# CEOTP actually open?



## tren898 (23 Feb 2006)

In my defense its 0230 and I am on watch in the MCR on "a ship" as I am typing.  Forgive me if I've missed a blaringly obvious answer in the numerous searches i've run here.  

Here it goes.  I am a NET comm flavour.  I have been to my local BPSO in ESQ many times in the past year.  Before the last visit it was all about UPTNCM.  I had acceptance into a civilian university in NL and the course reqs stated that I needed many (as I am checking the exact amount, I find the website for MUN down) credits.  The military rquired me to have only two credits in any program for entry to the UTP side.  I was given an explanation on transfer credit and how it wasnt the same as the credit required to enter UTP.  Needless to say I was miffed.  I worked my arse off for my ship even to the point of personal hardship and injury to gain a rep and rec as "walks on water".  I made myself indespensible (found out this was a mistake).  I have been filling in for my supervisor and my section head on a regular basis for over a year.  If they want something done chain of command doesnt exist anymore, its just "pipe Bloggins, he'll get it done".  Geting noticed is a wonderful thing if its for the right reasons.  Having that point abused is not.  I dont blame my ship so much as the personnel shortages.  Not so much actual as percieved.  There are plenty of people, they are just sick lame and lazy.

Enough ranting.  The explanation for UTP was a little sour for me as I've worked so hard to fit into the little hoops and rings they've put out for me.  Swallow hard and relaod.  New program, new hopes.  In October I nearly flew off my seat in anticipation.  CEOTP was released as an instruction.  

I was told specifically by my BPSO, and I quote "it is an instructional message only and was released too early.  The program is in place, but the actual open date is not.  In essence the program is not open.  Go back to work and keep watching for the message to come out (in CANFORGENS).  Also check our website often, we will update it as soon as CEOTP is open".  I thought to myself, self this doesnt sound right, but I was told by the BPSO and the nice letter that was sent to my CO regarding my UTP application (signed by the OC of this formations BPSO's office) also said that CEOtp was expected to open in FEB 06.  I have proof of all these events.  Documentation at work and at home.  Today I looked at their website again http://esquimalt.mil.ca/badm/BPSO/index.htm  and I kept up hope that soon this bright light of a program would soon be open.  Curiosity got the better of me and I started surfing for more info on my off watch.  I came across two new places with info.  Here, and the actual DND site for recruiting.  I see that some people here have had interviews already?  I am right about this?  Can someone who has had one or knows whats going on please let me know what is happening.  I hate to think I'm not getting the right info here.  Not that I think thats not possible.

Please shed some light.


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## kincanucks (23 Feb 2006)

CEOTP has been in effect since 12 Oct 05 and the CANFORGEN and the ADM (HR-MIL) Instruction attached to it are quite clear.  CANFORGEN is 156/05 and the Instruction is 09/05.

Your ramble about UTPNCM is unclear but if you are referring to the credits that you were given as part of PLAR not being acceptable for UTPNCM that is right and you need to have completed successfully a minimum of two full credit university courses or their equivalent and be eligible for acceptance to an accredited Canadian university, in a MOC acceptable programme. CFAO 9-13 is quite clear that even a ex NET(T) now Artillery officer can understand it.


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## Melbatoast (23 Feb 2006)

kincanucks said:
			
		

> CEOTP has been in effect since 12 Oct 06 and the CANFORGEN and the ADM (HR-MIL) Instruction attached to it are quite clear.  CANFORGEN is 156/05 and the Instruction is 09/05.



I'm going to go with you meanning 12 Oct *05*, as I recall seeing the instruction around that time.  I interviewed with my BPSO (also at Esq) in November about commissioning options and he (and I) believed that CEOTP was the option best suited to me.  He also said much the same thing with regard to the program being opened later on - _I_ personally was guessing it would open in the new fiscal year, but again, the silence coming from the BPSO office WRT the program has begun to get a little deafening.  I've had my supervisors keeping their eyes and ears open on my behalf, as they see a lot more message traffic than me.  There's been nothing.

