# RCN ships in high sea states



## FSTO (14 Mar 2018)

Oldgateboatdriver said:
			
		

> They are "coastal" vessels, Recceguy. Built for OUR coasts, which are basically open ocean areas. They can take a crossing without too much trouble unless they hit a storm mid-ocean. But then again, even aircraft carriers can be mauled pretty bad by storms if they get caught - Just ask admiral Halsey.  ;D



Just read that book. After reading what happened to the survivors of the USS Indianapolis and the ones from the ships that sunk in that Typhoon I would much rather be in arctic waters over tropical waters. A quick death by hypothermia seems much more desirable than one by sunburn, madness and sharks.


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## Stoker (14 Mar 2018)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Sending Coastal Defence Vessels to the other side of the world. I'm guessing when I say they must've been like bobbing around like a cork on the crossing.



Not really I have been across on deployments 3 times now, its not that bad.


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## Stoker (14 Mar 2018)

Oldgateboatdriver said:
			
		

> They are "coastal" vessels, Recceguy. Built for OUR coasts, which are basically open ocean areas. They can take a crossing without too much trouble unless they hit a storm mid-ocean. But then again, even aircraft carriers can be mauled pretty bad by storms if they get caught - Just ask admiral Halsey.  ;D



They have been in at least 14M seas without any troubles.


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## Oldgateboatdriver (14 Mar 2018)

Chief, 14 meters seas + is Beaufort Sea State 12 - hurricane. The frigates or IROs couldn't take that "without any trouble".

There has been one crossing I know of with the MCDV where they were hit by the tail of hurricane - down to Sea State 11 (violent storm - waves 11.5 to 14 meters), it was extremely tough on the crew and equipment and one of the MCDV tripped both shafts due to overspeed when the screws came out of the water, leaving them bobbing around dead in the water until they could be reset and making for very tense moments. I would not call that "without any trouble".

This said, and as I indicated, so long as they are facing normal seas, the MCDV's are fine to do crossings.


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## PuckChaser (14 Mar 2018)

Chief Stoker said:
			
		

> They have been in at least 14M seas without any troubles.


Thanks for reminding me why I joined the Army... god speed to all you crazy folks that enjoy that.


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## Furniture (14 Mar 2018)

Oldgateboatdriver said:
			
		

> Chief, 14 meters seas + is Beaufort Sea State 12 - hurricane. The frigates or IROs couldn't take that "without any trouble".
> 
> There has been one crossing I know of with the MCDV where they were hit by the tail of hurricane - down to Sea State 11 (violent storm - waves 11.5 to 14 meters), it was extremely tough on the crew and equipment and one of the MCDV tripped both shafts due to overspeed when the screws came out of the water, leaving them bobbing around dead in the water until they could be reset and making for very tense moments. I would not call that "without any trouble".
> 
> This said, and as I indicated, so long as they are facing normal seas, the MCDV's are fine to do crossings.



I believe I remember that crossing(2005/2006 ish), I briefed the command teams before they went... apparently saying there are 17m seas forecast along the route wasn't clear enough information. ;D


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## OldSolduer (14 Mar 2018)

Colin P said:
			
		

> With our PM, it will be a mall deployment.



West Edmonton Mall?  :rofl:


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## tomahawk6 (15 Mar 2018)

Might as well deploy to Detroit  ;D


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## ballz (15 Mar 2018)

Hamish Seggie said:
			
		

> West Edmonton Mall?  :rofl:



He'd be safer in Mali than surrounded by Albertans :clubinhand:


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## Fishbone Jones (15 Mar 2018)

ballz said:
			
		

> He'd be safer in Mali than surrounded by Albertans :clubinhand:



I thought it read 'He'd be safer at the MALL than surrounded by Albertans.'

Which, when I last was at WEM, it still would've been an accurate statement.


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## Stoker (15 Mar 2018)

Oldgateboatdriver said:
			
		

> Chief, 14 meters seas + is Beaufort Sea State 12 - hurricane. The frigates or IROs couldn't take that "without any trouble".
> 
> There has been one crossing I know of with the MCDV where they were hit by the tail of hurricane - down to Sea State 11 (violent storm - waves 11.5 to 14 meters), it was extremely tough on the crew and equipment and one of the MCDV tripped both shafts due to overspeed when the screws came out of the water, leaving them bobbing around dead in the water until they could be reset and making for very tense moments. I would not call that "without any trouble".
> 
> This said, and as I indicated, so long as they are facing normal seas, the MCDV's are fine to do crossings.



