# MPs in the field?



## Veovius (11 Apr 2010)

Hi, this is my first post, but I have been lurking for a while.  I have read a lot of threads, and I have a question.  If it has already been covered, please accept my apologies, this site can take forever to load (or just never load)!

I am very interested in applying for the Military Police, and I would like some info on what they do in the field, ala Afghanistan.  I talked to a Combat Engineer buddy and he mentioned that all they do is speeding tickets and traffic control at the market.  I'm pretty sure that's a gross generalization.  Does anyone have any info on what they do deployed, how to get deployed, how close to combat they normally get?  I also heard that MPs do things like mark routes, guard prisoner camps overseas, etc.

In the end, I guess my dilemma is that I want to go into policing, be it civilian or military.  I also want to serve my country, and would love the experience of being at the pointy end, to put it bluntly (ha!).  I'm considering signing up as Infantry and remustering to MPs, but if I can get that experience going straight MP, that would be great.

Thank you for all the help!


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## Retired AF Guy (11 Apr 2010)

Here is a link to the  Canadian Forces Provost Marshal Annual Report 2004-2005.  Its a little old but gives a good overview of military police operations. 

I knew I could find it! Here's an  overview of the MP trade  at the CF Recruiting website.


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## EpicBeardedMan (11 Apr 2010)

Veovius said:
			
		

> I'm considering signing up as Infantry and remustering to MPs, but if I can get that experience going straight MP, that would be great.



I think Infantry is full for awhile but they are hiring MP's I do know that much. It would be better to take the direct route unless you wanted to wait for a bit  :-X. I'm kind of in the same boat you are, I'm interesting in MP but I'm interested in the combat arms trades so my second choice was Combat Engineer after Military Police, from what I gathered off this site they fight as Infantry at times but you learn a lot about constructing things and demolitions. (Also I wasn't qualified enough for AESop  ;D)


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## SeanNewman (11 Apr 2010)

A lot of MPs in Afghanistan are involved in detainees, or "operations" MPs.

MPs in Canada (generally) do more conventional police-type police duties on bases.

That being said, they get Land Duty Allowance so they must go to the field a lot  :


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## Veovius (12 Apr 2010)

Retired AF Guy : Thank you for the Provost Marshall link, that was great.  It's easy to forget that there are lots of overseas assignments that don't start with A and end with -stan.

Petamocto : When you said detainees, did you mean basically guarding prisoner camps?  What's a Land Duty Allowance? Is that like the extra overseas tour pay?


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## Franko (12 Apr 2010)

Petamocto said:
			
		

> That being said, they get Land Duty Allowance so they must go to the field a lot  :



Especially the det in Moncton.         

Regards


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## brendanhm1 (13 Apr 2010)

If your an MP and want to see combat, go POMLT. POMLT is a small section of MPs and Infantry training the AUP. Plenty of patrols and plenty of time outside the wire.

There's a POMLT firefight vid on youtube if your interested.


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## Veovius (13 Apr 2010)

Wow, that sounds perfectly like something I would want!  I wish I knew about that a couple years ago.....

Is there any information on a pullout date for the POMLT teams?  Have they been done before or is this a new initiative?  As in, I'm pretty sure that even if I got in today, between training and people more senior to myself, I wouldn't stand a good chance of making it before it was all over.  Could this be something that I could look forward to in the future, or is it an Afghanistan-specific mission?


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## SeanNewman (13 Apr 2010)

If you haven't started yet, it will be completely impossible to you to get trade qualified plus go through tour work-up training before getting on the final Afghan deployment next year.

I don't know what the next mission will be, but it is highly likely that every MP or other soldier who will be involved in a P-OMLT position already knows.


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## MrPickles18 (27 May 2010)

Petamocto said:
			
		

> That being said, they get Land Duty Allowance so they must go to the field a lot  :



Negative... unless you're in Pet, edm or ValCat.  I'm paying back a month and a half of LDA at the end of this month.  Yipee...


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## vonGarvin (27 May 2010)

MrPickles18 said:
			
		

> Negative... unless you're in Pet, edm or ValCat.  *I'm paying back a month and a half of LDA at the end of this month.  Yipee*...


I have no sympathy for you whatsoever.  

