# Name tags for TPS



## AmmoTech90 (11 Jul 2006)

Slow news day item...

I would oppose this on the cost to the tax payers alone, never mind officer safety...

http://torontosun.com/News/TorontoAndGTA/2006/07/11/1678816-sun.html



> The force's tags have been estimated to cost $142,000.



In 2005 TPS had 5227 as its uniformed strength.  This works out to $27.00 per member for name tags.  Checking Canadian suppliers name tags can be had for $1.00-1.50 when ordering in lots of 500+ it seems a bit excessive.  Of course if they work under a system like PWGSC then it is completely understandable and possibly underfunded.  

How do cops maintain their uniforms anyway?  I can see a replacement being issued if it is damaged during work, but how about normal wear and tear?

D


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## Bruce Monkhouse (11 Jul 2006)

This is flippin' stupid.............name tags??? Why not also put your SIN number, home address and how many kids you have.

I feel for the men and women in blue in Toronto who have to work for the clowns that make up their Police service's board.


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## marshall sl (12 Jul 2006)

Corrections Canada makes all employees wear picture ID with full name on our uniform.The RCMP wear a tag with 1st initial and surname


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## Bruce Monkhouse (12 Jul 2006)

We used to here in Ontario but went to a number system for our protection.


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## Slim (13 Jul 2006)

DRPS now has name tags along with badge numbers and we are NOT allowed to black them out with marker as some have been doing. I can't say that I'm keen on that either.

Oh well...


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## MPIKE (13 Jul 2006)

Slim said:
			
		

> DRPS now has name tags along with badge numbers and we are NOT allowed to black them out with marker as some have been doing. I can't say that I'm keen on that either.
> 
> Oh well...



Can't say at first I was keen with the idea of having the name tag either when I came from a service that only has Badge numbers.  But I have gotten use to it and figure there are greater things to be more concerned about.  If someone is looking for you it is much easier than remembering your name tag.  If you think of your situation there are a ton of ways you can be found.  Easiest one, is after dealing with a "client" you've left your name on the top of the ticket etc..  I think there is a greater problem with station security and POMVs but some stations in TPS are addressing this one... Sort out the other security issues first and then we would have a greater argument for no nametags.   Until that happens there are too many other ways to be comprimised.


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## zipperhead_cop (15 Jul 2006)

Last year we got complaints from the Windsor Black Coalition that their "people" had to hard of a time remembering four and five digit badge numbers, which we used to wear on each shoulder in the form of epaulets.  Thus, at an expense of around $40,000 we were all issued three digit "patrol" numbers, which are sewn on our uniforms and jackets.  No, I am not making this shite up.  Now, I would have been insulted at the suggestion if I belonged to that community, yet the Chief ram rodded it through. 
Still, it is better than having name tags.  No asshat deserves to have your name on the street.  They get a number (and now, a conveniently short three digit number in our case) and that is it.  My last name is only four letters long, so it is very easy to remember.  Kind of a drag when there is a mob scene and people want to complain about anyone they can.  Short, easy names stick in peoples heads.


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## bitterntwisted (16 Jul 2006)

the whole thing is retarded.   if they get ur number, they can get ur name to report you to the internal standards guys.       the cars have numbers on em.  the tickets have your name and number on em.   waste of time and money.............


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## The_Falcon (16 Jul 2006)

bitterntwisted said:
			
		

> the whole thing is retarded.   if they get ur number, they can get ur name to report you to the internal standards guys.       the cars have numbers on em.  the tickets have your name and number on em.   waste of time and money.............



For someone who says they are a CIC officer and a former RCMP member, your spelling and grammar is piss poor.  I suggest (before the mods give you grief) that you make an effort to improve both, otherwise no one is going to take what you say seriously, particularly when you had so much to add to the conversation  :.



			
				PIKER said:
			
		

> Can't say at first I was keen with the idea of having the name tag either when I came from a service that only has Badge numbers.  But I have gotten use to it and figure there are greater things to be more concerned about.  If someone is looking for you it is much easier than remembering your name tag.  If you think of your situation there are a ton of ways you can be found.  Easiest one, is after dealing with a "client" you've left your name on the top of the ticket etc..  I think there is a greater problem with station security and POMVs but some stations in TPS are addressing this one... Sort out the other security issues first and then we would have a greater argument for no nametags.   Until that happens there are too many other ways to be comprimised.



