# Processing duration for a Chinese-Canadian applicant



## GrandMaple (22 May 2010)

Hi all,

I'm a Chinese-Canadian and have been living in Canada for 5 years during which I attained a M.A.Sc degree from a top-ranked Canadian university. I submitted an application to the regF for some engineering-related trades 2 weeks ago but have heard nothing from the CFRC. Will a security clearance which might be as long as 18 months be conducted for my case considering that I'm from a non-NATO country? Is it normal not to receive the first call 2 weeks after handing in the application?

Regards,


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## cn (22 May 2010)

Best bet is to call the RC and follow up with them, they are the only ones that can give you a time frame (if any).


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## Alea (22 May 2010)

Hi,



> I submitted an application to the regF for some engineering-related trades 2 weeks ago but have heard nothing from the CFRC.



As cn said, the best thing to do is call back and follow up with a recruiter, even better, go to the recruiting center of your area and ask to speak with someone.



> Will a security clearance which might be as long as 18 months be conducted for my case considering that I'm from a non-NATO country?



Chances are... yes there will be a security clearance conducted. Then again, only a recruiter can confirm this to you.



> Is it normal not to receove the first call 2 weeks after turning in the application?
> 
> Regards,



It is very normal. Recruiters are extremely busy and some people have been waiting way longer than 2 weeks. Be proactive and contact the recruiting center. 

Good luck,
Alea


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## sky777 (25 May 2010)

I am from non-NATO country too   :-[ .
After 9 months I am still waiting for security clearance.


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## bdave (25 May 2010)

sky777 said:
			
		

> I am from non-NATO country too   :-[ .
> After 9 months I am still waiting for security clearance.



Still??
Have you called them?


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## sky777 (26 May 2010)

bdave said:
			
		

> Still??
> Have you called them?


Sure.I call them every month  .Usual answer : Your file is still in Ottawa for security check.
I can understand this situation:
- I was not born in Canada
- I didn't live in Canada last 10 years. ( I have lived in Canada only last 5 years).
It takes additional security check. But in our age of IT I think it  must take 1-2 months to check all databases (Canadian, Interpol,etc).
But any case I have to wait.For me it is good time - I can prepare for CFAT ( language is issue for me , not mathematics - I have BAC  degree).Also I can do preparation for fitness test- every day I do jogging, push ups, etc). I am optimist.  :nod:


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## 2010newbie (26 May 2010)

A friend of mine from Mexico applied for Canadian residency and the process took almost three years. The big hold-up was her background check and getting responses from the countries she had lived in during the past decade. The country that had the longest response time for her was Malaysia. You would think in this day and age it would be a simple IT database search, but it isn't the case. For my CF application I had to provide an FBI background check that I had to procure myself in the US. That involved getting fingerprinted at a US police station, mailing it to the FBI,  and waiting 10 weeks for a response.


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## Steel Badger (26 May 2010)

We caution applicants that if they have foriegn implications impinging on their application ( Immediate family residing outside Canada etc) the security clearance proces may take up to 18 months. It can, however, take much longer if the applicant has provided incomplete or inaccurate information. It also depends a great deal on who willing agencies in the foriegn location are to work on the applicant's behalf and provide the CF the information required in a timely fashion. Timeliness means different things to different people.

Your local CFRC can advise you on the status of your file, but remember that we ( the CFRC) have no control over the process once the initial request has been sent off. If the agencies that deal with Pre-secs require more info or clarification, they email us and we contact the applicant and request that he/she or it provide the required data.


SB


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## sky777 (26 May 2010)

Steel Badger said:
			
		

> We caution applicants that if they have foreign implications impinging on their application ( Immediate family residing outside Canada etc) the security clearance process may take up to 18 months. It can, however, take much longer if the applicant has provided incomplete or inaccurate information. It also depends a great deal on who willing agencies in the foreign location are to work on the applicant's behalf and provide the CF the information required in a timely fashion. Timeliness means different things to different people.
> 
> Your local CFRC can advise you on the status of your file, but remember that we ( the CFRC) have no control over the process once the initial request has been sent off. If the agencies that deal with Pre-secs require more info or clarification, they email us and we contact the applicant and request that he/she or it provide the required data.
> 
> ...


