# The Bio-Science Officer Merged Thread



## rohitk (1 Feb 2008)

Hey Everyone, I'm in a bit of a unique spot here. 

I have a BSc. in Biotechnology and I'm in the final year of my MSc. in Pharmaceutical Sciences ... I'm considering applying to the Pilot and Bioscience Officer positions. I've read many posts on this site talking about how hard the "Pilot" trade is, so I was wondering if having gone to graduate school will put me in a better position than my competition? 

Also, I've had a surgery to repair a torn ligament (ACL) in my knee two years ago...My knee is not yet a 100%, but i'm still in rehab for it. So hopefully by the time summer rolls around and i'm ready to apply, it will be around 90%. Will this be an issue with my Physical? Any advice would be really helpful! Thanks!

Kalvapalle


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## George Wallace (1 Feb 2008)

NOT REALLY.

I am surprised if I can read your post.  Is something wrong at your end?


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## Loachman (1 Feb 2008)

Your success (hopefully) or otherwise during pilot training will depend solely on how hard you work on the course, plus a bit of natural ability and a bit of luck.

Your previous education may help with study habits, but not necessarily (I had no study habits at all when I went to Moose Jaw, and amazed myself at how much effort I was able to put into studying and homework), and that's about it.

I went through as UTPO, ie high school only. I noticed a far higher wash-out rate for the DEOs (Direct Entry Officers, ie already had a degree). I suspect that this was purely due to motivation and hunger - they had something to fall back upon, whereas we wanted it more.


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## rohitk (1 Feb 2008)

Firstly, apologies about the font colour of my post, i didnt realize it was that dark! 

About the graduate degree, i'm more curious as to whether that will give me an edge in the application process. Because as of yesterday, there were 0 positions for both, the Pilot and the Bioscience Officer positions.And i was told that there were several hundred files waiting for positions to open up...If i was to apply with a graduate degree, would i have any kind of advantage in the selection process?


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## benny88 (1 Feb 2008)

rohitk said:
			
		

> If i was to apply with a graduate degree, would i have any kind of advantage in the selection process?


    
    Interesting question. For pilot, I would say "no", as your master's degree isn't really relevant to the trade. For Bioscience officer though, it might help as the degree is related to the trade. I'm just guessing though, the only way to find out is to apply.


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## WannaBeFlyer (2 Feb 2008)

> If i was to apply with a graduate degree, would i have any kind of advantage in the selection process?



From what I understood during my interview, and don't quote me on it, having a degree did not mean that much during the selection process unless of course you were applying DEO: you had to have one. Having said that, a degree will really help your total score if your grades were exceptional. If you have C's all over your transcripts, it may actually hinder your total score. There are other ways you can distinguish yourself from the competition including: completing volunteer work, having cadet experience, and although it is not required, having previous flight time in the case of Pilot. You can also improve your score but getting the highest mark possible on the CFAT. 

In terms of your injury, I would suggest that you get things started now if they are accepting applications for Pilot. You will have plenty of time to heal and visit a specialists if you are applying for Pilot. To give you an example, I submitted my application in March 2007 and I am going to Aircrew Selection, the final step in the Pilot application process, in April. During your initial medical at the recruiting centre, they may spend a bit more time examining your injury and they may also ask you to visit a specialist concerning your injury. 

The only way to know how you will do is to apply and find out. Good luck.


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## rohitk (2 Feb 2008)

Thanks so much for all the replies! Very helpful and informative... MG, so you were saying that it took them 1year to call you for the Air Crew Selection? So i'm assuming that once thats done you go one file and then wait another few months for a position to open up...correct? To me that sounds like a 2 year process from the time of application! Is that an accurate estimate?


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## bbell (2 Feb 2008)

i can tell my story as a comparison. 3.79 GPA, steady job for 8 years, 7 years as a volunteer hockey coach, wrote my cfat- was told i was qualified for all officer pos. however i was told to wait to do my interview and medical because there are too many ahead of me, ie. just because i'm qualified doesnt mean they are going to take away a position already offered. i do think that you will eventually get in and get whatever trade you desire, you sound more than qualified. i just think we all have to wait our turn. I'm assuming i will be in the Sept BMOQ and that will put me at about a years wait. Now as i say this stranger things have happened and if you do searches you will read about much quicker and much longer wait times. the advice given to me was to be patient and you will get what you want. good luck mate.


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## WannaBeFlyer (2 Feb 2008)

rohitk said:
			
		

> Thanks so much for all the replies! Very helpful and informative... MG, so you were saying that it took them 1year to call you for the Air Crew Selection? So i'm assuming that once thats done you go one file and then wait another few months for a position to open up...correct? To me that sounds like a 2 year process from the time of application! Is that an accurate estimate?



Not necessarily two years for all applicants - timing, entry plan, your suitability, and the CF's requirements have a lot to do with it. When I applied, it was early in the year and from what I understand the CF's priority didn't include having more untrained Pilots in the system; they were looking to put boots on the ground.  Also, the airforce had raised the minimum required score to receive an offer. I was told I did really well, but I didn't have the required score to receive an invite for a week in Southern Ontario at that time. Should you do better, and if your timing is right, then you probably won't wait as long as I did. I should add that initially I was scheduled for ASC in February but I was bumped to April to make room for ROTP applicants. I guess a lot of them book over the spring break because you may have to be gone for a week.

There is a lot to do from the time you initially hand in your application to the time you receive an offer. There is:
- the initial CFAT, interview and medical (very similar to an annual medical) 
- enhanced reliability check 
- visual acuity test with a civie eye doctor recommended by the CF. You have a vision test at the recruiting centre, one with the civie eye doctor, and from what I understand, they examine your eyes in Toronto to determine whether or not you have had laser eye surgery. Maybe someone else can chime in on that one.
- blood tests 
- in my case, because I am CT'ing from the Reserves, a PT test (basic fitness test)
- finally, air crew selection in Trenton and if you pass that portion, aircrew medicals in Toronto. (It is one week straight)

So, given the amount of testing involved, considering my score/suitability, plus the amount of applicants that are processed for all trades; I think the process is moving along quite well.

Call the recruiting centre and find out if or when they are accepting applications for DEO Pilot. Again, good luck. In the mean time, I would suggest you prepare for your CFAT even if you can't apply now. (Have a look at the CFAT thread) When you are healed up, start running even when you don't want to. (actually, especially when you don't want to!) Do some weight training / body weight training. Maybe have a look at the Basic Training threads.


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## ark (2 Feb 2008)

MG, under which entry program are you applying?


