# Chopper shot down, crew executed....



## Stirling N6123 (22 Apr 2005)

:rage:

I am at a complete loss for words today after viewing the video of the chopper shot down over the skies of Iraq. The aftermath of which is the most disturbing. I regret that morbid curiosity has caught the best of me and I am very upset at the way the surviving  crewmember was put to death. Again, my being upset will at some point turn to anger as the thought of these animals conducting these types of executions are becoming the norm. 

I know there is allot of discussion on the reasons for the conflict, should the US have gone in, should they not have. Have the US opened Pandora's box sorta speak with the removal of Saddam. Who knows, hindsight is 20/20, and who am I to criticize. 

All I know is that my earlier comment of calling these people animals is indicating some sort of respect on some low level. The  :-X that comes out of my dogs arse has more respect than those who execute a person in that fashion. 

Just my 2 cents, and I needed to vent.


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## Scoobie Newbie (22 Apr 2005)

Not entirely sure what your talking about but I hope given the chance if I have to go I take a whole lot of them with me and die terriorist suicide (similar to cop suicide) then to be tortured and executed.


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## P-Free (22 Apr 2005)

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/iraq/20050421-1634-iraq.html

*BAGHDAD, Iraq â â€œ Insurgents brought down a Russian-made helicopter carrying 11 civilians with missile fire north of the capital Thursday and said they captured and shot to death the lone crew member who survived. The dead from the crash included six American bodyguards for U.S. diplomats.*

The chartered flight was believed to be the first civilian aircraft shot down in Iraq since the U.S.-led invasion two years ago. 

*An Internet statement by a group identifying itself as the Islamic Army in Iraq was accompanied by a video showing the repeated shooting of a man who was found in tall grass and forced to stand up and walk. The video showed burning wreckage just before the shooting. 

"One of the crew members was captured and killed," the statement said. 

The man who was shot to death in a grassy field spoke English with an accent and was wearing a blue flight suit, indicating he was one of the three Bulgarian crew members. Two Fijian helicopter security guards were also on board the flight. *

The video also showed two charred bodies near the burning wreckage, about 12 miles north of Baghdad. 

The authenticity of the video, posted on a Web forum often used by militant groups, could not be confirmed. A U.S. Embassy official in Baghdad said he had no knowledge that anyone on board survived the crash and was killed later. 

The Mi-8 helicopter was shot out of the air as growing numbers of contractors, diplomats and other civilian officials are turning to aircraft to avoid insurgent attacks on Iraq's roads. 

Elsewhere in Iraq, two U.S. Marines were killed Wednesday by a roadside bomb in Ramadi, west of the capital, the military said. The attack was followed by more explosions and gunfire Thursday in Ramadi and Baghdad that killed at least five people, including two foreign civilians. 

The six Americans on board the downed helicpter were employed by Blackwater Security Consulting â â€œ a subsidiary of North Carolina-based security contractor Blackwater USA, which had four employees slain and mutilated by insurgents in Fallujah a year ago. 

The Americans were assisting the Bureau of Diplomatic Security in protecting U.S. diplomats in Iraq. 

"They played a critical role in our effort to bring a better way of life to the people of a country who have not experienced freedom and opportunity for many years," State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said. 

*The Islamic Army statement said it killed the survivor "in revenge for the Muslims who have been killed in cold blood in the mosques of tireless Fallujah before the eyes of the world and on television screens, without anyone condemning them." It was apparently referring to the shooting by an American soldier of a wounded Iraqi in a Fallujah mosque on Nov. 13 during a U.S. offensive in the city. *

In the video, militants come across the injured man in the flight suit. "Stand up! Stand up!" an insurgent orders the man, who reaches out and says "Give me a hand." 

Then, apparently referring to a fractured leg, he says "It's broken." 

The militants â â€œ unseen except in brief glances â â€œ tell him to stand up. "Weapons? Weapons?" the gunmen ask him in Arabic as he stands uneasily. 

