# CFC Toronto as a posting



## shado_wolf (8 Aug 2005)

Hello,

Is anyone here posted to CFC Toronto?  What is it like to work there?  Are the PMQ's any good?  Were you able to live in an area outside of TO?  My posting choices just changed to TO and Greenwood.  I'm prolly gonna go with Toronto so the wife will have a better chance of getting a better paying job.  Thanks in advance.

Dylan


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## Fishbone Jones (8 Aug 2005)

Contact the two Dets and see if you can get hold of the pers your replacing. Ask them their thoughts. Are they posting out because of career progession, etc? Or are they leaving because of problems with the area? What type of extracurricullar activities are you interested in. Do you like clubbing and partying? Or hunting and fishing? Do you mind a one hour commute to work, or down the road? Are you worried about the Cost of Living? Will the PDA make up the difference? What are your chances of learning enough to progess you in your trade?

You've posed a question that presents opposite ends of the spectrum. I can say, when I was Air Force, I traded a job in Comox, BC for a promotion and job in Trenton, and it was probably the worst mistake I made in my career, because I only looked at that one aspect of it.

That's all I can give you.


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## aesop081 (8 Aug 2005)

recceguy said:
			
		

> I can say, when I was Air Force, I traded a job in Comox, BC for a promotion and job in Trenton



You are seeing a therapist about that..............right ?


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## Fishbone Jones (8 Aug 2005)

aesop081 said:
			
		

> You are seeing a therapist about that..............right ?



If you track me here, you'll find that, typically, therapists are money down the drain. Alcohol and Army Reserves seem to help somewhat, depending on the time of day and week.  

That and Prozac :blotto:


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## kincanucks (8 Aug 2005)

WTF is CFC Toronto?


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## aesop081 (8 Aug 2005)

kincanucks said:
			
		

> WTF is CFC Toronto?



Canadian Forces College


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## the 48th regulator (8 Aug 2005)

Canadian Forces College Toronto?

dileas

tess


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## kincanucks (8 Aug 2005)

And why would an ATIS be posted there?


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## the 48th regulator (8 Aug 2005)

geez Aes

you beat me again!!!!

dileas

tess


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## Fishbone Jones (8 Aug 2005)

The Aerospace Telecommunications and Information Systems Technician (ATIS Tech) performs, supervises and directs the repair and maintenance of all types of Air Force telecommunications systems, as well as information technology infrastructure supporting national operational command and control information systems. These include: static and deployable airfield communication, radar and navigational systems, long-range radio communications systems, deployable long-range radar and associated communication link systems, special purpose electronic systems used in signals intelligence operations, and cryptographic equipment.*ATIS techs also manage and maintain mobile and fixed satellite communications systems, microwave systems, switchboards, cable plants, and all forms of command and control computer systems and networks. Their primary technical functions are to perform preventive and corrective maintenance, system restoration, special inspections, modifications, installations and acceptance checks, as well as the repair and overhaul of all types of telecommunications, navigation and cryptographic systems.*

As well, I would also guess they do these same functions for whatever Unit they're posted with. Ergo, they probably take care of the Base computer and phone network amongst other things. The functions are the same throughout the trade, only the enviroment changes.


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## the 48th regulator (8 Aug 2005)

and here I thought you were in recruiting kincanucks?

dileas

tess


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## Fishbone Jones (8 Aug 2005)

the 48th regulator said:
			
		

> and here I thought you were in recruiting kincanucks?
> 
> dileas
> 
> tess



Remind me Wednesday night Hiram. I'll explain it


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## the 48th regulator (8 Aug 2005)

will do brother  

fy

tess


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## kincanucks (8 Aug 2005)

recceguy said:
			
		

