# sleeping...?



## thewildandelusivebacon (7 Jan 2011)

hi guys. If your an officer do you still sleep in those racks.

I heard if your an officer instead of sleeping in an area with 30 people, you share a state room. 

thanks.


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## KrazyHamburglar (7 Jan 2011)

Indeed, officers usually share a cabin but some Heads of Department might be alone, in destroyers at least... of course, most subbies end up in the messes at some point anyway.


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## Pat in Halifax (8 Jan 2011)

Ha Ha! - A stateroom????? These vessels are NOT "Oasis of the...", they are war ships plain and simple. Even HODs share cabins (2 per) and generally the only one alone is the XO. This may vary from ship to ship(and this is for HAL class) but you are never too far from someone.
Funny enough, the Officer who sailed with myself and my last group of trainees ended up in a mess deck due to a shortage of cabins - He said it was great! Around day 3, he actually asked me if there were lights in 10 mess!


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## Ex-Dragoon (8 Jan 2011)

Pat in Halifax said:
			
		

> Ha Ha! - A stateroom????? These vessels are NOT "Oasis of the...", they are war ships plain and simple. Even HODs share cabins (2 per) and generally the only one alone is the XO. This may vary from ship to ship(and this is for HAL class) but you are never too far from someone.
> Funny enough, the Officer who sailed with myself and my last group of trainees ended up in a mess deck due to a shortage of cabins - He said it was great! Around day 3, he actually asked me if there were lights in 10 mess!



The Coxn and the CO also have their own cabins unless the CPF has the Commodore embarked and then he and the CO share a cabin. There are also topics that discuss living conditions onboard the various classes of ships the Navy has.

Milnet.Ca Staff


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## Acer Syrup (8 Jan 2011)

We get to sleep?


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## Navalsnpr (8 Jan 2011)

Acer Syrup said:
			
		

> We get to sleep?



On board ship, the majority of Officers are 'Day Workers' and the ones who aren't (MARS) will do a 4 hour shift on the bridge. Now the ORO's are the only true shift workers onboard doing 12 hours in the Ops Room a day.


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## Pusser (9 Jan 2011)

Actually the term stateroom is not so far off the mark.  Although we call them cabins in Canada, US Navy officers do call them staterooms.

HODs in destroyers have single cabins.

Captains and Commodores do not share cabins.  They share a common area, but they each have separate sleeping areas.  In destroyers they also have their own heads (can't say for CPFs).

MARS officers frequently stand more than one four hour watch in a day. In a one in three rotation, that works out to three watches a day for two days followed by one day with only two watches, then the cycle repeats itself.  I'd say that pretty much qualifies as shift work, although I gather MARS officers don't often stand 1 in 3 anymore.


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## Occam (9 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> although I gather MARS officers don't often stand 1 in 3 anymore.



Unless things have changed drastically, the only people who stand 1 in 3 are engineering types.  Everyone else is always either 1 in 2 or 1 in 4 (or dayworkers).


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## gcclarke (9 Jan 2011)

Occam said:
			
		

> Unless things have changed drastically, the only people who stand 1 in 3 are engineering types.  Everyone else is always either 1 in 2 or 1 in 4 (or dayworkers).



For the Bridge Watch Keepers (BWKs), it really just depends upon how many qualified BWKs you have aboard. I have heard of 1 in 3, however something like 1 in 5 is more common. Often times on actual deployments, the limiting factor is bunking. If you don't *need* more than 3 BWKs, you might only bring 3 to allow you space to bring along others, air crew, Int, padres, etc. But the rotation of the BWKs is pretty much independent of whatever watch rotation the rest of the ship happens to be standing.


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## Dipstick (9 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> Actually the term stateroom is not so far off the mark.  Although we call them cabins in Canada, US Navy officers do call them staterooms.
> 
> HODs in destroyers have single cabins.
> 
> ...



For Subbie MARS officers in my ship, 1 in 3 is the norm.  Good times are had by all.


