# Its In! Saddam to be hanged NLT 27 Jan 07



## 1feral1 (26 Dec 2006)

While sitting here in the CP, watching CNN, not even 5 mins ago this BREAKING news came in...

Saddam and two others are to be executed within 30 days from now!

They are now debating to have it done publically on TV.

Ya, we knew the lights were buring in the courthouse tonight, and now we know why.

I wonder what the enemy has planned?????

Anyways, check www.CNN.com for more info. If knew how, I'd post a link.

So is it a kangaroo court of justice properly served? You decide, but I see it as a beginning of the end, and I don't think he'll be martyred. In time he and that regime will be in the history books as yet another chapter. 

However, just wait what the snivel libertrian tree-huggers will say........ watch and shoot 


Cheers from Baghdad,

Wes


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## Trooper Hale (26 Dec 2006)

So you dont reckon there will be any protests at your end? I mean, obviously the baddies are going to blow some stuff up and all that (from what i hear it wouldnt be baghdad without that) but i mean actual protesting mobs. Or are most folks more then happy to see him go?
Stay safe boss, good luck,
Hales


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## 1feral1 (26 Dec 2006)

Hey hales,

Ha, I am sure they'll be a tad upset, but in reality, the enemy is impotent, only able to 'shoot and scoot' and lob a few mortars and rockets un-accurately. At times launch a brief complex attack, again not sticking around for long, or placing car bombs or SVBIEDs, etc. In my opinion, overall a combination of poor training, rushed lotalists who know within a minute or soo the POO has been discovered, and somehting nasty could be upon them quicksmart, plus the fact that most ammo is buried or at least stored improperly, and many fuses fail either to this or having the safety pins not removed, again poor training and a need of urgency to get a few rds down range and pack up before the Great SATAN  sends a few messangers of their own.

However, he is dangerous, and is cunning and capable of planning some nasty things. I both fear him and respect him, so don't get me wrong. He is capable of all sorts of nasty things, he is organised, but really does not have any infrastructure to back him up. Its there but very poor overall. Personally I would expect even more unrest now with this decision up to and after the hanging, and beyond. Its still a bumpy road ahead, and no cakewalk here. I am sure in the foreseeable future, you'll be here yourself, by then, I hope its quieter than it is now.

Again today more crumps, more sensless sectarian murder. The carnage never seems to end, just like the two crumps on Christmas Day at 0910h, and 0923h respectively. For the people, I am sure it will get worse before it gets better. Again this is just my opinion.

Cheers mate,

Wes


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## KevinB (26 Dec 2006)

My biggest concern is they will close BIAP and my leave will get screwed up...


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## tomahawk6 (28 Dec 2006)

There are reports he will be executed this weekend. This will be his last view.


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## gaspasser (29 Dec 2006)

opcorn:
I hope they telelvise it, just so a lot of us can watch it out of morbid curiosity...and to make sure Sumdum is actually D.E.A.D.
{sorry, was that my out loud voice?}


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## Sig_Des (29 Dec 2006)

BYT Driver said:
			
		

> opcorn:
> I hope they telelvise it, just so a lot of us can watch it out of morbid curiosity...and to make sure Sumdum is actually D.E.A.D.
> {sorry, was that my out loud voice?}



Ok, Ottawa region who's got a 54+ inch Plasma Screen? I'll pring popcorn and beer!


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## geo (29 Dec 2006)

It aint over till the fat lady sings.

we'll talk after it's all done.

BTW, message to Sadam.............. 
" Have a Happy New Year!!!"


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## ArmyRick (29 Dec 2006)

Grim looking place.

Saddam, time to face the maker...


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## CrazyCanuck (29 Dec 2006)

Maybe instead of hanging him they can gas him with the same gas he used on the Kurds(that the right group?) give him a taste of his own medicine


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## Jacqueline (29 Dec 2006)

Boater said:
			
		

> Maybe instead of hanging him they can gas him with the same gas he used on the Kurds(that the right group?) give him a taste of his own medicine



Do you think that would be copying his murderous behaviour? Maybe.


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## warspite (29 Dec 2006)

Well  Saddam may you hang till your feet stop the kicking....
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2006/12/28/saddam-execution.html


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## proudnurse (29 Dec 2006)

ArmyRick said:
			
		

> Grim looking place.
> 
> Saddam, time to face the maker...



Too Bad we could not bring more of these people to justice to face the same fate. Saddam you have brought this on yourself. May the pain you have caused so many others, finally be yours.


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## harry8422 (29 Dec 2006)

saddam i hope you feel every bit of every crack of the bones in your next....

p.s does anyone know if it will be televised? i just want to know if i should keep my order for ufc or change it to happy hour with saddam


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## FredDaHead (29 Dec 2006)

CNN has announced that Saddam will be hung within the next 36 hours, or at least "this year." It will only be announced once it is done, to try and help with security and prevent some kind of action to prevent the sentence from being carried out.

Sounds like we're finally getting rid of one bad guy. Now on to Kim Jung-Il... or Ahmadinejad?


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## KevinB (29 Dec 2006)

A few of Sadr's henchman in Najaf and else got a dirt nap this week -- MNF's using the time to hit some Shia extremists, kinda of tit for tat - with the Sunni's losing Sadam.  If it does anything to stop the ethnic violence - who knows...


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## geo (29 Dec 2006)

As long as Iran continues to feed & fuel the fight, things are not going to settle down for some time yet


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## tomahawk6 (29 Dec 2006)

The reality has finally set in that as long as Sadr and his gang are above ground there is little chance of democracy taking hold and there is the real prospect of a shia vs Sadr civil war which needs to be avoided.


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## 1feral1 (29 Dec 2006)

Gallows tic-toc.......

So, here I am, on a wireless, in the common area of our room. Its struggling to keep it warm, the heater blows, yet from a metre on down, its cold. Outside, maybe 5C, but humid, so it feels worse.

Meanwhile the Butcher of Baghdad apparently has been handed over to the Iraqi Forces, and CNN reports of a gallows being constructed right here in the IZ. Hummm, I wonder how close it is from here, as the courthouse where all this went on is very close by.

So some say he'll swing tonight before 2359, others say tomorrow, but I guess time will tell, and we all won't know until after the fact, and then it will start. The 'happy' fire, when everyone with a weapon, points it up, and lets the mags go, and that means its time to stay under cover, but it will be madness, and then followed by the sunni side of it all which means nothing but bad news for the majority of the locals. More bombs, more sectarian violence, but it is however a two way road, as the shiite will respond in this ongoing tit for tat style of revenge killings.

Now as I send these words out, seems to be a little more thick out there with helos. Coinsidence or is something going on. I guess we'll all find out soon enough.

Anwyays if its tonight, I am sure we'll be woke up over it.


I wish I had a nice CC and ginger about now........ I guess I'll settle for an orange Gatorade, adn try to get back watching Commando with Arnie...


Regards,

Wes


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## Trinity (29 Dec 2006)

CNN

says 

1) no live broadcast 

and 

2) it will happen by 10 pm  *our time   0600 hrs their time    

thats... in 4 hours


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## Mike Baker (29 Dec 2006)

No live broadcast, wonder if that means it will be taped.


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## vonGarvin (29 Dec 2006)

Trinity said:
			
		

> CNN
> 
> says
> 
> ...



11 pm Atlantic, 11:30 Newfoundland 

:cheers:


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## Trinity (29 Dec 2006)

Hauptmann Scharlachrot said:
			
		

> 11 pm Atlantic, 11:30 Newfoundland



But doesn't the world rotate around Toronto?!?!?!

wait.. yes.. it does.

You scared me for a second... but I was right


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## tomahawk6 (29 Dec 2006)

Fox reports 9:30 pm EST. 

Update:Saddam wont die alone. His half brother Barzan Ibrahim Hasan and the former Chief Judge will also die today.


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## FredDaHead (29 Dec 2006)

tomahawk6 said:
			
		

> Fox reports 9:30 pm EST.
> 
> Update:Saddam wont die alone. His half brother Barzan Ibrahim Hasan and the former Chief Judge will also die today.



Shhhhh, the insurgents need to use each death one by one!


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## FredDaHead (29 Dec 2006)

CNN reports Saddam executed at approx. 2155 EST

Saionara, Saddam!


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## Meridian (29 Dec 2006)

Yep, arguing back and forth now about how they will "prove" to the Iraqi people and the world that he is actually dead, since they refused to broadcast it.


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## FullMetalParka (29 Dec 2006)

Ding Dong, the witch is dead! Burn in hell Saddam.


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## Mike Baker (29 Dec 2006)

Report that Saddam was hung 20 mins ago, bye bye  ;D


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## FredDaHead (29 Dec 2006)

Meridian said:
			
		

> Yep, arguing back and forth now about how they will "prove" to the Iraqi people and the world that he is actually dead, since they refused to broadcast it.



Maybe someone had their cell phone camera with them and filmed it? Seems to be all the rage these days.


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## aesop081 (29 Dec 2006)

Frederik G said:
			
		

> Maybe someone had their cell phone camera with them and filmed it? Seems to be all the rage these days.



Look for it on youtube  ;D


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## GAP (29 Dec 2006)

Good


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## Mike Baker (29 Dec 2006)

cdnaviator said:
			
		

> Look for it on youtube  ;D


Already tried, nothing there but silly cartoons  


http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2006/12/29/saddam-dead.html


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## Gouki (29 Dec 2006)

Aaannd apparently his lawyer has confirmed his execution .. according to CNN. 

Looks like one of the local stations there also confirmed it.


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## schart28 (29 Dec 2006)

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20061229/CPMONDE/61229057/5032/CPACTUALITES

According to France Presse, Saddam Hussien got hanged.


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## schart28 (29 Dec 2006)

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2006/12/29/saddam-dead.html

Saddam Hussein executed: Iraqi state TV

Former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein has been hanged, according to s tate-run Iraqiya television.

