# B.C. declares provincial state of emergency due to wildfires



## daftandbarmy (15 Aug 2018)

Fingers crossed for those in Fraser Lake, and many other small (and not so small) communities in the Central Interior....


B.C. declares provincial state of emergency due to wildfires

The B.C. government has now declared a provincial state of emergency due to the wildfires burning around the province.

This state of emergency will be in place for 14 days but may be extended or rescinded as necessary.

It applies to the whole province and ensures provincial, federal and local resources can be delivered in a co-ordinated response to protect the residents of British Columbia.

https://globalnews.ca/news/4388826/b-c-declares-provincial-state-of-emergency-wildfires/?utm_source=notification/


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## Scott (15 Aug 2018)

This may be of interest: http://www.ciffc.ca/firewire/current.php

It's updated at 1500 Winnipeg time every day.


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## AbdullahD (15 Aug 2018)

I have been on a work train, working terrace to PG... burns lake to PG is pretty darn bad. Let me see if I cant figure out how to post some pictures.

Took the pictures yesterday, in the afternoon.. in the thick of it, it looked like the sun had already set and then around rose lake it cleared right off.

Lots of good chaps fighting these fires and the controlled burn they did was a success. Praying hard for all them guys. But I guess it is the natural order of things in the long run, just sad for all those losing so much.

Abdullah

Funny couldn't post pic direct had to ss it first lol


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## daftandbarmy (15 Aug 2018)

AbdullahD said:
			
		

> I have been on a work train, working terrace to PG... burns lake to PG is pretty darn bad. Let me see if I cant figure out how to post some pictures.
> 
> Took the pictures yesterday, in the afternoon.. in the thick of it, it looked like the sun had already set and then around rose lake it cleared right off.
> 
> ...



OMFG... that's a huge fire...  

One out of over 560 so far, apparently.


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## Retired AF Guy (15 Aug 2018)

A couple photos posted today on Facebook by friends of mine in west-central Saskatchewan showing the overcast created by the fires in BC.


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## Retired AF Guy (15 Aug 2018)

Second photo. This one was taken at 1:00 PM. So bad that the outside yard light came on.


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## AbdullahD (15 Aug 2018)

Retired AF Guy said:
			
		

> Second photo. This one was taken at 1:00 PM. So bad that the outside yard light came on.



That's pretty insane but cool/scary.

Just saw shovel lake is 50,000 hectares 

https://www.interior-news.com/news/shovel-lake-fire-near-burns-lake-is-the-largest-active-fire-in-b-c/


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## Scott (16 Aug 2018)

How in the fuck are they still having 80+ human caused fires?

Good luck to the troops who will be involved. It's a slog, some of the toughest work I have ever done, but it is so rewarding.

CIFFC reports don't show much help in sight, resources are stretched super thin given that Ontario and Quebec have had significant trouble already this year. And here I was thinking that BC might get the year off - deservedly.


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## SeaKingTacco (16 Aug 2018)

Scott said:
			
		

> How in the frig are they still having 80+ human caused fires?
> 
> Good luck to the troops who will be involved. It's a slog, some of the toughest work I have ever done, but it is so rewarding.
> 
> CIFFC reports don't show much help in sight, resources are stretched super thin given that Ontario and Quebec have had significant trouble already this year. And here I was thinking that BC might get the year off - deservedly.



Nearly everyone I know has a story of witnessing some imbecile flick a lit cigarette butt from their car window. I know of crews who have been night flying and still discovered people in the backwoods partying at bonfires (pretty easy to see on NVGs).

In both cases, the Cops are eager to hand out tickets, if they can, but there is just so much stupidity...


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## daftandbarmy (16 Aug 2018)

SeaKingTacco said:
			
		

> Nearly everyone I know has a story of witnessing some imbecile flick a lit cigarette butt from their car window. I know of crews who have been night flying and still discovered people in the backwoods partying at bonfires (pretty easy to see on NVGs).
> 
> In both cases, the Cops are eager to hand out tickets, if they can, but there is just so much stupidity...



