# Beer For The Boys!



## Pte_Martin (29 Oct 2006)

I'm not sure where to put this but here we go... http://www.theglobeandmail.com/blogs/witnessworld

Breaking the Afghan drought
Paul Koring, today at 11:06 AM EST

KANDAHAR, Afghanistan - It's hot, dusty and dry – especially dry. Very dry. As in "no beer". The big sprawling air base where about half of Canada's 2,300 soldiers are based in southern Afghanistan is an alcohol-free zone (except in the British and French officers' messes which are off-limits to Canadians). And its an alcohol free-mission. Almost. 

Last Saturday was one of those warmly-welcomed exceptions. Pallets of donated cold beer (Molsons, Coors and Moosehead) plus German sausage and blaring music made for Oktoberfest-lite in Afghanistan. 

Bavarians might not have recognized it, nor might most Canadians. But for the hundreds of Canadian soldiers pouring back a few wet ones (actually there was a strict limit of two) it was a deeply meaningful experience celebrating the nation's multi-ethnic heritage. As for the soldiers out in the field, they will – they were promised – get their two beers when they rotate into the main base for a few days relief.



_(I've split this off here. It seems like a good post to have it's own thread, and hey...it's beer! - pc)_


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## Yrys (31 Oct 2006)

I don't like beer.

But seem to me only good that soldiers can have some, 
even if its only 2, to relax and have some fun.

2 beers/month should be mandatory, don't you think ?


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## probum non poenitet (31 Oct 2006)

Yrys said:
			
		

> I don't like beer.



COMMUNISM!


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## seaforth93 (31 Oct 2006)

2 beers per man per day was instituted in Yugoslavia during roto 0 of Palladium. the charges soon followed. Beer in theater is not necessary. Anyone who can't wait the until their leave to have a beer needs to perhaps seek help for addiction. Sorry to rain on anyone's parade, but this is absurd. It's not "just a beer", it's an intoxicant that affects both motor functions and impares judgement. When KAF gets bumped do you want the person next to you to fully respond or would it be better that they are "relaxed"? I suppose back home many members have a beer to unwind after work, but in my opinion, this is a disastrous policy to institute.

I understand that this was a one time deal, but my above response was to the "2 per man per day perhaps" concept.


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## Jacqueline (31 Oct 2006)

I think the people over there deserve it. If they wish not to drink a couple of beers, they shan't. Ain't no need to squabble.


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## gnome123 (31 Oct 2006)

I'll drink to that.  :cheers:


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## 043 (31 Oct 2006)

seaforth93 said:
			
		

> 2 beers per man per day was instituted in Yugoslavia during roto 0 of Palladium. the charges soon followed. Beer in theater is not necessary. Anyone who can't wait the until their leave to have a beer needs to perhaps seek help for addiction. Sorry to rain on anyone's parade, but this is absurd. It's not "just a beer", it's an intoxicant that affects both motor functions and impares judgement. When KAF gets bumped do you want the person next to you to fully respond or would it be better that they are "relaxed"? I suppose back home many members have a beer to unwind after work, but in my opinion, this is a disastrous policy to institute.
> 
> I understand that this was a one time deal, but my above response was to the "2 per man per day perhaps" concept.



Hmmmmmmmmmmmm I think you are way off the mark on this one, however, because it is your opinion I will respect it. Two beers a night will not hurt anyone at anytime. You refer to the charges on Op Palladium.......how many of those people who got charged only had 2 beer in the system?


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## SoF (31 Oct 2006)

Just too bad it's domestic beer lol. There must have been alot of disappointed Stella and Heineken fans. ;D


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## Fishbone Jones (31 Oct 2006)

seaforth93 said:
			
		

> 2 beers per man per day was instituted in Yugoslavia during roto 0 of Palladium. the charges soon followed. Beer in theater is not necessary. Anyone who can't wait the until their leave to have a beer needs to perhaps seek help for addiction. Sorry to rain on anyone's parade, but this is absurd. It's not "just a beer", it's an intoxicant that affects both motor functions and impares judgement. When KAF gets bumped do you want the person next to you to fully respond or would it be better that they are "relaxed"? I suppose back home many members have a beer to unwind after work, but in my opinion, this is a disastrous policy to institute.
> 
> I understand that this was a one time deal, but my above response was to the "2 per man per day perhaps" concept.



The charges were for going over the two beer limit. I'm also a big boy. Two beers is not a problem, but thanks for trying to be my conscience and forcing your moralistic outlook on the rest of society. I'd rather have a normal person beside me, that likes a beer once in awhile, than some caped crusader that thinks it's his job to save me and the rest of the world from what they perceive as evil.


