# What position for someone with a Paramedic degree? Reserve while in university?



## MedicStudent (3 Jul 2005)

Hopefully you can help me out here with my questions. I looked through many of the other old threads but my question (due to the degree I am persuing) is unique.

I will be going into my second year of the Joint Paramedicine Program at UTSC and Centennial College in September and three years from now I plan on graduating with a degree in Paramedicine. I am wondering what Officer positions in the CF would be available to me with this degree. The course sequence can be seen here if this will help in advising me: http://www.utsc.utoronto.ca/~jtprogs/paramedicine/sequence.html

If I decided that I will be joining the forces as an Officer in three years, what are my options in the reserves right now? Is there any way to join as an Officer Cadet or something rather than an NCM?

I am aware of the Med Tech position but I am looking for a career as an Officer.

Thanks


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## swanita (3 Jul 2005)

This question might be answered quicker if it was posted in the combat service support under medical group. I'm sure someone there will be able to answer your question.

Hope you find what you're looking for!


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## Vigilant (4 Jul 2005)

Officer - Health Care Administration

http://www.recruiting.forces.ca/engraph/career/tradeinfo_e.aspx?id=1076

I'm with 25 (Toronto) Field Ambulance. 416- 635-4440 press 8, then 3 for recruiting.

Seriously though, it is much better to go in as a Med Tech and then Commission later. It will be much more relevant for now.


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## MedicStudent (4 Jul 2005)

Vigilant, thanks for the info. Can you give me any more detail on what a typical day for an HCA is like? I have read what they say on the recruiting site but sometimes what a job description is differs from what someone actually does day to day.

Why would you say it is better to join as a Med Tech first? Wouldn't that mean that I would need to get trained as a Med Tech in the CF when I am getting PCP training already outside of the forces?


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## Vigilant (4 Jul 2005)

Well, I'm not a HCA, but there's a lot of paperwork involved in being an Officer. You might not like it, a lot of people don't like that aspect.

I recommend starting out as a Medic because if you want to later you can always Commission, but if you don't like being an Officer you can't really change your mind and join the ranks (not without a lot of problems). Try not to focus on the rank so much. Promotions come to those who deserve it. A lot of people believe that the best Officers come from the ranks, and it shows.

If you are PCP qualified you will be able to get your QL5 from the CF. You will have a lot of knowledge and experience that can be used back and forth from civvie life and your military career.

Give Sgt. Howard a call, he is the Unit Recruiting NCO and a really good guy. Tell him Pte. Ng sent you, that'll give him a good laugh.


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## Cansky (4 Jul 2005)

Vigilant said:
			
		

> Well, I'm not a HCA, but there's a lot of paperwork involved in being an Officer. You might not like it, a lot of people don't like that aspect.
> 
> I recommend starting out as a Medic because if you want to later you can always Commission, but if you don't like being an Officer you can't really change your mind and join the ranks (not without a lot of problems). Try not to focus on the rank so much. Promotions come to those who deserve it. A lot of people believe that the best Officers come from the ranks, and it shows.
> 
> ...



Ensure that you research your options very carefully.  There is no QL 5 in the reserves and I would doubt very much you will get the QL 5 qualification in the regs.  But you should (not always but should) get a wavier for the PCP Ql 3 course in BC or Quebec if your civi training is equivalent or better than these to course.  Recruiting should be able to answer those issues.  Ensure you have a copy of all the courses you have taken and I would recommend you find out what the PCP courses are from BC Justice Institute is so that you are sure  of what you do and don't have.  I have a Pte (reg force) in my unit who did her PCP course through Manitoba she got a prior learning assessment(PLA) done and was bypassed from having to go to BC.  She still had to go to Borden and do the Military portion of the QL 3 course (unsure of how long it is)  Unless you have PCP and EMC (emergent care course) that is the current QL 5 level you would still require a field portion of the QL 5.  I have yet to see someone from civi side come in and get the QL 5 level written off.  Not saying it can't happen but I haven't seen it or heard of it yet.  Hope this gives you a bit more info.
Kirsten


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## Donut (4 Jul 2005)

I get the impression that you're looking for a Reg Force (full time) career when you're done, in which case a degree in paramedicine will meet the degree requirement for a commission, but won't get you any extra points;  HCA's don't do patient care, and paramedics that do are in the NCM ranks.

A degree in paramedicine won't make any difference in the NCM ranks, either, any more so then any other PCP qualification will;  As Kirsten pointed out, you'll still have to complete the Military QL3 portion.

If you're looking for a PT job, the HS reserves can probably employ you, but, again, without the paramedic licence your practice will be the same as every other reserve med tech, which is to say fairly restricted.

