# You Want To Be A Pilot : 2018 - present



## CF_TOR

Gentlemen, learned quite a bit from this Forum, awesome source of information.

I am a 45 year old candidate, just applied for Pilot (DEO), and would like to clarify a few issues with you, hope you can help.

Have you ever heard of older candidates pursuing a Pilot career? Is it too late? Around 20 years ago I received my Commercial IFR Multi-Engine licenses but never pursued a civilian career, my licenses are expired but I will bring a strong basic knowledge to start. 

Last Friday I stopped by the Toronto recruiting center in North York and the recruiter informed me that it might take up to 5 years for a candidate to receive his/her wings from the start of application, is that correct??

My understanding, from this Forum and CAF's website, is that the total training would add up to approximately 21 months. Basic Training (15 weeks) plus the complete pilot training (around 17 months). Is it taking over two years to go through the whole application process?

My main option is to pursue a multi-engine (fixed wing) path, so how seriously do they take our first option? If I could pick only one option would be that (that's where my passion is), not too excited with rotary wing and I guess I am too old for jets anyway. 

Your feedback would be greatly appreciated, thank you.


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## mariomike

CF_TOR said:
			
		

> Have you ever heard of older candidates pursuing a Pilot career? Is it too late?



Some of the threads in this search discuss,  "Am I too old to become a pilot?"
https://www.google.com/search?rls=com.microsoft%3Aen-CA%3AIE-Address&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&ei=pU3qW4SnFamL5wLQ7K2IDQ&q=site%3Aarmy.ca+%22too+old%22+pilot&oq=site%3Aarmy.ca+%22too+old%22+pilot&gs_l=psy-ab.3...23590.30561..32058...0.0..0.92.555.7......0....1..gws-wiz.twj78YsWcVo




			
				CF_TOR said:
			
		

> My main option is to pursue a multi-engine (fixed wing) path, so how seriously do they take our first option?



"Can you choose what kind of aircraft you'd like to be trained in/fly full time?"
http://army.ca/forums/threads/12744.990;wap2

"so you can choose which airplane you want?"

Uncertain about going either multi or helo  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/69059.0

How is a Pilots aircraft chosen?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/120167.0

Do you have a choice between fighter/helo/multi ???  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/73253.0
2 pages.

Uncertain about going either multi or helo  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/69059.0/nowap.html
2 pages.

How is a Pilots aircraft chosen?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/120167.0

etc...



			
				Ditch said:
			
		

> There is also zero guarantee that you will get to fly the airframe of your choice (ie. Griffon, CF-18, Hercules).  It‘s all a matter of timing and your overall skill level.


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## Zoomie

I can’t believe the time that has passed since I wrote that post...


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## CF_TOR

Great, thank you.

To be honest the age issue is what concerns me the most... the dream to become a RCAF pilot is bigger than anything else.


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## mariomike

CF_TOR said:
			
		

> Great, thank you.



You are welcome. Good luck.  

As always, Recruiting is your most trusted source of official, up to date information.

"Unofficial site, not associated with DND or the Canadian Armed Forces."


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## Tennisball

My interviewer told me that I scored a bit above average on the CFAT and that will help me out on my application.

I emailed him to ask for details about my CFAT scores and he could only say that my application is "competitive" but couldn't tell me how good a chance I had against other applicants.

I did very well on ACS but he told me that ACS scores are only pass/fail and don't add to your competition list scoring.

Do I have a chance?


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## Spc_Cdt

CF_TOR said:
			
		

> Last Friday I stopped by the Toronto recruiting center in North York and the recruiter informed me that it might take up to 5 years for a candidate to receive his/her wings from the start of application, is that correct??



Not a recruiter but I recently came back from aircrew selection, where the pilot giving the Realistic Job Preview presentation said "there's one very important thing that recruiters fail to mention: it can take 3-4 years to get your wings AND THEN you add the 7 years of mandatory service". So it's at least a 10 year commitment. By no means should that discourage anyone from applying, but it's just a reality check that they wanted to give us... cuz they don't want people quitting halfway. If you really want to be a pilot, then this doesn't matter. But for me, as an older applicant (36) that was humming and hawing between pilot and ACSO, it solidified my resolve for pursuing the latter.


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## CF_TOR

Spc_Cdt said:
			
		

> "there's one very important thing that recruiters fail to mention: it can take 3-4 years to get your wings AND THEN you add the 7 years of mandatory service". So it's at least a 10 year commitment.



Personally I have no problem with the 7-yr commitment, as long as I am flying and enjoying it. 

My issue is the "3-yr" process until you get your wings.


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## SupersonicMax

Two of those three years will be spent training.  Only 1 year of wait being paid 40k+ a year.  Not too bad.


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## CF_TOR

SupersonicMax said:
			
		

> Two of those three years will be spent training.  Only 1 year of wait being paid 40k+ a year.  Not too bad.



Then, that's not that bad at all !!!!!!!


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## Spc_Cdt

Tennisball said:
			
		

> My interviewer told me that I scored a bit above average on the CFAT and that will help me out on my application.
> 
> I emailed him to ask for details about my CFAT scores and he could only say that my application is "competitive" but couldn't tell me how good a chance I had against other applicants.
> 
> I did very well on ACS but he told me that ACS scores are only pass/fail and don't add to your competition list scoring.
> 
> Do I have a chance?



Dude, if you passed ACS then you have a chance cuz they're so desperately in need of pilots (and ACS is "the easiest part of getting your wings", as they say). Once you get on the competition list then you're pretty much golden... it's just a waiting game (and it's killing me lol).

They can't really tell you how competitive you are against other applicants because it's a relative scale. As the recruiter told me: "you can be #4 on the list and then someone gets hired, so you're at #3 -- but then someone gets on the list who's more competitive and you end up back at #4, and so forth and so on until you get an offer" 

ACS was the big hurdle and you passed it. Congrats!


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## SupersonicMax

Spc_Cdt said:
			
		

> Dude, if you passed ACS then you have a chance cuz they're so desperately in need of pilots (and ACS is "the easiest part of getting your wings", as they say). Once you get on the competition list then you're pretty much golden... it's just a waiting game (and it's killing me lol).
> 
> They can't really tell you how competitive you are against other applicants because it's a relative scale. As the recruiter told me: "you can be #4 on the list and then someone gets hired, so you're at #3 -- but then someone gets on the list who's more competitive and you end up back at #4, and so forth and so on until you get an offer"
> 
> ACS was the big hurdle and you passed it. Congrats!



