# Shearwater Old Runway 16H/34H Recent News



## Tulsa01 (17 Jan 2016)

Back in 2009 DND bought back land that it had sold for redevelopment in 2002 at 12 Wing Shearwater. The land contains the long defunct runway 16H/34H. Soon after DND retook ownership there was word that the runway would be restored for future operations but nothing has been heard in years. Has anybody heard anything recently?


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## Baz (17 Jan 2016)

16H/34 is the current helo runway which is active and inside the fence line.   The old 16/34 is east of it... there is a fence around it but it's part of formation Halifax not 12 Wing (although formation Halifax couldn't give a hoot what is actually 12 Wing; to them the whole place is just a dumping group fo random ship parts).

The runway was required at the direction of Peter Mackay because a bunch of retired guys that didn't have anything better to do convinced him it was a good idea... that at some point we may need a full Sea Land Air embarkation point.  Debate amongst yourselves whether that is true.

The number I heard is $100 million to restore it; I can't remember if that includes reinstating some type of instrument approach.  No money for that has ever been set aside (remember, this is the same Shearwater which is losing the O'Mess building as they didn't put anything into that either).


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## Baz (17 Jan 2016)

Note on my last... Although 100M is what I remember,  it seems a tad high...


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## SupersonicMax (17 Jan 2016)

That's $10 000/ft of runway.  You need to build the drainage, build the runway, the lighting systems and an ILS on both sides capable of CAT II (runway certerline lighting).  I'd say it would be pretty close to that!  Just the runway itself would run you at 3-4K/ft.


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## Baz (17 Jan 2016)

Again,  from memory...

They surveyed 11/29, the old 16/34, and 16H/34H, and none are suitable for an ILS.   Hence the PAR,  which is hard to keep spares for.  But you still need the lighting.

Cyclone has no TACAN,  so that will go too.  Plan was a precision and non-precision GPS, but again, you still need the lighting.

Most of the drainage is there, but the surface isn't great.  I was on it last summer during one of the R/C days.

Moot discussion for now, because without the Big Honkin' Ship what is it needed for.  By the way, I'm at the sled hill looking at the building that was built for SCTF and never occupied as such; how'd that go?

Shearwater's a heliport and Halifax is jut up the road if you need a real airport.  Greenwood's not far away if you need a military airport (I used to know the exact bearing and range).


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## Oldgateboatdriver (17 Jan 2016)

The "Big Honking Ship" were amphibs, not carriers. 

We would not have gotten fixed wings to go on them anyway, just more helos, but with a more greenish hue  [.


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## Tulsa01 (17 Jan 2016)

Thanks for the clarification! I was truly optimistic when DND bought it back. It's sad to know that it will probably just end up continue deteriorating in the years ahead, then getting sold for redevelopment once again. It would be amazing to see fixed wing military flying return to Shearwater, Borden,  Edmonton/Namao etc... Just unrealistic these days.


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## ff149 (17 Jan 2016)

Sorry, wrong information.


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## Baz (17 Jan 2016)

Oldgateboatdriver said:
			
		

> The "Big Honking Ship" were amphibs, not carriers.
> 
> We would not have gotten fixed wings to go on them anyway, just more helos, but with a more greenish hue  [.



Know that...

Part of (a big part of?) the justification given to get the runway back was that the ship and "marine air wing" could be at Shearwater, and the Army somewhere where there was a training area.  The runway would allow the Army to fly in and mate up.

I never said anything of it was well thought through...


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## Baz (17 Jan 2016)

ff149 said:
			
		

> There were a couple of rumors floating around about Shearwater and the runway. When the bought the land back I had heard that it was partly because the developers that had bought the land wanted to put condos or a development and it would be in line with the radar, not sure if they meant actually in the danger zone or causing a dead zone. The last rumor I had heard was that Shearwater was going to become a detachment of Greenwood and would no longer belong to CFB Halifax. Again not sure what parts of Shearwater would be transferred.
> 
> Once again these are just rumors that I have heard, although I have heard of the last one from several different people.



I wouldn't put much stock in the first rumour as the land never left Canada Lands Corporation; that is why it was so easy to get back.  Plus, the airspace is still controlled, so it's hard to put whatever you want.

There was a developer farther north that went right up to the bottom of the control zone, and then stuck something on the roof and couldn't get an occupancy permit.