I know one of the guys who chases arsonists too, which is hard to prove but very prevalent apparently: 
https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/fire-bug-likely-a-thrill-seeker-or-revenge-seeker-arson-profiler-says


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## Scott (17 Aug 2018)

Oh arson is a huge problem that is not talked about much unless it becomes prolific or high value. That's my experience talking. I used to work an area where we'd be putting one out, just taking a break and cleaning up, only to see a plume from the next one kick off. This would go on for days/weeks in the spring before green up.

One lovely chap smiled at us as he walked by, on his way, likely, to set another.

Seems like the tone I am seeing through CIFFC is IA crews on the move. This might mean no relief in sight and an attempt to hit the new starts hard so they don't become campaign fires, but that's just my gut.


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## Scott (17 Aug 2018)

I wonder if the oil and gas guys have been contacted yet. I know last year they sat on their duffs. They used to deploy readily and had good success in interface fires or water sourcing operations. Nobody can move the volumes they do.


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## daftandbarmy (17 Aug 2018)

Scott said:
			
		

> I wonder if the oil and gas guys have been contacted yet. I know last year they sat on their duffs. They used to deploy readily and had good success in interface fires or water sourcing operations. *Nobody can move the volumes they do*.



Which is why various regulatory agencies are biting at their heels right now


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## Journeyman (17 Aug 2018)

Friends in Kimberley BC (south of Banff) just got the 'get out of Dodge' order this morning.


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## Scott (17 Aug 2018)

daftandbarmy said:
			
		

> Which is why various regulatory agencies are biting at their heels right now



Oh? That's good news then.

It was tried 15 years ago to set up some sort of framework. Government(s) stalled it. The industrial guys went back to their industrial things. Dave eager wrote a pretty good piece on it last year: https://energynow.ca/2017/07/oilfield-firefighters-fiddle-b-c-burns-david-yager-yager-management/


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## daftandbarmy (17 Aug 2018)

Journeyman said:
			
		

> Friends in Kimberley BC (south of Banff) just got the 'get out of Dodge' order this morning.



That sucks.... sorry to hear it. 

That's a tough area to get around in due to the geography, so they're being careful about pulling people out as soon as it looks like a fire could cut off escape routes. Last year I think they were working with a 20km radius as a rule of thumb. 

'No more Ft McMurray's' is the basic principle....


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## AbdullahD (17 Aug 2018)

An article showing how bad the smoke is :S

https://globalnews.ca/news/4393740/prince-george-wildfire-smoke/?utm_medium=Facebook&utm_source=GlobalBC


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## Rifleman62 (17 Aug 2018)

Possibly it is time to effect a CF task similar to the California air Guard.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modular_Airborne_FireFighting_System



> AIRBORNE FIREFIGHTING MISSION
> The Modular Airborne Fire Fighting System (MAFFS) program provides emergency capability to support the U.S. Department of Agriculture's Forest Service in fighting wildland fires. The MAFFS units are loaded onto C-130 aircraft and can drop 3,000 lbs of retardant on a wildfire in less than five seconds, fly back to its home base, and be refilled and airborne again in less than 20 minutes. This mission highlights interagency cooperation.


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## daftandbarmy (17 Aug 2018)

Rifleman62 said:
			
		

> Possibly it is time to effect a CF task similar to the California air Guard.
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modular_Airborne_FireFighting_System



Based on this report on last years' record wildfire and flood seasons, we need to be a whole lot more strategic than that:

Addressing the New Normal: 21st Century Disaster Management in British Columbia

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/public-safety-and-emergency-services/emergency-preparedness-response-recovery/embc/bc-flood-and-wildfire-review-addressing-the-new-normal-21st-century-disaster-management-in-bc-web.pdf


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## Good2Golf (17 Aug 2018)

Rifleman62 said:
			
		

> Possibly it is time to effect a CF task similar to the California air Guard.
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modular_Airborne_FireFighting_System



Don’t underestimate the power of the commercial aerial fire fightimg lobby.  DND last water bucketed on a civilian fire in the late 80s, and on DND property in the early 90s.  It was a shared federal and pan-provincial decision that DND Air assets not be used in support of fire fighting. 

