# Aftermarket Kit Manufacturers: Where to go for good gear



## tacsit (12 Jun 2004)

As I said in the thread regarding day packs there is a lack of understanding of good aftermarket kit primarily due to lack of experience with such kit. Quite understandable due to the majority view in the CF that the kit that's issued is good enough. That is a sore spot with me but one I will not delve into in this thread. Rather here I'll post a simple list of which companies make the best gear, so if you want gear that will actually hold up to the rigors of the battlefield, look no further. Note: this list I'll check back on and update now and again as I'm going purely off memory at this point and I'll surely forget the names of some companies that should be on here as well as write up incorrect links. My apologies for that, just bring such mistakes to my attention. The focus will be on tactical nylon products (webbing, chest rigs, rucks, etc.), as no weapons modifications are really tolerated in the CF and WRT knives, well, those are a very individual thing. Just look at the specs of a blade and that should tell you most of what you need to know.


Eagle Industries - www.eagleindustries.com
SOTECH - www.specopstech.com
London Bridge Trading - www.londonbridgetrading.com
Special Operations Equipment - www.soegear.com
CQB Solutions - www.cqbsolutions.com
Drop Zone Tactical - www.dropzonetactical.com
ARUC Systems   - www.arucsystems.com
Kifaru - www.kifaru.net
Danner - www.danner.com
Wellco - www.wellco.com
Tactical Tailor - www.tacticaltailor.com
Paraclete - www.paracletearmor.com
Snugpack - www.snugpack.com
Arktis (be careful with this one, there have been QC issues with Arktis, but those products which do not suffer are excellent) - www.artkis.co.uk
Blackhawk STRIKE line www.blackhawkindustries.com
Camelbak - www.camelbak.com
Surefire - www.surefire.com
Under armor - www.underarmor.com
Tactical Assault Gear - www.tacticalassaultgear.com
Tactical Assault Systems - www.tacticalassaultsystems.com
High Speed Gear Inc. - www.highspeedgearinc.com
Hatch - www.hatch-corp.com
Lightfighter Tactical - www.lightfighter.com (the only place to buy the RAID assault pack and the best distributor of tactical gear on the planet)
Wiggys - www.wiggys.com

Note: Canadian Peacekeeper makes some good gear... if all you do is carry around an FMP. I would not, put plainly, trust my life to any of their stuff purely because of their lack of experience making tactical nylon products. However, if you do have your heart set on CP gear of a tactical nature, I would advise you to look at only their nukebag or their OPS pack. My comment is in no way meant to paint the company as a shoddy one. Rather I point out that their packs lack features many do from the above companies and their quality (for the most part) while good, is not at the level of those listed above. Nothing I have posted here is beyond the purview of my personal experience and that backed up by acquaintances and friends who have combat tours under their belts. Hope this list is of help to some .


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## Firepower (12 Jun 2004)

blackhawk industries is good, i missed it in there, till after i posted a link to it lol

I've picked up a few after market things here, they aren't to bad, a little pricey though. You can order a catologue from them.


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## tacsit (12 Jun 2004)

With respect Firepower, the list I posted is for companies whose gear will step up and not fail on the battlefield. I have heard way too many stories of Blackhawk gear failing on exercises to trust it in times of war. The one exception to this is the STRIKE line of equipment produced by Blackhawk. If you buy a piece of gear and it performs well on exercise that is not necessarily a good judge of whether or not it will handle the real thing. Granted, I am not saying gear from the companies I listed will 100% of the time never fail. Rather their quality is superb and thus their pieces of kit that do fail fail much less than those from other companies (i.e. Blackhawk).


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## Farmboy (12 Jun 2004)

Excellent list.

 However I question stories about the Blackhawk gear failing.


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## Firepower (12 Jun 2004)

I've used their line of Hellstorm protective gear for awhile(mainly knee pads an gloves), an never had any problems. An I've read some of the after action reports from units in Iraq who recommened the US Army buy something similar for knee pads as most found the standard issue ones to stiff, an they also make mention of the leg drop system instead of issued holsters. For the most part I don't trust that MOLLE/STRIKE gear, I just picture those pouches ripping off easily an stay away from any thing that utilizes that system. They do offer a life time warranty on the stuff(except for protective wear, that only has on year), so I suppose if you had any trouble you could send it back.


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## Armymedic (12 Jun 2004)

Any Canadian sites (other then CdnPkpr), or atleast Companies that will take Cdn $?


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## scm77 (12 Jun 2004)

http://www.sealsactiongear.com is Canadian.


