# Need Advice on Flag Party



## RCD_Cadet (25 Sep 2006)

i am a Flag Party Cmdr and want any advice that will help me make the flag party look amazing on parade


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## condor888000 (25 Sep 2006)

Practice. Practice. Practice. And don't forget to practice. 

Using the spell check and proper grammar wouldn't hurt either.


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## Pronto123 (25 Sep 2006)

condor888000 said:
			
		

> Practice. Practice. Practice. And don't forget to practice.
> 
> Using the spell check and proper grammar wouldn't hurt either.



^^^ Practice.


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## Bergeron 971 (25 Sep 2006)

use five or ten pound weights that are used for running and made to be strapped around ankles. Strap them to your flag barrers elbow during practice.
This will help them build muscle and keep their arm straight when on parade. We practice on drill team time, and do PT to help their health. The flag party should be healthy and able to complete the duties of the task. Flags, rifles, swords, etc.
for 14 to 17 year olds these pieces of kit may be heavy for them. PT is the key to clean and sharp drill. Someone who is not healthy will tend to slack off sooner.
And lots of practice.
Do not only practice, the simple drill that you will use during the parade. try to cover all the drill involved with the flag party. Practicing the same old thing get boring for youths.


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## condor888000 (25 Sep 2006)

Don't forget, PRACTICE. 



			
				Bergeron 971 said:
			
		

> use five or ten pound weights that are used for running and made to be strapped around ankles. Strap them to your flag barrers elbow during practice.
> This will help them build muscle and keep their arm straight when on parade. We practice on drill team time, and do PT to help their health. The flag party should be healthy and able to complete the duties of the task. Flags, rifles, swords, etc.
> for 14 to 17 year olds these pieces of kit may be heavy for them. PT is the key to clean and sharp drill. Someone who is not healthy will tend to slack off sooner.
> And lots of practice.
> Do not only practice, the simple drill that you will use during the parade. try to cover all the drill involved with the flag party. Practicing the same old thing get boring for youths.



This is your post. 



			
				Bergeron 971 said:
			
		

> Use five or ten pound weights that are used for running and made to be strapped around ankles. Strap them to your flag bearers elbow during practice. This will help them build muscle and keep their arm straight when on parade.
> 
> We practice on drill team time, and do PT to help their health. The flag party should be healthy and able to complete the duties of the task. Flags, rifles, swords, etc. should be used regularly in order to properly familiarize the cadets with their use. For 14 to 17 year olds these pieces of kit may be heavy for them. PT is the key to clean and sharp drill. Someone who is not healthy will tend to slack off sooner.
> 
> And don't forget to practice, lots of practice. Do not only practice, the simple drill that you will use during the parade. Try to cover all the drill involved with the flag party. Practicing the same old thing may become boring for youths.



This is your post after I spent two minutes in word reformatting and spell checking. In the future, if you take the time to do so, it makes your posts much easier to read. Which in turn, makes you advice easier to understand. So please, do us all a favour.


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## Bergeron 971 (25 Sep 2006)

I'm on med's right now that makes me tired. leave me alone... :crybaby:


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## RCD_Cadet (26 Sep 2006)

WoW i would never thought about there health or that 5-10 pound weight idea thanks for that piece of advice


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## geo (26 Sep 2006)

get a "practice flag"
use a gray wool blanket.... 
try using it dry - it's light, easy
try using it wet (soak blanket) - it's heavy and will help you build character 
wet blanket being caught in the wind will toss the colour ensign around a bit but, good practice.


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## Bergeron 971 (26 Sep 2006)

Guy, LMAO, that is pricless... HAHAHA. I LIKE IT...


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## ryanmann356 (27 Sep 2006)

practice practice

I was flag party commander for 3 years, and you need to look up ALL the proper movements in the manuals and practice.  I dont recommend using a wool blanket and hockey sticks i personally found it rather degrating but thats up to you.  Meet up a half hour early every training night and practice the movements so you dont disrupt everyone on parade.  works well


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## geo (27 Sep 2006)

never said anything about hockey sticks, enough flag staffs around for that use & you can use pert much anything you want.  My only point is that, if you are ever caught out in the rain and the flags do get soaked, the Ensign will have the challenge of his young life trying to keep control of said flag.


