# CT -- Reserves into ROTP/RMC (merged)



## Erik

G'day folks I am Erik Bezpalko and I am 15.
After grade 10 I will be joining the army reserves as infantry.
Now, here is where my questions start.

    Will there be any problems that you can forsee from going from the reserves to RMC or would I just have to tell whoever is in charge that I am going to RMC. Then too, graduating from RMC (as a officer combat engineer) would I still be considered part of the reserves and have to transfer or do I just go straight from RMC to the regular force? Thank you for reading this thread and even more so if you can answer my question.

P.S In the reserve, I need a clarification, I am 90% sure I can take basic training on the weekends or will I have to wait a year till next summer when I have plenty of spare time. (B-day is August 10 so basic training that summer would not happen)


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## McInnes

Yes, there are coarses run on the weekends. You join the regular force before you even get to RMC.


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## Michael OLeary

Erik,

you are actually asking about a number of different programs. I will try to respond to the different issues you have raised.

You are considering joining the Reserves once you meet the eligibility requirement while you are still in high school.  You may want to read through threads of interest in the Recruiting Forum for a better understanding of the recruiting process and possible issues you may meet:

Recruiting FAAQ - http://army.ca/forums/threads/17073.0.html

Joining the Reserves as a soldier while in High School is a good way to get an introduction to the military. Many Reserve units do run Basic Military Qualification (BMQ) training on weekends through the school year, and you can attend other training course during the summers.

Once you get to the senior year of high school, if your intentions are to attend RMC, then your military career path will be changing significantly. Officer candidates at RMC are members of the Regular Force (not the Reserves). You will have to return to the Recruiting centre and repeat the Recruiting process as an applicant for the Regular Force. Keep in mind that being a serving Reserve soldier does not speed up this process, if anything it can slow the process because of the requirements for a Component Transfer. See the Recruiting FAQ links on Component Transfers and on Officers for more information to start your research with. Be prepared to start your application for the transfer and consideration or RMC very early in your senior year, to allow the Recruiting System to complete the steps it must put your file through.

Remember that your Reserve service will not be a significant factor for your selection as a candidate for officer training and attendance at RMC to the point where other perceived deficiencies would be waived. Your scholastic abilities and your general presentation as a well-rounded citizen with leadership potential and a variety of personal and inter-personal skills will be more important. No matter how much you may enjoy and wish to dedicate time and energy to your Reserve service, don't let these other factors slip to the point where they might undermine your application.

Good luck with your plans.


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## tree hugger

Michael OLeary said:
			
		

> Officer candidates at RMC are members of the Regular Force (not the Reserves).



Actually, you can attend RMC through the RETP:

http://www.rmc.ca/admission/plans/retp_e.html


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## Erik

Okay then, thank you all for the replys.

So I in the first month of grade 12 I will go to the recruiter and apply for RMC and the regular force at the same time. I assume I will have to take BMQ again and that I after all is said and done that there is a good chance that I would not be finished BMQ by the time RMC time rolls around.
Actually, would I not just take BMQ with the rest of the 1st year RMC students? 
If I was in BMQ while it was time to go to RMC would I have to wait to join next year and re-apply?


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## Inch

BMQ is for NCMs, I don't know what the new officer basic training is called but you'll do it the summer before you start 1st year so after grade 12. Just ask the recruiter about RMC and time frames when you should apply, etc when you go ask about the reserves.

Cheers


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## Tracker

When applying for ROTP you can go straight to your nearest CFRC for application, you don't have to do a component transfer request through your unit.  The difference is that the CFRC initiates the application, bypasses the unit and you move through the system as fast as a civilian applicant.


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## cameron_highlander

How am I clearing out of my unit when I transfer to ROTP? I need to have this all done by 21st June, and they called me this week and didn't actually specify how I clear out (and I can't get a hold of my recruiter). 

Am I quitting the reserves or doing a CT? 

According to my joining instructions, ROTP candidates who were previosuly in the CF need to bring their issued kit with them. So that wounds like I'm clearing out of my unit as if I was doing a CT to the reg force. Or am I quitting and rejoining?

It sounds like a stupid question, but its two different processs and I don't want to bugger it up (I have less then two weeks to do this). 

If anyone can actually tell me what I need when I clear out of my unit for ROTP, it would be appreciated (what forms am I bringing etc). Because no one can tell me SFU.


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## Acorn

Your unit will have to advise you. There are general guidelines, but nothing nationally that determines what you have to do. For example, some kit is held by the unit, the type of which is different for PRes than Reg - i.e. in the Reg force your ruck may be something that is personal issue, but in a PRes unit it may be a Temp Loan as the kit is "owned" by the unit.

Basically, anything you signed on a temp loan card will have to be turned in. Fitted and "next-to-skin" (uniform stuff usually) items will probably be retained, but only your unit can tell you what you can keep.

Acorn


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## old medic

Phone the clothing stores where you were actually issued and signed for your kit. Discuss the problem with them.
Ask for a certified copy of your clothing documents. That way you can both check it against what you have now, and you
can bring it with you to show both what you already have, and what you were not issued.

If memory serves, there is (was) a way for them to transfer the clothing docs to the new supporting base/unit. Basically
striking off your clothing from their account and adding your card to the recieving units account.  Things may be different 
now. 

As already mentioned, items from your unit QM stores and on temp cards will have to be returned.  Ensure you return them
and have the cards torn up or zero'd off. You don't want a wayward temp issue card coming back to bite you later on for
kit you don't have anymore.

Your unit should have some form of out clearance procedure or card.


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## kincanucks

You don't CT and you don't quit.  Clear out of the unit and provide proof that you have done so to your CFRC/D.  During the ROTP enrolment ceremony you will not be sworn in again but given a certificate indicating your acceptance into ROTP.  Going from the reserves to ROTP is not a transfer.


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## kincanucks

Get someone at the CFRC to call your unit and tell them to clear you out of the unit and provide you with an update 1007.  You have to turn in all loan card kit then.  If you are going to be in the same element in ROTP as you were in the reserves then you can keep your clothing.  However, if you are not then you have to get rid of your element clothing now because St Jean does not have time to freak around with clothing transfers.  If you unit is such a pain in the ass then tell them you want the CT clearing out done then.

_And as to the swearing in thingy, they said I am getting sworn in (asked me if I wanted a bible or not) and, this is cool, my dad gets to swear me in. _ 

Impossible you can't be sworn into the CF if you are already in it.  Ask them to clarify.


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## beach_bum

Okay, I can only tell you what we do in my own unit for pers going to the Reg F.  When someone needs to clear the unit because they are transferring (be it to the Reg F or another unit) they need to return their Regimental kit only.  The other kit stays with them and as clothing docs are electronic now, the docs will follow them.  For the rest of the unit, you should be given an outclearance sheet (preferably the same one you cleared in with).  It will have the places you need to clear out of, such as the Coy, Ops and Trg, Pam Library, Finance, Kit Shop etc.  So, what you need to do is see those people and get them to sign off that you don't owe anything to those areas.  That you don't have keys, Pams etc that belong to the unit.  That you don't owe the kit shop money.  Make sense?  When you go to get sworn in, you will bring a copy of that outclearance sheet and your 1007 with you.
Hope that helps.


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## big_johnson1

kincanucks said:
			
		

> You don't CT and you don't quit.   Clear out of the unit and provide proof that you have done so to your CFRC/D.   During the ROTP enrolment ceremony you will not be sworn in again but given a certificate indicating your acceptance into ROTP.   Going from the reserves to ROTP is not a transfer.



When I went to Reg force officer from the reserve NCM side, I was told by CFRC Vancouver that I had to get out of the forces. I literally had to have my sec clearance cancelled, ALL my kit was turned in, and I cleared out of my old unit one day, just to be sworn in the next day by CFRC Vancouver.


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## kincanucks

Feral said:
			
		

> When I went to Reg force officer from the reserve NCM side, I was told by CFRC Vancouver that I had to get out of the forces. I literally had to have my sec clearance cancelled, ALL my kit was turned in, and I cleared out of my old unit one day, just to be sworn in the next day by CFRC Vancouver.


And this was through ROTP?


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## tree hugger

When I transferred (or whatever), from reserves to ROTP, I was sworn in again.  On 25 Aug, I was in the navy reserve, 26 Aug I was reg force.  I had to return all my kit because I was changing elements.


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## kincanucks

Well so much for Standardized Processing.  As far as I am concerned there is no need for Reserve members going to ROTP to be released and re-enrolled again.  I have not done that in four years of ROTP processing but I can see that it is happening elsewhere and it is definitely something that I will/need to  check out with CFRG HQ about.  Whatever I learn, I will post here for future reference.

I will be posting a poll (if I can figure it out) to determine how prevalent the re-enrolment of reserves going to ROTP is.


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## kincanucks

On a previous thread it has been mentioned that some reservists were required to release from the reserves and turn in all their kit in order to be sworn in again for ROTP.  The policy in my CFRC/D (and what I thought was the CFRG wide policy) is that the reservist must clear out of their reserve unit, turn in all non-environmental kit, turn in all environmental kit if they are not going to be in the same environment in ROTP and to obtain a up-to-date CF 1007.  During the ROTP Enrolment Ceremony, the member is not sworn in again but is publicly acknowledged that they are now in the regular force vice the reserve force.  

If you were a reservist and have gone to ROTP I would appreciate your feedback and if I have missed a poll choice please let me know. Also could you please post what CFRC/D you went through.  Cheers.


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## McInnes

The Unit is not necessarily bypassed. My experiance is that CFRC will tell you to do a normal release through your unit, with the release being effective the day before your swearing-in ceremony is scheduled. This disables the long wait times for component transfers as you will be applying as a civilian for you will be civilian for 24 hours before becoming reg. force. 

As for reserve experiance...it can show the recruiters that you can indeed handle military courses, as they can lose a lot of people who simply quit due to a sort of 'culture shock'. Personally, I was still accepted, even with sub-par grades (below the recommended 'minimum' standard). However, this came with quite a bit of leadership experiance through school and the community, as well as sports, coaching and reserve experiance.

I handed in my application in October and had all my testing done by December. The deadline I believe is early February. In any event your CFRC will nicely walk you through everything like the lovely maternal organisation they are. 

cheers


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## big_johnson1

It was hinted to me that one of the reasons I was made to release and re-enroll is so that there is no more vested right to pay. Therefore they pay OCdt wages instead of what you used to make. Not first hand info mind you but it makes sense.


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## navygravy

Hello All!

Hopefully someone can answer my question. 

I am currently in the PRes at HMCS Scotian and am hoping to get enrolled in the ROTP program at a civilian university next year. My problem lies in the CT part of my application. When I began, I had to send an email to NDHQ (I believe that is the right name) and waited 1 week for them to reply and say that I can go ahead and contact the CFRC with my ROTP application. With that, I booked my interview and after than (because my pers file had everything else needed) it was immediately sent to what I believe to be RMC for the selection board. I just contacted my interviewer today and said that offers have come back but because I am doing a CT, he does not have one for me because he does not receive CT offers, it is DMCA that handles that, so he simply has no clue as to if I got in or not. He explained to me the process that it involved. However, he couldn't exactly answer my main question. Did I make it to the selection board. My worry is that once its sent from the recruitment office, it will sit in the CT office, waiting months to complete, before they send it off to the board. I feel like this would be ridiculous, as it would significantly hinder any ROTP applicants who are in the PRES as if a CT doesn't happen in time, the applicant will miss the board. So my theory, and my interviewer said that might be the process would be that it gets sent off to the board first, if the board selects me, then it goes through the long process of officially transferring me.

Sorry if that is a bit messy, by I don't exactly understand it myself and hopefully someone who knows exactly whats going on will be able to help me. 

Thanks a lot for your time


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## The_Falcon

I know this post is a couple of days old by now, but did you ever think that maybe, just maybe, you should/should have contacted your CT file Manager at DMCA and ask THEM.  Since THEY will (or should) have the pertinent info regarding YOUR specific situation.


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## macknightcr

I have said on a previous post that right now I am currently living in America and an RMC hopeful.  I have seen many post of people joining the reserves first before going to RMC.  This would be prefect for me to get my feet wet prior to RMC.  Can anyone shed some light on this for me?


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## chris_log

Well, you have to live in Canada to join the Primary Reserve. Are you planning on moving back before you head to RMC?


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## macknightcr

Yes, I would move back if I could be in the reserves and still attend RMC in the fall of 2010.


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## Cleared Hot

macknightcr said:
			
		

> I have said on a previous post that right now I am currently living in America and an RMC hopeful.  I have seen many post of people joining the reserves first before going to RMC.  This would be prefect for me to get my feet wet prior to RMC.  Can anyone shed some light on this for me?


Everything else aside, you say you want into RMC in 2010.  Assuming you are honest with the PRes unit you choose (about your motivation to join) why would they waste their time on money with you knowing you are leaving in less than a year? That is assuming your application to the PRes goes well and you get processed in min time.


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## chris_log

macknightcr said:
			
		

> Yes, I would move back if I could be in the reserves and still attend RMC in the fall of 2010.



Give it a shot, some reserve time gives you a heads up to the CF and a big bump in pay when you go into ROTP. You're cutting it pretty close though. It also gives you options if you don't get accepted into ROTP (being in the 'Mo is a great way to pay your way through school, gives you the option to take some time off from school to go on tour, great training etc etc). 



> Everything else aside, you say you want into RMC in 2010.  Assuming you are honest with the PRes unit you choose (about your motivation to join) why would they waste their time on money with you knowing you are leaving in less than a year? That is assuming your application to the PRes goes well and you get processed in min time.



That's for the unit to decide. I told them I was considering ROTP in the future the first time I went to a CFRC and no one said boo. Neither did the unit I joined. The CO signed a letter of reccomendation for me before I was even done BMQ (5 months in).


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## Brasidas

macknightcr said:
			
		

> I have said on a previous post that right now I am currently living in America and an RMC hopeful.  I have seen many post of people joining the reserves first before going to RMC.  This would be prefect for me to get my feet wet prior to RMC.  Can anyone shed some light on this for me?



What's your situation exactly? Canadian citizen, I assume. Finished high school, thinking you'll take a break for a year or two from school? Thinking of going to college in canada for a year, then go to RMC?

If it's the former, sure. It might be possible for you to get on a fall BMQ course, then do some unit training, maybe a driver's course, and trades training in the summer. The following year could include simply unit-level training, further (full-time) trades courses, or class B contracts (full-time, hopefully interesting and trade-related work). Second summer might be an initial officer's course, before going to RMC. 
Two years from september and you could be going to RMC with some trade-related experience (hopefully related to your career choice). Up until then, you'd have to be in the enlisted ranks. You'd probably not have made corporal, but you'd continue to make your best rate of pay that you'd been entitled to from your experience in the reserves.

If you're going to school immediately, you could try to do much the same, without the option of doing any full-time work during the year. But there's no opportunity for much fulltime work; maybe a driver's course around Christmas. You might be better off going officer through the RESO program. Without access to this summer's courses, you'd have a limited leg up; you could likely get through CAP over in Gagetown during the summer, freeing up room for second language and trade-related training earlier in your summer breaks at RMC.

EDIT: So you're living in the states, and considering moving back (in the very immediate future) prior to attending RMC in 2010. Well, throw out most of option 1. You *might* be able to do your QL3 trade training during the year, if you get on a reg force course. But the timings are too damned tight. Assuming you're out of high school (are you?), I'd say go to a (Canadian) community college, get ready for real academic challenges, and try going RESO at your local unit. You might go through BMQ in the fall, get on CAP for the summer, and be a step ahead of the game for fall 2010.


