# Interested in volunteering my time to Cadets - info?



## Kamaro (7 Aug 2008)

Gday all, sir, ma'am, soldier

I'm currently posted to CFB Petawawa. I recently saw an ad in the local paper about a need for CF volunteers in the cadet program. 

I was never in the cadets myself, and I'm interested in the program so I thought I'd post on here and ask a couple questions.

1: What positions do reg force members hold in the cadet structure, when volunteering?
2: Is there any use for a Private?
3: I've done camp before - I used to work at a riding stables and boy scout camp, back before I signed up. I have lifeguard and boat rescue courses on top of the first aid courses provided by the military. In reference to that experience, how does a cadet program differ?

Thanks for taking the time to read my post.


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## Neill McKay (7 Aug 2008)

Kamaro said:
			
		

> 1: What positions do reg force members hold in the cadet structure, when volunteering?



Likely possibilities would include instructing classes in areas that you have knowledge in, assisting with administration work, working in the supply department, and others.  There are relatively few jobs in a cadet unit that could not be done by any CF member, with some OJT and ongoing supervision and assistance from a CIC officer.  A lot of the work done by staff in a cadet unit is specific to cadet units and training establishments (interpreting the QSP, developing a training plan, mentoring instructors, quality control/standards, etc.) but there's a good deal of "general duties" as well.



> 2: Is there any use for a Private?



Absolutely.  My first experience with the cadet programme was with no background as a cadet, and only some time as an ordinary seaman.  The staff had no trouble putting me to work.



> 3: I've done camp before - I used to work at a riding stables and boy scout camp, back before I signed up. I have lifeguard and boat rescue courses on top of the first aid courses provided by the military. In reference to that experience, how does a cadet program differ?



A cadet unit is, as you might expect, more structured than the other youth activities you've worked with.  Having been in scouts I can say that more is expected of cadets, especially as they reach the senior ranks.  (If the unit is especially on the ball the senior cadets will take a very large part in running it, with the staff providing supervision and looking after the administrative aspects.)


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## BinRat55 (13 Aug 2008)

Kamaro - I hope you follow through.  My son joined Sea Cadets a few years ago and my wife and I volunteered with his corp. Not only did I not have experience with the cadets (not having been one myself) I'm reg force HARD army - of course I hate boats!!  Well I have to tell you - it has been the most rewarding experience of my life. I enjoy all my time with the corps and I go on all the outings (DND will allow you to sign certain things out in support of the cadets) all the trips... I can't say enough. My wife and I even formed a parent's committee!! Make sure your supervisor knows you are volunteering with the cadets (good brownie points for when you start getting a PER) and you could even look into becoming a CLO (Cadet Liaison Officer) - find out who the Senior CLO is in Pet and send them a request. If you have any questions about what DND will let you do to help support your cadets, PM me or reply to this post. Good luck to you!!

And I sail now!!


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## mysteriousmind (14 Aug 2008)

Well, the best thing to do, is to contact the local unit in Pet, (possibly more then one) and inform them that you might be interested into giving some time for the organisation and perhaps get and appointment with the CO.  

You could meet with him, and see if the time you are willing to give and his need can be compatible and if you would feel comfortable to work with this organisation. After you have to ask your chain of command the permission to volunteer with the unit. You wont be paid extra to do it and you wont get any special favor. Perhaps your Chain of command will give you some freebie as extra day off or stuff like that, but its not written no were that they have to or they will. 

like N. McKay said there allot of stuff do do, and allot of thing you can do to better the organisation, Often, I have seen when I was CIC, NCO often worked on more NCO matters, like drill, discipline and stuff like this. But again it is not written that it has to be like this, Ive also seen some NCO in charge of a platoon due to the lack of officers. 

Now that I'm trade qualified, I will possibly contact former CIC colleague of mine and offer them to do some volunteer work.


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## Franko (14 Aug 2008)

Speaking as a past CLO.....It's best to talk to your unit through the CoC and find out what their affiliated corps is and who to talk to rather than just going in unannounced. 

They will arrange a meeting for you to come out and see the CO of the corps and feel out the cadets as well. See how the corps operates and see if you'll be happy working with them.

Not only will you be making everyone aware of your intentions but it will be noted on PDRs and PERs as well...this is a good thing. 

Now if your affil corps is out of the area and you want to help out locally, fill yer boots.

