot of remembrance for the Korean War.  I‘d hazard to say most ordinary citizens don‘t even know we took part.

Cheers!

PS Shame on you for having a Globe and Mail subscription in the first place!
Had a wonderful ~26 years in the military and still miss it.

the patriot

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #32 on: July 05, 2000, 12:39:00 »
Heaven forbid the Gay Pride becomes a national holiday before Remembrance Day.  According to Chretien, it would be to expensive for banks, shopping malls, and IKEA to shut down to honour our war dead for one day.  What a sad testament this is.

-the patriot-

madorosh

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #33 on: July 05, 2000, 16:09:00 »
Didn‘t the Legion bring back the Two Minute silence last year for November 11?  I seem to recall a lot of ordinary folk stopping work at 11, even if they didn‘t get the day off.  Perhaps it is up to all of us to make Rememberance Day, at least two minutes of it, a National act of rememberance from a grassroots level, even if the pinheads in Ottawa won‘t.  

Seems to me, the two minutes had a lot of support - judging by the photos in Legion Magazine of transit workers, farmers, assemly line workers etc. stopping work at 11 am.  I hope the Legion makes the two minutes an annual thing.  I‘d like to see the federal government intervene - if they dont‘ have the balls to make everyone stay away from work on the 11th, then the least they can do is make people shut up for two minutes.   I would cut all the phone lines and turn off the cell phones at 11am if it was in my power.

Offline bossi

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #34 on: January 18, 2003, 08:52:00 »
Ya know, ya gotta wonder about all this.
On one hand, they're shoving gender equity down everybody's throats (no pun intended ... yuck - that's one image I'd rather not have visualised ... ).
Then, when some troopers exercise their right to dress in drag, the CF Ombudsman gets all bent out of shape ... ?
And, he's all in a huff about "his mandate" ... ?
Well, what about the mandate of a superior officer to defend his troops (who sometimes can't defend themselves very well, especially against smarty-pants and bureaucrats with big brains but little gonads ...)?
Whatever ...
This sounds similar to the tempest in a teapot when they tried to vilify the Navy for their "crossing the Equator" type of rituals - what some would call "time-honoured traditions" ... (but, oh - I forgot - bureaucratic gobble-dy-gook overrides common sense and tradition, doesn't it?)
Personally, I'm not a football fan, so I could care less.
As for dressing in drag?
I nearly "kilt" the last person who called it a skirt.
Some people just don't know how to lighten up, do they?
Oh, gee - maybe it's useful for troops to be able to laugh at themselves once in a while.   And, maybe it's not the worst thing in the world if we bring things out into the open, instead of hiding them ... dare I say ... in the closet?
Heck - I went to the MO this week, and nobody is giving me flak - actually, my buddies are being more supportive than ever.   Maybe bureaucrats like the Ombudsman would benefit from REALLY understanding the psyche of soldiers, instead of forcing political correctness upon a group that has to deal with politically incorrect stuff like "friendly fire", landmine strikes, etc. ...


'Train' a drag
Parade draws ire of army watchdog
By STEPHANIE RUBEC, OTTAWA BUREAU

OTTAWA -- Canada's military watchdog is attacking a senior military officer for dismissing complaints that Winnipeg soldiers who dressed in drag during a parade were mocking mentally ill troops.

Defence ombudsman Andre Marin told Sun Media he received a flurry of complaints from the Winnipeg barracks about a November drag queen parade called the "French Grey Cup."

Marin said he dispatched a team of investigators in December to probe the parade that featured floats built by the soldiers to celebrate the end of the battalion's fall sports program.

Each float had drag queen soldiers as entertainment, including an Arabian-themed float featuring soldiers who recently returned from Afghanistan.

Several hundred Winnipeg troops were ordered by the battalion commander to attend the parade.

Marin said investigators are focusing on one float in particular, a black cage adorned with the initials CT and a sign advising that the next stop would be at the north end of the barracks, where mentally ill soldiers received treatment. It's charged that CT stands for Crazy Train and that the drag queen soldiers were poking fun at Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.

Maj. Malcolm Bruce, deputy Commanding Officer of the Princess Pat's 2nd battalion, told The Winnipeg Sun yesterday that the drag queen show is a 21-year tradition. "It's all done in good fun," Bruce said. "It's unfortunate that, I think, it was taken in the wrong context."

Marin slammed Bruce for wading into his investigation and fired off a letter to Bruce's boss "to indicate my displeasure at the comments and the fact that they're in violation of the (ombudsman's) mandate."