We are not short of new pilots, we arw short of experienced pilot.  Recruiting more will not help the experiencd piece.


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## Dailyrcaf123

Spc_Cdt said:
			
		

> Dude, if you passed ACS then you have a chance cuz they're so desperately in need of pilots (and ACS is "the easiest part of getting your wings", as they say). Once you get on the competition list then you're pretty much golden... it's just a waiting game (and it's killing me lol).



There is absolutely no guarantee that you get an offer just because you made it on the competition list. Many people pass ACS, and not many spots are available for pilot. When I got on the comp list, the recruiter told me that I was competitive and should be getting an offer. That was one year ago... and still no offer.


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## Spc_Cdt

Dailyrcaf123 said:
			
		

> There is absolutely no guarantee that you get an offer just because you made it on the competition list.



I'm just going with what the recruiter told me. He said if I made the list then I can expect an offer. It might take years, and they'll ask if I want to stay on the list, but one will come -- as long as the position is open.


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## CF_TOR

Hi everyone... What exactly is a Target Interview (TI) and the difference from a regular interview? 

THANK YOU !!!


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## Chris4e

Anyone going to Trenton on the 21st?


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## rcafthrowaway2017

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone could speak on quality of life differences between the Pilot and ACSO occupations. Would you say the two experience similar working conditions throughout their respective careers, or are there some tangible differences?

Thank you


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## Swaggarius

Hello everyone, I have a couple of questions regarding the pilot occupation.
I'm graduating in a couple of months from McGill University with a Bachelors of Science.
I was looking to apply to be a pilot at the CAF and was wondering how hard it is to get in (there is a shortage I heard) and
how long is the process. I have been in the Infantry Reserves before for 2 years so I have already completed my BMQ and I don't think I have to redo it.


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## kratz

FY 2019 / 2020 has 79 positions open for DEO.
As with all CAF trades, shortages do not necessarily mean positions can and will be filled.
Due to your reserve time, your old records will be pulled from archives by CFRG and a VFS
(verification of former service) will automatically be part of your application. 
If you haven't completed PLQ before releasing from the reserve, you will complete part of BMOQ.


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## Swaggarius

Can I begin my application before finishing university or do I have to wait till I get my diploma? I'm graduating in Fall 2019.


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## kratz

You can apply anytime.

The length of time for the application process varies. Keep your CFRC aware of your graduation date and any changes in your situation.


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## jsmith

This thread has benefited me greatly. I have been lurking on here for years. I want to return the favour by transcribing my experience of my Pilot application thus far to the best of my memory's ability.

I graduated from uWaterloo with a Bachelor of Mathematics, took that $50k piece of paper straight to the CFRC and said "put my name in the hat."

6 months later, I got booked for my CFAT. Barely slept that night. The day of, my eyes were black bags. Anyway, passed for all trades. It was considerably harder than what I was expecting it to be. Gut check. Oh well. Let's go with it.

6 months later, I got booked for Aircrew Selection at CFB Trenton. I'm from the Greater Toronto Area. I drove there. Full heartedly ugly cried in the car from happiness on the 401 E, before I even got there. I was just grateful for even being given the chance to pursue my dream. It was becoming realer and realer. Cool.

Sunday:
Arrived Sunday at xx:yy. The accommodation is called Yukon Lodge (65 Yukon St). You can Google it. It's basically a perfectly clean hotel. No wi-fi. There is an Ethernet drop in all rooms. Bring your own Ethernet cable. I tested the speed: 5 Mb/s down and Spotify is blocked...  You get three (3) meals per day at the Galley next door. I never went. I just went to McD's and Tim's and Canex to buy food. By the way, the base is fully navigable by Google Maps. It's like a university campus. You can drive into it and nobody will care as long as you don't look out of place. Yukon lodge front desk told me to show up at CFASC at xx:yy. Okay. Couldn't sleep. Got maybe 4.5 hours of broken sleep.

Monday:
Black bags under my eyes. Bad sleep. xx:yy, we all (14 to 16-ish of us, I didn't count) show up and sit in the lounge as can be seen in the pictures of CFASC on the CF website and such. Lots of B.C. boys. Cool. Some cadets with glider experience. Only 1 girl, unfortunately... CFASC staff were very friendly. Anyway, we get briefed, they broke it down aka "good luck eh bud. These tests have successfully reduced the failure rate in Phase I of Pilot training. For a reason. They're hard." Okay. 4 hours of computerized testing. Jesus. Designed to discourage and overwhelm. Listen to my advice: Behave like a computer. If there's too much going on, don't react with any human emotion. Do whatever and/or however much you can do. Don't worry about anything that you let slip up 500 milliseconds ago. Just move on. It's nearly impossible to perform great on all the tests. Honest. In aviation, they say when something bad is happening, the first thing you do is "FLY THE PLANE." Adapt that mentality to the tests. That's what they're looking for. They want to know that you have the ability to not lock up mentally and freeze and stare at the screen with an elevated heart rate. If you fail any given objective, just MOVE ON and perform AS HARD AS YOU CAN for the next objective. I felt like I was being KILLED for a SIGNIFICANT chunk of the tests. Make sure you can do reasonably difficult math in your head. Learn all of the mental arithmetic tricks. When I walked out for my first break, the other guys asked me how I was doing and I just said "I refuse to comment. I'll know tomorrow." We had lunch. We got a bus to the control tower. It was SICK. We exchanged questions and comments for a full 20-25 mins. AECs were so friendly and down to earth. They scrambled some Hornets for our entertainment. Just kidding. I wish. They were very very very relaxed in there. That's the attitude you need to pass Aircrew Selection, btw. They had one of the SAR birds circle the tower a few times for us. It was SICK. They let us out on the cat walk outside while the bird was circling the tower. It was SICK, did I mention? I think I did. After that, the bus took us back to Yukon Lodge. The rest of the day is free. Relax, eat, go to bed early. Saw an actual SAR tech in an orange flight suit. Couldn't stop staring. Btw, they sell literally everything in the universe at Canex. Drove to Jiffy Lube to change my car's oil and got a haircut to take my mind off of things. Went to Wal Mart to buy some fruits and food. Got a full 9 hours that night. I was relaxed.