Regards


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## danchapps (14 Aug 2008)

These are some great tips, I've been thinking of doing the same myself, once I get a little more settled here. Now, my question is, I'm army, in Edmonton, would I need to go to an army cadet corps, or would I be permitted to return to my roots and go to and air cadet squadron?


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## BinRat55 (14 Aug 2008)

Chapeski,

If you read my post above, you'll notice that I volunteer with a SEA corps. I'm hard Army. Oh, and by the way - I'm on an air base!! For those who aren't sure, you do not need permission from your CoC to volunteer your free time with the cadets. Nor does many "reg force" units have an "affiliated corp". Just go to your local MFRC and find the name of the CO of the corps / sqn closest to you and call. Let him or her know who you are, what qualifications you have that will benefit them (they may just need to even up the male / officer ratio) and give them contact info. Remember - your time is your time - unless it's illegal, of course.

To mysteriousmind:



> Perhaps your Chain of command will give you some freebie as extra day off or stuff like that, but its not written no were that they have to or they will.



Actually, in CFAO 16-1- http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/cfao/016-01_e.asp Para 108 - Special Leave - Community Affairs.


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## danchapps (14 Aug 2008)

Thanks BinRat, it was the "affiliated corps" bit that made me ask. I'll be sure to stop in to get the number sometime soon and check things out.


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## Franko (14 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> Nor does many "reg force" units have an "affiliated corp".



Just a bit of background...I've been working with both the RCACC and the Cadet League for over 20 years. Mind you it's been off and on for the past couple years due to deployments.      

Every Army Reg Force Regiment/ Battalion has one, as do many reserve units. Even the Schools in Gagetown have affiliated corps. 

Many in their own units don't know of them, but they exist, and always need people to help out. 

I'm actually trying to think of a unit that I know now that doesn't have one....hell there are corps out there that still carry their deactivated affiliated unit's name.

As for Air or Navy cadets I'm in the dark.

You are correct though, no permission is required to volunteer.

Regards


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## gwp (14 Aug 2008)

Recce By Death said:
			
		

> You are correct though, no permission is required to volunteer.


Whoa!
Permission is required and there is a process to serve as a volunteer in the cadet organization whether one is a RegF member or PRes.  PRes members must have the concurrence of their CO.  

All persons supporting the cadets must sign an agreement with the RCSU and submit to vulnerable sector screening (an additional criminal record check).   Screening civilian volunteers is the responsibility of the Leagues and the League will issue an ID card that one must carry.

All CF members will be screened by the CF on receipt of the VSS report from the civilian police.  The CO of the cadet corps will provide the forms and details of the requirement.  

No one who is not properly vetted will have any direct contact with cadets.  You can't just walk in the door.  

See CATO 23-04 which has been updated this month as change 6/08 effective 13 Aug 08. It will be posted to the cadets.ca website shortly.


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## BinRat55 (14 Aug 2008)

gwp said:
			
		

> Whoa!
> Permission is required and there is a process to serve as a volunteer in the cadet organization whether one is a RegF member or PRes.  PRes members must have the concurrence of their CO.
> 
> All persons supporting the cadets must sign an agreement with the RCSU and submit to vulnerable sector screening (an additional criminal record check).   Screening civilian volunteers is the responsibility of the Leagues and the League will issue an ID card that one must carry.
> ...



You must have misunderstood. I said "You don't need permission from your own CoC to volunteer your own time..." You are very correct about the screening - you can't just walk in the door and blammo - you are volunteering with a group of youths...

All that said though, 





> All CF members will be screened by the CF on receipt of the VSS report from the civilian police.


 makes no sense to me. I'm the USS in my unit and I do screenings on a weekly basis. I'm also the Senior CLO's 2 I/C for the past 2 years and have not encountered this. I volunteer with approx. 14 cadet corps, teach first aid to many of them.


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## gwp (14 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> You must have misunderstood. I said "You don't need permission from your own CoC to volunteer your own time..." You are very correct about the screening - you can't just walk in the door and blammo - you are volunteering with a group of youths... All that said though,  makes no sense to me. I'm the USS in my unit and I do screenings on a weekly basis. I'm also the Senior CLO's 2 I/C for the past 2 years and have not encountered this. I volunteer with approx. 14 cadet corps, teach first aid to many of them.


