# Adventure Training



## matt22 (11 Feb 2005)

Is there adventure training available to the Ottawa area units? I've been hearing alot about avalanche training and such, but not alot about the Ottawa area.

Thanks.


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## Navalsnpr (11 Feb 2005)

Speak with your Divisional Officer/Platoon Commander.

There should be a QR&O or DAOD regarding this issue.


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## meaf0rdm0 (22 Feb 2007)

Hi all I was thinking of implementing a canoe trip from Ottawa to Petawawa and I seem to remember that while I was in 2CER. Now that I am a Traffic Tech (Air) I miss the army side of the things and and I seem to remember 2CER doing the same route just reversed as an adventure trg and was wondering if there was someone I could talk to that would help me with how to get it staffed up and approved for this summer.

CHIMO!!!

MO


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## Michael OLeary (22 Feb 2007)

Start here (found with Google search for "daod adventure training"):

http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/admfincs/subjects/DAOD/5031/10_e.asp


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## meaf0rdm0 (22 Feb 2007)

Thank you that tells me what it is i need to do what i am looking for is how i staff it up for approval


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## Jamtorky (22 Feb 2007)

Also try the AEL  and read the ADVTRE TRG portion of 

B-GL-300-008-001  TRAINING CANADA'S ARMY


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## Franko (23 Feb 2007)

Hmmm....perhaps not going against the current may be a better idea?

Try talking to your Ops WO or Ops O or your unit's training cell. 

Do up a memo/ proposal and submit it in writing along with a detailed plan, including such things as transportation, FMRs, TSRs for equipment etc.

Last thing that you want to do is walk in without the bare minimum homework done....or it'll be launched out the door.

My 0.02 Tolars worth.

Regards


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## meaf0rdm0 (23 Feb 2007)

Why make it easy, and what i was looking for was just that how to to do a proposal, and maybe a contact that has done one so i could ask for a copy of the one they staffed up and since i knew that 2CER had done one previously is why i posted it in the Engineer forum but i guess that is screwed up now.

i would like to that you Recce by death for you input   but you obviously assumed you were right as so i must have been wrong. My thought was to post it on a site that would attracted the people i wanted to see it.


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## Franko (23 Feb 2007)

It's a training question, therefore I placed it here.

You wanted input, I gave it.

Why not try contacting an old buddy in 2CER and see what they can find for you. Chances are adventure training schedules that have been done would have been kept.

Regards


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## meaf0rdm0 (23 Feb 2007)

the topic was a training but the main body was trying to get someone from 2CER to help me get a contact with there ops cell so that i could get them on the phone so i guess i will have to reword my post so that someone does not read into what they believe my post was about and put it in the area like if i use the word armour or tank it will be put into a armoured area.


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## Michael OLeary (23 Feb 2007)

Have you asked your own Chief Clerk to check unit files for an old Adventure Training request that you could copy as a reference?

Have you asked your own Chief Clerk to see if he/she can request a copy from the Orderly Room of 2CER of the exercise you think you recall occuring?

Those options might have a better chance then hoping someone on the forum just happens to be from 2CER AND knows about the exercise AND can get access to the document for you.


As for your first post, it was not clear that you only wanted to direct your questions at 2CER personnel for the specific purpose of finding that particular document.  Don't blame the staff for doing their job when the fault for the lack of clarity was not theirs.

Army.ca Staff


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## daftandbarmy (16 Dec 2008)

I'm thinking about cranking up some adventure training to Ellesmere Island. 

Should be easy: fly to Resolute Bay via scheduled airlines, rent a Twin Otter from Ken Borek Air for 30 grand, fly in, climb Mt Barbeau, trousers down and moon eastern North America, fly out, victory party in Resolute. Shouldn't take more than 6 weeks total. This would be a summer trip, but could also be a recce for a first winter ascent as I don't think anyone else has summitted it in winter before.

