# Close Protection Training



## riggs (24 Oct 2005)

Is there much training in vip/close protection training in the forces. And do regular army units provide close protection or does that task go to JTF. My goal isn't the JTF, but vip/close protection work does intrest me. Thanks


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## Daidalous (24 Oct 2005)

I am pretty sure that Military Police  might receive some training in this.


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## Scott (12 Nov 2006)

Edited the title for you.


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## Bruce Monkhouse (12 Nov 2006)

I will PM this thread to our resident expert, but for the next 2 weeks his attendance here will be spotty.


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## Colin Parkinson (12 Nov 2006)

The Combat carry magizine always has a scenario they talk about for protection teams. About $4-5 per issue and some good articles in between the 1911 love-in stuff.


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## Poppa (13 Nov 2006)

What exactly do you want to know?
1. The MPs recently got the tasking back,
2. We lost 2 who were part of BGen Frasiers team over seas to a roadside bomb,
3. There is a selection held about twice a year with as many courses,
4. The intent as far as I know is to reach a certain critical mass of CP operaters before a CP "unit" is stood up, and
5. That's all I have without getting too far into the weeds.

Cheers


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## George Wallace (13 Nov 2006)

Poppa

Did you attend the recent Town Hall meeting where the MP's are passing off the CP to Area Security Officers and Reps, or something along those lines?  Apparently there is supposed to be some sort of PPS to inform/show them how it is to be done.  Could you clear this up if you know anything about it?


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## Poppa (13 Nov 2006)

I've been on leave for the past week and a half so...no.
Is this just info on the CP tasking or were folks under the impression that the CP was being farmed out to non MP types?
I'm back at work Wed so I can do some snooping


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## QV (13 Nov 2006)

I am interested in this info as well.  I don't here any details over seas.  I am doing the CP thing right now in the ghan.


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## CombatMP265 (26 Nov 2006)

I've had a couple of my people apply for CPP. 
But I must warn you, you have to be in shape and confident in your weapons handling skills to even consider trying out. 
Plus if your icon is correct your also an Officer, which I have to tell you sets yourself at a higher standard than every NCM/NCO at the selection. I've known other Officers who've technically "passed" the CPP course but didn't get selected because of leadership. So you have to certainly not be half-***ed about your approach to the program. 

But if you are willing, I wish you the best of luck.


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## medaid (25 Feb 2007)

Is it still locked in as an MP only course? I was wandering about things like this. Is there anychance for PRes MP Officers/NCMs to apply for this?


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## Poppa (26 Feb 2007)

There are a number of Res MP's who are working in the CP world, domestically and in theater. It was also just opened up for MSE Ops to fill driver positions. The MSE types will go through all the same screening and training but will be used as...drivers, go figure.

MPO's can apply but IMHO there are too many MPO's who want to be Cpls and do all of the cool shit. BTW I know some MPO's who are CP types and I have no problem saying this to them. Don't take it as sour grapes.


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## Inspir (26 Feb 2007)

http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/Land_Force/english/6_1_1.asp?FlashEnabled=0&id=1289&action=comment


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## PhilB (26 Feb 2007)

Does anyone know why this isnt open to infantry? I know in Canada CP is more geared towards MP's, but in theater it seems like an infantry specialty to me.


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## Poppa (26 Feb 2007)

If you can wait a bit, say until tomorrow I'll take a bash at that one for you.

Oh what the hell.

Basically it's down to who owns the capability. Obviously, we'll use other trades because we don't have our own LAV dvrs etc...but if it's in our mandate why not do the job in theater?

I know that didn't answer your question but I think my cats just destroyed something upstairs. I'll try and get a better answer later.


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## KevinB (26 Feb 2007)

The basic CP stuff is done by the MP trade - basically they took it due to their "expertise" from doing the DFAIT stuff.
  Highend PSD is done by DHTC - however I understand CSOR will be developing this.

There is a big difference in domestic Executive Protection -- which most DFAIT jobs are as well.
  High Risk PSD as done in Iraq and Afghan - typically gets halfassed by the Military (the US mil as well from what I have seen).


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## QV (6 Apr 2007)

That is really too bad that they are accepting MSE Ops in the CP program.  They don't need drivers, every MP who goes thru the training is trained to drive to a very high standard .... they need Signallers and Medics as a priority.


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## captjtq (28 Apr 2007)

We were using R22eR folks in my Roto to fill positions here and there, with great success.... PM me if you want more info, this was theatre-specific, obviously - it's an MP mandate, for the most part, with JTF-2 coming in on specific occasions, as they are still responsible for certain aspects of CP (I can mention that much without breaching OPSEC). It's a great go for the MP branch, I really hope that we can sustain it. As a branch, we're stretching thin to retain the capability, but it is good for us. I've got many buddies and troops who have gone CP. I'm seriously debating it in the next year as it's an amazing job overseas, and I want to feel some of that rush that my friends have gone through  and related to me, and have tried to convince me to do, in terms of deployed-CP ops. Those folks who have mentioned that we're opening up the task to MSE-Ops are correct - we need drivers. It's definitely a good go. I don't know about opportunites for CP in other trades. It is a very physically and mentally demanding job... in *my opinion only* while it is a MP mandate right now, there is no reason why we couldn't open it to other trades who can qualify and complete the requisite training.


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## QV (28 Apr 2007)

captjtq said:
			
		

> We were using R22eR folks in my Roto to fill positions here and there, with great success.... PM me if you want more info, this was theatre-specific, obviously - it's an MP mandate, for the most part, with JTF-2 coming in on specific occasions, as they are still responsible for certain aspects of CP (I can mention that much without breaching OPSEC). It's a great go for the MP branch, I really hope that we can sustain it. As a branch, we're stretching thin to retain the capability, but it is good for us. I've got many buddies and troops who have gone CP. I'm seriously debating it in the next year as it's an amazing job overseas, and I want to feel some of that rush that my friends have gone through  and related to me, and have tried to convince me to do, in terms of deployed-CP ops. Those folks who have mentioned that we're opening up the task to MSE-Ops are correct - we need drivers. It's definitely a good go. I don't know about opportunites for CP in other trades. It is a very physically and mentally demanding job... in *my opinion only* while it is a MP mandate right now, there is no reason why we couldn't open it to other trades who can qualify and complete the requisite training.



Wow, I don't really know where to begin.....for starters have you actually talked to any CP guys that have come back from theatre about some of this?  The R22eR augmentees are not a "great success"..... From my experience they could barely keep the "great success" off of charge parade or from embarassing the VIP.  One bad apple?  Maybe.  As far as training him in CP drills go - we couldn't where I was, everytime we started to practise something all the LEPs on camp would come out to watch .... not too mention the lack of space.  You can't expect a guy to pick up all the drills in theatre during a few practise runs - so by no fault of their own  - they were not good to have on the team.  However, an untrained Vandoo was better then nobody at all.  Still this should not ever happen.    

Secondly the whole MSE Op thing.  I don't know but I would suspect again that nobody asks the guys in theatre or the guys returning.  I don't know who or where they seem to come up with these grand ideas.  Let me make this very clear:

WE DON'T NEED DRIVERS!!! 

Every CP member already knows how to drive, its part of the training, its required, is practised all the time.  Each team needs someone who is skilled with comms equipment.  Most meat heads don't know jack s**t about comms gear.  Each team needs someone who is a skilled medic.  Again most meat heads don't know any first aid past what is taught during pre-deployment training!! Many times you are far far away from QRF and medivac... so it would be nice to have some one who can treat a wounded member beyond sticking a tourniquet around his neck!

So basically CP operators know how to drive, know how to shoot, and they know how to protect the vip.  What needs to be brought to the table are skills that MPs don't normally have and that won't be taught to them.  Signallers, Medics, Mechanics, Infanteers - all have skills that are useful and that MPs don't have.  These are the people that should be recruited for the CP program.


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## captjtq (28 Apr 2007)

QV said:
			
		

> Wow, I don't really know where to begin.....for starters have you actually talked to any CP guys that have come back from theatre about some of this?  The R22eR augmentees are not a "great success"..... From my experience they could barely keep the "great success" off of charge parade or from embarassing the VIP.  One bad apple?  Maybe.  As far as training him in CP drills go - we couldn't where I was, everytime we started to practise something all the LEPs on camp would come out to watch .... not too mention the lack of space.  You can't expect a guy to pick up all the drills in theatre during a few practise runs - so by no fault of their own  - they were not good to have on the team.  However, an untrained Vandoo was better then nobody at all.  Still this should not ever happen.
> 
> Secondly the whole MSE Op thing.  I don't know but I would suspect again that nobody asks the guys in theatre or the guys returning.  I don't know who or where they seem to come up with these grand ideas.  Let me make this very clear:
> 
> ...



I don't need to ask any of the CP guys. I was the Deputy Task Force Provost Marshal on Roto 2. Yeah, it wasn't the 100% solution, but it was a great success in the view that they already had the mentality, and required a lot less training than even bringing in another non-CP trained MP. It allowed you folks to get on with a lot of jobs that you otherwise wouldn't have been able to do because of manpower issues. And while you're wonderful drivers, and I'd stack you up against anyone, we don't have the numbers to sustain everything at this point. Until those numbers increase, or they increase the numbers of the branch, it's going to be a struggle and we're going to continue to look for other solutions.


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## QV (29 Apr 2007)

captjtq said:
			
		

> *I don't need to ask any of the CP guys.* I was the Deputy Task Force Provost Marshal on Roto 2. Yeah, it wasn't the 100% solution, but it was a great success in the view that they already had the mentality, and required a lot less training than even bringing in another non-CP trained MP. It allowed you folks to get on with a lot of jobs that you otherwise wouldn't have been able to do because of manpower issues. And while you're wonderful drivers, and I'd stack you up against anyone, we don't have the numbers to sustain everything at this point. Until those numbers increase, or they increase the numbers of the branch, it's going to be a struggle and we're going to continue to look for other solutions.




So you didn't do the job but you are qualified to make decisions about it without asking the guys actually doing the job?  That is problem number 1 in our org.  No disrespect, just speaking my mind here.  As far as the augmentees go, that is definately not the way to go and it caused a number of problems - some minor some major.  But that was the solution at the time for a crappy manning problem.  No big deal, no body got hurt, hopefully we don't have to repeat that ever again.  

So why MSE Ops?  What do they bring to the table as far as important skills go?  They arn't bringing driving skills since they have to be trained to drive all over again.  I know what a medic or signaller would bring - much needed and important skills that MPs don't normally have already and something they won't learn before going.


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## captjtq (30 Apr 2007)

QV said:
			
		

> So you didn't do the job but you are qualified to make decisions about it without asking the guys actually doing the job?  That is problem number 1 in our org.  No disrespect, just speaking my mind here.  As far as the augmentees go, that is definately not the way to go and it caused a number of problems - some minor some major.  But that was the solution at the time for a crappy manning problem.  No big deal, no body got hurt, hopefully we don't have to repeat that ever again.
> 
> So why MSE Ops?  What do they bring to the table as far as important skills go?  They arn't bringing driving skills since they have to be trained to drive all over again.  I know what a medic or signaller would bring - much needed and important skills that MPs don't normally have already and something they won't learn before going.



No, I don't do the job. But I have had enough exposure to it, and the PM had enough access to SME (The CP Major and the Captains who were in theatre) who spearheaded the effort to ensure that you were able to do your jobs over there, and recommended that we go this way. I never heard a complaint until I saw your post. If it was such a horrible idea, and caused so many problems, how come we never heard about it at the time? Probably because you understood the reasoning behind it, I guess. That said, you're right - it was a quick fix, one that hopefully more courses and qualified CP folks will alleviate.