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## FDO (9 Jan 2011)

Navalsnipr said:
			
		

> On board ship, the majority of Officers are 'Day Workers' and the ones who aren't (MARS) will do a 4 hour shift on the bridge. Now the ORO's are the only true shift workers onboard doing 12 hours in the Ops Room a day.



True because none of the hard sea NCM's like Bos'n's or combat stand 1 in 2!! :


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## Navalsnpr (9 Jan 2011)

Retired FDO said:
			
		

> True because none of the hard sea NCM's like Bos'n's or combat stand 1 in 2!! :



Really?  Every ship I've sailed on over the past 12 years, we've always been 1 in 2. When I was on the Tanker, we gave the Junior NCM's the option of 1 in 2 or 1 in 4 and they choose unanimously 1 in 2.


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## NavyShooter (9 Jan 2011)

I've rarely sailed anything but 1/2, the times we've done other than that have mostly been to do 1/4 the last couple of days before getting alongside to tidy the ship up.

NS


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## trigger324 (9 Jan 2011)

Navalsnipr said:
			
		

> Really?  Every ship I've sailed on over the past 12 years, we've always been 1 in 2. When I was on the Tanker, we gave the Junior NCM's the option of 1 in 2 or 1 in 4 and they choose unanimously 1 in 2.




Pretty sure Retired FDO was making that comment in jest, thus the rolling eyes.


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## Neill McKay (10 Jan 2011)

Navalsnipr said:
			
		

> When I was on the Tanker, we gave the Junior NCM's the option of 1 in 2 or 1 in 4 and they choose unanimously 1 in 2.



Do you know why?


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## Ex-Dragoon (10 Jan 2011)

N. McKay said:
			
		

> Do you know why?



Because 1 in 4 you are generally turning to, during 1 in 2 the 1 in 2 messes don't report rounds either. Pretty cut and dry.


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## Pusser (10 Jan 2011)

For years we sailed with most of the ship's company in 1 in 4, although except for one brief period I always stood 1 in 3 as a MARS officer (determined by number of folks available to stand watch).  The stokers have always stood and continue to stand 1 in 3.  In a 1 in 4 rotation, you stand your watches AND work the normal day (i.e. if off watch between 0800 and 1600 you are doing departmental work.  Everyone also "cleans into night clothing" (red sea rig for officers, golf-shirts and bunny slippers for C&POs) at supper time.  With the first Gulf War we started to sail more often in the Second Degree of Readiness, which put the combat operators on a 1 in 2 rotation.  When in 1 in 2, there is no night clothing and no departmental work (i.e. when off watch, folks can go to their racks if they wish.  As a navy, we've gotten very comfortable with this.  So much so that when last at sea, the CO wanted to give the sailors "a break" so he put us into the Fourth Degree of Readiness and a 1 in 4 rotation.  The sailors howled!!!  They hated it because the manning of the ship had changed over the years such that the numbers actually made it difficult to support 1 in 4.  In order to support 1 in 4, personnel who didn't normally stand watches ended up having to.  In short, the sailors had to work harder and longer when they were being given a "break."  The HODs & CHODsprotested, but go nowhere.  Makes one think.... :brickwall:


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## Neill McKay (10 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> When in 1 in 2, there is no night clothing and no departmental work (i.e. when off watch, folks can go to their racks if they wish.



Is the departmental workload taken up by more dayworkers, then?


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## Pusser (10 Jan 2011)

N. McKay said:
			
		

> Is the departmental workload taken up by more dayworkers, then?



Generally, no.  For the most part, it simply doesn't get done at sea, unless it's operationally necessary.  Notwithstanding the watch rotation, officers and C&POs will generally use at least some of their "off" time to catch up on administrative work, which can sometimes be a little tricky with all the lights turned off.


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## Oldgateboatdriver (10 Jan 2011)

N. McKay said:
			
		

> Do you know why?