Yes I was the Chief Engineer and the situation was overblown by those ashore. We lost propulsion for about 1 min and it was restored. I would of had the shafts up sooner however I was on the aft end of the sweep deck securing a POL barrel that came loose. I wouldn't call it "tense" and all personnel were up and about. Point is the ship can handle it and have been handling it for the last 20 years. If it couldn't we wouldn't be still sending ships across.


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## daftandbarmy (15 Mar 2018)

Chief Stoker said:
			
		

> Yes I was the Chief Engineer and the situation was overblown by those ashore. We lost propulsion for about 1 min and it was restored. I would of had the shafts up sooner however I was on the aft end of the sweep deck securing a POL barrel that came loose. I wouldn't call it "tense" and all personnel were up and about. Point is the ship can handle it and have been handling it for the last 20 years. If it couldn't we wouldn't be still sending ships across.




'Tis pleasant to stand on shore and watch others labouring in a stormy sea.'  ;D
    

Lucretius


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## Halifax Tar (15 Mar 2018)

Chief Stoker said:
			
		

> Yes I was the Chief Engineer and the situation was overblown by those ashore. We lost propulsion for about 1 min and it was restored. I would of had the shafts up sooner however I was on the aft end of the sweep deck securing a POL barrel that came loose. I wouldn't call it "tense" and all personnel were up and about. Point is the ship can handle it and have been handling it for the last 20 years. If it couldn't we wouldn't be still sending ships across.



Kudos to you and your crew Chief.  I've sailed through hurricanes on a tanker and a CPF, neither of which were much fun and both made me become very good friends with the heads.  I cant imagine it would be anything but violent on an MCDV.  

We had filing cabinets break away from their securing and break peoples legs, had a sailor fall off the side of ladder and bust up his back because of a heavy roll.  And that was on the tanker.  HHT might remember that trip.  We went across to the Azores, IRO's Helo crashed on deck, we had to rig lines in the dispersal area to keep water from flooding down the stores and ammo lifts.  Smoking in the dispersal too... lots of fun, cant wait to go back   :nod:


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## Stoker (15 Mar 2018)

Halifax Tar said:
			
		

> Kudos to you and your crew Chief.  I've sailed through hurricanes on a tanker and a CPF, neither of which were much fun and both made me become very good friends with the heads.  I cant imagine it would be anything but violent on an MCDV.
> 
> We had filing cabinets break away from their securing and break peoples legs, had a sailor fall off the side of ladder and bust up his back because of a heavy roll.  And that was on the tanker.  HHT might remember that trip.  We went across to the Azores, IRO's Helo crashed on deck, we had to rig lines in the dispersal area to keep water from flooding down the stores and ammo lifts.  Smoking in the dispersal too... lots of fun, cant wait to go back   :nod:



It was rough and I won't dispute that but the nature of being on a MCDV for many years in all sorts of weather most of us was used to it and business as usual. The only person in their rack the entire time was the doc who sailed on a CPF normally. What I heard was someone sent a email and picture off the ship and of course it went viral through an extended email chain, thus the story that we were ready to go down. The ships can take an incredible amount weather and still get the job done. If I can find them, I'll post up a few pictures of the sea state.


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## Halifax Tar (15 Mar 2018)

Chief Stoker said:
			
		

> It was rough and I won't dispute that but the nature of being on a MCDV for many years in all sorts of weather most of us was used to it and business as usual. The only person in their rack the entire time was the doc who sailed on a CPF normally. What I heard was someone sent a email and picture off the ship and of course it went viral through an extended email chain, thus the story that we were ready to go down. The ships can take an incredible amount weather and still get the job done. If I can find them, I'll post up a few pictures of the sea state.



Would love to see them.  Getting through that strikes me as a feat of seamanship.  BZ to that crew.  I would have died from exhaustion, dehydration and starvation.


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## Stoker (15 Mar 2018)

Halifax Tar said:
			
		

> Would love to see them.  Getting through that strikes me as a feat of seamanship.  BZ to that crew.  I would have died from exhaustion, dehydration and starvation.

