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## Cleared Hot

Piper said:
			
		

> That's for the unit to decide.



Absolutely, I never said don't do it.  Just pointing out that you have to be prepared to answer those kind of questions when the CO brings them up.  When spots are few, the CO will go with the person they think they can get the most utility out of.  Yes most units have many spots NCMs but for officers they have far less.  I am assuming since the OP is interested in RMC they would be interested in PRes officer spots as well. I could be wrong.


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## chris_log

Cleared Hot said:
			
		

> Absolutely, I never said don't do it.  Just pointing out that you have to be prepared to answer those kind of questions when the CO brings them up.  When spots are few, the CO will go with the person they think they can get the most utility out of.  Yes most units have many spots NCMs but for officers they have far less.  I am assuming since the OP is interested in RMC they would be interested in PRes officer spots as well. I could be wrong.



I figured he meant NCM, if I could go back in time I'd have joined the 'Mo as soon as I turned 16 instead of waiting a year. Regardless, joining the reserves first was one of the best decisions I ever made and I advise anyone who queries me about ROTP to do so. In addition to the benefits to the member (financially mostly) it either a) gives the CF a reg force member familiar with the workings of the reserves or b) it allows someone to try the CF and leave at far less admin and financial expense for the CF then it would if they went a year in ROTP.


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## Cleared Hot

Piper said:
			
		

> Regardless, joining the reserves first was one of the best decisions I ever made and I advise anyone who queries me about ROTP to do so. In addition to the benefits to the member (financially mostly) it either a) gives the CF a reg force member familiar with the workings of the reserves or b) it allows someone to try the CF and leave at far less admin and financial expense for the CF then it would if they went a year in ROTP.



Agreed.  I did the RESO thing for a number of years at a unit out east before CTing a long time ago.  Back then our CO would not take any MITSIP (I don't actually know what the acronym was) because it took them so long to get trained they were often moving on before they were fully qualified.  I know (back then) HMCS Scotian in Halifax wouldn't take Res MARS applicants that were too far along in University because they couldn't guarantee they would be around for enough summers to get trained.  That was back in the time of FRP when it was harder to get in (even in the PRes) but I know times have changed.  In the end, the meeting/interview with the unit/CO is just like any other job interview, you have to make the potential employer see why you are a better applicant than the other guy.


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## macknightcr

Thanks for all of your responses, it seems I need to clear somethings up.  I am planning to attend RMC in the fall of 2010 with the ROTP program not the RETP program.  I would like to join the Reserves now, and become more accustomed to military life before going to RMC.  
I would not lie about my intentions with a Reserve Unit, if it really pissed the CO off I'm pretty sure he would have the ability to write a letter to RMC and pretty much make my application obsolete.
My situation is pretty weird.  I am 21 years old and have been living in the States since I was 9 with my parents who have been posted here from Canada.  I am a High School grad, 3.5 GPA, and have taken some classes at the University level.  The classes I took right after High School I did rather poorly in, but have since taken a few more classes and have brought my GPA up to a 3.5.  I am building my application for RMC now in hopes of them reading it first and giving me a spot.  Also I plan to move to either Halifax, NS or St. Stephen, NB and live with family until I go to school.  This is why I would like to join the reserves, I will have a lot of free time preparing myself mentally and physically for the challenges of RMC.


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## Larkvall

Hello,

Just to let you know it can take some time to go through the process of getting into the Reserves depending on how busy the local Recruiting Centre is. It could take only a month or more than three. I am just letting you know so you can plan accordingly.


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## Brasidas

macknightcr said:
			
		

> Thanks for all of your responses, it seems I need to clear somethings up.  I am planning to attend RMC in the fall of 2010 with the ROTP program not the RETP program.  I would like to join the Reserves now, and become more accustomed to military life before going to RMC.



That's great, and past decisions are past so I won't dwell much on how much more flexible things could have been if you had enlisted in time for the summer training period. But you need to understand that there's a grand total of one summer between now and fall 2010, and an RMC student is expected to be on a basic course in that summer.

What I've known friends to have done is to enroll in the RESO program as first year post-secondary students, intending to apply for RMC without any deception of their home unit. They were booked on CAP (then called "phase 2") and were in Gagetown when confirmation of their acceptance to RMC came through. The two programs did not interfere with each other, so there was no problem going on that summer's course.

This is almost ten years ago, and while courses have changed, timeframes between the end of high school and the beginning of university have not. Back then, a first year RMC student would take a 7 week BOTC part 1, iirc. If you're in the RESO program (reserve officer) while you're in the reserves, and you're able to take BMQ in the fall, you might be able to get on CAP in the summer. It's a relatively tough, field-oriented leadership course that you'd get something out of. If you're going into an army MOC, it's a course you'd be taking in the future regardless.


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## BK

Hi All,

I am sorry if this question is buried somewhere in the forum.  But if anyone is in my shoes i would gladly appreciate a point in the right direction.  I served in the PRes for 4 years as a private and transferred to ROTP in 2008.  In the process of transferring the Recruting center gave me a whole lot of technical info on the new system for pay for CT's but basically said my pay would downgraded to that of an Ocdt.

My few months at CFLRS during basic i saw different situations where i saw mbrs getting their old pay etc on CT.  I questioned my ULO on this issue and he said he would look in the matter.  I was wondering of anyone else could lead me to some hard documentation or refer me to the appropriate office within the CF so i could get the ball moving.  I would also appreciate if anyone that was in my situation could put a post on how they resolved it.

Thanks in advance
BK


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## timstec

check out CBI 204

http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dgcb-dgras/pub/cbi-dra/204-eng.asp

You should find all the details there


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## BeeDub

I know I am not the first one with this issue, and I know I will not be the last.  I enrolled ROTP and my COS date was Aug 2008.  It will be almost 14 months now and I continue to experience problems with my pay.  In my posting message, it is listed what I should be payed at (Pte 1, with 331 days towards my next incentive, and the CBI code was even included so we know EXACTLY what pay table is needed).  My dilema is, I have completey exhausted all my sources at my unit to resolve this issue, every senior NCO and admin officer tells me it is out of their hands and that a work ticket is in place (and it is) however I work with several clerks and from past experiences with similar issues, they are telling me it could be a few years before I see results.  I am getting paid an "approximate" of what I should be getting, however it is not full value, and I am getting taxed at a pay grade that is significantly less the what I am actually getting paid.  Basically CCPS says I am being paid as an officer cadet, and because I get more via being paid by a note, I am accumulating a negative balance, which isn't even money I owe.  So far it has worked its way up to 12k.  Given I will most likely be posted away within the year, I would like to have this resolved before I go.  As well I am expecting there to be some issues with my income tax this year, and if not this year, in the long run.  It was recomended by a colleague that I speak with my boss, who works directly for the CO/DCO, and see if someone can help me out.  I have already been through 'my other' chain of command and have gotten no where.  From what I have heard a few phone calls from someone with a little authority can speed things up in this particular situation and even solve it completely.  I am running out of options, and do not know what else to do, I have waited patiently for 14 months, but this issue is beginning to cause some problems.

I am looking for possible suggestions or advice, even a known solution, otherwise when I am posted out, I will most likely be leaving here with a pay statement saying I am negative 20k+, might have tax issues, and the problem still will not be fixed. 

Thankyou
BeeDub


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## sidereus

Hi, 

first of all I have searched a great deal recently but I found nothing clear on this so I have few questions for you guys and I hope you are going to be able to help me  

1. I am currently in Primary Reserve here at Rimouski, I heard it is possible to transfer from reserve to ROTP but that it is complicated and implicate a lot of paperwork. Is it true , if yes how long ( I mean an estimate) ?

2. If I ask my command center about transfering from reserve to ROTP are they going to know what I should do ( like what paper to fill, etc...) ? Or I should go to the closest CFRC ?

3. If I want to study Biochemistry, lets say at Laval University or Mcgill. Is it possible to get accepted in ROTP ?

4. Attending RMC is also something I'd like. Is it too late to apply for Chemistry/Chemical Engineering ? Is it hard to get accepted?

thank you very much, like I said I searched but could not find anything precise on my questions


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## tenor cumulus

Normal RMC cadets (non ex reservists) are going to hate me for answering this but here I go.

1. SI tu est à Rimouski ( ce qui est proche d'un centre de recrutement, ce qui te facilite la vie). First off I assume you speak french but since the forum is in english I'll help out other fellas that would want to read the thread. Yes in any case, reservist, cadet or civilian the procedure is long so strat it ASAP, it lasts untill april or may, but it is still doable.

2. I would go to the recruitment center and make sure they liaise with the recruitment center. A few of my friends went throught reserves in high school and then applied at RMC (or prep year in st jean). They should know what to do and if they don't, ask them to find someone who does since it IS POSSIBLE!

3. There is no biochem at RMC (we do have life science which is close tho) but YES YOU CAN BE ROTP AT A CIVILIAN UNIVERSITY (and with your reservist pay, you stay soldat 3 so you make lots of money while studying, compared to a "normal" officer cadet).

4. I would say that if you have an average of 75% with a VERY GOOD cadet or reservist file (and extra curriculars) you will get accepted at RMC. Or else you need to have at least 80%. But don't forget now the forces are recruiting more and more, so the odds are on your side.


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## sidereus

thanks for your reply it is very helpful. I hope it will also help people who are looking for informations about this.

p.s.: I went to the recruitment center today. I told them what I wanted to do and got scheduled a meeting with someone next tuesday.

p.s.: I'd like to thank publicly The dunnminator for his help through PMs.


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## Gunner_Askett

tenor cumulus said:
			
		

> Normal RMC cadets (non ex reservists) are going to hate me for answering this but here I go.
> 
> 1. SI tu est à Rimouski ( ce qui est proche d'un centre de recrutement, ce qui te facilite la vie). First off I assume you speak french but since the forum is in english I'll help out other fellas that would want to read the thread. Yes in any case, reservist, cadet or civilian the procedure is long so strat it ASAP, it lasts untill april or may, but it is still doable.
> 
> 2. I would go to the recruitment center and make sure they liaise with the recruitment center. A few of my friends went throught reserves in high school and then applied at RMC (or prep year in st jean). They should know what to do and if they don't, ask them to find someone who does since it IS POSSIBLE!
> 
> 3. There is no biochem at RMC (we do have life science which is close tho) but YES YOU CAN BE ROTP AT A CIVILIAN UNIVERSITY (and with your reservist pay, you stay soldat 3 so you make lots of money while studying, compared to a "normal" officer cadet).
> 
> 4. I would say that if you have an average of 75% with a VERY GOOD cadet or reservist file (and extra curriculars) you will get accepted at RMC. Or else you need to have at least 80%. But don't forget now the forces are recruiting more and more, so the odds are on your side.



One question. You mentioned having reservist pay and staying at "soldat 3."  What exactly does this mean?  I plan on applying to the ROTP to study in the 2011/12 year and will have been a reservist for 2 and a half years(since January '09).  Money isn't the number one issue but I'm just curious as how it all works.


----------



## The Dunnminator

You will receive the same pay and benefits as if you were transferring as an ncm, your private pay scale depending on how much time you are getting credited, 1 day per day of class B and 1 day per 3 days of class A.


----------



## VBanks

Hi Everyone 

I noticed that someone else asked a similar question, but no one has responded yet, so I'll start a topic.

For anyone at RMC or doing ROTP now that was in the reserves before they were accepted, how does the component transfer work? One person at my unit said that if I get accepted to RMC, I just go in to my unit for a few hours, fill out some papers, and the component transfer is complete. He said that it's basically a voluntary release followed by an immediate enrollment in the reg force, with no lapse in service. This is the first I've heard that a CT is actually a release from the reserves followed by an immediate re-enrollment, so I was just wondering if this is valid information. He also said that it should happen around July or August, but that seems really late. I was wondering if anyone has any information about this that they could share? Also, if the CT happens early, does that mean I can't do any more reserve work with my unit after that point?


----------



## Nauticus

VBanks said:
			
		

> Hi Everyone
> 
> I noticed that someone else asked a similar question, but no one has responded yet, so I'll start a topic.
> 
> For anyone at RMC or doing ROTP now that was in the reserves before they were accepted, how does the component transfer work? One person at my unit said that if I get accepted to RMC, I just go in to my unit for a few hours, fill out some papers, and the component transfer is complete. He said that it's basically a voluntary release followed by an immediate enrollment in the reg force, with no lapse in service. This is the first I've heard that a CT is actually a release from the reserves followed by an immediate re-enrollment, so I was just wondering if this is valid information. He also said that it should happen around July or August, but that seems really late. I was wondering if anyone has any information about this that they could share? Also, if the CT happens early, does that mean I can't do any more reserve work with my unit after that point?



Correct me if I'm wrong, but a CT means "Component Transfer", not "Component VR", so I believe it's just a transfer to another role in the CF.


----------



## DBF

VBanks said:
			
		

> For anyone at RMC or doing ROTP now that was in the reserves before they were accepted, how does the component transfer work? One person at my unit said that if I get accepted to RMC, I just go in to my unit for a few hours, fill out some papers, and the component transfer is complete. He said that it's basically a voluntary release followed by an immediate enrollment in the reg force, with no lapse in service.


I'm not ROTP but when I transferred from the militia to the regs that was the way it worked.  My "release date" was 1 day prior to my "enrollment date" so there was no break in service.  I imagine that ROTP works the same way but "your mileage may vary".


----------



## VBanks

DBF said:
			
		

> I'm not ROTP but when I transferred from the militia to the regs that was the way it worked.  My "release date" was 1 day prior to my "enrollment date" so there was no break in service.  I imagine that ROTP works the same way but "your mileage may vary".



Thanks for the reply  

I agree; I'm sure ROTP would be the same. Was your transfer recent?


----------



## DBF

VBanks said:
			
		

> Thanks for the reply
> 
> I agree; I'm sure ROTP would be the same. Was your transfer recent?


Not really but I checked with an RMS Clerk who specializes in releases/CT and she says that it still works that way.


----------



## VBanks

DBF said:
			
		

> Not really but I checked with an RMS Clerk who specializes in releases/CT and she says that it still works that way.



Thank you for your help


----------



## Gunner_Askett

VBanks said:
			
		

> One person at my unit said that if I get accepted to RMC, I just go in to my unit for a few hours, fill out some papers, and the component transfer is complete.



I'm not sure where you are in your ROTP application, but I had to start my CT online at my unit before the recruiting centre would accept my application.  About a week later, I received an email from someone in Ottawa confirming that my CT was "started," and I was also told that the actual transfer wouldn't take place until the summer, shortly before school starts.


----------



## VBanks

31engnr said:
			
		

> I'm not sure where you are in your ROTP application, but I had to start my CT online at my unit before the recruiting centre would accept my application.  About a week later, I received an email from someone in Ottawa confirming that my CT was "started," and I was also told that the actual transfer wouldn't take place until the summer, shortly before school starts.



Yes; I've already done that as well and was confirmed that my CT was started. What I was talking about before was the actual transfer; I want to know if that's how the actual transfer works, and when it happens. So what you're saying also goes along with what I've heard; that the transfer doesn't happen until the summer.


----------



## Zoomie

You will be transferred to the Regular Force the day before you need to show up for duty.

