# The CAF doesn't owe you a job.



## Scott (1 Jan 2012)

*The following advice is said in the most gentle tone possible*

I believe that we are, at least for this decade, in some pretty unprecedented times as far as recruiting for the CF goes. Fewer openings and more applicants makes for big competition. Many closed trades lead to loads of questions being asked here and we aim to help alleviate some of the clutter on the forums as well as ease your mind just a bit.

A few points:
-More people applying plus less jobs open equals much more competition for fewer jobs. Personally, I think that it would have been a good idea to hang up a "closed" sign on some Recruiting Centers (RCs), but that would cause the forums to implode with all of the questions and panic.

-*Simply meeting minimum standards is no longer acceptable.* You have to strive to be better and better, no matter how good your resume is right now. If you're happy with the bare minimum then you may apply, but do not be surprised if your file sits, and sits, and sits. *Now before someone PMs us to tell us how awesome they were with just the bare minimum - we get it. But you would likely agree that you're the exception rather than the rule.*

-_Blemishes on your past will be more amplified the tighter a competition is._ Use any downtime you have to clear up your record, if possible.

-Your "desire" means very little at the end of the day, sorry. While admirable, it has to be assumed that everyone applying has a desire to join.

-Recruiting Centers typically do not process applications for jobs that are not open.

-*Sometimes the best advice is, "Call the CFRC/your recruiter" *That's just the way it is. The Milnet family of sites are unofficial and have no ties to DND. We might have recruiters looking in and we might not - we defer to the recruiters so that *you* get the best info possible.

-Don't get discouraged if you are told that it will be a few months wait before you can go through the process. *Use that time* to learn a new skill, work on a second language, volunteer, start the pardon process for that mistake you made, get another few months clear of the wacky baccy, hit the gym, and so on. Use potential setbacks as opportunities - you can talk about them in your interview. Waiting times are opportunities in disguise - personally, I'd rather hire the guy that used his downtime to better himself than the thud who sat around eating Cheetos and playing Xbox.

-*DO NOT APPLY FOR A TRADE JUST TO GET IN.* Not only will this make you unhappy, but it closes the door for someone else who may really want that trade. Be prepared to serve in any trade on your application for many years. The CF does not have the luxury of being able to transfer you after spending time, money and resources training you for the trade you were hired under.

_The above list is not exhaustive. If you have something to add/delete/edit please PM me._

We cannot say this enough, and by no means to we intend to offend:

*The CF does not owe anyone a job.*

You are applying against what could be hundreds, if not thousands, of people for what very well could be a very few jobs (perhaps even single digits). Just because it's the CF does not mean they HAVE to hire anyone - you must compete, just like you'd have to compete for a job anywhere.

If you applied for a job elsewhere, would you automatically _expect_ them to hire you? Of course not, as there are not openings for every interviewee and candidate.

You have the right to apply, and at the same time the CF has the right to process or not to process, for their reasons. Given the current economy, political climate and culture, the CF can afford to be choosy, so why shouldn't they?

Many of your questions have already been asked and answered, so please make extensive use of the site's search feature. If, after searching, you still have a question then please ask it; that's what the boards are here for. However, do not get upset when you do not get the answer that you are looking for or are told something you did not want to hear. Don't simply rephrase the question to ask it differently because the answer will be the same.

Lastly, getting pissed off and trying to insult people when you do not get the answers you are seeking, or you're told to call the CFRC and speak to a recruiter, will win you no favours here, and may ultimately result in loss of access to this site. As suggested above, recruiters may be lurking as well, so it is in your best interest not to sabotage your own process with poor behaviour.

Most of all: GOOD LUCK!


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## Scott (18 Jan 2013)

Hi all,

The title is not at all meant to act as a slap or slight against you, anyone in the process, or those of you here because you're considering the process. If anything I am hoping that readers will gather some insight from this thus helping us declutter the forums a wee bit. 

Of course all of the forums are here for discussion and for you to ask questions. We've had candidates quote recruiters as saying, ''Go read Army.ca'' when their questions got in depth or perhaps too much to handle. We take this as a compliment and we are proud of it, as all members who help someone considering a career in the CF should be. That's never going to stop.

However, I have been noticing a trend on the site over the last few years where not only do we get a personal story (which is encouraged, by the way, in the Personal Stories board) but we also get pretty tough questions to put an answer to. The easy ones, such as:
-I just smoked a fatty and played Hungry Hungry Hippos all night, will the CF hire me? Or,
-I'm a triple amputee, blind and have schizophrenia, can I get in?
can be answered pretty simply and we aim to continue to offer the BEST advice possible - which is often taking the form of: go talk to a recruiter - but I also feel we can lend *reason* to the inevitable answer to the above, or to other situations. 

The posts that go like this:
-I just graduated with a PhD in basket weaving and want to join the CF as a steward and then progress into medical school, will the CF look at me degree with good favour or should I start anew and try a different stream? 
Are pretty difficult to say anything to other than, ''Go speak to a recruiter''

Not to be a dink, but we know everyone has a reason why they believe their story is unique and why they are, pardon the term, special little snowflakes of their own. That's great. I'd never discourage that belief. But telling someone here that you expect answers to your questions based solely on what could be flawed information you are providing, and the fact that you are a special little snowflake, gets no one anywhere. What we get is multiple threads that look similar and end similarly. Plus reported posts because special little snowflakes do not seem content with searching, or with heading into an RC to lay it all out and ask for themselves. Or, after they head to the RC and present their case and get blank expressions, or told it will take a while, come here to ask WHYYYYYYY? I'm afraid there are some things we just can't answer for you. Furthermore, getting pissed off when you do not get an answer you like, even when you state you want honesty, does no one any good.

From another end of the spectrum: For those who think they've done everything right: grades, sports, volunteerism, leadership roles, etc., we can't give you much more advice than _“you sound like you've got the right background.”_ While we see what you claim to have achieved, what we cannot see is how many other applicants are equally well qualified. They are the ones you will be merited against for a limited number of vacancies. Yes, you may appear to be competitive, but so are a hundred others vying for 20 positions. We cannot guess your chances. We cannot offer examples wait periods that you can expect to match. We can only say _“you look like you'll survive the recruiting process [but you already knew that], be patient.”_

From yet another: CFRCs are run by humans and humans have the annoying capability of making mistakes or, hopefully less commonly, being complete lazy fuckwads. We fully understand that some people can be given a raw deal, and others might come away with bad information. Please use the site, as most always have, to suss out whether or not this applies, and also to seek out remedies for said situation. Nobody wants to see someone get ''screwed'' and so I think anyone potentially facing a situation like this would find nothing but help from the membership. That said, consider your individual case before you go down this line with us - we might not have seen it all, but we have seen a lot in our collective experience within the CF, and here among the threads and posts within.

To go back, it is dead easy to tell the dude who is bankrupt and just got nailed for DUI that he has a very tough field to hoe. The guy who has the extra leg and the lazy eye to along with serious epilepsy is also a little more easy to tell - good luck, but don't get your hopes up. To others: if this is what you want then go apply. None of us, even the ones who have worked in recruiting, are experts. The one thing all situations have in common is that the very best of answers will come from a visit to an RC and actually sitting with someone to talk about this. To the rest: if you feel you truly had a mistake made then do something about it. We get that you're upset. Some of us have been fucked around in certain situations and can understand how frustrating this feels. If we can help then that is what we are here for.

If there's something useful that anyone thinks should be added please PM me. 

I'll sign off as speaking for the membership as it was the membership that helped inspire this post.

*Thanks to the members who are continually updating me with suggestions and alternative points to consider.*


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