# Verification of Former Service (VFS) [Merged]



## maple_leaf_forever

Question:

After your initial 3 year enlistment in the CF do you have to enlist for another 3 years after that ? or can you just go by the year after that ? 

Thanks in advance.


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## Ron

I am planning to re-enlist in the military. After 20 years as a TelOp212 (now SigOp215) I just found out that my experience does not count for anything! I have been out of the military for 6 years and will obviously need training to upgrade my skills. Just being given" recruit school bypass‘ is an insult to my career and the years I served. In hindsight, I wish I had never been released. To start over as a recruit is going to be hard but that is what I have to do I guess.
                                     Ron


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## towhey

Following an initial 3 year Basic Engagement, most soldiers who re-enlist do so on a second 3-year Basic Engagement.

After that, they may be offered an "Intermediate Engagement", essentially to the 20 year service point.  (i.e. about 14 more years)

At some point during that 20 years they may be offered an opportunity to convert to an "Indefinite Period of Service" that will take them to compulsory retirement age.


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## para

What did you expect I mean 6 years is a big gap especially in the sigs world just thimk of the technology.
I have served with guys that have got out and had to go back to basic with only 3 yrs. out.
feel lucky that they let you back in at all.


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## kowalski

you should be given some amount of credit for your time in service.ive known some reservists and they were credited for their reserve service.besides after 6 years there must have been a few changes.anyway welcome back!


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## Soldier of Fortune

Does anybody know if when you get a transfer from reserve to reg what happens to your rank and stuff. I‘ve been told that your experience insn‘t really worth much if you decide you want to go reg from reserve...


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## the patriot

When you transfer from the Reserve Force to the Regular Force, your time in the reserves does count.  It depends on the offer you receive from CFRC and the regiment you‘ll be serving with.  It all comes down to what courses you‘ve had and how many year of OJT (on the job training) experience you‘ve had.  You may be transferred in kind without it effecting your rank, or you might be knocked down a rank.

-the patriot-


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## Shrapnel

Knocked down a rank?

I didn‘t know they did that....
I always thought that was considered a "bad" thing.

I get sworn in to the Reserves next week.

I was thinking of joining the Reserves for a bit to see what the army was like and if I like it, I might sign up for the Reg Forces.


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## enfield

For the Infantry....
Reg to Reserve: Everything counts, but what rank they make you depends on their needs - ie, they may not need another sergeant major or Colonel. But Reserve units are usualy anxious to take advantage of Reg Force experience.

Reserve to Reg: Your time in counts towads your pension. Other than that, it matters jack ****. If you get a Reg course - like Jump, and last summer‘s Recce course was Reg Force - it still counts, but Militia courses don‘t. 
If you go on a tour your not allowed to go to Battle School, you go strait to Regiment.
If you have massive amounts of time in and experience you might get to keep some rank. For example, my QL3 instructor, a sergeant with a tour in the Golan and lots of time in, transferred over and became a corporal.


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## Shrapnel

> Originally posted by Enfield:
> [qb]
> If you have massive amounts of time in and experience you might get to keep some rank. For example, my QL3 instructor, a sergeant with a tour in the Golan and lots of time in, transferred over and became a corporal.[/qb]



Thanks for the info.

I have two more questions though- when you transfer from reserves to reg forces, is it a smooth transition or do you have to quit one first then join the other? What about from reg forces to reserves?


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## Deleted member 585

Wow, have things changed here! I haven‘t posted since 1998.  In any case, I‘m applying to the Regs too, but only been out of the Reserves for 2.5 years.  Hope it works out for us.

Good luck Ron!


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## aurawolf

I could use some help. I just recieved my compenent transfer. I am an infantry reserve private with 4 RCR, and I am going sigs215, but they gave me a recruit school by-pass.  Theoretically a good thing, but I have only been in since the end of June this year and the only training I have is my 2/3‘s from the summer I did in Meaford.  But the training was a little hurried.  They left out alot of important things!!  I have never been gassed, I didn‘t do a battle fitness test, the longest I have ever ruck-marched is 7 kliks, I only even wore a gas mask once. For goodness sakes I have never even done a night nav! I am hiker so I can but I didn‘t do one in training! My infantry course didn‘t teach me the gutov or the c6, and I havent done a swim test. I have never even been in shacks before (we stayed in Mods).  I was just informed that I am shipping out on Jan 7th, and sometime between then and the 7th of mar. I am taking a driver wheel, then I start my sigs course.  Which means there is no time to request a basic.  Does anyone have an idea as to how I can make up the training  o


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## para

All I have to say is the recruiter is odviously pushing you through because there was probably a shortage or a lack af recriuts for this course.
My advice is just go with it and let your insructors know (pick a time to talk in confidence) of your short comings (don‘t andvertise it) and you may recieve more training. Just worry about the course you are on at the time and you will have time to learn from the people on course with you to help you. And you might have some infantry skills these sigs guys may lack :bullet: bullet :bullet: bullet :bullet:


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## RCA

Your main concern should be passing your trade’s course. Concentrate on that. Once posted, when you are required to do skills you are not familiar with, put up your hand and say (honestly you haven‘t done it/not familiar with it.) You will get the benefit of the doubt and someone should/will help you out. At this point it will not hurt you admitting that you don‘t know something, As a Pte you are not expected to know/remember everything and with the training system being what it is, not unexpected. When someone shows how it is done soak it in and learn.

 Don‘t worry. As I said before at this point in time, it is important to learn your trade, the rest will come from learning and experience.


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## rolandstrong

I have been waiting for 9 months for my VFS. I served with the Seaforth Highlanders in the mid 90‘s as an ncm, and am now seeking my commission. Thing is, I haven‘t even been contacted by CFRC to do my aptitude tests, fitness or medical yet. Courses start in 3.5 months, and i am still waiting to see if I will even be a competitive candidate. 

Nine months seems rediculous to me. Is this a typical delay...do they need a VFS before they can even find out if I fit their profile? How long does this VFS take?


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## Michael OLeary

Sadly, 9 months for a VFS is probably not that unusual. The VFS seems to be one of the things that will slow the processing of a file more than any other single item. I have been told it‘s primarily a problem of too many requests and too few hands in the applicable shop in NDHQ. And, from what I have seen, the CFRC won‘t conduct further processing until they have the VFS. The best thing you can do is contact the CFRC regularly, at least weekly and in person if possible (it‘s always easier to brush someone off by phone), so that they know who you are and that you are ready for the next stage as soon as the VFS arrives.


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## Fishbone Jones

Took over a year to process my VFS when I rejoined, I even handed them a complete certified true copy of my UER, encompassing my total Reg and Res career. Good luck!


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## SpinDoc

As I understand it, they‘re working on computerizing all the current CF personnel records and VFS time will be cut drastically eventually, esp. if you left the service recently.


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## rolandstrong

damn. that‘s crazy. 

And i thought 9 months was a long time...

Recceguy, when you say one year, do you mean you were parading after one year?


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## Fishbone Jones

Nope, that‘s how long the VFS took. Then I had to bug them and argue with them in order to go on summer training with the Regt. After all that, they said I had been out too long and I had to start as a corporal. It was their ****ing around that put me over the time limit in the first place. Don‘t expect any favours or miracles. It‘s easier to come from a former Soviet Bloc country, with landed immigrant status and join. You‘ll get in much faster and easier than if you had prior service in OUR military.


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## rolandstrong

Great.

I just don‘t understand  this system. And today the defense minister announced another 200 million cut from the forces. Apparently its the Leopards being targeted now. And yet they claim to be so underbudget that the can‘t get the system to work. Not enough clerks to process VFS proposals fast enough.

Isn‘t it a benefit to have personnel who have training and understanding of the system? Doesn‘t that save tax dollars and provide better depth on the reserve force? 

What a joke. God help us when this war starts.


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## Pyropete

:warstory:  I thinking of returning to the forces. I been out 2 years and I am wanting to got reg force this time. I was wondering about RSBP, how they deside if you don‘t do basic. Is better to go to basic? Can you deside to got to basic even when you are eligible for this entry plan? The recuriter wasn‘t very helpfull, I was told they would let me know if I eligible at enrollment. If anyone could give heads up please.


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## casing

Since no one seems to be giving you an answer, I‘ll give you my understanding (which should NOT be taken as gospel) and at the same time bump this thread up for you.  First of all, how long were you in the Reserves for?  That might have an impact on the decision.  Without fobbing off at the mouth about reasons and exceptions, you will more than likely have to do basic upon enrolling into the Regs.


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## Michael OLeary

The recruiter can‘t tell you that, he hasn‘t seen the Verification of Former Service, which must be done on re-enrollees. The assessment on what equivalencies will be granted i determined by CFRG, not at the CFRC. All you can do is apply and wait for the offer; you don‘t have to sign if you don‘t like the offer.


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## tigerchasers

I am currently a reservist on edt who has requested  release from the army. I haven't received my release letter yet and decided that I wanted to transfer from reserve to reg's any edvice on that
and anyone know how long it will take


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## Canadian.Trucker

A component transfer or re-enrollment takes a while because you basically need to do everything that a first time applicant does.  However, you also need to do a bit more.  Things such as VFS (verification of former service) and all that good stuff.  I would suggest trying to go component transfer though, because a re-enrollment is a pain in the ass you don't need.  If you get out then go to get back in they need to pull up all your previous docs from your unit/archives.  Short story, do a CT you'll like it a lot more.


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## Meridian

My last unit was CFLRS St Jean... Im wondering if anyone (particularly any recruiters around) would have a best-guess (I recognize no guarantees) on a VFS timeframe for there? Clearly my file isn't too large... 1 year in......

Im just curious if I can expect a year, or a few months....


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## kincanucks

VFSs and PSDRs can now be requested through the computer at most recruiting centres/detachments and it takes approximately 5 minutes.  What takes so long with previous service applicants is the request for med records but this now only takes 2-3 weeks at most now.  There will still be occasional slow ups especially with people released before 1997 and those with reserve service from units that haven't forwarded their release paperwork, in some cases five years after release.


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## Meridian

So if its been 2 years, I should expect 1-2 months?


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## kincanucks

How about some details!   Were you just being a *** or did you want an answer?

_So if its been 2 years, I should expect 1-2 months?_

What does this mean?   You applied two years ago and they still don't have it?

Does anything in my post apply to you?

Note: Your file does not stay at your last unit it is sent to central archives.   That is why you have to wait a minimum of six months before reapplying to the CF after release.   That is so the wieners don't treat the release system as an occupational transfer system.


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## Meridian

No. I was in the forces under ROTP for a year. I was released with recommendation to re-enroll (I believe it is a 4(C) ?  Could be wrong... I'd have to look at the paperwork).

Without getting into why I released (since this has been rehashed before, and Im confident based on disucssions with my previous staff that I would be a good candidate for re-enrollment) I'm looking at re-joining but this time the reserves. I released July 2003. 

Not trying to be a shit at all... just clarifying!


(Also, interesting to note, I was actually encouraged by many staff at CFLRS to use releases and reenrollment as a type of OT - althought they were referring to enrollment program and not MOC (ie ROTP RMC to ROTP Civ. They mentioned it was pretty much the only way to do it).

Cheers, and thanks in advance.


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## Joe Blow

Hello - 

I have done a search of the forum using the keywords "verification former service" and have found quite a few complaints about how long the process can take (I won't bother you with my particular sob story), however I was not able to find any information on what might be involved.

The CFRC told me that it will contain information about my prior service (Cadets and Air Reserve) but it will not be entirely complete.  It apparently will not contain course reports for example.  However I applied for and received (under the access to information act) everything that DND had with my name on it, and my course reports are present in those files.  I suppose my first question is why the discrepancy?  It's only an academic interest, but I am curious. 

Additionally, also present are some very old letters of recommendation from various COs and former colleagues in Cadets and the Air Reserve for an application to RMC that I subsequently did not submit.  My second question is if they might be contacting these people.  That might account for the length of time this process seems to be taking.

Lastly, the CFRC informs me that they had to resubmit their request the required information.  The young lady I spoke with thought that it - given the time it is taking - someone might have been concerned that the request was not received.  ...She wasn't sure however, so I wonder if someone can tell me if this is a common occurrence and if so why. (Again, really just sort of curious.  The CFRC can seem like such a black box!)

(By the way the young lady with whom I spoke is kind enough to submit some inquiries on my behalf to see if there is anything that can be done to speed things along.)

Thanks,
Montreal


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## Griswald DME

I can tell you from experience its a lot longer to get in with prior/current (ie switch from reserves to reg force) than it is to start from scratch with no prior experience.  CF paperwork is a nightmare and unfortunately it results in unecessary delays trying to verify and track things down.  This from experience.


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## Joe Blow

Griswald,

I appreciate the inside scoop.   When your paperwork was finally processed were you able to ascertain what the devil was involved that took so long?


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## Griswald DME

With so many people involved in the process, and with the chain-of-command hurdle (I'm referring to when your recruiter can't phone someone and ask whats up with your file because that someone is "too high up" in the chain of command) its near impossible for me to find ou where the holds ups were.  In some cases people may be able to find out, but in my case its sat on so many people's desks for so long who knows where the delays were.  I know my medical went thru more promptly than others have, and the MA held on to my file for an awfully long time (over six months), but other than that I don't know why the three year delay.


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## Joe Blow

Did you say 3 year delay?  That's remarkable!  ...I really don't know what to say.  I'm glad that you were finally processed.

This might be a topic for another thread, but perhaps it's time to contract out the recruiting process (or as much of it as can be).


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## kincanucks

Joe Blow said:
			
		

> Did you say 3 year delay?   That's remarkable!   ...I really don't know what to say.   I'm glad that you were finally processed.
> 
> This might be a topic for another thread, but perhaps it's time to contract out the recruiting process (or as much of it as can be).




The delays do not have anything to do with recruiting.  All requests for prior service information go to NDHQ, reserve units and Reserve HQs.  The process is made easier now that requests can be requested electronically and, if the person was released after 1997, it can be received instantaneously.  If an applicant has previous service documents then they should provide those at the time of application.  Recruiters do not sit on requests and will regularly check on the status of those requests with whomever they feel can answer their queries.


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## Joe Blow

Kincanucks - Thank-you for your reply. That's very encouraging!  I have managed to obtain documents related to my prior service through the Privacy Act and will definitely make sure they are added to my file at the CFRC.


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## wack-in-iraq

not sure if this question belongs here or in the other areas of the forum, but here goes.....
   in the quest to find some action i left the canadian army and got myself a job in Baghdad. i will eventually be heading back to canada and to the army once i am ready to settle down and live the easy life, but what i am curious about is how long do i have before my courses are no longer valid. i really dont feel like doing my QL3 031 over again, but i guess i may have no choice if i leave it too long. also, if i get back in before this deadline, what are the chances of requesting the Bn of my choice ?


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## kincanucks

Skilled

Applicant has completed Reg F recruit and MOC trg, and applying for the same MOC and has been released less than five years. File will be forwarded to the appropriate MA/School to determine skilled status. If not considered skilled, then RSBP.

RSBP

Applicant has completed Reg F recruit and MOC trg, has been released for less than ten years and applying for any MOC (see Note B), unless granted skilled status.

Note B

if elapsed time since date of release is greater than five years, CFRG HQ in consultation with MA will review on a case by case basis if applicant has maintained relevant skills or qualifications deemed to be of military value.


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## wack-in-iraq

so what you are saying is, i have 5 years since i left before i have to redo my QL3 ?


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## kincanucks

wack-in-iraq said:
			
		

> so what you are saying is, i have 5 years since i left before i have to redo my QL3 ?


If you were Reg F and the school says okay yes.  Don't forget since you worked outside Canada you will have to do a pre-enrolment security check when you apply and that takes a long time.


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## Fry

that post seems relatively old (2003), and I'm curious as if anyone knows if they added any significant amount of money to the CF in the budget? Sorry to stray off topic here.


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## Raquette

I was wondering if the army take back people who had VR (Volontary Release) ?
I hate this civilian life, everything is so boring... Damn.


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## Infanteer

Well, what is the dumb reason - I'm sure if you give us some info, we can help.


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## kincanucks

Top reasons why recruits VR from BMQ:

- My girlfriend or wife can't handle it without me;
- I miss my family;
- Nobody told me it would be this hard; and
- We have to use weapons?


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## canadianblue

I've wondered that myself if a person VR's and then regrets what they did would be allowed to have another crack at it.


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## mcnutt_p

A guy that was my BMQ in Aug 2003, VR'd in week,   ran in to him the other day at the CANEX. He was allowed back in but after almost 18 months he said. As he said "they keep losing my records".

Personally, if you quit once, why should they take you back, you are probably just as likely to decide again it is not for you. 

It all depends I guess what your reason for leaving in the first place was.


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## Island Ryhno

I VR'd from BMQ in 01 because my father got diagnosed with terminal cancer. I'm returning to the regs very shortly, I've had no issues.


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## Raquette

Island Rhybo, how long did your application took the second time ? Did they ask you in the interview why you quit and did they asked you why you want to get back in ?

Well, anyway, I'll go fill the application sheet this week.


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## Fruss

I was wondering the same thing...

I VRed in Feb 2005 because mainly of the pace. I expected it to be hard as I read thru this forum, but I didn't expect the pace to be that fast (the PT gear to shower to combat dress in 8 min killed me). Also, being away from my first girlfriend in a while and being sick didn't help.

Since I got back, from time to time, I find myself missing BMQ and the pace of it.  I thought of going back, but still, I'm not sure if I want to live like that..

I guess I'll just wait to be sure before doing anything.

Frank


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## Island Ryhno

Haven't had a hitch with my application thus far. Dropped my app 2 weeks ago, did my testing last week and everything is good. I have to hand in some med docs and am waiting on my VFS (ex reservist, reg) I don't know how they look upon it. Perhaps not that favourable. I feel that I'm a good candidate though, I always had good per reports in the reserves and even when I left the reg force course the CO for my platoon recommended me as a good candidate to come back. I don't know if that makes any difference, perhaps the reasons are looked upon differently. Cheers


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## kincanucks

One VR is usually okay with me.  It is when I have some peckerhead sitting across me who swears up and down that he is ready to make a commitment to the CF after getting in and releasing for 3 or 4 times that I want to reach out and............ :rage:


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## Vigilant

Compassionate reasons are usually looked upon with sympathy. Dropping out because your girlfriend missed you (who is now your ex-girlfriend) would probably not.


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## 2 Cdo

Speaking as a two-time loser ;D I got out of the army after my second BE and almost 4 years later decided to get back in. The reason for rejoining I gave was I needed to feed my wife and kids because as a male I couldn't get a decent job in Bob Rae's Ontario. :threat:

That wasn't the only reason but I did wait almost 6 months to get back in. Those who VR from their basic training and have a change of heart SHOULD  be forced to undergo a waiting period(how long I don't know). Those who have joined and VR'd several times should be told in no uncertain terms to beat it and quit wasting the militarys time! I do realize that in some cases their are extenuating circumstances but lets fact it, anything more than once shows a distinct lack of maturity and absolutely no idea of commitment!

Just one soldiers opinion>


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## kincanucks

Every one who VRs has to wait a minimum of six months prior to reapplying.


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## Raquette

Well I hate speakin about that but it's actually because of my girlfriend who was threatening to kill herself. She was a serious depressive and had a light schyzophrenia... I dropped out of the army because I was dumb enough to think I was saving her.... But after several month spent with her, I left her because she was poisoning my life...


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## Compter

hey there

I VR for a stupid reason (wife) and I got back in this past October. It was a bit of a pain because they want to make sure you won't do it again(which is understandable). Just keep at it and make sure they know you want it bad. I was in the recruiting office at least once a week.

good luck

later


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## Vigilant

Raquette said:
			
		

> Well I hate speakin about that but it's actually because of my girlfriend who was threatening to kill herself. She was a serious depressive and had a light schyzophrenia... I dropped out of the army because I was dumb enough to think I was saving her.... But after several month spent with her, I left her because she was poisoning my life...



Wow, if it was that bad you can't really help her, she had to want to help herself and get professional treatment.

Good luck, and explain the situation. Hope you get back in. But just make sure things are taken care of before you leave.


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## Ex-Dragoon

> Wow, if it was that bad you can't really help her, she had to want to help herself and get professional treatment.
> 
> Good luck, and explain the situation. You'll probably get back in. But just make sure things are taken care of before you leave.



You don't know that for certain Vigilant, so I would keep that kind of speculation to yourself.


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## Raquette

Compter How long did the second application progress took and when did you VR'ed the first time ?


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## Benoit

Just woundering if anybody has enlisted into the forces under recurit school by-pass and how long did it take from the time they submitted your name for a job offer to the actual date when u got one. I was just woundering about this because i would imagine that a person going into the forces under R S B P would be selected quicker then a normal recurit. Anyways hit me back let me know.


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## Hummel

:skull:


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## Hummel

Well that didnt go the way I wanted  it to... Try this again here.
Ok well some ppl in St Jean end up in a holding Platoon after basic , so I mean it could really go either way from my experience. You could be waiting a year for your trade or you could wait 2 weeks. Thats my experience. Maybe they have changed things in the last few years.......


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## Bert

There is no recruit school by-pass from my understanding.  Taken from another perspective, recruits (NCM) enter 
the reg forces under three streams; unskilled, semi-skilled, and skilled.  You can find info and criteria in the CF 
recruiting site.  The skilled stream are recruits who were members of the CF (or others militaries in special cases) 
in the past and are allowed an excemption from BMQ.


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## meni0n

Sure there is recruit school by-pass just read here: http://www.recruiting.dnd.ca/engraph/enrollment/index_e.aspx?id=11


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## Bert

Yeah, the description doesn't provide much context but its referring to the skilled recruit stream.


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## meni0n

If you take a look at the infantry profile, you'll notice that there is no skilled entry as reserve infantry has to do their BIQ over in the reg force. So the most they can get is
recruit school by-pass.


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## Bert

Sorry Menion, I was referring to the CF general recruiting entry plans.   Prior military service and trade experience of the 
applicants is assessed on a case-by-case basis.   We might be referring to different things.  
Wheres Kincanucks when you need him?


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## hayterowensound

What should I except when joining backup. I have been out for 7 years. I completed my QL2/QL3 at petawawa summer 1994, 6 weeks at CFS Alert with 1 CEU, southern strike 1995. I also have 5 years in the army cadets. So do you think i will have to redo my BMQ/QL2. The unit I am trying to join is the Grey and Simcoe foresters Owensoud, so if that is your unit please respond I would like to meet some people from the unit.


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## geo

I could answer you "it depends" BUT
after 7 years, the system will probably be inclined to enroll you back as, at best, a Cpl
at worst..... a recruit.

I know of a former Sgt who left, started a business & family(business doing fine, family isn't), chose to come back after 10 or 12 yrs.... they took him back as a Recruit - and he's worked his way back up to Cpl. He's certainly no longer the fastest fella in the Platoon - but he's respected by his peers and his Sect/Plt commanders. He paces himself more - always there on time.... just in time.... and yeah - he knows about the weather before the storm fronts come in  (mild arthritis).

Special consideration has been given to "sonny"... he's permitted to attend annual WOs & Sgt's mess dinner (in civies) but the man is enjoying himself immensly.... (sigh - I miss my days back as a Cpl = best rank in the army)


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## hayterowensound

I would like to not have to do my BMQ/QL2, anything else
















i would prefer to not do my BMQ/QL2, anything else i can understand, but basic i dont think is needed


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## NavComm

I have a friend and her husband who were both on the supplementary reserve list, both are attach posted now - finally. They started re-applying to come back in 2003, they just got their messages this week (August 2005).

Anyway neither of them are re-doing bmq, they are both coming back with the ranks they held when they left.

They are navres, not sure if it's the same for army.


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## swanita

I remember hearing sometime ago that if you'd done your basic at the most 5 years ago then wouldn't have to redo it....but this just something i heard & do not know definitively, sorry. Good Luck!


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## geo

If your qualifications are more than 5 yrs old then yeah, it's time to do it over again
If you are on the Supp list then there is a possibility that you might be activated at whatever rank you used to be but, if as my friend Sonny, you got out a long time ago and then decided to come back then.... better than average chance that you'll be asked to redo your qualifications.

Sonny has enjoyed the courses he's had to redo... but I have some doubts that his body is in any condition to do the ELQ Pt6 anytime soon.....


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## Fruss

Hey guys,

Sorry to bring back an old subject, but I was wondering..........

I VR'd last spring (2005) and since then, I've been thinking of going back. I came home for many reasons, but none of them are good (girlfriend, home-sick, sick, pace, etc).

Any ideas to help me join again?

Thanks

Frank


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## nULL

...fixing the underlying reasons for why you VR'd in the first place would be a good start.

Then apply.

Then wait.


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## spud

VR's for weak reasons was explained to me by the Seargeant Major I dealt with when I wanted to quit. My brother was having emotional problems at the time (see..a weak reason). Long story short, the SM says to me "I got 8 brothers and sisters, if I ran to them every time they had a $%#&*^% problem I wouldn't have a spare minute in the day. Take care of yourself and YOUR problems, everything else will work out". 

He was right and I stayed.


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## sorefeet

OK lots of opinions but can anybody answer franks Q ?,I'm kind of in the same boat only being a single father  I had one good reason to vr and Ive reapplied now only part of my file is missing after i was told that everything is on track and i was good to go as of 10/05 now part of my file is missing and they say i might have to start the whole process again any opinions as to why this is,just wondering.


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## kincanucks

_i might have to start the whole process again any opinions as to why this is,just wondering._

and the answer is:

now part of my file is missing


----------



## sorefeet

Right now that thats straight answer me this how can only part of a file go missing? ???


----------



## kincanucks

sorefeet said:
			
		

> Right now that thats straight answer me this how can only part of a file go missing? ???



Well maybe some gremlins snuck into the office and stole it.  Who knows. So part of your file is missing maybe it was a bad part anyway, maybe it was out of date.  Basically suck it up and do what you have to do.


----------



## kincanucks

_OK lots of opinions but can anybody answer franks Q ?,_

with his own words:

_Since I got back, from time to time, I find myself missing BMQ and the pace of it.  I thought of going back, but still, I'm not sure if I want to live like that..

I guess I'll just wait to be sure before doing anything._


----------



## sorefeet

ok franks question was answerd by frank,re read it.
as to why part of a file went missing there is no bad part in my file and your sarcasm makes me think that  that type of attitude is why  things go so slow with enlistment ,p.s.am doing what i need to do!  nothing to suck up


----------



## kincanucks

sorefeet said:
			
		

> ok franks question was answerd by frank,re read it.
> as to why part of a file went missing there is no bad part in my file and your sarcasm makes me think that   that type of attitude is why   things go so slow with enlistment ,p.s.am doing what i need to do!   nothing to suck up



Good luck precious.


----------



## sorefeet

figures that you would say somthing like that you only re-enforce most peoples impression of the typica lncm,(a potatoe peeling jar head),to bad . :-*


----------



## Infanteer

Sorefeet,

Better to have everyone think you're an idiot rather than open your mouth and remove all doubt....


----------



## PPCLI MCpl

sorefeet said:
			
		

> figures that you would say somthing like that you only re-enforce most peoples impression of the typica lncm,(a potatoe peeling jar head),to bad . :-*



Son, you had best re-assess your life and attitude prior to your next attempt at entry into the CF.   No doubt you came to this site for information and advice from SERVING soldiers.   These serving members have demonstrated patience and given you outstanding advice.   If you insist on acting like a ignorant child, you will be treated as such.

Now sum up, open your ears, and carry on.


----------



## aesop081

sorefeet said:
			
		

> ok franks question was answerd by frank,re read it.
> as to why part of a file went missing there is no bad part in my file and your sarcasm makes me think that   that type of attitude is why   things go so slow with enlistment ,p.s.am doing what i need to do!   nothing to suck up





			
				sorefeet said:
			
		

> figures that you would say somthing like that you only re-enforce most peoples impression of the typica lncm,(a potatoe peeling jar head),to bad . :-*



WOW......What impressions would those be ? Last civilian i saw was on board an aurora last week and they thought i was very professional about my duties......did i miss something ?


----------



## armyvern

sorefeet said:
			
		

> ok franks question was answerd by frank,re read it.
> as to why part of a file went missing there is no bad part in my file and your sarcasm makes me think that   that type of attitude is why   things go so slow with enlistment ,p.s.am doing what i need to do!   nothing to suck up


Oh sorefeet, please get your file fixed quick!! Please apply to become a 911 Sup tech and for your 3 posting choices enter: 1) Gagetown 2) Gagetown and 3) Gagetown. I will then fight to have you come to work in my section....what fun it will be...especially if you think your feet are sore now!!  > And I guarantee that I will fix that attitude you seem to be sporting as well!!


----------



## goinpostal

WOW,this person who may or may not get another chance to become one of Canada's finest is obviously a little confused as to what the military is.However making veiled threats&belittling comments as to their mind set will not help this person get the direction and foundation they so obviously need ,cm on people you were all scared and confused at least once in your life .


----------



## PPCLI MCpl

goinpostal said:
			
		

> WOW,this person who may or may not get another chance to become one of Canada's finest is obviously a little confused as to what the military is.However making veiled threats&belittling comments as to their mind set will not help this person get the direction and foundation they so obviously need ,cm on people you were all scared and confused at least once in your life .



Nothing veiled here, and the preceding posts are not threats.  They are examples of "counselling".  And serving members of a certain rank are both trained and experienced enough to administer "counselling".  If you can't tolerate constructive criticism administered in the military style, find another career.


----------



## goinpostal

first I'm not in the military  my father is a retired rsm of 2ppcli who is now deceased and your term "counselling" is only a PC term for being a bully why even bother" getting your pantys in a knot" as my dad would say,i doubt this person will go very far in life but you do have a choice to be a little more understanding isn't that part of your training as well.
by the way my husband is an officer in the infantry and he will be very interested to see this I'm sure he will agree with some of what is being said to this person although I'm not sure he'll share your views on the "counselling" part.


ruck up and carry on would probably be a better piece of advise to this individual.

only an opinion of a military wife.


----------



## PPCLI MCpl

Goinpostal,

Interesting lineage, welcome to the site. Filling out your profile will prevent others from jumping to the same conclusion I did.   In regards to your comment on counselling, I have to disagree.   I have experienced both traditional counselling, which consisted of a verbal harangue covering every topic from my faults to the promiscuity of my mother, usually followed by a physical assault.   I am also familiar with pro-active counselling of wayward soldiers in need of advice and, well, counselling.   

Given we don't perform an ordinary job, and it's going to become even more out of the ordinary in the following months, the methods we use are going to have to do for now.


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse

Gee, funny how sorefeet and goinpostal seem to be posting from the same computer......bye bye troll.......


----------



## buddyhfx

goinpostal said:
			
		

> by the way my husband is an officer in the infantry and he will be very interested to see this I'm sure he will agree with some of what is being said to this person although I'm not sure he'll share your views on the "counselling" part.


WoW.. the last time i heard something similar to this, was at a christmas dinner, 1991 I think. Anyway she handed up wearing a turkey dinner and all the trimmings on her dress. Courtesy of an NCM. We already have a Queen and a GG, as an ''officer's wife'' no need to try to fill in that position, thank you very much...

Cheers


----------



## Mindanao

i left the CF about a year and a half ago and want to re-enlist. I was 031 reg force...how long is the typical wait for re-enlistees?....would you go through the same process as a new applicant?....cheers...


----------



## kincanucks

The length of time it takes for you to re-enlists depends on a lot of things such as the retrieval of your previous service information, which can take as little as a couple of hours and the retrieval of your medical file, which can take a couple of weeks.  Then you will have to wait to be booked for a medical and interview and, if you are going for a different trade, you may have to rewrite the CFAT.  So there is no typical time for re-enlistment as it depends on your circumstances, where you are re-applying (how busy they may be), and what you are applying for.


----------



## Mattscape

This is a question I have about how many times the CF is willing to allow a citizen the chance to become a recruit. I'm not in the military, and nor do I plan on any time soon enlisting. I'm in university right now and am considering a career in the military after I've finished with all this education nonsense, but am conflicted as to the picture given me of enlisting and the reality of it. I have a friend, I'll call him Josh because, well, that's his name -- he enlisted twice and took a VR *twice*, I think in the first month of basic training, or whatever you call it. I don't think he had a real good reason either time, he was just not feeling up to it mentally. None the less, it was something like a year or two between those first two incidents; it has since been about 3 years, and he applied again, and was accepted AGAIN! He is no prize, really, and has but a High School Education and only some University. Is this exceptional? It seems that everyone is stressed out over the application process and its difficulty. Seems to me that it mustn't be tremendously rigorous if they accept people for the military after this sort of capriciousness. I think he is going for the Infantry or Artillery or something of this nature. Any ideas? Cheers!


----------



## Pieman

When one is released, they can be released with or without restrictions. If no restrictions were placed against him after a VR, he can apply again after 6 months.  (In certain circumstances you can reapply sooner)

I am not sure how much weight that two past VRs would have on his re-application. 

Did he apply for Officer or NCM? Big difference in competitive levels.


----------



## SupersonicMax

As long as you can justify your release and the reason why you wan't to come back that should be all right for 1 time.  Twice I'd have doubt about it...

Max


----------



## Mattscape

He just applied as a regular soldeir, not an officer or anything. I reckon that would be the less competitive. He mentioned that the recruiters didn't know why he was released either time; is that information not on file? Anyway, I'm sounding like a maniac, prying into affairs like this, but I have an obsessive need for information and minutia. My family and friends hate my grilling them, but I like to know how things work in very fine detail.


----------



## kincanucks

Unfortunately, a person could release and reapply as many times as they want as there is no restriction on either.


----------



## Fry

Biggest mistake I ever made was to VR to come home and nurse my shoulder. Biggest mistake ever. MO said 2 years PAT possibly, didn't like that, so I said I'll come home and get treatment. Worst idea ever.


----------



## exsemjingo

The answer to your question lies in actually applying yourself.
The process of qualifying itself takes so long that non-serious applicants are quickly weeded out.
The process of getting selected is so uncertain that serious applicants start to look for other options.

The point is, many people would like to be in this hypothetical situation: "if I go for voluntary release, can I get back in?"
Generally, no one who goes on V.R. wants back in.


----------



## stoker34

Hi, as I mentioned in another message, I was an Naval Reserve Officer for 1 year only (april 1994 to april 1995).  I am re-enlisting as an NCO in marine engineering mecanic, wainting to get the phone call to sign the contract.  I am on the merit list.  I already have a college degree in marine engineering with prior sea time on merchant marine ships.  Any of you re-enlisting and are on the merit list?  What rank should I expect?  I don't have to go through basic training for NCO's and my QL3 is also recognised.  What is the next step when I go back to BFC Esquimalt?  

Thank you for the replies...


Stoker34


----------



## kincanucks

I would guess Able Seaman but it will all be on the offer from CFRG HQ so wait and see.


----------



## George Wallace

The rank may not be as important as what Pay Incentive Level you are accepted into.


----------



## 17thRecceSgt

I am CTing from Res to Reg currently...haven't gotten the actual job offer yet, which my MCC tells me will include my rank, IPC, training bypass, and potential posting locations.  However, for Marine Engineering Mechanic, this link might help, look at the bottom of the page...the NCM portion.  Some info is there on the trade you want...

http://www.recruiting.forces.gc.ca/engraph/navy/bonuses_e.aspx

Mud


----------



## stoker34

thank you all for your replies...  as soon as I get the call, I will let you know!


----------



## Wolf

I attended basic training and took a voluntary release from the forces.  In my release paper work it says that I was released under section 4(c).  I want to know whether or not there are any restrictions from me rejoining the military after my 6 month time period for reapplication has expired.

The reasons why I took a voluntary release:

1. b) occupational choice
    c) career path 

2. a) remustering trades after basic training was not a possibility.

3. a) trade qualified for Military Police 


I want to rejoin the Canadian Forces in 6 months as a Military Police Officer.  I will chose 3 trades for employment should the Military Police Trade not be available at the time of my application.  

1. Military Police
2. Fire Fighter
3. Infantry ( I will be infantry for 3 years and remuster after basic training) 
   ( better to do when I am young and strong). 

Qualifications Profile:

25 Years old
Single male
Ontario Canada
Education:  BA Sociology
                 Diploma Police Foundations

Auxiliary Police Constable 

Should I be allowed to do it all over again. I would have stayed in the Forces in the Infantry and done my 3 years service and switched trades to Military Police on the completion of my contract.  Due to my educational and volunteer experience, I felt it in my best interest to take a voluntary release and reapply for the trade of Military Police. 

I have above average physical condition, and I will be spending the next 6 months preparing myself mentally and physically for the Canadian Forces, my career choice!

Please comment on my post.

Thank you.


----------



## T59

Greetings,

I have been in the service from 1999 till 2001 Sig Op... Voluntary release cuz I got bored(PAT platoon sucks). I didnt even have my 3s yet. Yeah it was a mess up.. I know... having said that, you think I have a chance at Recruit School bypass next year?  (wont be applying for another year.. mother is ill)

The front desk guys a the recruiting office seems to think so but it seems all they want to do is to get me to hand in those papers.. AT ALL COST!.. lol..


----------



## kincanucks

T59 said:
			
		

> Greetings,
> 
> I have been in the service from 1999 till 2001 Sig Op... Voluntary release cuz I got bored(PAT platoon sucks). I didnt even have my 3s yet. Yeah it was a mess up.. I know... having said that, you think I have a chance at Recruit School bypass next year?  (wont be applying for another year.. mother is ill)
> 
> The front desk guys a the recruiting office seems to think so but it seems all they want to do is to get me to hand in those papers.. AT ALL COST!.. lol..



You are RSBP.

_The front desk guys a the recruiting office seems to think so but it seems all they want to do is to get me to hand in those papers._

Yes because you are so special. Perhaps you should tell them that you went on army.ca to verify their information.


----------



## T59

LOL!!!!   Yeah!  then I'll ask him to put a rush on it! LOL... chop chop!

What I meant by the guys at the recruiting center is that the impression the guy gave me when I went there is that he had NO INFO on the recruiting process. It seems he was just there to talk to me about military life or HIS military experience.. I know about military life.... I was looking for concrete, factual, "business" rules...   Lets just say that there was a lot of "I think.." in his dialect.. 

Enough about that..   One last quick question if I may...

What makes me RSBP? What's the rule of thumb?    (curiosity)


This site rocks!   Thanks a lot for your input guys!!!


----------



## kincanucks

T59 said:
			
		

> LOL!!!!   Yeah!  then I'll ask him to put a rush on it! LOL... chop chop!
> 
> What I meant by the guys at the recruiting center is that the impression the guy gave me when I went there is that he had NO INFO on the recruiting process. It seems he was just there to talk to me about military life or HIS military experience.. I know about military life.... I was looking for concrete, factual, "business" rules...   Lets just say that there was a lot of "I think.." in his dialect..
> 
> Enough about that..   One last quick question if I may...
> 
> What makes me RSBP? What's the rule of thumb?    (curiosity)
> 
> 
> This site rocks!   Thanks a lot for your input guys!!!



Released from the CF for less than 10 years.


----------



## T59

Greeting, 

I have read a few threads on recruit school bypass but I can't seem to find the answer to this next one:

I was Rad Op in 2000. I was told if I re-enroll, I was bypassing recruit training. 

What happens if I bypass basic?  When I get off the bus... I go to the QM, get my stuff and I'm in?...  :-\

I will re-enroll as  Infantry, I'm concerned about comming from civy land into Infantry directly... you know what I mean?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## 17thRecceSgt

You released in 2000 and didn't transfer to the Supplemental Ready Reserve (aka Supp List IIRC)?

I thought if you were "out" (read released completely) you had to start from scratch if your reapplied and it was longer than one year from your release to re-enrollment.

I could be right out too lunch.

Did you ask the staff at a CFRC this question?  They would know best...(spider senses tingling...I sense KinCanucks in the area   ;D)...

MRM


----------



## kincanucks

Out for less than 10 years and more than 5 years then your file is assessed by recruiting HQ and you may be granted RSBP.  If you are granted RSBP and get accepted then you will be enrolled and sent to Borden for PRETC and SQ and eventually onto Infantry QL3.


----------



## T59

I am so gratefull this forum exists! Thanks again for on point info!

When I first joined I was on PAT platoon on EME side in Borden for a while( cutting grass at 45 degrees beside EME HQ and waiting in a Aframe tent that the grass is long enough to cut it again!) lol... 
Then I went threw something they called EME Regimental(something like 6 weeks) where we learned that when you think you can't run... you can still run.. and when you puke running... its a good sign! 


Thanks a lot guys!


----------



## NJL

Hi, 2 months ago I returned home from BMQ (Reg Force in St.Jean) after putting in a VR... A day after returning home and "sleeping on it" I realised that I had made a big mistake in leaving (was also having major second thoughts while stuck on Pat for a month) and that I lost my focus and sight of the big picture on why I joined the CF in the first place... It was one of those things that you don't realize what you have till it's gone... So I now plan on reapplying asap (have to wait a few more months)... My question are?

1. My reasons for VR have been resloved and weren't medically related (I'm 100% healthy)... Are my chances of getting re-accepted good? on the aptitude test I qualified for all NCM trades/ medical and physical were no problems.
2.. How will the process be different for me the 2nd time around? Faster/slower than normal... hopefully faster I want to finish what I started asap.
3. Will I have to redo the aptitude test? I did it like 7-8 months ago.
4. Will I be given a new service number?

I imagine that my story isn't too uncommon  but it still sucks... I'm gonna take this as a learning experience and it should help me when I return to St. Jean/ BMQ.
Thanks


----------



## Michael OLeary

First step: Go talk to the Recruiter.


----------



## orange.paint

I remember my recruiter,capt Lutz (Sp?...can't understand why that name stuck with me over the years) told me not to ever quit.She said she seen a lot of people strolling back in after realising their mistake.Everyone has their moments and say/do stuff they don't mean.Be prepared for the question "why won't you quit this time".Make them realise you made a mistake and are planning on soldiering on.

Good luck.

p.s With whats happening in our army today,I can't see one mistake like this making it impossible for you to get in.


----------



## kincanucks

_1. My reasons for VR have been resloved and weren't medically related (I'm 100% healthy)... Are my chances of getting re-accepted good? on the aptitude test I qualified for all NCM trades/ medical and physical were no problems._ Yes after you wait another four months before you can reapply.

_2.. How will the process be different for me the 2nd time around? Faster/slower than normal... hopefully faster I want to finish what I started asap._ Should be faster.  The delay may be in getting your old documents.

_3. Will I have to redo the aptitude test? I did it like 7-8 months ago._  No.

_4. Will I be given a new service number?_ No.


----------



## ThatsLife

NJL, I made the EXACT same mistake as you did. I had to wait a few more months after the 6 month probationary period for my medical file to get back from St-Jean, but I now have an interview on the 29th...I hope I can get in for a December course but I won't complain if I slip into a January one. I made a HUGE mistake and felt like putting my balls in a vice...Don't quit this time man.


----------



## Guinness

what the hell is a VR? I cannot find it in the acronyms or anywhere else!


----------



## Michael OLeary

VR = Voluntary Release


----------



## harry8422

just make sure this is what you want to do ........ but it seems like it is so good luck  in your career by the way what trade were you applying for ? just in case i had missed it


----------



## PoPo

Guinness said:
			
		

> what the hell is a VR? I cannot find it in the acronyms or anywhere else!



As I have said before not an "official" acronym - "New guys" acronym for 4C Voluntary Release - on Request

PoPo


----------



## NJL

Thanks guys for the replies and info.... my trade was/is RMS Clerk second choice was Trafic Tech ... and yes the military is definetly my career choice (my step dad retired w/35 yrs of service- so I have a great source of info) . 

Looking back now it's hard for me not to "kick myself in the butt" everyday for VRing (when I was VRing I actually asked my instructor if I could reapply in the future which he said yes), seeing your platoons grad picture online (with you not in it) makes it even harder.. but I keep reminding myself it was a great learning experience(will help me train better/harder) and it should make my return to my next BMQ course (which I can't wait for) alot easier (knowing what to expect/living it before).

One of the one main factors that lead to me VRing wasn't that I found it too hard or that I wasn't in good enough shape (cuz for the most part I actually enjoyed the PT), it was..... a lack of sleep (like 1-2 hrs/night). I know that it sounds like a silly factor but not sleeping can/did lead to other problems mental/physical fatigue (I would forget directions to places I had just visted the day before) and stress build-up... I know sometimes sleep is a luxary in the military which I can accept and deal with, but before I went to BMQ last time I should have gotten into the habit of going to bed early (11) and getting up early(5) instead of what I was doing which was the total opposite (late and late)... I figured it would be easy to adjust, it wasn't.. so I'm gonna start getting in the habit now (get up at around 5 and work out/bed by 11) for my next BMQ course.

I'm not sure if others feel the same way, and it sounds kinda 'corny" but since returnning from BMQ I almost feel like I could write a book with all my BMQ memories/stories (mostly good and some bad) ... it was unlike anything I had done before; I can't wait to return and finish what I started.

Good luck to all those who are starting their BMQ soon... remember to train hard, stay focused, work together and enjoy the experience.


----------



## armychickenlittle

You will not have to redo the aptitude test unless you didn't meet the cutoff for whatever trade you are going for the next time. The score stays with  you forever, as does your service number.  That'll never change.  Yeah, you have to wait six months after the date of release to be eligible to reapply, but that gives you time to reflect and decide if that's what you want to do.  Just a tip, the trades you had before (RMS and Traffic Tech) are pretty tough to get into so a good time to reapply would be around the change of the fiscal year when the recruiting numbers increase and there are more openings.  Good luck, and remember, your whole military career won't be the same as basic training. You just need to tough it out those weeks. Just think, you'll have that many more good stories to look back on!   ;D


----------



## NavComm

(muffin) Don't worry someone will make sure you get to do it again and that everyone goes easy on you. We wouldn't want to stress you out or make life difficult. Someone will undoubtedly make it fast and easy for you to get right back in there and do what you are destined for.  Good luck. What element are you applying for?

corrected for typing error *gasp* tg I'm not an RMS clerk


----------



## NJL

NavComm, I can't tell by your post if you're being sincere or if your mocking me... if your sincere thanks for the comments but by no means do I want/need a easier ride than any other recruit (I know I'll pass BMQ when I returned, cuz I'll be better prepared phys/mentally)   but I would like to get back to BMQ asap... I'm normally great at dealing with stress/ stressful situation.. but not sleeping can compond stress/ fatigue issues (it's a proven fact), which I now know all to well, and I will use this info in helping me prepare/train so I can avoid/ deal with it when I returrn to BMQ.

Armychickenlittle, thanks for the answers... I was told that my applitude test score qualifies me for all trades... I know I gotta wait the 6 months (only 3 left) to reapply... I've defiently deceided that military is my career choice( I knew the day after I returned home and haven't thought different since... When I was decieding wether to VR or not  everyone (platoon mates/family) around me was saying the same thing about how it's only a few months and it will be different after you're done BMQ... which in my head I knew (I live in CFB Greenwood,NS/step dad retired MWO after 35 yrs in/ lots of friends in CF.. so I know/experienced alot of the military life) but at the time I was being stuborned and my mind was made up. Looking back I wish the instructors would've given me more time than a day to change/make my mind (maybe like a week) about VRing cuz even the day of my VR I was having major second thoughts but I figured the process had already been started so I went through with it  (I even asked the instructor if I'm able to reapply). Like I said previously BMQ was unlike anything I've done before, and was (for the most part/except for VRing) a great experience to meet some cool people/ do some great things. Even though PAT platoon sucks I got to meet some cool people there too, so it wasn't all bad.


----------



## aesop081

NJL said:
			
		

> but not sleeping can compond stress/ fatigue issues (it's a proven fact), which I now know all to well, and I will use this info in helping me prepare/train so I can avoid/ deal with it when I returrn to BMQ.



I certainly hope that whatever you do to prepare yourself, that you never forget it.  Not sleeping well, irregular sleeping patterns, and not sleeping at all are facts of life well beyond BMQ. If you cant get over it , and get over it fast......find a new line of work


----------



## spud

cdnaviator said:
			
		

> I certainly hope that whatever you do to prepare yourself, that you never forget it.  Not sleeping well, irregular sleeping patterns, and not sleeping at all are facts of life well beyond BMQ. If you cant get over it , and get over it fast......find a new line of work



Ya dude you may as well wipe all that stuff from your mental "hard drive"; because if it was an excuse once.....it'll be an excuse again. 

potato


----------



## NJL

cdnaviator, I understand that sleep can be a luxary in the military and that irregular sleep patterns are part of the job and I can accept that.. even now sometimes I only get like 4 hrs/night. Like I said previously my step dad was in the airforce for 35 years as a Flight Engineer so I've heard all about getting a few hrs of sleep a day/ getting up and going on trips overseas a different times during the night... I know that I can deal with and enjoy that kind of lifestyle


----------



## aesop081

NJL said:
			
		

> I know that I can deal with and enjoy that kind of lifestyle



Well then....why the need to VR in the first place.........to me, you COULD NOT deal with the lifestyle.


----------



## NJL

spud, I hear what you're saying but you're wrong... it (VRing) won't happen again.


----------



## aesop081

NJL said:
			
		

> it (VRing) won't happen again.



What exactly have you done to corect your problems ?

I'm sorry if this is going to sound harsh but your reason for VR'ing was lame.......and please, spare me the "my dad was AF for XX years" speach...you are not your dad...you have no idea.


----------



## NJL

cdnaviator, your right maybe at the time I could deal with the change in lifestyles (civy to BMQ)... that's why I'm gonna do a better job of preparing for it next time... anyways like others have said BMQ is only a few months and after that (depending on trade/element) ones day-day military career can be totally different than BMQ...


----------



## aesop081

NJL said:
			
		

> ones day-day military career can be totally different than BMQ...



You are correct.......BMQ is way easier.......

You never answered my question....what are you doing to prepare yourself ?


----------



## NJL

I've changed my sleep pattern  to match the BMQ schedule (getting up at 5 bed by 11), I'm also trainng differently to better match the BMQ course (more early moring running)... currently I'm training/ getting ready for BMQ not for 5 years from now that's what BMQ/QL's,etc help teach/train 

To say that "BMQ is easier than day-day military life" is a general statement... what do you mean by easier? what's easy can depend on the person, some find BMQ hard some don't....Plus There are many different types of jobs in the CF ... being a chef is alot different than being a pilot or a armoured soldier.. in that day-day life in the CF is diferent for many depending on job/posting/ duties


----------



## aesop081

NJL said:
			
		

> I've changed my sleep pattern  to match the BMQ schedule (getting up at 5 bed by 11), I'm also trainng differently to better match the BMQ course (more early moring running)... currently I'm training/ getting ready for BMQ not for 5 years from now that's what BMQ/QL's,etc help teach/train
> 
> To say that "BMQ is easier than day-day military life" is a general statement... what do you mean by easier? There are many different types of jobs in the CF ... being a chef is alot different than being a pilot or a armored soldier.



It doesnt matter what trade you are.  On BMQ you are coddled. They tell you when to go to bed, they tell you when to wake up.  You get 3 meals a day...you get a hot shower and a warm bed. And with all that you still VRed......What are you going to do when you are tired, wet, dirty , hungry and unde fire.......do you realy think that BMQ was harder than all that ?

You going to be a chef you say ? have you considered that cooks live in the field under the same conditions ? They work long hours too.  They even get sea sick on board ships to add to their misery. And watch out if the crew is mad because you cook crap !!!

On BMQ you only have very simple things to do and someone always tells you what it is.  After BMQ you have to think.....even if you only had 30 minutes of sleep and sometimes those decisions you have to make will be life or death ones.......


----------



## aesop081

Dont make the misstake of thinking that your post-BMQ career is going to be 9-5..........


----------



## Pte_Martin

I think he understands, it's up to him to change and pass the courses or to VR again, Keep us updated and good luck


----------



## NJL

I'm actually gonna be a RMS Clerk not a chef I was just using it as an example.

I know it won't be 9-5 job and I undersatnd and agree with alot of what your saying... all I'm saying is that BMQ is Step 1.... then QL3's, etc.. it goes in steps, BMQ helps recruits with the change from civy to military... are you saying that because someone VRs once means they shouldn't get a second chance... I guess time will tell if I'll pass the second time but I'm confident I'll suceed


----------



## aesop081

NJL said:
			
		

> I'm actually gonna be a RMS Clerk not a chef I was just using it as an example.
> 
> are you saying that because someone VRs once means they shouldn't get a second chance...



No i am not......but if you managed to come up with that sad an excuse for doing it the first time........I will wish you good luck but i wont be holding my breath.


----------



## NJL

Thanks Infantry, that's all I'm saying.... is it's up to me to change and pass the courses...which I plan on doing

Cdnaviator thanks for wishing me good luck and I know you have your doubts but time will tell.


----------



## armychickenlittle

Hi again, Rather than tell you to "get over it" as some would, I'd rather help you out. I wasn't on your course, I don't know just how hard that serial was so telling you to get over it or look for another line of work certainly isn't constructive or helpful. Sorry, guys.  So what I do want to tell you is that I happened to ask a few questions at work today about someone like you who wants to reapply and does he have to wait the six months. The answer I got back implied that you should apply now because "the powers that be" MAY be able to waive the requirement to wait the six months IF you are going for a trade that's in high demand. If you want something that's harder to get into, like, say, a construction trade or RMS, you might as well wait until the new fiscal year when there'll likely be more openings. I hope this helps.  As for the sleep issue, you just have to tell yourself that at 2300 hrs it's time to sleep, whether your s**t is done or not. You can't pass your classroom tests if you don't get the sleep, and THAT's something they can send you home for.


----------



## NJL

Thanks armychickenlittle for the info..  but my trade choices are RMS (I took 2 yrs of accounting/business in college) and Trafic Tech, I was accepted as a RMS clerk before so I'll probably stick with it and wait a few months to reapply (gives me more time to train)... I think some people here are misunderstanding my posts/story, I never said that I found the BMQ really hard (physically/class room lessons) cuz I didn't... I was doing fine (as well as most in my platoon) throught the day (5 a.m.- 11.am.) it just the fact the I wasn't sleeping at all started to cause mental fatigue/blood pressure issues (it's a fact people need to sleep, if you don't you'll begin to have health/stress issues)... I know for a fact that had I been sleeping more (and not had the health problems)  I wouldn't have VR and would've probably passed the course. One of the reason I say that is becuse once I was put on PAT platoon (where most days I would work in Farnham from 7-4 doing manual labor jobs) and began to sleep better (the 6hrs were supossed to get) I was fine, and the issues (mental fatigue/blood pressure) I had before went away.


----------



## aesop081

NJL said:
			
		

> Thanks armychickenlittle for the info..  but my trade choices are RMS (I took 2 yrs of accounting/business in college) and Trafic Tech, I was accepted as a RMS clerk before so I'll probably stick with it and wait a few months to reapply (gives me more time to train)... I think some people here are misunderstanding my posts/story, I never said that I found the BMQ really hard (physically/class room lessons) cuz I didn't... I was doing fine (as well as most in my platoon) throught the day (5 a.m.- 11.am.) it just the fact the I wasn't sleeping at all started to cause mental fatigue/stress/blood pressure issues (it's a fact people need to sleep, if you don't you'll begin to have health/stress issues)... I know for a fact that had I been sleeping more (and not had the health problems)  I wouldn't have VR and would've probably passed the course. One of the reason I say that is becuse once I was put on PAT platoon and began to sleep better (the 6hrs were supossed to get) I was fine, and the issues (fatigue/blood pressure) I had before went away.



I understood your problem quite well NJL and i regardless of what chickenlittle has to say , i stand by my comments.  lack of sleep is a fact of life regardless of trade or posting.  if you are going to start having health/stress/blood pressure issues everytime you dont get 6 hours sleep and cant do you job...again...seek life elsewhere. It may not be constructive....but its a fact !!


----------



## Zertz

At anyrate, are you not given 2300-0500 to sleep? Add firepicket somewhere in there are it adds up to around 5 hours, no? I'm not sure how you're not getting sleep.


----------



## NJL

I never once have said that when I don't get 6 hrs of sleep I experience these problems... even now in my civy life I sometimes only get 3-4 hrs of sleep and am able to function fine with no problems. I've even gone a couple days without sleep and have been fine... I'm not saying that lack of sleep was the only problems I had during my last BMQ time, but I feel it was a major contributing factor. I've learned from my past mistake (VR) and when I return to BMQ if/when I again have problems (sleep or anything else) I will suck it up and deal with it looking at the big picture... why I joined and what the future will hold

Zerts, I was in my bed from 11-5 yes but for some reason I was only sleeping 1-2 hrs if that.. whereas most everyone else had no problem sleeping... why wasn't I sleeping? if I knew then I would've fixed the problem. I realise now that one of the factor was that I didn't get into a proper sleep pattern before leaving (which won't happen again) and figured I would adapt easily.


----------



## aesop081

Well...i hope it works out for you.

For the record.....


			
				NJL said:
			
		

> ..... of the reason I say that is becuse once I was put on PAT platoon (where most days I would work in Farnham from 7-4 doing manual labor jobs) and began to sleep better (*the 6hrs were supossed to get*) I was fine, and the issues (mental fatigue/blood pressure) I had before went away.



BMQ is not the last course you will get 6 hours or less of sleep......
I didnt sleep much on my CLC...even less on my QL6A......i didnt sleep in navigation school...and now i cant sleep before 10 hour patrols.......


----------



## NJL

cdnaviator I realize that BMQ is just the beginning(then comes QL3's) and from there on sleep isn't guarnteed to nobody... I can remember my Platoon Commander saying "once we get to Farnham rules are I gotta give you guy 5 hrs of sleep/day but it doesn't say when and at what times) 

thanks for your comments though and while you may not understand where I'm coming from your 14+ years of service as a Combat Engineer is something I find commendable... in the future I hope to have a similar career just in a different trade.


----------



## aesop081

NJL said:
			
		

> thanks for your comments though and while you may not understand where I'm coming from your 14+ years of service as a Combat Engineer is something I find commendable... in the future I hope to have a similar career just in a different trade.



Dont get me wrong, i do hope it works out for you.  I sincerly wish you good luck.

BTW : 11 years combat engineer....3 years as a zoomie ...and counting


----------



## exsemjingo

NJL said:
			
		

> ... while you may not understand where I'm coming from your 14+ years of service as a Combat Engineer is something I find commendable... in the future I hope to have a similar career just in a different trade.


Like Infantry?  You only sleep there when the enemy lets you.


----------



## NJL

exsemjingo said:
			
		

> Like Infantry?  You only sleep there when the enemy lets you.


 I hear what you saying, Infantry are A+ in my book... they're on the frontlines (in places like Afganistan) doing/seeing crazy things, risking their lives for our country... true hereo's in every sence of the word.


----------



## armychickenlittle

Ok, now I see what trade you wanted. No need to answer that part of the personal email you sent me.


----------



## NavComm

NJL I just re-read all your posts on this topic and I think it's you that doesn't understand. I think you have an idealized version of military life. I don't agree that it's a 'fact' that everyone requires 6 uninterupted hours of sleep a night. In fact, I had a sargeant tell me that a person only really requires 15 minutes of sleep in a 24-hour period.

In the military, you get sleep when you can, not when you want it. It doesn't matter what job you do.

Having said that, if you get a job at an office that is only open from 8 - 4 you might be on a typical civvie-like schedule, but what if you are overseas or on a ship? What if you get GD (general duties) before you are trade qualified? That could go on for a year or more.