The report gave no furthers, but Arab television stations Al-Hurra and Al-Arabiya reported Saddam was hanged around 6 a.m. local time Saturday (10 p.m. ET Friday) in Baghdad's Green Zone.

But there has been no official confirmation from either the Iraqi or U.S. governments.

Also hanged were Saddam's half-brother Barzan Ibrahim and Awad Hamed al-Bandar, the former chief justice of the Revolutionary Court, according to the reports.

Saddam, who was captured in December 2003 following the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq, was convicted in early November of committing crimes against humanity in the slaughter of 148 Shia Muslims in the northern city of Dujail in 1982.

During his trial, Saddam requested he be executed by firing squad "as a military man" and not by hanging, which he said would be a fate befitting "a common criminal."


His lawyers filed documents in a U.S. court Friday afternoon asking for an emergency restraining order aimed at stopping the U.S. government from relinquishing custody of the condemned former Iraqi leader to Iraqi officials.

But the appeal was denied late Friday.

The attorneys argued that because Saddam also faced a civil lawsuit in Washington, he had rights as a civil defendant that would be violated if he were executed.

The Pentagon said U.S. forces in Iraq were on high alert in anticipation of any violence following the execution of Saddam, whose brutal rule of the country spanned 24 years.


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## te. crutch (29 Dec 2006)

http://64.233.179.104/translate_c?hl=en&u=http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/arabic/news/default.stm&prev=/search%3Fq%3Darab%2Bmedia%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-us
Iraqi official comfirms Saddam hanging??


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## NL_engineer (30 Dec 2006)

This is what CTV Reported http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061228/saddam_executed_dategoeshere/20061229?hub=TopStories


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## KevinB (30 Dec 2006)

Yeah -- celebratory fire woke me from my sleep -- I was pretty sure a running gun battle was going on in our compound, locals laughed when I popped out dressed in my knuckle dragger gear ready to rock.


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## FredDaHead (30 Dec 2006)

Anyone find it incredibly funny that his lawyers are bitching?

I find it especially amusing that they're saying that Saddam being burried in an unmarked grave is "an affront" to his family. What about the families of all the people he had executed? It was a pretty big affront to them, too, I'd say.

Now that he's dead, can we please silence those lawyers so they stop making fools of themselves?


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## 1feral1 (30 Dec 2006)

The trap door has opened, and 'ole mate' swung. Saddam has done the jig.

Yes, its done! woke up to the news on BCC, and got out of bed to watch CNN. Here in Baghdad, its really quiet so far. Not one shot, eriely quiet.

The calm before the storm??

Time will tell. Meanwhile December has proven to be the bloodiest month for US Forces, with KIAs topping 100 now.

I would imagine as Baghdad rises this cold morning (its 1C here right now),  the city might choose to come to life, one way or another.

So at 0605h this am local time, he climbed the 13 steps. The good news is I won the Saddam lotto, picking 0630h as the time, and one had to be closest to it without going over.


Regards from an exceptionally quiet cold winter morning. If anything thing signifigant happens, when I can I'll post it on here.


Wes


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## 1feral1 (30 Dec 2006)

Happy fire has started, lots of gunfire into the air as I type this out.......

What goes up, must come down!


Cheers,

Wes


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## jollyjacktar (30 Dec 2006)

Sic semper tyrannis.  Shame he went the easy way, I agree he should have had some of his own medicine with gas.  Hopefully 07 will see the end of more bastards like him, the AQ/Taliban leadership comes to mind.

Hope the locals take this easy for your and the guys Wes.  Good luck in the coming days.  BTW, I am a morbid sod, what was the pot at??


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## CrazyCanuck (30 Dec 2006)

Here's a little CTV description of his rise and fall if anybody's interested: http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061227/saddam_execution_061227/20061229/


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## HollywoodHitman (30 Dec 2006)

You guys remember the scene from South Park with Sadaam and his lover, the Devil?

HAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! Sorry. (Snicker).....HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! 

Cheers to those who fought to bring him to his hopefully painful end. 

 :cheers:


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## Desert Fox (30 Dec 2006)

Good Riddance!

Cheers to all of those who played a part in his demise.


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## 1feral1 (30 Dec 2006)

Well, its 1115h. The 'happy fire' has seemed to die down somewhat, and now its just another day. Little wind, its brisk though, and not a cloud in the big blue sky, no mist, no dust, no smog even, as at times its quite hazey here. You'd never even begin to guess what has happened at 0605 this am. In a way, its almost peacful, the hellhound who sneaks into our compound is sleeping in the sun, on top of a pile of sand, pigeons fly about, yes the odd pair of Blackhawks buzzing about, the sound of moving armoured vehicles in the distance, shy of the odd siren and gun shot, it is not that bad at all. 

Lets hope it stays that way.

A page has turned forth in the history books, and for the better we hope.


Cheers,

Wes


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## vonGarvin (30 Dec 2006)

Infidel-6 said:
			
		

> Yeah -- celebratory fire woke me from my sleep -- I was pretty sure a running gun battle was going on in our compound, locals laughed when I popped out dressed in my knuckle dragger gear ready to rock.


The question is, though, did you fire in the air as well?


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## 1feral1 (30 Dec 2006)

I am sure we'll all get a tracer show come tomorrow evening, around the witching hour of midnight, welcoming in the New Year will be even more outragous with today's hanging. I reckon it will be combined 'happy fire' for both occcasions, plus a good time for the insurgents to use it all as cover for something more sinister.

Just before 1630h local now, and still so bloody quiet, shy of a big crump in the distance a short time ago. I would imagine it killed many. One must have to checkout CNN.

Today, I was out and about, and it was traffic and work as per normal for all, or so it seemed. Spoke to a few locals who did not even mention it. Just another GHD.

Its cold here, the wind is sharp, and has a bite. It must be snowing to the north, it sure feels like it anyways.


Cheers,

Wes


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## zipperhead_cop (30 Dec 2006)

This looks like the closest thing to a video so far:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/arabic/avconsole/nb_wm_fs.shtml?nbram=1&nbwm=1&ws_storyid=061230_saddam_excution&ws_pathtostory=http://www.bbc.co.uk/arabic/avnews/avfile/2006/12/&bbram=1&bbwm=1

Good night, Skippy.  When you go forth to The Judgement, I hope all the earthly fun will have been worth it.


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## the 48th regulator (30 Dec 2006)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVk155U1mF0


This is pretty much the same, however a little better quality.

dileas

tess


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## 3rd Horseman (30 Dec 2006)

Good riddance to bad garbage. Lets hope this is the end and not the start of terror in Iraq.


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## armyvern (30 Dec 2006)

Let me just add that I hope that trap-door slammed his a$$ on his way out.


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## IN HOC SIGNO (30 Dec 2006)

The Librarian said:
			
		

> Let me just add that I hope that trap-door slammed his a$$ on his way out.



Hey they hung two of his cronies too!!


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## armyvern (30 Dec 2006)

IN HOC SIGNO said:
			
		

> Hey they hung two of his cronies too!!



I believe that the execution of his two cronies was post-poned!!


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## IN HOC SIGNO (30 Dec 2006)

The Librarian said:
			
		

> I believe that the execution of his two cronies was post-poned!!



According to the Halifax paper the two went too!

http://www.halifaxherald.com/Front/549941.html

"Also hanged were Saddam’s half-brother Barzan Ibrahim and Awad Hamed al-Bandar, the former chief justice of the Revolutionary Court. State-run Iraqiya television news announcer said "criminal Saddam was hanged to death and the execution started with criminal Saddam then Barzan then Awad al-Bandar."


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## Black Watch (30 Dec 2006)

Even though I think Hussein's death is a good thing, I would have rather killed him after all his trials were done. The just decides to carry on with his most "minor" crime and the US sentenced him to death so he couldn't speak on how he got those WMD


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## DSB (30 Dec 2006)

I still feel the spin doctors dropped the ball with Saddam.   He was a global villain, almost universally hated, but was transformed into the guy you felt sorry for. He will be viewed by some as a martyr…someone who was killed because of an unjust, American influenced, trial.

It would have been better if they had put him down in the dirt cave where they found him.


DSB


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## schart28 (30 Dec 2006)

good point...



			
				Black Watch said:
			
		

> The just decides to carry on with his most "minor" crime and the US sentenced him to death so he couldn't speak on how he got those WMD


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## the 48th regulator (30 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> Even though I think Hussein's death is a good thing, I would have rather killed him after all his trials were done. The just decides to carry on with his most "minor" crime and the US sentenced him to death so he couldn't speak on how he got those WMD



Ya,

You actually think they didn't squeeze him for any information?  Remember when nothing was heard of him immediatley after his capture??

dileas

tess


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## Kat Stevens (30 Dec 2006)

If there is an afterlife, I hope his 70 virgins all look like "Pat" from the old SNL sketches.   :-X


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## the 48th regulator (30 Dec 2006)

Kat Stevens said:
			
		

> If there is an afterlife, I hope his 70 virgins all look like "Pat" from the old SNL sketches.   :-X



He actually may like that....How about the church lady, however he finds that there is no lady under the steeple....

dileas

tess


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## Black Watch (30 Dec 2006)

the 48th regulator said:
			
		

> Ya,
> 
> You actually think they didn't squeeze him for any information?  Remember when nothing was heard of him immediatley after his capture??
> 
> ...


well...yeah. And so much for that democratic idea of a just and fair trial.


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## FredDaHead (30 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> well...yeah. And so much for that democratic idea of a just and fair trial.



What's the link between interrogating someone and them not having a fair trial?

I'm fairly certain we question criminals at home, too. Does that mean their trials are unfair, too? Maybe we should just let everyone go free, uh?


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## Bruce Monkhouse (30 Dec 2006)

He's just trying to get in his anti-American digs any pathetic way he can......


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## KevinB (30 Dec 2006)

The Iraqi's sentenced him and the Iraqi's carried it out.

  Anyone who has not set a foot on the ground in Iraq has no idea what the local feeling for him is -- there was so much celebratory fire one the news of his death.

