# first stoker posting



## fletch11 (21 Mar 2012)

I have a couple of questions about my husbands first posting after completing his 3's. He obviously can't get any straight answers from anyone until it's time so I'm hoping that I can get some insight here.
How soon before the end of his 3's is he likely to get his posting message?
I've read that 80% of baby stokers are being posted to Halifax, is this still an accurate number? Has the need become higher in Halifax with the amount of people leaving to go to ship building?


----------



## Occam (21 Mar 2012)

I'm sure Chief Stoker or Pat in Halifax will be along shortly to correct me, but 80% seems a little high to my non-stoker eyes.  Can't speak to how soon before the end of TQ3 they're getting messages these days.

Since 7 out of 12 CPFs and 2 out of 3 IRO class are east,  that would skew things a little...and the school (think staff) on the east coast is somewhat larger than west.  70%?  Maybe.

If there is any higher need in Halifax for stokers, it's definitely not because of the new shipbuilding program.  They don't even have concrete plans yet, never mind thinking about cutting steel.


----------



## Pat in Halifax (21 Mar 2012)

Actually Stacked isn't too far off. People coming off their initial trades training (any trades training) go where they are needed. If attrition through retirement, release, remuster etc is unusually high on one coast for whatever reason, then the requirement on that coast correspondingly increases. Engineers being recruited by Shipbuilding companies has little bearing on this. But as Occam said, with 9 of our 15 major surface combatants based out of Halifax...well, you can do the math. I know there used to be a provision for students to 'request' a coast but again, you go where needed. All I can tell you is to take advantage of what you perceive to be a bad thing. After your husband is QL5 qualified (with a Cert 2) - about 5-7 years, you can request a change in Home Port Division. That said, if he is posted to the `wrong`coast initially, as I said, take advantage of it and travel around a part of the country you have only read about and may never see again. Both the west coast and the Maritime provinces are beautiful places to live...and raise a family...if that is your concern here.
By the way, from someone likely soon on the way out the door, tell your husband `Welcome Aboard` and welcome to the best trade in the Navy!!! 
(Okay Jollyjacktar, there`s your cue!)


----------



## NavyShooter (21 Mar 2012)

As a followup, the WEng world seems to get posting messages about 4-6 weeks prior to the end of a course (QL3 or QL5) 

NS


----------



## Grimey (23 Mar 2012)

He'll get a posting message approximately one month before the end of the course.

WRT which coast, around 80 percent of the two Mar Eng QL3s that finished last Decembet went east.  With the three courses currently in house that finish in April, it's a little more balanced although every member got their coastal preference, if not ship.

At the end of the day, the career managers posting plot is in constant flux.  He is almost always playing catch up and filling holes.

Tell hubby he wants a 280  >


----------



## Pat in Halifax (23 Mar 2012)

280??? Are you on drugs?
Go Halifax class (or even RegF on Kingston class - currently only Cert 2-good training for AOPS and maybe CSC)
280 would be like going steamer 20 years ago...which I did...mistake. It set my career back about 5 years. My peers with 25 years in agree! With the recinding of CRA, time is every thing.Request HAL or CAL (FELEX'd or soon to be ships)


----------



## cupper (23 Mar 2012)

Pat in Halifax said:
			
		

> 280??? Are you on drugs?
> Go Halifax class (or even RegF on Kingston class - currently only Cert 2-good training for AOPS and maybe CSC)
> 280 would be like going steamer 20 years ago...which I did...mistake. It set my career back about 5 years. My peers with 25 years in agree! With the recinding of CRA, time is every thing.Request HAL or CAL (FELEX'd or soon to be ships)



So... I assume you wouldn't recommend an oiler then? >


----------



## runormal (4 May 2015)

I have a friend who just got on his 3s for mar eng. He told me that he has a few days to request his posting and ship.

He said he wants experience with the boilers and has been led to believe that Halifax is a better coast for that. 