I think that DAOD 5031-10 contains most of the info I need. Any other 'rules and regulations' out there I should pay attention to? Has anyone else ever led an Adventure Training exped to Ellesmere before? 

Any advice you've got for me would be welcome.

Cheers!

D&B


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## prima6 (22 Feb 2009)

We had some talk of that at our unit (entirely wishful thinking... no one was serious).  I've organized adventure training for my unit before and the first obstacle you are likely to run into is financial and the second is going to be the time off.  

I even checked flights to Resolute when I was "toying" with the idea and those flights were running about $5K per person.  With a party of ten you're probably looking at something in the $100K range ($50K to Resolute, $30K to charter the twin + other costs).  Since the money comes out of the unit's budget your unit is probably going to say no immediately.  I had a lot of trouble getting $15K last year for 10 people to do Adventure training.  I've heard of some Adventure Training Expeditions in the $20-30K range, but nothing even close to what would be needed to go to 

Another thing to consider is that even if your unit approves, higher approval is required. I know for Wings the authority to approve Adventure Training is delegated to WComds (this is contained in an ACO... I don't have the number at home).  I don't know how it works for the other elements.

I don't want to discourage you, going to Quttinirpaaq National Park would be a once in a lifetime opportunity for most people and getting it at least partially covered by your unit would be great.  Another thing to consider is that Adventure Training can be partially funded by members, so depending on how much people are willing to spend in order to do this trip you might be able to swing it.  I still think you'd be looking at a minimum of several thousand dollars a person though.


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## Bzzliteyr (23 Feb 2009)

daft,

Don't forget that flyboys sometimes run training missions up north and that you might be able to get a "free" flight that way.  This may lower your costs.

A few years back the Armour School ran an adv. training up North and we had a slight hiccup as the national park was over run by polar bears.  had to camp in town for a couple of days, then hire a boat to takes us somewhere nice with a guide.  We still had a wonderful time but it just goes to say, prepare for many eventualities.  If you want a contact name for the guy who set it all up, PM me.

Bzz


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## daftandbarmy (23 Feb 2009)

Thanks for the ideas. Overrun with Polar Bears? Sounds like I'd better take someone who can run slower than me!

Another idea I had was to run it as a military exercise/ Sov Op. That way we avoid all the hassle of trying to negotiate the labyrinthian adventure training rules and restrictions.

403 Sqn is just down the road... maybe I should crash one of their 'Prop Blasts' Friday night and start doing a recce of some sort.


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## daftandbarmy (23 Feb 2009)

`So, exactly where is Ellesmere Island?' most people would ask after hearing of my proposed expedition. `Next door to Greenland, on Canadian soil, and as far north as you can go before stepping off into the Arctic Ocean', became my stock reply. 

The Ball that Rolled. 
By Eric Philips 
Published in Wild Magazine (Australia). Summer 1995 