> The Aerospace Telecommunications and Information Systems Technician (ATIS Tech) performs, supervises and directs the repair and maintenance of all types of Air Force telecommunications systems, as well as information technology infrastructure supporting national operational command and control information systems. These include: static and deployable airfield communication, radar and navigational systems, long-range radio communications systems, deployable long-range radar and associated communication link systems, special purpose electronic systems used in signals intelligence operations, and cryptographic equipment.*ATIS techs also manage and maintain mobile and fixed satellite communications systems, microwave systems, switchboards, cable plants, and all forms of command and control computer systems and networks. Their primary technical functions are to perform preventive and corrective maintenance, system restoration, special inspections, modifications, installations and acceptance checks, as well as the repair and overhaul of all types of telecommunications, navigation and cryptographic systems.*
> 
> As well, I would also guess they do these same functions for whatever Unit they're posted with. Ergo, they probably take care of the Base computer and phone network amongst other things. The functions are the same throughout the trade, only the enviroment changes.



This is a bit of a stretch in thinking that a Private ATIS or any other ATIS would be posted to the Canadian Forces Colleg but I guess anything is possible. Perhaps the originator could confirm that he was referring to the college?


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## kincanucks (8 Aug 2005)

the 48th regulator said:
			
		

> and here I thought you were in recruiting kincanucks?
> 
> dileas
> 
> tess



Now why would I know that an ATIS Tech could be posted to CFC Toronto, if it is true?  I am not in the career managing business.

_The duties of an ATIS tech are performed in operation centres, in static and mobile workshops, or outdoors where they are exposed to all climatic conditions. In geographic terms, employment as an ATIS tech can vary from bases within Canada and the USA, including the Arctic, to locations throughout the world, in response to NATO and UN commitments. Appropriate training, environmental clothing and equipment are provided, and Aerospace Telecommunications and Information Systems Technicians' health, safety and morale are closely monitored._


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## the 48th regulator (8 Aug 2005)

oh, okay.

dileas

tess


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## Fishbone Jones (9 Aug 2005)

Given what I, and kincancks, posted from CF websites, I can see a posting to anywhere that has more than three phones and a computer. Read the trade specs. Sigs, etc is like any other common trade. Just cause your Blue, don't mean you won't train Green.


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## bossi (12 Aug 2005)

CFC (also commonly known as "Staff College") has quite a few computers, plus it's a "Joint" (Army/Navy/Air Force) institution - thus, it actually does make sense that an ATIS could get posted there (i.e. SOMEBODY has to do all the work ... ha!)

I spent four years there (on staff - not in remedial trg ...)

Toronto certainly offers employment opportunities for spouses.  However, it can be expensive to live there (hence it has the highest PLD rate in Canada, last time I checked).

The PMQ situation isn't a simple one to expain, but ... here goes ...
Once upon a time, some IDIOT decided to close down CFB Toronto and turn it into a park ...
Several years later ... it's not really much of a park ... (but, of course - nobody is ever going to admit they made a mistake ... and, greedy land speculators are still drooling at the propect of getting their hands on some dirt cheap dirt - pun intended ...)

Moving right along ... depending on who you listen to, there are plans to bulldoze the existing PMQs and build new ones ... or not.  So, there's some uncertainty ... or maybe not ...

The Downsview PMQ patch is small, and depending on the time of month CFHA will tell you there aren't any available ... or there are empty ones ... or ... or ... or ...

The Oakville PMQ patch is West of Toronto, and not everybody likes to commute - however, quite a few folks who live out there enjoy living in a nice neighbourhood (oh ... did I forget to mention that Downsview is roughly five minutes away from Toronto's WORST neighbourhood ... something my conscience forces me to mention ... ?)

Accordingly, you might like to consider living out - PLD makes it a reasonable option, BUT be careful - Toronto is divided up into "zones", and some people have made the horrible mistake of buying or renting "just across the border" ... where they receive a lower rate of PLD (and they've suffered).

If you can't afford to buy a house right now, don't worry about it - the real estate market is still very, very high (and "buy high, sell low" is just a joke ...)

