# 2 snowbirds crash



## sdimock (10 Dec 2004)

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2004/12/10/snowbird-crash041210.html


----------



## Bograt (10 Dec 2004)

Jesus no. Jesus no.

I pray they ejected. I fear they did not. Thoughts are with their families.

Jesus no.


----------



## Scott (10 Dec 2004)

Prayers to the families.


----------



## scm77 (10 Dec 2004)

Two snowbird jets crash south of Saskatchewan

CTV.ca News Staff

The military confirms two Canadian Forces Snowbird jets have crashed near Mossbank, Saskatchewan, about 65 kilometres south of Moose Jaw.

Airforce officials say the planes crashed in mid-air during a routine exercise Friday morning.

*The pilots were able to eject safely and were not injured in the crash.*

Capt. Jay Walker of 15 Wing, the Snowbirds' Saskatchewan home base, reported search and rescue crews had been dispatched to the site.

More to come ... 
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1102698891332_98108091/?hub=TopStories
-------------
Thank god.


----------



## sdimock (10 Dec 2004)

From CTV at 0950 pacific time

"Walker said the status of the pilots is unclear at this time, despite earlier reports that said the pilots were able to eject safely."

From CBC

Defence Department spokesperson Heather Bruner said both pilots were able to eject after the crash, which happened at 10 a.m. local time. 

Keep praying for them.


----------



## m_a_c (10 Dec 2004)

I hope they are ok, my thoughts and prayers are with them and their families.


----------



## Scoobie Newbie (10 Dec 2004)

Just like the submariners only had minor injures.   Lets what for the fog to lift here.   Send out our prayers and nervously wait for more confirmation.


----------



## Scott (10 Dec 2004)

Good point CFL


----------



## vangemeren (10 Dec 2004)

Newsworld is now saying one of the pilots died. :'( 
I give my condolances

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2004/12/10/snowbird-crash041210.html


Pilot dies in Snowbird crash over Saskatchewan
Last Updated Fri, 10 Dec 2004 14:01:34 EST

MOSSBANK, SASK. - Two Canadian Forces Snowbirds crashed in mid-air Friday morning while on a routine practice flight over Saskatchewan, killing one pilot.

The Defence Department confirmed the death Friday afternoon, but has not yet released the pilot's identity.
Canadian Air Force Snowbirds fly over Commonwealth Stadium in Edmonton. (CP file photo)

The two jets crashed while the famed jets were flying near Mossbank, about 112 kilometres from Regina.

    

Defence Department spokesperson Heather Bruner said both pilots were able to eject after the 10 a.m. local crash.

Captain Jay Walker of 15 Wing Moose Jaw, home base to the aerobatic team, said there was one pilot on each aircraft.

Lt. Andrea Collins said a ground search and rescue team is at the site, about 65 kilometres south of Moose Jaw.

The Canadian Forces is scheduled to hold a news conference at CFB Moose Jaw later Friday.

All flying training missions at the base have been suspended during the investigation into the crash.

The Snowbirds fly 11 Canadair Tutor aircraft: nine perform as a team in air shows and two other spare jets fill in when the others are down for maintenance or repairs. The planes were used as training aircraft by the air force until 2000.

In May, two pilots from 15 Wing escaped from a Hawk training jet before it crashed into a field northwest of the base.

Written by CBC News Online staff


----------



## Inch (10 Dec 2004)

It was Capt Miles Selby, the opposing solo. The other was Chuck Mallett, lead solo, and he's in hospital right now. 

Ejecting isn't guarantee of anything ladies and gents, it gives you a chance to survive.  Look at that Hawk crash back in May, the Hawks have Martin Baker Mk16 seats, one of the best seats on the market and the Cdn instructor ended up with a broken pelvis and femur.

A sad day in Moose Jaw and the rest of Canada without a doubt. My thoughts go out to his family in this difficult time.


----------



## condor888000 (10 Dec 2004)

May he Rest in Peace...


----------



## ark (10 Dec 2004)

R.I.P.


----------



## scm77 (10 Dec 2004)

RIP


----------



## Alex252 (10 Dec 2004)

Wow Capt. Vandenboss died 6 years ago to this day. Anyways Thoughts go out to the families


----------



## Goober (10 Dec 2004)

RIP to the pilot who died. My thoughts and prayers go out to his family and friends, and to the other pilot who crashed. May he make a speedy recovery.


----------



## Sam69 (10 Dec 2004)

Just wanted to add my condolences and prayers to Miles's family and wish Chuch a speedy recovery.

Sam


----------



## sguido (10 Dec 2004)

Inch said:
			
		

> *snip*
> 
> Ejecting isn't guarantee of anything ladies and gents, it gives you a chance to survive.
> 
> *snip*



You can say that again, Inch.

Pulling the 'loud handle' isn't something you take lightly.   You're sitting on a rocket, folks, and it doesn't give a nice, smooth ride.   The ride 'up the rail' on some models can cause injuries on its own, most commonly compacted vertebrae.   (The training isn't all that pleasant either.   The simulator once used by the CF frequently caused minor neck and back injuries...enough to get grounded for a month.)