Better get the form and make a visit to your local PD. 
GENERAL
1. This annex will specify the level of screening required for adults working in the CCO. Adults working with cadets come from a number of sources. The following paragraphs identify those sources and the level of screening required depending on the adult’s duties and level of responsibility.

CADET INSTRUCTORS CADRE (CIC)

2. All members of the CIC, regardless of where they serve, shall complete the VSS screening process.

CADET CORPS & SQUADRONS

3. *All adults* working with a Corps / Squadron, regardless of how often they attend, shall complete the PRC/VSS screening process.

CADET SUMMER TRAINING CENTRES (CSTC)

4. In addition to members of the CIC, *all adults* working in a position where they have direct contact with, or will be supervising cadets, shall complete the screening process.


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## Franko (14 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> You must have misunderstood. I said "You don't need permission from your own CoC to volunteer your own time..." You are very correct about the screening - you can't just walk in the door and blammo - you are volunteering with a group of youths...



I concur. I meant to say you don't need permission from your immediate supervisor.



> All that said though,  makes no sense to me. I'm the USS in my unit and I do screenings on a weekly basis. I'm also the Senior CLO's 2 I/C for the past 2 years and have not encountered this. I volunteer with approx. 14 cadet corps, teach first aid to many of them.



Again, your Regiment's CO can vouch for you and, if the gaining cadet corps allows it, the screening can (and has been many times in my experience) be waved. I also got that tidbit from the ACO for LFCA a couple years ago and also in LFAA as well.

Mind you I've never heard of anyone in the Regs or Reserves being mandated to go and get a screening. _Unless things have changed in a year_.

Then again, if you have nothing to hide....

Regards


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## Neill McKay (14 Aug 2008)

Recce By Death said:
			
		

> I concur. I meant to say you don't need permission from your immediate supervisor.
> 
> Again, your Regiment's CO can vouch for you and, if the gaining cadet corps allows it, the screening can (and has been many times in my experience) be waved. I also got that tidbit from the ACO for LFCA a couple years ago and also in LFAA as well.
> 
> Mind you I've never heard of anyone in the Regs or Reserves being mandated to go and get a screening. _Unless things have changed in a year_.



The requirement for a VSS (Vulnerable Sector Screening, more detailed than a police records check) is relatively new -- maybe a little more than a year old.  I'd be surprised if they were quick to waive that; release action was started with the few CIC officers who didn't have it done by the deadline.  Due diligence and protection from liability seem to be the watchwords these days.


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## gwp (14 Aug 2008)

Recce By Death said:
			
		

> I concur. I meant to say you don't need permission from your immediate supervisor. Again, your Regiment's CO can vouch for you and, if the gaining cadet corps allows it, the screening can (and has been many times in my experience) be waved. I also got that tidbit from the ACO for LFCA a couple years ago and also in LFAA as well. Mind you I've never heard of anyone in the Regs or Reserves being mandated to go and get a screening. _Unless things have changed in a year_.


They have changed.  The policy is as posted above.  *All adults*, there will be no waivers.  The stakes are too high. VSS is a very specific screening and is not covered by any other screening process.  Parents and other civilians are required to have their screening done by the League and they are issued a League ID card.


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## Franko (14 Aug 2008)

gwp said:
			
		

> They have changed.  The policy is as posted above.  *All adults*, there will be no waivers.  The stakes are too high. VSS is a very specific screening and is not covered by any other screening process.  Parents and other civilians are required to have their screening done by the League and they are issued a League ID card.



Source? I have a relativley new troop that wants to get involved and will point him in the right direction. 

I'd rather him have all the information and be ready with paperwork in hand so he can start immediately when the training years starts up again. 

I'll also be informing the CLO for our Regiment as well to this relatively new directive when I return to work. She hasn't indicated to me of any changes when I inquired last May, perhaps an oversight.

Regards


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## gwp (14 Aug 2008)

Recce By Death said:
			
		

> Source? I have a relativley new troop that wants to get involved and will point him in the right direction.


VOL 2 - CH/MOD 6/08  - CATO/OAIC 23-04 (CANADIAN CADET ORGANIZATIONS ADULT SCREENING POLICY / POLITIQUE D'EXAMEN PRÉALABLE DES ADULTES QUI TRAVAILLENT AU SEIN DES ORGANISATIONS DES CADETS DU CANADA


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## BinRat55 (14 Aug 2008)

Once again, I feel the need to clarify => a VSS has absolutely nothing to do with your chain of command. I had a police check done two years ago and again last year. The CO of the corp would not let me work with the kids until I had it done. Good on her - my own son is part of the corp and I wouldn't have it any other way. BUT I DID NOT NEED MY COC's PERMISSION TO DO IT!!!

