# "The Devil's Brigade" Reality Series on History Channel



## Strike (6 Nov 2006)

That's right.  History Channel is reliving the training of the lives of the Americans and Canadians that were part of the Devil's Brigade.  From food to uniforms, everything is as authentic as possible.

I heard about this on CBC Radio this afternoon.  The show premiers Tuesday night  (7 Nov) and runs until Friday night.

The people who volunteered are all current or former serving members of the Canadian and U.S. Armed Forces.  Sounds like it will be very interesting.  I always like when History Channel puts out their version of reality TV.  It is actually educational.


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## Nieghorn (6 Nov 2006)

The History Channel (US) or History Television?   I just checked Canada's HT, and there's nothing like that on at 7pm EST, but there is something called 'Devil's Brigade' (not the movie) on at 9 and 10pm.  Info doesn't say much.


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## Strike (7 Nov 2006)

Sorry, it's History Television.  It's on at 2100 (Eastern) or 0300 zulu to make it easier on everyone.   ;D


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## ProPatria Mike (7 Nov 2006)

It starts tonight and ends tomorrow and and is composed of four, one hour segments. The premise is as such. Current soldiers attempt to recreate the training that the famous Devils Brigade was subject to and then do one of the missions. Supposedly, one of the lads nearly dies and two bail out due to fact they could take no more. 

Hey, just out of curiosity, was anybody here on parade when they brought the unit back in the late seventies? I was a young private with 1RCR at the time and, like the rest of the battalion, was bussed up for the parade. Afterwards, I met several original members at the refreshment tents, very interesting.... as was the parade. 

Ozons!


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## Haggis (7 Nov 2006)

It runs for three nights: http://www.history.ca/microsites/devilsbrigade/



			
				ProPatria Mike said:
			
		

> Current soldiers attempt to recreate the training that the famous Devils Brigade was subject to and then do one of the missions.* Supposedly*, one of the lads nearly dies and two bail out due to fact they could take no more.



And your source for this is.....?


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## Journeyman (7 Nov 2006)

ProPatria Mike said:
			
		

> *Ozons!*


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## KevinB (7 Nov 2006)

Oral Sex Or No Sex  ;D


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## ProPatria Mike (7 Nov 2006)

Haggis said:
			
		

> It runs for three nights: http://www.history.ca/microsites/devilsbrigade/
> 
> And your source for this is.....?



My local papers television guide! Which, alas, is not on line.

I'll summarize.... Two days, not three. 15 current day soldiers ...same pace and training... same uniforms and equipment... says one soldier almost dies, four more hospitalized... archival footage and interviews with living veterans... 

I think it will be a good watch.


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## Bobbyoreo (7 Nov 2006)

A good buddy of mine from the R Wpg Rif is one of the guys involved with it. He said it was a great experience and he was glad he got to give it a try.


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## ProPatria Mike (7 Nov 2006)

Were they all from the same unit?


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## Bobbyoreo (7 Nov 2006)

nope from a bunch of different units...well the Canadian troops anyways...no idea about the us troops


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## Haggis (7 Nov 2006)

Bobbyoreo said:
			
		

> nope from a bunch of different units...well the Canadian troops anyways...no idea about the us troops



The names and backgrounds of the participants are listed on the site I quoted above.  Click on the "Characters" tab.


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## ex-Sup (8 Nov 2006)

Did anyone watch this program last night? Doing my duty as a history teacher, I made sure to check it out. I thought it was pretty good. The only thing I noticed (maybe someone else noticed as well) was the difference between the US and Cdn participants. Most of the US were reg force personnel, some even SF. I didn't see any Canadians who were reg force. All were reservists; QYR, RWR, N Sask R, etc. Kinda strange is all.


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## ProPatria Mike (8 Nov 2006)

I thought it was pretty interesting, and good, as well. I noticed that about the units... no idea what the answer might be, however. Should be good tonight, eh? Same time, same channel.


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## aesop081 (8 Nov 2006)

ProPatria Mike said:
			
		

> Ozons!



 :rofl:


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## Haggis (8 Nov 2006)

ex-Sup said:
			
		

> The only thing I noticed (maybe someone else noticed as well) was the difference between the US and Cdn participants. Most of the US were reg force personnel, some even SF. I didn't see any Canadians who were reg force. All were reservists; QYR, RWR, N Sask R, etc. Kinda strange is all.