Being an army reservist I don't have too much insight other than what I have already found on here.

" Best Vessel For A New Stoker To Serve On" http://army.ca/forums/threads/98766.25.html
 "Halifax or Victoria? Who's Been to both? "
http://army.ca/forums/threads/96482.0

 HMCS Refit in Halifax
https://army.ca/forums/threads/117138.0

I am wondering if anyone has current information as to which coast is the best choice for him. Obviously the choice isn't his too make but nevertheless.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## jollyjacktar (4 May 2015)

All of the steamers are gone.  If he wants to get experience in that regard he's far too late.  That ship isn't sailing anymore so you can't even say the old saw in this case.


----------



## Eaglelord17 (4 May 2015)

I think he might be talking about the boilers on the Frigates in which case they do get used more on the East Coast but are still pretty foreign to most people, only a couple people are really familiar with them. Personally speaking I feel the small steam generators on the Frigates aren't much to get excited over as the boilers and steam system on the Frigates are pretty neglected (at least in comparison to the other systems). Usually only one works and often it is due to some jerry rigged repair (your experiences may vary, this is just what I have seen with my own eyes). 

From a realistic standpoint you are only going to be posted to Frigates at this point, so the ship really doesn't matter too much, though if I had to choose, I would pick one that has been out of refit for a while, so you avoid the hassle of trying to get a ship up and running again and having to be retrained on the consoles when your ship gets refitted (examples on the East Coast would be ships like the Fredericton, Charlottetown, Montreal and somewhat the Halifax, which is more or less in its own category). 

The big thing that matters is what coast you go to. Personally I would have rather stayed in Esquimalt then have moved to Halifax for the following reasons (this is after picking Halifax and now seeing what it is like). The PLD is better in Esquimalt, and as long as your not buying a house the rent isn't really that much more than Halifax area (most guys I have talked to on the West Coast use there PLD to pay for rent, on the East Coast PLD doesn't cover half your rent). It is also cheaper for groceries in Esquimalt than Halifax for whatever odd reason. The weather is also better in the West Coast (winter sucks in Halifax, snows, then it rains, then it freezes, then it snows again, and it repeats until the winter is over). This is just my experience others love living in Halifax area.


----------



## jollyjacktar (4 May 2015)

Each coast has it's plus and minus factors and there you have to weigh each other against.  They're also in most respects two different navies too.  Of course don't forget you'll be posted where you're needed, not necessarily where you desire.  I've been on the east coast for 21 years now and I do hate the cost of living here and wish I'd never come from that respect, but the west coast attitudes of the folks out there really turned me off wanting to be posted there.  If only you could take the things you like of each and combine the two into your posting...


----------



## Pat in Halifax (5 May 2015)

A combination of the two might be...Nanasivik Naval Facility!


----------



## Pusser (5 May 2015)

I have been posted to and sailed in ships on both coasts and I can certainly say that Canada is a country of two navies.  They both dress alike and paint their ships the same colour, but then they start to diverge.

The East Coast navy is more relaxed and seems to apply common sense a bit more.  They look at regulations as a guide and you can pretty much do what needs to be done in order to accomplish your goal unless there is a regulation that specifically says you can't.

The West Coast navy is more uptight and sometimes seems to ignore common sense and logic.  Unless there is a regulation that specifically says you can do something, the usual answer is that no, you can't do that.

Don't get too wrapped around the axle about PLD.  It's not free money that you get as a reward for living in one place vice another.  The trouble is that few folks understand the way it's calculated and so usually only look at things like the cost of groceries.  There is a lot more to it than that.  Theoretically, sailors should enjoy similar standards of living, regardless of which coast they're posted to.

Whether west coast weather and scenery are better than that on the east coast is a matter of opinion.  Halifax winters have more snow and ice, but Esquimalt winters are wet, wet, wet.  It's not uncommon to go 30 days without seeing the sun in Esquimalt.  The autmun in Nova Scotia, however, can be outstanding.