Sheesh.  :


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## rwgill (14 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> BUT I DID NOT NEED MY COC's PERMISSION TO DO IT!!!
> 
> Sheesh.  :


You may be right, or wrong.  It would depend on your unit.  It is best to advise your chain of command of your intentions.  Simply put, CYA.  Unlike Scouts, Guides, hockey, or any other youth organization, Cadets has a DND/CF side to it.  Nothing may be written in black and white, but it never hurts to ask.


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## BinRat55 (15 Aug 2008)

In a roundabout way, that happens anyway. I really don't see the need to "CYA" for doing something good like volunteer your free time to help a youth group - especially one with ties to DND, but those who want it noted for PER purposes will inform their immediate supervisor. As well, any CO who is worth their salt will obtain the individual's supervisor's contact info and send appreciations on behalf of that individual. The word "permission" is what i'm hung up on...


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## mysteriousmind (15 Aug 2008)

Quick tricky question for you guys, 

lets say a Pres member in B class is interested in doing some volunteer work with a cadet unit; 

would you prefer to give time to a cadet unit supported by his own unit or, would you prefer to give time to a unit were he is employed during his B class???

thanks for point of view....


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## gwp (15 Aug 2008)

mysteriousmind said:
			
		

> Quick tricky question for you guys, lets say a Pres member in B class is interested in doing some volunteer work with a cadet unit;
> would you prefer to give time to a cadet unit supported by his own unit or, would you prefer to give time to a unit were he is employed during his B class???thanks for point of view....


Where can he contribute to the best advantage of the cadets and the cadet program? Where does he want to contribute? 
Those are the only two questions that matter.   
Taking some of the strain at an under manned corps/squadron would make more sense than being supernumary at a well staffed corps/squadron.


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## rwgill (15 Aug 2008)

mysteriousmind said:
			
		

> Quick tricky question for you guys,
> 
> lets say a Pres member in B class is interested in doing some volunteer work with a cadet unit;
> 
> ...


Hmmmm.............that's a tough question.  The best answer that I could give you is, check with your supervisor(s) and the Cadet Corps.

I have worked with different Army Cadet Corps who have had different affiliated units and very, very different relationships.  

One unit received outstanding support from the affiliated unit, but only members of the affiliated unit were permitted to help out the Cadet Corps.  There was actually a waiting list of PRes members who wanted to help out.  At the time, the CO of the affiliated unit gave 1 day paid for every month volunteered and 1 day paid for every weekend volunteered to Class A members.  The CO gave days off, in lieu of pay, to Class Bs.

Another Cadet Corps had virtually no contact with its affiliated unit and no relationship, so any help was very appreciated.

The Cadet Corps I am currently with has no problem with "outsiders" helping out (nor does the affiliated unit).  The affiliated unit provides members when possible.

I would never turn down help, as long as I had meaningful work for the volunteer.


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## BinRat55 (16 Aug 2008)

Not all cadet corps has an affiliated unit - in fact, unit affiliation is almost impossible here in NL. All corps however, have a supporting base. As stated above in GWP's post, find out which one needs the most help. Talk to their COs and CLOs. Which is most beneficial to you? Are you 5Km away from one and 50Km from the other? Is one in greater need of your time?


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## rwgill (17 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> Not all cadet corps has an affiliated unit - in fact, unit affiliation is almost impossible here in NL.



I am curious to know which Army Cadet Corps have no affiliated unit.


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## BinRat55 (18 Aug 2008)

rwgill said:
			
		

> I am curious to know which Army Cadet Corps have no affiliated unit.



I never said "Army Cadets" I said "Cadets" - there _are _ two other elements.


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## NL_engineer (18 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> Not all cadet corps has an affiliated unit - in fact, unit affiliation is almost impossible here in NL. All corps however, have a supporting base. As stated above in GWP's post, find out which one needs the most help. Talk to their COs and CLOs. Which is most beneficial to you? Are you 5Km away from one and 50Km from the other? Is one in greater need of your time?