Tuesday:
Wake up, check out of Yukon Lodge, show up at xx:yy and head straight to the testing room. Another 4 hours. I think I found the second day a little bit easier than the first. I don't know. Doesn't matter. We returned to the candidate lounge. They started calling us in one by one to a selection person's office. We were told simply whether or not we passed, and for which trades. They gave us a piece of paper with the result. Result is valid for 5 years. If you fail, you need to wait 12 months before re-testing. You get a maximum of 3 attempts in your life. They will tell you which domains you demonstrated strength in. If you ask, they will also tell you which domains were the worst. Pilots need to pass all domains and achieve a certain overall score. ACSOs and AECs need to achieve a certain overall score ONLY. That means, if ACSO and AEC candidates utterly get murdered in one domain, but perform great in another, you can still consider yourself safe. You're going after an overall score. Each test is weighed differently for all three trades. Therefore, it's possible to pass for AEC, but not ACSO or Pilot, for example. Myself and 3 or 4 others passed for Pilot. I don't have an exact count. Some of the guys made a B line straight to the front door as soon as they were given their results. We assumed they failed. After all candidates were briefed, the successful Pilot candidates were taken to a room with anthropometric measuring equipment. That took all of 2 minutes. They measured some dimensions of my thighs and knees and spine to determine which airframes I can safely fit in. I fit in all airframes.  Staff asked me what I wanted to fly, I said "it doesn't matter, it's an honour and a privilege to even be here right now." Flight suit guy responded with "good answer." lol. I thanked the CFASC staff for running the joint. It was good. I said bye and walked to my car and drove back home.

Aftermath:
Contacted CFRC. They said it typically takes 2 to 3 weeks after passing CFASC for the first medical and interview to be booked. Followed by a Phase II medical for aircrew candidates. After that, I can expect an offer. A year of waiting in the Competition/Merit list is typical. It's fine. I have a job right now. I told my supervisor EVERYTHING and he is highly supportive. Man wears a Tavares jersey every Friday. lol. I'm grateful.

TL;DR: The tests are discouraging and overwhelming. It's up to you to act appropriately about past failures by disregarding them and focusing on the current objective that matters at that point in time.

I've read many posts like this on forums, but I never thought I'd be in a position to write one myself. I'm grateful.


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## Sub_Guy

John Smith said:
			
		

> I never went. I just went to McD's and Tim's and Canex to buy food.
> 
> ACSOs and AECs need to achieve a certain overall score ONLY. That means, if ACSO and AEC candidates utterly get murdered in one domain, but perform great in another, you can still consider yourself safe. You're going after an overall score.



The food at the base kitchen is actually pretty decent.

As for the ACSO/AEC did they change things?   Went I went there for my ACS you could pass over all but if you failed a domain it was a headshot (for ACSOs).


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## observor 69

Thanks for the report Mr.Smith. Nice to read of your experience. Best of luck as you move forward towards your goal.


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## Duffman118

Hello all, 

I have been monitoring this forum for years and am happy to say I recently joined the competition list for DEO at beginning of February. I was just curious if anyone knows when they will start the selection process for the 79 candidates this year and how many people are selected at one time?

Thank you!


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## Redhead8989

I'm wondering if anyone can give me a proper breakdown of the pilot training?

I'm currently an NCM and looking to apply to UTPNCM this upcoming year. I'll have to go to St. Jean to finish BMOQ as I don't have PLQ. After I finish my degree what is after that?

I know there is an 8 month course in Moose Jaw followed by choosing your airframe type upon completion (fighter, multi-engine or rotary). I would like to rotary on the Cyclones (if possible).

What is the training for this path fir this route?


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## kratz

*PFT* (Primary Flight Training)  
*BFT* (Basic Flight Training)  
*AFT* (Advance Flight Training) : awarded your Wings upon graduation
Posting to OTU (Operational Training Unit) 

There are ideal lengths of time for each phase, but factors such as sick days, weather, aircraft repairs ect...can lengthen your personal experience.


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## Redhead8989

Thanks! Any idea the lengths of each course? Or locations? All I could find on the forces site was 8 months in Moose Jaw.


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## Loachman

Just out of curiosity, have you read through this and other relevant threads and still not been able to find out? If you haven't, I suggest that you do. You'll learn far more that way.

I went through this process a few decades ago, and some things have changed since then, but PFT (Musketeer - and I was on the first batch of Musketeers; there was a second buy when those wore out, and then the Slingsby Firefly, and now the Grob) was 2 to 2.5 months long, as was Basic Hel (Jet Ranger), and BFT (Tutor, then, and now Harvard) was ten months for those of us fortunate to go hel and a year for those not. Some of the hel guys are doing an extended Grob course now instead of flying the Harvard, which makes more sense.

Course times have likely not changed too much, but the gaps between courses has. When I went through, it was about a smooth two-year process, with only a few weeks between courses, plus six for Aeromedical, Land, and Sea Survival Training. I'm not sure what the current average is, but it's far less civilized. The OTU wait for one particular helicopter is about two years. Be patient, and bring a book.


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## Mozartkart

Just thought I'd let every hopeful recruit know that the new DEO pilot numbers have been reduced to 16 for the fiscal year. I believe one person was already selected leaving 15 slots (94%).


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## hiking

I am curious, where did you get this information ? It is quite a drop from what they announced earlier this year.


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## Mozartkart

hiking said:
			
		

> I am curious, where did you get this information ? It is quite a drop from what they announced earlier this year.



Heard a rumour so I called my recruiting centre to ask. They confirmed the drop in DEO Pilot intake numbers. No reason given as to why but I am guessing it might have to do with a training back log maybe? Or maybe they are hoping to entice back experience pilots with their new pilot retainment ideas that they are talking about and don't want to take on way more recruits if they can bring in experience people? Once again the reason is all speculation on my part but the numbers are correct as of at least 2 weeks ago.


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## Loachman

The former far more than the latter, if for no more valid reason.

The latter will have no more effect that its two-decade-older precedent, and for the same reasons.


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## K1tesurf

Another thing is that new trade coming out to fill the pilot desk positions will probably greatly
Reduce the positions available for pilots and thus, the recruiting numbers.


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## BurmaShave

K1tesurf said:
			
		

> Another thing is that new trade coming out to fill the pilot desk positions will probably greatly
> Reduce the positions available for pilots and thus, the recruiting numbers.



Air Ops isn't going to cut recruiting, it's just going (ideally) free up aircrew. Make good some of the shortages.

We're reducing New Wings Grad production for a few reasons. 1, Phase II was overloaded by the push the last 2 years (and ugly winter wx) and needs to unsurge. 2, it turns out a mass orgy of FOs and Wingmen with minimal hours was not the solution to the pilot shortage, and has just made more problems.

