# Do I have to be good at math to be a pilot?



## Tape (20 Aug 2012)

Sorry if this is a long read.
Let me introduce a bit more about myself: I am 17 as of now; I was born with a learning disability (did not know until I was diagnosed in grade 8, when I was 13). I did poorly in school with all subjects except gym because I'm fairly active and I like taking part in sports. I wasn't the smartest person in the class, but probably one of the dumbest if I say. My learning disability affected my English and mathematics skills throughout my years in school. It was the end of grade 9 when I decided to make a big commitment in improving my English and math skills, probably one of the hardest and discouraging years of my life. It wasn't until the late of grade 11, I motivated myself to pursue my dream as a pilot; ever since, I changed my ways physically, intellectually and organizationally. My dream is the only thing that motivates me to do well in school. I'm going to be grade 12 when school starts in September, and it's my last chance to do well in school and get accepted to university for criminology, and then join the forces with a DEO plan, wish me luck!  . 

Okay enough blabbering about myself, back to the regards of my question:
I was just wondering if I have to be good at math because I know for a fact that there is math involved with being a pilot. I mean, I can do math, just not like the Calculus and Vectors crap. I mean I'm fairly good at math once I know how to do it.


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## GnyHwy (20 Aug 2012)

I'm just a dumb gunner, but I'm pretty sure vectoring is important.  Couldn't resist.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVq4_HhBK8Y


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## Tape (20 Aug 2012)

GnyHwy said:
			
		

> I'm just a dumb gunner, but I'm pretty sure vectoring is important.  Couldn't resist.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVq4_HhBK8Y



Hahahaha, thanks for the laugh. Looks like I'ma watch the movie at the mean time, since I have nothing else to do.


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## GnyHwy (20 Aug 2012)

Need help with math?  I always found these two websites very helpful.

http://patrickjmt.com/

http://www.khanacademy.org/

Youtube is also your friend.  That is how I found these sites.


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## Tape (20 Aug 2012)

GnyHwy said:
			
		

> Need help with math?  I always found these two websites very helpful.
> 
> http://patrickjmt.com/
> 
> ...



Yeah, thanks. I've heard of them, and used them to help me with sciences and math as well. It's just when it comes to tests and exams is where I go bye bye to my marks because I blank out and I can't do anything about that.  :-\ :-\


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## aesop081 (20 Aug 2012)

Tape said:
			
		

> It's just when it comes to tests and exams is where I go bye bye to my marks because I blank out and I can't do anything about that.  :-\ :-\



Well, you are going to have to get over it.


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## dimsum (20 Aug 2012)

Tape said:
			
		

> Yeah, thanks. I've heard of them, and used them to help me with sciences and math as well. It's just when it comes to tests and exams is where I go bye bye to my marks because I blank out and I can't do anything about that.  :-\ :-\



Unfortunately, all aircrew trades (not just Pilot) will involve lots of tests and exams, both practical and written, that will involve math.  Nothing too involved, but definitely speed-time-distance, quick arithmetic and such.


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## Tape (20 Aug 2012)

Dimsum said:
			
		

> Unfortunately, all aircrew trades (not just Pilot) will involve lots of tests and exams, both practical and written, that will involve math.  Nothing too involved, but definitely speed-time-distance, quick arithmetic and such.



Yeah, I was just wondering what kind of math is involved during training, because what I learn in high school for math is just bizarre to my brain. I just go clueless. If it's basic math, I can breeze by with ease, and I tend to answer quicker than the students who's smarter than me. Just like in chemistry, hehe.


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## Tape (20 Aug 2012)

dennmu said:
			
		

> I love this forum. Great when folks help out. If we could only do without the snotty comments, that really provide no insight.



Well, I guess I gotta deal with it. Nothing we can do about that.


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## DonaldMcL (20 Aug 2012)

Tape said:
			
		

> Yeah, I was just wondering what kind of math is involved during training, because what I learn in high school for math is just bizarre to my brain. I just go clueless. If it's basic math, I can breeze by with ease, and I tend to answer quicker than the students who's smarter than me. Just like in chemistry, hehe.



Honestly, if you can't do High School math, you'll have trouble getting the required scores on the CFAT to even pass step#1. On the other hand (and the good news), is that with hard work and patience it is something that can be fixed. Those sites posted a few messages up are great. I plan on using them myself to try and understand this whole EW thing I do. 

Cheers, and best of luck!


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## Tape (20 Aug 2012)

BobSlob said:
			
		

> Honestly, if you can't do High School math, you'll have trouble getting the required scores on the CFAT to even pass step#1. On the other hand (and the good news), is that with hard work and patience it is something that can be fixed. Those sites posted a few messages up are great. I plan on using them myself to try and understand this whole EW thing I do.
> 
> Cheers, and best of luck!