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## 043 (31 Oct 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> The charges were for going over the two beer limit. I'm also a big boy. Two beers is not a problem, but thanks for trying to be my conscience and forcing your moralistic outlook on the rest of society. I'd rather have a normal person beside me, that likes a beer once in awhile, than some caped crusader that thinks it's his job to save me and the rest of the world from what they perceive as evil.



Hey man,

Were you on CanchargeBat in Visoko?? He thinks Roto 0 Unprofor was bad! haha


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## Fishbone Jones (31 Oct 2006)

Yep. I was there.


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## 043 (31 Oct 2006)

Right on.


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## Yrys (31 Oct 2006)

probum non poenitet said:
			
		

> COMMUNISM!



Nope, just a woman that decided to follow her father advised...

Personal anecdote:

When I begin drinking beer at the old ages of 18/19,
I told my father that I didn't like the taste.
He told me that it was a good thing, and not to 
try to change that.

As he was an alcoholic (rumours said by my mother that 
he was dry since when I was 3 years old, and him, drunk,
tried to get me to drink some, and me crying my soul out), I thought
it was an advised by somebody that new what he was speaking about...
So I never drink a full beer since then. Around once a year, I accept a gulp
from a friend to see if they have one that I would like, but it never happens ...


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## patrick666 (31 Oct 2006)

No whiskey?  

Hehehe, good to see them a get a couple well deserved pops.. Cheers! :cheers:


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## LIKELY (31 Oct 2006)

I am SOOOOOOOooo glad these rules weren't around in Cyprus in the 80's....now there was a fun place.
But that was a different can 'o worms.


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## Ex-Dragoon (2 Nov 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> The charges were for going over the two beer limit. I'm also a big boy. Two beers is not a problem, but thanks for trying to be my conscience and forcing your moralistic outlook on the rest of society. I'd rather have a normal person beside me, that likes a beer once in awhile, than some caped crusader that thinks it's his job to save me and the rest of the world from what they perceive as evil.



Agreed...I am not a big beer fan myself( I prefer rye/rum etc) but I would never bemoan the fact the guys get 2 beer, after what they have been through over there, you would even think of stomping on a little bit of something for them to look forward to just make me shake my head. Glad you are not serving with me....


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## George Wallace (2 Nov 2006)

seaforth93 said:
			
		

> ..... Beer in theater is not necessary. Anyone who can't wait the until their leave to have a beer needs to perhaps seek help for addiction. Sorry to rain on anyone's parade, but this is absurd. It's not "just a beer", it's an intoxicant that affects both motor functions and impares judgement. When KAF gets bumped do you want the person next to you to fully respond or would it be better that they are "relaxed"? I suppose back home many members have a beer to unwind after work, but in my opinion, this is a disastrous policy to institute.
> 
> I understand that this was a one time deal, but my above response was to the "2 per man per day perhaps" concept.



Let's see now......Your Troop has just spent the last twelve hours doing a 'Body Exchange', taking Body Bags from one side over to the other to exchange for more Body Bags so that each side can give them the 'Proper Burial'.  This has also involved the 'bagging' of said bodies.  Now you are back in Camp and all the Kool Aid Bde will allow you is perhaps a can of Coke before you hit the Fart Sack.  Right!!!!!  Some good that will do.  No time to debrief, de-stress, talk it over with others in the Troop and definitely not a pleasant nights sleep.

On the other hand, a few beers in the Mess with the Troop to de-stress can be a good thing.  Perhaps that was why the Mess was created so many centuries ago.  -   First line in the "De-stressing" program.


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## MikeM (5 Nov 2006)

Good to see everyone in KAF got some beer. Not so much for us guys out forward.


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## geo (5 Nov 2006)

Mike,  Someone promissed they'd save you some...... 
(I believe him )


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## spud (5 Nov 2006)

seaforth93 said:
			
		

> Anyone who can't wait the until their leave to have a beer needs to perhaps seek help for addiction. Sorry to rain on anyone's parade, but this is absurd.



If you believe desiring a cold one while enduring what they are going through = addiction problem, I think you have bigger problems then that. Thinking they don't deserve one is absurd. 

potato

p.s. And I'm gonna raise one to the troops right now..............here's to you guys


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## MikeM (5 Nov 2006)

Geo,

I sure hope they are keeping it cold


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## geo (5 Nov 2006)

Some people always look at alcohol in extremes.
Do you physically need alcohol to make you go thru your day.  Are you dependant?
Do you want a cold brew to relax & unwind after a hard day / week outside the wire, share with your friends?