Why MSE Ops? Because there are not enough MPs to fill all of the tasks internationally (not just over there). It's not a matter of MPs not being good enough to do the job, or the fact that they're trained any better at driving, but that they need more bodies. Someone high up in your world must have made the recommendation higher in Ottawa for them to recruit from the MSE Op trade. I do agree with you on the Medical and Sigs side as well. While TCCC training might be very good, it doesn't replace a medic.

Incidentally, I do hope to change the fact that I don't personally do the job, or at least haven't been trained. A few close friends who were over there as CP have been trying hard to convince me for a while to come over to the dark side - with fair success.  ;D I saw the job you were doing, and it seemed like the best one for MPs anywhere...


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## KevinB (1 May 2007)

TCCS - does give a better cbt medic than the medic trade (unless you stealing a 6A or 6B medic)
Comms -- uhm -- I would have though any meatheat passed QL3 should know how to talk on the radio.

CP/PSD is not magic science -- and realistically the military won't do it properly either anyway.

Since your short numbers - If you can make it a subtrade and make it a remuster.
I would suggest that your better off recruting from the CF internally and running them thru a 1-2 month PSD/CP course -- plusas a precursor send them to a real driving course (Tony Scotti, BSR, etc.) and a shooting course (BW or MidSouth) for a bit too -- so they have the skills to be employed on a course.

The MP trade needs to understand that the EP methods that they had secured elsehwere are not CP/PSD and they need to adapt.  


Factor in all the high value entities with still get DHTC cadre


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## garb811 (1 May 2007)

Infidel-6 said:
			
		

> The MP trade needs to understand that the EP methods that they had secured elsewhere are not CP/PSD and they need to adapt.


The Branch did not make this assumption and was aware that there was no in Branch capability to conduct this task when initially re-tasked.  ie. as you've alluded to, MSG do protection but IAW the MOU between DFAIT and DND, MSG do not conduct CPP and are limited to providing Escort only (although in some places the line is obviously very fuzzy and some guys push the envelope).  Currently guys going to certain places are going to outside locations and organizations for enhanced training prior to deployment but as far as I know, this is still not to CPP standards due to the MOU restriction.

Back in the 80's, MP were trained initially by the UK experts and maintained the capability via in-house courses with outside SME assistance from the UK until the task was assumed by Dwyer Hill.  When the capability was re-tasked to the Branch the initial candidates were screened and selected IAW RMP standards and then trained by the RMP.  I won't comment on the current conduct of CPP training as it's not my bag and I haven't kept up on it.

I'm 100% in agreement that this mandate would be best served by a nondedicated MP unit with candidates drawn from across the CF.  Unfortunately it has become the flavour of the day in the Branch and it is having a detrimental effect by taking time, resources and personnel away from what should be our core competencies.


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## QV (1 May 2007)

captjtq,

There were no complaints at the time because we _thought_ it was a good temp fix also ... but after time, us guys on the ground learned that it was not such a good idea at all.  But I am not going into details about that here.    

Infidel-6,

Anyone can talk on a radio.  But programming/fixing/calibrating (whatever) encrypted radios, and having a good general knowledge about some of the foriegn radios we used would have helped out a lot.  Where I was we didn't have a CDN Sigs guy just around the corner to assist.  As far as Ticks radio equipment.... none of us knew how to use it - but that didn't matter because there was no one else to talk to on that system where we were anyway.  

Initially CP training was done in in the UK.  Now it is done else where by the most skilled and professional crew anywhere - so be rest assured our training far exceeds what most countries/companies get for CP.  

________________________________________

You guys are all pretty much on side as far as recruiting goes.  This program needs to recruit from all across the board.  There is simply not enough interest/suitable candidates in such a small org as the MP branch to fill the tasking.  

There is a pretty consistant fail/non-selection rate of 75%.  That is from initial application all the way to training complete and passed.  So at least, despite the manpower shortage, they have not slacked the standards - which is real good to see.


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## garb811 (1 Jul 2007)

An email is out to the MP Branch stating that CPP is about to open to all trades, I imagine CANFORGEN to follow shortly.


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## regulator12 (8 Aug 2007)

The canforgen is out check it out on the DIN, its open to all pers cpl to sgt.


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## garb811 (11 Aug 2007)

For anyone interested who doesn't have easy access to CANFORGENs, or for those who are playing along from home, the message can be found here:  CLOSE PROTECTION (CP) RECRUITING CAMPAIGN.


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## Big Red (11 Aug 2007)

QV said:
			
		

> Initially CP training was done in in the UK.  Now it is done else where by the most skilled and professional crew anywhere - so be rest assured our training far exceeds what most countries/companies get for CP.



I hope you're not referring to BW...


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## Sideshow (13 Aug 2007)

Big Red said:
			
		

> I hope you're not referring to BW...



Yes he is.


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## westie47 (4 Sep 2007)

I just read the Canforgen, sounds like the selection is very similiar, albeit shorter than DHTC....looong runs, etc. I didn't make this (Sept) cut-off but plan to apply for the next course. 

Anyone out there heading for selection??? PM me with details.

One thing that I wasn't clear on, the message says it's a three year gig but be prepared to deploy for 6 months. How will that affect Reserve guys? If we even get in!!!!!!


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## Armymedic (4 Sep 2007)

CANFORGEN- interesting read...Sounds like if you are not good enough to be a SAR Tech, JTF assulter, or SOR operator...you might be able to shoot good enough to be in CPP.

Good news is that it will give you marketable skills beyond the cbt arms. Just don't waste your money buying t-shirts at the training establishment.


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## medaid (4 Sep 2007)

I have a serious question though... why aren't officers being considered?


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## westie47 (4 Sep 2007)

So it's true about where the training takes place????  :-XSomeplace in the US south? It's a good place, I know a few people who have trained/worked there.

Where does the selection take place? I guess I better get running.....


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## dapaterson (4 Sep 2007)

MedTech said:
			
		

> I have a serious question though... why aren't officers being considered?



Because officers are generally the planners for such things, vice the actual do-ers.  There is value in experiencing something before being told to lead & manage the activity; but the cost of training and the reality that officers would likely never employ the skills mitigates against their training in the field.

That's just my 2c; don't quote it as gospel.


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## Greymatters (5 Sep 2007)

Some courses solve this by offering two variations: a full course for specialists (who can be officers and/or NCO's depending on the country), and a shorter 'familiarization' course for senior officers who will manage the specialists.


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## captjtq (7 Sep 2007)

dapaterson said:
			
		

> Because officers are generally the planners for such things, vice the actual do-ers.  There is value in experiencing something before being told to lead & manage the activity; but the cost of training and the reality that officers would likely never employ the skills mitigates against their training in the field.
> 
> That's just my 2c; don't quote it as gospel.



I can speak from experience having had the privilege of being the DCO and A/CO of MPs in Afghanistan (including CP Operatives), and having some very good buddies (peers) who are CP-qualified Officers who led CP teams in Afghanistan (two of whom were awarded US MSMs for their leadership) that they not only employed the skills taught during their training, but did the job over there alongside their troops - they not only did the CP job, but experienced all the heartache that is leadership in a high-threat environment. 

It was ultimately up to the team leader to ensure that their VIP was kept as safe as possible in a very hostile environment... we're not talking VIPs who sat in an office all tour, but officers with leafs on their epaulets who did a lot of traveling throughout Afghanistan. Any CP team leader (Sgt+) not only has to be as well trained as their Cpls, but in fact more is expected of them when the job is actually being performed - so not only are they doing that traditional 'planning/training' function, but they're leading from the front doing CP.


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## Dissident (8 Sep 2007)

> Any CP team leader (Sgt+)[...]



There was a MCpl CP teamleader on TF1-07. I'm told he did a good job too and got promoted at the end of the tour, AFAIR.

Cheers.


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## captjtq (8 Sep 2007)

Dissident said:
			
		

> There was a MCpl CP teamleader on TF1-07. I'm told he did a good job too and got promoted at the end of the tour, AFAIR.
> 
> Cheers.



This is true... but as I understand it, the normal rank level for a team leader is Sgt. If I'm wrong, I'm sure someone will speak up (I'm definitely no SME). Obviously, when pers shortages occur, as in any trade and especially in operations, we are sometimes required to fill slots with lower ranks. All that said, you're right - all of the MCpls I've seen as team leads have acquitted themselves exceptionally.


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## DirtyDog (7 Nov 2007)

Today it was passed down to us that they are looking for apps....


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## dapaterson (7 Nov 2007)

There is a new CANFORGEN out on applicants for CP.  Your chain of command should be able to provide more information.


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## DirtyDog (7 Nov 2007)

dapaterson said:
			
		

> There is a new CANFORGEN out on applicants for CP.  Your chain of command should be able to provide more information.


After it was passed down I asked my CoC to check the CANFORGEN and let me know what I had to do (if I actually am interested).

The link earlier in the thread stated it was open to Cpls to Sgts.  Is that still applicable?  Can a Pte apply?

I'm sure I will find out, but I'm curious right now and if anyone could answer that I would appreciate it.


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## The_Falcon (7 Nov 2007)

You would think they (CFPM) would post the new CANFORGEN on their own site.  The old one is still there.


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## medaid (7 Nov 2007)

still want it to be opened to officers too! We're able bodied! Damnations!


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## blacktriangle (7 Nov 2007)

DirtyDog said:
			
		

> After it was passed down I asked my CoC to check the CANFORGEN and let me know what I had to do (if I actually am interested).
> 
> The link earlier in the thread stated it was open to Cpls to Sgts.  Is that still applicable?  Can a Pte apply?
> 
> I'm sure I will find out, but I'm curious right now and if anyone could answer that I would appreciate it.



I know I was told about it at my unit, and they still said Cpl to Sgt. I can be a Cpl pretty soon in the res, but that doesnt say much...for another thread I guess.


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## X-mo-1979 (7 Nov 2007)

Cpl is a Cpl.A regualr force cpl dont outrank a res cpl.A WOis a WO,no matter if he has 26 years regular force time and 10 tours or a class A warrant with a cd.


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## medaid (7 Nov 2007)

X-mo-1979 said:
			
		

> Cpl is a Cpl.A regualr force cpl dont outrank a res cpl.A WOis a WO,no matter if he has 26 years regular force time and 10 tours or a class A warrant with a cd.




yeah.... okay... try telling that to the WO who's got 26 years TI and 10 tours... see how you come out of that one.


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## X-mo-1979 (7 Nov 2007)

Try telling a WO with a CD and mostly class A that he isnt... ;D

either way if your a cpl, your a cpl.We have many unqualified Mcpl's coming into the regular force from the reserve.they still out rank a cpl with 14 years.Rank is rank.As is a cpl applying for a CP course.


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## medaid (7 Nov 2007)

in the sense of rank yes, they are all the same, but if you want to talk about the WO or the CPL in the broader sense, no they are not the same.

Not all pigs are equal.


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## Franko (7 Nov 2007)

X-mo-1979 said:
			
		

> Cpl is a Cpl.A regualr force cpl dont outrank a res cpl.A WOis a WO,no matter if he has 26 years regular force time and 10 tours or a class A warrant with a cd.



It's called experience....the ranks are the same.          

Let's not get this going the way so many threads, like this one, have done in the past....spiraling down the drain.

Regards


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## blacktriangle (7 Nov 2007)

MedTech said:
			
		

> Not all pigs are equal.



That's all I was trying to say. Sorry everyone.


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## armyvern (7 Nov 2007)

X-mo-1979 said:
			
		

> Try telling a WO with a CD and mostly class A that he isnt... ;D
> 
> either way if your a cpl, your a cpl.We have many unqualified Mcpl's coming into the regular force from the reserve.they still out rank a cpl with 14 years.Rank is rank.As is a cpl applying for a CP course.



Shhhhhh, please -- for just a 'lil bit. I'd so appreciate it (probably along with some others too).  