That way all the participants start off on an equal footing.   ;D


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## ProPatria Mike (8 Nov 2006)

Good one! snicker.


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## orange.paint (8 Nov 2006)

Ok this is not to put the young guy down at all.He only has two years in.

makes him sound like a ninja though:

http://www.history.ca/microsites/devilsbrigade/characters4.aspx

scott young.

Everyone else has all these army qual yet he's a rappelling martial artist.

As I said it just struck me funny.


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## pipesnake (8 Nov 2006)

I watched it. I was a little bit disappointed. There were no regular force Canadians. In no way do I mean to infer that reserve soldiers are lesser in some way but it seems just a little odd to pit someone whose job as a soldier is part time with seasoned full time American SF soldiers. It also seemed that the training was not very intense. Certainly nothing that a regular Canadian infantry unit couldn't do easily, at least when I was in, and definitely no where near what the guys used to do,  according to "The Black Devil Brigade" (an excellent read by the way). Perhaps things will pick up.

http://www.amazon.ca/Black-Devil-Brigade-Joseph-Springer/dp/1596872187/sr=1-1/qid=1162998594/ref=sr_1_1/702-4216974-3780059?ie=UTF8&s=books


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## Haggis (8 Nov 2006)

099* said:
			
		

> Ok this is not to put the young guy down at all.He only has two years in.
> 
> makes him sound like a ninja though:
> 
> ...



It's only funny because you mis-read it.  His skills are listed as "Rapelling, Martial Arts".  Note the cleverly placed comma separating the two "ninja skills".


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## Bigmac (8 Nov 2006)

If you haven't seen the 1968 movie "The Devils' Brigade", starring William Holden,  rent it if can find it. Although not totally accurate it is extremely entertaining. Here is a quote from the movie:



> Today I had the pleasure of interrogating some German prisoners....and they said some flattering things about us... *gangsters!* *murderers!* *savages!*... but the most flattering and memorial compliment came from their commanding officer... and he referred to us as *Die Teufel's Brigäde* members of The Devils Brigade.... long life... [toast] To the Devil!!!


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## Journeyman (8 Nov 2006)

ex-Sup said:
			
		

> Most of the US were reg force personnel, some even SF. I didn't see any Canadians who were reg force. All were reservists


If you go through the participants' units, you'll see the Americans are National Guard or training cadre. (I'm not sure about the Rangers, since I didn't think there were any NG Rangers [eg - one guy is listed as 2nd Bn, 75 Ranger Regt, Los Angeles - - yet the 2nd Bn is in Ft Lewis Washington]). But there doesn't appear to be a conspiracy to stack the teams

Now, about the kid who quit because the close combat training was "too intense"....  :


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## ex-Sup (8 Nov 2006)

pipesnake said:
			
		

> I watched it. I was a little bit disappointed. There were no regular force Canadians. In no way do I mean to infer that reserve soldiers are lesser in some way but it seems just a little odd to pit someone whose job as a soldier is part time with seasoned full time American SF soldiers.



Exactly my point. 

I was a reservist for two years and I don't think I came anywhere close to being on the same plane as SF soldier (except for the time that some US National Guard? mistook our green berets for...you get the point).

I'm long out of the loop, would there be any operational  reason why Cdn reg force were not there, or did no one volunteer or was no one asked?


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## pipesnake (8 Nov 2006)

I've done a lot of martial arts training in my life and that certainly was not intense. It also certainly is not cool to poke someone in the eye in any form of martial arts training as that can result in serious injury. If he had done that to me I would have given him the opportunity to see just how good his "Defendo" is.


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## fbr2o75 (8 Nov 2006)

pipesnake said:
			
		

> I've done a lot of martial arts training in my life and that certainly was not intense. It also certainly is not cool to poke someone in the eye in any form of martial arts training as that can result in serious injury. If he had done that to me I would have given him the opportunity to see just how good his "Defendo" is.



You missed his whole point he wasn't there to be "cool" his whole thing is maim and destroy.


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## pipesnake (8 Nov 2006)

fbr2o75 said:
			
		

> You missed his whole point he wasn't there to be "cool" his whole thing is maim and destroy.



