# Have Not Returned my Cadet Uniform



## Aitrean

I quit my air cadet squadron two months ago (last week of April). However, I still have not managed to return my uniform because of days supply is open, scheduling, etc. Now, supply is closed until cadets start up again in September and I cannot return it until then. I still have full intention to join the reserves and later, the regular force, but now I'm very anxious about my "illegal" cadet uniform. I feel very bad about holding onto the uniform longer than I should, but moreover I'm worried that when I do a background check for the real forces, it will show up on my transcript. So my question is, will a five-month late return of a cadet uniform show up to a recruiting office?


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## TN2IC

RCMP are knocking on your door now.


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## dogger1936

The CIC Gestapo Corp RC (4555) know where you live. You can now kiss your military career good bye.

In all seriousness drop it off in the fall. The cadets have nothing to do with the forces minus pay for adult volunteers for your youth program.


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## RememberanceDay

As with the above, it's no big deal. Really.


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## JorgSlice

I kept mine after I aged out. They can't send you a bill or anything.


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## my72jeep

JorgSlice said:
			
		

> I kept mine after I aged out. They can't send you a bill or anything.


No We can't send you a bill, we can call you once,send you a letter once. But look at it this way what use do you have for a cadet uniform out side of cadets? If you don't return it your 1) breaking your word that you gave when you joined saying you return it when you quit, 2) your costing the program extra $ because it now needs to acquire more uniforms for the next cadet.


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## dogger1936

my72jeep said:
			
		

> No We can't send you a bill, we can call you once,send you a letter once. But look at it this way what use do you have for a cadet uniform out side of cadets? If you don't return it your 1) breaking your word that you gave when you joined saying you return it when you quit, 2) your costing the program extra $ because it now needs to acquire more uniforms for the next cadet.



And don't you get a budget to replace the uniform each year for your numbers through logistic corp? While I only spent a short amount of time inside the world of a cadet det each new recruit was given points that their supply O could order a complete uniform for them. Infact our det had a problem if unit's were holding extra uniforms. While I couldn't find any regulations on it to enforce it (like most things in the cadet organisation) our det had a policy of not holding extra uniforms at the corp level.

She can bring it back; or not. It's up to her.


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## my72jeep

dogger1936 said:
			
		

> And don't you get a budget to replace the uniform each year for your numbers through logistic corp? While I only spent a short amount of time inside the world of a cadet det each new recruit was given points that their supply O could order a complete uniform for them. Infact our det had a problem if unit's were holding extra uniforms. While I couldn't find any regulations on it to enforce it (like most things in the cadet organisation) our det had a policy of not holding extra uniforms at the corp level.
> 
> She can bring it back; or not. It's up to her.



YES but the points given per cadet per year are not equal to a compleat uniform, some things are meant to be re issued IE, boots, tunics, coats. 
back when we came on line with Logistic we were not to hold more than 10% stock at the unit, they were concerned that the units would order to much and logistic would have nothing. 
As a supply officer I liked to keep stock for two reasons 1) if a cadet wanted to change a shirt you could do it same day not 3 weeks later. 2) new cadets stay if you can put then in a uniform with in a month of joining.


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## JorgSlice

my72jeep said:
			
		

> No We can't send you a bill, we can call you once,send you a letter once. But look at it this way what use do you have for a cadet uniform out side of cadets? If you don't return it your 1) breaking your word that you gave when you joined saying you return it when you quit, 2) your costing the program extra $ because it now needs to acquire more uniforms for the next cadet.



So that 20+ years from now I can look back on it, hopefully after a long, pleasant and fulfilling CF career, and reflect on the memories and how far I've come and to sit there and say to my children and grandchildren at how wonderful my experiences were and couldn't imagine my life without both organizations. I can show them what it looked like, and have them go "Wow grandpa, you're so cool! I wanna grow up to be just like you!"

But I guess I'm just a soulless monster that destroyed a youth program.

Probably differs per unit, but mine had no problem out fitting 12 cadets and exchanging things at any time, any piece. New cadets would have their uniform by the end of the week (pending correct sizes in stock). When we jumped from 12 to 90 over 2 years, we still had ZERO uniform and equipment supply problems and everything worked the same as above - exchange at any time, any piece and recruits had their uniform by the end of the week.


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## my72jeep

JorgSlice said:
			
		

> Probably differs per unit, but mine had no problem out fitting 12 cadets and exchanging things at any time, any piece. New cadets would have their uniform by the end of the week (pending correct sizes in stock). When we jumped from 12 to 90 over 2 years, we still had ZERO uniform and equipment supply problems and everything worked the same as above - exchange at any time, any piece and recruits had their uniform by the end of the week.


Good supply Officer and a good return on uniforms from past cadets.