They tell him, "Go!", and he starts to hobble away with his back to the camera. Then there are voices and he turns to the side, holding up a hand. Then the shooting began, bullets hitting his body as he fell backward into the grass. The insurgents can be heard shouting "Allahu akbar," or "God is great," as he went down. More bursts of gunfire then hit the body. 

Ereli, who spoke before the video was posted, said he could not confirm the cause of the crash. 

However, the Bulgarian Defense Ministry said the helicopter was struck by missile fire. 

The aircraft was owned by Heli Air of Bulgaria and chartered by Toronto-based SkyLink Aviation Inc. It was flying to Saddam Hussein's hometown of Tikrit from Baghdad's heavily guarded Green Zone, home to Iraq's parliament and many diplomats. 

Ereli said the U.S. government routinely hires contractors to provide security for diplomats, facilities or the activities of people connected with the government. 

"There is a need for security that goes beyond what employees of the U.S. government can provide and we go to private companies to offer that," Ereli said. "That's a common practice. It's not unique to Iraq. We do it around the world." 

Thursday's helicopter crash was thought to be the first shootdown of a civilian aircraft in Iraq since the invasion in March 2003. 

On Nov. 22, 2003, a plane operated by the global delivery service DHL was struck by a shoulder-fired missile near Baghdad and forced to make an emergency landing with its wing aflame. The three crew members were unhurt. 

It was not the first time Blackwater workers have died in Iraq. 

On March 13, two American security contractors working for Blackwater Security â â€œ a subsidiary of Blackwater USA â â€œ were killed and a third was wounded in a roadside bombing south of Baghdad on the main road to Hillah. 

Last year, four Blackwater employees were killed in Fallujah, 40 miles west of Baghdad, and their bodies were burned and mutilated. Two of the corpses were hanged from a bridge over the Euphrates River. The deaths touched off a U.S. Marine assault on insurgents in the city. 

This week has seen an increase in insurgent attacks, especially in the capital. 

On Thursday, a roadside bomb exploded on the highway leading to Baghdad's airport, severely damaging three SUVs carrying civilians. Police Capt. Hamid Ali said two foreigners were killed and three were wounded. U.S. Embassy and military officials could not confirm the casualties. 

In Ramadi, a roadside bomb wounded one soldier in a U.S. convoy. Another American soldier fired his machine gun at a suspected Iraqi ambush site, killing a female Iraqi civilian, U.S. officials said in a statement. Soldiers found an electronic device near the woman that may have been used to trigger the explosion, the statement said. 

Hours later, gunfire erupted downtown, and an Associated Press photographer saw the body of a young boy in a street near three smoldering cars. 

Sporadic gunfire continued for about two hours, said the photographer, Bilal Hussein. When it subsided, Iraqis pulled the charred body of an adult from one of the burned cars, Hussein said. It was not clear how the two were killed.


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## Jarnhamar (22 Apr 2005)

I saw that video, it's brutal. They didn't air the actual shooting of the wounded, guy stopping the tape right before it, but it was still sad.

All i can say is pussies.


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## Lady From Hell (22 Apr 2005)

;D

The People you call animals are Humans just like us. BUT its the The Type of Training they received in Military or Civil Life . .   & Religious Belief.

The Reason we are in there is because to try to Change there Attitude But First I must say i don't agree the way the U.S.A did it there are many other ways to take over a country especially in the Middle East & Africa.

insofar as the Killing well thats all part & parcel of what they believe in.

I was in The WW2 & seen a lot of action Covert & you name it i don't never admit how we had to Kill people but i don't need no lessons to & how to Kill as If i had to get to a destination or Eliminate some one well it was crude but nobody talks about it but i have to live with the past & i Will;l tell you it not very good. Yes i have Post Traumatic Stress . Yes i am being Treated in fact i help a few people from the Present Conflicts & passed one . But i tell you its not easy .

So what i am saying is done get to Exited about these type of Killings is almost Normal. But i think its Bad taste to show it on Public Broadcasting But again its not worse then some of these Electronic games around . :rage:

I don't think we will ever stop all the violence in this war as the politics is to involved in Religious Belief & HATE>

                                            My 2 cents & Change 

.