EDIT TO ADD: when I saw the thread title, I thought maybe this was in the humour section.  ("MPs in the field?  Sure, if you count the parking lot at Tim Hortons on Gateway as 'the field'.")


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## SeanNewman (27 May 2010)

Technoviking said:
			
		

> ...Sure, if you count the parking lot at Tim Hortons on Gateway as 'the field'.")



Baaaaaaaaaaaaaam!

MrP,

I would like to go on the record though as saying I have had nothing but positive experiences with MPs.  Any time one was ever mad at me it was completely justified.  Every time it could have gone either way the MP was always cool about it.  That being said though, all of those times were on base.

A bit anecdotal, but I experienced an absolutely brutal MPO case last fall where a candidate had passed 3/5 mods on BMOQ-L then failed.  For his own good, we suggested he actually return for the navigation mod (in the field) because sitting stagnant for a few months he would probably lose that skill and lose his field fitness.  He actually had tears in his eyes begging me _*not*_ to have to do those two weeks again because they were in the field.

I am not suggesting that all MPs are like that, but there was a small cheer in the office when the notice came out that he would lose LDA.


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## stealthylizard (27 May 2010)

The new term for POMLT is OMAT (A is for Advisory), not that it really makes that big of a difference.


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## lawandorder (2 Jun 2010)

MP's conduct more field functions then people might think, at the NCM level at least.  That MPO that was on his BMOQ that didn't want to go into the field to re-do his nav, is just like those young Pte's that don't want to go an re-do night nav or section attacks, or that Cpl/MCpl on PLQ that fails the defensive portion and has to re do it.  A Person, who in general, probably isn't cut out for the CF.


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## vonGarvin (2 Jun 2010)

Law & Order said:
			
		

> MP's conduct more field functions then people might think,


:rofl:



Oh, sorry, you were being serious?  Yes, we did have MPs in the field with us in Zharey, etc.  But here?  In Canada?  I think since the days of 4 MP Pl in Germany, well....


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## George Wallace (2 Jun 2010)

Law & Order said:
			
		

> MP's conduct more field functions then people might think, at the NCM level at least.



Why did a picture of that female MP from 2 MP Platoon just come to mind?  She was manning a TCP and was supposed to direct traffic.  When our convoy arrived (I was in the lead vehicle), we had to wait as she pushed the crosswalk button to change the lights and stop traffic.  As a MCpl she should have had at the very least some idea of how to stand in the middle of an intersection and direct traffic.  All us 011's know how, and we don't get Spec pay.


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## MP 811 (2 Jun 2010)

George Wallace said:
			
		

> Why did a picture of that female MP from 2 MP Platoon just come to mind?  She was manning a TCP and was supposed to direct traffic.  When our convoy arrived (I was in the lead vehicle), we had to wait as she pushed the crosswalk button to change the lights and stop traffic.  As a MCpl she should have had at the very least some idea of how to stand in the middle of an intersection and direct traffic.  All us 011's know how, and we don't get Spec pay.



Sorry to hear that George....rest assured, this is not the norm.  I along with many of my colleagues would have quite readily, got up and conducted traffic control in the intersection......its our job!


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## George Wallace (2 Jun 2010)

I agree it is not the norm.  It is an example of how one bad apple, no matter the Trade, can tarnish the whole Trade.


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## lawandorder (2 Jun 2010)

Technoviking said:
			
		

> Oh, sorry, you were being serious?  Yes, we did have MPs in the field with us in Zharey, etc.  But here?  In Canada?  I think since the days of 4 MP Pl in Germany, well....



Yep thats the kind of Example I was talking about.  

And George, I too am sorry for your encounter with that MP, unfortunately its the way it goes sometimes, But I would have directed traffic for you.


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## Poppa (3 Jun 2010)

Screw you George...you're big and ugly enough to cross the street on your own. Besides..I wouldn't want to get my boots dirty


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## SeanNewman (3 Jun 2010)

For the record here, getting out of a car/shack to direct traffic for a while isn't really in the spirit of LDA.

Ask yourself if you have spent just _*one night*_ on the job in the last year under the stars and exposed to the bugs and rain.

3/4 of Wainwright and CTC pers could say yes.  Thank god they stopped LDA for MPs.


