# Email Ranks



## Monarchist (15 Jan 2011)

Hi all,

Perhaps a strange question, or seemingly trivial.  When writing emails to persons with whom Im not overly aquatinted within the forces I generally begin correspondence by stating their abbreviated rank at the top of the email, much in the same way as one would start a conversation in real life.  For example, to a Sergeant, I'd put "Sgt," followed by a blank line and then the email body.  When addressing persons of a more gentile persuasion I'd put "Sir" or "Mme".  This is easy in the Army, but I need some help for a Navy rank.  I have to write a Petty Officer 1st Class, and I'd like to make the best initial impression possible.  How would open an email to a person of such rank?  While we are at it, how does address a person of such rank in real life?  Spit out the whole thing?  I know this all may seem odd but I have had almost zero contact with Naval personnel my whole time in.

Thanks for the help,
Monarchist


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## my72jeep (15 Jan 2011)

PO1 or P1

usually works.


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## Occam (15 Jan 2011)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> PO1 or P1
> 
> usually works.



PO1 is a little on the formal side, and wouldn't be used to address someone in person.

Were I writing it, I would address them as "PO", as one would do if you were going to address them in speech.

"P1" is something only used in very specific circumstances when one wanted to distinguish between the two different Petty Officer ranks, such as "He picked up his P1's the other day", or "He's been a P1 since the Ark".


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## Monarchist (15 Jan 2011)

Sounds simple enough.  Probably a case of me over thinking things.


Thanks all.


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## PPCLI Guy (15 Jan 2011)

Monarchist said:
			
		

> Hi all,
> 
> When addressing persons of a more *gentile* persuasion I'd put "Sir" or "Mme".


Hmmm - so Christians are always sir or ma'am, even if they are POs?


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## Monarchist (17 Jan 2011)

Actually, its everybody who is not Jewish.  

I miss used the word, my bad.

Thanks again for clearing up my initial question.


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## Pusser (17 Jan 2011)

Petty officers are normally addressed as "PO" and chief petty officers as "Chief."

My problem has always been with the Army.  How do i address a chief warrant officer in casual conversation?  I gather they don't like being called "Chief."  "Chief Warrant Officer," is quite a mouthful.  "Mr X," I gather is acceptable, but what if I don't his name?  "Hey you," is definitely out as far as I know.  "Sir" is inappropriate for me as an officer.  I like "Sergeant Major," but not all CWOs are sergeants major.  The Navy has it so easy.  "Chief" is never wrong for a sailor with either a crown and laurel or a coat of arms on his sleeve.

PS:  I think the word Monarchist was looking for was "genteel."


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## George Wallace (17 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> Petty officers are normally addressed as "PO" and chief petty officers as "Chief."
> 
> My problem has always been with the Army.  How do i address a chief warrant officer in casual conversation?  I gather they don't like being called "Chief."  "Chief Warrant Officer," is quite a mouthful.  "Mr X," I gather is acceptable, but what if I don't his name?  "Hey you," is definitely out as far as I know.  "Sir" is inappropriate for me as an officer.  I like "Sergeant Major," but not all CWOs are sergeants major.  The Navy has it so easy.  "Chief" is never wrong for a sailor with either a crown and laurel or a coat of arms on his sleeve.
> 
> PS:  I think the word Monarchist was looking for was "genteel."



Army CWOs are called "Sir" by their subordinates, "Bob" or whatever their first name is by their peers, and often "Mr", "Chief Warrant Officer", or "RSM" (if so employed) by their superiors.  ........ But NEVER "Chief".   >


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## Pusser (17 Jan 2011)

George Wallace said:
			
		

> Army CWOs are called "Sir" by their subordinates, "Bob" or whatever their first name is by their peers, and often "Mr", "Chief Warrant Officer", or "RSM" (if so employed) by their superiors.  ........ But NEVER "Chief".   >



Would you use "Mister" by itself, without a name?


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## George Wallace (17 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> Would you use "Mister" by itself, without a name?



No.  Too many heads would turn to reply back.  Some of them only O/Cdts.   It would be Mister __________, so as no mistakes as to whom is being addressed.   


[Edit]

The above would not be in an email, but in a person on person scenario.  Back to the email, it would probably be simplest to keep it simple and use CWO _______________.