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## Scott

Jesus, it's a frickin uniform worn for a youth organization. I wonder how many former Scouts keep their hirts and sashes or whatever with all of the dashes and doodads sewed on? I turned in my cadets uniform, I gave back my hockey jerseys, I do not feel less fulfilled because of it

It's been pointed out, by a CCM supply officer no less, that they do require the uniform articles for future Cadets.

I love it when I can spot guys destined for the Navy from a mile off.


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## JorgSlice

Scott said:
			
		

> Jesus, it's a frickin uniform worn for a youth organization. I wonder how many former Scouts keep their hirts and sashes or whatever with all of the dashes and doodads sewed on? I turned in my cadets uniform, I gave back my hockey jerseys, I do not feel less fulfilled because of it
> 
> It's been pointed out, by a CCM supply officer no less, that they do require the uniform articles for future Cadets.
> 
> I love it when I can spot guys destined for the Navy from a mile off.



Nor would I, but I did so because I could. Hell, my unit didn't even ask for it back. All I kept was the jacket with it's badges (or 'tunic' as some call it), the boots were hand-me-downs from my Dad and the DEU shirts (short sleeve) couldn't be used for re-issue anyway because it's a next-to-skin article.


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## gwp

my72jeep said:
			
		

> Good supply Officer and a good return on uniforms from past cadets.



Exactly

8.42 - MATERIEL - OWNERSHIP
(1) The ownership of all materiel provided to a cadet organization by the Canadian Forces remains vested in Her
Majesty the Queen in right of Canada.

(2) Materiel provided under (1) of this article shall not be bartered, sold or otherwise disposed of, except as prescribed
in QR(Cadets1 or in orders issued by the Chief of the Defence Staff.


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## Eaglelord17

Scott said:
			
		

> I wonder how many former Scouts keep their hirts and sashes or whatever with all of the dashes and doodads sewed on?


For the record Scouts do not have to return there uniforms as they pay for them out of pocket, unlike cadets where everything is free.


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## Scott

Eaglelord17 said:
			
		

> For the record Scouts do not have to return there uniforms as they pay for them out of pocket, unlike cadets where everything is free.



Right, remove Scouts from my statement and replace it with hockey teams and their jerseys. Or a Timmy's uniform. Do you have a point to your clarification? 

Stacked - not necessarily directed at you.


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## armyvern

Eaglelord17 said:
			
		

> For the record Scouts do not have to return there uniforms as they pay for them out of pocket, unlike cadets where everything is free.



Where everything is free!!?? My ass.

It's "free" to you ... and to you only. Each and every "point" used to obtain any item of kit from LogistikUnicorp is paid out in cash. You, and CF members use your points, the system then reimburses that civilian company with cold, hard, Canadian taxpayer money.

It ain't free. It costs money. And every one of "you" who insists this stuff is "free" so keeps it and break your promise, depletes funds from the coffers as the system has to fork out more dough to cover the full kitting out of the next youth who should get to benefit from that uniform.

Meanwhile, out here in the real world, budget cuts have the system taking food out of troops' mouths. But, no worries, your shit is "free" apparently.  :


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## my72jeep

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> Where everything is free!!?? My ***.
> 
> It's "free" to you ... and to you only. Each and every "point" used to obtain any item of kit from LogistikUnicorp is paid out in cash. You, and CF members use your points, the system then reimburses that civilian company with cold, hard, Canadian taxpayer money.
> 
> It ain't free. It costs money. And every one of "you" who insists this stuff is "free" so keeps it and break your promise, depletes funds from the coffers as the system has to fork out more dough to cover the full kitting out of the next youth who should get to benefit from that uniform.
> 
> Meanwhile, out here in the real world, budget cuts have the system taking food out of troops' mouths. But, no worries, your crap is "free" apparently.  :
> 
> :goodpost: :ditto:


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## Eaglelord17

For the record I was a Scout Leader for a while and I prefer people to be properly informed about things. The reason I said everything is free for Cadets is at the member level (the Cadets themselves) it is. For example for most Scouts it costs about 200$ a year plus uniforms (which are about 60$ each) and extra for any camps they wish to attend. Make the Cadets pay for there stuff if they don't return it simple as that. To get back to the topic and hopefully close it, if a cadet said they would return there uniform after there done they should end of story.


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## armyvern

Eaglelord17 said:
			
		

> For the record I was a Scout Leader for a while and I prefer people to be properly informed about things. The reason I said everything is free for Cadets is at the member level (the Cadets themselves) it is. For example for most Scouts it costs about 200$ a year plus uniforms (which are about 60$ each) and extra for any camps they wish to attend. Make the Cadets pay for there stuff if they don't return it simple as that. To get back to the topic and hopefully close it, if a cadet said they would return there uniform after there done they should end of story.



