# Brits Told to Keep Beards in AFG to Blend In More



## The Bread Guy (8 Jul 2006)

Shared in accordance with the "fair dealing" provisions, Section 29, of the Copyright Act - http://www.cb-cda.gc.ca/info/act-e.html#rid-33409

*British troops in Afghanistan told not to shave 'to fit in with locals'*
CHRISTOPHER LEAKE, The Mail on Sunday (UK), 8 Jul 2006
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=394749&in_page_id=1770

The British Army has abandoned more than a century of military tradition by allowing its 
soldiers in Afghanistan to grow beards. 

Troops from 16 Air Assault Brigade embedded in the volatile Helmand Province are being 
encouraged to flout rules which insist they must wear their hair above the collar and be 
clean-shaven. 

Army commanders in Afghanistan say that because their men are working so closely with 
bearded Muslim men from the Afghan National Army, it makes sense for them to let theirs 
grow. 

'Respectful' 

But once they return to barracks in safer parts from tours of duty on the front line, 
squaddies are told to shave off their facial hair. 

Normally the only soldier in an infantry battalion allowed to sport a full beard is the 
Pioneer Sergeant, who is a battlefield engineer - although the others can have a 
moustache. 

The other practical reason for the ban is that they prevent gas masks from securing 
a tight fit. Gas masks are not used in Afghanistan because there is no threat from 
chemical weapons. 

Since the Thirties the Queen's Regulations for the Army have stated that: "If a moustache 
is worn, it is to be trimmed and not below the line of the lower lip. Beards and whiskers 
are only to be worn with authority, which will usually be granted only on medical or 
religious grounds, or where tradition permits." 

A Ministry of Defence spokesman said: "Our men in the field are growing their beards 
because the Afghan soldiers think it is respectful. For men working very closely alongside
the Afghans for long periods wearing beards has proved to be an excellent way of helping
to win trust and breed understanding." 

But an eminent military analyst Tim Ripley was cynical about the MoD's reasons for 
allowing the beards. 

He said: "I think it might be more to do with the fact that there is a shortage of water 
for the troops in the more remote regions of Afghanistan and that they don't want to 
waste it on shaving."


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## The_Falcon (8 Jul 2006)

I wonder if any other conventional units (i.e. us canadians) will follow suit.


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## Scoobie Newbie (8 Jul 2006)

On operations are the troops actually shaving or using there water for more useful purposes?  ie Mountain Thrust.


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## Scoobie Newbie (8 Jul 2006)

and by troops I mean Canadians.


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## exsemjingo (9 Jul 2006)

Hate to see them when the Taliban throw a gas grenade their way.  The 'no beards' policy of many armies is not so much a tradition as it is pragmatic.
I for one am very proud of my goatee, but when I get the call, off it comes (and I start my _bad _ military moustache).


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## Big Red (9 Jul 2006)

I don't think they'd be carrying thier gas masks anyways so it's irrelevant whether they can get a seal.


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## George Wallace (9 Jul 2006)

exsemjingo said:
			
		

> Hate to see them when the Taliban throw a gas grenade their way.  The 'no beards' policy of many armies is not so much a tradition as it is pragmatic.
> I for one am very proud of my goatee, but when I get the call, off it comes (and I start my _bad _ military moustache).



 ???   The Taliban have gas grenades now?

As the Taliban often have beards, and if they are throwing gas, then they should also be wearing Gas Masks.  Following my logic so far.  That would mean that their gas masks would serve little or no purpose either......therefore they would not be very smart to be using Chemical or Biological agents, would they?


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## Mike Baker (9 Jul 2006)

I don't think that the Taliban are even capable to get gas grenade's, or a very good gas mask to say the least.


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## jc5778 (9 Jul 2006)

I know in '02 we didn't shave once we left the base at all (Afghanistan).  In fact out at an OP we were "encouraged" to grow any facial hair we could because of the respect factor of the locals (translated means if you don't have facial hair you are the "bitch", Men are for pleasure and women are for breeding.  This is not my crazy idea by the way, that is there culture)  Spent some weird nights on watch listening to the drugged induced laughter and squeeling from within their building.  Still gives me shivers.

