# 3.5km in 22 mins



## Newguy1

I just got an offer and start BMQ shortly, I was hoping to have more time to improve my running. I can do 3.5k in 22 mins and then im pretty much pooched, how do u think ill fair in BMQ? end of the pack?


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## brihard

Newguy1 said:
			
		

> I just got an offer and start BMQ shortly, I was hoping to have more time to improve my running. I can do 3.5k in 22 mins and then im pretty much pooched, how do u think ill fair in BMQ? end of the pack?



I won't BS you, you're in trouble. You really need to be working on both speed and distance. The process to join is long enough that this isn't a surprise for you. Your cardio should be much farther along by now. Get running at least four days a week- t least one day where you max out distance, and at least one day where you make yourself puke doing intervals. BMQ will not be forgiving if you show up out of shape.


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## McG

Aim for 5 km in 25 min.


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## runormal

I used to be a couch potato, Ive used this free program to go from nothing to a 5k in under 25. (Its literally a chart with 9 weeks of walking to running). I've also sent it to siblings/friends and all of them have gotten up to 5k.

Here is the link
http://www.squidoo.com/C25K-Running     [link no longer works. Bruce]

I'd try mid week 4 based on what you are saying. Just use the stop watch feature on your phone/iPod.

Like the others have said you will be screwed if you can't do 5k in 25.

Goodluck


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## Newguy1

Thanks for the response. So even if I pass the FORCE test or EXPRESS test depending on what they use, can i still choose to goto RFT if I cant do 5k in 25 or 30 minutes?


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## PMedMoe

You don't "choose" to go to RFT....


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## ForeverLearning

Although I havn't done BMQ myself I don't think you have to much to worry about from what i've read about people's experiences if they are close to accurate. BMQ isn't going to put you into 5km runs on day one. They do baby steps in, i believe its in 3 different phases. That being said, don't slack from this point to day 1.


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## ModlrMike

I'm not sure RFT is applicable if you're successful at the EXPRES or FORCE. I could be wrong.


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## Okanagan Guy

Week 1 day 04, 5km run at 5am... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zg_roqtn4Ok . Not sure about the pace though. I'm not in the CF either but based on the research I've done it's not the 5km run that will kill you. It's the 25 pushups immediately after. Then the 2 hour power point presentation. Then the afternoon run... then the evening run... with pushups every step of the way. Not to mention the shock to your system of early mornings, constant activity, change in diet, classrooms settings (for those of us that haven't been in a classroom for a while). Do all that for a few weeks straight while getting screamed at by the instructors (who are just doing their job) with no cell phone or internet while being away from the wife and kid... that is the tough part of BMQ. You should start working out and running multiple times a day. Do 25 push ups at random throughout the day. I highly doubt the CF is interested in people who just do the bare minimum... but again I'm not in the CF yet so take that for with a grain of salt. Good luck and congrats on the offer!


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## mkil

You really do need to get at least that distance up. 3.5 km is really short. At that pace, you will fall out early on. The pace they start is about 5km per 30 mins.


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## brihard

ForeverLearning said:
			
		

> Although I havn't done BMQ myself I don't think you have to much to worry about from what i've read about people's experiences if they are close to accurate. BMQ isn't going to put you into 5km runs on day one. They do baby steps in, i believe its in 3 different phases. That being said, don't slack from this point to day 1.



You aren't even in the military. You have no place whatsoever giving people advice on what they should and should not be concerned about for BMQ. You have no place giving advice on what should be expected of someone who aspires to be a soldier. Until you're in and have some time in to base your experiences on, get out of the habit of thinking you have anything to offer on military subjects. We have experienced soldiers here for that.


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## Newguy1

Ok thanks for the input.

I will be screwed if I cant do 5k in 25 mins? By screwed you mean what? released?

Why does the FORCE test only require level 6 shuttle run then?


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## brihard

Newguy1 said:
			
		

> Ok thanks for the input.
> 
> I will be screwed if I cant do 5k in 25 mins? By screwed you mean what? released?
> 
> Why does the FORCE test only require level 6 shuttle run then?