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## WannaBeFlyer (2 Feb 2008)

ark said:
			
		

> MG, under which entry program are you applying?



CEOTP


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## rohitk (2 Feb 2008)

First off, a huge thank you to everyone thats replying to my query! I really appreciate it.

With regards to the post by BBell, thats amazing that with such a high GPA and voluneer experience its taking a while. I assumed that as and when they get a great candidate, you move to the front of the pack regardless of how long the others have been waiting...is that not how it works? 

Also, I was wondering if applying for Bioscience officer as my second option would give the decision-makers the idea that i'm not 100% committed to being a Pilot? The recruiter said that they make the judgement for each position independently and that its only upto me to decide...is that really how it works though? Does anyone have any inside info or experience with this? Also, I was thinking of maybe making Armoured Officer my third option, so I'm worried that they'll straightaway ignore the Pilot and Bioscience options and consider me for only the Armoured position as there may be more spots open there...Because in the end, I want my suitability for each position to be judged independent of my other choices ... i.e., if there's more armoured openings and i dont make the cut for pilot, then fine. but i dont want them to not consider me for Pilot just cause I've already listed Armoured as an option...any advice/comments? 

( With regards to my ACL injury, I've already begun running and training to get to peak fitness...so hopefully I'll be good to go in a few months! )


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## Loachman (2 Feb 2008)

They ask for your top three preferences anyway, which helps them match you to something that you want.***

Once the process is complete, you will be made an offer, which you can accept or not.

We are about three hundred pilots short right now, and that is not going to improve for some time to come. That should help you somewhat, although trining system delays will not.

Your best and most current info will come from the recruiters. Ask them any questions that you have.

***Mine were "Pilot", "Pilot", and "Pilot" but that was because I'm doing another CT (back to the regular force) and I already are one. They still insisted that I put down three choices though.


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## rohitk (2 Feb 2008)

Haha thats hilarious that they NEED 3 choices. You said we're short some 300 pilots, but I was told by the recruiter that there were 0 positions..So does it mean that the lack of positions is due to them not being able to train enough pilots at once to overcome it? Also, does anyone know when during the year most positions open up? Is it at the start of the fiscal year in April? Or is it that as soon as one spot opens up, the best candidate from the hundreds who are on file gets the call? I assumed that they would pick the 170 that they need in one swoop, and train them together...can someone elighten me on the process please? Also, I've written several aptitude tests like the SAT and the GRE, and did very well on both...(1250/1600 on the SAT and 1350/1600 on the GRE). Can I safely assume that the CFAT test will not be much harder than those two? I plan to apply as a DEO (I'm currently in the last year of my graduate degree,i.e., MSc.)...

PS: any advice is great advice!


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## kincanucks (2 Feb 2008)

rohitk said:
			
		

> Haha thats hilarious that they NEED 3 choices. You said we're short some 300 pilots, but I was told by the recruiter that there were 0 positions..So does it mean that the lack of positions is due to them not being able to train enough pilots at once to overcome it? Also, does anyone know when during the year most positions open up? Is it at the start of the fiscal year in April? Or is it that as soon as one spot opens up, the best candidate from the hundreds who are on file gets the call? I assumed that they would pick the 170 that they need in one swoop, and train them together...can someone elighten me on the process please? Also, I've written several aptitude tests like the SAT and the GRE, and did very well on both...(1250/1600 on the SAT and 1350/1600 on the GRE). Can I safely assume that the CFAT test will not be much harder than those two? I plan to apply as a DEO (I'm currently in the last year of my graduate degree,i.e., MSc.)...
> 
> PS: any advice is great advice!



Read the recruiting threads.


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## rohitk (3 Feb 2008)

I did kincanucks, but I just thought it was humorous that it says they need three choices, but that they dont require it to be 3 different choices. I didn't mean to demean the policy or ask for info that was already out there.


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## bbell (3 Feb 2008)

according to the RC here in Edmonton, i dont get to jump ahead in line just because my grades are high. because if you think about it there are people who have been offerred jobs waiting to go to BMOQ, why would they take those job offers back for me? i wouldnt expect that to happen, so i'm assuming it doesnt. anyone feel free to correct me on this. I do know there is a lot of ocdt's waiting to go.


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## rohitk (3 Feb 2008)

Oh I understand that ... I was actually curious as to whether more qualified candidates get to jump ahead of the line in terms of those waiting to receive offers... the recruiter online said they had 0 positions and several hundred files waiting for the position to open up .. so i was wondering whether a new and more qualified applicant would jump to the front of that waiting line...I'm assuming thats what they'd do since they'd want only the best candidates. But either way it sounds like a looong wait ... I hope to get my application in during the summer, once my knee is all healed up.


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## benny88 (3 Feb 2008)

rohitk said:
			
		

> I was actually curious as to whether more qualified candidates get to jump ahead of the line in terms of those waiting to receive offers...



   Highly dubious...but like Loachman said, your recruiters are the best source for this info. The system is so wacky (I did all my medicals, interviews, aircrew, and got an offer all within 4 months of submitting my application.) so really no one's experience is relevant because it changes all the time, and the recruiters are the only ones who are current.


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## WannaBeFlyer (3 Feb 2008)

bbell, grades are a part of your score. My point was that if you had low grades in your transcripts, it could hurt your chances. Other applicants may have "jumped" ahead of me, but it was because I did not meet the required score to receive an ASC date at that time. I guess I was using my situation to illustrate how grades can hurt you. My grades were one of two areas I could have improved on. Good luck. 

rhotik, it doesn't have to take a "loooong" time. It depends on timing, the CF's priorities, and how competitive you are. Don't forget, I am doing a component transfer from the Reserves. It took a while for my docs to get to the recruiting centre. That combined with the fact that I didn't meet the minimum score lengthened the process.

Four months benny?! That is great. I think I had my vision test at that point.


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## bbell (3 Feb 2008)

so if grades are that important how come i'm being told to wait to do my interview/medical until they find out how many candidates from RC Edmonton are alloted to the May 5th course?


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## aesop081 (3 Feb 2008)

bbell said:
			
		

> so if grades are that important how come i'm being told to wait to do my interview/medical until they find out how many candidates from RC Edmonton are alloted to the May 5th course?



It doesnt matter how many positions there are. Without a valid medical and completed interview you are not elligible for any of them.


