# mess dress questions?



## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"C. Bryon McLeod" <bryonmcleod@gorge.net>* on *Thu, 27 Jul 2000 22:54:47 -0700*
Hello all I hope someone can provide some information on mess dress.
Here are my two questions:
1. In regards to all regiments, in particular British, Scottish, or
Canadian, is it acceptable to wear mess dress outside the mess i.e. dinner
parties, the theater, open air tattoos and the like?
2. Is there a time of day that ONLY mess dress is to be worn, much like a
day formal or evening formal wedding?
Any and all help is appreciated
Bryon McLeod
USA
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Rhett <lawson@cclacbrome.qc.ca>* on *Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:54:27 -0400*
Hello Bryon
1.    Mess dress may be worn on civilian occasions outside of the Officers
Mess as long as the civilian occasion calls for black or white tie dress.
2.    There is no formal hour during the day or evening that makes mess dress
mandatory.
Rhett Lawson
C. Bryon McLeod wrote:
> Hello all I hope someone can provide some information on mess dress.
>
> Here are my two questions:
>
> 1. In regards to all regiments, in particular British, Scottish, or
> Canadian, is it acceptable to wear mess dress outside the mess i.e. dinner
> parties, the theater, open air tattoos and the like?
>
> 2. Is there a time of day that ONLY mess dress is to be worn, much like a
> day formal or evening formal wedding?
>
> Any and all help is appreciated
>
> Bryon McLeod
> USA
>
> --------------------------------------------------------
> NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> message body.
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Gunner <randr1@home.com>* on *Fri, 28 Jul 2000 08:14:30 -0600*
I thought that mess dress couldn‘t be worn until after 1800 hrs?  Maybe
its‘ simply "gauche" to wear formal attire in the afternoon.
Rhett wrote:
> 
> Hello Bryon
> 
> 1.    Mess dress may be worn on civilian occasions outside of the Officers
> Mess as long as the civilian occasion calls for black or white tie dress.
> 
> 2.    There is no formal hour during the day or evening that makes mess dress
> mandatory.
> 
> Rhett Lawson
> 
> C. Bryon McLeod wrote:
> 
> > Hello all I hope someone can provide some information on mess dress.
> >
> > Here are my two questions:
> >
> > 1. In regards to all regiments, in particular British, Scottish, or
> > Canadian, is it acceptable to wear mess dress outside the mess i.e. dinner
> > parties, the theater, open air tattoos and the like?
> >
> > 2. Is there a time of day that ONLY mess dress is to be worn, much like a
> > day formal or evening formal wedding?
> >
> > Any and all help is appreciated
> >
> > Bryon McLeod
> > USA
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > message body.
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------
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> to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> message body.
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Ian Edwards <iedwards@home.com>* on *Fri, 28 Jul 2000 18:32:38 -0600*
Just in case no one with a more authoritative reference jumps in to
answer I will say in my NSH OPINION:
a ... British, Scottish, Canadian... last time I looked Scotland was
part of Great Britain, although some Scots and some English would have
it otherwise just like some from Texas and Montana regard the Union.
b Technically, what you refer to as mess dress is a uniform and wear of
such requires permission of the unit Commanding Officer. Technically a
"retired" Sr NCO, Warrant Officer or Officer requires the permission of
the local formation Brigade or whatnot commander, but this almost
never done in the real world as these gentlemen would know when such
wear is appropriate or not without asking.
c Certainly, unless the outside event was a military or paramilitary
event, the wearing of mess dress mess kit would be tacky at the least.
Since the wear is "formal" I can‘t conceive of it being worn at an open
air tattoo.
d the guide would be to wear mess kit when the invitation reads
"formal" In your country this sometimes reads "tuxedo" which is an
americanism for "dinner jacket", which is never worn before 5 pm.
"Morning coat" would be appropriate for lunch, however, that garment is
not very common today, while dinner jackets amongst the general
population have come back in common usage in the past decade or so. So,
since dinner jackets mess kit are not appropriate for noon luncheons
then uniforms for serving officers or business suits only are
appropriate at noon. I don‘t think morning coats are very common even at
daytime investitures of the Governor General or Lts. Gov. although I
expect you will see some amoungst staff members who must attend them
regularly.