ArmyVern
WO
19 & 5


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## westie47 (15 Nov 2007)

So is there a new CANFORGEN out since beginning of Sept? I printed all the info off the DIN in the Sept, jsut waiting for the next selection as it states there are normally two per year. Seeing as they just had one I am thinking spring sometime. 

Anyone out there done it yet? Curious to talk to you about it.


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## DirtyDog (16 Nov 2007)

westie47 said:
			
		

> So is there a new CANFORGEN out since beginning of Sept? I printed all the info off the DIN in the Sept, jsut waiting for the next selection as it states there are normally two per year. Seeing as they just had one I am thinking spring sometime.
> 
> Anyone out there done it yet? Curious to talk to you about it.


Last CANFORGEN I saw was dated Nov 07 I believe.  Didn't look much different then the one posted in this thread.  I could be wrong though.


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## RJS2511885 (5 Jan 2008)

Hello,

Please note there is a pin to commemorate Cpls Dinning and Payne who were killed on this CP tasking.

Regards,

RJS

http://www.vcds.forces.gc.ca/cfpm/intro_e.asp


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## garb811 (27 Jan 2008)

For those interested but who haven't seen the message, the next Close Protection Assessment Center will be held mid-Apr with 31 Mar 08 being the application deadline.  All the good stuff, including the message, is here:  Close Protection Documents


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## Nauticus (30 Mar 2008)

Somebody mentioned earlier that infantry cannot apply for close protection. Which members of the Combat Arms can?


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## NL_engineer (30 Mar 2008)

Nauticus said:
			
		

> Somebody mentioned earlier that infantry cannot apply for close protection. Which members of the Combat Arms can?



To the best of my knowledge that has changed, you best bet would be to look through the CANFORGEN's for the change.


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## Nauticus (30 Mar 2008)

NL_engineer said:
			
		

> To the best of my knowledge that has changed, you best bet would be to look through the CANFORGEN's for the change.


Excellent! Thank you.


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## westie47 (31 Mar 2008)

It's open to all trades, Cpl to Sgt. Just have to pass the Assessment Center and you're good to go.


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## M Feetham (24 Jul 2008)

So my question on this is would you be attached to a unit in Ontario for the duration of the three years or would you just be on call from your regular units. So if for example you are posted to a ship or field unit, you could just be called up last minute and deploy? The Canforgen doesn't say.
Marc


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## Armynewsguy (24 Jul 2008)

For anyone interested, here is a video story shot by us (Army News) on General Ray Henault´s close protection team last summer in Brussels.

http://www.armee.forces.gc.ca/lf/English/6_1_1_1.asp?id=2507

Armynewsguy


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## operator team 2 (24 Sep 2008)

What would you like to know about CP??


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## cpinfo (18 Oct 2008)

I am here to help clear some of the fog regarding CP.  First off, if you haven't looked at the CANFORGEN, Pls do.  It does provide a great deal of information into the selection of prospective Operatives.  Also, take a look at the VCDS-Military Police website (http://www.vcds.forces.gc.ca/cfpm/pubs/rm/cpp_e.asp).  Here is a brief history of CP within the MP trade.  We were tasked to train a team to protect a General in a command position while stationed in Europe.  This took place in the 80s and various taskings lasted into the 90s until being absorbed by the JTF.  Simple... since then, the CF has become operational with Afghanistan and the JTF were loaded with doing their primary missions which was not to perform CP duties.  The CF then tasked the Provost Marshal (PM) to establish some type of selection and training system in order to deploy MPs on specific CP duties.  Since the birth of this new CP program, there has been a considerable need for new operatives and thus the PM made the decision to open this specialized qualification to MSE Ops but there was little success in recruiting the required numbers.  The latest decision, which dates back to 07, has opened the doors to all trades BUT not all ranks (Private - Sgt only).  Will this change? I do not know.  This is a priority tasking and all individuals who are interested may apply.  They are required to submit a memo to their CoC and pass "phase 1" which is done at their respected bases.  This phase consists a CF Express but a higher standard; the swim test no longer applies.  The mbrs application is then passed onto a selection board which may potentially lead to an invitation to the CPAC (close protection assessment centre).  Here, the candidate is put through a series of tests in order to determine their suitability for CP employment.  Should the mbr be selected, HE or SHE is then be invited to attend an intense 6 week high risk protection training crse.  Keep in mind that this is a high tempo training environment and there is little downtime.  Mbrs are expected to be in top physical condition and more importantly, ready to push themselves on a daily basis.  Once this training is completed, the mbr is required to attend PDT and then is deployed into a theatre of operations.  What is the final end state?  Unkown, but at this point we have established a unit now known as the Canadian Forces Protective Services Unit.  Will you be posted to CFPSU?  I do not know.  The mbr may return to their respective units for a year or two before any decision is made.  The mbr may not be interested in continuing with this role or the unit may not be interested in keeping the mbr as an operative.  

I hope this helps... If you want to know what it is really about, apply.  It is a small team environment, very challenging and very rewarding.  We work closely with other CP/SF units WorldWide and we are regarded as being very professional and extremely well trained.  If you have any questions, pls reply.  I will not divulge any specifics regarding selection or cp training.


----------



## George Wallace (18 Oct 2008)

Thanks for the post.  I have a collegue who just entered the CP.  I hope you continue to visit this site and check for future replies to your post and offer.


----------



## cpinfo (18 Oct 2008)

Will do


----------



## brendanhm1 (22 Oct 2008)

I have a question. How would a guy hovering around 10.5 on the beep test do on the selection.

 Is this a sufficient level for the amount of cardiovascular demand during selection?


----------



## cpinfo (22 Oct 2008)

It's a very good start, go look at the links I left in my last post.  They will be able to give you a good indication of where you need to be physically.


----------



## brendanhm1 (22 Oct 2008)

I can do the official fitness test in well under 18.

By "good start" do you mean I shouldn't bother attending the selection in January? Like are most of the guys selected in the 12 range on a beep test?

Thanks for your response though.


----------



## The_Falcon (22 Oct 2008)

torunisfun said:
			
		

> I can do the official fitness test in well under 18.
> 
> By "good start" do you mean I shouldn't bother attending the selection in January? Like are most of the guys selected in the 12 range on a beep test?
> 
> Thanks for your response though.



If your invited to a selection, then I suggest you go, from guys I know who have attended, its NOT All about running.  That and don't forget "selections" also have a mental component, just because a person is a fitness god, doesn't mean they have the mental fortitude to get through it.  At the worst you fail, but get a sense of what to expect and can better prepare, and you can still say at least you made it to selection (as opposed to those hot sh*t ninja snipers, who can talk alot of game, but don't have the stones to even apply).


----------



## brendanhm1 (22 Oct 2008)

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> If your invited to a selection, then I suggest you go, from guys I know who have attended, its NOT All about running.  That and don't forget "selections" also have a mental component, just because a person is a fitness god, doesn't mean they have the mental fortitude to get through it.  At the worst you fail, but get a sense of what to expect and can better prepare, and you can still say at least you made it to selection (as opposed to those hot **** ninja snipers, who can talk alot of game, but don't have the stones to even apply).



I definitely see this point.  My problem is that it would involve taking a week off school.

The positive part is that if selected I would just defer my degree to after course/tour...the negative is that if I'm not selected Ill be a week behind.

This is why I'm trying to sort out whether my chances are worth taking the risk of being behind in school, as well as taking work off for a week.  However I think I will end up going either way, just trying to break down the options.

Thanks for the advice.


----------



## HItorMiss (23 Oct 2008)

Life is a risk, you just have to decide if this is worth the risk of possibly failing.

My advice take the risk.


----------



## Blakey (23 Oct 2008)

Don't go through life always asking yourself "What if..."
From someone that wished that he had done more...


----------



## cpinfo (23 Oct 2008)

torunisfun said:
			
		

> I can do the official fitness test in well under 18.
> 
> By "good start" do you mean I shouldn't bother attending the selection in January? Like are most of the guys selected in the 12 range on a beep test?
> 
> Thanks for your response though.



Not at all, I strongly suggest that you apply and attend selection.  By "very good start" I simply mean that you are on the right track.  The selection involves a battery of testing not limited to just physical abilities.  It is not impossible to pass but remains a challenge.  Good luck with CPAC and should you pass; we'll surely cross paths.


----------



## pickledmoped (23 Nov 2008)

Hey guys, does anyone know if there is a clothing allowance for guys that get into the cp unit?   And Ive heard theres a unit but no posting?? hows tha work is it like a secondary duty kind of thing whee thy call you up when they need you? are they planning on having a real unit?


----------



## garb811 (23 Nov 2008)

Yes you get a clothing grant and a clothing allowance.

Yes there is a "real" unit in the process of standing up, see the Maple Leaf article here:  CFPSU.  Right now the tasks are split.  Some are done by the pers already at the unit, some are done by pers who are trained but not at the unit.  Once the unit is fully operational, the intent is to have the unit do all the tasks.


----------



## pickledmoped (23 Nov 2008)

where are they going to stand up the unit? I heard someone say Borden because of the MP school and I heard Ottawa because of HQ.


----------



## KevinB (23 Nov 2008)

Neither of those would be my guess...


----------



## garb811 (23 Nov 2008)

pickledmoped said:
			
		

> where are they going to stand up the unit? I heard someone say Borden because of the MP school and I heard Ottawa because of HQ.


Glad you took the time to read the article at the link...



> These are just a few of the criteria personnel need to be part of the CF Protective Services Unit (CFPSU), a new Canadian Operational Support Command unit that held its stand-up ceremony recently at its *Shirleys Bay, Ottawa* location.


----------



## brendanhm1 (3 Dec 2008)

Any word on the latest dates for CPAC/ application due dates etc.

Either the provost website hasn't been updated or my internet isnt updating the webpages...


----------



## The_Falcon (3 Dec 2008)

torunisfun said:
			
		

> Any word on the latest dates for CPAC/ application due dates etc.
> 
> Either the provost website hasn't been updated or my internet isnt updating the webpages...



From the last CANFORGEN deadline is 9 Jan 09.


----------



## Dingle berry (25 Dec 2008)

Hey everyone, I have several questions about the CPP unit but I want to make sure Im getting answers from somebody with first hand knowledge and not info from someone who heard it from his cousin who was told by his friends uncle.
If you can answer the questions then please PM me.

Thanks.


----------



## Michael OLeary (25 Dec 2008)

Dingle berry said:
			
		

> Hey everyone, I have several questions about the CPP unit but I want to make sure Im getting answers from somebody with first hand knowledge and not info from someone who heard it from his cousin who was told by his friends uncle.
> If you can answer the questions then please PM me.
> 
> Thanks.



Having someone contact you by PM doesn't guarantee that they actually have first hand knowledge, but it does give them a chance to tel you anything without detractors.  At least when you ask the questions in the open, others have the opportunity to "throw the BS flag" to help you sort out the "_I heard_" crew from those who you might want to direct specific private questions to later.


----------



## Dingle berry (26 Dec 2008)

Usually I would throw the questions out there for everyone, but after reading  some items on here I've noticed alot of bickering and pettiness, Im here for information and not the BS that seems to come out of questions asked.  Thats why I'll try to get my info PM'ed to me.
But I understand your point O'Leary and I respect your advice. Thank you.


----------



## garb811 (27 Dec 2008)

Well, if that is your preference, there are two identified CP Ops on here.  Take the initiative and PM them, if you already have and they haven't answered...


----------



## pickledmoped (18 Jan 2009)

Im curious about pay in the CP unit, now that its open to all trades are there any plans to give a "spec" pay or bonus for members who are not MP's? If not its going to be hard to keep guys in as CP operators when they can do a few years at the unit then get out and work for a civi company. Im just curious if theres been talk about it.


----------



## KevinB (18 Jan 2009)

Civilian Contract protection gigs are not all they are cracked up to be.