Fewer NWGs means fewer enrollees. Remains to be seen how long or drastic the slowdown is. Best of luck.


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## Capfiddich

Was told from my CFRC that pilot numbers were shortened to a total of 16 for this year with 7 remaining as of today. Quite different from the 15 left from before, after waiting for so long I'm thinking of applying for the other aircrew trades now.


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## Duffman118

Capfiddich said:
			
		

> Was told from my CFRC that pilot numbers were shortened to a total of 16 for this year with 7 remaining as of today. Quite different from the 15 left from before, after waiting for so long I'm thinking of applying for the other aircrew trades now.



I know wait times differ drastically based on a great variety of factors but how long have you waited if you dont mind me asking? 

I've only just joined the comp list in March and am just trying to get a "rough" idea of the expected wait time.. I assume that the wait just got longer if the above info is correct.

I was also wondering if anyone knows if I need to redo the target interview and pilot medical each year... I did my first job interview last August, my last medical in Toronto was November.

Thank you!


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## Mozartkart

Duffman118 said:
			
		

> I know wait times differ drastically based on a great variety of factors but how long have you waited if you don't mind me asking?
> 
> I've only just joined the comp list in March and am just trying to get a "rough" idea of the expected wait time. I assume that the wait just got longer if the above info is correct.
> 
> I was also wondering if anyone knows if I need to redo the target interview and pilot medical each year... I did my first job interview last August, my last medical in Toronto was November.
> 
> Thank you!



I got on the competition list earlier this year so in the same boat as you. You have to redo your interview and basic medical every year (so you'll have to redo your interview in August for example). I think the aircrew medical is good for two years though. 
And it is very hard to give you a rough idea of the expected wait time. That depends on a lot of factors and how competitive the merit list is. Some people say if you get on the list it's just a matter of time but that is a very optimistic look. The competition list is just that, a ranked list of applicants that they will select starting with the most competitive. And who knows when they will select those pilots, they could select them all at the end of the year for all we know. So in the meantime keep physical and in good health, but also keep working on your personal life and career. That way if an offer comes, you are ready to go, but if one doesn't come anytime soon you haven't put your life on hold waiting. But if you want an idea of wait times, I know people that were selected for DEO pilot in 3 months, and I know someone who was selected after 3 years so who knows how long it'll take.


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## Capfiddich

Duffman118 said:
			
		

> I know wait times differ drastically based on a great variety of factors but how long have you waited if you dont mind me asking?
> 
> I've only just joined the comp list in March and am just trying to get a "rough" idea of the expected wait time.. I assume that the wait just got longer if the above info is correct.
> 
> I was also wondering if anyone knows if I need to redo the target interview and pilot medical each year... I did my first job interview last August, my last medical in Toronto was November.
> 
> Thank you!



I got on the list early last year and been waiting since then. Waiting doesn't mean anything and the people who come after you can take the spot as it competitive so it's a good idea to have back-up plan if it doesn't work.


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## Sub_Guy

RicoSalva said:
			
		

> i also want to be a pilot but my parents dont allow me. How can i convince them?



Are you trolling?   Seriously, I don’t know of any adults who wouldn’t let their kids become pilots.

Anyway.  Let them know you are entering a profession that is in demand, well paid, and eventually you might be able to get them free flights (if you move on after your RCAF obligations)..   Plus you’ll be moving out of their house!

My bot senses are tingling..


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## Loachman

If he's young enough to require parental consent, yes, that can be an obstacle - there are many otherwise intelligent parents who would not grant consent for their children to join the Armed Forces. He'd need a degree as well, which could mean consent for RMC.

RicoSalva - There is a Getting Parents Onboard (or something like that) thread somewhere on this Fine Site. I'd suggest a read through that for some ideas. I'd also suggest exploring other relevant threads as well. There is a ton of useful information here ripe for the plucking.

Flying training is extremely demanding. You may as well get used to doing homework by researching here. You'll also likely find answers to many questions before they even occur to you.

You have two choices, as I see it: Build a case so persuasive that your parents cannot refuse the necessary consent, or wait until you no longer require it.

It's worth whatever it takes. _Well_ worth whatever it takes.


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## hiking

Does any one know how long is the wait between the training phase at the moment? Is there a lot of pilot candidate waiting on the list for PFT.? Thank you.


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## Carf

hiking said:
			
		

> Does any one know how long is the wait between the training phase at the moment? Is there a lot of pilot candidate waiting on the list for PFT.? Thank you.



For DEO, yes. For CEOTP/ROTP, no.


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## mapleyankee

First time poster here. I'm having trouble opening up some of the links to the anecdotal threads with answers to common questions (says I don't have permission to read them). Is it because I don't have any posts on this forum?  

I'm 39, a Canadian citizen living in the 'States, Bachelors degree in Business Administration, and my FAA PPL. I'll have my instrument rating completed in two months. If I pass all of these assessments, should I get to skip PFT or must I start to learn how to fly like I did 24 years ago? I'm  quite competent at the controls, own my own complex aircraft (Mooney), and fly regularly.


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## BurmaShave

mapleyankee said:
			
		

> First time poster here. I'm having trouble opening up some of the links to the anecdotal threads with answers to common questions (says I don't have permission to read them). Is it because I don't have any posts on this forum?
> 
> I'm 39, a Canadian citizen living in the 'States, Bachelors degree in Business Administration, and my FAA PPL. I'll have my instrument rating completed in two months. If I pass all of these assessments, should I get to skip PFT or must I start to learn how to fly like I did 24 years ago? I'm  quite competent at the controls, own my own complex aircraft (Mooney), and fly regularly.



You'll have to Phase I if you don't have a CPL or equivalent. Either way, you're going to have to relearn how to fly, on Phase I or Phase II. I thought civvie flying would prepare me...no way b'y.


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## Dingodan

Just so everyone is aware -

I spoke to my recruiter today and they said all pilot positions are filled until next fiscal year.


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## FIFO

Dingodan said:
			
		

> Just so everyone is aware -
> 
> I spoke to my recruiter today and they said all pilot positions are filled until next fiscal year.



I assume you declined the offer back in 2015 then? Have you been trying to get a pilot slot since? I'm just curious as you've been in the recruiting system for a decade.


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## The Log Driver

Dingodan said:
			
		

> Just so everyone is aware -
> 
> I spoke to my recruiter today and they said all pilot positions are filled until next fiscal year.