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## tacsit (13 Jun 2004)

Farmboy, I'll get in touch with some people and get back to you with some anecdotes 

Firepower, imho the jury is still out on the hellstorm product line by Blackhawk. I've heard stories of it crapping out pretty early, while others have had good luck. That's why I put Hatch Corp on the list, as their aviators and operators gloves I've yet to hear a negative thing about (I have their operators gloves in OD and am in love with them). As for the PALS method of attaching pouches to vests or other products with PALS webbing on it your fears are groundless. Once the pouches are weaved on properly they are on there rock solid. No flop, no bounce, and they most certainly do not rip off gear. I have not heard a single story of pouches ripping off of gear and the only possible thing I can think of is that what I've heard from those I know in the USMC who were issued the MOLLE vest which is of subpar quality and thus the mesh backing of the vest itself ripped, not the pouches themselves. The PALS attachment system allows for true modularity and exceptional security of attachment; much better than the old attachment of the 82 pattern webbing or the attachment of the side pouches of the TV. If it helps make your decision any easier, hundreds of thousands of US servicemen (and several members of our own JTF-2) trust the PALS attachment system to keep their pockets on their rigs.

Armymedic, Drop Zone Tactical (www.dropzonetactical.com) which I have on the list is a Canadian company (situated in Alberta) and a great one at that. Excellent customer service and good products. Unfortunately the site is updated at a very slow pace mainly due to the business of the company itself, as they are frequently busy fulfilling government contracts which are quite large. I know their aftermarket ruck shoulder straps have been purchased by PPCLI (don't quite know which batt., I imagine 3VP) in company sized lots. They also provide a 20% discount to military personel, another good reason to give them your business.

Scm77, stay as far away as you can from Seals Action Gear. If you want to wear their stuff while sitting at your desk or playing airsoft commando then that's fine, but my list is meant to represent gear that you can trust your life to, and I would rate Seals Action Gear at the bottom of the barrel. Don't take my word for it, look at a couple of the posts in the "Day Pack" thread.

If I may I would like to make one comment. If you are a true professional and you are willing to spend your own money on aftermarket gear you had better spend money on that which will not crap out on you when the feces hits the rotating blades on the two way range. If you skimp on your gear I garuantee you that it will fail at the worst possible moment. Can't forget the everpresent Mr. Murphy. If you take your work seriously, you should buy serious gear.


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## Infanteer (13 Jun 2004)

> Armymedic, Drop Zone Tactical (www.dropzonetactical.com) which I have on the list is a Canadian company (situated in Alberta) and a great one at that. Excellent customer service and good products. Unfortunately the site is updated at a very slow pace mainly due to the business of the company itself, as they are frequently busy fulfilling government contracts which are quite large. I know their aftermarket ruck shoulder straps have been purchased by PPCLI (don't quite know which batt., I imagine 3VP) in company sized lots. They also provide a 20% discount to military personel, another good reason to give them your business.



Yup, and the owner is a good guy too, very helpful.



> Scm77, stay as far away as you can from Seals Action Gear. If you want to wear their stuff while sitting at your desk or playing airsoft commando then that's fine, but my list is meant to represent gear that you can trust your life to, and I would rate Seals Action Gear at the bottom of the barrel. Don't take my word for it, look at a couple of the posts in the "Day Pack" thread.



Yup.  They lie; I purchased a rig off them under the impression that I was paying top dollar for real CADPAT (which they advertise), and I got FAKEPAT pouches on a the material they make CF laundry bags with.


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## scm77 (13 Jun 2004)

tacsit said:
			
		

> Scm77, stay as far away as you can from Seals Action Gear. If you want to wear their stuff while sitting at your desk or playing airsoft commando then that's fine, but my list is meant to represent gear that you can trust your life to, and I would rate Seals Action Gear at the bottom of the barrel. Don't take my word for it, look at a couple of the posts in the "Day Pack" thread.



Thanks for the heads up.  I didn't say that they had quality stuff, I just said they were Canadian.  Now I know not to go there.  Unless I need some Gucci kit for some backyard commando raids.


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## Farmboy (13 Jun 2004)

Tacsit

 The reason I question it is because I use alot of Blackhawk gear. None of it has failed.

The only company I have heard though that has constant praise is Drop Zone.

 One funny story was when I was at a sniper match and talking to two guys one of which had an Eagle drag bag. I struck up a conversation about how he liked it. He went on and on about it and bad mouthing the Blackhawk one, either not noticing I was carrying one or not caring.