The major thing that made me glad to see the west coast in my rear-view mirror was the people.  West coasters are cold and reserved.  If you're not born there and amongst the friends you made in grade school, it can be very hard to break into a clique.  We lived in one house for five years and never got beyond speaking over the fence.  However, in two different houses in Dartmouth, we had been within all our neighbours' kitchens within a six months.  Knocking on a friend's door without having called ahead for permission to visit is considered rude on the west coast, whereas in Atlantic Canada it's routine and some cases it's not even required to knock!


----------



## jollyjacktar (5 May 2015)

Well said Pusser.  I hated the nit picking, chicken shyte navy that is the west coast.  I also remember walking downtown via the boardwalk and saying hello to passing people.  They reacted as if I had rabies or had large hunk of feces hanging off my nose.  The folks here are so very much friendlier, it's just the cost of living here I can't stand.  If they wanted to post me to the west coast, my release would swiftly follow.  I'm posted to Ottawa this APS and I am taking it on IR just to keep things in perspective on the west coast for me.


----------



## mariomike (5 May 2015)

runormal said:
			
		

> I am wondering if anyone has current information as to which coast is the best choice for him.



As seen above, opinions vary.

Halifax or Victoria? Who's Been to both?
http://army.ca/forums/threads/96482.0

ESQUIMALT VS HALIFAX??  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/70387.0/nowap.html

Navy > Chances of going East/West.
http://army.ca/forums/threads/91446.0


----------



## cupper (5 May 2015)

jollyjacktar said:
			
		

> Each coast has it's plus and minus factors and there you have to weigh each other against.  They're also in most respects two different navies too.  Of course don't forget you'll be posted where you're needed, not necessarily where you desire.  I've been on the east coast for 21 years now and I do hate the cost of living here and wish I'd never come from that respect, but the west coast attitudes of the folks out there really turned me off wanting to be posted there.  If only you could take the things you like of each and combine the two into your posting...



I need to change my underwear every time I come home for a visit, especially now that the wife has moved back. The only saving grace is that any purchases come out of the account in $US so with the favorable exchange it does soften the blow. I really can't believe how some people can survive on an average worker's salary based on the prices, and then taxes on top of that.


----------



## OldSolduer (5 May 2015)

jollyjacktar said:
			
		

> Well said Pusser.  I hated the nit picking, chicken shyte navy that is the west coast.  I also remember walking downtown via the boardwalk and saying hello to passing people.  They reacted as if I had rabies or had large hunk of feces hanging off my nose.  The folks here are so very much friendlier, it's just the cost of living here I can't stand.  If they wanted to post me to the west coast, my release would swiftly follow.  I'm posted to Ottawa this APS and I am taking it on IR just to keep things in perspective on the west coast for me.



I'll pipe in here. I'm a landlubber as you all know but I served in CFRS Cornwallis for three years. I found the people of Nova Scotia to be very outgoing and welcoming.


----------



## jollyjacktar (5 May 2015)

Yes, they are.  Too bad the BC types couldn't learn a thing or two about east coast hospitality.


----------



## Pusser (6 May 2015)

jollyjacktar said:
			
		

> I'm posted to Ottawa this APS and I am taking it on IR just to keep things in perspective on the west coast for me.



When I left the west coast, I was posted to Ottawa and found it a refreshing change from Esquimalt.  NDHQ is actually fairly relaxed (although it does have its fair share of chicken shyte).  Although folks in Ottawa are not as welcoming as the east coast, I found them much more open and friendly than the west coast folks.  Shortly after moving to Ottawa, my wife and I actually began to consider retiring there.  For the previous 20 years, we were hard set on returning to Nova Scotia.  Ottawa has a lot going for it in terms of things to do.  The weather is pretty good (a bit muggy in the summer, but not as bad as Toronto) and it has a lot of things that a city of that size normally wouldn't (i.e. because it's the national capital).  The biggest downside in my mind is that spousal employment can be a challenge if the spouse isn't bilingual (even the kids on the counter at McD's speak both languages there).  On the other hand, my wife is completely unilingual English, but had no trouble getting a job (however, she has special qualifications that are in demand - we've really lucked out in that regard as she has managed to get a job everywhere we've been posted).