`So, exactly where is Ellesmere Island?' most people would ask after hearing of my proposed expedition. `Next door to Greenland, on Canadian soil, and as far north as you can go before stepping off into the Arctic Ocean', became my stock reply. 
The island is the tenth largest in the world and a frozen sea almost permanently hems in its coast. In fact, as I write these words, I am peering out of the window of the DC10, which is returning us from Resolute Bay to Edmonton, and I can see an endless stretch of frozen sea ice. 
Almost two years earlier, after completing an 80-kilometre ski tour with a friend, I'd sat down in front of an atlas and pored over the pages, dreaming of all places wild. Like a magnet, I was drawn to northern Canada and to Ellesmere Island. Over the ensuing 20 months I had set about organising the expedition. With no previous Arctic experience and an open mind to the logistic and financial difficulties that lay ahead, I wanted to see how far I could get the ball rolling.  Through correspondence with the Canadian Parks Service, the Alpine Club of Canada and local guides, I realised that the expedition would achieve many firsts. Richard Smith, Nick Fairfax and myself would be the first Australians to climb Barbeau Peak (at 2606 metres, the highest in eastern North America) and our plan to `man'-haul across Ellesmere's largest, highest and most northerly ice cap would also be a world first. 
A long series of flights eventually took us to Resolute - Canada's most northerly outpost - where we stayed with local outfitters, Terry and Besal Jesudason. After portaging our 70-kilogram loads to the foot of our unnamed access glacier, we spent our first night bivvying under the midnight sun. 
The following morning I awoke excitedly stirred the others and begged that we be on our way. The lower reaches of the glacier were slushy and we had to contend with many gushing streams and melt pools. Richard stumbled chest-deep into a creek, soaking himself to the skin. We used a solar lens to dry his boots and clothing in a couple of hours, an early confirmation of the potential of this handy instrument. 
For three days we climbed northward through a gateway of snowcapped peaks and vertical rock walls. On the second day large crevasses began to appear, some covered by thin snow bridges. We promptly roped up, taking no chances in such a remote and isolated place. After all, at $10 000 per flight, we couldn't afford a single-person evacuation. A debilitating injury would mean immediate cancellation of the expedition. 
After 50 kilometres of upward grind we finally reached the ice cap proper. Soon the entire horizon became an unbroken line separating white from blue. All my life I'd been waiting for a view such as this, and here I was, an insignificant speck of dust on this massive carpet of white. 
The first ten days had been good to us in many ways. Our access glacier, chosen in Australia from a 1:25 000 map, proved to be relatively smooth. The weather was faultless, blue skies prevailed and there was little wind. Navigation was interesting, but not too challenging. Though our maps showed little detail, we quickly adapted and found a sufficient number of features to pinpoint our location. Our compasses worked well ... just. Due to the proximity of the north magnetic pole, the needle took a long time to settle. As a back up we took a hand-held Global Positioning System receiver. This incredible little device could pinpoint our position on the earth's surface to within 30metres. 
Having climbed some 2000 metres on the western part of the ice cap, we were now expecting a 15 kilometre downhill run to Yelverton Pass, a large valley dividing the western part of the ice cap from the Barbeau massif. We set off excitedly, our sleds trailing obediently behind. A panoramic vista unfolded before us glaciers spilling into the valley from majestic mountains on both sides of the pass. Small lakes dotted the valley floor and rivers cut through the bare ice. Our excitement was short-lived, however, as a large crevasse soon opened up directly underneath my sled. Thereafter we roped up and followed a smooth gully along the edge of the glacier until we reached solid ice. 
It took a whole day to negotiate the pass itself as, once again; we had to contend with fast-flowing streams and deep water holes. At one point a 40-metre-deep ravine confronted us, and as we stood on its edge and watched the swirling waters rush through the spiralling holes in the ice, we were awe-struck by the immensity of `all things Ellesmere'. 
We spent the next six days climbing onto the eastern ice cap via an unnamed glacier to our base camp below Barbeau Peak.  This eastern ice cap, unlike the western, is studded with mountains, which poke up through the ice. Much of the island's surface is permanently covered in ice and snow; only the coastal fringe loses its winter coat of drift ice. Very little precipitation falls here less than 10 centimetres a year. It is, in fact, a desert, but a very cold one. 
The sky was overcast on the day of our ascent of Barbeau Peak, obscuring our view of its summit. We skied northeast over flat ground to the base of a steep, narrow ridge, which led directly to the summit. We changed to crampons and soon found ourselves climbing a knife-edge ridge under a blackening sky. We were in our element - enjoying the isolation, the exposure and the exhilaration of moving unroped over steep ground. After a couple of hours the ridge flattened out, then stopped abruptly against a 300-metre vertical face of rock and ice. We decided to stop for lunch and rug up against the frosty minus 25-degree wind chill. After a welcome hot drink we set off on a traverse of a large cwm to the southeast. Shortly after this, disaster struck. 
Plodding along a little way ahead of me, Richard put his foot through a hidden bergschrund, twisting his ankle badly. He lay sprawled across the crack in intense pain and unable to move.  After hasty consultation, Richard decided to slide and self-arrest his way to the bottom of the cwm and wait there for our return. We took his Australian flag and camera, commiserated with him on his misfortune, bade him a safe descent and continued unroped on our steep traverse. 
Our route was littered with wind-scoured ice, old avalanche debris and that elusive bergschrund that remained so well hidden. At one point my foot broke through a thin snow bridge and I stumbled, teetering on the lip of yet another huge crevasse. The bottom was jet black and I grinned at my good 
                            