 Later that day I heard alot of swearing, well it seems that the zipper was falling off his bag  

I have a couple of Eagle products and will say it's top notch.

Most of the bad mouthing from Americans is because Blackhawk is made off shore while Eagle is made by Americans.

 It's also funny you praise Lightfighter so much, but they carry Blackhwk gear. If they were concerned as you say with top notch profetional gear, why carry Blackhawk if it's so bad?


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## devil39 (13 Jun 2004)

Wolverine Supplies - http://www3.mb.sympatico.ca/~jhipwell/

I bought my Eagle Industries drop leg holster from them.   Great holster, if I had to buy another I would buy the exact same one.


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## tacsit (13 Jun 2004)

Farmboy, gear from the top notch manufacturers like Eagle Industries is not free of defects as I said before. Now, let me rephrase. I do not think Blackhawk Industries is at the bottom of the barrel. Far from it, they're fairly high up. But I would not feel comfortable trusting my life to their kit based on the numerous stories I've heard (and yup, I'm working on getting those anecdotes). Lightfighter carries Blackhawk gear because unlike gear from other companies the wait time for gear from BHI is quite shorter because BHI has a bigger manufacturing base and Lightfighter is like any other business, they're there to make money. You're right, many Yanks do have a thing against BHI because their stuff is manufactured outside of the US, but I harbor no such problems with the company, and my view is one based purely on combat effectiveness. As I said, BHI's STRIKE line is top notch. Now, also keep in mind that gear from other companies tends to be better thought out and have better features than lots of stuff from BHI as well.


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## combat_medic (16 Jun 2004)

I would also highly recommend Drop Zone Tactical. Their Recce Smock, while pretty expensive, is a stellar piece of kit. They have so many orders coming in right now that they're a few months behind in delivering them, but the wait is worth it. They also have some pretty high speed patrol packs and the like. And the CADPAT you get from them is real; not some crappy reproduction.


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## Noyon (17 Jun 2004)

www.sealsactiongear.com is a good site. I just ordered a few products, any idea how long it'll take to get to Ontario (Toronto Area) VIA Purolater or whatever they use?

Also will I get hastled by superiors for having none issued equipment?

You'll have to excuse me, Im just a recruit!  ;D


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## Gunnar (17 Jun 2004)

I am not a soldier, nor was I ever a member of the CF.  But:

Everything I have heard about non-issued kit is that once you have passed your basic, you go with what works, and provided it makes sense, nobody really hassles you about it.  At one point (or maybe still?) a lot of our guys used American issue rain gear in the field because ours was lousy.

However:  Basic is all about training you how to use CF issue equipment, and familiarizing you with its advantages and shortcomings.  From everything I have heard they will give you a hard time during Basic, but not afterwards.  Point being:  Once you know your shit, you are given the freedom to make responsible choices, but as a recruit, you don't get choices.  Just say "Yes, Staff" and do what the nice Corporal told you to...

My opinions amount to a canteen of warm spit should a serving member of the CF correct me.


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## tacsit (17 Jun 2004)

Noyon, do you even READ the previous posts in this thread?!  :


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## Noyon (17 Jun 2004)

tacsit said:
			
		

> Noyon, do you even READ the previous posts in this thread?!   :



Umm.. yes, and no where did I read any information about a recruit being able to wear none issued gear. Question is have you read the previous post?


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## condor888000 (17 Jun 2004)

I think he was talking about the reviews seals action gear had been getting.


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## Noyon (18 Jun 2004)

Ahhh I see! Oh well, I just ordered a Gun sling and Goggles.


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## chrisf (18 Jun 2004)

Gunnar said:
			
		

> I am not a soldier, nor was I ever a member of the CF.   But:
> 
> Everything I have heard about non-issued kit is that once you have passed your basic, you go with what works, and provided it makes sense, nobody really hassles you about it.   At one point (or maybe still?) a lot of our guys used American issue rain gear in the field because ours was lousy.



It depends on the unit, the sergeant major of the unit, why you'd NEED to use civilian kit, and the kit in question. By and large though, non-issue kit is frowned upon, except in cases where the army doesn't issue somthing to fill the role, though that would be pretty much nothing (Backpacks used as assault packs or day packs are commonly seen, though they're authorized for use anyway, camel backs are a common purchase, as are knee pads). The biggest thing about non-issue kit is that it pretty much HAS to be olive drab, cadpat, or black if you intend to wear it or use it.

As a recruit? The only non-issue thing I'd show up with would be a pair of insoles for your boots. That's *it*.