----------



## Owner (4 Feb 2009)

Hi Guys,

I hope you don’t mind me butting in, I have been involve in Close Protection training at both a civilian and government level for a number of year and have seen drastic changes in the civilian market mainly a lowering of standards or not knowing what should be taught. This was mainly due to Iraq when a few years ago; due to certain misunderstandings the corporate sector hired a lot of ex military as protection operators. They did this without requiring an accepted syllabus or creating the proper structures to ensure accountability. We are now flooded with no knowledge experts teaching out anything they like. At the same time at the top level the unique nature of the modern threat has transformed the close protection operation into an intelligence-based multitasking process. Within top level protection the catch phase is Security Hazard Effects Management Process (SHEMP). This is a method of decision-making in which individual risks are analyzed to determine the optimal course of action for each phase of the operation. When combined with the procedures of planning and intelligence SHEMP produces the safest method of operating in any hazardous situation. If the same amount of planning was applied to military operations it would save lives. With SHEMP the Close Protection Officer applies this information to the tactical environment. This allows him to see what is invisible to most. They see patterns that others do not and can spot anomalies, things that should happen but didn't or vis-à-vis. It also recognizes when expected elements are missing from the picture. This is describes as "negative cues" and again are invisible to novices. Close Protection doesn’t stop there after SHEMP, comes probability theory. Analytic studies show that criminal or terrorist attacks are influenced by different situational factors. These will depend upon a different constellation of opportunities that are tailored to the crimes in question. What it means is that you can predict the place where an attack is most likely to happen. This list is endless surveillance counter and anti, threat and risk assessment, survey and audits. I don’t know about the Canadian training but I would say its one of the best courses available and one of the most interesting jobs for any military operator. If any body want info on the British Standard Instute Close Protection Pas let me know


----------



## KevinB (4 Feb 2009)

:


----------



## 2 Cdo (4 Feb 2009)

Owner said:
			
		

> Hi Guys,
> 
> I hope you don’t mind me butting in, I have been involve in Close Protection training at both a civilian and government level for a number of year and have seen drastic changes in the civilian market mainly a lowering of standards or not knowing what should be taught. This was mainly due to Iraq when a few years ago; due to certain misunderstandings the corporate sector hired a lot of ex military as protection operators. They did this without requiring an accepted syllabus or creating the proper structures to ensure accountability. We are now flooded with no knowledge experts teaching out anything they like. At the same time at the top level the unique nature of the modern threat has transformed the close protection operation into an intelligence-based multitasking process. Within top level protection the catch phase is Security Hazard Effects Management Process (SHEMP). This is a method of decision-making in which individual risks are analyzed to determine the optimal course of action for each phase of the operation. When combined with the procedures of planning and intelligence SHEMP produces the safest method of operating in any hazardous situation. If the same amount of planning was applied to military operations it would save lives. With SHEMP the Close Protection Officer applies this information to the tactical environment. This allows him to see what is invisible to most. They see patterns that others do not and can spot anomalies, things that should happen but didn't or vis-à-vis. It also recognizes when expected elements are missing from the picture. This is describes as "negative cues" and again are invisible to novices. Close Protection doesn’t stop there after SHEMP, comes probability theory. Analytic studies show that criminal or terrorist attacks are influenced by different situational factors. These will depend upon a different constellation of opportunities that are tailored to the crimes in question. What it means is that you can predict the place where an attack is most likely to happen. This list is endless surveillance counter and anti, threat and risk assessment, survey and audits.* I don’t know about the Canadian training but I would say its one of the best courses available and one of the most interesting jobs for any military operator. If any body want info on the British Standard Instute Close Protection Pas let me know*



The bold is mine.  Sounds like someone trying to drum up a little business for his "company".


----------



## Harris (4 Feb 2009)

Owner, perhaps filling in your profile, proper grammar and punctuation, and some relevant point to your rambling paragraph might help.


----------



## 1feral1 (4 Feb 2009)

Owner said:
			
		

> ....have seen drastic changes in the civilian market mainly a lowering of standards or not knowing what should be taught. This was mainly due to Iraq when a few years ago....



Were you there?

Quite frankly, I would rather have mature seasoned former-mil veteran pers, with time in country, now as PSD's than some 'SHEMPie' certified classroom/trg area trained wannabee, who has no military experience, and never experienced an operational environment, especially when Murphy's law takes over.

EDIT to clarify the fol:

I had limited esposure with PSD contractors during my tour in Iraq. The ones I met from Triple Canopy, and Blackwater, and others were mainly US former SF soldiers who, IMHO acted professionally, and from my own personal observation one day, acted with such bravery to save another from a shot down LOCH near Hiafa Street while under constant SAF from insurgents. On another occasion while under overwhelming SAF, they saved members from a RPG'd uparmoured SUV in their convoy, not too far from the 14th July Bridge. I did not see this but heard it all. You don't learn that type of stuff ina classroom. One thing I did learn is on a two way rifle range, all that theory/classroom stuff goes right out the window. Just because a few tainted the overall reputation of the Civvy PSD's, then having this over a biased one sided media system, does not make all of them bad. 

I do hope that makes sense.

My two bob,

OWDU


----------



## Owner (4 Feb 2009)

Harris said:
			
		

> Owner, perhaps filling in your profile, proper grammar and punctuation, and some relevant point to your rambling paragraph might help.



CDO 2 That's very interesting comment; it’s for a PAS that’s what’s known as a public available standard so there is not much chance to sell it. However it’s a British Standard, so I thought you would not have it. Why did I bother posting?  I served twenty-five in the Military most in sort of a JTF2 equivalent In fact I remember when JTF2 started up so I do know this PAS will save lives; close protection is a highly multidimensional assignment, it’s like Afghanistan an adversary needs to find and exploit only one option to succeed whereas the Closed Protection Officers must identify, understand, and manage all possible vulnerabilities. This involves risk based security using a modular system that lets you identify the options open to an attacker; this you know what his options are, you know his intelligence requirements. Spot his intelligence activities and it gives you an idea of the type of attack site he will use. Get the idea, what it means is you can run round the block twenty times a day and do as many practical pistol shoots as you like, but if you can’t plan on where how and when, you will loose. And thats not a sales pitch.
Please excuse any spelling etc.


----------



## Owner (4 Feb 2009)

Overwatch Downunder said:
			
		

> Were you there?
> 
> Quite frankly, I would rather have mature seasoned former-mil veteran pers with time in country, now as PSD's than some 'SHEMPie' certified classroom/trg area trained wannabee.
> 
> ...



Classroom trained wannabee, interesting comment. Might not be able to spell that good but I bet you a thousand bucks I have more operational experience than you have. 

Ok let’s retract the PAS offer you guys know it all.


----------



## 1feral1 (4 Feb 2009)

Wow, between SHEMP, PAS, negative cues, optimal courses of action, analitic studies, tactical environments, probability theories, and different situational factors, I need a rest reading anymore of this stuff.  :boring:

OWDU


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## 1feral1 (4 Feb 2009)

Owner said:
			
		

> but I bet you a thousand bucks I have more operational experience than you have.



Whatever floats your boat pal. I know where I've been, thanks. I need to prove nothing to no one. Usually those who mention any SF TI publically, or say 'I've got more TI on Ops than you' have been no where.

Owner, its your credibility, not mine.  I am bowing out, you'll cut your own throat without the aid of me.

Enjoy.

OWDU


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## Fishbone Jones (4 Feb 2009)

Everyone can stop this pissing contest right now.

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## KevinB (4 Feb 2009)

Owner said:
			
		

> Classroom trained wannabee, interesting comment. Might not be able to spell that good but I bet you a thousand bucks I have more operational experience than you have.
> 
> Ok let’s retract the PAS offer you guys know it all.



Just an observation but...

 Given your initially bad mouthing military trained PSD, then your going back to the fact that the military did in fact write the book on this, I am at a loss.

If your point was that due to the demand in Iraq, that missions previous undertaken by both SOF elements, and trained Military Police (which I like to consider an oxymoron   ;D) where farmed out to pretty much any swinging dick that could hold a gun, then yes you do have a point.
  However I dont care if your a former SSM of a Sabre Sqn, you can only teach so far from the outside, the rest of the learning is done on the ground, hopefully under the guidance of trained leadership.  Something your not able to do once your out.

Dropping in here to tell us your the wise one from the mountain is not the best way to communicate, at least in my humble opinion.


----------



## Owner (4 Feb 2009)

Sorry I miss-posted the last

Yes I see your point . But most people seem to be missing my point; I offered the new public standard to this forum. I did this because it was labelled Close Protection. I didn’t mention training. As for the military writing the book, I know I was there at the time doing a tour from a Sabre Squadron to CRW, the department that handled this sort of thing. Times have changed new drills and procedures have been incorporated. It was in the late sixties early seventies that the book was written and the ideas have evolved. With Iraq and Afghanistan operational priorities changed and a lot of stuff was passed to contractors. I know as the last non European operational job I was doing was for the UN with an ambassador in Kabul when the Canadians were by up by the old palace, and I was gone sixty then; before that Bosnia (UN) Mogadishu, lot of time in West Africa running the operation, lots of short term moves etc. Because of this I was part of the team instrumental in writing the PAS for the British Standard Institute. There was no monetary gain for me, been around long enough to know the military don’t pay for this. I didn’t expect the response, not the name calling just the attitude to new developments. Sad to see Canada.


----------



## Michael OLeary (4 Feb 2009)

Owner said:
			
		

> I didn’t expect the response, not the name calling just the attitude to new developments. Sad to see Canada.



Owner, 

Perhaps you need to review the posts you have made.  You jumped into a thread on a fairly sensitive topic (one in which most experienced professionals do not freely engage in random discussions about their business) with a blunt and frankly, poorly presented, opening statement.  You made no real attempt to establish bona fides and you have started with an empty profile and a nickname which could be perceived as pompous.

This forum can be very welcoming to professionals who take the time to introduce themselves and establish credibility through their contributions.  We've also had our experiences with walts and imposters and many of the members are guarded when anyone leaps into a thread claiming to be an expert with no substantiation.

It's easy to claim to be a professional, but we have seen that many also have difficulty presenting themselves as one in a text-only environment, where personality, appearance and all of those other clues we normally use in interpersonal interaction aren't there to help the worlds make the points.

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## the 48th regulator (4 Feb 2009)

My only questions is the following,

What Colour is the BoatHouse at Hereford.  No one has been able to get that for me, and it is drivingme nuts.

dileas

tess


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## 1feral1 (4 Feb 2009)

Owner said:
			
		

> Sad to see Canada.



Sad to see Canada what?

Kindly enlighten us please.

OWDU


----------



## Owner (4 Feb 2009)

Michael O`Leary said:
			
		

> Owner,
> 
> Perhaps you need to review the posts you have made.  You jumped into a thread on a fairly sensitive topic (one in which most experienced professionals do not freely engage in random discussions about their business) with a blunt and frankly, poorly presented, opening statement.  You made no real attempt to establish bona fides and you have started with an empty profile and a nickname which could be perceived as pompous.
> 
> ...



Fist point - on credentials I won’t bother looking it up as you wrote it.  It mentions impersonation of a member of  former of serving Canadian or other nations armed forces etc. the tick in the box was acknowledgment of prior military service. My email address was open to anyone; there was no commercial site or advertisement.  I had no initial interest in this forum as I was doing a search for a similar site. I read a couple or posts on a subject I am considered a proficient in. So I wrote:-

*I hope you don’t mind me butting in, I have been involve in Close Protection training at both a civilian and government level for a number of year and have seen drastic changes in the civilian market mainly a lowering of standards or not knowing what should be taught.*

*Note the term civilian market*

In the UK to protect business from bogus operators the UK government formed a body corporate known as the Security Industry Authority. Its role is to manage the licensing of the private security industry as set out in the Private Security Act 200 . 