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## ryanmann356 (27 Sep 2006)

geo said:
			
		

> if you are ever caught out in the rain and the flags do get soaked, the Ensign will have the challenge of his young life trying to keep control of said flag.



yikes, no officer in my corps would ever allow the flag to be used outside in the rain


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## RCD_Cadet (27 Sep 2006)

wool blanket i need to find one dose it have to be wool... if your corp was on parade and it was outside and the flag where there and it was raining we would still bring them on unless it was like a gale than they would say no


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## Spring_bok (27 Sep 2006)

Cadet Warrant-Mann said:
			
		

> yikes, no officer in my corps would ever allow the flag to be used outside in the rain


Do we cancel parades if it rains?


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## ryanmann356 (28 Sep 2006)

Spring_bok said:
			
		

> Do we cancel parades if it rains?



no We dont.  We only have flag parties for the ACR, and even then the flag party waits inside then marches on after the corps has marched on.


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## sgt_mandal (29 Sep 2006)

Don't call stupid commands and have them do something that isn't that command...ie flag party left left - form!....and they do a "left centre wheel"....on the subject of centre wheels, are they in some magic manual i've never been able to find? all i've been able to find in the way of turning a flag party are forms?


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## yoman (29 Sep 2006)

mandal said:
			
		

> Don't call stupid commands and have them do something that isn't that command...ie flag party left left - form!....and they do a "left centre wheel"....on the subject of centre wheels, are they in some magic manual i've never been able to find? all i've been able to find in the way of turning a flag party are forms?



Your right, searching "centre wheel" in the 201 brings up nothing. Perhaps its just a command that units created to easily turn the flag party in the direction of the march pasts?


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## Klc (30 Sep 2006)

IIRC, it is a command.... somewhere or other... I know band drill contains similar movements, but I can't remember if their related... I'll need to find my old band drill notes


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## geo (2 Oct 2006)

centre wheel???

try - "counter march"


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## Klc (2 Oct 2006)

Thats the one... I knew 'centre wheel' sounded rediculous.


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## yoman (2 Oct 2006)

geo said:
			
		

> centre wheel???
> 
> try - "counter march"



We use both.


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## geo (2 Oct 2006)

... centre wheel is wrong - let's leave it at that.


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## yoman (2 Oct 2006)

When I say we use both, I do not mean for the same thing. 

Centre Wheel is 7 mark time paces while moving the flag party 90 degres left or right. At least that how we use it. 

Counter march is a counter march.


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## Nfld Sapper (2 Oct 2006)

According to the "bible" THE CANADIAN FORCES MANUAL OF DRILL AND CEREMONIAL A-PD-201-000/PT-000
centre wheel is *not* an official drill command while counter march is.

Might be a corps thing.



			
				yoman said:
			
		

> When I say we use both, I do not mean for the same thing.
> 
> Centre Wheel is 7 mark time paces while moving the flag party 90 degres left or right. At least that how we use it.
> 
> Counter march is a counter march.


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## Burrows (3 Oct 2006)

I'm with geo.  He has the experience and is a CWO.  Unless you want to tell the Sgt Major he doesn't know about drill(and entertaining as that would be, I'm sure you don't), I'd listen to him.


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## geo (3 Oct 2006)

yoman said:
			
		

> When I say we use both, I do not mean for the same thing.
> Centre Wheel is 7 mark time paces while moving the flag party 90 degres left or right. At least that how we use it.
> Counter march is a counter march.


If you are doing a 90 degree ..... you're doing a.......... TURN.
You may chose / need to dress by the right, left or by the centre but.... it's still a turn


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## Sloaner (3 Oct 2006)

Moving 90 degrees either a wheel or form can also be used, but Geo is right a simple turn can work as well.  In my experience with the cadet program, I have always used standard forms and wheels to change direction but not formation and it works just fine.  As for the countermarches, reference the CFP-202 for the Band Drill and everything works from there.  There are no center wheels or other crazy commands that some units cme up with.  Turns, Forms, Wheel's, Counter march, that's it.


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## yoman (3 Oct 2006)

I understand that its not a real command. I agree with geo that we are doing it wrong. I`m just trying to figure out the correct way of doing things. I`ll check the 201 when I get home.



			
				Kyle Burrows said:
			
		

> I'm with geo.  He has the experience and is a CWO.  Unless you want to tell the Sgt Major he doesn't know about drill(and entertaining as that would be, I'm sure you don't), I'd listen to him.



I`m not that daring.


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## condor888000 (3 Oct 2006)

Ok, me and Yoman are getting really confused on msn here trying to figure this out. Looked in the 201, can't find it.