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## bbell (3 Feb 2008)

well thats not the info i recieved at the RC. I was told that because Edmonton might only receive 5 spots (just a hypothetical number she threw out. could be more could be less she said) the people whom have already been offered spots go first, then if there was still spots open i would be called in to do my med and interview. the initial thread was that my grades, no matter how good, were not going to propel me to the top of the list, because there are candidates waiting.


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## bbell (3 Feb 2008)

as i am just an applicant at this point i can only go by what the recruiting office tells me. If someone with more experience has any suggestions or comments i would appreciate the advice. cheers.


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## benny88 (3 Feb 2008)

MG said:
			
		

> Four months benny?! That is great. I think I had my vision test at that point.


   
  Yeah, I just had good timing I guess.



			
				bbell said:
			
		

> I was told that because Edmonton might only receive 5 spots



Whoa, I didn't know spots were allocated geographically like that, I thought everyone got thrown into the same pool.


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## bbell (3 Feb 2008)

yah i didnt either until Friday. Like i said i can only go off of what the RC tells me.


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## BC Old Guy (3 Feb 2008)

rohitk said:
			
		

> Oh I understand that ... I was actually curious as to whether more qualified candidates get to jump ahead of the line in terms of those waiting to receive offers... the recruiter online said they had 0 positions and several hundred files waiting for the position to open up .. so i was wondering whether a new and more qualified applicant would jump to the front of that waiting line...I'm assuming thats what they'd do since they'd want only the best candidates. But either way it sounds like a looong wait ... I hope to get my application in during the summer, once my knee is all healed up.



Yes, we constantly review the list, up until the offer is made.  Up until then, as better qualified applicants come into the system, they rank higher on the merit list.  

Your degrees will help, as education is one factor we consider - among many others.  However, your degrees do not relate directley to being a Pilot or an Armoured Officer, so would not be any more helpful than any other post-graduate degree.  The waits are long for pilot as there are few training vacancies in any one year, and there are many, many applications - close to 500 active for pilot at any one time.

Since you are taking a Pharmacy degree, would you consider joing as a Pharmacist?  There are not many vacancies in any one year, but neither are there very many applicants.  Take a look, and consider it as one of your options.

The idea of putting down more than one choice is so that the CFRC can consider you for positions that interest you.  If you are just interested in one job, then put down only one choice.  Expect the Recruiter to discuss this with you, especially if there is a lot of interest for that occupation, as we realy want to hire people instead of building up a load of files "just in case a vacancy comes open"


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## IntlBr (3 Feb 2008)

BC Old Guy,

This means that the merit list does have an order which means something?

I was told by my CFRC that one's position on the merit list is irrelevant.

Please confirm/deny!


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## BC Old Guy (3 Feb 2008)

As with many other things in recruiting  the answere to your question is - it depends.

If you are applying an occupation with local selection, with plenty of spots, then your placement on the merit list doesn't matter.  If you are applying for an occupation with national selection, with few spots, and many applications, then your placement has a lot to do with whether you get a job offer or not.  

If a person is applying for infantry, with over a 1,000 training vacancies in any one year, then the merit list placings doesn't really matter.  Same with Naval Electronics Technician - although there are only about 100 training vacancies for all three occupations in a year, the education and CFAT score requirements are high, so if a person qualifies then they will likely be hired.

Now, if a person want to be a Pilot, with about 70 training vacancies in the past year, and about 500 active applications - you have to have something special even to be considered.


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## IntlBr (3 Feb 2008)

BC Old Guy - PM Inbound.


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## bbell (4 Feb 2008)

so has anyone else been asked to hold off on interview/medical?


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## Kramer (4 Feb 2008)

bbell said:
			
		

> so has anyone else been asked to hold off on interview/medical?



Yes, also at CFRC/D Edmonton.  I'm doing a CT/DEO from PPres to Reg.  Last week, I called to schedule interview/medical and they gave me a date/time this month.  Twenty minutes later they called back saying there would be no processing of new officer plan applicants until the new fiscal year - gave me a new date/time in April.  It sounded like this may be because of the backlog in the training system (BOMQ).


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## Southern Boy (4 Feb 2008)

Have you considered becoming a physician? Sounds like you have the background for it, and it pays very well. The miliatary is short MDs as well. Think about it. Good luck nevertheless.


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## rohitk (4 Feb 2008)

Well my degrees dont really amount to medical school, thats another 5 year process ... so I wont be able to become a Physician anytime soon. As for Pharmacy, my degree only lets me do research in the area of pharmaceutical sciences, so i'm not actually a pharmacist...but i work in a lab trying to generate a drug for bone diseases...so yeah, i cant be a Pharmacist either. 

Kramer, thanks for the heads up on the backlog .. so there's no point in me rushing into the application, i can take my time and hand it in come april...

So I have another question ... when is the BOMQ conducted in Saint Jean sur Richelieu? Is it only once a year?


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## George Wallace (4 Feb 2008)

I think you missed his point.  I think he was suggesting that perhaps you may apply for the CF Medical Officer Plan or for the Cf to train you as a Pharmacist.


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## rohitk (4 Feb 2008)

Ohhh I understand that he meant Medical Officer, but wouldn't that mean that i either need to already be a physician or need to get into Med School? Cause its really really really hard to get into Med School to be trained as a Physician ...can anyone tell me how that works if i enroll in the Medical Officer Training Plan ?


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## Zoomie (4 Feb 2008)

The CF has arrangements for a specific number of spots in medical schools across the country.  If you meet the school's entry requirements, you're in.  You don't compete with civilians, just other CF candidates.


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## rohitk (4 Feb 2008)

Hmm, that sounds interesting. However, I've already been in School for 6yrs now, and I dont know if I want to go back for 5 more...


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## medaid (4 Feb 2008)

Talk to your local CFRC about MOTP. Talk to your local H Svc Gp recruiter about MMTP. For all other med school inquiries talk to your local CFRC.


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## rohitk (4 Feb 2008)

Thanks for the advice MedTech ... I will ask about it when I see the recruiter. With regards to the Basic Officer Training, does the BMQ take place only once a year? Or is it a year-round thing so that if you join in, say August, you dont have to wait too long to get a spot?


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## MAJONES (4 Feb 2008)

Hi:
With regards to the pilot trade the MSc will help your application a bit (part of your score is based on your academics and the higher your education the more points you get).  With regards to the BioSci officer the MSc will be an advantage.  
BMOQs run at different times during the year.  (Sept, Jan, April-MAy and June)


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## ShaneOB (21 May 2008)

rohitk said:
			
		

> Oh I understand that ... I was actually curious as to whether more qualified candidates get to jump ahead of the line in terms of those waiting to receive offers... the recruiter online said they had 0 positions and several hundred files waiting for the position to open up .. so i was wondering whether a new and more qualified applicant would jump to the front of that waiting line...I'm assuming thats what they'd do since they'd want only the best candidates. But either way it sounds like a looong wait ... I hope to get my application in during the summer, once my knee is all healed up.



