# How Much is Too Much?



## sapper332 (12 Feb 2005)

The single soldiers from my Unit were shown last week the "new" single quarters that they would be moving into come the summer of this year. We were dazzled by the 4 soldiers sharing one bathroom design - sure hope they can all fit into one stand-up shower stall in the mornings after PT.... but the were blown away by a "wheelchair accessible" room.
   While all other soldiers will be stacked in like cord wood into the newly renovated (and now much smaller) rooms - the ground floor corner rooms are being modified with larger access doors, a sit-down shower stall and lowered sink vanities. 
   Now, it may just be me, being an old soldier who's out of touch with the times - but since when have we required permanent single quarters for those physically challenged who happen to be wheelchair-bound?
   With our modern world of political correctness - is this too much?


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## a_majoor (12 Feb 2005)

Having navigated through the "shack" on crutches after spraining an ankle, I certainly see the merit in that design, but we all know that isn't the real reason it was installed. Either one person is going to get the "cushy" room by lottery, or it will sit as another empty white elephant.....


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## Scoobie Newbie (12 Feb 2005)

Were is this at?


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## sapper332 (12 Feb 2005)

Petawawa


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## SprCForr (12 Feb 2005)

Would this be in the same class as having wheelchair accessible parking spots in all new parking lots? You can find some here in WATC. Anywhere else?


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## Ghost (12 Feb 2005)

That's money well spent


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## BernDawg (12 Feb 2005)

It's been my experience that you can never have too much storage in the single quarters (insert note of sarcasm here).


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## Scoobie Newbie (12 Feb 2005)

a_majoor with regards to SLI members on crutches.  There would be a good chance that the member would already have a room in another part of the building and would not move into the handicapped room for 6 weeks.  The newer rooms in Edmonton are small as well from what I can remember.


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## a_majoor (12 Feb 2005)

Sorry, forgot the [sarcasm] [/sarcasm] around the post.

Seriously, how is this room going to be assigned?


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## Scoobie Newbie (13 Feb 2005)

Roger

Who knows.  They may well keep it empty.


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## Steel Badger (13 Feb 2005)

<Warning ....ADVOCATUS DIABOLI Post>

Its not a ramp for the disabled.but for the possible recruitment of the heavy mass /  mass-disadvantaged soldiers.....

Just wait till they introduce regs to assign 2 seats in each forces vehicle to the mass disadvantaged.....


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## Grimey (13 Feb 2005)

At the Engineering division building at the Fleet School in Esquimalt, a wheel chair lift was installed between the 1st and 2nd decks, despite the 2nd deck being accessed by a level entry side door. This being a Base construction project, they took their sweet time doing it.  After about a month, it finally dawned on us, the staff, as to what they where doing.

I can't remember if it was me or a winger who said it, but it was mentioned that it would be great for hauling desk books.  Fact is, that's what was used as a test load.

Ten years later, that was its first and only use.


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## George Wallace (13 Feb 2005)

What a PC country we live in.....All our Government Buildings must meet the requirements of the Wheel Chair Access codes.  Everything has to be 90% Handicap Accessable.  :  

GW


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## Spr.Earl (13 Feb 2005)

George Wallace said:
			
		

> What a PC country we live in.....All our Government Buildings must meet the requirements of the Wheel Chair Access codes.   Everything has to be 90% Handicap Accessable.   :
> 
> GW


George at 6Fd in N.Van they took a chunk of the ranks Mess for the elevator landing on the 2nd floor.
Yup an elevator that only goes up one floor but will be used how much?
We are going from the ludicrous to the sublime.


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## Storm (13 Feb 2005)

Spr.Earl said:
			
		

> George at 6Fd in N.Van they took a chunk of the ranks Mess for the elevator landing on the 2nd floor.
> Yup an elevator that only goes up one floor but will be used how much?
> We are going from the ludicrous to the sublime.



There's an elevator? Damn. I need to start paying more attention.


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## Scoobie Newbie (13 Feb 2005)

going to "test it" are you?


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## chrisf (13 Feb 2005)

Reference wheel-chair accessibility, I think everyone should remember that just because you happen to be able bodied, not everyone using the facilities will be.. visitors, injured troops, etc may potentially make use of the facilities....


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## Scoobie Newbie (13 Feb 2005)

That is true except for single lving in quarters.  If on the off chance there were that 1 in a billion chance then you could either improvise or carry someone down or up the stairs.  This thread I believe was in regards to a disabled room in the SLI quarters


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## Spr.Earl (13 Feb 2005)

Oh it's not finnished yet?
The monies DND have spent to plecate P.C. could have given years of training and bullets for us all.


