# Metal cap badges for all!!



## grayman (16 Sep 2005)

At the risk of offending some, I think the metal capbadge should be brought back for everyone regardless of trade, personnally I think it looks sharper, more professional.  Some of us wear metal capbadges daily and wouldnt think of wearing anything else.  I personnally think that there is nothing worse than looking at a filthy cloth capbadge, it doesnt exactly spew regimental pride.  I know certain trades have metal capbadges they wear on certain parades ie:EME, but I think the metal looks sharp no matter what the trade or Regt and should be worn on a daily basis.
out to you....


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## Pencil Tech (16 Sep 2005)

I'm with you G-man. But easy for you to say since you're a Patricia


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## jbeach95 (16 Sep 2005)

I don't understand why RCR MWOs, CWOs, and officers wear cloth capbadges. I think that the metal ones that privates to WOs wear look much better. While it does make it easier to know who to call "sir", one still has to look at the rank insignia to know whether to salute.   ???


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## reccecrewman (16 Sep 2005)

Absolutely!!!!!!!!!!!  The metal cap badge looks far better than a clothe badge.  And it does instill a degree of pride in the soldiers that wear it.  Speaking from an RCD perspective, I believe that the metal badge looks so sharp.  When young Dragoons recieve their first cap badge, it looks like hell.  It is metal, but there's absolutely no shine to it and the Springbok's hair is clearly visible as well as the grass veldt under it's feet.  The point of giving the badges like this is for the newbies to spend some time grinding it down with metal sandpaper, emery clothe etc. to get rid of the hair and grass so that the badge is smoothe and gleaming.  The end product is beautiful and again, the metal badge just looks far superior to clothe.  The officers in my Regiment (Unlike our RCR counterparts) also have metal, but theirs is a black metal that requires no polishing (go figure) and makes Officer recognition from afar much simpler.


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## Armymedic (16 Sep 2005)

grayman said:
			
		

> At the risk of offending some, I think the metal capbadge should be brought back for everyone regardless of trade, personnally I think it looks sharper, more professional.  .
> out to you....





			
				reccecrewman said:
			
		

> Absolutely!!!!!!!!!!!   The metal cap badge looks far better than a clothe badge.



I whole heartily disagree...

I got a line for you:

Get Bent!!!


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## Michael Dorosh (16 Sep 2005)

reccecrewman said:
			
		

> Absolutely!!!!!!!!!!!  The metal cap badge looks far better than a clothe badge.  And it does instill a degree of pride in the soldiers that wear it.  Speaking from an RCD perspective, I believe that the metal badge looks so sharp.  When young Dragoons recieve their first cap badge, it looks like heck.  It is metal, but there's absolutely no shine to it and the Springbok's hair is clearly visible as well as the grass veldt under it's feet.  The point of giving the badges like this is for the newbies to spend some time grinding it down with metal sandpaper, emery clothe etc. to get rid of the hair and grass so that the badge is smoothe and gleaming.  The end product is beautiful and again, the metal badge just looks far superior to clothe.  The officers in my Regiment (Unlike our RCR counterparts) also have metal, but theirs is a black metal that requires no polishing (go figure) and makes Officer recognition from afar much simpler.



Black metal?  Or is it oxidized silver?


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## grayman (17 Sep 2005)

Army medic.. nice reply on the capbadge issue, spoken like a true wog!!  You oviously dont have a clue on regimental pride !! 
As for the answer from Reccecrewman roger out to you, give a young troop something to work for, I know that our young troops work their ass off for that tiny piece of brass and it becomes one of their proudest days to take of the crappy old infantry capbadge and wear their highly shone Patricia cap badge for the first time.
Reccecrewman we will have to sit back and swill a cup of gravy together one day !! HAHA


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## George Wallace (17 Sep 2005)

Michael Dorosh said:
			
		

> Black metal?   Or is it oxidized silver?



Bronze


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## onecat (17 Sep 2005)

Metal, all the way.


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## muskrat89 (17 Sep 2005)

grayman - knock it off with the "wog" comments - go re-read the Conduct Guidelines

This was your freebie

Thanks in advance

Army.ca Staff


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## Pencil Tech (17 Sep 2005)

I've seen the odd Log guy wearing the metal cap badge (not talking about the officer's gold wire one). Dress regs are kind of vague for NCMs as they just say cloth or metal, but are not unit or branch specific. Anybody know what the Log branch policy is on cap badges? I have a metal one in my top drawer and wondering if I can get away with wearing it.