Not released, but you will be 'that guy' who quite obviously did not arrive in shape and can't keep up on runs. You will face more skepticism from course mates and closer scrutiny from your staff. The biggest factor, I'd argue, going into the first impression anyone makes showing up to start with the training is fitness, because that's something that is fully within our ability to affect prior to joining. You will have to push yourself harder and you will be more prone to injury as a result of showing up insufficiently fit for the demands you will face. You have no real choice but to work your ass off between now and when you leave. 

This isn't personal- I don't know you, likely never will, and don't really care. Take this all as a blunt, realistic assessment of where you're at and what you're heading into. This does NOT mean you will be unsuccessful in BMQ. It means that your chances of failure _are_ somewhat higher, and that it's definitely going to suck more. The biggest variable will be how badly you really want it and how hard you'll push from here on in to get it. The profession of arms is one where fitness is essential and can be the difference between life and death, mission success and mission failure.


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## Kat Stevens

Newguy1 said:
			
		

> Ok thanks for the input.
> 
> I will be screwed if I cant do 5k in 25 mins? By screwed you mean what? released?
> 
> Why does the FORCE test only require level 6 shuttle run then?


Because FORCE is the MINIMUM fitness standard for the CF.  Life as a soldier is ever so slightly more strenuous than that, and a higher level of fitness is therefore required.   PT at basic isn't really all that tough.


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## Newguy1

Ah ok thanks, im going for AC op, not a soldier


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## Kat Stevens

Newguy1 said:
			
		

> Ah ok thanks, im going for AC op, not a soldier



Well in that case, load up on the krispee Kremes and don't worry about it.


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## ballz

Okanagan Guy said:
			
		

> but based on the research I've done it's not the 5km run that will kill you. It's the...



You're pretty close, but those are all things that anybody with the right mindset heading into it can adjust, and this:



			
				Newguy1 said:
			
		

> Ah ok thanks, im going for AC op, not a soldier



is not it.



			
				Brihard said:
			
		

> The biggest variable will be how badly you really want it



Apparently, not really that much...  :not-again:


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## jlv031

Soldier first... AC op after.... Change your attitude sir


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## runormal

Newguy1 said:
			
		

> Ah ok thanks, im going for AC op, not a soldier



Every course I've been on the runs have been longer than they were anticipated. This doesn't really bother me as I enjoy PT, however it was unfortunate as it would screw everyone else over and cut int our ablutions and meal times. How? It because of people like you, even on my DP1 after people had been through two courses, they still would fall out of PT. 

So what ends up happening, is we can't  leave anyone behind, so we would run and around the 3/4 mark of the run people would fall out. We'd see that, turn around pick up said individuals and watch them fall out again and again. What was once a 5km run turns into 6km, and that takes away five precious minutes of meeting our timing for breakfast. If we are late, not only are we doing pushups, we now have even less time to eat. At the end of day it doesn't matter but it is frustrating to say the least. All of this could be avoided if people would show up courses physically fit. No one is asking you to be able run a marathon, but is it really to much to ask for you to be able to do 5k in under 25? Look I was just like you, I did nothing for cardio, played hockey in the winter and soccer in the summer that's it. But I played at the lowest level as my cardio was garbage. When I started that couch potato - 5k program in the summer I could barely finish the first day I was so tired after. But I knew that I was joining the reserves and had a swear in date for Sept, so when I showed up to basic I had no problems with the cardio.

Don't worry, when you need help from your course mates they won't forget.


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## Jarnhamar

If you fake an injury you won't even have to march with all the soldiers  :nod:


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## Flavus101

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> If you fake an injury you won't even have to march with all the soldiers  :nod:



And I thought the same couple of guys that constantly got injured during (or immediately before) PT were being legit!  : Even in my short time in I have seen this occur quite frequently. 

For the OP. If you are constantly dragging your feet and not putting out the effort to help your fireteam partner, section and platoon it will be noticed by the folks around you. Make sure you show up as prepared as you possibly can be, that is both a mental and physical game. Putting in a bit of effort before you show up goes a long way. Struggling here and there is normal and your buddies will be there to help you, just make sure that you are able to do the same for them when they are struggling.


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## Zulopol

I do 5km in 30min is that bad ?