Just another day in the life of a Kingston Class sailor.


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## Furniture (15 Mar 2018)

Chief Stoker said:
			
		

> The standard we all aspired to...   :not-again:
> 
> Awesome pics though, would have been an interesting trip.


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## daftandbarmy (15 Mar 2018)

Chief Stoker said:
			
		

> Just another day in the life of a Kingston Class sailor.



Surfing vacation?


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## Stoker (15 Mar 2018)

daftandbarmy said:
			
		

> Surfing vacation?



You could say that ;D


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## MarkOttawa (15 Mar 2018)

"If everybody had an ocean..."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2s4slliAtQU

Mark
Ottawa


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## jollyjacktar (15 Mar 2018)

Reminds me of taking IRQ across to the Azores.  She would completely disappear in the swells, then tower waaaay above us.  Quite the wild ride there and back.  Non stop action for two weeks.  This was the trip l was on with HT on PRE that he mentioned earlier.


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## Stoker (15 Mar 2018)

jollyjacktar said:
			
		

> Reminds me of taking IRQ across to the Azores.  She would completely disappear in the swells, then tower waaaay above us.  Quite the wild ride there and back.  Non stop action for two weeks.  This was the trip l was on with HT on PRE that he mentioned earlier.



You mean like this?


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## OldSolduer (15 Mar 2018)

I’m glad I didn’t join the RCN. Wow. Awesome stuff!


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## jollyjacktar (15 Mar 2018)

Chief Stoker said:
			
		

> You mean like this?



Close, but no, l mean totally gone.  Nothing at all visable.  She was about 900m off our port side.  And when she was at the zenith, you were looking up at her at about a 45 deg. + angle.  It was like a carousel ride, quite the adventure.  About 30 seconds or so between the ups and downs, non stop.  The old man said he had seen it rougher but never prolonged like that.  The only time we weren't bouncing was when we went into the Azores to bunker.  All the way there and back from home, bounce, bounce, bounce.   ;D

Like this, Jim.  Best fun ever.

https://youtu.be/Sx57-LnuuFs


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## PuckChaser (15 Mar 2018)

Some real cool pictures and stories here, figured I'd split this off for everyone.


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## jollyjacktar (16 Mar 2018)

Ok, l did put this one in earlier but swapped it out.  I put it back because it shows a greenie coming inside, like they were coming into the dispersal area and what it looks like off to your beam in heavy seas at the 20 and 30 second mark for all you land lubbers.  And yes, that shit is cold when it hits you.

https://youtu.be/7wZLqURGu1s


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## PPCLI Guy (16 Mar 2018)

Chief Stoker said:
			
		

> Just another day in the life of a Kingston Class sailor.



I toured the NANAIMO today - a very impressive ship and crew....


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## Halifax Tar (16 Mar 2018)

Hamish Seggie said:
			
		

> I’m glad I didn’t join the RCN. Wow. Awesome stuff!



Remember I am a storesman when I say this so I cant relate to life in the field as an infanteer.  BUT lol Never once in the field did I wake up and question my life's choices, and ask "why am I here ?" At sea, almost every day... 

But then we pull into some port and all the misery is forgotten...


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## NavyShooter (16 Mar 2018)

Here was a 'little storm' we saw on MON a couple of years ago.

Not the worst I've seen.  I was holding onto the Gyro doing rounds once and read the roll angle as 42.6 degrees.

NS


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## NavyShooter (16 Mar 2018)

A few more...


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## Stoker (16 Mar 2018)

a Video from the crossing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GX2q4i3a5MY


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## Stoker (16 Mar 2018)

a few more pictures you may enjoy


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## jollyjacktar (16 Mar 2018)

NavyShooter said:
			
		

> Here was a 'little storm' we saw on MON a couple of years ago.
> 
> Not the worst I've seen.  I was holding onto the Gyro doing rounds once and read the roll angle as 42.6 degrees.
> 
> NS



That was probably the storm that was throwing guys around on ATH then.  Quite a few were seriously hurt when the collided with things.  Didn't do the old lady any favours either and contributed to her demise.


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## Humphrey Bogart (16 Mar 2018)

All those rough waters made me think, you sailors must have steel cores!  Who needs Bosu Balls when your stabilizers are firing at all hours of the day!