I think that may only be the ones in your neck of the woods, because if I remember correctly the ones on the two costs have affiliated units.  For example the RNFR, and 56 ES both have affiliated units (last time I checked [a couple years ago])


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## armyvern (18 Aug 2008)

rwgill said:
			
		

> I am curious to know which Army Cadet Corps have no affiliated unit.



Well, I guess you could use this link and look each of them up indivdually ...

From the Cadet Canada website linked here, here is the listing of Cadet Corps located within Newfoundland & Labrador (Air, Sea and Army).


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## sapperboysen (18 Aug 2008)

rwgill said:
			
		

> I am curious to know which Army Cadet Corps have no affiliated unit.


3004 Nanook RCACC (Cambridge Bay) is affiliated with Northern Region Headquarters, not really a regiment.


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## gwp (18 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> In a roundabout way, that happens anyway. I really don't see the need to "CYA" for doing something good like volunteer your free time to help a youth group - especially one with ties to DND, but those who want it noted for PER purposes will inform their immediate supervisor. As well, any CO who is worth their salt will obtain the individual's supervisor's contact info and send appreciations on behalf of that individual. The word "permission" is what i'm hung up on...


Here is the Chief of military personnel policy regarding the employment of PRes and SupR pers within the cadet program. 

CHIEF MILITARY PERSONNEL INSTRUCTION 20/04
*2.11  P Res and Supp Res Mbrs - Res Svc with Cadet Organizations
a.	A mbr of the P Res, or a mbr att from the Supp Res, who is serving with the CIC is subject to the conditions under CFAO 49-6, Annex A; 
b.	A mbr of the P Res or a mbr att from the Supp Res serving on Cl “A” Res Svc in support of  Cadet related activities, are still required to sign a Res F Basic Attendance Register (CF 895).  This service must be authorized by the P Res CO for a mbr of the P Res, with concurrence from the Cadet CO, and by the Host Unit CO for a mbr of the Supp Res.  Cadet Region Commander authority is required when the service is funded by the Cadet organization.  The appropriate fin coding shall be provided to the P Res unit or the Host Unit of the Supp Res mbr through the appropriate chain of command.
*


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## Burrows (19 Aug 2008)

Employment is different than volunteering.


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## gwp (19 Aug 2008)

Kyle Burrows said:
			
		

> Employment is different than volunteering.



I presume you are being narrow in your definition to mean one is paid is one is not.    That does not however change the aspects of liability or accountability of the member to do his/her duty or the CF to look after the member appropriatly.  That is why volunteers are different from CIs and undertake a separate volunteer agreement.  That is why CFAO 49-6 was revised wrt to volunteer service and other support arrangements were put in place.


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## rwgill (19 Aug 2008)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> Well, I guess you could use this link and look each of them up indivdually ...
> 
> From the Cadet Canada website linked here, here is the listing of Cadet Corps located within Newfoundland & Labrador (Air, Sea and Army).


Gee thanks.

I had already done that before I asked the question 

Traditionally, affiliation is an Army Cadet thing, though there are cases of affiliation in both the Sea and Air Cadets.  IAW the respective QR&O (Cadets) and CATOs, affiliation is not required.  To the best of my knowledge, every Army Cadet Corps in Canada has an affiliated unit.  An affiliated unit can be any military unit, including administrative units, as decided upon by the CDS (VCDS).


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## armyvern (19 Aug 2008)

rwgill said:
			
		

> Gee thanks.
> 
> I had already done that before I asked the question
> 
> Traditionally, affiliation is an Army Cadet thing, though there are cases of affiliation in both the Sea and Air Cadets.  IAW the respective QR&O (Cadets) and CATOs, affiliation is not required.  To the best of my knowledge, every Army Cadet Corps in Canada has an affiliated unit.  An affiliated unit can be any military unit, including administrative units, as decided upon by the CDS (VCDS).



Did you go as far as me to copy and paste each cadet corps' name into google to find their Unit site and see which ones are affiliated with Reg/Res Units or not?  

I presume not, as you stated that you wondered which ones weren't. And, by doing such - you'd have had your answer.


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## rwgill (19 Aug 2008)

Not really Vern.  There are far better resources out there.  Sometimes, all it takes is a 30 second phone call.  The majority of Army Cadet Corps in NL are affiliated to the Royal Newfoundland Regiment.  Other affiliations are 727 Comm Sqn, 728 Comm Sqn and 56 Service Battallion.  There were 5 Corps which had no affiliation mentioned, but since my own Cadet Corps was listed (still) as "Hudson Bay", I assume that there is a small back log of information.