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## Eye In The Sky

jlv031 said:
			
		

> Soldier first... AC op after.... Change your attitude sir



Realizing this is a late reply, I'm still going to make it.

AC Op is an Air Op's trade, same as my trade is Air Ops.  There are no 'soldiers' in Air Ops trades.  It is not a matter of attitude.    :


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## Eye In The Sky

Zulopol said:
			
		

> I do 5km in 30min is that bad ?



You are going combat arms and will be heading to battle school.  Regardless of what your level is now, the better shape you are in, the better you are going to be able to perform on BMQ, BMQ-L and DP1 or whatever it is called now.  Example, (when I used to teach Armd QL3s atleast...) the FTX for the QL3 course was an "infantry in the defense" type field ex.  

After you're a qualified Trooper, you will continue to maintain your shape.  Round, from eating hot dogs in your c/s's boiler vessel and supporting the Sqn canteen.   ;D

 :2c:


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## jlv031

I know air force in general seem soft compare to some army trades but I still think we are all ask to carry a C7 if needed and to many times I saw air force guys on WASF being dangerous with a weapon. 
All component get through the same basic training. Anyways this is just my opinion and I would like to think that all canadian forces personnal are fit.


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## McG

Zulopol said:
			
		

> I do 5km in 30min is that bad ?


It is an okay start.  Now push yourself toward 5 km in 25 min, and toward 10 km in 1 hr.


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## Zulopol

Ok thanks for you response guys.

I know 5min in 30min is not bad but I could do better with practice.. 

With my Training before be enrolled + BMQ + other Courses my body have no choice to adapt the perfomance.


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## x_para76

I don't wanna be the bearer of bad news but as a young fit recruit an 8 minute mile shouldn't be such a tall order. That means you should be able to do 5km in about 24-25 minutes. If you're doing a 10 minute mile or 5km in 30 minutes you've got a way to go. You might wanna do some things like interval training or hill reps to help you work on your speed and endurance. 

Just my  :2c:


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## ace1125

runormal said:
			
		

> I used to be a couch potato, Ive used this free program to go from nothing to a 5k in under 25. (Its literally a chart with 9 weeks of walking to running). I've also sent it to siblings/friends and all of them have gotten up to 5k.
> 
> Here is the link
> http://www.squidoo.com/C25K-Running
> 
> I'd try mid week 4 based on what you are saying. Just use the stop watch feature on your phone/iPod.
> 
> Like the others have said you will be screwed if you can't do 5k in 25.
> 
> Goodluck




This link no longer exists, anyone have a similar link or the info it provided? I'm looking on google for something similar without much luck.


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## runormal

ace1125 said:
			
		

> This link no longer exists, anyone have a similar link or the info it provided? I'm looking on google for something similar without much luck.



I have the picture right here. 







It is really simple which is why I liked it when I used it. Use a stopwatch or your phone and you will be good to go.

Good luck!

Edit:

When I was doing it I never bothered to go above 25 minutes as I could 5k in that time, I then would consistently run for 25 minutes every other day or so there after.


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## KerryBlue

ace1125 said:
			
		

> This link no longer exists, anyone have a similar link or the info it provided? I'm looking on google for something similar without much luck.




Google couch to 5k program. If you have an iphone(andriod to maybe but I'm iphone) look for the zen labs 10k trainer app. It will take you from couch potato to 10k in a little over 3 months. I use it and its pretty remarkable how well it works. Plus no need to try and time it yourself with a stopwatch, it tells you when to run, when to walk etc..


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## BeyondTheNow

http://www.runnersworld.co.uk/racing/six-week-beginner-5k-schedule/67.html

Did it when I did my first 5K. Worked perfectly, easy schedule.


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## Zulopol

Zulopol said:
			
		

> I know 5min in 30min is not bad but I could do better with practice..



With the time and practice Now I can do easy 5km in 23-24 min !


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## McG

runormal said:
			
		

> I have the picture right here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is really simple which is why I liked it when I used it. Use a stopwatch or your phone and you will be good to go.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> Edit:
> 
> When I was doing it I never bothered to go above 25 minutes as I could 5k in that time, I then would consistently run for 25 minutes every other day or so there after.