TPS' efforts to improve security (erecting fences around station parking lots) is actually drawing criticism from the usual suspects notably the Toronto Police Accountability Coalition (www.tpac.ca), which is lead by John Sewell (Former Mayor of Toronto) who incidentally is running for city council.  I really really hope he does not get elected, the last thing we need on council is another person with these far left anti-police views.


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## bitterntwisted (17 Jul 2006)

Hatchet Man.  Seeing as you are interested in sharing advice, I will attempt to share with you one of my favorite quotes for little people who get bent about the small things in life.  

"Relax Francis"


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## zipperhead_cop (17 Jul 2006)

The quote was "lighten up, Francis".   :

Some people are not as comfortable giving out their personal information as others.  My crappy left handed writing precludes my name from being legible at the top of the ticket.  However, the badge number at the bottom is always easy to read.  
This isn't a case of trying to escape detection from accountability for actions on the street.  With computer assisted dispatching and GPS, it is impossible to do much without it being tracked.  Yes, if someone really puts their mind to it, they can find out your name.  However, you generally have to identify yourself, so that starts a trail.  
There are a great many people who don't appreciate what police do.  Last year, one of our members homes was firebombed by the HA's after he arrested one of their up-and-comers.  Members from the OPP and Customs intelligence also have had their cars firebombed in their driveways after significant drug seizures and/or arrests.  Recently, and RCMP officer found out that one of the eastern organized crime groups was trying to put together a contract on his life.  Another incident that comes to mind is a few years ago the son of a BC MP got arrested being a drunken dink in the downtown core.  His group of buddies decided that a GTA-style "cops are racist" BS-fest was in order, and were trying to get the crowd going (typically, that garbage doesn't get anyone too ramped up here).  One guy was trying to get badge numbers, and one of our guys gave him it.  Well, didn't he suddenly become the central figure in the drama, despite his being something like the eighth guy to arrive and was only holding a perimeter.  The written complaints he received were unreal, and the local rag was absolutely thrilled to print everything these clowns were spouting.  The paper would have published that officers name in a heartbeat if they had it, and as it was the splash headline was all about racism and cops.  That guy would have gotten totally screwed over in the media, and he was not involved with the arrest in any way.  And of course the retraction comes out on page 9 of section C if it ever does.  This is the crap we have to deal with.  
For my part, I go with the "be prepared, not paranoid" as well as "Complacency kills".  Both of our personal m/v's addresses are registered to police headquarters, as well as our drivers licences.  Heat checks on the way home can't hurt either.  
So Bitter, what service are you with?  I've never heard of it referred to as "internal standards" and surely you know that the numbers on the cruisers are less than useless in identifying a person? 
**sniff, sniff**  ???


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## Shamrock (17 Jul 2006)

Any of you guys call me Francis, and I'll kill you.


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## GO!!! (18 Jul 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> **sniff, sniff**  ???



Ohhhhh, I smell it too!!

<begins warming up GO SHOW!!! Suburbans>


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## Slim (18 Jul 2006)

Please remember that providing members with false information about who you are and what you do will get you banned in a heartbeat...Doubly fast if you claim to be a cop and are not!

Children who play at being police/soldiers are not welcome here.

Best to come clean quick. :tsktsk:

Slim
Mod


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## GAP (18 Jul 2006)

hehehe


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## Fishbone Jones (18 Jul 2006)

bitterntwisted said:
			
		

> the whole thing is retarded.   if they get ur number, they can get ur name to report you to the internal standards guys.       the cars have numbers on em.  the tickets have your name and number on em.   waste of time and money.............



Topic: Army.ca Conduct Guidelines: MUST READ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937.0.html

FRIENDLY ADVICE TO NEW MEMBERS - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937/post-259412.html#msg259412

Regarding the use of "MSN speak" or poor writing versus the employment of prose which is correct in grammar, spelling and punctuation, please see: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/34015/post-260446.html#msg260446
    
Grammar and Sentence Structures - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/31327.0.html

Re: Grammar and Sentence Structures - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/31327/post-340105.html#msg340105

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Public Profiles

I strongly encourage you to fill out all the sections of your public profile that you're comfortable with. We respect your privacy and won't force you to fill out your profile if you don't want to. Bear in mind though, that the amount of identifyable info in your profile will increase your general credibility here. Those with empty profiles are much harder to verify and will have to put a lot more effort into building a credible presence here.