I asked the question for clarification.  Perhaps *BinRat* was unaware of the affiliation requirement and by his response, that was the case.


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## armyvern (19 Aug 2008)

rwgill said:
			
		

> I asked the question for clarification.  Perhaps *BinRat* was unaware of the affiliation requirement and by his response, that was the case.



Don't be so sure that's the case ...

He happens to be RegF in Nfld ... actually supporting some of those cadet corps ... not all RCACC either ...


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## NL_engineer (19 Aug 2008)

rwgill said:
			
		

> Not really Vern.  There are far better resources out there.  Sometimes, all it takes is a 30 second phone call.  The majority of Army Cadet Corps in NL are affiliated to the Royal Newfoundland Regiment.  Other affiliations are 727 Comm Sqn, 728 Comm Sqn and *56 Service Battallion.*  There were 5 Corps which had no affiliation mentioned, but since my own Cadet Corps was listed (still) as "Hudson Bay", I assume that there is a small back log of information.
> 
> I asked the question for clarification.  Perhaps *BinRat* was unaware of the affiliation requirement and by his response, that was the case.



Me think you have two units mixed up

56 ES and 36 SVC


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## NL_engineer (19 Aug 2008)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> Did you go as far as me to copy and paste each cadet corps' name into google to find their Unit site and see which ones are affiliated with Reg/Res Units or not?
> 
> I presume not, as you stated that you wondered which ones weren't. And, by doing such - you'd have had your answer.



I just quickly tried and came up with no websites.


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## armyvern (19 Aug 2008)

NL_engineer said:
			
		

> I just quickly tried and came up with no websites.



Try "Newfoundland cadet corps" (ask for "Canadian" sites only - so much less crap to wade through ...)

ah man ...

You guys are going to make me post them up aren't you ... (I should have written them down when I googled the other night).


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## rwgill (19 Aug 2008)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> You guys are going to make me post them up aren't you ... (I should have written them down when I googled the other night).



One valuable resource is www.armycadethistory.com .  The site is owned by the Army Cadet League of Canada.


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## NL_engineer (19 Aug 2008)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> Try "Newfoundland cadet corps" (ask for "Canadian" sites only - so much less crap to wade through ...)
> 
> ah man ...
> 
> You guys are going to make me post them up aren't you ... (I should have written them down when I googled the other night).



I found them, I did a quick search at lunch  : I can't help that the army doesn't. give a longer lunch break.


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## BinRat55 (19 Aug 2008)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> Don't be so sure that's the case ...
> 
> He happens to be RegF in Nfld ... actually supporting some of those cadet corps ... not all RCACC either ...



Thanks Vern - Good to see you back from down south - without having to post bail!!

To RWGILL: I directly support 42 cadet corps on the Island:  15 RCACC / 13 RCACC / 14 RCSCC - and volunteer with about 10 of these personally. I was unaware there was a "requirement" to have an affiliation, and if you could provide a reference to that effect I would definitely concede the issue, however if you would please reread my original post, I said "Not ALL cadet corps had affiliated units..." meaning Air, Army AND Sea. I'm not about to research the hundreds of corps across Canada, but I can tell you that my own corps does NOT have an affiliation - which makes my statement correct.


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## gwp (19 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> I was unaware there was a "requirement" to have an affiliation, and if you could provide a reference to that effect I would definitely concede the issue, however if you would please reread my original post, I said "Not ALL cadet corps had affiliated units..." meaning Air, Army AND Sea. I'm not about to research the hundreds of corps across Canada, but I can tell you that my own corps does NOT have an affiliation - which makes my statement correct.


It is like another discussion that was locked.  There are no absolutes here.
QR&O (Cadets)
2.25
(1) Where practical, the appropriate region commander shall request the CDS to affiliate a cadet corps with a unit of the Regular Force or of the Reserve Force. 
(2) The unit with which a cadet corps is affiliated shall: a. appoint a LO and provide assistance as may be practical.
(3) The affiliation of a cadet corps with a unit shall not place upon that unit, nor upon any of its members, any financial responsibility for the activities of the cadet corps.  
2.26
(1) The local sponsor of a cadet corps may make application to the CDS through the appropriate region commander to change the affiliated unit of that cadet corps.  (Further subsections talk about mutual consent and justification)
CATO 11-10 amplifies those references.
http://www.cadets.ca/_docs/cato-oaic/1110_b.pdf


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## the 48th regulator (19 Aug 2008)

Here is a gentle warning, yet again.