Our neighbour had four family members killed at Sadam's behest, and most of the people in our town where singing praises to the executioners.


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## Black Watch (30 Dec 2006)

Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> He's just trying to get in his anti-American digs any pathetic way he can......


not at all...I'm just saying that Iraq is now a democratic country and should treat it's criminals with the same regard as in Canada or else. So, they should have not execute him now, but wait for the verdict of other trials.


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## Bruce Monkhouse (30 Dec 2006)

Why, so they could sentence him to ......extra death??

Why should they have the same court system as Canada?.........careful you don't strain yourself looking so far down at people.


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## LakeSup (30 Dec 2006)

You know what?  He showed bravery at the end....."pluck" as Mr Pierrepoint would have said.  He deserved this end but he showed dignity that I wouldn't expect from the guy, Rumsfeld, that shook his hand after he killed the Kurds, or the dancing arabs in Dearborm that gave him the keys to the city of Detroit in the1980s...... politics is so confusing, isn't it


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## Bruce Monkhouse (30 Dec 2006)

No, your post is.........what was that all about??


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## Fishbone Jones (30 Dec 2006)

WarmAndVertical said:
			
		

> You know what?  He showed bravery at the end....."pluck" as Mr Pierrepoint would have said.  He deserved this end but he showed dignity that I wouldn't expect from the guy, Rumsfeld, that shook his hand after he killed the Kurds, or the dancing arabs in Dearborm that gave him the keys to the city of Detroit in the1980s...... politics is so confusing, isn't it


Enough of the anti American crap. There's other web sites for you if you want to spout that shyte.


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## Babs087 (30 Dec 2006)

The sick F*ck got what he deserved.


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## zipperhead_cop (30 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> not at all...I'm just saying that Iraq is now a democratic country and should treat it's criminals with the same regard as in Canada or else. So, they should have not execute him now, but wait for the verdict of other trials.



I think they are trying to _fix_ Iraq, so why would you wish our broken legal system on them?  That is how it should work.  Sentence, swift appeal, execution.  None of this "25 years on death row" crap.  He needed to go, end of story.  
And the lack of hood thing wasn't being brave, it was just the last egotistical gesture from a guy that was way too into himself.  One more way to play to the cameras.


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## Colin Parkinson (30 Dec 2006)

WarmAndVertical said:
			
		

> You know what?  He showed bravery at the end....."pluck" as Mr Pierrepoint would have said.  He deserved this end but he showed dignity that I wouldn't expect from the guy, Rumsfeld, that shook his hand after he killed the Kurds, or the dancing arabs in Dearborm that gave him the keys to the city of Detroit in the1980s...... politics is so confusing, isn't it



No where near as confusing as your post. That wasn't pluck in his eye's that was realization.


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## zipperhead_cop (30 Dec 2006)

Colin P said:
			
		

> No where near as confusing as your post. That wasn't pluck in his eye's that was realization.



Maybe he meant "PLOCK" which is the sound his eyes made when the cord got tight?


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## Jacqueline (30 Dec 2006)

Is there a link to the gruesome Hussein videos. I think the media says they aren't suitable for public viewing.  ???


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## 1feral1 (30 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> The just decides to carry on with his most "minor" crime and the US sentenced him to death so he couldn't speak on how he got those WMD



Is this supposed to be funny? 

Minor crime? Mulitple murder is simply that!

The USA has nothing to do with the death sentence, and to try to argue this point is simply silly.


Wes


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## 1feral1 (30 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> well...yeah. And so much for that democratic idea of a just and fair trial.



Do you think Nuremburg was fair for the Nazi war criminals? Or would you symathise with the Nazis, claiming they did not get a fair trial? Iraq is a soverign nation, and things are quite screwed up here in many ways, they are still capable of conducting a trial for one of its own citizens. The outcome is NONE of our business.

I am beginning to think you want to stir the pot! 

Keep going, its your integerity, not ours........


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## RHFC_piper (31 Dec 2006)

Wesley (Over There) said:
			
		

> Do you think Nuremburg was fair for the Nazi war criminals? Or would you symathise with the Nazis, claiming they did not get a fair trial? Iraq is a soverign nation, and things are quite screwed up here in many ways, they are still capable of conducting a trial for one of its own citizens. The outcome is NONE of our business.
> 
> I am beginning to think you want to stir the pot!
> 
> Keep going, its your integerity, not ours........



War trials are always in the favour of the victor, as history is writen by the victors...  All the griping about fair trials means nothing when the outcome is the same for each charge. Debating over weather he dies for killing the Curds, or weather he dies for killing his own people, or for WMDs is just arguing semantics... Any way you slice it, he's dead... and he probably doesn't care why either way...  

And the world keeps turning.

(btw, wes.. this is my way of saying; I agree with you.:cheers


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## 1feral1 (31 Dec 2006)

RHFC_piper said:
			
		

> And the world keeps turning.



True mate. Life does goes on.

Too bad some take these moments and force their anti-US feelings. At times I really wonder just who's side they are really on, and I am quite happy they are not with us here.

Good on ya mate,

Wes


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## the 48th regulator (31 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> Even though I think Hussein's death is a good thing, I would have rather killed him after all his trials were done. The just decides to carry on with his most "minor" crime  and the US sentenced him to death so he couldn't speak on how he got those WMD





			
				Black Watch said:
			
		

> Even though I think Hussein's death is a good thing, I would have rather killed him after all his trials were done. The just decides to carry on with his most "minor" crime and the US sentenced him to death so he couldn't speak on how he got those WMD





> *What is Saddam charged with?*
> 
> Iraq's former dictator could face as many as a dozen trials. The first - the only one at present - is in many ways the simplest, and is expected to see Saddam charged with the premeditated murder, torture and forced expulsion and disappearance of the residents of one Shia Muslim town. These all fall under the category of crimes against humanity in international law.



http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,1250880,00.html

Yes very minor.

Trundle of, and bleat elsewhere champion of the right left.

dileas

tess


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## brihard (31 Dec 2006)

I have no problem at all with Saddam's death- and I'm one who publicly objects to capital punishment in most cases because of the propensity of the justice system to make errors. Saddam's death was long overdue, and despite my misgivings about capital punishment (again, based on judicial concerns, no moral or philosophical ones) I think the world is definitely better off without him.

That being said, his trial was a joke- yes, the outcome was foregone anyway, but nobody with respect for due process can give the trial itself much credibility. It was a kangaroo court in many ways.

Do I care? In this case, not particularly... But it's not a precedent I like, either. There was no need to rush to kill him when the credibility of the Iraqi judicial system would have been greatly aided by providing a fair and proper trial.


----------



## the 48th regulator (31 Dec 2006)

Brihard said:
			
		

> I have no problem at all with Saddam's death- and I'm one who publicly objects to capital punishment in most cases because of the propensity of the justice system to make errors. Saddam's death was long overdue, and despite my misgivings about capital punishment (again, based on judicial concerns, no moral or philosophical ones) I think the world is definitely better off without him.
> 
> That being said, his trial was a joke- yes, the outcome was foregone anyway, but nobody with respect for due process can give the trial itself much credibility. It was a kangaroo court in many ways.
> 
> Do I care? In this case, not particularly... But it's not a precedent I like, either. There was no need to rush to kill him when the credibility of the Iraqi judicial system would have been greatly aided by providing a fair and proper trial.



How was it a Kangaroo court?

What was unfair to the defendant, that he did not receive a fair judicial trial?

Please define what went wrong.

dileas

tess


----------



## brihard (31 Dec 2006)

the 48th regulator said:
			
		

> How was it a Kangaroo court?
> 
> What was unfair to the defendant, that he did not receive a fair judicial trial?
> 
> ...



Judge removed halfway through... Attorneys assassinated... Political interference... a 'special trial' that was unconstitutional under Iraqi law, defence team members excluded from the courtroom at times (though admittedly sometimes due to disruptive behaviour), defence team not allowed to present their entire case... My source for this is Amnesty International.

Like I said- no problem with the verdict or sentence, but due process was rather lacking at times.


----------



## zipperhead_cop (31 Dec 2006)

Brihard said:
			
		

> My source for this is Amnesty International.



Now that is a pile-on invitation.  I think it would suffice to say that world security is not high on their agenda.


----------



## 1feral1 (31 Dec 2006)

Brihard said:
			
		

> That being said, his trial was a joke- yes, the outcome was foregone anyway, but nobody with respect for due process can give the trial itself much credibility. It was a kangaroo court in many ways.



I'll take a chomp!

Amnesty Interantional, they're as bad as Al Jeezera! Great source  : This pack of lefty granola eaters can twist the truth to suit them again like AJ can or better! This is the same mob who refused a large $$$ donation for the 2004 tsunami from the NRA if I remember correctly, because the money came from.... you guessed it GUNS!

A joke, eh? Why don't you fly out and express your opinion to the MAJORITY of the population, and just see how far you get.

Its a dog eat dog world here pal (literally), and things don't work all happy and PC as they do in Canada. I guess if you spent some time here, and knew how things operated, understood their tribal system, way of life, and how the government works here, maybe, just maybe you'd understand.

The trial was no joke, it was serious stuff, with both the prosectution and defence being threatened and worse by both sunni and shiite. During the trial, I was less than 100 metres from it at times, and observed 'Ole mate' being whisked off in his Rhino, in convoy, and a sea of security to go with it. Thats just the nature of the beast. Don't forget, there is a civil war going on here, not some shoppers arguing over New Years sale prices in The Bay.

I find you comments an insult to the Iraqi people at large, and those of us who are endeavouring to assist in the rebuilding of a flattened nation, crushed by years of dictatorship, war and civil unrest. You have demonstrated your arrogance and ignorance simultaniously.

About the judge in quetion, he was not removed, but stepped down.


----------



## armyvern (31 Dec 2006)

Wesley (Over There) said:
			
		

> I'll take a chomp!



Nice chomp Wesley, and well-deserved at that. Imagine that? Coming from some-one whose experience comes from being there and going through it. Stay well.

