# LCIS227 Info



## loachduke (10 Jul 2001)

I have currently put my application into the 4900 Yonge St recruiting office for an LCIS technician (or field eng), and am wondering what kind of life I will have ahead of me. My physical condition is pretty good, and I have run the 2400m in 12:15, which is pretty good considering my last years complete lack of exercise. The other stuff is too easy! 19 pushups? My neighbor has a 6-year-old son, and he could pump out 12 when I asked him to try. Considering that, he‘ll be eligible minus the age limit by the time he‘s 9 or 10. I‘m not flaming really, it‘s just that the standards seem a little lower than I expected. I‘m sure if you just attain the minimum you‘ll never survive basic at St Jean, and go home with your tail between your legs.
The POET training in Kingston sounds very challenging, but my past education and work experience should make it a snap. Does this position get some respect, or are you labeled as a ‘techie‘ will all the ribbing that goes with the name.
Whether or not, the career is still a good one and the recruiter said they currenly are in dire need of good electronics technicians. The only real problem is the money at first. You know, I‘m 31 now and have had some nice salaries, but need a new direction. I‘m sure that if I put in my time, do my job well and don‘t lose anything, I may be able to get a promotion or extra pay as a specialist.
Any remarks are welcome.


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## Cbt Engr (22 Jul 2001)

As an FE for the last 10 and having taken the POET course after basic in 1988, I think I can comment on this. I‘d have to agree that standards have gone down in the 13 years since I did basic training. But to assume that anything is going to be a "snap" is naive and to be honest, arrogant. Although as a general rule, the standards have lowered there are quite a few "old-timers" that don‘t agree with how the military has "progressed". And butting heads with them with an arrogant attitude is going to get you nowhere fast. Completing your QL3 LCIS course gives you the qualification and the spec pay. I am a Mcpl yet my old roommate is Cpl LCIS and makes almost as much as my WO.
And the Cpl rank is a gimme at 4 years max.


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## fusilier (9 Aug 2001)

I‘m up in Kingston taking another trades course.  I know a few LCIS techs on  course up here.  As for PT, yes they do it quite often.  They‘re an awful proud group.  The training is tough, POET especially.  Don‘t go into it thinking it‘ll be easy, even with your civvy background it will still be challenging.  But hey gotta love that spec pay.  As a Cpl (4) you‘ll make more than a first year Sgt without spec pay.  Good luck and I‘ll see you up here.


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## Bloggins (10 Aug 2001)

Sorry to be a total gomer, but can you say what POET and LCIS stand for?

Thanks!


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## fusilier (12 Aug 2001)

No prob Bloggins, the Army is full of these acronyms.  POET stands for Performance Oriented Electronics Training.  It‘s a fairly demanding course you have to pass in order to go on to any technical QL3 delaing with electronics.  LCIS stands for Land Communications and Information Systems.  They fix all the comms gear and computer stuff we have.

Fideliter


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## LCISTech227 (23 Aug 2004)

I know there used to be a QL5 for LCIS Techs,  but as of 2002 there isn't one.  Anyone got the official word on what is going on with that?  Like is it just OJT or time in, or what?


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## poetboy (23 Aug 2004)

As I understand it, the QL3 course is the official end of "formal" training for LCIS before posting. After posting, you fill out your OJT log book and that completes the required skills to be "qualified" as the equivalent of QL4 I believe. Further advanced MOC courses are available for career progression. As for their proper description I am not sure if they are called QL5's or not. Hope that helps. If in doubt, consult your career mangler.


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## LCISTech227 (24 Aug 2004)

OJT Log book?  Good one.... anyways I've been posted for over a year and a half and that's the first I've ever heard about a log book.

Cheers,


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## bossdog (3 Sep 2004)

According to the CFSCE website there is only a LCIS Apprentice (QL3) crse and a LCIS Supervisors crse. For the Supervisor crse there is a prerequisite for a journeyman (QL5) qualification however, there is no information on the journeyman's course.


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## bossdog (3 Sep 2004)

PS - About the log book. As a 211 (now 215), we had to an OJT package for our 4's which could be seen as a log book of sorts.