An additional reason (at least in my days, and I hope still today) is that when in 1 in 2 rotation, you usually go into "modified Vietnam" mode: Four watches in a day - two of seven hours and two of five hours. And then plan the daily drills (fire/Mobex) refuelling and other similar necessary tasks to take place during the two five hour watches. This way, you are on watch at the same time everyday - no constant adapting to time shifts - and everyone gets a straight 6 to 6 1/2 hour  shut-eye period if they wish, that is only disturbed for real emergencies or operational requirements.

Coupled with the postponing of all departmental work that is not essential that goes with it, it makes for a much more relaxed work atmosphere for the NCM while it gets them more time practicing their actual trade. They usually love it and it makes for good morale.


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## FDO (11 Jan 2011)

trigger324 said:
			
		

> Pretty sure Retired FDO was making that comment in jest, thus the rolling eyes.



Yes I was. 32 years as a Bos'n I'm allowed to be sarcastic!!


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## Oldgateboatdriver (11 Jan 2011)

Allowed?  I thought sarcasm was a trade requirement for deck apes  .


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## Navalsnpr (11 Jan 2011)

Retired FDO said:
			
		

> Yes I was. 32 years as a Bos'n I'm allowed to be sarcastic!!



Yup!!


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## Occam (11 Jan 2011)

Retired FDO said:
			
		

> Yes I was. 32 years as a Bos'n I'm allowed to be sarcastic!!



32 years as a Bos'n, and you ought to be _certified_.


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## Lumber (14 Jan 2011)

Pat in Halifax said:
			
		

> Funny enough, the Officer who sailed with myself and my last group of trainees ended up in a mess deck due to a shortage of cabins - He said it was great! Around day 3, he actually asked me if there were lights in 10 mess!



I agree! I lived in 10 mess with the ping bosn's for a summer, and I loved it. Officers aren't suppose to sleep during the day, but who ever notices that there happens to be a couple subbies sleeping in 10 mess at 1300? Also, (those who haven't been in an officer's cabin may not realize this), the bunks in Officer's cabins have no curtains. If you want to keep it dark when others are working, or whatever, you need to make a make-shift curtain out of bungee cords, paracord, and extra wool blankets. In messes, every rack has a curtain.

Lights were never turned on there. No alarm clock EVER went off. It wasn't pretty nice.


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## yoman (15 Jan 2011)

Lumber said:
			
		

> Also, (those who haven't been in an officer's cabin may not realize this), the bunks in *Officer's cabins have no curtains*. If you want to keep it dark when others are working, or whatever, you need to make a make-shift curtain out of bungee cords, paracord, and extra wool blankets. In messes, every rack has a curtain.



I've never noticed... 



			
				Lumber said:
			
		

> Lights were never turned on there. No alarm clock EVER went off. It wasn't pretty nice.



I enjoyed living with the bosn's for a part of last summer for exactly the reasons you mentioned above + it was quieter. I got a much better sleep there then when I was living with the techs and stokers.


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## QM (16 Jan 2011)

First of all, what language are you guys speaking? Lol. We Army guys always assumed that when it got dark, the ships just dropped anchor, broke out the port and the fishing rods and the guitars, and made merry!! You're denying me the right to think the grass is greener (or the water is bluer) in the senior service! Sheesh!


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## aesop081 (16 Jan 2011)

Yeah, they insist on doing EMATT exercises at night.......whats up with that  ;D


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## SeaKingTacco (16 Jan 2011)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> Yeah, they insist on doing EMATT exercises at night.......whats up with that  ;D



I used to LOVE that.  Nothing like a 3 am, North Pacific launch into a no moon night to dip against an EMATT.  

Recover, put the helo to bed, have breakfast and go to the rack?  Not so fast- there is XO's morning prayers first in the Wardroom, then the stewards start to clean, then time for a FIREX...


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## aesop081 (16 Jan 2011)

SeaKingTacco said:
			
		

> Nothing like a 3 am, North Pacific launch into a no moon night to dip against an EMATT.



Yeah, its even more awesome when you have a 3 hour transit down and a 3 hour transit back to home plate after 4 hours on an EMATT.