Better hope that *all* the components will work properly.   It would suck if the stirrups didn't pull back and hold your legs on the way out...or you're going to be shorter when you land.   

Now you meet the air, which, if you're not in the ideal ejection window, will feel like hitting a brick wall.   All those carefully packed survival staples?   Hope that your vest is well made...since it's not uncommon to lose pockets & contents, or your helmet, or boots, as the air rips them off.   Better hope you're flying like you're supposed to...with the visor *down*.   If you're doing something, oh, like posing for your wingman's camera, and you're wearing shades...well..."ouch" is the word that comes to mind.

The separation sequence can cause problems; the seat, designed to fall away, sometimes doesn't, or snags on some strap. (Chuck Yeager once punched out of a modified F-104, and the seat conveniently fell at the same rate he did...with the rocket burning his face & hands.)   Or the raft & seat pan jerks at your body like a pitbull after a snack.    (A crewman - can't remember if he was the pilot or B/N - of an A-6 used in the Lebanon strikes survived bailing out...only to die of blood loss when the seat pan, containing survival supplies, amputated his leg on landing.)

The chute isn't a sport parachute, or even the ones you guys crazy enough to jump out of planes use.   It's a smaller 'life saver' with a higher rate of descent.   Broken legs are not uncommon.

More advanced models, like those on the Russian Mig-29's & Su-27 family are 'smart', modifying the ejection process based on speed, altitude, and attitude to provide the best survival rate.   Those on the US F/A-22 incorporate arm guards, as well as leg stirrups, to minimize flail injury.

However, there are still many in service which are basic bang seats...not even zero/zero models (which allow ejection even at zero altitude & airspeed).   If you're not within the acceptable parameters for ejection, better pray that the Force is with you...

-----------------------------

My prayers go out to the family & friends of those involved in this mishap.


----------



## I_Drive_Planes (10 Dec 2004)

I'd like to add my condolences as well


----------



## Northern Touch (10 Dec 2004)

RIP


----------



## Tpr.Orange (10 Dec 2004)

our condolences.


----------



## pbi (10 Dec 2004)




----------



## mdh (10 Dec 2004)




----------



## Blackhorse7 (10 Dec 2004)

Those of you who have libations at home, raise a glass tonight to a fallen comrade.   I know I will be...

Facta Non Verba


----------



## Hottie_Cowgirl_ (10 Dec 2004)

:'(    See you in the next world.  Prayers to the families and the survivor.


----------



## PteCamp (10 Dec 2004)

My condolances

RIP


----------



## FredDaHead (10 Dec 2004)

My condolences to family and friends of Captain Selby.   

And a prompt healing to Capt Mallett.


----------



## Scoobie Newbie (10 Dec 2004)

Thanks for the info sguido


----------



## sgt_mandal (10 Dec 2004)

RIP


----------



## Whiskey_Dan (10 Dec 2004)

My deepest condolances to the family of Capt. Miles Selby. 
Everyone in the Lower Mainland and across Canada will surely be affected by his death.
May he R.I.P. 
Prayers also go out to the injured pilot. May he have a speedy and full recovery.


----------



## 1feral1 (10 Dec 2004)

This is truly sad news. My thoughts are with his family, and now being so close to Christmas and all.


Wes


----------



## casca (10 Dec 2004)

Another fine pilot lost, Rest In Peace Capt Miles Selby.


----------



## WannaBeFlyer (10 Dec 2004)

I would also like to offer my condolenses to the Selby family and the Snowbirds team. Capt. Mallett I wish you well during your recovery. I am sure it will be extremely difficult to recover from this terrible day.


----------



## shaboing (11 Dec 2004)

R.I.P.  :'(


----------



## Corporal McDill. (11 Dec 2004)

I heard some Anti-war person at school saying how, "he's glad that he's dead"..."that's one less soldier in the world".

I punched him in the face.
Capt. Selby was also my friend's uncle.


----------



## 1feral1 (11 Dec 2004)

Corporal McDill. said:
			
		

> I heard some Anti-war person at school saying how, "he's glad that he's dead"..."that's one less soldier in the world".



You gotta be fu**ing kidding!

Frankly I find sub-humans of this calibre not even worthwhile acknowledging, but I am glad ya did what ya did.

Recenly getting diesel for one of our trucks, I was approached by a woman who said something rude about Australian involvement in Iraq (I won't repeat it here), and infront of about 10 other people, she began to rant. I just said to her 'feel bettter now?' as I walked by her. She just stood there stupified, and did not even have a come back. Another waist of skin, air and food.

Don't let people like this get you irratated.


Cold beers,

Wes


----------



## vangemeren (11 Dec 2004)

> I heard some Anti-war person at school saying how, "he's glad that he's dead"..."that's one less soldier in the world".



I was going to comment on this yesterday, but I was disgusted to type an intelligent answer.  I don't care if you are a peacenik, a comment like that is disrespectful. Soldiers are human, they have families and loved ones to support too.


----------



## Korus (11 Dec 2004)

RIP.


