# USMC SUSTAIN concept getting serious attention



## a_majoor (17 Oct 2008)

Some of you may have read of the USMC's "SUSTAIN" ( Small Unit Space Transport and Insertion ) concept. Well it is attracting serious attention, and was recently discussed by military planners. SUSTAIN would be wildly challenging to pull off, and I suspect the closest analogue to SUSTAIN would be the Glider Infantry of WWII, but it is really out of the box thinking, for sure:

http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?i=3772336&c=AME&s=TOP



> *U.S. Eyes Reaction Force That Rockets Into Space*
> By TOM VANDEN BROOK, usa today
> Published: 14 Oct 15:51 EDT (19:51 GMT)  Print  |    Email
> 
> ...


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## 54/102 CEF (18 Oct 2008)

They stole it from the book "Starship Troopers"


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## GAP (18 Oct 2008)

54/102 CEF said:
			
		

> They stole it from the book "Starship Troopers"



Yep....neat!!


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## CougarKing (18 Oct 2008)

Or from the Space Marines of the Sci-Fi Series "Space Above and Beyond".


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## GAP (18 Oct 2008)

They should talk to the Russians....they have lots of practise bringing capsules back to earth, with only the occasional splat....


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## McG (18 Oct 2008)

54/102 CEF said:
			
		

> They stole it from the book "Starship Troopers"


I'm pretty sure Mobile Infantry were Army.  It seems to me we are talking about Space Marines.


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## Kat Stevens (18 Oct 2008)

Like the drop ships from "Aliens"?  Cool


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## Ex-Dragoon (18 Oct 2008)

You guys are such geeks


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## Greymatters (18 Oct 2008)

Even if the capability is developed, it would have to be an extremely serious incident to risk not only the lives of the men involved but also the cost of a multi-million dollar transport vessel that could be captured and reverse-engineered.  Past operations with high-value mechanical assets have done their best to ensure that leading edge technology would not fall, or be in threat of falling, into the wrong hands, so unless a plan is in place to deal with this issue, cant see it happening...


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## Ex-Dragoon (18 Oct 2008)

I don't think its economically feasible at present to do so...its costs millions to send the shuttle into orbit...imagine sending a unit of soldiers into space?


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## Greymatters (18 Oct 2008)

Government and military leaders will always spend ridiculous amounts of money on pet projects - all it will take is to get enough support and this baby will be rolling, just like Reagan's Star Wars project...


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## Ex-Dragoon (18 Oct 2008)

Very true.


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## George Wallace (18 Oct 2008)

So true.  Without that "factor of life" we wouldn't have new C-17s, and CH-47s coming online.  All military procurements fall into this line of reasoning.


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## medaid (19 Oct 2008)

I can just see it now... Cap Trooper Wings will be the new fad. WAY cooler then Jump Wings. 

"Come on you apes! Do you wanna live forever?!"


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## a_majoor (19 Oct 2008)

Greymatters said:
			
		

> Even if the capability is developed, it would have to be an extremely serious incident to risk not only the lives of the men involved but also the cost of a multi-million dollar transport vessel that could be captured and reverse-engineered.  Past operations with high-value mechanical assets have done their best to ensure that leading edge technology would not fall, or be in threat of falling, into the wrong hands, so unless a plan is in place to deal with this issue, cant see it happening



If the will to create SUSTAIN units were in place, they could get into space pretty quickly by leveraging off Scaled Composite's "SpaceShipOne" and "SpaceShipTwo" as the basic technologies. While the composite materials might be cutting edge, most of the other equipment would be taken from current or near term military items (comms gear, navigation equipment etc.). If the plan is to abandon the troop carrier once it is grounded, the crew can pull the pin of a thermite charge and incinerate the craft after debussing.

While overall the idea seems pretty outlandish, it is probably more feasible than the plan to drop an American division behind German lines by parachute in 1918 was then.


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## daftandbarmy (20 Oct 2008)

Pentagon plans ‘spaceplane’ to reach hotspots fast
John Harlow in Los Angeles 

The American military is planning a “spaceplane” designed to fly a crack squad of heavily armed marines to trouble spots anywhere in the world within four hours. 
At a recent secret meeting at the Pentagon, engineers working on the craft, codenamed Hot Eagle, were told to draw up blueprints for a prototype which generals want to have in the air within 11 years. 

Pentagon planners have been encouraged by technical breakthroughs from Burt Rutan, chief designer on Sir Richard Branson’s White Knight spaceship, which is due to begin test flights next year and to carry tourists on suborbital journeys from 2010. 

Last week Rutan, 65, who built the first privately funded craft to reach space and won the $10m X prize for his achievement in 2004, gave his blessing to Hot Eagle, which could be based on White Knight’s technology. Rutan said it would be an expensive way to transport troops “but it could be done. It is feasible”. 
Will Whitehorn, president of Virgin Galactic, which is funding White Knight, recently predicted that it could be used to airlift emergency supplies into disaster zones. 
“It could be like Thunderbirds, like International Rescue,” he said. A passenger version would be capable of flying from London to Sydney in four hours. 
The two-stage Hot Eagle would be launched from an aircraft carrier. A large booster rocket would carry a smaller spacecraft containing 13 “space troopers” 50 miles into space, far above hostile radar, before landing in enemy territory. 