I did GD all summer and I had a few 19-hr days. In the field we were lucky to get more than 2 hours of sleep at a time. I did GD on a ship recently and my day started at 4 a.m. and ended around 8 p.m. I didn't get to say 'people need sleep you know, it's a fact'. Nobody gives a rat's a## is it's a fact or not.

There were a few people on my bmq that vr'd for some pretty lame reasons, so I guess it's not all that unusual. I just hope that if you do go back, you change your attitude and are doing this for the right reasons. There are already too many people graduating bmq and trades courses who are lazy, whiny, annoying little princesses and I hope you don't become one of them.

My .02 and I do wish you success on all your courses and in your future in the military. Serving one's country is a priviledge and an honour not to be taken lightly IMO.


----------



## IrishCanuck

Allright, I'm seeing alot of guesswork being thrown back and forth in regards to the amount of sleep needed for any given person.

It is true the amount of sleep needed for any one person varies greatly. Some people are fine with four hours, others need six , seven, or even eight.

I also see the validity in stating that people in the military should for their own good and producitivity be some of the people that require less sleep than average.

However 15 minutes of a sleep a day is not enough for a person aside from maybe 1-2 days maximum at a time followed by a chance to catch up on their sleep.

The brain needs sleep, it's a fact. Anyone who has taken a basic psych class knows that if the brain isn't allowed to enter into continuous, then there are adverse side affects such as: inhibited physical growth ( as growth tends to be spurred by Stage 4 sleep), and with no REM sleep : reduced memory performance, and reduced verbal abilities. This stems from the brain not having time to "processes and assimiliate" new information gleaned since the previous sleep session. This is why anyone who pulls an all nighter for exams (bad idea) must stay awake until the exam, because getting 2 hrs sleep , the brain will not enter into REM stage sleep, at least not for a very long period of time, and that information will be lost.

If you are sleep deprived for too long a period, you may actually experience something called "microsleeps", in which the body falls asleep for a few seconds up to a minute at a time. People generally aren't aware of this, and it is most often described as "zoning or spacing out". This is highly dangerous for a soldier, operating high tech and deadly machinery , not to mention any sentries on duty.

Now , modern Armed Forces are aware of the effects of sleep deprivation, and the US military is working on pills that change the chemical and neural composition of the brain in the short term, and reduce the effects of sleep deprivation. 

Just fyi haha.

Hence I believe at least 4 hrs a night at BMQ or on any course would be crucial, as the brain needs to process all the new training that has come its way.


----------



## NavComm

Irish, of course everyone needs sleep, the point I was trying to make is that it's not always going to be guaranteed that NJL will get up to 6 hours of uninterupted sleep. Nor can he expect to always sleep during the night. He might have watch, he might work a 12 hour night shift in the field and have to sleep during the day. There are all kinds of variables.

There are all sorts of studies done on sleep deprivation, shift workers and sleep, etc. But what good are they to a guy in the field that's doing duty watch and thinking 'oh the unfairness of this, I should be getting 6 hours of sleep!' People can be their own worse enemies with thinking like that.

 The fact is that NJL VR'd because he wasn't getting any sleep and couldn't function. If he can't overcome that, he shouldn't be opting for a military career.


----------



## NJL

All this talk about sleep is making me tired I'm kidding.... When I first started this topic all I was doing was trying to get some answer to a few questions about re-applying after VRing... I never thought it would turn into such a long topic, but thats OK...\

1. Lack of sleep (the issues that came as a result of it) was one of my reasons for VRing... a major one but not the only one. 

2. I have never once said I couldn't function as a result of not sleeping... quite the opposite I was fine/did good during the day (PT/Class room,etc)... it's just that the stress/fatigue(forgetting things) build-up/ plus a minor helath problem(blood pressure) caused me AT THE TIME to loose focus on the big picture (why I was there)... I know my next time on BMQ I will react differently to any issues(sleep or anything else) that come up...(How do I know? My previous experience has been a great learning experience for me) Time will tell  

3. My views on a CF career may be idealistic... but what do you expect from a potential recruit? Recruits are just starting out and are there to be taught/trained.. I would never say I know what to expect after BMQ , cuz I don't.. that's part of the fun/journey.


----------



## Zertz

Oh wow, this thread is going in more circles than a BMQ coy on grad parade practice.


----------



## aesop081

edited because i just dont care anymore.......


----------



## NJL

I agree this topic is going no wheres now (around and around) hopefully it will die down... I got the answers to my questions (along time ago) which is all I wanted from this topic


----------



## vyrago

I've already perused the boards and noticed a definate trend in the time a VFS takes.  seems like 6-9 months is the average, which is depressing.

I have a few questions:

1.  is this acurate?  what is a no-bullsh**t time frame?

2.  why does CFRC continue to tell me "two weeks", like its some kinda sick joke by now.  (ive waited 2 months already)  I really would have prefered an upfront heads up on this from them.

3.  is there anything I can do?


seeing those other poor guys writing that it took them 8 months (or more!!) is really putting a damper on my desire.  I'm going to have to consider alternate employment, I just cant wait that long to see IF they'll let me back in.


----------



## career_radio-checker

vyrago said:
			
		

> I've already perused the boards and noticed a definate trend in the time a VFS takes.  seems like 6-9 months is the average, which is depressing.
> 
> I have a few questions:
> 
> 1.  is this acurate?  what is a no-bullsh**t time frame?
> 
> 2.  why does CFRC continue to tell me "two weeks", like its some kinda sick joke by now.  (ive waited 2 months already)  I really would have prefered an upfront heads up on this from them.
> 
> 3.  is there anything I can do?
> 
> 
> seeing those other poor guys writing that it took them 8 months (or more!!) is really putting a damper on my desire.  I'm going to have to consider alternate employment, I just cant wait that long to see IF they'll let me back in.


Answer
Question 1. Don't know, I don't work there
Question 2. Who knows? CFRC is a strange entity like NDHQ, But to be fair, you aren't the only one going through CFRC so you get processed when you get processed
Question 3. Go to the Gym, practice drill, not much else you can do administratively. Take it from someone who lives in Ottawa and understands paper trail systems. It's one of those things you just don't have control over, the conveyer belt sets its own speed, trust me you can't make it go faster.

Yah its a shame it takes so long but that's life. I feel empathy for you knowing that you have to have employment to survive. In the mean time you could probably get a temporary job, which you would have no qualms leaving at a notice's moment.


----------



## Blindspot

It took about 6 months for my VFS to go through. If you're lucky like I was, they'll let you take the Aptitude test during the archaeological dig.


----------



## new_armoured_trooper

I apparently got off lucky with mine, it took me roughly 2 months to get my VFS done, and another month or so to get my med docs. All my information had been sent to archives in Ottawa.


----------



## vyrago

I really hope they hurry up, im rapidly approaching my 10 year mark since I got out and I'd really like to get RSBP (recruit school bypass).  id much rather jump right into my new trade than be practicing an "advance in review order" on some parade square.


----------



## great_white

I recently put in a VR during BMQ and was granted my release.  I have been out of the CF for a month and a half.  My mind changed during Basic, i did not want to join the Naval element, and I was struggling to adapt to the new surroundings because i had set such high expectations for myself.  I came to BMQ in top shape, and was easily one of the top 3 scores on the PT test.  I was in week 3 on the Parade Square, getting $#!& on by my Section 2 IC and it was because we were learning new drill....cant quite recall exactly what, but i was struggling.  They verbally told me to shape up and get with it, and that is when all my expectations had hit the LOW...  I felt like everything i had to offer would result in me not doing it well enough, or that i would get harped on by an Instructor.  Having a temper i felt was about to flare up, and to my instructors suprise i asked for a VR.  I was Not about to loose my temper and get shit on in front of my company and all the sections and then head to PRB because i didn't make a rational choice at the time.  
I have thought about my choice to VR and it was WRONG!  I feel really bad about my choice.  Criticism and Drill....Drill and Criticism....  I lost track of the fact we had to be challenged by our Instructors every minute of the day.  
Here is my plea for HELP!!
WHAT ARE MY OPTIONS TO GET BACK IN?
could it happen after Xmas??
Thank you for taking the time to read this Post, any helpfull info would be greatly appreciated


----------



## schart28

Reserve or Reg force??


----------



## great_white

Reg Force


----------



## schart28

ok, can't help you on that side..


----------



## FredDaHead

First, use the search function; someone asked pretty much the same question not long ago.

Secondly, if you couldn't stick with it the first time, how can you know you'll stick with it if you go back? Worse, how can you possibly hope to convince a recruiter that you want to go back for real, and that you won't just drop it again?

Thirdly, grow a thicker skin.

Fourth, you can try and re-apply. Just prepare a pretty damn good excuse for quitting.


----------



## WannaBeFlyer

I agree - I think the interview will be your biggest hurdle. I thought you had to wait something like 4 months before reapplying if you release (not sure)...As Frederik G mentioned, do a search. Good luck with whatever you decide.


----------



## NJL

Great white, I also made the big mistake of VRing during BMQ (for different reasons than you) and am planning on replying asap...
here's my post I started about a month ago on the topic: 
http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/52927.0.html

You gotta wait at least 6 months (from release) before re-applying... I know it sucks, but I only got a couple months left to wait. PM me if you got some more questions.


----------



## retiredgrunt45

Good your you!! Get back on that horse!!, Just try and remember that during your military career, there will be verbal dressing downs and not to take them so personally, especially during basic training. It takes courage to admit that one has erred, but the important thing is not to give up.

 In time you will learn some self dicipline and grow a thick skin and eventually you will learn to take everything in stride. Just remember that someday you may be the one doing the shouting.


----------



## Dog

+1 to the question. Does anyone have a general time-frame of how long it's been taking over the past couple months? I've been waiting about 2 months now, and have yet to be told that it's come through.


----------



## vyrago

Sadly, ive been waiting 4 months so far and I cant wait anymore.  I've accepted a full time civvy job, sorry CF but I just cant wait for ya.  Rather ridiculous considering we're somewhat a nation "at war".


----------



## mysteriousmind

2 month is nothing trust me. 

do not give up. Every thing is going get settle eventually.


----------



## career_radio-checker

vyrago said:
			
		

> Sadly, ive been waiting 4 months so far and I cant wait anymore.  I've accepted a full time civvy job, sorry CF but I just cant wait for ya.  Rather ridiculous considering we're somewhat a nation "at war".



Sad to hear that, but we aren't really 'a nation at war'. There is no rationing, no draft, 1 in 10 citizens are not in uniform, and there are no black out hours. We are just 'at war'.


----------



## goingback

Mine took about 2 months


----------



## geo

Heh... would appear that the US military has been approving people with long criminal records to serve.  

Imagine, training the "Crips", organising em into better street gangs 

Now that the press has gotten a hold of the story, we can only hope that they will do better into their VFS


----------



## TN2IC

vyrago said:
			
		

> Sadly, ive been waiting 4 months so far and I cant wait anymore.  I've accepted a full time civvy job, sorry CF but I just cant wait for ya.  Rather ridiculous considering we're somewhat a nation "at war".



I waited for 2 years...2 years. And that was for a CT...skilled. Now you want to pipe up? Just don't put all your eggs in one basket. Enjoy life.


----------



## geo

Heh.... CT from same trade to same trade, per CDS was supposed to be 5 days.....

Oh well, work in progress.


----------



## TN2IC

Yeah it was pretty sad... but worth it after I seen my first pay cheque. 15% is a lot. Even if I drop a rank. It worth the wait.


----------



## wack-in-iraq

I figure this is the right forum for this, if not please move it where it belongs.

After leaving the army in 2004 I took a job offer and went to Iraq for a year and change. I did my time there, and managed to make it out with a few pretty cool scars, and a fat load of cash.

Now that I have come back and adjusted to civillian life I realise I want back into the army. I want to have my education paid for and do something I enjoy while taking my distance learning. 

Heres the kicker. Even though I am 031 regular force trained and experienced, along with lots of off the record training in Iraq, the army is giving me a hell of a time getting back in. My application has been in for over 6 months now, and I am getting told this is just the beginning. 

All my med docs, and VFS have come through, but it is the security clearance that is killing me. I did a huge form, which pretty much outlines my entire life for the last 10 years (not the normal one you do when signing up, this is a bigger one) and provided them with all the details of my time in Iraq, along with contacts of my employers, and records of US DoD certificates (proving I was legally in country).

So even with all this they are telling me it could take YEARS to get back in. There is no way anything takes this long, especially not with the technollogy that can be used.  If I havent heard back from them by September I am just going to say screw it and do my own thing again, but I would rather serve my own country.

Yes, I know we need to ensure our servicemen are secure, but there is no way it should take a matter of years. We are talking about someone who is trained, and wants to join a combat unit, something the CF should be jumping at.

Anyone got any advice on how to make this go smoother ?


----------



## geo

The thing is hung up at the VFS level.... which means, investigation of activities that you have had since releasing from the Reg force.....
- Activities carried out in Iraq - which the CF, SIU, CSIS will probably have a hell of a time checking / vetting.

Wonder if "Infidel 6" is in the area.... he might have some ideas - given that he too has contracted out.

In the meantime... good luck


----------



## George Wallace

I might add that there is also the questions about how you were Released in the first place.  I remember three friends putting in their requests for Release to go to Alaska.  Two wrote neutral memos, while the third really slammed the Regiment and the CF.  A year or two later, all three tried to get back into the CF.  Two did.  The third had burnt his bridges when he left, and was an 'undesirable' when it came to trying to get back in.  Anyone in a similar position, should remember to never burn their bridges behind them, as it will come back to bite you in the end.


----------



## wack-in-iraq

Just to clear the air, I was released on good terms. Obviously it is the Iraq thing that is holding me back.

All I want is some advice that people might have to speed up the process. Please, lets not turn this into a flame thread.


----------



## riggermade

Wack 

I think there are enough recuiters on here someone may have some advice


----------



## geo

From my perspective, I think this is beyond the recruiters.
Verification of former service isn't the hard part, it's the time spent after your release from the Regs.... and that has to be looked into by the nice people at CSIS, RCMP, SIU &/or other similar agency.


----------



## beach_bum

geo said:
			
		

> From my perspective, I think this is beyond the recruiters.
> Verification of former service isn't the hard part, it's the time spent after your release from the Regs.... and that has to be looked into by the nice people at CSIS, RCMP, SIU &/or other similar agency.



That's exactly where the problem is.  It's out of the recruiting centres control.  I don't think there is any advice you will receive, or anything you can do to speed this up.


----------



## aesop081

I would like to say something meaningful, or say that i feel bad for you but here's how it is

I have been waiting 3 years for my security clearance to come through , and i need to have it for the job i am already in !!!

The people that do this stuff are very understaffed and overworked, i have talked to them directly....

good luck


----------



## Dilea_Gu_Bas

Vyrago what area command do you fall under LFCA?


----------



## mysteriousmind

vyrago said:
			
		

> Sadly, ive been waiting 4 months so far and I cant wait anymore.  I've accepted a full time civvy job, sorry CF but I just cant wait for ya.  Rather ridiculous considering we're somewhat a nation "at war".



Let me laugh 4 month is nothing...if you were not able to wait...perhaps you were not meant to join in....  We are not "at war", we are present in a war zone but not at war.

some people said they waited 2 years... I hope you will have no regrets doing so...I'm in waiting (409 days today) and if i have to wait an other year then be it... the army (even Pres for me) is not just a "job" it is more then that.

God luck in you civvie job.


----------



## Keebler

Hurry up and WAIT as they say.

My VFS only took about a month and a half, but thats because my former unit had my docs there easily accessed and not archived. So if they have been archived they have to find them and send them still...so definately at very least a few months. I was told mine could take up to a year, i was very surprised when they called to book my interview and medical, i wasnt expecting to hear from them for a few months.


----------



## vyrago

I was going through CFRC Winnipeg.  I havent cancelled my application, but with the nature of my civilian job (network administrator), I dont see how I would be able to get time off for summer training.  as it stands, im not holding my breath anymore.  if the recruiting center calls and things in my life facilitate joining back up then I will, if not then I wont.  I fully expected some angry comebacks at my post, im just surprised that there isnt more resentment from those having to wait so long.  

its as if in saying that you cant put your life on hold for the army is somehow an insult to everyone in a uniform?  Please dont forget that I wore the infantry capbadge for 5 years, so im not here to piss anyone off just by saying that I can no longer keep crossing my fingers for a phone call.


----------



## bravo2824

I had to wait 3 years to apply and i have now completed 4 months of waiting for my call, they've been telling me any week now for the past 2 months, but thats ok. I'd say the wait will be well worth it, then freaking out and loosing interest after a couple months of waiting for a call like a nice chunk of people on this site. The soldier i want watching my back in the infantry would be someone who's had the patients to wait like i did for my chance in the forces.
at this point there calling my references that i had provided.  
bring it on month 5    ;D


----------



## dardt

Assuming the only training one has is BMQ (old course, Reg F 2005). Is a recruit school bypass likely to be given upon re-enrollment considering the new BMQ has been extended (incorporating aspects from SQ) ? That is, are they considered equivalent when determining RSBP.


----------



## bravo2824

to add on to my last post, i spoke with my recruiter today and i will be starting basic on march the 12th   He also said that the RCR where full but they have created more openings for troops, and that the ppcli need a ton of troops  so i will be with the ppcli


----------



## geo

Keebler said:
			
		

> Hurry up and WAIT as they say.
> 
> My VFS only took about a month and a half, but thats because* my former unit had my docs there easily accessed and not archived.* So if they have been archived they have to find them and send them still...so definately at very least a few months. I was told mine could take up to a year, i was very surprised when they called to book my interview and medical, i wasnt expecting to hear from them for a few months.



For reserves.....
Once your unit processes your release - regardless of release type, your file is sent to brigade, that sends it to the area HQ which looks after HR Mil management.  Once the release is processed, your file is then stored at area HQ for 3 years before being sent to National Archives.

If your unit still had your file, you would not have been released....


----------



## pylon

Bravo,

Congrats and good luck.  Give em hell.



kc


----------



## Dog

I've got another question WRT the VFS; why exactly would I need to have one done if I've never really left the system? I released from the Reg force, to the Supp Res (tried going to a PRes unit, but no one did any of the paperwork required, before my release) I got my file transferred to 33 CER, was told to show up for parade in January where they requested my availability for this summer and then promptly told me that I couldn't show up again until my VFS was complete.
 My understanding of the purpose behind the VFS is that it's to ensure that I didn't desert my Reg force unit, or that I wasn't kicked out. But if either of those scenarios had happened I wouldn't have been put on the Supp Res in the first place, no?


----------



## geo

VFS is intended to uncover all details on an individual
This will include an analysis of Disciplinary & administrative measures on file, PERs, Medical file, the works.  
Unless you did a Component transfer, there is the possibility of gaps in your service and the VFS is intended to look after that.

From your profile, I can't identify you pedigree but will assume you were with 2 CER until your release to the Suplist... As a member of the sup list, you can be activated/employed by a Reg OR res unit... until such time as you are taken on strength with 33CER.

Ask the OR to request your activation from the Supp list.  Ex regs in the sup list work regularly with the Cadets, Rangers and PRes....  Supp list personnel can be employed up to 6 months with a unit - at which time, people have to get off the pot & get you TOS'd


----------



## Mamma Bear

Guess its who you end up speaking to because my previous service was more than 10 yrs ago...alot more..And i received my Recruit Bypass in November 2006 and presently patiently awaiting my Course in Borden...Thank god for small miracles...mine is a way too long of a story to post on here..trust me


----------



## Dog

Geo,

I took the information that you posted above to a friend of mine who works in the Puzzle Palace for 33 CBG recruiting and this is what he had to say:

"Bad news...

What he told you is "how things are supposed to work" purely theoretical, but doesnt apply to your situation. While your VFS should not take longer than a week, unfortunately at this point in time LFCA is experiencing major staffing issues which puts current VFS timelines down to 3-4 months. Since the unit didn't submit it until just prior to the Xmas break I suspect that it'll be a while before you get your TOS issued."

So anyone waiting for a VFS from LFCA, there you go, that's why it's taking so long.


----------



## geo

ah well..... LFQA goes thru that particuar meat grinder in August...... 
troops away for 6 mths
staff officers away for 9 mths...

In the meantime - if there is a cl B employment available (course or work)
they can request your activation from the Supp list..... it's done all the time.


----------



## great_white

Today marks the END of the fourth month...  I am 2 months away from being able to submit another application to the Forces.  I have been informed that the process will not take as long this time around.   I have one expectation this time, to never quit.  Four months have passed since i was last at CFB Borden on BMQ.  In the time that has passed, looking back all that seems to matter is  MENTALITY!  
I am a strong patient man, capable of anything I put my mind to!  My mind is still focused on matters/memories that took place in Borden.  I will always be able to distinguish the positive influence the military had on my life between the negative feelings i had because of a sudden change.  
Army or not...here i come!


----------



## dardt

Mamma Bear said:
			
		

> Guess its who you end up speaking to because my previous service was more than 10 yrs ago...alot more..And i received my Recruit Bypass in November 2006 and presently patiently awaiting my Course in Borden...Thank god for small miracles...mine is a way too long of a story to post on here..trust me



To a certain extent yes, I've already received different opinions from CFRC personnel. I'm looking to find out what guidelines the board uses when reviewing PLAR's for RSBP, specifically when the only training one has is BMQ.


----------



## SoF

I received a bypass for my reserve bmq, ofcourse that was only after a few months of completing bmq.


----------



## bravo2824

pylon said:
			
		

> Bravo,
> 
> Congrats and good luck.  Give em hell.
> 
> 
> 
> kc



Thanks  and i sure will


----------



## Dog

Does anybody know if writing my member of parliament is a viable option for speeding up the VFS? Or is this the sort of thing where everyone's hands are tied? Would it be worth the effort do you think?

The reason I ask is that aside from not knowing who my current member of parliament is (I've moved in the last 6 months) I've never actually considered writing him/her for anything before. And don't really know if they are able to influence the speed of something like a VFS... I've heard of people writing their MP in order to speed up the initial recruiting process, but I don't know if the nature of the VFS is different enough that it won't matter, or if it could, in fact, slow it down.

Any suggestions would be helpful.


----------



## mysteriousmind

sit back and enjoy...you are talking to a master in waiting...VFS will go trough...

Don't contact your parliment, it would not be well seen if you get a decree that says to pass you in the fast lane...you would probably be miserable. 

get in the line an wait. there are people in front and behind.


The army way: Wait.


----------



## Dog

Why would it be a problem? My unit has a whole whack of recruits that started basic trg just this year... I'm already past them when it comes to that, I just don't want to miss out on my summer courses, since that delays my training by a year... a year that I don't want to wait. I'm already dreading the time it comes for me to do a CT...

This whole "sit back and wait, it'll be worth it, and make you a more dedicated soldier" argument is a lousy excuse to let bureaucracy run amok... I should be working with my unit already. I should have been activated from the supp list already. I should have already had my VFS complete. I'm not content to sit back and watch my file drown in red tape, since I just found out that my time on the supp list is limited since I don't have a 3's course yet...

So why exactly would writing my MP be a bad idea... who would make my life miserable when I'm already behind the timeframe that a VFS is supposed to take? It's supposed to take weeks, not months.

http://www.forces.gc.ca/crs/pdfs/rsrc_e.pdf


----------



## mysteriousmind

look, even if you VFS gets in...that is not sign that all your paper work is done, you still have to do interview, test, and, job offer...Ive been waiting 15 months (in 3 days) for a transfer.

you missing this summer BMQ? really..let me cry  :crybaby:. Ive miss 3 BMQ and I'm still motivated to join in.

If you don't do it this summer....you will do it part time in autumn or in winter. 

Its life...if i would have 10$ each time I would have been suppose to have a fast access to something, I would have been rich.

When I joined CIC in 1997-1998 it took 14 months also...

Its a fact of life, they are trying to get te process faster but the systems is not perfect. 

I thnk you should think to change that negative attitude..otherwise you will be often disappointed


----------



## Dog

I'm not missing BMQ, as I've already done it along with my SQ... when I was in the reg force only 6 months ago. Any infantry training I did is irrelevant since I've changed trades to Engineer.

I want a QL3 this summer because those are NOT conducted again until next year, and I'd rather have some training under my belt, and possibly a tour, before I CT back to the reg force... especially since ENG training is supposed to be at least nearing the equivalent of reg force training. I don't want to be 30 years old and still a Private.

Not to mention I have a wife who wouldn't mind if I actually had a decent career that made me happy, since she has to live with me.


----------



## geo

Dog said:
			
		

> Does anybody know if writing my member of parliament is a viable option for speeding up the VFS? Or is this the sort of thing where everyone's hands are tied? Would it be worth the effort do you think?
> 
> The reason I ask is that aside from not knowing who my current member of parliament is (I've moved in the last 6 months) I've never actually considered writing him/her for anything before. And don't really know if they are able to influence the speed of something like a VFS... I've heard of people writing their MP in order to speed up the initial recruiting process, but I don't know if the nature of the VFS is different enough that it won't matter, or if it could, in fact, slow it down.
> 
> Any suggestions would be helpful.



Launching a Ministerial inquiry on the process of a VFS?
If anything, yo'll slow things down more than speed it up.....

However, if you feel like you have to... go ahead and fill your boots BUT service won't be any faster.


----------



## RetiredRoyal

Good day,

If any are considering re-enrolling, here's my experience.

Aug 06         Online Application
Sep 06         CFRC Phones me
Sep 06         Take doc's etc to CFRC and they request VFS
Dec 06          VFS Returns, shows outstanding kit from reserve transfer
Jan 07           Return Kit plus file lost stores report for kit stolen from locker
Feb 07          Pay $400 for kit that could not be written off.
Mar 07          CFRG waives to allow re-enrollment
April 07         Interview and Part I & II medical

If you were an AVN, AVS  etc and got out...they need people. They're trying to generate 200 tradesmen. You will not have to do the aptitude test if you are 'skilled' nor will you have to go to basic, even if you've been out over 10 yrs. One of my students just re-enrolled after 12 yrs on the streets. He was an AFT and has since departed for Borden. He did have to do the CFAT as he never IOC converted but was a recruit school bypass.

If you are skilled, ex-air force NCM and want to re-enroll contact : 

Chief Warrant Officer Tom Walker at
walker.wt@forces.gc.ca or 1-866-355-8195. 

He heads up the Air Force Intake and Liason Team. The Chief has been very helpful in keeping some of the other parties concerned motivated and liasing with the recruiting center to keep the ball rolling. His goal is to turn your 12 month experience into a 6 week experienc, if possible. I was told by a MCpl in supply that he wasn't in a position push a young LT into action...the Chief did when I let him know.

You'll notice that VFS is a long wait....


----------



## CFR FCS

Retired Royal, 
This is good int. Too bad someone nobody has shared it with the recruiting staff. I'm sure a change in this direction would be welcomed by the attractions staff at CFRG to share with the unfortunate people who don't read Army.ca. Maybe this is why some people are disenchanted with the recruiting system, we only can give out the information we actually have. If you want to re-enrol it does take time as most personnel  files are sent to the National Archives and have to be requested from another government department. Their priorities aren't always the same as ours. remember the old soldiers saying  " hurry up ... and wait"


----------



## Dog

Okay, quick update for any of you who might still be interested in knowing how long these things take...

It seems the email to my MP either worked, or it ended up falling on deaf ears and the process just ended up dying a natural death... either way I'm now officially re-activated and will be a deployable sapper by september of this year. 

So here's how it went: the VFS was initiated in January and I received a phone call on April 11 telling me that it had been completed. So, there you have it... a current example of how long a VFS takes.

Give it 6 more months, and this timeline will probably be obsolete... but for now... there you go.


----------



## geo

15 jan - 11 april = +/- 90 days... all in all, you're doing good.

Chimo!


----------



## Keebler

Mine only took a month and a half to be verified and they had to find my file from 1995 - 1996.


----------



## Transmundane

geez... some of these timeframes are scary... 2 years for a CT?!? I've mentioned in other threads that CFRC's just waiting on my background check. What's after that? The Fitness Test, yeah. What else? And how long does the background check take? Things seem to be moving pretty quickly for me so far...


----------



## geo

Trans... some of these CTs are... not ordinary.
Mysterious is presently a CIC and has applied to go into the reserves - which is, in actual fact, a ab-normal enrollment.  Things should go faster now.  There was a recent change of regulation that resolved issues with the defenition of "officer" in the Cadet & Ranger movement.


----------



## mysteriousmind

Geo, 

I was not aware of this information, is possible if you happen to fall on this info to send me a link, a reference, or a pdf files about it, It would be appreciate.


thanks,


----------



## wilburforce

first let me say that i have researched this on the site and found many results but i cant seem to reply in those posts.

a brief history: 

Graduated basic,  made it to last week SQ took an injury that took me off course sent to pat platoon.  While on pat pl my family experienced some difficulty's requiring that i leave the forces with every intention of returning when i could.

I have been out for 1 yr now and that time has come and my questions are,
1. do I repeat bmq.
2. can I change trades. 


p.s. the injury was resolved but my VR was put in while in physio so no recourse
p.s.s I also understand the best thing to do would be to phone my local but as i work the hours that there open its proving difficult.

i apologize if this was posted before and i didn't locate it.

thanks in advance

W.F.


----------



## stealthylizard

Only out for a year?  I would probably say they would have you bypass BMQ provided you can of course meet the physical requirements.  You could probably change trades quite easily, if they have the room.  Don't take my words for any of it though, Just my $0.02 cents from what I have read/understood previously.


----------



## geo

if you have only been out for a year, then any qualification you have should carry over, the partial qualifications will all get flushed.

The kicker will be to get your medical category validated


----------



## wilburforce

my injury was rather wierd.  it wasnt very bad so i dinnt get a p-cat or a t-cat it kept me down for long enough to miss a p.o. and while i was on pat i got some physio work done on something that had happend in bmq.


----------



## geo

In that case.... good luck
and let us know how things turn out
CHIMO!


----------



## ChristianMN

I joined the reg force about five months ago give or take a few days. While I was on course in Saint Jean I had a number of family issues arise at home. I made the decision that I was going to VR and rejoin the military as a primary reservist. I am in the process of doing that now and my question is how long would you suggest this is going to take? 

I would like to get back into the forces as soon as possible and I know that my initial enrolment took nearly nine months. Seeing as I have already gone through the application process, and my information is still in the DND shouldn't the process go faster this time around?

 ???


----------



## kincanucks

You have to wait six months before you can reapply and yes it shouldn't take too long but it depends where you are applying at and how busy they are.  From what I understand reservists are not a priority around this time of the year because if you haven't been enrolled by now they will wait until after the summer period to process you.


----------



## ChristianMN

Actually I was told by both my file manager and staff in Saint Jean that I am allowed to join the primary reserves or Canadian rangers immediately after my VR from the reg force is complete. I'm not allowed to join the reg force for six months, but that's it. 

I'm glad to hear it will go more quickly. Why is it then that they're asking me to complete a full application again?


----------



## medaid

Something that I know could happen for individuals getting out of the RegF was to contact a PRes unit that they would like to be in, get the position number sent up, and the idea is that the release cell at the Base you're on could just CT you DOWN to the PRes. That's what I've done for some of the Reg F personnel who have retired from the RegF or just wanted to get out, but not completely.


----------



## kincanucks

_my file manager and staff in Saint Jean _ Told you BS.

_Something that I know could happen for individuals getting out of the RegF was to contact a PRes unit that they would like to be in, get the position number sent up, and the idea is that the release cell at the Base you're on could just CT you DOWN to the PRes. _ 

And that would be after serving honourably for years rather than a few months and then quitting because of _I had a number of family issues arise at home_.


----------



## medaid

Roger that kincanucks, I was just saying that it wold be a possibility. But thanks for clarifying it for me as well


----------



## ChristianMN

kincanucks said:
			
		

> _my file manager and staff in Saint Jean _ Told you BS.
> 
> _Something that I know could happen for individuals getting out of the RegF was to contact a PRes unit that they would like to be in, get the position number sent up, and the idea is that the release cell at the Base you're on could just CT you DOWN to the PRes. _
> 
> And that would be after serving honourably for years rather than a few months and then quitting because of _I had a number of family issues arise at home_.


Well it seems they didn't, because my primary reserve unit, the Calgary Highland Regiment is processing my information now. They're doing exactly what the staff in Saint Jean told me they would do.


----------



## Remius

There used to be a six month wait requirement upon release.  That's pretty much on the way out.  Recruiting centres will start processing people even within the six month waiting period.  However it can take some time to get your former documents and medical records as they may be in transit or still in St-Jean.  So yes it isn'st a problem re-applying just don't expect the fastest processing time due to admin.  

Yes you need to re-apply as your old file was closed.  Your birth certificate, school tarnscripts should all still be good.   You probably don't need an aptitude test as long as you qualify for the Pres trade you applied for.  Medical should for the most part be good as well, unless there are any serious changes.  An update interview will also be required.  You are reapplying, that's why you need to fill out the paperwork.  That's it that's all.

And for those that are curious a CT from St-Jean to the Pres is very, very unlikely.  As in not going to happen.


----------



## RetiredRoyal

RetiredRoyal said:
			
		

> Good day,
> 
> If any are considering re-enrolling, here's my experience.
> 
> Aug 06         Online Application
> Sep 06         CFRC Phones me
> Sep 06         Take doc's etc to CFRC and they request VFS
> Dec 06          VFS Returns, shows outstanding kit from reserve transfer
> Jan 07           Return Kit plus file lost stores report for kit stolen from locker
> Feb 07          Pay $400 for kit that could not be written off.
> Mar 07          CFRG waives to allow re-enrollment
> April 07         Interview and Part I & II medical
> 
> If you were an AVN, AVS  etc and got out...they need people. They're trying to generate 200 tradesmen. You will not have to do the aptitude test if you are 'skilled' nor will you have to go to basic, even if you've been out over 10 yrs. One of my students just re-enrolled after 12 yrs on the streets. He was an AFT and has since departed for Borden. He did have to do the CFAT as he never IOC converted but was a recruit school bypass.
> 
> If you are skilled, ex-air force NCM and want to re-enroll contact :
> 
> Chief Warrant Officer Tom Walker at
> walker.wt@forces.gc.ca or 1-866-355-8195.
> 
> He heads up the Air Force Intake and Liason Team. The Chief has been very helpful in keeping some of the other parties concerned motivated and liasing with the recruiting center to keep the ball rolling. His goal is to turn your 12 month experience into a 6 week experience, if possible. I was told by a MCpl in supply that he wasn't in a position push a young LT into action...the Chief did when I let him know.
> 
> You'll notice that VFS is a long wait....



So latest is:
9 May 07 3 Month post Lasik Appt
1 June 07 Aircrew Vision 
4 June 07 Aircrew Part II Medical (bloodwork, ECG etc)
7 June 07 Docs off to Ottawa etc.

June 13th...waiting.


----------



## NJL

Crantor said:
			
		

> However it can take some time to get your former documents and medical records as they may be in transit or still in St-Jean.



So true, I'm rejoining the reg force after a VR during BMQ.. everything is completed (VFS/PLAR,etc) except for getting my previous med docs... I reapplied back on Feb 15 not sure why the med docs are taking so long .. I'm keeping updated w/ my CFRC and trying to find out why the delay (no previous med problems)... while waiting sucks (big time) it's gonna be worth it..just gotta stay patient.


----------



## RetiredRoyal

15 June 07 Docs clear Medical Review Officer in Ottawa, go to Toronto for Air Factor (happens to be my 42nd birthday, too)


----------



## NJL

I reapplied back in Feb 07 after making the stupid mistake of VRing and have been waiting since then to get my interview/medical done... I stayed in contact w/ my CFRC getting regular updates and for the past few months was being told that everything is done(PLAR/VFS,etc) except we're just waiting on your previous med docs to come back fr St. Jean... I finally found out today that that the request for them was being sent to people that no longer work at St.Jean and that the people in St.Jean weren't getting the request.. The request was resent last week to the proper people.. so my question to my booking clerk was "This isn't gonna take another three months months is it?" He said "no it should only take a couple weeks".. my interview/medical is now scheduled for 2 weeks today.  While the waiting has been frustrating I'm just glad that the ball is finally rolling.


----------



## Fry

At least the ball is rolling. Either call them up in two weeks for an update or ask them when you go in for your interview/medical.


----------



## RetiredRoyal

RetiredRoyal said:
			
		

> 15 June 07 Docs clear Medical Review Officer in Ottawa, go to Toronto for Air Factor (happens to be my 42nd birthday, too)



04 Jul 07 Docs still in Toronto for Air Factor.

Talked to file manager this am, she says that DRDC Toronto, or at least the department doing the Air Factors has been/is closed for about a month to move. Go figure, send my file to a closed department.


----------



## NJL

Sorry if it wasn't clear.. my interview/medical is scheduled for July 17


----------



## Fry

From your post, I figured it to be around there. If they said a few weeks, I'd go on that. However, I applied in July 2006 and got a call in December that my documents had arrived back to CFRC from Borden.


----------



## aesop081

NJL.....

I remember reading the same thing in another thread.....same info same story.

Was it realy necessary to start another thread with the same thing ?

army.ca staff


----------



## NJL

CDN Aviator....

Just figured I'd start a new topic in case someone did a seach/ or didn't read my previous thread.. if you wanna lock this topic I understand.


----------



## RetiredRoyal

RetiredRoyal said:
			
		

> 04 Jul 07 Docs still in Toronto for Air Factor.
> 
> Talked to file manager this am, she says that DRDC Toronto, or at least the department doing the Air Factors has been/is closed for about a month to move. Go figure, send my file to a closed department.



13 July 07 (Yes, Friday the 13th) Air Factor awarded, docs cleared for Borden to formulate offer.


----------



## Federalist_frog

Hi, I used to be in te canadian forces last year (2006) at least I did my BMQ in Valcartier from may to august. I've finish best student and best athlete, so im not some kind of fuck all. After that, my fiance finally realized that she didn't like the military way of life for our relationship... So with some pression from the family I decided to retire from the army in october. It's not been yet a year and Gosh I miss the army way of life. I'm still with my girl but I,ve kinda change my way of seing things... I'm not happy at the university despite being an overaverage student. I don't want to be an officer,, well not yet... I don'T believe that I have what it takes to lead men... I would be interrest in rejoining as an armour personnel (what I used to be) or in the infantry. I would like to know if anyone knows if the army really likes to re-enroll personnel? and if yes what can I do except (phys test) to be more interresting for them? 

Thanx a lot

 Federalist Frog


----------



## Meridian

Plenty of folks re-enrol.  

Head down to a CFRC and have a chat with them. 
You will need to think about and be able to explain in your interview why you left the first time, and what is different this go around that means you won't leave a second time.

Good luck!


----------



## RetiredRoyal

funny, nobody in the system ever asked why I got out and I'd actually written down all my points and put them into a bit of a speach/answer so I'd know how to answer.

 I know another gent who has been out as long as me, was the same trade and he has to write an essay for the Military Career Counselor on why he got out and why he'd be a better soldier now.


----------



## Meridian

My guess is it all depends on circumstance....  plenty of Recruiting folk around here have been saying for some time how that every situation is different.


----------



## NJL

I had my interview last tuesday (7/17) after Vring during BMQ.. it went great, was told I scored better than last time. The captain that interviewed me never really asked about why I left/what's different.. if fact I was the one who made a point of pointing out  my reasons/ whats changed.. he basically said "it's good that you've learned from your mistakes and are correcting them" and it (VRing) happens.


----------



## Whalley

Ive been in for about a year now. tried to switch trades, but wasnt able to due to red flags.  SO I am a VR got another month till im out but I am going to join back up in the desired trade. Anyways, my question;  The time it takes to reenlist was at 6 months.  I heard it was lowered but I dont know if this is true.  Does anyone here know if this is true?  If so lowered to how long?  Chimo


----------



## the 48th regulator

> Ive been in for about a year now. tried to switch trades, but wasn't able to due to red flags.



Is it me, or are there some spaces here.  If you already red flagged what makes you think you can get back in?  You know that they will have your file readily available.

Wouldn't you agree this sounds a bit, how can I put this politely, sensless?

dileas

tess


----------



## Whalley

im not joining back up in the same trade...


----------



## Whalley

sorry read that wrong.  I am not red flagged.  The combat engineers is a red flag traded, youre not able to transfer out of it.


----------



## BC Old Guy

The intent on enrolment is to keep people in the occupation they joined for at least 3 to 4 years.  This allows for training to be completed, and for some employment in occupation - hopefully a deployment.  The new enrolment form provides better layout of this information.

How long it will take to get back in will depend a lot on what your CFAT score was, and what occupation(s) you want.  The occupations that are open throughout the year are the Combat Arms and the Technical occupations - especially Navy Technical occupations.  If you have university entrance math and science you would be a good fit for the Technical occupations - if not, it will be harder.


----------



## kincanucks

I have been told that the six month waiting period is no longer in effect but it can take that long to get your paperwork to re-enrol you into another trade.  Which is fine by me because, IMHO, the recruiting system should not be used as OT facilitator for those people that don't like their current trades and want to change.  They didn't have to pick the trade in the first place and shouldn't be wasting valuable resources to change now.


----------



## sigtech

kincanucks said:
			
		

> Which is fine by me because, IMHO, the recruiting system should not be used as OT facilitator for those people that don't like their current trades and want to change.  They didn't have to pick the trade in the first place and shouldn't be wasting valuable resources to change now.



No the recruiting system shouldn't be used as a OT facilitartor, this slows down the process for new members joining. If you don't like you trade spend your time and ot later, you can OT our of Red Flagg trades it just takes longer then a normal OT


----------



## JLeclerc

When I went through in a very similar story, the 6 months period stands. This gives the time to your unit to filter you out of the system and archive your files in the proper places.

It takes quite a bit of time to get your files back together and in order after you decide to do this, so trust me...be extra patient. Doing it this way will cost you many many extra months.

On the other hand, I obtained a waiver from the commander of the recruit station I re-applied to that granted me immediate right to go through and forgo the wait time.

Best of luck!


----------



## Whalley

as for not liking my trade and knowing what I was getting into, shouldnt have picked it all that stuff you were talking about...  When I applied I was told by the recruiters to just put down any combat arms trade and then transfer to the trade I wanted after basic, because it would get me in the military faster.  So I did, and then was told I wasnt allowed to OT.  
But none the less thanks for your input.


----------



## sigtech

Whalley said:
			
		

> as for not liking my trade and knowing what I was getting into, shouldnt have picked it all that stuff you were talking about...  When I applied I was told by the recruiters to just put down any combat arms trade and then transfer to the trade I wanted after basic, because it would get me in the military faster.  So I did, and then was told I wasnt allowed to OT.
> But none the less thanks for your input.



To Play devils advocate I understand your issue the recurting system fails at times , but why get out , take the time build some rank senority and get paid to do it. Remember if you get out it could take a long time to get back in. Trades you are interested in can be closed faster then you think. If you enjoy the forces then stick it out

That is all


----------



## Lozio

I was in the Army before doin my courses up in Meaford. I VRd on my DP1 course now its been 7months and i feel its been the worst mistake of my life. I had family reason to leave the military but now i wanna comeback. I was no shit pump i held my own. I was wonderin if any of you VRd and cameback and how was the steps you had to go through to get back. I did call and they still have my file and info was wonderin also if they take long to review me or do they go straight to physical and medical ytraining and get me back in it. Thank you


----------



## Michael OLeary

Although some here may be able to tell you their stories of getting back in after a VR, no-one can say for certain how long it will take for you.

Your best bet is to get yourself to the CFRC as soon as possible and get the process started.


----------



## RetiredRoyal

RetiredRoyal said:
			
		

> 13 July 07 (Yes, Friday the 13th) Air Factor awarded, docs cleared for Borden to formulate offer.



Since my file cleared Toronto I've been getting a bit of a run around that I won't go into detail about until I sign my offer. Short story is that left and right hands aren't coordinated and its taking ages to get my offer written up.


----------



## Remius

A lot of things go into it.  One, they need to locate your old pers docs and medical file.  If you reapplied within six months of releasing their is a strong chance that your file may be in transit or in between admin. procedures.  This can cause delays.  Also, if you were in, a prior learning assessment takes place to see what you qualify as/for.  This is for your benefit as well as the CF's.

One thing though, despite the length of time it takes to get back in, and the procedures it takes, ultimately you made the decision to leave the CF.  Complain all you want about the procedures but you have but yourselves to blame at the end of the day.  Now I'm not knocking anyone for leaving for whatever reason.  Just keep in mind that you are the architect of what is happening now with your file.

Good luck to all.


----------



## klee519

Federalist_frog said:
			
		

> Hi, I used to be in te canadian forces last year (2006) at least I did my BMQ in Valcartier from may to august. I've finish best student and best athlete, so im not some kind of frig all. After that, my fiance finally realized that she didn't like the military way of life for our relationship... So with some pression from the family I decided to retire from the army in october. It's not been yet a year and Gosh I miss the army way of life. I'm still with my girl but I,ve kinda change my way of seing things... I'm not happy at the university despite being an overaverage student. I don't want to be an officer,, well not yet... I don'T believe that I have what it takes to lead men... I would be interrest in rejoining as an armour personnel (what I used to be) or in the infantry. I would like to know if anyone knows if the army really likes to re-enroll personnel? and if yes what can I do except (phys test) to be more interresting for them?
> 
> Thanx a lot
> 
> Federalist Frog
> 
> You can switch to reserve service, so you can have time to accomplish your university and have time with you gf and family. One day when you done school and divorce, you can get back into regular force without starting BMq all over again.


----------



## vyrago

I was released from the Primary Reserve in Feb 1997, I re-applied for Re-enrollment to the reserves in October of 2006 but its already August of 2007 and still waiting for VFS, Have I missed the window to be granted RSBP?  It might have an impact on my continued interest as im 32 years old now.


----------



## PMedMoe

To the best of my knowledge, RSBP can be granted if the time between service periods is 5 years or less, however, every situation is different.  When I got back in the Reg Force in 1995, I received a RSBP, however, I had been in the Reg Force before, had just left the Res F less than a year before and there was a very short time between my swearing in (after the May long weekend) and the beginning of my QL3 crse (05 Jun).  You would have to check with your local unit.


----------



## geo

Well, under normal circumstances, you certainly have missed the boat as far as retaining all your rank & trade qualifications.  To date we are talking about 9+ years and much has changed in the subject matter we teach our reservists.

Will you be forced to start from the bottom & work your way up, not for me to say, but you have a lot of catching up to do.

Talk to your recruiter &  good Luck!


----------



## vyrago

I would be going into a different trade, so I dont care about previous rank or previous trade courses, I would just prefer to avoid doing basic again and get right into my 'new' trade.


----------



## Blakey

Did you call your recruiter?


----------



## RetiredRoyal

RetiredRoyal said:
			
		

> 15 June 07 Docs clear Medical Review Officer in Ottawa, go to Toronto for Air Factor (happens to be my 42nd birthday, too)



Well, I did a telephone interview with recruiting yesterday ( 5 Sep 07) because the trade I was initially interviewed for isn't the one i'm going in as my entry trade it's a long story but my enrollment trade is generally not direct entry. They had to ask me the basic interview questions based on the other trade.

I was advised today that my position for my post course posting has been given a position number and that I have two upcoming course dates and should receive my offer in the next few days. First course date is Sept 17th here in Winnipeg. Kind of curious where I'll be attached or ordered to report during the month between my courses as my current residence is not the same as the intended posting unit and my October course is in neither of those places.

So far it's taken 13 months. Some of it my fault as I had LASIK and waited the 3 months before submitting my medical stuff from my doctor and had some reserve kit issues to deal with. My stuff was removed from my locker when they reno'd the hangar and disappeared. I filed a loss kit report instead of paying for it which ate up another month or so.


----------



## ShediacNB

Hi everyone. I realize this question will be addressed by medical staff. I am just wondering if anyone knows of any cases where a similar thing has happened or if anyone has any insight as to what could possibly happen.  When I was enrolled I disclosed ALL pertinent and relevant information about my medical history.  I have ADHD. When i mentioned this to the medic at the recruiting centre, I was given a form for my doctor to fill out. I returned the form and my medical was accepted. I was enrolled and went to Borden for BMQ Sept 10th. While I was there, I spoke to a doctor at the MIR. I dont know if it was the stress of just being there or what it was but I had noticed I was a bit distracted and I spoke to a Doctor about it since I am not medicated for ADHD. The DR told me that the Forces woudl not treat me for this and that in his opinion I should not be in the Forces. I then went and spoke to my course instructors and to a Warrant. I was told that  if the DR recommended a release. I was told I could be put on PAT until the files was cleared and a decision was made and this could take several months.

 I was a bit discouraged by this and did not know what to do. I spoke to somebody else who gave me differ5ent information all together. Anyway I asked the Warrant and a PO2 and also another instructor about the possibility of having a VR ...seeing a civi DR getting treatment for my ADHD which is just a pill in the morning and the re enlisting. They told me that it wasn't a bad idea. I was told that ADHD should not prohibit me from entering the forces. Which it hadn't in the first place as it was disclosed before my enrollment. 

Anyway to make a very long story short. I'm wondering what my chances are of being re enlisted. Will the fact that I Had a VR and the fact that the DR thinks I should not be in the Forces keep me from re entering?..The Dr spoke to me for like 10 mins..he never examined me or anything...so he really couldn't diagnose me with anything ...does anyone have any idea what teh chances or re enlisting are?...and Im looking at Comm Reserve this time instead of Reg Forces


Thank You


----------



## geo

WTF, if you are in and want to stay in... why on earth would you do the VR thing.
If you are released due to ADHD and the MOs recommendation, you will be facing an uphill battle to get back in.

Your choice BUT, don't be surprised of the barriers you're going to be stuck facing.


----------



## ShediacNB

yeah I understand your point. I had no idea how to proceed and I was told going hoem and seeing a civi doctor would be easier than going through all that crap...the DR never even examined me or anything. I sope to somebody from Medical at Gagetown who told me the DR cant suggest realeasing me without a full medical check...I should have thought of that before!!!...anyway I will just have to deal with whatever happens. She also told me I can appeal any decision if Im not let back in..but whatever...liek I said I will deal with whatever happens


----------



## geo

appealing a decision from the inside is one thing
appealing a decision from the outside is a whole other thing.... extremely irritating, long and drawn out.... also pert much at your expense.


----------



## ShediacNB

Yeah I can imagine. I was at the recruiter today. I applied for Communications Reserve this time. Doing same trade. Anyway the way it was explained to me was that it is between the unit and the recruiting center. Im not 100% sure if thats really the case, as I seem to get different info from everyone I talk too. But if thats the case the process should be easier ( at least a little bit) than having my file go before somebody in Ottawa or Borden and just saying no I dont approve this application without even speaking to me. With the recruiter and unit at least I can try to plead my case with the medic staff and the captain. The unit has sent an Email to the SGT at the recruiting center saying as long as I pass with the recruiter they will hire me on strength..whatever that means...but anyway As I said..I will have to deal with whatever decision is made.


----------



## RetiredRoyal

rant deleted


----------



## CFR FCS

Skilled or Semi Skilled PLAR are sent from CFRG to the Managing Authority (MA) in your case likely someone in the Air Force who is either a FE or has access to an FE to ask. Sometimes the MA provides a matrix to compare training and experience with the applicants submission.  At anytime during the recruitment process you are not happy with the results or what you have been told ask to speak with another person or ask to see the policy. CFRG only has the authority to enrol what the MA's ask for and we cannot create vacancies such as FE without extra staff work.
In defence of the officer who told you that you could only be a AVN tech, Capt's do as they are taught and must follow orders, procedures and directives like anybody else. Their personal experience level and training may not have exposed them to such a special case as yours.  

Glad it all worked out for you and thank you for blazing a new career path for others.


----------



## top4u20

I did not want to start another thread on this so here are a few questions with regards to my case. Hopefully someone can help out although I may already know the answers. As I have mentioned in a past thread I VR'd at the end of July 07 and have already decided to re-enlist after six years of service in the Regs as Cpl QL5. I was thinking of going Air Force but to be honest due to the loss of money now and postings available Im really thinking of going back to my old trade. Questions are: Would a PLAR still be conducted? Would I have to do the apptitude tests? I know the med and physical is coming. Note; local CFRC has already accepted my application but waiting a couple of months to request Med docs. Im just another one on the list who made a huge mistake!


----------



## alexpb

Hi Everyone,

It's been a long time since I've been back in these parts. 
The last time I was here I was 18 and was on my way to Basic in Quebec (NOV 19 2005). A few weeks in, I ended up on PAT Platoon with a fractured ankle after slipping off an icy curb during morning PT. Not too long after that , a serious family issue arouse and I had to make the decision to VR so I could be home to deal with it. I'm now 20. For the past 2 years in the back of my mind I have always thought about rejoining. For the first few months I even spent many restless nights awake contemplating about it and if I should try to rejoin.
It's 2 years later, and I still feel like crap leaving Quebec and leaving my platoon. I feel like not only did I let everyone else down, but I let myself down the most. Especially leaving so early into Basic (ended up leaving around Week 5). My Master Corporals and Sargent of my platoon told me to be sure about my decision as I might regret it. And at the time I really thought I was making the right one, but now I honestly do regret it. 

I was just curious about what the Army's stance is on recruits rejoining, especially after how short my stay was.
Any info you could share would help me a lot.

Thanks


----------



## GAP

Your best bet is talk to the recruiting office....there's no shame in having a fractured ankle, and as for the other....well, we all make decisions in life for a lot of reasons.....


----------



## PMedMoe

You certainly wouldn't be the first person that has done it.


----------



## geo

Hey... some people with many years VR only to figure out that they had it pretty good in the military


----------



## Hogie

If you released honorably, no problem - reapply but expect to wait at least a month for your old medical documents to be ordered from the archives before you can get booked for a medical/interview.  It happens all the time.  You won't even have to redo the written test unless you apply for a trade that your first mark didn't qualify you for. i.e. if you got a middling mark and now want to apply for another trade that requires a higher mark, you will have to try again.


----------



## spr_sldr

I defiantly understand what your going through.
I did my BMQ and SQ courses and then had 2 weeks in between my SQ graduation and the start of my DP1.
I did not go on course and went NES and got a civi job.
At first it seemed like I was happy didn't want to go back.
But then, I'd see a soldier in CADPAT, or see a Canadian Forces commercial, or hear from one of my army buddies about their DP1 course.
I was starting to lose sleep over it and couldn't stand it anymore.
Finally one day I just cleaned my kit, shaved and showed up for my unit's muster night, and now 6 weeks later, I'm training again and couldnt be happier. 
If you have that little feeling of missing it or have restless sleeps thinking about it, go back, I guarantee you wont regret it.

I hope whatever ur decision it works out for you.


----------



## CallOfDuty

When I went through almost 2 years ago...in my platoon of 45, there were two people who were doing it again after VRing.  One guy VR'd at week 5, and the other VR'd after week 9!!!!  
  They had to wait 6 months to rejoin.  They were given a little teasing from the instructors throughout training.................." Are you gonna quit again private!!!??".....that kind of thing, but it was no big deal really.
  Actually those guys came in handy, because they would tell the rest of us what to expect from upcoming weeks.  
Cheers 
COD


----------



## geo

Mallard,
... Don't do it again.
If you decide at some time in the future that you've had enough, say so, put it in writing AND return your kit.
If you go NES you are released as "not advantageously employable" by the CF, Recovery action will be initiated against you for your kit (ie= collection measures for the $$ value) and, you might find it difficult to find another job for the government at a later date...


----------



## spr_sldr

o i know believe me, i dont plan on goin anywhere. 
I was lucky, i didnt have to go through any paperwork, i was only a few weeks away from having to go through alot of red tape to get back in, im just glad I did return.


----------



## geo

Mallard,
Glad you've snapped out of it and are firmly back into service.


----------



## top4u20

As a follow up to this....does anyone know off hand what the least I could expect as far as IPC is concerned if I was in fact to go back into another trade? Leaving as a Cpl QL5 IPC 3 Spec. Im thinking that I would return in another trade as a Pte IPC 3?

Any thoughts?


----------



## top4u20

Do any Recruiters know if there is still the 6 month wait implemented after VR? I have heard many different opinions on this. Some say yes and some say its waived. If its waived is there anything in writing on it? I understand that a couple of Air Force trades are taking qualified re-enrollee's but it seems that those are the only trades.

Thanks


----------



## navy-nesop

First of all, Happy new year to all,

Here is my situation,

I was in the first time in Dec, 92 Army Reserve, transferred in the Navy in March, 94 as a NESOP 276 until Nov, 97.  I was an AB, QL5 qualified.  I met this girl and then left the Military.  I saw the light in 2007 (still with the same lovely girl) and rejoined in the same trade NESOP 00115.  They told me that I lost all my qualifications so I had to redo everything except BMQ.  I have just finished my QL3 so I'm officially a qualified NESOP again.  In my EMAA account it is written that I was enrolled as an AB but at the school they said it was a mistake because my first message was written as an OD.  They did that to get me in the system faster and did not have the time to wait for an answer back from Ottawa.  But know I'm stuck in between two ranks, I wear the OD slipons but at the BOR they think I' am an AB.  I asked to have my pay set to incentive 1 (it was at incentive 3 when I started in April) because I was scared they actually made a mistake and did not want to returned 1 year of over pay... been in before...LOL.  I can't find anything helpfull in the CFAO's, no one seems to to know really, I have asked the BOR to look into it (6 times already), still waiting for their call.

What appens if I' am really an AB, should I get incentive 3.  Some are telling me that it's not a rank and no pay increase should go with it, not like Leading Seaman.  But some other tells me that if they gave me my rank back, they also gave me the time in accordingly.  When can I expect to be promoted to LS.  My re qualifications will not fit with my time in.  

So if anyone knows anything about this matter, it would help me a lot.

Pierre


----------



## Disenchantedsailor

This is what happened in my situation, I was reserve for 3 years prior to joining the reg navy as a navcomm, I was given only my BMQ as far as the navy was concerned (kept alot of my army quals though) I was enrolled as an OD but given a higher IPC (3), due to TCP (time credit for promotion) this will show on your MPRR in EMAA in the military data block (PFTPS). This was back before you no longer had to write a fleet exam to be AB Qualified, in your case however you may just well be an AB, one of my JR Hands when I was still a navcomm enrolled with 4 years previous svc (infantry reserve) and was granted his AB on enrollment, I suspect seeing as you have just completed your TQ3 you are or will be posted to a sea-going unit shortly, 1 your posting msg will have the rank the carreer manager thinks you are, and 2. the ship or FAP/FAA will fight a little harder for you than the school. The unfortunate problem with the school is they are short handed as it is and have so much admin to deal with stuff like this is often forgotten due to other things like the unit #@@# magnet who has to have an escort from cells in Vancouver every month (especially combat div at the school). Hope it helps if its a little muddy feel free to fire me a PM.


----------



## navy-nesop

Thanks for the reply,

Thats what I figured so far.  My next course is the NETP then the ship.  And you are right about the work load for the staff.  We have problems with drugs and discipline.  I don't recall that from ten years ago.  Now they have people in birds permanently at Nellies.

Pierre


----------



## Disenchantedsailor

hey no prob and yes the drugs (mostly smoke dope) and drink has progressivly been on the rise at nelles for the last 10 years. And of course about 3 or 4 years ago they started houseing people in the pup rooms on a rather permanent basis


----------



## PO2FinClk

Simple answer, look at your ETP Instr and it will state the rank and IPC you are to be at - that is the authority under which you were enrolled and not simply a tool to get you in. Whatever is on it must either be enforced or submitted through the CoC to CFRG for adjudication. Nothing else really to say about this subject.