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## MP 811 (3 Jun 2010)

Well I for one have spent many MANY nights out in the rain, manning defensive positions, bugging out of freshly dug shell scraps and enjoyed trenches half full of water while my armoured bretheren were nice and warm in their AFV's...

And for the record, I could care less about LDA.


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## SeanNewman (3 Jun 2010)

MP 811 said:
			
		

> Well I for one have spent many MANY nights ...
> 
> And for the record, I couldn't care less about LDA.



1.  Then you were likely in a job that deserved LDA.

2.  I call BS.  Unless you are independently wealthy, nobody would say they do not care about $300-$700/month.


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## lawandorder (4 Jun 2010)

Petamocto said:
			
		

> For the record here, getting out of a car/shack to direct traffic for a while isn't really in the spirit of LDA.
> 
> Ask yourself if you have spent just _*one night*_ on the job in the last year under the stars and exposed to the bugs and rain.
> 
> 3/4 of Wainwright and CTC pers could say yes.  Thank god they stopped LDA for MPs.



Well I guess Ignorance to what MP's actually do is still alive and flourishing.


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## Franko (4 Jun 2010)

MP 811 said:
			
		

> Well I for one have spent many MANY nights out in the rain, manning defensive positions, bugging out of freshly dug shell scraps and enjoyed trenches half full of water while my armoured bretheren were nice and warm in their AFV's...



Here's a news flash....AFVs leak and half the time the heaters are pooched. Turret crews are always exposed to the elements.      

Regards


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## MP 811 (4 Jun 2010)

Petamocto said:
			
		

> 1.  Then you were likely in a job that deserved LDA.
> 
> 2.  I call BS.  Unless you are independently wealthy, nobody would say they do not care about $300-$700/month.



Call BS all you want, I live within my means my friend!  I work on an Air Force Base where LDA is just a three letter acronym.  I'm sure as hell not complaining about what I get now.  Offer me more?..............sure I'll take it, but I could care less about this whole LDA debacle.  I live a decent life doing the things I like to do on my free time.


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## MP 811 (4 Jun 2010)

Der Panzerkommandant.... said:
			
		

> Here's a news flash....AFVs leak and half the time the heaters are pooched. Turret crews are always exposed to the elements.
> 
> Regards



thought that would get a zipperhead going!...........lol.  I have all the respect for crewman and all combat arms in general.  I played infantry back in the days when my back and knee's could take the abuse.  Loved being a soldier and was of the belief that if you weren't wet, tired, dirty cold, and generally miserable, you weren't experiencing the field.  Alas, I'm at an age now where the old body just cant hack it anymore.  The guys in the Cougars were always willing to hook up a poor wet jock with a hot cup of coffee!


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## Fotoshark (3 Jul 2010)

Forgive me but what does LDA stand for ?


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## Michael OLeary (3 Jul 2010)

Fotoshark said:
			
		

> Forgive me but what does LDA stand for ?



Land Duty Allowance (LDA)
http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dgcb-dgras/pd/all-ind/mnd-pce/ldadu-iscud-17-eng.asp

See http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/93960.0.html


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## Fotoshark (4 Jul 2010)

Michael O'Leary said:
			
		

> Land Duty Allowance (LDA)
> http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dgcb-dgras/pd/all-ind/mnd-pce/ldadu-iscud-17-eng.asp
> 
> See http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/93960.0.html



Thank you


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## MrPickles18 (6 Jul 2010)

Technoviking said:
			
		

> I have no sympathy for you whatsoever.



Wasn't asking for it.  It was to be expected.  Still got my spec though!


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## MrPickles18 (6 Jul 2010)

Petamocto said:
			
		

> A bit anecdotal, but I experienced an absolutely brutal MPO case last fall where a candidate had passed 3/5 mods on BMOQ-L then failed.  For his own good, we suggested he actually return for the navigation mod (in the field) because sitting stagnant for a few months he would probably lose that skill and lose his field fitness.  He actually had tears in his eyes begging me _*not*_ to have to do those two weeks again because they were in the field.
> 
> I am not suggesting that all MPs are like that, but there was a small cheer in the office when the notice came out that he would lose LDA.