A PAS is a professional security code of practice. In the UK Close Protection is a civilian qualification. Even a trained military close protection officer leaving the military has to do a fast track SIA course in order to work in the UK. As for it being a sensitive topic. I explained in the first a brief post what I had to offer, a Pas

The PAS is over a hundred pages long it covers briefly the skills that incorporate the latest close protection skills, mainly operational planning. I would have been more then happy to have mailed it to someone who was in the CP role. 

I was under the impression that I was on a professional forum that would have appreciated an exchange of information. This is from some of the post I received in return? 

business for his "company".
proper grammar and punctuation
certified classroom/trg area trained wannabee.
I need a rest reading anymore of this stuff.   
more TI on Ops than you' have been no where.
easy to claim to be a professional

The reason I made the offer is I always believed that any exchange of information will save lives, it seemed nobody replied in any civil form nobody evaluated the PAS or even read it. 

I think we all now agree its time to call it a day.

 Please except any apologies for the provocation I might have caused.


----------



## Owner (4 Feb 2009)

the 48th regulator said:
			
		

> My only questions is the following,
> 
> What Colour is the BoatHouse at Hereford.  No one has been able to get that for me, and it is drivingme nuts.
> 
> ...



There isn't one.


----------



## the 48th regulator (4 Feb 2009)

Owner said:
			
		

> There isn't one.



Dang,

You saw me placing the coffee cup....

dileas

tess


----------



## Poppa (5 Feb 2009)

Infidel-6 said:
			
		

> trained Military Police (which I like to consider an oxymoron   ;D)



Ah man...I'm sitting right here...c'mon!


----------



## 1feral1 (5 Feb 2009)

Owner, 

Mick was absolutly right in everything he said. I thought you might learn from his post, and instead we get a blast of shyte.

Presentation, presentation, presentation. You only get one chance at a first impression.

We are not AHs here, in fact we can be a lot of fun. You come into our house rather abruptly, without an introduction, and immediatly begin to spout off a bunch of 'techo' knowledge, which almost apprears to be several cut and paste jobs form who knows what/where. Terms I have never heard of have been used, and your overall approach sucked.

Then you have this reaction of your response to Mick (whose reply to you was open, honest and fair), which as far as I am concerned was a rather predictable response unbecoming of who you say you are.

I don't think you'll be back. Sad, but the outcome could have been 360 degrees different, and your ideas/input welcomed if put forward with a different manner.

Don't blame us for your own shortcomings on how you conducted yourself in our house.

Cheers and g'day from the tropics, 

OWDU


----------



## KevinB (5 Feb 2009)

I'm SIA certified, however I tend to feel that certification only does justice to those working in Europe, on EP details.  The thread is about Mil CP teams which is more HR PSD than EP.  Granted there is some cross over the majority of the grunt work does not.


Poppa - brother I'm just checking to see if you still read what I post


----------



## Nauticus (8 Feb 2009)

Overwatch Downunder said:
			
		

> Were you there?
> 
> Quite frankly, I would rather have mature seasoned former-mil veteran pers, with time in country, now as PSD's than some 'SHEMPie' certified classroom/trg area trained wannabee, who has no military experience, and never experienced an operational environment, especially when Murphy's law takes over.
> 
> ...


I completely agree with your point, but I think some of us missed Owner's point.

He didn't say that ex-military CPP "aren't good", nor is he blaming them for anything. He's suggesting that companies like Blackwater and Triple Canopy hired them based on their military experiences, not their protective experience, and in that, I agree with Owner.

Military experience is a HUGE advantage to doing close protection, but I think standardized knowledge in close protection is more important. Knowing combat, and knowing how effectively protect somebody and assess risk are two different things. I think Owner was just suggesting that all close protection agents should have a basic knowledge of protection, PLUS their military histories. I've been in the industry for a while, and if you don't have first-hand, direct CP training, you won't be an effective CPP, regardless what your background is - military, law enforcement, or just plain security.


----------



## 1feral1 (9 Feb 2009)

Naut, 

I failed to mention in that post that 4/5 pers in that LOCH which was shot down had survived, and were executed by insurgents in an alley-way between two buildings. The bravery that day was like something out of a movie.

Secondly, the BW blokes used to practise daily their trade, many rehersals even just for a vehicle convoy. Drills included action on breakdown, action on ambush etc, and from the air, drills included extraction of pers from rooftops, and similar actions when they needed to be required. 

I would recon that most former SF pers had PSD experience in the first place, and those that did not were trained by those who had been there. Aside from all of this which I watched at numerous occasions at the Crossed Swords and other areas in the IZ, saying anything more in reality would be out of my lane. I still view Owner's comments out of character for who/what he represented.

Cheers,

Wes


----------



## Nauticus (12 Feb 2009)

Overwatch Downunder said:
			
		

> Naut,
> 
> I failed to mention in that post that 4/5 pers in that LOCH which was shot down had survived, and were executed by insurgents in an alley-way between two buildings. The bravery that day was like something out of a movie.
> 
> ...


I understand your point, and you may be right, but in my experiences, a former member of the military or law enforcement do not have a comparable skillset in relation to close protection, as an actual trained CPP does in close protection.

There's obviously a huge difference between close protection and the military. I'm certain we'll agree that the average CPP does not learn how to become a soldier by just doing his close protection. Likewise, we should also agree that a soldier will not learn close protection to the extent of a specifically trained close protection professional would. Although some _may_ learn _some_ CPP in the military, I would argue that they would learn it much better if they had taken a course specifically teaching close protection.

From my experience, military people have GREAT potential in CPP (and I argue the best criteria for a CPP is a military background, and a working, thorough knowledge of close protection). But without both sides of the bill, I feel some of them are lacking.

Just to give a brief background on myself, I've done lots of training at Executive Security International (which is the Harvard of protective schools), and I have completed the advanced executive protection course, protective intelligence, and special operations courses. Over 1.5 years of intense training covering just close protection (including threat assessment, psychological analysis, investigation, and special responses) is what I feel can "make or break" anybody trying to get into the field.

*That said*, my comments do not refer to the military close protection team. As I would imagine, these guys undergo unreal amounts of training as well.


----------



## 1feral1 (12 Feb 2009)

Nauticus said:
			
		

> I understand your point, and you may be right, but in my experiences, a former member of the military or law enforcement do not have a comparable skillset in relation to close protection, as an actual trained CPP does in close protection.
> 
> There's obviously a huge difference between close protection and the military.



The Combat Team I was a member of had a PSD cell, an all Australian Military Police 'detachment', some on their 3rd tour as PSD in Iraq (also teaching PSD at the School of RACMP between tours). ADF RACMP members are trained to an extreme high standard beyond any civilian accreditiation. They were mature seasoned profesional soldiers/MPs. Ranks were WO2's and SGTs mainly, and with these ranks alone, comes a wealth of experience in itself.

Our Lads had numerous taskings including Australian high ranking politicians and many dignitaries. They were often out several times a day in the most wicked neighbourhoods in the Badlands. I did not spend a just a 'weekend' with these guys, but my entire 207 day tour. Due to the ongoing mission in Iraq, it is not in anyone's best interest for me to comment more on this mission. 

Mate, you can have all the graphs, books, videos, DVDs, and certificates of accreditiation you want, but unless thats backed up with real world experience you know, the 'boots on the ground in an hostile and unpredictable environment' stuff, it really does not mean much. Consider it like having sex before your first time, with all the accouterments mentioned above with graphs, books, videos etc, unless you experience it, you don't know what it feels like, so your 'make and break' quote does not go far, nor does your 'experience' as a recently graduated student in this field. I am not flinging shyte at you, just giving you some constrctive criticism which I do honestly hope you can benifit from.

On that note, I do wish you all the best in your future endeavours in this trade, and should you get a chance to be hired to do the CPP/PSD thing 'over there' do stay safe.

Regards,

Wes


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## KevinB (12 Feb 2009)

Nauticus said:
			
		

> I understand your point, and you may be right, but in my experiences, a former member of the military or law enforcement do not have a comparable skillset in relation to close protection, as an actual trained CPP does in close protection.
> 
> There's obviously a huge difference between close protection and the military. I'm certain we'll agree that the average CPP does not learn how to become a soldier by just doing his close protection. Likewise, we should also agree that a soldier will not learn close protection to the extent of a specifically trained close protection professional would. Although some _may_ learn _some_ CPP in the military, I would argue that they would learn it much better if they had taken a course specifically teaching close protection.
> 
> ...



Hey rockstar,

 MIL does teach CP/PSD.

 How long was your course if your such the expert?  You spent a year and a half on a course, did you fail it repeatedly?

WPPS contracts (which you refereing to with TC, Dyn, and BW) have a selection and training course.
  Secondly there are many segments of operating in a NON Permissive environment that members of a PSD team are not doing PSD, but they are support for the actual operatives doing PSD.

 Your signal to noise ration is way to high, and you have nothing credible to add.

ESI is fine for CONUS CP duties.  It does jack and shit for teaching you how to do HR PSD.


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## Greymatters (4 Mar 2009)

Nauticus said:
			
		

> I understand your point, and you may be right, but in my experience, a former member of the military or law enforcement do not have a comparable skillset in relation to close protection, as an actual trained CPP does in close protection.



Can you expand on this certification?  Are you refering to the ASIS program or some other private org process?


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## medaid (4 Mar 2009)

Greymatters said:
			
		

> Can you expand on this certification?  Are you refering to the ASIS program or some other private org process?



GM he's talking about ESI http://www.esi-lifeforce.com/


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## Greymatters (4 Mar 2009)

MedTech said:
			
		

> GM he's talking about ESI http://www.esi-lifeforce.com/



Ah.

There are several companies out there with international reputations that offer similiar certifications - claiming to be the 'Harvard' of protection schools seems a bit much...


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## medaid (4 Mar 2009)

Greymatters said:
			
		

> Ah.
> 
> There are several companies out there with international reputations that offer similiar certifications - claiming to be the 'Harvard' of protection schools seems a bit much...



GM I agree with you. I think it's the OP tooting a little bit.


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## Greymatters (4 Mar 2009)

I will add to the comments by saying our company has CP experts, some with CPP-type quals and some without, and come from a variety of military, law enforcement and private sector backgrounds.  From what Ive seen of their work, there is no 'right formula' for who and what a CP expert is or should be, although a military background is definately an asset...


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## Nauticus (6 Mar 2009)

Sorry for the delayed reply guys. Thanks for those of you who decided not to be rude.

Yes, I've completed the EP and SpecOps certification programs at ESI. And yes, in the private EP industry, ESI is considered the Harvard of EP schools. The reason for this is that ESI is the only EP school that teaches hundreds and hundreds of hours of EP theory, while most others teach reactive techniques related to the field of EP. To better paint this picture, most EP schools teach you what to do if your convoy became ambushed. ESI teaches that, but also advanced ways of not being ambushed in the first place.

Second, it appears most of you missed the point that I was making. *I said that a regular member of the military makes the best protection agent if they are specifically trained in EP.* Additionally, I also said that a member of the military who isn't trained in EP, wouldn't make as good an EP agent as somebody who is trained in it. The reasoning for this is, if you aren't trained to do a job, somebody who is will always do it better. The military offers great training, but unless you are part of Canada's Close Protection Team, or you've taken the course, you haven't been trained in EP.

I'm not really trying to be controversial or anything silly like that. While I don't think the people here have been giving private sector EP training the credit it deserves, you can obviously express your own opinion. I, however, would respectfully disagree with your opinion, and the experiences that I've obtained support my perspective. If yours differ, that's fine as well.


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## Greymatters (6 Mar 2009)

Nauticus said:
			
		

> The military offers great training, but unless you are part of Canada's Close Protection Team, or you've taken the course, you haven't been trained in EP.