Good explanation.
Every case is different.So therefore it can be different time of waiting period.
In my case my parents are dead ,  I am only child.My wife and kids are with me in Canada.But my wife's parents live in our country of origin.
I am just surprised why the agencies that deal with Pre-secs ,do this assignment up to 18 months in age of computers.
They need to check person in:
-Canada (much easy way)
-Interpol (harder, but it can do it).
- country of  origin . ( is much harder.)


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## kartik (29 May 2010)

I am an Indo Canadian, so non NATO country basically. I have had my application in process since last 18 months and I am been called by CSIS for a meeting in Edmonton. I am actively lobbying against the process of security clearance. We in Canada take pride in our system but basically the principle behind these systems are great, they are not implemented in a good way. All systems work independently and have no exchange of information. I guess we should take pride that our systems are not implemented to be efficient. I agree with security clearances but I do not agree with that when I have lived in this country for more than 5 years. Also Canadian Law states "Every individual is responsible for hisher own actions" Then why in first place the Forces do a background check my family. This is absolutely against the principle of individual justice. Secondly the immigration law allows anyone meeting requirements to enter Canada. There are minimal or almost no background check to be a permanent resident of Canada. The process of security clearance indicates that a person can be a threat to civil society but he should not be a threat to Canadian forces. I guess we should not forget Col. Rusell Williams and spying case of navy. Whatever agruments I have got from the Forces does not appeal a logically thinking mind. But eventually we are so common that we have to take these kind of common nonsense. What I am trying to prove is implement a process fair so more immigrant Canadaians can avail jobs in the Forces. At the moment I feel like the Germans and the Japanese after 1945. The process should be not how criminal the person is but whether the person has criminal tendencies or whether person will react to situations criminally. It should be more psychological than physical to avoid even a single odd case of bad reputation.


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## Neolithium (30 May 2010)

kartik said:
			
		

> I am an Indo Canadian, so non NATO country basically. I have had my application in process since last 18 months and I am been called by CSIS for a meeting in Edmonton. I am actively lobbying against the process of security clearance. We in Canada take pride in our system but basically the principle behind these systems are great, they are not implemented in a good way. All systems work independently and have no exchange of information. I guess we should take pride that our systems are not implemented to be efficient. I agree with security clearances but I do not agree with that when I have lived in this country for more than 5 years. Also Canadian Law states "Every individual is responsible for hisher own actions" Then why in first place the Forces do a background check my family. This is absolutely against the principle of individual justice. Secondly the immigration law allows anyone meeting requirements to enter Canada. There are minimal or almost no background check to be a permanent resident of Canada. The process of security clearance indicates that a person can be a threat to civil society but he should not be a threat to Canadian forces. I guess we should not forget Col. Rusell Williams and spying case of navy. Whatever agruments I have got from the Forces does not appeal a logically thinking mind. But eventually we are so common that we have to take these kind of common nonsense. What I am trying to prove is implement a process fair so more immigrant Canadaians can avail jobs in the Forces. At the moment I feel like the Germans and the Japanese after 1945. The process should be not how criminal the person is but whether the person has criminal tendencies or whether person will react to situations criminally. It should be more psychological than physical to avoid even a single odd case of bad reputation.



Sorry I just have to disagree with you on that - if someone has nothing to hide there should be no reason to fear the background checks or interviews done by CSIS.


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## TCBF (30 May 2010)

kartik said:
			
		

> ... At the moment I feel like the Germans and the Japanese after 1945. ...



- You need a good lesson in history before you write something stupid like that again.  You skip history class in high school?  Not bother learning about your new country?

- I was born here, my parents were born here, their parents were born here and I am STILL, after thirty three years regular force service, doing another clearance.  

- Grow up.