I think your education will help you most definitely, as others have already mentioned, it will help increase your score.  I have an MA and I think it has helped me in the recruiting process.
I got my call mid April and was made a conditional offer for pilot, after about a year (I had to wait until the beginning of this fiscal year, which began 01 April and I think that is often the case for positions that have a supply that is low, relative to the demand).  My last obstacle is Aircrew Selection in Trenton and the following medicals in Toronto, which I will do in July.
I guess all I'm trying to say is stay the course.  If it's what you want, wait for it, because your education will most likely give you an edge over other DEO candidates.
Also, don't let them talk you into joining the artillery   I hear they do that a lot.


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## Ergotracer (24 May 2008)

I've really enjoyed reading the various topics on this site and find the posts and replies very informative. Thank you.   

Perhaps my question would be better suited to someone who works as or has a handle on the recruitment process for the Bioscience Officer position. I will be graduating near the end of the summer and recently (2 weeks ago) made formal application with the recruiting office for the Bioscience Officer position. Though the recruiting officer didn't know much about this particular speciality, he was able to tell me that 3 positions existed and explained the application process (CFAT, medical, interview etc).  I have researched this position extensively, mostly provided via CF site and here. Though I feel I have positioned myself well for a career with the CF, for example, I hold a Kinesiology (honours) degree, Masters of Science (Mechanical Engineering), 5 years applied ergonomics, industrial hygiene (IH), OH&S field experience and will have full ergonomics accreditation soon (application pending approval), I'm hoping to gain some additional insight about the recruiting process for this position. 

Given that there only a few openings annually for the Bioscience Officer position, when would these positions typically become available? What I mean is, 3 positions available at once seems to be a high number but could it be that these became available recently which are to be filled soon with existing top ranked applicants?  If this is the case, what is the likelyhood of me missing the boat, since I'm now only going through the application process?    

As well, it would seem that applicants with cognant science degrees are wanting to pursue this profession even though the brochure identifies human factors / ergonomics / IH etc. as specific and desirable  backgrounds for this career (I believe one post mentioning holders of military backgrounds filled the position of Bioscience Officer). One question which arises concerns grooming those who are already employed by the CF.  Is it really important to the CF to have individuals with existing skill sets because the CF seems to invest an enormous amount of resources on upgrading and developing skills of individuals from within.  

Any insight would be helpful. 

EG


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## Dirt Digger (17 Jun 2008)

Ergotracer said:
			
		

> I've really enjoyed reading the various topics on this site and find the posts and replies very informative. Thank you.
> 
> Perhaps my question would be better suited to someone who works as or has a handle on the recruitment process for the Bioscience Officer position. I will be graduating near the end of the summer and recently (2 weeks ago) made formal application with the recruiting office for the Bioscience Officer position. Though the recruiting officer didn't know much about this particular speciality, he was able to tell me that 3 positions existed and explained the application process (CFAT, medical, interview etc).  I have researched this position extensively, mostly provided via CF site and here. Though I feel I have positioned myself well for a career with the CF, for example, I hold a Kinesiology (honours) degree, Masters of Science (Mechanical Engineering), 5 years applied ergonomics, industrial hygiene (IH), OH&S field experience and will have full ergonomics accreditation soon (application pending approval), I'm hoping to gain some additional insight about the recruiting process for this position.



I can't really tell you much about the recruiting process except for my own story.  I applied to the Bioscience trade back in the Feb/March time frame (after a huge nightmare of nobody knowing the trade even existed), received my acceptable message in the summer and was in St-Jean in the fall.  Currently the Bioscience recruiting video is being redone, but I'm not sure when it'll show up on the CF site.   



> Given that there only a few openings annually for the Bioscience Officer position, when would these positions typically become available? What I mean is, 3 positions available at once seems to be a high number but could it be that these became available recently which are to be filled soon with existing top ranked applicants?  If this is the case, what is the likelyhood of me missing the boat, since I'm now only going through the application process?



Three positions is actually quite a few and your background would steer you towards the human factors positions in Toronto.  How the slots are filled will depend on when the next board sits.  Ask your recruiter if they know the date.



> As well, it would seem that applicants with cognant science degrees are wanting to pursue this profession even though the brochure identifies human factors / ergonomics / IH etc. as specific and desirable  backgrounds for this career (I believe one post mentioning holders of military backgrounds filled the position of Bioscience Officer). One question which arises concerns grooming those who are already employed by the CF.  Is it really important to the CF to have individuals with existing skill sets because the CF seems to invest an enormous amount of resources on upgrading and developing skills of individuals from within.



Prior military is big simply because when you're in a applicant pool where everybody has the same educational credits, that experience sets you apart from the crowd.  It's not really an issue of grooming, as there are few trades out there that actively seek out some of the degrees that Bioscience goes for.  As such, not many people currently in the CF are working through ergonomics courses or going for their CRSP.  The trade does have two post grad streams, so they actively look for people that either meet the graduate criteria, or have the ability to meet the entrance requirements.

If you have any other questions about the trade, feel free to send me a PM.


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## Ergotracer (18 Jun 2008)

Hello everyone,

Many thanks DirtDigger for your time and kind reply. I'm happy to report that I successfully completed the CFAT and medical today.  The next step will be to have all the additional medical testing requirements completed and submitted and then hopefully I'll be invited back for the interview. 

ErgoTracer


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## Pieman (4 Sep 2009)

I have been looking into this trade to switch into as my contract is up soon. 

Are there any bioscience officers lurking here who can answer my questions?

The recruiting page describes the job:
http://www.forces.ca/html/bioscienceofficer_reg_en.aspx



> As a Bioscience Officer, your contribution to the Canadian Forces mission will be to develop practical procedures, standards, equipment and strategies that conserve personnel and material resources, protect the environment, and enhance operational effectiveness.
> 
> You will have opportunities to become involved in a wide variety of CF operations, depending on your assignments and interests.



My questions are:

1) What limitation is there to the projects that  you can work on?  Can I move into any R&D area that involves development of training equipment and technology? Or is it restricted to safety factors?

2) What Universities are bioscience officers typically allowed to attend? Are foreign universities that fit the research area accessable?