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## D-n-A (17 Sep 2005)

Pencil Tech said:
			
		

> I've seen the odd Log guy wearing the metal cap badge (not talking about the officer's gold wire one). Dress regs are kind of vague for NCMs as they just say cloth or metal, but are not unit or branch specific. Anybody know what the Log branch policy is on cap badges? I have a metal one in my top drawer and wondering if I can get away with wearing it.



At my previous unit, only Sgts - CWO wore the metal capbadges(both LOG an EME), and the lower ranks just wore cloth.


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## Cliff (17 Sep 2005)

grayman said:
			
		

> At the risk of offending some, I think the metal capbadge should be brought back for everyone regardless of trade, personnally I think it looks sharper, more professional.   Some of us wear metal capbadges daily and wouldnt think of wearing anything else.



In the early years of MOBCOM, the cap badges weren't anodized = so you had to keep polishing them with Silvo (or Brasso). That's probably why I like the cloth ones  Being shiny, they also make good targets, when you consider that they were worn in the field with full combats.


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## Neill McKay (17 Sep 2005)

I thought the metal badges were great until mine fell out while I was "cheering ship".  Now I'm a convert to the embroidered badge (with quite a bit of metallic thread, so it does still shine).  Additional advantage: it never goes crooked on me.


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## FormerHorseGuard (17 Sep 2005)

well i worn a metal log badge for years, i  took the cloth one off my  beret  and replaced it. i was a cpl and mcpl when i worn it. 
i read some where that  the  tech trades were going to be all wearing sew on cap badges so they  could not come off when working on equipment and could not fly  off into moving parts...safety  thing.
i hated the cloth badges they  looked cheap i thought.


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## Trinity (17 Sep 2005)

Exactly...

my understanding is there is a safety issue with metal capbadges...

The one excuse i heard was the EME or Log capbadge falling off and 
into the veh's when servicing engines... causing a potential little flying object

but other than using them as a ninja star (which takes actual thought and stupidity)
on the soldiers part.. I can't think of anything wrong with them..

Oh well.. I have half metal/cloth trade badge..  it's on, stays on.. and still looks
as keen cause of the metal....  ;D


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## ZipperHead (17 Sep 2005)

Not that I'm prone to defending medics (I'm married to one, and that's painful enough ;D), but armymedic IS a former Dragoon (as am I), and I think his "get bent" comment is in reference to the practice of bending good ol' Bambi (the Springbok) so it looks kewler (to use nerdspeak).

Al

P.S Metal hatbadges, while requiring daily maintenance (for the REAL brass/silver ones), are where it's at. The cloth ones are pretty lame, and people who would rather wear one of those when given the choice, are probably the one's who don't polish/blacken their boots, de-lint their beret, burn threads off uniform, etc. In a word: idle.


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## Steel Badger (17 Sep 2005)

My vote is for Metal Badges with cotter pins....

The present style of using tangs to affix the badge to said cap is just government parsimony.....leading to crooked badges, and lost badges....


Cloth badges are for the weak...


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## Armymedic (18 Sep 2005)

grayman said:
			
		

> Army medic.. nice reply on the capbadge issue, spoken like a true wog!!   You oviously dont have a clue on regimental pride !!
> As for the answer from Reccecrewman roger out to you, give a young troop something to work for, I know that our young troops work their *** off for that tiny piece of brass and it becomes one of their proudest days to take of the crappy old infantry capbadge and wear their highly shone Patricia cap badge for the first time.
> Reccecrewman we will have to sit back and swill a cup of gravy together one day !! HAHA



Wog?!? Now you go get bent (this time I mean 90 degrees forward flexion at the hips)...I wore a Gun, a Springbok, and then the 8CH capbage before I became a medic. I might know something about regimental pride, and quite a bit about the pride of wearing a nice shiny capbadge. And yes, my get bent comment was about how we used to bend Bambi's head and tail. Also about how nicely one of my capbadges broke when my beret fell down under the turret...cloth don't break.

I totally disagree with the concept of all members of the army having a metal capbadge. Having it as part of your dress uniform (DEU 1), maybe, but as part of your daily work dress...definately not. Case and point...have you seen a new metal medical hatbadge? It don't shine and looks like crap. The new dress cloth one with the gold thread looks really sharp.

I like cotter pins on the metal capbadges as well., it fixes the capbadge much better.

Let everyone wear their metal capbadges on thier forge caps.