If your BOTP/BOTC/IAP (whatever) starts on 20 June 2010 - then you will show up in St-Jean on 19 June 2010.  All your initial paperwork, kit issue, brow-beating will occur on the 20th.  If you get late acceptance into RMC, then you will be CT'd late August.

I CT'd from the PRes to the RegF, never was I told that I was VRing and re-enrolling.  I was transferred from the Militia to the Regular Force.  I worked at my Militia unit Class A until a week before leaving.  I cleared out of my ASU and returned some kit that I would not need anymore (Army CF's, cot, helmet, webbing etc).  All of that was re-issued to me in St-Jean.


----------



## Gunner_Askett

I was told that I would not be doing anything during the summer no matter what and would do my BOTP and whatever else during the summer after my first year of university.  I originally thought that it would be this summer but apparently they are doing things differently than they used to.  I'm not sure what anybody else has been told regarding the summer and whether or not they are doing BOTP, but this is what I was told.


----------



## BK

Vbank,

i did it last year.  Couple of tips to help you in the transfer.

- Keep on top of the paper work in your admin office, there is alot of stuff being flown from recruiting to your BOR and you will need to sign a big stack of forms just before your release from reserves.  Make sure your benefits forms are correct(like of you got injured or something).

- MAKE sure and guard that form you get signed off by everyone especially your Kit return list.  When you land in St.Jean and they say you should have all your kit, just rip out the form and proceed.  Computer glitches to exist.


- itis weird to get released and then hired again by the Reg. but make sure you are completely off the reserve system or else your reg force pay wont come in.


----------



## VBanks

BK said:
			
		

> Vbank,
> 
> i did it last year.  Couple of tips to help you in the transfer.
> 
> - Keep on top of the paper work in your admin office, there is alot of stuff being flown from recruiting to your BOR and you will need to sign a big stack of forms just before your release from reserves.  Make sure your benefits forms are correct(like of you got injured or something).
> 
> - MAKE sure and guard that form you get signed off by everyone especially your Kit return list.  When you land in St.Jean and they say you should have all your kit, just rip out the form and proceed.  Computer glitches to exist.
> 
> 
> - itis weird to get released and then hired again by the Reg. but make sure you are completely off the reserve system or else your reg force pay wont come in.



Thanks BK   So did you switch from the Reserves to ROTP? And even though it's a release from the Reserves and a re-enrollment in Reg Force, is your pay as an officer still based on the time you spent in the Reserves (how you can never go down in pay in the military)? Thanks again.


----------



## BK

Well thats a different can of worms.

I stand to be corrected, it was 08 i did the transfer from PRes to ROTP.  Back to the pay issue, it depends on everyone's personal case, I was just so happy that the ball was rolling as quick as it was, that i kind of put the pay 2nd verses getting in the Reg Force Career.  Also i was a private with little leverage to bring to the table.  They did give me time in as a Reservest but my pay actually decreased.  But then again i was a reservest that gets payed for showing up to parade and exercises and on becoming a Reg Force member you get payed every 2 weeks, so i still consider myself blessed.

If you have vast experience, like MCpl and above i think you have a much better chance of getting higher pay as an OCdt.  We had a Mcpl on our basic that had 2 tours under his belt and was a qualified instructor (i doubt he was getting my pay).  But that is just my opinion, to how the CFRC handles this, i am not sure.  The clerks at the CFRC are gods with all this information, consult them.  Note adding anything could mean delaying the enrollment, so its all about pros and cons. 

What trade are you heading for?


----------



## VBanks

Currently I'm a sig op, but if I go to RMC I'm hopefully transferring to armoured; what about you?


----------



## ekpiper

I'm in a similar boat, applying to ROTP, but currently PRes.  The essentials are thus:  

If you are a private: you will be paid as if you had no military service

If you are a corporal or greater: you will be paid as if you CT'd into your current trade, at your current rank.  Upon commissioning, you will be paid in Pay Category D, starting at the next highest pay level (from your current pay) at that new rank, at that category.

I'm not 100% sure how promotions work, specifically if you are promoted to 2Lt from OCdt making $x, you either get the next pay level greater than your current, or 1 pay level beyond that.

This can all be found in the CBI 204-02 documents. found on the DGCB.



> 204.211(10) (Officer Cadet – former non-commissioned member)  An officer cadet who is appointed directly to that rank from a non-commissioned rank shall be paid:
> 
> 1. if the member was a non-commissioned member of the Regular Force, at the rate of pay which, including any upward adjustments to the rates of pay determined under subparagraphs (i) and (ii) that may be established from time to time, and any upward adjustments resulting from the reallocation of the last military occupation in which the member served as a non-commissioned member to a higher trade group, is the greater of the rate of pay established for:
> 1. the rank, pay increment, pay level and trade group held on the day immediately prior to the date of appointment to the rank of officer cadet, or
> 2. any higher pay increment to which the member would have become entitled had the member remained in the former rank, pay level and trade group as a non-commissioned member; and
> 2. if the member was a former Regular Force member who re-enrolled or a member who transferred from the Reserve Force to the Regular Force, at the rate of pay, including any upward adjustments to the rates of pay, in CBI 204.30 (Pay – Non-commissioned members) for:
> 1. the rank, pay level and trade group that they would have received had they enrolled directly as a non-commissioned member as determined in orders or instructions issued by the Chief of the Defence Staff, at the pay increment determined by CBI 204.015 (Pay Increments); or
> 2. any higher pay increment to which the officer would have become entitled under CBI 204.015 (Pay Increments) had the officer remained in the former rank, pay level and trade group as a non-commissioned member.





> 204.211(3) (Rate of pay – ROTP) An officer to whom the ROTP applies shall be paid, for each month after the month and year specified in the table, at the rate of pay established for the officer’s rank and pay increment as follows
> 
> 1. if a lieutenant or second lieutenant
> 1. with no former non-commissioned member service, in pay level A of Table “B” or “C” to this instruction, or
> 2. with former non-commissioned member service and appointed to the rank of officer cadet directly from the rank of private, in pay level A of Table “B” or “C” to this instruction; or
> 3. with former non-commissioned member service and appointed to the rank of officer cadet directly from the rank of corporal or above, in pay level D of Table “B” or “C” to this instruction; and
> 2. subject to QR&O 203.20 (Officers – Regular Force – Limitation of Payments) , if an officer cadet with no former non-commissioned member service, in pay level A of Table "A" to this instruction.



http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dgcb-dgras/pub/cbi-dra/204-eng.asp


----------



## MMChai

I was just wondering if anyone else who is Component Transferring into ROTP is going to CMR and got offered up to 4 years (I already have 2 years complete at a Uivi U). I am going from Reserve Infantry Officer 2Lt to MARS and what I find interesting is through talking with those who deal with the CT's that it is not 1 year CMR then 3 in Kingston, but all done through CMR in a BA. Anyone else get an offer like this? I will be interested to see what the final offer looks like after the PLAR.


----------



## Gunner_Askett

I am also CT'ing from the reserves to ROTP and my offer letter sounded similar to that, though I am not already in university and I am an NCM.  It said 
"Under the terms of the plan, you will be subsidized for up to 4 years depending on the accreditation that you may receive at Collège Militaire Royal Saint-Jean to obtain a Bachelor of Engineering. You will be enrolled in the MOSID of 00207 MARS."
I found this weird because it is either worded in a confusing way or they actually want me to get a bachelor of engineering at CMR, which, as far as I know, they don't offer.  I also posted this in the "ROTP 2010..." thread where no one else had seen something similar.


----------



## MMChai

Yes!, that was exactly what mine said. (Looks like we are going to be going to school together)


----------



## TheBlackCat

I'm CT'ing to Armoured Officer under ROTP this year as wekk going into my 2nd year @Saint Mary's U and I talked to my contact in ottawa and no matter what experience you have you have to go to the RMC St.Jean for the orientation camp at the beginning of August, everyone going civyU in the maritimes is goin to St.Jean. he said all the formal CT offers will be emailed out by the end of April and then the CT takes affect at the beginning of August. until then I'm going to try and get a tasking in gagetown, I suggest you try to as well!


----------



## VBanks

TheBlackCat said:
			
		

> I'm CT'ing to Armoured Officer under ROTP this year as wekk going into my 2nd year @Saint Mary's U and I talked to my contact in ottawa and no matter what experience you have you have to go to the RMC St.Jean for the orientation camp at the beginning of August, everyone going civyU in the maritimes is goin to St.Jean. he said all the formal CT offers will be emailed out by the end of April and then the CT takes affect at the beginning of August. until then I'm going to try and get a tasking in gagetown, I suggest you try to as well!



Thanks for the info. I'm also CTing to Armoured Officer  Maybe we'll cross paths in the future


----------



## TheBlackCat

Are you the OCdt with the sig det at the halifax armouries? if so you must kno dylan colbourne then ive met you already lol


----------



## VBanks

TheBlackCat said:
			
		

> Are you the OCdt with the sig det at the halifax armouries? if so you must kno dylan colbourne then ive met you already lol



No, sorry, I'm not - I'm in Ottawa, and I'm a Private


----------



## Blenkarn

Thanks TheBlackCat,

I had no idea when the formal offers would be coming out, or what the situation is for CT & Civy U. Nice to know a general guestimate. Second year MSVU student CTing to MPO.


----------



## ekpiper

I can corroborate TheBlackCat's info, as the PO handling my CT also told me the same thing WRT when letters will go out.


----------



## TheBlackCat

Blenkarn said:
			
		

> Thanks TheBlackCat,
> 
> Second year MSVU student CTing to MPO.



yeah my sister is goin to MSVU next year, wow congratulations! I talked to the recuiter when i was choosing secondary choices for trades and I asked her about MPO and she told me there was only 2 spots in canada, so I said screw that haha, although I am taking Criminology.


----------



## Blenkarn

Thanks - Yeah, I was happy, I was especially worried with the only two spots. MSVU is a great school, I'd probably be taking Criminology at SMU, but I dislike Sociological type stuff. Headed to Gagetown tomorrow for course, so I hope I dont have to be in Halifax to deal with anything ROTP wise.


----------



## TheBlackCat

Are you with the reserve MP unit now?


----------



## Blenkarn

Yeah, with 3MP out in Sackville, Pte T atm, What are you CTing from?


----------



## TheBlackCat

my home uniti s  The Ontario Reg't (RCAC), I was attached to the PLF for about 6 months, and then i got assigned to 33svc so i could train with the hailifax rifles (RCAC)


----------



## Blenkarn

You've been around. I'm out in Gagetown atm on a Comm course - Hoping this letter gets here somewhat soon


----------



## Phosphoric

Hello,

I've been in CF for almost 2 years now. I joined as a reg. force NCM in the Weapons Tech (L). I'm currently on my QL3 course and I am doing good so far. However, I am not enjoying it as much as I had originally hoped. The idea of swapping parts the rest of my career (which a few senior members have the trade have told me is all I would be doing), does not appeal me. Overall though, I love the military and I can't imagine going back to the civvy world. I have been toying with the idea of becoming an officer in the combat arms, which was something I thought would interest me when I was applying, but thought it better to see if I even like the military life before going that route. What I am interested in knowing is, what is the process and how difficult would it be to move from NCM to the ROTP at this point, and, would it be better for me to finish my course and then bring this up the chain of command during my QL4's. On one hand my peers say that I'm so close I might as well finish. On the other, someone requesting a change of trade after just being trained might not be viewed as kindly as someone requesting before training is completed.


----------



## ModlrMike

I thin the answer's going to be "you can't get there from here." IIRC, the three commissioning plans for Reg NCMs are: UTPNCM, SRCP, and CFR. I don't think ROTP is available to serving NCMs. Some else will point you at the reference, I'm sure. In any event, you still wouldn't qualify until you had career status: 3 years served and at least QL4, maybe QL5. SRCP requires you already have a degree, and CFR requires that you have significant experience.


----------



## Wookilar

Mike is absolutley correct. 

ROTP is an entry plan. You are already in.
If you want to gain your Queen's Commission, you have to wait till minimum QL5 trade qualification and then look at the UTPNCM program. CFR is a longer route (potentially) while for SCP you need to be working on your degree part time for a number of years till complete. There is also the CEOTP program, which is similar to the UT.

You could always get out and reapply for ROTP in however many months it is now, but I would really do not think that is a good idea. 

That all being said, don't let the bitter school staff disillusion you too much. Life in 2nd line units (Svc Bn) may be largley parts changing, but life in 1st line units is a different kettle of fish. As a gun plumber you will be diagnosing faults a lot more than you think. Don't let CFSEME and Borden get you down. Life gets better.

Wook


----------



## bitza

Looked and searched for this on the forum, found nothing. 

I'm still in the application process for ROTP, but was told that I have a very good chance of being selected to become an Infantry Officer. I previously thought that training began in May if you were in University (I am finishing/completing my first year of civi uni this year), but that doesn't appear so. Instead of getting a summer job, I was hoping I could possibly advance a pay grade by going into the Reserves starting sometime during the second semester of university. 

Essentially, my questions are:

Would I be able to continue working for the Reserves on weekends and select weekdays during the school year of ROTP?

How long would it take for me to upgrade a pay grade?


----------



## ekpiper

Well, to answer your questions, yes you can parade with a unit on weekends/training nights if you have the time and if the reserve unit is willing to train you.

As for pay grades, it is dependant on your rank and pensionable time in.

I've just gone through the CT a couple of months ago into ROTP, so I can direct you to a few references if needed.

Best of luck,

ekpiper


----------



## nairna

What prompted the recruiter to tell you that you had a very good chance of being selected for infantry officer? Strictly out of curiosity.


----------



## JRBond

I was wondering what the process I would have to go through to CT from the reserves to ROTP would involve.


----------



## ekpiper

You do everything through the recruiting center as if you were fresh off the street.  Once Accepted, you fill out a Voluntary release and do a whole bunch of paperwork.


----------



## Chang

speak with your unit orderly room. They'll have a form on the DIN that you can fill out. Under the "select desire program" option, select ROTP. After that, someone from Ottawa should e-mail you.


----------



## MMChai

Yes you can train with a reserve unit. I my self CT'd from PRes Infantry Officer, to RegF MARS officer. And due to my background in the reserves I wanted to give back some time, as other class B soldiers did for my platoon to help out. So now I am training with a Navy PRes Unit, not only gaining that extra experience, but I find it keeps me in the better military mind set through the school year. All it takes is a memo through you CoC to the CO to get it approved for the volunteer time. As well you would need something from the PRes Unit. 

As far as summer courses go take them if you have the time. It is never a sure thing if you will be selected and dont turn down course loadings because you think you might be going somewhere. Plan for the worst and hope for the best, though I do wish you the best in your application. Currently how it stands there is a 2-3 week ROTP orientation period in Kingston or Saint-Jean depending on you qualifications, school, etc. I did not attend it and was slated to instructed but got held back do to some paper work problems last year. If (like me) you did not get selected my contract never kicked in until the end of Aug so that still leaves plenty of time to work. Get the money if you can, get promoted if you can, it all pays off later down the road. As well more education (Regardless of NCM-Officer) if your going on course never hurts you. Best of luck!


----------



## Str1k3r

I have a quick question that hopefully can get a quick answer. If a regular force NCM whose first contract is done in a little less than year is curious about the possibility of becoming an officer what (if any) would be the process? Would you have to return to the awesomeness that CFLRS to do BMOQ? Also would the accredited degree still be a requirement? Thank you for any replies. Again just curious.