Keep your comments at a respectable level, and leave the snide remarks and insults out of this thread folks.

Otherwise, another one for the glue factory.

dileas

tess

milnet.ca staff


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## BinRat55 (20 Aug 2008)

gwp said:
			
		

> It is like another discussion that was locked.  There are no absolutes here.
> QR&O (Cadets)
> 2.25
> (1) Where practical, the appropriate region commander shall request the CDS to affiliate a cadet corps with a unit of the Regular Force or of the Reserve Force.
> ...



Sounds like affiliation and supporting base could be one in the same...


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## Neill McKay (20 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> Sounds like affiliation and supporting base could be one in the same...



Not necessarily, but it wouldn't surprise me if they were in some, or perhaps many, cases.  (Of the sea cadet units in my area, those that are named after currently-serving ships are affiliated with their ships and the rest are affiliated with with the local Naval Reserve unit, but the nearest CFB is the supporting base for all of them.)


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## rwgill (20 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> Sounds like affiliation and supporting base could be one in the same...


Absolutely correct!  and Neill is correct as well.

The badge worn by the cadets (in the case of army) and that of the affiliated unit do not have to be the same either.  Very confusing isn't it?!?


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## BinRat55 (20 Aug 2008)

See? Now we're making some progress - not all  cadet corps (army, air & sea) have affiliated units - some just have supporting bases.


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## rwgill (20 Aug 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> See? Now we're making some progress - not all  cadet corps (army, air & sea) have affiliated units - some just have supporting bases.



Yes and no.  Trying to compare affiliations between the elements is extemely difficult.  Even within an element it appears to be difficult.

Now please understand that I mean no disrespect here, but I have to ask:  Are you coming to this conclusion based on support issues of Cadet Units?  I am wondering because I have had run into issues before with Support Base vs. Affiliated Unit responsibilities.


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## BinRat55 (21 Aug 2008)

rwgill said:
			
		

> Yes and no.  Trying to compare affiliations between the elements is extemely difficult.  Even within an element it appears to be difficult.
> 
> Now please understand that I mean no disrespect here, but I have to ask:  Are you coming to this conclusion based on support issues of Cadet Units?  I am wondering because I have had run into issues before with Support Base vs. Affiliated Unit responsibilities.



Great Caesar's Ghost!!! If I could find the little icon with the smiley banging his head against a brick wall, i'd definitely use it here.

RWGILL - No disrespect taken, but you have to get your head outta your #$@ and READ MY POSTS. I promise you, there's nothing more to them than exactly what you are reading. My original statement, which I have never deviated from, maintains that "SOME CADET CORPS HAVE NO AFFILIATED UNITS - BUT ALL HAVE SUPPORTING BASES" 

Will a mod somewhere PLEASE put me out of my misery here?


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## rwgill (21 Aug 2008)

Going back to your original post, which started this side tracked conversation, you said 





> Not all cadet cadet corps has an affiliated unit - *in fact, unit affiliation is almost impossible here in NL*.


 http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/78740/post-744935.html#msg744935

This statement is in fact false.  Unit affiliation is dependant on the respective QR&O (Cadets) and the CATOs.  Unit affiliation takes on many different meanings.

As it has been mentioned before, “affiliation” is difficult thing to answer definitively.  Like it or not, that is how things are.  It’s not always clear, cut and dry.

I would have been willing to discuss this with you, but it seems that this discussion has lost any civility.  You are always free to move on.


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## gwp (24 Aug 2008)

Here is the complete information that was not available earlier.  

Effective August 2008. all adults working with cadets  - CF members (regardless of component/sub-component) Civilian Instructors and civilian volunteers must have Police Records Check PRC and Vulnerable Sector Screening VSS approved in advance of employment or volunteering.  See para 4-10 in Policy.

http://www.cadets.ca/_docs/cato-oaic/2304_b.pdf

Entire document with annexes.  NOTE The title is changed to "Canadian Cadet Organizations Adult Screening Policy"

http://www.cadets.ca/support/cato-oaic/intro_e.asp?cato=23-04


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## aesop081 (24 Aug 2008)

Correct me if i am wrong but didnt you make that point abundantly clear in a cadet related pissing match already ?


