# "Ontario highway 'toll booth' peaceful: OPP"



## mariomike (22 May 2010)

"TORONTO (CBC) - A nominal toll booth on a busy northwestern Ontario stretch of highway is slowing down long-weekend motorists, but has been a peaceful incident so far, OPP said Saturday.
Members of the Couchiching First Nation set up on Highway 11 on Friday afternoon, stopping motorists to collect a $1 toll and hand out literature explaining why they were there.":
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/manitoba/story/2010/05/22/mb-ont-couchiching-toll-booth-10522.html

"Welcome to Couchiching First Nation Toll Booth Initiative Website":
http://couchiching.ca/page5/TollBooth/tollbooth.php

According to the website, $25.00 monthly passes are available:
http://couchiching.ca/page5/TollBooth/page62/page62.html


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## ballz (22 May 2010)

I had to go through one of these toll booths when I was living in Corner Brook, NL, a few times... It was some church group collecting money so they could go to Africa and force their beliefs on somebody else as usual.

They had it set up on a bridge that connects 6 communities to CB, people couldn't get to work or back home without getting across that bridge. Due to the fact that was completely unexpected and out of the blue, people were getting to work/school/whatever late, and getting home late.

Personally, I thought it was a bit way too much, especially when they were knocking on my damn window.


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## cn (22 May 2010)

Is that even legal? I understand the police are monitoring it, but holding up traffic, setting up an unofficial toll booth and not letting vehicles pass until they pay does not seem too legit to me.


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## Spanky (22 May 2010)

So, what happens when someone refuses to pay?


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## harry8422 (22 May 2010)

HMM anyone else wondering why the police don't just order them to remove the booth? this has to be against the law, or i may be mistaken but i don't think i am.


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## Retired AF Guy (22 May 2010)

I like this quote from the article, _"The OPP suggested motorists may wish to consider alternate routes to avoid delays associated with the toll booth."_ My suggestion is that may be the OPP should do its job and enforce the law.


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## Fishbone Jones (22 May 2010)

Enabling domestic terrorism. It's what the McSquinty liebral government has done since they took power. They are ignoring the problem and will denounce the next government that is sure to take their place, for doing something about it. These people and groups are criminals and domestic terrorists. The sitting government doesn't have the balls to apply the letter of the law equally to everyone in the province. If you are a tax paying citizen, you have no rights. If you are aboriginal, you can take over huge tracts of land, from said tax paying citizens by violence. Steal their houses and their property, with the help of the Ontario Provincial Police and sitting McSquinty liebral government and you will not be prosecuted, in fact, you will be rewarded.

The OPP, their boss Fantino and McSquinty have no stomach to confront these terrorists head on and apply the rule of law availed to all citizens of this country and province. There are two sets of rules in Bantario. One for the taxpayer, and none for terrorist aboriginals.

We pay taxes for unencumbered access to the roads that we pay for. Anyone restricting said access is breaking the law, and should be arrested post haste, on the spot and the thoroughfare kept open.  However, our OPP, Fantino and McSqunty's liars don't have the balls to deal with criminals. They have abdicated the rights and soverienty of the tax paying citizens, to low life terrorists and criminals, for political expediency and culpability.

Bantario is a sad province, led by sad, ineffectual and useless zombies, with no guts and no balls. It has become a province held captive by special interest groups, criminals and terrorists, led by an ineffectual cabal of useless gluebags.


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## DexOlesa (23 May 2010)

> On Saturday, the OPP issued a news release to say they were monitoring the situation.
> 
> "Participants have been peaceful and co-operative with police," said the release from Insp. John Kendrick of the Rainy River District OPP.
> 
> ...



This is not a complex issue, just kick them off. It's not legal to just set up a toll booth on a highway. (i'm 99.999% sure)


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## SeanNewman (23 May 2010)

Spanky said:
			
		

> So, what happens when someone refuses to pay?



The key to this is being as vocal as possible that you feel like you are being threatened (and even better if your kids are in the car and claiming you feel like they are being threatened).

And when I say "vocal", I mean escalating the thing until you force them to do something that gives you no choice but defending the safety of your family by knocking the people out in a rampage, possibly with a bat.

