# 6 June 1944



## Steel Badger (5 Jun 2005)

I can't help thinking as I sit here in my unit module on night shift, that 61 years ago this night a fleet was steaming towards the Normandy coast; and Allied para's were dropping into occupied France.

Around the same time of the morning that I will be relieved of duties tommorrow; the ramps had dropped and the allied troops were fighting their way ashore....the first step in the Liberation of Europe....

It always amazes me that dates like 6 June pass without much comment or thought in the daily life of the country......that the significance is ignored or downplayed unless it fits a political agenda.....and that remembering D Day and the campaign in North-West Europe leaves one open to charges of "glorifying war".

First thing I intend to do when I get home tomorrow morning is raise a glass to Lads who went ashore on the morning of 6 June 44, and the Sailors and Airmen of the Allied forces who fired them onto the objective......

The second round down range will be for those Canadian Soldiers who are in harms way as I write this.

I am not arguing that we as a nation should make overt sentimentalism mandatory....just expressing some quiet pride and deep appreciation for 2 groups of Canadians who put themselves on the line for our nation and the greater good....leading from the front.


God rest the fallen and safeguard the living....


Delias gu Brath 

SB


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## Bruce Monkhouse (5 Jun 2005)

Hey my friend, on duty I see.
Nice post..........raising a toast right now.


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## paracowboy (6 Jun 2005)

http://www.legionmagazine.com/features/canadianmilitaryhistory/98-04.asp



> The supreme commander of Allied troops in Europe, Dwight Eisenhower...after trusting in a weather forecast that promised minimally acceptable cloud and sea conditions, he gave the order to go. Ramsay wrote: "Monday 5 June: Held a final meeting at 0415.... Thus has been made the vital and critical decision to stage this great enterprise which will, I hope, be the immediate means of bringing about the downfall of Germany's fighting power and Nazi oppression. I am under no delusions as to the risks involved in this most difficult of all operations.... We shall require all the help that God can give us and I cannot believe that this will not be forthcoming.
> "Tuesday 6 June: I was called at 0500 which meant that nothing bad had happened.... The sky was clear than God.... Surprise seemed to be achieved up to the time the paratroops had been dropped.... Only 29 transport aircraft were lost out of 1,300. H.Q. 6 Airborne Division report themselves established."
> The airborne commanders had not dared to sleep. The night of June 5-6 was moonless with patchy cloud and winds gusting up to 20 miles per hour. The odds of placing the paratroop companies in the right place were not great. Major John Howard's coup de main glider assault on Pegasus Bridge was able to land on target, but high winds and flak over the coast meant the parachutists were widely scattered. Maj. Dick Hilborn's recollection of that night explains what happened to one "stick" or group of paratroops: "As we crossed the coast of France the red light went on for preparing to drop. We were in the process of hooking up when the plane took violent evasive action.... Five of us ended up at the back of the plane.... We got out okay and after wandering about for a bit I picked up three of my stick. It took us three hours and the assistance of a local French farmer to find out where we were.... We were one and a half miles north of the drop zone."
> Despite the winds, flak and almost total failure of the radar beacons carried by the Pathfinders of 22nd Independent Parachute Company, the men of the two parachute brigades were able to capture or secure their objectives. For 1st Cdn. Parachute Bn. this meant that C Company dropped first to secure the drop zone and eliminate the enemy at Varaville, blowing the bridge over the Divette a tributary of the river Dives. Only a fraction of C Co. was available, but it all went like clockwork.
> ...



We will remember them.


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## Michael Dorosh (6 Jun 2005)

Steel Badger said:
			
		

> I can't help thinking as I sit here in my unit module on night shift, that 61 years ago this night a fleet was steaming towards the Normandy coast; and Allied para's were dropping into occupied France.
> 
> Around the same time of the morning that I will be relieved of duties tommorrow; the ramps had dropped and the allied troops were fighting their way ashore....the first step in the Liberation of Europe....
> 
> ...



Perhaps you ought to speak for yourself.  Oh wait, you just did.   I hope you're not suggesting you're the only person who will be remembering them tomorrow.

I have a photo of the grave site of Michael Dorosh in my office - killed with the RCR in April 1944, no relation to me.  A woman noticed my photo, and the name on the office wall.  Turns out she worked with my mom - and when she asked about the grave, she said "it looks like my brother's - he was killed on June 6th 1944 with the Queen's Own Rifles."