I would disagree with you there - there are many routes to EP/CP, and not all of them involve courses.  You fail to account for most persons working in EP gaining their skills through direct experience and mentoring under others.


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## CountDC (6 Mar 2009)

one point Nauticus so that everyone has a better picture of what experience you are basing all your comments on - what is your military experience?  You have nothing showing in your profile other than that you are in BC, have indicated in Oct you were enrolling in armoured and then in Dec indicated you were going infantry while your avatar indicates you are a trained private. Perhaps it is time for you to update your profile and put your correct information out here.


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## westie47 (8 Mar 2009)

The 'Harvard' of EP schools??? Some think Pheonix is the Harvard, others think Ronin is the standard, still others believe Trojan is. I'm not even going to mention the US WPPS schools...BW, Dyncorp Crucible. The video on the ESI site looks like a Tactical Response HRCC course video.

I'm sure it's a good school/course, but not the be all/end all.


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## lunn200 (3 Apr 2009)

Hello all,

I have heard about a close protection course offered to any trade of the military. Like most things on training bases I have heard it second hand. Can anyone point me in the right direction or if anyone has taken this course I would like some info. 

Thanks for your time and your responses
chimo


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## dangerboy (3 Apr 2009)

lunn200 said:
			
		

> Hello all,
> 
> I have heard about a close protection course offered to any trade of the military. Like most things on training bases I have heard it second hand. Can anyone point me in the right direction or if anyone has taken this course I would like some info.
> 
> ...



I do not know if you have read this entire thread or not but there is some good info in it about the course (plus some junk). The place to find info about course dates is in CANFORGENS, just look them up they tell you the course dates , prerequisites and submission deadlines.  My advice read old CANFORGENS if you don't have access to them or don't know how to get them ask you supervisor.


----------



## garb811 (3 Apr 2009)

There is an updated CANFORGEN out, but until you get a chance to find it, this should cover most of what you are looking for:  Close Protection (CP) Opportunities


----------



## lunn200 (4 Apr 2009)

OK, thanks for reading. This is for info on the colse protection course only. Im not interested in military police. From info that I have heard from other guys i work with, there is a close protection course avail to all trades  of the military. It includes, emergency driving etc. It is meant for members of other trades to be able to take taskings specific to close protection. 

Please PM me if you have specific info pretaining to this course or if you have taken the course. I only want to know about the course offered in the military not the EST program outside of the forces. 


Thanks again
Chimo


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## garb811 (4 Apr 2009)

Rather than contribute to one of your other threads, which you posted after you replied here and which show you a) are confused or b) never bothered to actually read the info I directed you to, here is a quote from one of those items, CANFORGEN 099/08 VCDS 012/08 211727Z MAY 08:



> 3.  THE CP QUALIFICATION IS OPEN TO ALL CF MEMBERS WHO MEET THE FOLLOWING PRE-REQUISITES FOR CP TRG AND EMPLOYMENT:



The MP Branch runs the program but it is open to all CF members who meet the requirements.


----------



## hammond (4 Dec 2009)

Sorry for Reviving this thread, I have read the CP recruiting campaign web page and see that it states applications must be submitted NLT Sept 2008. I was wondering if there is a new campaign for this year or next, if anyone has some insight it'd be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


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## dapaterson (4 Dec 2009)

If they are looking to recruit more, the message will be passed through appropriate channels.


----------



## cpinfo (4 Dec 2009)

A CANFORGEN should be generated for the New Year.


----------



## hammond (6 Dec 2009)

Thanks for the heads up that's good news. Will the CANFORGEN also be put up on the CFPM website? And have the  requirements for application been changed much if you have any info.


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## hammond (14 Jan 2010)

I have seen the New CANFORGEN for this Years CPP Recruiting Campaign, I just have a couple questions hopefully someone can help out with. One of the requirements to apply is to complete the CF Express Test and meet the min standards for CPP, just wondering as a reservist, how can I schedule a test from PSP?


----------



## Nfld Sapper (14 Jan 2010)

Try coordinating it through your Trg WO/MWO


----------



## hammond (30 Mar 2010)

Good Day all,

I know that the application deadline has only just past and understand the CPAC is sometime in Apr, but I was wondering from previous years, roughly when invitations to attend selection were sent out. Just trying to do some contingency planning for summer taskings/courses if it turns out I am not competitive enough.

Cheers


----------



## TrooperHibbs (7 May 2010)

anyone know the odds of CP selection come september 2010, or early 2011?


----------



## ortona19 (7 Nov 2010)

I am just wondering if anyone has been on the CP course lately. Just looking to hear the physical demands of the course. I work civi side as a firefighter and I a plan applying in the first hirer in the new year when I can get time off. Any pointers or insight would be greatly appreciated. And yes I know I need to pass selection first.


----------



## HItorMiss (9 Nov 2010)

You need to be a memebr of the CF first...

The list of requirements are stated somewhere in the beging of the thread make sure you meet all of them.


----------



## ortona19 (10 Nov 2010)

Alright I guess I wasn't clear enough on what I was asking. First off this training is open to all trades I know that for a fact.  I know you go through a selections process in Esquimalt BC. After you pass the selection you go down to the US  for CP training. Canadian ran course just US facilities. My question is has anyone completed both the selection and the CP course recently? Also what insight can you give me in regards to physical and mental training to prepare. I know weapon skills and confidence is very important.  I know things are pretty hush hush so I am not asking anyone to spill the beans just your insight on physical fitness or some studying I can do in advance.


----------



## AmmoTech90 (10 Nov 2010)

Just hit the gym.

You've got four years once you join the CF before you can apply for the close protection programme (min rank Cpl), use that time to try to find out more details.


----------



## ortona19 (10 Nov 2010)

I have been in the army for 6 years. I am a corporal that's why I am interested in this course.


----------



## ortona19 (10 Nov 2010)

The task was given to MP's but is now open to all trades. There is a selection process in Esquimalt BC. Then I believe it's two months of training in the US. Canadian instructed course just using US facilities. I have heard that is it pretty intense.


----------



## George Wallace (10 Nov 2010)

I have two Cpls working for me, who have gone CP.  The selection is very physically and mentally challenging.  You have to be in excellent shape both physically and mentally to even be selected.  It is not an option to get into shape while on selection.  This still does not guarantee success in passing the training phase.


----------



## Haggis (10 Nov 2010)

One of my NCOs is a PTI for the CP training programme.  He's one of the fittest men I have ever met.  Take that as a hint:  he does not come in second to any students.


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## onlytruth (12 Nov 2010)

Yes the military police do undertake a 5 week CP course. However, there is a try out, psyc exam, and interview which you must pass prior to enrollment. You must also be a trades qualified MP. There was an exception for CP drivers to undertake a special driving course in 2008...they were not required to be MP. JTF does not currently undertake any non VIP CP taskings. They are all MP tasks. Typically, unit CO's...embassy pers etc....


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## HItorMiss (12 Nov 2010)

OT

Your info is out dated currently any CF member may do the CP course after passing selection and the course and then be so employed on CP task. The CP tasking is still however under the governance of the MP branch. As for who and what persons are protected by CANSOF assets let us not speculate shall we.


----------



## PMedMoe (16 Nov 2010)

Sideshow Bob said:
			
		

> Keep watch for the CANFORGENs...they will announce when application are being accepted.



It's already out:

CANFORGEN 215/10 VCDS 028/10 211449Z OCT 10
CLOSE PROTECTION (CP) RECRUITING CAMPAIGN
UNCLASSIFIED

PLEASE NOTE THAT ALL PREVIOUS CPAC CANFORGENS ARE TO BE CANCELLED UPON RECEIPT OF THIS MSG 

THE CANADIAN FORCES PROVOST MARSHAL IS SOLICITING HIGHLY MOTIVATED, PHYSICALLY FIT VOLUNTEERS FOR EMPLOYMENT WITHIN A SMALL TEAM ENVIRONMENT CONDUCTING CP. THE CP MANDATE CALLS FOR PERS WHO POSSESS VERY UNIQUE PERSONAL ATTRIBUTES AND ABILITIES, ENABLING THEM TO BE TRAINED TO PERFORM A VERY SPECIFIC, HIGH PRIORITY TASK. AS SUCH, A CP ASSESSMENT CENTRE (CPAC) WILL BE HELD IN JAN 11 TO SCREEN PERSONNEL INTERESTED IN APPLYING FOR THE CP ROLE. APPLICATION DEADLINE IS 1 DEC 10 

IT IS ESSENTIAL FOR VOLUNTEERS AND THEIR CHAIN OF COMMAND TO UNDERSTAND THAT THOSE FOUND SUITABLE FOLLOWING CPAC WILL BE LOADED ON ONE OF THE UPCOMING SERIALS OF THE CP COURSE, THE FIRST OF WHICH IS SCHEDULED TO RUN EARLY 2011. SUCCESSFUL GRADUATES OF THE CP COURSE WILL LIKELY BE TASKED AS A CP OPERATIVE AS EARLY AS MAR 11 TO BE DEPLOYED IN 2011 

THE CP QUALIFICATION IS OPEN TO ALL CF MEMBERS WHO MEET THE FOLLOWING PRE-REQUISITES FOR CP TRG AND EMPLOYMENT: 

REG OR RES F MBR OF THE RANK OF CPL TO SGT 

REG FORCE MP OF THE RANK OF CAPT AND BELOW 

MOS ID QUALIFIED 

MIN SECURITY CLEARANCE LVL II (SECRET). APPLICANTS NOT IN POSSESSION OF LVL II  MUST COMMENCE UPGRADE PROCESS WHEN APPLYING 

MUST NOT HAVE A CRIMINAL RECORD AND COMPLETE A MILITARY POLICE QUOTE CONSENT TO DISCLOSURE OF CRIMINAL INFORMATION UNQUOTE APPLICATION A-SJ-100-004/AG-000 7H4-1/4 HTTP://VCDS.MIL.CA/CFPM/PUBS/POL-PUBS/MPPTP/CH7H4 UNDERSCORE B.DOC 

DRIVER S LICENCE: A VALID PROVINCIAL DRIVER S LICENCE, DND 404 AND UP TO DATE 416 WILL BE REQR FOR TRG AND DEPLOYMENT 

PERSONNAL READINESS VERIFICATION GREEN 

MUST BE PROFICIENT IN FIREARMS AND WILL BE REQUIRED TO PASS THE MP SIG SAUER P225 AND THE C8 CARBINE WPN QUALIFICATION STANDARDS 

POSSESS AND/OR BE ELIGIBLE FOR A CANADIAN PASSPORT AND 

BE AVAILABLE FOR UP TO SIX-MONTH DEPLOYMENT DURING A THREE-YEAR LIABILITY PERIOD FOLLOWING SUCCESSFUL COMPLETION OF CP TRG. FOR RESERVE FORCE PERSONNEL, THIS DOES NOT GUARANTEE A RESERVE FORCE EMPLOYMENT CONTRACT 

THE APPLICATION FORM REQUIRED FOR CP DUTIES AND OTHER INFORMATION MAY BE FOUND ON THE CFPM WEBSITE, OR BY CONTACTING THE CFPM CCLK, WO T. LETAIN, AT 613-949-1261, TWILA DOT LETAIN AT FORCES DOT GC DOT CA 

PHYSICAL SCREENING. ALL INTERESTED MBRS MUST UNDERGO THE FITNESS TESTING AND REACH A MINIMUM OF LEVEL 8.5 ON THE 20MSR, 31 CONTINUOUS PUSH-UPS, 35 SIT-UPS IN ONE MINUTE, AND A 100-METRE CASUALTY EVACUATION IN 60 SECS OR LESS IN PT GEAR IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING THE EXPRES TESTING. TEST TO BE ADMINISTERED BY PSP STAFF AT RESPECTIVE CF BASES. EVEN IF MBRS HAVE RECENTLY COMPLETED THEIR EXPRES TEST, THEY SHOULD BE TESTED AGAIN, AS MAXIMAL PERFORMANCE IS REQUIRED ON ALL COMPONENTS. APPLICATIONS THAT INCLUDE A FITNESS TEST BELOW THE AFORMENTIONED MINIMUM LEVELS WILL NOT BE ENTERTAINED AND WILL BE RETURNED UNPROCESSED 