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## Scoobie Newbie (22 Apr 2005)

Why the big toothed grin?   I'd say thats just as tasteless as airing these things which in another war were called propaganda.


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## -rb (22 Apr 2005)

Lady From Hell said:
			
		

> ;D
> i don't agree the way the U.S.A did it there are many other ways to take over a country especially in the Middle East & Africa.



Got any other suggestions?



			
				Lady From Hell said:
			
		

> I was in The *WW2* & seen a lot of action Covert & you name it i don't never admit how we had to Kill people but i don't need no lessons to & how to Kill as If i had to get to a destination or Eliminate some one well it was crude but nobody talks about it but i have to live with the past & i Will;l tell you it not very good. Yes i have Post Traumatic Stress . Yes i am being Treated in fact i help a few people from the Present Conflicts & passed one . But i tell you its not easy .



I don't think any one thinks it would be easy, just out of curiousity where did you serve and with whom, or is the covert info classified? You must be a very elderly lady from hell.


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## Pte Cowden (22 Apr 2005)

killing military personelle is one thing. Civilians is another.

I've seen the copter video and i have seen some beheading videos.

Anybody who can cut an innocent civilians head off with a pocket knife and not think twice about it is not a human being.

Karma will come to them


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## Jarnhamar (22 Apr 2005)

> So what i am saying is done get to Exited about these type of Killings is almost Normal.



With respect to your experience, i still couldn't disagree more.

Don't get excited about an unarmed, wounded civilian who just survived a helicopter crash being murdered for show?   
It's almost normal?
Maybe for a cold blooded murderer.

Showing real life human beings being killed on TV is less gruesome than violence on video games?

No way.


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## Stirling N6123 (22 Apr 2005)

> The People you call animals are Humans just like us



 That's a real intelligent statement.


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## winchable (22 Apr 2005)

With all condolences to his family, any death is senseless so naturally that goes without saying.

What I actually found to be sickest about this was how they told him to run and shot him in the back as he probably thought he was being given a reprieve. Apart from that....

I see people saying things like "Total wars a B" when we're talking about Iraqi Civilian Casualties. The fact that insurgents are hitting us with a total war should condition us to expect civilian casulties on our side, after all we are probably inflicting the same to them.

As I said, what is sick about this is the way he was executed (in the back, thinking he was getting away) the fact that he was executed at all should be something we should start getting used to because it's going to happen again and again but to pretend that we are any better, or were any better is funny at best..
With my very limited historical knowledge this is something that has happened in all wars to this point in all times and is something that has happened on both sides, so why should we expect to be treated any differently when it happens to us?

I think I'm coming across alot more callous and cold then I actually am, but every time one of these movies comes out the whole world goes into an uproar but when you think about how many civilians over there are probably dying alone in a basement at the hands of insurgents it's hard to tremble indignation at this and serves only to make good soldiers act on impulse and make silly mistakes...like videotaping or photographing things.


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## Slim (22 Apr 2005)

> I was in The WW2 & seen a lot of action Covert & you name it



Lady From Hell

I'm having a real hard time with the background you say you have...Would you care to give us some proof please. You can PM me if you don't want it posted for all to see. 



Slim


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## KevinB (22 Apr 2005)

There is a BIG difference between killing unarmed noncombatants (the flight crew) and killing armed enemies - but these worthless POS have no honour and know no code other than BS Hatred in the name of perverted religion.   The fact that is goes on day in and day out does nothing to mitigate this.   


LFH, I would understand that someone of your professed background and age should not write, or at least not type like a 16yr old school child so...

   
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





If Im wrong sue me.


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## enfield (22 Apr 2005)

Che said:
			
		

> I see people saying things like "Total wars a B" when we're talking about Iraqi Civilian Casualties. The fact that insurgents are hitting us with a total war should condition us to expect civilian casulties on our side, after all we are probably inflicting the same to them.



I have to agree. With all sincere condolences to the victims and families, acts like this are the nature of beast. I'm not sure flying private security personnel around Iraq makes the flight crew 'noncombatant' - civilian maybe, but they're definitely involved. 