----------



## ModlrMike

This is quick answer just from memory:



> If a regular force NCM whose first contract is done in a little less than year is curious about the possibility of becoming an officer what (if any) would be the process?



There are several programmes for serving NCMs to become commissioned:

UTPNCM - must be accepted at a university and by the CF for funding;
SRCP - usually only offered to CWO or exceptional MWO;
CFR - must be Sgt, MOC and rank qualified; a pure nomination programme
SCP - must have an undergraduate degree completed



> Would you have to return to the awesomeness that CFLRS to do BMOQ?



Unlikely, however each case is different.



> Also would the accredited degree still be a requirement?



Yes, with the exception of CFR and SRCP; accepting that CFR and SRCP would not be offered in your circumstance.

It's been a couple of years since I last looked at the subject, so I could be in error. Notwithstanding, I'm sure someone more current will correct me if appropriate.


----------



## Str1k3r

Very informative reply... much appreciated!


----------



## niceasdrhuxtable

When I went through this process last year, the CDA informed me that they were only providing full BMOQ equivalencies for NCMs that had completed the PLQ.


----------



## crayon851

Hey so I've served with 1RCR for the last three years and am now serving with a reserve unit. I applied for ROTP and am wondering what training I will have to go through. Since I already have basic training, does anyone know how I will be placed exactly?


----------



## DexOlesa

Your prior training will be PLARed. Then they will let you know what equivalences you have earned. Some bypass BMOQ straight to CAP.


----------



## JesseWZ

Some will not do the first half of Phase 1 (used to be known as IAP) and move straight onto the leadership aspect of phase 1 (BMOQ). It really depends on what leadership qualifications you hold.


----------



## Hamegreg

You will probably have to go through BMOQ, because the course is not the same.
Many friends of mine went from reserve to RMC, but they still have to do their BMOQ.
Something good about it though is that you will probably be exempted from some of the tests you already went through.


----------



## Pusser

When I went through BOTC (as we called BMOQ in those days), the only folks with previous service who were exempted the course (regular or reserve) were those who had previously completed *both* the JLC and SLC courses (PLQ and ILQ in modern speak).


----------



## azman648

Hello all,

I've been lurking on these forums for a while, trying to get information on ROTP and the infantry officer trade. 

One thing that I can't find is the process of applying for ROTP from the PRes (which I am currently in). I used the search function, and looked at every page of this board and the occupational and component transfer board. Some posts suggest that you have to put in your CT and wait, or put in your CT and then you're free to put in your application to ROTP at the CFRC, or that you simply skip the CT and fill in the section on the ROTP application about your current unit and trade. The recruiters at the CFRC have never done this before so they don't know what to do, nor do my unit's clerks.

So my question is: What is the process for a member of the PRes to apply to ROTP? Also, I would like know where you got the information from (e.g. personal experience, you're a recruiter, a certain document, etc.).

Thanks

EDIT:  Once I complete the process I will make a new thread with the necessary information for future applicants in my situation.


----------



## ekpiper

Hello,

I did that process last year, so I can give you a pretty solid idea.

Everything for ROTP, no matter your circumstances, begins at the Recruiting Centre.  You will have to go through most of the same process as a new recruit.  The only difference is that you may not need to do the CFAT and the Medical again, and that depends on your performance on the CFAT and when your last medical was.  You will submit an application to Component Transfer (CT) during your application process, noting that it is dependant on being accepted into ROTP.  If you get a letter of offer, you accept and then go through the procedures of a CT.

ekpiper


----------



## Gino151

Hi,

You must do a component transfer.  I work at a CFRD and we are dealing with this exact issue right now.  An individual applied and got into the PRes with the idea that this would make it "easy" for him to go ROTP. When he found out that wasn't the case he tried to release and now it is casuing headaches for everyone.  
FYI people have been waiting on component transfers for well over a year.  However doing this allows for great pay when you become an OCdt, as you will stay in your old pay scale.


----------



## ekpiper

In my case, the component transfer happened in a very timely fashion.  As there are explicit deadlines for the ROTP process, they are likely considered priority, and separate from normal CTs.  While I applied for the CT in early NOV-2009, my ROTP acceptance letter came in on 15-MAR-2010.  The transfer took place on 5-AUG-2010.


----------



## azman648

Thanks for the quick replies.

Unfortunately I received some conflicting answers, but it's a good start.

It seems to me that ekpiper applied for a CT through your unit then applied for ROTP at the recruiting centre simultaneously yet separately, is this correct?

Gino151, I submitted my CT application in early October, and on 16-OCT-2011 I received the e-mail that they received the application. Do I have to wait until my CT is accepted (which could likely be after the 15-JAN-2012 (?) deadline) to apply for ROTP? And what about Part 4 on the ROTP questionnaire where it asks if I am in a PRes unit? 

Also, anyone else is free to add their own input.

Thanks again!

P.S. Once I complete the process I will make a new thread with the necessary information for future applicants in my situation.


----------



## PMedMoe

azman648 said:
			
		

> P.S. Once I complete the process I will make a new thread with the necessary information for future applicants in my situation.



Why not just continue with this one?  Afterwards, maybe a Mod will sticky the thread.


----------



## ekpiper

azman648 said:
			
		

> Thanks for the quick replies.
> 
> Unfortunately I received some conflicting answers, but it's a good start.
> 
> It seems to me that ekpiper applied for a CT through your unit then applied for ROTP at the recruiting centre simultaneously yet separately, is this correct?
> 
> Gino151, I submitted my CT application in early October, and on 16-OCT-2011 I received the e-mail that they received the application. Do I have to wait until my CT is accepted (which could likely be after the 15-JAN-2012 (?) deadline) to apply for ROTP? And what about Part 4 on the ROTP questionnaire where it asks if I am in a PRes unit?
> 
> Also, anyone else is free to add their own input.
> 
> Thanks again!
> 
> P.S. Once I complete the process I will make a new thread with the necessary information for future applicants in my situation.



As it happened, I submitted my CT at the Recruiting Centre, but it gets sent to your unit automatically.  That was the same day that I had handed in my questionnaire to apply for ROTP.  If you intend to apply for ROTP, you should do so immediately, as it is best to go through any hoops early on; Delays can appear in any step, whether it be a Recruiting Centre flub, or D Mil C, or medical.

WRT Part 4, you should fill out exactly what it asks for, as you are a reservist.  Joining as a PRes in all likelihood does add to your application, but it alone can never guarantee acceptance.

ekpiper

<edit to remove double signature>


----------



## Veiledal

I am going to try for ROTP as well, I went to the CFRC and they gave me a questionnaire and told me to put a CT through when I parade with my unit.


----------



## azman648

Lil r said:
			
		

> I am going to try for ROTP as well, I went to the CFRC and they gave me a questionnaire and told me to put a CT through when I parade with my unit.





			
				ekpiper said:
			
		

> As it happened, I submitted my CT at the Recruiting Centre, but it gets sent to your unit automatically.  That was the same day that I had handed in my questionnaire to apply for ROTP.



Which recruiting centre did you apply through? Maybe I can call them and then they can talk to the guys at my recruiting centre and fill them in.


----------



## ekpiper

azman648 said:
			
		

> Which recruiting centre did you apply through? Maybe I can call them and then they can talk to the guys at my recruiting centre and fill them in.


I applied through CFRC Windsor.  I don't know if there is much for them to tell, as aside from having my medical/CFAT taken from my prior application, it made no difference to the application process.  Once your CT application is done, thigs will start moving again if you get accepted.

At this point, your primary focus should be getting your ROTP application moving.  You still have to do an interview, which can take time to schedule.

ekpiper


----------



## thomf

Hi, 
I searched all around and couldn't find answers to my questions.

I was in Kingston a few months ago and a cadet at RMC gave me a tour of the place. The cadet recommended I join the Reserves before going the ROTP route for the reason of getting a little experience in the military before committing to it. I thought it was a smart idea so I'm planning to apply when I turn 17 in March. I'm currently in grade 11.

My questions are:
1: If I complete my medical/aptitude test/interview for the reserves, will I do them all again when I apply to ROTP in September? I'm not complaining, just wondering(I'd actually be happier to do them all again, it would help to fix any problems I had first time around)

2: Will I continue working with the reserves during the application period, right up until I accept my offer to RMC (if I get one that is), or will I have to stop when I apply this fall?

And any other thoughts you have on the idea of joining the reserves would me much appreciated.
Thanks in advanced.


----------



## blacktriangle

If you can get into the reserves in a timely manner, I would think it a good move. It will give you a bit of an insight into the life and training, and perhaps help you earn a bit higher incentive for when you go to RMC, although I am not sure how this is calculated these days. I do know that my being in the reserves certainly helped my pay incentive, but I went from NCM to NCM, I did not become an Officer Cadet. 

1. I went through ROTP selection and never had to redo an aptitude test, as my score was high enough for the officer trades I selected. I had to update my medical because it had been a few years, and I did another interview. The ROTP interview was far more in depth than any other interview I have had so far in the CF. Show up prepared and able to communicate well, and it will reflect positively on you. Research the trades and have an idea why you would like and dislike them, and show true enthusiasm to the MCC interviewing you.

2. No you can keep working with your reserve unit until you are given an offer. I would possibly not tell the unit that you intend to apply for ROTP, as they might want to hire someone else who wants to stay in the reserves longer. Not saying this is the case everywhere, but just keep that in mind. I would suggest keeping your goals to yourself, and just surprise them one day with an acceptance offer. I cannot recall there being any requirement to notify your reserve unit of your intent, but again, take this as dated experience and with a grain of salt please. Worst case scenario if you don't get in the first time around, you will have the reserves to build experience and leadership in to reinforce an application another year. Plus, it's one of the best part time jobs going. 

Last thing...make sure you pick 3 trade choices you actually want. I was stupid and only wanted my top pick. My medical file took it's sweet time to be deemed "med fit", and as such, the trade I wanted filled up. I ended up throwing a great interview and aptitude test into the garbage because I didn't want to settle for another trade. I then went Reg Force as an NCM...and I am starting to see that I missed out. Don't throw away a good chance. You may never see it again.

Good luck - keep your head down, work hard, and with any luck you will be my boss in 5-6 years.


----------



## thomf

Thank you for the response Spectrum, I really appreciate it. Especially that you went above and beyond what I asked for.

What you said about not telling the unit I hope to join that I plan to apply for ROTP, at what point do I tell them? As far as I've been able to tell from here: http://www.rmc.ca/adm/rotpr-pforr-eng.asp,  I would need to apply for a CT before I apply to ROTP. Do you or anyone know if they would consider not taking me for the reserves because I plan to apply for ROTP?

Thanks again spectrum, I will be taking everything you said into consideration.


----------



## Pusser

thomf said:
			
		

> Thank you for the response Spectrum, I really appreciate it. Especially that you went above and beyond what I asked for.
> 
> What you said about not telling the unit I hope to join that I plan to apply for ROTP, at what point do I tell them? As far as I've been able to tell from here: http://www.rmc.ca/adm/rotpr-pforr-eng.asp,  I would need to apply for a CT before I apply to ROTP. Do you or anyone know if they would consider not taking me for the reserves because I plan to apply for ROTP?
> 
> Thanks again spectrum, I will be taking everything you said into consideration.



Unless things have changed significantly since I did it (albeit 27 years ago), you should not have to mention this to your prospective Reserve unit.  Keep in mind, at this point, you are neither a Reservist, nor an ROTP candidate.  You are a civilian who's looking at options.  I suggest you treat them separately and apply for both as soon as you are able.  If you apply for the Reserve in March, you don't have to say anything about applying for ROTP, because you won't be doing it at that time anyway.  In fact, you won't even be able to apply for another six months anyway.  You could actually change your mind in that timeframe and decide that Reserve service is what you really want and you could change your mind about ROTP altogether.  Don't burn bridges before you cross them.

Once you get into the Reserve unit, you likely won't have to worry about telling them, because the recruiting system will let them know (they'll be looking for information).  Again, don't worry about this.  The Reserve actually expects this sort of thing, especially from students.  Reserve units fully realize that everytime a reservist finishes high school, there is a chance the unit will lose him/her simply because their educational path may take them away, whether it's military or not.  There's a possibility that you could get a hard time from your peers and even your supervisors, but my experience was that my Reserve unit as a whole was very supportive when I applied for ROTP.  I even got a nice congratulatory card from the JR Mess (still have it somewhere).

Think of it this way.  If you're applying for a job at McDonald's, you don't have to tell them that you're also applying for one at Burger King.


----------



## thomf

Thank you Pusser, that clears things up perfectly.


----------



## Phoebe

I'm very happy to see that this question has been answered. I can say I will benefit from this. 

        I would like to add a question relating to the benefits of taking reserve force before going into ROTP. If an individual was applying for ROTP and is declined, could the recruitment centre, at the applicants discretion,  move them into an application process that would lead them to employment with a reservist unit? I especially would hate end up having to be sitting around at home for another year do sweet nothing and having to wait another year for a shot at ROTP. Gaining experience in the reserves is probably highly beneficial and I for one would like to exploit it if I was declined from ROTP. 

Thanks in advance.

-Phoebe  :yellow:


----------



## Kayghee

Phoebe said:
			
		

> I'm very happy to see that this question has been answered. I can say I will benefit from this.
> 
> I would like to add a question relating to the benefits of taking reserve force before going into ROTP. If an individual was applying for ROTP and is declined, could the recruitment centre, at the applicants discretion,  move them into an application process that would lead them to employment with a reservist unit? I especially would hate end up having to be sitting around at home for another year do sweet nothing and having to wait another year for a shot at ROTP. Gaining experience in the reserves is probably highly beneficial and I for one would like to exploit it if I was declined from ROTP.
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> -Phoebe  :yellow:



I was actually looking for an answer to that exact same question! My situation is this:
I'm currently taking a 5th year of high school ('victory lap' as some call it), because due to certain circumstances, I ended up losing my spot at a University deeming me unfit for ROTP last year.
Anyways, I applied for 'Electrical and Mechanical Engineering Officer' as well as 'Communications and Electronics Engineering Officer' last year at ROTP. At one point, I was told by my local CFRC that I was registered for the program, but was not going to be attending RMC.
Of course, since I was not able to attend a Civillian University -and consequently ROTP- , I decided to take another year of highschool to increase the competitiveness of my profile.

This year, I applied online, e-mailed my supporting documents and am currently awaiting a replay from the CFNRCC. 

@Thomf Regarding applying to ROTP and Reserves at the same time, I don't think it's possible.
I say this because when I attended the university fair this year, I spoke with one of the correspondents for RMC regarding applying to ROTP and Reserves simultaenously and she told me that you can only apply to one at a time.
It would probably be best if you called your local CFRC (if you applied in person) or the CFNRCC if you applied online and asked them.

If anyone can answer the question regarding applying to reserves (if declined by ROTP), that'd be great!

-Kevin


----------



## stretch

I have been searching everywhere to find specific information on CT ROTP acceptances (as I am one now) and I can only find civilian timelines such as swear in dates and BMOQ (which I should be exempt from as I have my PLQ). I understand that contacting a recruiting centre would be a good idea, however my RC centre contact is away on leave for a week, my file manager in Ottawa is very busy with this years applicant processing and I have been informed that any more details will be sent by mail no sooner than 3 weeks from now.