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## Synthos (5 Nov 2006)

There is very little that can match up to the relaxing effect of a beer after a long day. If you think wanting to have a beer a day is addiction you are way off. It's not *necessary* to have a beer but it is cool, refreshing, and a taste of home. Yes, some people abuse alcohol but there isn't any reason you should deny it (in reasonable quantities) to the majority of people who like to drink it -casually-. 

Think of it this way: France (used to? still does?) include(d) wine in their IMPs! People don't see wine stereotypically as an abused drink because it is a "social drink". THAT'S WHAT MOST PEOPLE DRINK BEER FOR!

As Bart simpson would say "Don't have a cow, man."

Two concerns: 
    If someone is feeling upset about a wounded buddy (or worse) there shouldn't be any people trying to sneak beers if they think it'll help them forget the pain. 
    I've seen some people get almost drunk off two bruskies.. Maybe there should be a weight consideration to the amount of beer one can drink?


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## RangerRay (5 Nov 2006)

The least they could have done was send in some decent beer, instead of mass produced swill! Geez!

Right now, I'm hoisting an Okanagan Spring Pale Ale to the lads overseas.  Ahhh...sweet, sweet ale!


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## Alex (5 Nov 2006)

I know seaforth93 is already getting enough flak for his post.. but I'm going to chime in as well.

I know far more people who drink that are "normal" than people who are alcoholics.  I also know several people who have a casual beer that are in fantastic shape both mentally and physically.  

As a sidenote, I also think that with the vegetable matter in beer, the occasional beer may actually be doing you more good than harm.  I wonder if anyone can confirm this?

Either way, it's good to hear that the soldiers over in Afghanistan are getting their dues.  Good on them.


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## geo (5 Nov 2006)

Guiness.... a steak in every glass 8)


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## Kat Stevens (5 Nov 2006)

2023 said:
			
		

> Hey man,
> 
> Were you on CanchargeBat in Visoko?? He thinks Roto 0 Unprofor was bad! haha



Roto 0 UNPROFOR was 4 CMBGs tour.  Let me assure you, the decks were awash with beer, and we did pretty good in my opinion.  The only thing that got to us faster than crappy taskings were sea cans full of beer, in true "Germany Story" tradition.    :warstory:


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## axeman (5 Nov 2006)

Being allowed to have two beers  isnt the same as being forced to have two beers. if the troop doesnt want them thjey can leave them and get two pops instead.  in the navy the beer machines are still onboard . they pump out beers to any that have a loony . and theres generally no-one taking names  common sense can prevaill sometimes . just take it as it is a gesture to allow 2 beers to those that would want them . 

i know i woulda liked them while on OP APPOLO  with the 101 Airbourne .


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## navymich (5 Nov 2006)

I am curious.  In Afghanistan, or on any other deployment, what is the policy as to when you can have your beers?  Onboard ship we have the 2 beer limit.  You cannot drink while on duty and you can also not drink less then 6 hours before your next watch.


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## Journeyman (6 Nov 2006)

At one point, when PTSD was just being "discovered," someone asked what SAR Techs did after somewhat gruesome missions involving the stuffing of body bags with former people. It turns out that they would return to the hangar, have a few beers, and talk it out. The shrinks said "that's _exactly_ what they should be doing."

Beer is a CNS depressant. People, whether SAR Techs or deployed infantry, are apparently more willing to talk about troubling experiences after a beer or two. It's healthy, and therefore in our troops' best interest. 


And in an irrelevant response to navymich's query about when beer can be consumed.....I had the opportunity to do some jumping with the Dutch Marines. They were "asked" (as in, _please_), could they not drink beer while _on_ the plane. And that was on the freefall lifts, not the dope rope (where they only had to go out the door and turn left) static-line jumpers.  
Uh, we'll do our own JM checks, thanks.


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## George Wallace (6 Nov 2006)

navymich said:
			
		

> I am curious.  In Afghanistan, or on any other deployment, what is the policy as to when you can have your beers?  Onboard ship we have the 2 beer limit.  You cannot drink while on duty and you can also not drink less then 6 hours before your next watch.



There is no beer.  The two beer we are talking about is a 'special shipment/treat" that is shipped in once during the six month Tour.  Perhaps there will be another for Christmas/New Year.  These Tours are DRY.  When I hear Guns and seaforth93 spouting off about the Task Force, on matters they are completely in the dark on, I get upset.