----------



## NCRCrow

You were a QL-5 NESOP in 97 and you had to redo your 3 & 5's upon re-entry! That is brutal!

You should have just do the QL-5 A/B to give you a refresher. Another waste of taxpayers money and your time.

Nice website btw!


----------



## navy-nesop

Thanks,

Yeah, I can understand if i guy left for 10 years and washed dishes for those ten years.  OK then maybe is really out of the technological game.  They told me that the NESOP trade had changed alot since I left.  They took out fire control from our QL3 and added SEASEARCH.  Wow, what a change.  I could have learned SEASEARCH in about 2 hours.  This system is computer based.  Maybe I should precise that for the last 10 years I worked as a Document management specialist and Software design.  Even my Chief sent a message to Ottawa saying I should have been sent to the ships right away.

What I don't understand is that 2 guys on my course got given time in for cadet time and reserve time.  But did not get any for actual reg force time and a QL5 qualification.

But it's allright.  I'm 32 years old, I understand the military now and I missed it anyway, with it's good sides and it's bad sides.

navy-nesop

EDITED: PS.  Did you look at the Combat Information Center section http://www.navy-nesop.com/100.php.  I have noticed that people skip this section alot and it's where the good part is (in my humble opinion anyway)  I'm working on 2.0 version.  Should come out before the Jan 20th.


----------



## navy-nesop

PO2FinClk said:
			
		

> Simple answer, look at your ETP Instr and it will state the rank and IPC you are to be at - that is the authority under which you were enrolled and not simply a tool to get you in. Whatever is on it must either be enforced or submitted through the CoC to CFRG for adjudication. Nothing else really to say about this subject.



Can anyone inlight me with "ETP Instr", sorry don't know that one.

navy-nesop


----------



## NCRCrow

Its a good feature but a PRINT Page would be ideal for making a Bridge Pack. (see ATP-29)

Finguerprint-- EMITERs are misspelled

Because my understanding is that when a program goes on high side computer it becomes the intellectual property of the CF.

You should be commended for your initiative, it is raising a few eyebrows on the East Coast EW community as a QL-3 NESOP at Blackrock Student is making an excellent product.

CDN Aviator , I see some potential for the LRP world for Merchant/Warship visual identification?


----------



## Disenchantedsailor

HFXCrow said:
			
		

> Because my understanding is that when a program goes on high side computer it becomes the intellectual property of the CF.


Not entirely the case, generally if a mbr develops a database to make thier job easier they share it with thier wingers, we had 10 or 12 floating around the navcomm community, It doesn't become the property of the CF just because it was stored on a "RED" machine, the disk however that it was copied from is now classified and in most cases the mbr doesn't mind it becoming part of the muster sheets, on the other side if they do the ISSO just orders a destruction for the media through the CO and life carries on.


----------



## aesop081

HFXCrow said:
			
		

> CDN Aviator , I see some potential for the LRP world for Merchant/Warship visual identification?



Potential yes, a requirement no. We already have something and it works 


navy-nesop :

I have PM'ed you with some concerns, i hope i hear from you soon


----------



## Ex-Dragoon

navy-nesop while your website is commendable, I would strongly recommend taking it offline and let your superiors look at it just so there is no potential of OPSEC concerns.

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## NCRCrow

Ex-Dragoon and CDN Aviator the information looks like it derived from Janes.

You can do the same feature with the Janes on-line version and tailor databases for yourself.

Ex-Dragoon have a look yourself, you are aptly qualified.


----------



## navy-nesop

My superior did take a look at it.  In fact they are using it for teaching the studens at BlackRock.  Thanks for the concern.  I'm working on version 2.0 right now.  It will be on line hopfully by the end of Jan.  Keep in mind that this is just a demo, it's not intended to be on the web.  It should work on a secure network.

And for the intellectual property part...don't DND own me anyway...LOL.  I don't care about that, I resign that contrat with the intend of staying a long time now.  If I can improve some of our tools, that's great, if I does not go anywhere, well I had fun doing it.

PS. For the spelling mistake, thanks for letting me know.  As you can all tell, English is not my first language!

navy-nesop


----------



## NCRCrow

spelling mistakes take away from the credibility of your work especially in 5 eyes correspondence.


----------



## PO2FinClk

navy-nesop said:
			
		

> Can anyone inlight me with "ETP Instr", sorry don't know that one.


Ref: A-PM-245 Chap 1 Annex B: Enrolment or Transfer/Posting Instruction


----------



## dano

Hi all. 

Hope everyone had a good new year.

I have a question with regards to rejoining the forces after retirement.

A REALLY good friend of mine served full time for 17yrs where we was asked to retire in 2001 due to his G factor. The forces considered him undeployable due to injuries sustained overseas on deployment and asked him to either leave with a full disability pension or he could stay but as a M/Cpl for life and never be deployed or moved. He chose to leave. They gave him his 10k and a pension. 

He’s been a great friend for years now, he still talks about how we wish’s he could stay in the forces. I did get him to join the CIC, just in enough time for him to keep all his quals and etc to carry over. The CIC was not a stepping stone for him, but really he does like working with the kids and such, but of course it’s not the same as being full time ‘army’.

I’ve told him to go see a recruiter to see what his options are now as some things have changed in the last 6 years, but telling him to take a day off to do something he thinks is impossible to happen is difficult, so I’m asking any of you if perhaps now he has a chance to come back and serve in his occupation which was RMS. He said he would consider coming back even if that means staying a MCpl… as he’s seen what life is without the army… 

So please if you have any professional input or experience please respond.


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse

Maybe a good read.

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/65499.0.html


----------



## navy-nesop

Seems I' m ...xxx... out of luck,

Regulation appears to be against me.  After more than 5 years of break in service, they don't consider previous service.  I will be the most qualified OS of the fleet until Aug 2009...LOL.

Thank god I don't mind scrubbing the deck.  If any of my future boss see this post, please be gentle...!  ;D

Still loves this job, would not pick any other over it.

this is navy-nesop, out.


----------



## armyvern

PO2FinClk said:
			
		

> Simple answer, look at your ETP Instr and it will state the rank and IPC you are to be at - that is the authority under which you were enrolled and not simply a tool to get you in. Whatever is on it must either be enforced or submitted through the CoC to CFRG for adjudication. Nothing else really to say about this subject.



In echoing what PO2FinClk said above, it is essential that _*you*_ write up a memo formally requesting that your reenlistment file and ETP undergo a "Formal Review" by CFRG.

I just went through this this past spring at my last Unit for a member who was getting nowhere with his OR, who were all insistant that his ETP was the final word.

After talking to a live human at CFRG ref the matter on his behalf, CFRG informed me that the member should submit a Memorandum (Subj: "Req  CFRG formal review of reenlistment and ETP Instruction") ...

I gave him a call and he came into my office & we whipped up the Memo, attached a copy of his ETP Instruction and submitted it formally. The next week we were informed via telecon that his file review was underway, and my Chief Clerk received an ammended ETP Instruction the 3rd week which corrected his trg history, incentive category, and rank -- retroactive of course, as it should be. She went in and fixed up his pay and EMAA for him immediately -- being that he was now tasked to us for the time period in question.

BTW -- the "5 year" rule out of ranks _can_ be considered moot if a member was determined to have improved or upgraded skills applicable to his trade during the time period that he was OUT of the CF. That's something to consider as well. The worst case scenario for you is that they are going to say "no." You won't know definitively however until you request a formal review by CFRG -- officially and in writing.

Good luck.


----------



## TCBF

A pity you an other rank (NCM).  I have yet to hear of any officer re-entering the CF and re-doing BOTC, or Phase Trg, etc.


----------



## NCRCrow

Nice post Army Vern and TCBF!!

I find it hard to believe that navy-nesop who left in 97 as a QL-5 NESOP, has had to re-do his QL-3! What a waste for him and training systems. (He is more patient than I would be)

The most he should have to do is his QL-5 again, which I have seen many "Navy" (cannot speak for other elements) pers do.

Other than that, this thread has motivated me to have my previous Reserve time looked at.


----------



## Disenchantedsailor

I sailed with a guy who left the navy a MS NavSig and came back 1 year later, as a LS NavComm and had to do the 277 Conversion course (amalgamation occurred during the time he was out) granted this is not a 5 year absence but really the systems can't have changed that much for the EW guys.


----------



## NCRCrow

The STIRS/ESM Systems are exactly as he left them in '97 and cleaning stations may be a shorter! (not by much)

a QL-5 refresher would have sufficed! 

Oh well!


----------



## navy-nesop

The Chief at Black rock tried to get me off to the ships right away with a conditional QL3, but was denied somewhere along the chain of command.  He is a good man, no doubt about it.

They said since Seasearch was new, I needed to take the course all over again.  OK, I can live with that, new piece of gear, computer based equipment, fair enough.

Seasearch course is about 2 weeks long.  I don't want to come across as arrogant but...  my job for the past ten years was in information management software.  I actually designed some software and now I code a web application to relax myself at night.  So, software based equipment is kind of my thing.  I could have learned Seasearch in about 8 hours ... wait, I did. 8)

Like I said, I knew what I was getting myself into.  Military as not changed that much, don't you just love that.

this is navy-nesop, over


----------



## NCRCrow

.......so every time we get a new piece of kit, you are going to have re-do your 3's or 5's


----------



## George Wallace

HFXCrow said:
			
		

> .......so every time we get a new piece of kit, you are going to have re-do your 3's or 5's



 :

I hope you were being sarcastic, as that was one of the dumbest statements on this site.

If one is no longer in the Forces, they miss out on many of the changes that are happening.  Think back of when you went on leave and returned to ask "What's new" and everyone answers back "Nothing".  You look around and there is a 'new guy' in your section/troop/platoon/etc., or your phone number has changed, or your desk has been moved down the hall, any sort of little changes that they took for granted and you now return to find all at once.

On the other hand, any changes that are taking place while one is still Serving are usually done in a fashion where you have OJT and Conversion Courses.  Someone who is not Serving does not have that advantage.


----------



## Gunner98

TCBF said:
			
		

> A pity you an other rank (NCM).  I have yet to hear of any officer re-entering the CF and re-doing BOTC, or Phase Trg, etc.



I agree with Army Vern.  Each case is considered based on the facts and policies in place at the time.  Policies evolve over time.  The ETP Instruction is the initial assessment and at one time was considered an "offer"...  

My story (for those who care to read on...helmets on) :warstory:

As an Reg Force Artillery Offr, I left the CF in May 89 after my obligatory service and (was silly enough to) re-enrolled in Dec 90.  While my application was being considered I was told I might have to re-do BOTC, then it was changed to perhaps Phase IV.  Once my file and my references (in one case a serving senior officer) were considered I went right back to my former status.  It was as though I went on coffee break for 18 months and returned.  Shortly after I was placed on a career course and I did pretty poorly as I had lost some of my knowledge, skills, and understanding of artillery stuff (as can be expected from even 18 months out of the flow.  Not much call for gunnery skills on civie street.).  That course result and some other issues led to me spend a total of 14 years as a Arty Capt with little hope of ever becoming a senior officer.

Fast forward (not surprisingly) When I took an Occupational Transfer out of the Artillery into HCA, I was granted a prior learning qualification for Basic Medical Field Operations and did two EOs (Medical Ethics and Customs and Traditions of the CFMS/CFDS) from the HCA course by distance education.  No additional training was required to change my status from Untrained to Trained in my new MOS. :warstory: (Helmets off)


----------



## George Wallace

navy-nesop said:
			
		

> They said since Seasearch was new, I needed to take the course all over again.  OK, I can live with that, new piece of gear, computer based equipment, fair enough.
> 
> Seasearch course is about 2 weeks long.  I don't want to come across as arrogant but...  my job for the past ten years was in information management software.  I actually designed some software and now I code a web application to relax myself at night.  So, software based equipment is kind of my thing.  I could have learned Seasearch in about 8 hours ... wait, I did. 8)
> 
> Like I said, I knew what I was getting myself into.  Military as not changed that much, don't you just love that.



No the Military hasn't changed a lot when it comes to conducting Courses.  Don't be so arrogant in your 'youth'.  Later you will realize that "ALL" courses are designed to be instructed to the 'lowest common denominator'.  In other words, they are designed to be taught to the 'dumbest' persons on course, in a manner by which they can learn and pass the course.  Just because you are an IT genius and can learn it in eight hours, doesn't mean the System is flawed.  You aren't the dumbest person on the course, so you picked it up much faster.  You, however, are the dumbest person on course in another sense, because of your arrogance and lack of rational in reasoning as to why the Crse is structured as it is.  On a Bell Curve, you may place in the 50% range.... ;D


----------



## NCRCrow

GW-my sarcasm is here for your enjoyment! (I can feel your blood pressure rising)

But navy-nesop my opinion (and I think I may be a little more than qualified to give it) is you got screwed in this situation but it will be over soon.

your arrogance is not unfounded based on your previous service. Good luck in your new career!

I am off to St Jean!


----------



## kincanucks

It all comes down to whether or not his medical condition has improved.  If not then he does not meet the common enrolment medical standards and can't be re-enroled.  Best place to start is with a visit to his local CFRC/D for a chat with the medical personnel.


----------



## dano

I've talked to him, he said he could make the common enrolment medical standard, but due to the universality of services he is not deployable.. therefor unemployable.


----------



## xo31@711ret

I'm confused: CEMS (common enrolment medical standard) was before I retired Aug 06  (last posting was recruiting doing medicals) was V4 CV3 H2* G2 O2 * A5; Your friend meets CEMS, but not universality of service? Has the standard changed for those coming in off civvie street? (not talking CT's). 
 If he doesn't meet universality of service at least his G & O factor would have reflected that (or it use to).


----------



## geo

I'm confused.
How can someone NOT meet universality of service while passing the "common" medical standard.
It makes no sense.... Yeah, we can enroll you but, the minute you're in, we'll have to turf ya out...?!?!?!?  WTF


----------



## kincanucks

It is possible for a skilled applicant (ex-reg F) who does not meet the CEMS to be re-enroled but only if they meet their trade medical standards but this case still doesn't make sense.


----------



## geo

yup... my point


----------



## dano

Has the policy changed since he left? Because otherwise they would have never have asked him to leave. Or is it one of those they would let him back him and the original offer still stands that he stays a m/cpl for life without any possibility for promotions/deployment etc?

Does the same go if he can meet the physical req' but not the medical? He said his injury has not gotten much better (as its permanent) but it has not gotten any worse.


----------



## kincanucks

Dano said:
			
		

> Has the policy changed since he left? Because otherwise they would have never have asked him to leave. Or is it one of those they would let him back him and the original offer still stands that he stays a m/cpl for life without any possibility for promotions/deployment etc?
> 
> Does the same go if he can meet the physical req' but not the medical? He said his injury has not gotten much better (as its permanent) but it has not gotten any worse.



Best place to start is with a visit to his local CFRC/D for a chat with the medical personnel.


----------



## geo

Dano said:
			
		

> Has the policy changed since he left? Because otherwise they would have never have asked him to leave. Or is it one of those they would let him back him and the original offer still stands that he stays a m/cpl for life without any possibility for promotions/deployment etc?
> 
> Does the same go if he can meet the physical req' but not the medical? He said his injury has not gotten much better (as its permanent) but it has not gotten any worse.



As kincanuck said, CFRC med staff should be able to put light to his problem BUT regulations concerning "universality of service" are relatively recent and are probably "post" your friend's departure.  Where the CF would sometimes provide umpteen "accomodation" to certain people in certain trades, the new directive clearly stipulates that if a certain trade is lacking in qualified personnel, they may provide one (repeat ONE) accomodation of three years in order for the Forces to fill the position out of the personnel it has.



> _A recent qualification to the above "BUT"... new rules are coming down the pipe for soldiers who have been injured & maimed while in service & who would be "out" after their 3 years accomodation.  Steps are being taken to keep them in - though I have not seen any directives on how they intend to make that work._


----------



## navy-nesop

Weird thing happen today,

I got my posting message today (HMCS Ottawa).  They addressed the message as me being an AB.  Is a message reliable in terms of information on it?  If I show up on the ship with these on my shoulder, can I get in trouble?


----------



## PMedMoe

Don't put them up until you've officially received them.


----------



## PO2FinClk

Yup, unless you want to be duty for the next month or "birds", I would not suggest putting them up. Once on ship then perhaps the Ships Office and the Cbt Chief will be able to sort this out for you.


----------



## mackhot

Hey..I have a question, do you think it is a good idea to add a "Personal Statement" letter to a apt.
My story, I was in about 5 years ago got after my first 3 yrs. I had a med cat. but did not release medical.
Now I am ready to get back in, but they want Dr. letters and letters and letters which is fine. But should I include my own
letter,  I own my past problem and it is no longer an issue, letter?
Thanks


----------



## the 48th regulator

mackhot said:
			
		

> Hey..I have a question, do you think it is a good idea to add a "Personal Statement" letter to a apt.
> My story, I was in about 5 years ago got after my first 3 yrs. I had a med cat. but did not release medical.



What was the Med Cat. for, and what did the medical documentation say with regards to the Category and the medical challenges you had.



			
				mackhot said:
			
		

> Now I am ready to get back in, but they want Dr. letters and letters and letters which is fine. But should I include my own
> letter,  I own my past problem and it is no longer an issue, letter?
> Thanks



What do you mean by "your own " letter, from a Doctor?  Your file can still be retrieved (Pers. and Med.), therefore depending on the answer to my question above, you may be assessed as being unfit to reenter.

Help us help you,

dileas

tess


----------



## mackhot

I had a 5d, it was a stress thing that my husband made get help for, but ended up a real cluster f... my PO was not happy I was not explaining every detail of my problem, and when I released it did not reflect well for me.

The letter I was thinking of writting was and personal statement letter, saying I understand what was wrong, this is what I did to fix it and I am ready to come back to the CF.
I did see the recuiting center and really good Sgt. I would have asked him about adding a letter but  I wanted to hear if anyone else did or heard of such a thing.

Plus a side note, if I am not accepted and I really am over my past problem, Dr. letter stating to such, would the Ombusdman be something to looking into, Or would that make life hell if they did let be back


----------



## the 48th regulator

mackhot said:
			
		

> Plus a side note, if I am not accepted and I really am over my past problem, Dr. letter stating to such, would the Ombusdman be something to looking into, Or would that make life hell if they did let be back



The military will only accept you based on current medical details, which includes previous categories.

Understand this, like a drivers licence, it is not your right to serve your country, but a privilege.  IF you do not meet the standards, what do you want to argue?  That you know , more than a medical professional?  

Now me may be gettingyour back up, but picture this, what if you were unable to do your duty, due to a fact of a previous injury.  What do you think would happen?

dileas

tess


----------



## GUNS

mackhot said:
			
		

> Hey..I have a question, do you think it is a good idea to add a "Personal Statement" letter to a apt.
> My story, I was in about 5 years ago got after my first 3 yrs. I had a med cat. but did not release medical.
> Now I am ready to get back in, but they want Dr. letters and letters and letters which is fine. *But should I include my own
> letter,  I own my past problem and it is no longer an issue, letter?*Thanks



This site came provide very knowledgeable replies to most questions but in your case a trip to the CFRC is in order.

They are there to help.


----------



## RTaylor

Hey all,

Got a few questions for people re-enlisting after being out for a while. How long did the process take for you? Mine's taken nearly a year and I just completed the medical / re-interview (trade change from 1st interview). I've passed everything so far, all papers are done but when I call the CFRC they say, after 5 weeks, that they are still waiting for the rest of my med docs.

I'm not complaining though, because I know that the recruiting computers and the person talking(calling the CFRC and hitting 0 to talk to someone) usually aren't as specific as talking to your file manager (mine wasn't available). 

So how long did your process take, and how long after all the i's were dotted and t's crossed did it take for you to get your offer, sworn in and start Basic?


----------



## PMedMoe

I did the YTEP program from Nov 86-Nov 87 then went Reg until May 89.  Joined the ARAF in 1990.  I went to Germany for the Base closures in Jan of 93 and when I returned, I put in for the Reg F, probably between Sep 93 and Jan 94.  I got out of the Res in Sep of 94.  At that point, everything was up to date on my RegF application and they were just doing updates by phone.  I got a call before the long weekend in May of 95 to come in on the Tuesday and was advised not to miss the appt.  I was back in as of 01 Jun 95.  Recruit school by-pass, not because I had done it before, but because the Med A QL3 course started on the first week of June.


----------



## RTaylor

I was hoping for the bypass but didnt get it. Oh well


----------



## PMedMoe

Chances are, if you were out for more than 5 years, they won't give you the bypass.  It won't kill you.


----------



## RTaylor

Im actually looking forward to it, getting into shape and all, and having already done basic at least Im not going in without a clue...I know exactly (more or less) what Im getting myself into.


----------



## KevinB

I was out for 4 and a bit - the process took close to 9 months 

 Reg -> Reg: same trade same unit


----------



## acheo

I was out for 9 years. It took 1 1/2 year to complete the recruiting process. It drove my ex-employer crazy. :crybaby:

I had everything from the BOTC to my occupational courses credited.

I did not negotiate my payscale but I should have. Many guys after me did it and got a higher payscale with less time in.


----------



## jeffb

Still waiting on my end. I got out in '99 and walked in CFRC Toronto about 6 months ago. As of now I've completed the process (OMD's have been found, interview done, etc.) and I'm waiting for the new fiscal year to hear back about an offer. One thing that I've found is that showing up at the recruiting centre around the time that you are expecting things to be ready seem to expedite the process. A couple of weeks ago I showed up to check on the status of my OMD's to find that they had already arrived. I did my medical the next day and my interview 2 days after that.


----------



## RTaylor

yeah, the told me my old med docs still havent arrived, but I really don't know if I believe the frontline man I talked to. All I know is that Im awaiting my offer


----------



## DjC

Hello there, I've been in the army before (reserve, infantry) for a year and half. I completed my BMQ, SQ, and did reg force BIQ because I got sick of waiting for the reserve course to come up during the summer. When I came back to my unit after the BIQ, I saw the significant differences between the reserves and reg force. I'm a kinda person where its everything or nothing, I realized if I was going to stay in, I'd want to be reg force but wasn't ready to commit 3 years. So I left the reserves and did other stuff in my life. I must say however, I think about the army a lot even though its been going on 2 years (come October) that I'll be out. I'm having thoughts of going back in because civilian life is pissing me off.

I would like to know if I have to do all my basic courses over again. I was told by a friend who is currently in the reserves that I have 3 years before everything 'expires' and I come in as a new recruit. I must admit, I practice drill sometimes alone and I still remember it (How sad eh?) I even got an airsoft M16 - I mean C7, and I still remember all my drills for that too. Can someone shed some light on this for me? Oh and I searched the forums and couldn't find anything related to this, if there is something, I'd appreciate if I could get the link, thank you.


----------



## DjC

I apologize but I had to bring this up to the top again... so many views and not one reply, I'd really like to find something out about my situation and what can/can't happen, its a pretty big decision for me and I want to make sure I don't regret it.


----------



## kincanucks

Call or visit the CFRC/D.


HH and DA


----------



## DjC

I went to the recruiting centre I first visited when I joined the reserves and all they told me was I'd have to apply all over, then the papers would be sent to a head office of some sort and a decision could be made then. But I've heard from a friend who is still in the reserves, that I have an expiry of 3 years from the day I left the army, to come back in and not do anything over.


----------



## CFR FCS

DjC,
Your friend is incorrect. You have to reapply no matter how short a time you were out. I believe that he is talking about your qualifications. The BMQ / SQ should be good but HQ must review them for content to see if anything has changed. Depending upon your courses and how many class B days you had you might get a RSBP (Recruit School bypass). The recruiting office should be able to help determine that once you apply.

Bottom line, you must reapply with all the correct paperwork any normal applicant would have to bring. If you have copies of your Reserve course reports that will help you somewhat. 

If you come to this site for advice and were advised by a very knowledgeable person to go to a CFRC/D and decided your friend's advice was better why did you even bother asking for advice. 

Yours for action!


----------



## DjC

CFR FCS said:
			
		

> DjC,
> Your friend is incorrect. You have to reapply no matter how short a time you were out. I believe that he is talking about your qualifications. The BMQ / SQ should be good but HQ must review them for content to see if anything has changed. Depending upon your courses and how many class B days you had you might get a RSBP (Recruit School bypass). The recruiting office should be able to help determine that once you apply.
> 
> Bottom line, you must reapply with all the correct paperwork any normal applicant would have to bring. If you have copies of your Reserve course reports that will help you somewhat.
> 
> If you come to this site for advice and were advised by a very knowledgeable person to go to a CFRC/D and decided your friend's advice was better why did you even bother asking for advice.
> 
> Yours for action!



Although my friend's advice is better, it still doesn't mean he's right, thats why I'm here asking. Like I mentioned, I've been to the recruiting office and I pretty much got the same answer that I received here, I was looking for more detail or perhaps someone who has gone through this process and could tell me what happens.


----------



## armyvern

You go in to the CFRC and reapply. Bring in any copies of previous records that you have.

They will process your application and it will be vetted to determine whether your previous qualifications are still valid. Some may be. Some may not be. But, you'll not find out until you've reapplied.

Then, once their done vetting your file and processing your reapplication ... they'll come back and make you an offer and will advise as to which training courses etc you will (or will not) have to re-do. It all depends upon MANY factors -- which can ONLY be determined by the CFRC.

Then, you get to decide whether or not you'll accept that offer.

There ... that was easy.

Answered ... 

With two previous answers given to you by folks with intimate knowledge of the recruiting process & it's requirements ... listen to them -- go to your CFRC.

Locked. 

Usual caveats apply -- anything significant to add, please contact a staff.

ArmyVern
The Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## RTaylor

I was told that Basic is good for 10 years, yet I have to do it over again and it's only been 9 since I did it. 

I think that the reg force will want you to do Basic over again because, to be honest, reservist units don't do the full course no matter what MOC you're coming from, unless you actually did do a reg force basic somehow. When my unit did it we didn't cover alot of material. We did what was necessary to the forces, and concentrated on what was specific to our trade - infantry. We LEARNED that during QL3 that summer when we had a slew of reg force teaching us what we did and didn't learn. Same thing happened to a friend who was reservist artillery.

Add that to the changes that occurr during any period over 2-3 years and I can almost sense you'll be doing basic, but first ask the CFRC.


----------



## RetiredRoyal

took 18 months to get my offer, i declined. I'm swearing back into the PRes today instead.


----------



## Sigger

I left last Feb and I put in my application a month ago. Same trade same unit. I was told I should "get the call shortly". I hope it is indeed shortly.

Mind you I have been very lucky with the whole enrollment process. My first time enrolling took 3 months - from time of applying to starting BMQ


----------



## RTaylor

..And I'm still waiting. No reason why they shouldn't have had my docs ready and waiting besides someone being a slack ass.

Sigh  :rage:


----------



## GUNS

If you have been out for an extended period of time, all your military information is moved to Archives Canada.
That's what I was told when I decided to join my local Reserve unit.
It was eight months before I was offered a position. I originally wanted Engineer(many friends) but was offered RCEME(veh tech) I.m a mechanic by trade.
When CFRC called me to come in to their office, I was offered a position with the Regs, signing bonus and a higher rank upon entering. 
If I had known then what I know now, I'd be in like flint. When I had to turn down the offer, I had to wait another eight months before I got a call from the Reserve unit.
Unfortunately, I got a promotion a work which changed my work schedule and rendered my application to the Reserves useless.
I know it is difficult when holding down a job and joining the military.

All I can say, "Good things comes to those that wait" :warstory:


----------



## 2 Cdo

Out for almost 5 years, and when I got back in in 93 it only took about 6-7 weeks from initial visit to to recruiting centre to landing in Winnipeg at -30*C!


----------



## Sigger

OK, OK..

Called my Recruiter. PLAR is in. I bypass BMQ, QL3. The frigged up thing is, I told the PO that my med docs are at my unit(same city as me), and so he decided to put it of untill now. Last week my med docs went to archive... WTF.. so now I must wait for those to come back to finish off..
So with any luck I will be back in rank within 10-20 years!


----------



## Sigger

Any ideas if it is SOP to have to redo the criminal/credit check after 1 year being out?? My recruiter is sick and no one knows...


----------



## George Wallace

Sigger said:
			
		

> Any ideas if it is SOP to have to redo the criminal/credit check after 1 year being out?? My recruiter is sick and no one knows...



You don't figure a former member of the CF could plan and perform a Criminal act in less than twelve months?


----------



## Sigger

No, I dont, and I did not...

However you never know...


----------



## CFR FCS

Sigger, 
Current policy is that once file is closed for any reason, enrolment being one, a new CNRC is required. The turn around on CNRC is usually 3-5 working days so I don't see an issue. Also a few returning applicants have found themselves with credit issues after a short career.

CFR FCS


----------



## GunnerNo387

As of right now I am serving a 20 year contract.  However I wish to leave the Army after 7 years of reg force service, and take a trade in the Air Force (Reg force).  I know all about the OT systems, tried 1 of them and it failed due to Arty being under manned and capped red for OT's.  So I'm thinking about the release and then re enlist way about it. I've seen this work first hand, as other fellow gunners have left and come back wearing different cap badges.

From what I understand there is a 6 month release time and a 6 month wait before you can re-apply, and then he additional wait untill a recruiter calls you back with joining instructions.  If anyone can confirm this or clear up any errors I might have about the process, it would be much appreciated.


----------



## GunnerNo387

Hmm, I don't know why my post ended up in "Whalley's" thread, but what ever.



			
				sigtech said:
			
		

> No the recruiting system shouldn't be used as a OT facilitartor, this slows down the process for new members joining. If you don't like you trade spend your time and ot later, you can OT our of Red Flagg trades it just takes longer then a normal OT



The CF needs to offer us combat arms people an education option.  It's nearly impossible to take time off work and go back to college or uni.  Maybe then the retention rate would be higher.  I got nothing against the combat arms, in fact I would recomend joining up as a grunt, tanker, gunner etc., for your first 3-5 years but after a certain amount of time you really start to question what your going to do after 20 or 25 years of service.  Most of us are around 20 when we join, so at 40 or 45 years of age retirement isn't an option.  The civi world isn't exactly screaming for guys for can call in arty fire or drive a tank.


----------



## George Wallace

Make up your mind.  Are you asking questions about getting out and then reenlisting, or are you going to change your mind and talk about "education programs"?  Both are subjects covered in several topics, with many good points covered to most, if not all, the questions you are asking.  The CF does have programs for members to get education courses.  All you have to do is visit the PSO office.

If you want to ask questions about getting out and reenrolling then keep them here.

If you want to ask questions about education programs for CF members; do a SEARCH and discuss them in one of those topics.




Perhaps this will help:



Welcome to Army.ca. Here are some reading references that are core to how Army.ca operates. I strongly recommend you take a moment to read through these to give you a better sense for the environment here. It will help you avoid the common pitfalls which can result in miscommunication and confusion. For those that choose not to read, their actions often lead to warnings being issued or even permanent bans.

*Army.ca Conduct Guidelines*: MUST READ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937.0.html

MSN and ICQ "short hand" -  http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/33247.0.html

Regarding the use of "MSN speak" versus the employment of prose which is correct in grammar, spelling and punctuation, please see: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/34015/post-260446.html#msg260446

Tone and Content on Army.ca: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/51970.0.html

FRIENDLY ADVICE TO NEW MEMBERS - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937/post-259412.html#msg259412

*Frequently Asked Questions - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/41136.0.html*

Recruiting FAQ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/21101.0.html
Army.ca Wiki Recruiting FAQ - http://army.ca/wiki/index.php/Frequently_Asked_Questions
Canadian Forces Aptitude Test - http://army.ca/forums/threads/21101/post-103977.html#msg103977
Fitness requirements at enrolment, see page 12 of this brochure: http://64.254.158.112/pdf/physical_fitness_en.pdf


Infantry Specific FAQ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/21131.0.html

CFAT practice test - http://64.254.158.112/pdf/preparing_for_aptitude_test_en.pdf

Search page - http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?action=search;advanced

Google search of Army.ca - http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=+site%3Aarmy.ca+%22search+term%22&btnG=Search&meta= (follow the link then replace "search term" with what you are looking for)

Army.ca wiki pages  - http://army.ca/wiki/index.php/Main_Page


To summarize. Welcome to Army.ca, start reading.


----------



## lost4words

Hey, I left for basic last march but half way through my training I had a family emergency and had to VR.  Thankfully, everything is resolved now and I have begun to look at re-enrolling.  My question is how this process differs from applying orignially.  I was told by the ladies who processed my release that if I reapplied within a year, that my file is still considered "open" and because of that it should take less time.  Does that mean that I dont have to retake the CFAT or medical again?  Or is it just faster because they dont have to add me to their computers?  Any information would be appreciated.

Thanks,
AC


----------



## kincanucks

_I was told by the ladies who processed my release that if I reapplied within a year, that my file is still considered "open" and because of that it should take less time. _
Never heard that one before.  Actually once your are enrolled, your file is considered closed. If you reapply at the same CFRC/D, apply for the same trade or one that you already meet the CFAT for and there are openings for that trade, and it doesn't take them too long to find your medical file it shouldn't take too long.  Talk to your CFRC/D and good luck.


----------



## shlindz

Hello, 
I hope this topic may be useful to others as well as myself.
I'm looking for information from those of you who have re-enrolled. I started my BMQ in June and VR'd in July. I was very idealistic upon my return to the civilian world. Unfortunately my vision didn't last long. I feel as if I don't belong outside the military. I have this craving to return to the mega and try again. My reasons for VR'ing in the first place were my family. My husband and I were a week apart on our BMQ courses. Some people might think that's cool. We thought it would be too. Unfortunately, its horrible. I was doing very good until my husband arrived at the mega. After he showed up I became distracted and inconvenienced my platoon to say the least. I would see my husband in the mess and around base, but was forbidden to speak with him. It became increasingly difficult to concentrate on my priorities. So I VR'd and so did he.My husband VR'd because he didn't think the Regular force was for him. Now he wants to join the reserves in out city. I know I want back in the mega. I may choose a different career now, but I deffinately need to go back. Unfortunatly I keep getting this weird feeling. What if I don't end up loving it as much as I think I miss it? What if my 2nd platoon isn't as awesome as my first? (They just graduated 2 days ago. I'm so proud and a lil envious). These questions and others like them are swimming through my head. It seems now to be an even bigger decision than the first time. I guess what I'm trying to get at is: What experiences has anybody had (good or bad) on re-enrolling? What to look out for. What to consider when applying. Etc... Thanks in advance to all the helpful souls out there. I'm sorry to have taken so long to get to the point.
-Eckert


----------



## Celticgirl

Hi...I don't have any personal experience with this, but I have a friend who just re-enrolled under very similar circumstances. She VR'd previously due to family issues and regretted it for a long time after. She finally took the leap and re-enrolled. I heard from her this week from St. Jean and she is very happy with her decision to go back. 

That isn't to say you would be, too. Listen to your own inner voice. No one can tell you what you already know. 

Here is a method of decision-making I used to use with my students:
For one week, pick one decision (i.e. re-enrolling) and "wear it like a hat". That is to say, act like you have already made the decision and are planning the future around that decision. Then, the following week, "wear a different hat" (not re-enrolling). Do the same thing - act like this is your future plan. Looking back at those two weeks afterwards, which "hat" felt more right to you? You should have a pretty clear answer.


----------



## shlindz

Thank you Celtic Girl. Your advice is so much more hands on then just making a list of pros and cons on a piece of paper. I'm excited to try on a few "hats". My one further question would be. How do I focus on my hat of the week and not look like a flake in the process. Do I tell those around me that I'v made a decision and then tell them something new next week? Is it important to have them believe each week that this is the decision I have made in order to gauge their reactions? Or should I tell my friends and family about my decision making process? Thanks again,
-Eckert


----------



## Celticgirl

shlindz said:
			
		

> Thank you Celtic Girl. Your advice is so much more hands on then just making a list of pros and cons on a piece of paper. I'm excited to try on a few "hats". My one further question would be. How do I focus on my hat of the week and not look like a flake in the process. Do I tell those around me that I'v made a decision and then tell them something new next week? Is it important to have them believe each week that this is the decision I have made in order to gauge their reactions? Or should I tell my friends and family about my decision making process? Thanks again,
> -Eckert



I would say either keep mum about it or tell that about the exercise and let them play along. The point of this exercise is not to gauge the reactions of others, but to gauge your own.


----------



## mysteriousmind

my opinion, as never had a decision like that to take since i was to chicken not to transfer to Reg force due to family issue, I decided to stay with the Pres.

Take a sheet of paper, and make 2 columns, on one side puts goods of joining back and on the other column, put the cons of going back. and after doing the pros and cons, you will have your answer.

but if you want my humble opinion, for what it counts...Go for it. Yes it will be a different platoon, different people...but everyone who goes there are there to succeed, and you find a new team spirit. If I was not chicken...I would transfer!!


----------



## CountDC

Just looked through a lot of prior posts and did not really find one to add this to so started new thread. Search did not find this at the time. 

CANFORGEN 072/09 CDS 012/09 221848Z APR 09
- CF RETENTION STRATEGY - IMPROVED PROCEDURES TO RETURN TO REGULAR FORCE SERVICE
UNCLASSIFIED


REFS: A. ROD FROM AFC 21 JAN 09 
B. QR AND O CHAP 6, ENROLMENT AND RE-ENGAGEMENT 
C. DAOD 5002-1, ENROLMENT - REGULAR FORCE 
D. CBI 204.015, PAY INCREMENTS 
BILINGUAL MESSAGE/MESSAGE BILINGUE 



AS MANY OF YOU ARE AWARE, THE RE-ENROLMENT PROCESS FOR FORMER REGULAR MEMBERS WAS INEFFICIENT. IN AN ATTEMPT TO REBUILD AND STRENGTHEN OUR FORCES, I AM PLEASED TO ANNOUNCE THAT THE PROCESS TO RE-ENROL HAS NOW BEEN SIGNIFICANTLY STREAMLINED 


EFFECTIVE 01 APR 09, AND IAW REF A, THE MEMBER PERSONNEL RECORD RESUME (MPRR) WILL BE THE SOURCE DOCUMENT FOR PREVIOUS REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WHO MEET ALL OF THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS: 


PREVIOUS CF REGULAR FORCE EXPERIENCE AND CURRENTLY A CIVILIAN OR A MEMBER OF A RESERVE FORCE SUB-COMPONENT OTHER THAN THE PRIMARY RESERVE. NOTE THAT CURRENT PRIMARY RESERVE MEMBERS WILL CONTINUE TO USE THE EXISTING COMPONENT TRANSFER PROCESS 


RELEASED FROM THE REGULAR FORCE WITHIN THE PAST 5 YEARS 


OCCUPATION QUALIFIED 


RELEASED FROM THE REGULAR FORCE UNDER ITEMS 4, 5B OR 5C 


MEETS ALL OTHER QUALIFICATIONS, CONDITIONS AND STANDARDS FOR ENROLMENT OR COMPONENT TRANSFER 


DESIRES RE-ENROLMENT TO PREVIOUS OCCUPATION 


THE REGULAR FORCE MPRR WILL BE THE MAIN SOURCE USED TO DETERMINE RANK AND QUALIFICATIONS FOR INDIVIDUALS RETURNING TO REGULAR FORCE SERVICE. RANK, TIME IN RANK AND YEARS OF SERVICE ON RELEASE WILL BE CREDITED TO THE INDIVIDUAL APPLYING TO RE-ENROL INTO THE REGULAR FORCE. THIS INFORMATION WILL BE THE BASIS FOR THE D MIL C DETERMINATION OF RE-ENROLMENT OFFER. ERRORS FOUND IN THE MPRR CAN BE CORRECTED THROUGH THE USE OF ORIGINAL DOCUMENTATION 


FORMER REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WILL BE RE-ENROLLED INTO THE REGULAR FORCE AT THE SUBSTANTIVE RANK INDICATED ON THEIR REGULAR FORCE MPRR WITH THEIR QUALIFYING SERVICE USED TO DETERMINE PAY AND SENIORITY LEVELS. TOS WILL BE OFFERED ON THE BASIS OF SERVICE REQUIREMENT AND EXISTING QR AND O PROVISIONS 


THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT CHANGE TO CURRENT ENROLMENT PRACTICES WHICH I BELIEVE WILL GO A LONG WAY TOWARDS REINFORCING MY COMMITMENT TO FORMER REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WHO POSSESS SKILL SETS THAT WE REQUIRE. 


SIGNED BY GEN W.J. NATYNCZYK, CDS


----------



## BlueOne

Hi there,

I've been re-applying on may 15 and the girl in charge of my file told me she would have to send an archive request for my past services within the force. (10 years ago) She also stated that she needed confirmation from Kingston, Ottawa and Longue-Pointe.

How many time does it usualy takes for thoose archives to come back? I mean, she told me she had to wait for thoose before scheduling an interview and medical.


----------



## George Wallace

I took a Release in 1978 and returned to the Reserves.  The Release Section was not very helpful and never told me about going onto the SUP List.  I was back into the Regs in 1979 before my records caught up to me from the Archives.

Remember, this is before they did everything digitally, and it took over a year.  Do not be surprised if it takes almost as long today, depending on circumstances of your previous Service and how your files were handled, and the administrative procedures/delays involved in retrieving your files.

Your former (Regular Force) Unit is required to keep your Medical File for a year before sending it to Health Services and then to the Archives.  Your Pers File also has regulated "holding times" that various organizations must follow prior to it going into the Archives.

These are factors you will face in retrieving your files.

In your case, 10 years would mean that all your files should be in the Archives.  They may not be digital copies and may be in a stack of files to be entered digitally into a database.  This may create a delay as someone will now have to look through those stacks to find your file(s).



Other than saying that it could take a couple of weeks to a year as a guesstimation, I don't think anyone could accurately predict when your files will be retrieved.


----------



## Biohazardxj

Sounds like what is been done is a VFS "Verification of Former Service"  In the last year I have done three of these for people wanting to join my unit. One was a guy who was reg then went res and then on the sup res list.  The VFS took about two months for him.  The other two are long retired guys who are becoming our honorary COL and LCOL.  It's been about 10 months now and I haven't heard anything back on them.  So I guess it depends on how old your records are and how long you have been out.


----------



## BlueOne

According to what is said here, it's more a pain in the *** than just be new to army.

I havn't been a long time in the army 10 years before... Did 2 months of the BMQ and then VR for medical and personal reasons (released 4c) Had an injury and had death in near familly. So my release reason depends on my past medical I guess. But they should'nt search too far once they have it, was a minor feet injury

Anyways, thanx for the advise. I will enjoy my freedom now and wait until they found the file(s). I will certainly call them once each two weeks (CFRC) to ensure the file isn't felt between two chairs.


----------



## Jake J

Hello,
I'd like to get some info on these 2 trades that the CF website doesn't offer.  I'm currently in the process of releasing from the reg force after 8 years in the artillery.  I'm thinking about joining the reserves, but I have little interest in continuing on as a gunner.  Would any of the members here know if either of these 2 trades (EGS / ED Tech) are offered in the reserve world? If so are the employing units few and far between or are these trades just part of the big family that a reservist support unit would employ - ie: Sup Techs, MSE OP's, V-Techs, Cooks etc. all parading together in a service battalion unit.

Also getting back into the reg force is a real possibility for me, as I'm not bitter or jaded with the CF. So what would the wait time be like to get back into the reg force - how bad off are these trades for personal and how often does the engineer school in Gagetown run a QL3?


----------



## George Wallace

Jake J

You asked similar questions last year.  Please read some of the links provided, and the try a Search of some of the topics you are asking about.  We weren't born yesterday, and we have covered most of what you are asking in detail.


----------



## templeton peck

Sorry to post another downer, but I too found it much harder to re-enlist than to join fresh off the street. Counter-intuitive, you bet! I had this request for former service as well, and it took 3 years as part of my records were in archives and the other part  elsewhere (that is all I ever learned of that). I requested an access to information as any civilian has the right and I got it back in a month, while the recruiting center still took the extra 2 years and some to get the same, and of course they needed it directly from the source and my copy wasn't acceptable. Keep your chin up!


----------



## BlueOne

I called on tuesday this week and my file was felt between two chairs (to make a difference) and the cpl to who I spoked to just gave me a medical appointment for june 30 !

The things are going on now, after then, the "normal" procedures will go on (I guess!) and a few weeks later will follow the interview (if medicaly qualified) and then the merit list, the contract and finaly the BMQ!

I think the only tip is to call them often to ensure the file is keeping going, it seems that they have trouble making the files to follow their route.


----------



## newrecuitez

hellow everyone I was just thinking about rejoining the cf's. Here are my circumstances.. I just when i was 17 and now 19. I was really young (and still am haha) and was my first time away from home and was very scared. But I really want to rejoin but i left for the wrong reason and i put on my vr form was "that it wasnt for me." But I REALLY want to rejoin for all the right reasons which are job security, traveling, and a few others. BUT when they are going to ask me "why should we reenroll you" I can't say it was my first time away from home. I was thinking about lieing (trust me its good) but I don't think its right or legal. PLEASE HELP what should I say considering my application is already in and im very worried.


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## MikeL

I'm gonna let you in on a secret... it'll be helpful for this situation an the rest of your life.


Be honest an truthfull with people. Don't give people BS stories, etc.


----------



## newrecuitez

I wasn't really looking for an ethical reviue im oviously not going to lie. My question is whats something that would impress the recruiter so i can be back  on my way to bmq.


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## fuzzy806

Honesty, will always impress. The recruiter's are looking for people with integrity, show them some and I'm sure they will show you some understanding.


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## newrecuitez

Ok, we'll the only reason I am posting is because I nevous about how the recruiter said "we will see the reasons for why you left".


----------



## PuckChaser

newrecuitez said:
			
		

> I wasn't really looking for an ethical reviue im oviously not going to lie. My question is whats something that would impress the recruiter so i can be back  on my way to bmq.



The 2 sentences in your post conflict each other. Unless of course you want to hear that "the truth" is the something that would impress the recruiter.


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## newrecuitez

No it doesn't I just want to know if its even possible to get in? maybe i said it in to many words.


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## derael

Yes it's possible. I was once in, got out and then rejoined a few years later. 

Just make sure you know why you left, and why you want back in. You can be sure they will ask you on your interview.

Most of all; be honest.


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## newrecuitez

Thats great to hear I have had this burning feeling in my gut ever since I left. Its almost like a calling. =). Besides always having a place to sleep and a decent salary job security(and many more but to many to name).


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## kincanucks

Jesus wept!  What kind of organization do you think the CF is?  We don't care you got out before as long as you weren't kicked out for some disgusting reason.  You have changed your mind and now want to rejoin, big freaking deal.  The CF doesn't hold grudges.  You aren't the first and you certainly won't be the last.  Now worry about something else.


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## George Wallace

Must have been different standards back then.  Looking at these posts, I don't think the criteria for Education was met.  You may not get back into the CF.


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## newrecuitez

what do you mean education requirment has not been met?  I am compelety competent that is not a problem.


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## MikeL

newrecuitez said:
			
		

> what do you mean education requirment has not been met?  I am compelety competent that is not a problem.



He's saying your spelling and grammar skills are weak.


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## newrecuitez

good thing im going infantry and going to kick ass :threat:


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## George Wallace

newrecuitez said:
			
		

> good thing im going infantry and going to kick ass :threat:



Right!    :


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## derael

He's going to first blind them with bad grammar and then finish them off with a bayonet charge.


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## George Wallace

At first I thought you said he was going to go blind.......remembering the old saying that if you don't stop that, you'll go blind; and perhaps he will.   ;D


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## derael

Oh! That's what my mom was always trying to tell me! .... Never got that till just now.


----------



## Rayman452

I applied for the regular forces in February, and got my ROTP acceptance offer in April.  I didn't accept the offer due to family issues, and now I'm considering applying to the local reserve unit.  Will my previous lack of commitment to signing on affect my new attempt to join the reserves?


----------



## PMedMoe

Rayman452 said:
			
		

> I applied for the regular forces in February, and got my ROTP acceptance offer in April.  I didn't accept the offer do to family issues, and now I'm considering applying to the local reserve unit.  Will my previous lack of commitment to signing on affect my new attempt to join the reserves?



It shouldn't, if you explain why you didn't follow through on your previous acceptance.


----------



## kincanucks

Rayman452 said:
			
		

> I applied for the regular forces in February, and got my ROTP acceptance offer in April.  I didn't accept the offer do to family issues, and now I'm considering applying to the local reserve unit.  Will my previous lack of commitment to signing on affect my new attempt to join the reserves?



Yes, because the CF is a spiteful organization and gets really pissed off at people who don't accept their offers.  In fact there is a wall of shame in each CFRC/D that has the names of all those that have pissed off the CF.  So don't even try applying again.

HH and DA


----------



## Hilander

Hi Everyone,

So, after 13 years in civy street, I've decided to get back into the CF.  Not sure why I left in the first place, but haven't really regretted my time away.  It's just that I never really should have left.

Anyways, the recruiting process for a re-enrollee - to me - isn't a smooth as it should be.  Granted there are prior documents that need to be retrieved to support your recruiting process, but I feel that there should be a quicker timeframe to get re-enrollees back into the military.

Right now I'm over 3 months into the process.  Whereas a new recruit typically has just finished school and has minimal responsibilities, a re-enrollee is either in a job or is unemployed.  Most often, the responsibilities a huge. So, wouldn't Recruiting want to get a re-enrollee back in quicker?  If the process takes too long, Recruiting could find them long gone because they couldn't wait that long and now you've lost a skilled person.

Just my thoughts as I continue to wait for my previous medical docs to show up at the Recruiting Center.

Cheers.


----------



## NewellR

I'm not sure if it go's with to your situation but i was under the impression that they did streamline the process for re-enlistment and there is a post on it somewhere.  i imagine one of the reason's for delay would have to do with the fact that you have been out for 13years and all the process's have changed.  I re-enlisted today and i have only been out for 4 years, and the paperwork was already different.  if i remember correctly i filled out my app for re-up for the first time 1 year ago and the papers were different then to.  i dont know what the answer is to your situation. just that no matter what, it takes along time to join no matter if your a new app or a re-up.  on a side note does it take this long to join other forces around the world.... is it standard practice around the world to take 4 to 10 months to join the military?


----------



## starseed

I would imagine that if you kept a copy of all your documentation, preferably in something fireproof, the process would be streamlined. If DND has to go digging to find documentation of your previous career, you've gotta know it will take a bit.


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## George Wallace

Let's begin with some basics.  A person reenrolling after a couple of years of their Release is usually not a problem.  Their skill sets and training are still relatively current.  

A person reenrolling after five years is now facing evaluation of their previous training and qualifications.  They may or may not be offered Recruit School/BMQ/BMOQ bypass.  They will in all likelihood have to do SQ over again.

A person reenrolling after being away ten years is usually deemed as being too removed from the CF to still be current, and will most likely have to do BMQ and SQ, and depending on their qualifications, part or all of their Trades training again.  Their files must be retrieved from the Archives.   A Prior Learning Assessment must be conducted.  Terms of Service must be drawn up and accepted by the member.  All the normal paperwork that all new applicants must fill out, must be filled out.  A reenrollee has much more documentation to be done than a 18 year old right out of high school with no previous Service.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

starseed said:
			
		

> I would imagine that if you kept a copy of all your documentation, preferably in something fireproof, the process would be streamlined. If DND has to go digging to find documentation of your previous career, you've gotta know it will take a bit.



Wrong. I had my complete original UER, amongst other documents, and it took them over a year to verify my previous service and get me re-enlisted after an eight year absence.


----------



## NewellR

to reiterate my question is our recruiting process long or short in comparison to other forces around the globe.


----------



## Hilander

George Wallace said:
			
		

> A person reenrolling after five years is now facing evaluation of their previous training and qualifications.  They may or may not be offered Recruit School/BMQ/BMOQ bypass.  They will in all likelihood have to do SQ over again.



It's not a given the retraining will be required.  I've spoke with my (soon to be) Career Manager and have explained my career post-CF and I'm considered a skill applicant ... despite my Classification being Logistics.  It's been deemed I won't have to do Basic again nor my Log Officer course, however I "might" have to take the Supply Specialty Officer's Course again.  That still hasn't been determined yet.



			
				recceguy said:
			
		

> Wrong. I had my complete original UER, amongst other documents, and it took them over a year to verify my previous service and get me re-enlisted after an eight year absence.



You're right ... I have all my previous documents, but they won't even take a look at them.

Thankfully, I know someone at Recruiting Group HQ and they've just hastened the Medical Offices in Ottawa.  I asked the CFRC to hasten them, but they said they can't.  So, effectively, if it took 6 months to get my Med Docs, so be it.  That to me is unacceptable.

The Air Force Intake & Liaison Team states: "Re-enrolment for previous serving members can take as long as one year. The AFI&LT is working closely with CFRG and the career managers in an effort to reduce re-enrolment waiting time to four to six weeks."

That ain't happening ...


----------



## George Wallace

Hilander said:
			
		

> Thankfully, I know someone at Recruiting Group HQ and they've just hastened the Medical Offices in Ottawa.  I asked the CFRC to hasten them, but they said they can't.  So, effectively, if it took 6 months to get my Med Docs, so be it.  That to me is unacceptable.



I can see a problem perhaps developing right here.


----------



## kincanucks

Woo is me.  Yes it takes a longer time to enroll someone with previous service than someone without.  So what.  Nobody made you get out and no one is making you get back in.  Should service records be more accessible?  Sure they should but I freaking guarantee that this is not anything that CFRG has any control over.  Enrolling someone in to the CF is a combination of several different entities all working on different agendas.  You as a former CF officer should set a better example and not be on here whining about how long it is taking you to get back.  I expect that from a ill-informed civilian not someone has been in before.  You want it?  You have to wait for it.

T_hankfully, I know someone at Recruiting Group HQ and they've just hastened the Medical Offices in Ottawa.  I asked the CFRC to hasten them, but they said they can't.  So, effectively, if it took 6 months to get my Med Docs, so be it.  That to me is unacceptable._

Yes keep making friends at the CFRC.  People who pull the "I know somebody at ..." a just a little too self important.


----------



## Hilander

kincanucks said:
			
		

> Woo is me.  Yes it takes a longer time to enroll someone with previous service than someone without.  So what.



Wow. Considering you don't know my situation, etc., that's pretty rude to assume this attitude.  Did you ever think there might be a reason I need the process to go quickly and that waiting until 2010 just wouldn't be acceptable?  Think about being in my shoes before commenting like that.



			
				kincanucks said:
			
		

> _Thankfully, I know someone at Recruiting Group HQ and they've just hastened the Medical Offices in Ottawa.  I asked the CFRC to hasten them, but they said they can't.  So, effectively, if it took 6 months to get my Med Docs, so be it.  That to me is unacceptable._
> 
> Yes keep making friends at the CFRC.  People who pull the "I know somebody at ..." a just a little too self important.



And yet I have an excellent relationship with them.  Again, you need to know the whole situation before commenting negatively as you've done.  Have you ever heard of networking?  You've probably done it in your day-to-day business ... well guess what?  My business at the moment is getting back into the military.  So, I will contact whomever I need to get the job done.

They have no knowledge of any hastening actions taking by myself or CFRG at the CFRC, as this was done behind the scenes.  They would not hasten Ottawa for the docs, so I took the bull by the horns and got it done.  So tell me, why couldn't the CFRC do this?  Why did I have to seek assistance elsewhere?

As for getting out of the military previously, you're right ... no one did make me get out.  But so what?  Again, you have no idea of my circumstances at that time.  So, because I do want to get back in am I to be considered a 3rd class citizen?  Should I expect to be treated differently ... actually, yes.  I offer a skilled package that can be utilized by the CF now.  I don't have to do any training, so I can be slotted right into a position now and not months later.

Feel free to slam me again.  We've seen what you're made of now.

Cheers, Hilander.


----------



## kincanucks

Hilander said:
			
		

> Wow. Considering you don't know my situation, etc., that's pretty rude to assume this attitude.  Did you ever think there might be a reason I need the process to go quickly and that waiting until 2010 just wouldn't be acceptable?  Think about being in my shoes before commenting like that.
> 
> And yet I have an excellent relationship with them.  Again, you need to know the whole situation before commenting negatively as you've done.  Have you ever heard of networking?  You've probably done it in your day-to-day business ... well guess what?  My business at the moment is getting back into the military.  So, I will contact whomever I need to get the job done.
> 
> They have no knowledge of any hastening actions taking by myself or CFRG at the CFRC, as this was done behind the scenes.  They would not hasten Ottawa for the docs, so I took the bull by the horns and got it done.  So tell me, why couldn't the CFRC do this?  Why did I have to seek assistance elsewhere?
> 
> As for getting out of the military previously, you're right ... no one did make me get out.  But so what?  Again, you have no idea of my circumstances at that time.  So, because I do want to get back in am I to be considered a 3rd class citizen?  Should I expect to be treated differently ... actually, yes.  I offer a skilled package that can be utilized by the CF now.  I don't have to do any training, so I can be slotted right into a position now and not months later.
> 
> Feel free to slam me again.  We've seen what you're made of now.
> 
> Cheers, Hilander.



Don't worry buds I know your situation very well because I have seen self important people like you come through my detachment all the time when I was in recruiting.  Think the world owes them everything because they were once in and they know people.  No, you are not a 3rd class citizen but you should wait your turn just like everyone else.  You know what happens when CFRC/Ds ask other agencies to hasten things?  They get told to wait just like everyone else.  Good luck.

HH and DA


----------



## Hilander

Wow ... look at you.  Talk about self importance!  You think because you've either been in or are in Recruiting, you've got all the answers.

You know what?  I am that important.  Maybe not in your eyes, but I KNOW I offer the military a lot.  I did when I was in and I do even more so now.  No, I wasn't the answer to all problems ... I'm human.  So what if I want the timings to be quicker.  I take it YOU would just roll over and take whatever answers you're given?  You would wait 12+ months because that's what they tell you it would take?  Well, then you deserve all the crap you've received in your career.  If you want something bad enough, you have to fight for it.

And that is what I'm doing.  I'm questioning the timeframe it's taking.  I'm finding ways to improve upon those timings.  I'm doing it discretely through the Group (not the Detachment like you think), as I know someone there that can make things happen.  He and I have discussed how to approach these timing issues and he's advising me on what the CFRG HQ can do for me.

I'm being told that it'll take a long time to get booked for a medical because there aren't that many Dr's available to do one.  You actually think I'm going to accept that?  Guess what, I'll drive to the next province on my own dime where the Dr situation might not be as bad.  Don't tell me I'll have to wait one month for the medical, when in the next province it could possibly be this week.  The CFRC/D's are all on the same system, so the tests and results can be done elsewhere.

You know that and I know that.

Me, I choose to see if the system can be improved upon and you know what?  It can, in a number of ways.  I want to be back in the military, so I'm going to do EVERYTHING I can to make that happen.  The quicker, the better at this point.

So, take your attitude and sell it to someone else.  You talk to me about being an Officer in the military?  Take the time to understand an issue first before thinking you have the right to crap on someone.

Who's self important now?

Cheers, Hilander
(More of leader than you ever wished to be)


----------



## aesop081

Hilander said:
			
		

> Who's self important now?



I don't know about everyone else but i read your posts and all i see is "I".



> (More of leader than you ever wished to be)



Brilliant. You bitch that other posters make assumptions about you and you turn around and make some about them. Theres a word for that. I will give you a hint, its starts with "H".

Dont bother getting back in, we dont want ya.