Confirming the above: A couple days ago my RC said that Pilot and ACSO positions were filled for this year.


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## xxphoenixx

Just got a call from my recruitment center, they said all Pilot spots are full right through 2020, so any potential spots would only be for 2021 and won't hear about those for a while. So much for a pilot shortage


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## Good2Golf

...a pilot ‘throughput’ shortage...


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## m9322

xxpheonixx - Is that only for DEO, or all entry plans?

I fairly recently got an offer through the CEOTP program for this year, even though I'd previously heard rumours about recruiting centres saying the spots were full.


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## xxphoenixx

m9322 - yep, DEO


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## ssrb653

hey xxphoenixx, when did you get your offer for CEOTP? When had you applied for it?


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## Insane_Coconut

Hey guys,

I completed the air crew selection test and passed for pilot earlier this year and at the time they made it very clear that my results were valid for 5 years. This was about 7 months ago. I have now just been informed by CFRC that the results are valid for only 3 years. Anyone know when this change was made? Has there been a mistake?

Kind regards


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## jsmith

Hi all,
In mid-January '20, CFRC Toronto told me FY20/21 has 11 DEO pilot spots. Does anybody have any information to add? I couldn't find any intake numbers for the upcoming fiscal year on these forums.
Thanks much.
Edit: Follow-up question: I asked CFRC Toronto if they know when the first round of DEO pilot selections takes place for a given fiscal year. The person that I spoke to didn't have an answer. Does anybody on this forum have any information about that? Thanks much.


----------



## Drallib

Insane_Coconut said:
			
		

> Hey guys,
> 
> I completed the air crew selection test and passed for pilot earlier this year and at the time they made it very clear that my results were valid for 5 years. This was about 7 months ago. I have now just been informed by CFRC that the results are valid for only 3 years. Anyone know when this change was made? Has there been a mistake?
> 
> Kind regards



I passed my Aircrew Selection Test in November and they told me they were valid for 5 years.



			
				John Smith said:
			
		

> Hi all,
> In mid-January '20, CFRC Toronto told me FY20/21 has 11 DEO pilot spots. Does anybody have any information to add? I couldn't find any intake numbers for the upcoming fiscal year on these forums.
> Thanks much.



I heard (not confirmed) that numbers were 11 DEO, 25 CEOTP, 28 ROTP for 2021.


----------



## jsmith

Drallib said:
			
		

> I heard (not confirmed) that numbers were 11 DEO, 25 CEOTP, 28 ROTP for 2021.



Where'd you hear it from?


----------



## Drallib

Someone in the CAF that heard it from someone at the DPRG, or something like that...

(I know a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy...)


----------



## jsmith

Drallib said:
			
		

> (I know a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy...)


 :rofl:


----------



## Eye In The Sky

Drallib said:
			
		

> Someone in the CAF that heard it from someone at the DPRG, or something like that...



What is DPRG...is it a sub-org of CMP like DPGR is?


----------



## Drallib

Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> What is DPRG...is it a sub-org of CMP like DPGR is?



DPGR maybe? Lol I don%u2019t know. %u201CThose people%u201D in Ottawa. Irregardless (not a word), those are the numbers I heard. This waiting is difficult. Seems like last year people started hearing results in late March / early April, which years prior to that people were hearing result a lot later. So it could be worse!

Good luck to all. 

EDIT: Yes, DPGR!


----------



## Tiwill123

Hi everyone,
I am a new member on here and i have followed the forum for a few months now. I have a few questions regarding the kind of things the recruiters look for in the CV of candidates. I did the ACS test in November 2019 and I havent reached the score to pass it. So until i redo it, im trying to do stuff to make my resume and experiences even better until I pass my interview. So, do you guys have any ideas what are the best stuff to do? 
Also, im trying to get in with the ROTP program.

Thank you, 

Tiwill123


----------



## Duffman118

Just spoke with my recruiter office. Deo is 11 spots... I'm going into years three of competition list this March. According to them pilot positions are becoming even more competitive.


----------



## jsmith

Duffman118 said:
			
		

> I'm going into years three of competition list this March.


Has your CFRC ever given you an idea of how well you're currently ranked on the competition list? Have they ever implied anything to you, to give you a better understanding of where you stand? I'm just curious, because I'm nervous myself.
Also, which CFRC detachment is your application being processed in?


----------



## Duffman118

John Smith said:
			
		

> Has your CFRC ever given you an idea of how well you're currently ranked on the competition list? Have they ever implied anything to you, to give you a better understanding of where you stand? I'm just curious, because I'm nervous myself.
> Also, which CFRC detachment is your application being processed in?



I was told last Sept during second interview extreamly vaguely that I am "about" right in the middle of the competition list out of the ppl that had completed all required prerequisites for pilot at the time (ie aircrew/medical/interview).. unfortunately I dont think I would fall into the top 11 but I'm being extremely optimistic since it's my (and I assume all.other applicants) dream job.


----------



## Drallib

Duffman118 said:
			
		

> Just spoke with my recruiter office. Deo is 11 spots... I'm going into years three of competition list this March. According to them pilot positions are becoming even more competitive.



I think it was 16 for FY 19/20. I heard it was 11 for FY 20/21 as well. So yeah it's getting more competitive.


----------



## yolotuber

hi,

Get high marks at school , so you become competitive for Kingston , Practice a lot to pass the ACS , volunteer and sports, but don’t focus too much on that. In my experience once you pass acs and you are good at school you get a slot for pilot rmc.


----------



## FSTG

The demand for baby pilots was reduced significantly. I was contacted in January to tell me they have raised the requirements for pilot and i was no longer admissible for now.

I was scheduled for my interview a week earlier after passing the tests in Trenton and the recruiter told me that i had good odds since my overall file score was above the last offer.

It's a bit frustrating since my first aircrew selection test was canceled and delayed for 6 months but i'll keep trying for a couple years (i'm getting older tho at 30 y.o). Hopefully they lower the requirements back to normal once the demand will grow a little.

I work at a big four as an engineer and i just cant stop thinking about this, truly feels like a calling.


----------



## Drallib

FSTG said:
			
		

> The demand for baby pilots was reduced significantly. I was contacted in January to tell me they have raised the requirements for pilot and i was no longer admissible for now.
> 
> I was scheduled for my interview a week earlier after passing the tests in Trenton and the recruiter told me that i had good odds since my overall file score was above the last offer.
> 
> It's a bit frustrating since my first aircrew selection test was canceled and delayed for 6 months but i'll keep trying for a couple years (i'm getting older tho at 30 y.o). Hopefully they lower the requirements back to normal once the demand will grow a little.
> 
> I work at a big four as an engineer and i just cant stop thinking about this, truly feels like a calling.