Too bad that some people will always rely on MSM and other various interest groups for their "facts" and "data" on any given situation.


----------



## zipperhead_cop (31 Dec 2006)

The Librarian said:
			
		

> Nice chomp Wesley, and well-deserved at that. Imagine that? Coming from some-one whose experience comes from being there and going through it. Stay well.
> 
> Too bad that some people will always rely on MSM and other various interest groups for their "facts" and "data" on any given situation.



If you say that I can't get my world news from www.seanpenn.com anymore you are going to ruin my 2007


----------



## armyvern (31 Dec 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> If you say that I can't get my world news from www.seanpenn.com anymore you are going to ruin my 2007



Well Zipperhead, I hate to have to ruin your Holidays but......no you can't.


----------



## 1feral1 (31 Dec 2006)

Thanks Vern, but I knew this long before I got here, but being here puts the plan altogether. 

It just shytes me to tears how some people can be so niave listen, believe and easily lead by the limp wristed left. The word sheeple comes to mind.

Have a good and safe New Year,

Wes


----------



## KevinB (31 Dec 2006)

Wes -- funny how everyone here knows this...  But some of the more "knowledgeable on this issue" have never set a single foot inside the country.
  Spot on post BTW


----------



## gaspasser (31 Dec 2006)

IMHO, 16 years too late.     
 :sniper:  The Americans should have taken the shot back in 1991, they had the chance but it would have been "politically incorrect".

Case closed...I _believe_ justice (Islamic justice, an eye for an eye) has been served, and swiftly!
Close the book and move on to the 21st century.
One more despot out of the way.

my $0.02

Oh, and HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL.

 :cheers:


----------



## Black Watch (31 Dec 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Enough of the anti American crap. There's other web sites for you if you want to spout that shyte.


just because I criticize the way Saddam was juged doesn't mean i'm anti-american.


----------



## Black Watch (31 Dec 2006)

Brihard said:
			
		

> I have no problem at all with Saddam's death- and I'm one who publicly objects to capital punishment in most cases because of the propensity of the justice system to make errors. Saddam's death was long overdue, and despite my misgivings about capital punishment (again, based on judicial concerns, no moral or philosophical ones) I think the world is definitely better off without him.
> 
> That being said, his trial was a joke- yes, the outcome was foregone anyway, but nobody with respect for due process can give the trial itself much credibility. It was a kangaroo court in many ways.
> 
> Do I care? In this case, not particularly... But it's not a precedent I like, either. There was no need to rush to kill him when the credibility of the Iraqi judicial system would have been greatly aided by providing a fair and proper trial.


i think the same


----------



## Colin Parkinson (31 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> not at all...I'm just saying that Iraq is now a democratic country and should treat it's criminals with the same regard as in Canada or else. So, they should have not execute him now, but wait for the verdict of other trials.



Why should they use the Canadian system? Malaysia is a Islamic country and also has the death penalty, in fact most Islamic countries do, for such minor things like renouncing Islam, etc. Saddam had more justice than about 85% of the world's population gets. Time to get out and see the real world I think.


----------



## 1feral1 (31 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> i think the same



I never thought I'd say it, but 'good grief'!

Obviously. Seeking an auidence too? Trolling perhaps?

With your current train of thought, maybe its better to go and discuss it over a some warm beers and a few bongs with some of your lefty university friends. Together you can save the middle east, or the world for that matter. 

 :


----------



## Infanteer (31 Dec 2006)

Impressed, it was a very short time between verdict and sentence - we could take a few lessons from the Iraqi justice system.  Until then, maybe we can lend them guys like Olson and Bernardo to keep the gallows warm....


----------



## the_man06 (31 Dec 2006)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6Cr3Xh9s9Q


----------



## gaspasser (31 Dec 2006)

Morbid curiousity made me  want to watch that just to make sure he was no longer with us.
I think he got off easy.
 :threat:


----------



## Black Watch (31 Dec 2006)

Wesley (Over There) said:
			
		

> I never thought I'd say it, but 'good grief'!
> 
> Obviously. Seeking an auidence too? Trolling perhaps?
> 
> ...


i do not have to take your insults (I'm not trolling). I was just saying (perhaps I didn't made my point clear enough) that for a democratic country, they might have waitted for other trials to be carrid our. He was a human being after all. Yes yes, I know and I agree to those that say that he was a nasty bastard. I also think that it's not fair. Look at all those criminals, such as Milosevic and Pinochet, whom were not trialed for their murders. So please, stop making fun of different opinions.


----------



## aesop081 (31 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> Look at all those criminals, such as Milosevic and Pinochet, whom were not trialed for their murders. So please, stop making fun of different opinions.



Were those 2 people in Iraq ?  The Iraqis dealt wit Sadam in their own way ( which was alot more fair and just than what sadam ever gave anyone)....Who are you to criticize how they did it. Are you going to criticize the Roumanians too ?


----------



## zipperhead_cop (31 Dec 2006)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> i do not have to take your insults (I'm not trolling). I was just saying (perhaps I didn't made my point clear enough) that for a democratic country, they might have waitted for other trials to be carrid our. He was a human being after all. Yes yes, I know and I agree to those that say that he was a nasty bastard. I also think that it's not fair. Look at all those criminals, such as Milosevic and Pinochet, whom were not trialed for their murders. So please, stop making fun of different opinions.



So how many death sentences should he have?  What is the point?  Were you hoping for more judges, lawyers and prosecutors to get killed during the other trials?  Did you thing that there would be some good served by the expense and danger to the security detail that was employed for keeping him around?  Were you hoping that if somehow he got freed, and there would be a cool cat and mouse chase across Iraq that would make a great docu-drama?  Would his existence as a rallying point for some of the resistance be a good reason to keep him alive longer?  Are we so disdainful of the Iraqi people that we here in Castle North America should be able to look down our noses at them and decide what is good justice or not?  
This one isn't going to work out for you.


----------



## 1feral1 (1 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> He was a human being after all. Yes yes, I know and I agree to those that say that he was a nasty *******. I also think that it's not fair. Look at all those criminals, such as Milosevic and Pinochet, whom were not trialed for their murders. So please, stop making fun of different opinions.



A human being??? Please give it a break! He was a socialpath, and a murdering monster. He was found guilty in his own country, by his countrymen. Its none of our business. He was buried in a plywood coffin, carried in the back of a 1/4T small truck. Next you'll be whinging that he should have had a state funeral.

"Please stop making fun of different opinions" 

Are you for real?  

Do you want me to call you a whaaaaambulance?

BW, I am not making fun of anything, I am dead serious.

Time to let your balls drop pal, or at least give ém a squeeze for a shot of testosterone!

(shakes head)

Wes


----------



## KevinB (1 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> i do not have to take your insults (I'm not trolling). I was just saying (perhaps I didn't made my point clear enough) that for a democratic country, they might have waitted for other trials to be carrid our. He was a human being after all. Yes yes, I know and I agree to those that say that he was a nasty bastard. I also think that it's not fair. Look at all those criminals, such as Milosevic and Pinochet, whom were not trialed for their murders. So please, stop making fun of different opinions.



 :

Maybe if Milosevic and Pinochet where executed for their crimes the worl dwould be a better place.


----------



## armyvern (1 Jan 2007)

Infidel-6 said:
			
		

> :
> 
> Maybe if Milosevic and Pinochet where executed for their crimes the world would be a better place.



Unfortunately, Milosevic checked out naturally during his trial for war-crimes. There were probably some very disappointed people who would have loved to be the ones to spring his trap door.

 http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe/03/11/milosovic/


----------



## Big Red (1 Jan 2007)

Saddam deserved to die.  As far as I'm concerned the execution should have been done during GW1.

I think he should have stood trial for more of his crimes, but I see why the Iraqis wanted to get it over with (his execution).  He's been in custody for a couple years, it was time to put him down and let the Iraqis move on.

I've met several Iraqis who spent time being tortured under his system and also heard from others of friends/family that 'disappeared'.  An electrical engineer had both of his elbows repeatedly snapped so his arms were permanantly bent backwards.. This was part of his incarceration for daring to have a book on communism written in English.

Outside of his ruling circle and hometown, most people are glad he's dead.


----------



## GAP (2 Jan 2007)

Iraq's PM orders probe into leaked Saddam video  
Updated Tue. Jan. 2 2007 12:58 PM ET CTV.ca News Staff
Article Link

Iraq's prime minister has ordered an investigation into the circumstances surrounding Saddam Hussein's hanging after a damaging cell phone video of the event was leaked to the media. 

Sami al-Askar, a close political adviser to Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, told The Associated Press that the Iraqi leader had "ordered the formation of an investigative committee in the Interior Ministry to identify who chanted slogans inside the execution chamber and who filmed the execution and sent it to the media."

The unofficial video shows the former dictator moments before his death being taunted with chants of "Muqtada, Muqtada, Muqtada" -- referring to Muqtada al-Sadr, a Shiite cleric who controls one of Iraq's most violent religious militias. 

Al-Sadr is a major power behind the government of al-Maliki, a Shiite, who pushed for the speedy execution. 

Others can be heard shouting "Go to hell" and trading insults with Saddam before the metal trap door below him opens and he drops to his death. His body is then shown swinging from the rope with his neck clearly broken. 

The official video released by the Iraqi government shows a hangman talking to a composed Saddam as he placed the noose around his neck. There is no audio in that version and it does not show Saddam's actual death. 

Munqith al-Faroon, an Iraqi prosecutor who worked to convict Saddam of genocide, was among the small group of witnesses who saw the hanging. 

"Two top officials... had their mobile phones with them (at the execution). There were no mobile phones allowed at that time," he told AP. 
More on link


----------



## Black Watch (2 Jan 2007)

cdnaviator said:
			
		

> Were those 2 people in Iraq ?  The Iraqis dealt wit Sadam in their own way ( which was alot more fair and just than what sadam ever gave anyone)....Who are you to criticize how they did it. Are you going to criticize the Roumanians too ?


who am I? Well, I study foreign poluitics in Université de Montréal


----------



## Sig_Des (2 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> who am I? Well, I study foreign poluitics in Université de Montréal



Really? Well, maybe some would take you more seriously if you'd stayed at a Holiday Inn last night.