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## Michael OLeary (24 Aug 2008)

Here it is:

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/78740/post-744036.html#msg744036



			
				gwp said:
			
		

> Better get the form and make a visit to your local PD.
> GENERAL
> 1. This annex will specify the level of screening required for adults working in the CCO. Adults working with cadets come from a number of sources. The following paragraphs identify those sources and the level of screening required depending on the adult’s duties and level of responsibility.
> 
> ...



gwp, I suggest that you start using the Search page.


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## rwgill (24 Aug 2008)

gwp said:
			
		

> Here is the complete information that was not available earlier.


Glad to see that we finally have something that is extremely clear and makes no exceptions.


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## tumbling_dice (5 Oct 2008)

_CHIEF MILITARY PERSONNEL INSTRUCTION 20/04
2.11  P Res and Supp Res Mbrs - Res Svc with Cadet Organizations
a.   A mbr of the P Res, or a mbr att from the Supp Res, who is serving with the CIC is subject to the conditions under CFAO 49-6, Annex A; 
b.   A mbr of the P Res or a mbr att from the Supp Res serving on Cl “A” Res Svc in support of  Cadet related activities, are still required to sign a Res F Basic Attendance Register (CF 895). This service must be authorized by the P Res CO for a mbr of the P Res, with concurrence from the Cadet CO, and by the Host Unit CO for a mbr of the Supp Res.  Cadet Region Commander authority is required when the service is funded by the Cadet organization.  The appropriate fin coding shall be provided to the P Res unit or the Host Unit of the Supp Res mbr through the appropriate chain of command._


Does this mean you can be employed as a reservist and CIC? I've never heard of this...


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## gwp (6 Oct 2008)

tumbling_dice said:
			
		

> _CHIEF MILITARY PERSONNEL INSTRUCTION 20/04
> 2.11  P Res and Supp Res Mbrs - Res Svc with Cadet Organizations
> a.   A mbr of the P Res, or a mbr att from the Supp Res, who is serving with the CIC is subject to the conditions under CFAO 49-6, Annex A;
> b.   A mbr of the P Res or a mbr att from the Supp Res serving on Cl “A” Res Svc in support of  Cadet related activities, are still required to sign a Res F Basic Attendance Register (CF 895). This service must be authorized by the P Res CO for a mbr of the P Res, with concurrence from the Cadet CO, and by the Host Unit CO for a mbr of the Supp Res.  Cadet Region Commander authority is required when the service is funded by the Cadet organization.  The appropriate fin coding shall be provided to the P Res unit or the Host Unit of the Supp Res mbr through the appropriate chain of command._
> ...



It allows that members of the Primary Reserve and those on the Supplementary Reserve List to be employed in the Cadet Organizations.  In addition to the requirements above all CF members in employed in direct support of cadets must also get a Vulnerable Sector Screening Clearance from the Police Department where they live. 

See para 8 
http://cadets.ca/_docs/cato-oaic/2304_b.pdf

P Res members may parade with their unit and a cadet corps/squadron. That does not mean they are CIC as well. 

CF members of the CIC are reservists and are employed in support of the cadet organizations.  With the approval of DCdts they may be employed outside of the cadet organization.


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## tumbling_dice (6 Oct 2008)

gwp said:
			
		

> It allows that members of the Primary Reserve and those on the Supplementary Reserve List to be employed in the Cadet Organizations.  In addition to the requirements above all CF members in employed in direct support of cadets must also get a Vulnerable Sector Screening Clearance from the Police Department where they live.
> 
> See para 8
> http://cadets.ca/_docs/cato-oaic/2304_b.pdf
> ...



Would these PRes members employed by cadets be able to take CIC courses (ie. if you corps needs an RSO or UHRA could you take the applicable courses?) If so, could you also take these courses if you were a volunteer and not employed.


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## gwp (6 Oct 2008)

tumbling_dice said:
			
		

> Would these PRes members employed by cadets be able to take CIC courses (ie. if you corps needs an RSO or UHRA could you take the applicable courses?) If so, could you also take these courses if you were a volunteer and not employed.


Generally, no.  PRes and SupR pers are employed in the cadet program with the skills they bring .. i.e your PRes RSO qualification or admin quals.  There is no requirement for UHRA training in the PRes.  That is not to say a special request based on need would not be endorsed by the CO  of the relevant RCSU.


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