So I am running low on time and I am intending to take a couple university courses through the summer on my own dime to ease my workload in the coming years. this means that I will be busy from may 7th to mid August and I need to know if this will conflict with any important dates or processes that will be happening though the summer.

On that note I am well aware of the nightmare of paperwork required for any CT but that can be done while still attending my classes.

Can anyone please share their experiences, and if there are any suggestions to ensure a smooth transfer than I would be more than happy to hear them.

Thank you in advance


----------



## Alex.Landry

http://www.rmc.ca/ji-ir/ji-ir-eng.asp

Everything you need to know and more.

Also, swearing in is usually within the first 2 weeks of July.

-Alex


----------



## stretch

thats perfect, I really appreciate the link.

Kind of seems stupid that I didn't think of looking for that before.

there is one thing that I forgot to add, I will be attending a civilian University does that have any bearing on the information in those JI's? that specific set seem directed towards RMC bound students


----------



## ekpiper

When I went through mine (2010) I still had to go to the RMC Recruit Camp, and there were a few other ex-reservists who were on it as well for varying reasons.  I would expect that you won't, given your PLQ, but you can never be sure.  If you have a training conflict for a final exam, you should be able to get your school to allow you to take it at a later (or earlier) date if you inform the instructor and the registrar early enough, or they'll let you take it at RMC.

Expect your COS to take place around the beginning of August, when you will inclear to your new base.  If you aren't going to the Recruit Camp, you'll probably just wind up at home after the first day doing absolutely nothing until school starts.

That is the best information that I have.  Best of luck.


----------



## stretch

thank you, very helpful! that covers my main thoughts and I've chosen a course of action.

If anyone else is willing to elaborate on their experiences, it would be great to know what CT civ U students can expect with regards to employment over the summer.

I have been thinking about asking to remain with my unit considering it is close and they wont have to worry about travel expenses.

I have no doubt this is information that can been attained during my orientation, however at the risk of being over zealous, and for the benefit of remaining well informed, could anybody fill in some blanks; share experience and inform me if i am able to discuss the option of working with my unit over the summer for convenience?

thanks again


----------



## ekpiper

stretch said:
			
		

> thank you, very helpful! that covers my main thoughts and I've chosen a course of action.
> 
> If anyone else is willing to elaborate on their experiences, it would be great to know what CT civ U students can expect with regards to employment over the summer.
> 
> I have been thinking about asking to remain with my unit considering it is close and they wont have to worry about travel expenses.
> 
> I have no doubt this is information that can been attained during my orientation, however at the risk of being over zealous, and for the benefit of remaining well informed, could anybody fill in some blanks; share experience and inform me if i am able to discuss the option of working with my unit over the summer for convenience?
> 
> thanks again



The biggest issue there is that your unit does not have a University Liaison Officer, nor the experience with handling textbook claims, etc.  I highly doubt that they would let you, and if they did, it may very well turn into an administrative nightmare.  I would have preferred to be based in Windsor with my old unit, but I didn't try changing bases, so I'm at ASU London...it is a major PITA for forms.

Between your first and second years, you will be sent on BMOQ.  In the following summers, it will be either Phase 2, SOLET (Second Official Language Education and Training), and OJT, possibly with Phase 3 or 4.


----------



## jwtg

This past year, anyone who had a certain level of experience (I forget what the requirement was) was bypassed from the recruit camp so you will probably be skipping that.  It's just lecture material/basic instruction from the first few weeks of BMOQ anyways.

Your PLQ probably gets you a BMOQ bypass, but that doesn't matter until your second summer anyways.  First year ROTP candidates do their BMOQ after their first year of school.  

I don't know what happens for CT Civ U cadets.  Guys off civi street get enrolled and placed on LWOP until they actually start doing some work, be it paperwork at the ULO or their recruit camp, and then they start school in September.


----------



## stretch

Great insights, it would seem that I have reached that point in the CF where you dont exactly know what your going to be doing until you've already done it; that is the best I could hope for. 

thank you for the input


----------



## Melbatoast

I went through the UTPNCM thing last year and was left almost completely in the dark except for these forums.

Have you accepted the offer?  As in, a message has been sent to Ottawa in reply to their offer?  If so, you can now get your unit to request a PLAR from CDA for bypassing BMOQ.  Once granted it will go on your MPRR, and your subsidized education manger (SEM) will be aware of it for future coursing purposes.  That is also done by message.

Summer employment is coordinated through your area university liaison officer (ULO).  I don't know where you're going to school, if it's the same area as your location now, but you might just want to go introduce yourself to him or her one day soon if it's feasible.  You'll get info straight from the horse's mouth.  

Through my ULO office, if you're not being sent on course it will be 85% your responsibility to coordinate your summer employment (contact the unit you want to work for, etc).  It's one guy dealing with 60+ post secondary students so you need to take a lot of the load for your own career out here.  Could be different where you are.  Coursing is done through the SEM via whomever is in charge of your occupation's training - you'll be done through the AF pilot training shop at 2 CAD.  Messages come to the ULO and will be passed to you.

You in particular probably won't be on any courses till summer after 3rd year for PFT, except for maybe language training (although we were told that has mostly been kiboshed for civy-u students).  It is theoretically possible to work for your reserve unit for this summer, _if_ they will take you.  I worked at my old navy unit last summer after switching over - it was just easier because it was such a short period of time (you have to burn most of your leave over the summer).  This summer I'm at a maritime helicopter unit, something I set up myself and got approved by my SEM and 2 CAD.


----------



## stretch

That is almost bang on to what I'm looking for, thank you

I got a call and a brief email from D mil C7 saying that I was selected and she would be sending an offer in the mail within 2 weeks and to not email or call her until I received it. I have no idea what to expect in the letter but more than that I don't want to miss the boat or deadline of replying (wouldn't be the first time I've been screwed by snail mail), so I'm a little overly anxious to get the info and letter asap so I know who to contact to reply with my acceptance.

Thank you for the heads up on the PLAR even though I haven't sent my reply yet I think I will talk to a few people in my BOR and tell them to get the paperwork ready (even if that means just printing it out). 

I'll do my best to inquire about and contact my ULO (I attend U of T by the way but I live in Brampton). I have no doubt that I will be getting to know him well based on the amount of contact you have mentioned and theres no reason why I shouldn't start now. The more were secure with one another the more trust there can be.

Whenever PFT starts I'll be ready for it, sooner is always better than later. I wonder why they would take out language training for Civ U students......

And thanks again, Agreed these forums are a pretty amazing tool (when used properly)


----------



## Melbatoast

Just do what D Mil C said.  The message will come, and it will have the effective dates and say they want an acceptance message NLT that date.  As others have said, it's normally 1 July so you have lots of time.

Defence Academy's budget was hit pretty hard, so they cut out sending people to St. Jean every summer for language training.  I guess they figure there are enough opportunities for SLT later in your career.  

There's very little paperwork for the PLAR, it's a two-line message to CDA.  Your OR can put it together super quick.

Have fun and congrats.


----------



## stretch

Fantastic. 
Thanks for the congrats and the info


----------



## dad

I came across some information but cant find it again.
basically i want to finish my apprenticeship but while i do that i want to join the reserves. after completing my apprenticeship i want to do the ROTP program but because im already in the CF theres another program for that. Does anybody know what im talking about and where i can get more information besides a recruiter.
Why i want to do this is because i have a family and transfering from NCM to officer program you get more $ while in school.


----------



## brihard

A reservist who gets in to ROTP will normally do it as ROTP. Reservists generally aren't continued to be in a class of service that brings them under the ambit of UTPNCM or the like.


----------



## dad

UTPNCM:

Eligibility and Application Procedures Admissions
In order pursue undergradudate studies at RMCC, you must meet certain eligibility criteria. 

These are: 

1.Be a Canadian citizen, or authorized by the Canadian government; 
2.Possess the required academic programme prerequisites or qualify for mature student status; and, 
3.Meet one of the following conditions: 
◦Be an applicant for the Regular Officer Training Plan (ROTP) or the Reserve Entry Training Plan (RETP); or, 
◦Be a member of the Regular or Reserve Forces and have completed basic MOSID (Military Occupational Structure Identification Code) training. 
◦CF members who have not completed their basic MOSID qualification may apply with the written recommendation of their Unit or Formation Commander; or 
◦Be honourably released from the Regular or Reserve Forces; or,  
◦Be an employee of the Department of National Defence (DND), or other Federal government department, or 
◦Be the spouse of a member of the CF. 
Individuals who do not meet these eligibility requirements for admission to RMCC and who wish to pursue RMCC's Certificate Programmes or specific individual courses offered by RMCC may apply as 'interest only' students and may be accepted, on an exceptional basis, provided there is space available and their admission serves the aims established for RMCC, the CF and the Government of Canada. 


found the information i was looking for thank you


----------



## MJP

dad said:
			
		

> UTPNCM:
> 
> Eligibility and Application Procedures Admissions
> In order pursue undergradudate studies at RMCC, you must meet certain eligibility criteria.
> 
> These are:
> 
> 1.Be a Canadian citizen, or authorized by the Canadian government;
> 2.Possess the required academic programme prerequisites or qualify for mature student status; and,
> 3.Meet one of the following conditions:
> ◦Be an applicant for the Regular Officer Training Plan (ROTP) or the Reserve Entry Training Plan (RETP); or,
> ◦Be a member of the Regular or Reserve Forces and have completed basic MOSID (Military Occupational Structure Identification Code) training.
> ◦CF members who have not completed their basic MOSID qualification may apply with the written recommendation of their Unit or Formation Commander; or
> ◦Be honourably released from the Regular or Reserve Forces; or,
> ◦Be an employee of the Department of National Defence (DND), or other Federal government department, or
> ◦Be the spouse of a member of the CF.
> Individuals who do not meet these eligibility requirements for admission to RMCC and who wish to pursue RMCC's Certificate Programmes or specific individual courses offered by RMCC may apply as 'interest only' students and may be accepted, on an exceptional basis, provided there is space available and their admission serves the aims established for RMCC, the CF and the Government of Canada.
> 
> 
> found the information i was looking for thank you



That is just the requirements that are needed to study at RMC not be accepted to UTPNCM.  It is confusing as they are linked together.  Serving reservist entering subsidized education in the Reg Force utilize the ROTP programme.  I have yet to meet someone that was a reservist becoming an officer through the UTPNCM programme.  Regardless of which program one enters though pay is protected.


----------



## Knight13

I want to join the army reserve squadron located near by (16 Y/O - 17 in September) but I also plan on applying to RMC in fall.  What are the benefits/negatives of joining the reserves first.  I talked to recruiter today and he said it would be Reserve Officer Entry Plan which would mean I would have to pay for my education plus it would be harder to transfer, but on the RMC application it says "Previous Military Experience - Cadets - Reserves - Rangers"  (I'm in cadets BTW) and that was all it mentioned of that.  Thanks - Conlan


----------



## dapaterson

Short answer:

There are many folks who have gone into the Primary Reserve then done a component transfer to the Regular Force to enter ROTP at RMC.

A quick search on this site should provide a good eal of information, and pros and cons.  If you don't like the site's search engine, try using google with "site:forums.army.ca  your search terms"


----------



## Eaglelord17

Unless you wanted to be a reserve officer through RMC you wouldn't have to pay for your degree. I would recommend waiting then applying for RMC as you would have to component transfer if you joined the reserves and it can take YEARS to component transfer. Wait until the summers over then apply to RMC, you probally wouldn't even get on course if you joined as a reservist (there pretty much booked full).


----------



## Knight13

Thank you both! I did search but didn't really find what I was looking for.


----------



## Knight13

One more thing, wouldn't a component transfer happen regardless?  I mean, if I am in the reserves for grade 12 and I am accepted into RMC, I have to show up for the following school year regardless right?


----------



## PuckChaser

Knight13 said:
			
		

> One more thing, wouldn't a component transfer happen regardless?  I mean, if I am in the reserves for grade 12 and I am accepted into RMC, I have to show up for the following school year regardless right?



You misunderstand. For your file to even get to RMC, you have to go through the Component Transfer process. That could take over a year. Are you willing to miss out on a school year, because you think joining the reserves is an easy road to RMC?

Don't waste yours or more importantly the CF's time: Wait and apply to RMC and skip the reserves.


----------



## stretch

PuckChaser has the right idea, it took me a year and a half to fully complete my CT and wait to see if I got accepted. That was without any breaks or pauses (its just how long all the processing takes).

I have been in the reserves for 5 years so it was worth it for me as I had enough time to gain the experience and knowledge I needed to make my application stronger (and other financial benefits). 

However if you intend to move on to RMC so quickly then no, reserves is a worse option as you are just creating more hoops to jump through for yourself and everyone else.


----------



## Nunavut Explorer

Hello

I an a ROTP applicant and going through selection process. I am also member of Reserve Forces and my rank is corporal. I was wondering what would I get paid while in University as Officer Cadet. Does my service as a reserve member has any bearing on my salary. 
Thank you.


----------



## eggert

What trades did you apply for?


----------



## George Wallace

Trade/Occupation has nothing to do with it.  He will have some credit for his Reserve time and rank.  For an accurate payscale, you will have to talk to the CFRC and find out what they will offer you.


----------



## brihard

Nunavut Explorer said:
			
		

> Hello
> 
> I an a ROTP applicant and going through selection process. I am also member of Reserve Forces and my rank is corporal. I was wondering what would I get paid while in University as Officer Cadet. Does my service as a reserve member has any bearing on my salary.
> Thank you.



This is only anecdote, not data- but we had one Cpl in my PRes unit go to RMC some years back. He got paid as a RegF Cpl until his officer's pay finally surpassed it. I think carrying Cpl's pay over to ROTP might be one of the greatest barely heard of things out there. I was lucky and never short of class A or B work while in school, but making a real salary to do ROTP would just be phenomenal, especially if you're at all smart with money.


----------



## jwtg

Nunavut Explorer said:
			
		

> Hello
> 
> I an a ROTP applicant and going through selection process. I am also member of Reserve Forces and my rank is corporal. I was wondering what would I get paid while in University as Officer Cadet. Does my service as a reserve member has any bearing on my salary.
> Thank you.


Brihard is correct. I'm not sure exactly how the pay scale carries over- whether you're paid the reg force rate for your former rank or not, but however they do it, you get paid a lot more than ROTP recruits off civi street.



			
				eggert said:
			
		

> What trades did you apply for?


What the hell does this matter?


----------



## ekpiper

If you look up CBI 204.211 on Google, it will explain the precise regulations. Suffice it to say that because you are a ResF Corporal, you will be paid as a RegF Corporal once you are transferred to ROTP as an OCdt/NCdt. Your IPC is dependant on how long you have been in rank, calculated by some fraction of your total Class A time, and all of your Class B time. 

Edit: Spelling


----------



## Nunavut Explorer

Thank you very much for your replies. I searched the document mentioned  online and think following section section applies to  reserve to reg force officer cadet transfer. 