Their system did what it did. Saddam's dead, and he damned well deserved it. I never understood why we spent thousands of dollars on trials that result in multiple life sentences, or the Americans on multiple death sentences.

You can only kill the guy once. Quick and clean, which is more than can be said for many who were under his thumb.


----------



## aesop081 (2 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> who am I? Well, I study foreign *poluitics * in Université de Montréal



Well i'm sorry, i didnt realise that it gave you more insight into Iraqi justice than the Iraqi people themselves. I study political science as well, should i go over to the US now to tell them thier system is messed up or just wait for later?


----------



## observor 69 (2 Jan 2007)

cdnaviator said:
			
		

> Well i'm sorry, i didnt realise that it gave you more insight into Iraqi justice than the Iraqi people themselves. I study political science as well, should i go over to the US now to tell them thier system is messed up or just wait for later?





Just tell them now.   ;D


----------



## Trinity (2 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> who am I? Well, I study foreign poluitics in Université de Montréal



The difference between school and real life... are huge.

And I speak from experience  -  M.Div does not prepare you for real life in ministry.

Education is no substitute for practical experience.


----------



## daftandbarmy (2 Jan 2007)

According to this Spectator article, Saddam could have used a little more education...


Like Stalin, but more Stupid:
http://www.spectator.co.uk/online-edition/elsewhere/27139/like-stalin-but-more-stupid.thtml


----------



## George Wallace (2 Jan 2007)

daftandbarmy said:
			
		

> According to this Spectator article, Saddam could have used a little more education...
> 
> 
> Like Stalin, but more Stupid:
> http://www.spectator.co.uk/online-edition/elsewhere/27139/like-stalin-but-more-stupid.thtml



Not having a subscription, there is really little to read there.


----------



## daftandbarmy (2 Jan 2007)

Once more with feeling...

Like Stalin, but more stupid
Niall Ferguson


Only a minority of modern dictators have been executed for their crimes. The most bloodthirsty of all, Stalin and Mao, died in full possession of their powers, if not their faculties. Franco pulled off the same trick. Hitler cheated the hangman with a bullet in the bunker. Pol Pot lost power, but was never brought to justice and died in his bed, as did Idi Amin.

Slobodan Milosevic stood trial for his crimes, but died of a heart attack in March with 50 hours of testimony still to be heard. Augusto Pinochet, too, suffered the indignity of arrest; three weeks ago he also expired naturally before prosecution could even begin. Suharto is another fallen dictator who has avoided standing trial on the grounds of ill health. And let's not forget that dwindling band of dictators who are still alive and in power: Fidel Castro, Robert Mugabe and Muammar Gaddafi.

Dictators, by definition, have absolute power. For a dictator to end his life hanging from a rope, or facing a firing squad, therefore requires a rather rare combination of wickedness and stupidity: enough of the former to incur the hatred of his countrymen, enough of the latter to take on armies mightier than his own. Both these qualities Saddam Hussein possessed in abundance. That is why, in the wake of his execution at dawn yesterday morning, he deserves to be remembered as the Mussolini of Mesopotamia — if not the Ceausescu of Baghdad.

These were not, of course, Saddam's intended role models. Even before he came to power, he boasted to KGB agents in Iraq of the admiration he felt for Stalin. And the majority of his crimes were perpetrated in an authentically Stalinist spirit of paranoia and sadism. The atrocity for which Saddam Hussein was hanged — the murder in 1982 of 148 Shias in the town of Dujail — was only one of many murderous acts directed, like so many of Stalin's crimes, against supposedly unreliable ethnic groups.

As Stalin persecuted the Poles and Ukrainians of the Soviet Union, so Saddam hounded the Shias and Kurds of Iraq. Among his worst crimes was the so-called "Anfal" ("Spoils") campaign he launched against the latter in 1988. Thousands died as poison gas and other weapons were deployed against Kurdish towns like Halabja. Even more Kurds and Shias were killed in the wake of their 1991 revolt.

Saddam shared more than a few traits with his hero Stalin. Like Stalin, his origins were humble (he was a shepherd's son from Tikrit). Like Stalin, he was attracted as much to nationalism as to socialism, which made the Ba'ath Party his natural political home. Like Stalin, he had no fear of revolutionary violence; indeed, he was wounded in the leg during an abortive Ba'athist rising in 1959. And, like Stalin, he rose through the party ranks until powerful enough to establish a ruthless dictatorship.

As Deputy President after the 1968 Ba'athist coup, Saddam brought to Iraq an authentically Stalinist combination of modernisation and repression. Under his direction, revenues from the newly nationalised oil industry were poured into education and infrastructure. At the same time, however, he tightened his grip on both party and army. Having forced his way to the presidency in July 1979, he gathered together the leading members of the Ba'ath Party and read out the names of 68 people he suspected of disloyalty. Each was immediately arrested. After being tried for treason, in true Stalinist fashion, 22 of them were executed. A pattern of exemplary terror was soon established that owed as much to The Godfather as to "Koba the Dread" (Stalin's nickname). One minister who ventured to criticise Saddam was literally diced up and presented to his own widow.

The People's Army — the military wing of the Ba'ath Party — and the Mukhabarat (Department of Intelligence) were his chosen instruments for terrorising real and imagined opponents. The facade of legitimacy was provided by a classic personality cult. The gargantuan statues, the garish murals, the bombastic propaganda: all were taken from the 1930s Soviet playbook.

Yet Stalin would never have been as stupid as Saddam was — to pit his own army not once but twice against the most powerful military in the world.

The first mistake was perhaps understandable. Between 1980 and 1988, Saddam had tried and failed to annex the Iranian province of Khuzestan. Weighed down by war debts, he turned his eye to neighbouring Kuwait. The United States was at best equivocal in its support of the Kuwaitis in the months before Saddam's invasion; indeed, President George H W Bush seemed to Margaret Thatcher to be "going wobbly" even after Iraqi troops had crossed the border. Yet Saddam had fatally miscalculated. The collapse of Soviet power after the fall of the Berlin Wall meant that he could no longer play one superpower off against the other. Facing a clear-cut ultimatum from the UN Security Council, Saddam should have backed down. Instead he fought — and was thrashed.

Saddam's second and ultimately fatal blunder was downright stupid. In George W Bush he faced an antagonist very different in temper from the elder President Bush; a leader persuaded by his advisers that Saddam's overthrow was desirable in three ways: as retaliation for the terrorist attacks of 9/11 (though Iraqi complicity was conspicuous by its absence); as pre-emption before Saddam acquired weapons of mass destruction (though the evidence for their existence was woefully thin); and as proof of the superiority of democracy over dictatorship (though history offered no evidence that democracy could be imposed at gunpoint in the Middle East). Saddam had been Bush-whacked once; to suffer the same fate twice was worse than carelessness. Rather than confess that his WMD programmes had been abandoned in the 1990s, he continued to bluff, apparently ruling out the possibility that Bush Jnr was hell-bent on invading Iraq, with or without UN backing.

Today, of course, we can look back and understand Saddam's miscalculation better. In Saddam's eyes, as in the eyes of Bush Snr, the lesson of history was that the alternative to Saddam was civil war, not democracy. The US had stopped short of regime change in 1991 and had cynically left the Shias and Kurds to face Saddam's wrath, having initially urged them to rise up in revolt. All that has happened since 2003 has vindicated those who argued that, without Saddam's iron fist, Iraq would disintegrate, not democratise. The dictator's nemesis proved to be a president so naive that he did not even know the difference between Sunni and Shia.

The decline and fall of Saddam Hussein has been too tawdry to pass muster as a Shakespearian tragedy. Its protagonist was too crass a character, more Don Corleone than Coriolanus. This play has been part Marlowe, part Brecht: a cross between The Massacre at Paris and The Threepenny Opera. Like the Duc de Guise in Marlowe's bloodthirsty drama, Saddam was responsible for more than enough mass murder to justify his own violent end. Unlike Macheath in Brecht's musical, Saddam was not pardoned in the last minute before his execution, but his death seems to pose a version of Brecht's old question: "Who is the bigger criminal: he who robs a bank, or he who founds one?"

In the same spirit, we may ask ourselves who is the bigger criminal: he who tyrannises a people, or he who first bankrolls the tyrant — and then replaces his tyranny with anarchy?

For Saddam's career would have taken a very different course had he not, at vital times, received support as well as opposition from the United States. He was given training by the CIA in Egypt following the abortive coup of 1959. Though Iraq appeared to be drifting into the Soviet orbit in the early 1970s, Saddam won favour in Washington for purging the Iraqi Communists. After 1979, he received copious quantities of arms and aid to prosecute his war of aggression against Ayatollah Khomeini's Iran.

President Bush yesterday described Saddam's execution as "an important milestone on Iraq's course to becoming a democracy that can govern, sustain, and defend itself, and be an ally in the War on Terror". Another way of regarding it is as just the latest of tens of thousands of acts of vengeance perpetrated by Iraqis against other Iraqis since the American invasion.

The dictator is dead, hoist by the petard of his own Stalinist cruelty and Mussolini-like miscalculation. But Iraq's road towards democratic stability has a very long way still to run. If every milestone is an execution, it will be a hellish highway indeed.

Niall Ferguson is Laurence A Tisch Professor of History at Harvard University www.niallferguson.org


----------



## 1feral1 (2 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> who am I? Well, I study foreign poluitics in Université de Montréal



Bloody hell, its just 0645h here in Baghdaddy, its cold and crappy out, and you have made me laugh, not with you, but at you.

Do you want a medal or something? Feeling special are we? Does being a foreign POLUITICS 'student expert' give you a special qualification of the school of real life in real time in a real war? The media and people like you, are the main problem why we cannot prosecute this war the way it should be. 

What does being a student (and one with an attitude at that) have to do with the topic at hand? Keep your day job.