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## Eye In The Sky (30 May 2010)

kartik said:
			
		

> I am an Indo Canadian, so non NATO country basically. I have had my application in process since last 18 months and I am been called by CSIS for a meeting in Edmonton. I am actively lobbying against the process of security clearance. We in Canada take pride in our system but basically the principle behind these systems are great, they are not implemented in a good way. All systems work independently and have no exchange of information. I guess we should take pride that our systems are not implemented to be efficient. I agree with security clearances but I do not agree with that when I have lived in this country for more than 5 years. Also Canadian Law states "Every individual is responsible for hisher own actions" Then why in first place the Forces do a background check my family. This is absolutely against the principle of individual justice. Secondly the immigration law allows anyone meeting requirements to enter Canada. There are minimal or almost no background check to be a permanent resident of Canada. The process of security clearance indicates that a person can be a threat to civil society but he should not be a threat to Canadian forces. I guess we should not forget Col. Rusell Williams and spying case of navy. Whatever agruments I have got from the Forces does not appeal a logically thinking mind. But eventually we are so common that we have to take these kind of common nonsense. What I am trying to prove is implement a process fair so more immigrant Canadaians can avail jobs in the Forces. At the moment I feel like the Germans and the Japanese after 1945. The process should be not how criminal the person is but whether the person has criminal tendencies or whether person will react to situations criminally. It should be more psychological than physical to avoid even a single odd case of bad reputation.



All you have to do to avoid this is retract your application to the Forces.

Which, based on what you wrote here, I hope you do.  I hate hearing about you people who think you are special because you have been here X years.  I was born here;  I've been waiting for my latest security clearance to process for 2+ years now.  And I am not bitchin' and moaning about my rights and blah blah blah whatever the crap you posted.  Its part of the system.  Don't like it?

Don't join!  Simple!  'Cause I bet if you DID get in, you'd be one of those fucksticks that "lobby about whatever else doesn't suit you".

 :


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## bdave (30 May 2010)

kartik said:
			
		

> I am an Indo Canadian, so non NATO country basically. I have had my application in process since last 18 months and I am been called by CSIS for a meeting in Edmonton. I am actively lobbying against the process of security clearance. We in Canada take pride in our system but basically the principle behind these systems are great, they are not implemented in a good way. All systems work independently and have no exchange of information. I guess we should take pride that our systems are not implemented to be efficient. I agree with security clearances but I do not agree with that when I have lived in this country for more than 5 years. Also Canadian Law states "Every individual is responsible for hisher own actions" Then why in first place the Forces do a background check my family. This is absolutely against the principle of individual justice. Secondly the immigration law allows anyone meeting requirements to enter Canada.



1- I don't see how this is against individual justice. I'm not even sure what individual justice is.

2- It is a matter of national security. Just because you worked in a country for 5 years does not mean you have no ill intentions.
You might be linked to someone who has a very shaddy background. Some people wish ill on the North American population. They [bad guys] are willing to lie low for a decade just to get a chance to hurt people. Not only that; hundreds of thousands of dollars will be spent on you for training purposes and other, depending on what path you take. It isn't something that should be taken lightly.

3- Anyone meeting requirements. Requirements might include an extensive background check.





			
				kartik said:
			
		

> There are minimal or almost no background check to be a permanent resident of Canada.





> http://www.canadaimmigrationlaw.net/Immigration/FAQ/canada_immigration_frequently_asked_questions.htm said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





			
				kartik said:
			
		

> The process of security clearance indicates that a person can be a threat to civil society but he should not be a threat to Canadian forces. I guess we should not forget Col. Rusell Williams and spying case of navy. Whatever agruments I have got from the Forces does not appeal a logically thinking mind. But eventually we are so common that we have to take these kind of common nonsense. What I am trying to prove is implement a process fair so more immigrant Canadaians can avail jobs in the Forces. At the moment I feel like the Germans and the Japanese after 1945. The process should be not how criminal the person is but whether the person has criminal tendencies or whether person will react to situations criminally. It should be more psychological than physical to avoid even a single odd case of bad reputation.



Except seeing "how criminal the person is" is usually a good indication of criminal tendencies.
If my background check says I have killed people, or stolen; it would indicate that I am criminally inclined. Wouldn't you agree?
As a Canadian Forces member, you will be put in situations of high responsibility which will have severe moral implication. In some situations, you will be responsible for the well being of fellow soldiers; this can also include their lives.
Making sure you are mentally and physically capable to handle such situations is important. That being said, joining any military force is not a right, it's a privilege. Sort of like driving.
They make up the rules.
If you don't like it, don't join.