Keeping an eye on Richard's descent, we noticed him continue on after reaching the base of the cwm - not towards base camp, but across a snow-bowl to an alternative spur that led up on to the Barbeau ridge. His ankle seemed to be holding his weight and two hours later, after a horrific walk along a narrow, precipitous ridge, he met us on a peak just below the summit. 
By this time the weather had miraculously cleared and we set off on the last and steepest part of the climb under a blue, still sky. The ridge narrowed until we were able to straddle it, each boot pointing to a separate valley floor 1000 metres below. Finally, at 7 p.m. on the 7th day of the 7th month (pure coincidence), we stood on the summit of Barbeau Peak, the highest people on the island in both senses of the word! It was a tiny summit, the apex of three identical ridges and three near vertical ice faces. We had climbed a classic peak. We locked the moment into our minds, took photos and footage, then set off on an incident-free return to base camp. We arrived at 10.30 p.m. in bright sunshine, having traversed 15 kilometres in just under 13 hours. 
The following day we awoke at midday to find a blizzard raging outside the tent. Inside it was a cosy haven - warm and dry - and we spent the day snoozing, reading, writing and generally bathing in self-indulgent euphoria over the previous day's climb. After all the stresses, doubts and disappointments, we had achieved one of our major aims. We also paid a fair amount of attention to Richard's badly swollen ankle. With more than 100 kilometres to go, and no success in making radio contact, we were all worried. Fortunately, there was no shortage of ice and we began a routine of icing and strapping Richard's injured joint over the next few days, with considerable effect. 
Day 15 was overcast, but we covered a record distance that day  - 21 kilometres - despite Richard's injury. That night we were finally able to make radio contact with our charter plane company and confirm our pick-up on the 17th. 
Overnight, however, dark, billowing clouds and a rapid drop in barometric pressure confirmed we were in for some nasty weather. All the next day we watched the worsening sky as we negotiated the descent of the heavily crevassed Charybdis Glacier. As soon as we pitched camp at the terminus of the glacier, the storm hit like a steam train. Ironically, we slept soundly despite the violent shaking of the tent and awoke to a gray, lifeless sky and only one split tent pole. 
After a quick portage across 20 metres of terminal moraine, we climbed the very steep Scylla Glacier on to the Viking Ice Cap.  Over the next four days we navigated in whiteout conditions, negotiating crevasses, cornices and steep traverses that left our sleds skewing perilously, threatening to take us on a one-way ride to oblivion. 
On the 19th day we set off in thick fog to traverse around Mt Reeds, but after only 10 minutes we were stopped in our tracks by a gaping crevasse. We had no idea what lay beyond this point so, mentally unprepared to continue in such conditions, we decided to turn back, set up camp and wait for better weather. 
The following day, after considerable debate and planning, we set off with a taught rope between us - navigating as a team through the pea souper for seven hours. In the late afternoon, we topped a rise and suddenly, Cleaves Glacier - our exit from the ice cap - was there before us. Our joy was indescribable 
And we felt a unique pride in our teamwork and perseverance. 
The next day, after 240 kilometres of sledding over this remote and beautiful ice cap, we were once again on terra firma.  Intoxicated by emotion, we shook hands, captured the moment on celluloid, then began the 45-kilometre portage to our pick-up point at Tanquary Fjord. 
As I sat on a rocky knoll overlooking the fjord, I began to reflect on our journey and the 20 months preceding it. My dream of completing an expedition on a remote polar ice cap had become reality. We had proven to ourselves - and to others - that lifelong ambitions can be achieved. 

http://www.icetrek.com/index.php?id=228
http://www.bivouac.com/PhotoPg.asp?PhotoId=10077


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## Snakedoc (23 Feb 2009)

Sounds like quite the amazing adventure! Must of been pretty intense training for it though.