The marines first called for a spaceplane in 2002 after the US military failed to capture Osama Bin Laden in the mountains of Afghanistan. The project was known as the Small Unit Space Transport and Insertion programme (Sustain). Its advocates said it took too long on foot to reach the caves where Bin Laden was said to be hiding and helicopters were too visible. 

General James Mattis, leading the marines’ Central Command at the time, said he wanted the spaceplane in the air by 2019. He was recently promoted to be one of the most senior officers in the US military establishment and Sustain has since become a priority. 

Last week Lieutenant Colonel Mark Brown, a US air force spokesman, confirmed that Nasa and Pentagon officers had met for two days of talks to draw up plans for Hot Eagle. 
Invitations to the meeting said participants would be discussing a “potential revolutionary step in getting combat power to any point in the world in a time frame unbelievable today”. 
Although aided by Rutan’s breakthroughs in ever-lighter composite materials, there are many technological hurdles ahead for Hot Eagle. 
Designers have not yet decided whether to build a relatively simple disposable craft, which the space troopers would destroy before being picked up by helicopter, or a vastly more complex vehicle which could fly them home. 

Some critics dismiss Hot Eagle as Hollywood-inspired science fiction or an expensive toy. Others question how effective a fighting force of just 13 soldiers could be on the ground. 

“That is, if they get there,” said Ivan Oelrich, of the Federation of American Scientists. “It would be wildly vulnerable as you cannot armoura rocket ship.” 
Roosevelt Lafontrant, a former marine colonel now employed by the Schafer Corporation, a technology company, said the technology was advancing rapidly. “If we had had the Sustain programme in operation in 2002, Bin Laden would have been captured and history fundamentally changed,” he said recently. 

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article4969025.ece


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## Gasplug (20 Oct 2008)

> Others question how effective a fighting force of just 13 soldiers could be on the ground.



Poor critic, these are MARINES you are talking about.... HURRAH!

Gasplug


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## MarkS33 (20 Oct 2008)

cool idea... dont know how many marines would volunteer for space flight... I know I would!

good find!


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## Greymatters (20 Oct 2008)

I think this is the same as the 'SUSTAIN' thread already posted...?


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## geo (20 Oct 2008)

Gawd.... something right out of a Dale Brown novel..... Spaceplanes
Will a militarized space station and ground based laser weapons be next ???


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## Greymatters (20 Oct 2008)

Ah, I see its been combined now...


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## Ex-Dragoon (20 Oct 2008)

Mark said:
			
		

> cool idea... dont know how many marines would volunteer for space flight... I know I would!
> 
> good find!



Are you a Marine?


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## Old Sweat (20 Oct 2008)

If I recall correctly, a similar concept was being bandied about by The Corps in the sixties.


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## Greymatters (20 Oct 2008)

Old Sweat said:
			
		

> If I recall correctly, a similar concept was being bandied about by The Corps in the sixties.



Referred to in post number 1...


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## a_majoor (8 May 2009)

Virgin Galactic expands on the concept. I particularly like long haul suborbital flights (halfway around the world in 21/2 hours....)

http://www.reuters.com/article/lifestyleMolt/idUSTRE54639Q20090507?pageNumber=2&virtualBrandChannel=0&sp=true



> *Virgin sees space tourism as just the beginning*
> Thu May 7, 2009 11:26am EDT
> 
> By Georgina Prodhan
> ...


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## ExSarge (8 May 2009)

Okay, First I have to say that some of you guys gotta move out of your parent’s basements! 
Now with that said, what really would be the point of sending a “squad/section size unit to a hot spot? More importantly why spend billions on development, cost over runs, pork barrelling, training etc when for half the cost, existing resources could be adapted to serve the same purpose?
First, regardless of what the media tells us these “hot spots” do not spring up fully formed or develop overnight. Expanding the present intelligence gathering capability, or more properly the intelligence analyzing abilities of the existing agencies would allow for earlier detection and monitoring of these hot spots. 
Secondly making better use of forward deployment bases, either ashore or afloat would give the Marines more flexibility in their response. I doubt they will develop (in the short term) a space delivery system that will accommodate field pieces, aviation or armour). Presently they already have a number of LSD’s, LPH and LPA’s ready to transport troops as well as access to Naval and Air Force transport aircraft. 
Making better use of existing resources to provide a faster, better balanced more flexible response would seem to me to make more sense. That’s not to say that a space delivery system does not have a place. Delivery of urgently needed spares, medical equipment or even fresh donuts from Krispy Kream, but cramming it full of Marines, Spam in a Can, No!


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