Small world.

Incidentally, there was a huge "to do" last year about the 60th anniversary of the Normandy Invasion (calling it D-Day is a dis-service to the millions of servicemen who faced D-Day at Tarawa, Sicily, Anzio, Salerno, the Rhine, Arnhem, Imphal, etc. and et al)

I have no heartache with pausing to remember as a nation on important anniversaries.  And we have November 11th every year.  

How many policemen and firefighters died in Hamilton in the last 100 years?  And how many of their anniversaries have you marked?  

Or do you only remember dead policemen when there is some political reason to do so?

Not trying to be abrasive, just think it is unbecoming for "us" to moan about lack of public respect when from my perspective, the opposite is true.


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## Steel Badger (6 Jun 2005)

Check fire Mike.....



Many  of my personal friends are Police Officers, Fire Fighters, Emergency workers etc here in Steel Town.......and I do mark their service and express my appreciation for them on an ongoing basis

Nor am I suggesting that "no one remembers"...I would not be self-centered enough to suggest that...I I know enough Stelco and Defasco workers (among others) who are very cognisant of the sacrifice made by former or serving soldiers....

I admit that I am puzzled by the tone of your post....I would have thought that a Canadian posting his thoughts on the service of Canadian Soldier's past and present is exactly the kind of thing this forum was created to express......

No hard feelings,I realize it is Zero-dark-30........


My thoughts and comments are my own, and no one else's.......

I chose to make the post because I got to thinking of the lads (some of whom are personal friends of mine..or at least tolerate me) waiting to go in on the morning of 06 June.......and of my friends who are presently in harms way in Afghanistan..........

Further to that, I was reminded of what an example both groups have been to me, particularly as at present I am supervising some 130 odd individuals for whom "self-sacrifice", "others before self" and "loyalty" are completely alien concepts......


Feel free to join me in raising a glass.....


SB


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## paracowboy (6 Jun 2005)

Ike's letter to the troops:



> SUPREME HEADQUARTERS
> 
> ALLIED EXPEDITIONARY FORCE
> 
> ...


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## BDG.CalgHighrs (6 Jun 2005)

Hmmm, I came here intending to make a D-day anniversary thread, but I was beaten to it. I guess these things happen when you get to work at 0830...

It's 0930 now which is when the Casino Pillbox on Sword fell to French soldiers and a sherman tank. 

Anyhow, here's to remembering the courage and sacrifice of those who fought.


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## Shec (6 Jun 2005)

Pte. Gaisford said:
			
		

> Anyhow, here's to remembering the courage and sacrifice of those who fought.



From the Book of Remembrance...

http://www.vac-acc.gc.ca/content/collections/books/bww2/ww2487.jpg


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## Alex252 (6 Jun 2005)

Is it just me or is there little or no attention this year? LAst year it was great all the publicity that it got, but now I havent seen one thing on it except on History's D-Day Remebered


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## BDG.CalgHighrs (6 Jun 2005)

Alex252 said:
			
		

> Is it just me or is there little or no attention this year? LAst year it was great all the publicity that it got, but now I havent seen one thing on it except on History's D-Day Remebered


 Last year was the 60th...61 isn't such a milestone therefore the public and press are uninterested. As long as they get involved every 5 or 10 years they can still feel good about themselves without having the hassle of having to go through it every year. Besides Joe-average Canadian already shut up for a whole minute on remembrance day, can he really be expected to spend another few minutes in sober remembrance of an important occasion only 7 months later?


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## patrick666 (6 Jun 2005)

Raise your glasses to the sky, gents. If there is a heaven, they are our angels.

Disregard the media, in my opinion. I don't believe it has to be a mass mediated sensationalized ceremony to be completely effective, it is up to us to pass on the memories and stories of the brave brave men who stared death in the face and gave him a punch in the chops. 

All I did, was go to the war memorial statue, and say "Thanks." - I think that's all you can do sometimes.

Cheers.


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## Michael Dorosh (6 Jun 2005)

Patrick H. said:
			
		

> Raise your glasses to the sky, gents. If there is a heaven, they are our angels.
> 
> Disregard the media, in my opinion. I don't believe it has to be a mass mediated sensationalized ceremony to be completely effective, it is up to us to pass on the memories and stories of the brave brave men who stared death in the face and gave him a punch in the chops.
> 
> ...