If the program is open, which MOCs are accepting CEOTP applicants?  There's nothing to that effect in the CANFORGEN or instruction.  My file with all the refs and so forth is at work but I'll check it tomorrow to get the exact gist of what's going on, but my feeling is that everything released to date says the program will be opening, not that it is open.  I'm not in a panic yet, as I'm going on course and then deployment soon, and still have to develop some of my skills (math) and qualities (leadership), but I can feel time beginning to press a bit.

Obviously I should call the BPSO and further clarification, but since the subject was brought up...


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## kincanucks (23 Feb 2006)

CEOTP is open now as that is what is meant by 'in effect'.  The trades are:

Pilot
Cbt Arms
MARS
AEC


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## Melbatoast (23 Feb 2006)

Well, I'm screwed as I don't see ANAV on that list.  Harumph.

Thanks anyway.

Do you suppose there would be any differences between what is open for serving members and civilian applicants?  In the way that as a UTPNCM I could apply for any MOC?  (obviously a very faint and unrealistic hope on my part)

I'm not that upset as like I said I'm still many months away and things can change.  Eyes on the prize etc.


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## kincanucks (23 Feb 2006)

_Do you suppose there would be any differences between what is open for serving members and civilian applicants?_

No


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## tren898 (23 Feb 2006)

> Your ramble about UTPNCM is unclear but if you are referring to the credits that you were given as part of PLAR not being acceptable for UTPNCM that is right and you need to have completed successfully a minimum of two full credit university courses *or their equivalent *


 First off, to kincanuks,  I am accepted and enroled at MUN starting my program at 4th year.  When the PLAR finally came back I was granted enough credits to prove that.  


> CEOTP has been in effect since 12 Oct 05 and the CANFORGEN and the ADM (HR-MIL) Instruction attached to it are quite clear.  CANFORGEN is 156/05 and the Instruction is 09/05.


Second the instruction said in plain english so that even a hopefully soon to be ex Comm tech could understand "program is in effect" not program competition has commenced.  Nor did it say anything to that effect.  One could read that the UTP or SCP or ROTP plans were in effect but are they open?  We see messages cut to that effect on whether they are or not, so why should this be any different.  As one other member who posted right in this thread from ESQ has stated our BPSO (foremost authority in this situation for our region, unless you suggest I see a cook about it) has led us astray.

Melbatoast, keep on keeping on.  I went into fort street recruiters this afternoon and talked to the PO2 at the front desk (a friend of mine from back in the day) and he said it has been open since Oct.  From there I called the BPSO's office and right now 217 pst I am waiting for his side of the story.  Needless to say I called my CSE right away and he has the chain kicked into gear to make some pointed questions to him. 

kincanucks, just incase you were actually not trying to be cynical or play the silent insult game, thank you for your second post on what was open.


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## kincanucks (23 Feb 2006)

Must be nice to have an anonymous means to mouth off officers. I wish I had it when I was a LS.   ;D


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## George Wallace (23 Feb 2006)

kincanucks said:
			
		

> Must be nice to have an anonymous means to mouth off officers. I wish I had it when I was a LS.   ;D


AH!  Yess!

As I pointed out to a poster on this site before.  It is a very small world.  It is an even smaller Army.  If someone truly wants to, his identity can easily be found, from the information that he has posted already in these public forums.  Very little 'detective work' is required to identify someone who had posted their Trade, their rank, their location, and their plans and steps that they have taken in the applications process, in this particular case CEOTP.  The CFRC has been ID'd, etc.  How many applicants are there that will fill all the 'boxes' on this 'Check List'?  We all know that this person really is no longer anonymous.


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## Melbatoast (23 Feb 2006)

kincanucks said:
			
		

> Must be nice to have an anonymous means to mouth off officers. I wish I had it when I was a LS.   ;D



Keep in mind it can be frustrating on our end because quite honestly, despite quite a lot of searching on everyone's part up to and including my P1 there is nothing unambiguously stating that competition has opened.  Moreover the only place that indicates what MOCs are open, that I have seen anywhere, is your helpful post - presumably on the recruiting site as well, but recruiting has nothing to do with serving reg force members.  Furthermore, the BPSO _told_ us that competition wasn't open and to check their website periodically for updates (other than that I've been perfectly happy with our BPSO - helpful, enthusiastic and friendly).