The key is not to just jump to that step though, as that would land you in jail.  You have to ensure all the other people near you will have heard your *multiple* warnings (to the guy not letting your car pass) that you feel like your family is being threatened.

I can freely say that I would avoid paying that $1 on principal indefinitely.  They are doing something completely illegal, and the gem of it all is that if OPP are there and they don't do something to save you from being extorted (robbed, essentially) you can sue the hell out of them.  You basically can't lose.  Either you get to punch a lot of idiots in the face and have it be completely legal, or you get rich.

Worst-case scenario = you demand they let you by, the OPP does nothing, you throw some punches and end up getting beat up before the OPP comes in to break it up, at which point you still end up ahead (and suing the OPP for allowing criminal behaviour but now for a lot more since you're beat up due to said illegal activity that the OPP did not stop).


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## harry8422 (23 May 2010)

That's it I'm setting one up on petawawa blvd and i will charge 50 cents both ways to cross the bridge, anyone want in? split profits 50/50


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## SeanNewman (23 May 2010)

harry8422 said:
			
		

> That's it I'm setting one up on petawawa blvd and i will charge 50 cents both ways to cross the bridge, anyone want in? split profits 50/50



Do it!  It would force them to finally build the second bridge across the river from the North PMQs to Ypres like they've been planning on doing for 30 years when Petawawa had 1/5th the soldiers and traffic it does now.

Thank god I don't live there anymore.  Nothing like living 2km from work and having a 1/2 hour commute in the winter.


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## Retired AF Guy (23 May 2010)

The Ghosts of  Ipperwash  still haunt the Ontario legislative building and until they are exorcised no action will be taken against native extremists.


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## MP_Bound (23 May 2010)

All my posts are in yellow, and important information pertaining to the particular quote is in red.

According to the Highway Traffic Act of Ontario the part that governs tolls in the Province of Ontario is as follows:

PART X.1
TOLL HIGHWAYS

Definitions, Part X.1
191.1  In this Part,
“electronic toll system” means all of the equipment, including the toll devices prescribed under clause 191.4 (a), that is used to electronically determine the amount of tolls owed and who owes them; (“système de péage électronique”)
“toll highway” means Highway 407 as defined in the Highway 407 Act, 1998 and any other highway designated as a toll highway under any Act. (“voie publique à péage”) 1996, c. 1, Sched. E, s. 2 (3); 1998, c. 28, s. 67 (1).
Toll device required
191.2  (1)  No person shall drive a motor vehicle on a toll highway unless a validated toll device, as prescribed under clause 191.4 (a), is affixed to the vehicle in accordance with the regulations made under clause 191.4 (b). 1996, c. 1, Sched. E, s. 2 (3).
Validation of toll device
(2)  For the purpose of subsection (1), a validated toll device is a toll device that is validated under the Capital Investment Plan Act, 1993 or a toll device that is validated under the Highway 407 Act, 1998. 1998, c. 28, s. 67 (2).
Evasion, etc., of electronic toll system
191.3  (1)  No person shall engage in an activity or use any device or material for the purpose of evading, obstructing or interfering with the effective operation of an electronic toll system. 1996, c. 1, Sched. E, s. 2 (3).
Powers of police officer
(2)  A police officer may at any time, without a warrant, stop, enter and search a motor vehicle that he or she has reasonable grounds to believe is equipped with or carries or contains a device or material contrary to subsection (1) and may seize and take away any such device or material found in or upon the motor vehicle. 1996, c. 1, Sched. E, s. 2 (3).
Forfeiture of device, material
(3)  When a person is convicted of an offence under this section, any device or material seized under subsection (2) by means of which the offence was committed is forfeited to the Crown. 1996, c. 1, Sched. E, s. 2 (3).
Sale of interference device prohibited
(4)  No person shall sell, offer or advertise for sale any device or material that is designed or intended to interfere with the effective operation of an electronic toll system. 1996, c. 1, Sched. E, s. 2 (3).
Regulations, toll devices
191.4  The Lieutenant Governor in Council may make regulations,
(a) prescribing toll devices for the purpose of section 191.2;
(b) prescribing the manner in which the toll devices shall be affixed in or on a motor vehicle;
(c) exempting any vehicle or class of vehicles from the application of section 191.2. 1996, c. 1, Sched. E, s. 2 (3).