204.211(10) (Officer Cadet – former non-commissioned member) An officer cadet who is appointed directly to that rank from a non-commissioned rank shall be paid:

if the member was a non-commissioned member of the Regular Force, at the rate of pay which, including any upward adjustments to the rates of pay determined under subparagraphs (i) and (ii) that may be established from time to time, and any upward adjustments resulting from the reallocation of the last military occupation in which the member served as a non-commissioned member to a higher trade group, is the greater of the rate of pay established for:
the rank, pay increment, pay level and trade group held on the day immediately prior to the date of appointment to the rank of officer cadet, or
any higher pay increment to which the member would have become entitled had the member remained in the former rank, pay level and trade group as a non-commissioned member; and
if the member was a former Regular Force member who re-enrolled or a member who transferred from the Reserve Force to the Regular Force, at the rate of pay, including any upward adjustments to the rates of pay, in CBI 204.30 (Pay – Non-commissioned members) for:
the rank, pay level and trade group that they would have received had they enrolled directly as a non-commissioned member as determined in orders or instructions issued by the Chief of the Defence Staff, at the pay increment determined by CBI 204.015 (Pay Increments); or
any higher pay increment to which the officer would have become entitled under CBI 204.015 (Pay Increments) had the officer remained in the former rank, pay level and trade group as a non-commissioned member.


now, I am trying to decipher it.

thanks again


----------



## Nunavut Explorer

Now that I've read it couple of time, it has started to make sense. I think I will be paid at reg force Cpl pay scale  after transition to Reg force O cadet.


----------



## stretch

how many years in do you have? I had 6 before I came to the ROTP I could share a round-about guess and some financial upsets to prepare for aswell


----------



## oscarmu272508823

So I am currently a dedicated artillery reservist (trade qualified) doing my BscNursing degree at UBC (first year almost done! YAY~)
I applied for ROTP-CT undergraduate 2013-2014 Air Force Nursing Officer, and have received an interview two months ago. They did not tell me how I did right after the interview, however I called CFRC VAN for inquires 2 months later, and the recruiter checked my files and told me that my interview and personality test are pretty competitive.  (Yay once again)
So my questions are: 
1.	Anyone could tell me, since my interview & all those things are “pretty competitive”.  How likely (compare to civilians & others) is my ROTP Nursing dream.
2.	As a reservist, does it increase your chance to get accepted?
3.	What other factors (besides your interview & personality tests) would be considered by Ottawa to make their final decisions?
4.	When will Ottawa announce the result? (approximated dates)
5.	 I am currently a Gnr/Pte (T) in the reserve, what would my pay check look like as an OCADT? Will I get a Pte pay scale, or just basic OCADT pay? (So I can have a brief overlook on my finance)
-	(I forgot to ask the recruiter these questions  because I was happy with my ‘pretty competitive’ result)   
-	[I did not join the military for the $, I joined the military for service and career.]


I think it is good idea to answer the question in order of 1.2.3.4.5 easier for me and other people 

Thanks,		~~ and hopefully you all have good luck on your military careers~


----------



## brihard

oscarmu272508823 said:
			
		

> So I am currently a dedicated artillery reservist (trade qualified) doing my BscNursing degree at UBC (first year almost done! YAY~)
> I applied for ROTP-CT undergraduate 2013-2014 Air Force Nursing Officer, and have received an interview two months ago. They did not tell me how I did right after the interview, however I called CFRC VAN for inquires 2 months later, and the recruiter checked my files and told me that my interview and personality test are pretty competitive.  (Yay once again)
> So my questions are:
> 1.	Anyone could tell me, since my interview & all those things are “pretty competitive”.  How likely (compare to civilians & others) is my ROTP Nursing dream.
> 2.	As a reservist, does it increase your chance to get accepted?
> 3.	What other factors (besides your interview & personality tests) would be considered by Ottawa to make their final decisions?
> 4.	When will Ottawa announce the result? (approximated dates)
> 5.	 I am currently a Gnr/Pte (T) in the reserve, what would my pay check look like as an OCADT? Will I get a Pte pay scale, or just basic OCADT pay? (So I can plan ahead my finance)
> -	(I forgot to ask the recruiter these questions  because I was happy with my ‘pretty competitive’ result)
> -	[I did not join the military for the $, I joined the military for service and career.]
> 
> 
> I think it is good idea to answer the question in order of 1.2.3.4.5 easier for me and other people 
> 
> Thanks,		~~ and hopefully you all have good luck on your military careers~



1-2: Nobody can really comment on the competitiveness of your file. Being a reservist won't hurt, however as a Pte you aren't exactly standing on a ton of experience that would carry weight.
3: Intake numbers  needed for the trade for the year, how many are to be internal versus external, likely your academics, etc etc.
4: Ottawa will announce the result when they decide to. Don't hold your breath waiting for it.
5: You may or may not get to keep your current pay. When are you up for Bdr? I have known several people to make Cpl before switching to ROTP who kept their pay. I don't have a firm idea of the exact policy on this. Don't let yourself 'plan ahead' based on anything short of a real policy document, or even better, your component transfer offer.


----------



## oscarmu272508823

Brihard said:
			
		

> 1-2: Nobody can really comment on the competitiveness of your file. Being a reservist won't hurt, however as a Pte you aren't exactly standing on a ton of experience that would carry weight.
> 3: Intake numbers  needed for the trade for the year, how many are to be internal versus external, likely your academics, etc etc.
> 4: Ottawa will announce the result when they decide to. Don't hold your breath waiting for it.
> 5: You may or may not get to keep your current pay. When are you up for Bdr? I have known several people to make Cpl before switching to ROTP who kept their pay. I don't have a firm idea of the exact policy on this. Don't let yourself 'plan ahead' based on anything short of a real policy document, or even better, your component transfer offer.



Your info is really helpful and ur right I should not 'plan ahead'. I just want to have a brief overlook. Thanks for your answer ~


----------



## stretch

I am at RMC now, I transferred as a Cpl but there is an OCdt here who did barely a year in the reserves before switching and he has a significant pay jump over the other Cadets.

I didn't ask him in detail, obviously, how much he gets paid, however even though it is more than the average OCdt, don't expect much.

There are a lot of deductions from our pay and along with the taxes, it can sometimes be quite a shock if you "count your eggs before they hatch"


----------



## Chernoble

I don't have experience on a personal level but:

An aquantaince of mine that is serving with a reserve Unit was having quite the time doing a "component transfer" to the regular force, to become an officer, as an NCM.  It may just seem like it but it might be easier to get accepted to ROTP off the street vice a component transfer from Reserve to Reg.

I can tell you from a personal standpoint, it would probably be easier for me to get out and apply for ROTP than competing for UTPNCM spot like I am now.  

Nothing is guaranteed though and experiences do vary!  Good luck!


----------



## htam_har

Afternoon everyone,

I just had a couple questions about some things in my offer. I am Pte BMQ trained, and I'm curious about what Incentive Credits, Time Credit for Promotion and Enter Promotion Zone are.

Thanks


----------



## Crispy Bacon

Incentive credits: the number of days you're being given towards your next incentive pay category (IPC).

Time credit for promotion: the number of days you're being given towards your next promotion.

Enter promotion zone: when you're promotable to the next rank


----------



## htam_har

Morning all,

I'm off to Kingston soon for RMC and I'm a PRes CT to ROTP. I was in the Army element but changed over to Air force now. My question is, is that my unit is telling me that I go into the clothing stores and exchange my shirts for blue ones, return my MOB box, duffels and rucksack but would I not need that kit for BMOQ? Are these items re-issued prior to BMOQ or when I go in for in-clearance. The joining instructions on the RMC website say that I should be *closing* my clothing docs.

Hope you guys can shed some light for me, thanks.


----------



## DAA

As a CT to the Regular Force, you are required to complete all your CT paperwork and clear out of your previous Reserve Force Unit and that would include returning all kit issued which is considered an "accountable" item.

You will be "reissued" all new clothing and equipment after you arrive at RMC.


----------



## ekpiper

Good morning,

When I CT'd, I returned everything, save for one or two articles. I showed up to Kingston for the 2 week Recruit Camp "course" with pretty much just my combat boots. The positive was that I was issued most of the things that I needed, but the negative was that they gave me very poor sizing on a number of items that had previously fit well (CADPAT went from 7040 shirt to 7044...fun doing a swimming test in a sail clotth).

At the very least, get a copy of your docs, and separate what is not listed there. I ended up not returning some next to skin articles like balaclava, and thermal underwear, which was never reissued to me, and some mosquito netting. I never closed out my clothing docs, and experienced no ill effects from it, although they are a little more cluttered than some others.


----------



## Bassil_Inf

Good day,
  It has been a while since I've posted on here. I am now a fully qualified infanteer reservist and am in first year university. I am looking forward in component transferring soon to the Reg force as an infantry officer through the ROTP program. I was a couple points off qualifying for officer one year ago when I wrote my CFAT for the PRes, so I hope to re write the CFAT and qualify as an officer. I hope to get some progress and update everyone on my progress. From what I understood, I must deal with my BOR whom will transfer my application to the CFRC. Anyone got tips/their 2 cents? Thanks!


----------



## runormal

I've done this.

What you need is to put in a component transfer on the dwan. It is a very simple form that is only 2 pages. You provide some tombstone data and then select the trade you wish to apply for. You must also select the officer entry plan as ROTP.

When I did it back in 2012 I never dealt with the Cfrc directly and just  kept in contact with my file manager at Dmil-c7. However Dmil-c7 is no longer in charge of cts the responsibility is now DCMPG-5 I believe all the rc does is book interviews/medicals If  required. Hopefully someone can confirm this.

One last point DCMPG 5 is understaffed due to budget cuts so until they start contacting you _likely_ won't be able to communicate with them. If you try you will get a message sent back saying "due to budget cuts we can't give individual sit reps at this time ."

If you update something on your MPRR i.e fitness/transcripts I'd get your chief clerk to contact DCMPG 5 on your behalf to ensure they have that. 

To start this either contact your COC or chief clerk.

Cheers and good luck.

Edit:changed a few words around


----------



## Bassil_Inf

Good day everyone,
I have submitted my CT online at my BOR about 2 days ago, and received a confirmation email from Ottawa with my MPRR attached. I was asked to email a copy of my high school transcript. I am currently in first year university, and upon reviewing my MPRR that was attached to the email, under the education section it says I have only completed 2 years of high school. Would just sending my transcript be sufficient for them to know I've completed high school? Also is receiving the confirmation the next day a good sign or the process going fast? Thanks!


----------



## PuckChaser

Send them what they asked, and then go to your BOR with your High School diploma in hand, your clerks can update that you are completed HS.


----------



## Zsimaandru

I have already understood to follow.


----------



## crewman4l

I created a new post after looking though all the treads and not finding any information pertaining to my questions. I apologize if I missed a similar post.

I joined the reserves 3 years ago to an armoured recce unit as an NCM. During this time I have been attending a civi university, and I am currently in second year. I have now applied to the ROTP - Undergraduate to become an armoured officer. If I do get accepted to this program what are the chances that they will keep me at the university I am attending now for my last two years? Also would I keep the Cpl pay that I am getting now, or would I be paid the same amout as a new OC? And last thing is would I have to complete BMOQ and BMOQ-L, if I have already completed BMQ, and BMQ-L? 

I really appreciate all responses. Thank you


----------



## jwtg

crewman4l said:
			
		

> If I do get accepted to this program what are the chances that they will keep me at the university I am attending now for my last two years? Also would I keep the Cpl pay that I am getting now, or would I be paid the same amout as a new OC? And last thing is would I have to complete BMOQ and BMOQ-L, if I have already completed BMQ, and BMQ-L?


1) No idea how likely it is that you would get to stay at Civ U.  Many have tried and still ended up at RMC, but obviously there is a possibility.  If I were to guess, I would say that 2 years probably gives you a decent shot at staying there, but that's a guess.

2) I don't know if you would move laterally into the Reg Force Cpl pay bracket, but I do know that there is a way that they calculate your pay which includes your prior service.  Having been a Cpl, you will make a lot more money than OCdts off civi street.

3) A PLAR will be done which will assess your previous courses and their equivalencies in the officer stream.  You will *probably* have to complete at least part of BMOQ (BMQ does not cover the 'Leadership' aspect), and all of BMOQ-L.  I know several former Cpls who have gone this route, both completing a shortened (7 week, IIRC) BMOQ and all of BMOQ-L.


----------



## Conz

I after completing my second year of university, I was accepted into ROTP and remained at my civi institution. There were former Cpls and a MCpl on my BMOQ course that stayed at their pay grades. Because they had already completed BMQ, they came into my pl in mod 2 and only had to do 7 of the 14 weeks for the leadership component of the course.


----------



## sidemount

I went to university with a guy that CT'd from res ncm to ROTP

He was paid at his NCM rate.


As for BMOQ, unless you have PLQ completed......expect to have to do some of it


----------



## PteAJL

So I was wondering some things as I'm on class B contract and I've asked around my OR for information, and didn't get much due to the lack of staff.

I've already missed the deadline to apply for ROTP through the DWAN. I'm clear with that.

I applied to several civilian universities, and I will most likely attend university in September. I'm requesting an attach posting to another unit, and I was wondering, if I wanted to apply for ROTP for the next academic year, do I apply through my home unit or the unit I am attached to?

Second, I will be completely DP1 Veh Tech qualified by the end of this summer coming up should I go on course if it's running.
Does the unit you are attached to have the authority to promote a soldier from another unit?


----------



## DAA

PteAJL said:
			
		

> I've already missed the deadline to apply for ROTP through the DWAN. I'm clear with that.



Obviously not.  You can still apply for ROTP, even beyond the deadline.  The only caveate which comes with applying late, is that they cannot guarantee that your processing will be completed in time for the first round of selections.

If you want to apply for ROTP, I'd suggest you do it now!


----------



## PteAJL

I've tried to access the CT application through the DWAN from the link on the RMC website for three days in a row now.

The link is dead, or someone in Ottawa isn't doing their job right...


----------



## DAA

PteAJL said:
			
		

> I've tried to access the CT application through the DWAN from the link on the RMC website for three days in a row now.
> 
> The link is dead, or someone in Ottawa isn't doing their job right...



Yup, that is a bad link on their website.  We shall try and have them update it.


----------



## Eric Wang

Hi Everyone, I am currently in grade 9, entering grade 10, I want to join the Naval Reserve force next year (2016), and when I graduate high school (2018) I want to go to RMC (Royal Military College of Canada). I have few questions that I want to ask.

1. How will the reserve benefit me? 

2. Do reserves get deployed to another base? 

3. I am currently 14, birthday is on July 19 (2015). However, my age will still be 15 in grade 10 until July 19 (2016) Can I apply for reserve even if I didn't fully turn 16

4. I have bad vision, right eye -3.75 left eye -4.75 will it lower my chance of joining? 

5. I want to improve my leadership skill to get in RMC. Will the reserve benefit me? I do have some leadership skill because I did won the student council election, which means I will be running as a grade 10 representative next year.

6. What are the grades requirement in order to apply for MARS officer (when I apply)

7. Do RMC look at grades from grade 9? or grade 10? (when I apply)

8. When I apply for RMC, how competitive is it going to be

This is all the questions that I want to know, can someone please answer my questions? Thank you so much for taking your time reading through my questions and answering them.


----------



## Loachman

Good morning, Eric, and welcome to Army .ca

If you take the time to look around this Site, and use the Search Function, you will find answers to your questions. You will also find answers to questions that have no even occurred to you yet.

We, both in the CF and on this Site, expect people to do their homework. Assistance will happily be provided if you need it, but doing your own digging will help you more than anything else that we can do right now.

You've got plenty of time...


----------



## runormal

I'll help as much as I can.

Background: I'm an army reservist who joined the reserves after getting declined from RMC. I reapplied once I was in the reserves, I got accepted and turned it down as I wasn't sure what I wanted at the time.