That said, the perpetrators and their comrades should be hunted down and treated to whatever form of justice seems appropriate. 

What I find most remarkable is the coverage that this is receiving and the way the insurgents seem to be playing this up. A Bulgarian civilian helicopter was shot down - how is that a dramatic tactical victory? Little Big Horn was a tactical victory for the Natives. The Argentinians sinking the 'Atlantic Conveyor' in the Falklands was a tactical victory. Bringing down Blackhawks in Mogadishu was a serious blow. Shooting down a civilian Bulgarian helicopter? That was simply the softest target available. Was it front page news everytime the Vietnamese brought down a US Huey?

If anything, I think this demonstrates (1) how weak the insurgents actually are and (2) the power and importance of playing the media.


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## Britney Spears (22 Apr 2005)

I suppose, in somuch as the goal of the insurgents is the cessation of ALL western involvement in Iraq, it is tangible progress. Whether this goal will garner much support from the Iraqi populace is another question entirely.


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## Stirling N6123 (22 Apr 2005)

Enfield, I have to agree.

It does demonstrate how week they are. Democracy has gone ahead despite best efforts to railroad it. It would seem the only weapon the insurgents have is the video camera. Not to take away from the pain and anguish of the victims families. In some way, I think it works against the insurgents. Me as a Canadian, I have no interest in that country as far as family or financial, but it sure as heck makes me want the US to stay the coarse. It makes me want the Iraqi government to stand up and become free and strong.

 It makes me want these murderers to be brought to justice, whatever form that justice takes. You can draw your own conclusion to that.


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## Glorified Ape (22 Apr 2005)

Enfield said:
			
		

> (2) the power and importance of playing the media.



I think that's an especially important factor. As much as we may not see how this helps the insurgents, PR wise, I can't help but think that there's a segment of the Iraqi population (probably primarily Sunni in persuasion) that receives this type of news well. 

Above all else, it's a focoist insurgency and as such it employs the tactics appropriate thereto - that means committing acts of terror to influence the populous and provoke over-reactions from the enemy (thus further influencing the population), attacking any personnel or resources in aid of the enemy (civilian or not), and avoiding pitched battles until the very last stages (amongst other things). While I don't mean to sound cold because I do, honestly, deplore such acts as this, it's the nature of the beast - insurgency can't operate on the same moral, Geneva-Convention-type level as traditional warfare and so wherever you have insurgency, you're going to have acts such as this as par for the course - be it in France, Algeria, Cuba, S.Vietnam, N.Ireland, or wherever.


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## kincanucks (23 Apr 2005)

Lady From heck said:
			
		

> ;D
> 
> The People you call animals are Humans just like us. BUT its the The Type of Training they received in Military or Civil Life . .     & Religious Belief.
> 
> ...




 :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring:

Aren't they cute?


I would love to see some of these misunderstood insurgent arseholes shot and killed on TV on a regular basis.


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## Michael Dorosh (23 Apr 2005)

Apollo13 said:
			
		

> > The People you call animals are Humans just like us
> 
> 
> 
> That's a real intelligent statement.



psstt...umm, it's kinda true, really....they _were_ homo sapiens....

With respect to the other posts, is there really anything to "debate" here?


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## Stirling N6123 (23 Apr 2005)

I figured it to be an animal with a small amount of intelligence. Not an intelligent human acting like an animal.

True, no debate.


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## wack-in-iraq (23 Apr 2005)

i didnt notice this post before, or else i would have said something, but seeing as ive just come back from the funeral at skylink i will put my 2 bits in. the 2 fijians on board were my friends, i am at skylink almost everyday and enjoy talking with all the guys there, some of the most genuinely kind people a person can hope to meet. the fact that they were killed in such a manner really tears me up inside, but i remember one very important thing : we all know the risk associated with being here.  no matter who you work for over here, if you are supporting OIF then you are officially a target, doesnt matter if you are riding in an apache or a helo with a big red cross on it, the insurgents really dont care. we are here, they want us gone.

   a lot of things were said at the service tonight, and as someone who has been to a few military style funerals i would rank this one at the top. the most important thing that was said in my opinion is something im sure everyone has heard, if we give up and start packing our bags then they have won, and our friends died for nothing. it is so true, and if anything it makes me want to double my efforts over here.

   before anyone starts talking about right and wrong, remember where you are. chances are you are somewhere quite comfy and the only Iraq you have seen has been on the TV. before i got here i wasnt too supportive, just wanted some extra cash and some adventure, now after being here and experiencing everything first hand i can honestly say i support it 100%, but lets not get into politics.