3) What is the typical work environment like for the bioscience community? Where is the head office? Are you trapped in the head office for long portions of your career? 

4) What is the demand for Bioscience officers? Are there openings for the trade each year?

Thanks in advance.


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## Gunner98 (4 Sep 2009)

I am not a Bio-Sci but I have worked closely with several:

My questions are: *Answers to the degree I can answer*

1) What limitation is there to the projects that  you can work on?  Can I move into any R&D area that involves development of training equipment and technology? Or is it restricted to safety factors?

*Human factors - takes into account most equipment for soldier to pilot to diver.  Whereas laser safety would find you with air force in Winnipeg, Chem/Bio - Suffield, Hazardous environments - Ottawa and Suffield, CBRN - Borden at School or Suffield, there is a team from Ottawa that deploys on recce to regions we are thinking of deploying - they do hazard assessments, equipment design, trials - Toronto, Ottawa.  You with work with a lot of public servants and contractors  (scientists with specific specialties)*

2) What Universities are bioscience officers typically allowed to attend? Are foreign universities that fit the research area accessable?  *Not sure, I will have to defer!*

3) What is the typical work environment like for the bioscience community? Where is the head office? Are you trapped in the head office for long portions of your career?   *Your career path depends on your sub-specialty - you can spend most of your career in one or two locations.  Head office is at DRDC in Toronto.
*
4) What is the demand for Bioscience officers? Are there openings for the trade each year? *Yes and yes.*

Thanks in advance.


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## Pieman (4 Sep 2009)

Thanks for the response, was helpful. Perhaps you could direct this link to one of the bioscience officers you know?


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## Gunner98 (4 Sep 2009)

Perhaps...???  But that would make me the middleman, I already have a career and it is not liaison or recruiting.  Perhaps you could...

Get some answers by using contacts through - http://www.drdc-rddc.gc.ca/careers-carrieres/index-eng.asp 

or http://www.drdc-rddc.gc.ca/contact-contactez-eng.asp

or do some reading at http://www.forces.gc.ca/health-sante/ps/oh-so/DHHAT-EDERS-eng.asp 

or http://www.drdc-rddc.gc.ca/sitemap-plandusite-eng.asp


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## Pieman (4 Sep 2009)

> Perhaps...  But that would make me the middleman, I already have a career and it is not liaison or recruiting.


Thanks, did not intend to turn you into the middle man.


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## Dirt Digger (6 Sep 2009)

Pieman said:
			
		

> I have been looking into this trade to switch into as my contract is up soon.
> 
> Are there any bioscience officers lurking here who can answer my questions?



As far as I know, I'm the only Bio that actively monitors this site.  A few others have posted in the past, but usually only for specific topics (i.e. ongoing equipment projects).



> 1) What limitation is there to the projects that  you can work on?  Can I move into any R&D area that involves development of training equipment and technology? Or is it restricted to safety factors?



Restricted, but not in the way you've phrased the question.  You appear to be leaning towards the role of a defence scientist, *which we are not*.  You don't have the ability to pick and choose research projects or areas of interest...you're posted into a job and you perform that job.  For example, you may have a background in organic chemistry and find yourself working in Winnipeg as the Standards Officer at the CF School of Survival and Aeromedical Training (CFSSAT).  

There is a lot of variety in the trade and a lot of opportunities to do unique courses.  However, the chance of getting into the trade and working on a single specialty for your entire career is very unlikely.



> 2) What Universities are bioscience officers typically allowed to attend? Are foreign universities that fit the research area accessable?



The only reason you would go to a university is for a post grad (or if you wanted to take some courses on your own time).  The trade currently offers two PGs from schools in the States, with a yearly competition for the slots.  The first is in Human Factors from Monterey, CA and the second is in Industrial Hygiene from Bethesda.  Each of the PGs is a two-year posting...slots are based on the needs of the trade.  There is also a certificate in Aerospace Physiology from NAS Pensacola, but that's a three-month course.



> 3) What is the typical work environment like for the bioscience community? Where is the head office? Are you trapped in the head office for long portions of your career?



Work environment changes based on where you work...each location is different.  The trade is small and only has a few main postings:  Suffield (Medicine Hat), Winnipeg, Toronto and Ottawa.  There are also a few one-of positions in Halifax, Trenton (mine) and Fort Detrick, MA.  For example, Winnipeg is flight suits and combats...flights suits around the altitude chamber and combats when out in the field for SERE courses.  In Trenton I'm in combats...plus I'm in one of the positions that deploys overseas (DHHAT).  Your number of subordinates will vary based on the job as well.

Head office is in Ottawa.  People either really like or really hate going there.  There are a few positions there besides the trade advisor...we have a DHHAT based out of NDMC, a medical intelligence position, etc.  Personally, of all the places I've been, I would say that my least favorite was Toronto...simply because I hated living in the city.  Toronto tends to have the highest number of Bios, so is often seen as being the "head".



> 4) What is the demand for Bioscience officers? Are there openings for the trade each year?



Small trade...about 35(?) positions.  Usually there are one or two slots open per year.  We've recently had a few members release from the CF, so that number may increase for the next few years.  Minimum to apply is an undergrad in the health sciences with the ability (i.e. B average) to get into a Masters program.

If you've seen the video on the recruiting website, you've probably figured out who I am (no, my avatar is not a picture of me  ;D).  Feel free to send me a PM if you have more questions.  You can also search for "bioscience" and read some of my historical comments.


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## paxis (2 Jan 2012)

I'm currently working towards a BSc in biotechnology (closely related to microbiology) and I'm looking for potential employment as a Commissioned Officer in the CF. From the official recruiting website, I found that there were indeed scientist positions offered ("Bioscience Officer"). But the description seems to imply that this position is geared towards people with an engineering or physiology background. The description also says that the candidate "meet minimum requirements for acceptance into a post-graduate programme in Human Factors, Physiology or Industrial Hygiene". Can anyone shed light on this? Would this position be compatible with my background? Are there other science related positions that the site does not state that would be suitable for me or would I be best off looking at other agencies like NRC or DRDC?

On a side note, I might choose to get a BA after my BSc (just because political science and military subjects are also my interest aside from science) so there are potentially other options there.


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## MedCorps (2 Jan 2012)

I work with Bioscience Officers frequently.  Small trade but a good bunch who do some really neat stuff.  They are the interface between the Canadian Forces Health Service (CFHS) and the Defence Research and Development scientists and between contracted researchers and the CFHS. They also do some research proper in their own right. 