Onto your Questions

1. There is a direct correlation between how much you put in the reserves (time) and the benefits. Obviously the more you show up, the more money you will make. However the more you show up, the better you will be at your job, you will make more friends and quite frankly you will enjoy it a hell of a lot more if you show up more. You may also be recognized from your CoC for a good career course or a good tasking. You can also get an ILP (Individual Learning Plan) for up to $2k a yr to help assist with post-secondary funding assuming you do not get into RMC.  There are also dental benefits, claims, td, field pay. The list goes on and on. I’d recommend it to anyone, but caution that it is not for everyone.

For me the biggest things the reserves have given to me: A solid group of friends, leadership experience, a major empathise on attention to detail and some pretty cool experiences on the job. I’ve also become a better driver, learned some car parts and have become a better trouble shooter. It is also an extremely flexible job as a student, which doesn’t hurt.

Everyone’s experience will differ and you will get more out of the reserves if you actually put the time and effort in.

2. Not quite sure what you are asking. I know you can apply for tasking/CLS B at various bases in the Army Reserve. We also train at various bases on weekends. I’m not sure about the Navy.

3. Pretty sure you need to be 16 to apply, ask your CFRC because to be honest I don't know.

4. You will find this out when you apply. Only a Medical officer can make the call. 

5. Depending on your trade, and how long you are in the reserves. Likely, no one can say for sure.  You should be able to extract some leadership experience regardless of what you do.

6. Technically you need an Undergrad degree, but since you are applying for ROTP they will look at your average HS grades. It is very competitive you can look at the threads in the RMC boards. If you had a bad year or semester, put effort into improving your marks. I was cut for academics. 

7. I had to give a transcript and was told they took a straight average from 9-12. (Again I'm not a recruiter so I don't know for sure). But I was told my average for HS was mid-70s, but my last 6 grade 12 course were 87.5%. Such is life I guess.

8. It varies year to year. Think about it this way, you are looking at a full ride scholarship, and making some money on the side, as well as guaranteed job after graduation. Furthermore the 4 years at RMC is pensionable time… How bad do you want that? Now realize you are going to be competing against the best of best across Canada. Do whatever you can now in your power to be the best you can. 

Food for thought:
Don’t worry too much about the people you are applying against. Worry about what you can to do improve yourself. Volunteer, Get involved in sports (Try to become a captain or assistant captain), get more involved with your school. Study hard. Also if you aren’t in shape get in shape now. Even if one part of your application is poor you may be able to make it up somewhere else. (Example: Marks are low but you have an amazing CFAT and Interview).


----------



## Eric Wang

Q 3. I am currently 14, birthday is on July 19 (2015). However, my age will still be 15 in grade 10 until July 19 (2016) Can I apply for reserve even if I didn't fully turn 16
A 3. Pretty sure you need to be 16 to apply, ask your CFRC because to be honest I don't know.

New: Do I have to turn fully 16 to apply? because my birthday is the summer (July 19) is it possible to apply during the middle of grade 10 somewhere between March/April, so I can get an early start? Or do I have to wait until my birthday and turn fully 16, then I may apply.

Q 4. I have bad vision, right eye -3.75 left eye -4.75 will it lower my chance of joining? 
A 4. You will find this out when you apply. Only a Medical officer can make the call. 

New: http://imgur.com/Tli5o1Y <--- Does this mean I don't have to do a vision test? It says its only necessary for aircrews.


----------



## Eric Wang

runormal said:
			
		

> I'll help as much as I can.
> 
> Background: I'm an army reservist who joined the reserves after getting declined from RMC. I reapplied once I was in the reserves, I got accepted and turned it down as I wasn't sure what I wanted at the time.
> 
> Onto your Questions
> 
> 1. There is a direct correlation between how much you put in the reserves (time) and the benefits. Obviously the more you show up, the more money you will make. However the more you show up, the better you will be at your job, you will make more friends and quite frankly you will enjoy it a hell of a lot more if you show up more. You may also be recognized from your CoC for a good career course or a good tasking. You can also get an ILP (Individual Learning Plan) for up to $2k a yr to help assist with post-secondary funding assuming you do not get into RMC.  There are also dental benefits, claims, td, field pay. The list goes on and on. I’d recommend it to anyone, but caution that it is not for everyone.
> 
> For me the biggest things the reserves have given to me: A solid group of friends, leadership experience, a major empathise on attention to detail and some pretty cool experiences on the job. I’ve also become a better driver, learned some car parts and have become a better trouble shooter. It is also an extremely flexible job as a student, which doesn’t hurt.
> 
> Everyone’s experience will differ and you will get more out of the reserves if you actually put the time and effort in.
> 
> 2. Not quite sure what you are asking. I know you can apply for tasking/CLS B at various bases in the Army Reserve. We also train at various bases on weekends. I’m not sure about the Navy.
> 
> 3. Pretty sure you need to be 16 to apply, ask your CFRC because to be honest I don't know.
> 
> 4. You will find this out when you apply. Only a Medical officer can make the call.
> 
> 5. Depending on your trade, and how long you are in the reserves. Likely, no one can say for sure.  You should be able to extract some leadership experience regardless of what you do.
> 
> 6. Technically you need an Undergrad degree, but since you are applying for ROTP they will look at your average HS grades. It is very competitive you can look at the threads in the RMC boards. If you had a bad year or semester, put effort into improving your marks. I was cut for academics.
> 
> 7. I had to give a transcript and was told they took a straight average from 9-12. (Again I'm not a recruiter so I don't know for sure). But I was told my average for HS was mid-70s, but my last 6 grade 12 course were 87.5%. Such is life I guess.
> 
> 8. It varies year to year. Think about it this way, you are looking at a full ride scholarship, and making some money on the side, as well as guaranteed job after graduation. Furthermore the 4 years at RMC is pensionable time… How bad do you want that? Now realize you are going to be competing against the best of best across Canada. Do whatever you can now in your power to be the best you can.
> 
> Food for thought:
> Don’t worry too much about the people you are applying against. Worry about what you can to do improve yourself. Volunteer, Get involved in sports (Try to become a captain or assistant captain), get more involved with your school. Study hard. Also if you aren’t in shape get in shape now. Even if one part of your application is poor you may be able to make it up somewhere else. (Example: Marks are low but you have an amazing CFAT and Interview).



Thank you so much for answering most of my questions, It did help a lot.


----------



## Loachman

Eric

Please see my earlier post.

Start reading older threads and using the Search Function before you ask more questions.


----------



## runormal

I would like to confirm what I have found on the RMC website. Over the holidays I will be meeting up with a family friend`s younger son. From what I gather said individual is debating on joining the reserves or applying to ROTP or both. I want to ensure that I have the most up to date information. 

https://www.rmcc-cmrc.ca/en/registrars-office/eligibility-criteria

I`ve noted that it says:

In order to pursue undergradudate studies at RMCC, you must meet certain eligibility criteria.

These are:


> Be an applicant for the Regular Officer Training Plan (ROTP); or,
> Be a member or, be an honourably released member of the Regular or Reserve Forces, and have completed basic MOSID (Military Occupational Structure Identification Code) training.
> CF members who have not completed their basic MOSID qualification may apply with the written recommendation of their Unit or Formation Commander; or
> Be an employee of the Department of National Defence (DND), or other Federal government department, or
> Be the spouse of a member of the CF.




I believe that this is referring to reservists who want to study at RMC on their own dime and not through the ROTP program. Is this assumption correct? 

I then searched some more and found a dedicated section for ROTP for reservists 

https://www.rmcc-cmrc.ca/en/registrars-office/regular-officer-training-plan-rotp-reservists

Regular Officer Training Plan (ROTP) - Reservists



> If you are currently a member of the Reserves and would like to apply for the Regular Officer Training Plan you may do so by applying on-line for a Component Transfer (CT) and submitting the application to D MIL  C.
> 
> Once the application has been properly submitted, D MIL C will advise the member and the member's Reserve unit and will commence processing the application with the appropriate Canadian Forces Recruiting Centre.
> 
> Once the assessment has been completed the Recruiting Centre will in turn advise D MIL C of the candidate's eligibility and suitability for ROTP.
> 
> It is important for Reserve members to submit the application to D MIL C as soon as possible and to read the appropriate CF MIL PERS INSTR pertaining to CT



CF Military Personnel Instruction 03/08 (http://cmpapp.mil.ca/dgmc/pg/iss-si/ct-tee/ct-app-tee-eng.asp)


I have found one important piece of information in section 4.9:

4.9 Component Transfer Career Programs 



> All CT applicants selected for attendance to an RMC program and meeting the OFP status under this instruction shall be treated as if they were UTPNCM candidates. CT applicants who do not meet the OFP status shall be treated as if they were ROTP candidates



Which I understand as saying that if a member reaches OFP they will likely have vested rights to pay + a slightly more lucrative pay scale upon graduation. 


OFP



			
				Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> Add-on point.  Check your occ specs for your trade OFP.  Not all are the same.  My current trade OFP is QL5. My previous trade was QL3.



I`m going to assume _most _army reserve trades are OFP is at QL3 or dp 1.0. However I do have a few friends in the SVC batallion (veh techs, weapon techs) who have said that they "will never get trained completely" because of the sheer amount of time it takes. 

If anyone has anything else to add that'd be greatly appreciated. 
Thanks


----------



## Haggis

You may also want to investigate this.

 University Program for Primary Reserve Members


----------



## runormal

Thanks Haggis, 

if anyone has anything else to add that'd be great.


----------



## Tait

Please accept my apologies if this is answered elsewhere. I have looked.

I have a current application for CT-ROTP with ACSO as my trade aspiration. My interviews, medicals, university / RMC applications and aircrew selection were all successful but I haven't heard anything for a month. I did contact my CFRC but my MCC is on long term sick leave.

Does anyone know what happens next? Is there a timeframe for the next step (which I assume is an offer or otherwise)? I hope to start this summer.

Thanks!


----------



## mariomike

Tait said:
			
		

> I haven't heard anything for a month. I did contact my CFRC but my MCC is on long term sick leave.



From Ask a CAF Recruiter,

if you would like to know the status of your application, it is recommended that you do the following:

•   Visit the link to our Forces site, ( http://www.forces.ca/en/page/contactus-73 ) and submit a status update request for your application. 
•   If you know your application number, include it in the email. 
•   If you do not know your application number, ensure you include your first name, last name, date of birth and the postal code of your home address. This will ensure that the recruiter who receives your email can locate your application and provide you with a status update.
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/118929.0.html



			
				Tait said:
			
		

> Is there a timeframe for the next step (which I assume is an offer or otherwise)?



TIMINGS - ESTIMATED TIMES FOR_______________  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/81054.0


----------



## runormal

You are in an interesting situation being a CT applicant.

The CFRC _doesn't_[1] know your status, they merely process paperwork and book medicals etc as directed by DMCPG-5. I know that this there RMC is doing the early acceptances but I'm not sure if that applies to CT. When I applied in 2011 we all heard  around may. You will need to get a hold of your CT file manager.

You should have his contact information from one of the initial emails after you submitted your CT. 

Edit:1
FYI- typically they don`t give status updates but if you ask for a general range as when you should hear something they should be able to help you out. 


Edit 2: [1]

I looked in my email and found something that will help. I was asking about the early acceptance. 

''Thank you for your interest in the Canadian Armed Forces (CAF).

As you are a CT as with all other off the street applicants the CFRC will council you as to if you have qualified for the early offer.  Your CT Broker will be notified shortly as to your being selected for further processing.

It is generally only to the top 80% to 100% that will qualify for early offer.''

So it _seems_ that you if qualified for an early acceptance the CFRC will know, but if you haven't you will have to shake the trees at DMCPG-5.

Hope it helps


----------



## DAA

Yup, contact your CT Broker at DMCPG 5-2 as any CT Offer will come from that office.


----------



## mariomike

Tait said:
			
		

> Please accept my apologies if this is answered elsewhere.



No need to apologize. The number of Component Transfers ( CT ) to RMC/ROTP discussions is overwhelming. 

For future reference, perhaps Component Transfers ( Reserve to RMC/ROTP ): Q&A  will be merged, as Component Transfers (Reserve to Regular): Q&A  was.

These Reserve to RMC/ROTP discussions are _just a sampling _ of what is out there,


CT-ROTP 
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/122099/post-1418030/topicseen.html#new

ROTP CT acceptance  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/105655.0/nowap.html

CT ROTP, Army PRes to Air Force 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/115914.0

Component Transfer from Res Force to Reg Force for ROTP
https://army.ca/forums/threads/91320.0

( RMC ) Eligibility for CLS A reservists? 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/121255.0

Component Transfer from Res Force to Reg Force for ROTP  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/91320.0/nowap.html

CT from Reserves to ROTP  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/89151.0/nowap.html

Questions on CT ROTP offer  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/115537.0

PRes to ROTP application process  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/103410.0

Reserve before ROTP = higher chance? & questions  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/109955.0

Joining the Reserves before ROTP  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/104216.0

CT'ing going to CMR ROTP  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/92675.0

Interesting Problem - ROTP Component Transfer  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/85120.0

NCM to ROTP  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/95594.0
"I've just gone through the CT a couple of months ago into ROTP, so I can direct you to a few references if needed."

PRes to ROTP, Unit Clearing Out  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/31592.0

Reserves to RMC  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/86697.0;nowap

Reserves before RMC?
http://army.ca/forums/threads/106290.0

Reserves to RMC to Army  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/19204.0

Questions about joining the Reserve force and RMC  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/119563.0

Cadets vs Reserves for RMC applicant 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/96589.25


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## Tait

Thanks for all the help. 

I contacted DMCPG-5 and had a very clear response that my file is in order, I am merit listed (not that I'm sure what that means precisely) and waiting for the selection board for ROTP. 

There is no guidance as to the timeline for the selection board meeting and a decision being made but at least I know that all the admin has been done and "merit listed" sounds good, right?


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## mariomike

Tait said:
			
		

> I am merit listed (not that I'm sure what that means precisely)



You can read about the Merit List here,

The Merit List Mega Thread of Questions  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/12776.0
10 pages.


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## Tait

Thanks!


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## mariomike

Tait said:
			
		

> Thanks!



You are welcome.  Good luck.


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## Adam0216

I am a Reserve Naval Cdt. (Officer)  27 years old, I am looking to get into the ROTP program (Marine Engineering Officer). I have completed my BMOQ and MARS II and I also have completed most of my Engineering degree with only about two years left. I would like to know what pay scale I will fall under if I go to school under the ROTP program. I see on the pay scale:

A - ROTP (former CBI 204.2111 & 204.2151)
B - OCTP-NFS (former CBI 204.2113 & 204.2153)
C - DEO (former CBI 204.2114 & 204.2154)
D - UTP-NCM / OCTP-FS (former CBI 204.2112, 204.21135, 204.2152 & 204.21535)
E - CFR (former CBI 204.212) 

I  cant find what each means exactly , so I am hoping for clarification. I hope I fall under the B - OCTP-NFS, as the "A" will be like a little bit more than a week pay for me, which is not viable.  This is an important fact for me because I am a professional Engineering Technologist with an established career in the in the privet sector with all my experience coming form supporting the Navy and I am confident ill be an asset in the Navy. I understand  I will be taking a large pay cut if I go ROTP but, I also want to finish my degree and be apart of the awesome organization that I came to like more and more through out my time in training at the fleet school. so can some one please tell me what I am really getting into here when it comes to the finances, I am confident that I understand other aspects of the sailors life, its just this pay thing that is stopping me from leaving the office and running away to the navy. 