  Rest In Peace my Fijian friends, as well as the 3 crew and 6 members of blackwater


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## Lady From Hell (23 Apr 2005)

Slim said:
			
		

> Lady From heck
> 
> I'm having a real hard time with the background you say you have...Would you care to give us some proof please. You can PM me if you don't want it posted for all to see.
> 
> Slim



Slim .
First if i would Divulge the Real Back ground I would be putting myself in Jeopardy.

Bu Yes I had served in Canadian Armed Forces(Army) since i was 16 & then some Served in the European Campaign & other place did Infiltration & more .

If you like to know more you send me your personal Address & where u r located .

That Symbol with theLarge teeth was a ERROR  >> SORRY<<< 

[Moderator note:  Edited for clarity - response was inadvertently included in 





> "quote"


]


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## Bruce Monkhouse (23 Apr 2005)

Someone post the flag again!!!!!


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## Michael Dorosh (23 Apr 2005)

2332Piper said:
			
		

> I saw the video on CNN. I'm disgusted, but for some reason, not surprised. Maybye the Americans have made mistakes, but they own up to them eventually. Difference between them and the insurgents is, the insurgents do it on purpose and LIKE it.



How do you know what they like or don't like?


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## Stirling N6123 (23 Apr 2005)

Michael, 

Maybe they like it because it comes so easy for them to do it. If we did not have access to the video, I am not so sure I could answer this question. The fact that it comes so easy to them is probably the most chilling part. And for them to be yelling Allah Akbar, and carry out gods will etc. etc...is just really twisted in my opinion.

LFH,



> If you like to know more you send me your personal Address & where u r located



No thanks. I'll keep my address thank-you. I am sure you have your own.

wack-in-iraq,

My deepest sympathy's buddy.


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## Michael Dorosh (24 Apr 2005)

2332Piper said:
			
		

> The jubilation amongst these people after every murder (remember, I said murder and not killing in combat of an American soldier) kinda tells me all I need to know, I don't know about you. You don't see Americans cheering in the streets after some Iraqi civvies get killed, often the opposite. But see these people when some Americans die......
> 
> Maybye I'm just biased because I'm pro-American, very very pro-American. I can't read the Iraqi insurgents minds, but I figure I can make an educated guess after watching so many of these videos.



We've seen, on this very forum, footage of Marines cheering when an enemy combatant was killed.  I have no opinion on that one way or another, but I kind of think it doesn't mean the Marines enjoy killing people.  More like relief that an unpleasant part of their job was done and they were still alive.  

I would suspect "they" don't see what they are doing as murder any more than the Marines...


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## aesop081 (24 Apr 2005)

Lady From Hell said:
			
		

> Slim .
> First if i would Divulge the Real Back ground I would be putting myself in Jeopardy.
> 
> Bu Yes I had served in Canadian Armed Forces(Army) since i was 16 & then some Served in the European Campaign & other place did Infiltration & more .
> ...





			
				Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> Someone post the flag again!!!!!


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## Slim (24 Apr 2005)

o.k...Enough is enough.

This istuation is being handled a little differently due to some of the info we as mods have received regarding this issue. The vote is still out. Thanks for your patience.


Thanks

Slim


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## Slim (24 Apr 2005)

> I would like to request all others refrain from posting here until this situation has been resolved please. If you have info for me, shoot me a quick PM.



Was this in regards to challenging LFH, or no posting period, including about the topic? 

Both...