Before you go any further, if you can't even spell the subject you are taking, something is wrong.

Stop the press! Another live wire as entered the ring.


Shaking head and smiling,

Wes

EDITed for clarity


----------



## George Wallace (2 Jan 2007)

Well Wes.

Some READ about it, while others LIVE it.


----------



## Black Watch (2 Jan 2007)

Wesley (Over There) said:
			
		

> Bloody hell, its just 0645h here in Baghdaddy, its cold and crappy out, and you have made me laugh, not with you, but at you.
> 
> Do you want a medal or something? Feeling special are we?
> 
> ...


truly sorry if I'm francophone


----------



## Black Watch (2 Jan 2007)

what I find realy weird is that Saddam was kept under the cusdity of the Americans...


----------



## old medic (2 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> truly sorry if I'm francophone



You do not need to apologize for that here. 
We do have a spell checker feature to help you out however.


----------



## George Wallace (2 Jan 2007)

Perhaps we should revisit Capt. Travis Patriquin's notes: How to Win in Iraq
 and have a look at his presentation.


----------



## Black Watch (2 Jan 2007)

the point is...I have some problems making my point in English and people seem to find that funny...


----------



## 1feral1 (3 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> truly sorry if I'm francophone



Oh really, whats wrong with being a Canadian who speaks French?

If you wanna make it outside of  your home province, better learn the other official language.


Wes


----------



## Black Watch (3 Jan 2007)

I guess I was good enough to make my Bacc. at Concordia...I was just stating my opinions as someone who truly believes in a State of rights. I was not saying that he didn't deserve to die (I agree with all of you on that point). I just think that he could have been trialed for all of his crimes. Would have it made a difference? Maybe. Maybe we would have found out why the U.S. of A. (no offense to anyone here) did not intervened when the Kurds were being gazed (please do not tell me it's because of the International laws). I also wander if Saddam and his regime was that much of a threat to the international security. Please, I'm eager to know your opinions on that issue, but PLEASE, be respectfull this time. Thank you.


----------



## aesop081 (3 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> truly sorry if I'm francophone



So am i......what is your next excuse ? 



			
				Black Watch said:
			
		

> I guess I was good enough to make my Bacc. at Concordia...



Again...do you want a medal ?


> I was just stating my opinions as someone who truly believes in a State of rights.


What about a state of resposibilities and civic duties ? I am a big fan of those.


> I was not saying that he didn't deserve to die (I agree with all of you on that point). I just think that he could have been trialed for all of his crimes. Would have it made a difference?


He would still be dead...so i turn what difference does it make if he was executed now ? Justice delayed is also justice denied.



> Maybe we would have found out why the U.S. of A. (no offense to anyone here) did not intervened when the Kurds were being *gazed* GASED (please do not tell me it's because of the International laws).



I wont tell you its because of international law.... it was because of international politics...two different beast.  One day when you hit the real world you will figure this out.



> I also *wander* WONDER if Saddam and his regime was that much of a threat to the international security. Please, I'm eager to know your opinions on that issue, but PLEASE, be respectfull this time. Thank you.



Someone made the determination that he was a threat........and did so a long time ago.  Are you telling us that he was not.


----------



## Black Watch (3 Jan 2007)

"justice delayed, justice denied". Not true for all cases. Yes Saddam would be dead anyways. However, the Iraqui GVT did not have the right to judge Saddam for crimes against humanity. This term can only be used by the UN. 

When it comes to the international laws, the U.S. of A. broke them with their preventive war. Such attack is forbidden by the current laws. So, why the American GVT did not broke this rule back in '88 when those kurds were being killed?

Btw, I would like poeple to be a little more respectfull of others...


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## aesop081 (3 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> Btw, I would like poeple to be a little more respectfull of others...



I am not going to get into a pissing contest with you.  I havent seen anything so far in this thread that requires moderator action.  You can always use the "report to moderator" function to complain but ...i'm already here.

Stop with the anti-US retoric and make a GOOD case for yourself instead of regurgitating the same tired old crap.


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## Black Watch (3 Jan 2007)

again: criticizing some old foreing policies thignies that involves the U.S. of A. does not mean I'm a anti-us hippie. I do like and have respect the great American people.


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## George Wallace (3 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> "justice delayed, justice denied". Not true for all cases. Yes Saddam would be dead anyways. However, the Iraqui GVT did not have the right to judge Saddam for crimes against humanity. This term can only be used by the UN.
> 
> When it comes to the international laws, the U.S. of A. broke them with their preventive war. Such attack is forbidden by the current laws. So, why the American GVT did not broke this rule back in '88 when those kurds were being killed?



He was tried in Iraqi Court.  He was charged with murder.  Mass Murder.  What more do you want?  



			
				Black Watch said:
			
		

> Btw, I would like poeple to be a little more respectfull of others...



I am sorry that the sensibilities of a grown University student have been dished, after he was informed of the "Spell Check" function below the "Reply Box" with which he could correct many of his spelling errors and improve his post.  Perhaps respect for those who give good advice is also called for.

I see you have already been repremanded, but will still post to reiterate the use of the Spell Check function.


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## Meridian (3 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> I guess I was good enough to make my Bacc. at Concordia...



Must have been before the University Writing Test requirements.

Oh, wait, right. Because Concordia is in Quebec, the UWT can be written in French too, if you are a Francophone. Never mind that it is a unlingually English university.


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## daftandbarmy (3 Jan 2007)

Ummmm.... aren't we off topic here? 

How about them hangin' videos, eh?  I vote for tracking down Idi Amin and stretching his neck next.


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## Black Watch (3 Jan 2007)

daftandbarmy said:
			
		

> Ummmm.... aren't we off topic here?
> 
> How about them hangin' videos, eh?  I vote for tracking down Idi Amin and stretching his neck next.


so am I.


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## gaspasser (3 Jan 2007)

daftandbarmy said:
			
		

> Ummmm.... aren't we off topic here?
> 
> How about them hangin' videos, eh?  I vote for tracking down Idi Amin and stretching his neck next.


You mean to tell me that Idi is still alive after all these years?
Didn't he die of old age awhile back? 
But, I'm not bitter. ;D


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## daftandbarmy (3 Jan 2007)

Rats... you're right. I should have done my homework first.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idi_Amin

Still, there are a host of despots (e.g., Mugabe) out there that could be knocked off as a prelude to some good old fashioned nation building. Who knows? We might save millions of lives and billions of wasted $ in foreign aid. The way that Saddam was dealt with is a good precedent.


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## Colin Parkinson (3 Jan 2007)

Blackwatch, lets see Saddam attacked Israeli on several occasions, remember 91 when Saddam used Scud missiles against Israel even though it was not involved in the fight against him?

He got involved in a war against Iran that caused 1.2million deaths, invaded Kuwait and attacked Saudi Arabia. He oppressed his own people and used WMD's on them. He ignored UN sanctions, corrupted the oil for food program and the UN, spent money meant for medicine for his people building palaces. His nuclear program was only found out because of a defector, he was developing long range missiles in contravention of the UN sanctions. He caused two major environmetal disasters by draining the swamps so they could kill the Marsh Arabs and destroying the oil fields. He caused the infastructure of Iraq to be destroyed so he could retain power.

Have I missed anything? Do I have a problem with him being hanged, just wished they would have been able to do it in 1991.


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## 1feral1 (3 Jan 2007)

Black Watch said:
			
		

> 1. "justice delayed, justice denied". Not true for all cases. Yes Saddam would be dead anyways. However, the Iraqui GVT did not have the right to judge Saddam for crimes against humanity. This term can only be used by the UN.
> 2. When it comes to the international laws, the U.S. of A. broke them with their preventive war. Such attack is forbidden by the current laws. So, why the American GVT did not broke this rule back in '88 when those kurds were being killed?



Response to your para 1 - How old were you in '88? Do you remember it, I sure do. I have even served with a guy from that Kurdish vill, who got out hours before, and watched this demise from a near by hill. He was only 9 yrs old at the time. 

The Iraqi government had a trial for one of THEIR citizens who was found guilty and was hanged. The US had nothing to do with his trial or its outcome. To suggest otherwise is fanning a conspiricy rumour, nothing more. The US Forces only held Saddam for security reasons.

WTF! Since when has the UN had such exclusive rights to that phrase? You don't have a clue, and trying to make you understand is like beating my head against a brick wall. I just won't get through. 

Response to your para 2 - You are now irritating me beyond a joke, as for respect, you are showing none for us here. We are here in Iraq, and in the middle of a most dirty war. Whinging and bitching about the issues you have brought forth does nothing but inflame the issue. Your are part of the overall problem, not the solution.

More anti US propaganda spewing from your mouth. If you want, come over here and bat for the otherside's media groups. You'll fit like a glove. Ya, you know the guys, who bomb, torture and kill their own kind, ya, the ones that supported Saddam, and the Baath Party.

Its a bigger picture (iraq is just a small piece in a big jigsaw) than your textbook student mentality can even comprehend. Lets prosecute this war the right way (more troops and media restrictions), get on with it, meet our goals, and leave when its the right time, when this horrible hellhole of a place can stand on its own, and only then.

I, along with countless thousands of US and Coalition Forces are here, and quite frankly, it really pisses me off with 'Alpha Hotel' shyte disturbers of your calibre gobbing off when they know SFA about the truth and the facts at the pointy end, aside from what they are told by their professors and read in certain media groups. Meanwhile here in Shyteland, we cop it, well you discuss this on here, warm, happy, fat and 21. Eating pizza and sleeping in a warm bed, when your only worry is "gee did I plug my car in, or it won't start and I'll be late for school".

Either your trolling for an audience, seeking reaction, or you have a mental problem.

Your credibility is shot with me, and your just wasting bandwith on a good thread.

Proud of yourself?

The only thing you have succeeded in is raising my BP!


