# Drivers Liscence!?



## lucasbutts (4 Jul 2009)

I did a search on drivers licence's and could only find one relevant topic that was also locked and not active in the last 5 years, SO i decided to make my own topic. (sorry) Im just unable to figure out what the deal is with getting your liscence.... I live in british columbia and currently only have my class 7 (L or Learners) and was wondering if i can get the rest through the military (roadtest)? 
I heard something about 403's where you can get a military liscence and drive military vehicles but it deos not permit you in any way to drive a civilian insured car?


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## lucasbutts (4 Jul 2009)

...and yes i realize im a fool and spelled licence wrong on the topic title...  :crybaby:


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## Nfld Sapper (4 Jul 2009)

DND 404'S will not allow you to drive civilian vehicles unless they are rented by DND.

So my  :2c: is that you go and get your full license so you can drive a personal car.


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## aesop081 (4 Jul 2009)

lucasbutts said:
			
		

> and was wondering if i can get the rest through the military (roadtest)?



No. You are on your own with that.


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## PMedMoe (4 Jul 2009)

In _some_ provinces, having 404s will shorten the period between doing your written test and your road test.


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## lucasbutts (4 Jul 2009)

alright thanks alot for the replies. I just found out that i cant book a road test prior to my departure to st.jean because its full... and my liscence is going to expire before im finished my BMQ....
Will not having a civvie licence hurt me at all? (besides not being able to drive civvie cars on the weekends off?)


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## PMedMoe (4 Jul 2009)

No.


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## George Wallace (4 Jul 2009)

You know........Some days you should just ask your parents these things.


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## aesop081 (4 Jul 2009)

lucasbutts said:
			
		

> Will not having a civvie licence hurt me at all? (besides not being able to drive civvie cars on the weekends off?)



Did you see "Valid civillian driver's permit" listed as a requirement on your CF application ?

 :


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## mariomike (4 Jul 2009)

My  :2c:
Having a valid licence is always a good idea, the younger, the better. Even if you do not require one for business or pleasure. That way your driver's abstract shows you have experience, and no accidents or tickets. It will help your insurance premiums, and if you intend to drive for a living on civvy street.


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## deej96 (4 Jul 2009)

When I went for my N they didn't have any available opening in Langley, so I went all the way out to Chilliwack.  If you are that desperate go to Burnaby or Surrey or something.  May suck getting out there, but if you're that desperate...


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## PMedMoe (4 Jul 2009)

I wouldn't worry too much about getting it before BMQ.  Many car rental places won't rent to people under 25 years old, and if they do, you're charged a load of insurance.


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## Fishbone Jones (4 Jul 2009)

lucasbutts said:
			
		

> ...and yes i realize im a fool and spelled licence wrong on the topic title...  :crybaby:



.........then you continue to post and continue to spell it wrong. Couple of things. You can use 'Spell Check' before you hit Post. You can use a dictionary. Once you identify a fault, correct it. Lastly, you can't have one if you can't spell it. (OK, not true, but it will be when I become King of Canada)


I suggest you wrap this one up, before it gets locked also. 

Milnet.ca Staff


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## stewacide (8 Jul 2009)

Does anyone know if there are provinces left that don't have a graduated licensing system?

I've never had any reason or desire to drive, so the complicated, costly, and lengthy system here in Ontario has put me off completely (I did my first written test simply to have the ID), but it'd be tempting to get it somewhere else if I can avoid the hassle.


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## George Wallace (8 Jul 2009)

stewacide said:
			
		

> Does anyone know if there are provinces left that don't have a graduated licensing system?
> 
> I've never had any reason or desire to drive, so the complicated, costly, and lengthy system here in Ontario has put me off completely (I did my first written test simply to have the ID), but it'd be tempting to get it somewhere else if I can avoid the hassle.



So you plan on moving permanently to another province?  Have you told your parents yet?


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## stewacide (8 Jul 2009)

George Wallace said:
			
		

> So you plan on moving permanently to another province?  Have you told your parents yet?



I'm going to be in the military, so I don't know where I'll be. Once you get your full license anywhere you can transfer it AFAIK.

My brother did one better: he moved from Ontario to Alberta years ago with his G2 (a step below full license), and when he visited the licensing bureau there they exchanged that for a full Alberta license (he could swap that for a full Ontario license now if he wanted to).


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## George Wallace (8 Jul 2009)

stewacide said:
			
		

> I'm going to be in the military, so I don't know where I'll be. Once you get your full license anywhere you can transfer it AFAIK.
> 
> My brother did one better: he moved from Ontario to Alberta years ago with his G2 (a step below full license), and when he visited the licensing bureau there they exchanged that for a full Alberta license (he could swap that for a full Ontario license now if he wanted to).



 :

Good for your brother.  Now back to you.  Are you planning on becoming a permanent resident of another province?  You can't get a licence unless you are a resident of the province that issues it.  

Do you understand this?


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## George Wallace (8 Jul 2009)

Shake your head.  

What do you hear?


Exactly!