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## jbeach95 (18 Sep 2005)

A good way to keep the metal capbadges from falling out is to cut a slit in the cardboard/leather backing and feed the prong into the inside of the beret. The extra thickness holds my capbadge quite well. Since doing this, I haven't had a problem with it.

View of slit from the outside (capbadge removed):






View from the inside with capbadge:


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## luck881 (18 Sep 2005)

Well, for my trade and branch...     the cloth   badge is just fine.   While i do like the look of the officer/Sr NCO badge with the gold thread and metal lightning bolts and Jimmy, more than the one I have now; the metal badge for Jr. ranks is about as appealing as a colored cornflake to me.   Also, the look of a working, or field (Iknow it doesn't really exist) beret with a slightly worn capbadge is a source of personal pride that distinguishes us (ex RadOps) from the others (Ex non-field TelOps, 291'ers) in the branch.   
P.S. No offence meant to any other Sigs I might have offended, it's Saturday, after midnight and well, you know....

edited for spelling


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## George Wallace (18 Sep 2005)

JBeach said:
			
		

> A good way to keep the metal capbadges from falling out is to cut a slit in the cardboard/leather backing and feed the prong into the inside of the beret. The extra thickness holds my capbadge quite well. Since doing this, I haven't had a problem with it.
> View from the inside with capbadge:



Now....if you cut the round knob off the end of the pin and then stuck the pin inside the little leather pocket, it would stay in even better.


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## Michael Dorosh (18 Sep 2005)

Steel Badger said:
			
		

> My vote is for Metal Badges with cotter pins....
> 
> The present style of using tangs to affix the badge to said cap is just government parsimony.....leading to crooked badges, and lost badges....
> 
> ...



Tangs?  Or sliders?  The two are different things.  Tangs go in and bend over, a slider just slips into a slot on the beret. Tangs would be an improvement over sliders actually.....


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## ZipperHead (18 Sep 2005)

> Let everyone wear their metal capbadges on thier forge caps.



Ashley, Ashley, Ashley...... Where did the Corps go wrong with you?!?!? First you go Medic (Uh, excuse me, you'll have to remove your pants and underwear so I can get a REAL close look at that festering hemmorhoid.....). Then you lose your ability to spell (thier, forge [it's forage, as in "forage for berries"]). Suggesting cloth badges over metal!!!!!!! Then you suggest we actually WEAR forage caps!!!!!! We may have to see that you get sent to get your tea-leaves read.....

Al


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## Steel Badger (18 Sep 2005)

MIkle


Is not the pictured object a tang?


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## chrisf (18 Sep 2005)

Luck881 said:
			
		

> Well, for my trade and branch...     the cloth   badge is just fine.   While i do like the look of the officer/Sr NCO badge with the gold thread and metal lightning bolts and Jimmy, more than the one I have now; the metal badge for Jr. ranks is about as appealing as a colored cornflake to me.   Also, the look of a working, or field (Iknow it doesn't really exist) beret with a slightly worn capbadge is a source of personal pride that distinguishes us (ex RadOps) from the others (Ex non-field TelOps, 291'ers) in the branch.
> P.S. No offence meant to any other Sigs I might have offended, it's Saturday, after midnight and well, you know....



I was actually just reading through this thread about to post the same thing, in comparing the two, I far prefer the look of the embroidered jimmy to the metal jimmy.


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## Armymedic (18 Sep 2005)

Allan Luomala said:
			
		

> Ashley, Ashley, Ashley...... Where did the Corps go wrong with you?!?!? First you go Medic (Uh, excuse me, you'll have to remove your pants and underwear so I can get a REAL close look at that festering hemmorhoid.....). Then you lose your ability to spell (thier, forge [it's forage, as in "forage for berries"]). Suggesting cloth badges over metal!!!!!!! Then you suggest we actually WEAR forage caps!!!!!! We may have to see that you get sent to get your tea-leaves read.....



I lost my ability to spell when somebody called me a WOG...REMF, maybe...But a WOG?!? Only thing more insulting then that would be calling me a LEG.
(BTW, you spelt hemorrhoid wrong) _Al, you are right agian....edited to add the "H" I forgot, its that darn WOG thing again_.

Suggesting everyone wear Forage caps is the same as suggesting everyone wear metal cap badges, no?

I loved my Dragoon Capbadge (still have my last one wrapped in velvet), as much as I hated shining the VIII one. But just as I think Forage caps are not for everyone, metal cap badges are not either.

With my current one, the dress cloth looks much sharper.