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## daftandbarmy (24 Feb 2009)

OK, so I've just received a copy of an adventure training ex run on Ellesmere in 2006 by the Rangers (thank you to the donor!). 6 people walked from Lake Hazen to Tanqueray Fjord - about 100 miles. They got a flight in to Lake Hazen and hiked out.

I'd like to put a CF team on the summit of Mt. Barbeau in 2010 - the Olympic year. We can even wag the flag from the summmit if they want us to. I don't think the CF has done this before (anyone know?) so it should be a worthy goal. I'm not sure what the availability of military airlift will be like during the 2010 summer, but it's got to be one of the options. I'll cost out the options for Ken Borek flights as well.

Plan A: Helicopter/ Twotter from Lake Hazen to the glacier at the base of Barbeau
Plan B: Ski, towing pulks, from Lake Hazen to Mt Barbeau, and return (or pickup from the glacier)

Looks like we should plan on taking at least 2 weeks of food, plus a reserve.

I'll get the spreadsheet going tomorrow. 

Tulloch Ard


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## Gandalfqc (11 Jun 2012)

I am a junior member, Cpl, of a rather sedentary unit. I want to get the ball rolling on the planning of an adventure training. However outside of the DAOD 5031-10, I can not find much information. Also most links on the DAOD are not working any more. Any useful references or input on the planning process from experienced members would be greatly appreciated.


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## Blackadder1916 (12 Jun 2012)

Since no currently serving members have replied yet, I'll provide you with some advice gleaned from personal experience.  If you are looking for some magic checklist or fill in the blanks form, you probably won't find it.  Simpliest way to start is to write a memo proposing what you have in mind and send it up your chain of command.  Include as much detail as possible about what you want to do (e.g type of activity, possible time frame, number of participants, previous experience in the activity, estimated costs . . . ).  You should be able to informally propose the idea to someone higher up the food chain who could assist in drafting your proposal and may be better versed in operational planning process.  Not knowing the type of unit (reg/res, static/field, army/navy/air force . . .) that you are in, I can't comment on any bde/area/comd orders or directives that may contain further instruction about staffing adventure training requests.

Do not be surprised if your commanding officer shoots you down (there could be factors beyond his control) or if he appoints a junior officer to run with it (that's what they are trained for and expected to do - it also provides an opportunity for the CO to observe his performance) but try to remain involved in the process, you will learn about how things get done (or get FUBARed).  Also, don't be surprised, even if everything works out and it is a go, that it could take up to a year before it happens.


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## MedCorps (12 Jun 2012)

Blackadder1916 said:
			
		

> Also, don't be surprised, even if everything works out and it is a go, that it could take up to a year before it happens.



I will add to the fine post of Blackadder.  

1. Gone are the days of pots of money for adventure training at the higher formation HQs.  As such the CO must budget for this.  Business planning occurs (at least) a year in advance.  A such you are looking to:
      A. get your adventure training plan into the business plan for execution in the following cycle, or 
      B. grab some end of the year money that was not spent and that the CO feels is well spent on your adventure training. 

2. Read DAOD 5031-10.

3. Find a competent junior officer / WO to latch on to in order to get some horsepower.  Sell the idea to them and offer to do as much of the leg work as possible for them.  

Adventure training is good fun, valuable for leadership development, promotes teamwork, and enhances morale.  Good on you for running with it. 