Thanks for the heads up.

What did you apply through? DEO? ROTP?

I just did my ACS this past November, medical in December, but haven't been told anything. I'm hearing rumours about them not taking any CEOTP internal candidates. I really wish there was some information passed on to people about what's going on. Maybe no news is good news.


----------



## FSTG

Drallib said:
			
		

> Thanks for the heads up.
> 
> What did you apply through? DEO? ROTP?



I applied as DEO. Last year was 16 positions for 2019/2020 and 11 for 2020/2021... so yeah i can understand why they raised the requirements.


----------



## Xylric

I received a letter outlining the minor medical concerns which render me currently unsuitable in January of 2019. Having been working to resolve those issues, I was going to start the process of trying again this year, but for the pandemic. At least that gives me time to be absolutely certain that those concerns are entirely resolved.


----------



## jsmith

Hey y'all.

Just came back from my CFRC. Asked the guy behind counter how many DEO Pilot slots there are available right now (22 Sep 2020). He said more than 1, less than 10. He had the exact number on his computer screen, but wouldn't tell me.  :-X

Anybody know anything about intake numbers right about now?

Thanks much.


----------



## Drallib

John Smith said:
			
		

> Hey y'all.
> 
> Just came back from my CFRC. Asked the guy behind counter how many DEO Pilot slots there are available right now (22 Sep 2020). He said more than 1, less than 10. He had the exact number on his computer screen, but wouldn't tell me.  :-X
> 
> Anybody know anything about intake numbers right about now?
> 
> Thanks much.



Not sure if you read my previous comment, but I removed it because I misunderstood your questions...

You're wondering how many are remaining for this current year. 

As of last week, there were 5 out of 11 spots taken. So 6 remain! Hope this helps.  ;D


----------



## junker2122

1. I had a call with a recruiting officer saying that CEOTP-pilot was not opened for application for the year 2021/2022. I am 19 years old and failed the ACS once two years ago. I also declined an offer to go to RMC and join as an AERE because I wanted to reapply.  I don't know if the recruiters are just lazy or it is true that Seneca is not an option this year.

2. Is joining the reserve a good idea prior to applying for pilot in the CAF? I heard that the CT can be a long process and that joining for another trade can enhance the chances to not be selected or be delayed for a greater amount of time for the ACS.

Thanks.


----------



## Drallib

junker2122 said:
			
		

> 1. I had a call with a recruiting officer saying that CEOTP-pilot was not opened for application for the year 2021/2022. I am 19 years old and failed the ACS once two years ago. I also declined an offer to go to RMC and join as an AERE because I wanted to reapply.  I don't know if the recruiters are just lazy or it is true that Seneca is not an option this year.
> 
> 2. Is joining the reserve a good idea prior to applying for pilot in the CAF? I heard that the CT can be a long process and that joining for another trade can enhance the chances to not be selected or be delayed for a greater amount of time for the ACS.
> 
> Thanks.



Hey Junker.

First, CEOTP-Pilot at Seneca isn't continuing I believe. One reason programs like that, as well as DEO, are cutting on numbers or stopping all together is because those candidates begin flight training almost immediately which increases the amount of pilots awaiting training. Programs like ROTP and UTPNCM (internal applicants) are continuing because those candidates have to complete schooling prior to beginning flight training, allowing more pilots awaiting training to go through the flight training. 

I hope this makes sense.

Second, I wanted to go Pilot upon graduating high school but I didn't want to spend another semester upgrading my marks in order to go to RMC. I joined as a Combat Engineer at 19 years old in the Reserves and put in my Component Transfer for ACS Tech. From applying to my transfer to the RCAF was almost 2 years. Another 2 years of training in Borden (which now is longer due to the amount of personnel awaiting training), and then another 2 years of becoming Operationally Qualified, and now completing 4 University Courses on my own time, and applying through UTPNCM, only to go to RMC for 4 years, and then flight training for another 4 years... I'll be in my mid-30's as a Winged Pilot at my first unit.

If I were you, I would try for Pilot now. If not, join RMC as an AERE and try the ACS in Trenton again. You have an idea of what the test is like. And how to prepare.

Good luck! Maybe (hopefully) we'll cross paths in Flight Training. I applied for UTPNCM this year and could be at RMC in the Fall.


----------



## junker2122

Thank you very much. Do you know how many slots pilot trade have this year for ROTP applicants. I know this is probably classified info, bot if someone have an insight it would be nice to know.

Thanks.


----------



## Zoomie

Why does it matter?  You've stated that your Aircrew Selection was not successful - when is your next attempt?  If it is later than what you need to apply for ROTP - just apply to another trade at RMC and then VOT to Pilot while at school.


----------



## dimsum

Ditch said:
			
		

> Why does it matter?  You've stated that your Aircrew Selection was not successful - when is your next attempt?  If it is later than what you need to apply for ROTP - just apply to another trade at RMC and then VOT to Pilot while at school.



...unless your trade is "red" (ie. very low numbers of people) so they are loathe to let people leave the trade, untrained or not.  

OP, if you declined RMC I don't know if they'll take you again this year.  Are you set on a paid university program?  If not (and you have the funds to do so), go to university on your own dime and apply for Pilot again next time.


----------



## junker2122

Thanks a lot!!


----------



## Newbie2020

Hi,

I am new to this forum. 

Have a strong desire to be a Pilot in Canadian forces. Where can I find more information about Salaries and benefits of various Pilot roles. 

Appreciate all responses in advance!

Thanks


----------



## SupersonicMax

Pay: https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/services/benefits-military/pay-pension-benefits/pay/officers.html

Aircrew Allowance: https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/corporate/policies-standards/compensation-benefits-instructions/chapter-205-allowances-for-officers-and-non-commissioned-members.html#sec-32


----------



## FSTG

I talked to a recruiter today and it should be about 20 DEO spots for PLT 2021-2022. There is a major backlog in BMQ and officer training that slow the process. They told me to contact them again in april. Been 3 years now that i'm in the process. Super bad timing i guess.


----------



## PuckChaser

There's a major backlog in every training process in the CAF, it's not unique to Pilot although backlogs in flight training are now compounded with the COVID backlogs.