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## teltech (3 Sep 2004)

Currently, all trg above QL3 has been suspended as poetboy said, pending a review of the course content. (I'm trying to remember a memo I saw back in '02). The basic scoop was that the QL5/6 was teaching material that was becoming increasingly outdated, and as such was to be suspended. As well, I recall someone on the last course to be taught on the 524 and other LEGACY equip't said that they WERE QL5 qualified (His words, not mine). Now, IMO I believe that promotion is based stricly on TI reqirement met and performance, and not courses (except for PLQ to get MCpl). If anything has changed recently, I am willing to stand corrected. BTW I have never heard of a OJT log book either, not that it isn't a bad idea.OPINION I wouldn't be suprised if the 5's will be implemented to coincide with MOSART kicking off.


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## wern32 (25 Nov 2004)

Ive got my OT for LCIS tech and I want to eventually end up near, or in Ottawa.  Any one know all the places that LCIS can be posted to other than battalions?
My choices now are Ottawa, Kingston or even Dwyer Hill...any thoughts?


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## m_a_c (25 Nov 2004)

You could be posted to CFS Leitrim in Ottawa.  I would think that if you wanted to go to Dwyer Hill, you would have to go through the JTF support selection process.  Your best bet is going to be Kingston.


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## KaptKain (26 Nov 2004)

I just started my 20 year stint as an LCIS tech.
Hoping to get a posting out east myself. But as mentioned above, will prob get Regimental at Kingston.
Two years there on course will make me sick of the place by then though.


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## tyson12 (28 Nov 2004)

hello all

I am new to this site and am in the application process for LCIS227 and was wondering if anyone would mind sending a little info my way.  I have read and re-read all the info on the army website concerning the position and I have gone through many of your posts.  I must say I was pleased to find what appears to be good place to ask a question or two and get a legitimate answer.  Enough drivel, here goes.

1. What are the real day to day duties? Challanging? Boring? Rewarding?
2. POET is at Kingston, I am assuming that the apprentice training takes place at your first posting?
3. Any tips for material to review before training? 
4. Any regrets? Did you resign after you initial 3 yrs?

thanks in advance for any replies.


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## LCISTech227 (29 Nov 2004)

Hey Tyson, and welcome to the site.

1. Here's the deal with LCIS,  first off most of your time will be consumed with fixing problems other ppl create(I think statistics state like 80 percent of all trouble tickets are from ppl error, instead of equipment breakdown),  I love my job, and I don't have any regrets.

2. POET is at Kingston but so is LCIS apprentice training(like another 6-8 months worth).  The rest of the training you will require will be provided at your first posting.  Be prepared when you start your LCIS training, mostly we deal with component replacement and not at the circuit level.

3. Make sure you got your math skills up to speed,  you'll be going over a lot of interesting things that you might get confused with, if your mind gets bogged down on the math.  Also make sure you start working on your fitness level now.  The more fit you are now the less likely you are to get injured later.

4. No Regrets, Love my time so far.

Kingston was kind of a bag drive, but mostly it was just long... but don't fret it gets better, believe me.  Work hard, and don't ever quit.


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## LCISTech227 (29 Nov 2004)

Funny, I was the same way after my 2 years in Kingston.... sad thing is now I want to go back 

Cheers,


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## tyson12 (29 Nov 2004)

Thanks for the reply and the info LCISTech227.  How long have you been in so far? Was it you that had just signed his 20yr?  What was your background prior to training.  I have university and a networking degree with MCP and most of the way to MCSE.


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## LCISTech227 (29 Nov 2004)

Well, nope wasn't me who said it... but I did just sign my 20 year IE.  I guess I'm tethered to the machine for good now 

Previously I had some computer tech experience as well as some High school electronics and OAC Maths etc.

It's not too terribly difficult in the math end, but I would say at least on the POET side the bulk of the classes you will be doing will relate to math in some way.


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## OLD F of S (29 Nov 2004)

Tyson
   227 is correct keep your math skills up ypu will require a fair amount of math to complete
Poet. I am sure there have been changes since I wrote the poet course in 93 but electronics
is math based to promote the basic concepts.

     As a LCIS tech the whole of the Forces is open to you from field experiences to secret
spook work. As 277 said work hard and enjoy.