e All Scottish infantry regiments in the past 30 or so years could be
longer wear the kilt, although the kilt was worn for many years prior
only by HIGHLAND Scottish regiments. Highland regiments also now wear
trews trousers as well, depending on the dress required. I mention
this in case you were envisioning English and Scottish as two different
"sets" of dress the rules apply to all.
f Now, as long as you don‘t refer to HM The Queen as "the Queen of
England" as is common amongst U.S. TV reporters the few who were not
born and raised in Canada. Call her "the Queen of the United Kingdom"
if you wish, as a short term for "the Queen of ...., her other realms
and territories." And she is ALSO the Queen of Canada.
g Don‘t take my remarks as personal or anti-American, there are no
silly questions, just silly answers out there.
"C. Bryon McLeod" wrote:
> 
> Hello all I hope someone can provide some information on mess dress.
> 
> Here are my two questions:
> 
> 1. In regards to all regiments, in particular British, Scottish, or
> Canadian, is it acceptable to wear mess dress outside the mess i.e. dinner
> parties, the theater, open air tattoos and the like?
> 
> 2. Is there a time of day that ONLY mess dress is to be worn, much like a
> day formal or evening formal wedding?
> 
> Any and all help is appreciated
> 
> Bryon McLeod
> USA
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------
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> to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"The MacFarlanes‘" <desrtrat@amug.org>* on *Fri, 28 Jul 2000 17:51:00 -0700*
Gunner.. that was always my impression too.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gunner" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 7:14 AM
Subject: Re: mess dress questions?
> I thought that mess dress couldn‘t be worn until after 1800 hrs?  Maybe
> its‘ simply "gauche" to wear formal attire in the afternoon.
>
> Rhett wrote:
> >
> > Hello Bryon
> >
> > 1.    Mess dress may be worn on civilian occasions outside of the
Officers
> > Mess as long as the civilian occasion calls for black or white tie
dress.
> >
> > 2.    There is no formal hour during the day or evening that makes mess
dress
> > mandatory.
> >
> > Rhett Lawson
> >
> > C. Bryon McLeod wrote:
> >
> > > Hello all I hope someone can provide some information on mess dress.
> > >
> > > Here are my two questions:
> > >
> > > 1. In regards to all regiments, in particular British, Scottish, or
> > > Canadian, is it acceptable to wear mess dress outside the mess i.e.
dinner
> > > parties, the theater, open air tattoos and the like?
> > >
> > > 2. Is there a time of day that ONLY mess dress is to be worn, much
like a
> > > day formal or evening formal wedding?
> > >
> > > Any and all help is appreciated
> > >
> > > Bryon McLeod
> > > USA
> > >
> > > --------------------------------------------------------
> > > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > > message body.
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > message body.
> --------------------------------------------------------
> NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> message body.
>
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"S. Brent Warne" <sbw@netidea.com>* on *Sat, 29 Jul 2000 21:10:31 -0700*
Interesting post. 
Seems we forget one thing.  A member pays for a mess kit and is not 
required by any CFAO that I‘m aware of to possess one.   Therefore where 
and when you wear it is up to the member........
I was reminded by a former Chief Warrant Officer that "he paid for it 
and he‘ll wear it wear he wants to" .  He advised me that he wore his on 
a recent cruise during the Captains dinner and was complemented on the 
sharp dress by several ladies.
This should create some discussion ??
-----Original Message-----
From:The MacFarlanes‘ [SMTP:desrtrat@amug.org]
Sent:Friday, July 28, 2000 5:51 PM
To:army@cipherlogic.on.ca
Subject:Re: mess dress questions?
Gunner.. that was always my impression too.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gunner" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 7:14 AM
Subject: Re: mess dress questions?
> I thought that mess dress couldn‘t be worn until after 1800 hrs?  