From a personal standpoint, I will never willingly go on IR.  I proceeded unaccompanied for three months when I moved to Ottawa (because they just HAD to have me there RIGHT NOW!!!).  It SUCKED!  I spent three months staring twiddling my thumbs in an apartment while my wife is trying manage two young children (still in school), a dog, a cat and her job, all while trying to sell the house.  Never again...

Of course now that the current government has screwed us all over with respect to our final moves, Nova Scotia is now moving up again in the choice of retirment location standings...


----------



## Airforcestoker (6 May 2015)

As someone who has been posted to both coasts, I have found that each has its good points and bad, as everywhere else. Just as an anecdote though, the East Coast (specifically Halifax), was the only place I was ever called a baby killer. Now to be fair, I am pretty sure it was University students who could have been from anywhere.  :2c:


----------



## runormal (6 May 2015)

I would like to thank everyone for their responses. He has chosen to _request _ Halifax and is _hoping _ to get on ship recently out of refit. 

WRT to boilers, he was refering to the boilers on the frigrates. 

This information has also reinfornced my decision to _request _ Halifax whenever my CT goes through ;D. Though I had never really considered cost of living in the terms of taxes/grocercies only on the basis of real estate so I appreciate the inisight.

Thanks again.


----------



## Pat in Halifax (6 May 2015)

Okay but make sure he knows that the 'boiler' on the frigates are little more than glorified hot water heaters. He will not be using any entropy extrapolating equations nor exercising all that thermodynamics he may have learned...not on the steam generators anyway.


----------



## Pusser (8 May 2015)

Airforcestoker said:
			
		

> As someone who has been posted to both coasts, I have found that each has its good points and bad, as everywhere else. Just as an anecdote though, the East Coast (specifically Halifax), was the only place I was ever called a baby killer. Now to be fair, I am pretty sure it was University students who could have been from anywhere.  :2c:



Halifax has a love/hate relationship with the Navy.  My wife grew up with the advice of "don't date a puker," but she got over it.  For the most part, Halifax realizes that without the Navy, their economy would be considerably less than it is.  I've never been treated disrespectfully in Halifax because I was in the Navy.  I didn't always get the girls, but I was usually fairly confident that it wasn't because of my occupation.  In Victoria, however, I once spent the evening chatting up a girl and were getting along great until she found out I was in the Navy.  She literally screamed, walked away and refused to speak to me any further.


----------



## Pat in Halifax (9 May 2015)

For what it is worth, I was called a "baby killer" once in 33 years...at the airport in Victoria BC. (And that was about 5-6 years ago)
I too married a local girl from Ketch Harbour just outside of Halifax...whose father was a Signalman in he Navy and whose mother was a PS employee with the Halifax MPs for 25 years, and whose stepfather was a Bos'n and whose grandfather was a Steward during WWII and... Halifax is not only a VERY "Navy tolerant" city but I think actually embraces that.

Pat


----------



## cupper (9 May 2015)

A Captain (Army) friend of mine was on a parade at the NS Legislature many years ago (back in the 90's?) and had the same comment hurled at him.

But the best response to that situation I've seen was at a Remembrance Day parade several years ago when I happened to be home for a visit. I was at the parade at the Dartmouth Cenotaph at Sullivans pond watching my old unit parade. Someone in the crowd made the same comment about them being a bunch of baby killers. An elderly veteran took the young man to task by literally giving him a dope slap on the back of the head, and told him to have more respect for people who ensure he has the freedom to make stupid comments like that.


----------