It's a figure of speach. You don't maim and destroy your own troops. Not if you want an effective fighting force. Intense training often results in injury but it should not be from a poke in the eye by your own instructor. What's the point of that? The guy could have been permanently injured for a TV show.


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## Strike (8 Nov 2006)

The point is, he was training the guys the same way the original members were trained -- except that these guys weren/t using real knives.  Or maybe you weren't listening to the comentary by the former members to catch all that.



> It also seemed that the training was not very intense.



Try doing all that training wearing wool and using (what can be considered in our day and age) sub-standard equipment.  Then come back with your view.


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## spud (8 Nov 2006)

pipesnake said:
			
		

> I watched it. I was a little bit disappointed. There were no regular force Canadians. It also seemed that the training was not very intense.
> http://www.amazon.ca/Black-Devil-Brigade-Joseph-Springer/dp/1596872187/sr=1-1/qid=1162998594/ref=sr_1_1/702-4216974-3780059?ie=UTF8&s=books



I found it interesting. I have no infantry background, however I would think that they did more physical training then just what we saw. Don't forget they have to edit for tv and to make it interesting to the viewer, some of it would be painfully boring. As well, it's too easy to sit back and be an armchair quarterback. I just hope they do justice to the original guys themselves. Regs or reserves, who cares, I say good on them and I am looking forward to the rest of it. 

potato


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## pipesnake (8 Nov 2006)

Strike said:
			
		

> The point is, he was training the guys the same way the original members were trained -- except that these guys weren/t using real knives.  Or maybe you weren't listening to the comentary by the former members to catch all that.
> 
> Try doing all that training wearing wool and using (what can be considered in our day and age) sub-standard equipment.  Then come back with your view.



Sure he was training them the original way. I'm sure a lot of those old timers have the detached retinas to show for it. Give you head a shake _sir_. As well perhaps you haven't read the book I was referring to? They did 40 plus mile forced marches. What did they do last night? Nineteen km's if I recall. Not exactly the 40 miles the guys did in 42 is it? That's what I mean by not as intense.


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## Strike (8 Nov 2006)

> Don't forget they have to edit for tv and to make it interesting to the viewer, some of it would be painfully boring. As well, it's too easy to sit back and be an armchair quarterback.



Exactly my point.  Thanks Spud.  



> Give you head a shake sir.



By the way pipesnake, when you answer the phone at work, you're one of the ones that says,"How can I help you, sir?" aren't you.  Maybe you should stop doing that.  It could get you in trouble one of these days.  And could those italics be any more sarcastic?  Maybe you should set them in bold next time.


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## HItorMiss (8 Nov 2006)

Pipe you're in a world of hurt....

Give your head a shake sir..... *giggles loudly* yup thats rigth Strike shake you head *cough* actulay I like when my piolts heads moves left and right means there doing a good look at the land to get me to the LZ as covered from view as possible, so Strike keep shaking that head  ;D


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## pipesnake (8 Nov 2006)

Actually I haven't called anyone sir since I left the army. Brings back bad memories of having to feign respect for people I had no respect for.


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## HItorMiss (8 Nov 2006)

Wow guess that whole qoute what you justsaid by Strike wasn't you..... Ahh well either way Show is good, I'll keep watching it and enjoying it


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## spud (8 Nov 2006)

pipesnake said:
			
		

> Actually I haven't called anyone sir since I left the army. Brings back bad memories of having to feign respect for people I had no respect for.




Skirting the line of "now your just being rude baby"..............................perhaps if you are no longer in, your profile should say "former 2 RCR" in the unit description. 


potato


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## Garett (8 Nov 2006)

http://www.history.ca/microsites/devilsbrigade/default.aspx

Reality TV show on the History Channel that puts CF Army Reserve soldiers and US Army soldiers through WW2 Devil's Brigade trg.  There are two of the episodes on tonight.


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## Strike (8 Nov 2006)

Garett,

????

We cleared that one up in the first two posts.


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## niner domestic (8 Nov 2006)

Strike, thanks for clearing that up, for a moment I thought this was going to be the thread that never ends by starting over and over again. LOL

The show was ok, but hands down, I'd rather spend the time watching the movie "Cockleshell Heroes" (which has an extra treat for me as my granpa was the movie's technical consultant when it was produced in the 50s).   As my granpa used to say, "Nothing motivates you to get your arse down that 40 mile meander than a megolmaniac called Hitler!"