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## Figure11 (25 Apr 2005)

Excuse me Mr. Lady from Hell but here is a site which I think will interest you. 

www.cpmh.net

Enjoy!


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## Figure11 (25 Apr 2005)

Slim- PM sent.


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## old medic (25 Apr 2005)

Slim,

LFH replied in this thread :

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/29754/post-207128.html#msg207128


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## Sub_Guy (25 Apr 2005)

Ghost778 said:
			
		

> Showing real life human beings being killed on TV is less gruesome than violence on video games?
> 
> No way.



??? Killing in a Video game is less gruesome than human beings being killed on TV.... ONE IS A GAME ONE IS REAL LIFE.......

It is a fact that violence in video games does not contribute to real world crime, in fact violent crimes have decreased over time not increased.

If you can't tell the difference between a game, and real life, then don't play it!  IT is no different than watching Saving Private Ryan...... Or any other movie that shows humans getting killed


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## LordVagabond (25 Apr 2005)

I have seen the video in question but what really  :rage:'s me off is that they tell him to run, and he starts walking, someone says something, he turns to see what it is and BAM! They told him to run then shot him point blank.


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## KevinB (25 Apr 2005)

Sub_Guy said:
			
		

> It is a fact that violence in video games does not contribute to real world crime, in fact violent crimes have decreased over time not increased.
> 
> If you can't tell the difference between a game, and real life, then don't play it!   IT is no different than watching Saving Private Ryan...... Or any other movie that shows humans getting killed



Utterly incorrect - violence has increased - just advanced medical care has reduced the death rate from these things.
 You really ought to read some of the studies - linking TV violence and community violence - its shocking.


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## I_am_John_Galt (25 Apr 2005)

KevinB said:
			
		

> Utterly incorrect - violence has increased - just advanced medical care has reduced the death rate from these things.
> You really ought to read some of the studies - linking TV violence and community violence - its shocking.



Ah, but correlation and causation are not the same ...


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## -rb (25 Apr 2005)

Sub_Guy said:
			
		

> ??? Killing in a Video game is less gruesome than human beings being killed on TV.... ONE IS A GAME ONE IS REAL LIFE.......
> 
> It is a fact that violence in video games does not contribute to real world crime, in fact violent crimes have decreased over time not increased.
> 
> If you can't tell the difference between a game, and real life, then don't play it!   IT is no different than watching Saving Private Ryan...... Or any other movie that shows humans getting killed



I must say I haven't exactly done a ton of research on the correaltion between the two (violence and the media)...but after reading Grossman's "On Killing" it certainly gave me a new prespective and a few things to think about in regards to this. IMO I think KevinB has summed this up nicely.

cheers.


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## tomahawk6 (25 Apr 2005)

http://www.armytimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-807386.php

Update.


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## Slim (25 Apr 2005)

O.K> all... the thread is open once again.

Due to recent developments I have turned the matter over to Mike B as the situation is far more complicated than it first seemed. 

I thank you all for your patience and support of both myself and the forum during this rather unusual issue (even those after the fact ;D)

The thread is now once again fully open.

Slim
STAFF


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## Sub_Guy (26 Apr 2005)

KevinB said:
			
		

> Utterly incorrect - violence has increased - just advanced medical care has reduced the death rate from these things.
> You really ought to read some of the studies - linking TV violence and community violence - its shocking.



http://142.206.72.67/04/04b/04b_002a_e.htm   

Violent crimes have decreased (since the 90's)  Although this study was completed up to 2002.   The media, granny's against teens, and everyone else are always looking to point the finger.  There is more to it than violent videogames and TV


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## wack-in-iraq (26 Apr 2005)

tomahawk6 said:
			
		

> http://www.armytimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-807386.php
> 
> Update.



well id like to say thats great news, but im curious as to how true it is. there is so much propaganda on both sides of this war you never know what is true and what isnt, i learned that really fast upon getting here. i really do hope its true, it would be nice to see some justice, if only it could bring back the dead....


