# Special Forces to SWAT?



## DarkFireTaker (2 Nov 2008)

I remember watching Flashpoint, which I find very interesting and a great TV show especially because it's Canadian. During the episode where they introduce Sam Braddock, I think they said he joined their tactical team directly from JTF2. It's great on TV, but is it really possible in real life? I know for a fact that you can't join a tactical team directly from the Army, you'd have to apply for the police and go through what every other regular cop goes through.. but what about special forces?

Links regarding Flashpoint:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashpoint_(TV_series)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Characters_of_Flashpoint


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## HItorMiss (2 Nov 2008)

Having talked to a member of the OPP Tac Team, who used to be a member of JTF2

No you cannot you still must do the minimum beat time.


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## Civvymedic (2 Nov 2008)

I saw that original episode as well and I think how they play that characters history is he had taken a LOA from the Toronto Police Service having had some experience then went to the CF and JTF then came back to Police.....

Jeez and I was bugging my girlfriend the other day about her soaps.... :


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## Greymatters (3 Nov 2008)

Writers licence is a wonderful tool - how else are you going to get a superninja-spook ops-doorkicker on a SWAT team?

_Plus its a lot cooler than saying the guy used to be top horse handler with the musical ride, or handed out the most tickets while with the traffic division.  Apparently just being a good dedicated cop isnt enough..._


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## CougarKing (3 Nov 2008)

Will someone please correct if I'm wrong- SWAT units are called SRUs here, right? For both the RCMP and regional/city police forces like the VPD (Vancouver)?


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## medaid (3 Nov 2008)

NO

ERT is the RCMP and Most Municipals here in BC. SRU, ICE, HRT and other terms are used by different agencies and different forces depends on who's in charge when they first named it.


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## Civvymedic (3 Nov 2008)

I think you will find it's different everywhere. Ive worked alongside them here in Ontario and it varies. ETF Emergency Task Force. (Toronto Police), TSU Tactical support unit for some others.


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## Greymatters (3 Nov 2008)

Most LEA's in western Canada use the term ERT - at least they did as of a few years ago, has there been a trend in renaming these teams recently?


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## medaid (3 Nov 2008)

Greymatters said:
			
		

> Most LEA's in western Canada use the term ERT - at least they did as of a few years ago, has there been a trend in renaming these teams recently?



Empire building?  ;D


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## Nfld Sapper (3 Nov 2008)

And here on the Rock its called the Tactical Response Unit.


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## CougarKing (3 Nov 2008)

MedTech said:
			
		

> NO
> 
> ERT is the RCMP and Most Municipals here in BC. SRU, ICE, HRT and other terms are used by different agencies and different forces depends on who's in charge when they first named it.



Thanks for the clarification. So you really don't like watching "Flashpoint" because of that character who the writer tries to make up to be ex-JTF2?


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## Greymatters (3 Nov 2008)

Actually we should be reading between the lines on this one - to make such an effort to make the police officer an ex-JTF2, doesnt it acknowledge that the public perception is that the best ERT members would be those that used to be with JTF2?


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## medaid (3 Nov 2008)

CougarDaddy said:
			
		

> Thanks for the clarification. So you really don't like watching "Flashpoint" because of that character who the writer tries to make up to be ex-JTF2?



I think it's stupid. No research... just pure bs.


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## Haggis (3 Nov 2008)

Civvymedic said:
			
		

> I think you will find it's different everywhere. ..... TSU Tactical support unit for some others.



Bosnian Police "SWAT" units are also called Tactical Support Units.  Worked with them on my last tour in Bosnia and they're pretty switched on.


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## twistedcables (3 Nov 2008)

FYI - JTF2 originated with the SERT (Special Emergency Response Team) of the RCMP (http://www.jtf2.forces.gc.ca/faq/index-eng.asp. - see question 9).  The RCMP's current tactical unit is called the ERT, Toronto's ETF (Emergency Task Force), OPP has several tactical units (http://www.opp.ca/specresteams/index.htm), and as the others mentioned, variations exist among the other services.

SWAT is an American term and is not used anywhere in Canada.  In fact, even Special Forces is an American term, whereas Canada uses Special Operations Forces (like CANSOFCOM) to convey the same idea.

Semantics really.


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## stryte (3 Nov 2008)

twistedcables said:
			
		

> SWAT is an American term and is not used anywhere in Canada.  In fact, even Special Forces is an American term, whereas Canada uses Special Operations Forces (like CANSOFCOM) to convey the same idea.



Regina Police has a SWAT team. http://www.reginapolice.ca/swat.htm


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## Greymatters (3 Nov 2008)

twistedcables said:
			
		

> FYI - JTF2 originated with the SERT (Special Emergency Response Team) of the RCMP (http://www.jtf2.forces.gc.ca/faq/index-eng.asp. - see question 9).



FYI - You are misinterpretting that statement.  JTF2 took over the responsibility the SERT had, but did not originate from them...


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## twistedcables (3 Nov 2008)

http://www.jtf2.forces.gc.ca/faq/index-eng.asp#que-09 

"Q9 - Hasn't JTF 2 been developed out of the Canadian Airborne Regiment?

A9 - JTF 2's soldiers perpetuate the proud tradition of Canadian Special Forces dating back to World War II. Although several members of JTF 2 served with the Canadian Airborne Regiment during their career, today's JTF 2 is very different from any other CF unit that preceded it. It has a rigorous training and selection process for modern-day operations, and a very unique role designed to counter modern threats to Canada.