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## pipesnake (8 Nov 2006)

spud said:
			
		

> Skirting the line of "now your just being rude baby



OK perhaps you are right and that is somewhat rude and if so I apologize. It may be that I get my back up a little when an Airforce Captain infers that, essentially my opinion is not based on some form of foreknowledge. 

"Try doing all that training wearing wool and using (what can be considered in our day and age) sub-standard equipment.  Then come back with your view."

Aside from actually passing TQ3 and serving in an infantry regiment, I was also on the Canadian NECIC team. That means that for a period of approximately 8 months, probably comparable to the length of time 1 SSF was in Montana, I ran, forced marched, etc. any where from 5 to 20 miles a day. This is not to mention other extremely gruelling physical punishment they put us through that I will not go into detail here. Suffice to say of the dozens that tried out I was one of the final 8 that represented Canada and competed in Germany against other NATO countries. Although we came in 3rd to the English and also Dutch Royal Marine Commandos we were actually more fit than either and lost for other reasons. 

In other words I am basing my opinion regarding the show not only on a the book that I read but on my own experiences.


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## ProPatria Mike (8 Nov 2006)

Good show, Brother. 

Pro Patria!


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## pipesnake (8 Nov 2006)

Pro Patria!


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## 043 (8 Nov 2006)

Starting watching it last night...........saw some of the intro's..............turned it off..........


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## Strike (9 Nov 2006)

Pipe, I'm not disputing that you may have some experience under that belt of yours.  But, as I said earlier, do it all in wool fatigues and old, heavy equipment, and then say that these guys on the show weren't working.

By the way, did anyone else get a little teary eyed?  What can I say.  I'm a sap.


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## Journeyman (9 Nov 2006)

All in all.....VERY well done. I enjoyed it.

Yes, I know....I know....it's made for "entertainment value." Get over it, and get from it what you can.

(why were both LTs such absolute geeks?!   )


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## Strike (9 Nov 2006)

Thank God someone else brought that up!!!

Have you ever seen such huge glasses on a guy?  Reminded me of Deidre's old glasses from "Corrie."


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## Nieghorn (9 Nov 2006)

Thought it was a great program for all the reasons already mentioned.  Thanks for the heads up, Strike!


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## ex-Sup (9 Nov 2006)

I thought it was a good show on both sides. As I've mentioned before, I've been out of the loop so long that I have no idea how realistic the actual training part was. However, I do agree with a prior comment regarding the use of period equipment and how difficult that might have been for individuals accustom to using the latest modern versions. As a historian, I found the best part was the information about the DB and the stories from the veterans themselves. I thought the ending was poignant with the visit to the cemetery at the base of Cassino.


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## Haggis (9 Nov 2006)

Strike said:
			
		

> Have you ever seen such huge glasses on a guy?  Reminded me of Deidre's old glasses from "Corrie."



Or the character Bubbles from "Trailer Park Boys".


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## ex-Sup (9 Nov 2006)

Haggis said:
			
		

> Or the character Bubbles from "Trailer Park Boys".



Was it to look like he was in "period?" His specs looked like the pair one of the veterans they were interviewing was wearing.

My wife said those glasses looked like the specs I used to have in high school.  :'( (she likes to exaggerate!)


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## spud (9 Nov 2006)

ex-Sup said:
			
		

> Was it to look like he was in "period?" His specs looked like the pair one of the veterans they were interviewing was wearing.



I don't know about period because the two years I spent on a US Naval base I saw those glasses many times! 

Glasses aside, it was a pleasure and a privilege to see and hear the old vets; as well there was obviously a great deal of respect given them and their fallen by the guys who were portraying them. Good stuff. 

potato


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## ex-Sup (9 Nov 2006)

spud said:
			
		

> I don't know about period because the two years I spent on a US Naval base I saw those glasses many times!



US issue combat glasses???  ;D

I was glad to see he was wearing a geek strap though. I always wore mine when I was in the field. At Milcon '91 I had a buddy who fell following a night ambush ex and lost his. He couldn't see anything (I know I would be blind without mine) and had to spend the rest of the week peeling spuds, etc.  :-[


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## Paul Gagnon (11 Nov 2006)

I thought it was a great mini series. The training was a little too Discovery Channel for me,  but the historical info and the interviews more than made up for any dramatic licence taken by the producers.


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