Wes


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## JesseWZ (3 Jan 2007)

I was under the impression that the trials Saddam was sentenced in were for Mass murder; and the ones regarding War-Crimes/Crimes Against Humanity were to take place later. Therefore Iraq did what any nation does when it has a criminal; introduces him to the Justice System. 
UN intervention (hypothetically speaking if they were the only authority for War Crimes/ Crimes against Humanity) should not be required for a "domestic" Iraqi trial; dictator or not right?

Edit: I realise my grammar is probably terrible. Don't worry school resumes on Thursday.
Edited again to try and fix comma splices and other irritating little things...


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## armyvern (3 Jan 2007)

JesseWZ said:
			
		

> I was under the impression that the trials Saddam was sentenced in were for Mass murder, and the ones regarding War-Crimes/Crimes Against Humanity were to take place later. Therefore Iraq did what any nation does when it has a criminal; introduces him to the Justice System. UN intervention (hypothetically speaking if they were the only authority for War Crimes/ Crimes against Humanity) should not be required for a "domestic" Iraqi trial, dictator or not right?



Correct and BINGO!! He was tried and convicted and sentenced by fellow Iraqis. 

Edited to add:

I'll figure these new buttons out yet!!


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## KevinB (3 Jan 2007)

FWIW -- the US Mil guarded Sadam for several reasons primary being.
1) His safety
2) Safety of the guards

The Iraqi MOI has enough problems internally and externally.

IMHO IT WOULD BE CRIMINAL at this junction to turn over the entire of Iraq to Iraqi's.  Much like Africa in the 60's and 70's, the people have not developed enough to be able to administrate themselves in a moral or competant manner.  In Africa that was due to ruling class oppression, the same as here -- the rule of law is run by who has the largest militia.  
  I can only hope that Sadam's death will prove a turning point here -- and that both the Iraqi gov't and the coalition will seek to stamp out the instigators of the violence.

I'd start targetting the militia leaders and make it unhealthy to run a group of thugs -- thats just me...
Surgical Violence does have a place in this society.


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## 1feral1 (3 Jan 2007)

Infidel-6 said:
			
		

> Surgical Violence



Surgical violence, I have learned a new phrase for today, ha (and I agree - 'surgical' is better than 'complete/total' so far in this case anyways).

Stay safe Kevin,

Cheers,

Wes


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## zipperhead_cop (3 Jan 2007)

I am out of my lane with international law, but I would imagine that if someone really felt they needed to prosecute Sadam for the rest of his crap, they could.  Just do the trial ex-parte and base it on facts.  
Why?  No good reason I can think of, unless it would bring closure to the victims or help them get some sort of restitution.  
Of course, if that did happen it would be for some stated candy coated reason, but in reality would actually  be for the purpose of paying some UN committee made up of insider toadies an ungodly amount of money to look into it for a few years.


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## Remius (3 Jan 2007)

Now maybe i got this wrong or the media did (likely).  is there not a law that prevents anyone 70 and older from being executed in Iraq?  I thought that I heard that.  And was Saddam close to that age?  69, turning 70 in April?

Wes?  Someone else who might be better informed than me?

So if all this is true then Justice (and I don't mean the law) would not have been served in the end by bringing his other crimes to trial (long long process, read: years) as he would have escaped his ultimate fate due to a technical loophole.

So, Blackwatch, although your sentiment about bringing his other crimes to trial is not lost on me (it would have been nice but not practical), the need for justice is greater in this case (for me anyway) than any sense of state rights or what not.

Anyways, about the videos, does not do any good for anyone.  A shame really.  We have to be above that kind of crap.  I for one will not be going to see that s**t on You Tube.  I'm glad he's gone but I don't need to see that.


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## geo (3 Jan 2007)

There are plenty of historical precedents for Trials "in absentia".

If a gov't wants to go to the time & trouble of going thru the process of a trial, there are enough witnesses still alive who would be prepared to testify.  I think that there is merit in conducting trials for people like Gen Pinochet AND Sadam Hussein.  Villify him or make a saint out of him - it's better to put all your cards on the table now instead of having a martyr in the history books...........


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## 1feral1 (3 Jan 2007)

Sorry mate, I don't know about that execution law for 70yr olds.

Around here, there really is no law, that I've seen anyways. At a street corner, at a shop, kitted out to the max, and with our carbines, we  are the LAW, or at least they think so. Me, I just want to make it back to our compound in one piece. In brief, just thinking at a glance now, I know what it is like to have bullets pass close (05 Nov), or to be < 50metres from 122mm HE Katyusha rockets slamming in (21 Dec). Memorable, but NOT pleasant! Or to hear the many daily and at times nightly multiple VBIEDs/IEDs, ongoing firefights at check points, etc. It is mayhen at the best of times, and thats in Baghdad, a city of over 4 million! Imagine Toronto or Sydney in such carnage.

In time it will change here, but not to our expectations we would like to see.

A western presence will be here for the foreseeable years to come. 

As for the videos of the hanging (Al Jezeera called in a lynching today), the MEDIA is really fanning the flames on this, blowing it way out, and any casualties from their disgusting behaviour, well the blood is on their hands. CNN is guilty as Al Jeezera. Shame on them all!

So Saddam was taunted. So what? Look what he did for over 2 decades. Now look at every exectuion in the US for example, the high profile ones get the news. You know the placcards 'Burn Bundy Burn' brings back memories. Ya too are the pro-lifers outside the prisons also. Both sides expressing themelves. Thats what happened here, and with something new called FREEDOM (they don't really know how to handle itin my opinion), its more intense.

The videos are in bad taste, but it tells the world that yes he was hanged, and is DEAD. Seems many islamic countries which are pro-sunni are blaming the US. Anything to get back at them.

Over here, middle eastern mentality seems all to be based on revenge and centuries old hatred. Its tribal here. Strange customs very foreign to us. Kind of like a 13th century mentality in the 21st century. Scarey times ahead for us all, and Canada like other western nations is not immune.

I believe in time, things wills settle, and even now, they might quiet down, as he's gone now. As for being martyred, only by the extremists, like Hitler and his followers, many today who are alive 60+yrs after the war ended in Europe. For the average guy here just wants to have a job, watch TV, smoke some heesh, play soccer, and be with his family.

Now, if the lefty do gooders whinge about these videos, consider Al Zahraa TV (channel 006 if you are in the area), for those of you that have not heard, its a 24hr Iraqi pro-insurgent propaganda based station which continiously broadcasts the IED VBIED, mortar and rocket attacks, plus sniping too, even with a Juba sniper special with the most obcene graphic headshots you could imagine on US Forces. So thats 24hrs a day, promoting hatred and showing graphic killing, as opposed to a simple hanging which lasts only a matter of seconds.

Both are wrong, but which is worse. You decide.

Cheers from yet another cold clear night in Baghdaddy,

Wes


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## GAP (3 Jan 2007)

Numerous TV programs commented on the 70 year old exemption law.


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## Remius (3 Jan 2007)

Wes, I totally blame the media for promoting the video.  Just like when they showed all those beheadings.  Gruesome.  I really don't care how he was treated, but some people will, and they'll exploit it to the max.  I'm not really whining about it (ok maybe a little) in so far as how he was treated before he died, but more on the belief that it will cause more unecessary bloodshed in the name of someone best forgotten. 

Oh, and thanks for some of the descriptions of how it really is.  Puts things in perspective sometimes for us living in the comforts of home.


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## Yrys (3 Jan 2007)

Crantor said:
			
		

> someone best forgotten.



My opinion is that in a cell , he would have been easier to forget. Now, I'm sure
he will be seen has a martyr by many.


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## 1feral1 (3 Jan 2007)

Yrys said:
			
		

> My opinion is that in a cell , he would have been easier to forget. Now, I'm sure
> he will be seen has a martyr by many.



I respect your view.

As long as he was alive he gave hope and inspiration to the baddies, as one day they thought he'd be back in the saddle. Now gone, I think it will be different, over time anyways. The short term it could be nasty and more so if the media keeps playing their game of ratings. Thats my gut feel, but I might be wrong. Time will tell, eh. At least there is hope now, and hopefully dispair will gradually fade out, although there will always be unrest here, as thats the nature of the beast when it comes to middle eastern mentality, again in my opinion.  

Regards, now I got to get to my movie 'The Lord of War". Orval Redenbacher's buttery popcorn on stand by (thanks to my sister Sandy in Regina, she sent a BOX of 24 packets for my Platoon) .... smells like a theatre in here. A theatre within a theatre, ha!

Wes


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## KevinB (3 Jan 2007)

Martyr -- :  not likely

Sunni Whabbist extremists hated him 
Shia HATE him
Iranain Shia's hate him

The only ones he gets a bit of sympathy are from Baathists -- and thus Syrian.

Some may try to use him as a Martyr -- but he was not a well liked guy anwhere around here.

FWIW I think we should carpet bomb the triangle of death too...


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## Trinity (3 Jan 2007)

Infidel-6 said:
			
		

> FWIW I think we should carpet bomb the triangle of death too...



But... then we actually do become the great Satan they claim we are.


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## RHFC_piper (3 Jan 2007)

I find it interesting that they (the people in Iraq who Saddam brainwashed tricked forced in to and now have the stockholm syndrome, through kind words and actions, got to like and revere him) Protested his death... after the fact...  I can't think of a sutable analogy other than "that makes as much sense as protesting the death penalty after it's been executed." :brickwall:

What were they chanting? "Bring him back, bring him back!"

The sad part is; he will be looked at as a martyr by all those who dislike the people he was killed for killing (it makes sense... kinda).  He said, just before dying, that he was willing to die for 'his people' and 'his beliefs'... you know someone (if not many someones) will see that as a call to arms and a banner to fight under.  And if that doesn't do it, the video of him (and indirectly, his 'people') being mocked before his death might do it.

Either way, just trial or not, protests or not, taunting or tickling, He's Dead..  Done deal.  