----------



## George Wallace

You know that the more you post like that, like a spoiled little child, the more you dig yourself into a deeper hole.  You are setting the stage here where many who have been or are in the same boat as you are wondering about YOUR ethics.  They are wondering how they too can start to used the backdoor connections of their Members of Parliament, their Mayor, their Premier, their friend in the PMOs Office, their best friend's uncle the CLS, etc. to hasten their entry into the CF.  

Go ahead.  Tell us all about your "connections at CFRG".  I think some of your "connection's" bosses are also interested in your morale and ethical values.  Many from the CFRG do frequent this site, and offer valued advice to potential prospects.  I wonder what example you are demonstrating in jumping the Que.

I hope that you also realize that the CF has changed drastically since you left in 1996.  Others who have re-enrolled as skilled applicants are also wondering about your situation and why theirs is so much different.  

But if you want to argue 'till you are blue in the face with people who have been or are Recruiters....fill your boots.  Your subordinants are also making judgements of who you are.  You have after all given us all a good description of who you are;  a Log O, returning after being out for 13 years.  You know how small the CF is, and how fast the word gets around.   Heck, us peons really can't hold you back.  So carry on.  Paint us more of a picture of who you really are.


----------



## starseed

recceguy said:
			
		

> Wrong. I had my complete original UER, amongst other documents, and it took them over a year to verify my previous service and get me re-enlisted after an eight year absence.


Well, that's why I said I imagine =\


----------



## the 48th regulator

starseed said:
			
		

> Well, that's why I said I imagine =\




Please refrain from imagining what is the right and wrong thing to do.

It just wastes bandwidth.

dileas

tess


milnet.ca staff


----------



## starseed

the 48th regulator said:
			
		

> Please refrain from imagining what is the right and wrong thing to do.
> 
> It just wastes bandwidth.
> 
> dileas
> 
> tess
> 
> 
> milnet.ca staff


Fair enough, but if everyone refrained from posting things that are a waste of bandwidth on this site the forum wouldn't need to be subdivided.


----------



## the 48th regulator

starseed said:
			
		

> Fair enough, but if everyone refrained from posting things that are a waste of bandwidth on this site the forum wouldn't need to be subdivided.



And that is strike three.


You have mouthed off enough on this site, and I will tolerate no more.

If you are here to participate, learn the rule about staying in your lane, with regards to experience and what you post.

If you are here to torment the Moderation staff, trundle off and spend your time preparing to be a soldier.  If you haven't noticed, most of the people you challenge are, or were.

dileas

tess

milnet.ca staff


----------



## kincanucks

"More of leader than you ever wished to be"

Wow just wow.  Really?  I don't see me on here bitching about how the recruiting system is slowing down my re-enrolment.  Oh that is right I have served for 25 continuous years.  You are a shining example of self before service but I guess to each his own.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

I think that's all that's needed here.

Locked

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## Steve_D

Not sure if anyone would be interested in my story, but here it goes.  In 1985, I applied for ROTP straight out of grade 12, but was denied due to the fact that my "marks were just not high enough". One year later, after a year at Saint Mary's University, I applied again (my only goal in life at that time was to be a pilot) and was accepted.  I entered as "B List" which meant that I was slated to go back to Saint Mary's unless a spot opened up for me at Mil Col.  Two days before I was slated to get on the plane in Vancouver to go back to Halifax, I was informed that I would be going to Royal Roads Military College.  I had 4 seperate ULOs (University Liason Officers) tell me that I would NOT make it as my marks were not good enough.  I believed the first three, but the fourth one ticked me off enough that I decided to prove them all wrong.  In 1990, I graduated with BSc in Pysics and Oceanography (showed them!). I did not make it as a pilot, and was transferred to Logistics (transportation).I got out in 1994, believing that the grass would be greener on the other side and dump trucks just don't turn my crank. At that time, the pay was still quite low and progression was limited as there was a real slow down in promotions.  
I have done a large variety of jobs since then; almost all in a leadership capacity.  But after being laid off twice, and having a wife and 2 children, the need for job security is very much a priority in my life.

I have been batting the idea of re-joining for a while now, but would like to be a MARS officer this time.  So...early July, I went down to the RC and picked up my application.  I returned it two days later and was scheduled to write the CFAT on Aug 4, but it has been rescheduled for Aug 17.

I am very, very excited to re-enter the military as I feel that I never truely left.  I don't focus on regrets about getting out, but instead focus on the fact that I have gained a lot of great leadership experice in other areas of life which I believe will make me a better officer.  I am almost 42 and trying like hell to get back in shape.  I can do push ups and sit ups (but not that many, yet) and on my third day of running, was able to run 1/37 miles in 14 minutes and fully intend on being able to complete the 2.4 km in the required time.

It has been so long since I went through the process the first time that I was wondering if anyone could help me prepare for the interview. What type of questions do they ask?

Thank you ahead of time for anyone who responds.

Steve


----------



## SupersonicMax

Steve, the interview is very straight forward.  Granted, it's been 10 years since I did it, basically, all you have to do is know a little bit about the trade(s) you want, the CF in general and be honest in all the answers about yourself.

If you search on this forum, you'll find a bunch of good information about the interview.

Good Luck!


----------



## Steve_D

Thanks for the quick response.  Without wanting to sound too confident, I do believe that my "life experience" and maturity level will help my somewhat, but do have concerns about them not wnating me back in due to my age. Anyone else try to get in when they were in their 40s?

Although my body is in civies, my heart remains in uniform.


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse

Steve_D said:
			
		

> . Anyone else try to get in when they were in their 40s?



I believe you will find several threads about those that have done it.


----------



## chrome1967

I am 41, and I am in the process of joining. I decided to join last winter when I was laid off for the first time. I went to a few job seminars while I was off, and the CF was  giving a presentation at one session. I was approached by a recruiter who asked if I was interested, I told him that I thought I was too old and would not be accepted. Long story short, that was not the case and I am just waiting for my medical to be OK'd, then I am on my way.
 Remember age is just a number. I am looking forward to the challenges ahead. I know it is going to be hard, but in the end I am sure it will be the most rewarding experience of my life. Just keep in mind because you are over 40, you are going to have to get a bunch of extra medical testing done, ECG ,blood work and such. This will slow down your process a little but just stay focused and start working out! Good luck to you!

Mark


----------



## Steve_D

Thanks Mark.

I am not worried myself about my age.  I truely believe that I can and will accomplish this as long as I remain dedicated and focused on my goal.  My main worry was how the RC was going to view my age. Good point about the extra medical, thanks.


----------



## Steve_D

Just wondering how long most people waited between writing the CFAT and receiving their results and then how long until they had thier interview?

Thanks

Steve


----------



## MrJimi

Steve_D said:
			
		

> Just wondering how long most people waited between writing the CFAT and receiving their results and then how long until they had thier interview?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Steve



I just wrote my CFAT and you basically find out immediately whether or not you've made the grade for your specific trade. They won't tell you a percentage score, but only if you've passed or not. After I was told that I passed, they told me to call tomorrow morning to book the interview. Hopefully I get mine booked sometime this week but I won't know until tomorrow.

MrJimi


----------



## Antoine

Hi Steve,

I am in my late 30'ies already and applying for MARS too but in the reserve. However, during the interview it was thought that I was applying for the regular, I don't know if that makes difference in the type of interview given.

For the CFAT, time yourself when you are preparing for the exam. I found the main challenge was the small amount of time allowed to answer, but I am a slow thinker. I got the interview one or two weeks later, I don't remember exactly.

For the interview, I found it was mainly to double check all the information in your application, to make sure that you have common sense and you are not a "special case" as you can find times to times on the present forum. However, they get banned pretty quickly from this forum, thanks to the Mod!

In my case, it was more about who I am than what do I know, to make sure that I am not living in Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, which in my situation, could apply as I have tendency to be a dreamer, not always smart on the evaluation of challenges, often I take too much on my shoulder for what I can carry!

I was honest about my strength, my weakness (being older, my CV was talking for me), my hope, my interest in CF, my concerns, well to sum-up, I was honest to all the questions I was asked!

Be clear, concise, short answer for wide questions, answer to the question, avoid digression,...

They didn't comment on my age at anytimes.

Be constructive in your answer, don't be shy about past mistakes or failures but explain it in a constructive way, what did you learn about it and so on...

Make sure that you read on your trade, enough to show in your answers how you could be a good fit for this trade based on who you are.

I don't know how the interview changes from officer to officer, trade to trade and files to files so I am just talking about my own experience and perception of the interview, but I got the ticket for the next application step, still take my word for the  :2c:

Hope this help!


----------



## Steve_D

Antoine

Thanks for the reply. It certainly did help.  I can't help but laugh at myself at the sudden level of anxiety that I am feeling about this. But it is an excitement about getting things underway and started.


----------



## Antoine

I was stress too for the CFAT, the interview and the medical but after all, I was over-thinking it.  

The CFAT given on the web site of the CF helps but I found mine a bit more challenging.

However, the questions were similar, thus if you forgot how to solve those 12Th grade math problems, take sometime to practice and as you probably found already, there is a huge amount of information on the CFAT in the present forum.

Don't stress for the interview, I am sure you'll do fine.

If you are applying for the regular, after you are done your medical, you might read on the NOAB in the present forum to prepare for it.

Cheers


----------



## Steve_D

I have been a sponge on as many of these forums as I possibly can. I have been reading them pretty much non stop during my down time at work. NOAB sounds like it is going to be great.  
I am applying for Reg.  
Have you recieved a date for BMOQ yet?


----------



## Antoine

In my case, I got the interview before the medical examination, ended up that my vision was (still is ) too weak for MARS, my eyes are V4.  

I am defending my thesis in two weeks  . After the defense, I'll shop for the eyes surgery and get it done (that makes me anxious), wait 3 months (my eyes are good for LASIK) and hopefully continue the application process.


----------



## Steve_D

Good luck with both the Thesis and the eye surgery, Antoine.


----------



## Steve_D

****update****

The old guy was able to run 2.2 km in 13:40 (the route I have been using is that distance and so far, that is about all I can handle) for only 1 week into my personal training along with 15 situps and 15 pushups.  I have set myself 3 main goals before BMOQ. (1) at least 30 pushups and situps (2) 2.4 Km in 11 min and (3) run at least 5km without feeling like I am going to die.

The situps and pushups feel like they are going to get better with only continued workouts.  The running has me a little worried as I have really short legs and it is hard to get a good pace going with long strides.  I am 5'8" and 173 lbs.  Hope to be down to at least 165 by enrollment date.  The only real fat that I have is a small spare tire which I have lost 20 lbs from since January.

I could have probably started a personal blog somewhere about this, but since I spend time in here practically every day and enjoy reading others progress regarding their application and recruiting stories along with their fitness progress, I thought that I might as well join in and give some people a bit of a laugh as we follow the old guy (but still consider myself young with a lot of time left to give to the military) through his progress.


----------



## Nfld Sapper

The PT test now consists of a 20 MSR and not a 2.4 km run.......


----------



## Antoine

That is funny,  I am the same size and weight, and also started same as you for the laps time, pushups and situps.

Don't give up, you are on a good start and it is a great idea to get fit before BMOQ.

Hope you take also some time off to enjoy the summer!

Cheers


----------



## Steve_D

I would love to take some time off this summer, but unfortunately, I need to find a second job (my income dropped to less than 30% of what it was in January and we just can't get by on what I am making now. We have been forced to sell our house and move to a rental (one of many reasons for my re-enlisting).  Please note that I am not looking for sympathy by my comment, just how life works.  Our weather has also been so poor here that we only had very few days with sun for the entire month of July. Hoping that August will be better.

My only concern will be fitting in workout time if I am working at one job from 6am - 11am and the other job from 1:30pm - 10pm.  I guess I need to answer my fathers old question of "what do you do between midnight and 5am anyway?"  lol

The answer is....I will find a way if I am serious about what I want to do...and I am VERY serious about getting back in the military and very excited about the Navy.

How are your workouts coming along, Antoine? Where are you up to now?

 :cdnsalute:


----------



## Antoine

Don't give up, life is a roller coaster with ups and downs, tough times are energy draining but it is through challenges that we are at our best and the survival machine start to be 100% creative, we are a learning sponge occasion hunter again as when we were in our early twenties, remember?

I guess training will be difficult to fit somewhere between the two jobs and the family, but I am sure you're going to make it, but be carefull with the burnout stuff, you know your limits (that is one of the advantage of getting older  ), so push your limit a bit further but slowly and surely! that is my  :2c: advice!

Focus and determination, and take care of yourself and your family.

In my case, I am preparing for my defense thesis, I have changed field, and I never had time to review the basics during my research, so I am catching up along with working on reviewing the advance stuff related to my research and with the preparation of my defense presentation. Times flying ! Will see how it goes  

Anyway, I don't complain as I am healthy, still young, happy with my girlfriend, happy in Vancouver, and in the process of joining the CF family to take up new challenges and serve the country (so I'll be usefull once in my life  ).

Cheers,
:cheers:


----------



## rod_barolo

Steve I am a lot older than you and can say that I have never been discouraged from joining.
I will say that I am in pretty good shape.  I can still run the 2.4 km in under 9min and could still likely get back to doing 100 plus pushups.  I also really enjoy things like climbing and parachuting.  

The Capt at the interview was even suggesting that I should consider officer. However, I was only interested in med tech.

Unfortunately, it looks like I may not make it due to bad luck.  My ECG came back as abnormal.  I thought that was impossible - I recently finished an ultra marathon in third.
It took over 2 months for me to get referred to a cardiologist.  He told me that since my heart was so strong and beat very slow and I was so lean that it likely just made some values on the ECG appear abnormal.  Unfortunately, he could not state this for sure without some other test.  Since there is no urgent reason for the other test it was not going to happen before my 54th birthday which makes me too old.


I got fowled up on bad luck and not the recruiting system.  Indeed I even asked them point blank if they were processing my application for political correctness and departmental policy reasons.  The recruiter said absolutely not.  All my experiences would make me believe they were being honest with me.

Also thanks a lot to all you men and women that serve our country .  I for one really appreciate it.  Wish I had been able to join you.


----------



## Steve_D

Rod - Sorry to hear that.

I took a rest day today and will be back at the workout routine tomorrow morning.  

Antione - Thanks for the update - keep us posted on your research.

Sun is finally out today here...yay!  Stuck inside at work...boo!  

There is an elementary school directly behind my house, so tomorrow I am going to go down and see if they have a bar that I can use to do chin ups.  In my prime, I only could manage about 16.  I think that I will set my goal tomorrow at 2 and see how it goes.


----------



## Steve_D

Well...good and not so good today....started a new workout routine with a higher intensity. Felt really good.  Went for a run at a different location. Thought is would be flatter, but it turned out to be more uphill than I expected.  I only got 2km in 11 min.  I did find a bar at the school to try my chinups. Got 3! Last one was tough, but I beat my goal of 2..so I felt good about that.

14 days until CFAT. Already been on math.com for revision.  Math is generally a stong subject of mine (BSc in Physics and Oceanography), but it has been over 19 years, so a refresher is a good idea and I plan to go back and do more tutorials and practice tests.


----------



## Otis

Steve_D said:
			
		

> Well...good and not so good today....started a new workout routine with a higher intensity. Felt really good.  Went for a run at a different location. Thought is would be flatter, but it turned out to be more uphill than I expected.  I only got 2km in 11 min.  I did find a bar at the school to try my chinups. Got 3! Last one was tough, but I beat my goal of 2..so I felt good about that.
> 
> 14 days until CFAT. Already been on math.com for revision.  Math is generally a stong subject of mine (BSc in Physics and Oceanography), but it has been over 19 years, so a refresher is a good idea and I plan to go back and do more tutorials and practice tests.



Good work Steve, Keep up that PT!

Don't forget to look into the other topics of the CFAT ... spatial recognition can often vex people as well as the problem solving. As for the math, concentrate on remembering Grade 10 formulas and concepts (How to figure out diameters and volumes, how to multiply, divide, add and subtract fractions, etc.)

Good luck!

Otis


----------



## MeghanC

Hi Steve, 

I am 42 and in the process of applying myself to go back in after an absence of 7 years.  I have not had any issues come up with my age but as another poster stated, you will have to do a few extra medical tests such as blood-work and EKG.  I did my CFAT two weeks ago and right after they let us sign a conditional offer of employment which by that you knew you passed the test. I had my interview last week and at the interview was informed of my scores and where I stood relative to others (14/15 verbal, 14/15 spatial and 27/30 math which placed me in the 95th percentile). I am not sure if they tell everyone their scores or not, and I hadn't asked, the officer just asked me if they told me my results or not.  I also used math.com for some of my studying as well as a few other sites and did a few practice spatial quizzes I was able to find online. I think the main thing is to not spend too much time on each question as I always had time to quickly come back to the ones I earmarked on my paper to check over again. Most men score well on the spatial testing, so you likely will have no issues there but if isn't your strong point play some video games, research shows it can improve scores on spatial testing at least for women. The verbal isn't too difficult if you are a reader at all and have a decent vocabulary. The math has a variety of questions on it and you may study as I did some areas that are not covered but better safe than sorry. I only had the weekend to study and I was able to cover enough to do well on the test, so you should do fine. 

The interview can be lengthy but not unpleasant, they cover basically what you have put on your application, what you know about your trade, the pros and cons, the training, etc... Just read up on your trade, watch the video on DND, have an idea of why you think you are a good fit for it.  As well on the interview you will be asked situational type questions, like tell me of a time when..., so that might be an area you might want to prepare for as well. You are lucky you are going Mars as there are many spots open for it so you don't have to worry about  your trade being closed. You do need V3 for vision for Mars (I checked into it myself as I was trying for CEOTP) but I have V4 for my vision so cannot apply for it and there are no other open CEOTP spots for my vision level so I am applying NCM.

I am now waiting on my medical results and will see if things will continue or not.  Best of luck with everything, I am sure you will do great.


----------



## Steve_D

MeghanC

Thanks for the info. Very useful.  I am feeling confident about the interview (just want to not be over-confident).  My PT is getting better everyday as well. I was able to run 3.5 km today. My Goal will be to hit the 5km mark before the end of Aug.
Sorry to hear that your vision is not strong enough for MARS.  Were there no other officer careers that interested you (ie Logistics).  Either way; good luck and keep us updated as I believe everyone loves to hear the good news from others.

Steve


----------



## Steve_D

Some progress with my fitness is making me feel better.  I was able to run for over 27 minutes non stop yesterday (not the fastest pace, but non stop non-the-less).  I am up to 20 pushups and 15 situps and even managed to complete 4 chin ups.  I am feeling confidenent that all of these will be much higher by the time I start BMOQ; which looks to be Jan 2010 at the earliest.

Hope everyone else is progressing well too.

9 days until CFAT.

Steve


----------



## MLanteigne

...to the local Army reserves, after 7 years being out. I was in from 1995-2000, and a lot has changed since I was in. A lot of my good friends are still in, of course they have a few more stripes on their sleeves. 

My questions are: 

1. How it would be for a 32 year old to join back up in a younger man's game?

2. Are my courses (comms, recce, infantry) still valid? 

3. Would I go back in as a private, or the rank I left as, corporal?

4. I'm currently a police officer, but could manage some extra time. What is the minimum commitment to the reserves?

Thanks!


----------



## BC Old Guy

You will find that there are a number of people going the same route as you are - some for the first time.  We had several 50+ year old candidates on the recruit training this summer.  You may be one of the older people in your unit, but you will find others of a similar age, or older, in the other units.

In response to your specific questions:

1.  Work on your physical fitness.  You have an advantage over younger soldiers - you have used your muscles, and know what your body can do before it breaks.  You also have a disadvantage - us older people take longer to heal, and to get back in shape.  The better physically fit you are, the better you will do.

2.   There should be a review of your previous qualifications when you enroll.  However, it sometimes takes a long time - so you may have to re-do all your qualifications.   I'm not as current in this area as I once was - so perhaps someone else can provide a better answer.

3.  Normally, the rank is tied to the qualifications that are recognized.    But see caution at answer 2.

4.  The minimum commitment is 1 evening an week, and 1 weekend a month.  To get your courses, you will need more time, sometimes 3 weekends in a month.  I've seen people get by with less, but tempers tend to get short, as the leadership and your buddies are depending on you to show up to help with the training / work  / exercise prep.

Good Luck


----------



## George Wallace

Having been out for over 5 years, you may have to do BMQ and SQ over again.  That will be determined in the assessment they make of your previous service and qualifications.  You may loose some qualifications if they are "time sensitive", but will likely keep most of your qualifications.  You may loose your rank, if you are placed on BMQ or SQ, and if your unit CO feels you are a good candidate he may promote you to Cpl again on completion of those crses.  (Unit COs have the discretion to promote up to MCpl.)


Merged.

Read some of the previous posts for more info.


----------



## Steve_D

Called the RC today to see if they received my VFS and/or med docs yet.  I had been dealing with a PO, but he is on vacation this week and spoke to a sergeant that I have not previously spoken to.  He asked me a few questions about my former service and implied that I may not have to write the CFAT if he can pull my scores from my previous test (written in 1986).  That would be awesome as I had qualified as a pilot when I wrote that one.  Has anyone else ever heard of this as true?  It has got my hopes up, but I want to be careful not to get them up too high and set myself up for a let-down.

Still running my short little legs off on a daily basis.

Steve


----------



## MLanteigne

Roger, thanks for the info! I won't be able to re-do any courses simply based on the amount of free time I have available, which isn't much. So hopefully something can be arranged!

Thanks for your replies.


----------



## Otis

I hope it all works out for you Steve, but I'm _pretty sure_ that a test from 1986, even if he CAN find it, won't count because it was a much different test back then.

Having said that, I'm not entirely sure. It MAY be a CFRGHQ decision.

Good Luck.


----------



## Steve_D

Thanks Otis.  I am feeling similar now that I think about it some more.  What I will do is plan for the worst and hope for the best.


----------



## Antoine

Steve,

You'll be find, keep up the math problems solving review that are similar to the one given in example on the CF recruiting web site with a timer in hand.

Your progression on the PT looks pretty good.

Cheers,


----------



## MeghanC

Hey Steve, 

I was told the same thing regarding my original cfat, but they never found it so had to do the new one with only a week's warning, so best not to pin your hopes on it. At least the new one is pretty short compared to the old test and doesn't cover such a broad subject base.  I was hoping they would find my old one as I scored very well on it, and expected to score worse on the new one but am happy with the results.  

You are doing great on your PT, my running is something I have to really focus on more in the weeks to come. I was not interested in MARS so much as going Sigs O for ceotp but there was only one spot and it is filled and there are no ceotp spots open for V4 vision, so rather than wait another year, I will go back in NCM which I was before, and see if I can look into going officer later on, but if I stay NCM I am fine with that as well as I think there are some jobs I would enjoy more that are only available that route.


----------



## Steve_D

Great news!  I just spoke to the RC and I don't have to go in Monday to write the CFAT.  Just waiting for my med docs to come in so they schedule my interview and medical.  If they don't hear anything by Tuesday, they will put a rush on it as it can take up to a month to get them with summer vacation in place right now.  I hope that they don't take that long as I am really, really hoping to be at the NOAB on Sept 28.  I was also told that they are looking at (nothing confirmed yet) at putting on another BMOQ before Christmas.  That would be awesome.  You all know what it is like.  Once you make a decision like this, you just want to get the ball rolling.

Did a 6.5km walk with hills yesterday evening. Went well as I was not out of breath or anything, but the muscles are talking to me a little bit this morning. Next time, I am going to put on a back pack with some weight in it as well.  I don't own a rucksack, but figure this would be better than nothing.

Have a good day everyone.

Steve


----------



## chrome1967

That's great news Steve! Keep us posted,and keep up the PT, it sounds like you are really coming along.

Mark


----------



## Antoine

Good news Steve  :nod:


----------



## Steve_D

...and the day just keeps getting better.
I stopped at the new Sobeys (grocery store for those of you on the west coast, like save-on-foods) near my house this morning and guess who was there recruiting? You guessed it..the Navy.  Got to talk to some MARS officers and see some really awesome videos that are not on the website.  If you get a chance to see them, make sure you do. Your heart rate WILL climb and you will be pumped!  I spent about an hour chatting with them.  It was really great.

This day has been just awesome!


----------



## Otis

Steve_D said:
			
		

> Great news!  I just spoke to the RC and I don't have to go in Monday to write the CFAT.
> Steve



I am MOST pleased to hear that I was mistaken!

Congrats Steve!

Otis


----------



## MrJimi

Steve, great job on the PT! It's amazing the gains that can be made in such a short span of time. Not enough credit goes to the mental aspect of training and how a lot of times, the only person you're competing with is yourself. I'm also training and love the feeling that comes with finishing what you've set out to do.
I started hitting the track about a month ago to set up a time-trial log and have gone from 12:25 to 10:54 for 2.4 or 6 laps. When I first started the time-trials I had to push myself out the door, now I can't wait until the next time so I can attempt to lower my time. It becomes a nice challenge.
Best of luck on your interview and medical!

MrJimi


----------



## Steve_D

Great work MrJimi! Keep it up.  I am trying to find a 400m track around here, but no luck so far.  All I have is a cheap pedometer and sometimes it works, but I can't be sure of it's accuracy.  My running has not improved that much, but I am now up to 25 sit-ups and they were always my weakest point, so I feel good about that.  

Have a great day everyone!


----------



## Antoine

Nice to see all of you working on PT, I have to go back on it, I was slacking off a bit. 

I don't think that my Boss will let me go for the summer BMOQ, so I am looking for a strategy either to convince him or for a weekend BMOQ if it is available for reservist on the West Coast.

I'll pass by my local CFRC at some point and ask.

Cheers!


----------



## Steve_D

Update:

Short update here.  Called the RC on Tuesday and they are still waiting for my med docs to come in.  Been a little over a month now, so hoping that it will be soon.  The Sergeant said that he would make come calls to see if he can get a little move on it so that we can still do the interview and medical in time for me to attend the NOAB on Sept 28.  Fingers crossed.

More good news.  Two of my five references were contacted this week by BackCheck.  So at least I know that some things are on the move forward.

Only ran 2KM today, but that was in the middle of a 6.5KM walk around our local nature park (loaded with hills). So the workout was still a good one.

Hope you are all having a great day!

Steve


----------



## chrome1967

Great work with the PT Steve! Keep it up. That would be great if you could make it for Sept. 28th. Good luck.

Cheers 
Mark


----------



## Steve_D

Update:

I went into the RC on Tuesday morning. Instead of calling (again); I decided to dress nice (not a tie, but a short sleeve button up shirt with dress pants and dress shoes) and introduce myself to the Sgt whom I had been dealing with since the PO that I originally spoke to is away.  I know that having a face to go with the voice and name is a good thing, but this visit turned out even better than I expected.

The Sgt was very happy to have a face to go with the voice.  My med docs were not in yet (fingers crossed for any day now).  While he was looking through my file, I noticed the drug form that gets filled out at the same time as the CFAT.  Since I was exempt the CFAT, I mentioned to him that I knew that the form is filled out during CFAT and that I could fill it in now. (Thanks to these forums, I knew this little tidbit of information).

Well....next thing I know, I am in the Captain's office chatting with him about my application.  He had me fill out the drug form in front of him.  Wow...there are names on that form that I could not even pronounce and nicknames of drugs that I had never heard before.  Fortunately for me, I have never touched an illegal drug in my life.  But I did check off the alcohol box and we got a bit of a laugh when it came time to fill in total number of times (since I am 41) I just put unknown or we would still be there doing the math.

Anyway....by the end of the conversation, the Captain advised me to expect a call in the next couple of days to try and get me in for the interview and medical next week so that they can get me on the NOAB for Sept 28.

Now I do not wish to count my chickens before they are hatched, but I believe that this is potentially good news and am now jumping everytime the phone rings (and having a 16 yr old daughter, you can only guess how many times a day that happens).

I do believe that if I had simply phoned down the to RC and asked for an update, I would only have received "they are not in yet, call back next week"; but since I showed the initiative to dress nice and show up in person, they were willing to go the extra mile for me.

Let's hope.....

PS as far as PT goes, things are good, except that my right elbow keeps "clicking" when I am doing pushups and hurts like hell after 20.  Anyone else experience something like this? Might just be part of the old age kicking in     I found out that there is a 400m track at the local university, so going to go and check it out tonight on the way to touch up the wedding back tattoos that my wife and I got last month.

Thanks for all the encouragement and I will keep you posted as to any more progress.

Have a great day everyone.

Steve


----------



## dustinm

Good luck!

As Red Green puts it, "I'm pulling for you. We're all in this together" ;D


----------



## Steve_D

Awesome news!!  My wife took the call as I was arriving at work.  Interview and medical are scheduled for next Wednesday, Sept 2 at 8am.

Things are definately looking up!   ;D

BTW, does anyone know the start date of the October BMOQ  and if it is full?  I am wondering if there is any chance of getting on that course with the NOAB ending Oct 2.

Cheers to all

Steve


----------



## Steve_D

October BMOQ?  Don't ask where I got that one from. Guess I was just wishful thinking.  I believe the next BMOQ is Sept 8, followed by Jan 2010.

Sorry if I confused anyone.

Steve


----------



## Steve_D

And the good news just keeps on comming.  I have heard from all of my references and they have all been contacted.  Four of the five were via email and the fifth was a phone message.  When my friend called them back, they told him that they did not need him as they had enough from the other references.

Cool....one more check mark off the list.

Steve


----------



## ruckmarch

Sounds like you are making good progress Steve. Keep working at your physical strength, as you don't want them to capitalize on that weakness when you go to basic

Good luck


----------



## chrome1967

Things are really going your way Steve ! Good Luck on Wednsday. Keep us posted.


----------



## willellis

I am currently in the application process to once again become a member of the forces. I am looking into NES OP as a trade and want to know how different the recruitment process is for someone that doesn't require basic training. If anyone has any knowledge into how the recruits are assigned postings after their ql3s, please let me know. 

Thanks,

Will


----------



## Fishbone Jones

The recruting process, whereby you see a recruiter and join the Forces will be the same. Also, after you have gone through that process, they will give you an offer on where your career will start, and with what course.

This is really a question that you should take to the CFRC, as they are the only ones that can tell you where you stand and what will be required of you.


----------



## aesop081

willellis said:
			
		

> If anyone has andy knowledge into how the recruits are assigned postings for their ql3s, please let me know.



You get posted to where the apropriate school is. Not that complicated.


----------



## willellis

Thanks folks. I figured the same. always good to look for more input. I was also under the impression that in the aspect of the navy, since there is only two bases for initial posting, that you were able to request a posting, and yes, I know that it is "where and when needed"; not a rookie. I guess my question goes out to anyone that has knowledge of how this system works and if you know if its MARPAC or MARLANT upon your initial enrollment or whether you have to wait till ql3 training is complete. Thanks again.


----------



## shaunlin

Don't know how long you have been out but if it has been longer than 5years be prepared to re do basic, last i checked that was the cut off.


----------



## willellis

Icic. I talked to the CFRC Victoria and they said that 10 years was the limit. I got out in 03 so who knows. Just outta curiosity, where did you hear this.


----------



## shaunlin

I released in 2001 and was informed of the 5 year cut off by the release section in Borden.  Re joined in 2003 and worked in recruiting in Vancouver in 2005 and this was the rule then.  Don't have access to DIN right now so cannot give references.  Once application is complete and you get an offer it will state exactly what you are being granted, recruit school bypass, credited time towards promotion, pay incentive and such.  You will know for sure then.  I only suggest that you prepare to have to re do it unless you were an officer and did Basic officer training or were a MCpl with PLQ or had years in before you got out....
Just don't be surprised. and read any offer carefully.  Best of luck 


Just found this post in another thread.  Maybe it has some usefull info.

ANFORGEN 072/09 CDS 012/09 221848Z APR 09
- CF RETENTION STRATEGY - IMPROVED PROCEDURES TO RETURN TO REGULAR FORCE SERVICE
UNCLASSIFIED


REFS: A. ROD FROM AFC 21 JAN 09 
B. QR AND O CHAP 6, ENROLMENT AND RE-ENGAGEMENT 
C. DAOD 5002-1, ENROLMENT - REGULAR FORCE 
D. CBI 204.015, PAY INCREMENTS 
BILINGUAL MESSAGE/MESSAGE BILINGUE 



AS MANY OF YOU ARE AWARE, THE RE-ENROLMENT PROCESS FOR FORMER REGULAR MEMBERS WAS INEFFICIENT. IN AN ATTEMPT TO REBUILD AND STRENGTHEN OUR FORCES, I AM PLEASED TO ANNOUNCE THAT THE PROCESS TO RE-ENROL HAS NOW BEEN SIGNIFICANTLY STREAMLINED 


EFFECTIVE 01 APR 09, AND IAW REF A, THE MEMBER PERSONNEL RECORD RESUME (MPRR) WILL BE THE SOURCE DOCUMENT FOR PREVIOUS REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WHO MEET ALL OF THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS: 


PREVIOUS CF REGULAR FORCE EXPERIENCE AND CURRENTLY A CIVILIAN OR A MEMBER OF A RESERVE FORCE SUB-COMPONENT OTHER THAN THE PRIMARY RESERVE. NOTE THAT CURRENT PRIMARY RESERVE MEMBERS WILL CONTINUE TO USE THE EXISTING COMPONENT TRANSFER PROCESS 


RELEASED FROM THE REGULAR FORCE WITHIN THE PAST 5 YEARS 


OCCUPATION QUALIFIED 


RELEASED FROM THE REGULAR FORCE UNDER ITEMS 4, 5B OR 5C 


MEETS ALL OTHER QUALIFICATIONS, CONDITIONS AND STANDARDS FOR ENROLMENT OR COMPONENT TRANSFER 


DESIRES RE-ENROLMENT TO PREVIOUS OCCUPATION 


THE REGULAR FORCE MPRR WILL BE THE MAIN SOURCE USED TO DETERMINE RANK AND QUALIFICATIONS FOR INDIVIDUALS RETURNING TO REGULAR FORCE SERVICE. RANK, TIME IN RANK AND YEARS OF SERVICE ON RELEASE WILL BE CREDITED TO THE INDIVIDUAL APPLYING TO RE-ENROL INTO THE REGULAR FORCE. THIS INFORMATION WILL BE THE BASIS FOR THE D MIL C DETERMINATION OF RE-ENROLMENT OFFER. ERRORS FOUND IN THE MPRR CAN BE CORRECTED THROUGH THE USE OF ORIGINAL DOCUMENTATION 


FORMER REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WILL BE RE-ENROLLED INTO THE REGULAR FORCE AT THE SUBSTANTIVE RANK INDICATED ON THEIR REGULAR FORCE MPRR WITH THEIR QUALIFYING SERVICE USED TO DETERMINE PAY AND SENIORITY LEVELS. TOS WILL BE OFFERED ON THE BASIS OF SERVICE REQUIREMENT AND EXISTING QR AND O PROVISIONS 


THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT CHANGE TO CURRENT ENROLMENT PRACTICES WHICH I BELIEVE WILL GO A LONG WAY TOWARDS REINFORCING MY COMMITMENT TO FORMER REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WHO POSSESS SKILL SETS THAT WE REQUIRE. 


SIGNED BY GEN W.J. NATYNCZYK, CDS


----------



## willellis

Thanks so much. That is the info that I was looking for. Hope that I can avoid Saint Jean, but what ever, more important to get in asap. Again, thanks!


----------



## Steve_D

***UPDATE****

I had my interview and medical yesterday.  Both went very well and I was told that I was a very strong competitor for MARS, but since I am over 40, I also need the doctors appt, blood work and ECG.  The earliest that I could get into my doctor is next Wednesday. After that, I am not sure how soon I can get the blood work and ECG done.  Once they are completed (and results sent to my doctor) I need to get the documents to Fredricton (I live in Saint John). I told them that I will drive them up instead of dealing with extra time in the mail.  From there, they need to go to Ottawa and back to the RC before I can be confirmed for the Sept NOAB.  The final date that this can be done by is Sept 18.  I don't think that things can happen that quickly.  How long have others waited for the Ottawa reply?  The Capt at the RC did say that he will try to expedite it.

With the attempt to clear the backlog, I wonder if they would put on another NOAB prior to the Jan BMOQ.

Here's hoping for the best.....

Steve


----------



## chrome1967

Hey Steve,

As you know, I am also over 40. My blood work and ECG was the easiest part, I had an appointment with my doctor pretty quick, and then had the results in a week.  The hearing specialist was a different story, 4 weeks. When I dropped off  my completed medical forms, I was told 6 weeks I believe, for a response from Ottawa. There was a mix up and it ended up taking around 8 weeks.

It's hard to say because you have no way of knowing what the backlog is. I hope it all works out for you.
Good Luck and God speed to those documents!

Cheers 
Mark


----------



## Steve_D

Chrome

Were you able to do your bloodwork and ECG at the same place? or did you need seperate appointments?

Thanks for the kind words.

Steve


----------



## chrome1967

Yes Steve, my Doctor's office was set up to do both of those tests. The ENT specialist was even in the same building. 

If your Doc is in the same building as a clinic, or has a large practice, you should be good to go. Even if they have to send you to a Hospital, you should be able to do both of those tests at the same time, it's no big deal they only take a few minutes. It just took about a week for the blood work to be completed.

Good Luck.

Mark


----------



## Steve_D

Mark

Thanks for the information.  My doctor is not part of a clinic, but Saint John is not that big and I should be able to get in the same day.  The time frame from having the work done to getting the results is the one area that has me concerned as it is out of my hands.  I intend to request that my doctor help me with the urgency of it.

Steve


----------



## CFR FCS

Steve,
There is a 19 October BMOQ and when I checked last Friday there were spots still available. Keep up the workouts. Best of Luck

CFR FCS


----------



## Steve_D

Thanks CFR FCS

****UPDATE****

I got into see my doctor today.  she filled in the two forms right in front of me and gave me the paperwork for the bloodwork and ECG with a request that the ECG results are faxed to her.  So...off I run to the hospital. Got the bloodwork and ECG done in half the time that I spent waiting to see the doctor.  The lady at the ECG lab faxed the results right in front of me.  My doctor is away until Tuesday, but assured me that she will have everything ready for me to pick up on Tuesday morning.  Then I am going to drive to Fredericton on Tuesday morning and hand deliver the paperwork.  I did stop in at the Saint John RC to update them and the Captain still sounded positive that with this time lines, I still have a good change to make the Sept 18 deadline for NOAB.

More to follow next week.

Steve


----------



## Steve_D

****New Update****

I picked up my bloodwork and ECG results this morning from my doctor's officer here in Saint John and drove (read hauled A$$) up to Fredericton to hand deliver them.  At first, the Sgt at the front desk did not think that there were any medical staff in (heart sinks), but it turns out there is one in (heart rises again).  She tells me that there is not way that my medical docs can make it to Ottawa and be looked at by this Friday (heart sinks, again), unless the Capt at my RC sends her an email requesting that she sends the docs via Purolator.  I drive back to Saint John and straight to the RC.  It is 12:30 and the only one in the office is the Master Bombadier.  I ask him if the Capt is out for lunch and he tells me that the Capt took the day off (damn! heart sinks, again).  I start to explain to him what I was told in Fredericton and he tells me that he has already spoken to them. They are sending my file via purolator this morning and expect it to get to Ottawa later today so that the RMO can look at it tomorrow (an email has already been send expressing urgency).  The Master Bombadier feels that me making this NOAB is still very feasible. (heart is now up again).

I must say that my RC has been absolutely fantastic.  No matter who I speak to, they know my situation and are doing whatever they can to make this dream happen for me.  Kudos to the Saint John RC.

I am now going to go crazy for the rest of this week until I hear word.

Happiness never decreases by being shared.

Steve


----------



## Antoine

It looks pretty good, and means also that they found your candidature highly competitive if they help you to get to NOAB on time, that is also encouraging.

With all these running everywhere, the fact that you've been back on physical training is already usefull  

Cheers,


----------



## chrome1967

I wonder what your ECG would look like after all that !   That is all great news Steve ! I have my fingers crossed for you.

Cheers
Mark


----------



## chrome1967

I just read the good news Steve. Congratulations! Wishing you all the best my friend. I hope to see you around.

Cheers
Mark


----------



## Steve_D

Thanks Mark

I am really pumped.  I will update everyone more after I get details from my RC.

Steve


----------



## Steve_D

For those who missed my update on the NOAB thread, here it is:

I WILL be attending the NOAB on Sept 28.  I found out from someone in Esquimalt.  My travel arrangements have not been made yet. I gave a call to my RC this morning inquiring and the Cpl who makes the arrangements is out today and 'should' have them done by Thursday.

I seem to have a pattern of cutting things close with regards to timelines.  Keeps the blood pumping.

I am now like a little kid at Christmas time waiting for this week to end.  Today is my Friday at work, so having the next two off will help.

Remember:  In order to succeed, your desire for success should be greater than your fear of failure.

Steve


----------



## gcclarke

Steve_D said:
			
		

> For those who missed my update on the NOAB thread, here it is:
> 
> I WILL be attending the NOAB on Sept 28.  I found out from someone in Esquimalt.  My travel arrangements have not been made yet. I gave a call to my RC this morning inquiring and the Cpl who makes the arrangements is out today and 'should' have them done by Thursday.
> 
> I seem to have a pattern of cutting things close with regards to timelines.  Keeps the blood pumping.
> 
> I am now like a little kid at Christmas time waiting for this week to end.  Today is my Friday at work, so having the next two off will help.
> 
> Remember:  In order to succeed, your desire for success should be greater than your fear of failure.
> 
> Steve



Have fun on your NOAB. Be sure to try to acquire a nickname that will (likely) follow you the rest of your bloody career, like I did!


----------



## Steve_D

and.....share. What did you do? and what was the nickname that has followed you?


----------



## gcclarke

Steve_D said:
			
		

> and.....share. What did you do? and what was the nickname that has followed you?



I, while drinking at the gunroom at NOTC, went to the washroom. And on my way back, was somewhat eager to get back to my drink. I did not feel liek running back to the table would be a good idea, so I decided to kind of half run half walk. 

The other people drinking at said table thought it looked like I was skipping. Thus, since then, I have either been known as Skippy or Skipper.


----------



## Steve_D

Thank you for sharing that.  We will have to ensure we keep an eye out for opportunities next week.

Cheers


----------



## owa

I finally found the time to read through the thread.

Best of luck man!


----------



## Steve_D

Thank you very much, owa.

T minus 3 days (2 for me as I am flying out on Saturday)

 ;D


----------



## Steve_D

And the good news keeps on coming.

I picked up my travel docs this morning from the RC for NOAB next week in Victoria and was told that I have been exempt BMOQ.  

I am now vibrating like a little kid at Christmas time.  Can't wait to get back in uniform.  I won't really know more until after NAOB as to what the next steps are or when they will take place.  I can only hope that they will be quick as I know they are looking to get some of the candidates pushed through and started as quick as possible.  I hope to be one of them.

Steve
 ;D


----------



## CFR FCS

Normally NOAB candidates must have all their processing completed and are merit listed. If you are successful at NOAB you should expect an offer from CFRG within a few weeks of your completion date. Ask the DS when you are finished and be sure to tell the CFRC when you get back to turn in your claim that you were successful (or not) and when you are available to enrol. You might just get an early Christmas present. Best of luck.


----------



## Steve_D

Thank you for that, it helps me continue this feel good I have got going on right now.  I return home on Saturday and already told the RC that I will be in first thing Monday morning with the news. They also already know that I am available to enrol immediately.  In fact, nothing would make me happier than to be enrolled asap.  My work is already aware of my situation and do not require 2 weeks notice.

If I am lucky, I could even get an early halloween present.


----------



## philr1960

Have a question hopefully will get an answer just competed ecfat and interview medical is on 26 oct but at 48 i know they need blood test and ecg what are they looking for in blood test hope i get an answer ty in advance


----------



## medicineman

philr1960 said:
			
		

> Have a question hopefully will get an answer just competed ecfat and interview medical is on 26 oct but at 48 i know they need blood test and ecg what are they looking for in blood test hope i get an answer ty in advance



Anti-run on sentence gene.

MM


----------



## George Wallace

Cancer.


----------



## observor 69

Following the story of the members of the Sept 28 NOAB has been riveting reading. 
I eagerly await word from those members on their experiences and maybe news on their results.


----------



## Steve_D

Baden Guy

Good news!  Word from those of us who posted comments on the NOAB thread all made it in; including myself.  They made me an offer and I accpepted on the spot. I had a blast and can't wait to get back to Victoria and back in uniform (feels like it can't happen fast enough for me).  A great bunch of guys and gals were there and a fantastic time was had by all.

For me, I will meet with my RC Capt next week and see if he can send me back early so that I can do my in-routine and even be SLJO for somebody.

I will let everyone know more once I do.

Cheers

Steve


----------



## Antoine

Congrats Steve!


----------



## observor 69

Steve_D said:
			
		

> Baden Guy
> 
> Good news!  Word from those of us who posted comments on the NOAB thread all made it in; including myself.  They made me an offer and I accepted on the spot. I had a blast and can't wait to get back to Victoria and back in uniform (feels like it can't happen fast enough for me).  A great bunch of guys and gals were there and a fantastic time was had by all.
> 
> For me, I will meet with my RC Capt next week and see if he can send me back early so that I can do my in-routine and even be SLJO for somebody.
> 
> I will let everyone know more once I do.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Steve



Steve my wife and in laws are from Saint John and I am from NB so you'll have to excuse me if I am interested in your adventure.   

I know you mentioned earlier that you went to RRMC and have a Bsc. Also you were an officer in a support trade ? So I am curious, when you go Victoria will you get your commission back and if so what rank?


----------



## Steve_D

I still have to work out the details with the RC, but at the moment it appears that I will be sworn in as a commissioned officer. As far as the rank is concerned, I am not sure.  I am expecting Acting Sub Lieutenant (2nd LT).  If they start me at sub Lt (Lt), then bonus for me, but I am not expecting any privilages because it is me coming to the CF asking to get back in.

I will probably know more later next week.  I will let you know the status then.

Steve


----------



## gcclarke

Steve_D said:
			
		

> I still have to work out the details with the RC, but at the moment it appears that I will be sworn in as a commissioned officer. As far as the rank is concerned, I am not sure.  I am expecting Acting Sub Lieutenant (2nd LT).  If they start me at sub Lt (Lt), then bonus for me, but I am not expecting any privilages because it is me coming to the CF asking to get back in.
> 
> I will probably know more later next week.  I will let you know the status then.
> 
> Steve



No, it's you coming back to the CF offering up once again your valuable skill set, albeit in a different trade. The experience that you have is useful, if for no reason other than getting an understanding of how the bloody system works. Your knowledge isn't *that* outdated. 

Even if you don't manage to get your Subbie strip, I sincerely hope that you are able to get (more than) a few IPC levels out of this.


----------



## Steve_D

Thank you for those words, gcclarke.  I had not even though of the IPC levels.  I am just remaining grateful for this second opportunity.  

Remaining pumped....


----------



## Steve_D

Like so many others say...I got the call!  

I will be sworn in on Oct 14 and then flown out to Victoria for OJT until NETPO starts up.  I know that a lot of people may think that OJT could also mean being someone's SLJO; but that is just fine with me.  I will even do it with a smile on my face.  After Oct 20, I will not have much access to the internet, so my visits here will be less frequent.  

I would like to thank everyone who made comments and supported me through this interesting little journey of mine.  I feel a bit like a Phoenix, rising from the ashes (lay-offs, ect) to face a better life (back in the military).

Cheers for now.

Steve


----------



## mariomike

Steve_D said:
			
		

> I feel a bit like a Phoenix, rising from the ashes (lay-offs, ect) to face a better life (back in the military).



Just like they say in the movies, Steve: "You never had it so good"!
All kidding aside, congratulations and good luck.


----------



## gcclarke

Steve_D said:
			
		

> Like so many others say...I got the call!
> 
> I will be sworn in on Oct 14 and then flown out to Victoria for OJT until NETPO starts up.  I know that a lot of people may think that OJT could also mean being someone's SLJO; but that is just fine with me.  I will even do it with a smile on my face.  After Oct 20, I will not have much access to the internet, so my visits here will be less frequent.
> 
> I would like to thank everyone who made comments and supported me through this interesting little journey of mine.  I feel a bit like a Phoenix, rising from the ashes (lay-offs, ect) to face a better life (back in the military).
> 
> Cheers for now.
> 
> Steve



Glad to hear Steve. You had previously posted that you were hoping to get in on time to be on the Jan BMOQ. Shall I take it that you're exempted that since you're going straight to OJT? If so, that's completely awesome. No one needs to do that twice


----------



## Steve_D

Yes, I have been given a by-pass for BMOQ.  Although I was quite willing to do it in order to get in; I am extremely happy to be able to avoid doing it a second time.


----------



## observor 69

Great to hear you got your good news Steve. 
Happy times to see one freed from the "call centre hell."  ;D
Best of luck in Victoria and in moving toward your goals.

Acting Sub Lt.?


----------



## Steve_D

Baden Guy

Yes, I will be sworn in as an Acting Sub Lieutenant.  Pay grade yet to be determined, but low on my list of importance at this time. Just happy to have my desired path work out for me.

Have a great day and happy thanksgiving.

Steve


----------



## FDO

This helped a lot in people getting back in as far as the process goes. The problem we have now is it can still take a while for your Med Docs to come in. If you were out for a couple of years your med file is in archives and has to be located. It has taken several weeks in some cases. However, we can do everything else while we are waiting for the med info.


----------



## helpup

Nice to know and will keep that in mind for those earlier in their careers who leave after initial engagements.  Personally though when I get out it will be no more Regs for me.  Reserves maybe.


----------



## Touchingthevoid

Hi, 

   I submitted an application today to my local CFRC- DEO. Because I have previous military service I was told that the CFRC will need to do a verification of former service, I've been out for about a year, does anyone have an idea how long it takes to complete this step? Thanks, Happy holidays.


----------



## George Wallace

I just merged your question to several other topics on this subject.  You'll get a feel for what you are in for, if you read the preceding posts.


----------



## Otis

Touchingthevoid said:
			
		

> Hi,
> 
> I submitted an application today to my local CFRC- DEO. Because I have previous military service I was told that the CFRC will need to do a verification of former service, I've been out for about a year, does anyone have an idea how long it takes to complete this step? Thanks, Happy holidays.



SO, when I TOLD you today that it would take 2-6 months for your VFS and PMD's to be pulled from Ottawa, sent to us and reviewed I was what...? Talking to myself? Lying? Mistaken?


It never ceases to amaze me ... I REALLY have come to appreciate the depth and breadth of experience here on the Milnet, but when the Subject Matter Expert working IN the job tells you something, asking a second opinion from an unregulated, unofficial, anonymous forum on the internet seems to be the height of foolishness.

So, someone please correct me ... tell Touchingthevoid that the application to rejoin the CF is going to take 2 weeks ... nevermind the REMAINDER of the info that this member neglected to fill in ... that the file isn't even AT the CFRC being  reapplied to, so it has to be transferred (during the holidays no less!) from the original CFRC to the one now being applied to, or the fact that TTV was a reserve NCM now applying to Reg Officer with as yet unconfirmed CFAT scores and an incomplete University Education ... I want to see this person come back in January and tell me how wrong I am because someone on the Milnet forum told them I was.

Some people's kids ...  :brickwall:

I was wonder where my dander went ... and there I just found it, up there!

Otis

PS: note that no OPSEC is being breached ... I haven't identified the member in question, though I have quite plainly made clear that I DO know who it is ... someone remind me to write a post about how NOT to annoy your Recruiter ...


----------



## Touchingthevoid

Understood. I apologize, I just wanted to see other people's timelines.


----------



## CountDC

lol  - ok Otis have a 24 and come back after the holidays with your rosey glasses on.

and they wanted me to go to a recruiting centre. HA!

Cheers


----------



## Otis

Touchingthevoid said:
			
		

> Understood. I apologize, I just wanted to see other people's timelines.



Apology accepted.

If you were just attempting to do a comparison of your experience vs others, then you simply worded your original question poorly.

Rather than asking how long it takes to complete the step, if you had no intention of attempting to disprove me then you maybe should have asked if anyone else has gone through the process and how long it took them when THEY did it (a subtle difference I know, but a definite difference in tone and perceived intention)


CountDC: I'm calm now  8) ... I thought I was rather restrained considering what I MAY have said to a Pte who questioned what I told him - less than five hours after I'd told it to him - and went and publically asked other people if I was right or not ...  ;D


----------



## daftandbarmy

Otis said:
			
		

> Apology accepted.
> 
> If you were just attempting to do a comparison of your experience vs others, then you simply worded your original question poorly.
> 
> Rather than asking how long it takes to complete the step, if you had no intention of attempting to disprove me then you maybe should have asked if anyone else has gone through the process and how long it took them when THEY did it (a subtle difference I know, but a definite difference in tone and perceived intention)
> 
> 
> CountDC: I'm calm now  8) ... I thought I was rather restrained considering what I MAY have said to a Pte who questioned what I told him - less than five hours after I'd told it to him - and went and publically asked other people if I was right or not ...  ;D



Awesome. Yet more proof that ours is a small army and there's little room for BSers like me. Now I'm afraid.. very afraid (looks furtively over left shoulder while packing remaining bottles of snake oil in small carpet bag).


----------



## Touchingthevoid

I'll just follow the instructions I recieved previously.


----------



## rosco

Recruiter’s Advice Required

I have a soldier who will probably be released 5d - Not Advantageously Employable.  In this case he was “wholly or chiefly because of the conditions of military life or other factors beyond his control, develops personal weaknesses or has domestic or other personal problems that seriously impair his usefulness to or impose an excessive administrative burden on the Canadian Forces.”  

In short, he racked himself up to a 'Violation of C&P' for ‘Abuse of Alcohol.’  No laws were broken he just kept showing up hung-over.  He will be completing the 60 day spin dry and I think he will stop drinking.

He is a good soldier with above average conduct and performance save the drinking.  He has asked me the likelihood being accepted of he reapplied to the CF if he is released (assuming he stays sober).  The party line here at regiment in NO I would like to know what someone in the recruiting world thinks?


----------



## Tow Tripod

Rosco, To bad for him for breaking his CNP conditions.We can't care how great of a soldier he was if he can't control himself with alcohol.NCO's get paid to train troops and they should not be in baby sitting mode because Cpl Supertrooper can't make it to work on time!!


----------



## Haggis

rossco said:
			
		

> I have a soldier who will probably be released 5d - Not Advantageously Employable.


  The CANFORGEN specifically does not mention 5D.



			
				rossco said:
			
		

> In short, he racked him up to a violation of C&P for ‘Abuse of Alcohol.’  No laws were broken he just kept showing up hung-over.  He will be completing the 60 day spin dry and I think he will stop drinking.





			
				rossco said:
			
		

> In this case he was “wholly or chiefly because of the conditions of military life or other factors beyond his control, develops personal weaknesses or has domestic or other personal problems that seriously impair his usefulness to or impose an excessive administrative burden on the Canadian Forces.”



He was on C&P and still refused to stop drinking?  How is that a factor "beyond his control"?




			
				rossco said:
			
		

> He is a good soldier with above average conduct and performance save the drinking.  He has asked me the likelihood being accepted of he reapplied to the CF if he is released (assuming he stays sober).  The party line here at regiment in NO I would like to know what someone in the recruiting world thinks?



If he successfully completes C&P (which looks highly doubtful at this point) and the "spin-dry" and stays sober he may not need to be released.  If not so, the history of people getting back in with a 5D or 5F is pretty dismal.


----------



## secup

Hello,

I've completed BMQ + 11 weeks out of 13 of infantry course. As you prolly know SQ + PP1 is merged. Now that i left (4c) without completing PP1, is it possible to get the SQ credited?

I left 6 months ago


----------



## FDO

That will be up to the Occupation Manager. When you submit the application paperwork a PLAR will be sent to the OM. At that time he/she will decide what you are given credit for.


----------



## Caffeine Addict

Is there anything that parallels going to the Reserve Force?

I have an ex RegF Snr NCO, out less than two years, and currently on the SHR, who want's to come to the Reserves in the same trade. He's been told he must undergo a Prior Learning Assessment (!) first so they can determine what equivalencies to grant. Seriously. And this is not the first time.

My thought is that if they are simplifying a rtn to the RegF, then surely a simplification of a move to the ResF must be in hand. Or am I just being naive, again?


----------



## CountDC

Really?? Less than two years out??  We used to do a VFS request if needed and transfer the member.


----------



## dapaterson

Places to start - Internet links:

DAODs:
Component and Sub-component Transfers:
http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/dao-doa/5000/5002-3-eng.asp

Supplementary Reserve:
http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/dao-doa/5000/5002-4-eng.asp


CF Component Transfer and Component Transfer Career Programs:
http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/pd/pi-ip/doc/03-08-eng.pdf


----------



## Caffeine Addict

*CountDC* - I _know_. The scenario we're facing is certainly a disincentive to the (much desired) mbr.

*dap* - thanks for the refs; we've reviewed them. I'm hoping someone has had a similar experience in here and found _the answer_. No doubt it exists, but the tedium to reinvent the wheel ...

The issue was raised because the mbr in question was made aware of the likely req for a PLA down the road via a letter from DMPP - should they desire to return to active service _after 5 years_ on the SHR. So, goes the logical question, if it's apparently not needed until the 5 year mark, why now?

This takes on more significance when we discover that some releasing cells seem to have a habit of throwing mbrs onto the SHR despite their explicit written desire to do direct transfer. Now, a CT in the _other_ direction? Well, that's been seen to happen in 2-3 weeks. *sigh  Recruiting and retention _are_ priorities, right? Sure they are ...


----------



## CFR FCS

secup,
Make sure you bring your course report from your your INF DP1. That should show how many PO's you have completed against your SQ. It will make the PLAR a little quicker. 

CFR FCS


----------



## CountDC

have to ask - who is saying that a PLA is required?  With less than 2 years out all his qualifications should still be valid. 

Not surprised about release cells dumping people onto the supp list.  This has gone on for a long time.  Often it is because the member indicates they want to transfer to the primary reserve but do not have a unit lined up to transfer to.  Release cells will not take (or have) the time to find a unit for the member, it is up to them to find their own unit. of course, the member should actually contact the unit to make sure they will accept them first.

Have to do some more checking on this as I have time.  Really curious on this one.


----------



## Nesopgal

Sorry to bump this really old topic, but I didn't want to start a new one as this one is right on topic.
I searched around allot on this forum, and haven't found anything specific.
Here's my question, or situation. I reapplied a little bit more then a month ago, after VRing during Basic for reasons fully supported by my staff.
The people working at my CFRC, told me they are waiting for my medical file from Ottawa. Last week, I call for an update, and I talked to this really nice Corporal, he told me they had requested my file twice already, and to call back next week(this week). He said if they had not received it this week, they would go down another route and try and get my file(something about calling a ministry). I call today and talk to another person, and he tells me, yes my file was ordered but they have not received it and there is nothing he can do. I proceed to ask him what the corporal was talking about last week and he tells me he has no idea, but there is nothing he can do. Which is fine, I understand that he corporal didint leave any information about our conversation on my file. 

So I know there is a bunch of ex-recruiters on this website, and recruiters still in action, and maybe one of you will know what this corporal was talking about? 

Again sorry for bumping this old topic.


----------



## Caffeine Addict

My understanding is the req comes from Area. Then again, it could just be Area making the req known.

In this case, the (other) mbr was specific about the unit; had made contact, had indicated that unit on the paperwork. Bah ... Just attributing it to apathy. Unfortunately, there's precious little recourse on our side, and the mbr is (rightly) just a bit pissed at having to jump through extra hoops to get over here. The PRes already has a rep in some quarters for being a little on the slow side, administratively; even though it's a RegF issue, the PRes gets tainted with it.