JTF 2 was created on April 1, 1993 when the Canadian Forces accepted responsibility for federal counter-terrorism operations from the RCMP. Prior to the creation of JTF 2, the RCMP's Special Emergency Response Team (SERT) was responsible for federal counter-terrorism operations. Since its creation, JTF 2 has evolved, and this evolution is continuous. The threat of terrorism comes from an elusive, sophisticated and determined enemy. In order to maintain an edge on its potential adversary, JTF 2 is continuously developing new capabilities, technologies, and tactics."


Thank you GM for the correct phrasing.  I say it originated from them only because from what I know, many of the SERT guys went on the become the first JTF2 members - a very natural thing.

And thank you PILON - I stand corrected.   Other sources also stand corrected like, 

http://ca.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080813075042AAq1Crp 

 In fact, here's a recent story about the Regina SWAT:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/saskatchewan/story/2008/10/17/atm-arrests.html?ref=rss 

Cheers


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## HItorMiss (4 Nov 2008)

twistedcables said:
			
		

> Thank you GM for the correct phrasing.  I say it originated from them only because from what I know, many of the SERT guys went on the become the first JTF2 members - a very natural thing.



No they didn't...members stayed with SERT as they trained up members of the CF to hand over the job to a functioning unit who then went on to seek training from other units and validate their training.


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## DarkFireTaker (4 Nov 2008)

Yeah, that would make sense. I mean, if someone can't directly join a SWAT team from JTF2, then it would be the same for someone wanting to join JTF2 directly from SERT (at the time).

About using the SWAT term, lol I use it cause it's more common and I can get more people to understand what I'm saying. American terms seem to be big these days. About using the term in Canada, some police forces do, it doesn't matter. I mean, at the end of the day, they all have about the same goals and tasks (whether you call them SWAT, ERT, SRU, HRT, ETF, ETU, ERU, ESU, SRT, TRU, TIG, GTI, etc.). To me, they're all synonyms for some type of a specialized tactical/paramilitary unit composed of highly trained members of some type of police force.

In addition, got a video link for you guys concerning the Flashpoint TV Show ex-JTF2 now-SRU character Sam Braddock: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pM4NA6K6oQ
What do you guys think? How accurately depicted is he?


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## canuckkwan (4 Nov 2008)

a few years ago I was very lucky to have the chance to go to Toronto's ETF station. Interestingly enough, one member of the ETF was apparently ex-JTF2, and another guy who went through ETF as bomb squad was (for lack of a better word) a bomb specialist in JTF2. he actually had his hand blown off one mission so he had to leave but he got a hook and made it through the police service! I saw him back in May and he's K-9 now.
don't know if it's related or not to the show, but about four years ago, my friend's dad was actually the sergeant for Team 1, and his last name is Gregory (similar to the character Sgt. Greg(ory) Parker), his nickname or son's name is Parker or something, and he had semi-smiliar relationship issues that I won't get into). just throwing it out there, thought it was interesting.


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## Greymatters (4 Nov 2008)

twistedcables said:
			
		

> I say it originated from them only because from what I know, many of the SERT guys went on the become the first JTF2 members - a very natural thing.



Can anybody verify this?  Its cerainly different from what I know.  I have never heard of RCMP SERT becoming JTF2 members, other than a training/advisor capacity during the handover...


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## HItorMiss (4 Nov 2008)

Grey Matter check my reply they didn't, a training cadre remained in place to train the incoming CF pers who then after being trained sought out more modern training from other CT units.


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## Greymatters (4 Nov 2008)

canuckkwan said:
			
		

> don't know if it's related or not to the show, but about four years ago, my friend's dad was actually the sergeant for Team 1...



If you are refering to JTF2 members, or any special police unit, I think they would appreciate your not putting their names in open posts...


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## Greymatters (4 Nov 2008)

BulletMagnet said:
			
		

> Grey Matter check my reply they didn't, a training cadre remained in place to train the incoming CF pers who then after being trained sought out more modern training from other CT units.



Copy, see my PM...


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## twistedcables (4 Nov 2008)

GM - yes you are right (of course).  The info I got came from RCMP members who claim they heard this from some ERT guys - but either one or both did not know the correct answer.

I was able to get a much better verification through DND and it is as GM and BM said.

Thanks guys - this place would be a mess without you...


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## Greymatters (4 Nov 2008)

No credit for me, I am not an SME on the subject, I think BM and others here are more knowledgeable but are limited in what they can say in this forum...


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## 2 Cdo (4 Nov 2008)

canuckkwan said:
			
		

> a few years ago I was very lucky to have the chance to go to Toronto's ETF station. Interestingly enough, one member of the ETF was apparently ex-JTF2, and another guy who went through ETF as bomb squad was (for lack of a better word) a bomb specialist in JTF2. he actually had his hand blown off one mission so he had to leave but he got a hook and made it through the police service! I saw him back in May and he's K-9 now.
> don't know if it's related or not to the show, but about four years ago, my friend's dad was actually the sergeant for Team 1, and his last name is Gregory (similar to the character Sgt. Greg(ory) Parker), his nickname or son's name is Parker or something, and he had semi-smiliar relationship issues that I won't get into). just throwing it out there, thought it was interesting.



The ex-JTF troop who is missing a hand is also ex-Canadian Airborne Regiment, 2 Cdo. I haven't seen him in 20 years so it's good to hear he's doing well.


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