# NATO Climate Change and Security Centre of Excellence



## OceanBonfire (29 Jun 2022)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542207607947104256

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542208605520334848


----------



## Weinie (29 Jun 2022)

OceanBonfire said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542207607947104256
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542208605520334848


FFS


----------



## rmc_wannabe (29 Jun 2022)

I don't know how in the hell NATO, as an organization, can fight against climate change. There's no enemy we need to deter. We can't lob a Salvo of artillery at it. What the hell do they expect us to do?

Are we waging war against corporations who pollute more than some NATO partner nations? I'm honestly at a loss for how this is anything but a pet project distraction from our abysmal contributions to the Latvian Brigade...


----------



## KevinB (29 Jun 2022)

OceanBonfire said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542207607947104256
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542208605520334848


Well I guess money for yet another HQ can go towards that 2% commitment…


----------



## rmc_wannabe (29 Jun 2022)

KevinB said:


> Well I guess money for yet another HQ can go towards that 2% commitment…


Oh no no no.... that's more of a "General Coffers" item. NATO is still going to have to pay us rent and taxes....


----------



## KevinB (29 Jun 2022)

rmc_wannabe said:


> Oh no no no.... that's more of a "General Coffers" item. NATO is still going to have to pay us rent and taxes....


I have faith you will make another GOFO and staff for it…


----------



## Good2Golf (29 Jun 2022)

OceanBonfire said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542207607947104256
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542208605520334848


----------



## Navy_Pete (29 Jun 2022)

KevinB said:


> I have faith you will make another GOFO and staff for it…


Only one? Those are rookie numbers!

(Sorry, needed a laugh so rewatched the Shoresy finale).


----------



## daftandbarmy (29 Jun 2022)

Convenient timing, NATO released this report yesterday.

While dozens of innocents are dying daily in Ukraine, we're doing our bit!

NATO releases its Climate Change and Security Impact Assessment​
In a 'sobering' assessment report released today (28 June 2022), NATO recognises climate change as an 'overarching challenge of our time' that will 'measurably' increase the risks to security and ‘worsen as the world warms further’. It calls for a fundamental transformation of NATO’s approach to defence and security and sets NATO as a leading international organisation in understanding and adapting to climate change.

This assessment is part of an ambitious Action Plan on Climate Change and Security that NATO Leaders adopted at the Brussels Summit in 2021. Enhanced awareness will help inform NATO’s work to adapt to the altered strategic and operating environment.

At the first High-Level Dialogue on Climate Change and Security held today in Madrid on the margins of NATO’s Summit, NATO’s Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg announced Allies’ decision to reduce gas emissions by at least 45% by 2030, down to net zero by 2050. A new methodology for measuring NATO’s greenhouse gas emissions, both civilian and military, will help guide gas reduction efforts. ‘This is vital’, the Secretary General said at the Dialogue, ‘because only what gets measured, can get cut’.  The aim is to ensure that NATO maintains its operational effectiveness and readiness in a more environment-friendly way.

The event, which brought together NATO Allies, partners and other stakeholders from around the world, will, under NATO’s leadership, become an annual platform for international consultations on climate change, address security impacts in a collaborative way and exchange best practices.
NATO’s new Strategic Concept, to be adopted by Allied Heads of State and Government later this week, will also, for the first time, recognise climate change as a major security challenge for NATO in the decade to come.









						NATO releases its Climate Change and Security Impact Assessment
					

In a 'sobering' assessment report released today (28 June 2022), NATO recognises climate change as an 'overarching challenge of our time' that will 'measurably' increase the risks to security and ‘worsen as the world warms further’. It calls for a fundamental transformation of NATO’s approach to...




					www.nato.int


----------



## FJAG (29 Jun 2022)

rmc_wannabe said:


> I don't know how in the hell NATO, as an organization, can fight against climate change. There's no enemy we need to deter. We can't lob a Salvo of artillery at it. What the hell do they expect us to do?
> 
> Are we waging war against corporations who pollute more than some NATO partner nations? I'm honestly at a loss for how this is anything but a pet project distraction from our abysmal contributions to the Latvian Brigade...


NATO as an organization has interests beyond pure military. This includes a NATO Science and Technology Organization which has some far reaching mandates.

All that to say that while there may some benefits to this project, to highlight it with such fanfare while dodging the real challenges and events ongoing right now shows where our government's priorities are and how unbelievably shallow it is. It is entirely unable to get its head out of its ass.

😖


----------



## OldSolduer (29 Jun 2022)

At this rate I am going to listen to George Carlin (RIP) - a man way ahead of his time - and Jim Jefferies who's talk was defecating in front of an almost  three year old to show him how to not crap in his pants.