When the unit is moved from line into column of route, how does the flag party maneuver? All the flights or platoons just do a right turn(for example), but doing so would immediately place the flag party in the incorrect position(from what I understand). 
As well, a form or wheel would place the flag party in front of the front rank of the unit, which doesn't make sense either. So pretty much, my question, is how the flag party gets from this:

      C                            C

22222222   F G F   1111111111
22222222             11111111111
22222222   G   G   11111111111

      D                            D

Into this:


     22222222         G    F        1111111111
D   22222222   C          G    D  1111111111   C
     22222222         G    F        1111111111

The C's being the flight commander, the D's being the flight Sgt, the G's being the guards, the F's the flags, and the numbers the flight themselves. 

What my former unit and Yoman's did, is while the commanders and flight Sgt's are marching to their new position, the flag party marks time, and shifts as a unit, maintaining their formation, now I understand this is incorrect, so once more, how is it supposed to be done?

Sorry for the bad diagram, but I am hopelessly incompetent.


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## George Wallace (3 Oct 2006)

The Guard would make a Left Turn, and the Flag Party would make a Right Turn and they would Wheel into position.  There would be no need for any 'Order' to be given by anyone in the Party, as the Parade Commander has already given the 'Order' to "Form Column of Route".


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## Sloaner (3 Oct 2006)

A right form would do the trick, this is predicated on a couple elements of positioning of your flag party.  First, which rank is the flag party dressing off; and second how many paces betwen the edges of the flag party and the right/left files of the flights/platoons.  How you have done it is very common in the cadet program, where it came from I have no idea, but its been around for years (I remember the flag party at my home squadron when I was a cadet in the 80's doing the same thing) however that doesn't make it right.  Since that time I have found that since the flag part is generally out of dressing with the rest of the unit (following the close order march depending on the company/squadron position when the colours were marched on) the easiest process is this:

1. When the company/squadron turns for the march past in column of route, the flag bearer/ensign on the right completes a right turn and all other members of the front rank of the flag party execute a right incline

2. when the company/squadron steps off the flag party completes the form on the march and dresses of to the center file (right flag bearer and escort step short, comander normal pace, left flag bearer/ensign steps out) and the flag party is in position by the first wheel with no additional commands or effort.

3. Going from column of route back to in-line, the flag party after the final wheel dresses to the rear rank prior to marking time (left flag bearer/ensign directly behind the rear rank or marching right file).

4. On the turn to the advance, the left flag bearer/ensign completes a left turn, all other members of the front rank of the flag party complete a left incline.  On completion of the turn, the flag party waits one standard pause and completes the left form at the halt, and will be back in their proper position before the platoon/flight commanders reach their designated positions.

Simple, no funky wheels, just drill straight out of the 201.


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## condor888000 (3 Oct 2006)

Alright, thank you for the explanation. That does seem to make much more sense that what is being done.


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## RCD_Cadet (12 Oct 2006)

Well is there anyone who knows where i can get(or how to get) a proper sword for parades b/c i only have a practice one and need a real one with the cipher on it


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## geo (12 Oct 2006)

(QM or borrowed from your affiliated unit)


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## Burrows (13 Oct 2006)

Please explain to me the reason for a C/MCpl to carry a sword.  Last I checked this was done primarily by officers.


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## p_imbeault (13 Oct 2006)

I was curious also...


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## GGHG_Cadet (13 Oct 2006)

For an escort to the Flag most likely.

 I carry a sword as an RSM and I would like my escorts to carry swords just like my AFU and Sister corps does.


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## Burrows (13 Oct 2006)

GGHG_Cadet said:
			
		

> For an escort to the Flag most likely.
> 
> I carry a sword as an RSM and I would like my escorts to carry swords just like my AFU and Sister corps does.


Possibly, but a reason would have been good.  I'd rather not have a bunch of MCpls running around with swords strapped to themselves.  It seems rather dangerous doesn't it? GIVING CADETS A POINTY METAL OBJECT.


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## p_imbeault (13 Oct 2006)

RCD_Cadet,

Why do you need a sword? Usually if it is required that you must have a sword for a parade (which is quite rare in cadets) it is supplied for you.


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## RCD_Cadet (14 Oct 2006)

Well in our corp the flag party Cmdr has always had a sword(except if they are carring a flag) and yes it was provided but only for a short time i asked one of my officer if he knew where we the corp could get one and he said to ask around... the reason that a mcpl can carry one is that there is not enough Sr NCO right now in my corp not disrespecting my own corp or anything


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## geo (14 Oct 2006)

RCD, as previously suggested, get your corp to inquire on their availability from your affiliated unit.  Another source would be EBay.  Getting new ones would be devilishly expensive and not something your corp would be interested in funding.


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## RCD_Cadet (14 Oct 2006)

thanks i shall inquire as to requesting one at the next O group and i will look on e-bay


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