Peta,

Unfortunatly there are a lot of MPs like that and it's embarrassing to the trade.  I went through training and worked with guys like that and it makes you ashamed to be an MP sometimes.  They keep pushing people through that probably shouldn't be since we are hurting for people so much.   Ask yourself, would you rather work 4 on, 2 off with someone you can trust?  Or the normal 5 on, 5 off but with someone that can't even bend over to tie their own shoes? (not intending to offend anybody)  :-\


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## SeanNewman (10 Jul 2010)

FWIW, I'll be in the field doing Army stuff 5 of the next 8 weeks without permanent LDA (only CLDA, which over the course of the year is scraps compared to LDA).

Very strange that I spend far more time in the field in a non-LDA unit than I ever did in a light battalion with LDA, even being a platoon commander for half of it.


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## Franko (10 Jul 2010)

MrPickles18 said:
			
		

> Peta,
> 
> Unfortunatly there are a lot of MPs like that and it's embarrassing to the trade.  I went through training and worked with guys like that and it makes you ashamed to be an MP sometimes.  They keep pushing people through that probably shouldn't be since we are hurting for people so much.   Ask yourself, would you rather work *4 on, 2* off with someone you can trust?  Or the normal *5 on, 5 off *but with someone that can't even bend over to tie their own shoes? (not intending to offend anybody)  :-\



If that's days per week, you guys have it real tough.  I won't even get into spec pay.       :



			
				Petamocto said:
			
		

> FWIW, I'll be in the field doing Army stuff 5 of the next 8 weeks without permanent LDA (only CLDA, which over the course of the year is scraps compared to LDA).
> 
> Very strange that I spend far more time in the field in a non-LDA unit than I ever did in a light battalion with LDA, even being a platoon commander for half of it.



Every instructor at the Armour School is in the same boat, if not worse, most averaging 9-10 months in the field instructing courses or on task. 

Regards


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## SeanNewman (10 Jul 2010)

Der Panzerkommandant.... said:
			
		

> ...Every instructor at the Armour School is in the same boat, if not worse...



My post was not at all to suggest that the Infantry School is the only one going to the field in CTC.  I know we're all in the same boat.

In fact, I think CMTC Wainwright deserves it the most in the CF and they don't even get it.

I can not allow myself to think that this wrong will not be righted at some point though.  The two groups of people who spend more time in the field than anyone else, CMTC and CTC, not getting LDA is a massive oversight and thankfully I know people are working at higher levels at least attempting to remedy it.

Of course it's a double-whammy because not only do you not get the money, but you lose out on the incentive points too so when you do go back to a unit you're making hundreds less per month.

[/whining]


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## Klinkaroo (10 Jul 2010)

Can't remember where I heard this but don't MPs have some kind of job at embassies also?


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## CorporalMajor (10 Jul 2010)

Klinkaroo said:
			
		

> Can't remember where I heard this but don't MPs have some kind of job at embassies also?


Guarding Canadian Embassies abroad?

Not 100% sure, but some MP here can confirm/deny.


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## aesop081 (10 Jul 2010)

Klinkaroo said:
			
		

> Can't remember where I heard this but don't MPs have some kind of job at embassies also?



Yes they do. A freind of mine is a MP and he just got posted to the embassy in Manila.


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## lawandorder (14 Jul 2010)

IF you collect CLDA for 30 days in a month, its actually could me more $$ then a person getting LDA.

Its also taxable.


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## aesop081 (14 Jul 2010)

Law & Order said:
			
		

> IF you collect CLDA for 30 days in a month, its actually could me more $$ then a person getting LDA.
> 
> Its also taxable.



You can only collect CLDA ( or any of the environmental allowances) up to that of the highest monthly LDA rate.



> 205.335(2) (Limit) The total amount of Casual Land Duty Allowance payable in a calendar month to a member shall not exceed the highest monthly rate set out in the Table to CBI 205.33 (Land Duty Allowance).


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## SeanNewman (15 Jul 2010)

Cdn Aviator is correct but that does not remedy the injustice.

You should not have to spend 20 days per month in the field consistently to make the same money as the vast majority of people in field units who certainly do not spend 20 days per month year round.

This is not meant to be a personal gripe; I joined the CF for X pay, and I'm now getting that pay so it's great.  What bothers me is that the MCpls-WOs who are in the field year-round here actually doing the slogging walking through the swamps to do their candidate assessments aren't getting it, when they know that their peers in are likely sitting in unit lines somewhere nice and dry, making more money.


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