Exactly.  We go through this every June 6th, April 9th, June 25th, May 8th, April 25th, September 2nd, August 19th, etc.  I was amazed at the turnout on VE Day in Ottawa this year, and really don't expect people to turn out en masse twice a month to mark events in the same way.


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## jmacleod (7 Jun 2005)

"Holding Juno" by Mark Zuehlke is reviewed in the Globe &Mail , Friday 3 June 2005. This is the
history of "Canada's heroic defence of the D-Day beaches, June 7-12, 1944". Author Tony Foster
of Halifax NS and Toronto, son of the late Major General Harry Foster, provided some insight into
the Canadian defence of the D-Day beaches and the campaign in Normandy in his excellent book
"A Meeting of Generals" - the Generals being Major General Foster and SS General Kurt Meyer,
12th Adolf Hiltler SS Panzer Division commander whose troops murdered Canadian POW's. The
book by Mark Zuehlke goes into far more detail about the battles during the period shown - I
have not seen it or read it, other than the Review by Mark Starowicz, in the Globe, which is
available on the DND CF Air Force Site - it appears to me that this is an important documentation
of a almost forgotten action by Canadian soldiers, which saved the forces on Juno Beach from
what would have been a major German attack. MacLeod


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## Michael Dorosh (7 Jun 2005)

jmacleod said:
			
		

> "Holding Juno" by Mark Zuehlke is reviewed in the Globe &Mail , Friday 3 June 2005. This is the
> history of "Canada's heroic defence of the D-Day beaches, June 7-12, 1944". Author Tony Foster
> of Halifax NS and Toronto, son of the late Major General Harry Foster, provided some insight into
> the Canadian defence of the D-Day beaches and the campaign in Normandy in his excellent book
> ...



Zuehlke is STILL peddling his warmed over treatises?  His Italian trilogy was pretty bad - tell me he's actually looked at some German sources this time around and isn't just recycling Stacey and the regimental histories.....


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## Dottir (7 Jun 2005)

Michael Dorosh said:
			
		

> Exactly.  We go through this every June 6th, April 9th, June 25th, May 8th, April 25th, September 2nd, August 19th, etc.  I was amazed at the turnout on VE Day in Ottawa this year, and really don't expect people to turn out en masse twice a month to mark events in the same way.



Hi Michael,

The VE Day in Ottawa did have an incredible turnout didn't it! ... and I was totally amazed by the whole experience. It was wonderful to see the faces of the many people in the parade crowds that really understood and cared. I think of "Remembrance Day" as something we should do every day in our lives and the Anniversary Dates as the dates of annual official social ceremonies, but really, EVERY DAY we can remember and honour by upholding and protecting all that WW2r and these soldiers all laid their lives on the lines for. Actions speak louder than words and words (educating and preserving history) waken and  inspire new people to carry this on. I loved seeing all the kids and youth, especially the littlest ones coming up to the Vets to shake hands, give the Vets a flag, and say thanks ... if they were too young to understand the signifigance, they certainly understood the feeling of the signifigance in the crowds response to these Vets. These kids are well on their way to learning about and carrying on appreciation ... gotta love that potential 

Dottir (It was good to meet you there, Michael  )


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## Michael Dorosh (7 Jun 2005)

Dottir said:
			
		

> Hi Michael,
> 
> The VE Day in Ottawa did have an incredible turnout didn't it! ... and I was totally amazed by the whole experience. It was wonderful to see the faces of the many people in the parade crowds that really understood and cared. I think of "Remembrance Day" as something we should do every day in our lives and the Anniversary Dates as the dates of annual official social ceremonies, but really, EVERY DAY we can remember and honour by upholding and protecting all that WW2r and these soldiers all laid their lives on the lines for. Actions speak louder than words and words (educating and preserving history) waken and   inspire new people to carry this on. I loved seeing all the kids and youth, especially the littlest ones coming up to the Vets to shake hands, give the Vets a flag, and say thanks ... if they were too young to understand the signifigance, they certainly understood the feeling of the signifigance in the crowds response to these Vets. These kids are well on their way to learning about and carrying on appreciation ... gotta love that potential
> 
> Dottir (It was good to meet you there, Michael  )



It was good to be seen!  