The guys I know do research in the fields of soldier survival (personnel armour), personnel equipment improvement, chemical biological radiological nuclear defence, the human machine interface, blast injury, medical countermeasures, improving individual and team performance, operational culture, synthetic environments, modeling, simulation, and decision support. I am sure there is stuff I missed / do not know about as it seems that much of their research is done at the classified level, either for security reasons or intellectual property. 

When they are not employed in doing research type stuff they are involved in the CFHS aerospace medicine program, medical intelligence, and lead the Deployable Health Hazard Assessment Teams (DHHAT). 

All of the ones that I have met have at least one masters degree. Often they come with a degree and then get a second one in industrial hygiene (for DHHAT or medical intelligence), or human factors (for research and aerospace medicine) in order to meet the needs of the service.  In a few cases I have met officers who have came in with an undergraduate degree, with the obvious capability to get into one of the masters programs that you have mentioned. 

If you apply the CFHS Science and Technology Manager (the senior Bioscience Officer) will see your application to determine if your undergraduate degree will meet the needs of the CF.  You need to be in a position however then you leave undergrad to undertake and succeed in graduate schooling.  

If you need more information let me know and I can ask around for you. 

MC


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## Dirt Digger (5 Jan 2012)

MC covered most of the bases already (excellent info), but do a search here for the bioscience thread.  Give it a read and if you have any further questions, feel free to PM me.  I'm one of the Bios in the recruiting video.


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## The Bread Guy (5 Jan 2012)

:crystalball:

I see a merge coming soon.....

*Milnet.ca Staff*


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## paxis (29 Jul 2012)

Thread revival!

Just got a few miscellaneous questions after reading through the entire consolidated thread:

1. How much choice do Bioscience Officers get as to what field they get trained in or does it depend on the need of the Forces? I plan on specializing my BSc Honours in Microbiology and Immunology (changed from my last post) and would like to work with cells (which I guess means that I'm leaning towards health/occupational hygiene). I wouldn't be sent to do applied R&D on stuff like equipment would I?



			
				Dirt Digger said:
			
		

> The trade currently offers two PGs from schools in the States, with a yearly competition for the slots.  The first is in Human Factors from Monterey, CA and the second is in Industrial Hygiene from Bethesda.  Each of the PGs is a two-year posting...slots are based on the needs of the trade.  There is also a certificate in Aerospace Physiology from NAS Pensacola, but that's a three-month course.



2. Dirt Digger (or anyone else in the know), is the above information still accurate for place and duration of the MSc?

3. I've been doing a bit of career exploration and it seems that in the civilian scientist field, there is a lot of emphasis on research and lab experience. Is any of this necessary/useful for entry as a Bioscience Officer? How much research does each specialization within the Bioscience trade do?

4. What pay scale does Bioscience Officer fall under?

5. More of a fun question: upon entry, what element uniform do Bioscience Officers wear (since it is a purple trade)? I heard that Bioscience Officers wearing Naval uniforms get cherry red bands between the gold rank bands on their sleeves


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## CombatDoc (29 Jul 2012)

paxis said:
			
		

> 4. What pay scale does Bioscience Officer fall under?
> 
> 5. More of a fun question: upon entry, what element uniform do Bioscience Officers wear (since it is a purple trade)? I heard that Bioscience Officers wearing Naval uniforms get cherry red bands between the gold rank bands on their sleeves


4.  I suspect that BIO falls under the pay scale for general duty officers i.e. no spec pay, same as every other Captain rank.

5.  Naval uniforms for Medical Officers have the red bands, all other allied health professionals wear maroon bands between the gold bars.  BIO would wear maroon.


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## Dirt Digger (30 Jul 2012)

paxis said:
			
		

> 1. How much choice do Bioscience Officers get as to what field they get trained in or does it depend on the need of the Forces? I plan on specializing my BSc Honours in Microbiology and Immunology (changed from my last post) and would like to work with cells (which I guess means that I'm leaning towards health/occupational hygiene). I wouldn't be sent to do applied R&D on stuff like equipment would I?


Hard to say - while CF need plays a role, you obviously can't fill certain positions unless you have the right background.  As a junior Bio (as in "Pre-PG"), you could very well find yourself involved in some sort of job you were not expecting.  For example, I started off doing aerospace physiology, which I had no idea even existed before I joined (and loved every minute of it).  Some positions you can "OJT" into with some coursework, some you need a certain check in the box like the PG.  So, until such time as you start down either the Industrial Hygiene (IH) or Human Factors (HF) path, you leave yourself open.

Remember as well that the BSc is just your foot in the door.  You say that you like working with cells, but the important thing to remember is that a Bio *is not a defence scientist*.  I completed my undergrad in biology and did lots of genetics - haven't done any of that since my commissioning.  Can't really say that I miss it either, because I've been able to do what I consider to be much more interesting things.


> 2. Dirt Digger (or anyone else in the know), is the above information still accurate for place and duration of the MSc?


The IH PG is currently in Bethesda, although I've argued that it should also be offered at UofT (where I did mine).  The HF PG was last offered in Monterey, although that might change to Bethesda as well.  In the past, HF was also offered in Loughborough, UK.  This one is almost impossible to predict for the future, as the trade is trying to maximize what we get out of the programs.  Length of training hasn't changed.


> 3. I've been doing a bit of career exploration and it seems that in the civilian scientist field, there is a lot of emphasis on research and lab experience. Is any of this necessary/useful for entry as a Bioscience Officer? How much research does each specialization within the Bioscience trade do?


It really depends on what you mean by "research and lab experience".  On the IH side, you don't really do hypothesis-based experimentation.  As a short example, there's concern that chemical X may be an exposure issue for people in job Y.  I would research the chemical and investigate the job, then make a sampling plan for routine exposures.  My team would then go out, complete the sample plan and send the samples off to an accredited lab.  Once the results came back, I would compare the results against accepted Canadian standards and determine if there was a problem.  The basics are actually fairly similar to doing a patrol or a small party tasking, with people filling certain roles, using specialized equipment and meeting specific timings.  HF falls along the same line, but it's the area I have the least amount of trade experience in and can't go into a lot of detail.  HF also does a lot of project management.  

Not really a lot of lab-coat style work done in the trade.  Emphasis is more on the scientific method toward doing studies and scientific writing.  I do very little true research outside of reading journal articles, although I have presented results from environmental sampling at conferences.  Again - _*not defence scientists!*_


> 4. What pay scale does Bioscience Officer fall under?