Unfortunately, we've had some cases where a visitor tries to exaggerate or invent stellar military experience. ("I was a special forces sniper, but I can't tell you about that as my file is sealed...") Please. Don't insult us with this drivel. It is always painfully obvious what your real experience is, and we're impressed with quiet professionalism, not open bragging. These guys inevitably get forced out in the open and eventually leave the forums in disgrace.

The above also pertains to any type of professional experience, especially, but not limited to, LEO.


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## The_Falcon (18 Jul 2006)

bitterntwisted said:
			
		

> Hatchet Man.  Seeing as you are interested in sharing advice, I will attempt to share with you one of my favorite quotes for little people who get bent about the small things in life.
> 
> "Relax Francis"



I was trying to save you the trouble of attracting attention from the moderators. Too late.

Back on topic.


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## portcullisguy (8 Aug 2006)

marshall sl said:
			
		

> Corrections Canada makes all employees wear picture ID with full name on our uniform.The RCMP wear a tag with 1st initial and surname



Two more reasons why the federal law enforcement agencies are no role model to anyone.

Funny enough, although my agency (CBSA) has lots of "issues" with it, they have long chosen not to have their officers wear name tags.  We wear a badge with a badge number which is difficult to read beyond 10 cm.

A lot of people though my name was "April" ... the renewal month on my airport restricted area pass was "April 2003" until I renewed it (now my name is "October 2007"   ).  That and my picture are all that is on the front of the pass.  The name is on the back, which is not visible to the public.


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## Red 6 (15 Aug 2006)

Is that seat next to you taken, GAP?

 :argument:


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## GAP (15 Aug 2006)

.


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## Cloud Cover (16 Aug 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> Thus, at an expense of around $40,000 we were all issued three digit "patrol" numbers, which are sewn on our uniforms and jackets.  No, I am not making this shite up.



Who got 007 and I hope 666 went to some well serving member in professional standards.  ;D


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## marshall sl (16 Aug 2006)

When Correctional Service of Canada changed uniforms(similar toCBPSA) we were supposed to be issued a numbered badge to be worn on the shirt.That changed and we we issued it in a wallet with the ID  card.  I'd prefer the number only but with the way our service interpets disclosure we have to identify ourselves by rank and name on all official reports and documents anyway.


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## zipperhead_cop (17 Aug 2006)

whiskey601 said:
			
		

> Who got 007 and I hope 666 went to some well serving member in professional standards.  ;D



Hah!  The numbers started at 100 and went up.  666 hasn't been issued yet, but will be up probably in two years.  There are ones out there that are 123 and 469.  Some of the numbers are funny when you look at the corresponding section of the Criminal Code that they relate to.  Sucks to be officer 151 and 152  ;D


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## Shamrock (17 Aug 2006)

Officer 160 has been permanently banned from the K9 unit


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## Red 6 (17 Aug 2006)

On a serious note, what's the issue with names on your uniform?


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## Thompson_JM (17 Aug 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> Hah!  The numbers started at 100 and went up.  666 hasn't been issued yet, but will be up probably in two years.  There are ones out there that are 123 and 469.  Some of the numbers are funny when you look at the corresponding section of the Criminal Code that they relate to.  Sucks to be officer 151 and 152  ;D



i would think 155 and 159 would get a bit of teasing as well  ;D

And how Ironic would it be if Officer 162 was part of an undercover survelance team?


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## zipperhead_cop (17 Aug 2006)

Red 6 said:
			
		

> On a serious note, what's the issue with names on your uniform?



Many officers don't want the general public to have access to our names for personal security reasons.  Albeit that if someone puts their mind to it they can find out, but at least whoever is inquiring will create a trail of traceability to a certain extent.  Retaliation against officers is becoming more common, with organized crime photographing officers families and homes/ cars being fire bombed.  
Using visible numbers to represent ourselves is the compromise from not wearing name tags.