----------



## leopard11 (12 Dec 2004)

i was looking up the news this morning on ctv.ca, and noticed a poll: 

Another Snowbird pilot has been killed in an accident. Do you think the squad should be disbanded?


Yes   651 votes     (22 %) 

No   2362 votes     (78 %) 

Total Votes: 3013 


I for one am glad to see that thus far a large majority has said they did not think that they should be disbanded because of the accident and the accidents in the past. It would be a shame to disband a "national emblem" because of accidents despite the tragic loss. I believe they should find out what went wrong whether it be mechanical failure or not, that led to the accident in mid air and ultimately the loss of a pilot who served his country at home and abroad (Capt Selby flew missions in Kosovo, and has some 2,650 hours in a cockpit), and then correct the problem.


On another note, i was reading other articles about people discussing the future of the CT-114 tutors in the snowbirds.  if a replacement was called for because of the information found in the investigation, what would happen to the Snowbirds? with the cutdown in numbers of CF-18's the Air force is going to retain, (i heard figures of around 85) would it not be possible to retain extras for the snowbirds? Thus giving the Snowbirds a more modern Jet, same paint sheme could be applied as the tutors, and possibly tributes on the planes to the 6 pilots that have died with the snowbirds in the past. I guess all of this will be discussed after the investigation,

rest in peace, my regards to the families  
Marc,


----------



## MissMolsonIndy (12 Dec 2004)

I heard about that. Very tragic.

I as well am disgusted at the comment made...people are seemingly lacking respect these days.


----------



## Inch (12 Dec 2004)

m_a_r_c said:
			
		

> On another note, i was reading other articles about people discussing the future of the CT-114 tutors in the snowbirds.   if a replacement was called for because of the information found in the investigation, what would happen to the Snowbirds? with the cutdown in numbers of CF-18's the Air force is going to retain, (i heard figures of around 85) would it not be possible to retain extras for the snowbirds? Thus giving the Snowbirds a more modern Jet, same paint sheme could be applied as the tutors, and possibly tributes on the planes to the 6 pilots that have died with the snowbirds in the past. I guess all of this will be discussed after the investigation,



Marc, this was discussed at length in the Navy/Air Force/Joint forum a few months back. I think the general consensus is that unless someone else starts funding the Snowbirds, they won't be flying Hornets anytime soon. They're just far too expensive to fly, it's cheaper to fly the 30+ yr old Tutors.


----------



## mo-litia (13 Dec 2004)

God bless


----------



## sdimock (16 Dec 2004)

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2004/12/15/selby041215.html


----------



## foerestedwarrior (16 Dec 2004)

RIP


----------



## Excolis (16 Dec 2004)

I cant stand people like that.  My ex-girlfriend turned out to be a tree hugger after 2 years.  she told me to choose the army or her,  needless to say i didn't have to even think about it. and yes i am still in the army.    i just don't understand how people cant see how vital a good military is, the army does far more good then bad.  i am just at a loss for words.  and Mc Drill. your peer got what was coming to him.  maybe he will think twice before thinking out loud.  

as for the pilot, may he rest in peace, and at the going down of the sun we will remeber him.


----------



## MissMolsonIndy (17 Dec 2004)

hopefully airborne soon said:
			
		

> I cant stand people like that.   My ex-girlfriend turned out to be a tree hugger after 2 years.   she told me to choose the army or her,   needless to say i didn't have to even think about it. and yes i am still in the army.      i just don't understand how people cant see how vital a good military is, the army does far more good then bad.   i am just at a loss for words.   and Mc Drill. your peer got what was coming to him.   maybe he will think twice before thinking out loud.
> 
> as for the pilot, may he rest in peace, and at the going down of the sun we will remeber him.



Tree-hugger, eh? She must be one hell of an environmentalist!
Sad to see terminology used in such an incorrect manner...


----------



## 1feral1 (19 Dec 2004)

MissMolsonIndy said:
			
		

> Tree-hugger, eh? She must be one heck of an environmentalist!
> Sad to see terminology used in such an incorrect manner...



Hey MMI are you really trying to stir the pot here? Sounds you got a bent and twisted hidden agenda here. I have been reading some of your posts.

I am sure you know what the person in the above post was trying to get accross to the readers on this thread.

Treehuggers, granola eaters, save-the-whale types, ban the cars, anti-globalisation, etc, etc. These terms are used here too for the same reason, usually meaning anti-war, anti establishment, anti-government, legalise drugs, rights for terrorist suspects, professional shyte disturbers,   basically a bunch of leftist snotty nosed shyte distrubing uni students who spend too much time thinking they know about it all, when in reality a text book, and attending a few rallies is nothing compaired to life experience. 

Simply put, I call people of this pursuasion oxygen thiefs.


----------



## Excolis (20 Dec 2004)

We are on the same page Wesley


----------



## Corporal McDill. (5 Jan 2005)

MissMolsonIndy said:
			
		

> Tree-hugger, eh? She must be one heck of an environmentalist!
> Sad to see terminology used in such an incorrect manner...



My name is McDill, but Mc Drill is good too I guess.


----------