Regarding the rain gear, our current issue rain gear is pretty good in a heavy rain, in a light rain you're usually better off wearing nothing, as you'll wind up getting wetter from sweat then from the rain.


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## chrisf (18 Jun 2004)

Noyon said:
			
		

> Ahhh I see! Oh well, I just ordered a Gun sling and Goggles.



If you're in the armoured, they should have issued you goggles anyway? The SWDG goggles?


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## Noyon (18 Jun 2004)

Just a Sig Op said:
			
		

> Noyon said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I purchased the ones with the fans in the bottem to suck out the hot air and take in the cooler air. Seems worth it to me, nothing more annoying than having a sweaty pair on goggles on your face. Im not sure if the issued set is anti fog anyways?


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## chrisf (18 Jun 2004)

I've never had them fog... they're reasonably vented, and there's no real source in them for warm/moist air...


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## Noyon (18 Jun 2004)

Jeez, really? Perhaps I got different ones or something. I always get persperation around the seams and it becomes quite itchy after taking them off.


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## SOLDIER702 (25 Jun 2004)

I realize the subject includes the word "after market" but If I'm not mistaken the CF is supposed to be coming out with CADPAT kneepads and elbow pads. Knowing our government they probably spent millions researching the matter. Anyone know if/when they will issue them?
Also, I think alot of these companies would get a lot more business if they made their products in CADPAT, both TW and AR. I recently came across a dropleg holster made of CADPAT TW on ebay but I lost it and haven't seen another one. I am a big fan of aftermarket kit as well as modifying kit. When I was a reservist I managed to aquire a new rucksac which I promptly modified by putting quick release clips, carabeeners, tougher sleeping bag straps, better padding (i even made a padded waist belt for it, mmmm comfort) and a couple mag pouchs on it. it is a mean piece of kit. but now they are phasing those out for the new custom built rucks (I'd like to see the day every soldier has one of those)
So back to my point of this post, anyone know where I can get good, CADPAT tactical gear?


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## tacsit (25 Jun 2004)

Drop Zone Tactical. Check out their website and give them a call. They make a good drop leg holster which I'm sure you can get in CADPAT. Their gear is top notch and they're a Canadian company.


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## linddd (28 Jul 2004)

Any one needing Custom Cadpat Gear Contact
A&D MFG
Box 338 okotoks Alberta
T1S-1A6
licenced cadpat manufacturer


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## KevinB (28 Jul 2004)

+1 for Dave of A&D.

 We got a bunch of stuff done by them for Afghanistan - they listened and built solid gear backed by a iron clad guarantee.  I have som eother of his stuff and it works perfectly.


A note on SEALS - John is a great guy and he has had geniune CADPAT items in the store and built.  However the majority of the airsoft/wannabe's will not shell out top dollar for kit.  As a result he had the hit dumbed down so it was affordable for those who were not going to use it overseas.


BHI - since it moved its manufacturing overseas has really gone downhill - lookign at their gear at SHOT over the last few years you can see a remarkable decrease in quality.


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## Toadie (28 Jul 2004)

Check out www.canadianpeacekeeper.com They make great stuff.


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## mudgunner49 (16 Aug 2004)

Farmboy said:
			
		

> Tacsit
> 
> The reason I question it is because I use alot of Blackhawk gear. None of it has failed.
> 
> ...



Any company can have a bad apple slip out the door, it's the percentages that count...

Lightfighter carries Blackhawk because they are one of the few companies that can produce in quantity to supply large orders on short notice (possibly due in part to their large, low-cost workforce?).   They produce OK quality kit, that seems to do the job (most of the time) and for many people that is sufficient.   There have been QC issues and waranty issues with a number of their products, several that i have experience with personally.   I myself am a big fan of SO Tech, Eagle and Tactical Tailor as I have had nothing but superb results from these three companies.


YMMV

Blake


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## Matt_Fisher (16 Aug 2004)

In response to the comments regarding Blackhawk, I must say also that alot of their equipment is sub-par.

I used a set of their triple M-16 mag pouches in Iraq:
http://www.lightfighter.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=849
This thing sucked!  It was so tight that you could barely put 3 mags in it, but that wasn't the worst.  The flap was very stiff and very tight around the mags.   So much so that in order to open the mag pouch you had to wrestle the flap over the top of the mags and then it interfered with extracting mags out of the pouch.  I would not recommend this pouch at all.

http://lightfighter.net/eve/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=7336015661&f=829100313&m=669105804
Review of how the poor construction of the para-flare pouch http://www.lightfighter.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=539

http://lightfighter.net/eve/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=7336015661&f=2756008371&m=754107424
A story on the failure of a Blackhawk 3-day assault pack
http://www.lightfighter.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=694

As pointed out, Blackhawk does have not bad customer service, and a big draw is that they've got most of their gear in stock and ready to ship, unlike alot of other companies (Eagle, SO Tech, etc.) that have backlogs on gear.  However, how useful is that Lifetime Warranty when you're deployed (?) and you need your gear to work, otherwise you wouldn't have brought it if you wanted to spend a good portion of the deployment waiting for replacement kit to arrive as per warranty agreements.