Hey GO, you remember what happens when you can't grow the facial hair?? 

lol, sry man  ;D


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## silentbutdeadly (9 Jul 2006)

At the beginning of the tour we weren't shaving , but then when a high ranking officer went out on his own patrol for OP PeaceMaker , he went to link up with another platoons guide and almost shot him because he had a beard and said he looked like a tailban. Kinda funny since he was wear arid cadpat and such , but after that we had to shave every few days when we are outside the wire.


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## paracowboy (9 Jul 2006)

exsemjingo said:
			
		

> Hate to see them when the Taliban throw a gas grenade their way.  The 'no beards' policy of many armies is not so much a tradition as it is pragmatic.


sshhh!


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## Michael Dorosh (9 Jul 2006)

milnewstbay said:
			
		

> But once they return to barracks in safer parts from tours of duty on the front line, squaddies are told to shave off their facial hair.



If anything, you'd think it would be the other way around - I thought some British troops reportedly used to grow their hair longer than regulation so that IRA terrorists couldn't single them out when they were in civvies. As mentioned above, you'd want to stand out from the enemy in action.


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## big bad john (9 Jul 2006)

Michael Dorosh said:
			
		

> If anything, you'd think it would be the other way around - I thought some British troops reportedly used to grow their hair longer than regulation so that IRA terrorists couldn't single them out when they were in civvies. As mentioned above, you'd want to stand out from the enemy in action.



That would be the SBS, SAS, and 14 Intelligence Company mostly.  Regular service units didn't have leave to grow their hair no matter what the novelists and Hollywood say.


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## Michael Dorosh (9 Jul 2006)

big bad john said:
			
		

> That would be the SBS, SAS, and 14 Intelligence Company mostly.  Regular service units didn't have leave to grow their hair no matter what the novelists and Hollywood say.



It was quite a matter of speculation when I was loaned to the Scottish Division for a month; at about the time as our Commonwealth contingent was on duty there, two squaddies had been killed by the IRA while in civvies - the rumour was they were obvious because of their short hair. Having seen the way the men of the battle groups dressed at Chinook Centre when on leave from BATUS in the summer, I have to believe it wasn't the hair that gave them away...but at the time we thought it prescient...


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## big bad john (9 Jul 2006)

The hair isn't a 'buzz cut' like the Guards, Para's or the USMC, but their is a standard and it is kept up.  It is stretched in the field (BATUS) and on leave.  But in N.I. you could always spot a squaddie.


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## Fishbone Jones (9 Jul 2006)

Michael Dorosh said:
			
		

> It was quite a matter of speculation when I was loaned to the Scottish Division for a month; at about the time as our Commonwealth contingent was on duty there,



Having just returned from Scotland, I've taken a bit of an interest in this stuff. Who were you attached to and what was your job?


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## Michael Dorosh (9 Jul 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Having just returned from Scotland, I've taken a bit of an interest in this stuff. Who were you attached to and what was your job?



It was in 1990, and I believe the last time the Scottish Division beat retreat with all the regiments represented on parade. Members of all the Canadian, Australian, NZ and Gurkha regiments with official alliances with the Scottish Division regiments were represented on parade also, as well as a trio of Malaysians. Even a Royal Tank Regiment piper who seemed amused when I asked him if all the battalions of the RTR had tanks. "Do you mean you have armoured regiments without tanks?" He asked.  "Yes, most of them."

It was mostly musicians from Highland and Scottish units there - though was representation from the Royal Newfoundland Regiment in their tan DEU playing with the Massed Military Bands.  We practiced for 10 days at the Infantry Training Depot in Glencorse, then stayed at the Guards Depot at Pirbright for a couple more weeks of rehearsals, and then 3 performances on Horse Guards in London, with the majority of the Royal Family in attendance at the final show.