We're classed as Specialist Officers, but we're paid as General Service Officers.  The real difference is that we bypass the rank of 2Lt and go straight from OCdt to Lt.  


> 5. More of a fun question: upon entry, what element uniform do Bioscience Officers wear (since it is a purple trade)? I heard that Bioscience Officers wearing Naval uniforms get cherry red bands between the gold rank bands on their sleeves


The element seems to almost be a roll of the dice.  The year I joined, all three of us ended up army, although one has since transfered over to the naval uniform.   They try and keep the numbers balanced between the three, but this is one part of the joining process that's a true mystery.  I think it involves several beers and a dart board.

What you've heard about the bands are true for the navy - the docs wear a difference shade than other medical trades.


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## dapaterson (30 Jul 2012)

Strictly speaking, you're supposed to be commissioned as a second lieutenant with simultaneous promotion to lieutenant.

A pedantic point, but it does provide the CF the ability to reduce you in rank to 2Lt at court-martial, should such a situation ever occur.


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## paxis (31 Jul 2012)

Thanks for the replies all, definitely helped. To be honest I am not 100% sure how much research I want to do (finding it difficult to even find opportunities) so I'm gonna have to do some meditation/soul searching to see where my interests fit in terms of research and employment (which should determine if Bioscience Officer is really the thing for me vs civilian).


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## dvaronam (5 Mar 2013)

Hi Guys,

I don't mean to be jesus here in resurrecting the thread, but I do have a few questions that I hope you guys can answer.
First of all, that's really awesome that you're in the promo video. Which one are you?

So onto the questions:
1) I am somewhat confused as to why this job places so much emphasis on biology when they expect you to meet the typical prerequisites for Human Factors graduate programs, which typically require a major in Psychology/Engineering/(Computer Science for HCI). 

2) I will be completing my undergrad in Psychology in December, and I would like to know what are the chances of getting in, considering that I don't have a masters yet? Is this common?

3) If it's not too much to ask, could someone take a quick look at my resume website that I just built and tell me if I have the kind of experience required for this job? I will buy you a beer! (or a case). site: dvaronam.wix.com/danniel

4) I will be starting my honours thesis in May and I would like to explore a topic that is similar to what I would be doing in this job. I have a whole department at my disposal with all the research labs. I was thinking something along the lines of camouflage since I find that really interesting and I know you guys do a lot of PPE work. However, I need some more direction as to what would be a research question you guys, as experienced bioscience officers, would find interesting and want to hire me 

I really appreciate the time you guys take the help out the newcomers. Keep it up.

-Danniel


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## MedCorps (5 Mar 2013)

Not a Bioscience Officer, but work with them.  Bioscience Officers feel free to jump in.  

1) Human factors is only a group of the overall positions, which require a post-grad for training. I would guess less than 25% of the overall positions.  You need to understand biology or biochem to understand the physiology (for things like blast injury and injury analysis from PPE failure), the impact of chemicals / biologicals / radiation / lasers / noise / vibration on humans (and understanding things like LD50, LC50, threshold values, does-response relationships) and understanding the effects of pressure & G-force on humans.  It would be hard for someone with a psychology background to do some of these entry level jobs. 

2) I have not met a Bioscience Officer with only an undergrad degree in psychology.  I have not met a Bioscience Officer with only a graduate degree in psychology.  

3) Talk to CFRC. 

4) Look at: http://www.drdc-rddc.gc.ca/drdc/en/publications/strat/annexb/

I would start your focus on: 1.1 to 1.4, 4.2, 4.4, 4.5, 6.1, 7.1, 7.2, 8.1 to 8.4, 9.5, 10.1 to 10.3 as I suspect there has been some Bioscience Officer involvement in research within these fields. I base this on conversations with them, seeing them author reports. Area 8 especially.  

Dirt Digger... thoughts?  

MC


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## dvaronam (7 Mar 2013)

Awesome, thanks for the input. 

I've also been reading that most bios are hired from the ranks, so I pretty much have no hope right now. Maybe in the future, once I've been in the reserves for a while.


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## Dirt Digger (10 Mar 2013)

dvaronam said:
			
		

> 1) I am somewhat confused as to why this job places so much emphasis on biology when they expect you to meet the typical prerequisites for Human Factors graduate programs, which typically require a major in Psychology/Engineering/(Computer Science for HCI).


MedCorps covered it - it comes down to biology being a building block - most of the trade positions use human physiology in some form or another.  For example, within IH you have the toxicology of exposures (ie. heavy metals), concentrations of airborne contaminants (mg/m3 or ppm), physiological reasons why a 10 micron particle is a risk over a 20 micron particle, etc.  The trade is rather unique in having the requirement for biology.


> 2) I will be completing my undergrad in Psychology in December, and I would like to know what are the chances of getting in, considering that I don't have a masters yet? Is this common?


Not something I can really comment on.  You would have to speak with a recruiter.  I can say that people have gotten into the trade with just an undergrad - I did - it all comes down to the skills, knowledge base and experience that you apply with.


> 3) If it's not too much to ask, could someone take a quick look at my resume website that I just built and tell me if I have the kind of experience required for this job? I will buy you a beer! (or a case). site: dvaronam.wix.com/danniel


I checked it out.  Remember that education is only one component of an application.  A Bioscience Officer is first and foremost - an Officer - therefore you should look at including achievements that reflect "Officer-Like Qualities" (aka OLQs).  Also, consider the CF Principles of Leadership.


> 4) I will be starting my honours thesis in May and I would like to explore a topic that is similar to what I would be doing in this job. I have a whole department at my disposal with all the research labs. I was thinking something along the lines of camouflage since I find that really interesting and I know you guys do a lot of PPE work. However, I need some more direction as to what would be a research question you guys, as experienced bioscience officers, would find interesting and want to hire me


MedCorps answered this much better than I ever could.

Sorry about the late response - just got back from vacation!


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## dvaronam (10 Mar 2013)

Awesome. Thanks, Dirt.


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## Scientific_Cowboy (15 Jul 2013)

First I would like to say fantastic thread, and thank you to all those who have to answered so many questions. As someone interested in this position I have found this thread more enlightening than talking with recruiters. Like past posts, I have a few quick questions that I hope a BioSci officer or someone with the knowledge can help me with. I currently have a PhD in Biological Sciences and while my focus is in cellular and molecular neuroscience, I have extensive experience in pathology, physiology, pharmacology, microbiology and immunology as applied to new diagnostics, vaccines and therapeutics. Having been in contact within defense scientists at Suffield I realize that there are ongoing research initiatives in these areas within the defense department. While a fantastic opportunity, I have always admired and respected the traditions and culture of the Canadian Forces and believed I would one day make my way into a uniform. My first major concern however, is that the CF does not require/will not make use of my education and I would help more as a Post-Doc with the department of defense. This route however is not my first choice as I want to move past the lab coat and use my knowledge in practical applications (ie. my initial interest was in response units like DHHAT and CJIRU). As such, I would be grateful if anyone can answer a few questions to help me clear up a few things.  