If you can come up with anything, that'd be great! I'll keep my eyes peeled.


----------



## dapaterson

LFCO 24-20 explains the process for PLARs.  DWAN only link: http://lfcms.kingston.mil.ca/Document.aspx?DocID=143000440110665

It states in part:



> 16a.	Break in service of three years or less. Provided the applicant, if applicable, is currently certified (see para 17), the Land Force Area Headquarters (LFA HQs) have the authority to reinstate valid Army-level and Army occupation qualifications.  Authority for the reinstatement of all other qualifications rests with the appropriate MA;



Ref in whole should be reviewed for context.

If the  individual in question is Cbt Arms or any other trade managed by the Army (such as EME or Sigs), it should be trivial - Area can sign off.  If they are Log branch or some other occupation not under the Army, it becoems significantly more difficult, as other Managing Authorities for training (MAs) must be engaged.


----------



## CountDC

para 11 is the killer:

11.	Submission of the Request for Equivalency. Annex A shall be included with all equivalency requests.  Documentary proof of the qualification(s) or a detailed and substantiated description of experience must be attached.  *A request for equivalency must be submitted when*:

a.	a Component Transfer application is requested;
b.	a Occupational Transfer application is requested;
c.	*transfer from the Supplemental Reserve*; and


----------



## dapaterson

CountDC said:
			
		

> para 11 is the killer:
> 
> 11.	Submission of the Request for Equivalency. Annex A shall be included with all equivalency requests.  Documentary proof of the qualification(s) or a detailed and substantiated description of experience must be attached.  *A request for equivalency must be submitted when*:
> 
> a.	a Component Transfer application is requested;
> b.	a Occupational Transfer application is requested;
> c.	*transfer from the Supplemental Reserve*; and



An MPRR should be sufficient as proof of qualifications.  The G1 staff at the next level above the unit should be able to assist.


----------



## Caffeine Addict

Many thanks for all of that, folks. Hopefully I can offer some guidance based on the above and suggest that the wheel, indeed, does not require reinventing.


----------



## cdinunzi

I have Reserve and Reg force experience.  However I Was RTU when I was in the reserves (i was 17 and dumb) and V.R. due too family reasons while on BMQ in the Regs.  It has always been my goal to have a career in the forces, and my family and I believe that now is the perfect time.  I have grown up and have two children (7 and 3).  Would the CF accept me for a third time?
Ya Im the guy who wants to do Basic for the third time, I am very determined to serve and was hoping a recruiter or instructor would be able to give me some advice.


----------



## dangerboy

Go to the recruiting centre and ask them, that way you have it straight from the source and not an anonymous voice on the internet.  Are you wishing to go regular force or reserve?


----------



## Loachman

cdinunzi said:
			
		

> Would the CF accept me for a third time?



Standard advice: Talk to a recruiter. Do not put it off if you are really interested.


----------



## cdinunzi

I would like to go back to reserve and give my family a chance to adapt to me being gone.  Hoping that I can do like 2 years reserve and re-muster to Full time.  Doing this, I already know, will ease a lot of tension.  I thank you for your input and it is something that I will pursue with determination.


----------



## Nauticus

cdinunzi said:
			
		

> I have Reserve and Reg force experience.  However I Was RTU when I was in the reserves (i was 17 and dumb) and V.R. due too family reasons while on BMQ in the Regs.  It has always been my goal to have a career in the forces, and my family and I believe that now is the perfect time.  I have grown up and have two children (7 and 3).  Would the CF accept me for a third time?
> Ya Im the guy who wants to do Basic for the third time, I am very determined to serve and was hoping a recruiter or instructor would be able to give me some advice.


I'd consider you reconsider, then if you come to the same conclusion, do it.

You've already backed out twice. If you backed out a third time, I guarantee there wouldn't be a forth.


----------



## cdinunzi

I greatly appreciate you advice, and I have been reconsidering since the day I released.  Everything in me tells me I belong in the Forces.  Its a strong passion, (I am sure you are aware of what I am talking about)  Everyday I replay my military career in my head, with the thought of "What if".  I do not want to think of "What if" but rather "I DID IT!  After weighing the pros an cons I have come to the conclusion that this is what I want.  After having had some small experience in the forces, I know where my weakness' lay.  Therefore giving me the confidence to succeed.  

I am headed to the Recruiting Center in about 10 minutes, and hope to return with Good News.  Hopefully I can get on a course A.S.A.P.

Wanting a career in the military is not for money, I have a job that pays rather well.  I want to live the my life as a soldier with meaning not a civi with a job.


----------



## Loachman

cdinunzi said:
			
		

> I am headed to the Recruiting Center in about 10 minutes,



Well...? Are you back yet?


----------



## Nostix

Seems the recruiting center is a more dangerous place than originally anticipated.


----------



## cdinunzi

I was told there would be no problem with returning to the forces, as long as my Medical and Background check cleared. However there is a hiring freeze for the Reserves, and limited trades for the Reg Force.  Hopefully I will get accepted for Reg Force.


----------



## Qaziness

I have a quick question.  Does this Cf Retention Strategy apply to trades that are closed?  I am qualified Infantry and I'm looking to get back in does this new procedure help me in any way?

Thanks


----------



## dapaterson

It depends.  If you're a Pte/Cpl, probably not.  If you're a Sgt or above, it may.

Even trades that are overborne may accept direct entry into ranks that are stressed.


----------



## Flips13

Hey Everyone,

I have looked through these forums for about an hour or so and have not found the answers i been looking for yet. My background is this: i was in 3vp para mountain company for 3 years. 09 i got out in Aug. My original plan was to re join into the Navy since i heard that this was the fastest way and the recruiters told me so. Once i got out the economy went downhill and the navy stopped recruiting untill the following year 2010. I have been unsuccessful in getting back into the Military as Navy i was looking to Boatswain or sonar. Last week i talked to a recruiter in Nanaimo BC since that's where i'm from and i'm pretty much a shoe in to get into the infantry reserves. Now my question is, Is it possible to OT out of the infantry reserves into Reg Navy. The only reason i think it is possible because i will have my foot in the door since i will be in the Military. Thanks.

Chris.

Edit: I went  on the Supp. Reserve List. before i got out.


----------



## ArmyRick

If you recently left the patricias then it should not be too much of a stretch to enroll you in the PRes as a trained infantryman. Then you can put in a CT when its availible for your trade your looking for. BUT, big but, you make sure you play by the rules and attend at least 80% of the parade nights and exercises. That will keep you from going NES and then ending up with a 5D or 5F release (That will ruin your future plans).

Cheers and good luck.


----------



## jgies44

first time using a forum. i was in the reseves when i was 16 i quit shortly after i completed my bmq and bmql.i have recently been thinking about rejoining hoping if somone could give some info about rejoining and conditions. thanks


----------



## nicolka

I'm sure everything you need to know is in the threads you just have to look


----------



## aesop081

jgies44 said:
			
		

> first time using a forum. i was in the reseves when i was 16 i quit shortly after i completed my bmq and bmql.i have recently been thinking about rejoining hoping if somone could give some info about rejoining and conditions. thanks



1- Go to CFRC or reserve unit you wish to join;
2- Say "I used to be in, habe BMQ and BMQ-L; and
3- say "i would like to re-join"; and
4- Follow instructions given by staff.


----------



## Sigger

Greetings,

I was just advised by my recruiter that he has never seen this CANFORGEN and believes it has been superseded by another. He mentioned I will likely not be taken through this route, but by the regular recruiting process.  

Advice?


----------



## PuckChaser

How long have you been out? Did you release to the supp res?


----------



## Sigger

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> How long have you been out? Did you release to the supp res?



3 years. Released Item 5c

No. Why would releasing to supp res affect the CANFORGEN(forgive my ignorance)?


----------



## PuckChaser

Its far easier to get back in from the Supp Res, your file is held. Dollars to donuts your pers file went to the Archives at NDHQ, and it would be longer to find it than to go through the recruiting process. Best guess is you'll get at least semi-skilled entry (recruit school bypass). If you have your course reports still, provide those and they may PLAR your QL3 as well.


----------



## Sigger

Perhaps I misunderstood the CANFORGEN, as it seems to me you are in contradiction to it..


----------



## PuckChaser

If the recruiting center is telling you this is superseeded, I'd go with what they're telling you. The army doesn't owe you anything to bring you back, a few years ago you might have had to redo BMQ/SQ.


----------



## Sigger

When I hear a recruiter incorrectly describing a trade to another, I dont go with much they say..
I am just dumbfounded a recruiter was not familiar with a CANFORGEN directly related to their job..

And no, a few years ago, I would not have needed to redo BMQ(in my situation). I really am not concerned with the length of time it takes to get back in, as regardless of time, I will be a soldier again.

Anyways, Thank you for your advise.

Does anyone(else) know anything about this document? Are there any new amendments or superseding docs?


----------



## Flips13

Flips13 said:
			
		

> Hey Everyone,
> 
> I have looked through these forums for about an hour or so and have not found the answers i been looking for yet. My background is this: i was in 3vp para mountain company for 3 years. 09 i got out in Aug. My original plan was to re join into the Navy since i heard that this was the fastest way and the recruiters told me so. Once i got out the economy went downhill and the navy stopped recruiting untill the following year 2010. I have been unsuccessful in getting back into the Military as Navy i was looking to Boatswain or sonar. Last week i talked to a recruiter in Nanaimo BC since that's where i'm from and i'm pretty much a shoe in to get into the infantry reserves. Now my question is, Is it possible to OT out of the infantry reserves into Reg Navy. The only reason i think it is possible because i will have my foot in the door since i will be in the Military. Thanks.
> 
> Chris.
> 
> Edit: I went  on the Supp. Reserve List. before i got out.





Hey,

So it's been a couple months since i last posted this, and as an update i have got into the reserves from the supp. res. list. As soon as i got in they wanted to promote me and put me on mod 6 for Mcpl.  Since i'm more qualified then most of the people there. 

Now my question is, should i wait to put in my CT OT to the Navy till April when more open up or put it in now. I see they have some occupations ''in demand'' on the forces.ca site. I mean i'm just using the reserves to get into the navy instead of going through the recruiters not that i have anything against the Reserves i would just like to be full time in the navy.

Thanks,

And, thanks for the response ArmyRick. Appreciate it.


----------



## PuckChaser

Take your PLQ for sure, won't have to do it in the RegF.

Is the Navy trade you want one of the In demand jobs? Your CT/OT could take a little while, so if that's your ultimate goal, apply now. You can delay your transfer to finish the PLQ if you're course loaded as long as you take the CT/OT within the same fiscal year.


----------



## thewildandelusivebacon

If I was an officer already, what would maximum age I can reinlist, thanks.


----------



## Loachman

Are you? And why do you ask?

One enrolls in the Canadian Forces by the way, rather than enlisting.


----------



## Navalsnpr

In my experience, I've seen NCM's come back into the RegF up to the age of 48 with a 5 year contract.


----------



## George Wallace

Have we not covered this question thousands of times already?  The answers are always the same.  Why do we always have to answer some lazy soul's questions on Age Limits - Regular Force or Age Limits - Reserves.  

Reenlistment is also a topic covered dozens of times on this site, so it is also an option to SEARCH.


----------



## thewildandelusivebacon

You guys dont understand, I mean is there forced retirement?


----------



## Fishbone Jones

thewildandelusivebacon said:
			
		

> You guys dont understand, I mean is there forced retirement?



55. A small extention from there is possible under strict circumstance.


----------



## thewildandelusivebacon

I searched, could not find anything.


----------



## George Wallace

thewildandelusivebacon said:
			
		

> You guys dont understand, I mean is there forced retirement?



You claimed to have been an officer?  Your question has me baffled?  Of course there is forced retirement.  When you reach CRA you have to retire.  That is also explained in the links I posted.  Are you sure you are whom you claim to be?


----------



## PMedMoe

thewildandelusivebacon said:
			
		

> I searched, could not find anything.



See reply #331 here.   :


----------



## Loachman

thewildandelusivebacon said:
			
		

> You guys dont understand, I mean is there forced retirement?



We did not understand because you _*did not ask that question*_.

Compulsory Release Age (CRA) is sixty.

That, too, can be found here by using the Search Function.


----------



## thewildandelusivebacon

recceguy said:
			
		

> 55. A small extention from there is possible under strict circumstance.



WOW really...I hardly see the point if I have to stop at 55. 

The only reason for me joining the military is becasue I dont want to be stuck behind a desk. 

If I have to retire sooooo early Ill probably have to be in the civilian sector anyways.


----------



## thewildandelusivebacon

George Wallace said:
			
		

> You claimed to have been an officer?  Your question has me baffled?  Of course there is forced retirement.  When you reach CRA you have to retire.  That is also explained in the links I posted.  Are you sure you are whom you claim to be?




Sorry, I worded my post wrong, let me make this clear. I AM NOT an officer. I AM NOT in the military. I am a student who is considering it as an option. The main criteria is if there is forced retierment.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

thewildandelusivebacon said:
			
		

> WOW really...I hardly see the point if I have to stop at 55.
> 
> The only reason for me joining the military is becasue I dont want to be stuck behind a desk.
> 
> If I have to retire sooooo early Ill probably have to be in the civilian sector anyways.



Because it's the rules. Don't like it, don't join. You can extend to 60 but there are contingincies that need to be met first. 

The rest of your post borders on trolling.


----------



## thewildandelusivebacon

recceguy said:
			
		

> The rest of your post borders on trolling.




How? trolling is just trying to annoy people. My posts were ment as actual questions. Just becasue I worded them wrong or used  the wrong term does make me a pest.
 :'(


----------



## Fishbone Jones

Your question has been answered.

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## Loachman

As an Officer, you will spend a fair amount of your career (if you are successful in the application and training stages) "stuck behind a desk". I've been a Pilot for thirty years, and I've spent almost half of that "stuck behind a desk".

"Stuck behind a desk" does not mean "completely devoid of job satisfaction", though.

Many people leave before CRA, for various personal reasons, just like many people switch civilian careers.

Even having been "stuck behind a desk" for as much as I have been, I'd still do everything over again if I could be seventeen once more, with very few changes.

Your reason for not joining is trivial, but indicates that this is not likely a good career choice for you.


----------



## Loachman

Provided to me via PM by Celticgirl:



> CRA is now 60.  Anyone enlisting or re-enlisting now can (and will be expected to, unless they VR) work to age 60 if they are medically fit to do so.  Also, anyone currently serving can 'elect' to change their CRA of 55 to 60 (exeption: if you have already had your 54th birthday, this is no longer an option for you).  Once you elect age 60 as your CRA, however, you cannot change it back to 55.
> 
> For serving mbrs, if you are not sure if your CRA is 55 or 60, it will be on your MPRR (entered through HRMS).  Direct any queries to your Orderly Room staff."
> 
> I didn't make it up - it's in the CFAOs.   I'm a newbie clerk getting ready for my 5's and pub searches are a big part of my preparation.  The CRA issue is one that we actually deal with a lot in our unit as well, so I am confident that it is not 55 anymore (since 2004, I believe).



The same info can be found a few replies down from the one at the link provided earlier in this thread by PMedMoe.


----------



## LCIS Tech 2011

Hello,

I am looking for information regarding the current policy for the Recruit School By-Pass entry option. I have spoken to a number of recruiters regarding this and have gotten several different pieces of conflicting information. 

I have previously completed BMQ in 2000 through a reserve course, though completed on a full time basis, as opposed to a weekend course. I had also completed roughly 75% of the current 13 week BMQ in 2007, but due to an injury on course was released, and advised to re-apply upon recovery. 

The information I have been given has been that a Recruit School By-Pass is availabe if you have ever completed BMQ, without any time restriction, to it only being valid for 3 years, to 5 years, to 10 years. Any information as to what the current policy is regarding this entry option would be greatly appreciated. 

I have attempted to search the forums, so i do apologize if I have missed information already posted. The only information I was able to find is several years old. 

Thanks in advance.


----------



## George Wallace

LCIS Tech 2011 said:
			
		

> Hello,
> 
> I am looking for information regarding the current policy for the Recruit School By-Pass entry option. I have spoken to a number of recruiters regarding this and have gotten several different pieces of conflicting information.
> 
> I have previously completed BMQ in 2000 through a reserve course, though completed on a full time basis, as opposed to a weekend course. I had also completed roughly 75% of the current 13 week BMQ in 2007, but due to an injury on course was released, and advised to re-apply upon recovery.
> 
> The information I have been given has been that a Recruit School By-Pass is availabe if you have ever completed BMQ, without any time restriction, to it only being valid for 3 years, to 5 years, to 10 years. Any information as to what the current policy is regarding this entry option would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> I have attempted to search the forums, so i do apologize if I have missed information already posted. The only information I was able to find is several years old.
> 
> Thanks in advance.



With my knowledge of the Recruiting process, if a person has been out for less than five years they often get to keep their Qualifications, but may be required to do BMQ(L) (SQ) over again.  If a person has been out for ten years, they may be able to keep their Qualifications, but are most likely to be required to do both BMQ and BMQ(L) again.  As you have no Qualifications other than a Reserve BMQ and that is from ten years ago, your most recent attempt not successfully completed, then in all likelihood you will have to start with the Regular Force BMQ.


This topic has been covered in numerous other questions on Recruit School Bypass.


----------



## Flips13

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> Take your PLQ for sure, won't have to do it in the RegF.
> 
> Is the Navy trade you want one of the In demand jobs? Your CT/OT could take a little while, so if that's your ultimate goal, apply now. You can delay your transfer to finish the PLQ if you're course loaded as long as you take the CT/OT within the same fiscal year.



The trade i will CT/OT to is in demand, So who would i be going to, to get the ball rolling on this. 

Thanks,


----------



## agc

CANFORGEN 002/11 CDS 001/11 101504Z JAN 11

CF RETENTION STRATEGY IMPROVED PROCEDURES TO RETURN TO REGULAR FORCE SERVICE
UNCLASSIFIED

REFS: A. CANFORGEN 072/09 CDS 012/09 221848Z APR 09 CF RETENTION STRATEGY - IMPROVED PROCEDURES TO RETURN TO REGULAR FORCE SERVICE 
B. ROD FROM AFC 21 JAN 09
C. QR AND O CHAP 6, ENROLMENT AND RE-ENGAGEMENT 
D. DAOD 5002-1, ENROLMENT-REGULAR FORCE 
E. CBI 204.015, PAY INCREMENTS 

1.      THIS CANFORGEN REPLACES REF A. AS MANY OF YOU ARE AWARE, THE RE-ENROLMENT PROCESS FOR FORMER REGULAR MEMBERS WAS INEFFICIENT. IN AN ATTEMPT TO REBUILD AND STRENGTHEN OUR FORCES, I AM PLEASED TO ANNOUNCE THAT THE PROCESS TO RE-ENROL HAS NOW BEEN SIGNIFICANTLY STREAMLINED

2.      EFFECTIVE 01 APR 09, AND IAW REF A, THE MEMBER PERSONNEL RECORD RESUME (MPRR) WILL BE THE SOURCE DOCUMENT FOR PREVIOUS REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WHO MEET ALL OF THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS:

3.      PREVIOUS CF REGULAR FORCE EXPERIENCE AND CURRENTLY A CIVILIAN OR A MEMBER OF A RESERVE FORCE SUB-COMPONENT OTHER THAN THE PRIMARY RESERVE. NOTE THAT CURRENT PRIMARY RESERVE MEMBERS WILL CONTINUE TO USE THE EXISTING COMPONENT TRANSFER PROCESS

4.      RELEASED FROM THE REGULAR FORCE WITHIN THE PAST 5 YEARS

5.      OCCUPATION QUALIFIED

6.      RELEASED FROM THE REGULAR FORCE UNDER ITEMS 4, 5B OR 5C

7.      MEETS ALL OTHER QUALIFICATIONS, CONDITIONS AND STANDARDS FOR ENROLMENT OR COMPONENT TRANSFER

8.      DESIRES RE-ENROLMENT TO PREVIOUS OCCUPATION

9.      THE REGULAR FORCE MPRR WILL BE THE MAIN SOURCE USED TO DETERMINE RANK AND QUALIFICATIONS FOR INDIVIDUALS RETURNING TO REGULAR FORCE SERVICE. RANK, TIME IN RANK AND YEARS OF SERVICE ON RELEASE WILL BE CREDITED TO THE INDIVIDUAL APPLYING TO RE-ENROL INTO THE REGULAR FORCE. THIS INFORMATION WILL BE THE BASIS FOR THE D MIL C DETERMINATION OF RE-ENROLMENT OFFER. ERRORS FOUND IN THE MPRR CAN BE CORRECTED THROUGH THE USE OF ORIGINAL DOCUMENTATION

10.     FORMER REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WILL BE RE-ENROLLED INTO THE REGULAR FORCE SUBJECT TO THE AVAILABILITY OF AN ENROLMENT VACANCY, I.E., A STRATEGIC INTAKE PLAN REQUIREMENT, AT THE SUBSTANTIVE RANK INDICATED ON THEIR REGULAR FORCE MPRR WITH THEIR QUALIFYING SERVICE USED TO DETERMINE PAY AND SENIORITY LEVELS. TOS WILL BE OFFERED ON THE BASIS OF SERVICE REQUIREMENT AND EXISTING QR AND O PROVISIONS.

11.     THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT CHANGE TO CURRENT ENROLMENT PRACTICES WHICH I BELIEVE WILL GO A LONG WAY TOWARDS REINFORCING MY COMMITMENT TO FORMER REGULAR FORCE MEMBERS WHO POSSESS SKILL SETS THAT WE REQUIRE.

12.     SIGNED BY GEN W.J. NATYNCZYK, CDS


----------



## Sigger

RGR

Changes were made to para 10.
The recruiter advised me this CANFORGEN is utilized in Ottawa, not at the recruiter level. He did however mention a new signing bonus for QL3 trained mbr's looking to get back in for certain trades. I have not been able to locate this document as of yet. 

Thank you for the update.


----------



## Sigger

Update:

I was in for my Medical and interview yesterday.
Due to this CANFORGEN, the interview was about 15 mikes. I was advised by the Capt at the CFRC I will be entering with my same rank and time in. All that is needed is my credit and reference check to return, then when a position is available, the Career Manager will send an offer. Pretty painless, actually.


----------



## CountDC

great! Nice to see the system improving somewhere.  Hope it doesn't take long for you to get your offer.


----------



## painswessex

Man this is a good thing to bad i had so many hoops to jump through to get back in now i have to wait for the revised para 10 a vacancy for april hopefully


----------



## Kaveman

Hi there,
To start off: sorry if this is in the wrong section.
I've been out of the military for quite some time now (20+ years). I was originally honourably discharged due a knee injury I sustained while working. I was a 2Lt back in the day.
Recently the kids have left the house and I have been wanting to rejoin OR start a new civi career that works with the military. I am in my late 40s. 
Just wondering if anyone here knows if I would have to redo basic (probably) or if there are any ways to look into getting a career with DND civi side. I plan on going to the local CFRC sometime soon but just thought I'd throw some feelers out to start with.
If I had my way my ideal job would be working with veterans affairs or something along those lines, helping out ol' vets. 

Please let me know

Cheers


----------



## Michael OLeary

After 20+ years, if you want to be back in uniform, plan to redo your basic training. Your best first step will be a visit to the Recruiting Centre. As you browse the site, you'll soon find many references to how long the process can take right now, and how few openings there may be this year (new numbers being released in March/April).


----------



## bick

In 2007, we had a guy get back in after being out for 20 yrs.  At the time, he was 49 yrs old.  He just showed up at battalion one day, no redo's of any crses.  He served with us in A-stan and still is a very productive mbr of the battalion.

How this helps.


----------



## George Wallace

bick said:
			
		

> In 2007, we had a guy get back in after being out for 20 yrs.  At the time, he was 49 yrs old.  He just showed up at battalion one day, no redo's of any crses.  He served with us in A-stan and still is a very productive mbr of the battalion.
> 
> How this helps.



This would appear to be a rather unique and exceptional case.  For the most part, the CFRC will likely follow the policy of having a person redo BMQ and SQ if they have been out for over ten years, and perhaps grant a BMQ Bypass if they have been out for less than five years.  

Michael's advice above is the best to follow.  Have all your documentation in order when you visit the CFRC, to include all Qualifications and Crses that you have been on, as a Prior Learning Assessment may be done to process you and eliminate some training that someone straight off the street would have to do.  It is quite a long process to get the final Prior Learning Assessment Report done, so ensure you have all your paperwork in order when you go to the CFRC.


----------



## bick

The point is, there are exceptions to every rule.  Disregarding my story is and experience is nothing short of rude.


----------



## JMesh

bick said:
			
		

> The point is, there are exceptions to every rule.  Disregarding my story is and experience is nothing short of rude.



Your story was not disregarded. George merely pointed out that it is the exception rather than the norm. In fact, he further helped your point by stating that he should have his stuff ready for a PLAR as he might be able to get some qualifications back. I feel that George was actually very tactful in his post.


----------



## PMedMoe

JMesh said:
			
		

> Your story was not disregarded. George merely pointed out that it is the exception rather than the norm. In fact, he further helped your point by stating that he should have his stuff ready for a PLAR as he might be able to get some qualifications back. I feel that George was actually very tactful in his post.



I agree.  Each situation is different and it's good to ensure people know the all advice/info that may (or may not) apply to theirs.


----------



## Journeyman

bick said:
			
		

> The point is, there are exceptions to every rule.  Disregarding my story is and experience is nothing short of rude.


Lots of things get posted that get disregarded; shake the sand out of your ovaries and get over it.

I too thought George Wallace was being helpful.


----------



## bick

It is very nice to hear that Journeyman, PMedMoe and JMesh didn't think George was being rude, point is, it doesn't matter what your opinion was, I found it rude.

People tend to hide behind their anonymity on these types of forums and make comments.  

All is did was state a very similar situation to the one described by the post creator.  As this is a true story, it is just as revelevent.  There are rules set out by the CF for all enrollments.  My point was that there are exceptions.

OUT


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse

Back on topic folks.


----------



## bick

ack


----------



## Fishbone Jones

Kaveman,

Expect the worst (least?). Not withstanding some over the top highly exceptional case(s) the advice you want to follow is what Michael and George posted.

The sky always has the possibility of being pink and the sun purple but don't hold your breath depending on it.

Get your ducks in a row and be prepared to run the whole gambit.

Good luck and let us know how you make out.


----------



## Sealife

I was out for 13 years walked back in were I left off. NO REDO's.
I am a Leading Seaman mind you, but no BMQ again.
I kept my skills concurrent. The trade was red for 15 yrs. and is still red.
Naval Weapons Technician.  Currently in the re-muster process to RM Tech = HVAC&R.

Not a special circumstance I just had what the Military wanted - Electromechanical technician or another
words lots of experience will electrical, hydraulic and pneumatic systems. I am someone who 
can troubleshoot and repair efficiently, quickly and properly - no guessing.

Hope this helps.


----------



## field 1

I did my out clearance from the Cameron highlanders of Ottawa 11yrs ago I was NES at the time, but had no strikes against me other wise. I'm at a point in my life were I want to get back in. My question is will I need to do BMQ again? If I do is it up to the unit whether I have to go away for retraining or do it in house. Not wussing out on going away for training but with a family and running two business 6weeks away just won't work. Anyone out there with some experience with this sort of situation?


----------



## chrisf

Usually courses "expire" after 5 years out, so yes, more than likely.


----------



## JasperC

I have been trying to find the answer to this question and was wondering if anyone here can help me.  I am currently in the Navy reg force and enjoy being a sailor but do not like the trade I am in.  My issue is that my trade is so red I can't get out of it without finishing my contract and not resigning.  I don't really have a problem with that since it is only another year, but how long would I have to wait after I get out to go to the recruiting center and apply back in?


----------



## MJP

JasperC said:
			
		

> I have been trying to find the answer to this question and was wondering if anyone here can help me.  I am currently in the Navy reg force and enjoy being a sailor but do not like the trade I am in.  My issue is that my trade is so red I can't get out of it without finishing my contract and not resigning.  I don't really have a problem with that since it is only another year, but how long would I have to wait after I get out to go to the recruiting center and apply back in?



Unless things have changed I don't think you have to wait at all to re-apply.  I have seen more than a few people unhappy with their trade or location but unable to OT or get posted release and then re-enroll right away.  The big problem right now for you is that the CF has drastically cut back on recruitment and you could be in for a lengthy wait to get back in.  All the folks I knew that went that route did it when we were hurting for people so had minimal delays in rejoining.


----------



## Flips13

JasperC said:
			
		

> I have been trying to find the answer to this question and was wondering if anyone here can help me.  I am currently in the Navy reg force and enjoy being a sailor but do not like the trade I am in.  My issue is that my trade is so red I can't get out of it without finishing my contract and not resigning.  I don't really have a problem with that since it is only another year, but how long would I have to wait after I get out to go to the recruiting center and apply back in?



I tried that in '09 from the reg and it's now '11, so now i'm trying a new approach by ct/ot'ing, i don't know which way is slower but after 2 years i figure i would go into the reserves and try the CT/OT. That is where i stand now.


----------



## Silverfire

I released out of the CF six months ago due to family issues and I was at my CFRC to reenlist.  It was previously stated that a recruiting freeze would occur for 6 months before being eligible for reenlistment.  CFRC has stated that on 08 APR 11 a directive was sent saying that the freeze has now become 24 months.  If there are any recruiters or MCC's around, is this applicable to only Reg Force or does it apply to PRes as well? My CFRC has provided conflicting answers. 

Thanks


----------



## George Wallace

When it comes to the Reserves, you will have to contact the Reserve unit to find out if they are affected by the "freeze" or not.  Some are still recruiting, others are not.  The Reserves have reached the same level as the Regular Force, where they have more applicants than positions.  Where the CFRC will recruit for the whole Regular Force, each Reserve unit is responsible for their own recruiting, although all processing is done by the CFRC.  The CFRC will not process you for a Reserve unit until they get the approval from that Reserve unit.


----------



## Silverfire

Thanks for the reply, just for curiosity sake, is the freeze on my file more of a budgetary concern or is a policy thing? 

What I mean to say is, is there any official rule saying that you must wait x amount of months before being eligible for reenrollment or is it a budgetary thing where CFRC has been told, "If they released within the last 24 months, don't bother, we want fresh meat."  Assuming the PRes unit I contact is hiring, will they also say, "You released 6 months ago, sorry, wait another year and a half" or will they still process me?  I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that no one will know the answer except for the unit themselves, but I figure any MCC's or people working at a CFRC might know the answer.  


If the Reg Force won't accept me for 24 months (17 left to go  ), I'll gladly work under PRes if thats an option.


----------



## AdamMullis

Ive release under 4C, anyone else here too? and  playing the waiting game.


----------



## M_M

AM83 said:
			
		

> Ive release under 4C, anyone else here too? and  playing the waiting game.



I released under 4C as well.... but due to being an officer, no waiting required. They know that voluntary trade transfers are not easy to get and are pretty much expecting us to get out and come back in off the street for the trade we tried to VOR to.  

On the release SOU, article 11 there was some mention of "implications" of re-enrolling within 60 days of release. I asked the release section but they had no clue. Anyone have any idea what that might be referring to?


----------



## SeaKingTacco

M_M said:
			
		

> I released under 4C as well.... but due to being an officer, no waiting required. They know that voluntary trade transfers are not easy to get and are pretty much expecting us to get out and come back in off the street for the trade we tried to VOR to.
> 
> On the release SOU, article 11 there was some mention of "implications" of re-enrolling within 60 days of release. I asked the release section but they had no clue. Anyone have any idea what that might be referring to?



So...you...are...gaming the system?  ???


----------



## AmmoTech90

M_M said:
			
		

> I released under 4C as well.... but due to being an officer, no waiting required. They know that voluntary trade transfers are not easy to get and are pretty much expecting us to get out and come back in off the street for the trade we tried to VOR to.



Given para 8



> 8.      DESIRES RE-ENROLMENT TO PREVIOUS OCCUPATION



How does this CANFORGEN help someone trying to do what you are?


----------



## M_M

SeaKingTacco said:
			
		

> So...you...are...gaming the system?  ???



I'm really not sure what you mean by "gaming the system" ...

There isn't as great of a system in place for an officer to change trades as there are for people in the ranks. The recruiter for the trade I want actually TOLD me, that this was what I had to do. There was simply no other way. This is actually common practice for officers who want to switch trades but are repeatedly denied. 



			
				AmmoTech90 said:
			
		

> How does this CANFORGEN help someone trying to do what you are?



In previous years, there were some stories of people having start over from 2Lt again. Recently people are getting their old rank and pay grades back. It's not written explicitly in THIS CANFORGEN. 

I was trying to help buddy out in case he didn't know he didn't have to wait and asking a question about the "implications" stated in para 11 of SOU upon release and figured other people getting back in might know. Instead of answers you guys are giving me a hard time. Sheesh...


----------



## SeaKingTacco

I'm not giving you a hard time.

 I am genuinely trying to figure out what you are trying to do.  You don't have to answer if you think it would give away too much info, but I am curious what stage of your career are you currently in (ie are you still untrained, or have you become occupationally qualified in your current occupation?) and if obligatory service is a player in your scenario.

I am also curious why you have been denied a VOT.  Is your current occupation distressed?  Is your target occupation overborne?  Are you absolutely certain you qualify (medically, academically) for your target occupation?

Finally, I have big question marks about who would give you such advice.  Admittedly, I am working with only posts on the internet, but you are taking a big risk IMHO by releasing- there is no guarantee you will be allowed back in the CF.


----------



## Eye In The Sky

M_M said:
			
		

> I released under 4C as well.... but due to being an officer, no waiting required. They know that voluntary trade transfers are not easy to get and are pretty much expecting us to get out and come back in off the street for the trade we tried to VOR to.
> 
> On the release SOU, article 11 there was some mention of "implications" of re-enrolling within 60 days of release. I asked the release section but they had no clue. Anyone have any idea what that might be referring to?



I thought he was out already, and re-entering....and that was because he was not able to change MOCs within the OVOTP??


----------



## Eye In The Sky

M_M said:
			
		

> There isn't as great of a system in place for an officer to change trades as there are for people in the ranks.



I'm pretty familiar in the NCM OT processes (MOC Reassignment, COT, VOT) and programs (COTP, AVOTP, LOTP, and recently SVOTP) and requirements

- MOC Reassignment if you are not QL3 qual'd, 
- LOTP if Combat Arms with 36 months service and QL4 qual'd (QL3 qual'd if no QL4 in MOC)
- COTP & AVOTP if you have 48 months of service and QL4 qual (QL3 if no QL4 in MOC)

Of course NCMs also have to meet medical/CFAT/etc requirements for the trade you wish to move to.

Aside from the fact there are less #s of OVOTPs because there are less #s of Officers than NCMs, what are the differences that make the OVOTP "not a great system" compared to the NCM side?


----------



## M_M

Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> I'm pretty familiar in the NCM OT processes (MOC Reassignment, COT, VOT) and programs (COTP, AVOTP, LOTP, and recently SVOTP) and requirements
> 
> - MOC Reassignment if you are not QL3 qual'd,
> - LOTP if Combat Arms with 36 months service and QL4 qual'd (QL3 qual'd if no QL4 in MOC)
> - COTP & AVOTP if you have 48 months of service and QL4 qual (QL3 if no QL4 in MOC)
> 
> Of course NCMs also have to meet medical/CFAT/etc requirements for the trade you wish to move to.
> 
> Aside from the fact there are less #s of OVOTPs because there are less #s of Officers than NCMs, what are the differences that make the OVOTP "not a great system" compared to the NCM side?



We don't have all of those options you listed above - there is only one type of VOT. Further, career managers often give you a hard time if your trade is yellow or just came out of being yellow.  There are also some training plans that you can try for such as med/dent/chaplain/pharm/physio which is also open to the rest of the CF. Career managers, again can step in and say "no". There have been instances where aircrew members have been told while trying to apply that regardless of whether they get selected: they are not allowed to go.  



			
				Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> I thought he was out already, and re-entering....and that was because he was not able to change MOCs within the OVOTP??



Yes, I am already out. The longer you stay in your current trade, the more cause they have to hold you longer in your trade and refuse your VOR because of your skill sets. I know a guy who spent 10 years in the Navy submitting a VOR  EVERY SINGLE YEAR  for an open air force trade he wanted and was refused. Eventually he got fed up, released and signed back in under the trade he wanted.

I don't want to turn this into "unrelated-to-post" story time here, if you have more questions, please PM me.


----------



## aesop081

Officer or NCM , it does not matter, the CoC does not have the authority to refuse an OT once a member has been selected. If the trade is not red, the career manager does not have the authority to refuse the OT.


----------



## captloadie

Although true the CoC cannot refuse once the member is accepted, they can go a long way in making sure the member is deemed unsuitable for the plan they are requesting. The CM, even in a green MOSID, has a number he can let OT, and being accepted doesn't necessarily mean you make the cut.

That being said, I personally don't know many officers that VOT after reaching the Capt rank, unless they are going into a specialty trade (MO, Legad, Dental, maybe HCA).


----------



## M_M

captloadie said:
			
		

> Although true the CoC cannot refuse once the member is accepted, *they can go a long way in making sure the member is deemed unsuitable for the plan they are requesting*.



That's exactly the problem. They can write horrible references or give you horrible PERs for the next session. 



			
				captloadie said:
			
		

> That being said, I personally don't know many officers that VOT after reaching the Capt rank, unless they are going into a specialty trade (MO, Legad, Dental, maybe HCA).



Some people just never liked the trade they go to begin with, or didn't like it after they got on phase training, or don't like the lifestyle of certain trades after they get married/start a family. The guy I was talking about released as an Lt (N) because he hated the Navy so much and got back in as an air force officer.  



			
				CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> Officer or NCM , it does not matter, the CoC does not have the authority to refuse an OT once a member has been selected. If the trade is not red, the career manager does not have the authority to refuse the OT.



Have you met/dealt the aircrew CMs? They rarely approve anything that would involve a trained pilot/nav leaving their trade forever, save for compassionate reasons.


----------



## Eye In The Sky

Just a small point, but even RED trades are not 'closed'.  0.5% of the TES is the OUTCAP for red, 1% for amber, 2% for green.  For NCM atleast, I've never read up on the Officer side of the house.

I am sure that CM's aren't drawing much attention to _that_ in their Briefings though...


----------



## CountDC

Just to add my  :2c: for what little it is worth this is not the first time I have heard what M_M is mentioning.  I have talked to a couple of officers in the past that mentioned going the same route to change over although they did do it at the 2Lt/Lt stage.

M_M - the navy officer case sounds familiar - was he by chance on the east coast?


----------



## secondchance

Hello everybody!
A few months ago I was in CFLRS.
But I had some personal and family issues and plus I decided I am not good enough for Army and I decided to put my Voluntary Release.
After returning home I have realized that I did biggest mistake in my whole life. I have found I liked my life there-PT,Inspections, Drill etc.
I am feeling and I want to be back to pass through all things. I want to be in CF.
I know I can apply after 6 months. My VR is category 4C. But I can not imagine how I can go again to my local CFRC and how I can look at eyes of recruiters who wished me good luck after ceremony just last year. I feel guilty before CF,  before you girls and guys who are waiting here for job offer. I want to apply again, but I feel like betrayer . I feel really sorry about that. 
And I am curious if there are people here who re-applied again?


----------



## jeffb

I went back in after almost a 10 year hiatus. As long as you have honestly grown as a person and not only sorted out your personal issues but set yourself up so that your personal issues won't be a burden to others, I say go for it.


----------



## secondchance

jeffb said:
			
		

> I went back in after almost a 10 year hiatus. As long as you have honestly grown as a person and not only sorted out your personal issues but set yourself up so that your personal issues won't be a burden to others, I say go for it.


Yes,
You are absolutely right. 
It is important  to solve personal issue. I have found solution after returning home. Maybe it is little  quickly but I was talking with psychologist and I found why I had personal issue. I passed through this and now I feel brave to meet challenges in my life. Some people can not believe if short time can change character.
P.S. Thanks for your message.


----------



## secondchance

cypres78 said:
			
		

> Not sure how seriously they are going to take you if it's only been a few months since you released.


May be.
I didn't know about different types of the leave (like temporally leave). If I had information of course I would not put my VR.


----------



## Jhunt

Did you complete your QL3?
because if not prepare to redo basic, there is a certain timeline you have to get back in without having to redo it. If you have your ql3 its good for 'life' (new directive) but if you were only a year or so you are likely going to have to redo it. Even after waiting the 6 months to reapply. 

But if it is something you want I would go for it


----------



## Silverfire

Unless things have changed since April 11, I believe it is not a 6 month waiting period but 24 months as per the recruiting staff at CFRC Det Barrie.  If I recall correctly, because of the large number of applicants, a directive was passed down 08 APR 11 stating members need to be out of service for 24 months to reapply.  That being said, my information is almost a year old now.  If things have changed feel free to correct me.


----------



## George Wallace

Silverfire said:
			
		

> Unless things have changed since April 11, I believe it is not a 6 month waiting period but 24 months as per the recruiting staff at CFRC Det Barrie.  If I recall correctly, because of the large number of applicants, a directive was passed down 08 APR 11 stating members need to be out of service for 24 months to reapply.  That being said, my information is almost a year old now.  If things have changed feel free to correct me.



Question:

Does this apply to those who Released and went onto the Supp List or CT to the Reserves; or just those who Released and did not elect  to go on the Supp List or CT to the Reserves or PRL?


----------



## jeffb

Silverfire said:
			
		

> Unless things have changed since April 11, I believe it is not a 6 month waiting period but 24 months as per the recruiting staff at CFRC Det Barrie.  If I recall correctly, because of the large number of applicants, a directive was passed down 08 APR 11 stating members need to be out of service for 24 months to reapply.  That being said, my information is almost a year old now.  If things have changed feel free to correct me.



And does this only apply to unqualified applicants or if someone with 10 years in gets out for whatever reason and reapplies 6 months later, will they still be sent away? This wouldn't make sense to me as the individual with 10 years experience wouldn't be coming in at the Pte level like someone off the street.


----------



## DAA

Silverfire said:
			
		

> Unless things have changed since April 11, I believe it is not a 6 month waiting period but 24 months as per the recruiting staff at CFRC Det Barrie.  If I recall correctly, because of the large number of applicants, a directive was passed down 08 APR 11 stating members need to be out of service for 24 months to reapply.  That being said, my information is almost a year old now.  If things have changed feel free to correct me.



Minimum waiting time in order to reapply is normally not less than 6 months.


----------



## secondchance

I called to
Canadian Forces National Recruiting Contact Centre  1-866-966-8718  and they told me about 6 months.
Believe me or not I feel guilty about my VR and I really feel sorry that I could not use temporally leave instead of VR.


----------



## Silverfire

George Wallace said:
			
		

> Question:
> 
> Does this apply to those who Released and went onto the Supp List or CT to the Reserves; or just those who Released and did not elect  to go on the Supp List or CT to the Reserves or PRL?





			
				jeffb said:
			
		

> And does this only apply to unqualified applicants or if someone with 10 years in gets out for whatever reason and reapplies 6 months later, will they still be sent away? This wouldn't make sense to me as the individual with 10 years experience wouldn't be coming in at the Pte level like someone off the street.



I didn't ask them too much about it as it didn't pertain to me but I do believe it refers more to unskilled applicants.  But again, I could be wrong, secondchance said he spoke to CFNRC and they said 6 months so I could be wrong.


----------



## secondchance

Jhunt said:
			
		

> Did you complete your QL3?
> because if not prepare to redo basic, there is a certain timeline you have to get back in without having to redo it. If you have your ql3 its good for 'life' (new directive) but if you were only a year or so you are likely going to have to redo it. Even after waiting the 6 months to reapply.
> 
> But if it is something you want I would go for it


I don`t know what is QL3.
I did not complete my Basic training. I finished on week 7. I need to start from Week 1 (or 0).
I don`t know if CFLRS will keep my records what I passed some tests : First Aid,Firefighter....


----------



## secondchance

Are there people here who did reapply last 1-3 years?
What is your experience?


----------



## aderochie

Hi everyone,

So here is my thing! I was in the military for 3 years, loved everything about it! It was my life, I worked hard and put everything I had into it. It took me a couple years to finally get a job threw the CF, when I finally got in life was good. One year ago, I was released. I was having a hard time with my 3's. not that I was not smart enough to pass, but I was going threw as a MSE OP (a driver). I have never been behind a wheel of a vehicle ever, first time was my 3's. So being 4'11 and driving a HUGE truck was not easy. So I failed out of my 3's, after the 2nd time going threw the trade, I decided that I would change trades for something I would enjoy doing, and something I could see myself doing for 20 years. Well, I went to see the BPSO and told her what was going on and how I wanted to stay in the CF as, I've wanted this since I was younger and worked hard to get where I am. She told me that I would have to rewrite the app test! As soon as she said those words, I knew I was going to have some issues. She also told me if I were to fail the test that the CF would have to release me, if that didn't add some pressure. Anyways, I failed the test, seeing I have not been to school in 10 years, have not touched or seen math in god knows how long and english. So they had to release me! I have two little girls, and pretty much turned my life upside down. 1 year later, just say things are not easy. I had to let the ex husband who is in the army too, take care of the girls while I got my life together. When I was released they told me I can rejoin apply 6 months to 1 year later. So here I am, wanting this more then anything. The only thing standing in my way is the app test. I was told about this site and was told there is a lot of helpful tips and help on here! So here I am asking for everyones help. It's been a while since the app test, and seeing it's going to be my 3rd try this is it. The last chance at it! Thirds a charm right? So if anyone has tips, sites, if they know what kind of stuff they cover on the test, please email me. I need all the help I can get! Never wanted something so bad! Thanks everyone for listening. Here is my email aderochie@gmail.com


----------



## RCDtpr

Just curious....how did you pass the CFAT the first time but then fail it a second?  What also has me kind of curious is you are asking about what kinds of questions are on the test.  You've already done it twice.....you should know what to expect.

As for advice....study harder


----------



## aesop081

RCDcpl said:
			
		

> how did you pass the CFAT the first time but then fail it a second?



Probably failed to qualify for the trade(s) she was thinking of transfering to.


----------



## mmmjon

I already had an extensive conversation about the CFAT with someone else, so I will gather the info I had put together for him and PM it to you.

EDIT: PM sent. If anyone else needs the info, as in links to practice tests and grade 10 math, let me know.


----------



## Mushroom

My recruiter told me that there changing the CFAT format in April,  It will be the same test generally but there adding a new section of questions, so come april any of our responses could become irrelevant, you should talk to a recruiter.  At the very least they'll be able to give you a handout that contains the practice test.


----------



## mmmjon

Mushroom said:
			
		

> At the very least they'll be able to give you a handout that contains the practice test.



Also available right here:

http://cdn.forces.ca/_PDF2010/preparing_for_aptitude_test_en.pdf


----------



## matthew1786

If the English part was your weakness: read, read, read, and read some more. News articles are usually a good start.
If the Spatial Awareness was your weakness: try drawing 3D shapes, playing video games, or constructing 3D puzzles.
If the Logic/Math was your weakness: practice pattern finding, long division and multiplication, ratios, and memorize the multiplication table.

Any more advice would be giving it away!


----------



## The_Falcon

RCDcpl said:
			
		

> Just curious....how did you pass the CFAT the first time but then fail it a second?  What also has me kind of curious is you are asking about what kinds of questions are on the test.  You've already done it twice.....you should know what to expect.
> 
> As for advice....study harder



It happens, once out of school some people do much poorer on standardized testing, especially if they were already iffy on things like math to begin with.  

To the OP, if you apply your going to be in for a long haul, as not only are you probably going to require a re-enrolment waiver (if you had an unfavourable release, which seem like the case),  you are going to need a 3rd level CFAT rewrite waiver, which is not easy to obtain, and you are going to have to demonstrate to CFRG's satisfaction that you have undertaken steps to improve your ability pass (ie taken additional math/english courses etc.).

The CFAT itself isn't really changing, just the way its being administered, CFRG is rolling out the "iCFAT"  as opposed to the "eCFAT" currently being used.  It's really anything for applicants to be concerned with, its more a new system for the CFAT to store and process the results.


----------



## Bigm

I am currently reapplying as well.  I was at the mega in June, some family issues led me to VR.  BIG mistake, definitely should have attempted a special leave or anything else really.  However, I'm not sure how well that goes over when you're on your first course.  Anyways, I called and spoke with a recruiter who told me there was no 6 month minimum wait time.  Just apply and see what happens.  The interview is where you're going to have a good chance to explain what went wrong and why it's not going to happen again.  My biggest concern now is that a VFS (verification of former service) is going to be done before and interview can be conducted and it can take a rather long time to get.  If it takes to long and the trades you apply for are closed, then it's HUAW until next April.  Good Luck! Let me know how it goes!


----------



## Gatsby

Sorry for likely sounding obtuse, but what's a "3's"?


----------



## aesop081

Gatsby said:
			
		

> Sorry for likely sounding obtuse, but what's a "3's"?



QL3.........Initial Trade training.


----------



## secondchance

Bigm said:
			
		

> I am currently reapplying as well.  I was at the mega in June, some family issues led me to VR.  BIG mistake, definitely should have attempted a special leave or anything else really.  However, I'm not sure how well that goes over when you're on your first course.  Anyways, I called and spoke with a recruiter who told me there was no 6 month minimum wait time.  Just apply and see what happens.  The interview is where you're going to have a good chance to explain what went wrong and why it's not going to happen again.  My biggest concern now is that a VFS (verification of former service) is going to be done before and interview can be conducted and it can take a rather long time to get.  If it takes to long and the trades you apply for are closed, then it's HUAW until next April.  Good Luck! Let me know how it goes!


I agree with you  


> BIG mistake, definitely should have attempted a special leave or anything else really.


Thanks for information.
I will contact CFRC after April 1st.Thanks again and good luck.
I heard about VFS (verification of former service)  but  I don't think so it can take a long time because I spent   less 3 months in CFLRS.


----------



## MMSS

Bigm said:
			
		

> I am currently reapplying as well.  I was at the mega in June, some family issues led me to VR.  BIG mistake, definitely should have attempted a special leave or anything else really.  However, I'm not sure how well that goes over when you're on your first course.  Anyways, I called and spoke with a recruiter who told me there was no 6 month minimum wait time.  Just apply and see what happens.  The interview is where you're going to have a good chance to explain what went wrong and why it's not going to happen again.  My biggest concern now is that a VFS (verification of former service) is going to be done before and interview can be conducted and it can take a rather long time to get.  If it takes to long and the trades you apply for are closed, then it's HUAW until next April.  Good Luck! Let me know how it goes!



If you VR'd in June, then it's been more than six months anyway. Good luck on getting back in  If all goes well, maybe we'll both be there this summer.


----------



## starseed

Like a couple of other guys who have posted in here, I was advised by CoC/BPSO that as a member who was not MOC qualified, it would be in my best interest to leave (Release item 4c.) and rejoin the forces in the trade I wanted as opposed to waiting on a VOR that would take (insert vague estimate here) to complete. I was told at the time that all my qualifications would carry over, as well as my pay grade (P-3). This has me worried, though.

Obviously this CANFORGEN doesn't apply to me directly - but I wonder - this would seem to indicate there is a mechanism for recognizing previous qualifications. Therefore, can anyone answer definitively - will my BMQ be recognized? AsI was a cbt arms recruit, "BMQ-L" for me was just the first 5 weeks of DP1, which I completed and got my crossed muskets infantry badge - but I've been told that since this isn't the same as the BMQ-L course (though as there was a BMQ-L running in parallel with my inf Dp1 course, this confuses me - they ran the same curriculum and timetable as us, only we were up a lot later scrubbing stuff). Will I have to redo the course? And of course I'd like to know if I'd start again as a Pte-Basic in terms of pay..

Thanks


----------



## MikeL

When you rejoin a PLAR will be submitted - make sure you ask your question to the recruiter. Do you have any paperwork saying you are qualified BMQ-Land ie course certificate.  Do you have your DP1 course report still as that will say which PO's you have completed.  Not sure if those PO's would be valid as you did not(from the sounds of it) finish DP1, ie meaning the BMQ-L qual was granted to you.  Copy of your MPRR - that will list all qualifications you have. 


Also crossed muskets Infantry badge?  I assume you mean the Infantry Corps capbadge?


----------



## Jhunt

Your basic most likely will not be recongnized there has  been a new directive that state any member who releases and is not QL3 will need to redo basic...i have been out just under 5 years and will need to redo it as well


----------



## Jhunt

I was advised upon releasing my basic would be good as well, but in 2010 a few things changed. Most recruitment centres do not even know of the new changes until you start the process. The directive came from the CDA. Many members are not even aware of it. I have tried to get around it but in the end there is nothing you can do. I know of one other guy so far that has dealt with this as well and lost. So just be aware that although the BPSO says you will be fine chances are you will not. I would get them to look further into the new basic directives for non ql3 members


----------



## Jhunt

Individuals who want to re-enrol in the CF after a period of absence apply
through normal recruitment procedures. CFRG HQ R7 PLAR and all CFRC's, have
been authorize to validate or recognized common qualifications that are
managed by the Canadian Defence Academy (CDA). Based on the PD system,
(education, training, experience, self development) gained while serving,
the BMQ remains valid for a limited timeframe unless a mbr reach the
Operational Function Point (OFP) before being release from the CF.

A BMQ completed on or after 1 January 2003 remains valid for:

Time served 12 months - valid for 24 months
Time served 12-23 months - valid for 48 months
Time served 24-35 months - valid for 72 months
Time served 36-59 months - valid for 96 months
Time served 60 months + Qualified for Life

Duration of Qualifying Service is as per - CBI 204.015(2)- Qualifying
service.

This is the email I got back from them. Sorry for the multiple posts


----------



## dapaterson

Remember, this policy was to bring back qualified members - people who could draw their uniforms and start working immediately.  Those folks were the priority, not people who decided to quit before they were occupationally qualified and then reconsidered.


----------



## PMedMoe

dapaterson said:
			
		

> Remember, this policy was to bring back qualified members - people who could draw their uniforms and start working immediately.  Those folks were the priority, not people who decided to quit before they were occupationally qualified and then reconsidered.



Not to mention someone who wants to rejoin in a different trade.


----------



## Shoto

Howdy folks. I did two years as LCIS, which is now a new trade as I understand. 

*Reason for Leaving*
Personal issues mainly, I joined up right after college, and I intended to be a medic. They convinced me to join LCIS, because I was a nerd. I had a college education in Health and Wellness, and no real life experience. Went from college to the CF. I wanted to get out and start my own business, experience Civvy life. 

*Why I want back in*
Civvy life blows. There's no money (at least for me!), no plan, no work ethic... It's all just blah. I'm trying to go ATIST, and was wondering how long I might expect to wait to get back in. 

*Completed*
BMQ, POET

Thanks folks!


----------



## starseed

@ Skeletor - yes, the infantry corps badge. I wasn't sure what to call it

JHunt - thanks for the information. That's a pity and I certainly hope you're wrong, but at least I'm forewarned now if you're not ><


----------



## Jhunt

No problem, it was a huge blow to me. I don't want anyone else being blindsided! Good luck


----------



## Gulruthina

I heard you have to re-apply online in the Canadian Forces website. And there is an option I think where you can choose from that label you as a "skilled" (previous CF experience) applicant.


----------



## secondchance

MMSS said:
			
		

> If you VR'd in June, then it's been more than six months anyway. Good luck on getting back in  If all goes well, maybe we'll both be there this summer.


Good luck guys!!!


----------



## chughes

I was in 4 years ago and left as well, I think they said a 6 month wait or something before reapplying.
But I applied back about 2 years now, and just got a call last week with a job offer, and I was merit listed 6 months ago, but there was no jobs open at that time. The wait seems to be longer now to get in since the jobs keep closing. When I joined the first time took about 1 month from when i applied and was given an offer.


----------



## MdB

Really, the application process is not much different from others who have not previous military experience.  The RC will have to ask for your pers file and CFAT results and verify your release item. Since you were eligible in the past, you should equally be eligible now.  It depends now on what trades you're interested in and those who are open at this time. Your application wouldn't be skilled unless you apply LCIS tech again and even since trades have been put together under LCIS trade, it could change. Otherwise, your application would be semi-skilled as you have military qualifications done.

As to how long that could take, it really is a case by case situation, but I don't expect it to be that longer from an applicant from the street.


----------



## rotarywing

Hi guys. 
I figured this was the most appropriate thread for the this post. If I am wrong please feel free to correct. 
I 4C released a few years ago. Shortly after release I joined the Vocational rehab program. 
I am mentally and physically fit and am wondering if any avenues exist to rejoin?
Or having participated in the Vocational rehab have I thrown that out the window?
I appreciate everyone's time.


----------



## secondchance

Bigm said:
			
		

> I am currently reapplying as well.  I was at the mega in June, some family issues led me to VR.  BIG mistake, definitely should have attempted a special leave or anything else really.  However, I'm not sure how well that goes over when you're on your first course.  Anyways, I called and spoke with a recruiter who told me there was no 6 month minimum wait time.  Just apply and see what happens.  The interview is where you're going to have a good chance to explain what went wrong and why it's not going to happen again.  My biggest concern now is that a VFS (verification of former service) is going to be done before and interview can be conducted and it can take a rather long time to get.  If it takes to long and the trades you apply for are closed, then it's HUAW until next April.  Good Luck! Let me know how it goes!


For your information Bigm.After 6 months of waiting I reapplied. Now I  stocked with VFS (verification of former service). My local CFRC sent request to Ottawa and they don't know how many weeks it can take.Even months as duty clerk told me yesterday.I was surprised in our age of Information technology it must take 1-2 weeks maximum. But any case it was my fault to do VR so I must have passion.Only one thing disturbs me - today is Selection Board of trade what I applied.Of course I am not merit listed - a lot of papers are missing.So I don't now but it looks like may be  I will need to wait next Aprill.
Last month I checked my health - I am over 40 ( blood test, heart). Everything is fine. So I just do training - ruining 3 times per week - total 30 km per week.Push-ups , sit ups....
I hope everything will be fine.This is just price of my VR.
So guys think twice before putting VR.


----------



## Wilder

Would anyone know the minimum wait time prior to re-enrollment as previous trade?  Also is it listed in any existing documentation? (canforgens, QR and O chapter and item etc?)


----------



## PuckChaser

Wilder said:
			
		

> Would anyone know the minimum wait time prior to re-enrollment as previous trade?  Also is it listed in any existing documentation? (canforgens, QR and O chapter and item etc?)



Timelines like that aren't going to be in documentation, every case is different. Expect a year wait, and be presently surprised if its shorter. Remember, they have to pull your file from archives and then figure out what courses you are granted if you've been out a while and things change.


----------



## Wilder

Sorry should have included a few more details.  Out for less than 6 months, enrolled in Sup Res on release, released 4B at end of contract.  Looking at re-enrolling same trade as I released from.  I was more curious as to the wait time for re-enrollment ex, 6 month wait period to re-enroll or 24 month wait period prior to re-enrollment.  I was wondering if the wait time is common knowledge or documented in QR and O's or notice by the CDS, anything substantive that states I CANNOT apply to be re-enrolled prior to X amount of time after my release date.


----------



## PuckChaser

You can apply any time, its the paperwork thats going to really slow you down. They have to track your file and you've been out less than 6 months which means it could be anywhere in transit.