To be clear, I am also a Scout Leader and that is completely irrelevant to the topic at hand; as is the price their uniforms cost their families. Apples N Oranges.

Now, if you want to "properly inform" people about things, you should start with, "nothing in the world is free, not even that uniform cadet X didn't have to pay for (but taxpayer did)." It's theft - plain and simple; he/she signed a DND638 _*Temporary Loan*_ Card to obtain it.


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## dogger1936

Very good point Armyvern; everything does cost dollars. I was wondering how much volunteers in scouts Canada get paid and applying that to the cadet program may save our budget millions as well. >


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## medicineman

Eaglelord17 said:
			
		

> For the record I was a Scout Leader for a while and I prefer people to be properly informed about things. The reason I said everything is free for Cadets is at the member level (the Cadets themselves) it is. For example for most Scouts it costs about 200$ a year plus uniforms (which are about 60$ each) and extra for any camps they wish to attend. Make the Cadets pay for there stuff if they don't return it simple as that. To get back to the topic and hopefully close it, if a cadet said they would return there uniform after there done they should end of story.



Thread derailment.

Psst -  I got side tracked by total misuse of that infamous set of homynyms - THERE, THEY'RE and THEIR...dude, they're not interchangeable  .

Back on track...

Kids sign a 638 to get the loan of the uniform...loan, being the operative word, as the word implies that the Cadet unit actually owns it.  In reality, it's kind of like a promissory note - you sign it, it's binding.  This is a way of starting to make kids accountable in life...and the aim of the Cadet movement is to make good citizens...ergo, if you sign for it and don't bring it back, don't be surprised when someone shows up with a bill in your name or asking for/demanding the uniform back, as they should.  If they don't, well, just is another sign of the times that kids are apparently not accoutnable for their actions or lack there of.  To the OP - send your uniform back, because unless you bought it, it's not really yours.

And BTW, not all Cadet units are free...my kid belonged to a Sqn that had dues every year to help pay for flight familiarizations and other things DND didn't support.

 :2c: for what it's worth.

MM


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## gwp

medicineman said:
			
		

> Kids sign a 638 to get the loan of the uniform...loan, being the operative word, as the word implies that the Cadet unit actually owns it.  In reality, it's kind of like a promissory note - you sign it, it's binding.  This is a way of starting to make kids accountable in life...and the aim of the Cadet movement is to make good citizens...ergo, if you sign for it and don't bring it back, don't be surprised when someone shows up with a bill in your name or asking for/demanding the uniform back, as they should.  If they don't, well, just is another sign of the times that kids are apparently not accoutnable for their actions or lack there of.  To the OP - send your uniform back, because unless you bought it, it's not really yours.


Armyvern has it right.  The recovery of kit from cadets parallels the process for the Primary Reserve. The process should start when a cadet has missed three nights of attendance.  First there is a phone call to determine if there are extenuating circumstances regarding attendance.  It that brings a negative response a letter is sent to return the kit (less next to skin items and other expendables) often with an indication of the value of the items.  What happens next probably differs from corps to corps.  Some SUPOs will go to the house to collect the kit.  The unfortunate part is that unlike the PRes the system cannot recoup the cost from a final pay cheque.  If the kit is not returned there is a procedure for the items to be written off.  An aside from the earlier post a SUPO may decide that a usually returnable piece of kit is no longer serviceable and allow a senior cadet to keep a tunic as a souvenir for instance.  It's not pusser but it happens.  



> And BTW, not all Cadet units are free...my kid belonged to a Sqn that had dues every year to help pay for flight familiarizations and other things DND didn't support. :2c: for what it's worth. MM



The cadet program is not free, but it is important to know that any request for funds from a sponsoring committee is not a cost to enrol in the cadet program.  It is a solicitation by the civilian sponsor that is voluntary and should have no impact on cadet enrollment or participation.  The civilian sponsor requires funds to pay its responsibilities that include, accomodation, utilities, telephone, cable, liability insurance, additional training aides, and enhanced activities and transportation not supported by the CF/DND.  No cadet may be turned away from the cadet program or otherwise disadvantaged because  of non-payment of such a solicitation.   

A cadet corps of 40 cadets represents a Federal Government investment of about $100,000 annually in the youth of the community.  That includes uniforms and the local training program, Support and Class A pay for the CF supervision and leadership, Headquarters oversite, and about 10 to 12 of the 40 cadets attending summer training.   

That investment cannot exist without the support of the community including a group that takes on the responsibility, under the supervising Army Cadet, Air Cadet, or Navy League to sponsor the cadet corps that includes those expenses mentioned above.


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## RememberanceDay

At my corp, if you age out (not just quit), they let you keep your uniform. Certain parts, anyways. I'm not sure what they are, but I think the tunic is one.


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