                       Regards Old F of S


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## Fruss (30 Nov 2004)

Hi, first off, just want to let you know, I took an electronic course in 97-99 and it's fairly math oriented (formula, binary, etc)..  As long as you can do 5a+2b=6c, you'll be ok!  : Again, I DIDN'T do POET, just an electronic course, but I guess it's fairly the same thing..  Electronic for the army or for the civilian world stay electronics....

2nd thing is, I made a little document for myself of what people replied to some of my and other's posts. If it doesn't help you, maybe it will help someone else!  

LCIS tech (Land Communications and Information Systems) tech - we repair / maintain any communications equipment that the army uses, including radios (tactical and commercial), telephone systems (phones, switches, indoor wiring), radar, satellite equipment (dishes, receivers, transmitters), computers and network systems (switches, routers, wiring, PC's, laptops) and cyrptographic equipment. Working evironment can vary - as a new tech, you can be expected to be posted to a brigade, where the work will be done in a shop in garrison, 9-5, and in the back of a truck during exercises and operations. (0-dark hundred to 0-dark hundred). If you are posted to a static position (non-operational), the job is mostly 9-5 (or 0730-1600 here) with the odd job outside those hours.

From my experience, the LCIS work on the electronics and communciations systems not found within land vehicals.  On base, they repair service and maintain HF, VHF, UFH, X-band based communication systems usually this is hand-held or base station transceivers.  They set-up and maintain satellite earth stations, computer networks, datacom systems, to the more mundane paging, order wires, intercom and telephone systems.  In the field, they'd be setting up satellite earth stations, radio systems, and the general electronics techs on a case by case basis.

Typically an LCIS tech will deal with the TCCCS radios and TE (Terminal Equipment - Switchboards, phones etc.) to start with.  After that, again depending where you are posted you will then get the option of going on different courses like satellite communications, UNIX courses, network admin courses and many others.


Land Communication and Information Systems Technicians (LCIS TECHs) repair and maintain all types of Army communications and information systems. These include: communications equipment and radio systems, radio relay systems, radar systems, ground surveillance and miscellaneous radiation detection and associated equipment, and cryptographic equipment. LCIS TECHs also maintain strategic, long range radio communications systems, portable satellite communications systems, microwave systems, personal computers and area networks, and ground telecommunications systems. 

Their primary technical functions are the following: 

  perform system restoration, preventive and corrective maintenance, inspections, modifications, installations and acceptance checks, as well as repair and overhaul; 

  perform installations as well as preventive and corrective maintenance on a wide range of radio, radar, switching, data processing, cryptographic, terminal, audio and video equipment; 

  install and operate test and diagnostic equipment to determine the general condition of systems; and 

  repair and calibrate radiation detection equipment.


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## tyson12 (30 Nov 2004)

just another thanks for the replies to my post..........definetely a forum I will remain a member of.

Troy "Tyson12"


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## 227representin (13 Dec 2004)

Re:  Postings out East...

Lots of posting for LCIS.  Yes...JSR (Kingston) does employ a lot of LCIS, SigOps, etc, but the current trend has been to staff Gaugetown, and Petawa.  Most of my classmates end up at either of those bases.


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## 227representin (13 Dec 2004)

They are working on a 4's and 5's package now.  This concern was brought up by the LCIS foremen in a conference call in September.  They have to get there Sh** in gear as the lack of formalized 5' has placed new staff in a precarious position on not collecting "spec pay" as a result.


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## SigPigs (14 Jan 2005)

When you are trained in Kingston you rx a QL3-QL5 qual. SO when you come out out of Kingston as a Pte you are "kind of QL5" qualified. What is left for the individual to do is an OJT package that unfortunately is not standardized. There are many things in it to be signed off by the supervisor and once that is done the P provisional can be signed off. Especially in the case of direct entry pers. As soon as you rach Cpl you will rx spec pay. 

Andrew


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## LCISTech227 (14 Jan 2005)

Not entirely correct.  I've been out of Kingston for 2 years now, and have never seen/heard about a OJT package and neither have any of the other LCIS Techs here.  As for the Spec pay,  you will not get the entire spec pay until you complete a QL5.   You will be getting a lesser amount,  they changed how the spec pay thing works in our trade... and you don't get the full shot until 5's qualified.