----------



## Wilder

Thank you for your honest response.  I will be going into the recruiting center soon in that case.  I am so excited to re-apply and not have to wait the 6 months to a year to start the re application process.  Now hopefully my paper work isn't impossible to track down.


----------



## Wilder

Update:

Difference of Reg interpretations between CFNRCC and Local Recruiting Center.  :brickwall:  

Oh well, I will have to wait and see what happens now. :waiting:


----------



## DAA

Wilder said:
			
		

> Update:
> 
> Difference of Reg interpretations between CFNRCC and Local Recruiting Center.  :brickwall:
> 
> Oh well, I will have to wait and see what happens now. :waiting:



I'd be interested to know what the different interpretations were that you received?

Depending on your release item, if you have been out for less than 5 years and had reached the OFP (ie; generally QL3 trained) there is no waiting period.  You should be treated as a "high priority" applicant and take precedence over civilian applicants.  There are "waiting periods" but these are specific to individual circumstances and can vary widely (ie; from 6 months up to 5 years and it is generally based on the Release Item).


----------



## Wilder

4 B release in June 2012. Told I absolutely must wait 6 months from the local recruiting center.


----------



## DAA

Wilder said:
			
		

> 4 B release in June 2012. Told I absolutely must wait 6 months from the local recruiting center.



The 6 month waiting period is at the discretion of the CO CFRC and is not a hard and fast rule.


----------



## Wilder

Thank you for all the information.  I wish my local recruiting center was up to date with current information. Would have made my trip there yesterday less frustrating. (Still would have had to apply online due to that change but being told incorrectly that I absolutely must wait was very upsetting)


----------



## painswessex

Does CANFORGEN 002/11  Still apply?


----------



## DAA

painswessex said:
			
		

> Does CANFORGEN 002/11  Still apply?



It sure does, however, the processing steps for re-enrolment are dependant upon your Release Item...  Certain items are managed differently.


----------



## painswessex

Released 4c. Told by  CFRC Edmonton, that my file should be reviewed shortly, and a file manager should call withen the next three weeks. Other trades have priority. I was hoping that they already contacted the career manager for supply tech's and had a position for me. Oh well more waiting never hurt anyone.


----------



## DAA

painswessex said:
			
		

> Released 4c. Told by  CFRC Edmonton, that my file should be reviewed shortly, and a file manager should call withen the next three weeks. Other trades have priority. I was hoping that they already contacted the career manager for supply tech's and had a position for me. Oh well more waiting never hurt anyone.



What happened with this???

http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?action=post;quote=1175944;topic=13064.3275;last_msg=1179607


----------



## secondchance

Just called to CFRC - they are waiting for CFAT results. I don't know why they can not just take data  from system .It was in the same CFRC just 1 and half year ago.After 2 months - no progres in my application.Clerk even doesn't know if they did previous service check.I added my second choice also. So reaplying is not easy how I expected. But I have time to prepare best physically I do  running and physical exercises. Good luck to all who reaplly.I woluld like to know if there are people in the same boat likee here.


----------



## DAA

secondchance said:
			
		

> For your information Bigm.After 6 months of waiting I reapplied.



If I understand your circumstances correctly, I am actually surprised your CFRC is processing you.  If you VR'd prior to completing your Recruit training (ie; 4.C. Release), then the normal waiting period to reapply is "1 year from the effective date of release" and not the 6 months as I previously stated above (policy changed May 12).  The CO of your CFRC can ask for a waiver though, provided the circumstances that precipitated your initial VR have been resolved.

I believe the CFRC would have to process you the same as any other applicant (ie; Unskilled) because you did not complete your BMQ.


----------



## secondchance

DAA said:
			
		

> If I understand your circumstances correctly, I am actually surprised your CFRC is processing you.  If you VR'd prior to completing your Recruit training (ie; 4.C. Release), then the normal waiting period to reapply is "1 year from the effective date of release" and not the 6 months as I previously stated above.  The CO of your CFRC can ask for a waiver though, provided the circumstances that precipitated your initial VR have been resolved.
> 
> I believe the CFRC would have to process you the same as any other applicant (ie; Unskilled) because you did not complete your BMQ.


Yes, you are right that I did VR  prior to completing my Recruit training (ie; 4.C. Release).


----------



## Steve_D

Long time coming update:

I figure that I should wrap this topic up with an update.  After being sworn in on Oct 14, 2009, I arrived at CFB Esquimalt on Oct 21 and happily awaited my first course (NETPO), which started in Jan 2010.  I progressed through the MARS training and successfully graduated on March 4, 2011 upon which I was posted to HMCS ALGONQUIN. I joined the ship at sea on March 7.  It was the lottery of postings as the ship was scheduled to sail a lot.  I was very fortunate to sail for a missile firing exercise, numerous Task Group Exercises, JIATF-S (for which I have already received the Operational Service Medal) and RIMPAC-12.  I completed all my reqs and sat (and passed) my NOPQ board in Sept 21, 2012.  I have just been promoted to Lt(N) and am awaiting my Director Level course which is scheduled for Feb 2013.  It was not an easy accomplishment, but one that I am proud to be able to say that I have done.  The biggest key here is to never lose sight of your goals and to regularly ask yourself "how bad do I want this and what am I willing to do to get there?"

I remain proud of my uniform, the Navy, and the CF as a whole.

Thank you everyone for all of the support that you provided me during the entire process.

Steve


----------



## Allgunzblazing

Awesome post Steve! 

Your story is truly inspiring. I wish you the best  .


----------



## markody

Anyone have any fairly recent personal experiences with a recruit school bypass?


----------



## MikeL

What are you looking for?  I assume you are rejoining(?) and wanting a RSBP and trying to find out if someone else's experience/situation is similar to yours?


----------



## markody

I know it sounds crazy but I don't want a bypass. When told I was approved for one, I was very surprised since I have been out of the Reg force for almost 10yrs and the last info I knew regarding this was if you were out more than 5 yrs, back to basic you went. Having been out for so long, I really don't want to look like a fool fumbling through drill movements and such that I haven't thought about for a decade.  I just wanted to know what others went through regarding this..is there any type of refresher? Any details regarding kit issue? Would you typically be sent to a PAT PL (if there is still such a thing) before your QL3?


----------



## MikeL

Yea,  I've read past 5 years you need to redo your courses, but I've seen one person with 8-10 years out be able to come back in at his previous rank(MCpl) and go straight to a Battalion.  Another was a ex Sgt with about the same time out,  but had to start back as a Private Recruit, redo basic training, etc.


I would guess that you would be issued your entitlement of kit once you arrive/clear at the base and unit(either a school's PAT Pl or PRETC).

Yes PAT Platoons are still around,  and I would assume you would get sent to PAT Platoon(or PRETC) prior to your QL3/DP1.  As for a refresher on drill, etc that would be something you can pick up during PAT Platoon/PRETC if there is time/available staff.  Plus there are the other pers on PAT/PRETC who could help you out as well.


----------



## Sgt_McWatt

aurawolf said:
			
		

> I could use some help. I just recieved my compenent transfer. I am an infantry reserve private with 4 RCR, and I am going sigs215, but they gave me a recruit school by-pass.  Theoretically a good thing, but I have only been in since the end of June this year and the only training I have is my 2/3‘s from the summer I did in Meaford.  But the training was a little hurried.  They left out alot of important things!!  I have never been gassed, I didn‘t do a battle fitness test, the longest I have ever ruck-marched is 7 kliks, I only even wore a gas mask once. For goodness sakes I have never even done a night nav! I am hiker so I can but I didn‘t do one in training! My infantry course didn‘t teach me the gutov or the c6, and I havent done a swim test. I have never even been in shacks before (we stayed in Mods).  I was just informed that I am shipping out on Jan 7th, and sometime between then and the 7th of mar. I am taking a driver wheel, then I start my sigs course.  Which means there is no time to request a basic.  Does anyone have an idea as to how I can make up the training  o



Come out on 4 RCR IBTS weekends and you can get gassed (I know it happened this year.) It's probably not best to blame or mention your unit/course staff, you never know who's reading this....


----------



## Dissident

Ranger Rick said:
			
		

> Come out on 4 RCR IBTS weekends and you can get gassed (I know it happened this year.) It's probably not best to blame or mention your unit/course staff, you never know who's reading this....



11 year old post you responded to...


----------



## DAA

markody said:
			
		

> Anyone have any fairly recent personal experiences with a recruit school bypass?



Anyone who reached the OFP (ie; BMQ and QL3 qualified) prior to releasing, then the BMQ is good for life.   If you finished BMQ but did not finish QL3 and are subsequently "honorably released" on or after 1 Jan 03, then the validity of the BMQ qualification is linked to "qualifying service".  The more qualifying service you have, the longer the BMQ is valid for.


----------



## shogun506

DAA said:
			
		

> Anyone who reached the OFP (ie; BMQ and QL3 qualified) prior to releasing, then the BMQ is good for life.   If you finished BMQ but did not finish QL3 and are subsequently "honorably released" on or after 1 Jan 03, then the validity of the BMQ qualification is linked to "qualifying service".  The more qualifying service you have, the longer the BMQ is valid for.



Do QL3 qualified NCMs who release and re-enter as officers after 5 years get any type of BMQ equivalency or is it inapplicable because the officer basic is different?


----------



## DAA

Reaper-1 said:
			
		

> Do QL3 qualified NCMs who release and re-enter as officers after 5 years get any type of BMQ equivalency or is it inapplicable because the officer basic is different?



You answered your own question.....NCM quals generally have little if any impact on BMOQ training, except at the more senior levels...


----------



## secondchance

secondchance said:
			
		

> And I am curious if there are people here who re-applied again?


The same question as a few months ago.I re-applied already and in process.
Anybody?


----------



## Sizzle709

Myself. I left in December of 2011 due to personal issues and reapplied again in June 2012

BMQ starts again on January 7th.


----------



## secondchance

Sizzle said:
			
		

> Myself. I left in December of 2011 due to personal issues and reapplied again in June 2012
> 
> BMQ starts again on January 7th.


Almost the same. I left in December of 2011 due personal issues and reapplied again in July 2012.
File now on hold because trades are closed.


----------



## Determined

So, as a newbie, I am curious as to why when a new recruit, not even out of BMQ yet, requests VR, is not educated on their options according to their personal issue that has them requesting VR. Special leave, etc. 
It sounds like it's hard to keep up with what the rules, and regulations, are even if you are in the CF, let alone new. It all depends on who you ask. 
Congrats to the person getting into BMQ January 7th. 
As for the person who started this thread. Just keep doing what you're doing. Stay on top of things. Keep training and checking in. 
Three months is going to go fast and before you know it April will be here with new trades to apply too. 
Best of Luck


----------



## secondchance

Determined said:
			
		

> So, as a newbie, I am curious as to why when a new recruit, not even out of BMQ yet, requests VR, is not educated on their options according to their personal issue that has them requesting VR. Special leave, etc.
> It sounds like it's hard to keep up with what the rules, and regulations, are even if you are in the CF, let alone new. It all depends on who you ask.


It is hard to explain why people request VR - sometimes it is family issues and people are not sure when family situation can be improved, sometimes after being injured, sometimes recruits are thinking they are not good enough for CF, sometimes they are deciding CF lifestyle is not for them.Different reasons.But in majority cases nobody who applied for VR thinks about re-applying. Only small amount of people return back.
By the way it is not quickly to return back. 
Yes, special leave is good option.


----------



## Jarnhamar

secondchance said:
			
		

> Different reasons.But in majority cases nobody who applied for VR thinks about re-applying. Only small amount of people return back.


What are you basing this fact off of?


----------



## secondchance

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> What are you basing this fact off of?


About " nobody who applied for VR thinks about re-applying" ?
I meant  exactly time when people sign papers about VR usually they don't think about returning because for returning there are different types of temporally leaves. When I was signing papers about VR I couldn't expect if I re-apply again because I didn't know how things go.
Sure , after some time people change their decision.Again.It is better to ask temporally leave instead of VR if there are family issues.

About "Only small amount of people return back" ?
Just guessing . During last year I met only a few people here , on forum and facebook group who are returning back.
May be I am wrong? Correct me.


----------



## Journeyman

secondchance said:
			
		

> It is better to ask temporally leave...


I'm pretty sure all CF leave is temporal.   ;D


----------



## secondchance

Journeyman said:
			
		

> I'm pretty sure all CF leave is temporal.   ;D


even VRs?  :


----------



## Journeyman

Ah, another one with a Germanic understanding of humour.   :facepalm:


Perhaps it would help if you googled the term "temporal" -- especially since I suspect you mean "temporary."


----------



## secondchance

Journeyman said:
			
		

> Ah, another one with a Germanic understanding of humour.   :facepalm:
> 
> 
> Perhaps it would help if you googled the term "temporal" -- especially since I suspect you mean "temporary."


Ops
I just mixed words.English is not my first language.


----------



## Fiver

Jhunt said:
			
		

> CFRG HQ R7 PLAR
> 
> A BMQ completed on or after 1 January 2003 remains valid for:
> 
> Time served 12 months - valid for 24 months



Well well well. I served 9 months before getting my 4C in march 2010. Graduated from BMQ in october 2009. I did not reach my OFP.

Now, according to this I am well out of the validation period for my BMQ. Which I don't mind so much. However, CFRC Montreal requested a PLAR on my file a few months ago to see if I could bypass the BMQ, and it has been bogging down my application hardcore. Is it possible that they are confused about the new policy and that my PLAR is for naught and that they could just forgo it and process me along?


----------



## kratz

Being careful not to mix terms or concepts.

Anyone applying to enter the CF, who has prior service will have a VFS (Verification of Former Service) done.

This VFS is not a PLAR.


----------



## Fiver

I see where there could be a confusion... I've been communicating with my file manager and recruiter in French and every time, the term used by all parties has been "PLAR" instead of "ERA" or "VSA".


----------



## DAA

Fiver said:
			
		

> Well well well. I served 9 months before getting my 4C in march 2010. Graduated from BMQ in october 2009. I did not reach my OFP.
> 
> Now, according to this I am well out of the validation period for my BMQ. Which I don't mind so much. However, CFRC Montreal requested a PLAR on my file a few months ago to see if I could bypass the BMQ, and it has been bogging down my application hardcore. Is it possible that they are confused about the new policy and that my PLAR is for naught and that they could just forgo it and process me along?



Based on the information you have provided (ie; 9 months svc, BMQ Crse, but did not reach the OFP), you are correct in saying that your BMQ qual is no longer valid.  You local CFRC can continue your processing as an "unskilled" applicant without submitting a PLAR.  All that should be required is a VFS and nothing more.  The PLAR will only serve to further validate what is already known, that your BMQ qual has expired.  The only other reason a PLAR may be needed is due to civilian related education, trg, skills, experience or quals.  There are, however, a very limited number of NCM occupations (Med Lab, Med Rad, Dent Tech, Bio Ele Tech and Musc) which do require PLARS but these are few and far between.


----------



## Fiver

DAA, I wish you could've been in charge of my file from the beginning, even if you are probably overqualified and outranking that kind of position. I cannot overstate how much of a great wealth of information you are.


----------



## DAA

Fiver said:
			
		

> DAA, I wish you could've been in charge of my file from the beginning, even if you are probably overqualified and outranking that kind of position. I cannot overstate how much of a great wealth of information you are.



My posts are based on what information "you" are providing.  There may be other factors in play I'm not aware of that have triggered your CFRC to initiate a PLAR.  Good luck anyhow!


----------



## krasny

I have a special situation here... Im a sonar operator onboard the submarine HMCS WINDSOR i have 4 months left on my contract and want to remuster to a red trade in the airforce unforunately ive been told that it would be very difficult for me to use the VOT due to the fact that im in training to be a submariner and am posted in a core crew billet and training billet. so to remuster i would have to first request to cease my training then have a TRB which is not what i want. so im thinking about just finishing my contract then joining back after the 6 month waiting period but some people told me they might refuse me due to the fact that i didnt re sign a contract... which doesnt really make sense if i apply for a red trade... so is it possible that i could not get back in after 6 months ?


----------



## PuckChaser

Good luck getting in after 6 months. You shouldn't have to stop training to apply for a VOT, because you may not get that VOT. The BPSO will have all that information for you, but it sounds like someone is trying to scare you into staying by telling you that you have to cease training first. Keep in mind I doubt they're going to look at you for VOT until you sign another contract, which means you can be stuck as a sonar op, get out for probably a year before you MIGHT be able to get back in, or luck out and get your VOT.


----------



## krasny

well VOT would take a year and is not guaranteed ... they dont like to let submariners go... last year they lost 38 qualified and got 36 new ... 1 year wait isnt too bad it just ive been told they could just refuse me ... if its only waiting i dont mind theres at least 3 red trades in the airforce i can do and i compete well against new applicant due to the qualification i already have im current on everything. i just need certitude that they will let me go back in. when i joined 4 years ago it took me 1 week of waiting for sonar op to join the trade was beyond red... now they recruited so much that the trade is no longer hurting so im guessing a red trade air force should do to accelerate the process of getting back in ?


----------



## krasny

well im glad the info i got here is not that ill get rejected but just that it will take some time due to normal factor of jobs available... but yeah thats a good point in 10 months / a year will there be red trades ... if its the only obstacle then i think its worth it. Its really difficult to get out of the submarine world unless medically unfit... well ill re enroll in chicoutimi quebec i think quebec is always a little behind with their quotas for recruitment.i could find a job there waiting ... 

i know one guy with dolphin waiting to go firefighter ... did they do the process recently ?


----------



## DAA

krasny said:
			
		

> I have a special situation here... Im a sonar operator onboard the submarine HMCS WINDSOR i have 4 months left on my contract and want to remuster to a red trade in the airforce unforunately ive been told that it would be very difficult for me to use the VOT due to the fact that im in training to be a submariner and am posted in a core crew billet and training billet. so to remuster i would have to first request to cease my training then have a TRB which is not what i want. so im thinking about just finishing my contract then joining back after the 6 month waiting period but some people told me they might refuse me due to the fact that i didnt re sign a contract... which doesnt really make sense if i apply for a red trade... so is it possible that i could not get back in after 6 months ?



Generally speaking, there are several conditions that need to be met for this type of processing to apply, one of which is "being fully qualified for employment in the military occupation they are applying for" (see CANFORGEN 02/11).  So if you allow your contract to lapse (....you should have already been offered new TOS) you can reapply right away.  The waiting period, if any, is at the discretiion of the CO CFRC that is processing your file.  Under an Item 4.b. release, they will want to know why you didn't accept new TOS and if it appears that you did so to "avoid" or "achieve" something then you may have to wait.  They will NOT process your application until after your status has been determined.


----------



## Eye In The Sky

krasny said:
			
		

> I have a special situation here... Im a sonar operator onboard the submarine HMCS WINDSOR i have 4 months left on my contract and want to remuster to a red trade in the airforce unforunately ive been told that it would be very difficult for me to use the VOT due to the fact that im in training to be a submariner and am posted in a core crew billet and training billet. so to remuster i would have to first request to cease my training then have a TRB which is not what i want. so im thinking about just finishing my contract then joining back after the 6 month waiting period but some people told me they might refuse me due to the fact that i didnt re sign a contract... which doesnt really make sense if i apply for a red trade... so is it possible that i could not get back in after 6 months ?



1.  IAW the regulations [ADM (HR-MIL) Instr 05/05 and CANFORGEN 031/09] you should have been offered your next TOS [which should be a choice of a CE or your IE25] 12 months prior to the expiration of your current TOS.  Did you turn down a TOS offer or was one, including a choice of IE25 or CE, not offered to you?  

2.  Did you sign a SOU before beginning your sub trg stating you agreed to serve "X amount of years as a submariner" after completing "training level Y" with a restricted release period/date?

If not, well then the regulation that apply to your situation are clear; CFAO 11-12.  You aren't a combat arms trade, so you have to be QL4 qualified (QL3 if your trade doesn't have a QL4), with 48 months service, etc IAW CFAO 11-12, including meeting the requirements for entrance into your trade (medical, CFAT scores, etc).


----------



## Eye In The Sky

krasny said:
			
		

> well VOT would take a year and is not guaranteed ... they dont like to let submariners go... last year they lost 38 qualified and got 36 new ... 1 year wait isnt too bad it just ive been told they could just refuse me  ...



Who will refuse you?  Your CofC?



> if its only waiting i dont mind theres at least 3 red trades in the airforce i can do and i compete well against new applicant due to the qualification i already have im current on everything. i just need certitude that they will let me go back in. when i joined 4 years ago it took me 1 week of waiting for sonar op to join the trade was beyond red... now they recruited so much that the trade is no longer hurting so im guessing a red trade air force should do to accelerate the process of getting back in ?



I think your plan to get out and get back in is a *bad idea*.  Who knows what could happen; what if you get injured or into some legal trouble while out?  I wouldn't risk it, not with the cutbacks etc we are seeing now.  Thats me.

If you want to apply for a VOT, then apply.  You can expect to hit some roadblocks from your CofC by the sounds of it, but if you want to apply, look at CFAO 11-12 and talk to the BPSO.


----------



## krasny

Well now things got a little more interesting ! i did not sign an agreement to serve X time in submarine and i just discover that my TOS contract is invalid i signed a CE stating effective on may 28 2013 but it shouldve said upon acceptance so ive been told my contract isnt good ... so im putting a memo in to cancel that contract ... and hope to be back in service by 2014 there are always red trade !


----------



## secondchance

I continue my application process.After TSD and checking my references I just got a call today with some security questions and my CFRC told me that MP will do security check. Last  month when I was in Canadian Forces was December 2011.Since this time I stay in Canada .I hope my security check will not take long time...


----------



## Shafted

Hello, in July of 2010, I was enrolled & left for BMQ in August 2010 & I went in as a Vehicle Tech. I voluntarily released in October 2010 & I was in week 7 or 8. I left on request (Section 4C), for personal reasons. I went to school for mechanics, but had a hard time finding a job so I ended up on welfare. I re-applied for the Canadian Forces as a Weapons Tech, since an change had been made 2 years ago that I now need advanced math to apply for the Vehicle Tech trade. I was wondering if being on welfare would affect me in any way (such as slowing down my process). I am currently on the merit list & waiting for openings in April. Hopefully I get a call soon, so I can re-join the military. I made a stupid mistake by leaving & I completely regret it..


----------



## Davidson22

secondchance said:
			
		

> I continue my application process.After TSD and checking my references I just got a call today with some security questions and my CFRC told me that MP will do security check. Last  month when I was in Canadian Forces was December 2011.Since this time I stay in Canada .I hope my security check will not take long time...



Good luck man, I hope all goes well for you! 

I am also trying to get back in, i was at BMQ back in April of 2008 but i was really unprepared mentally and physically. Because i was so out of shape i suffered a knee injury on a morning run, sitting on PAT platoon for 2 months while having to try and deal with stuff back at home took its tole on me so i put in for a VR. I regretted leaving but i think i regret more not preparing myself enough before i went. Life got in the way for 2 years before i got to start working towards getting myself ready to go back. I have been training for 3 years now... i really wanted to make sure i wasn't going to run into any knee problems again,  and am finally confident that i am ready.


----------



## secondchance

Sawb22 said:
			
		

> Good luck man, I hope all goes well for you!


Thanks,
I am in process - waiting for interview and medical.


----------



## Wjones

Hello all,

New members here. I was in the military for 8.5 years as a Sig Op (later ACISS). I have been out for just over a year now and am looking at getting back in. I was a MCpl upon my release and have many courses such as .50 cal, lots of driver wheel crs, jump course ect.
Question is will they accept me even tho the trade (ACISS) is not in demand, but still open. If so how long may it take? I live in Edmonton but released in Shilo and would like to get back, what are the chances of a cost move right from the start back to Shilo? And am I eligible for a signing bonus?


----------



## MikeL

No signing bonus anymore

If the trade is open, they are still taking in people then

As for the chances of a Shilo posting, how long it will be, rank upon getting back in, etc   I don't know if anyone here can give you that answer,  you are going to have to apply and discuss this with the CFRC and see what they offer you.


----------



## Wjones

I'm well aware that there is not signing bonus for new recruits, however they still do signing bonuses for pre-skilled, or re-enrollment of QL5/PLQ trained members. I'll speak to my local CFRC.


----------



## MikeL

A message came out a couple years ago, that the CF would no longer give out a signing bonus as manning levels were good, etc.  AFAIK the signing bonus for QL5 qualified Sig Ops, etc is no more.


----------



## DAA

If you have been out for "less than 5 years" and were released 4.c., then you would be considered as a "high priority" applicant.  Just submit your application online at the forces.ca website and be sure to indicate that you have "prior service".  There should be NO requirement to submit any source documents, as your MPRR will be used for that.

Turn around time from application to re-enrolment, should be relatively short........provided the processing CFRC reads the darn processing instructions applicable in your case!!!


----------



## Wjones

Yes I have only been out for a year and a week. Things are not greener on this side, and I'm looking to get back in. 
I'm hoping this goes smooth but it's the military so something that should take a few weeks or a month or so will probably take half a year...


----------



## DAA

If they follow the processing model, 30-60 days at the most and that is conditional upon obtaining D Mil C support for re-enrolment.


----------



## Remius

Wjones said:
			
		

> Yes I have only been out for a year and a week. Things are not greener on this side, and I'm looking to get back in.
> I'm hoping this goes smooth but it's the military so something that should take a few weeks or a month or so will probably take half a year...



Just a reminder that YOU made that choice.  Whatever delays or hoops you have to go through to get back in are ultimately of your own design. 

With that though, I hope it does go as smoothly as possible.


----------



## Wjones

I'm hoping its pretty straight forward, it's only been a year and really nothing has changed except my current address.
I applied with CFRCC online but have been unable to get ahold of anyone there to find out if I still need to produce copies of my birth certificate and school transcripts, so when my local CFRC opens I'm going to call them to have my application transferred over.
30-60 days is what I'm looking for, I guess I'll have to wait to see what D Mil C says and if they will agree to a cost move.


----------



## Wjones

Crantor said:
			
		

> Just a reminder that YOU made that choice.  Whatever delays or hoops you have to go through to get back in are ultimately of your own design.
> 
> With that though, I hope it does go as smoothly as possible.



I'm fully aware that it was my decision, and they infact may not even take me back, but I'll deal with it as it comes.


----------



## PuckChaser

-Skeletor- said:
			
		

> No signing bonus anymore



If he was Reg F, signing bonus wouldn't have applied to him anyway. It was only for DP1-trained PRes members, or pers with civilian quals that allowed them to bypass training in understrength occupations.


----------



## 421_434_226

Wjones, I fully understand what you are feeling, I believe that they will still require your core documents, birth certificate and school transcripts, besides could it hurt to send them regardless? As for myself 37 days and counting as of today.


----------



## DAA

Gizmo 421 said:
			
		

> Wjones, I fully understand what you are feeling, I believe that they will still require your core documents, birth certificate and school transcripts, besides could it hurt to send them regardless? As for myself 37 days and counting as of today.



Have they even contacted you yet???


----------



## Wjones

Me? No, no one had contacted me as if yet.


----------



## 421_434_226

DAA, yes they have, additional forms faxed in, currently waiting for Guarda hopefully they completed last week, I know that they contacted as least one of my references. In fairness though the 37 days includes the online portion, 30 days is closer to reality on the CFRC side.

edited: for clarity


----------



## DAA

Gizmo 421 said:
			
		

> DAA, yes they have, additional forms faxed in, currently waiting for Guarda hopefully they completed last week, I know that they contacted as least one of my references. In fairness though the 37 days includes the online portion, 30 days is closer to reality on the CFRC side.



Upon receipt of your file, they have 24 hours to contact you to verify your MPRR and once you sign off, they as supposed to ask for your "posting prefs".  Then they have "6 business days" to contact D Mil C to obtain CM concurrence and a posn # and then they do the "condensed" processing.  The PLAR is done after re-enrolment, so the only hold up would be the "reliability" clearance.  Nothing more.....

Your MPRR is the "core" source document for the entire process......


----------



## 421_434_226

DAA, well it really hasn't quite followed that line so far, PM inbound cause details are not for public consumption.


----------



## 421_434_226

Got my job offer yesterday, off to Trenton for August.


----------



## 421_434_226

OK some more information looks like I will be re-enrolled on the 30th of July and report to Trenton on the 1st of Aug, hope they don't mind me showing up in civies as I got no uniforms yet. Anyone here work at 8 TIS Squadron?


----------



## UnwiseCritic

So a quick background on me
3 years previous service (fully trade qualified, no tours, quite a few courses), 4b release, attempted to join British military, didn't work out now I'm in the process of getting back in.

Applied mid march, was told to expect late May for an offer. Sadly I believed them haha, I know I'm an idiot. I was merit listed last week. Then I recieved a phone call telling me I was de merit listed due to my processing being wrong!? Apparently I was merit listed as an untrained recruit. Do I have to go through the whole merit listing process again?

I'm trying to be patient but the first time I joined the army they lost my application! And then my new one sat for a few months before someone picked it up... And now that I know the British process ours has become all the more disappointing.


----------



## d_edwards

krasny said:
			
		

> well im glad the info i got here is not that ill get rejected but just that it will take some time due to normal factor of jobs available... but yeah thats a good point in 10 months / a year will there be red trades ... if its the only obstacle then i think its worth it. Its really difficult to get out of the submarine world unless medically unfit... well ill re enroll in chicoutimi quebec i think quebec is always a little behind with their quotas for recruitment.i could find a job there waiting ...
> 
> i know one guy with dolphin waiting to go firefighter ... did they do the process recently ?



It sounds like your main objective is to get out of the submarine trade,  and hoping to get fast tracked back in by accepting any red trade.   I think this is an ill advised and short sighted tactic that will bite you in the ass.  There are a boatload of risks in getting out for the sole purpose of getting back in, and things can change on a dime.   And just taking a trade because it is expediant for you does a disservice to you, the forces, and the person who really wanted the job whose position you took.

My advice is to hold out for a vot,  and be selective in what you want.  Rack up the pensionable time and dont burn any bridges.


----------



## JohnBent

http://www.rcaf-arc.forces.gc.ca/en/re-enrollment.page?
Folks if you are a skilled applicant and you have been out for less than 5 years (in some cases longer than 5 years) and you are looking to re-enrol go to that link - it's for Skilled Air Force Managed Occupations.  NCM or Officer, we will assist you back into service.  

I need skilled AVS techs and skilled pilots; call me, leave a message, or fire me an email.  If you are a pilot I'll send you to my co-worker who just finished going through the re-enrolment process himself.

Can't hurt .. call me!  The process has indeed improved!


----------



## Andy2014

Hello all, I have searched for some information, but everything comes back from 2009. I am looking for current info.

I had just finished my POET course as an LCIS Tech, and I decided to get out. I was 22 when I left, I wanted to start my own business - which I did. I don't see a long term future with it.

I would like to re-apply as Air Force ACIST I think it is. My credit sucks, I think I need to declare a bankruptcy to get back in.

Will I have to redo boot camp and POET to get back in? Can I get in to a different trade that was similar (at least until POET) ?



Any advise is helpful!


----------



## PuckChaser

Are you thinking ATIS Tech? That's the RCAF tech trade. ACISS (CST) is the new name for your old LCIS trade.


----------



## Andy2014

Thanks! I was thinking: 

(Air Force version of LCIS?) Aerospace Telecommunication & Information Systems Technician

Or 

Avionics Systems Technician


----------



## PuckChaser

I believe the skill fade is 5 years for technical courses (POET) and 10 years for BMQ. You should be able to bypass both.

What I think your big concern is what the credit check will hold. You need to find out the policies from the recruiting center ASAP, as simple bankruptcy might be a limiting factor for recruitment, despite your former service.


----------



## Andy2014

THANK YOU. That is extremely helpful information. I've enjoyed being out for 3 years, starting my own company here in Toronto, but have gone very broke in the process. (have just turned 26).

I have settlement letters with the companies, I'm in pretty regular communication with them. I've settled 3/5 accounts over the last year, I only have 5k outstanding, and 10k owing on my student line of credit. My credit rating is awful, but this can all be fixed within 5 years. 

Last year when I re-applied, the officer who did my entrance interview only spoke to be for about 5 minutes. "Everything looks fine except for your credit, you won't be able to join with your current situation. You *could* declare bankruptcy."

Thanks again, the info about BMQ and POET was awesome. I would hate to redo POET... So... Hard... !!!

EDIT: Will I need to re-qualify for a tech trade on CFAT?


----------



## Jayjaycf

Andy, I am not 100% sure but I think I have read somewhere that, if you declare bankruptcy you won't be able to join either, you would have to wait a certain time before you could rejoin. I would call a recruiter and check with him, to me it sounded like he was saying you can't join with your credit at the moment, and a recent bankruptcy would be a show stopper too so don't worry too much about what course you would have to re do because I think you need to get a definitive answer before doing anything. I am pretty sure  bankruptcy is a big deal not only for your re enrollment but in many aspect of your life it is going to have repercussion so make some calls get your question answered and then make a decision, that's what I would do. Note that I am not a recruiting expert, I did spent quite some time reading topics on the forum but that's it good luck with everything I hope everything works out for you. My  :2c:


----------



## WestCoastHipster

Hey long time lurker but yet to post. So far so good for information on here without having to ask any questions. Anyways my TOS are coming up (first 3) and I seem to be in the same boat as krasny. But I'm infantry and would like to go boatswain. The general consensus seems to be that I should do a VOT as opposed to a release and enrollment. 

I saw eye in the sky post something about combat arms, which I am (QL3) so is all I need that plus 48 months? And mainly do I have to wait until a canforgen comes out and then apply for a VOT or can I just go down to the BPSO and start the process/notify my CofC? I'll stay in regardless and just continually try to apply. And I don't know if it makes any difference but on the forces website it says currently recruiting for boatswain.


----------



## Free071

I spent about 7 years in the Army Reserves (armoured), including doing my DP2.  I have been out for roughly the past 2 years now, but I am strongly considering re-joining reg force.

I was wondering if any of my passed experience would have any bearing or if I would be starting from scratch again.  I have no problem with doing it all over.  I will be there to learn.  

  I am just curious.


----------



## jlv031

I got back in reg force after 4 years out of the reserve. I bypassed BMQ and SQ. 
I think you have 5 years to get back in without doing every courses again


----------



## The_Falcon

Free071 said:
			
		

> I spent about 7 years in the Army Reserves (armoured), including doing my DP2.  I have been out for roughly the past 2 years now, but I am strongly considering re-joining reg force.
> 
> I was wondering if any of my passed experience would have any bearing or if I would be starting from scratch again.  I have no problem with doing it all over.  I will be there to learn.
> 
> I am just curious.



Free071, I merged your topic with this, as it was the closest and most relevent to what you are looking for, providing you are looking to go into the same trade.   Look up a few posts to what DAA wrote, about how things will work.  And generally speaking, you have 5 years to get back in without having to redo courses.  The caveat is though, if there have been significant changes to the qualifcation standards while you were out, or in your case there are some big differences between the RegF and Reserve trade quals.  The only way to know for certain is you have to apply and let the system do it's job. 

Hatchet Man 
Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## Free071

Thanks for the information guys.  My application is in (online).  I will speak to a recruiter on what my options are.


----------



## Free071

Just one quick question.  When I applied online, I noted all my previous service, including my service number.  Is it normal to get the default "Proof of citizenship/education/age" email reply?  I served for quite some time, so I meet those requirements obviously.


----------



## George Wallace

Free071 said:
			
		

> Just one quick question.  When I applied online, I noted all my previous service, including my service number.  Is it normal to get the default "Proof of citizenship/education/age" email reply?  I served for quite some time, so I meet those requirements obviously.



I would think it is a default question.  You are after all dealing with a machine.


----------



## DAA

Free071 said:
			
		

> Just one quick question.  When I applied online, I noted all my previous service, including my service number.  Is it normal to get the default "Proof of citizenship/education/age" email reply?  I served for quite some time, so I meet those requirements obviously.



If that email came from   jobs@forces.ca   then that is your "que" to contact your local CFRC to start your processing.  No one is going to call you, YOU have to call them!

Good luck!


----------



## Free071

Well, looks like the recruiting process has certainly changed.  I'll get on the phone with them asap.  Thanks again for the info.


----------



## Ultrasound

Hey guys.
I saw alot of information on this thread but its alot of old information and I'm interested in current information. I released in august of 2013 from infantry DP1. I VR'd because I felt like the infantry wasn't the right trade for me. I wanted to put in an OT but we were told that the OT process was backed up and that if one put in an OT before April then it wouldn't get looked at until February (and it was May at this time.) I was under the impression that if I put in an OT it would take around 2 years before it got looked at. Whether or not this is the case is irrelevant. I do have a friend who recently transferred from the Air force into the Navy but I don't know when she put in her paperwork. I talked to the guys at the recruiting center and they told me it would be 12 months before I could re-enlist. I learned that the trades I want to re-enlist in are "high in math and sciences" so I'm upgrading my math and science credits through distance learning. They also told me to get some community service, although I already have 240+ hrs. I'm wondering if anyone could tell me how long I could expect it to take to re-enlist and what I could do in the meantime to make me more competitive.

P.S. My trade choices are navcomm, sonar, weng-tech, e-tech and bosun.


----------



## The_Falcon

> I'm wondering if anyone could tell me how long I could expect it to take to re-enlist and what I could do in the meantime to make me more competitive.





			
				Ultrasound said:
			
		

> *I talked to the guys at the recruiting center and they told me it would be 12 months before I could re-enrol.** They also told me to get some community service*



You complain that information here is old, so you went to a recruiting centre and they told you 12 months and start volunteering....So....what do you want people here to tell you?  Something different and more to your liking?


----------



## DAA

Yup, you have to wait a "minimum" of 12 months from the effective date of your release, which would probably be Aug 14 and then it's still not a given.  You will have to "prove" that you overcame the problems which made you VR.

How long will you wait?  Too many factors to give you any reasonable answer but shortest would be 6 months after you re-apply.

And to expand on what HatchMan said, this thread may contain "old" information but Army.ca is probably the most "current".

Also, I wouldn't take what your Recruiting Centre told you as "gospel".  Upgrading your math and science credits may not be of much use, unless you know "exactly" which High School credits you need in order to apply for your occupation choices.


----------



## Ultrasound

1. it took me 6 months to get in the first time, and all i need to do is the interview and medical again, do you think it would possibly take less time.
2. yes, they specifically told me that these credits will make me more competitive for these trades.
3. why is minimum in quotation marks? do you think it could take less time? more?


----------



## George Wallace

Ultrasound said:
			
		

> 1. it took me 6 months to get in the first time, and all i need to do is the interview and medical again, do you think it would possibly take less time.



FIRST......We appreciate site members being 'professional' and able to make proper use of the English language in the written form.  There is a SHIFT Key.  Use it to capitalize words that require it.


As has been mentioned thousands of times on this site, YOU are an INDIVIDUAL.  As such, your case is not identical to anyone else; nor will it be identical to your original application.  Times have changed.  You have changed.  Requirements may have changed.  NO ONE can give you anything more than a 'guesstimate' at how long it may take, and that is just what it is; a guess.  No one can give you a time.





			
				Ultrasound said:
			
		

> 3. why is minimum in quotation marks? do you think it could take less time? more?



 :

Minimum means: "the least amount".  The least amount of time it will take will be twelve (12) months after your Release date.   Take the date that you were Released and add twelve (12) months or more to it and that is your answer.


----------



## The_Falcon

To echo what George said, minimum is just that the minimum. You are no longer a brand new applicant.  I posted it somewhere and so has DAA, that starting around 2012, those looking to re-enrol and who had NOT completed their initial trades training (ie people like you) would receive extra attention and SCRUTINY, as well as have to wait a minimum cooling off period.  We elaborated on the details in those posts so unless DAA is feeling nice, you will have to look them up yourself.  Bottom line the CAF, is not some day labour employer, where you can come and go as you please.  You voluntarily signed up to a commitment which ultimately you did not fulfil, wasting a lot of time, effort, a training slot, and money in the process.  That sort of thing has consequences, the CAF doesn't like being burned by recruits multiple times.


----------



## Eye In The Sky

WestCoastHipster said:
			
		

> Hey long time lurker but yet to post. So far so good for information on here without having to ask any questions. Anyways my TOS are coming up (first 3) and I seem to be in the same boat as krasny. But I'm infantry and would like to go boatswain. The general consensus seems to be that I should do a VOT as opposed to a release and enrollment.
> 
> I saw eye in the sky post something about combat arms, which I am (QL3) so is all I need that plus 48 months? And mainly do I have to wait until a canforgen comes out and then apply for a VOT or can I just go down to the BPSO and start the process/notify my CofC? I'll stay in regardless and just continually try to apply. And I don't know if it makes any difference but on the forces website it says currently recruiting for boatswain.



Combat Arms VOTs go under a VOT program called LOTRP or LOTP (might not be the exact name...can't remember, it's in CFAO 11-12).

Anyways, the difference for LOTP is that you only need 36 months service vice 48 months for AVOTP or COTP.

By the book, you also need your QL4, but...that CFAO is so out of date, there is some flexibility shown sometimes.   However, CFAO 11-12 is still the authoritive CF policy for Reg Force NCM OTs (what is holding up that 5002 series DAOD??), so I'd say...find it on the DIN/DWAN, read it, read the latest (2013) VOT NCM CANFORGEN (2014 isn't out yet) and go from there.

The BPSO will (should) be able to help you out but look after your own interest; find the applic policy and reg's, read them and don't just take what people say as 'the facts'.  Policy is in black and white, and lots of people think they know it or they can just ignore it.


----------



## Bmorsted

Hello, I believe this is where I would post this if I am incorrect sorry about that.  I have been out of the Canadian Forces Reserves for about 2 years and am thinking about re-enlisting, Now if I do so will I:
1. Keep my old service number?
2. Need to redo BMQ and BMQ-Land?
Thanks to anyone who reply/answers


----------



## jlv031

I kept my s/n from reserve to reg force (4 years later). Did not redo bmq and sq and was sent on my ql3 right away(different trade).


----------



## Bmorsted

Ok, Great thanks for answering.


----------



## ModlrMike

As much as every case is taken individually, the following is likely:

You would probably have the same SN;

Your training requirements will be dictated by the level of training you had when you left and what trade you are going into. I believe, but don't quote me, that BMQ / BMQ-L is good for five years.


----------



## lcl024

Hey guys! I appologize in advance for my writing its been a while since I've wrote in english so.. anyway here is the thing . To make a long story short I'm trying to re-enroll in the army but I'm having a problem with a 5f note in my file(don't know if its the same in english but its a "Bad standing" note if I may).They said I`ve forgot to bring back ALOT of equipements(For about3000$ worth of stuff)but after I made some verification with the JAG they told me everything was fine with them and they sent me and my recruiting center a copy of a letter that  have been send to me in decemeber 2006. After this they proceed with the medical and the interview ,wich I succeed, and told me that will put me on the list for the next selection.But monday after a couple of month(I pass the interview in november) I went back to the center to check out if they had some opening for my trade  and then they told me  that my file have to be approuved by the Chief of the army staff  before  they put me into the selection process.So no need to tell I was a little bit confused. My questions are:

-Do you think its a normal  that, even if I did'nt realy diserve a 5f,  my file need to get this higher clearence?
-Do you think that there is anything I can do to make this go a little fast.( I know this is a high level )

Thanks for your opinions and comments  they are apreciated . sorry again for the writing .
p:s I've forget to mention I relaese in august 2006.


----------



## DAA

lcl024 said:
			
		

> Hey guys! I appologize in advance for my writing its been a while since I've wrote in english so.. anyway here is the thing . To make a long story short I'm trying to re-enroll in the army but I'm having a problem with a 5f note in my file(don't know if its the same in english but its a "Bad standing" note if I may).They said I`ve forgot to bring back ALOT of equipements(For about3000$ worth of stuff)but after I made some verification with the JAG they told me everything was fine with them and they sent me and my recruiting center a copy of a letter that  have been send to me in decemeber 2006. After this they proceed with the medical and the interview ,wich I succeed, and told me that will put me on the list for the next selection.But monday after a couple of month(I pass the interview in november) I went back to the center to check out if they had some opening for my trade  and then they told me  that my file have to be approuved by the Chief of the army staff  before  they put me into the selection process.So no need to tell I was a little bit confused. My questions are:
> 
> -Do you think its a normal  that, even if I did'nt realy diserve a 5f,  my file need to get this higher clearence?
> -Do you think that there is anything I can do to make this go a little fast.( I know this is a high level )
> 
> Thanks for your opinions and comments  they are apreciated . sorry again for the writing .
> p:s I've forget to mention I relaese in august 2006.



Your situation is very common with regards to former members of the CF Reserves having their Release item designated as a "5.F." due to the non-return of kit.  If you did in fact "return" the kit and or made some form of restituition to pay for missing kit and you did this through your prior supporting Clothing Stores, then you "might" have a case to try and have the Release Item changed.

The CF will pretty much NOT touch you with a 5F release item and inorder to do so, requires "CDS Approval" which has not be delegated.

Your best and probably only option, is for you to contact the CF Ombudsman and explain your situation.

Good luck!


----------



## lcl024

Thanks a lot for the answer it's appreciated ! Now I understand why it has to go anyway to the CDS's office ! The letter from the Jag says that everything has been returned or paid for and its in date of december 2006.  Should I try to contact the  ombudsman just to make sure or should I wait for CDS's approval?


----------



## DAA

lcl024 said:
			
		

> Thanks a lot for the answer it's appreciated ! Now I understand why it has to go anyway to the CDS's office ! The letter from the Jag says that everything has been returned or paid for and its in date of december 2006.  Should I try to contact the  ombudsman just to make sure or should I wait for CDS's approval?



Missing and or unreturned kit became such a huge problem years ago and that is why the PRes went to such an extreme measure.  Non-return of kit = 5F;  Failure to sign release paperwork and or perform unit outclearance procedures = 5F.

But prior to doing this, I believe they may have been obligated to attempt contact to resolve the issue, then to send you a regular letter (Canada Post), followed by a "Registered" letter.  If there was no result, the file was passed to the JAG who tried and ultimately with no results, the file/debt was sold to a Collection Agency.  If you received a letter from the JAG, then it's a good indication that your previous Unit had washed their hands of the matter and just turned everything over to Legal, hence the reason behind the 5F release.  

CDS approval will not be coming, so your best bet is to go through the Ombudsman.  You need to have the Release Item changed to something more "favourable" other than a 5F.  

Call them ---->  http://www.ombudsman.forces.gc.ca/en/ombudsman-questions-complaints-submit-complaint/index.page?

It's a very basic question that you need ask which is "I was released from the Reserve Force under QR&O 15.01, Item 5.F. for the following reasons and I am wondering how or if I can have that changed because............and then just tell them your story"


----------



## lcl024

All rigth I will call them. thanks again !


----------



## Arcset

Hello all, I was wondering if anyone would be willing to share their experience with their application process during re-enlistment, specifically whether or not it was shorter or longer due to their previous history?  

I was in the Forces 6 years ago in the co-op program, however once I realized I wasn't mature enough or physically ready for it (found out the hard way), I quit one month into the program.  Now that I've matured and become more physically fit, I began the application process earlier this year.  My past history requires me to get a re-enrolment waiver, however in order to get that I need to get an approval which will take about a month to receive.  Assuming that I indeed get the approval and can continue with my application, does anyone know how long the rest of process would end up taking?  I'm not trying to sound impatient and I'm fully aware of the fact that the amount of time for processing varies greatly.  The problem is that I have a potential contact job coming up from May to August, and so I'm wondering about the likelihood of getting an offer within that time period.  I know I can turn down an offer, but for obvious reasons I'd rather not and would be very hesitant to do so.  I figured the processing would take longer than the contract job period, so I don't really have much to worry about.  All I want is a few opinions, preferably from people who have been in similar situations.

I've searched the forums for similar posts, but all the posts regarding re-enlistment ask about whether or not they'll have to do the training again or whether they'd be able to keep their old pay.  If I missed a post that would be relevant to my question, please post a link.

*Abridged: * Previous history requires re-enrolment waiver, approval will be determined by the end of April.  Contract job coming up between May to August.  What's the likelihood of getting the whole process complete before the end of August, ie should I take the contract job?

Thanks a bunch for the responses, cheers.


----------



## Goose15

I would recommend posting here: Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread. 

Good luck


----------



## Arcset

Goose15 said:
			
		

> I would recommend posting here: Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread.
> 
> Good luck



Damn, I never saw that.  Given how popular it was, you'd think the mods might have stickied it.  Thanks a bunch for the post, I'll definitely look into it.


----------



## The_Falcon

Arcset said:
			
		

> Damn, I never saw that.  Given how popular it was, you'd think the mods might have stickied it.  Thanks a bunch for the post, I'll definitely look into it.



It was stickied in a different sub-forum.  You'd think by SEARCHING prior to posting, you might have seen that.


----------



## jaybe316

Hello all, I couldn't figure out where to post this, as there isn't really a forum regarding transfers (I'm new to the site, so if there is, please correct me).
In any case, I've been a reserve infantry corporal for a few years new, last year I made the decision to transfer to the officer ranks, after a year of office-work, and other unpleasant activities, I realize that I *hate* my new job. 
My question, how can I get back to being a corporal? The recruiting sections said its either a trades change or a release. I really like the infantry and do not want to change trades, but nor to I feel like releasing for x years (how many would it take?) just to return and be a recruit again, though I would do that rather than continue to be an officer.
Does anyone know the proper procedures for this?
Thank you.


----------



## George Wallace

jaybe316 said:
			
		

> Hello all, I couldn't figure out where to post this, as there isn't really a forum regarding transfers (I'm new to the site, so if there is, please correct me).
> In any case, I've been a reserve infantry corporal for a few years new, last year I made the decision to transfer to the officer ranks, after a year of office-work, and other unpleasant activities, I realize that I *hate* my new job.
> My question, how can I get back to being a corporal? The recruiting sections said its either a trades change or a release. I really like the infantry and do not want to change trades, but nor to I feel like releasing for x years (how many would it take?) just to return and be a recruit again, though I would do that rather than continue to be an officer.
> Does anyone know the proper procedures for this?
> Thank you.



You obviously have little experience if I read this post correctly.  You are looking for a Component Transfer.  We have a whole group of topics on Component Transfers.  Please feel free to read them and find where you may fit in and what your expectations may be.


----------



## aarontoles

So I am going to try and share my story with army.ca. Tonight I applied to get back into the armed forces. My little story is that I spent three and a half years in the reg force with a tour of Afghanistan. I left the army fairly bitter and looking for better things. After getting out I have been working full time and doing fairly well (bought a house, steady woman, just bought ten acres in the country). But there is something missing (adventure, comradeship, sense of accomplishment). So I am going to attempt to get back in. I'll try and keep everyone informed on my progress.


----------



## swoop_ds

Hello everyone,

I served as a Mobile Support Equipment Operator in the reserves for almost eight years, and three of that was as the rank of MCpl.  I VRed from the reserve about four years ago as I had a full time job, and a small business that was taking off.  I found that I didn't have time to dedicate to it and wasn't doing the unit any favours by only showing up once every two or three weeks and barely any weekends.

Since then, I've gotten married, had a child, and I'm looking to get out of my business (wedding photography - I'm getting a little bored of taking photos of women in white dresses). I've begun looking at the Reg force as a possible career but have a few questions:

1. Does my reserve time only transfer over if I join as a reg force MSEop or similar trade?
2. What about if I were to join the navy/airforce? (In an unrelated trade)
3. Even if training/rank/etc doesn't transfer, would I possibly start at a higher point on the payscale?
4. I'm certainly not against taking BMQ/SQ/PLQ/etc over again as it's been four years since I've been in, but is it likely that I would need to retake these courses?

Thanks in advance for anyone who takes the time to reply,
-Dave


----------



## DAA

swoop_ds said:
			
		

> Hello everyone,
> 
> I served as a Mobile Support Equipment Operator in the reserves for almost eight years, and three of that was as the rank of MCpl.  I VRed from the reserve about four years ago as I had a full time job, and a small business that was taking off.  I found that I didn't have time to dedicate to it and wasn't doing the unit any favours by only showing up once every two or three weeks and barely any weekends.
> 
> Since then, I've gotten married, had a child, and I'm looking to get out of my business (wedding photography - I'm getting a little bored of taking photos of women in white dresses). I've begun looking at the Reg force as a possible career but have a few questions:
> 
> 1. Does my reserve time only transfer over if I join as a reg force MSEop or similar trade?
> 2. What about if I were to join the navy/airforce? (In an unrelated trade)
> 3. Even if training/rank/etc doesn't transfer, would I possibly start at a higher point on the payscale?
> 4. I'm certainly not against taking BMQ/SQ/PLQ/etc over again as it's been four years since I've been in, but is it likely that I would need to retake these courses?
> 
> Thanks in advance for anyone who takes the time to reply,
> -Dave



Your clock is "ticking", as "5 years" out is the magic number in most cases.  Generally, you will retain BMQ and any leadership quals for life but your occupation quals are subject to a PLAR.

If you choose MSE Op and you are beyond the 5 year mark, it will most likely be "Cpl (IPC B, TCP/IC 0), any occupation other than MSE Op, then it is a coin toss.  Hence, the need for a PLAR to determine just what quals they are willing to grant you and also what your TOS on enrolment will be.  I've seen these go many different ways, so there is no real answer to give you other than "A PLAR will be required and once completed, the PLAR will outline exactly what will be granted at the time of enrolment with respect to Pay and Quals."


----------



## aarontoles

Just a little update from me. I have made contact with the local recruiting center and am currently waiting for my med files to be sent from Ottawa. Anyone with any experience know how long this step usually takes?


----------



## George Wallace

tried_it_once said:
			
		

> Just a little update from me. I have made contact with the local recruiting center and am currently waiting for my med files to be sent from Ottawa. Anyone with any experience know how long this step usually takes?



Why, yes I do:

http://army.ca/forums/threads/81054/post-774714#msg774714


----------



## q_1966

5 years out timeline, does the clock run out at the start or end of the 5 year mark for a recruit school bypass?


----------



## PuckChaser

Get Nautical said:
			
		

> 5 years out timeline, does the clock run out at the start or end of the 5 year mark for a recruit school bypass?



Pretty sure recruit school bypass is 10 years. Technical trades/qualifications are 5 years. It may be a good question to post in the "Ask a Recruiter" forum for an official answer.


----------



## George Wallace

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> Pretty sure recruit school bypass is 10 years. Technical trades/qualifications are 5 years. It may be a good question to post in the "Ask a Recruiter" forum for an official answer.



This has been covered before:

http://army.ca/forums/threads/294/post-871021.html#msg871021

http://army.ca/forums/threads/294/post-1010922.html#msg1010922



			
				George Wallace said:
			
		

> With my knowledge of the Recruiting process, if a person has been out for less than five years they often get to keep their Qualifications, but may be required to do BMQ(L) (SQ) over again.  If a person has been out for ten years, they may be able to keep their Qualifications, but are most likely to be required to do both BMQ and BMQ(L) again.  As you have no Qualifications other than a Reserve BMQ and that is from ten years ago, your most recent attempt not successfully completed, then in all likelihood you will have to start with the Regular Force BMQ.
> 
> 
> This topic has been covered in numerous other questions on Recruit School Bypass.


----------



## George Wallace

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> Pretty sure recruit school bypass is 10 years. Technical trades/qualifications are 5 years. It may be a good question to post in the "Ask a Recruiter" forum for an official answer.



WRONG



			
				DAA said:
			
		

> Your clock is "ticking", as "5 years" out is the magic number in most cases.  Generally, you will retain BMQ and any leadership quals for life but your occupation quals are subject to a PLAR.


----------



## PuckChaser

Thanks for telling me, twice. Pretty sure I read it the first time, directly above the caps lock button got stuck on your second post. Must have been a slow posting day?


----------



## George Wallace

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> Thanks for telling me, twice. Pretty sure I read it the first time, directly above the caps lock button got stuck on your second post. Must have been a slow posting day?



It's not for you, but the persons who are too lazy to look for this, which has been posted ........How many times now?







And we know that someone else will show up and ask the same question, yet again.   :-\


----------



## jman

I joined the reserves when I was 17 and as most kids do got off track and into the party scene at 18 and before I new I stopped going to parade nights. I was filed as nes and  it didn't go threw until I was 20. im 21now and have learned lots of life lessons over the past three years and no my passion and I would like to reinlist. I no its possible but hard. im looking for input and advise. Its been 3 years but im worried since I wasn't technically released until recently because of how long paperwork takes they may look at file and assume I havnt matured enough because its only been a year on there file. (really its been three). Thanks for reading, and any advice


----------



## Master Corporal Steven

Good day,

Applicants released from a Primary Reserve (PRES) unit under release item 5F due to not parading and being deemed Non-Effective Strength (NES) are required to provide written documentation proving that all kit was returned and that there are no outstanding obligations to the PRES unit or the Canadian Armed Forces as part of the reenlistment application process.


----------



## Brasidas

Master Corporal Steven said:
			
		

> Good day,
> 
> Applicants released from a Primary Reserve (PRES) unit under release item 5F due to not parading and being deemed Non-Effective Strength (NES) are required to provide written documentation proving that all kit was returned and that there are no outstanding obligations to the PRES unit or the Canadian Armed Forces as part of the reenlistment application process.



In the case of an applicant who provides such documentation, is the decision on whether to accept such an applicant made at the unit level?


----------



## Master Corporal Steven

Good day,

No the decision to process is not made at a Unit level. If provided the appropriate documentation from the applicant the local CFRC may then submit a request for a re-enrolment waiver in order to process the applicant.


----------



## formersapper

First post - appreciate the level of information available on this forum.

My story - served 11 years as a Combat Engineer Officer. RMC - fully trained - retired as a Captain in 2002.

I have contacted the local reserve Combat Engineer Regiment about joining them - and have read / heard about the 5 year expiry on technical qualifications and the 10 year expiry on basic training.

My question is - does the reserve recruiting authority (not sure about the official title) make specific offers based on individual cases - or is it just blanket application of policy, and I should expect to have to do basic again (which I almost find appealing as I am sure I could teach most of the classes from memory, and I predict I would just giggle inside for the entire length of the course)?

As I understand it most reserve combat arms units are under strength, and they are all recruiting for officers and NCMs. So - wondering why there wouldn't be some move to take advantage of former members to fill those gaps (with some form of refresher training and certification testing required). This sort of approach would be much more cost effective than completely retraining former members...

As I go through the process and find the answers to this (and I am sure many other questions) I will post to this thread.


----------



## TopOp90

Hi there I am from St Johns Newfoundland. I was In the Canadian Forces for five years. Awhile back I got a release for continuing education but interested in rejoining my home unit but a different trade. My question is How many years do I have to be under, out of the Forces that I wont have to redo my BMQ & SQ? I have been out for three years. I have been told it is under two years and I have been told under five years. Do's Army,Navy,Air make a difference? Thank you for your time  Hope you can help me out. Cheers!


----------



## Master Corporal Steven

Good day,

A PLAR is used to assess all prior education and qualifications including courses taken by prior serving members who are applying for reenlistment into the Canadian Armed Forces related to the chosen occupation on the current application. Courses change over time and a PLAR is used to determine what knowledge gained from previous qualifications match the current requirements of the training for the occupation and may result in the granting of some qualifications towards the current courses/occupation standards. 

For example if you've already done a basic military qualification course and the course has not changed then an individual would be granted that qualification and not have to redo the course if they are re-enrolled.