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## wildman0101 (17 Jan 2011)

When in doubt allways 3-bag's full Sir
When adressing unknown member's
SIR... Until reply recieved,, 
Then 3-bag's full,,, 
The reason behind that.
They deserve  the compliment.
Notice the 3-bag's.
!. Compliment to thier service.
2. Compliment to thier rank.
3. Compliment to you for considering
all of the above and caring for the service
they gave.
4. Kudoo to you.
5. Ill shadupp now.
Scoty B
AKA (the brat)
P.S. no doubt in my mind you will (along the
way) make some super friend's.


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## brihard (17 Jan 2011)

Monarchist said:
			
		

> Hi all,
> 
> Perhaps a strange question, or seemingly trivial.  When writing emails to persons with whom Im not overly aquatinted within the forces I generally begin correspondence by stating their abbreviated rank at the top of the email, much in the same way as one would start a conversation in real life.  For example, to a Sergeant, I'd put "Sgt," followed by a blank line and then the email body.  When addressing persons of a more gentile persuasion I'd put "Sir" or "Mme".  This is easy in the Army, but I need some help for a Navy rank.  I have to write a Petty Officer 1st Class, and I'd like to make the best initial impression possible.  How would open an email to a person of such rank?  While we are at it, how does address a person of such rank in real life?  Spit out the whole thing?  I know this all may seem odd but I have had almost zero contact with Naval personnel my whole time in.
> 
> ...



I would assume that a filthy guard would salute, 'sir', and offer to polish whatever is within eyesight by default.  >

But no, I kid. I've always used rank abbreviation at the start of emails for up to the rank of WO, 'Sergeant Major' for CSMs, and 'Sir' for MWO (not SgtMaj) and CWOs. Officers are obviously 'Sir' or 'Ma'am'. In real life (I often enough run into them in my civvie job working retail) it's 'sir' for.. well, for 'sir's, and rank as appropriate for other SNCOs.


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## Pat in Halifax (18 Jan 2011)

For God's sake, do not call a CPO2/CPO1 "Sir". I have only been in Ottawa since mid-December but have been called Sir (and have been saluted!) by many in green and blue up to the rank of Sgt!!!
Maybe I can get away with it but I call a CWO "Chief" - The planned come-back if I get a nasty look is "How would you like to be addressed".
There must be one on these forums somewhere????? to answer this?

As for the original query - Many are correct - Simply PO.


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## aesop081 (18 Jan 2011)

Pat in Halifax said:
			
		

> Maybe I can get away with it but I call a CWO "Chief"



Well, its not just you who gets away with it. In MAG, all MWOs and CWOs are reffered to as "Chief".


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## Monarchist (18 Jan 2011)

Brihard, that is correct.  This is why I carry Brasso in my mag pouches and all the other pockets on my Tac are stuffed with Kiwi cloths.  I've also found that my fingers have absorbed enough Brasso that in a pinch, I can generally garner a mirror shine out of metal simply through the vigorous application of my digits.     I'll leave the technique to your imaginations.

Pusser, thats the word I was looking for, thanks!

Regarding the addressing of anything above Sergeant in the Army, at my particular unit its easy.  Since Warrants are Colour Sergeants, we call them Sir, and the same goes for Masters and Chiefs!  So, we Guards have it easy there.  However one must be sure to not apply this rule outside the Regiment, as calling a non-Guard Warrant "Sir" would probably just double the scorn we poor Household Brigaders already receive for being what we are!

Anyways the email was sent, and the individual with whom Im corresponding probably wouldn't care if I called him buddynuts.  Thus far my naval experience has been quite casual!


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## ModlrMike (18 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> Would you use "Mister" by itself, without a name?



The days of calling WOs in the CF Mr are long gone. It's still a tradition in the British Army however. Just the same, a junior would never address a senior as Mr xxxx. The would still be addressed by their rank.

As an aside, when I was serving with the British, I became accustomed to officers referring to me as Mr.

To finish, you'll never go wrong in writing CWO/MWO/WO Bloggins.