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## ZipperHead (18 Sep 2005)

> (BTW, you spelt hemorroid wrong)



... whatever... [Actually it is 'Hemorrhoid') I actually took the time to Google it, this time...... You know that I'm only picking on your spelling because you tradesmen are supposed to be so much more edumacated than us stunned-ass combat arms types.....

I think the key issue here, in my mind, is that the cloth hatbadge is a lazy man's way out. Some of them (the embroided ones with "metal" threads) look OK, but a lot of the other one's reek of "I'm too idle to polish a metal one, so there!!!!". 

The non-brass metal ones can look like crap (all that anodized metal, plastic, etc). So I suppose a fancy cloth one is a better substitute. But, if given the choice between a metal and cloth, I would take the shiny one any day.


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## Kat Stevens (18 Sep 2005)

Allan Luomala said:
			
		

> I think the key issue here, in my mind, is that the cloth hatbadge is a lazy man's way out. Some of them (the embroided ones with "metal" threads) look OK, but a lot of the other one's reek of "I'm too idle to polish a metal one, so there!!!!".



You make it sound like we had a choice.  In '84, when the switch was made, our CO mutinied, and we wore the metal for 2 more years in 1 CER.  The pointy heads finally got their way, though.


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## ZipperHead (18 Sep 2005)

> You make it sound like we had a choice.



I'm not saying it's always the individual who is to blame: on the contrary, it can be the office dwellers, at the unit or Ottawa level who make the decision. And if the power's that be are prone to idleness, the rest can suffer. I mean, do you really think a Cpl or Captain made the decision to go ahead with the Garrison dress program? I think not....

Al


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## Michael Dorosh (18 Sep 2005)

Steel Badger said:
			
		

> MIkle
> 
> 
> Is not the pictured object a tang?



No, it isn't, it's a slider.  A tang has a sharp end, generally, and is folded over to secure the badge in place.


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## grayman (19 Sep 2005)

ARMY MEDIC 
Maybe "wog" was a bit harsh, I may of been hasty in my choice of words,  I was not aware of the "get bent" phrase ment bending the springbok, my neck of the woods "get bent" means something else.
I offer up the olive branch


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## Acorn (19 Sep 2005)

Allan Luomala said:
			
		

> I think the key issue here, in my mind, is that the cloth hatbadge is a lazy man's way out. Some of them (the embroided ones with "metal" threads) look OK, but a lot of the other one's reek of "I'm too idle to polish a metal one, so there!!!!".
> 
> The non-brass metal ones can look like crap (all that anodized metal, plastic, etc). So I suppose a fancy cloth one is a better substitute. But, if given the choice between a metal and cloth, I would take the shiny one any day.



Well, it'd be the lazy way out if we had a choice. Frankly, I think it's the cheap way out (by the gummint) - those enamelled anodized WOG badges must have cost a fortune.

I recall a comment from a few years back (few in the geological sense): a SALH NCO was jacked by someone from another Reg't for an unshined hat badge. The reply was "The badge of the South Alberta Light Horse shines in it's own Glory sergeant!" (I think there was a "recce doesn't wear shiny stuff" thing in there somewhere, but....)

Acorn
(Who would be happy to have the metal badge of the C Int C to wear)


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## Kat Stevens (19 Sep 2005)

Yes, as a Combat Engineer, I proudly wore my BRASS, enamelled WOG badge.  Took me a year to earn it, and I wore it on the inside of my beret since they took them away.


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## Armymedic (19 Sep 2005)

grayman said:
			
		

> ARMY MEDIC
> Maybe "wog" was a bit harsh, I may of been hasty in my choice of words,   I was not aware of the "get bent" phrase ment bending the springbok, my neck of the woods "get bent" means something else.
> I offer up the olive branch



No prob, my mistake as well.

At my end of the telephone wire, "get bent" was a funny response. Both as a negative reply to the question and as a literal reply to why metal capbadges aren't the best thing to be worn by everyone.


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## Arctic Acorn (19 Sep 2005)

Acorn said:
			
		

> Acorn
> (Who would be happy to have the metal badge of the C Int C to wear)



Amen!

The first generation cloth and metal Branch badges_ were_ pretty nice, IMHO. The star was made of a decent metal (and shines up real nice), and the gold in the leaves and the crown look nice and rich with age. I used to have one, but its gone now and sadly I can't seem to find a decent replacement...The new ones are crap. Cheaper metal on the star (which no amount of silvo can shine up), and they're often off-centre on the badge. 

 :dontpanic:


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