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## DBA (14 Feb 2005)

From what I understand all government departments must show progress towards making things accessible. If they started granting exceptions or lessened requirements to one department then all the others would ask for the same and we would be back to square one. As for troops accommodations, keep in mind they are sometimes also used for housing contractors running training and computer based exercises. It's certainly possible for contractors to benefit from accessible rooms.


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## a_majoor (14 Feb 2005)

DBA said:
			
		

> From what I understand all government departments must show progress towards making things accessible. If they started granting exceptions or lessened requirements to one department then all the others would ask for the same and we would be back to square one. As for troops accommodations, keep in mind they are sometimes also used for housing contractors running training and computer based exercises. It's certainly possible for contractors to benefit from accessible rooms.



In my experience, contractors and civvies stay in hotels. 

Face it, this is just the *blind application of rules* without any consideration as to the utility or cost/benifit ratio. The last time the Army did business this way was the Battle of the Somme, a straight frontal assault behind a week long artillery barrage, costing the British 20,000 dead and 60,000 casualties all told in the first day alone. Luckily for us, we are only sending tax dollars rather than people into a frontal assault........


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## Dave Mount (14 Feb 2005)

We now have two firehalls with a handi-cap washroom.  It does have to make one wonder about the blind application of the rules.  HMM a fire truck with a wheel chair lift would make us look really pro active.


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## ArmyRick (14 Feb 2005)

Reference elevator near the mess.

How often is it going to get used?

Wait until you have a really good mess dinner and you can hardly stand on your own two feet (LOL)


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## Rick_Donald (14 Feb 2005)

How are politicians going to visit the various bases across Canada if you don't make them accessible to the handicapped.


My apologies to the handicapped.


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## Brad Sallows (14 Feb 2005)

Access in reserve armouries is, I think, worthwhile.  Not all of the associates and veterans who might come down will necessarily have the unencumbered use of their legs, not to mention that it makes the facility more usable to the general public.


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## Cloud Cover (14 Feb 2005)

In the late 1980's, there was a guy who was injured at sea out west, and was in and out of a wheel chair in Nelles Block [CFB Esquimalt] for almost 2 months before he was good to go. For those of us who were there, and picked him up and carried him up the stairs; or into the head; or bothered to leave the friggin remote for the TV someplace where he could reach it; or carried him down the 4 concrete stairs on the west side of the block; and all sorts of other stuff like that .... you know why those rules for accessibility are important.


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## dutchie (14 Feb 2005)

To reiterate and add to what already has been said:

SLI (IIRC) do not house transients/contractors/civvies (or Res on work-up). They have transient quarters for that.

SLI(again, IIRC), is 100% restricted to Reg Force Pers (single). It is verbotin for all others to overnight in SLI Quarters, unless you're sleeping with one of the troops. 

The handicapped/wheelchair access issue for transients, contractors or whomever is a red herring.


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## MG34 (15 Feb 2005)

That's as bad as the Braille signs in the shacks at CPC in Trenton,yeah a bit too far.No offence to any blind people reading this.


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## Fishbone Jones (15 Feb 2005)

MG34 said:
			
		

> That's as bad as the Braille signs in the shacks at CPC in Trenton,yeah a bit too far.*No offence to any blind people reading this*.



MG34,

I'm sure it was a slip. I'm sure they won't be offended.


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## George Wallace (15 Feb 2005)

recceguy said:
			
		

> MG34,
> 
> I'm sure it was a slip. I'm sure they won't be offended.



They may have one of those computers from the CNIB that reads the text for them.....


GW


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## simysmom99 (29 Apr 2008)

Over the last 6 years Canada has been at war.  This war has cost 82 fallen soldiers and over 400 wounded.  That is enough numbers so that each and every building in the CF is has to be accessible. 
 Gen Hillier has vowed to keep all wounded soldiers in uniform and if that comes at such a heartache to any other soldier than I shall meet them in the alley for a "chat".
All buildings must fall under the building codes of the day.  That also happens to be the morally right thing to do.

For those out east I know a sniper that you can talk to.....
For those on ships...please wait your turn as the first sailor to be wounded on a boarding party will change some mindsets.
For those in the air they already understand that the CF has a pointy end and at times also has desks to be manned.
To those out west I encourage anyone who feels my committment to the uniform the flag and the Queen hasnt been to their liking.....well id love to chat about it.

Accessibility is an issue to people who have legs, who can see and who can walk to those that cant do these things allow us the honour and dignity to somehow not hide, not cower and wear our uniform with pride.
.
To all the others look in the mirror and be thankful that the war hasnt touched you.

MCpl PM Franklin
973 4011
local 6119
ptepaul1@rogers.blackberry.net


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## Remius (29 Apr 2008)

Well said.  Pretty much puts an end to this discussion I think.


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## Good2Golf (29 Apr 2008)

On that note, looks like we have the full range of points out there so we'll let this one settle down for a bit.

*Milnet.ca Staff*


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