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## navymich (6 Nov 2006)

George, I understand this was a "special treatment".  However, is there not still a policy laid out for these occasions WRT when the troops can and cannot drink it?


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## George Wallace (6 Nov 2006)

navymich said:
			
		

> George, I understand this was a "special treatment".  However, is there not still a policy laid out for these occasions WRT when the troops can and cannot drink it?


 ???

Two beer per man.  Issued only at that function.....be it a dinner or BBQ or whatever is laid on.  There is no such thing as there being a Canadian bar that you can go to over a period of a week or two to consume your two beers.


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## countrygal620 (6 Nov 2006)

two beers a limit? wow that must be hard . im glad to see you can benefit from some home things. i praise all you guys over there and ill have a beer right now for you.


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## Synthos (7 Nov 2006)

hard? I don't think that's quite how they look at it.


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## a78jumper (8 Nov 2006)

Having seen all sides of the coin, I would have to put in a vote for dry operations. Some people went nuts with alcohol, especially in Germany and Cyprus. There was problems with alcohol in both Somalia and Bosnia, resulting in rape and worse. I saw the two beer per man per day system in place in Camp Julien. Believe you me the RCR tried an honour system, but as usual a select few ruined it for everyone else, so we all were treated like two year olds. Even with rations cards in place, people still begged others to buy them beer. When they leaned on their employees to do so ( I was there as a civy) it was the most pathetic thing I ever saw, picking on a Nepalese labourer so as to keep an addiction fueled. When I was reassigned to work for this "professional" engineer "S", I refused, because I had zero respect for him. A drunk, pure and simple. Yes I still drink on occasion, and confess to drinking too much at times in the past. I did enjoy my daily two wines, but then I got pneumonia and was too sick to drink even that. Suffice it to say my life did not revolve around a daily drink. 

We did get a lot of free beer from Molsons Xmas 2003, "Bavaria" which I think they were having difficulty flogging back home


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## armyvern (8 Nov 2006)

a78jumper said:
			
		

> Suffice it to say my life did not revolve around a daily drink.


Quite like the other 99% of the people that were there then?


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## HItorMiss (8 Nov 2006)

a78jumper said:
			
		

> We did get a lot of free beer from Molsons Xmas 2003, "Bavaria" which I think they were having difficulty flogging back home



LOL yeah that CFPSA/Canex wanted us to pay for instead of giving it to the troops for free, glad that didn't fly...course it still cheesed many of us off that the Nepalese and camp workers were also drinking the beer which was given to THE Troops for free, but I digress.

2 beer per day per man is more then sufficient and in some case many just chose not to drink at all. Either way glad thwy can have some if they want it.


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## Pte_Martin (8 Nov 2006)

I agree with a couple of posts here, about drinking and talking with the "boys" is a good stress reliever. Why Many times have guys gone to bars here at home and had beer and wings and watched the game and talked about anything. It helps, and two beers aren't going to hurt anyone


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## daftandbarmy (9 Nov 2006)

I've noticed that it's usually the senior officers (above Lt/ Capt) and SNCOs who have the hardest time sticking to the prescribed limit in theatre. Then guess what? The soldiers follow the example.

Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa


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## geo (9 Nov 2006)

Daftandbarmy...........
Yes I was young and stupid once.... 

Senior officers were junior officers way back when.  Senior NCOs were Junior NCOs once - so you've got a bit of the chicken and the egg thing here in your post.

Good Offrs & NCOs have learned from their youthful exuberance & have corrected their mistakes..............

Every morning I receive MP & Incident reports on who overdid it the day/night before.
There have been a couple of Senior Offrs & Sr NCOs hauled in but, 95% are at the Junior level.....


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## a78jumper (9 Nov 2006)

HitorMiss said:
			
		

> LOL yeah that CFPSA/Canex wanted us to pay for instead of giving it to the troops for free, glad that didn't fly...course it still cheesed many of us off that the Nepalese and camp workers were also drinking the beer which was given to THE Troops for free, but I digress.



Given I controlled the rations cards for CANCAP, I can honestly say 90% of the Napalese did not drink. They were saving their $$$.  I think I had one "free" Bavaria, did not like it, and went back to screw top white wine. which meant I did not have to get up in the middle of the night!

The we/them attitude was prevalent all right, I am not sure how you would resolve the "free" beer issue without causing even more of a rift. I sort of sat in the middle as I certainly could not relate to most of the CANCAP crap.


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