I can understand some hot headedness, especially if a guy is ready to put forward an application.


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## maniac779 (24 Feb 2006)

Alright, so I've completed my process for my component transfer from PRes to RegF Pilot via CEOTP.

Rumour has it the board for applicants like myself is being convened mid-April. Assuming all goes well, can anyone in the know give me an idea what IAP/BOTC course I will be loaded on?

April? September?

Thanks...


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## Zoomie (24 Feb 2006)

Assuming that Aircrew Selection is complete and the files come back in April - you should expect an IAP/BOTP for Sept'06.  If you are really lucky and there are enough candidates, you may be put on an IAP/BOTP that is run out of Borden - don't count on it though.


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## kincanucks (24 Feb 2006)

maniac779 said:
			
		

> Alright, so I've completed my process for my component transfer from PRes to RegF Pilot via CEOTP.
> 
> Rumour has it the board for applicants like myself is being convened mid-April. Assuming all goes well, can anyone in the know give me an idea what IAP/BOTC course I will be loaded on?
> 
> ...



The next scheduled board for Pilot is 15 Apr 06 but selection has been continuous for the last few months.  The next scheduled IAP/BOTPs are 10 Apr and 29 May.


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## maniac779 (25 Feb 2006)

Zoomie said:
			
		

> Assuming that Aircrew Selection is complete and the files come back in April - you should expect an IAP/BOTP for Sept'06.  If you are really lucky and there are enough candidates, you may be put on an IAP/BOTP that is run out of Borden - don't count on it though.



I thought they only ran BMQ out of Borden?

Is there any chance as a CEOTP applicant they'll put me on the summer IAP/BOTP?


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## kincanucks (26 Feb 2006)

_Is there any chance as a CEOTP applicant they'll put me on the summer IAP/BOTP?_

No, summer is for ROTPs only.


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## Former291er (21 Mar 2006)

Hey maniac 779, could you keep posting updates for your process. I am going ceotp pilot and am taking the acs end of april. I would like to hear how things are going on your end.
Cheers
Rob.


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## maniac779 (21 Mar 2006)

Sure.

9 Mar my completed file went to Borden for selection.

20 Mar I was issued my conditional offer. It is conditional on my medical stuff coming back okay. I don't really forsee it being a problem.

My offer puts me on a Sept IAP/BOTC and they want me in St. Jean in early April. I will be in PAT until the course starts.

Thats all so far.


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## double0three (21 Mar 2006)

My file went off to Borden (I believe thats where it goes) on March 8th.  So hopefully this means I will be hearing back one way or another this week (crossing my fingers).  I am going ROPT which seems like a mistake at this point, all you CEOTP people are getting conditional offers!!!  Hopefully I am able to change my entry plan.  Actually just getting accepted under any entry plan would be amazing right now...


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## Former291er (21 Mar 2006)

double0three said:
			
		

> My file went off to Borden (I believe thats where it goes) on March 8th.  So hopefully this means I will be hearing back one way or another this week (crossing my fingers).  I am going ROPT which seems like a mistake at this point, all you CEOTP people are getting conditional offers!!!  Hopefully I am able to change my entry plan.  Actually just getting accepted under any entry plan would be amazing right now...



Stick with it, i'm sure you'll hear something. I don't think that RMC is a mistake, I would choose that over CEOTP. The problem for me is that I have a wife and daughter so I can't just make 1000 bucks a month and get by on it. I think your decision for ROTP is the right one.
Just my .02 cents, its really up to you what you want, not what everybody else tells you.
rob.


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## Former291er (21 Mar 2006)

maniac779 said:
			
		

> Sure.
> 
> 9 Mar my completed file went to Borden for selection.
> 
> ...