1) While I understand that BioSci officers are NOT defense scientists, are there still positions within the CF that require/will make use of the same knowledge base (ie. PhD in cellular and molecular aspects of biology/physiology)?

2) Is any research conducted by the CF in conjunction with civilian scientists in regards to scientific initiatives like those at Suffield (ie. DARPA within the United States?). This question is particularly interesting to me as the BioSci officer is the only position I can find that fits the credentials of a "military scientist". (I have talked frequently with individuals from the US army attending international Neuroscience conferences that refer to themselves by this title) 

3) Are there any other CBRN/Medical/Bioscience-related response units within the CF beyond DHHAT and CJIRU?

4) Assuming I qualify and get accepted as a BioSci Officer what freedoms (if any) do you have to choose the area/field of specialization?  

Thank again for any help you can provide. I have been exploring these questions and talked within numerous recruiters within the CF for months now, but have yet to get any concrete answers.


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## Dirt Digger (16 Jul 2013)

Scientific_Cowboy said:
			
		

> As someone interested in this position I have found this thread more enlightening than talking with recruiters.



Nature of the beast - considering how small the trade is, it isn't really surprising that the recruiting centers don't know much about it.  I'd hazard that many of them never even see applicants.  From personal experience, I was told that the trade didn't exist when I first applied.  They ever had a chart and physically showed me (like I was a five year old) that they had "MOC 55 - That's a doctor" and "MOC 57 - That's a nurse", but no MOC 56.  Needless to say, I was not impressed.  I will say that since then, things have gotten better; I've ever had two recruiters contact me via email because I'm in the Bioscience video. 



> My first major concern however, is that the CF does not require/will not make use of my education and I would help more as a Post-Doc with the department of defense.



That is true to a certain extent, but all education has value.  While your background could be seen as getting "into the weeds", you also have the general experience with research, writing, thesis defense, etc. that goes along with getting an advanced degree.  *However*, people in your shoes often feel that "I'm educated enough" and push back when it comes to additional training.  For example, you need a specific background in Industrial Hygiene to work within DHHAT.  Are you willing to take two years to go to Bethesda and complete a Masters?

On top of that, imagine a different scenario:  You have an Lt with a PhD having to take orders from a Capt with a MHSc or a BSc.  Some people have a very difficult time with rank vs. education.  



> 1) While I understand that BioSci officers are NOT defense scientists, are there still positions within the CF that require/will make use of the same knowledge base (ie. PhD in cellular and molecular aspects of biology/physiology)?



Not that I'm aware of.  There might be some limited opportunities if you were in the right place at the right time.  For example, being involved with a Human Factors project that had a specific requirement for that knowledge.  Yet that project would only involve maybe a year or two out of your whole career.  Maybe also some capacity within aerospace phys, but that could be overkill.  A big "what if" that I can't really answer for you.



> 2) Is any research conducted by the CF in conjunction with civilian scientists in regards to scientific initiatives like those at Suffield (ie. DARPA within the United States?). This question is particularly interesting to me as the BioSci officer is the only position I can find that fits the credentials of a "military scientist". (I have talked frequently with individuals from the US army attending international Neuroscience conferences that refer to themselves by this title)



If you're posted to one of the DRDC establishments, there's a chance you'd be working alongside civilian scientists.  In what role or capacity I can't really comment one, as it's the one component of the trade I have limited experience with.

The concept of the "military scientist" is a little prickly.  I personally dislike the term, however there are others in the trade that probably feel otherwise.  As I see it, I'm an Officer that uses science in my day to day functions to get the job done.  In some cases, I may be called upon to perform an experiment to determine if one piece of air sampling equipment is superior to another.  Or I may be called upon to perform a risk assessment of a environment such as a submarine.  I'll write a report of my findings, maybe do a poster presentation at a conference, but I'm not looking to get published in a peer reviewed journal.  



> 3) Are there any other CBRN/Medical/Bioscience-related response units within the CF beyond DHHAT and CJIRU?



Response units?  I'd say DART, but there are no Bios attached to DART.  DHHAT could conceivably deploy alongside (not part of) a DART and I know that for Haiti, that sort-of happened (different role - DHHAT is Force Health Protection).  Beyond that, a lot of the smaller-scale / local base response is handled by your friendly neighbourhood Preventive Medicine Technician. 



> 4) Assuming I qualify and get accepted as a BioSci Officer what freedoms (if any) do you have to choose the area/field of specialization?



Hard to say with your initial post.  I was told I was going to Toronto (Human Factors) and saw Winnipeg (Aerospace Phys) on my posting message.  Apparently the trade is adopting a preceptorship program that will introduce a common training package for new Bios, however I'm out of the loop on its current status.  

Once you get some training under your belt, it tends to become very clear if your geared towards Human Factors or industrial Hygiene.  Plus, it helps to state your intentions to the Career Manager.  The Post Grads are merit based and it's your choice which one, or any, you want to apply for.  Once you have that qual, that pretty much guides your future for the next ten or so years.  That is, since I have the IH background, it would be very doubtful the trade would post me into a HF billet (and that's the way I like it).

Just remember that the CF does not lend well to doing the exact same job for the rest of your life.  You'll do four years of something, then four years of something else.  To me, that's heaven - I never get bored!  But with Bio being such a small trade, there aren't -a lot of room for promotions.  Most top out at the rank of Maj, with a few going to LCol.  Don't expect to make Surgeon General, heck - don't expect to make Col - we don't have any.

So I can't say the trade's right for you, only that it was right for me.  Hopefully my experiences have given you a better understanding of the trade, but feel free to PM me or post here if you have other questions.


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## MissMercury (3 Aug 2022)

I apologize for resurrecting an old thread, but I'm curious if anyone has information on the current occupational training requirements for Bioscience Officer? I'm not concerned with meeting the entry standards, but moreso looking for specifics on where the training is run, how long is it and when does it entail? If the training at CFSSAT in Winnipeg? The forces.ca site is very vague and the email at the bottom of the page doesn't respond to inquiries.


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