Well, I can. It just takes longer for me to process information in my head than the average student for math. As long there is patience and time involved, I think I would do fine. If worse comes to worse, I'll just ask my friend or hire a tutor to help me before I take the CFAT test. Is it possibly to retest CFAT if you did poorly or something?


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## Donny (20 Aug 2012)

I know few pilots in CF and their math was really bad. I guess the aircrew selection was too easy for them and they got in easily.


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## roadrunner60 (20 Aug 2012)

Its easy man, dont worry about negative stuff or stress over how they say you wont be able to do it. Just study gr 8-10 math on google somewhere, thats all you need to know. I hated math in school and stopped at gr 10 and thought id do bad on the cfat too, i studied three days befor the test and found it the easiest part out of the three. Keep in mind 3/4 answers are usually wayyyyy off and using reverse math(multiplication) to find the answer youll realise only ones remotly close befor you even finish the math. Just study long multiplication, cross multiplication like 12x-8y / 5a-B what is B? Type qeustions. Word qeustions. If you can add the 0 and carry the 1 youll be fine.


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## AGD (20 Aug 2012)

Tape said:
			
		

> Well, I can. It just takes longer for me to process information in my head than the average student for math. As long there is patience and time involved, I think I would do fine. If worse comes to worse, I'll just ask my friend or hire a tutor to help me before I take the CFAT test. Is it possibly to retest CFAT if you did poorly or something?



Well, unfortunately, you've got to be pretty quick on that third section of the CFAT. You get 30 minutes to do 30 questions, but that time flies by in a hurry. 

Yes, you can re-write, but you have to wait a year.


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## Tape (20 Aug 2012)

Donny said:
			
		

> I know few pilots in CF and their math was really bad. I guess the aircrew selection was too easy for them and they got in easily.



They must be really lucky then !


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## Tape (20 Aug 2012)

roadrunner60 said:
			
		

> Its easy man, dont worry about negative stuff or stress over how they say you wont be able to do it. Just study gr 8-10 math on google somewhere, thats all you need to know. I hated math in school and stopped at gr 10 and thought id do bad on the cfat too, i studied three days befor the test and found it the easiest part out of the three. Keep in mind 3/4 answers are usually wayyyyy off and using reverse math(multiplication) to find the answer youll realise only ones remotly close befor you even finish the math. Just study long multiplication, cross multiplication like 12x-8y / 5a-B what is B? Type qeustions. Word qeustions. If you can add the 0 and carry the 1 youll be fine.



Thanks for the tip! 



			
				AGD said:
			
		

> Well, unfortunately, you've got to be pretty quick on that third section of the CFAT. You get 30 minutes to do 30 questions, but that time flies by in a hurry.
> 
> Yes, you can re-write, but you have to wait a year.



Oh, I see. I'm assuming you've taken it. How was it?


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## roadrunner60 (21 Aug 2012)

God damn, thats what i said, review gr 8-10 math.


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## Tape (21 Aug 2012)

roadrunner60 said:
			
		

> God damn, thats what i said, review gr 8-10 math.



LOL, sorry. I wasn't reading the whole thing properly.


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## Donny (21 Aug 2012)

Tape said:
			
		

> LOL, sorry. I wasn't reading the whole thing properly.


Don't take this forum as a joke! If you don't read why would you bother posting anything? I suggest you use the search function and you will probably find answers for most of your questions.


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## Tape (21 Aug 2012)

Donny said:
			
		

> Don't take this forum as a joke! If you don't read why would you bother posting anything? I suggest you use the search function and you will probably find answers for most of your questions.



Because I stated before, I have a learning disability, and I tend to perceive the comment wrong sometimes. It takes me another read to fully realize what he said, but I guess I wasn't doing that with his post.  Sorry if I offended you or anyone else.


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## Strike (21 Aug 2012)

If you're that worried about some of the math used, why not sign up for a session of ground school at your local flying club?

I went through with a few people that had math issues, but they actually found flying math easier, because you knew WHY you needed it, whereas in school you never really get taught why something is important.


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## Tape (21 Aug 2012)

Strike said:
			
		

> If you're that worried about some of the math used, why not sign up for a session of ground school at your local flying club?
> 
> I went through with a few people that had math issues, but they actually found flying math easier, because you knew WHY you needed it, whereas in school you never really get taught why something is important.



Sounds like a good idea. How much would a session be?


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## AGD (21 Aug 2012)

Tape said:
			
		

> Sounds like a good idea. How much would a session be?



The whole private pilot ground school is in the neighbourhood of $400 and includes a minimum of 40 hours instruction, although most places exceed that just to make sure you do well on the exam the first time. I'm not sure that any place would let you pick and choose which classes you want to attend, but I suppose there's no harm in asking.



> Oh, I see. I'm assuming you've taken it. How was it?



I think you'll find that most people on this forum have written it (in my case, 10+ years ago.) Search "CFAT" and you will find a multitude of threads on the subject.