:2c:


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## CBH99 (18 Aug 2018)

G2G,

Care to expand on that at all?  Legitimate question - I don't know anything about the decisions made, or the reasoning behind them.

Given that massive fires are the new norm, and every summer we seemingly deploy troops to assist - would it not be wise to make this part of a "normal planning" during summer months?  I'm sure it probably already is somewhere, but air assets might be a big help?  Or not?   (I literally don't know...)


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## SeaKingTacco (18 Aug 2018)

I don't detect that in Canada, we are much short of either helos or water bombers for aerial fire suppression.

I am not sure what the RCAF could realistically add, that would not the seriously detract from our ability to get into rough strips and get people out by the metric boatload. That is what we excel at. Not dropping retardant.


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## Good2Golf (18 Aug 2018)

CBH99 said:
			
		

> G2G,
> 
> Care to expand on that at all?  Legitimate question - I don't know anything about the decisions made, or the reasoning behind them.
> 
> Given that massive fires are the new norm, and every summer we seemingly deploy troops to assist - would it not be wise to make this part of a "normal planning" during summer months?  I'm sure it probably already is somewhere, but air assets might be a big help?  Or not?   (I literally don't know...)



The original Chinooks used to have 1200gal rigid buckets and the Hueys had 200gal bambi buckets, and in the 80s would assist aerial firefighting outside of DND property.  There were complaints from the industry, however, that the military was taking away revenue from the civilian operators...so then the water bucketing capability was restricted to DND property only, primarily on Army bases where 10 TAG helicopters were based, due to fires often resulting from use of the Guns.  Later in the 90s, responsibility for forest fire fighting, even on DND property came under respective provincial natural resources ministries and then, even fires inside military ranges, etc. were handled by provincial or contracted civilian aerial fire-fighting assets, both fixed-wing and helos.  Today, there is no firefighting capability in the RCAF, and probably won't ever be.  The tac hel fleet that used to fire fight now is smaller and focused on operations, such as those in Mali and Iraq.

Regards
G2G


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## CBH99 (18 Aug 2018)

Scott said:
			
		

> Oh arson is a huge problem that is not talked about much unless it becomes prolific or high value. That's my experience talking. I used to work an area where we'd be putting one out, just taking a break and cleaning up, only to see a plume from the next one kick off. This would go on for days/weeks in the spring before green up.
> 
> One lovely chap smiled at us as he walked by, on his way, likely, to set another.
> 
> Seems like the tone I am seeing through CIFFC is IA crews on the move. This might mean no relief in sight and an attempt to hit the new starts hard so they don't become campaign fires, but that's just my gut.




Screw tickets.  Charged & remanded until trial if sufficient evidence exists to suggest someone is either a) causing arson in the form of fires during forest fire operations (especially these massive ones) - or b) massive fines if someone is seen throwing a lit cigarette or some other stupid thing during these types of situations.

The amount of money & manpower to fight these is HUGE.  Plenty of fires occur naturally, as nature intended & needs.  Fine, fair enough.  Nature will always manage nature far better than we can.

But if someone is intentionally starting fires, or is too stupid to not start a fire by being a bonehead?  No moral problem here arresting/charging them, or hitting them with a massive fine.


**If I was driving through BC and threw a lit cigarette out a window under these circumstances, I would rightfully hope someone would just kick my a$$.


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## Colin Parkinson (18 Aug 2018)

Used to be an issue that people in certain communities up north would set fires in order to get jobs fighting it. Canada could set up a air squadron under PWGS using new build Cl-215 water bombers. An firm order on 10 bombers would likely kick start the production line and result in a lot of international sales, helping to offset the initial order.