Quite a while ago a parcel between Imperial Refinery and Portland Estates opened up and Air Command (at the time) had it bought to prevent encroachment on the old 16/34 (Formation Halifax could never have rubbed those two clues together).  Maybe that is the source of the rumour?  I don't know what has happened to that parcel.

As for Greenwood that doesn't make any sense; unless to get rid of Commander 12 Wing and make Shearwater and Pat Bay both detachments (of Greenwood and Comox).  Which would even further screw MH.  So, it's probably what they'll do.


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## Baz (17 Jan 2016)

Tulsa01 said:
			
		

> Thanks for the clarification! I was truly optimistic when DND bought it back. It's sad to know that it will probably just end up continue deteriorating in the years ahead, then getting sold for redevelopment once again. It would be amazing to see fixed wing military flying return to Shearwater, Borden,  Edmonton/Namao etc... Just unrealistic these days.



 Just wondering what fixed Wing it would be?

Some of us would just be happy if we could help get the Cyclone into service; and then maybe we could could get the RCAF and/or the RCN to give a hoot about MH?


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## Tulsa01 (17 Jan 2016)

Nothing permanently stationed, I think it could be a decent aerial logistics hub for the CF in the immediate Halifax area. I know there's a video on YouTube of a Globemaster landing on the new 16H/34H in 2010 I think. But with the old 16/34 rehabilitated you could accommodate something that can't land as shortly as a C-17 or C-130.


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## McG (17 Jan 2016)

Oldgateboatdriver said:
			
		

> The "Big Honking Ship" were amphibs, not carriers.
> 
> We would not have gotten fixed wings to go on them anyway, just more helos, but with a more greenish hue  [.


But the embarked companies might rotate in and out on a Polaris.

If one really wants, they can invent a need for that runway to support fixed wing aircraft.


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## Tulsa01 (17 Jan 2016)

Bingo


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## dapaterson (17 Jan 2016)

We pay too much to maintain unnecessary infrastructure as it is.  No need to add an airfield of dubious utility when there are ample other options in the area; it's not like Stanfield airport is overloaded.


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## McG (17 Jan 2016)

dapaterson said:
			
		

> We pay too much to maintain unnecessary infrastructure as it is.  No need to add an airfield of dubious utility when there are ample other options in the area; it's not like Stanfield airport is overloaded.


When have we let "need" get in the way of "want"?


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## Eye In The Sky (18 Jan 2016)

ff149 said:
			
		

> The last rumor I had heard was that Shearwater was going to become a detachment of Greenwood and would no longer belong to CFB Halifax. Again not sure what parts of Shearwater would be transferred.



There's been no talk about that at all from anyone I know at ZX.  Stuff like that would normally be expected to circulate the breezeway and the like.

I guess they could do it, re-write CFOOs and such but...to what end?  I don't see any pro's to that at all...while MH and LRP are maritime air assets, the 2 communities have different agendas and missions.


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## Baz (18 Jan 2016)

Tulsa01 said:
			
		

> Nothing permanently stationed, I think it could be a decent aerial logistics hub for the CF in the immediate Halifax area. I know there's a video on YouTube of a Globemaster landing on the new 16H/34H in 2010 I think. But with the old 16/34 rehabilitated you could accommodate something that can't land as shortly as a C-17 or C-130.




That was a one time waiver for an airshow, and it was really light...


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## rotrhed (19 Jan 2016)

Baz said:
			
		

> snip
> 
> Moot discussion for now, because without the Big Honkin' Ship what is it needed for.  By the way, I'm at the sled hill looking at the *building that was built for SCTF* and never occupied as such; how'd that go?



Remind me Baz, it's been a few years since I was in YAW...which building was built for SCTF?


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## Baz (19 Jan 2016)

At the bottom of the hill, across from the Sea King club.  Wasn't a waste as they turned it into the RTF and French School.   It's why it has three flag polls that never have any flags.

For a while it seemed a direction had been chosen: we were modding aircraft, going to sea on an American ship just to figure out what we needed and how it worked, building a building, had a new introduction plan for Cyclone...and then poof, it all went away when the CF figured out Afghanistan  and the Olympics were too much.


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## rotrhed (22 Jan 2016)

Thanks Baz. Jay here. When I came back in 2005, I think the trials with the USN had just come to an end and SCTF/SCF was just ramping up. Then it was dead. Couldn't remember which building had suddenly become surplus.

At least the ARC210 was a somewhat useful legacy.


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