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## FishOuttaWater (19 Aug 2009)

Does having or not having a civilian drivers license effect any aspect of obtaining your 404..?

What about tickets/suspensions, how do they effect (if at all) you driving military vehicles..?

 ???


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## ammocat (19 Aug 2009)

Yes, not having a civilian drivers license can affect you when trying to get 404's. We are suppose to teach forklift on our QL-3 course but have been unable to due to the number of students that do not have full drivers licenses. Transport will not issue learner permits to pers who have not completed the graduated license program and have achieve their full license. 

I find this strange, since it states on the back of my 404's that Military drivers do not require a provincial drivers lincence to operate DND owned and leased vehicles on public roads in Canada. I am not aware of all the details why transport will not issue the temp 404's as someone higher in the food chain is working on the problem.


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## PuckChaser (19 Aug 2009)

What it means on the back of your 404s is that you do not need to produce a civilian driver's license to the civilian police in the event of an incident. When driving SMP or DND vehicles, your 404s are your provincial driver's license.

You are required to have at least a G1 (in Ontario) or equivalent to drive DND vehicles. Once you have that, you can be issued a learner's permit or full DND 404s which will expire when your civilian license expires. If at any time your civilian license expires/gets suspended/gets removed you need to report it to your transport section and they will take appropriate action.

I learned to drive using LSVWs, then I took Young Driver's civvie side, having already 404s to drive LSVW with Trailer. All I needed was a G1, which I got 2 weeks before starting the LSVW driver wheeled course.


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## mariomike (19 Aug 2009)

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> You are required to have at least a G1 (in Ontario) or equivalent to drive DND vehicles.



Not to be adversarial, but, my understanding is that you can drive DND vehicles without a PDL. There are a few exceptions, such as Med Tech.


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## FishOuttaWater (19 Aug 2009)

As with MarioMike, I find it rather contradictory that you need a PDL to *get* the 404's but dont need a PDL (according to the back of Ammocats' 404 license) to drive a DND vehicle.

Wierd...  :-\ Can anyone else add any info...?


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## aesop081 (19 Aug 2009)

FishOuttaWater said:
			
		

> As with MarioMike, I find it rather contradictory that You need a PDL to *get* the 404's but dont need a PDL (according to the back of the 404 license) to drive a DND vehicle.
> 
> Wierd...  :-\ Can anyone else add any info...?



That is something that has changed fairly recently. I did not have a PDL when i joined the CF. I didnt even get my learner's permit until after i was HLVW qualified.

It is rather contradictory. I suspect that the 404 document simply just has not caught up with current policy but that being said, you do not have to have a PDL to operate a DND veh and if pulled over, there is no requirement to produce it for the officer.


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## Fishbone Jones (19 Aug 2009)

Maybe it's just laziness. If you already have a license, they don't have to spend any time teaching you the rules of the road etc.  No one should be required to have a civvie license to drive a military vehicle. I wonder how far it would go in a redress if someones career was put on hold, and he couldn't get courses, because he refused to get a civvie license.





_Edit for Spelling_


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## FishOuttaWater (19 Aug 2009)

recceguy said:
			
		

> No one should be required to have a civvie license to drive a military vehicle.



Yeah, that's exactely what I mean. That regardless of the staus of your civilian license (never had one, suspended, learners permit, etc), I don't understand how it would effect a military D/L if the two _systems_ are "different"...

 ??? Thanx for the additional input from all...


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## mariomike (19 Aug 2009)

FishOuttaWater said:
			
		

> Yeah, that's exactely what I mean. That regardless of the staus of your civilian license (never had one, suspended, learners permit, etc), I don't understand how it would effect a military D/L if the two _systems_ are "different"...
> 
> ??? Thanx for the additional input from all...



Even if the PDL was suspended for "impaired driving"? From what I have read on here, I think it would affect the 404's.


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## Fishbone Jones (19 Aug 2009)

mariomike said:
			
		

> Even if the PDL was suspended for "impaired driving"? From what I have read on here, I think it would affect the 404's.



It could, and likely will, however, suspension of your 404's is a military decision outside the Provincial Court system.


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## X Royal (20 Aug 2009)

FishOuttaWater said:
			
		

> Yeah, that's exactely what I mean. That regardless of the staus of your civilian license (never had one, suspended, learners permit, etc), I don't understand how it would effect a military D/L if the two _systems_ are "different"...





			
				recceguy said:
			
		

> It could, and likely will, however, suspension of your 404's is a military decision outside the Provincial Court system.


Although what you say is true it's only part of the story. If someone is prohibited drive Canada wide (generally due to a criminal conviction ie; impaired, fail to provide breath sample ect.) this would carry over to someone driving a military vehicle and even having a valid 404 would not be a defense in a court action. Even without producing a civilian license your criminal convictions and federal judgments would show up on a CPIC check by running your name & birth date. Provincial driving prohibitions would also show up. Generally when someones license is suspended by the province there is also a court order prohibiting driving province wide. DND vehicles & 404's will not over ride a court order. The charge would not be driving without a license but driving while prohibited.


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