> CANFORGEN 111/04 ADM(HR-MIL) 059 061843Z AUG 04
> RESTRUCTURE OF OCCUPATIONS RECEIVING SPECIALIST PAY
> UNCLASSIFIED
> 
> ...



Enjoy


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## SigPigs (14 Jan 2005)

Well here you go, here is the full list. If this is too screwed up due to formatting grab the text file I attached.
Number of positions available by Unit and Location
LOCATION	Unit Name	TOTAL	CWO	MWO	WO	Sgt	MCpl	Cpl	Cpl/PteT
ALDERGROVE	CFB Esquimalt Det Aldergrove	4	 	 	 	1	1	1	1
ALDERSHOT	LFAA TC Det Aldershot	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
BFC VALCARTI	3 R22ER	2	 	 	 	 	1	 	1
BORDEN	CFB Borden	16	 	1	1	3	4	4	3
BORDEN	CFMPA	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
BORDEN	CFRETS HQ	1	 	1	 	 	 	 	 
BRUNSSUM	Reg HQ AFNE	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
CALGARY	1 PPCLI	4	 	 	 	 	1	1	2
CASTEAU	SHAPE	5	1	1	1	1	1	 	 
CFB GAGETOWN	4 AD Regt Det Gagetwon	12	 	 	 	1	5	6	 
CFB PETAWAWA	3 RCR	2	 	 	 	 	1	 	1
CHARLOTTETOW	721 Comm Regt	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
CHILLIWACK	ASU Chilliwack	2	 	 	1	 	1	 	 
COLD LAKE	AETE	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
DEBERT	CC NICS Det Debert	8	 	 	1	4	 	3	 
EDMONTON	1 CER	2	 	 	 	 	1	1	 
EDMONTON	1 CMBG HQ & SS	21	 	1	1	1	7	5	6
EDMONTON	1 Fd Amb	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
EDMONTON	1 GS Bn	11	 	 	1	1	3	3	3
EDMONTON	408 Tac Hel Sqn	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
EDMONTON	742 Comm Sqn	39	 	1	2	6	7	6	17
EDMONTON	745 Comm Sqn	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
EDMONTON	CFB/ASU Edmonton	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
EDMONTON,ALT	1 Svc Bn	4	 	 	 	 	2	2	 
EDMONTON,ALT	3 PPCLI	2	 	 	 	 	1	 	1
EDMONTON,ALT	LDSH	6	 	 	 	1	5	 	 
ESQUIMALT	CFB Esquimalt	9	 	 	 	 	3	3	3
GAGETOWN	2 RCR	4	 	 	 	 	1	1	2
GAGETOWN	4 ESR	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
GAGETOWN	724 Comm Sqn	12	 	1	 	1	6	1	3
GAGETOWN	CFB/ASU Gagetown	32	 	1	1	3	6	7	14
GAGETOWN	Fd Arty School	5	 	 	1	2	2	 	 
GAGETOWN	LFTEU	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
GANDER	CFB Gander	1	 	 	 	 	 	 	1
GANDER	CFS Leitrim Det Gander	6	 	2	 	 	2	2	 
GT VILLAGE N	72 Comm Gp Det Gt Village	3	 	 	 	1	 	1	1
HALIFAX	CFB Halifax	9	 	1	1	1	2	3	1
HALIFAX	CFB Halifax Det Mill Cove	5	 	 	 	1	3	1	 
HAMILTON	705 Comm Sqn	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
HULL	DGLEPM	8	3	4	1	 	 	 	 
KINGSTON	1 CDN DIV HQ & SIG REGT	9	 	 	 	1	3	 	5
KINGSTON	CFB/ASU Kingston	6	 	 	 	1	3	1	1
KINGSTON	CFCMU	18	1	 	1	4	6	6	 
KINGSTON	CFIOG HQ Det Kingston	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
KINGSTON	CFJSR	69	1	1	1	7	22	19	18
KINGSTON	CFSCE	50	 	1	1	12	26	10	 
KINGSTON	CLFCSC	3	 	 	 	1	1	1	 
KINGSTON	LFDTS HQ	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
KINGSTON	RMC	3	 	 	1	2	 	 	 
LEITRIM	CFS Leitrim	39	1	1	2	7	8	16	4
LETHBRIDGE	18 AD Regt	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
LONDON	ASU London	2	 	 	 	 	1	1	 
MASSET	CFS Leitrim Det Masset	6	 	 	 	1	3	2	 
MEAFORD	LFCA TC	2	 	 	 	1	 	1	 
MONTREAL	202 Wksp	10	 	 	2	 	3	5	 