Maybe
> its‘ simply "gauche" to wear formal attire in the afternoon.
>
> Rhett wrote:
> >
> > Hello Bryon
> >
> > 1.    Mess dress may be worn on civilian occasions outside of the
Officers
> > Mess as long as the civilian occasion calls for black or white tie
dress.
> >
> > 2.    There is no formal hour during the day or evening that makes 
mess
dress
> > mandatory.
> >
> > Rhett Lawson
> >
> > C. Bryon McLeod wrote:
> >
> > > Hello all I hope someone can provide some information on mess 
dress.
> > >
> > > Here are my two questions:
> > >
> > > 1. In regards to all regiments, in particular British, Scottish, 
or
> > > Canadian, is it acceptable to wear mess dress outside the mess 
i.e.
dinner
> > > parties, the theater, open air tattoos and the like?
> > >
> > > 2. Is there a time of day that ONLY mess dress is to be worn, much
like a
> > > day formal or evening formal wedding?
> > >
> > > Any and all help is appreciated
> > >
> > > Bryon McLeod
> > > USA
> > >
> > > --------------------------------------------------------
> > > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > > message body.
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > message body.
> --------------------------------------------------------
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Gunner <randr1@home.com>* on *Sat, 29 Jul 2000 22:43:35 -0600*
As you have to buy mess dress yourself there is obviously not a CF
policy on the issue.  There are policies that are set by your corps over
what you will wear.  For instance and I‘m quoting from memory the
Royal Regiment of Canadian Artillery Standing Orders dictate that a
subaltern will purchase mess dress within a year of arriving at the
Regiment.  
The question of leaving it the discretion of the officer/NCM who
purchased it begs the question that if you turn your back on your
Regimental Standing Orders...why would you wear mess dress if you don‘t
believe in what it stands for?  In the case of the Chief Warrant Officer
who wore his mess dress I offer two points:
a.  I believe a retired member can wear his regimental mess dress to
functions as pointed out by Brent...Lord knows I‘ve been to many mess
dinners with lots of old COs, etc wearing it
b.  I think it is entirely appropriate for the CWO to wear it at the
Captain‘s Dinner anyway.
Good Night!  
"S. Brent Warne" wrote:
> 
> Interesting post.
> 
> Seems we forget one thing.  A member pays for a mess kit and is not required by any CFAO that I‘m aware of to possess one.   Therefore where and when you wear it is up to the member........
> 
> I was reminded by a former Chief Warrant Officer that "he paid for it and he‘ll wear it wear he wants to" .  He advised me that he wore his on a recent cruise during the Captains dinner and was complemented on the sharp dress by several ladies.
> 
> This should create some discussion ??
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From:   The MacFarlanes‘ [SMTP:desrtrat@amug.org]
> Sent:   Friday, July 28, 2000 5:51 PM
> To:     army@cipherlogic.on.ca
> Subject:        Re: mess dress questions?
> 
> Gunner.. that was always my impression too.
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gunner" 
> To: 
> Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 7:14 AM
> Subject: Re: mess dress questions?
> 
> > I thought that mess dress couldn‘t be worn until after 1800 hrs?  Maybe
> > its‘ simply "gauche" to wear formal attire in the afternoon.
> >
> > Rhett wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello Bryon
> > >
> > > 1.    Mess dress may be worn on civilian occasions outside of the
> Officers
> > > Mess as long as the civilian occasion calls for black or white tie
> dress.
> > >
> > > 2.    There is no formal hour during the day or evening that makes mess
> dress
> > > mandatory.
> > >
> > > Rhett Lawson
> > >
> > > C. Bryon McLeod wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hello all I hope someone can provide some information on mess dress.
> > > >
> > > > Here are my two questions:
> > > >
> > > > 1. In regards to all regiments, in particular British, Scottish, or
> > > > Canadian, is it acceptable to wear mess dress outside the mess i.e.
> dinner
> > > > parties, the theater, open air tattoos and the like?
> > > >
> > > > 2. Is there a time of day that ONLY mess dress is to be worn, much
> like a
> > > > day formal or evening formal wedding?