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## Halifax Tar (17 Jan 2011)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> Yeah, they insist on doing EMATT exercises at night.......whats up with that  ;D



I wonder if the officer of the watch every knows how much they can piss off the galley and the crew when they do unscheduled OOWMs with out informing the galley who then watches the nights supper end up sculling about the galley...I watched this all go on the Toronto not too long ago! I have never seen a more mad P1 cook in my life! Delayed the feeding of the crew by 2 hours while cooks rushed to put together another meal lol


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## Halifax Tar (17 Jan 2011)

As well I would like to know what a day worker is and what this elusive animal looks like ? I have often been mistaken as one but I assure you it is a mistake! 

Retired FDO I think you were my last Buffer on the Tor!


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## SeaKingTacco (17 Jan 2011)

And why, after the all night EMATTEX, do engineering drills need to be piped on the main broadcast at 0530?  Can the siren call of "Steering Gear Breakdown, Steering Gear Breakdown" not just be yelled in the MCR, since, by definition, it is a drill?  Or do I need to "practice" waking up?


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## aesop081 (17 Jan 2011)

SeaKingTacco said:
			
		

> Or do I need to "practice" waking up?



Sure. The Army like to practice staying up so......


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## Halifax Tar (17 Jan 2011)

SeaKingTacco said:
			
		

> And why, after the all night EMATTEX, do engineering drills need to be piped on the main broadcast at 0530?  Can the siren call of "Steering Gear Breakdown, Steering Gear Breakdown" not just be yelled in the MCR, since, by definition, it is a drill?  Or do I need to "practice" waking up?



After my first year at sea I didn't even hear that one anymore...

I don't know if anyone else can agree with me but I have great sleeps at sea, often comparable or better than what I get at home... Dont tell my D9 that though...  >


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## wildman0101 (18 Jan 2011)

I did ask you to PVT PM me regarg's your other post right.
Scoty B


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## NavyShooter (18 Jan 2011)

Re-circ pumps for the JP-5  right above 16 Mess.....gets real loud just as you're trying to sleep coming off the mids.


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## Snakedoc (18 Jan 2011)

Halifax Tar said:
			
		

> As well I would like to know what a day worker is and what this elusive animal looks like ?



JAG Officers while embarked? lol


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## Halifax Tar (18 Jan 2011)

Snakedoc said:
			
		

> JAG Officers while embarked? lol



That would make sense! I have only ever seen it once...And it was off Africa, must be indigenous to the flora and the fauna of the area... :nod:


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## Torlyn (18 Jan 2011)

SeaKingTacco said:
			
		

> And why, after the all night EMATTEX, do engineering drills need to be piped on the main broadcast at 0530?  Can the siren call of "Steering Gear Breakdown, Steering Gear Breakdown" not just be yelled in the MCR, since, by definition, it is a drill?  Or do I need to "practice" waking up?



From a STP MSEO, because one of the ships a few years ago had mishap with the drill, and when they piped "Engineering Emergency" x2, they didn't hit the main broadcast, they hit the drill button they'd been practicing with.  If navigationally safe, the OOW is supposed to stop the engines, and allow the engineers time to figure out / rectify the problem.  This wasn't done, speed wasn't taken off, and it caused a VERY expensive repair to a GT.  Thus, they now practice exactly the same way they should be reacting in a real emergency.  

Now, what you SHOULD be doing is figuring out why they do the drills at 530, and not 730-8am...  We used to hold off on ours until 730.  Much more civilized...


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## Occam (18 Jan 2011)

Torlyn said:
			
		

> We used to hold off on ours until 730.  Much more civilized...



What, and interfere with OOW maneuvers during breakfast?


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## Lumber (18 Jan 2011)

Occam said:
			
		

> What, and interfere with OOW maneuvers during breakfast?