So yes, you are right in saying that it is illegal to put up a toll booth in the Province of Ontario, with the exception of Highway 407, which we all know was leased to a private consortium by the Harris Government in 1999 for 35 years.





			
				Spanky said:
			
		

> So, what happens when someone refuses to pay?



Couchiching First Nation put up their controversial toll booth late this afternoon at the west end of the Noden Causeway on Highway. #11.
While originally set to go up at noon, delays meant that the booth wasn’t set up until almost 4 p.m. with Couchiching Chief Chuck McPherson, alongside Coun. Dan Mainville the first to step into the booth to collect the first tolls.

 The first cars to go through who paid were met with applause from the dozens of Couchiching community members who lined the side of the road . Other vehicles chose to drive through, refusing to pay a cent.

No one is required to pay while passing through this part of Highway 11, only encouraged to support the cause in which the First Nations are informing motorists, as pointed out below
Letters were given out to those in the passing vehicles to mail along to Indian and Northern Affairs Minister,Chuck Strahl. The letters urged action on the issues which are the motivation behind the band’s decision to put up the toll booth—contaminated soil, and compensation for the land Highway #11 sits upon.



			
				recceguy said:
			
		

> Enabling domestic terrorism. It's what the McSquinty liebral government has done since they took power. They are ignoring the problem and will denounce the next government that is sure to take their place, for doing something about it. These people and groups are criminals and domestic terrorists. The sitting government doesn't have the balls to apply the letter of the law equally to everyone in the province. If you are a tax paying citizen, you have no rights. If you are aboriginal, you can take over huge tracts of land, from said tax paying citizens by violence. Steal their houses and their property, with the help of the Ontario Provincial Police and sitting McSquinty liebral government and you will not be prosecuted, in fact, you will be rewarded.
> 
> The OPP, their boss Fantino and McSquinty have no stomach to confront these terrorists head on and apply the rule of law availed to all citizens of this country and province. There are two sets of rules in Bantario. One for the taxpayer, and none for terrorist aboriginals.
> 
> ...



Following the band’s action, individual O.P.P. vehicles drove past the toll booth at various intervals and then at approximately 6:15 p.m, uniformed officers parked off of the highway and proceeded on foot to speak with members of the public who were present.
O.P.P. officers handed out notices to participants directing them to “discontinue [their] interference with traffic and disperse immediately,” as well as took the names of those people who willingly gave them.
The hand-out read: “The public has a legal right to free and uninhibited passage on highways in the Province of Ontario. Your actions constitute a deliberate interference with traffic on this thoroughfare, which is illegal and cannot be permitted. Criminal charges may result if this activity continues.”
Listed as possible charges the police might lay included: Obstructing police, breach of peace, causing a disturbance, mischief, intimidation, refuse to accompany a police officer off a highway prohibited to pedestrians.
“These offences are punishable upon conviction by fine and/or imprisonment. Additionally, the Highway Traffic Act authorizes for the towing and impounding of your vehicle under these circumstances."
Following this, O.P.P. officers dispersed from the area.
Despite the legal consequences, many band members remained at the site, awaiting to take their turn in the booth.
“I was nervous but I was also excited, so it was a combination of the two,” Coun. Sarah Mainville said about her feelings as the community put up the toll booth.
“The nervousness is because of the safety issues. I wanted to make sure logistically that it seemed safe and when I saw the first truck go through I was happy to see that it went through safely,” she added.
For many members, standing in the toll booth is going to be a source of pride, a way to give back to the community, said Mainville, although she did recognize how the toll booth is controversial to some people.
“I don’t think it’s hardship on each individual going by. Most of us carry spare change in our vehicles and its just a matter of putting your spare change together and supporting what we’re trying to do,” she added.
“We’re still in discussions with government, Ontario and Canada,” Mainville noted, “And [the toll booth] seems to be working, and it seems to be working peacefully. But there’s still safety issues.”
“The best solution is for the three governments, the First Nation government, the Canadian government, the provincial government and work through these issues together,” she said.
Earlier this morning, Chief Chuck McPherson and Coun. Dan Mainville were in discussion with the province in Winnipeg concerning compensation for the land which Hwy. #11 was built on.
This offer included some cash and unspecified economic development opportunities, stated Chief McPherson early in the afternoon at a press conference before the toll booth went in. The council will be considering the proposal, but Chief McPherson also stated that the community wants something on an annualized basis—and right now the province is not prepared to go there.
Meanwhile, when it comes to a federal response Couchiching First Nation leadership said that as of this evening Chuck Strahl finally did contact them for the second time since they announced plans for the toll booth—the first time being this morning, when he phoned to say he was in transit and would speak with them at 5 p.m. today.
From this 5 p.m. conversation, Strahl has promised “no more studies and no more testing,” said Coun. Christine Jourdain, when it comes to the contaminated grounds which six residences are located on.
Strahl has also promised to “come down and come to a resolution about what’s supposed to happen with these affected residents,” noted Jourdain.
“I even teased him and said I had a home for him to live in,” she said, referencing one of the family homes at the contaminated site whose residences have relocated into town instead of risking living there.
"[Strahl] says he can’t promise this upcoming week because their cabinet is sitting, but as soon as he’s available he’ll let us know and come visit us.”
But for now, the toll booth stands.
The toll is $1 each way for passenger vehicles and $10 for commercial ones, with monthly passes also to be available for $25 and $100, respectively.