There is magic math starting in week 6.


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## Navy_Pete

You may also want to look at how you run as well.  I used to always get shin splints, then I tried 'chi running'.  There are a number of different variations, but the jist of it is you land on the ball of your foot vice your heel.  Aside from absorbing your impact a lot better, it's more efficient mechanically, as you lose a lot of energy when your heel strikes.

If you try running barefoot this is how you'll naturally do it, as it hurts less, but it does use different muscle groups.  However, easier on the knees and other joints, which I've grown to appreciate now that I'm getting older.  Do find I have to do some different stretches after though, in particular the ITB band, but I found it easier to run the same distance, and wasn't hobbling after a week from crippling shin splints, so works for me.  If you watch kids, it's how they run naturally, before they get in the bad habit with the padded heels, and noticed a lot of pro runners do as well.

http://www.chirunning.com/

Not pushing this particular company, but it seems to be somewhat widespread, so may have luck looking for a workshop.  Takes a bit of getting used to, and I found with my gangly limbs that it's more comfortable and natural if I do it at a slower cadence (around 160 bpm or something vice 180), but worth a try.


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## Epp12

Basic fitness standards are a joke now a days. You'll be fine, basic was a joke we only had 2 challenging weeks. I showed up to basic in great shape left in worse shape, if you show up in good shape you leave in worse shape if you show up in bad shape you leave in better shape that's what me and all the athletes from my basic platoon figured


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## ace1125

KerryBlue said:
			
		

> Google couch to 5k program. If you have an iphone(andriod to maybe but I'm iphone) look for the zen labs 10k trainer app. It will take you from couch potato to 10k in a little over 3 months. I use it and its pretty remarkable how well it works. Plus no need to try and time it yourself with a stopwatch, it tells you when to run, when to walk etc..



I downloaded this app, I think it's great. Been using it a few weeks and can already notice my endurance has improved. Its nice because it easily keeps track of the time to switch between running and walking when you first start.  Also, I enjoy how it gives you something to aim for as opposed to running aimlessly hoping to improve. As someone who has smoked for a few years I feel this thing will save me from a world of hurt if I ever get to basic training. 

Thanks to everyone who posted tips or guidance in this thread!


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## trustnoone73

Here is a four step program:

1.  Log off
2.  Go to the library and get this book:  http://www.amazon.ca/Runners-World-Less-Faster-Revolutionary/dp/159486649X
3.  Photocopy a 5km plan.  I believe there are beginner, intermediate, and race plans. 
4.  Follow the plan. 

Two step plan:
1. log off
2. run 5km 3 - 5 times a week every week until you are in St Jean.


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## RedcapCrusader

Epp12 said:
			
		

> Basic fitness standards are a joke now a days. You'll be fine, basic was a joke we only had 2 challenging weeks. I showed up to basic in great shape left in worse shape, if you show up in good shape you leave in worse shape if you show up in bad shape you leave in better shape that's what me and all the athletes from my basic platoon figured



You must have done something wrong then.


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## Brasidas

RedcapCrusader said:
			
		

> You must have done something wrong then.



I've had ten years service, and I've trained prior to every course I went on. I've been in good shape. Every time, I've been in worse shape by the end of the course.

He's got the basic facts right, but the attitude wrong.

Personal fitness is a personal responsibility. Failing to do the best you can within your means is a personal failure. Maybe a PRes university student with kids who goes from finals in the last week of April to course the first week of May isn't going to have been running half marathons and doing nine hours of upper body workouts, but he should have been doing something for personal fitness. Showing up for a recruit course without effort in preparing for it because he knows that "if you show up in bad shape you leave in better shape" is a cop out that reduces his ability to succeed and drags down his coursemates are obliged to support him.

On course, tasking, or field exercise, you do what you can, but you may not have the ability to do what you otherwise might fitness-wise. You prioritize what's important among your responsibilities. Talk to anybody whose been on a leadership course about how great their fitness or nutrition were. They're stupid if they didn't look after themselves (I've got some clear memories of leadership failures by people who didn't drink, eat, or take care of their own injuries), but they're unlikely to have been in better shape at the end than they were in the beginning.


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