# Combat action badge



## slayer/raptor (29 May 2012)

I came across this picture of the CDS with a combat action badge, I'm just curious where he would have seen ''action'' to get one, I don't think he was in a combat role when he went to Iraq with the marines.

Your thoughts?


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## Rifleman62 (29 May 2012)

> He became the third Canadian to serve as Deputy Commanding General, III Corps and Fort Hood, Texas and deployed with III Corps to Baghdad, Iraq in 2004 serving first as the Deputy Director of Strategy, Policy and Plans and subsequently as the Deputy Commanding General of the Multi-National Corps.



I wonder who authorized his wearing of a foreign badge!


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## AmmoTech90 (29 May 2012)

Rifleman62 said:
			
		

> I wonder who authorized his wearing of a foreign badge!



As it is a US general awarding something the CDS I would think that he is either in the States or being hosted by the States at a formal function.  Therefore he is entitled to wear any badges/qualifications the US has awarded him.  If it has been properly awarded by the country you are in or are being hosted by you do not need someones approval to wear it, the approval is in the dress regs.

Note: This does not mean you can wear the badge an American buddy slipped you at the end of an exercise.


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## GAP (29 May 2012)

slayer/raptor said:
			
		

> I came across this picture of the CDS with a combat action badge, I'm just curious where he would have seen ''action'' to get one, I don't think he was in a combat role when he went to Iraq with the marines.
> 
> Your thoughts?





> He became the third Canadian to serve as Deputy Commanding General, III Corps and Fort Hood, Texas and deployed with III Corps to Baghdad, Iraq in 2004 serving first as the Deputy Director of Strategy, Policy and Plans and subsequently as the Deputy Commanding General of the Multi-National Corps.



In a declared combat zone


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## daftandbarmy (29 May 2012)

slayer/raptor said:
			
		

> I came across this picture of the CDS with a combat action badge, I'm just curious where he would have seen ''action'' to get one, I don't think he was in a combat role when he went to Iraq with the marines.
> 
> Your thoughts?



Awesome.

I think our Walt is a 'Walt'! (Walter Mitty, that is)

This must be a first. Go Canada!


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## Sigs Pig (29 May 2012)

slayer/raptor said:
			
		

> I came across this picture of the CDS with a combat action badge, I'm just curious where he would have seen ''action'' to get one, I don't think he was in a combat role when he went to Iraq with the marines.
> 
> Your thoughts?



III Corps is regular army, not marines, right?

ME

Found on Wikipedia: "The CAB is not awarded unless the soldier is engaged in direct enemy fire." 
Is there a story behind his medal?


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## dapaterson (29 May 2012)

AmmoTech90 said:
			
		

> As it is a US general awarding something the CDS I would think that he is either in the States or being hosted by the States at a formal function.  Therefore he is entitled to wear any badges/qualifications the US has awarded him.  If it has been properly awarded by the country you are in or are being hosted by you do not need someones approval to wear it, the approval is in the dress regs.
> 
> Note: This does not mean you can wear the badge an American buddy slipped you at the end of an exercise.



The dress regs permit you to accept it and wear it when presented to avoid offending your hosts.  However, a foreign award must be gazetted prior to your being permtited to wear it officially.  In theory the foreign nation will have sought approval in advance.  In practice, it's usually a process of scramblign after the fact to get approval.


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## my72jeep (29 May 2012)

Plus Who wants to commit career suicide by walking up to the CDS and saying Oh by the way Sir you can't wear that!


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## Haggis (29 May 2012)

AmmoTech90 said:
			
		

> As it is a US general awarding something the CDS I would think that he is either in the States or being hosted by the States at a formal function.  Therefore he is entitled to wear any badges/qualifications the US has awarded him.  If it has been properly awarded by the country you are in or are being hosted by you do not need someones approval to wear it, the approval is in the dress regs.



The CF Dress Manual only makes allowances for the wearing of foreign orders, decorations and medals and foreign flying and specialist skills badges.  The Combat Action Badge is none of these. _However_, as *dapaterson* noted, an unauthorized foreign medal/badge/award can be worn as a courtesy at the time of presentation only.  In that the photo has no context (i.e. date, caption etc.), it's possible that this is the case.