MONTREAL	3 CSG	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
NORFOLK	CC SACLANT	1	 	1	 	 	 	 	 
OTTAWA	76 Comm Gp HQ	57	 	2	6	8	12	18	11
OTTAWA	763 Comm Regt	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
OTTAWA	ADM(IM) PMPR List	5	 	3	 	1	1	 	 
OTTAWA	CFEWC	2	 	 	 	1	1	 	 
OTTAWA	CFIOG HQ	8	 	2	6	 	 	 	 
OTTAWA	CFNIS	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
OTTAWA	CLS	1	1	 	 	 	 	 	 
OTTAWA	DGISDS	15	1	2	7	4	1	 	 
OTTAWA	DGMC	2	1	 	1	 	 	 	 
OTTAWA	LFC H List	2	 	 	 	1	1	 	 
OTTAWA	NATO COMFAC Ottawa	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
OTTAWA	NDHQ PRL	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
OTTAWA	PROJECT MANAGEMENT RESOURCE PO	21	1	12	5	3	 	 	 
OTTAWA	QAWC St Lawrence	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
PEMBROKE	1 AD Regt	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
PETAWAWA	1 Cdn Fd Hosp	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
PETAWAWA	1 RCR	4	 	 	 	 	1	1	2
PETAWAWA	2 CER	2	 	 	 	 	1	1	 
PETAWAWA	2 CMBG HQ & Sig Sqn	20	 	1	1	1	7	4	6
PETAWAWA	2 Fd Amb	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
PETAWAWA	2 GS Bn	15	 	 	 	1	2	7	5
PETAWAWA	2 RCHA	10	 	 	 	 	1	5	4
PETAWAWA	2 Svc Bn	6	 	 	1	 	3	2	 
PETAWAWA	427 Tac Hel Sqn	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
PETAWAWA	702 Comm Sqn	22	 	1	1	5	3	4	8
PETAWAWA	RCD	6	 	 	 	1	5	 	 
QUEBEC CITY	2 R22ER	4	 	 	 	 	1	1	2
QUEBEC CITY	6 Fd Regt 58 AA Bty	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
QUEBEC CITY	CFRC Québec	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
RICHELAIN.QU	ASU St Jean	3	 	 	1	 	 	1	1
SAINT-JEAN	715 Comm Sqn Det St-Jean	12	 	 	 	5	2	4	1
SAINT-JEAN	CFLRS ST-JEAN	1	 	 	1	 	 	 	 
SAINT-JEAN	CFMDS	1	 	 	 	 	1	 	 
SELFKANT,GER	76 Comm Gp Det Selfkant	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
SHILO	1 RCHA	10	 	 	 	 	1	5	4
SHILO	1 Svc Bn Det Shilo	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
SHILO	731 Comm Sqn	16	 	 	1	2	3	4	6
SHILO	CFB/ASU Shilo	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
ST JOHN'S	CFS St John's	5	 	 	1	 	 	1	3
ST-HUBERT	715 Comm Sqn	10	 	 	1	1	4	1	3
ST-HUBERT	CFB/ASU Montréal	4	 	 	 	 	1	2	1
SUFFIELD	CFB Suffield	10	 	1	1	1	3	3	1
TORONTO	CFC	2	 	 	 	2	 	 	 
TORONTO	CFEME	3	 	 	1	 	 	1	1
TORONTO, ONT	ASU Toronto	5	 	 	 	1	 	3	1
TRENTON	CFB Trenton	2	 	 	 	 	1	1	 
VALCARTIER	1 R22ER	4	 	 	 	 	1	1	2
VALCARTIER	12e RBC	6	 	 	 	1	5	 	 
VALCARTIER	430 Tac Hel Sqn	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
VALCARTIER	5 CER	2	 	 	 	 	1	1	 
VALCARTIER	5 CMBG HQ & Sig Sqn	19	 	1	1	1	6	4	6
VALCARTIER	5 Fd Amb	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
VALCARTIER	5 Svc Bn	4	 	 	 	 	2	2	 
VALCARTIER	5e RALC	10	 	 	 	 	1	5	4
VALCARTIER	711 Comm Sqn	18	 	1	1	2	5	5	4
VALCARTIER	CFB/ASU Valcartier	18	 	 	1	3	4	1	9
VALCARTIER	DRE Valcartier	2	 	 	 	2	 	 	 
VALCARTIER	LFQA TC	3	 	 	 	 	 	1	2
WAINWRIGHT	742 Comm Sqn Det Wainwright	5	 	 	 	1	 	4	 
WAINWRIGHT	LFWA TC	2	 	 	 	 	1	1	 
WASHINGTON	CFIOG HQ/USN Office	1	 	 	 	 	 	1	 
WINNIPEG	2 PPCLI	4	 	 	 	 	1	1	2
WINNIPEG	735 Comm Regt	1	 	 	 	1	 	 	 
WINNIPEG	CFB Winnipeg	5	 	 	 	1	1	3	 
YELLOWKNIFE	CFNA HQ	2	 	 	 	 	1	 	1