Feel free to pm me if there's any questions I can answer,

DF


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## MedicStudent (5 Jul 2005)

So until I burn out from being a parmedic I guess I wouldn't wanna be an HCA since I'm going to school to learn to treat pts, not paper push (no offense to any HCAs).

Can someone please explain to me (or provide a link to an explanation for) the QL 3 and QL 5 stuff? (as in what it means, how you get it, how it compares to PCP, ACP, and CCP)

What would happen if I wanted to join the reserves while in school still (w/o passing EMCA or having my diploma) as a med tech? Would they make me go through all the CF training even though I will have paramedic training in two years?

Thanks


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## Donut (5 Jul 2005)

OK, here goes, I'm sure things have and will be changed, but here's the gist of it:

Reg F: QL3 = PCP + a clinical phase, about 26 weeks total, the basic medic course.  Every medic gets it before they can work as a medic.  If you're lucky, you'll end up in a clinic doing clinical work under sr medics/PA/NO/MO.  You may end up in a field amb, where, again, if you're lucky you'll get into a base clinic, or attached to a cbt arms unit in the field.  You may spend a fair amount of time taking care of the units kit and equipment.

QL5 = some ACP skills, some ACP drugs, more clinical, not sure in terms of how long they are now.  It is NOT an ACP course, military types don't usually need all the cardiac treatments, don't need a lot of the peds and geriatric stuff, either.  You get it after some time in, merit listed against others in the same cohort for advancement.  Not every medic will get his or her QL5.  I don't know if the average medic is getting it during their first BE (contract) or not, it may come with the second.

The top end medical training for Reg F is a Physician Assistant (PA) program.  Not every medic gets it, if you do it's after a while in (10 yrs+).  This may change, but afaik that's it for now.

If you join the res without a civi license, you'll do the res force QL3, an EMR + program, probably in Borden.  I have no idea what's on the rest of the res courses anymore.  You may get summer employment in trade, working in a MIR, cadet camp, or replacing a reg f member in a posting somewhere.  Without a civi license, you'll be quite restricted in your treatment, and employment options.  You'll do courses like PHTLS, CPR, driver training, etc.

Hope this helps

DF


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## MedicStudent (6 Jul 2005)

Thanks for the info, DF.

What if I were to join the reserves sometime during the fall or winter but before the summer when I am still in school, will they understand that I can't just drop my school work and go off and train? Does anyone know how long all the res medic training is total?

This is probably a noob question, but what is an MIR?

Who should I contact from the CF to find out about joining as a reserve medic? I go to school in Toronto but I live in London in the summer, will that be a problem? Is there even a reserve medic unit in London?

Thanks for answering all the questions


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## Donut (6 Jul 2005)

I should have mentioned that before you do any trade training you'll need to do Basic military qualification (BMQ) and Soldier Qualification (SQ) courses, about 8 weeks in total, but they can be done on weekends during the winter months for most res units.  

Most units are aware that student's studies are their first priorities, some accomodate that better then others.

The break down would be something like:

BMQ--4 weeks, or alternate weekends to a total of 20 training days
Sq-- about the same

QL3 Med-- 4 weeks full time in Borden.

Then you're kind of employable in trade,

QL4 med-- another 4 weeks full time in Borden

MIR: Medical Inspection Room, army speak for clinic.

If you spend most of your time in London, I'd enroll there.  Res units typically "stand down" for the summer months, but that's when their people are off on courses, so there's no collective training for them to conduct anyway.  Excepting area-wide exercises, taskings such as supporting other res training, things like that.

Happy to help.

DF


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## Vigilant (6 Jul 2005)

MedicStudent said:
			
		

> I will be going into my second year of the Joint Paramedicine Program at UTSC and Centennial College in September and three years from now I plan on graduating with a degree in Paramedicine.



Follow the directions for the 25 Fd Amb recruiting NCO (Sgt. Howard) like I give you above. He will answer ALL of your questions. This is the unit you would join since you are in Toronto and not London most of the year.


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## kj_gully (20 Jul 2005)

Search and Rescue will be conducting a pilot program for selection in 2007, where they will accept personell with a college degree directly from the street for selection as a Search and Rescue Paramedic. You are exactly the person this program is designed to reach. Search and Rescue Technician is a very demanding and rewarding trade, in which highly trained airforce paramedics parachute, rappell from helicopters, moutaineer, or dive to extricate survivors from air sea and land disasters. Search and Rescue Technicians are not officers, but non-commissioned members. Due to the high level of speciality, and hazard, they are compensated much better than an basic soldier of equivalent rank. If this interests you, please feel free to PM me, and refer to the Airforce forum under "SAR tech" for more info. Beware, much of the thread is corrupted by rumour and heresay. For the straight goods on this extremely rewarding trade, PM me.

Gully


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