Explain why sailors are so good in bar fights, they turned Ali's "Rope A Dope" in to a vocation!

Answer from D Mil C on my pending VOT from Infantry to the "Senior Service" should be in any day, oh and my brother is joining the CAF, as a Boatswain.


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## kratz (16 Mar 2018)

All these photos look like a battle of the rough seas.


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## jollyjacktar (16 Mar 2018)

The sea is every sailor's enemy at times.  She is cold, heartless and relentless at times.   And she will try to take your life if things go south.  When she is in her fury, it can be fascinating, beautiful and terrifying all at the same time.  

I love her and I'll miss her, as my sailing days are done, l think.


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## Halifax Tar (16 Mar 2018)

jollyjacktar said:
			
		

> I love her and I'll miss her, as my sailing days are done, l think.



One more time mess mate! Join me on Freddy!


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## jollyjacktar (16 Mar 2018)

Halifax Tar said:
			
		

> One more time mess mate! Join me on Freddy!



I'm too old and broken to bounce around like old, I'm afraid.  I have to pass the torch to you younger guys.


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## Oldgateboatdriver (16 Mar 2018)

Couldn't agree more with Jollyjacktar.

BTW, if you look at the pics of NavyShooter, you now understand why, in Canada, we chose to set our hull mounted sonars below the ship, about one third distance from the bow, instead of in the bow, like the Americans. A sonar out of water ain't much use.

I remember one storm on the West coast when I was in MACKENZIE and we could actually see the sonar dome on YUKON when she was cresting! I assume they could do the same when looking at us, but for reason unknown (and I am sure everyone around here can attest to that), when we look at our consorts in a storm, we always feel like they have it worse than ourselves. Misery loves company, I guess!  :nod:


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## jollyjacktar (16 Mar 2018)

I always liked RASing in rough weather. It could be entertaining to watch the greenies smacking the others and watching them plunge and roll.   :nod:


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## Stoker (16 Mar 2018)

Of course a heavy sea state in winter is no fun at all, from a set of WUP's I did about 15 years ago. Took a day alongside to remove the ice


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## Oldgateboatdriver (16 Mar 2018)

One of the pleasures (so to speak) of being stuck in local waters or too slow. Unlike the "heavies", it's more difficult in the MCDV's to deke South East quickly into the gulf Stream for about 12 hours and melt it all.


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## Lumber (16 Mar 2018)

NavyShooter said:
			
		

> Here was a 'little storm' we saw on MON a couple of years ago.
> 
> Not the worst I've seen.  I was holding onto the Gyro doing rounds once and read the roll angle as 42.6 degrees.
> 
> NS



Ah yes, the 24 hours of constant list to port crossing the Gulf of Maine. Great if your bunk opening faced to starboard, not so much if it opened to port (especially if you're Seat Trg...). 

I remember everyone walking into the Wardroom for breakfast that day had the same look on their face when they saw all of our furniture bundled up in a pile, a look of "Wtf?" Followed immediately by, "Where am I suppose to eat my fruit loops?!".


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## Furniture (16 Mar 2018)

Our transit from Hawaii to home on WIN. The sig wave was only about 3-4m with a few 5m and 6m seas thrown in for good measure.  The winds were the real culprit, they were out of the south at 25-30kt with gusts to 35kt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yd2BjPkTJ4s


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## Halifax Tar (16 Mar 2018)

WeatherdoG said:
			
		

> Our transit from Hawaii to home on WIN. The sig wave was only about 3-4m with a few 5m and 6m seas thrown in for good measure.  The winds were the real culprit, they were out of the south at 25-30kt with gusts to 35kt
> 
> <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Yd2BjPkTJ4s" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>



Sandy bottom sailors  

*said with all intended humor*


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## Oldgateboatdriver (16 Mar 2018)

Yes. For landlubbers out there: When you are on a long track with strong winds on your beam, it's pretty normal for the ship to be rolled and held down at a certain angle away from the windy side, just like a sailboat. In fact, the more flat surface  on your beam exposed to the wind, the more you get leaned over and held. That "flat surface" of a ship is actually called her "sail" area.

The IRO's were particularly subject to that, as were the old minesweepers.