----------



## daftandbarmy (30 Jun 2022)

FJAG said:


> NATO as an organization has interests beyond pure military. This includes a NATO Science and Technology Organization which has some far reaching mandates.
> 
> All that to say that while there may some benefits to this project, to highlight it with such fanfare while dodging the real challenges and events ongoing right now shows where our government's priorities are and how unbelievably shallow it is. It is entirely unable to get its head out of its ass.
> 
> 😖



Or we could just invade China, India and Russia 

*Not all countries face the same level of responsibility regarding the climate crisis. *

The last report of the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) pointed out that during the last year recorded (2020), the concentration of CO2 in the atmosphere broke another record, despite a drop in fossil fuel emissions during the Covid-19 pandemic. Specifically, the concentration reached 413 parts per million (ppm) in 2020, 149% more than pre-industrial levels (before 1750).

*Top 10 polluters*

However, most of this pollution comes from just a few countries: China, for example, generates around 30% of all global emissions, while the United States is responsible for almost 14%.In the ranking below you can find the 10 countries that produce the most emissions, measured in millions of tons of CO2 in 2019.


China, with more than 10,065 million tons of CO2 released.
United States, with 5,416 million tons of CO2
India, with 2,654 million tons of CO2
Russia, with 1,711 million tons of CO2
Japan, 1,162 million tons of CO2
Germany, 759 million tons of CO2
Iran, 720 million tons of CO2
South Korea, 659 million tons of CO2
Saudi Arabia, 621 million tons of CO2
Indonesia, 615 million tons of CO2









						Which countries are the world’s biggest carbon polluters? - ClimateTrade
					

Which countries are the world’s biggest carbon polluters?




					climatetrade.com


----------



## FJAG (30 Jun 2022)

daftandbarmy said:


> Not all countries face the same level of responsibility regarding the climate crisis.


This is why I think our carbon tax program is just plain stupid grandstanding.

🍻


----------



## rmc_wannabe (30 Jun 2022)

Me using my reusable mug and paying carbon tax as a consumer....


----------



## The Bread Guy (30 Jun 2022)

The flashiness of the announcement does make it look like "look here, not at that other stuff" - well done, info-machine at not achieving that goal.  And I'm betting my loonie the same way as others smarter than me saying "another HQ" and "another GOFO (or so)".

That said, militaries & others all over seem to be taking climate change seriously as a cause/aggravator of conflict, and a factor affecting ops ...








						‘Climate change is going to cost us’: How the US military is preparing for harsher environments
					

Climate change is no longer a problem for future defense leaders — it is an immediate challenge.




					www.defensenews.com
				











						Defense Department warns climate change will increase conflicts over water and food
					

The Defense Department was among 20 federal agencies that unveiled climate adaptation plans this week.




					www.cnbc.com
				











						How climate change paved the way to war in Syria | DW | 26.02.2021
					

Researchers agree that climate change alone cannot be blamed for the outbreak of war in Syria in 2011. However, neither can it be ignored as a reason the once blossoming country has become a parched, war-torn place.




					www.dw.com
				




Is this worth looking at?  Yup.  

Is this going to do it?  Maybe.  

Will it do a good job?  See above re:  how I'm betting my loonie.


----------



## Furniture (30 Jun 2022)

I suspect the centre will be an ECCC lead, with a minimal military component. There is already a MOU between DND and ECCC for Met/Climate support.


----------



## KevinB (30 Jun 2022)

Furniture said:


> I suspect the centre will be an ECCC lead, with a minimal military component. There is already a MOU between DND and ECCC for Met/Climate support.


Never downplay the ability of the CAF to construct yet another HQ...


----------



## Furniture (30 Jun 2022)

KevinB said:


> Never downplay the ability of the CAF to construct yet another HQ...


I'm sure they can make it new two star job, I'd be tempted to work there... Montreal is pretty fun.


----------



## daftandbarmy (30 Jun 2022)

It's OK, CAF retirees are already standing by to escort your politicians to important events. We, the pensioners, got this 


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542542153959804934


----------



## Kirkhill (30 Jun 2022)

Anand, Trudeau and Joly on the platform.

Joly looking dead chuffed.

Anand looking dead.

Canada skates again.