At least there is breakfast is at 0730, and not 0630 like on Yank American warships. They love their extra early wakey wakey. Then again, as a subbie, I won't really have a concept of morning/evening/night will I?  :boring:


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## Pusser (19 Jan 2011)

SeaKingTacco said:
			
		

> And why, after the all night EMATTEX, do engineering drills need to be piped on the main broadcast at 0530?  Can the siren call of "Steering Gear Breakdown, Steering Gear Breakdown" not just be yelled in the MCR, since, by definition, it is a drill?  Or do I need to "practice" waking up?



I always kind of enjoyed the feeling of thinking, "Yay!  I get to ignore that one,"  and go back to sleep ZZZZZZZZZZZZ.....


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## Occam (19 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> I always kind of enjoyed the feeling of thinking, "Yay!  I get to ignore that one,"  and go back to sleep ZZZZZZZZZZZZ.....



I got the same feeling when hearing "Rescue Stations, Rescue Stations, Man overboard..."......zzzzzzzzzzzzz.  Kinda twisted when you think about it...


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## cobbler (19 Jan 2011)

Halifax Tar said:
			
		

> I wonder if the officer of the watch every knows how much they can piss off the galley and the crew when they do unscheduled OOWMs with out informing the galley who then watches the nights supper end up sculling about the galley...I watched this all go on the Toronto not too long ago! I have never seen a more mad P1 cook in my life! Delayed the feeding of the crew by 2 hours while cooks rushed to put together another meal lol



I gotta say though nothing is stopping the Quartermaster on the bridge from having a bit of initiative and picking up the phone, calling the galley and informing them when they see an OOWMANs or similar type serial beginning.

Wheras there is something stopping the OOW from doing it, the responsibility of driving 5000tons of warship in very close proximity to other 5000ton warships amongst RADHAZ, other contacts, navigation safety, constant reports to command, etc etc. 

OOWs, particuarly junior ones, are often under the pump with ALOT of important things taking thier attention, whilst a courtesy call below is a nice touch, it falls very very low on the list of priorities. As annoying as those serials are for the crew, I assure you for the trainee in the middle of the bridge with his rear enbd hanging out it is a million times worse.

Gotta ask why the pots and pans were not secured for sea in any case


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## kratz (19 Jan 2011)

Good point cobbler.




			
				cobbler said:
			
		

> Gotta ask why the pots and pans were not secured for sea in any case



Now your just  :stirpot: *grin*


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## Pusser (19 Jan 2011)

cobbler said:
			
		

> Gotta ask why the pots and pans were not secured for sea in any case



How exactly does one secure a pot of soup for sea?


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## Halifax Tar (19 Jan 2011)

cobbler said:
			
		

> Gotta ask why the pots and pans were not secured for sea in any case



lol It wasn't pots and pans it was pizzas that were caused to slide right out of their SECURE trays and racks all over the deck...

Remember when you don't take that 1 min to keep the lowers deckers informed we (CPOs and below) are the ones who will make or brake you for promotions and career aspirations... I have known more than one officer who's Nelson complex has been quickly torpedoed by the "commoners" below decks!

I also know that particular OOW was quickly visited to ensure that in the future when he decides to play silly buggers in an empty ocean that he inform the crew before hand.


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## Halifax Tar (19 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> How exactly does one secure a pot of soup for sea?



Exactly!


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## gcclarke (19 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> I always kind of enjoyed the feeling of thinking, "Yay!  I get to ignore that one,"  and go back to sleep ZZZZZZZZZZZZ.....



This is even more fun when your cabin-mate is the baby Engineering Officer by the way.


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## wildman0101 (19 Jan 2011)

Sorry mate's.  
Re: Reply 35
That was directed to:
thewildandelusivebacon
Regard: Gun Owner's
The wild and all the rest
Awaiting pvt pm. 
Will clarify then. Or Email.
Scoty B


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## Lumber (21 Jan 2011)

Annoying pipe to hear during work ups while you are sleeping: "Emergency Stations, Emergency Stations! Man Ov..... [pause for thought]....* Rescue Stations, Rescue Stations*! Man Overboard!" 

... damn bosn's mates under training... :brickwall:


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