> > > >
> > > > Any and all help is appreciated
> > > >
> > > > Bryon McLeod
> > > > USA
> > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------
> > > > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > > > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > > > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > > > message body.
> > >
> > > --------------------------------------------------------
> > > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > > message body.
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
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> >
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Wyn van der Schee <vandersw@cadvision.com>* on *Sat, 29 Jul 2000 22:59:57 -0600*
 On Sat Jul 29 22:09:24 2000 S. Brent Warne wrote
>Interesting post.
>
>Seems we forget one thing.  A member pays for a mess kit and is not
>required by any CFAO that I‘m aware of to possess one.   Therefore where
>and when you wear it is up to the member........
>
>I was reminded by a former Chief Warrant Officer that "he paid for it and
>he‘ll wear it wear he wants to" .  He advised me that he wore his on a
>recent cruise during the Captains dinner and was complemented on the sharp
>dress by several ladies.
>
>This should create some discussion ??
As I stated in a previous post, a mess kit consists of two mess tins, a kfs
combination and a canteen cup, while mess dress is a uniform. Like other
uniforms, and perhaps even more so, there are certain customs and
traditions associated with wearing mess dress. We certainly do not forget
that individuals purchase their own mess uniforms it‘s an obligation that
comes with Sr NCO and officer rank. The issue is not who buys or supplies
the uniform, but under what circumstances it may be worn.The CWO who made
the above statement was merely being ridiculous if that expresses his
personal philosophy. Certainly compliments from a couple of ladies on a
cruise are no justification for a breach of tradition, although in this
particular instance a marginal case may be made for wearing mess dress I
sincerely hope he does not make a habit of wearing it every night to the
casino.
This discussion is really about the differences between the military ethos
and civilian individualism, and your CWO is really expressing a very
civilian attitude. If he doesn‘t believe in the rules, how can he, at the
pinnacle of the OR hierarchy, expect to enforce them? He can‘t  be
selective. The rules consist of not only CFAOs and QROs but also
regimental standing orders, customs and traditions.Or do we now have a
Canadian military force in which everyone makes his own rules?
More food for thought.
Wyn van der Schee
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Ian Edwards <iedwards@home.com>* on *Sun, 30 Jul 2000 13:31:25 -0600*
Wyn from Ian Edwards:
It‘s been commonly called Mess Kit for a century! Perhaps not in the
cavalry but then ....
Just as a KFS set was commonly called a set of "gut wrenches" by the
junior ranks   :-.
I can recall losing two sets of KFS sets in the first week of my basic
training. We had to carry the damn things on our person all day haybox
lunches and luckily that week didn‘t have small packs or basic pouches
and the KFS sets must have bounced out of a pocket or whatever somewhere
in Camp Wainwright the Ponderosa Ranch, circa 1959. Only cost me $0.69
per set price scarred on my mind forever but the embarassment of going
back to the QM Stores on my time and signing CDVs each time was far
worse. Eventually we all learn to hang on to our stuff. "Sgt-Maj be a
mother to me."
Wyn van der Schee wrote:
> 
>  On Sat Jul 29 22:09:24 2000 S. Brent Warne wrote
> >Interesting post.
> >
> >Seems we forget one thing.  A member pays for a mess kit and is not
> >required by any CFAO that I‘m aware of to possess one.   Therefore where
> >and when you wear it is up to the member........
> >
> >I was reminded by a former Chief Warrant Officer that "he paid for it and
> >he‘ll wear it wear he wants to" .  He advised me that he wore his on a
> >recent cruise during the Captains dinner and was complemented on the sharp
> >dress by several ladies.
> >
> >This should create some discussion ??