----------



## Good2Golf (30 Jun 2022)

Perhaps we could splurge for some portable, teleprompters so the PM doesn’t look like he’s just reading from a sheet of paper… 🤷🏻‍♂️ 

$4,500…look like…(looks down to check notes)…a professional 









						Prompter People StagePro 19" Presidential Teleprompter Pair
					

Buy Prompter People StagePro 19" Presidential Teleprompter Pair featuring Two Sets of StagePro 19" Pres. Prompters, 19" Self-Reversing Monitors, 60/40 Beamsplitters (14 x 12"), Low-Iron Glass Eliminates Color Shift, Anti-Reflection Coating, 25 ft Reading Range, HDMI, VGA, and Composite RCA...




					www.bhphotovideo.com


----------



## daftandbarmy (1 Jul 2022)

Maybe we can use this as an opportunity to leverage some dollars do more combined operations e.g.,

Navy-Marine war game puts their climate action strategy to the test​
The Navy conducted a war game Wednesday to assess how amphibious exercises in the Western Pacific will navigate the consequences of climate change, particularly in terms of resourcing deployed units and logistics.

The goal was to test out the service’s new climate action strategy and identify ways to become more resilient against such threats.









						Navy-Marine war game puts their climate action strategy to the test
					

The scenario involved a Navy amphibious ready group and an embarked Marine expeditionary group poised to conduct an exercise with a partner nation amid storms and a typhoon.




					www.militarytimes.com


----------



## Eye In The Sky (1 Jul 2022)

Kirkhill said:


> Anand, Trudeau and Joly on the platform.
> 
> Joly looking dead chuffed.
> 
> ...



If there was a version of this with a little girl…accurate.


----------



## Kirkhill (1 Jul 2022)

This is the Screen Cap I was looking for.    Global Affairs smug and engaged.  Defence depressed

Joly's expression only changed to "if looks could kill" when Trudeau was confronted by questions from David Akins, Murray Brewster and the Europeans wanting to know how many (troops), with what (equipment) and when (would they arrive) - oh, and how much (money).

It was noteworthy that Anand got thrown under the bus for all those questions and had to deliver the non-answer.



Kirkhill said:


> Anand, Trudeau and Joly on the platform.
> 
> Joly looking dead chuffed.
> 
> ...


----------



## Brad Sallows (1 Jul 2022)

"storms and a typhoon".

Was a time people just called that "weather".


----------



## SeaKingTacco (1 Jul 2022)

Kirkhill said:


> View attachment 71754
> 
> 
> This is the Screen Cap I was looking for.    Global Affairs smug and engaged.  Defence depressed
> ...


Could be that Minister Anand looks that grim because she is the only one of the three who understands just how grave the situation is.


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse (1 Jul 2022)

SeaKingTacco said:


> Could be that Minister Anand looks that grim because she is the only one of the three who understands just how grave the situation is.


Yup,....I'd love to have screenshots of some of you folk while you're in your meetings.   Meme central I'm sure....


----------



## Weinie (1 Jul 2022)

Bruce Monkhouse said:


> Yup,....I'd love to have screenshots of some of you folk while you're in your meetings.   Meme central I'm sure....


I was accused of having a non-poker face multiple times during my career.


----------



## Good2Golf (2 Jul 2022)

Weinie said:


> I was accused of having a non-poker face multiple times during my career.


You, Weinie?!?


----------



## Weinie (2 Jul 2022)

Good2Golf said:


> You, Weinie?!?
> View attachment 71796


Guilty, as charged.


----------



## RangerRay (2 Jul 2022)

Good2Golf said:


> You, Weinie?!?
> View attachment 71796


Looks like me at my staff meetings!


----------



## SeaKingTacco (2 Jul 2022)

RangerRay said:


> Looks like me at my staff meetings!


I may have, as a fairly junior captain, after my (fairly senior) boss declared himself to be a “man of the 90s” during a staff meeting added audibly “you mean of course, the 1890s…”. It brought the room down, but I paid for it…

Luckily, he had a good sense of humour and laughed about it later…


----------



## Good2Golf (31 Jul 2022)

And when people are starting to reach their limit of tolerance of the governmental fear-mongering around the world, a new Ozone-hole is conveniently discovered around the tropical belt… 🤔 

Sounds like Canada can come to the worlds rescuer with a Montréal Convention - Mk.2









						New tropics ozone hole is 7 times bigger than Antarctic hole, study says - The Weather Network
					

Approximately half of the global population could face increased ultraviolet radiation as a result of the tropical ozone hole.




					www.theweathernetwork.com


----------



## OldSolduer (31 Jul 2022)

SeaKingTacco said:


> Could be that Minister Anand looks that grim because she is the only one of the three who understands just how grave the situation is.


The other two could care less. As long as the gravy train continues for these so called “leaders” and their loyal minions nothing will change.