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## Danjanou (29 May 2012)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> Plus Who wants to commit career suicide by walking up to the CDS and saying Oh by the way Sir you can't wear that!



when you do make sure you get it on video, it'll be worth milpoints for sure. >


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## medicineman (29 May 2012)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> Plus Who wants to commit career suicide by walking up to the CDS and saying Oh by the way Sir you can't wear that!



I'm sure there are enough RCR RSM's out there daring enough...

MM


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## Haggis (29 May 2012)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> Plus Who wants to commit career suicide by walking up to the CDS and saying Oh by the way Sir you can't wear that!



I have corrected several field grade, senior and flag officers on matters of dress.  I always ensure that I am 100% correct, even if it means deferring the correction until I can check current references.  Without fail, the response I receive is always a version of  "Thank you, CWO.  I'll fix that."


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## Journeyman (29 May 2012)

Maybe the NDP and _Toronto Star_ are considered "enemy fire"?


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## my72jeep (29 May 2012)

Haggis said:
			
		

> I have corrected several field grade, senior and flag officers on matters of dress.  I always ensure that I am 100% correct, even if it means deferring the correction until I can check current references.  Without fail, the response I receive is always a version of  "Thank you, CWO.  I'll fix that."


"I'll fix that" does that mean they take it down, re write the regs, or transfer the member who pointed it out away?


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## Haggis (29 May 2012)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> "I'll fix that" does that mean they take it down, re write the regs, or transfer the member who pointed it out away?



Not so far.....


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## dapaterson (29 May 2012)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> Plus Who wants to commit career suicide by walking up to the CDS and saying Oh by the way Sir you can't wear that!



In my experience, respectfully addressing a problem to a senior officer so they can make corrections is not a career-ender.

Other approaches may have differing results.


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## AmmoTech90 (29 May 2012)

Haggis said:
			
		

> The CF Dress Manual only makes allowances for the wearing of foreign orders, decorations and medals and foreign flying and specialist skills badges.  The Combat Action Badge is none of these. _However_, as *dapaterson* noted, an unauthorized foreign medal/badge/award can be worn as a courtesy at the time of presentation only.  In that the photo has no context (i.e. date, caption etc.), it's possible that this is the case.



Dress regs specify qualifications due to a course and honorary qualifications by a foreign force, both having the same criteria to worn afterwards.  The CAB could be presented under this second catagory as you have to _qualify_ for it by the US regs.


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## Rifleman62 (29 May 2012)

RSM's  maxim (to me anyway): Go, See, Fix.

Haggis. What about a US Air Medal?   http://www.gruntsmilitary.com/am.shtml


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## dogger1936 (29 May 2012)

CDS wearing it on Pde in Ottawa:

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/452646--canada-s-top-general-takes-command


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## bick (29 May 2012)

Maybe he is wearing a US Army CAB because he secretly wants to have a Combat Action Insignia in gold, but then again, he trashed that idea.


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## MikeL (29 May 2012)

Sigs Pig said:
			
		

> Found on Wikipedia: "The CAB is not awarded unless the soldier is engaged in direct enemy fire."
> Is there a story behind his medal?



Maybe a mortar round landed in the base he was staying in,  or IED went off near a convoy... number of other possibilities.

CAB awarding Requirements from an official source
http://www.army.mil/symbols/CombatBadges/action.html


> Resources Command and will be announced in permanent orders.
> 1.The requirements for award of the CAB are Branch and MOS immaterial. Assignment to a Combat Arms unit or a unit organized to conduct close or offensive combat operations, or performing offensive combat operations is not required to qualify for the CAB. However, it is not intended to award all soldiers who serve in a combat zone or imminent danger area.
> 2.Specific Eligibility Requirements: a.May be awarded to any soldier.
> b.Soldier must be performing assigned duties in an area where hostile fire pay or imminent danger pay is authorized.
> ...


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## bick (29 May 2012)

It is a little ironic that he is wearing a CAB when he was the CDS that cancelled the Cdn CAI.  The CAI was such a hot topic, people either loved the idea or hated it.  In the end, we are not a military that believes one trade is more deserving then another.  Many groups within the US Army over the yrs have tried to bring in Combat Armor, Cav, Engineer and Arty Badges.