> 
> As I stated in a previous post, a mess kit consists of two mess tins, a kfs
> combination and a canteen cup, while mess dress is a uniform. Like other
> uniforms, and perhaps even more so, there are certain customs and
> traditions associated with wearing mess dress. We certainly do not forget
> that individuals purchase their own mess uniforms it‘s an obligation that
> comes with Sr NCO and officer rank. The issue is not who buys or supplies
> the uniform, but under what circumstances it may be worn.The CWO who made
> the above statement was merely being ridiculous if that expresses his
> personal philosophy. Certainly compliments from a couple of ladies on a
> cruise are no justification for a breach of tradition, although in this
> particular instance a marginal case may be made for wearing mess dress I
> sincerely hope he does not make a habit of wearing it every night to the
> casino.
> This discussion is really about the differences between the military ethos
> and civilian individualism, and your CWO is really expressing a very
> civilian attitude. If he doesn‘t believe in the rules, how can he, at the
> pinnacle of the OR hierarchy, expect to enforce them? He can‘t  be
> selective. The rules consist of not only CFAOs and QROs but also
> regimental standing orders, customs and traditions.Or do we now have a
> Canadian military force in which everyone makes his own rules?
> More food for thought.
> Wyn van der Schee
> 
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"S. Brent Warne" <sbw@netidea.com>* on *Sun, 30 Jul 2000 13:11:28 -0700*
Wyn
Interesting comments.  Whether we call it Mess Kit or Mess Dress  as 
you said,  each Regiment or Branch has their own customs  the issue is 
- where and when is it appropriate to wear.
I would suggest that the CWO was wearing his Mess Kit at an appropriate 
occasion given that it was probably a black tie affair.  I believe most 
members who go the expense of purchasing their Mess Kit are very proud 
of their association with the military either past or current.
Maybe, some appropriate occasions might be:
Wedding and / or reception and dinner.
Black tie dinner  can‘t remember the last invitation I received to one 
of these affairs 
College or University Graduation Ball.
As things change in the military, so do our traditions and customs.  
Change is inevitable, we must respect our past and apply those rules 
which are appropriate in today‘s context. 
Be interested in other comments.
 On Sat Jul 29 22:09:24 2000 S. Brent Warne wrote
>Interesting post.
>
>Seems we forget one thing.  A member pays for a mess kit and is not
>required by any CFAO that I‘m aware of to possess one.   Therefore 
where
>and when you wear it is up to the member........
>
>I was reminded by a former Chief Warrant Officer that "he paid for it 
and
>he‘ll wear it wear he wants to" .  He advised me that he wore his on a
>recent cruise during the Captains dinner and was complemented on the 
sharp
>dress by several ladies.
>
>This should create some discussion ??
As I stated in a previous post, a mess kit consists of two mess tins, a 
kfs
combination and a canteen cup, while mess dress is a uniform. Like other
uniforms, and perhaps even more so, there are certain customs and
traditions associated with wearing mess dress. We certainly do not 
forget
that individuals purchase their own mess uniforms it‘s an obligation 
that
comes with Sr NCO and officer rank. The issue is not who buys or 
supplies
the uniform, but under what circumstances it may be worn.The CWO who 
made
the above statement was merely being ridiculous if that expresses his
personal philosophy. Certainly compliments from a couple of ladies on a
cruise are no justification for a breach of tradition, although in this
particular instance a marginal case may be made for wearing mess dress 
I
sincerely hope he does not make a habit of wearing it every night to the
casino.
This discussion is really about the differences between the military 
ethos
and civilian individualism, and your CWO is really expressing a very
civilian attitude. If he doesn‘t believe in the rules, how can he, at 
the
pinnacle of the OR hierarchy, expect to enforce them? He can‘t  be
selective. The rules consist of not only CFAOs and QROs but also
regimental standing orders, customs and traditions.Or do we now have a
Canadian military force in which everyone makes his own rules?
More food for thought.
Wyn van der Schee
--------------------------------------------------------
NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
message body.