Now, think how diluted that response would be if we expected people to line up every month to give thanks like that.  It was special because it was a landmark anniversary.  I couldn't do that every year on June 6 or May 8 or September 2.  Few could, I don't think it is a reasonable expectation.


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## Dottir (7 Jun 2005)

I agree with much of what you say ... the ceremonies are awesome and when big Anniversaries are done, they make for a lot of media coverage and awareness, but its also so  important to live the awareness and remembrance in everyday meaningful ways ... like doing bits to ensure that people remain aware that their freedoms and perks come from the blood, sweat, and tears of someones who had to sacrifice something for that to exist, and still lay their lives on the life to maintain it all too. It simply never occurs to many people to even question whats so taken for granted in their daily lives and lifestyles ... maybe its not politically correct to know that the "taken for granteds" only exist because of BS and T (blood sweat and tears)  born of necessary aggression, blah blah blah

My kids are learning through me that their freedoms costs lots to others and don't cringe in discomfort when I mention my Uncles or WW2, etc ... Left Coast meant a lot of exposure and influence about anti-violence, anti-war, etc ... I still remember walking into our local smalltown politically correct bookstore and when I only found a couple of books on WW2 for my research, i went to the saleperson and asked for WW2 books. His reaction was interesting indeed ... he answered my questions but his negative moral reaction to me regards my interest in war and violence you could cut with a knife ... which was intensified because I'm a woman. 

Enough babble for now.


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## BDG.CalgHighrs (7 Jun 2005)

I don't think there needs to be a huge event of every well...event annualy. It would, however, be nice if people would atleast recognize them on their own. Less than half of Canada knows what happened on the 6th of June 1944. I doubt a third knows VE day was the 8th of May.

On a side note, I was quite surprised when a civie at the bar knew why we were in DEUs on th 30th of April, and even more surprised when he knew that Kitchener wood was 21-22 April.


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## jmacleod (8 Jun 2005)

If you think you had a good turnout in Ottawa for VE Day, you should have been in Halifax Nova
Scotia on VE Day, (the actual day) in 1945 - I was a 15 year old, and remember the "riot" well
- despite the book by Professor Stephen Kimber, School of Journalism, Kings College, Halifax NS
the "riot" was actually some property damage by a group of drunken citizens and members of His
Majesty's Forces - there in fact were few of them, most of the military people absconded with
some beer (liberated from local liquor stores and breweries) and spirts, got drunk and passed out
- many on the famed Citadel Hill - most of the damage and looting was in fact carried out by
citizens of Halifax - many teenagers I went to school with (tough kids from the "Dear Old North
End "Dearo", of Halifax). Got Kimber's book for Christmas - it is badly written and researched, no
surprise coming out of a "journalism school"  MacLeod


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## Love793 (8 Jun 2005)

One of my regimental duties, is to be the LO to our cadet corps.  On Monday while working with one of them, I sat in on a lecture by the CO of the corps (whom is coincedently my former Gr 11 & 12 history teacher).  He was teaching his kids the importance of  Op Overlord, and the contributions that the Canadian Army made to the War.  It was the first time I have ever seen, 25 kids sitting through a history class and actually paying attention.  It made me happy to see their memories and efforts will live on.

With the going down of the sun, and in the morning, we WILL remember them.


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## Michael Dorosh (8 Jun 2005)

Love793 said:
			
		

> One of my regimental duties, is to be the LO to our cadet corps.  On Monday while working with one of them, I sat in on a lecture by the CO of the corps (whom is coincedently my former Gr 11 & 12 history teacher).  He was teaching his kids the importance of  Op Overlord, and the contributions that the Canadian Army made to the War.  It was the first time I have ever seen, 25 kids sitting through a history class and actually paying attention.  It made me happy to see their memories and efforts will live on.
> 
> With the going down of the sun, and in the morning, we WILL remember them.



I tend to blame teachers and institutions before I blame students.  Make it INTERESTING and the kids will learn.  Sometimes just hearing it from a veteran or military person makes a big difference from hearing it from teacher - even if the words are exactly the same.  History needs to be more hands on - what would be more interesting to a teenager, a filmstrip on Vimy Ridge, or physically walking through a reconstructed trench line?  Would that we had the resources to do that sort of thing.  Pity it would be so costly to send every school kid to the Vimy Memorial at least once intheir school career - I would have loved to have gone.  Just being outside Canada makes you appreciate what we have that much more.


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