I was born in Montreal, Quebec but spent most of my life in Europe. I came back to Canada almost every summer, for the entire summer. I even lived there  for a few years - when I was younger.
I still had to wait a year to be finally sworn in. 
If you want in badly enough, you'll go through the same process as everyone else.


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## Mr. St-Cyr (30 May 2010)

I jockey the recruiting desk at my unit so I can entertain this one.  Candidates born outside of Canada who are not from NATO countries have an extra form to fill out for the security check.  Right now if there are NO problems (medical and security checks are the most frequent and may hold up files for extended periods of time) a file is completed within two to three months.

It is the candidate's responsibility to keep informed as to where his file is at.  That being said, don't blame the army if your file has been on hold for six months, keep in mind that you are not the only one with a file being processed.  You need to call your CFRC and keep pestering the clerk who is responsible for your file, call him every two weeks if you deem it necessary.


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## forgiven (30 May 2010)

> joining any military force is not a right, it's a privilege



Very true.


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## Alea (30 May 2010)

kartik said:
			
		

> I am an Indo Canadian, so non NATO country basically. I have had my application in process since last 18 months and I am been called by CSIS for a meeting in Edmonton. I am actively lobbying against the process of security clearance. We in Canada take pride in our system but basically the principle behind these systems are great, they are not implemented in a good way. All systems work independently and have no exchange of information. I guess we should take pride that our systems are not implemented to be efficient. I agree with security clearances but I do not agree with that when I have lived in this country for more than 5 years. Also Canadian Law states "Every individual is responsible for hisher own actions" Then why in first place the Forces do a background check my family. This is absolutely against the principle of individual justice. Secondly the immigration law allows anyone meeting requirements to enter Canada. There are minimal or almost no background check to be a permanent resident of Canada. The process of security clearance indicates that a person can be a threat to civil society but he should not be a threat to Canadian forces. I guess we should not forget Col. Rusell Williams and spying case of navy. Whatever agruments I have got from the Forces does not appeal a logically thinking mind. But eventually we are so common that we have to take these kind of common nonsense. What I am trying to prove is implement a process fair so more immigrant Canadaians can avail jobs in the Forces. At the moment I feel like the Germans and the Japanese after 1945. The process should be not how criminal the person is but whether the person has criminal tendencies or whether person will react to situations criminally. It should be more psychological than physical to avoid even a single odd case of bad reputation.



Kartik,

We should also keep in mind something that is extremely important: We, as immigrants, have been sworn in to become Canadian citizens. By doing so, we accepted to follow Canada's rules, laws and way of living. We should not come here to make our own rules, ask for special privileges or worst, impose our ways of living just because we are immigrants. Doesn't make sense. 
If I was to go live in India, I would have to bind by India's laws.

There is a "general thought" among the immigrants who come to live here: Canada owes us! Canada should treat us better! Why? Because we vote? Because we help increase the birthrate? Because we work? WHY? 
If we don't like the laws and rules here... then lets go back to our own countries.
The same way, if you don't feel comfortable with the Canadian Forces rules, then by all means, cancel your enrollment process so a Canadian citizen who's been waiting for a long time to join can take the spot. 

Simple as that.

Alea


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## 1feral1 (30 May 2010)

kartik said:
			
		

> I do not agree with that when I have lived in this country for more than 5 years. Also Canadian Law states "Every individual is responsible for hisher own actions" Then why in first place the Forces do a background check my family. This is absolutely against the principle of individual justice.



Hummmm, I find it hard to beleive what you've posted.

Don't like how things are done?

Think you're a special case immigrant?

You're no one special. If you are going to have a whine about secuirty vetting and claim 'poor me, I am hard done by', what else are you going to complain about should you EVER make it past the front door?

Care for a little cheese with your whine?

Suck it up like everyone else has WRT background checks (we've all been through it), in other words HTFU.