----------



## Backinthesaddle

Thank you for helping, I am also looking to rejoin.  I was in the Navy from 1989-late 2001. (seems like yesterday)  I was a MS marine engineer cert 2c qualified, submariner qualified.  I got out to embark on a civilian career.  I was college trained through the Navy via the old METTP program and I was wondering if the recruitment process is the same for a re-enrollment.  I understand there is a PLAR process in place and need to know if I proceed with the initial online app or do I book an appt. at the Recruitment office.  I have always regretted leaving and would love to become a "lifer" again


----------



## Master Corporal Steven

Good day,

To begin your reenlistment you will need to submit an online application through http://www.forces.ca/ website to begin the process of rejoining the Canadian Armed Forces.


----------



## formersapper

Quick update. Paperwork is in. If all goes well, I will belong to 44 Field Engineer Squadron. I will most likely parade in North Van and Chilliwack though...

I have my Force test tomorrow morning - arranged it through contacts at 19 Wing in Comox. Then, at some point, I will go to the recruiting center in Victoria for the aptitude test (they can't find my original results from 1990) and the interview. Should be fun.

I have asked for a PLAR, and am preparing a detailed resume of my experience since leaving the Army to demonstrate that I have built on, and grown my leadership and planning skills.

Fingers crossed I get a reasonable offer. Otherwise, I won't be putting a uniform back on. I have thought about it, and while attending 2 and a half months of phase training would be a nice break, I can't leave my business or my family for that long. Too bad - I would really enjoy it!


----------



## JohnBent

Skilled applicants returning to (or wishing to return to the RCAF) in an Air Force managed occupation can contact us through our website.  We work individually with every applicant - if you are not elligible for re-enrolment we will let you know right away.

Let us try to help you renew your career in the RCAF!

http://www.airforce.forces.gc.ca/en/re-enrollment.page?


----------



## Boromir

Hello,
  I would like information on reenlistment - I have been retired for 27 months and was thinking of trying to get back in the service - I was an Sgt AVS technician - after a PLAR, do you think would I be entitled to my previous rank or has too much time elapsed? TIA


----------



## Scorched

Hello,

I was wondering if a recruiter or anyone with experience for that matter would be able to tell me what my chances are of getting back in for a 3rd time?

Heres a quick run down.. I was ACISS both times and wanted to be ACISS again for this third time.

Joined in 2011. Was injured on platoon, went to AWT for 5 months, decided that I wasn't getting any better and VR'd to improve my recovery pace.

Re-enlisted in 2013 and after week 4 I had some family issues that I felt at the time were more important then continuing on in the military at that time. So I VR'd (to this day I still regret this because everything worked out in the end.)

Both times I was Generally discharged with the code 4-C (Which I believe allows me to return)

Now, i've been thinking about trying to re-enlist. Its been two years and I miss it everyday... Will the CF take me back for a third and final time? Will my process take longer then others? Should I just give up on this dream? 

Any information that could be provided would be excellent.

Thank you,


----------



## SMG III

Can't seem to find an answer..

I left the Forces as a Pte this past fall, and am hoping to re-enroll for the 2016/17 school year and go the officer route. 
I understand the training is different for NCMs and Officers, but will my BMQ count or will I have to "redo" it with BMOQ?


----------



## The_Falcon

SMG said:
			
		

> Can't seem to find an answer..
> 
> I left the Forces as a Pte this past fall, and am hoping to re-enroll for the 2016/17 school year and go the officer route.
> I understand the training is different for NCMs and Officers, but will my BMQ count or will I have to "redo" it with BMOQ?



You obviously do no understand there is a training difference.  BMOQ is not a "redo" of BMQ it is a different course altogether, hence why it is called Basic Military OFFICER qualification.  Officers are expected and trained to be leaders the moment they receive their commission, Privates are not.  Where do you suppose that leadership part is taught? :


----------



## SMG III

I do realize it is different. I put "redo" in quotations for a reason. I know it's not actually redoing the course.
I wasn't sure if I would just have to do some leadership courses or not. I honestly just didn't know. 

Hence why I came here simply to check.

A simple "No, you have to do BMOQ, they are different courses." would have sufficed in answering my curiosity.

But thank you.


----------



## George Wallace

SMG said:
			
		

> I do realize it is different. I put "redo" in quotations for a reason. I know it's not actually redoing the course.
> I wasn't sure if I would just have to do some leadership courses or not. I honestly just didn't know.
> 
> Hence why I came here simply to check.
> 
> A simple "No, you have to do BMOQ, they are different courses." would have sufficed in answering my curiosity.
> 
> But thank you.



A simple "Thank you." would have sufficed instead of your snide remarks.  I now have the impression that you would make the worse type of officer that one may have the displeasure to run across.


----------



## SMG III

My answer was in no way meant to be snide. I'm sorry if it was taken that way.
The reply I received seemed snide to me, although perhaps I'm guilty of assuming as well.
I had a question, I was curious, and that's all.

Saying my abilities as a officer are affected by this post is highly irrational.

I'm appreciative of the answers I get here.


----------



## Scorched

And mine? 

I couldn't find any results on the issue.


----------



## DAA

Boromir said:
			
		

> I would like information on reenlistment - I have been retired for 27 months and was thinking of trying to get back in the service - I was an Sgt AVS technician - after a PLAR, do you think would I be entitled to my previous rank or has too much time elapsed? TIA



It's entirely possible, provided you are applying for the same occupation.  In your case, the PLAR process validates your prior quals and service.  Recruiting must forward your information to DGMC (ie; CM), who is the trigger here.  If applying to get back in to the same occupation, it's entirely up to the CM as to just what the possible offer will be.

Could be the same rank, could be something else...


----------



## DAA

Scorched said:
			
		

> I was wondering if a recruiter or anyone with experience for that matter would be able to tell me what my chances are of getting back in for a 3rd time?
> Heres a quick run down.. I was ACISS both times and wanted to be ACISS again for this third time.
> Joined in 2011. Was injured on platoon, went to AWT for 5 months, decided that I wasn't getting any better and VR'd to improve my recovery pace.
> Re-enlisted in 2013 and after week 4 I had some family issues that I felt at the time were more important then continuing on in the military at that time. So I VR'd (to this day I still regret this because everything worked out in the end.)
> Both times I was Generally discharged with the code 4-C (Which I believe allows me to return)
> Now, i've been thinking about trying to re-enlist. Its been two years and I miss it everyday... Will the CF take me back for a third and final time? Will my process take longer then others? Should I just give up on this dream?



You have VR'd (ie: quit) twice now.  You were probably scrutinized closely when you applied the second time around to make sure it wasn't going to happen again.  How did that work out for the CAF?

Really don't care why you VR'd nor what the cirumstances were, heard all of them before.  Go ahead, submit your application and see how it goes........you never know what can happen!


----------



## Boromir

Hello,
  I would like information on reenlistment - I have been retired for 27 months and was thinking of trying to get back in the service - I was an Sgt AVS technician - after a PLAR, do you think would I be entitled to my previous rank or has too much time elapsed? TIA


----------



## krimynal

boromir you asked the same question 3 days ago and DAA gave you the exact and ONLY answer that we can provide you , don't start spamming the forums , you got the answer , deal with it


----------



## Pwegman

hmmm weird ,at first  boromir said  he was ACISS and now he was a AVS tech ... multi task ?  Spamming and not telling the truth  ? If you're going to lie at least stick on it ,  not nice for people who are trying to help you here... :2c:


----------



## PMedMoe

Pwegman said:
			
		

> hmmm weird ,at first  boromir said  he was ACISS and now he was a AVS tech ...



Boromir said he was AVS.  _Scorched_ said he was ACISS.


----------



## Scorched

DAA said:
			
		

> You have VR'd (ie: quit) twice now.  You were probably scrutinized closely when you applied the second time around to make sure it wasn't going to happen again.  How did that work out for the CAF?
> 
> Really don't care why you VR'd nor what the cirumstances were, heard all of them before.  Go ahead, submit your application and see how it goes........you never know what can happen!



Thank you for the reply.

Believe it or not, I wasn't scrutinized on my return for the 2nd time. I made my intent to return very clear when I left the first time.

I do however expect to be highly scrutinized this time. But like you said we'll see what happens.


----------



## DAA

Scorched said:
			
		

> Thank you for the reply.
> 
> Believe it or not, I wasn't scrutinized on my return for the 2nd time. I made my intent to return very clear when I left the first time.
> 
> I do however expect to be highly scrutinized this time. But like you said we'll see what happens.



It's a hit and miss process.  Some people will breeze through it and others will experience the snails pace version.

Good luck!


----------



## JSingh04

Hello there,

Ok, I was in the military for almost 2 years and failed on my phase 4. I have gone through the Basic and CAP phase. Due to discouragement and some personal matters, I thought it would be better to VR. It was a tough decision. After re-experiencing the civilian life, I feel that military is where I was meant to be. I miss that discipline and lifestyle. I'm not sure If my previous training will count (I have heard it will) and how long it will take for me to get back in. I was being offered OT at the time of release and not sure If I will have that privilege again.

Thanks.


----------



## DAA

So what is your question?


----------



## RJ

Hello all,

I am looking to try and get some information on how long quals from previous service are good for.

I served for 12 years in the reserves (MSEOP) and got out as a SGT. I have been fully released for just shy of 7 years (no Sup Reserve). I decided last year that I wanted to get back in and have finished pretty much everything to get back into the reserves as an Officer (Armour).

Let me state up front that I never expected any armoured quals to be written off. However, when I first went into the recruiting centre they told me that I would "probably" get a bypass on basic and the land phase and would jump in to "trade" training (I assumed that would be BMOQ and CAP-R - sorry if I am dating myself with the terms).

I just got a call a few days ago that my file is in final review and they are getting ready to hand me over to the unit for my swearing in. I asked what the status of granting any bypass was - the reply to which was pretty much "Oh, you aren't going to get anything you got out over 5 years ago. But I will look into it". I haven't heard anything since, and I know it has only been a few days, however I was thinking that I would ask here if anyone could shed some light or had any previous experiences.

Thanks!


----------



## RJ

Sorry,

I think I should have put this in the reenlistment mega thread...


----------



## JS2218

5 years is correct. You *may* have been able to get away with being out a bit longer than 5 if you could prove you've been employed in a field related to your military trade.


----------



## RJ

Hi JS2218,

Is there an actual "rule" related to this though?

I always heard 5 years myself - which is why when they first said I might have a bypass I was surprised.

I am also curious because a buddy of mine got in last year after being out for 7 years. He was allowed to keep all his quals and his rank (SGT Sup Tech). Also, reading other posts there seems to be lots of people saying 5 years for Quals but 10 for recruit school - which obviously wasn't the case for my friend but still makes me wonder if there is an actual set of rules or even guidelines out there somewhere.

Thanks.


----------



## JS2218

RJ said:
			
		

> Hi JS2218,
> 
> Is there an actual "rule" related to this though?
> 
> I always heard 5 years myself - which is why when they first said I might have a bypass I was surprised.
> 
> I am also curious because a buddy of mine got in last year after being out for 7 years. He was allowed to keep all his quals and his rank (SGT Sup Tech). Also, reading other posts there seems to be lots of people saying 5 years for Quals but 10 for recruit school - which obviously wasn't the case for my friend but still makes me wonder if there is an actual set of rules or even guidelines out there somewhere.
> 
> Thanks.



The recruiting centre would have to send off for a PLAR, which is reviewed/obtained through CDA, so I'd look into the references related to PLARs and the authority of CDA to waive certain training requirements.


----------



## TCM621

Posting from my phone so I don't have the ref but there is a document out there that lists how long a qual lasts. IIRC basic should be good. I would do a plar immediately. A lot of the times this stuff gets missed due to lack of information or GAFF. CDA is the opi and they will get the right info. It is a waste of time and money to send you on BMOQ.


----------



## JS2218

See, for example, this CBI that deals with determining the pay increment for re-enrollees:



> 204.015(4) (Exception) Qualifying service for pay increments does not include:
> 
> (a) any service prior to a continuous interruption of more than five years during which no service designated in paragraph (2)
> was performed, unless the member during the period of the interruption has maintained relevant skills or qualifications considered by the Chief of the Defence Staff, or any officer designated by the Chief of the Defence Staff, to be of military value;


----------



## RJ

Thanks guys,

In retrospect, one other piece of info and confusion is that when CFRC initially said that I might have a bypass it is because some sort of review of my MPRR had been done and that review indicated I had equivalency - they even showed me the message. I don't know if it was an official PLAR or where it came from. But then they said that because I was going PRes that there would have to be another review done by the reserves and that it might not reflect what was shown in the first review.

Anyway, thanks for the help. I am not sure what CFRC meant when they told me they would look into it so I will keep asking for clarification and/or a PLAR to be done either through CFRC or when I am actually sworn in again. I have looked over DAOD 5031-1 and if I am interpreting it correctly the review should be done at CFRC for both Reg and PRes - but I know that doesn't mean that is what actually happens... And I might be misinterpreting it.


----------



## marinemech

I was released back in Late November due to Injury and required Surgery ( was not bad enough for a #3 Category) as it was only a Hamstring tear that required 18 Carbon-fiber stitches, and with a estimated heal time of 6-12 months (from the docs at CFLRS), well went in and had the wound opened to remove the stitches and the surgeon said it was healing really well with no scarring on the muscle. I have been doing my Physio excersises and can run 3-5 easily (indoors since Saint John is currently a skating rink) and walk about 20-30k a day while wearing Goretex boots (mil surplus) with no issues. I want to go back and try again since it was my fault for letting it get so bad by ignoring it and i still want to fight for my country. I know it says one year, is that before i can apply or can go back to ASU St Jean


----------



## DAA

marinemech said:
			
		

> I was released back in Late November due to Injury and required Surgery ( was not bad enough for a #3 Category) as it was only a Hamstring tear that required 18 Carbon-fiber stitches, and with a estimated heal time of 6-12 months (from the docs at CFLRS), well went in and had the wound opened to remove the stitches and the surgeon said it was healing really well with no scarring on the muscle. I have been doing my Physio excersises and can run 3-5 easily (indoors since Saint John is currently a skating rink) and walk about 20-30k a day while wearing Goretex boots (mil surplus) with no issues. I want to go back and try again since it was my fault for letting it get so bad by ignoring it and i still want to fight for my country. I know it says one year, is that before i can apply or can go back to ASU St Jean



You can't apply until one year after your effective date of release.  After that, you will be subject to the waiver process which will add more time.


----------



## Addicted

Hello,

I searched the forum for an answer and I couldn`t find anything. Once a regular force NCM releases at the end of his entry contract (4B?), how long does he have to wait before he can re-enroll? (in a different element/trade) I heard 60 days and also 6 months. 

Thank you very much.


----------



## DAA

Addicted said:
			
		

> I searched the forum for an answer and I couldn`t find anything. Once a regular force NCM releases at the end of his entry contract (4B?), how long does he have to wait before he can re-enroll? (in a different element/trade) I heard 60 days and also 6 months.



Provided it was in fact a 4.b release item and as long as you reached OFP (ie; minimum QL3/DP1) at the time of release, you cannot reapply to the CF for a minimum period of "6 months" from the effective date of your release.


----------



## Addicted

Thank you for your reply. Is it clearly stated in one of the pub? The Release Clerk I saw based her 60 days on "I also understand the implications of re-enrolling within 60 days after my release date in the same component concerning potential benefits." (A-PM-245-001/FP-001 Ch. 15, Annex F, Appendix 8)

Left me confused.


----------



## DAA

Addicted said:
			
		

> Thank you for your reply. Is it clearly stated in one of the pub? The Release Clerk I saw based her 60 days on "I also understand the implications of re-enrolling within 60 days after my release date in the same component concerning potential benefits." (A-PM-245-001/FP-001 Ch. 15, Annex F, Appendix 8)
> 
> Left me confused.



Your Release Clerk deals with release benefits and not recruiting directives, which are two different things.

Yes, the "6 month" policy is clearly articulated in recruiting directives but these are only available on the DWAN.  I shall have a look at APM-245 in the morning and see just what is there in the Anx/App you quoted.


----------



## Addicted

Hi!

Would I have to wait 6 months as well if I decided to join as a Reservist instead?


----------



## ModlrMike

Addicted said:
			
		

> Hi!
> 
> Would I have to wait 6 months as well if I decided to join as a Reservist instead?



Probably not. You could do a component transfer straight to a Reserve unit, or PRL. Provided there was a position available in your rank and trade.


----------



## DAA

Addicted said:
			
		

> Hi!
> 
> Would I have to wait 6 months as well if I decided to join as a Reservist instead?



I would think so but then again, stranger things have happened.  As ModlrMike has mentioned, you could do a Component Transfer from Res to Reg but this would have to be done prior to your release and only if you can arrange to find a position at a local Res F Unit in the area you plan on residing at.


----------



## Addicted

DAA said:
			
		

> I would think so but then again, stranger things have happened.  As ModlrMike has mentioned, you could do a Component Transfer from Res to Reg but this would have to be done prior to your release and only if you can arrange to find a position at a local Res F Unit in the area you plan on residing at.



Thanks for the help guys. I will keep all of that in mind.


----------



## JoeDos

I enrolled in the Regular Force but while I was at BMQ and before I finished, I had to VR due to family circumstances that I needed to attend to.  I'm still really interested in the CF and would like to apply to the Reserves as this would probably be a better fit for now.  I searched the boards and other threads but from what I found, it seems to me that I have to wait a full year before applying for reserves and even after, I might need some sort of waiver.  I don't know if I do my reserve application now or wait?


----------



## Tundra Lee

I actually completed my BMQ and graduated but had to VR shortly after and before starting my trade training.  My husband fell ill and I had no choice but to return home to look after his recovery.  It was unfortunate for us and a blow to me.  I was and still am dedicated to joining to CF and at my age, time is of the essence.  So I tried joining my local Reserve Unit who seemed happy to have someone like me.  However, I was told I had to wait a year after releasing from the Reg Force to try again.  The Reserve Unit was even ready to hire me on the spot too!   So expect to wait your year and then try again."


----------



## AFruch

Hello,
I'm currently in the process of re-enrolling in the CF in the same trade as before and was wondering if anyone here was ever in a similar situation as myself. I served four years as an combat engineer, was promoted to corporal after three years and got out a year and a half ago at the end of my four year contract. After I got out, all the documents I received dealing with my final claims and supplementary reserve started referring to me as a private trained. I figure it must be related to me not having done my fives (there was a backlog and I was off in the field a good chunk of the time anyways). I'm just wondering if I am getting demoted on a technicality when I go back, or if I have a chance to keep my old rank? 

I still have a copies of all my paperwork and can prove when I was promoted and the amount of time in rank. No matter what happens, I wont let it deter to me, even if I have to start as a sapper again. But it would be preferable to keep my rank.
So I was just wondering if anyone has dealt with this, or seem it happen to someone they knew and how it turned out in the end?
Much obliged for the information.


----------



## Captain Mark

I have received confirmation that there is no waiting period for members who released (4c) from the Regular Force, prior to completion of BMQ/BMOQ, and who want to join a reserve unit. However, the local reserve can still decide if they are willing to accept you as a reserve member or not.


----------



## DAA

AFruch said:
			
		

> Hello,
> I'm currently in the process of re-enrolling in the CF in the same trade as before and was wondering if anyone here was ever in a similar situation as myself. I served four years as an combat engineer, was promoted to corporal after three years and got out a year and a half ago at the end of my four year contract. After I got out, all the documents I received dealing with my final claims and supplementary reserve started referring to me as a private trained. I figure it must be related to me not having done my fives (there was a backlog and I was off in the field a good chunk of the time anyways). I'm just wondering if I am getting demoted on a technicality when I go back, or if I have a chance to keep my old rank?
> 
> I still have a copies of all my paperwork and can prove when I was promoted and the amount of time in rank. No matter what happens, I wont let it deter to me, even if I have to start as a sapper again. But it would be preferable to keep my rank.
> So I was just wondering if anyone has dealt with this, or seem it happen to someone they knew and how it turned out in the end?
> Much obliged for the information.



Even though you were released as a Pte(T), you will most likely be re-enrolled as a "Cpl (AL/Q)".


----------



## Colta

Hello! Question for any of you that VR'd and re-applied. I'm aware that there will need to be a re-enrollment waiver approved for me to be able to re-join following my VR last year. I'm going for my medical and interview in a few weeks and I'm just trying to get an idea of how the process may have gone for any of you that also needed a re-enrollment waiver? Just trying to prepare whatever I need to prepare and make sure I have all my ducks in a row. 
So if anyone would care to share that part of the process with me, that'd be awesome.


----------



## marinemech

I am planning on re enrolling in a few months after having a rough go the first time having to get multiple surgeries on my ACL, hamstring. Having to deal with multiple deaths in the fall/winter. I finally got the green light from the doctor that all is good, he had me do the "stair test 10 floors down and 10 up and along with a 5 k run/bike on a machine, and i am planning on restating a vigorous gym regime soon (likely 4 times a week for 90-120 mins each). I know i have to wait the 12 months from signing my VR, what should i be expecting in terms of medical stuff as some happened in Quebec under the CF and all the followup stuff happened in NB outside of CF control. I know all or most of my tests will be needing to be redone. I am looking to reroll in my old trade as a MarEng 00367. Would i be better to roll in a a Reservist and CT over to Reg in a few years (likely 18-24 months)

Thanks for your help and thoughts

Hatf 254 Out


----------



## DAA

marinemech said:
			
		

> I am planning on re enrolling in a few months after having a rough go the first time having to get multiple surgeries on my ACL, hamstring. Having to deal with multiple deaths in the fall/winter. I finally got the green light from the doctor that all is good, he had me do the "stair test 10 floors down and 10 up and along with a 5 k run/bike on a machine, and i am planning on restating a vigorous gym regime soon (likely 4 times a week for 90-120 mins each). I know i have to wait the 12 months from signing my VR, what should i be expecting in terms of medical stuff as some happened in Quebec under the CF and all the followup stuff happened in NB outside of CF control. I know all or most of my tests will be needing to be redone. I am looking to reroll in my old trade as a MarEng 00367. Would i be better to roll in a a Reservist and CT over to Reg in a few years (likely 18-24 months)
> 
> Thanks for your help and thoughts
> 
> Hatf 254 Out



Same medical as before and they will request your previous CF Med File.  You will also be subject to the re-enrolment waiver process as well.


----------



## FortYorkRifleman

DAA said:
			
		

> Same medical as before and they will request your previous CF Med File.  You will also be subject to the re-enrolment waiver process as well.



For those of us re-enrolling are we low priority, regardless of how well we've done on the CFAT, TSD etc?


----------



## Colta

FortYorkRifleman said:
			
		

> For those of us re-enrolling are we low priority, regardless of how well we've done on the CFAT, TSD etc?



So far I haven't noticed any extra time or lag on my file... I had to wait a little bit (3 weeks or so) for them to request and receive my old med files and I was emailed and given a date/time for my interview and medical 2 weeks after that. I'll be waiting 3 weeks for the interview and medical, but I figure it's just because they've kind of slowed down with recruiting for the moment. But yeah, otherwise it's been fairly quick. I'm hoping that trend continues and the background check and re-enrollment waiver don't take too long and I'll manage to get into a BMQ before the end of the summer.


----------



## FortYorkRifleman

Colta said:
			
		

> So far I haven't noticed any extra time or lag on my file... I had to wait a little bit (3 weeks or so) for them to request and receive my old med files and I was emailed and given a date/time for my interview and medical 2 weeks after that. I'll be waiting 3 weeks for the interview and medical, but I figure it's just because they've kind of slowed down with recruiting for the moment. But yeah, otherwise it's been fairly quick. I'm hoping that trend continues and the background check and re-enrollment waiver don't take too long and I'll manage to get into a BMQ before the end of the summer.



Your case may be different given that your desired trade is in demand whereas mine (infantry) isn't. I think it also depends on whether or not you have completed BMQ and your trade courses. I don't think they're looking to fast track my application


----------



## Colta

FortYorkRifleman said:
			
		

> Your case may be different given that your desired trade is in demand whereas mine (infantry) isn't. I think it also depends on whether or not you have completed BMQ and your trade courses. I don't think they're looking to fast track my application



Fair enough... I didn't complete BMQ or Trade courses, so I don't know how that will effect me (probably not much I would expect)... but it is handy that I'm going for an in demand trade. I had really good scores on my cfat too, so that probably helped a bit. I don't know... I'm hoping it goes quick for both of us. Where are you at in the recruiting stage?


----------



## FortYorkRifleman

Colta said:
			
		

> Fair enough... I didn't complete BMQ or Trade courses, so I don't know how that will effect me (probably not much I would expect)... but it is handy that I'm going for an in demand trade. I had really good scores on my cfat too, so that probably helped a bit. I don't know... I'm hoping it goes quick for both of us. Where are you at in the recruiting stage?



Waiting for a medical and interview. I haven't been asked for a re-enrollment waiver yet but according to an e mail I received the staff at the CFRC will be doing it. I need to go down there to clarify but thats where I'm at


----------



## Colta

I haven't heard much about the waiver from the staff beyond that it would all the questions they had for me regarding it would be discussed during the interview (why I left, what has changed, why I won't leave again). I'm hoping to know more and have a better idea as to what will happen when I get there. I've been told by others that I need to write an essay explaining all of that and that the essay will be attached to my waiver request when the staff at the CFRC send it up for approval... but I don't know. My recruiter was saying otherwise, so we shall see on June 3rd I guess.


----------



## FortYorkRifleman

Colta said:
			
		

> I haven't heard much about the waiver from the staff beyond that it would all the questions they had for me regarding it would be discussed during the interview (why I left, what has changed, why I won't leave again). I'm hoping to know more and have a better idea as to what will happen when I get there. I've been told by others that I need to write an essay explaining all of that and that the essay will be attached to my waiver request when the staff at the CFRC send it up for approval... but I don't know. My recruiter was saying otherwise, so we shall see on June 3rd I guess.



I'm assuming the re enrollment waiver will be part of your application package although its strange if thats the case; you'd think they would want a waiver first before even touching your file. Like I said I need to head down to my local CFRC and clarify


----------



## Colta

FortYorkRifleman said:
			
		

> I'm assuming the re enrollment waiver will be part of your application package although its strange if thats the case; you'd think they would want a waiver first before even touching your file. Like I said I need to head down to my local CFRC and clarify



Not sure... from what I've been told it's something they do after your interview and medical and can be dependant on your cfrc staff as to when and how quickly they process it. Hopefully when you go to your cfrc you'll get some more info. I'm hoping at my interview things will be laid out clearly with regards to how it's going to go.


----------



## JohnBent

http://www.airforce.forces.gc.ca/en/re-enrollment.page?

Folks, if you are a skilled applicant trying to re-enroll back into the service (RCAF Managed Occupation) or currently going through the recruiting process as a skilled applicant into the RCAF, give me a call (the toll free number is on our web page) or fire me an email through the web page and I will be happy to answer your questions or offer guidance or simply point you in the right direction.

The link above is our web page.

Cheers


----------



## holieee

Hello,

I released in feb from dent tech and am currently waiting the 6 month time frame to reapply (I am a 4C release category). 
I'm going to reapply but under a different MOSID and was wondering if anyone could give any insight on the application process and what would happen to me should I be given an offer as I am already BMQ/5's qualified in my current trade. I'd like to reapply as RMS clerk, but not sure if I would be sent to borden on PAT platoon or be put on OJT/BTL in my current geographical location until course time.

Would it be better/easier to re-enlist as my current MOSID and remuster to clerk after a year?

Thank you.


----------



## RocketRichard

Greetings:

I've done a search on this site and can not find current answers to my query.  I've talked to my file manager and they are waiting for my prior service docs before they schedule a medical and my final interview.  Any ideas on the wait time for this at present?  Thanks in advance.


----------



## RocketRichard

Got it. I will hurry up and wait, just like old times.   Thanks mm.


----------



## Master Corporal Steven

Good day  RocketRichard,

Ensure that you read information provided at the top of this form before posting a question to be answered. I have copied and paste two of the locked posts containing the rules for posting in this form and what you need to do after submitting your application. Your question is being moved to the recruiting process board.  

 Welcome to the “Ask a CAF Recruiter” section. The members tagged as “CAF Recruiter” are official Canadian Armed Forces recruiters. They will identify themselves with their rank, first name and the Forces.ca avatar. In order to best answer questions, there are some rules that need to be adhered to.

This section is for persons who have questions about joining the Canadian Armed Forces, occupations, different enrolment programs, and prerequisites. Much of the information can be found at Forces.ca, or the Recruiting FAQ and wiki section of this site. Before you ask a question, you should be searching the forum or the Forces.ca website for these answers.

We will not answer questions about technical difficulties with the application process, or the website. *We will not answer questions about difficulties contacting your recruiting centre or general inquires with regards to your current application or file.* These questions can be asked here: http://forces.ca/en/page/contactus-73

After submitting your application:

        You should receive an email within 5-7 business days after the submission of your online application, giving you further direction on the next steps to take in the application process. 

   To ensure that you receive correspondence between yourself and Canadian Armed Forces Recruiting the following is recommended: 

•   Adding the email address "@forces.gc.ca" to your Safe Senders list in your email account is recommended, as there have been instances where email communications between Recruiting Detachments and applicants are filtered out and end up in the junk/spam mail folder. 
•   Check your junk/spam email folder in case Forces emails continue to be filtered out.
•   Check up on the status of your application every 30 days with the Recruiting Detachment processing your application.
•   Ensure that you are checking the email account that you provided on your application.
___________________________________________________________________

If you have applied and have not yet received an email within 10 business days of submitting your online application, or if you would like to know the status of your application, it is recommended that you do the following:

•   Visit the link to our Forces site, ( http://www.forces.ca/en/page/contactus-73 ) and submit a status update request for your application. 
•   If you know your application number, include it in the email. 
•   If you do not know your application number, ensure you include your first name, last name, date of birth and the postal code of your home address. This will ensure that the recruiter who receives your email can locate your application and provide you with a status update.


----------



## Colta

I just got word today that my re-enrollment waiver has been approved. It didn't take as long as I thought it would. Feeling very lucky right now.


----------



## formersapper

formersapper said:
			
		

> Quick update. Paperwork is in. If all goes well, I will belong to 44 Field Engineer Squadron. I will most likely parade in North Van and Chilliwack though...
> 
> I have my Force test tomorrow morning - arranged it through contacts at 19 Wing in Comox. Then, at some point, I will go to the recruiting center in Victoria for the aptitude test (they can't find my original results from 1990) and the interview. Should be fun.
> 
> I have asked for a PLAR, and am preparing a detailed resume of my experience since leaving the Army to demonstrate that I have built on, and grown my leadership and planning skills.
> 
> Fingers crossed I get a reasonable offer. Otherwise, I won't be putting a uniform back on. I have thought about it, and while attending 2 and a half months of phase training would be a nice break, I can't leave my business or my family for that long. Too bad - I would really enjoy it!



Sooo - took the CFAT - still smart enough to do the job (Combat Engineer Officer) that I did for 6 years previously - phew!

Interview was a formality - and had to do some medical follow-ups.

Initial review of my medical information resulted in the finding that I wasn't fit for re-enrollment. Older people trying to get into the reserves be warned - the language on any reports from your Dr. needs to be very specific and demonstrate that you fit the medical category - regulations here: http://www.forces.gc.ca/en/about-policies-standards-medical-occupations/cf-medical-category-system.page

I had my Dr. write a letter that quoted the regs and confirmed that I meet the requirements - just waiting for a response.

After that I have two security clearances to get through as I lived in both California and Ireland after getting out, and then we will see what is offered.

For those re-enrolling in the reserves, the authority to make an offer actually resides with the reserve formation commander - I found the regulation at one point but couldn't find it today...


----------



## BobbyCarr57

My name is Robert. I am a resident of Kingston, ON and a recent graduate of the CFLRS Basic Military Qualification Course, for NCMs. My Platoon's ceremony was held on Feb 19th, 2015. Shortly after though, I handed in my VR and was liberated on March 11th, 2015. I was released under item 4C and was told that could not apply for the Reg Forces until; March 11th, 2016. I have come to regret this decision though and wish to return to the Reg Forces. I wanted to see if I could retract my VR and continue my training, but I understand if that is not an option. However, would it be possible to expedite my waiting period, so that I can rejoin sooner? I believe my negative mind set at the time of release, is what lead me to leave in the first place. I do not feel that way now, and I am determined  to make this happen. I will do whatever it takes, within reason, to achieve this goal. This means too much to me to just simply let it pass by. 

As it stands, I will speak to anyone who can help with my situation. I was originally going in as a Artillery Soldier, and I would possibly like to get back in that trade again and continue with my QL3, which was to take place in Gagetown, NB. I have sent countless e-mails to the recruiting centre, CFLRS, Application management and most recently the Ombudsman Office. They suggested I write a letter to the CO of the recruiting centre, explaining my situation. He called me back and gave the same answer as everyone else. I'm finding this time in my life to be very difficult as I feel a bit ashamed of myself for being a burden to the Recruiting Officers and other members a-like. I realize that I only have to wait another 6 months, but then I think about the waiver I have to get, the interviews, the medical and overall waiting period. I've already been through it once and that was hard to tough it out. I know it's wishful thinking to think a miracle could happen, but this is bothering me too much. I could use some advice, if anyone has anything to offer?


----------



## George Wallace

Sorry.  Once you have Released, you can not undo it.  You have been given a timeline that you must follow in order to Reapply, and that is final.


----------



## PanaEng

Gents, need an answer but don't have DWAN until later in the week. 
What is the delta between BMQ and BMOQ?  (what mods, etc.)
Is that delta offered as a distinct course?
Who runs these? Local BSL, Div/region or national?
Would a reservist be able to jump into a reg BMOQ for that portion?

Discuss here or PM me.
Thanks in advance.

Frank


----------



## formersapper

Well - I was successful in convincing the authorities that I am medically fit for service.

I have learned today that my PLAR has started.

Just waiting for the result of that, and clarification around the two security checks I was asked to do.

I will update everyone when I hear more.


----------



## JOHNNYBLACK

Good Evening, 

I am directing this question to the forums here since there are many experienced members and the point of contact for the unit I will be enrolling into is unavailable until mid-noon on Monday, whereas this may act a response more timely. Thank you  for your time in regarding my inquiry; my question is if my prior swearing in ceremony from 29AUG13 would over-ride the newest ceremony at a different unit, different occupation, on what's looking like 08OCT15. The reason I am curious is because I understand that there will be occasions where I will need to remember which date to put for documents such as initial enrollment paperwork, and I wouldn't want to put the wrong one. My new unit will be having a ceremony for me, but because my service number has carried over this whole time I am wondering if this new date (08OCT15) will be what I should go by from now on, or if 29AUG13 is the correct date of original hire? 

I will likely double-check with the clerks for sure measure, but since this is on the tip of my mind right now, I thought I'd try my luck directing it to the forums here where it may be answered with good accuracy. 

Thank you once more for your time, 
Regards
JB


----------



## holieee

I just received my offer to re-enroll and have a few questions;

Since I am coming back as a different trade and element (army dent tech to navy clerk) and getting RSBP. I'm guessing it would be more appropriate to report for duty in civvies than wearing what little kit I have left, ie my army CF's. I thought maybe wearing my 3Bs would be better so I can be in some form of uniform, but the more I think about it, it makes more sense to just wear civvies. What do you fine folks think?

Also, I need to release from the SuppRes before I can re-enroll on my swear-in date (19 Nov), but I wasn't given any direction on this and can't find much about the SuppRES. Help?

Thank you.


----------



## LightFighter

AFAIK, you aren't releasing from the SuppRes, you are transferring from the SuppRes to Reg Force(or PRes). Perhaps just send the SuppRes email account a message saying you will be transferring to the RegForce/PRes on 19 Nov.

Wear civilian dress until told otherwise/get your initial kit issue. Also, are you sure you are going to swear in or perhaps just do some paperwork? I would think the swear in you did when you first joined is still valid.


----------



## holieee

LightFighter said:
			
		

> AFAIK, you aren't releasing from the SuppRes, you are transferring from the SuppRes to Reg Force(or PRes). Perhaps just send the SuppRes email account a message saying you will be transferring to the RegForce/PRes on 19 Nov.
> 
> Wear civilian dress until told otherwise/get your initial kit issue. Also, are you sure you are going to swear in or perhaps just do some paperwork? I would think the swear in you did when you first joined is still valid.



I'm just quoting what the clerk told me. Her words, "I cannot enroll you until you release from the SuppRes and provide me documentation as such"
And yes, second swearing in, she asked if I wanted the oath or affirmation. From what I gathered from reading the forum, that was the case.

I thought as much about the civvies, thank you.


----------



## DAA

holieee said:
			
		

> I'm just quoting what the clerk told me. Her words, "I cannot enroll you until you release from the SuppRes and provide me documentation as such"
> And yes, second swearing in, she asked if I wanted the oath or affirmation. From what I gathered from reading the forum, that was the case.
> 
> I thought as much about the civvies, thank you.



You are NOT being re-enrolled into the Regular Force.  You are actually doing a Component Transfer from the Supp Res to the Regular Force (DAOD 5002-3).  This is all completed by your CFRC and there is nothing for you to do!!!  Nevertheless, you might want to touch base with the Supp Res just to let them know that you have received an Offer of Employment for the Regular Force and provide them with the details.

Supp Res can be reached at 1-866-558-3566   (I think this is a good number to call!)


----------



## holieee

Editted. The CFRC figured it out.
Everything is in their hands.

Go figure.


----------



## Alpha dog

Congrats holiee!  I'm in the process of re-enrolling myself. Just did the personality test and waiting. May I ask, when did you start the process and how long did it take? 

Cheers


----------



## holieee

I applied PRes they day I got notification of my release. So, that was Jan 2015. My file was sent from CFRC Winnipeg to CFRC victoria because they still had it (they retain them for 3 years)... long story short, PRes didn't happen because I was tired of jumping through hoops and not getting anywhere after 5 months and then I decided to re-enroll RegF. My file being in Victoria saved a lot of time and just had to show the CFRC my release papers. All in all, from applying RegF 12 Jun 2015 to getting my offer 23 Oct 2015... a little over 4 months. Record time for me.

Thanks and Good luck!


----------



## krimynal

Hello everyone, been a long time, I was pretty busy sorting everything out...

Finally I decided to weight in the pros and cons of my transfer over to Reg Forces.  Finally my decision was that I would release from the reserve , reapply in the reg forces for the trade that I really want to do.  I was offer a transfer to Transmission before my release but I did feel like it was going to be a bad choice.  So I decided to release this summer ( after my DP2 ) and well I signed all the papers and everything on October 17Th.  

As of now , I am currently waiting for my release to be totally cleared out at my local regiment , to reapply in the reg forces ASAP.

My main question is ... what is the waiting period before I reapply ???

Some people are saying you can reapply as soon as the release is cleared , some say 6 months , some say a year , some say 2 years , etc. etc. etc. 
Every person I've spoke to had a different answer .... I will wait for the time that I need to , and I know it might take a while before I am allowed to join back in .... but if I can reapply next month , I don't want to wait 1 year just because someone told me to ....

If someone has any idea or any input on that , I would REALLY appreciate !!!

Thanks


----------



## runormal

I really don't understand what you are doing or have been doing for the past year. You seem to be doing things without thinking. It probably would of been a good idea to properly _understand _the procedure before releasing... 

In any event on the options my CT broker proposed the option to release if I wanted to transfer into my desired trade because it was closed for the next 5 years for CT/OTs. 

I was told the following

"2.      Release from the primary reserves entirely, then 6 months later, apply to the RegF through a recruiting centre. I don’t normally recommend this option because you’ll have to wait 6 months to even begin the application process, *and there are absolutely no guarantees that you’ll be offered a job*."

The reason you are being told different time frames is because there are different waiting periods associated with the conditions of your release.

However I would wait for an admin expert to confirm what I was told. 

Edit: Grammar


----------



## krimynal

runormal said:
			
		

> I really don't understand what you are doing or have been doing for the past year. You seem to be doing things without thinking. It probably would of been a good idea to properly _understand _the procedure before releasing...
> 
> In any event on the options my CT broker proposed to option to release if I wanted to transfer  into my desired trade because it was closed for the next 5 years for CT/OTs.
> 
> I was told the following
> 
> "2.      Release from the primary reserves entirely, then 6 months later, apply to the RegF through a recruiting centre. I don’t normally recommend this option because you’ll have to wait 6 months to even begin the application process, *and there are absolutely no guarantees that you’ll be offered a job*."
> 
> The reason you are being told different time frames is because there are different waiting periods associated with the conditions of your release.
> 
> However I would wait for an admin expert to confirm what I was told.




When I first applied for my Transfer.

They gave me a 6 to 8 years waiting period ( my broker told me that by email , which I still have in my mailbox ).

She told me to look up for other trades that might be looking at right now , the only other trade that kind of interesting , was transmission.  I then changed my application for Transmission ( back in march / April ) I spent the whole summer with people that were doing their DP1 as transmission while I was doing my DP2 , so I was able to see what really the job was like and I really didn't look forward to it. 

Instead of just selecting a job and hope that in some days I might be able to apply for something else , I decided that if I left the reserve and reapply it would be faster for me.


----------



## runormal

I'm not disputing that, all I'm saying is that in the future you should take the time to make sure you understand the whole process prior to committing. I don't doubt that releasing will be faster so best of luck whenever you get in. Good on you for making sure that you have the right trade. 

Cheers :cheers:


----------



## JohnBent

JohnBent said:
			
		

> Skilled applicants returning to (or wishing to return to the RCAF) in an Air Force managed occupation can contact us through our website.  We work individually with every applicant - if you are not eligible for re-enrolment we will let you know right away.
> 
> Let us try to help you renew your career in the RCAF!
> 
> http://www.airforce.forces.gc.ca/en/re-enrollment.page?



For Info: This link is still good - the RCAF are still hiring skilled folks back into service.  Please contact us through our website.  We will answer questions with fact as quickly as possible.


----------



## DAA

krimynal said:
			
		

> As of now , I am currently waiting for my release to be totally cleared out at my local regiment , to reapply in the reg forces ASAP.
> 
> My main question is ... what is the waiting period before I reapply ???



It depends on two things.   Your Release Item and whether or not you reached OFP (ie; fully trained QL3/DP1) in your Reserve Force occupation.


----------



## krimynal

DAA said:
			
		

> It depends on two things.   Your Release Item and whether or not you reached OFP (ie; fully trained QL3/DP1) in your Reserve Force occupation.



I applied for a Voluntary Release ( I know its one that doesn't block me from reapplying ) 

And I was Fully Trained , DP2 Qualified , was going to get my Coporals right after the summer.


----------



## DAA

krimynal said:
			
		

> I applied for a Voluntary Release ( I know its one that doesn't block me from reapplying )
> 
> And I was Fully Trained , DP2 Qualified , was going to get my Coporals right after the summer.



In which case, you can reapply online, 6 months after your effective date of release.  So you need to stay on top of your Reserve Unit's processing of the release paperwork and ensure it get's done!!!

Good luck!


----------



## JoeDos

So I figured I would bite the bullet, and finally post in this thread. 

I VR'd in February during BMQ(Very stupidly, and have regretted it every day), my final release date was the 26th of February, I feel ashamed that I did especially after all the help I received getting in. But you learn from your mistakes I guess..

Anyways, as soon as I released I knew I made a mistake so instantly sent in my application for the primary reserve unit in my area (Was told I have to be released for 6 months to re-apply for Regular Force), but found out it was actually a year (DAMN), so I continued processing for the Reserves, the background check was sent in April and didn't hear anything until mid July, where I was scheduled for my Medical and Interview for the same day.... I thought fantastic, I can fix my mess up, and very likely make it onto the September BMQ. But unfortunately during my interview the MCC didn't like my previous work experience (and the VR from Regular Force). 

I was told to stay at my current job, and to wait until November to re-open my file.............. As of last week my file was re-opened, and background check was started again. (Hopefully this won't take another 2-3 months), I was told I am to expect another Medical and Interview..... The Medical I understand as it's no longer valid as I did my medical in October of last year, but was told it will just be an updated medical. The Interview, I am not so sure of why I have to do it again as I have kept the MCC updated with the information she had asked, and I cannot seem to get a hold of the MCC or the Sergeant whom is driving my file as to why.

Anyways, I am getting closer to my 1 year release date... So I am trying to decide if I should continue processing for the Reserves, which only has one position left for my chosen trade, or just wait it out until February 26th and change my file from Reserve to Regular.

Also let's say I decide after my background check, medical, and interview I want to change my file to Regular force am I expected to do everything over again? I know I will need a re-enrollment letter.


----------



## runormal

It depends what you want:

 If you want _fairly_ consistent part time work with the potential of unstable contracts/tasking (CLS B's) and random CLS A taskings then join the reserves. 
if you want full time consistent work join the reg-f.

The reserves is great for students, people who have a job that they enjoy but want to something else on the side and seasonal workers (fishermen/construction/farming) because they have something that occupies the bulk of their time. 

While it is an option to transfer from the Res-F to the Reg-F it isn't always a smooth or timely process and it isn't a guarantee.


----------



## JoeDos

It's a toss up for me, I wanted a full time career in which I could experience the full thing. But I also wanted to make sure the trade I was going into was for me (Which was and is still Cook).... My civilian job right now happens to be a Cook, within a restaurant.

But I am still not sure if the military is the right fit for me...... I mean it made me feel like crap leaving, after only getting to week 7. But part of me still wants to make sure I know what I am getting myself into, though I know that if and when I come to the point where I decide Regular Force is best it might be a pain to OT to Regular Force.


----------



## runormal

AlphaBravo said:
			
		

> It's a toss up for me, I wanted a full time career in which I could experience the full thing. But I also wanted to make sure the trade I was going into was for me (Which was and is still Cook).... My civilian job right now happens to be a Cook, within a restaurant.
> 
> But I am still not sure if the military is the right fit for me...... I mean it made me feel like crap leaving, after only getting to week 7. But part of me still wants to make sure I know what I am getting myself into, though I know that if and when I come to the point where I decide Regular Force is best it might be a pain to OT to Regular Force.



You'd be going cook to cook right? A straightforward CT is much less complicated and _should_ take less time.. The reserves is also great for "Getting your feet wet". But if you decide that you love it will likely take some time to transfer (The lengths I've seen for Straight CT's aren't _too _bad: depending on the year and trade it was an between 3 months - 1 year. Once you try to CT-OT it _can _become a very frustrating process. 

Are you going Navy or Army cook? 

If you are going to be an Army cook in the reserves you will have some other things to consider:
A) As a cook are you going to be able to get the time off in the summer to attend your cooks course? I don't know how long it is in the Res-F but the Reg/F course is 18 weeks. 
B) Can you get weekends off to go on exercise with the reserves?
C) Can you get weekends off to do weekend basic (Yes full time basics in the summer are an option, but then see point a?)

If you don't think that this is realistic but still want to try the Forces as cook join up full time. If after you find out you don't like it don't resign your contract. 

If you are going Navy I have no idea how the NAV RES works..

I've enjoyed my times in the reserves and would recommend it to everyone while at the same time I would also say that it isn't for everyone. Like I said earlier if you have something to occupy the bulk of your time then it is a great job. Just make sure you will actually be able to the get time off in order to become qualified. 

Edit:
In any event you have the time, so make sure you use it to find the right job for you. Try to talk to someone who loves their job and someone who hates their job that way you can get both sides of the coin. 

If you want to discuss army reserves in general send me a PM.


----------



## JoeDos

Thanks so much for your reply! Yes I would be going from Cook to Cook, my current job is more than accommodating for time off. I told them I would need some time off if I were enrolled within the reserve unit and they were totally fine with it, my current employer actually said it's a benefit to them as my trades training gets me a red seal in Cooking and they see that as an asset. 

It is a Army Reserve unit. Unfortunately the Naval, and Air Reserve units in my province are not hiring cooks, and as far as I know they won't even in the new Fiscal year. 

I will likely be sending you a PM, as I do have some questions on how the reserves work!


----------



## mariomike

AlphaBravo said:
			
		

> I told them I would need some time off if I were enrolled within the reserve unit and they were totally fine with it.... They actually said it's a benefit to them as my trades training gets me a red seal in culinary and they see that as an asset.



I see you are in B.C.

Not sure if the program in Alberta ( the Ontario link no longer works ) would apply to Reservists, but you may wish to take a look at it,

CF SKilled Trade jobs; Jouneyman Status?
http://army.ca/forums/threads/112669/post-1266217.html#msg1266217
Reply #2

See also, Ontario College of Trades,
Trade Equivalency Assessment (TEA) Application Guide
http://www.collegeoftrades.ca/wp-content/uploads/Trade-Equivalency-Assessment-Application-Guide-March-2015-FINAL.pdf


----------



## BobbyCarr57

Good day,

My name is Robert B. I am a resident of Kingston, ON, and a graduate of the CFL&RS Basic Military Qualification, for NCMs. My BMQ course was from Nov 3rd, 2014 - Feb 19th, 2015. Following my graduation, I was released from the CAF on March 11th, 2015, under item 4C. After returning home though, I had come to regret my decision to leave and ever since, I have been working on finding resources to help me get back in(basically bypassing the 1 year waiting period) that comes from my VR. After speaking with; The Ombudsman Office, The Director General of Military Careers, the Attorney General of Military Affairs, the CO of the CFRG HQ and most recently, the Minister of Defence, my request has been answered to no avail. I have come to accept that I must wait-out the remaining months, but I have learned from my local recruiting centre, that due to the recent aptitude test scoring changes, I no longer qualify for Reg Forces trades. I tried to discuss about going through the Reinstatement process, through the QR&O's, but that did not work out either. Now, am I looking into having my file possibly reviewed, in that I want to see if; based on my original aptitude marks, and how far I am off from certain trade scores(Infantry, Artillery, Armoured being my main goals) if I would be able to get back with my current mark, and experience.I want to get back on a course ASAP! If there are any recruiters who can help me with my situation, or simply give their advice, I would greatly appreciate it. If you would like, I will personally email you, and provide my SN and MPRR, if you need verification of my identity. I thank anyone who takes the time to read this, and I hope to hear back from someone soon. 

Sincerely,

Robert B.


----------



## Warrant Officer Robert

Please see the READ FIRST posting in our Ask a CAF Recruiter forum --->   http://army.ca/forums/threads/115341.0.html   (We will not answer questions about difficulties contacting your recruiting centre or general inquires with regards to your current application or file.)

Topic moved and available for open discussion.


----------



## mariomike

BobbyCarr57 said:
			
		

> I was released from the CAF on March 11th, 2015, under item 4C. After returning home though, I had come to regret my decision to leave



This may help,

Want to get back in - Released under item 4C  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/120252.0

Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.600

Re-enrollment to the CF Questions  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/39585.0/nowap.html

Re enlist after a vr?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/116018.0

VR and getting back In...  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/54711.0

Questions regarding VFS/ re-applying after a "VR" 6 mths ago  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/57812.0/nowap.html

etc...



			
				BobbyCarr57 said:
			
		

> , that due to the recent aptitude test scoring changes, I no longer qualify for Reg Forces trades.



Canadian Forces Aptitude Test (CFAT) FAQ  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/23193.75

etc...


----------



## JoeDos

My one year is up on February 26th, 2016. Lately I have been thinking it would be smarter for me to join Regular Force again. I want to give it some time before I do decide though, and ultimately if I get a job offer for the Reserves before February 26th, I will likely take it, though if not I will just switch my application back over to Regular Force, as from what I see and have heard, the Canadian Forces are still really, really hurting for Cooks...

I was just wondering in terms of a re-enrollment letter which Reg-F requires, what should I be writing? How long should it be? And how specific should it be? 

Also would anyone happen to know if when the Recruiting Centers re-open in January, that it may be possible to switch my file to Reg-F before my one year release is up, because of the need for Cooks? 


Thanks in advance, AlphaBravo.


----------



## marinemech

Well my 1 year waiting period has come and gone, fought though some tech issues and finally sent everything off


----------



## DAHOK987

Hi there folks!

Been a long time since I posted on here. I first applied for the CAF on my 18th Birthday, and went off to CFLRS three days before my 19th birthday. I was unable to pass the beep test, and was sent off to WFT. I spent a month there, and just before returning to platoon, the intense training I was doing agrivated an old injury, which had be then carted off to AWT. I spent just shy of 11 months living at St.Jean Garrison. Anyone else who has spent longer than the required course time knows the frame of mind being there puts you in. Over the course 9 months on AWT, I stupidly had enough swipes to land me in a formal PRB. I sat in front of the board of review (which included of the CO & XO of the Warrior Preperation Company, as well as the CO of my first BMQ platoon). I was told by my staff which informed me of the review, that I didn't have a chance, that my lack of physical fitness and attitude towards training would have me packing for home.

On the day of my review, I went in to plead my case, and against all odds, the recommendation was for my to remain on AWT until I recieved my medical fit in a months time. Two of the 8 swipes were removed from my records, and I was given a second chance. After that, one of my platoon staff made it his personal mission to swipe me out again. One of the swipes I was standing in ranks with the platoon, and everyone was talking. When I saw the staff member approaching, I told them all to the quiet. When he arrived, he got in my face and started cussing me out for talking in ranks, when all I had done was try to quiet the others. I was swiped for that incident. At that point, I knew what he was doing, and a few days after the platoon in general had a few really bad inspections, we were told we were confined to base on Friday night, and not allowed to go to the Mess. Me and my fellow platoon mates stayed on base that night, went to the Subway for supper just for a break from the mess food. Over half the platoon did the same. On Monday morning, I was brought into the office and swiped for disobeying orders, for going to Canex when we were confined to the floor. I had over 20 recruits willing to stand by me and say that it was total bullshit, but I knew if the School's Commanding Officer saw my name on two PRB's in less than a month, no matter the recommendation of the board, I would probably be released with a 5-D. The Platoon CO (whom had been the commander of my first PRB) called me into his office, and told me if I submitted a VR, he would make the second PRB go away, and make it possible for me to return someday.

Sorry about the novel, but I just wanted anyone who answers my question to be have the full story, and be able to give the best advice for me specifically. I know I was being stupid while I was there in getting all those swipes, and I have learned my lessons from that. No mistake at CFLRS is a little mistake, when any mistake shows a lack of commitment. My mind is clear on that, and I know next time, it will not be a problem. I am eligible for re-applying as of February 2016, and am not sure what kind of scrutiny I am going to be dealing with. I've heard that I will need to write an essay as to why I want to return, or why I left in the first place. What kind of process will I be looking at when I return? If anyone here knows what I may be dealing with, please feel free to reply. If there is anyone out there who went through a similar experience, feel free to share your experiences in a PM, or reply below!

Thanks everyone, again, sorry for the novel!


----------



## PuckChaser

I'm going to tell you, right away, to start taking responsibility for your own actions. You were talking in ranks, regardless of the reason. You, alone, are responsible for the swipes you recieved. 9 months on AWT is no excuse. If you can't go 11 months without disobeying lawful commands, you won't last 10 minutes in the real CAF, let alone on operation.

You are extremely lucky the Platoon Comd allowed you to submit a VR and get away with your transgressions, and which gives you a chance to reapply. Don't screw it up this time.


----------



## DAHOK987

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> I'm going to tell you, right away, to start taking responsibility for your own actions. You were talking in ranks, regardless of the reason. You, alone, are responsible for the swipes you recieved. 9 months on AWT is no excuse. If you can't go 11 months without disobeying lawful commands, you won't last 10 minutes in the real CAF, let alone on operation.
> 
> You are extremely lucky the Platoon Comd allowed you to submit a VR and get away with your transgressions, and which gives you a chance to reapply. Don't screw it up this time.



I won't be going back until I am sure I am mature enough to handle the situation. I'm not making the same mistake again


----------



## marinemech

I spent a few months with dahok, and WPC was a shitshow, talking in ranks ran rampant in WPC, some got lucky and not caught, others spoke at the wrong second. Capt. Likely took it easy on him as there were bigger fish to fry ( including a staff member)


----------



## PuckChaser

marinemech said:
			
		

> taking of in ranks ran rampant in WPC



Was that english?


----------



## marinemech

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> Was that english?


Trying to type on a tablet, when autocorrect takes over


----------



## DAHOK987

Thanks for the words, marinemech. But PuckChaser is right. Either way, things are gonna be different. Just hoping someone out there will be able to give me an idea what my recruitment is gonna be like this time round.


----------



## DAA

DAHOK987 said:
			
		

> Just hoping someone out there will be able to give me an idea what my recruitment is gonna be like this time round.



The same as the last time but you will now require a re-enrolment "waiver".  You will have to "prove" that you have over come the reasons for VRing the first time around and they will most likely want a letter from you outlining this.  

Good luck!


----------



## formersapper

And.... PLAR results have come back! I've been granted P Res BMOQ (AIOV) and P Res Basic Engineer Officer (AKXY).

Still need to find out if this means I avoid going to Gagetown for a summer altogether. It would be nice if that is the case.

I will update again when I get more info.


----------



## jee.string

Hi. I just finished my heavy equipment operator DEP (diplome d'etudes profesionnelles) a 9 months long course offered by quebec gov. I know it is an advanced training for CE.

Is my diploma recognized by the forces and is it spec pay?


----------



## jee.string

I served 4 years in reg force less than 5 years ago. If i want to rejoin. Is the process faster?

And is there any type of "reminder" course for drills and all?


----------



## DAA

jee.string said:
			
		

> I served 4 years in reg force less than 5 years ago. If i want to rejoin. Is the process faster?
> 
> And is there any type of "reminder" course for drills and all?



The process will be the same as anyone else who applies.  However, due to your prior service, your processing may take slightly longer as they will need to verify your prior service, initiate a PLAR and recall your PMD's (Prior Medical Documents/Records).


----------



## DAA

jee.string said:
			
		

> Hi. I just finished my heavy equipment operator DEP (diplome d'etudes profesionnelles) a 9 months long course offered by quebec gov. I know it is an advanced training for CE.
> Is my diploma recognized by the forces and is it spec pay?



It will depend on which occupation(s) you are applying for.  If the academic/training qualification can be attributed to the initial occupation training for any of your chosen occupations, they "might" initiate a PLAR to see if any equivalencies could be granted.

Specialist Pay (Spec Pay) is associated with some CF occupations only after you have reached a certain qualification level and the rank of Corporal.

Spec Pay Listing (some occupations listed are no longer in existence)  -  http://www.forces.gc.ca/en/caf-community-pay/specialist-pay-reg-force-ncm-mosids.page


----------



## Towards_the_gap

Yes and no. It is recognised as 'nice to have', and no it does not confer spec pay. In fact were you to join the engineers, you would still most likely be required to attend the Hvy Eqpt Op course in Gagetown, in order to become fully trained on CF equipment and also some military specific tasks and techniques. That being said, you would most likely, if you so desired, be given that opportunity following your posting to a Combat Engineer regiment. 

And it's Cbt Engr, not CE (Construction Engineers)


----------



## jee.string

Ohh okay! Thank you.

When you join as a cbt engr do you choose your posting/unit?


----------



## jee.string

If i join the caf again. I want to go either armoured or combat engineer. In both cases, do i choose my posting / unit? How does it work?


----------



## mrjasonc

jee.string said:
			
		

> Ohh okay! Thank you.
> 
> When you join as a cbt engr do you choose your posting/unit?


Just like any trade you have your 3 preferences and career manager makes the final call based on need. Nov. I graduated the CBT Eng DP1.

By the sounds of this post and your others you have previous service, a colleague of mine just rejoined (trained cbt Eng) and rejoined as CBT Eng and he was sent to previous unit. So not sure if that answers your question?


----------



## McG

Did you get to choose your posting the last time you were in the Reg F?

The Army's needs come first and your wants second.  Where you want to go will be considered, but you may be sent somewhere else.


