# CIC



## sparker (13 Oct 2006)

I have a question or two about the Cadet Instructor training etc.
Currently two people I know run my local army cadet unit and they
would like me to join the CIC and help out. I am former reg. force Navy
and I think I might be better off with the Naval Cadets. Unfortunately
the nearest Naval unit is 100km away from my town. Could I take CIC
training in the Naval enviroment and still help out the local army cadets
or would they prefer me to take the army CIC training.
I know it sounds silly but I would be like a fish out of water.  ;D


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## Yashiko (13 Oct 2006)

For the CIC, you are the element of the unit you are attached to. So if you are with an Army Cadet unit, you will be land element CIC and so forth. CIC is really the only branch where you can (more easily) change elements if for example you were with a Sea Cadet corps and then you move to a town or city where there are only Air or Army Cadets offered. You would switch to the element of your new unit. 

As well, all CIC officers go through MOC after BOQ, which gives you a groundwork in the element you are in.


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## Neill McKay (14 Oct 2006)

sparker said:
			
		

> Could I take CIC training in the Naval enviroment and still help out the local army cadets
> or would they prefer me to take the army CIC training. I know it sounds silly but I would be like a fish out of water.  ;D



Almost all CIC career courses are tri-service; only the MOC qualification (the second course in the series) is element-specific.

I don't know how easy it would be for you to enrol as a CIC (Sea) officer if there's no sea cadet unit on whose strength you could enrol.  If you were to walk into an army cadet unit and ask to start the enrolment process you'd likely wind up dressed in green.  However, it's certainly not unheard of to see an officer from another element serving in a cadet unit.  My sea cadet unit, for example, has had at least two air force officers at different times.


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## Sloaner (16 Oct 2006)

Neil is correct in that you would be enrolled in the element of the unit you are working with, however the previous post from Yashiko indicates that you have to wear the uniform of the element with which you work which is incorrect.  If you are an enrolled Naval CIC officer and choose to work full time at the Army cadet corps, you would never be required to change elements.  The problem would be getting enrolled as a Naval CIC officer, but there may be ways around that.  I recall early in my time in the CIC an officer at a squadron in Toronto enrolled as army from an air unit.  I'll have to touch base and see how he did it which may take a couple days, but I'll check.


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## sparker (16 Oct 2006)

Thanks for the replies,
The main reason I've asked this question is because I was in the Navy some years
and I think my experience in the Naval enviroment would be put to better use
as a Naval instructor. Having said that, I realize there is only a Army Cadet unit
in my small town. I look around my town and I see a plethora of ex-military,
many ex-navy, I think if enough of us got together we could perhaps start a 
Naval unit if that would be possible.
  My friends who run the Army cadet unit have a constant uphill battle to recruit
members. I was thnking if there was also a Naval component that might boost
members and help to keep this unit afloat. Unfortunately, I don't know if it is possible
to have two enviroments working together.


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## Sloaner (16 Oct 2006)

The issue with combining two elements in a single unit would be the fact that they are governed by different leagues.  The military side of the house could likely be accomodated easier, but dealing with the seperate leagues would be a particular concern.  You may be able to work with the local army unit and introduce a custom supplemental training program to build on the expertise of some of the former CF members, however there will still need to be qualified CIC officers to oversee certain elements (not all CF qualifications translate down to the cadet program).  Thgis may be a good place to start, and once the word is out about the additional training available the numbers may grow.  There are a lot of options, but you'll have to work closely with the army unit CO either way (starting a sea unit or adding supplemental training).


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## 3rd Herd (16 Oct 2006)

Staying in my narrow lane as a CI. I started over twenty years ago with Army Cadets as the BN safety and support personal. From the army I then switched to navy and worked with them for about seven eight years. Last year it was with the Air cadets and this year the circle has come round and I am back with the Army again. Each unit as mentioned above does have different leagues in charge with slightly different procedures but in the local area there is alot of overlap ie. drill, leadership, public speaking, field exercises. Now I agree with Sloaner in that training beyond the norm or experiences beyond the norm add excitement and may in fact increase numbers. Take a look a the training syllabus and see what you can add. Off the top of my head my knot/rope work would be a good place to start.


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## Wolfmann (17 Oct 2006)

Central Region will pay up for 80km one way for travel expenses...and may/may not adjust that policy, if the Sea Cadet closest to you is 100km AND has a need. The only decision then would be you driving 100km.