----------



## Colin Parkinson (31 Jul 2022)

Good2Golf said:


> And when people are starting to reach their limit of tolerance of the governmental fear-mongering around the world, a new Ozone-hole is conveniently discovered around the tropical belt… 🤔
> 
> Sounds like Canada can come to the worlds rescuer with a Montréal Convention - Mk.2
> 
> ...


Shocked I tell you, Shocked!

_For example, monitoring stations in Japan and South Korea revealed significant levels of CFCs being released in parts of China in 2019, likely from factories and manufacturing processes._


----------



## brihard (31 Jul 2022)

Some surprising opinions in this one. Why shouldn't a security alliance be taking seriously a major phenomenon that has security implications?

Let's remember that we're fat dumb and happy in the west. Food insecurity affects us in the form of food costing a bit more at the grocery store. Because staple foods are commodities, it's a supply and demand thing and as long as we can afford more than other poorer places, we'll get our Cheerios and 5 minute rice. Elsewhere in the world, though, failed harvests due to out-of-pattern flooding, droughts, heatwaves, etc may mean that millions of people don't eat. Millions of hungry people is a major security threat. Wars start and are fought over this. That's relevant for a military alliance.

We'll see increased melting in the north. Should NATO be concerned about a navigable northwest passage? I'd say so. Hell, even within the alliance we've got divergent views (that very much don't work in Canada's favour).

Militaries are increasingly getting pulled to do domestic disaster response for climate-related disasters. This has impacts on force availability and readiness.

Among government departments, agencies, and programs, militaries will for obvious reasons have potentially the largest carbon output. Thinking that governments won't look to militaries to do their bit is unrealistic, and this is a pressure that will be felt to some lesser or greater extent across the major allies. Nothing wrong with exchanging knowledge, innovation, and best practices. The militaries are under civil control, so if the governments decide this is going to be a reality, then the question isn't whether or not militaries will deal with it, but rather, simply 'how?'

So yeah, I get it, this can at first glance be an easy eye roll.. But once we remind ourselves that we have to contend with reality as it is, and that climate change with real impacts on the ground is one of those realities, it makes sense that the alliance should approach this cohesively.


----------



## Edward Campbell (31 Jul 2022)

KevinB said:


> I have faith you will make another GOFO and staff for it…


Oh, yes, I think it will need a very, very senior civil servant - maybe even deputy minister level (is Catherine McKenna looking for a job?) - and a military two star as a "strategic advisor." Wonder if they cold finesse that two star advisor into a three star level job.


----------



## Navy_Pete (31 Jul 2022)

One obvious thing that comes to mind is how the farmland in India, Pakistan and I believe parts of China all rely on the same glacier run off for growing crops.

That glacier is shrinking every year, and with those countires having something like a third of the world population and being nuclear powers there are some pretty obvious potential national security related items around access to water for growing food. Also, things like general global warming is evaporating more water so storms are more intense, which also threatens basics like food security.

We're fat, dumb and happy here in Canada until the US starts having serious drought issues and starts looking at our small population and abundance of fresh water. So doing things like turning off the taps for companies like Nestle that extract billions of litres for bottled water might be a more obvious COA if you start looking at the overall strategic impacts of water shortages (and crop yields etc).


----------



## suffolkowner (31 Jul 2022)

Colin Parkinson said:


> Shocked I tell you, Shocked!
> 
> _For example, monitoring stations in Japan and South Korea revealed significant levels of CFCs being released in parts of China in 2019, likely from factories and manufacturing processes._



I believe I read on skepticalscience.com that one of the theories for those CFC plumes were believed to be from recyling facilities in China working on refrigerators and AC's sent there from here. 



Navy_Pete said:


> One obvious thing that comes to mind is how the farmland in India, Pakistan and I believe parts of China all rely on the same glacier run off for growing crops.
> 
> That glacier is shrinking every year, and with those countires having something like a third of the world population and being nuclear powers there are some pretty obvious potential national security related items around access to water for growing food. Also, things like general global warming is evaporating more water so storms are more intense, which also threatens basics like food security.
> 
> We're fat, dumb and happy here in Canada until the US starts having serious drought issues and starts looking at our small population and abundance of fresh water. So doing things like turning off the taps for companies like Nestle that extract billions of litres for bottled water might be a more obvious COA if you start looking at the overall strategic impacts of water shortages (and crop yields etc).


Thus the importance of the Kashmir region

The Lake Mead/Lake Powell/Colorado river situation is probably going to come to a head sooner rather than later and with 80-90% of pretty much every fruit or vegetable grown in the US coming from California and most of that from 500,000 acres in one valley there is no way to turn that tap off


----------

