# What weapon is this?



## Tpr.Orange (3 Oct 2004)

i think im having a brain fart but what weapon is the guy in the front carrying? It looks like a c9 but im having a hard time figuring it out? i think im loosing my mind. :'(


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## Infanteer (3 Oct 2004)

Judging by the receiver, I'd say you're right on (except the Americans call it the M-249 SAW).  One of the more proficient musketmen around here may see something different.


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## SEB123 (3 Oct 2004)

look's like the FN Minimi


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## Tpr.Orange (3 Oct 2004)

Infanteer said:
			
		

> Judging by the receiver, I'd say you're right on (except the Americans call it the M-249 SAW).   One of the more proficient musketmen around here may see something different.



I have a feeling your right, but that the boxed ammo is in a desert cam shroud


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## Infanteer (3 Oct 2004)

I can't tell from the picture whether it is actually desert cam or just dirty.  I suspect from the size that it is actually a 50 or 100 round cloth ammo bag and not a plastic box.


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## gun plumber (3 Oct 2004)

You are correct-and both right-it is  the american version of the C-9,and yes it is a FN Minimi.The americans have been constantly been mod'n thier weapons to achive user pefectivness(even a word)?so what started as a m-16 45 years ago may look totally differnt in say 5 years.Some recognition notes are upper reciever,forward trunion for pintle mount, front sight assembly and the barrel(abeit a shorter one or longer plastic one of the 2).


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## 1feral1 (3 Oct 2004)

Looks like a M249 SAW (Squad Automatic Weapon) Minimi fitted with a 'Para' Minimi barrel.

Australia refers to their version Minimi as the F89A1 LSW (Light Support Weapon)

As for the cloth 'mag', we use the exact same except in AUSCAM. A canvas 100rd capacity, fitted with a zip, and three come issued for every Minimi. We also have the 'para version' too.

Cheers,

Wes


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## 1feral1 (3 Oct 2004)

In comparison to Canada's C9, on the F89A1 LSW note the plastic butt M249 type butt, the different optics (1.5X ADI design), the absence of a front sight, different handguard, thicker barrel, and a MAG 58 style flash suppresor.

Soon ADI is coming out with a RAS to replace the handguard, and an improved bipod, and with a new type gas block which has no regulator, just direct gas, with no adjustment for N or A. ROF is supposed to be in between the N and A setting.

What is ADI? Australian Defence Industries, and it is based out of the Lithgow Small Arms Factory where small arms, etc have been made since 1913. However, ADI is a big company and they make everything from clothing to vehicles, and are all over the country.

Lithgow is about a 2hr drive west of Sydney.

Many components such as the barrel, feed cover, and feed tray (plus other parts too) are ADI made. The reciever is FN made.

Cheers,

Wes


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## KevinB (4 Oct 2004)

I think it is and early version of the Mk46 (USSOC modified M249)
FN has then on their website IIRC

*editted cause the Mk46 has an integral RAS while the one in the pic does not - but it has the shortened para bbl without the Para stock.

Maybe a mix and match gun.


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## VRC (4 Oct 2004)

I'd say (experience is limited, though) that it's a M-249 slightly modified to be a personal (rather than a Squad) weapon.


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## Infanteer (4 Oct 2004)

Looking at the Aussie LSW, what is the rational of sticking an optical sight on a Machine Gun?   It's always confused me.


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## gun plumber (4 Oct 2004)

You dont have to go all the way to australia(sp)to ask that question.The c-9 has a weaver rail for a reason......


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## Infanteer (4 Oct 2004)

I know that.   My comment was directed towards the fact that we do not seem to be the only ones silly enough to throw an optical sight on a machine gun.


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## 1feral1 (5 Oct 2004)

The Yanks have got them on their M240B's (ELCAN M145 series), and we use various types of optics on the MAG 58 and the LSW (C79), but the LSW comes standard with the same otpics as the F88SA1 has. 

I know that our so called gurus in the small arms field share alot of info with Canada (I have seen CFTOs and many of the F89 parts have CF NSNs ( op rod for example), and some gauges for inspection are infact Diemaco made (firing pin protrusion gauge for example, it too has a CF NSN right on it), plus I seen some 1982 Ptrn CF spare bbl carriers for the C9, but we developed our own instead in yes, AUSCAM. 

Keeping things simple, the optics here are ADI designed, and very robust and durable. Only a 1.5X magnification, with a 'donut' and cross hair as a sighting picture.

Commercially, these optics can be purchased for about $US400.00, as I have seen them advertised occasionally in the USA, etc.

You'll note that the Aussie weapon has no iron sights at all, as the front sight is not even milled for on the gas block, and there is no rear sight at all period. However the optics have an emergency sight on top, and white dots are used for low light etc on them.

I am in the armoury all day tomorrow, and I'll post some new pics after work tomorrow.

Cheers,

Wes


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## foerestedwarrior (6 Oct 2004)

it only makes things easier to engage(in my limited range experiance). Proper drill sais you are supposed to aim with the sight, and then choot looking over then top of the sight and correct by tracer or splash. that is for both iron and optical. so if you are going to be looking over top of the sights regardless, i would rather have an optical sight(providing its sighted correctly), just you can see better, and make more accurate range estimations with the C-79 sight


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## Footie (12 Oct 2004)

The wpn in question is the Mk46 Mod 0 made for special forces by FN. The product page is here:
http://www.fnmfg.com/products/mk46mod0/mk46mod0.htm


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## Jon-ice-sham (12 Oct 2004)

are you sure?!??!1 doesn't look like it


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## SEB123 (13 Oct 2004)

it's not this one


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## Jon-ice-sham (13 Oct 2004)

yeah that's what i thought it kinda looks like it but it's not or maybe it so modified that i can't recognize it lol


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## kruger (14 Oct 2004)

Its an FN MINIMI Para with american PIP upgrades.


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## 1feral1 (16 Oct 2004)

Note the wpn in question does have a carrying handle (folding) which is the latest type FN has developed. I also think its the para version bbl on a standard M249. Note too the absense of the adjustable gas reg. This type pictured on this 'shorty' Minimi is 'direct' gas only.

Here is some pics of one I took off an East Timorese contract FN Minimi. Also   note the differernt gas reg too. Its knurled opposed to the standard types encountered on the C9 and and F89. The standard FN flash suppressor is also used.

The US M249 and M240 series of MGs are made by FN at a factory in the USA, and not in Herstal.

Cheers,

Wes


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## rounder (16 Oct 2004)

Wes,

    How do you change from normal gas to adverse?


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## 1feral1 (17 Oct 2004)

It turns the same way as the standard one, but knurled instead. When the wpn is hot, you had better have some serious callaces as even on the standard type the reg gets a wee tad  warm.

On the version with a non-adjustable 'direct gas' reg, one does nothing, as the setting for ROF is done at the factory.

Cheers,

Wes


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