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## I_am_John_Galt (26 Apr 2005)

Sub_Guy said:
			
		

> http://142.206.72.67/04/04b/04b_002a_e.htm
> 
> Violent crimes have decreased (since the 90's)  Although this study was completed up to 2002.   The media, granny's against teens, and everyone else are always looking to point the finger.  There is more to it than violent videogames and TV



Or wrestling, or guns, or whatever the boogey-man-of-the-week is ...


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## 1feral1 (12 May 2005)

Lady From Hell said:
			
		

> Slim .
> 
> First if i would Divulge the Real Back ground I would be putting myself in Jeopardy.
> 
> ...



Humm, why would you be in danger after 60 years after of the end of World War Two? And we are the victors!

Let it be known, like us all, I have great respect for our Vets and our Allied vets, so don't get me wrong here.

Excuse me, but something does not quite wash here, most Vets tend to keep the graphic details of their past to themselves or people close to them, not airing it out on the internet. Cdn Army Over Seas at 16? I find this odd, and need I say more.

This person's profile is pretty much empty, and that alone makes me suspicious.

Cheers,

Wes


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## CougarKing (24 Jan 2007)

I couldn't find the other recent thread dealing with this so I posted it here. Therefore it's technically another example that applies to this thread.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/23/AR2007012300400.html



> BAGHDAD, Jan. 24 -- A private security company helicopter was shot down after responding to assist a U.S. Embassy convoy that came under attack in central Baghdad on Tuesday afternoon, U.S. officials said.
> 
> One contractor traveling with the convoy and four contractors aboard the helicopter were killed. The contractors, officials said on condition of anonymity, were employed by North Carolina-based Blackwater USA. Blackwater officials declined to comment.
> 
> ...




And a quote from another article about the same instance:



> U.S. Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad, meanwhile, offered condolences for the five Americans killed in the helicopter crash in Baghdad, called them good men and said he had traveled with them. The aircraft, belonging to the Blackwater USA security company, went down as it flew over a dangerous Sunni neighborhood while a gunfight was raging.
> 
> Confusion still cloaked the circumstances of the crash.
> 
> ...



Here's the source of the second quote: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070124/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq


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## 1feral1 (24 Jan 2007)

We heard that the four were shot in the back of the head, and found together in a near by alley. These contractors know the risks. I have often seen their Hughes LOCHs whizzing about around here. No military markings. 

Meanwhile it was one wild day here yesterday, with Hiafa Street (again) being the forefront of extreme intense battles which waged all day yesterday, and even just after 0400 it has started again. Fast air, Apaches, and the rest of it. Not prretty. The enemy is fighting in place, and standing his ground, rather than 'shoot and scoot'. It looks like it will be another wild day. At least is sunny and warm, METREP about 17C.

Cheers,

Wes


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## Sig_Des (24 Jan 2007)

Best of luck, Wes


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## midget-boyd91 (24 Jan 2007)

Wesley (Over There) said:
			
		

> These contractors know the risks. .



A few years ago there were a handful of contractors working paramilitary style in Iraq who were killed. The name of the company mentioned about this bird that was shot down sounds familliar, any idea if it is the same company as the previous incident?

Stay safe Wes


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## tomahawk6 (24 Jan 2007)

Tomahawk Strike II is having alot of success. If the bad guys are standing their ground its because they have nowhere else to go. 

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=aef3155d7c


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## The Bread Guy (25 Jan 2007)

Wes - stay safe, man.

Meanwhile, cfm of crew shootings, and a few more details, from Associated Press

"Four of the five Americans killed when a U.S. security company's helicopter crashed in Baghdad were shot execution-style in the back of the head, officials said yesterday.  A senior Iraqi military official said a machine-gunner downed the helicopter, but a U.S. military official in Washington said there were no indications that the aircraft, owned by North Carolina-based Blackwater USA, had been shot out of the sky.

Two Sunni insurgent groups separately claimed responsibility for the Tuesday crash, the second associated with the U.S. war effort in Iraq in four days.

In Washington, a U.S. defense official said four of the five killed were shot in the back of the head but that he did not know whether they were still alive when they were shot.