Marin said Bruce's comments could jeopardize his investigation. He expects to release a report late next month.

Marin's investigators were dispatched to Winnipeg at the same time he released his second report on Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, which found the military stigmatizes soldiers suffering from mental illnesses.

Marin said that makes the complaints about the Crazy Train float all the more disturbing.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2004, 20:54:21 by Bruce Monkhouse »
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Offline Michael Dorosh

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #35 on: January 18, 2003, 15:32:00 »
Quote
Then, when some troopers exercise their right to dress in drag,
Which right is that?  Can you quote the CFAO for me, I must have missed it.
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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #36 on: January 18, 2003, 19:27:00 »
As a former insider of the Bud shop, here are some extracts from the Charter.

Fundamental Freedoms

2. Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms:

(a) freedom of conscience and religion;

(b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication;

(c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and

(d) freedom of association.

The angle that is being examined is as follows.

12. Everyone has the right not to be subjected to any cruel and unusual treatment or punishment.

In the setting of the CF, it is then based upon the extrapolation of rules, regs and orders to ascertain if in fact a Charter violation occurred.

In this specific case, those who felt that the CT and float made ref to pers in or under medical care and assistance.  And further, as this was, to use the military term.  A regimental parade, was it truly a freely attended assembly.

Just some thoughts...  Knee jerk, maybe, does it expose shortcomings in the Bud Shop, yes.  

The tact of Moral suasion in lieu of a real mandate is starting to make him look like a ineffective and purely symbolic individual who is struggling to find a raison dete.

As for dressing in drag, I am sure a case under Sect 2 could be raised.  

Me I will stick defending myself in a kilt.  Hard as heck sometimes to beat those women with impure thoughts off sometimes.  Then sometimes you just have to surrender to the obligatory underwear check.

COMMANDO-OORAH

Offline Gunner

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #37 on: April 04, 2004, 22:18:00 »
Military cadet makes history with wedding

Is this really news?   More to the point, does anyone really care anymore?   When I read this article I was shaking my head about a 19 year old getting married to someone he met only four months ago.    :confused:


Military cadet makes history with wedding; 19-year-old first armed forces gay to take a husband Couple celebrates with front-row concert tickets
As far as his fiance was concerned, Officer Cadet Jason Stewart was planning a simple weekend getaway to Toronto.

But when a white stretch limo rolled up outside Joey Schwehr's Kingston, Ont., home Friday afternoon, he realized it was much more than that. It became the much-anticipated weekend they would say their vows, making Stewart, who attends Kingston's Royal Military College, the first man in the military to marry another man.

"The first time we went on a date, (Joey) said he wanted to be picked up in a white stretch limo with white roses in the back and be surprised," said Stewart, 19, from the Fairmont Royal York hotel yesterday afternoon, just hours after they were wed.


Accompanied by a few close friends, the two were married at city hall. Last night, they celebrated at the Britney Spears concert after finding front-row tickets for $150 apiece.

While neither of their families attended the wedding, Stewart said both groups are happy for them. "They knew we were engaged and going to get married. (Joey's) father took it well. I think his mother was a little upset that she wasn't going to be there for it," Stewart said.


But both of their parents, as well as about 300 friends and family, will be present when the two reaffirm their vows at the military college in October.

"Everyone's always been really supportive," said Stewart of his peers and teachers at the college. "I've never gotten any flack about it. Everybody's just gung-ho and most of my superiors are more worried about me getting married at a young age than who I'm getting married to."

 

Stewart and Schwehr, 20, dated for a little over four months after being set up on a blind date. They said their connection was instant. "It was so special. I just knew ... it's hard to explain, but I just knew. Every moment right from there, it was great," said Schwehr, who works at a clothing store in Kingston.


Since they met, Stewart said the two have spent every day together. He proposed to Schwehr at work about a month ago.

"Since I started dating when I was about 16, I probably hadn't really been in love before until I met Joey," Stewart said. "We definitely wouldn't have gotten married if we didn't think we were perfect for each other."


When he told his mother last month that he was gay and he was getting married, she wasn't surprised. Unsure of how his father, a lobster fisherman in Nova Scotia, would react, she offered to tell him when he got home from work. A few hours later, Stewart got a phone call.


"My dad called me up and the only thing he said was, 'Just tell Joey he's gotta look after us when we get older,'" said Stewart. "So they took it very well."

« Last Edit: October 17, 2004, 22:05:46 by Bruce Monkhouse »
Had a wonderful ~26 years in the military and still miss it.