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## cupper (29 May 2012)

Rhodesian said:
			
		

> It is a little ironic that he is wearing a CAB when he was the CDS that cancelled the Cdn CAI.  The CAI was such a hot topic, people either loved the idea or hated it.  In the end, we are not a military that believes one trade is more deserving then another.  Many groups within the US Army over the yrs have tried to bring in Combat Armor, Cav, Engineer and Arty Badges.



But if you read the qualifications, it says the award is branch or MOC immaterial. Therefore all trades are eligible as long as all other requirements are met.


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## bick (29 May 2012)

Roger, the branches rangling for their own version of the CIB ended when the CAB was announced.


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## RubberTree (29 May 2012)

dogger1936 said:
			
		

> CDS wearing it on Pde in Ottawa:
> 
> http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/452646--canada-s-top-general-takes-command



Unless I'm missing something I'm pretty sure that is the Commanders badge of the Order of Military Merit he is wearing.


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## dogger1936 (29 May 2012)

RubberTree said:
			
		

> Unless I'm missing something I'm pretty sure that is the Commanders badge of the Order of Military Merit he is wearing.



 :facepalm:

Yup. My mistake.


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## my72jeep (29 May 2012)

dogger1936 said:
			
		

> CDS wearing it on Pde in Ottawa:
> 
> http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/452646--canada-s-top-general-takes-command


In that pic hes not wearing a CAB just his wings.


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## Fishbone Jones (29 May 2012)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> In that pic hes not wearing a CAB just his wings.



Whoa, whoa there big guy. Let's not deprive everyone of their sour grapes so soon. :


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## Journeyman (30 May 2012)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Whoa, whoa there big guy. Let's not deprive everyone of their sour grapes so soon. :



:rofl:


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## Tow Tripod (30 May 2012)

Really? Who cares?


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## Towards_the_gap (30 May 2012)

About the Canadian Combat Action Badge? I certainly don't. However, as others have pointed out, it's kinda hypocritical of him to wear it when he kyboshed the Canadian equivalent, and, how on earth did he earn it as a Deputy Corps Commander in Iraq? As it should only be awarded when rounds are incoming and you are popping them back to the bad dudes, either someone wasn't doing their job for him to get in a TIC or it was an old boys kinda thing, like thanks for coming out walt, this will impress the boys back home.


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## cupper (30 May 2012)

actually, if you read the qual's it says engaging or being engaged by the enemy. So it covers both incoming and outgoing.


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## OldSolduer (30 May 2012)

Towards_the_gap said:
			
		

> About the Canadian Combat Action Badge? I certainly don't. However, as others have pointed out, it's kinda hypocritical of him to wear it when he kyboshed the Canadian equivalent, and, how on earth did he earn it as a Deputy Corps Commander in Iraq? As it should only be awarded when rounds are incoming and you are popping them back to the bad dudes, either someone wasn't doing their job for him to get in a TIC or it was an old boys kinda thing, like thanks for coming out walt, this will impress the boys back home.



I think you should re think what you just said. I am not impressed with your logic, nor your characterization of the CDS.

But you are entitled to your opinion.


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## Rifleman62 (30 May 2012)

Agree.


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## 392 (30 May 2012)

Towards_the_gap said:
			
		

> However, as others have pointed out, it's kinda hypocritical of him to wear it when he kyboshed the Canadian equivalent, ....



You do understand that the CDS doesn't decide on CF dress matters alone? The National Defence Clothing and Dress Committee is but one body who advises his on all matters dress....


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## Pusser (31 May 2012)

Capt. Happy said:
			
		

> You do understand that the CDS doesn't decide on CF dress matters alone? The National Defence Clothing and Dress Committee is but one body who advises his on all matters dress....



Furthermore, the only picture I have seen with him wearing the CIB is where he is also receiving his US Legion of Merit.  As stated before, this is within the regulations and would be entirely appropriate at an American ceremony.  To not be wearing it could be considered rude under the circumstances, notwithstanding a Canadian policy decision for a proposal that never did garner complete support.  

I don't see any hypocrisy at all.


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## Towards_the_gap (1 Jun 2012)

Ack on all points above, and in retrospect agreed. Talked out my *** on that one, just was having a bad day I guess. Consider my comment retracted.


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