I'd rather plan ahead, spend a bit more and have kit that is not going to fail me.  If your gear does take a dive, it's also a good idea to bring a small field repair kit of some replacement fastex buckles, a couple swatches of cordura for patches.  About the only thing that is likely to go bad is a broken fastex buckle here or there, or some of the stitching coming loose.

If you don't feel like assembling your own you can get a pre-made Gear-Aid Repair Kit from MEC
http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=779989&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=134457&bmUID=1092685767974

This is invaluable for repairing stitching on packs and webbing:  
Speedy Stitcher Pack
http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=779989&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=482605&bmUID=1092685767989


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## gun plumber (16 Jan 2005)

Could some helpful Mod maybe compile a listing of links to some of the more reliable equipment site?IE,CP gear,dropzone,seals action gear etc?
I think this would be a great resource for people to find the products that we talk about in the equipment forum.


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## gun plumber (16 Jan 2005)

Alright,I'll start,and hopefully everybody will add thier fav's

KNIVES AND MULTI_TOOLS

http://www.crkt.com/
http://www.leatherman.com/
http://www.gerberblades.com/home.php

BAGS AND OTHER STUFF

http://www.wheelersonline.com/2005Catalog/1-All-Products(1).asp
http://www.compusmart.ab.ca/spplsgt/index.htm
http://www.uscav.com/
http://www.sealsactiongear.com/
http://www.kifaru.net/
http://www.dropzonetactical.com/home.html

BOOTS

http://www.danner.com/
http://www.shoestoboot.com/matterhorn_boots.cfm

HYDRATION SYSTEMS

http://www.nalgene-outdoor.com/store/
http://www.platypushydration.com/
http://www.camelbak.com/

CANADIAN MILITARY KITSHOPS

http://kitshop.ppcli.com/


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## Yeoman (16 Jan 2005)

www.actiongear.com TONS of stuff
www.foxsox.com best damn socks out there period
www.otisgun.com one of the best cleaning kits I've seen out there
www.afmo.com has a ton of yank stuff mostly, but there's some things
www.specopsbrand.com make the best slings on the market, currently answering some q's to have an c9 sling made for me (both for the a1 and a2)
www.tetragon.ca carries some decent stuff, from missisauga
www.blackhawkindustries.com eh they make some okay stuff
www.ironwolfent.com eh there's some stuff
www.tigertactical.com alot of custom cadpat
www.optactical.com pretty decent site
www.rangerjoes.com mainly yank stuff
www.tacticaltailor.com alot of custom made stuff
www.lightfighter.com alot of stuff, but they'll run you around if you purchase stuff from them
those are the sites I check out often.
Greg


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## KevinB (16 Jan 2005)

I have had nothing but great deals with Brad Nelson owner of Lightfighter

 With any kit purchase if you are goign in harms way - tell them - send them a copy of your id and given them your deployment dates.  Most of the good site will push the pogues and airsoft clowns to the rear and get the troops the gear they need.

I generally try to one stp shop with Brad as he is will to go the distance for you if he knows you need it.

General Gear

Paraclete
Tactical Tailor
SOTECH
ESSTAC
and of course EGGROLL  


Kifaru for rucks hands down

-Kevin


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## gun plumber (17 Jan 2005)

Thank you for the help so far.One other request(if it is;nt to much trouble):could you maybe trim the excess and make this topic a permanent fixture that wouldn't fade out of existence?
If trimmed and made a permanent FAQ,this could be a good resource tool in this forum.not only for explaining things better(a picture is worth a thousand words)and also for those of us who might be interested in purchasing some of the items talked about here.
Thank You.


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## Smamit /REG646 (22 Jan 2005)

Hi,  First of all so as not to be under handed I make custom made rucksacks and vests etc for the IDF here in Israel
There are other good companies  such as
 Kata and Merom-Dolphin  Packs and vests from Israel
Crossfire and Plata-tac from Australia
Karrimor military , Web-tex and Arkis from the UK
I hope this helps
yours Smamit /REG646


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