Besides, look out the window... Worlds still turning...  people die every day, and some of them (by that I mean most of them) are a bigger loss to the world than that goon (Saddam)


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## KevinB (3 Jan 2007)

RHFC_piper said:
			
		

> I find it interesting that they (the people in Iraq who Saddam brainwashed tricked forced in to and now have the stockholm syndrome, through kind words and actions, got to like and revere him) Protested his death... after the fact...  I can't think of a sutable analogy other than "that makes as much sense as protesting the death penalty after it's been executed." :brickwall:
> 
> What were they chanting? "Bring him back, bring him back!"
> 
> ...



WTF?

 Dude  no one anywhere near me is suffering any sort of remorse for him.

Chanting was for 'ol Sadr (who should join Sadam for a dirt nap)


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## RHFC_piper (3 Jan 2007)

Infidel-6 said:
			
		

> WTF?
> 
> Dude  no one anywhere near me is suffering any sort of remorse for him.
> 
> Chanting was for 'ol Sadr (who should join Sadam for a dirt nap)



The news was showing Iraqi's (and others around the world) protesting the execution the day after Saddam was hanged.  
(it wasn't a slag at you, just bringing up the silliness of protesting something that already happened and can't be reversed.)

It's all good... and like I said; either way he's dead... Karma can be a ***** sometime.


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## armyvern (3 Jan 2007)

RHFC_piper said:
			
		

> The news was showing Iraqi's (and others around the world) protesting the execution the day after Saddam was hanged.
> (it wasn't a slag at you, just bringing up the silliness of protesting something that already happened and can't be reversed.)
> 
> It's all good... and like I said; either way he's dead... Karma can be a ***** sometime.



Didn't the news also happen to mention that most of them were protesting because the *democratically elected Government of Iraq chose* to execute this convicted dictator on the 1st day of Eid? Most were not protesting his death, rather it's timing; and, _in that_, there is a huge difference.


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## Colin Parkinson (3 Jan 2007)

Out of 23 million people, the media should be able to find somebody protesting about anything. Hell even his family and clan must number in the thousands.


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## geo (3 Jan 2007)

Iran, Syria and everyone who has an axe to grind against the great satan (USA) will be crying the death of the martyr......... regardless of their real views of the man.

The enemy of my enemy is not my enemy.

So while Iran hated Sadam's guts, they have a passion hating the USA and that trumps Sadam any day.


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## RHFC_piper (3 Jan 2007)

The Librarian said:
			
		

> Didn't the news also happen to mention that most of them were protesting because the *democratically elected Government of Iraq chose* to execute this convicted dictator on the 1st day of Eid? Most were not protesting his death, rather it's timing.



True... Good point... But most of the media I saw on the topic focused more on the 'Saddam Supporters' and less on Eid.  

I fully understand protesting an execution on a religious day, and even protesting an execution before it happens (weather on religious or 'fair tiral' grounds... or just the 'don't kill and human' grounds), but those few who protested, specifically, Saddams death (and there were a few in Tikrit) seem kind of, well, foolish... or better yet, counter productive.

Frankly, in my own oppinion, I find debating his death quite pointless.  He was a thug, he got ousted, the people he ruled over turned on him (for the most part), he was a refugee in his own country, he was caught, tried by the people he oppressed, and hanged for being a blight on humanity (or for whatever other reason make people sleep better at night)... Karma got him but good.

My point:  Argue the death of people who didn't deserve to die but did unjustly (I can think of a few thousand thanks to Saddam), don't argue the death of a tyranical dictator who brought nothing to the benifit of humanity besides thinning the herd in a very grotesque manner.  I, for one, am happy the world is rid of one more useless waste of oxygen (taking a deep breath of what could have been his air) and I don't really care how he died, as long as he's dead... he could have died in a mugging and it wouldn't have changed a thing.

wow... no more ranting for me...


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## KevinB (3 Jan 2007)

RHFC - I don't get Western news -- all I get is a "interpreted" version of the local news, and a shit load of celebratory fire.
  I guessed I missed where your comments where comming from.


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## armyvern (3 Jan 2007)

Infidel-6 said:
			
		

> RHFC - I don't get Western news -- all I get is a *"interpreted" * version of the local news, and a crap load of celebratory fire.
> I guessed I missed where your comments where comming from.



You mean just like the kind of interpreted news that the MSM puts out over here for RHFC_Piper and the rest of us to see?? Go figure eh?


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## Bruce Monkhouse (3 Jan 2007)

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/2007/01/03/3154040-ap.html
  
Iraqi official arrested over Saddam execution video

By QASSIM ABDUL-ZAHRA
    
BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) — The person believed to have recorded Saddam Hussein’s raucous execution on a cell phone camera was arrested Wednesday, an adviser to Iraq’s prime minister said. 

A U.S. military spokesman, meanwhile, said the United States would have handled the execution differently had it been in charge. 
The adviser to Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media, did not identify the person. But he said it was “an official who supervised the execution” and who is “now under investigation.” 

“In the past few hours, the government has arrested the person who made the video of Saddam’s execution,” the adviser said. 
Iraqi state television broadcast an official video of Saturday’s hanging, which had no audio and never showed Saddam’s actual death. But the leaked cell phone video showed the deposed leader being taunted in his final moments, with witnesses shouting “Go to hell!” before he dropped through the gallows floor and died. 

The unruly scene was broadcast on Al-Jazeera television and was posted on the Internet, prompting a worldwide outcry and big protests among Iraq’s minority Sunnis, who lost their preferential status when Saddam was ousted in the U.S.-led invasion of March 2003.  
“If you are asking me: ‘Would we have done things differently?’ Yes, we would have. But that’s not our decision. That’s the government of Iraq’s decision,” said Maj. Gen. William Caldwell, a U.S. military spokesman. 

He said that Saddam was “dignified” and “courteous” as he was transferred from US military control to Iraqi custody before he was executed. 
“He spoke very well to our military police, as he always had, and when getting off at the prison site he said farewell to his interpreter; he thanked the military police squad,” Caldwell said. 
Some Sunni Muslims have taken to the streets in mostly peaceful protests in the days since Saddam’s execution, mourning their former leader and protesting the manner in which he was executed. 

Al-Maliki on Tuesday ordered his Interior Ministry to investigate the video — who made it and how it reached television and Web sites for public viewing. 
On Wednesday, an Iraqi prosecutor who was also present at the execution denied a report that he had accused National Security Adviser Mowaffak al-Rubaie of possible responsibility for the leaked video. 

“I am not accusing Mowaffak al-Rubaie, and I did not see him taking pictures,” Munqith al-Faroon, a prosecutor in the case that sent Saddam to the gallows, told The Associated Press. 
“But I saw two of the government officials who were ... present during the execution taking all the video of the execution, using the lights that were there for the official taping of the execution. They used mobile phone cameras. I do not know their names, but I would remember their faces,” al-Faroon said in a telephone interview. 

The prosecutor said the two officials were openly taking video pictures, which are believed to be those which appeared on Al-Jazeera satellite and a Web site within hours of Saddam’s execution. 
The New York Times on Wednesday reported that al-Faroon told the newspaper “one of two men he had seen holding a cell phone camera aloft to make a video of Mr. Hussein’s last moments up to and past the point where he fell through the trapdoor was Mowaffak al-Rubaie, Mr. Maliki’s national security adviser.” 
The Times said it had been unable to reach al-Rubaie for comment. AP also could not reach him Wednesday. His secretary said the security adviser, a close aide to al-Maliki, was in Najaf and would not return until later. 

Al-Faroon said there were 14 Iraqi officials, including himself and another prosecutor, as well as three hangmen present for the execution. All the officials, he said, were flown by U.S. helicopter to the former military intelligence facility where Saddam was put to death in an execution chamber used by his own security men for years. 
The prosecutor said he believed all mobile phones had been confiscated before the flight and that some of the officials’ bodyguards, who arrived by car, had smuggled the camera phones to the two officials he had seen taking the video pictures. 

Some of the last words Saddam heard, according to the leaked cell phone video, were a chant of “Muqtada, Muqtada, Muqtada,” a reference to Muqtada al-Sadr, the radical anti-American Shiite cleric, whose Mahdi Army militia is believed responsible for many killings that have targeted Sunnis and driven many from their homes. 

Al-Sadr’s father was killed by Saddam. The militant cleric is a key al-Maliki backer


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## geo (3 Jan 2007)

Even money that these guys had obtained orders for the recordings - before going in for the necktie party.


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## Yrys (5 Jan 2007)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6233951.stm



> Hanging 'makes martyr of Saddam'
> 
> The circumstances of the hanging of Saddam Hussein have turned the former
> Iraqi leader into a martyr, Egypt's President Hosni Mubarak has said.


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## RHFC_piper (6 Jan 2007)

Not going to be a Martyr, eh?

No supporters, eh?

ok..

Libya to build statue of Saddam
Link to Article

[quote author=news.bbc.co.uk]
*Libya has said it will build a statue of former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein, executed in Baghdad on Saturday.* 

It would show him standing on the gallows with a Libyan resistance leader who fought Italian occupation, executed in 1931, Libya's Jana news agency said. 

Libya declared three days of mourning after Saddam Hussein's death and cancelled public celebrations around the Eid religious holiday. 

_more on link_
[/quote]

Seems Lybia likes Saddam.


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## KevinB (6 Jan 2007)

Dude -- Libya is its own thing -- when he rolled over on Iran, Pakistan and NK right after 911 to the US about the nuclear stuff, ol Col. G lost all his street cred.  I view this as more wailing from his soap box -- more of a posturing issue than anything real


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## Colin Parkinson (8 Jan 2007)

I sure Iraq could sell them a few statues, they likely have warehouses full of them!


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## daftandbarmy (8 Jan 2007)

A slim guidebook for executing a deposed ruler - International Herald Tribune

http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/01/07/news/execute.php


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## muskrat89 (8 Jan 2007)

I hadn't given this whole issue much thought. As usual, Krauthammer makes some good points. Shared under the provisions of the Fair Dealings...etc.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/04/AR2007010401347.html



> The Hanging: Beyond Travesty
> 
> By Charles Krauthammer
> Friday, January 5, 2007; Page A17
> ...


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