Don't be afraid of going Army. Much of your knowledge may translate as well...just the context will change. 

OR alternative...start a Sea Cadet corps up.


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## rwgill (18 Oct 2006)

Given that you have so much naval support around you, Wolfie does have a good idea.  Why not start a Sea Cadet Corps?


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## sparker (18 Oct 2006)

Thanks for the replies, It would be great if a Naval cadet unit could be
initiated here. Anybody know how difficult it would be to start one? Or
how much of a bureaucratic nightmare it might be?
  I did phone the National Cadet office in Ottawa a few days ago to get some information
but the person couldn't understand what I was proposing(could have been the
language gap). I've been trying to contact Pacific region command but no one
seems to answer the phone. I know a Brigadier General here in BC. He used to
have something to do with the cadets a few years ago, I will contact him and see
if I can get some advice.
 Thanks for the help.


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## goodform (18 Oct 2006)

Brigadier General Sharpe? Used to be director of reserves and army cadets.

If you want to start a sea cadet corps, more power to you. The only problem I see is the fact that there is another corps right there in a small town. I grew up in rural SK and was a cadet in a rural corps. Numbers on parade are hard to come by sometimes so the army side already in town may not like the idea of another corps draining 'their' numbers. A cadet corps has to parade so many to be feasible.

To start a corps you need to have numbers for your parade state, qualified members (CIC qualifications, or a member who is willing to be loaded onto the next available course) to run it, a sponsor and then you can deal with your respective office to in Victoria to get things made official. Though I guess I made it sound like raising a regiment and then presenting it to the queen in the days of old. The Sea cadet office and league will of course have to know you want to raise a corps and provide counsel.

Lastly, to throw my $0.02 in. When you apply to become a CIC officer, I was under the impression you could stick a "91A" into the box asking what element you prefer. I'd filled out that paperwork twice in my CIC career (another two for transfer purposes) and remember having to make it known I was interested in "92A". Summer camps are also a prime example for showing how different elements work under one of the three branches. Heck, you could even be an expert in naval matters in army cadet training, look into the adventure programs!

Good Luck.


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## sparker (18 Oct 2006)

Brigadier General Dean.
I think most of you are right. At this point and time I don't want to bite
off more than I can chew. After being out of the Reg f. for 15yrs. I think
it will take a little time to get back into the swing of things. First off I'll
have to join the CIC, get the training and once that is done after I get
my sea legs ;D then think about a Sea Cadet unit. After all I did wear green
in Cornwallis and in the Navy until we got those snappy new uniforms ;D.
Now to get the ball rolling and talk to my buddies at the army cadets.
Thanks for the help.


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## Wolfmann (18 Oct 2006)

Detachment/Region has the final say on the element of a CIC Officer. What the process and criteria is, I dunno...but I assume that when the candidate moves to the CFRC merit list they will match his element appropriately when they go to put him with his corps. It does or could create a little catch-22.

As for starting a new Corps...it can be difficult to get it going. Sponsor, which is the Navy League of Canada, is taken care of. They have their own internal processes for starting Branches. Local Legions and such also do lend a hand financially. The host Town also has some say in the process. 

As for stepping on the toes of an Army or other corps...well...take that with a grain of salt. There is feasibility analysis done, and if the criteria that is used says the town, and it's surrounding area, can support two corps...then the other corps in town may have to swallow. Likewise, that does not mean that the sea cadet corps has to start up in THAT town...it can start up in another geographical area as well.

It's much easier getting a corps re-instated (after it's been shutdown), then starting a new one up.


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## PViddy (18 Oct 2006)

hey all,

We currently have a NCdt. on slate with my unit (Air) but the powers that be (Central Region) are forcing him to remuster.  As said, their are ways around this but it usually requires that you are a little up there in rank (Cap or el tee) ie.  joining the RCIS slate or holding platoon.  i would suggest that you go green for now, until you have the opportuinity to join a Sea unit.  when you do re muster to Navy, even though you may be a Capt. they will make you take the MOC(S) course to bring you up to speed with your new element (you have RegF experience, i don't know how that will equate).  Anyways, i am sure the CIC would appreciate your experience and knowledge any way we can get it.  Best of luck.

cheers,

PV


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## dano (3 Nov 2006)

Well I can tell you with experience from one of our staff coming over with 17yrs reg f who was a m/cpl, his rank on enrollment was denied and none of you're quals will carry over unless you join prior to the 5yr after release. Luckily for us, he was within the 5yrs.


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