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## Tape (21 Aug 2012)

AGD said:
			
		

> The whole private pilot ground school is in the neighbourhood of $400 and includes a minimum of 40 hours instruction, although most places exceed that just to make sure you do well on the exam the first time. I'm not sure that any place would let you pick and choose which classes you want to attend, but I suppose there's no harm in asking.
> 
> I think you'll find that most people on this forum have written it (in my case, 10+ years ago.) Search "CFAT" and you will find a multitude of threads on the subject.




Sounds great. I most likely will do it in the future because there is no way I can muster up $400 + dollars right now, thanks. Yeah, I've done some researching on the CFAT on this site, and I'm just looking over thread after thread about CFAT.


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## Scott (21 Aug 2012)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> Well, you are going to have to get over it.



I think this is some good advice. It doesn't really give you a ''how'' to get past your issues, but the sum total is that if you want to attain your goals then you just have to get over your difficulties. Blunt, perhaps, but still good wisdom.


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## SupersonicMax (21 Aug 2012)

If you have learning disabilities, you'll have a hard time.  Being a pilot in the CF is all about how fast you can learn new things, both academically and practically.  

As far as math goes, it's important (just like any science type class), as a concept.  You don't necessarily put it into practice everyday, but you use physics and maths concepts every single day.


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## Habs (21 Aug 2012)

Tape said:
			
		

> Yeah, I've done some researching on the CFAT on this site, and I'm just looking over thread after thread about CFAT.



I suggest you don't do that too much. It'll only make you worried and make the CFAT seem like some impassable test. That's what happened to me anyway.

It is not very hard. It is not very easy. The time given seems like a lot, but it really isn't once you start answering questions. You'll probably end up guessing on a few. And that reminds me! Never leave a question blank, if you don't know the answer, just guess! Don't spend 3 minutes on one question, that's what killed me on a couple.

Anyway, just review grade 8/9/10 high school math/English and you should be fine. I went on math sites and printed off sheets, answered the questions, then checked my answers. Seemed to help a lot.


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## Journeyman (21 Aug 2012)

OK, the main reason I avoid Recruiting threads is that my loving, caring advice is sometimes taken as.....well, harsh -- but I'll try again; maybe it'll help if you read it aloud in your favourite grandmother's voice.

The original poster has a learning disability exacerbated by anxiety issues when under pressure....so now the "helpful advice" is trying to coddle him through the _CFAT_! Seriously?! I'm sure once past that gruelling CFAT hurdle, flight training will be a piece of cake.   :

Go back and read the posts by SupersonicMax, Dimsum, and CDN Aviator. They're in this business, (unlike those who are obviously not aircrew, if they're in the CF at all); they are trying to tell you that flying within the CF is not in your future. 

Here, have a cookie. [Loving grandma voice ends]



*Once again*, we see "opinions" and "useful, _informed_ opinions"  :not-again:


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## Loachman (21 Aug 2012)

Achieving Wings is not in _*many*_ people's future.

While I was going through Pilot training, we were told that only one in eight hundred applicants was successful.

CFAT is only one minor step at the beginning of the whole process. It is the least of your worries.

Aircrew Selection strips out a lot of people that score high enough on CFAT.

The first flying course strips out people that made it past Aircrew Selection, and each successive flying course strips out people that made it through the preceding one.

The hardest that I have ever worked was my first month in Moose Jaw on the Tutor course. That month was all ground school. I studied in the morning during breakfast. I studied during lunch. I studied from the moment that I got home at the end of each day until I went to bed, save a twenty-minute dinner break. On Friday nights I got drunk at the Officers' Mess like everybody else, did all of my personal stuff on Saturday plus some studying, and then studied all day on Sunday.

The following nine months required slightly less effort, but the ability to slack off was minimal.

It takes a lot of work to absorb the amount of absolutely essential knowledge that is being force-fed, even without learning disabilities. A lot. If one cannot keep up, one is not going to pass, and there is no extra time to be found.

If tests are a problem now, they will be a much bigger problem on flying courses. Several written tests on my Tutor course had pass marks of 90%. There are flying tests at the end of every phase on every course. I saw coursemates fail because they had tendencies to freeze under the perceived pressure of flying tests even though they were solid performers during regular training trips.

In practice, every flight is a test of sorts. If you do not understand every aspect of a flight in the briefing room before you walk out, you can expect the trip to be cancelled. It does not take many such cancellations before one is removed from the course. Similarly, failure to achieve the performance levels required during each flight will result in training being ceased pretty quickly.

Yes, you could be one of the 0.125% of Pilot applicants who succeeds. You'll not know until you try. Be prepared for disappointment, however.


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## Tape (21 Aug 2012)

Loachman said:
			
		

> Achieving Wings is not in _*many*_ people's future.
> 
> While I was going through Pilot training, we were told that only one in eight hundred applicants was successful.
> 
> ...



Thanks for taking your time to write this. I will still continue with my plans, and hope for the best, as you said, I won't know until I try.


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