OWDU
(I was an immigrant too - and I waited)


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## MedTechStudent (30 May 2010)

Alea said:
			
		

> As cn said, the best thing to do is call back and follow up with a recruiter, even better, go to the recruiting center of your area and ask to speak with someone.



No, the best thing to do is be patient and let the system do what its designed to do.  You know what *does* slow down the system though?  Having dozens of applicants calling and coming into the CFRC asking about their files because they think they are a beautiful unique snowflake that the military should swiftly blow through the enrolment process.  Thus taking up the staff's time while they sift through hundreds of files and names online or hardcopy just so they can tell you what the told you last week.  "We're processing your file."   

And on top of that, 2 weeks is *nothing*.  Have you read some of the application horror stories in here GrandMaple?


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## Mr. St-Cyr (30 May 2010)

Mine took six months, but 4 years ago that was the norm.  The system has greatly improved since then.


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## Neolithium (30 May 2010)

Mr. St-Cyr said:
			
		

> Mine took six months, but 4 years ago that was the norm.  The system has greatly improved since then.


It's of course case by case, mine will be less than a year from application drop-off to walking in the green doors; that's with a criminal record from almost a decade ago and a few credit issues that had to be dealt with on the way.   Not bad timing at all from my perspective.


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## Steel Badger (31 May 2010)

MedKAWD said:
			
		

> You know what *does* slow down the system though?  Having dozens of applicants calling and coming into the CFRC asking about their files because they think they are a beautiful unique snowflake that the military should swiftly blow through the enrolment process.  Thus taking up the staff's time while they sift through hundreds of files and names online or hardcopy just so they can tell you what the told you last week.  "We're processing your file."



How true that is!
 I think I am gonna have to start referring to that class of applicants as BUS's.


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## cn (31 May 2010)

MedKAWD said:
			
		

> No, the best thing to do is be patient and let the system do what its designed to do.  You know what *does* slow down the system though?  Having dozens of applicants calling and coming into the CFRC asking about their files because they think they are a beautiful unique snowflake that the military should swiftly blow through the enrolment process.  Thus taking up the staff's time while they sift through hundreds of files and names online or hardcopy just so they can tell you what the told you last week.  "We're processing your file."
> 
> And on top of that, 2 weeks is *nothing*.  Have you read some of the application horror stories in here GrandMaple?



Agreed.  Going to the RC will slow down the system for other applicants.  But my reply and Alea's quotation was referring to the OP asking about a time frame.  No one on this forum can give a time frame as to how long any part of the process can take except the people actually dealing with the file, so the advice was that only people that *can* advise on time/file status/processing are the people at the RC.  

As MedKAWD said though, you're best to be patient and let the system work.


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## 57Chevy (31 May 2010)

kartik said:
			
		

> I am actively lobbying against the process of security clearance.



What is it that you really want to know?

This may be a bit off topic, however, Do questions regarding National Security and Security Clearance
                                                    related topics violate OPSEC ?


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## GrandMaple (31 May 2010)

MedKAWD said:
			
		

> No, the best thing to do is be patient and let the system do what its designed to do.  You know what *does* slow down the system though?  Having dozens of applicants calling and coming into the CFRC asking about their files because they think they are a beautiful unique snowflake that the military should swiftly blow through the enrolment process.  Thus taking up the staff's time while they sift through hundreds of files and names online or hardcopy just so they can tell you what the told you last week.  "We're processing your file."



First of all, I'm not thinking I'm something special, not to speak of a unique snowflake. I just want to know what progress has been made on my application, like most of the
other new comers. I went to the CFRC of my area last week and it didn't take them more than a few key strokes to get my information displayed on the screen. The recruiter told me 
told me that they were processing my file and that they had given my application priority. If they are conducting a security clearance, shouldn't they have required me fill out 
a TBS/SCT 330-60e form before doing that?




			
				MedKAWD said:
			
		

> And on top of that, 2 weeks is *nothing*.  Have you read some of the application horror stories in here GrandMaple?



I did read some stories the authors of which got informed to take CFAT, Medical test, etc. even on the day they dropped off their applications. I'll leave the system alone to
help it gain speed. No worry.