Rather than waste your money renting a ramshackle PMQ at CFHA's rip-off prices, you'd probably get much more value for your hard-earned dollar by renting something in a nicer neighbourhood.

Finally - talk to some of the other guys in your rank/pay bracket, and get their opinions (and "lessons learned" ...) - BUT, please promise me you'll talk to some Torontonians, too - I've lost track of how many horror stories I've witnessed "the blind leading the blind" (i.e. just because somebody else was posted into Toronto one or two years ago doesn't mean they actually know the REAL lay of the land.  Make sure you talk to some locals ... or long-timers ...)


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## wilson (3 Dec 2005)

bossi said:
			
		

> Toronto is divided up into "zones"



I see that rates have changed again.  I am up for a posting to Toronto.  Can anyone tell me what the geographical boundaries are for the 5 different PLD zones.

Thanks


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## shado_wolf (3 Dec 2005)

As it sits my COS date is 09 Jan 06 to be in T.O....

I am going to see IRP on Monday and I am hoping they can answer that question as I've asked everybody I could so far and haven't recieved any definative answers.

I'll let you know what I find out.  By the way, what is you trade and when are you supposed to be there?

Dylan


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## wilson (3 Dec 2005)

I'm a 011.  I haven't got the message yet but I have been told I am heading to T.O. during the next APS.


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## Dirt Digger (3 Dec 2005)

bossi said:
			
		

> The PMQ situation isn't a simple one to expain, but ... here goes ...
> Once upon a time, some IDIOT decided to close down CFB Toronto and turn it into a park ...
> Several years later ... it's not really much of a park ... (but, of course - nobody is ever going to admit they made a mistake ... and, greedy land speculators are still drooling at the propect of getting their hands on some dirt cheap dirt - pun intended ...)



Well, they've just started construction on the Canada forest-park-thing and shut off road access to a big chunk of the grounds.  Still a nice place to run without having the worry about being shanked by the locals.

[/quote]
Moving right along ... depending on who you listen to, there are plans to bulldoze the existing PMQs and build new ones ... or not.   So, there's some uncertainty ... or maybe not ...
[/quote]

They sent out a flyer explaining the master plan for the Downview grounds...William Baker was turned into a desert ecosystem for the Canada Park.  No actual word on what the hell is planned...just the usual disconnect between inerested parties.  Hopefully they'll tell us first before the bulldozers start rolling.

[/quote]
The Downsview PMQ patch is small, and depending on the time of month CFHA will tell you there aren't any available ... or there are empty ones ... or ... or ... or ...
[/quote]

That seemed to depend on who you got on the phone when you called.  If you walk around William Baker there are quite a few empty houses, but from what I've been told, CFHA has a weird reno schedule.  We're having our windows redone this winter...should be fun.

[/quote]
The Oakville PMQ patch is West of Toronto, and not everybody likes to commute - however, quite a few folks who live out there enjoy living in a nice neighbourhood (oh ... did I forget to mention that Downsview is roughly five minutes away from Toronto's WORST neighbourhood ... something my conscience forces me to mention ... ?)
[/quote]

Oakville is nice, but if you're looking at commuting by rail it'll cost you a monthly GO pass and a TTC pass.  It's about $60 for the first and $90 for the second.  While the Downview patch isn't in the greatest location, Jane & Finch *isn't* really within walking distance.  For the most part, the locals stay out...but it doesn't mean you won't find a used hypodermic needle in your front yard (as my wife did).

I'm just here until I'm done school (Dec 06), then I'll be posted out.  PLD is in the highest bracket.  House is in pretty good shape.  I have a lawn, good neighbours...it really isn't *that* bad if you're looking at a short posting...but if you're looking at 4+ years in Toronto, BUY.


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## shado_wolf (7 Dec 2005)

Well.....

The Sgt I'll be reporting to in TO told me to check with IRP.  IRP told me to check with my BOR.  My BOR said I should ask someone in TO...

Gettin dizzy yet?