----------



## Cardinal177

If there are 20 DEO spots for FY 21-22, anyone knows for the other programs, specifically the in-svc ones?


----------



## PuckChaser

In Service Selection numbers are available on the DWAN on the DPGR intranet site. They cannot be shared here.


----------



## Drallib

I don't think the numbers on the DPGR site are up to date. The latest date I see is July 2019.


----------



## PuckChaser

The pandemic got in the way. At any rate, do those numbers actually matter? If there's no context to them (how many people applied, how many people made it to the board), then it really doesn't matter if there's 5 spots or 50 spots for ISS. A more important number would be the OUTCAP of the trade you're leaving and it's general trend of PML health as to whether that OUTCAP will go up or down year to year.


----------



## Eye In The Sky

Just to add, those OT OUTCAP numbers don't apply to NCM trades/pers that are applying for Commissioning thru UTPNCM, as an example.

For anyone who is ISS and wants to read the info, do a search for and go to the _DPGR site (Director Personnel Generation Requirements) _IntraNet/DWAN site.  Once you're there, go to _Production Reports_, and read the _Basic Production Documents (BPD) _section.

You might search on this forum and see references to "trade health" and people talking about Green/Yellow(Amber)/Red trades.  That is the old version of "Critical/Caution/OK" status when talking about TES to PML ration...which has a direct bearing on OUTCAP numbers.  You'll notice the OUTCAP is still using...green...yellow..and red in the Forecast column.


----------



## Drallib

PuckChaser said:


> The pandemic got in the way. At any rate, do those numbers actually matter? If there's no context to them (how many people applied, how many people made it to the board), then it really doesn't matter if there's 5 spots or 50 spots for ISS. A more important number would be the OUTCAP of the trade you're leaving and it's general trend of PML health as to whether that OUTCAP will go up or down year to year.



I was telling another member this on the forum that knowing the numbers takes away some stress. Of course, none of it actually makes a difference in the grand scheme of things. There's a number to be selected, you either get selected or you don't. I wonder why there can't be some more transparency with such a big career transition program.


----------



## junker2122

"Quebec applicants for aircrew jobs cant go do their ACS because of the interprovincial travel restrictions."

Thats what my ccm told me today. Only one person from Quebec got the chance to go to Trenton for an Aircrew Selection Test since septembre. Do someone know when this restriction will be removed or when more Quebec applicants will have the opportunity to do the CFAST.

Thanks to all.


----------



## FSTG

junker2122 said:


> "Quebec applicants for aircrew jobs cant go do their ACS because of the interprovincial travel restrictions."
> 
> Thats what my ccm told me today. Only one person from Quebec got the chance to go to Trenton for an Aircrew Selection Test since septembre. Do someone know when this restriction will be removed or when more Quebec applicants will have the opportunity to do the CFAST.
> 
> Thanks to all.



I wouldnt worry too much about that for now until the recruitement is back to somewhat normal since your ACS is only valid for 3 or 5 years (cant remember).  I've been in the process for 3 years now even tho i was told my file score was above the last person to receive an offer after completing my ACS for PLT in 2018. The backlogg in training was high and caused DEO intakes to drop to 10-15 (down from like 50ish in 2016 i think).
Like my recruiter said, its really up and down for PLT; some years they dont have enough candidates and for now they have too many.

My ACS might expire depending on the COVID aftermath. Of course if you have sky-high scores on your file and you are within the top 10 applicants accross Canada; you will be prioritized anyway. Just use the time to practice your maths and play on apps like luminosity


----------



## junker2122

FSTG said:


> I wouldnt worry too much about that for now until the recruitement is back to somewhat normal since your ACS is only valid for 3 or 5 years (cant remember).  I've been in the process for 3 years now even tho i was told my file score was above the last person to receive an offer after completing my ACS for PLT in 2018. The backlogg in training was high and caused DEO intakes to drop to 10-15 (down from like 50ish in 2016 i think).
> Like my recruiter said, its really up and down for PLT; some years they dont have enough candidates and for now they have too many.
> 
> My ACS might expire depending on the COVID aftermath. Of course if you have sky-high scores on your file and you are within the top 10 applicants accross Canada; you will be prioritized anyway. Just use the time to practice your maths and play on apps like luminosity


Will do! Thank you very much for your answer it very appreciated!


----------



## AliTheAce

I came back from Aircrew Selections for Pilot on Feb 2, thankfully passed this time after failing my first attempt in Jan 2019! I'm done the medical/interview, all I have left is the CFEME medical done in Toronto. Any Pilot applicants here done that recently? I'm in Ontario only a 30 minute drive from DRDC Toronto. ROTP RMC applicant.


----------



## FSTG

Just to get general opinions. I just learned that my file score doesnt make the cutoff for this year again for PLT DEO. I completed the ACS 2 years ago and passed for pilot. My CFAT score was considered good and at the time my recruiter told me my file was above the last person to receive an offer as PLT but now they really raised the requirements and i'm no longer admissible. I really dont want to retake the ACS at Trenton even if i really enjoyed the experience so my question is this: should i just try and rewrite the CFAT or hang on for another year and risk having my ACS expired??  What do you guys think?


----------



## Scramjet

FSTG said:


> Just to get general opinions. I just learned that my file score doesnt make the cutoff for this year again for PLT DEO. I completed the ACS 2 years ago and passed for pilot. My CFAT score was considered good and at the time my recruiter told me my file was above the last person to receive an offer as PLT but now they really raised the requirements and i'm no longer admissible. I really dont want to retake the ACS at Trenton even if i really enjoyed the experience so my question is this: should i just try and rewrite the CFAT or hang on for another year and risk having my ACS expired??  What do you guys think?


Same boat as you. My file was very competitive and scored highly at ACS but no longer meet the new standard. I was told my CFAT score was very high and getting perfect wouldn't be enough to hit the PCL as I can't improve my personality score and those are the only two things that really make up the score. 

ACS is however valid for 5 years so we both have a few more to go before that expires.


----------



## FSTG

Scramjet said:


> getting perfect wouldn't be enough to hit the PCL


Damn that must be frustrating. Especially since you were probably close to make the competition list after ACS...  We're really unlucky in our timing with the training backlogs and covid. Patience will pay-off i guess; keep it up.


----------



## Messerschmitt

FSTG said:


> Damn that must be frustrating. Especially since you were probably close to make the competition list after ACS...  We're really unlucky in our timing with the training backlogs and covid. Patience will pay-off i guess; keep it up.