ASSESSMENT CENTRE SELECTION. APPLICANTS WILL BE SELECTED TO ATTEND THE CLOSE PROTECTION ASSESSMENT CENTRE (CPAC) BASED ON A REVIEW OF THE MBR S CP APPLICATION, AND ASSESSED LEVEL OF PHYSICAL FITNESS. AS THIS PROCESS WILL RESULT IN A MERIT LISTING OF ALL APPLICANTS, IT SHOULD BE NOTED THAT THE STRONGER THE PERFORMANCE DURING FITNESS TESTING, THE BETTER THE CHANCE OF BEING SELECTED TO ATTEND THE CPAC 

LANGUAGE : ALTHOUGH THE CANADIAN FORCES PROTECTIVE SERVICES UNIT IS DESIGNATED AS BILINGUAL THE TRAINING IS CURRENTLY ONLY AVAILABLE OUT OF COUNTRY AND ONLY IN ENGLISH. DAOD 5039-6 STIPULATES THE INTERNATIONAL REQUIREMENTS. THE LONG TERM PLAN IS FOR THE TRAINING TO BE CONDUCTED IN CANADA AT WHICH TIME IT WILL BE PROVIDED IN BOTH OFFICIAL LANGUAGES 

SUBMITTED FILES. APPLICANT FILES MUST CONTAIN THE FOLLOWING: 

COMPLETED APPLICATION FORM 

COMPLETED PERSONNEL READINESS VERIFICATION 

UPDATED MPRR 

EXPRES TEST RESULTS ON A COPY OF THE DND 279 FORM SIGNED BY PSP AUTHORITIES (MUST MEET MINIMUM REQUIREMENTS) 

CONDUCT SHEET (IF APPLICABLE) 

MILITARY POLICE CONSENT TO DISCLOSURE OF CRIMINAL INFORMATION A-SJ-100-004/AG-000 7H4-1/4 HTTP://VCDS.MIL.CA/CFPM/PUBS/POL-PUBS/MPPTP/CH7H4 UNDERSCORE B.DOC AND 

PHOTOCOPY OF VALID DRIVER S LICENSE AND DND 404/416 

ALL COMPLETED APPLICATIONS MUST REACH THE CFPM OR, ATTENTION: CCLK, WO LETAIN (TWILA DOT LETAIN AT FORCES DOT GC DOT CA) CANADIAN FORCES PROVOST MARSHAL DEPARTMENT OF NATIONAL DEFENCE 2200 WALKLEY ROAD OTTAWA ONTARIO K1A 0K2, NLT 1 DEC 10 

ANY FILES RECEIVED AT CFPM THAT ARE INCOMPLETE OR HAVE NOT MET THE MINIMUM FITNESS STANDARD, WILL NOT BE CONSIDERED FOR THE SELECTION CENTRE 

UNITS WILL BE INFORMED BY EMAIL/MSG WHICH APPLICANTS HAVE BEEN SELECTED TO PROCEED TO THE CPAC. SUITABLE APPLICANTS WILL BE INVITED TO ATTEND A FIVE-DAY SELECTION CENTRE IN JAN 11. APPLICANTS WHO ARRIVE AT CPAC AND DO NOT MEET THE PRE-REQUISITES FOR CP TRG AND EMPLOYMENT AS DETAILED IN PARA 3, WILL BE RETURNED TO THEIR HOME UNIT AND COST ASSOCIATED WITH THE APPLICANTS TRAVEL (BOTH WAYS) WILL BE RECOVERED FROM THE HOME UNIT 

PREPARATION TRAINING. THE CPAC IS DESIGNED TO ASSESS IF APPLICANTS ARE LIKELY TO SUCCEED DURING THE CP COURSE, AND WHETHER THEY DEMONSTRATE THE ATTRIBUTES AND BASIC SKILL SETS REQR FOR FUTURE EMPLOYMENT AS A CP OPERATIVE. CP OPERATORS ARE EXPECTED TO PERFORM THEIR DUTIES OVER EXTENDED PERIODS OF TIME AND IN DEMANDING CONDITIONS. AS SUCH, A HIGH LEVEL OF FITNESS IS REQUIRED OF ALL OPERATORS. THE CLOSE PROTECTION ASSESSMENT CENTRE WILL ASSESS CANDIDATES BASELINE OF FITNESS IN ORDER TO ENSURE SUCCESS DURING CP TRAINING. THE CP COURSE INCORPORATES A PHYSICAL TRAINING COMPONENT DESIGNED TO PROGRESSIVELY BRING CANDIDATES FROM THE MINIMUM ENTRY STANDARD TO A HIGHER LEVEL OF FITNESS IN ORDER TO MEET THE DEMANDS OF THE JOB 

IN ORDER TO PREPARE FOR CP TRAINING, IT IS STRONGLY RECOMMENDED THAT INTERESTED MBRS FOLLOW A COMPREHENSIVE PHYSICAL TRAINING PROGRAM, INCLUDING BOTH AEROBIC AND ANAEROBIC EXERCISE. TO THIS END, MBRS CAN FOLLOW A PHYSICAL TRAINING PROGRAM, OR THE ARMY FITNESS MANUAL, A LINK TO BOTH IS AVAILABLE ON THE CFPM WEBSITE. IN ADDITION, PROSPECTIVE CANDIDATES ARE ALSO ENCOURAGED TO SPEND AS MUCH TIME AS POSSIBLE ON THE RANGE PRIOR TO SELECTION, CONCENTRATING ON BOTH THEIR PERSONAL WEAPON (P225, PREFERRED, OR 9MM BROWNING), AND THE C8 

ASSESSMENT CENTRE. APPLICANTS WILL UNDERGO A FIVE-DAY SELECTION CENTRE. APPLICANTS WILL BE EXPECTED TO COMPLETE ENDURANCE RUNS OF UP TO 12 KM, AND ANY RUN MAY BE INTERSPERSED WITH CIRCUIT TRAINING (E.G., PUSH-UPS, SIT-UPS, SQUAT THRUSTS, TRICEP DIPS, CASUALTY EVACUATION, ETC.). MBRS WILL ALSO UNDERGO BOTH INDIVIDUAL AND GROUP TASKS DESIGNED TO ASSESS THE FOLLOWING COMPETENCIES: CONSCIENTIOUSNESS, SITUATIONAL AWARENESS, OPENNESS TO EXPERIENCE, SELF-CONFIDENCE, INTERPERSONAL SKILLS, TEAMWORK, PERSONAL EFFECTIVENESS, WRITTEN AND ORAL COMMUNICATION, PHYSICAL FITNESS, AND WEAPONS SAFETY/HANDLING 

THE OP EFFECTIVENESS OF THE CP OPERATIVE DIRECTLY CONTRIBUTES TO THE PROMOTION OF CANADIAN SECURITY INTERESTS ABROAD. THE NATURE OF THE CP ROLE DEMANDS THAT INTENSIVE TRG BE CONTINUALLY CONDUCTED TO ENSURE THAT SKILLS ARE MAINTAINED AT A VERY HIGH LEVEL OF PROFICIENCY AND THEREFORE, MBRS MUST BE OPERATIONALLY EFFECTIVE AND READY TO DEPLOY ON SHORT NOTICE. THIS ENVIRONMENT REPRESENTS A UNIQUE AND CHALLENGING EXPERIENCE IN TERMS OF LIFESTYLE, AND DEMANDS THAT THE RIGHT PEOPLE BE SELECTED FOR THE JOB. THE WEALTH OF SKILLS, KNOWLEDGE AND EXPERIENCE GAINED BY CP OPERATIVES SERVES TO BENEFIT THE MEMBER IN ALL FUTURE EMPLOYMENT AND THE CF AS A WHOLE 

QUESTIONS REGARDING THE SCREENING AND SELECTION PROCESS SHOULD BE DIRECTED TO THE COORD CELL, AT 613-949-1145, OR FAX (NON SECURE) 613-949-1117. INFO MAY ALSO BE FOUND ON THE CFPM WEBSITE 

Link here:  http://vcds.dwan.dnd.ca/vcds-exec/pubs/canforgen/2010/215-10_e.asp


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## C.F.L. (4 Jun 2012)

Hello, did a quick glance over the last couple of pages and didn't see anything related to Close Protection so I hope this isn't a repost. 

My question is, does anyone know when/where Close Protection courses are being run? That is if they are still being run. If anyone can help me out, I would greatly appreciate it. This is somewhere I would really like to take my army career.


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## PuckChaser (4 Jun 2012)

If they are looking for more operators, there is a CANFORGEN released every year detailing when the applications need to be submitted by. If you have DIN access, the Provost Marshal intranet site has all the info about applying to be CP.


----------



## The_Falcon (4 Jun 2012)

Currently CP is only open to MP's it could change back, it could stay this way for awhile.


----------



## brihard (4 Jun 2012)

Strange. I have two buddies both reserve infantry who I think are on course right now, or are loaded to Start it very shortly. I'm almost certain it's running currently. Do you have a source for 'MP only'?


----------



## PuckChaser (4 Jun 2012)

I'm interested as well, last CANFORGEN I saw had it open to any trade.


----------



## MP 811 (4 Jun 2012)

there's a big push to have CP MP only.....BUT it's still open for other trades at this moment.


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## The_Falcon (4 Jun 2012)

Brihard said:
			
		

> Strange. I have two buddies both reserve infantry who I think are on course right now, or are loaded to Start it very shortly. I'm almost certain it's running currently. Do you have a source for 'MP only'?



There is a Sgt from my unit on the course as well, however if you have DWAN you can go here http://vcds.mil.ca/sites/CFPM/Resources/docs/CP%20requirements%20March%202012.doc  and see for yourself, last 2 CPAC's were MP only who could apply.


----------



## C.F.L. (4 Jun 2012)

outstanding! thank you all, i have just quit smoking and i feel like i can take this course by the balls if i were to get loaded lol


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## The_Falcon (5 Jun 2012)

C.F.L. said:
			
		

> outstanding! thank you all, i have just quit smoking and i feel like i can take this course by the balls if i were to get loaded lol



You would still need to pass selection, and I don't just mean survive until the end.  As I found out the hard way (cause I am bloody stubborn and thickheaded), my own personality and what they expected/wanted didn't match too well.


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## brihard (5 Jun 2012)

I've got a bit more word on this.

There are indeed guys from many trades on CP course right now. It also looks like this is the last one open to non MPs.

There's another troop in my unit who was going for it. I just saw an email exchange betwen him and a CWO over at the CP side of things, who confirmed that as of May it's being restricted to MPs only, and that on those grounds he can't apply. I suspect a new CANFORGEN will probably be promulgated at some point on this.

I'm by no means an official source, but I have seen this second hand from someone who is. Take that for what it's worth.


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## garb811 (5 Jun 2012)

There's a huge push on to get MP onto this, and the next, CPAC but I haven't heard anything about it being restricted to MP only in the future.  

Even if it is, keep training, my guess is it won't be long before the doors are opened again to non-MP.  The Branch just isn't big enough to supply the numbers that are needed to attend CPAC to have the final numbers graduate the process IMHO and my belief is after this big push, there is going to be another huge dip in the number of candidates from the Branch.  It's all well and good for the Comd CF MP Gp to order,  "x number of MP WILL attend CPAC", but at the end of the day, CP is a very specialized interest that I've only seen a comparatively small number of MP expressing an interest in.