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"The MacFarlanes‘" <desrtrat@amug.org>* on *Sun, 30 Jul 2000 15:53:27 -0700*
I had a BQMS who would absolutely fly into a rage, if someone referred 
to a "kit bag" as a duffel bag, which he knew/thought was an 
Americanism. I think, when all is said and done, whether a soldier, 
SnrNCO, or Officer refers to it as mess kit, instead of mess dress, or 
whether they put the plural "s" on the first or second part of a 
hyphenated term, has little bearing of their real abilities, as they 
pertain to being a good soldier. Everyone just seems to have certain 
things, however minor, that get under their skin. I always found it 
amusing to see an otherwise seasoned professional be so easily 
irritated.
M J MacFarlane
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
I had a BQMS who 
would
absolutely fly into a rage, if someonereferred to a "kit bag" as a 
duffel
bag, which he knew/thought was an Americanism. I think, when all is said 
and
done, whether a soldier, SnrNCO, or Officer refers to it as mess kit, 
instead of
mess dress, or whether they put the plural "s" on the first or second 
part of a
hyphenated term, has little bearing of their real abilities, as they 
pertain to
being a good soldier. Everyone just seems to have certain things, 
however minor,
that get under their skin. I always found it amusing to see an otherwise 
seasoned professional be so easily irritated.
M J 
MacFarlane
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"The MacFarlanes‘" <desrtrat@amug.org>* on *Sun, 30 Jul 2000 16:00:37 -0700*
OOOps... sorry about the typo in the subject
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: The MacFarlanes‘
  To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca
  Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2000 3:53 PM
  Subject: Mes kit, etc.
  I had a BQMS who would absolutely fly into a rage, if someone referred 
to a "kit bag" as a duffel bag, which he knew/thought was an 
Americanism. I think, when all is said and done, whether a soldier, 
SnrNCO, or Officer refers to it as mess kit, instead of mess dress, or 
whether they put the plural "s" on the first or second part of a 
hyphenated term, has little bearing of their real abilities, as they 
pertain to being a good soldier. Everyone just seems to have certain 
things, however minor, that get under their skin. I always found it 
amusing to see an otherwise seasoned professional be so easily 
irritated.
  M J MacFarlane

http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
OOOps... sorry 
about the typo in
the subject
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From:
  The
  MacFarlanes‘ 
  To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca 
  Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2000 
3:53 PM
  Subject: Mes kit, etc.

  I had a BQMS who 
would
  absolutely fly into a rage, if someonereferred to a "kit bag" as 
a
  duffel bag, which he knew/thought was an Americanism. I think, when 
all is
  said and done, whether a soldier, SnrNCO, or Officer refers to it as 
mess kit,
  instead of mess dress, or whether they put the plural "s" on the first 
or
  second part of a hyphenated term, has little bearing of their real 
abilities,
  as they pertain to being a good soldier. Everyone just seems to have 
certain
  things, however minor, that get under their skin. I always found it 
amusing to
  see an otherwise seasoned professional be so easily 
irritated.
  M J 
MacFarlane

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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"Steve Kuervers" <skuervers@hotmail.com>* on *Mon, 31 Jul 2000 15:24:47 GMT*
I don‘t believe it‘s written down anywhere, but tradition has it that mess 
kit is never worn before 1800 hours.
Steve
>From: Rhett 
>Reply-To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca
>To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca
>Subject: Re: mess dress questions?
>Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:54:27 -0400
>
>Hello Bryon
>
>1.    Mess dress may be worn on civilian occasions outside of the Officers
>Mess as long as the civilian occasion calls for black or white tie dress.
>
>2.    There is no formal hour during the day or evening that makes mess 
>dress
>mandatory.
>
>Rhett Lawson
>
>C. Bryon McLeod wrote:
>
> > Hello all I hope someone can provide some information on mess dress.
> >
> > Here are my two questions:
> >
> > 1. In regards to all regiments, in particular British, Scottish, or
> > Canadian, is it acceptable to wear mess dress outside the mess i.e. 
>dinner
> > parties, the theater, open air tattoos and the like?
> >
> > 2. Is there a time of day that ONLY mess dress is to be worn, much like 
>a
> > day formal or evening formal wedding?
> >
> > Any and all help is appreciated
> >
> > Bryon McLeod
> > USA
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
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>
>
>
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