While at the infantry depot, we ran into a Canadian serving with a territorial battalion as an infantryman.  Infantry exchanges were in vogue in the 80s apparently - we had at least two NCOs serve tours in Northern Ireland with our affiliate regiment, The Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders (P.L.).  And when we visited the regimental depot there, they had their recruiter give us a serious pep talk about how easy it was for Canadians to enlist in the British Army. No takers from amongst the band.

Was eye opening - the musicians of the Scottish Division were all soldiers first - the Argylls Pipes and Drums were actually a Machine Gun Platoon. The professionalism of all ranks impressed us tremendously, as did the poor quality (in comparison) uniforms they had to wear and what to us was crappy food and living conditions while in barracks. Not to mention their propensity to sell off all their kit between paydays. The discipline seemed quite stern in the Argylls' band, but it may have only seemed harsher than what it really was because of the Pipe Major's love of four letter words (the only words we could understand when he was yelling at people).

And to top it all off, we had a genuine double-barrelled named officer in charge of us, a delightfully pompous TA officer from the London Scottish who was a bit of a dandy to boot.

I doubt very much this was anything you wanted to hear, but since you asked...

As for Scotland itself, it was dirty but the people friendly, London was even dirtier, they charged you extra for ketchup, you could rarely find Heinz, they all looked at you as if you were retarded if you asked for Root Beer, and as impressed as I was with London Bridge, touring the HMS Belfast for free when we told them we were with the CF, drinking in the Yeoman's Warder's mess for the same reason, etc., it was great to come home.

Were you there for business or pleasure?


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## Fishbone Jones (10 Jul 2006)

Both, business and pleasure.


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## Michael Dorosh (10 Jul 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Both, business and pleasure.



Military business, I mean? What were your impressions?


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## Fishbone Jones (10 Jul 2006)

Michael Dorosh said:
			
		

> Military business, I mean? What were your impressions?



I was there for the opening of the new Royal Scots Dragoon Guards museum at Ediburgh Castle. Met Her Majesty (Colonel in Chief) and Prince Edward, Duke of Kent, (Deputy Colonel in Chief) was impressed with the history and architecture of the whole area, found the city clean and the people amazing and friendly. Also enjoyed the food and beer.


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## Michael Dorosh (10 Jul 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> I was there for the opening of the new Royal Scots Dragoon Guards museum at Ediburgh Castle. Met Her Majesty (Colonel in Chief) and Prince Edward, Duke of Kent, (Deputy Colonel in Chief) was impressed with the history and architecture of the whole area, found the city clean and the people amazing and friendly. Also enjoyed the food and beer.



We were at the castle only briefly, did tour the Scottish War Memorial and looked through the books of rememberance there. I liked the graveyard for pets of the castle residents, as well. Didn't really get to see much of Edinburgh other than that. If you got pictures of the event, would be neat to see them in the gallery...unless they are up already?


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## Fishbone Jones (10 Jul 2006)

Just got back. You'll have to give me a chance.


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## GO!!! (10 Jul 2006)

7 - 10 days said:
			
		

> I know in '02 we didn't shave once we left the base at all (Afghanistan).  In fact out at an OP we were "encouraged" to grow any facial hair we could because of the respect factor of the locals (translated means if you don't have facial hair you are the "*****", Men are for pleasure and women are for breeding.  This is not my crazy idea by the way, that is there culture)  Spent some weird nights on watch listening to the drugged induced laughter and squeeling from within their building.  Still gives me shivers.
> 
> Hey GO, you remember what happens when you can't grow the facial hair??
> 
> lol, sry man  ;D



Very funny Mofo!

I'm still trying to grow a beard, but yes, I remember S tower - and being told "Let them do their thing, we're not here to give them a SHARP lesson"

From pics I've seen, it looks like our guys in the forward bases are permitted to ditch the shaving rules - about time too. Shaving in an environment as dirty as there, and sweating your *** off in the summer heat is just asking for infections to occur. Perhaps sanity is prevailing?


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