Now that I look back at this thread, I see that bitterntwisted chose to not respond to being called out.  I guess that sums up the credibilty in his/her profile.


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## Slim (18 Aug 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> Now that I look back at this thread, I see that bitterntwisted chose to not respond to being called out.  I guess that sums up the credibilty in his/her profile.



Yep

Kinda thought that smelled a bit funny...I probably should give out a verbal or 500 pushups or something.

Posers...Damn!

Slim


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## Red 6 (18 Aug 2006)

Hey ya'll: It's been my experience that wearing a name tag doesn't have a lot of impact one way or another. My agency has worn them since way back when and we've never had a problem. Also, everybody has business cards with their name, assignment and work extension printed on them. By policy, you cannot obscure your name tag, nor can you refuse to hand out a business card if asked for it. From what I've seen, most officers in the US Northwest wear some kind of name tag.


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## zipperhead_cop (18 Aug 2006)

Red 6 said:
			
		

> Hey ya'll: It's been my experience that wearing a name tag doesn't have a lot of impact one way or another. My agency has worn them since way back when and we've never had a problem. Also, everybody has business cards with their name, assignment and work extension printed on them. By policy, you cannot obscure your name tag, nor can you refuse to hand out a business card if asked for it. From what I've seen, most officers in the US Northwest wear some kind of name tag.



But at least in the US if some gear box pulls a stunt at your home like firebombing your car there is a high degree of likelihood of a harsh consequence.  Here, the criminal would get a charge of arson and probably get to plead it down to mischief.  There are not specific laws that address targetting LEO's directly.  How large of a population base is the police service that you work for?


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## Red 6 (18 Aug 2006)

I'll shoot you a PM, zipperhead cop.


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## zipperhead_cop (19 Aug 2006)

Red 6 said:
			
		

> I'll shoot you a PM, zipperhead cop.



Got it, and thanks  

I think it just boils down to your comfort level with people knowing your name.  I like having the option of giving my name.  My tag number is always available, but when somebody is being a dink, it's always nice to just indicate to the tag and say "that's all you will need".  Conversely, for nice/normal people I am always happy to toss out a business card.  And it has my first AND last name on it.   ;D


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## rregtc-etf (26 Oct 2006)

If it was just a matter of the police having to deal with normal people including irate motorists there would not be a big deal about wearing nametags.  The problem is that police deal with a lot of dickheads that have access to computers and know how to pull up 411.ca. address.   Some officers probably still have listed phone numbers or the rookies may still live at home with mom and dad.  

If a cop is threatened, he can get permission to be "fully dressed" off duty and have  police patrols on his street.  But why go through all that BS. 

Cops aren't too concerned about someone lodging an open complaint against an officer, they are concerned that some nutjob with too much time on his hands will deliberately target them anonymously because of their chosen profession.

The educated idiot politicians in T.O that suggested the idea did not have any thoughts for the potential consequences or any regard for officer safety.   The police union have declared it to be an officer safety issue and have instructed their members not to wear the name tags.  

I'm sure the city will be forking out a lot of money to replace  "lost" name tags and ripped shirts every time a cop gets into some body and fender work on the mean streets of Toronto.


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## Slim (27 Oct 2006)

Just got an e-mail from my former partner and her new pal..Seems that they were doing crowd liason/management (control being such a nasty word these days) at a town fair and the local drug dealer decided that that was the night he was going to try and intimidate some police officers...(Why not start with the auxiliary right?!)

Anyway in the midst of his telling my to pals that he now KNEW THEIR NAMES  and was going to (I think she said) firebomb their houses, some of the Old Clothes (what my service calls undercover) guys and gals arrived and asked him to lie down on the ground and consent to being searched and arrested. I think they even helped him get there. Seems he had an outstanding warrant and had forgotten that the Auxiliary have RADIOS too, :rofl: in addition to the batons and handcuffs that they were getting ready to put into use. 

Man I would hate to be that stupid! :blotto:


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## zipperhead_cop (30 Oct 2006)

Yeah, it isn't as effective when some tool is ranting on about "Oh yeah 490, I'm gonna see you again 490!  I'm gonna remember that, 490" etc.  Give it a ten count and they already have forgotten the number.  

(BTW, my f#g tag number isn't 490, so don't pile on that guy/girl  ;D )


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