Dealing with an issue as complex as this requires more than just kicking them off the road; Doing so will just create a short term solution and does nothing to address the underlining issue which drove the First Nations to be there in the first place. 

I am not condoning their actions, but having a delicate hand in dealing with this issue will go a long way to smooth relations for a longer period of time.

Thats just my two cents


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## 1feral1 (24 May 2010)

A public roadway held to ransom by a group who thrive on intimidating others.

I would not be paying. Let them try and stop me!

They know that no government agency has the intestinal fortitude to stand up to them, and they win yet again.

Goes to show you that crime does pay in Ontario. 

OWDU


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## mariomike (24 May 2010)

"Somebody's gotta go back and get a &^%$ load of Loonies!":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbWg-mozGsU


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## OldSolduer (24 May 2010)

cn said:
			
		

> Is that even legal? I understand the police are monitoring it, but holding up traffic, setting up an unofficial toll booth and not letting vehicles pass until they pay does not seem too legit to me.


Short answer....no its not legal.

Why? Political correctness rules the law....if you arrest them then your "racist"


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## QORvanweert (24 May 2010)

I had to log in just so that I could comment on this particular story! BS like this is the reason that people are leaving Ontario. McGuinty has never had the balls to stand up for an issue and you can expect many more of our 'rights' to be trampled all over long before his term is over. Caledonia and now this. It just makes my blood curdle. I am a second generation Canadian born of Dutch immigrants. What have I or my ancestors ever done to these people that they think they can harass us like this? I absolutely despise the liberals for the way they handle native issues. They seem to forget that we are an entire generation of natives. My ancestors came 50 years ago and their's 500 years ago. We were all born here. We don't owe them a damn thing.


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## karl28 (24 May 2010)

I know that there may be allot of Issues that Native Americans have with bad conditions on some of the reserves , but I am so tried of hearing about these kind of stories that the Native Comunity has lost any support that I have ever had for them .  I think its about time that the Canadian Government stepped in and taught them who is boss .


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## Jarnhamar (24 May 2010)

Lets just give them EVERYTHING they want.

They should put toll booths up everywhere.  I'd like to see one every 20Kms or so on a highway.

I'm sure glad the OPP are suggesting people just go around them instead of putting an end to illegal checkpoints.

You know what *I* would do if I came up to one of these checkpoints? 
I would get out of my truck and give them the keys, and whatever money is in my wallet. Because they deserve it.

It's actually bullshit that the government is allowing them to run their own toll booths. The OPP should be out stopping cars and taking money FOR the natives. OPP takes the money and hands it over to them, complete with apologies.


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## ballz (24 May 2010)

Apollo Diomedes said:
			
		

> It's actually bullshit that the government is allowing them to run their own toll booths. The OPP should be out stopping cars and taking money FOR the natives. OPP takes the money and hands it over to them, *complete with apologies.*



Which of course they would then complain were not "sincere."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRoWjH2lq-o&feature=related

Forgiveness sure is going to be expensive...


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## cn (24 May 2010)

Mid Aged Silverback said:
			
		

> Why? Political correctness rules the law....if you arrest them then your "racist"



Agree 100%.  