The helicopter was shot down after responding to assist a U.S. Embassy ground convoy that came under fire in a Sunni neighborhood in central Baghdad, said a U.S. diplomatic official in Washington. A second helicopter also was struck, but there were no casualties among its crew, the official said.

The helicopter that crashed had swooped into electrical wires before going down. U.S. officials said it was not clear whether gunfire brought the aircraft down or caused its pilot to veer into the wires during evasive maneuvers.

Witnesses in the Fadhil neighborhood told The Associated Press that they saw the helicopter go down after gunmen on the ground opened fire. Accounts varied, but all were consistent that at least one person operating the aircraft had been shot and badly hurt before the crash.

An American official in Baghdad, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said three Blackwater helicopters were involved. One had landed for an unknown reason and one of the Blackwater employees was shot at that point, he said.

That helicopter apparently was able to take off, but a second one then crashed in the same area, he added without explaining the involvement of the third helicopter. Blackwater USA provides security for State Department officials in Iraq, trains military units from around the world and works for corporate clients."


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## Big Red (25 Jan 2007)

midget-boyd91 said:
			
		

> A few years ago there were a handful of contractors working paramilitary style in Iraq who were killed. The name of the company mentioned about this bird that was shot down sounds familliar, any idea if it is the same company as the previous incident?
> 
> Stay safe Wes



There have been far more than a handful of contractors killed in Iraq, the numbers are in the hundreds.  You may not see it on the news but it happens all too often.

Blackwater has suffered many deaths but that is because they are a large organization that runs many missions everyday.  The deaths are proportional to how large thier operation is.

RIP to the crew, it's been a bad week for PSDs in Iraq.


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## tomahawk6 (25 Jan 2007)

Well over 700 have been killed. Thats why contractor pay is what it is.


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## CougarKing (25 Jan 2007)

An appalling turn of events: those despicable insurgents have the nerve to actually post a video of the chopper crash and the bodies of the unfortunate contractors.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070125/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_helicopter_video



> Insurgents post video of downed copter
> 
> By MAAMOUN YOUSSEF, Associated Press Writer
> 1 hour, 59 minutes ago
> ...


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## KevinB (25 Jan 2007)

Here is a letter from the brother of one of the fallen warriors.


> deseretnews.com (Salt Lake City)
> Thursday, January 25, 2007
> 
> This is an e-mail letter sent to KSL producer Kim Thomas from Dan Laguna, a Utah man whose brother was among five Americans killed when their private security helicopter crashed Tuesday in Baghdad.
> ...


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## 1feral1 (26 Jan 2007)

I was just behind the 28 CSH in the IZ when three dark blue Hughes LOCHs (known as 'litttle birds' one with a silver stripe on it) came in hot. If this is the same incident just a few days back. One LOCH buzzed in circles around the CSH and area, as the two others landed. As one came in, I could see one contractor bloke on the skids, apparently holding on to a casualty in the back. Both LOCHs landed, as the third one buzzed around the CSH in circles, flying right over us.

We knew something was up. It was no drill. Once on the ground, I could not observe anything more because of the 4 metre high T-walls, and we had our own thing to do. Blackhawk medivac choppers  (red cross marked) are quite common on the CSH's helipad, so know one really notices much. Its all routine, sadly when choppers come in they are full of casualties.

After a few minutes, the two LOCHs on the ground took off, and all three headed off somewhere. This was between 1030 and 1130h or there abouts. For luch we went to the local DFAC, and I walked right by the helipad, only some LNs there who were repainting the red crecent on the concrete, all under supervision of course. 

This all simply reinforces the extreme danger here. Its real, and in our faces, 24 hours a day.

I can't wait to be a short timer!

Just another day in Baghdad.


Gotta go,

Wes


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## harry8422 (15 Mar 2007)

they did there jobs but sadly they had to pay the ultimate price for it rest in piece


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## HeatRoca (18 Mar 2007)

I have a video y'all can check out it has the MI 8 crash the crew where 3 bulgarians and 2 fujians and 6 american security contractors the man being excuted in the video is bulgarian but anyways if you all wanna see it check it out on my account on youtube screen name is AJIX


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