MC


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## daftandbarmy (12 Jun 2012)

Blackadder1916 said:
			
		

> Since no currently serving members have replied yet, I'll provide you with some advice gleaned from personal experience.  If you are looking for some magic checklist or fill in the blanks form, you probably won't find it.  Simpliest way to start is to write a memo proposing what you have in mind and send it up your chain of command.  Include as much detail as possible about what you want to do (e.g type of activity, possible time frame, number of participants, previous experience in the activity, estimated costs . . . ).  You should be able to informally propose the idea to someone higher up the food chain who could assist in drafting your proposal and may be better versed in operational planning process.  Not knowing the type of unit (reg/res, static/field, army/navy/air force . . .) that you are in, I can't comment on any bde/area/comd orders or directives that may contain further instruction about staffing adventure training requests.
> 
> Do not be surprised if your commanding officer shoots you down (there could be factors beyond his control) *or if he appoints a junior officer to run with it (that's what they are trained for and expected to do - it also provides an opportunity for the CO to observe his performance) but try to remain involved in the process*, you will learn about how things get done (or get FUBARed).  Also, don't be surprised, even if everything works out and it is a go, that it could take up to a year before it happens.



We're doing an adventure training exercise right now where we have no Officers available to set it all up (apart from old farts like me) so I found a keen Sergeant to git 'er done. He's doing  a great job. So don't assume that you can't lead one of these things. 

I do agree that it's a very good idea to get a senior level sponsor for your plan, like a Major or something, so you can go forward with a more thoroughly thought out concept of ops. Don't ignore the RSS staff (if you're in the reserves) or the Ops staff. They have lots of good advice about what can and can't work out.

If your unit hasn't done one of these before, I'd also try to pitch a 'phased' approach to an ultimate goal over a longer period of time. For example, 'to summit Mt Everest' is probably not a good idea for your mountaineering focused adventure training plan on your first try. However, if you propose a work up phase consisting of a couple of progressively more challening hikes/ climbs leading to a summit bid on something more local and realistically achieveable, then that is generally much better received.

Good luck and keep pushing. You will carry it by force of passion! (and some reasoned common sense)


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## VIChris (24 Jun 2012)

PM me your e-mail address, and I can forward you the OP Order from an avalanche survival training and mountaineering course we did as part of adventure training. It may help you frame things as you put a proposal together.


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## Gandalfqc (25 Jun 2012)

Thank you all for the great replies! I followed your adviced, found a WO willing to point me in the right direction. I am currently doing the leg work and hoping it leads somewhere.


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## MartyMonster (21 Aug 2019)

Does anybody know of any funding available, through CFMWS perhaps, for unit adventure training to offset the cost to members?

Thanks!


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## 211RadOp (21 Aug 2019)

DAOD 5031-10 Adventure Training is the bible on that.



> Budgetary Support
> 
> 5.9 Maximum materiel, transportation and financial support may be given for adventure training, provided it is not at the expense of operational training. Support shall be allocated as part of command and unit budgets, and shall be included in training plans.
> 
> ...



https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/corporate/policies-standards/defence-administrative-orders-directives/5000-series/5031/5031-10-adventure-training.html


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## tomahawk6 (25 Aug 2019)

Back in the day our adventure training was either a death march of say 50 miles or a week at an Army recreation facility where we could fish or boat. The Army paid for the later from non appropriated funds that came from user fees from the bowling alley or movie theater. The so called adventure training that were really long marches paid out of operating funds. No matter its name we stayed fit. Through a normal week we did road marches and daily runs of a couple miles. Not hard for a bunch of 18 year olds to stay fit.


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## ballz (26 Aug 2019)

MartyMonster said:
			
		

> Does anybody know of any funding available, through CFMWS perhaps, for unit adventure training *to offset the cost to members?*
> 
> Thanks!



What costs to members?


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