And it is not just limited to the Natives.  This reminds me of another case of gross PC'ness that shocked me just the same: http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/303897

And although the law was upheld in this story, as the article points out, other provinces and countries have laws that exempt those who wear turbans.  Even the Ontario Human Rights Commission sides with this guy, despite the fact that this law is in place for his safety!  Unbelievable.

Political correctness trumps common sense yet again.


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## DexOlesa (25 May 2010)

As a fellow Motorcyclist that makes me sick. I never ride without full gear. I have been tempted to on many a hot day to ditch the armoured leather jacket but it only takes seeing the results of a guy who dumped his bike while wearing only a t-shirt, shorts, flip flops, and a helmet to convince you that if its too hot to wear the gear its too hot to ride


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## mariomike (25 May 2010)

DexOlesa said:
			
		

> As a fellow Motorcyclist that makes me sick. I never ride without full gear. I have been tempted to on many a hot day to ditch the armoured leather jacket but it only takes seeing the results of a guy who dumped his bike while wearing only a t-shirt, shorts, flip flops, and a helmet to convince you that if its too hot to wear the gear its too hot to ride



In Denmark they promote hockey walking helmets for pedestrians. 
"A walking helmet is a good helmet":
http://www.copenhagenize.com/2009/08/walking-helmet-is-good-helmet.html
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kSNVKrktKUQ/SnmSvPQeLLI/AAAAAAAADxE/7PchBe9afXI/s1600-h/gohjelm.png


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## DexOlesa (25 May 2010)

There is something to be said for Natural Selection though :-\


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## 2010newbie (25 May 2010)

mariomike said:
			
		

> In Denmark they promote hockey walking helmets for pedestrians.
> "A walking helmet is a good helmet":
> http://www.copenhagenize.com/2009/08/walking-helmet-is-good-helmet.html
> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kSNVKrktKUQ/SnmSvPQeLLI/AAAAAAAADxE/7PchBe9afXI/s1600-h/gohjelm.png



From the link.....

"We have almost one million daily cyclists in Denmark but we have 5.3 million pedestrians. *It's a group that daily navigates the danger zone and we wish to make them aware of their potentially lethal actions*."

Hilarious....


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## OldSolduer (25 May 2010)

mariomike said:
			
		

> In Denmark they promote hockey walking helmets for pedestrians.
> "A walking helmet is a good helmet":
> http://www.copenhagenize.com/2009/08/walking-helmet-is-good-helmet.html
> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kSNVKrktKUQ/SnmSvPQeLLI/AAAAAAAADxE/7PchBe9afXI/s1600-h/gohjelm.png



Watch out.....the walking helmet will catch on here too. Another cash cow. >


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## The Bread Guy (1 Jun 2010)

> TOLL BOOTH REMOVED FROM HIGHWAY -- COUCHICHING FIRST NATION RECEIVES ASSURANCES THAT CONTAMINATED LANDS WILL BE DEALT WITH AND HOME-OWNERS WILL BE MOVED AS WELL THERE NOW WILL BE NEGOTIATIONS ABOUT THE HIGHWAY 11 CORRIDOR RUNNING THROUGH COUCHICHING TERRITORY.
> 
> “Our Community is claiming victory” says Chief Chuck McPherson, “we have received a commitment to relocate 8 home-owners from contaminated lands to newly serviced lots on our reserve, and also a commitment to negotiate suitable compensation for the highway claim.”
> 
> ...



A bit more here.


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## cn (1 Jun 2010)

According to the website:



> The Couchiching Toll Booth Initiative was enacted upon by Couhiching First Nation Chief and Council as a means to address many of the social and legal issues surrounding the community and band membership. The issues, and sole reasons for enacting the Toll Booth Initiative are threefold:
> 
> 1) The land on which a portion of Highway 11 sits upon was stolen from Couchiching First Nation.
> *2) The Federal Government has failed to address the contaminated soil sites that have forced Couchiching residents from their homes.*
> 3) All other outstanding claims and grievances with the Provincial and Federal government.



But then that raises the issue, if this was to address the contaminated soil, and the government now said they would deal with the issue (at the cost of the taxpayer no doubt), what will become of all that money collected? 

(Not to mention that issues 1 & 3 bring on a whole set of other debatable issues)


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