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## SigPigs (14 Jan 2005)

We can read the canforgen but really it doesn't mean that much at this time, for people who have done OJT and have had their supervisors write off their qual.You may have been out of Kingston, 2 yrs ago,  but I administer people under me who have done said OJT. This isn't anything I heard or from anyone else I have done it. This is the way it works. You must remember also that our trade is in a state of flux right now. Also there are many types of people out there direct entry, and reserve transfers and normal recruits. So many options.
Andrew


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## Christien (22 Jan 2005)

I'm presently taking my LCIS QL3 and we had a meeting with the Career Manager a couple of months ago and here's how it stood then:

There is no QL5 package YET, it's in the works and ETA is unkown.

As for the whole SPEC PAY thing, technically you need to be 5's qualified before you can start receiving it, but since there's no QL5 yet and no ETA, LCIS Tech will receive SPEC PAY 24 months after finishing QL3, at which point you are considered to have enough OJT to be QL5 "qualified". 

We we're told that my course will not be affected by the upcoming LCIS QL5.


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## Christien (22 Jan 2005)

The LCIS course that is graduating in March are posted as follows:

5 to Petawawa
3 to Shilo
1 to Kingston

And on my course 2 have been already "offered" Wainwright


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## KaptKain (23 Feb 2005)

tyson12 said:
			
		

> Thanks for the reply and the info LCISTech227. How long have you been in so far? Was it you that had just signed his 20yr? What was your background prior to training. I have university and a networking degree with MCP and most of the way to MCSE.



I was the one that just started my 20yr stint.
My prior background was school for Electronics Eng. Technology. I finished about 90% of that 5 years ago and decided to get into IT instead and got a piece of paper for that. I was in the Reserves for a few years before this. I had a fulltime contract in a LCIS position for 3 years at a Detached Training Center. The base didnt support radio's so I have no knowledge on that. But myself and 2 others maintained the whole IT/Tele for the base. Your course you mentioned will help you on that part of the LCIS trade. There are many specialty training courses offered as well; Fibreoptics, Advanced Soldering, Network Management(you have this one already) and a few others.
If ya ever had any Calculus courses prior then you will know the math and already have an open mind for the electronic concepts "Thrown" at ya. Staff is great to help as well if you need any.


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## Old_tech (8 May 2008)

Ok, let me clear up some of the confusion.  I was a reserve rad tech and on the second LCIS course ever run.  There was no QL5 level course at that time, I don't know what's happening in the trade nowadays.

What happened with the QL5 was this.  The QL 5 tech's course was an advanced POET course.  In 1991 they revamped the POET course, and incorporated what was in the advanced POET into the basic POET, so a QL5 course wasn't necessary, as the qualification was already held by anyone taking POET.


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