Thats awesome hope to see you there, if everything goes good on my side. If I do get an offer and am asked to go on PAT, I will accept but I am going to see if I can be attach posted to the recruiting center or reserves base here because I have a wife and daughter. If not I will still go, anything to provide a good life for the family doing something that I would enjoy.
Cheers.
Rob.


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## maniac779 (21 Mar 2006)

Here is an update on myself for those of you looking for an idea of what is going on.

I sat down with a MCC at CFRC today and they informed me that there is a problem with my offer, having to do with conditions of rank/promotion/pay etc. Because of my education and backround, I am entitled to certain items not expressed in my offer.

I've informed the recruiters if they can't get this things fixed (I won't go into details, but they ARE signifcant) I will have to reject the offer. They have told me (off the record) that would be a prudent course of action as the errors are due to oversights with involving CFRG, not myself, and that the errors are significant enough to warrant a rejection.

I should know more by tomorrow.


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## double0three (21 Mar 2006)

maniac779 said:
			
		

> Here is an update on myself for those of you looking for an idea of what is going on.... *snip*



Wow, I'm not sure exactly what could possibly be the problem but hopefully it works out for you!  I hate to see people go through so much trouble with the recruiting process only to run into problems when the process is finally complete!  Hope it works out for you and keep us posted.

EDIT:

Changed the wording of my post a bit since for one, it didn't make much sense gramatically, and another it had a different tone to it than what I wanted


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## maniac779 (22 Mar 2006)

Okay, here it is.

I rejected the offer this morning, citing the errors on it.

Got a call back around 4pm today. They fixed the offer and loaded me on 10 Apr IAP/BOTC.

100% correct offer. On course right away. No PAT... 

Doesn't get any better than that.

The girlfriend is gonna be pissed.  :-\

Good luck to everyone else.


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## double0three (22 Mar 2006)

Wow thats awesome, they must really want you in there!

Wish I could say the same myself........ my medical file is still in limbo so I think I'm screwed...


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## Former291er (22 Mar 2006)

That's absolutely great man. Good luck with basic. Update us after your basic to let us know how you did.
Congratulations.
Rob.
P.S. Jealous, Jealous, Jealous......lol


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## Zach15 (22 Mar 2006)

Congrats man, great to hear everything is working out for you.

   I got a surprise the other day when a Captain called me. Unfortunately he was just looking for information on my degree program and didn't offer me a job. Hopefully I will have an offer by next week, Im gettin' ancy! haha

          Zach


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## double0three (23 Mar 2006)

Best of luck Zach!  Keep us updated!


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## Gobes (18 Sep 2006)

Hey, I hate to start on an old topic again, but I have been following the same program(CEOTP) as well, as I want to be a pilot. CEOTP has been open as of October 2005...here's the bad news...to civilian applicants. They will be opening it to military members, but there is a catch. I have been following this since the message was drafted in October, and a message was supposed to follow in January on how the BPSO's would direct serving members applications. January came and went...nothing. The date got bumped to FEB/ MAR. Came and went ...nothing. July was the next I heard( I keep in regular contact with BPSO's from both coasts...very friendly people, never met an ignorant one) and of course July came and went with no message. I was talking to my PSO last week( starting my application to UTPNCM) and here's the scoop. It's easy for civilian applicants, because the terms of the "contract" with CEOTP is that you finish your degree on your own time by the end of your contract. So, they sign Civies up for a nine year contract in which they must finish their degree, or get booted off the island!! FOR MEMBERS...because there is so many different contracts,(some people are on their first BE, Second BE, IE 20, IE 25, CE....etc...etc...) and so many people are different ones, they are having trouble trying to find common ground where they can be fair and give everyone a "reasonable amount of time to complete their degree" So that's the scoop. My daily routine is to go onto the intranet daily, check the CANFORGENS, and DMHRR message boards, because when that message comes out, it will be on either one of those sites. In the meantime, here's my suggestion, if you have to requisites for UTPNCM, apply, the worst they can say is no, and then you just apply next year. The BPSO did tell me that the instruction for CEOTP will be out sometime, but it could be 2 weeks, or 12 months. I'm going to chance it with UTPNCM, and hope for the best.


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