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## Colin Parkinson (16 Mar 2018)

MCDV, the modern "Corvette"


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## Baz (16 Mar 2018)

NavyShooter said:
			
		

> Here was a 'little storm' we saw on MON a couple of years ago.
> 
> Not the worst I've seen.  I was holding onto the Gyro doing rounds once and read the roll angle as 42.6 degrees.
> 
> NS



I flew in a Sea King down from Sheartwaer and embarked on HMCS Nipigon from Patrick AFB, Florida on March 12, 1993 in order to replace aircraft 12423 which had ditched on or about the night of 26 Feb 93 (crew all went swimming but got out)... it took us 10 days to get there because we broke down in Boston for 6 nights and then had to wait 3 dats for the ship to come back around from the Gulf of Mexico at Patrick.

March 12 was significant because 





> The 1993 Storm of the Century (also known as the '93 Superstorm, The No Name Storm, or the Great Blizzard of 1993) was a large cyclonic storm that formed over the Gulf of Mexico on March 12, 1993. The storm was unique and notable for its intensity, massive size, and wide-reaching effects; at its height, the storm stretched from Canada to Honduras. The cyclone moved through the Gulf of Mexico and then through the eastern United States before moving on to Canada. The storm eventually dissipated in the North Atlantic Ocean on March 15, 1993.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Storm_of_the_Century.  It hit us off of Norfolk on the 13th and 14th; at one point we went over 48 degrees and all the furniture in the wardroom broke loose.  We rode it out better in an old steamer than some of the other ships in StaNavForLant did though...

There was also a case, on HMCS Fraser I think, in the early to mid '90s that the spare engine broke loose in the hangar and was sliding around and they had to lasso it.

In the steamers there was no way to the hangar except outside, so if the upper decks were out of bounds for weather you had to go out through the bridge and over the top to the hatch at the front of the hangar, which was a pain to open in heavy winds, and then down a tiny ladder with the nose of the aircraft about 15 inches away.  You told the OOW you were going and then called him so he knew you got there, and the reverse to come back.


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## Colin Parkinson (16 Mar 2018)

CCG on the Westcoast had a young seaman killed by a landing craft that came loose on the welldeck of either the Wofe or Camsaul during a storm, apparently jumped off of the hatchcover to get a line on it without orders and got caught inbetween when the landing craft shifted.


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## jollyjacktar (16 Mar 2018)

So easy to lose one's life at sea.  Sometimes I'm amazed we don't lose a guy or two like the big players do on a sort of regular basis.


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## Furniture (17 Mar 2018)

jollyjacktar said:
			
		

> So easy to lose one's life at sea.  Sometimes I'm amazed we don't lose a guy or two like the big players do on a sort of regular basis.



Sometimes we even do big seas and other things at the same time, yet we manage through good training to get everybody home. The night PRO was burning we ended up in 3-4m swells drifting with no power. It was the hard work and training of the guys in the attack teams and section bases that got everybody through.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVeNJVbGkF8


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## NavyShooter (17 Mar 2018)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxMClWhWS2U

Here's a 'little' trip across the pond. 

Back in the old days.


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## Occam (17 Mar 2018)

Beer and smoking in the AMR.  How did we ever survive?


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## jollyjacktar (17 Mar 2018)

Occam said:
			
		

> Beer and smoking in the AMR.  How did we ever survive?



After AMR parties were always enjoyable.


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## Eye In The Sky (17 Mar 2018)

I've never sailed in a high sea state but I've spent some time skipping over them (rolling seas = rough air low level).  I've sat on EO watching Group 3s nose in hard and the screw come visible.  I always feel for the crew onboard, I know I get to climb out of the muck and RTB at some point and they've got to ride it out.

The one that sticks in my mind was a SAR re-tasking we picked up;  a Type 23 had taken a casualty onboard and a SAR helo was inbound from Stornoway.  We were IVO the Faroe gap after just getting a few barriers laid when the retasking came in.  We met up with the helo and flew a moving orbit until we got to the HMS;  it was about sea state 7, as the helo went in to lower the Doc off we did overwatch from an orbit watching everything on IR and it was something else to see hoisting happening as the stern of the frigate was coming out of the water.

I've had a tremendous amount of respect for ship and helo crews since then after watching that op go down.


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