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## daftandbarmy (21 Aug 2018)

And, of course, the fires are the second state of emergency declared in BC this year after the floods:

B.C. wildfires 2018: Premier says wildfires prompted unprecedented second state of emergency

An air quality alert remains in effect for much of the province because of the smoke from the wildfires. 

https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/b-c-premier-john-horgan-to-tour-areas-affected-by-wildfires


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## Scott (22 Aug 2018)

CBH99 said:
			
		

> Screw tickets.  Charged & remanded until trial if sufficient evidence exists to suggest someone is either a) causing arson in the form of fires during forest fire operations (especially these massive ones) - or b) massive fines if someone is seen throwing a lit cigarette or some other stupid thing during these types of situations.
> 
> The amount of money & manpower to fight these is HUGE.  Plenty of fires occur naturally, as nature intended & needs.  Fine, fair enough.  Nature will always manage nature far better than we can.
> 
> ...



Easy to detect, extraordinarily difficult to prove/make stick.

My hope has always been that communities begin to band together to encourage these folks that they have lost their way. No, not vigilante justice, just subtle hints that their behaviour is offside. My general belief is that someone always knows something.

G2G, funny, I thought that RCAF always had access to buckets. In fact, I was told just such a thing in the mid 00's. It made little sense to me at the time because, like bucketing does take some practice and isn't something you just do. Just like one of the civvy guys might love to land on the back of a heaving ship, but it isn't the wisest idea without some experience first.

Now, as I have said before, I wish the private sector was looked upon as a resource the same as a pump or hose kit were within CIFFC. Legitimize them, end the salesmanship that always accompanies them, and come up with a framework to pay them clear and openly across the board. Private sector isn't going to take a loss. Period. Accept that and find a way to ensure they don't and then it's up to them to decide if it's worth their while to split some resources away from potential blowouts and high revenue events in the oilfield. Risk/reward.


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## daftandbarmy (22 Aug 2018)

One down, dozens to go....

Suspect arrested in B.C. after fires intentionally lit

RCMP in Penticton, B.C. say a man is in custody after fires were intentionally lit on Sunday afternoon.

A witness who called police said he saw a man start a fire before running away near the Channel Parkway Trail and Eckhardt Ave.

https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/2018/08/14/fires-suspect-arrested-bc/


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## daftandbarmy (28 Aug 2018)

It will be interesting to see if they keep the bush open for this coming Labour Day long weekend. A lot of active logging areas have already been closed:


Drought worsens as fires continue to burn throughout B.C. 

This weekend's rain was not enough to extinguish fires or replenish streams and rivers

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/drought-worsens-as-fires-continue-to-burn-throughout-b-c-1.4800686?cmp=news-digests-british-columbia


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## larry Strong (28 Aug 2018)

*Humans responsible for more than 400 B.C. wild fires so far this season*

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/humans-responsible-for-more-than-400-b-c-wildfires-so-far-this-season-1.4069178


Cheers
Larry


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## daftandbarmy (28 Aug 2018)

Meanwhile, in the USA:

Report: Poor Management of Forests, Not Global Warming, To Blame for Widespread Wildfires

“Global warming may contribute slightly, but the key factors are mismanaged forests, years of fire suppression, increased population, people living where they should not, invasive flammable species, and the fact that California has always had fire,” University of Washington climate scientist Cliff Mass told TheDCNF.

https://www.westernjournal.com/report-poor-management-forests-global-warming-blame-widespread-wildfires/?utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=PostSideSharingButtons&utm_content=2018-08-27&utm_campaign=websitesharingbuttons


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## Brad Sallows (3 Sep 2018)

And ... there is still a lot of beetle-killed timber out there.  Years ago, people predicted a long run of years of more severe fire seasons than usual.  Did all that disappear from memories?


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## Scott (4 Sep 2018)

Brad Sallows said:
			
		

> And ... there is still a lot of beetle-killed timber out there.  Years ago, people predicted a long run of years of more severe fire seasons than usual.  Did all that disappear from memories?



As soon as the first snow flew. 

Same everywhere.


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