Best regards, 
Adam


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## George Wallace

It will be indicated on your Msg informing you of your offer to join as to what Pay Scale you will be brought in under and what IP you will have.  

Right away you can eliminate the following:

E - CFR ..... as you will not be getting promoted from the ranks.


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## DAA

CBI 204.211(3) (Rate of pay – ROTP) An officer to whom the ROTP applies shall be paid, for each month after the month and year specified in the table, at the rate of pay established for the officer's rank and pay increment as follows

b.  subject to QR&O 203.20 (Officers – Regular Force – Limitation of Payments) , if an officer cadet with no former non-commissioned member service, in pay level A of Table A to this instruction.

Simply put, the same rate of pay that a newly hired ROTP applicant would be paid.


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## Lumber

Also, factor in that while in the ROTP program, you won't have to pay tuition or any other education expenses (books, supplies). 

Depening on where you live and are going to school, you would receive PLD. That's anywhere form 0 (Kingston) to something like $1500 in Toronto.

If you live with your parents, bonus!

Where are you going to school?


----------



## Adam0216

Hello, 

Thank you for informative replies. 

I have the choice to go to school in Thunder Bay, ON, or Cambridge, ON. Yes, if I am going to be under the class A pay which is very little I would like to choose the location that will have a PDL rate. I am from Ottawa originally and I heard the PDL is zero here.


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## Brasidas

Adam0216 said:
			
		

> Hello,
> 
> Thank you for informative replies.
> 
> I have the choice to go to school in Thunder Bay, ON, or Cambridge, ON. Yes, if I am going to be under the class A pay which is very little I would like to choose the location that will have a PDL rate. I am from Ottawa originally and I heard the PDL is zero here.



Call me a pedant, but there's a difference between what you would be paid and Class A pay.


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## Adam0216

My mistake "level A" pay. Not class A. 

Unfortunately I am married and have a family, I mean unfortunate in this context. So $1500 a month will not cut it for me at all. If I were to get some thing like $3000 a month we can still live with not much of a drastic change in lifestyle.

I guess this ROTP is a freshmans game.  

It sad that the military can't recognize my qualification in the privet sector even though it's directly related. 

If some one has any input to guide me to a positive outcome please share. 

Thank you


----------



## mariomike

Adam0216 said:
			
		

> If some one has any input to guide me to a positive outcome please share.



You may find this discussion of interest,

CT -- Reserves into ROTP/RMC (merged) 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/19204.0
7 pages.

For future reference, perhaps "NAVRES to ROTP" and "CT -- Reserves into ROTP/RMC (merged)" will be merged.


----------



## DAA

Adam0216 said:
			
		

> My mistake "level A" pay. Not class A.
> Unfortunately I am married and have a family, I mean unfortunate in this context. So $1500 a month will not cut it for me at all. If I were to get some thing like $3000 a month we can still live with not much of a drastic change in lifestyle.
> I guess this ROTP is a freshmans game.
> It sad that the military can't recognize my qualification in the privet sector even though it's directly related.
> If some one has any input to guide me to a positive outcome please share.
> Thank you



Your options are rather limited here.  It's a good thing that you don't already hold a commission, because if you did, it would make you ineligible for a Component Transfer to ROTP.


----------



## Adam0216

that's  a surprise,

I will get Commissioned end if this summer with the successful completion of MARS 3. I was thinking that is a good thing for my ROTP as I might get a higher pay? are you saying officers who are commissioned cannot be in the ROTP program to get their degree? 

if this is the case then what can a commissioned officer do to complete there degree with in the military? is there another program? 

best,


----------



## DAA

If you don't have DWAN access, then you want to pay a visit to your Unit Orderly Room and ask for a copy of CANFORGEN 002/14.

The Readers Digest condensed version is........

OVER THE PAST DECADE, THE COMPONENT TRANSFER ROTP APPLICANT POOL HAS SEEN A SHIFT FROM RES F NCM S TO MORE SENIOR COMMISSIONED OFFICERS APPLYING FOR FULL-TIME SUBSIDIZED EDUCATION. AS THE PLAN WAS NEVER INTENDED TO ATTRACT COMMISSIONED OFFICERS, IT IS NECESSARY TO CLARIFY AND ESTABLISH ELIGIBILITY CRITERIA WITH RESPECT TO THE TYPES OF APPLICANTS WHO MAY APPLY FOR THE ROTP UNDER CFAO 9-12. EFFECTIVE 1 SEPTEMBER 2013, APPLICATION TO THE ROTP IS LIMITED TO THE FOLLOWING TYPES OF APPLICANTS: 

(A) CIVILIAN APPLICANTS 

(B) RES F NCM S OR 

(C) RES F OFFICERS WHO ARE HOLDING THE RANK OF OFFICER CADET/NAVAL CADET AND ARE UNQUALIFIED IN THEIR CURRENTLY ASSIGNED MILITARY OCCUPATION (I.E., WHO HAVE NOT REACHED THE OPERATIONALLY FUNCTIONAL POINT OF THEIR ASSIGNED MILITARY OCCUPATION) 

OFFICERS HOLDING THE RANK OF SECOND LIEUTENANT/ACTING SUB-LIEUTENANT WHO HAVE NOT YET OBTAINED A DEGREE AND WISH TO APPLY FOR COMPONENT TRANSFER TO THE REG F MUST DO SO THROUGH THE CONTINUING EDUCATION OFFICER TRAINING PLAN - REGULAR FORCE (DAOD 5002-6)


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## Adam0216

I must Admit this forum is very good. 

It might be wise for me to not do MARS 3 then, as I am not trying to be a MARS offer in the RegF anyway, I enjoy doing in the reserve and the actual  training is awesome for a hobby. Does any one know what are the chances of an applicant qualifying for ROTP and when they might find out of that fact? is it going to be before September? I have qualified for ROTP in 2013 but I decided to just join the reserve instead. this time I know I would go for it but, Unsure what the acceptance rate is for MSE officers as its no longer in demand.


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## DAA

Adam0216 said:
			
		

> I must Admit this forum is very good.



We try our best and when in doubt  --->   http://www.ask8ball.net/


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## Adam0216

Thank you for the email, I did apply online already before the closing date now its me gauging how much time I have before I will have to leave work and what kind of saving I need to make till (If) I get accepted etc. I wonder If RegF will allow me to start school in the winter semester etc.


----------



## DAA

Adam0216 said:
			
		

> Thank you for the email, I did apply online already before the closing date now its me gauging how much time I have before I will have to leave work and what kind of saving I need to make till (If) I get accepted etc. I wonder If RegF will allow me to start school in the winter semester etc.



In which case, you need to maintain contact with your Transfer Broker at DMCPG 5-2.  I trust you were already sent the link for the RMC Portal to complete your application and upload your current transcripts???


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## Adam0216

yes, I first requested a component transfer filled out the DWAN questionnaire then I received the link and I followed it and uploaded the transcripts but, I do not know nay thing about a Transfer Broker at DMCPG 5-2. no one contacted since I uploaded by transcripts. should I be looking for this broker?


----------



## DAA

Adam0216 said:
			
		

> yes, I first requested a component transfer filled out the DWAN questionnaire then I received the link and I followed it and uploaded the transcripts but, I do not know nay thing about a Transfer Broker at DMCPG 5-2. no one contacted since I uploaded by transcripts. should I be looking for this broker?



YES, you need to get in touch with your Broker as soon as possible to find out what the results of your Academic Assessment were and just where your file stands.


----------



## mariomike

For reference,



			
				DAA said:
			
		

> As an "active" serving NCM member of the PRes and if you wish to apply for ROTP, it is now considered to be a Component Transfer (ie; Res F to Reg F).  As a result, you won't be applying through your local Recruiting Detachment but rather online through the DMCPG 5-2 CT Portal, which you can do at your own leisure and through a DWAN Computer.  Your ROTP Application will be managed by DMCPG 5-2, who will provide you with the details and requirements after you have applied.
> 
> Your local Recruiting Detachment can't help you.


----------



## Saskalarri

My son, currently in Gr 11, has applied to Reserves (infantry) and the process is moving along, just awaiting an interview.  His long term plan is to apply to RMC after his senior year to study military psychology.  

I have found an old thread regarding whether it is a mistake to apply to RMC as an reservist due to the length it takes for the component transfer. It apparently can either make the process longer or no problems whatsoever.  The posts were from 2010 so I am wondering if the component transfer delay is still an issue. He will be talking to his recruiter about it as well, but thought I would ask here while he is waiting to hear back. 

These boards have been a fountain of information. Thank you.


----------



## brownsailor03

So I've been looking around the forums but haven't seen anything regarding this

Does anyone know any information regarding selection messages for CT into ROTP for Log?

Thank you in advance


----------



## Morror21502

Hello
Wondering how long it typically takes to hear back after a CT to ROTP. Currently in grade 12, in reserves, and applying to RMC as pilot. I haven’t heard anything yet, not even a confirmation that it was received. 
I heard there is no way to contact anyone to check. 


Thank you


----------



## winds_13

Morror21502,

If not done already, complete an application on the Forces.ca website. You can also contact your nearest recruiting centre, they will be processing your file.


----------



## Morror21502

But with a component transfer I understood you do not do an application. In fact I tried online and it would not let me. The CT is the application. That is submitted to D MIL C and there doesn’t seem to be any way of contacting them.


----------



## jaysfan17

Morror21502 said:
			
		

> But with a component transfer I understood you do not do an application. In fact I tried online and it would not let me. The CT is the application. That is submitted to D MIL C and there doesn’t seem to be any way of contacting them.



I’m in the same boat dude. I’ve emailed the D MIL C people numerous times only to tell me we’ll get back to you when we hear more info on ROTP. Problem is ROTP 20-21 was supposed to start Sept 1st. It’s ridiculous that  I haven’t heard anything. My latest email to D MIL C is I asked if they could confirm that I fall under the ROTP program and buddy emailed me this past Thursday saying he’ll get back to me mid next week. I’ve asked the clerk at my unit handling my file to look into it for me, but I haven’t heard anything back yet. I suspect I’ll hear some progress soon, but it’s still frustrating. If I don’t hear any news I might just call the recruiting centre. I don’t know why but maybe they’ll have some insight.

Also, I’m not sure why people online are suggesting to reapply to the forces altogether. We’re already in. We’re just doing CT’s.


----------



## Morror21502

Thanks. How did you email D MIL C?

I read elsewhere that it might be better to quit and apply as a civilian, which sounds ridiculous.


----------



## jaysfan17

Morror21502 said:
			
		

> Thanks. How did you email D MIL C?
> 
> I read elsewhere that it might be better to quit and apply as a civilian, which sounds ridiculous.



Sent you a PM


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## jaysfan17

Just got my ROTP notice with the link and additional info. I am now official applying to RMC.

For future notice those of you doing a CT (ie: currently in reserves) with the entry plan ROTP selected, make sure you constantly email Ottawa (you’ll receive the email address in the CT receipt) until you hear whatever news you are looking for.

Persistence folks. No need to consult the recruiting center or reapply to the forces online.


----------



## MisterBig

I have seen multiple anecdotes on Cpl pay carrying over to ROTP as OCdt.
Received my offer today for Log O ROTP. I am currently a reservist with a Cpl pay rate.
The pay rate cited is Pte PI 1.

I have checked the CBIs. It sounds as if I would have received the Cpl pay rate, and that the PI was determined by days of service at the current rank. However, there is another clause:
204.015(6) (Reduction or reversion)
On reduction in rank or reversion to a lower rank, an officer or non-commissioned member shall be paid at the pay increment for that lower rank that is determined by taking into account all previous qualifying service in that rank and in any higher rank.
*How is this determined? *204.015 sounds as if it is speaking* only of the PI, not the rank to be paid at itself.*

How does this compete with this other clause:
204.211(10) (Officer Cadet – former non-commissioned member) An officer cadet who is appointed directly to that rank from a non-commissioned rank shall be paid:
b. if after August 2018, if the member transferred from the Reserve Force to the Regular Force, at the rate of pay, including any upward adjustments to the rates of pay, in CBI 204.30 (Pay – Non-commissioned members) and:

if the member was a private trained, a corporal or an any greater rank, the rank, pay level and trade group that they would have received had they enrolled directly as a non-commissioned member as determined in orders or instructions issued by the Chief of the Defence Staff, at the pay increment determined by CBI 204.015 (Pay Increments)
EDIT: Found it - 204.015(7)

has completed one year of qualifying service, or after such lesser amount of qualifying service as may be authorized by the Chief of the Defence Staff.
*A future reference for anyone doing CT ROTP as a Cpl/Bdr: you are not necessarily going to receive Cpl pay. A lot of people told me this was the case, and a lot of people said so online. No one said otherwise.*
If you have completed LESS than 1 year of qualifying service, you will receive Pte(R) pay. Still better than OCdt but do with that what you will.
'Qualifying Service' - 1:1 Class B and Class C days | 1:4 Class A days (a Class A day is worth 25% of a Reg Force day)


----------



## winds_13

MisterBig said:


> I have seen multiple anecdotes on Cpl pay carrying over to ROTP as OCdt.
> Received my offer today for Log O ROTP. I am currently a reservist with a Cpl pay rate.
> The pay rate cited is Pte PI 1.
> 
> I have checked the CBIs. It sounds as if I would have received the Cpl pay rate, and that the PI was determined by days of service at the current rank. However, there is another clause:
> 204.015(6) (Reduction or reversion)
> On reduction in rank or reversion to a lower rank, an officer or non-commissioned member shall be paid at the pay increment for that lower rank that is determined by taking into account all previous qualifying service in that rank and in any higher rank.
> *How is this determined? *204.015 sounds as if it is speaking* only of the PI, not the rank to be paid at itself.*
> 
> How does this compete with this other clause:
> 204.211(10) (Officer Cadet – former non-commissioned member) An officer cadet who is appointed directly to that rank from a non-commissioned rank shall be paid:
> b. if after August 2018, if the member transferred from the Reserve Force to the Regular Force, at the rate of pay, including any upward adjustments to the rates of pay, in CBI 204.30 (Pay – Non-commissioned members) and:
> 
> if the member was a private trained, a corporal or an any greater rank, the rank, pay level and trade group that they would have received had they enrolled directly as a non-commissioned member as determined in orders or instructions issued by the Chief of the Defence Staff, at the pay increment determined by CBI 204.015 (Pay Increments)
> EDIT: Found it - 204.015(7)
> 
> has completed one year of qualifying service, or after such lesser amount of qualifying service as may be authorized by the Chief of the Defence Staff.
> *A future reference for anyone doing CT ROTP as a Cpl/Bdr: you are not necessarily going to receive Cpl pay. A lot of people told me this was the case, and a lot of people said so online. No one said otherwise.*
> If you have completed LESS than 1 year of qualifying service, you will receive Pte(R) pay. Still better than OCdt but do with that what you will.
> 'Qualifying Service' - 1:1 Class B and Class C days | 1:4 Class A days (a Class A day is worth 25% of a Reg Force day)


MisterBig, the para on "reduction or reversion" in rank does not apply in your case. Transferring from Cpl to OCdt is considered a promotion, not a reversion in rank, regardless of the lower pay levels for OCdt (ROTP). The other para seems pretty clear, you will be paid at a rate that is equivalent to what you would receive if you had done a straight CT, PRes to RegF, in your current NCM trade.


----------