Regards,


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## 57Chevy (31 May 2010)

GrandMaple said:
			
		

> I'll leave the system alone to
> help it gain speed. No worry.


 
You walk on eggs.
You and others of previous forein nationality should understand that timings regarding security
clearences are integral to "preparation and planning" of terrorists factions. Has it not already been
seen?
Would you like to know how long it took me to get my security clearence to secret? Well, I will
tell you. That information is classified and strictly between the CSIS and me, myself, and I.
And don't go thinking that you can hide my question regarding OPSEC. That won't happen.
I have nothing against you, nor any other person who would like to become a member of the Forces.
Wherever you go to find your answer as to how long it will take regarding your security clearance,
You will always hear the same reply. "We are processing your file". Why do you think that is?


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## readytogo (31 May 2010)

Some folks have nothing better to do i guess : I contacted my recruiter after a week and a half and she booked all my testing on the spot, I am going reserve and want nothing more in the world than to wear the uniform of my country and do something to make my children proud of me and to be proud of myself for having the courage to do what many others will not....but you know what????i gotta wait my turn just like everyone else so stop whining and get in line bud!!!  :nod:


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## Kat Stevens (31 May 2010)

Spinning, whirling, still descending,
Like a spiral sea unending.....


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## GrandMaple (31 May 2010)

57Chevy said:
			
		

> You walk on eggs.
> You and others of previous forein nationality should understand that timings regarding security
> clearences are integral to "preparation and planning" of terrorists factions. Has it not already been
> seen?
> ...



I asked in my very first post whether I needed a security clearance, not about the schedule/milestones of it. 10 days ago, I knew very little about the application process.
Why do you always try to make an otherwise relaxed forum topic so intense/"heavy"? Why do you always try to draw a line between native citizens and foreign-born citizens 
who are doing their best to get admitted by the main stream, by Canada - the new homeland? It is you who are in fact doing harm to this country!

This is my last post. Have fun!


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## Alea (31 May 2010)

Hi GrandMaple,



			
				GrandMaple said:
			
		

> First of all, I'm not thinking I'm something special, not to speak of a unique snowflake.



Don't worry about this 



> I just want to know what progress has been made on my application, like most of the other new comers.
> I went to the CFRC of my area last week and it didn't take them more than a few key strokes to get my information displayed on the screen. The recruiter told me told me that they were processing my file and that they had given my application priority.



Wanting to know the progress made on your file is legitimate and by going to see a recruiter, you did exactly what you had to do. The recruiters are human beings and they are very busy but it is also part of their responsibilities to answer you about your file. Not the forum's responsibility.



> If they are conducting a security clearance, shouldn't they have required me fill out a TBS/SCT 330-60e form before doing that?



This is another question that you should ask your recruiter.

I wish you good luck with your process.
Alea


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## A-ryathker (16 Jun 2010)

I do not agree with that when I have lived in this country for more than 5 years. Also Canadian Law states "Every individual is responsible for hisher own actions" Then why in first place the Forces do a background check my family. This is absolutely against the principle of individual justice. 

well...... I'm thinking its mabey more along the lines of making sure there not putting you in a situation where you will have to face potential moral conflicts with your self. If someones trying to join our army it makes sense they do a background to see if anyone in your family has any ties to a foreign military (just an example) or anything that conflicts with your loyalty to Queen and country. (not saying this could be your case) Once you sign you got to be willing to go when ever where ever, even if it means the old country. Which I'm guessing could be very hard on a guy who's got family or ties back in the old country. There is a lot bigger deeper issues at hand than we currently as civys can understand its about the greater good not just you and I getting a smooth ride in. Its a big responsibility to for the powers that be to hand a guy a uniform that represents our entire nation and weapon with live ammo. They have to cover all the bases security wise. I'm sure a lot of thought has gone into this rule by guys who are way more in the know than anyone on this forum so lets just trust their judgment and leadership that the rules are there for a good reason. By the way due to my parents work i spent time overseas and haven't been back home for 5 yrs as well. But my clearance came in only a few months. Everyones case is different but just letting you know it can possibly come sooner than you think.


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