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## The_Falcon (5 Jun 2012)

garb811 said:
			
		

> There's a huge push on to get MP onto this, and the next, CPAC but I haven't heard anything about it being restricted to MP only in the future.
> 
> Even if it is, keep training, my guess is it won't be long before the doors are opened again to non-MP.  The Branch just isn't big enough to supply the numbers that are needed to attend CPAC to have the final numbers graduate the process IMHO and my belief is after this big push, there is going to be another huge dip in the number of candidates from the Branch.  It's all well and good for the Comd CF MP Gp to order,  "x number of MP WILL attend CPAC", but at the end of the day, CP is a very specialized interest that I've only seen a comparatively small number of MP expressing an interest in.



On my CPAC we had 2.  Neither made it.


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## Bomber for Life (27 Jun 2012)

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> Currently CP is only open to MP's it could change back, it could stay this way for awhile.



Thats not totaly true. You have to be an MP to be POSTED to the CP team, anyone can be selceted for the course. Then they call you up when they need you for a tour or tasking.


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## The_Falcon (27 Jun 2012)

Bomber for Life said:
			
		

> Thats not totaly true. You have to be an MP to be POSTED to the CP team, anyone can be selceted for the course. Then they call you up when they need you for a tour or tasking.



Since the last two selections were MP only.....now things may (probably will) change back.


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## MPwannabe (1 Jul 2012)

The next CPAC is in November, so apply now if you want a chance at it. I suggest at least Exempt on your express test, it's competitive.


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## Popurhedoff (1 Jul 2012)

I took my Close Protection course in the United States, I didn't want to wait so I paid for my own course, travel, and expenses. When I retired I went straight into Close Protection in Afghanistan and haven't looked back yet.  

Cheers
Pop


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## Maplehawk (6 Jul 2013)

Hello, I am new to army.ca. I came here because I can not get any real answers elsewhere. This year, they are not running a CP selection/course. I am wondering if this is temporary or have they shut it down? Any feedback would appreciated.


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## The_Falcon (6 Jul 2013)

If it's going to happen it will come out in a CANFORGEN, but given how many selections/courses that have run in the last several years, and the winding down of major ops next year, I suspect there are plenty of qualified personnel floating around in the CF, and they don't really need to run any selections.


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## Verge1993 (6 Jul 2013)

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> If it's going to happen it will come out in a CANFORGEN, but given how many selections/courses that have run in the last several years, and the winding down of major ops next year, I suspect there are plenty of qualified personnel floating around in the CF, and they don't really need to run any selections.




What is CP selection/course?


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## Shamrock (6 Jul 2013)

Maplehawk said:
			
		

> Hello, I am new to army.ca. I came here because I can not get any real answers elsewhere. This year, they are not running a CP selection/course. I am wondering if this is temporary or have they shut it down? Any feedback would appreciated.



Only MPs are selected for close protection training.  CP Operators who aren't MPs received previous training.


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## The_Falcon (6 Jul 2013)

Verge1993 said:
			
		

> What is CP selection/course?



Close Protection ie military bodyguard.


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## Delaney1986 (6 Jul 2013)

Shamrock said:
			
		

> Only MPs are selected for close protection training.  CP Operators who aren't MPs received previous training.



Do you know when that changed again? Just because I was reading this thread:

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/35757.125.html

and it stated that CP was open to all trades as recently as 2010 and then the thread goes dark. Just curiousity on my part.


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## Shamrock (6 Jul 2013)

Delaney1986 said:
			
		

> Do you know when that changed again? Just because I was reading this thread:
> 
> http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/35757.125.html
> 
> and it stated that CP was open to all trades as recently as 2010 and then the thread goes dark. Just curiousity on my part.



Keep reading that thread


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## Maplehawk (7 Jul 2013)

Shamrock said:
			
		

> Only MPs are selected for close protection training.  CP Operators who aren't MPs received previous training.



No, that is not the case anymore as two people from my reserve infantry unit got their qualification last year and a buddy of mine from QOR the previous year.


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## Delaney1986 (7 Jul 2013)

Shamrock said:
			
		

> Keep reading that thread



? The last post in that thread states:



> CANFORGEN 215/10 VCDS 028/10 211449Z OCT 10
> CLOSE PROTECTION (CP) RECRUITING CAMPAIGN
> UNCLASSIFIED
> 
> ...



Did I miss something?


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## The_Falcon (7 Jul 2013)

There were CANFORGENs that came out after that one.


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## mariomike (7 Jul 2013)

Delaney1986 said:
			
		

> Just because I was reading this thread:
> 
> http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/35757.125.html
> 
> and it stated that CP was open to all trades as recently as 2010 and then the thread goes dark.



A more recent discussion.

Close Protection Courses? Are they still being run?
http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/106223.0/nowap.html


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## Delaney1986 (7 Jul 2013)

mariomike said:
			
		

> A more recent discussion.
> 
> Close Protection Courses? Are they still being run?
> http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/106223.0/nowap.html



Thank you!!! That's what I was asking! I didn't get that thread when I searched.


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## mariomike (7 Jul 2013)

Delaney1986 said:
			
		

> Thank you!!! That's what I was asking! I didn't get that thread when I searched.



You are welcome.


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## Shamrock (8 Jul 2013)

Maplehawk said:
			
		

> No, that is not the case anymore as two people from my reserve infantry unit got their qualification last year and a buddy of mine from QOR the previous year.





> 3. CPAC IS OPEN TO MP 00161 AND MPO 00214 WHO MEET THE FOL PRE-REQS:
> A. REG F OR RES F MP OF THE RK OF CPL TO MWO
> B. REG F OR RES F MPO OF THE RK OF MAJ AND BELOW
> C. MOS ID QUAL
> ...



Two serials have already been run this year


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## Jarnhamar (8 Jul 2013)

Sorry I'm a little confused.

Is this saying that currently Close Protection selection is available for Military police trades only or is it open for all trades to apply?
I clicked on the link
http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/106223.0/nowap.html

but it's saying there is an error.


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## The Bread Guy (8 Jul 2013)

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> I clicked on the link
> http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/106223.0/nowap.html


That's because what used to be that thread has been merged with this one.  Shoulda mentioned the merge - my apologies.

*Milnet.ca Staff*


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## Jarnhamar (13 Jul 2013)

milnews.ca said:
			
		

> That's because what used to be that thread has been merged with this one.  Shoulda mentioned the merge - my apologies.
> 
> *Milnet.ca Staff*



Ah thanks. Editing confuses me  ;D

it's too bad Close Protection is closed to trades other than MP now, I wouldn't have minded taking a crack at the course. I've heard about some of the job opportunities guys have had after that course and it's pretty wild.  It would also be a good way to disseminate the training across the CF


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## Gmoney845 (23 Oct 2013)

I went through the CPAC in 2007 which I'm sure is different now......my advice, if you can only get the minimum physical standard mentioned in the CANFORGEN then you're in trouble. The only portion of the CPAC that you can influence is your physical fitness level.


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## x_para76 (23 Oct 2013)

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> Ah thanks. Editing confuses me  ;D
> 
> it's too bad Close Protection is closed to trades other than MP now, I wouldn't have minded taking a crack at the course. I've heard about some of the job opportunities guys have had after that course and it's pretty wild.  It would also be a good way to disseminate the training across the CF



A buddy of mine from the reserves ended up landing a gig doing CP for Eugene Melnyk's family. Sounded like a pretty good go and the money wasn't bad either.


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## christoph.b (3 Jan 2016)

I've heard through the grapevine that CP is going to open this year to NON-MP trades again. Can anybody confirm or deny this?


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## PuckChaser (3 Jan 2016)

christoph.b said:
			
		

> I've heard through the grapevine that CP is going to open this year to NON-MP trades again. Can anybody confirm or deny this?



You'll know as soon as there's a CANFORGEN about it, I haven't seen a CANFORGEN for MP-only in years, however.


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## garb811 (4 Jan 2016)

christoph.b said:
			
		

> I've heard through the grapevine that CP is going to open this year to NON-MP trades again. Can anybody confirm or deny this?


I doubt it.  With the slowdown in tempo due to the withdrawal from Afghanistan (although there is still a team at the Embassy), we have been able to fill the demand from within for the last several years.

Unless it does get opened to all again, you won't see a CANFORGEN looking for applicants as it is all done on the MP net right now.


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## ResMP (26 Jan 2016)

I second this - there is a huge flux of Military Police Reg and Reserve in the que who want to go on tour. Also, it is my understanding the vision of the CP Program is to sustain trained pers with a view to generate corporate knowledge so that the MP Branch can be relied upon to commit to CP related tasks that will likely present themselves in the future. CP capability is a strategic priority for the MP Branch and it fits very well with the Law Enforcement ethos.

Sooooooo ... If you wanna become CP qualified ... shoot me a PM and we can discuss if the Reserve Military Police is a good fit for you!  8)


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## garb811 (20 Jul 2017)

New CANFORGEN is out regarding the next few CPOACs.  Junior members of the combat arms are eligible to apply again.


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## RedcapCrusader (30 Jul 2017)

garb811 said:
			
		

> New CANFORGEN is out regarding the next few CPOACs.  Junior members of the combat arms are eligible to apply again.



CANFORGEN 120/17 CDS 032/17 181849Z JUL 17 - CP Recruiting

For those curious


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## BlueJays1985 (17 Dec 2018)

Good day all!
Does anyone know the meaning behind the CP Patch? The griffons holding the down facing sword?


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## dangerboy (17 Dec 2018)

A Lost Gunner said:
			
		

> Good day all!
> Does anyone know the meaning behind the CP Patch? The griffons holding the down facing sword?



The sword is taken from the Canadian Forces Protective Service Unit badge. The griffins, which have the body of a lion and the head and wings of an eagle, represent the power of the lion and the good eyesight of the eagle, two qualities personified by Protective Services specialists. They symbolize military courage, boldness, leadership, strength and intelligence. Griffins are also known to be good guardians and protectors, thus reflecting the “all around protection” of the generals, diplomats and government officials protected by the Protective Services specialists. Their number signifies teamwork. The Royal Crown symbolizes service to the Sovereign while white and red, the national colours of Canada, symbolize service to the country.

http://reg.gg.ca/heraldry/pub-reg/project.asp?lang=e&ProjectID=2217&ShowAll=1


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## BlueJays1985 (17 Dec 2018)

dangerboy said:
			
		

> The sword is taken from the Canadian Forces Protective Service Unit badge. The griffins, which have the body of a lion and the head and wings of an eagle, represent the power of the lion and the good eyesight of the eagle, two qualities personified by Protective Services specialists. They symbolize military courage, boldness, leadership, strength and intelligence. Griffins are also known to be good guardians and protectors, thus reflecting the “all around protection” of the generals, diplomats and government officials protected by the Protective Services specialists. Their number signifies teamwork. The Royal Crown symbolizes service to the Sovereign while white and red, the national colours of Canada, symbolize service to the country.
> 
> http://reg.gg.ca/heraldry/pub-reg/project.asp?lang=e&ProjectID=2217&ShowAll=1





			
				dangerboy said:
			
		

> The sword is taken from the Canadian Forces Protective Service Unit badge. The griffins, which have the body of a lion and the head and wings of an eagle, represent the power of the lion and the good eyesight of the eagle, two qualities personified by Protective Services specialists. They symbolize military courage, boldness, leadership, strength and intelligence. Griffins are also known to be good guardians and protectors, thus reflecting the “all around protection” of the generals, diplomats and government officials protected by the Protective Services specialists. Their number signifies teamwork. The Royal Crown symbolizes service to the Sovereign while white and red, the national colours of Canada, symbolize service to the country.
> 
> http://reg.gg.ca/heraldry/pub-reg/project.asp?lang=e&ProjectID=2217&ShowAll=1



Amazing. Thank you for including the source.
That's exactly what I was looking for all afternoon!


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