Scramjet said:


> Same boat as you. My file was very competitive and scored highly at ACS but no longer meet the new standard. I was told my CFAT score was very high and getting perfect wouldn't be enough to hit the PCL as I can't improve my personality score and those are the only two things that really make up the score.
> 
> ACS is however valid for 5 years so we both have a few more to go before that expires.


If I'd be you too, I'd definitely try to get my licence privately and start working through the industry as hopefully it will start ramping up. Just waiting after the military is really a bad idea. Have it in the back pocket, and do what you need to do like you wouldn't have had an application in. I think this is the best advice I can give.


----------



## Scramjet

Messerschmitt said:


> If I'd be you too, I'd definitely try to get my licence privately and start working through the industry as hopefully it will start ramping up. Just waiting after the military is really a bad idea. Have it in the back pocket, and do what you need to do like you wouldn't have had an application in. I think this is the best advice I can give.


Couldn't agree more! Got my PPL last year because I didn't want to put all my eggs in one basket. I'm currently pursuing my CPL, albeit slowly. I would much rather fly for the forces but seeing how the odds are against us getting in, need to have back-ups.


----------



## SupersonicMax

Not sure the CPL way is a viable backup in the short/medium term!


----------



## dapaterson

SupersonicMax said:


> Not sure the CPL way is a viable backup in the short/medium term!



There's always sommelier, just in case...



			https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/career-job-changes-pandemic-1.5935256


----------



## Scramjet

SupersonicMax said:


> Not sure the CPL way is a viable backup in the short/medium term!


I agree. Taking it slow but also not interested in airlines. I already have a decent career so this would be for a fun side gig. Unfortunately to get paid at any capacity to fly you need a CPL. That being said I would take the pay cut and drop everything for a Pilot slot in the forces.


----------



## Messerschmitt

SupersonicMax said:


> Not sure the CPL way is a viable backup in the short/medium term!


If you think the military is a short/medium term you are hardly mistaken my friend. And I mean WING STANDARDS, not 17-25 years career. Expect a minimum 5 years once you got your acceptance letter to just get your wings. That's 150hrs in minimum 5 years. 6-7 years is more realistic with the current clogged system.


----------



## Hafoc

Can anyone give advice on what to do once you are told you do not meet the PCL?  I passed ACS, as well as Aircrew medical, however I guess the needs of the RCAF have changed and my file is no longer competitive.  I've tried reaching out to the local recruiting office but they didn't have any advice other than to maybe try again later.


----------



## Scramjet

I hope more people on this thread have had their application progress recently. Mine just got competition listed after 4yrs of trying. If you don't make the PCL just keep on it and keep trying, even if you have to retake the CFAT.

What is weird though is, I was never asked to go to CFEME for the last part of the medical before getting on the comp list. Maybe that is still yet to come or maybe covid is changing things.


----------



## BMAL

Scramjet said:


> I hope more people on this thread have had their application progress recently. Mine just got competition listed after 4yrs of trying. If you don't make the PCL just keep on it and keep trying, even if you have to retake the CFAT.
> 
> What is weird though is, I was never asked to go to CFEME for the last part of the medical before getting on the comp list. Maybe that is still yet to come or maybe covid is changing things.


Congrats! You must be extremely pleased. 

DEO or ROTP?


----------



## Scramjet

BMAL said:


> Congrats! You must be extremely pleased.
> 
> DEO or ROTP?


Thanks! My application is for DEO. I was told there are still a few spots remaining for this fiscal year for both ROTP and DEO.


----------



## Kickingsauce

Anyone have the numbers on this current years intake numbers? (Or next years )


----------



## PuckChaser

Yes, they're on the DWAN and need to stay there. Those numbers are also useless without context on how many people applied, how many people you'd be competing against.


----------



## Kickingsauce

PuckChaser said:


> Yes, they're on the DWAN and need to stay there. Those numbers are also useless without context on how many people applied, how many people you'd be competing against.


So I can't access them unless I'm part of the Armed Forces already then eh? Seems a little bit useless for us recruits, damn :/


----------



## PuckChaser

Kickingsauce said:


> So I can't access them unless I'm part of the Armed Forces already then eh? Seems a little bit useless for us recruits, damn :/


Its not useless. It's protected information that literally will not help you at all in your recruiting process. There could be 1,000 spots available this year, but if you're one of 100,000 applicants you'd have a 1% chance of getting a spot. 

Worry about controlling what you can control: Make your file as competitive as possible and wait for a call.


----------



## EnginesFullThrottle

3 years later, and I finally got my offer for Pilot! Well worth the wait, but it has been a patient struggle. Going in as DEO, with BMOQ slated for September 12th. I even swear in the day after my birthday haha, so it'll be a nice present. 

Godspeed to everyone else and best of luck, these forums have been immensely helpful and I thank you all.

Cheers!


----------



## Eye In The Sky

Good luck on your training.   Wings parade is an awesome high point in a RCAF career.


----------



## fdojr

Is the CFAST done after the interview with the officer?

I lack the theoretical exam to get my CPL. Would it be interesting to get the CPL before the CFAST or does it not matter?


----------



## SupersonicMax

fdojr said:


> Is the CFAST done after the interview with the officer?
> 
> I lack the theoretical exam to get my CPL. Would it be interesting to get the CPL before the CFAST or does it not matter?


Get it after.  If you fail CFAST, all you’d have to do to try again is write the CPL exam.  If you finished your CPL before, you’d have to get to ATPL.


----------



## fdojr

SupersonicMax said:


> Get it after.  If you fail CFAST, all you’d have to do to try again is write the CPL exam.  If you finished your CPL before, you’d have to get to ATPL.


Ah ok, thanks!

So I imagine CFAST must have a minimum score. Right?

If you get this minimum score, you enter a list and at the end they will choose the best placed. Would it be this?

Is the CFAST the battery of tests done there in Trenton?


----------



## SupersonicMax

fdojr said:


> Ah ok, thanks!
> 
> So I imagine CFAST must have a minimum score. Right?
> 
> If you get this minimum score, you enter a list and at the end they will choose the best placed. Would it be this?
> 
> Is the CFAST the battery of tests done there in Trenton?


I have no idea how CFAST is done now.  I did it 20 years ago…


----------



## Eye In The Sky

SupersonicMax said:


> I have no idea how CFAST is done now.  I did it 20 years ago…









😁


----------