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## McG (18 Jan 2011)

The proper way to address individuals (in full and abreviated, formally and informally) of different rank is outlined on DWAN in this book:  A-AD-200-000/AG-00 - Honours, Flags and Heritage Structure of the Canadian Forces 

For Army and Air Force, it is mostly the same.  The Navy has a number of differences (including the acceptable use of the title "Chief").


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## AmmoTech90 (18 Jan 2011)

ModlrMike said:
			
		

> The days of calling WOs in the CF Mr are long gone. It's still a tradition in the British Army however. Just the same, a junior would never address a senior as Mr xxxx. The would still be addressed by their rank.
> 
> As an aside, when I was serving with the British, I became accustomed to officers referring to me as Mr.
> 
> To finish, you'll never go wrong in writing CWO/MWO/WO Bloggins.



CWOs are still called Mr, either when being referred to in the third person by their peers, or by officers directly or indirectly.  I agree Mr is not used for WO/MWO.


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## Pat in Halifax (19 Jan 2011)

Monarchist said:
			
		

> Brihard, that is correct.  This is why I carry Brasso in my mag pouches and all the other pockets on my Tac are stuffed with Kiwi cloths.  I've also found that my fingers have absorbed enough Brasso that in a pinch, I can generally garner a mirror shine out of metal simply through the vigorous application of my digits.     I'll leave the technique to your imaginations.
> 
> Pusser, thats the word I was looking for, thanks!
> 
> ...


Bolded and underlined-DO NOT do this in the Navy with PO1s and CPO1/2s!!!! Call a PO1 Stoker a "Colour Sergeant--Let me know how that one works out for you!


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## Pusser (19 Jan 2011)

As interesting as all this is, it really doesn't answer my question.  Here is the scenario I'm referring to: 

1)  I see an Army CWO and wish to get his attention.

2)  I do not say, "Good morning Mr XXXX," because I do not know his name.

3)  I do say, "Good morning Sir," because I am senior to him.

4)  I do not say "Good morning Sergeant Major," because that is an appointment he may not hold (which is more than likely in Ottawa).

5)  I could say, "Good morning Chief Warrant Officer," but that seems very awkward.

6)  I do not just say, "Good morning,"  because I don't know if it actually is a good morning for him ;D.

7)  I do not say, "Hey you, " because that is just rude.

Is there another option?


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## Journeyman (19 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> As interesting as all this is, it really doesn't answer my question.  Here is the scenario I'm referring to......


Wow. 
Under the heading of "cutting the defence budget, starting with people in NDHQ with obviously too much free time on their hands"..... the daily conundrums you staff officers face.


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## Pusser (19 Jan 2011)

Journeyman said:
			
		

> Wow.
> Under the heading of "cutting the defence budget, starting with people in NDHQ with obviously too much free time on their hands"..... the daily conundrums you staff officers face.



I'm not exactly losing sleep over this.  I can always resort to calling him "Chief" and claiming ignorance of Army rank structure (seems to work for Army and Air Force folks when talking to the Navy), but I have always been curious.  I'm starting to think that there is no answer....

Maybe I can call him 42?


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## Occam (19 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> Is there another option?



8.  Toss the nearest Pte at him so that he addresses you first.

 ;D


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## Journeyman (19 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> I'm not exactly losing sleep over this.


Of course not; you're sitting in the office surfing the internet   >


Personally, I'd just say "good morning," or if I wanted his attention, "excuse me."


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## Fishbone Jones (19 Jan 2011)

Senior, long serving people, especially those working in a combined HQ situation don't, or shouldn't,  need the internet to figure out how to address someone from a different element. There are enough around you at work. Go ask them.

Milnet.ca Staff


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## McG (19 Jan 2011)

Pusser said:
			
		

> As interesting as all this is, it really doesn't answer my question.  Here is the scenario I'm referring to:
> ...
> 
> Is there another option?


See my previous post:





			
				MCG said:
			
		

> The proper way to address individuals (in full and abreviated, formally and informally) of different rank is outlined on DWAN in this book:  A-AD-200-000/AG-00 - Honours, Flags and Heritage Structure of the Canadian Forces


The clunky DWAN search engine finds the answer easy enough in Chapt 11 here: http://hr.ottawa-hull.mil.ca/dhh-dhp/pub/cfp-pfc/doc/AAD200000AG000_C080515A.pdf


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