Offline Willy

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #38 on: April 04, 2004, 22:27:00 »
I certainly don‘t care.  Let him do what he wants, it doesn‘t affect me any.  I just hope the poor guy doesn‘t get harassed too badly over it.  I wonder if he‘s thought the thing through fully: not only is he marrying someone he met four months ago, but by being the first such case in the military he‘s really opening himself up to a lot of flak.  Either he‘s really brave, or really stupid.

Offline Gunner

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #39 on: April 04, 2004, 22:29:00 »
Being a young guy, I would have to vote for the stupid part.
Had a wonderful ~26 years in the military and still miss it.

Offline Willy

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #40 on: April 04, 2004, 22:31:00 »
Yeah, probably.  Oh well, live and learn.

Offline CheersShag

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #41 on: April 04, 2004, 22:56:00 »
Could you imagine, marrying every person you still thought you loved after 4 months when you were 18 or 19??

Ohh man...

Gay marriage issue aside, guys not even through university yet, still a teenager. Well good luck to him in any case becaue that‘s going to cause an odd backlash back at the college.

I can just picture old dad the bluenosed lobster fisherman‘s reaction to that too.
"lord tunnerin.."

Offline Jason Bourne

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #42 on: April 05, 2004, 00:35:00 »
"lord tunnerin.." lol east coasters.

yeah...thats gonna cause somewhat of a backlash down the road being in the military and all...I‘m not a bigot by any means but this military is built on Christian values (sort of). I personally don‘t care and I wish the guy the best of luck.
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Offline Infanteer

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #43 on: April 05, 2004, 01:01:00 »
I‘m not even going to say anything....
"Overall it appears that much of the apparent complexity of modern war stems in practice from the self-imposed complexity of modern HQs" LCol J.P. Storr

Offline Michael Dorosh

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #44 on: April 05, 2004, 01:55:00 »
Quote
Originally posted by Infanteer:
[qb] I‘m not even going to say anything.... [/qb]
I‘m getting to the point where I hate agreeing with every **** thing you post infanteer, but there it is!!  :mad:    :mad:    :eek:  

I may have to go reread Heinlein to see what he would have said about this.   :crybaby:
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Offline Infanteer

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #45 on: April 05, 2004, 02:16:00 »
Since you disabled your PM, I‘ll post my response here.

 
Quote
I‘m getting to the point where I hate agreeing with every **** thing you post infanteer, but there it is!!    

I may have to go reread Heinlein to see what he would have said about this.
I don‘t get it.

Not a challenge or anything.  But I honestly don‘t understand your response.  Please PM me.
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nbk

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #46 on: April 05, 2004, 15:01:00 »
This isnt really news. Why would anyone care? Gay marriage is no longer an issue. After only 4 months he gets married? I think this guy just wants attention, and is trying to stir the pot...

Offline Not a Sig Op

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #47 on: April 05, 2004, 15:29:00 »
Quote
Originally posted by Jason Bourne:
[qb] "lord tunnerin.." lol east coasters.

yeah...thats gonna cause somewhat of a backlash down the road being in the military and all...I‘m not a bigot by any means but this military is built on Christian values (sort of). I personally don‘t care and I wish the guy the best of luck. [/qb]
I note you say soon to be a sig op, meaning you‘re not in yet...

Somthing you‘ll find pretty quickly about the CF is that discrimination is pretty gravely frowned on...
Remember troops, the minimum acceptable standard is still an acceptable standard.

Offline Garry

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #48 on: April 05, 2004, 15:44:00 »
The Military, being a Federal organisation, lives by the Federal Government rules.

These kids were married in a Province, (by the Province), that recognises gay marriage.

As of right now, the Federal Government does not recognise gay marriage.

It‘ll be very interesting to see if they are in fact allowed to "re-solemnise" their vows at the Military University‘s chapel: it would setting a precedent.

Offline Michael Dorosh

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Re: The Merged Thread on Gay/ Homosexual Topics and the CF.
« Reply #49 on: April 05, 2004, 19:05:00 »
Quote
Originally posted by Infanteer:
[qb] Since you disabled your PM, I‘ll post my response here.

 
Quote
I‘m getting to the point where I hate agreeing with every **** thing you post infanteer, but there it is!!    

I may have to go reread Heinlein to see what he would have said about this.
I don‘t get it.

Not a challenge or anything.  But I honestly don‘t understand your response.  Please PM me. [/qb]
I don‘t PM.  Just saying that I keep agreeing with everything you‘ve been posting lately....

You also kidded me about coming around to Heinlein...I was kidding back...
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