Dylan


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## shado_wolf (12 Jan 2006)

Well I've got a map of the PLD zones in TO.  I'll find a way to post shortly.  Now that I've been here and looked about here are some things I've noticed....

If you drive now, sell yer car.

I thought Alberta started high for insurance.  Was payin 170 for two vehicles now lookin at about 400+

If you have kids, leave em with friends.

Daycare in Edm is about 700-900 for the two tots.  Here is 700-900 each.

Rent is a little high but you can get brand new never lived in 4 bdrm houses for 1300-1400 in very family orientated areas like markham.

Don't forget PST if your not used to it, it can add up.

Anyways, Later....


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## TCBF (14 Jan 2006)

And don't forget the frag vests and some extra blast blankets to use as spall liners in the Q.

 ;D

Tom


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## PPCLI Guy (15 Jan 2006)

If you are thinking of renting, I currently live in a 3 bedroom house in the Beach, that has a separate 1 bedroom apartment.  The house is a turn of the century row house, and it is admitedly small.  On a cul de sac, with off leash area and kiddie park (including water park) at end of road.  140 metres from a good pub (although sometimes when I come home it seems longer...)  Backyard is fenced, but no driveway (so just one car is ideal as you park on the street).  Commute to CFC is about 40 minutes by TTC, and about 25 minutes by car.  I am paying 1300, and landlord loves Army Guys.  I am leaving mid July - PM me if you wish.

Dave


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## Zombie (15 Jan 2006)

Just to add to this - I was living in a 3 bedroom house at Yonge and Sheppard right in the middle of North York for $1200/month. One subway stop away from York Mills, which is where you go for the CF College (There's also a good daycare facility in the York Mills Centre, not sure of prices though, and the CFC is one traffic light west). I also lived for years right next to the Downsview base and the area is really not that bad. As far as Markham, I grew up in Thornhill and it's one of the best areas around. Car insurance I'm only paying $70/month. Just keep looking around, it's not that bad. Good Luck


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## shado_wolf (16 Jan 2006)

I guess you're all right.  Rent ain't too bad for the area.  We signed a lease on Thurs for a brand new duplex in S.E. Markham for 1400.  4 bdrm, master ensuite, unfinished bsmt.... the works. 

Just got a quote for 290 for the two vehicles and tenant insurance.  Thanks for the advice, I'll keep shoppin...

Dylan


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## Danjanou (16 Jan 2006)

Dylan, Markham's not bad and that rent sems reasonable if such a word exists here in the GTA. Actually the one advantage of the seemingly never ending condo boom is that there are some fairly good rental deals now. Mostly apts for sibngles or couples w/o kids but they're there if you go looking.

There are plenty of us on the site from the GTA, serving and retired if you have any general questions or important ones like the name of the pub PPCLI Guy was talking about. ;D


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## GGHG_Cadet (17 Jan 2006)

$1400 is about average for rent here in Markham, the most expensive areas are probably Unionville and old Markham (near Main Street). Markham is mostly a great place, some areas are a little sketchy but its nothing compared to other areas in the GTA. 
  
One of my Captain's was in almost the same situation as you, he came from BC to work at CFC as a civilian a couple of years ago and he is now living in Markham.


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## shado_wolf (19 Jan 2006)

It's a nice area.  Just N of steeles and E of Markham Rd.  I have two kids so we were lookin for a place that seemed to be really kid friendly.

Thanks for the warm welcome.

Dylan


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## Zoomie (19 Jan 2006)

Markham is a nice place to live.  Still far enough outside of the GTA so that you can escape into the country.

[Begin playing Devil's Avocate]
Does Markham even fall within the PLD zones for T.O. ?  I would suspect not.  $1400/month can get you a mortgage - albeit probably not enough to buy a house in York Region.  Take that $1400/month and move closer to CFC, get your PLD of approx. $1000/month and now you can afford a much larger mortgage (around $350,000).  Food for thought.
[Finish playing...]


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