# I have some questions



## Aidan (9 Jun 2018)

I am not a part of the armed forces in any capacity but I have an interest in joining. I'm not sure if this is the place but I was hoping some of you could tell me first hand what your experiences have been. 

You see, upon expressing my interest to my family to join I was met with a lot of discouragement. Most of what was said came down to this: "once you're in, you're in for the long haul; they can call you whenever something happens, etc. They own you, etc." 

It's been difficult to find too much information about this simply from reading around and so I was hoping to get some first hand experience on post-service life and everything that comes before. 

So:

Say you join the military for a few years and are discharged; do you have any further obligations at any time for any reason to the military thereafter? 

How would you rate your experience? Were your fellow soldiers, on the whole, good, virtuous people? (I've also been told that poor behaviour can run rampant) 

Do you think that you improved as a person? Have you ever felt you had to sacrifice something about yourself that you could never get back after doing your service? 

I want an honest outlook on what my experience could look like, please and thank you.


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## mariomike (9 Jun 2018)

Aidan said:
			
		

> You see, upon expressing my interest to my family to join I was met with a lot of discouragement.



How to get family on board  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/13678.0
20 pages.


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## Underway (9 Jun 2018)

Aidan said:
			
		

> I am not a part of the armed forces in any capacity but I have an interest in joining. I'm not sure if this is the place but I was hoping some of you could tell me first hand what your experiences have been.
> 
> You see, upon expressing my interest to my family to join I was met with a lot of discouragement. Most of what was said came down to this: "once you're in, you're in for the long haul; they can call you whenever something happens, etc. They own you, etc."



Lots of people think they know what the military is about but have never served.  Their information comes from rumour, second hand information and glorified US movies.  And it's generally wrong.

Once you're in you are in for the duration of your contract.  That can be a short as 3 years or as long as 10+ years, depending on the trade and the amount of money the military has put into you.  For Reservists you can quit by giving 30 days notice.  Regular forces there are other ways to get out if its not really the life for you, generally early in your training before to much has been invested in you.


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## Aidan (9 Jun 2018)

Thank you both for replying, in particular the linked thread was helpful. Ultimately, it is my decision so I think I will go through with it, and, after all, I won't really know what it will be like unless I do it myself.


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## mariomike (9 Jun 2018)

Aidan said:
			
		

> Thank you both for replying, in particular the linked thread was helpful.



You are welcome. Good luck.


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## Pusser (3 Jul 2018)

Underway said:
			
		

> Once you're in you are in for the duration of your contract.  That can be a short as 3 years or as long as 10+ years, depending on the trade and the amount of money the military has put into you.



NOBODY has to stay in for 10+ years.  I really wish recruiters would do a better job of explaining this.  There is a difference between "Terms of Service" (TOS - our "contracts"), which are often the numbers that are quoted and "Obligatory Service," which seems to be much misunderstood.  The key difference between the two is that TOS is how long we're willing to employ you (provided we don't throw you out - which is rare), while Obligatory Service is how long we insist you stay (even then, there are exceptions).  For the most part obligatory service is around three years if we don't provide you with any education (training is different).  If we subsidize your education, your obligatory service may increase (e.g. an ROTP candidate will generally have to serve at least four years after commissioning/graduation).  Generally, if you don't have any obligatory service remaining, you can be released within six months.  Note, however, that if you release prior to the completion of your TOS, there can be some penalties involved.


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## Loachman (3 Jul 2018)

Welcome to Army.ca, Aidan

Much of the information that you seek is already here, somewhere, on this Site. I'd recommend exploring existing relevant threads. You'll learn a lot more that way - and likely find answers to questions that have not even occurred to you yet - and save others from typing out the same answers yet again.

And everybody's experiences are different. You could read a few thousand detailed replies and still not know what to expect. There are far too many variables.

In short, though, If I could be seventeen again, I'd do it all over again.



			
				Pusser said:
			
		

> NOBODY has to stay in for 10+ years.



ROTP Pilots have twelve years of obligatory service - five for RMC and seven for Pilot training.


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## Pusser (3 Jul 2018)

Loachman said:
			
		

> ROTP Pilots have twelve years of obligatory service - five for RMC and seven for Pilot training.



No, they have seven years of obligatory service.  If they don't finish RMC or they fail or withdraw from pilot training, things can change.  If they switch out of pilot training while at RMC, their obligatory service will change.  Subsidized education plans (e.g. ROTP) are also a bit of an anomaly because obligatory service doesn't generally start until after the education is completed. My point though is that the periods of service often quoted as "contracts" are actually Terms of Service and that the amount of time you are required to serve is usually quite a bit shorter (notwithstanding that there may be penalties for releasing prior to the end of TOS).  To give myself as an (albeit dated) example:  I enrolled with a TOS of nine years of commissioned service, which on top of two years of subsidized education, would have made for a total of 11 years of service.  However, my obligatory service was only three years (after graduation/commissioning).  So, although my "contract" was for 11 years, I could have voluntarily and without issue released after five.


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## Loachman (4 Jul 2018)

Okay...

But the fellow at the desk next to mine, an RMC grad and about to leave for his next flying course, confirms that he has five years of obligatory service for his success at RMC, and will have a further seven years tacked on once attaining his Wings, for a total of twelve.

Yes, not completing his training would obviously change that, but I was not discussing failure.


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## Pusser (10 Jul 2018)

Loachman said:
			
		

> Okay...
> 
> But the fellow at the desk next to mine, an RMC grad and about to leave for his next flying course, confirms that he has five years of obligatory service for his success at RMC, and will have a further seven years tacked on once attaining his Wings, for a total of twelve.
> 
> Yes, not completing his training would obviously change that, but I was not discussing failure.


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## Posthumane (10 Jul 2018)

Loachman said:
			
		

> Okay...
> 
> But the fellow at the desk next to mine, an RMC grad and about to leave for his next flying course, confirms that he has five years of obligatory service for his success at RMC, and will have a further seven years tacked on once attaining his Wings, for a total of twelve.
> 
> Yes, not completing his training would obviously change that, but I was not discussing failure.


The seven years after attaining wings is Restricted Release, not obligatory service. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe obligatory service and a restricted release period can occur simultaneously. So in five years, the fellow at the desk next to yours will have finished his obligatory service and 5 of his seven years of restricted release (or however many years since he got his wings).


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## Loachman (10 Jul 2018)

When I went through - some time ago - it was five years of obligatory service post-Wings Grad. Restricted Release was not the term being used. RMC grads got that, _plus_ their RMC time.

I posed the question multiple times, and received the same answer each time: twelve years total, which was my previous understanding.

I shall ask a few others tomorrow.


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## Pusser (11 Jul 2018)

When I went through ROTP (when EVERYBODY wore a green uniform), it was four years obligatory service for most of us and (I believe) six years for pilots, but the obligatory service started on your commissioning date.  In other words, pilots only had to serve two additional years.  It's also worth noting that in many cases, pilots received their wings shortly after commissioning, because a lot of their flight training was conducted during the summer breaks between school years.

I'm wondering if our current sample case is lumping his school time in with his obligatory service (which would in effect be 12 years) in his calculations?  Kind of true, but not quite.  ROTP candidates will end up serving longer periods of "obligatory" service (sort of) than others, but they are in the minority.  Most CAF members are only required to serve for considerably shorter periods.  The key point is that folks need to understand the difference between obligatory service and their terms of service.


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## tomahawk6 (11 Jul 2018)

I come from a military family and my dad was opposed to me joining in 1972.He said I needed his permission,as I was 18 I disagreed.I enlisted and he asked to swear me in.Lol.


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