----------



## Loachman

Merged and moved.

There is much discussion about these matters here already, jee.string. Please take the time to explore older threads on this Site and try the Search Function. This saves others' valuable time repeating earlier answers, saves DS the effort of merging threads of repetitive questions and answers, saves new people the effort of wading through them, and rewards you by providing answers to other questions before you even think of them.


----------



## me689

I was medically released for anxiety and depression that started in 2010. I was released in may 2015. I WANT BACK IN! I'm getting a lot better and have no more problems. What are my chances and what steps do i have to take to get back into the Army?

Thanks!
A.


----------



## PuckChaser

Barely a year out and you're all cured? Good luck, expect a solid no until your civilian doctors sign off a lot of paperwork, even then...


----------



## me689

I've been getting treatment since March 2010, 6 years of treatment.


----------



## PuckChaser

If you had a prognosis of recovery, why are you medically released?


----------



## me689

F***ed if i know. They knew it, the psychiatrist said it, but Ottawa sent me my release date anyways.


----------



## Jarnhamar

Non-medical expert advice; little to no chance.

If I was a heartless bureaucratic type I would look at your file and ask is it worth bringing this released soldier back in, who may very well get sick again and get put in restrictions/require more medical appointments and treatment?


----------



## DAA

me999 said:
			
		

> I was medically released for anxiety and depression that started in 2010. I was released in may 2015. I WANT BACK IN! I'm getting a lot better and have no more problems. What are my chances and what steps do i have to take to get back into the Army?
> 
> Thanks!
> A.



Your first step, is to re-apply online ( http://www.forces.ca/en/page/applynow-100 ).  After that, you'll be provided with information on how to proceed.

There used to be some pretty tight restrictions on re-enrolling someone who was released 3.b. but I think they let up just a wee bit a couple of years ago.  I believe that the requirement today, is to be able to "prove" that the circumstance(s) that gave rise to a 3.b. medical release in the first place, is no longer present and is unlikely to reoccur as a result of future service in the CF.

Good luck!


----------



## Greenarrow09

Hello,

I am currently doing the military basic qualification on a basis of 2-3 weekends per month for 4 months. I am halfway done but I have a hard time keeping up with work and training.  I would like to know if I could quit without making a bad name of mine and re-enrolled at a better time. I know it doesnt looks good for making a good name but I just want to know what my options are. 

Please let me know what you think in english or french

Thank you


----------



## DAA

Greenarrow09 said:
			
		

> Hello,
> I am currently doing the military basic qualification on a basis of 2-3 weekends per month for 4 months. I am halfway done but I have a hard time keeping up with work and training.  I would like to know if I could quit without making a bad name of mine and re-enrolled at a better time. I know it doesnt looks good for making a good name but I just want to know what my options are.
> Please let me know what you think in english or french
> Thank you



Completion of BMQ and the subsequent occupation training later on will require the "biggest" of time commitments on your part.  This will never change, so whether you quit or not, you could still very well find yourself right back in this position should you join again at a later date.

If you choose to quit, you will need to let your training staff know and you merely need to give them the reason(s) for doing so.  It shouldn't create any issues if you feel you are in a better position to join at a later date.


----------



## krimynal

Greenarrow09 said:
			
		

> Hello,
> 
> I am currently doing the military basic qualification on a basis of 2-3 weekends per month for 4 months. I am halfway done but I have a hard time keeping up with work and training.  I would like to know if I could quit without making a bad name of mine and re-enrolled at a better time. I know it doesnt looks good for making a good name but I just want to know what my options are.
> 
> Please let me know what you think in english or french
> 
> Thank you



It might be a big commitment.  But you are already half way throught it .... most of the sucky boring things are about done.  Now you actually going to start the nice things.  
If you think you are better by leaving and re-applying later on it's your call , but keep in mind that this is basically the same thing all over again.  You might end up in the same situation all over again
Might as well try to go with it and see.  Sometimes we expect too much , we see it to big.  Take it a day at a time and it will go way easier and smoother


----------



## JSingh04

Hello there,

I want to re-enroll in the military. I applied a while ago and just got my TSD personality test booked for next month. I`m wondering how long the whole process can take. I tried calling CFRC but was unable to reach. I`m working a full-time job so it`s a little hard for me to make the trip personally. Hopefully someone here can guide.


Thanks.


----------



## secondchance

Nobody can tell you how long the whole YOUR process can take.My personal experience - I applied March,15,2015 .I didn't need to do even TSD. I am merit listed since February, 2016. Somebody has faster, somebody  hasn't.


----------



## krimynal

so many different variables will change the outcome. 

-School results
-Time between the appointments
-if you fail any type of tests
-if the trade you decided is open
-if the results of your CFAT are competitive
-etc. etc. etc.

All of this will make DRASTIC changes on the timeframe it can take.  Some may take 6 months , some 1 year , some 2 years .... it depends on A LOT of things !


----------



## Nudibranch

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> If you had a prognosis of recovery, why are you medically released?



Ex-mbr is currently "getting a lot better" after 6 yrs of treatment. And recurrence or treatment resistance is properly seen as higher risk (not sure if mbr here had 6 yrs of treatment non-stop, or 6 yrs total for a recurring issue).
Thankfully the system does have a level of awareness of the insta-cures some mbr undergo after yrs of issues as soon as a release message makes an appearance.


----------



## mariomike

From the Original Poster,



			
				me999 said:
			
		

> I WANT BACK IN!



For future reference, perhaps this discussion will be merged with,

Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.475
25 pages.


----------



## RocketRichard

Almost the year long point to start of  re enrolment here. Standing by...


----------



## medicineman

Nudibranch said:
			
		

> Thankfully the system does have a level of awareness of the insta-cures some mbr undergo after yrs of issues as soon as a release message makes an appearance.



...and deployments, and cool courses, and hockey tournaments, and, and, and.

Not that I've seen much of that in the past.

MM


----------



## Colta

I just got an offer last week. It took me just over a year to get back in. Everyone's time lines are different and there are different issues people run into. 
You have to be patient and let things happen as they happen.


----------



## RocketRichard

Colta said:
			
		

> I just got an offer last week. It took me just over a year to get back in. Everyone's time lines are different and there are different issues people run into.
> You have to be patient and let things happen as they happen.



Roger that. Had lots of practice doing the hurry up and wait thing. Glad to hear you got your offer Colta.


----------



## dfm112286

Hey everyone, I was in basic training did about 2 months then Vr'd(about 3 years ago) due to family problems, everything is good now but i want back in, i called the recruiting office and they said i would have to go through the reserves and get in that way for reg force. The reason why was because back then my test score was a pass and now from what they told me is that the score changes every year and the passing mark i had wont be considered to get back into the reg forces.. is there any way around this?  thanks.


----------



## RedcapCrusader

dfm112286 said:
			
		

> Hey everyone, I was in basic training did about 2 months then Vr'd(about 3 years ago) due to family problems, everything is good now but i want back in, i called the recruiting office and they said i would have to go through the reserves and get in that way for reg force. The reason why was because back then my test score was a pass and now from what they told me is that the score changes every year and the passing mark i had wont be considered to get back into the reg forces.. is there any way around this?  thanks.



That is wrong, you do NOT have enrol in the Reserves in order to get back in. If your goal is Regular Force, you apply to the Regular Force.

You can rewrite the CFAT. However, should you score lower, they will not honour your previous score.


----------



## dfm112286

Hi. Just need some info I wrote the test for the 3rd time and got in. Went to bmq but had to vr due to family issues. It's been about 3 years now and I'm ready to go back but when I talked to a recruiter they said since my test scores from before did not meet the passing mark as the scores changes every year I would have to go into a reserve unit and go on from there. I don't want to do a reserve unit I want to do reg. Is it possible to rewrite the test? Since I wrote the test the 3rd time? Or am I done for. Thanks


----------



## mariomike

LunchMeat said:
			
		

> You can rewrite the CFAT.



Sounds like dfm112286 has already done it three times,



			
				dfm112286 said:
			
		

> Is it possible to rewrite the test? Since I wrote the test the 3rd time?


----------



## DAA

http://army.ca/forums/threads/122478.0.html

Didn't you already ask this question?


----------



## Loachman

And I just merged that post into this thread.


----------



## formersapper

And I'm in! Was re-enrolled last Thursday at 6 Engineer Squadron in North Van. I'm a Captain again also, and managed to pick up all my gear at 19 Wing Comox this week.

I don't have a real position yet - I'm in RHQ and part of the Ops Cell. I totally get that the Regiment needs to check me out before they give me real work.

I have to say I am super stoked to be back in. Went through all my gear and labelled it last night. Dug out all of my old "extras" that make Army life better. First ex at the end of April.

CHIMO!


----------



## mariomike

Saw this in Ask a CAF Recruiter. Adding it here for future reference,

Left the CF & comming back 


			
				CBT-TRACKER said:
			
		

> Hey I left the CF in NOV i am in the New Zealand Army at the moment. I hope to re-enlist into the CF when I come back.



See also, 

The "Wanting To Join Another Military" Thread- Them To Us- Us To Them  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/18494.400.html
17 pages.



			
				CBT-TRACKER said:
			
		

> Am I able to begin the process online before i come back to Canada?



Applying from Overseas (Officer, NCM - merged)
https://army.ca/forums/threads/86619.100
5 pages.

Applying from Abroad  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/114771.0/nowap.html

etc...

( There are a lot of applying from outside Canada discussions. )


----------



## Loachman

And the last has been merged with the second.


----------



## JJ09

Hi I was just wondering if anyone could help me out with a few questions I have. I was going Reg force for infantry and completed my BMQ but ended up having to release due to issues at home. I was wondering if anyone knew how long i'd have to wait to reapply? and what are the odds of me getting back in? and how long that'd take? Also would there be any way to help get back in? 

Thanks.


----------



## mariomike

JJ09 said:
			
		

> I was going Reg force for infantry and completed my BMQ but ended up having to release due to issues at home. I was wondering if anyone knew how long i'd have to wait to reapply? and what are the odds of me getting back in? and how long that'd take? Also would there be any way to help get back in?



Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.625
26 pages.

See also,

Release and Reapply  


			
				JJ09 said:
			
		

> Hi i was just wondering if I'd be able to get help with a few questions I have. I was going Reg force for infantry but after completion of BMQ I had to release (4c) due to issues at home. I was wondering how long I'll have to wait to reapply for reg force? and the odds of me being able to get back in? Also what could I do to help myself get back in quicker?
> 
> Thanks


----------



## Loachman

Welcome to Army.ca, JJ09.

One of the Site Rules - you did read those when you registered, right? - is that one may pose one's question in one place only; multiple posts is considered to be spam. I have therefore removed your post in the "Ask a CAF Recruiter" forum.

We also expect people to do some basic research on this Site before blasting away with questions (frequently within seconds of registering), which have most likely been asked multiple times before.

I will be merging this thread with the one at mariomike's generously-provided link shortly. Once you have worked your way through all 26 pages, you should have learned two things: all of the answers to your questions, and why we are so strict about people reading what is already here. If mariomike can find this information, you can too.

Thanks, and happy reading...


----------



## Ryan_T

I was in the CAF 2012-13. I let go to do an irregular enrollment. I re-applied in 2014 and was brutally honest about my insomnia.I had seen a specialist who even told them that my insomnia was do to stress from a lack of work locally. The illness has long gone now. I am just curious to know if anyone has ever appealed the CMO and how long did it take before they granted enrollment.


----------



## mariomike

Ryan_T said:
			
		

> I am just curious to know if anyone has ever appealed the CMO and how long did it take before they granted enrollment.



Some have,

Appealing a medical evaluation for re-enrollment  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/111804.0

Challenging a medical decision/Requesting second review  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/37404.0
2 pages.

appealing medical rejection 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/119953.0

Failed to meet Medical Standards.
http://army.ca/forums/threads/110159.0
3 pages.
"As I said, all you can do is appeal.  We can't (and won't) answer medical questions here."

Medical appeal  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/68680.0

etc...


----------



## Foxtrot330

Hi there, I released from the RES force in 2012 (30th Fld Ottawa), under class 4C. I was sworn-in June of 2009 but did not reach full operational status.

I have begun the hiring process and have sent in an online application as I wish to re-enlist but this time with the REG force (primary-Combat Eng, secondary-Infantry).

I was surprised when I received a call last week informing me that I cannot obtain a CFAT by-pass because when I went down to CFRC Ottawa I was told that since Combat Eng falls under the same qualifications as my prior Trade in artillery that I will not have to re-do the CFAT.

Now I'm confused as to what is going on and After calling CFRC Ottawa I was advised that they have received my prior MED docs and now waiting for a CFAT Waiver.

Why is that? I do not mind re-writing the CFAT, I'm just curious how long a waiver will take because after reading this forum I was under the impression that first re test waivers are automatic, what exactly is the long wait for? I applied April 1st 2016 and have not heard back regarding a re-write since and I'm worried that perhaps I'm supposed too seek a waiver independently? I'm a little confused.

Thanks all for your input.


----------



## mariomike

Foxtrot330 said:
			
		

> I was surprised when I received a call last week informing me that I cannot obtain a CFAT by-pass because when I went down to CFRC Ottawa I was told that since Combat Eng falls under the same qualifications as my prior Trade in artillery that I will not have to re-do the CFAT.
> 
> Now I'm confused as to what is going on and After calling CFRC Ottawa I was advised that they have received my prior MED docs and now waiting for a CFAT Waiver.
> 
> Why is that? I do not mind re-writing the CFAT, I'm just curious how long a waiver will take because after reading this forum I was under the impression that first re test waivers are automatic, what exactly is the long wait for? I applied April 1st 2016 and have not heard back regarding a re-write since and I'm worried that perhaps I'm supposed too seek a waiver independently?



CFAT waiver?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/118342.0

? waiver on the CFAT? 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/30901.0

Waivers and the CFAT  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/28030.0

Anyone have experience or knowledge surrounding CFAT waivers?
http://army.ca/forums/threads/114203.0

etc...

See also,

Canadian Forces Aptitude Test (CFAT) FAQ  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/23193.800.html
33 pages.


----------



## Foxtrot330

Thank you, I have already checked on those links in the last few weeks but none seem to answer my question as I have not failed the CFAT I completed it and continued on with my military career for 3 years, also tried to investigate as to the process of a waiver I'm wondering if it is automatic or if I have to do anything to receive one or what exactly is the wait pertaining too in order to receive a waiver, i did not fail it so I'm wondering what and why I am waiting on one if the trade I am going for has the same standards as my previous trade.

Thank you, sir.


----------



## mariomike

Foxtrot330 said:
			
		

> Thank you, sir.



You are welcome. Good luck.  

Just call me Mike.


----------



## Andraste

Foxtrot330 said:
			
		

> Thank you, I have already checked on those links in the last few weeks but none seem to answer my question as I have not failed the CFAT I completed it and continued on with my military career for 3 years, also tried to investigate as to the process of a waiver I'm wondering if it is automatic or if I have to do anything to receive one or what exactly is the wait pertaining too in order to receive a waiver, i did not fail it so I'm wondering what and why I am waiting on one if the trade I am going for has the same standards as my previous trade.
> 
> Thank you, sir.



Good morning.  The requirement to write the CFAT upon enrollment can vary depending on the circumstances.  It is likely since the time you originally wrote in 2009 the cut score for your chosen MOSIDs has changed . . . it does happen from time to time but not yearly.  I suspect that is the reason for you have to write again as you must meet the current entry standards regardless of past test results.

WRT waiver process the first level rewrite is not automatic in the true sense of the word but must be authorized by the UPSO at the CFRC.  However in your case I suspect because they are awaiting medical documents and other admin documents they are holding until that review is done before scheduling you for a rewrite.

I note that you last wrote in 2008 . . . so, unless you have been using grade 10 level math (or higher) for past while you might want to brush up on those concepts before you write the CFAT.  It is likely the CFRC is going to ask you what you have done to prepare for the CFAT as a matter of procedure. You only get three kicks at the can when it comes to the CFAT so it is important you go in prepared and nail it this time around as that will be time 2.  This leaves you one more potential rewrite should you wish to apply for an in-service selection program once in the Regular Force or commissioning.  

Good luck

Andraste


----------



## DAA

Foxtrot330 said:
			
		

> Thank you, I have already checked on those links in the last few weeks but none seem to answer my question as I have not failed the CFAT I completed it and continued on with my military career for 3 years, also tried to investigate as to the process of a waiver I'm wondering if it is automatic or if I have to do anything to receive one or what exactly is the wait pertaining too in order to receive a waiver, i did not fail it so I'm wondering what and why I am waiting on one if the trade I am going for has the same standards as my previous trade.
> 
> Thank you, sir.



No, the request for a CFAT Waiver is NOT automatic as there are a couple of hoops to jump through first.  I'd suggest that you make contact with your local CFRC to determine just what the status of your application is.   It shouldn't take this long!


----------



## Foxtrot330

Andraste said:
			
		

> Good morning.  The requirement to write the CFAT upon enrollment can vary depending on the circumstances.  It is likely since the time you originally wrote in 2009 the cut score for your chosen MOSIDs has changed . . . it does happen from time to time but not yearly.  I suspect that is the reason for you have to write again as you must meet the current entry standards regardless of past test results.
> 
> WRT waiver process the first level rewrite is not automatic in the true sense of the word but must be authorized by the UPSO at the CFRC.  However in your case I suspect because they are awaiting medical documents and other admin documents they are holding until that review is done before scheduling you for a rewrite.
> 
> I note that you last wrote in 2008 . . . so, unless you have been using grade 10 level math (or higher) for past while you might want to brush up on those concepts before you write the CFAT.  It is likely the CFRC is going to ask you what you have done to prepare for the CFAT as a matter of procedure. You only get three kicks at the can when it comes to the CFAT so it is important you go in prepared and nail it this time around as that will be time 2.  This leaves you one more potential rewrite should you wish to apply for an in-service selection program once in the Regular Force or commissioning.
> 
> Good luck
> 
> Andraste



Thank you very much, I have been practising and brushing up on grade 10 academic math. Thank you for your insight and clarification I will heed your advice and await further instruction from CFRC Ottawa.

Regards.

M


----------



## Andraste

Bear in mind, there is nothing wrong with contacting the CFRC just to get a status on your application.

Good luck

Andraste


----------



## Loachman

mariomike said:
			
		

> CFAT waiver?
> https://army.ca/forums/threads/118342.0
> 
> ? waiver on the CFAT?
> http://army.ca/forums/threads/30901.0
> 
> Waivers and the CFAT
> http://army.ca/forums/threads/28030.0
> 
> Anyone have experience or knowledge surrounding CFAT waivers?
> http://army.ca/forums/threads/114203.0



These have now been merged into CFAT Waiver https://army.ca/forums/threads/28030.0.html.


----------



## CanadianJackass

Hey Everyone.
This is my first post, sorry in advance.

Im doing some initial recce on this site. I'll write a quick intro to myself followed by some questions recruiters are to busy for.

I am Reenlisting after 3 years of VRing from week 11 of BMQ at age 18. Release status: 4C. I enlisted right out of my private catholic highschool, Needless to say I wasn't worldly at the time. Time has passed and I've spent some time in the real world gaining varied life experience.

That being said, Ive never been happier or prouder then when I think back to having that flag on my left arm. Im already in the system and just wrote my TSD test (the new one) and am awaiting response from recruitment HMFIC. I have a few questions for some of you veteran members, They are as follows:

1: Should I have any trouble being selected? 

2: If I'm selected and I going to get lit the f*** up for quiting before?  


3: Can I wear my cornflake/tags when I go back to CFLRS if I'm selected?

4: I'd love to hear from a Bosn about everything to be expected and learnt after BMQ.

5: I'd love to know about extra courses I could take Ex: TCCC etc. (Yes I wanna be a boyscout)

Thanks for any constructive advice.
-Jordan


----------



## mariomike

CanadianJackass said:
			
		

> I am Reenlisting after 3 years of VRing from week 11 of BMQ



Congratulations, you may find these discussions of interest,

Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.650
27 pages.



			
				CanadianJackass said:
			
		

> I'd love to hear from a Bosn



Boatswain 
https://www.google.ca/search?q=site%3Aarmy.ca++boatswain&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&gfe_rd=cr&ei=NyNBV4qTKsqC8QeQhZboBg&gws_rd=ssl

( BOSN )
https://www.google.ca/search?q=site%3Aarmy.ca++boatswain&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&gfe_rd=cr&ei=NyNBV4qTKsqC8QeQhZboBg&gws_rd=ssl#q=site:army.ca++BOSN

Bosun
https://www.google.ca/search?q=site%3Aarmy.ca++bosun&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&gfe_rd=cr&ei=i59BV6vQFMuC8QffipbADQ&gws_rd=ssl



			
				CanadianJackass said:
			
		

> I'd love to know about extra courses I could take Ex: TCCC etc.



TCCC
https://www.google.ca/search?q=site%3Aarmy.ca++boatswain&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&gfe_rd=cr&ei=NyNBV4qTKsqC8QeQhZboBg&gws_rd=ssl#q=site:army.ca++TCCC



			
				CanadianJackass said:
			
		

> Should I have any trouble being selected?



Re enlist after a vr? 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/116018.0

VR'd, want back in, chances? 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/84438.0/nowap.html

re-applying after a "VR" 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/57812.0/nowap.html

VR and getting back In
https://army.ca/forums/threads/54711.0

VR/Get back in for OT? 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/79305.0

back from VR 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/120664.0

etc...

_As always_,  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.


----------



## Dan99

Just a little background about myself, I started off in the Reg force in 2009 in the army, finished my 3 year contract, transferred in the reserves and got out of the forces in 2015 at the rank of a Cpl. I decided to go back in the cf in the airforce, got my employment offer but they offered me the rank of pte basic with a pte trained pay. Ive been out for 1 year. I thought that when you get out and get back in within 5 years you get to keep your last rank and pay. If this is true what should I tell the recruitment centre to reconsider my employment offer? 

Thank you


----------



## Pusser

If you are selected for re-enrollment, then my advice to you is to go through BMQ saying as little as possible about your previous experience.  You won't make any friends saying you've done all this before, but you may get a few awkward questions about why you quit the first time.  BMQ is not the place to attract attention to yourself.  Now, don't lie about your past (your instructors will know anyway), but don't make a big deal about it.  The best you thing you can do is help your mates by GUIDING (do not lecture, nor do it for them) with things like polishing boots, ironing and preparing for inspections.  Subtly helping others is the best thing for everybody and will be noticed (in a good way).  Forget wearing the cap badge - I would wait until they're issued to everyone.  It would be different if you were occupation qualified, but that's not the case here.


----------



## mariomike

Dan99 said:
			
		

> I decided to go back in the cf...



For reference, perhaps "Re-enlistment" will be merged with "Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread".
http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.650
27 pages.

Also asked and answered in, Ask a CAF Recruiter,

Re-enlistment into the CF  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/123110/post-1436443/topicseen.html#new
Dan99: "I decided to go back in the cf..."


----------



## mariomike

For reference, perhaps "Reenlisting as Bosn" will be merged with "Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread".  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.650
27 pages.


----------



## mariomike

Adding a few "getting back in" discussions not yet merged into these 27 pages for reference,

Re-enlistment  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/123111/post-1436447/topicseen.html#new
OP: "I decided to go back in the cf..."

Same OP as above:
Re-enlistment into the CF  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/123110/post-1436443/topicseen.html#new
OP: "I decided to go back in the cf..."

Reenlisting as Bosn  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/123101/post-1436448/topicseen.html#new
OP: "I am Reenlisting after 3 years of VRing..."

Released Canadian Forces member looking to rejoin?  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/116586.0
OP: "Awhile back I got a release for continuing education but interested in rejoining..." 

Reenlistment  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/64663.0
OP: "I am a VR got another month till im out but I am going to join back up in the desired trade."

Re-enlistment Questions  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/113796.0
OP: "I have been out of the Canadian Forces Reserves for about 2 years and am thinking about re-enlisting,"

Re-entry in the Forces  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/69215.0/nowap.html

Question about Release and Reenrollment  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/100377.0

released f5, possible reinlist? 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/115855.0

Maximum reinlisment age  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/98499.0

Medical Release, but want back in  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/122332.0

Want to get back in
http://army.ca/forums/threads/120252.0

looking to get back in
https://army.ca/forums/threads/121507.0

VR'd from regular forces now I want back in 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/118634.0

Getting Back In? How soon?
http://army.ca/forums/threads/104993.0

Getting back in help  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/104861.0

Trying to get back in 15 years later. 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/87938.75
4 pages.

I want to get back in 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/33877.0

etc...


----------



## Loachman

All merged, except for the one in the "Ask a CAF Recruiter" sub-forum. I'll bring that one in once it's run its course.

Eventually, maybe we'll get this whole Site down to just one humungous mega-thread.


----------



## PMedMoe

Loachman said:
			
		

> Eventually, maybe we'll get this whole Site down to just one humungous mega-thread.



Precisely what I thought....  ;D


----------



## krimynal

Hey just wondering. 

I did my interview yesterday and it all went great.  We spoke about getting an offer to join back and what would my salary be ( Captain didn't know if I was going to be paid as a Soldier 1 or 2 or Corporal ) 

We spoke about what the next steps would be.  

He told me , I should get an offer anytime soon , and the offer would be telling me when I would need to show up to Borden.  He told me that my first day back would be probably the first day of some course.  Or like 1 week prior to the start of a course. 

So basically they could send me an offer in 3 weeks , to be there in 4 months ( because he said they will not put me on PAT Platoon and wait )

My question is : When i sign the offer , when do I start to be paid and considered a member ?  Let's say I receive and offer in 3 weeks.  I sign it and I am happy and everything is perfect, but the offer says I need to be in Borden only in January.  Do I need to keep my civilian job until January because the army don't want to send me on PAT ? how does that work ?


----------



## George Wallace

krimynal said:
			
		

> My question is : When i sign the offer , when do I start to be paid and considered a member ?  Let's say I receive and offer in 3 weeks.  I sign it and I am happy and everything is perfect, but the offer says I need to be in Borden only in January.  Do I need to keep my civilian job until January because the army don't want to send me on PAT ? how does that work ?



All that information will be on the message that is your "Offer".  Until you get that message, no one will know what the answer will be.


----------



## krimynal

okay thanks


----------



## coreyw709

Currently in the process of re-enlisting and was wondering if there is any preference given from recruiting to return to previous unit. 
Served 2012-2015 as reg force Infantry, in Shilo with 2nd battalion PPCLI. 

Is there any way to apply with the intention of returning to this battalion, or at least the regiment? 
Or is there no option given, and go where you are told after applying?


----------



## Loachman

Welcome to Army.ca, coreyw709

While you are waiting (there is only a very small number of Recruiters and others who can post replies here), have a look at http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.0.html. If you don't find any useful information therein, ask your question there, where a lot more people can reply. We do not normally permit multiple identical posts on this Site, and consider it to be spamming, but I will make an exception.

Take some time to explore the rest of the Site as well. There is a ton of useful information here already.


----------



## coreyw709

Currently in the process of re-enlisting and was wondering if there is any preference given from recruiting to return to previous unit. 
Served 2012-2015 as reg force Infantry, in Shilo with 2nd battalion PPCLI. 

Is there any way to apply with the intention of returning to this battalion, or at least the regiment? 
Or is there no option given, and go where you are told after applying?


----------



## George Wallace

You can ask the Recruiting office.  They should have a copy of your MPPR and it will have your Affiliated Unit on it, so there is a good probability that you can return to it, unless you specify that you want to go elsewhere.  I have seen former members return to their unit many times in the past.  To be safe, this is a question that they will be able to answer for you at the Recruiting Center.


----------



## da1root

Good Day,

As long as you're coming back as the same trade you will be treated as a skilled applicant.  You can request to rejoin your previous unit, and prior to signing a new Terms of Service you will be told where your first posting would be and you can then decided whether you want to resign or not.

Best Regards,
Sgt Laen


----------



## krimynal

hey everyone , 

Do any of you actually have any clue on when the next selection date is for :

ACS Tech 
AVN Tech 
ATIS Tech 

Last email I sent to the person in charge of my file , I got told that , no one knows and it might take A LONG TIME ( she did actually use cap letters ). 

So I was just wondering what "A LONG TIME" meant.

P.S. Like usual I know it all depends on the interview / CFAT / Medical , but all of those were good to go and I was qualified for all trades. I just want to have an average of if there should be a selection this month , next month or ? 

Thanks 

P.S2. I looked up on the forum but it looked like old posts from 2005-2006-2007 .... if there is a new one , please just delete this post and link me towards it ! thanks !


----------



## timed

So I know medical and the interview expire after a year, and the CFAT doesn't, but what about the background check and the reference check?


----------



## George Wallace

timed said:
			
		

> So I know medical and the interview expire after a year, and the CFAT doesn't, but what about the background check and the reference check?



They likely will contact you by email to verify your references and all the info; and what changes that you may need to make can be done by replying via that email.    Redoing all the forms should not be necessary.


----------



## drewlt

Hello,

I am in need of some help. I was at bmq at st Jean in September but due to unforeseen circumstances, I had to VR and return home. I have expressed my interest of re-enrolment as soon as possible and the military career counsellor has informed me that I have to write myself a re-enrolment letter. I am just curious as to what are the requirements and guidelines to writing this letter. Any assistance would be great.

Thank you


----------



## mariomike

drewlt said:
			
		

> I have to write myself a re-enrolment letter. I am just curious as to what are the requirements and guidelines to writing this letter.



Re-enrollment letters are discussed in the Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.875
"I was just wondering in terms of a re-enrollment letter  which Reg-F requires, what should I be writing? How long should it be? And how specific should it be?" 
36 pages.


----------



## Loachman

Welcome to Army.ca, drewlt

There is a ton of information already on this Site about almost everything, as mariomike has kindly shown you.


----------



## Mountaintime

If you VR then re enlist 3 years later do you maintain your pay rate. I left as a Cpl 4 and I'm wonder when I get back in if I'll go back to making the Cpl 4 pay rate or if I'll have to start back at Cpl 1 pay. 

Thanks a lot for any help.


----------



## DAA

Mountaintime said:
			
		

> If you VR then re enlist 3 years later do you maintain your pay rate. I left as a Cpl 4 and I'm wonder when I get back in if I'll go back to making the Cpl 4 pay rate or if I'll have to start back at Cpl 1 pay.
> 
> Thanks a lot for any help.



Usually, the CAF will recognize all prior service time, provided you re-enrol less than 5 years from your date of release.  Less than 3 years out, you usually get everything back (Rank, Pay and Occupation/Non-Occupation/Leadership Quals), 3-5 will be PLAR'd which results in a coin toss and anything more than 5 years post release, will be a hard sell but usually results in "Cpl (B)".


----------



## hannloot

So I want to know all requirements to receive cpl rank. I have 4 years in and got out and getting back in. I should get cpl but was told I'm starting g at p3 pay grade until I finish my ql3's which is ok but I will not be getting back paid which does not make since to me is this a mistake because i have timed served. I will end up being in the training system for 1 1/2 to 2 years how can I stay at p3 for 2 years tell me that's wrong. Anyone have excess to the proper paper work in Dwan to clear this up for me thanks


----------



## mariomike

hannloot said:
			
		

> got out and getting back in.



Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/294.475
36 pages.


----------



## hannloot

Thanks but That tread did not have what I needed.


----------



## mariomike

hannloot said:
			
		

> Thanks but That tread did not have what I needed.



You are welcome. 

But, why not ask your getting back in questions, in the Getting Back In mega-thread?


----------



## Nfld Sapper

hannloot said:
			
		

> So I want to know all requirements to receive cpl rank. I have 4 years in and got out and getting back in. I should get cpl but was told I'm starting g at* p3 pay grade until I finish my ql3's *which is ok but I will not be getting back paid which does not make since to me is this a mistake because i have timed served. I will end up being in the training system for 1 1/2 to 2 years how can I stay at p3 for 2 years tell me that's wrong. Anyone have excess to the proper paper work in Dwan to clear this up for me thanks



Simple you are not qualified in your new trade...each trade has their own requirements to be promoted to Cpl....

For a P.Res Engineer for example you need DP1 complete (so BMQ-C,BMQ-L and trades course this alone could take 2 years or more) and then at a minimum 2 years in the CF....


----------



## hannloot

I understand not get cpl right away but once qualified my pay should be back dated. I have friends that got their  cpl rank after their ql3's on same course and they got back pay just trying to find out why I'm being told different


----------



## George Wallace

hannloot said:
			
		

> I understand not get cpl right away but once qualified my pay should be back dated. I have friends that got their  cpl rank after their ql3's on same course and they got back pay just trying to find out why I'm being told different



Just because your friends did, does not mean that you can.  Your Service Record is not the same as theirs.  Your conditions of re-enrolling are not the same as theirs (if they even re-enrolled).  You have Broken Service.  Do your friends have Broken Service as well?  You have to ask your CoC what the story is, not us.


----------



## Jarnhamar

hannloot said:
			
		

> So I want to know all requirements to receive cpl rank. I have 4 years in and got out and getting back in. I should get cpl but was told I'm starting g at p3 pay grade until I finish my ql3's which is ok but I will not be getting back paid which does not make since to me is this a mistake because i have timed served. I will end up being in the training system for 1 1/2 to 2 years how can I stay at p3 for 2 years tell me that's wrong. Anyone have excess to the proper paper work in Dwan to clear this up for me thanks


I posted regarding a friend who is in the same position except he has almost triple your time in and a couple tours overseas.  Only getting Pte(3). You can ask for it to be reviewed.


----------



## PuckChaser

Can't find a copy of cfao 49-4, but is it not 4 years for accelerated, 5 years for mandatory promotion to Cpl? You're not entitled to promotion to Cpl until that 60 month mark. You haven't said what rank and qual you released at, or how long you've been out. All of those things have huge bearing on the advice you can get here.


----------



## George Wallace

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> Can't find a copy of cfao 49-4, but is it not 4 years for accelerated, 5 years for mandatory promotion to Cpl? You're not entitled to promotion to Cpl until that 60 month mark. You haven't said what rank and qual you released at, or how long you've been out. All of those things have huge bearing on the advice you can get here.



.....and were you a Reservist or Regular Force?


----------



## mariomike

OP's Profile does not offer many clues.
http://milnet.ca/forums/members/101764


----------



## ModlrMike

IRC, it's 48 months service. For substantive promotions, it's also appropriately trade qualified. Accelerated promotion is 36 months and qualified for the rank (you can't be accelerated to acting rank). In all three cases, you require the CO's concurrence. The foregoing applies to the RegF... the ResF is somewhat different.

As someone with broken service, you can ask your career manager for a review of your "Time Credit for Promotion", or TCP. That being said, the normal process for re-enrollment at the rank of Cpl is that you were substantive prior to your release, and your qualifications meet the current trade requirements.

It appears that you are re-enrolling in a different trade, that being the case, you would not meet the requirements for promotion to Cpl as you are trade qualified. Once you are qualified QL3 or QL4, you might be promotable to A/Cpl, but like I said earlier it requires the CO's approval.


----------



## JohnBent

http://www.airforce.forces.gc.ca/en/re-enrollment.page? 

If you are looking to return to reg force service, please follow the link.  I'll be the one to reply directly to you for NCM via phone call or email.

Cheers

The Air Force Intake & Liaison Team (AFI&LT) is working with Canadian Forces Recruiting Group (CFRG) to get the word out that the Air Force is actively seeking ex-military members of the Canadian Forces who were fully trained in an Air Force occupation.

The AFI&LT, which is based in Ottawa, works to identify and staff initiatives aimed at improving the re-enrolment of Air Force personnel into the Canadian Forces (CF). Due to manning shortages, personnel from many Air Force occupations are being sought.

In an effort to reduce waiting times the AFI&LT is working closely with CFRG and the career managers to expedite re-enrolment.

There are many advantages to re-enrolling fully qualified personnel. The Air Force recognizes the qualities of leadership, maturity, and experience that former personnel bring with them. We have found that these personnel can immediately contribute to aerospace capability. Those returning are an indicator to serving personnel that the CF remains an employer of choice.

Persons interested in receiving more information on this initiative are asked to contact the AFI&LT via email or through one of its toll free numbers.

For Re-enrollment

Officers: Please contact the AFI&LT team AFILT-EALFA@forces.gc.ca or 1 866-355-8195

Non Commissioned Members: Please contact the AFI&LT team AFILT-EALFA@forces.gc.ca or 1-877-877-2741

For general information on how to join visit http://www.forces.ca/en/home


----------



## PeteRecruit

Hey folks

Simple question:

I heard that members can re-enlist with the army and pick up where they left off in their training as opposed to dropping back to week one if they re-enlist. I was 2 weekends away from finishing my BMQ-L but had to release in July of 2015. It is 16 December 2016 and I was wondering if anyone knows if that's too much time to have passed (1 yr 5 mo's) for me to be able to re-enlist and pick up where I left off, or if I'd have to go back to week 1 and start everything over.

Thought I'd ask because a family member of mine told me (back in Sept of last year) that just because I'm no longer in the military, it doesn't mean the time I was a member just disappears off into the ether. 

Anyway, yeah I figure that'd be too long but then again I honestly have no idea what the military considers a reasonable amount of time to have passed.

Thanks and have a great weekend.


----------



## Mudshuvel

Your time in may not change, but to my knowledge unless you finish a qual, you'll have to begin at the start. IE: Had you finished BMQ-L then you'll still have kept the qual.


----------



## RedcapCrusader

PeteRecruit said:
			
		

> Hey folks
> 
> Simple question:
> 
> I heard that members can re-enlist with the army and pick up where they left off in their training as opposed to dropping back to week one if they re-enlist. I was 2 weekends away from finishing my BMQ-L but had to release in July of 2015. It is 16 December 2016 and I was wondering if anyone knows if that's too much time to have passed (1 yr 5 mo's) for me to be able to re-enlist and pick up where I left off, or if I'd have to go back to week 1 and start everything over.
> 
> Thought I'd ask because a family member of mine told me (back in Sept of last year) that just because I'm no longer in the military, it doesn't mean the time I was a member just disappears off into the ether.
> 
> Anyway, yeah I figure that'd be too long but then again I honestly have no idea what the military considers a reasonable amount of time to have passed.
> 
> Thanks and have a great weekend.



It depends.

Reservists retain their BMQ and BMQ-L after release, only if they had completed their trade course.


----------



## westcoastrider7

Hello everyone,

I got into the military in 2009 and out in 2012 and recently applied again, my application was selected for further processing and I go in 2 weeks for a personal trait test or something. My question is would they of already looked at my previous military service prior to sending me the email stating my application was selected for further processing or will they look at all of that at a later date?

Thank you 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## mariomike

westcoastrider7 said:
			
		

> I got into the military in 2009 and out in 2012 and recently applied again,



For reference, perhaps,

previous military service

will be merged with,

Getting Back In/Re-enrolling Mega Thread  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/294.875
36 pages.

See also,

OP: westcoastrider7
Reenlisting after being released on a 5f  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/125092/post-1474467.html#msg1474467

As always,  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.


----------



## BrewsKampbell

I'm assuming your question is because of your 5F release, personally I'd call and talk to someone. It's better to find out now then show up, write the TSD only to find out they won't continue to process your file.


----------



## da1root

Good Day,

All 5(f) Releases require a waiver to re-enroll, you must be out of the CAF for 5 years and the approval for the waiver is the CDS.
Your prior service should have been identified, but I would follow up with your recruiting detachment to make sure.

Best Regards


----------



## beardedsawyer

This afternoon I reported to my local CFRC for the (PRes) medical and interview. I was last in the forces in the mid 90's. During the interview I was informed that it would not be necessary to take the BMQ as I had prior service. But that was 20+ years ago. Does anyone know a reason for this? I am quite puzzled.


----------



## George Wallace

beardedsawyer said:
			
		

> This afternoon I reported to my local CFRC for the (PRes) medical and interview. I was last in the forces in the mid 90's. During the interview I was informed that it would not be necessary to take the BMQ as I had prior service. But that was 20+ years ago. Does anyone know a reason for this? I am quite puzzled.



Unless things have changed, I would double check on that.  If things have not changed, even as a PRes, you would have to do BMQ if you were out for more than five years.  Perhaps things have changed; or the Recruiter couldn't do the math.  Double Check, as I have seen people with less than five years break in Service (Reg to PRes), PLQ qualified, land up on a BMQ.


----------



## mariomike

beardedsawyer said:
			
		

> This afternoon I reported to my local CFRC for the (PRes) medical and interview. I was last in the forces in the mid 90's. During the interview I was informed that it would not be necessary to take the BMQ as I had prior service. But that was 20+ years ago. Does anyone know a reason for this?



This is a good place to ask questions about joining the Reserves,

QUESTIONS about JOINING THE RESERVES  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/16735.175

_As always,_  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.


----------



## beardedsawyer

Thank you George Wallace.

I am in the process of contacting the unit for further info. The officer that conducted the interview seemed very certain. The idea related to me was that I already know rank, structure, history, boot shining and such so it would be a waste of time.

Honestly, the idea of reporting to my unit without going through what every other soldier has to endure bothers me greatly. I have been through basic before and absolutely see the need for it. I can't see this as casting me in a positive light. 

Mariomike, I know everyone says 'sorry' when they are corrected as to the erroneous placement of their posts. I missed the proper placement entirely.


----------



## mariomike

beardedsawyer said:
			
		

> Mariomike, I know everyone says 'sorry' when they are corrected as to the erroneous placement of their posts. I missed the proper placement entirely.



Good luck with your application.


----------



## da1root

There's a handy dandy chart that the recruiters follow when answering this question.
There are several cases where BMQ is "good for life" regardless of how long you've spend away from the CAF, basically as long as a member reached OFP chances are BMQ is not going to be required upon re-entry into the CAF.

Side Note: The chart is a CDA Directive that came out in September 2013, anyone who enrolled/CT'ed prior to this didn't get the same provisions...


----------



## jpgbrookes

Hello folks:

I have considered re-enlisting as an EDT after being out for a year and two months. For my previous service, I completed a VIE (6 YR) contract and released in November 2015. When I released, I was a junior-level Naval Weapons Engineering Technician (QL4 - completed DP1 OJT) in my trade, and was also a qualified MCC/DCC watch keeper.

Before I pay a visit to the recruiting office, I would appreciate some feedback on a few things:

1.	Are there any other trades besides EDT that will allow me to earn hours toward a Red Seal Electrician ticket in case I can't get into the EDT trade? I am open to other trades as well as long as I can earn hours toward a civilian ticket of some kind. Below are some other military trades that caught my eye. Are there any civilian trade tickets or certifications that I could earn by doing one of these trades?

a.	Refrigeration and Mechanical Systems Technician
b.	Plumbing and Heating Technician
c.	Aerospace Telecommunication and Information Systems Technician
d.	Electrical Generating Systems Technician
e.	Avionics Systems Technician

2.	I realize that EDT is a purple construction engineering trade and that I would be a soldier first and tradesman second. What alternate duties do EDT and construction engineering trades typically do?

3.	Will I need to do BMQ over again?

4.	A family member of mine is currently an AVS. He was telling me that if I enlisted as an AVS, I could earn the Transport Canada AME certification if I really applied myself. He also indicated that an AVS journeyman could transfer into other trades after spending a significant amount of time as a journeyman (ie Non-Destructive Testing). Are there any other specialties that an AVS could transfer into down the road?

Thanks!


----------



## mariomike

jcrockett said:
			
		

> What alternate duties do EDT and construction engineering trades typically do?



Electrical Distribution Tech  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/121491.0

Electrical Technician vs. Electrical Distribution Technician?
http://army.ca/forums/threads/119977.0

RE: Electrical Distribution Technician  
http://army.ca/forums/threads/109711.0

Electrical Distribution Technician
https://www.google.ca/search?q=site%3Aarmy.ca+Electrical+Distribution+Technician&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&gfe_rd=cr&ei=kcdkVsLxCIHd8gf8paeADA&gws_rd=ssl

Electrical Distribution Technician,
For applicants who have a Department of National Defense Certificate of Military Achievement with a QL5 rating and rank of corporal in one of nine matched trades (below), a copy of your Member’s Personnel Record Resume (MPRR) is sufficient evidence of your qualifications and experience; once submitted, the College will verify the validity of your certification and approve you to write the C of Q exam without further training.
http://www.collegeoftrades.ca/wp-content/uploads/Trade-Equivalency-Assessment-Application-Guide-March-2015-FINAL.pdf
See page 3.

Education requirements to become an electrical distribution technician  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/122930/post-1435455/topicseen.html#new
"I want to apply to become an electrical distribution technician in the army."



			
				jcrockett said:
			
		

> Are there any other trades besides EDT that will allow me to earn hours toward a Red Seal Electrician ticket in case I can't get into the EDT trade? I am open to other trades as well as long as I can earn hours toward a civilian ticket of some kind. Below are some other military trades that caught my eye. Are there any civilian trade tickets or certifications that I could earn by doing one of these trades?



Certificates of Military Achievement Recognized in Alberta:
http://tradesecrets.alberta.ca/sources/pdfs/forms/military_trades.pdf

Vehicle Technician QL5 
Construction Technician QL5 
Cook QL5 
Electrical Distribution Technician QL5 
Marine Engineering Technician QL5
Marine Engineering Technician QL5 
Supply Technician QL6
Plumbing and Heating Technician QL5 
Refrigeration and Mechanical Technician QL5
Material Technician QL5 

Certificates of Military Achievement Recognized in Ontario:
http://app06.ottawa.ca/cs/groups/content/@webottawa/documents/pdf/mdaw/mtkx/~edisp/cap201209.pdf
See page 5.

"If you hold a DND Certificate of Military Achievement at the Ql5 level and the rank of Corporal in the certification programs listed below, you can write the.red.seal Certificate of Qualification exam that corresponds to your military certification with no further training:
■ Marine Engineering Technician
■ Marine Electrician
■ Vehicle Technician
■ Material Technician
■ Refrigeration and Mechanical Technician
■ Electrical.distribution Technician
■ Plumbing and Heating Technician
■ Construction Technician, and
■ Cook
To be able to write the certification exam, you must submit the three documents listed in the “required documentation” section and include a copy of your Member’s personnel record résumé (Mprr) as evidence of your work experience in place of a letter from your employer."



			
				jcrockett said:
			
		

> A family member of mine is currently an AVS.



AVS
https://www.google.ca/search?q=site%3Amilnet.ca+getting+back+in&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&gfe_rd=cr&ei=nyGZWOnXN6KC8Qf3gZqoAQ&gws_rd=ssl#q=site:milnet.ca+AVS



			
				jcrockett said:
			
		

> Will I need to do BMQ over again?



Do I have to do BMQ again after being released?
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/87770.0

_As always,_  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.


----------



## The Bread Guy

JohnBent said:
			
		

> http://www.airforce.forces.gc.ca/en/re-enrollment.page?
> 
> If you are looking to return to reg force service, please follow the link.  I'll be the one to reply directly to you for NCM via phone call or email.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> The Air Force Intake & Liaison Team (AFI&LT) is working with Canadian Forces Recruiting Group (CFRG) to get the word out that the Air Force is actively seeking ex-military members of the Canadian Forces who were fully trained in an Air Force occupation.
> 
> The AFI&LT, which is based in Ottawa, works to identify and staff initiatives aimed at improving the re-enrolment of Air Force personnel into the Canadian Forces (CF). Due to manning shortages, personnel from many Air Force occupations are being sought ...


The RCAF info-machine has a fresh reminder that this is still out there:


> Do you miss working with some of the greatest people and technology in the Canadian Armed Forces? Would you like to put your skills back to work for Canada and Canadians?
> 
> If so, there may be a place for you (again!) in the Royal Canadian Air Force (RCAF).
> 
> The RCAF has established a dedicated team – the Air Force Intake and Liaison Team (AFI&LT) – to work with the Canadian Forces Recruiting Group to actively attract and enroll former trained members of the Canadian Armed Forces.
> 
> Working together, the two teams are focused on supporting RCAF occupations that face particular personnel shortages and can benefit immediately from the return of individuals who have the skills and experience that the Air Force needs ...


----------



## sksteve

Looking for CF member and recruit experiences in regards to their wait times for archived medical files when rejoining. 

Was a member of CF back in 2010 (Over 7 years out now) and wanting to rejoin Reg. Forces once again.  My recruit application is currently at a stand still while waiting on my previous medical file, which is archived in Ottawa. ( FYI "Previous medical history is clean and never had any issues") 

Recruit center has confirmed my VFS already and will book my medical + interview once the medical is in. Ottawa Archives (Canadian Forces) indicated a 30 day turn around time for the request but wanted to see on a personal level what your wait times happen to be. 

Looking forward to getting back into uniform and retiring as a CF member 20+ years from now. 

Thanks for any input and advice. All the best


----------



## EpicBeardedMan

I've searched the forums for everything containing the words "birth certificate" and couldn't find anything matching my question so I'm posting it up to see if anyone knows. As a returning member, do I still need to provide my birth certificate? It got lost on the move back to Ontario after I got out and I can't find it for the life of me. I have a 10 year passport that is valid but I don't want my application to get delayed due to not having a Birth Cert.


----------



## PuckChaser

It's like 35 bucks for another birth certificate, and I've had them show up in only a few weeks. You order it online, at least in Ontario.


----------



## EpicBeardedMan

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> It's like 35 bucks for another birth certificate, and I've had them show up in only a few weeks. You order it online, at least in Ontario.



yeah, was in the middle of doing this..went out and bought a pre-paid credit card and it turns out the site doesnt take them i guess. Bummer  :-\


----------



## da1root

Yes you will still need to provide your Birth Certificate to enroll even that you have prior service.
The Birth Certificate is a mandatory piece of enrolment identification.


----------



## NeeNo

I had a damaged birth certificate a few years ago and needed a replacement ricky tick.  Paid $60 (Rush shipping) and had it in less than 48 hours.


----------



## EpicBeardedMan

Has anyone had any experience returning to the forces with any paperwork being sent to Dmed Pol? When I released I was on a tcat so apparently thats a huge issue even though the injury doesnt exist anymore and I had an MRI done showing nothing wrong(its been 3 years). The PA for my intake medical was really great and wrote basically a novel in his paperwork trying to challenge it, just want to get some feedback at this point if I should expect a positive response or not.


----------



## Zombie

Good day,

Would like to pose a question for those who may know, regarding a reinstatement to corporal after being out for a period of time and then getting back in.

I did reg force basic in '06 and was in for about 4.5 years, was promoted to Cpl after 3 years, did a tour.

Got out in 2010, and re-enlisted in 2016 to a different trade. Was out for exactly 6 years. Started again from P1 but did not do basic, and was credited 70 days toward promotion. 

Wondering if anyone knows if there is any chance of getting Cpl's back in this situation.

Thanks in advance


----------



## mariomike

Zombie said:
			
		

> Would like to pose a question for those who may know, regarding a reinstatement to corporal after being out for a period of time and then getting back in.
> 
> I did reg force basic in '06 and was in for about 4.5 years, was promoted to Cpl after 3 years, did a tour.
> 
> Got out in 2010, and re-enlisted in 2016 to a different trade. Was out for exactly 6 years. Started again from P1 but did not do basic, and was credited 70 days toward promotion.
> 
> Wondering if anyone knows if there is any chance of getting Cpl's back in this situation.



DAA is / was a CAF Recruiter,



			
				DAA said:
			
		

> Usually, the CAF will recognize all prior service time, provided you re-enrol less than 5 years from your date of release.  Less than 3 years out, you usually get everything back (Rank, Pay and Occupation/Non-Occupation/Leadership Quals), 3-5 will be PLAR'd which results in a coin toss and anything more than 5 years post release, will be a hard sell but usually results in "Cpl (B)".


----------



## AlbertaSparky

Hello,

I’ll get right to it here, Ex Artillery NCM (RegF) interested in re-enrolling into the Air Force as an Electrical Distribution Tech (RegF).  I have read through this thread from start to finish and it answered most of my questions but not all of them.  

As far as total time served, it was around 13 years with a little of reservist time at the end of it after a component transfer from the RegF. I did VR from the reserves around 2012. I’m not concerned about having to do BMQ again, I’m cool with it either way. 

The reason why I left the CAF was a simple one, I wanted a trade ticket that was outside the scope of an Artillery soldier. I did try the OT process while in the RegF, but it was a dead end, out cap for the Arty was 6 people per year at the time. 

During my post RegF time in the reserves I started my Electrician Apprenticeship civi side pretty much from the get go and I quickly discovered that there was no way I could balance work, wife, kids, mortgage, spare time etc. and continue with the reserves. Rather than be a “no show” for 90% of weekends and parade nights I decided to VR completely as this pace of life was set to continue for some time. 

Fast forward to today and I am a Red Seal Journeyman Electrician, apprenticed in Alberta, all schooling done at NAIT. Life has stabilized and I find myself longing for the military. I miss everything that comes with it. Except for CFB Shilo. 

So my questions are:
1. Is the Air Force looking for ED Techs and if so is my civi ticket valid or would I have to do a QL3 or some skill set upgrading/refresher training? 
2. Picking up where I left off with pensionable time, (not concerned about rank or pay). What are the current options to buyback your pension? 
3. After completing BMQ/QL3/Training and receiving your first posting, what services does the military provide these days regarding your personal effects in the province you came from. IE: House, vehicles, land owned 

My remaining questions are more specific about the ED Tech trade  and the process of getting there.  The Forces.ca website indicates that an ED TECH’s QL3 is 6 months in Gagetown... Due to the length of the course can candidates show up with a set of wheels and are you in the shacks for the entire course? 
http://www.forces.ca/en/job/pdf/electricaldistributiontechnician-57

Upon completing a QL3 or qualifying for direct entry are your posting locations determined by your element? How long are the postings for ED Tech’s?  I understand manpower is placed where needed but if able to, I would gladly stay in Alberta. 

If what I have posted here is in the wrong thread, then my apologies.  Thanks for any input and advice, also if there are any ED Tech’s out there looking to make the jump to civi side and are looking for info about being a tradesman on the outside please feel free to message me. 

Thanks


----------



## mariomike

AlbertaSparky said:
			
		

> Is the Air Force looking for ED Techs and if so is my civi ticket valid or would I have to do a QL3 or some skill set upgrading/refresher training?



ED Tech questions and answers,
https://www.google.ca/search?rls=com.microsoft%3Aen-CA%3AIE-Address&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&dcr=0&ei=fukZWr-kBsrAjwShx5mYCw&q=site%3Aarmy.ca+%22ed+tech%22&oq=site%3Aarmy.ca+%22ed+tech%22&gs_l=psy-ab.12...91368.95349.0.97734.2.2.0.0.0.0.103.167.1j1.2.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..0.0.0....0.uakkb-xXODI





			
				AlbertaSparky said:
			
		

> What are the current options to buyback your pension?



Pension buy back,
https://www.google.ca/search?rls=com.microsoft%3Aen-CA%3AIE-Address&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&dcr=0&ei=iOoZWozAEIrojwSpj4BI&q=site%3Aarmy.ca+buy+back&oq=site%3Aarmy.ca+buy+back&gs_l=psy-ab.3...13652.16086.0.16675.8.8.0.0.0.0.123.616.7j1.8.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..0.0.0....0.dfVR2TGkyZA

Service Buyback—Canadian Armed Forces pensions
https://www.tpsgc-pwgsc.gc.ca/fac-caf/act/rnsrgm/rcht-bybck-eng.html


----------



## SeokSah

Hey guys, wondering if anyone can help me. I’m getting conflicting answers about applying to the Reserves after a 4a voluntary release from reg force BMQ. 

The HR staff and release office at St. Jean are saying that there is no waiting period or restrictions when applying to the Reserves after being released from reg force BMQ. They encouraged all of us to apply directly as soon as we arrived home.

However, two of my local reserve units are telling me otherwise with one indicating that I’d need a chief of defence staff waiver and the other saying I’d need to wait one calender year prior to applying for all aspects of the CAF (reg force and reserves.)

Hoping someone on the forum could shed some light on the issue. I appreciate the help.


----------



## da1root

Based on CFRG HQ policy (Waivers - WI 3.3.2.07 Rev 6, Annex K), the waiting period for re-enrolment after a 4(C) Release is for applying to the Regular Force only.  There is no waiting period to apply to the PRes after a 4(C) release from either Reg or PRes.
* Release Item 4(C) applying to the RegF prior to reaching OFP, there is a 1 year waiting period, waiver authority is the CFRC CO (must present evidence that issued that precipitated release have been resolved and/or are no longer an issue) and specifically states that this is Not applicable if re-enrolment is into the PRes.
* Release Item 4(C) applying to the RegF less than 6 months since release there is a 6 month waiting period, waiver authority is the CFRC CO (based on service needs) and specifically states that this is Not applicable if re-enrolment is into the PRes.
* Release item 4(C) for other situations, there is no waiting period and no waiver required.

<b>The only release items that require CDS approval are for 3(a), 5(d) & 5(f).</b>

------

That said, there might be Unit/Brigade/Division policy that is different; if you are being told that is policy, it is in writing and you should ask for a copy of the policy if you wish to "challenge" the decision.

I'm curious as to what recruiter is stating that a CDS approval is required for re-enrolment after a 4(C) release...?


----------



## da1root

I read original post as 4(C) release (I really only payed attention to the fact that you said "voluntary release"), I now realize it's a 4(A) (Voluntary - On Request (when entitled to an immediate annuity) release.
I'm leaving my original post as I deal with 4(C) re-enrolment queries quite often, so I'm leaving above information for that reason.
-------------------
However based on the original question here is my response:

Based on CFRG HQ policy (Waivers - WI 3.3.2.07 Rev 6, Annex K), there is no waiting period for re-enrolment after a 4(A) release and there is no waiver required.
<b>The only release items that require CDS approval are for 3(a), 5(d) & 5(f).</b>
------
That said, there might be Unit/Brigade/Division policy that is different; if you are being told that is policy, it is in writing and you should ask for a copy of the policy if you wish to "challenge" the decision.

I'm still curious as to what recruiter is stating that a CDS approval is required for re-enrolment after a 4(A) release...?


----------



## westbeacheh

I left the reserves 3 years ago and I was in for 3 years. I had a bad breakup and it fucked me up for awhile. I should have gone supp reserve. Will the army allow me to re enlist and retrain me as a reserve INF soldier? and if so should I enlist threw my regiment or go to the recruiting office?

Thankyou!


----------



## LightFighter

Releasing from the CF doesn’t bar you from rejoining - circumstances/release item dependent. 


Assuming you released on good terms, you are still medically/physically fit, unit accepts you back, etc you will probably be able to back in.  

I would start by speaking with a recruiter at the unit and go from there.

As for retraining, were you DP1/BIQ qualified?  Due to the time passed, you probably won’t have to redo any courses.


----------



## jaysfan17

Hi everyone. I just have a quick question I was hoping someone(s) could answer for me. If a reservist wants to OT into a different reserve trade would it make more sense to just release and re apply considering the CF is doing this new expedited recruiting program where they can get in by 30 days or was that simply a small trial they were doing with one or two reserve units. I realize the complexity of these situations with recruitment times, OT/CT's, so I do apologize if that question has been asked before, but I've been skimming through the forum for about an hour and can't seem to find the answer to my question.


----------



## mariomike

luttrellfan said:
			
		

> If a reservist wants to OT into a different reserve trade   would it make more sense to just release and re apply considering the CF is doing this new expedited recruiting program where they can get in by 30 days or was that simply a small trial they were doing with one or two reserve units. I realize the complexity of these situations with recruitment times, OT/CT's, so I do apologize if that question has been asked before, but I've been skimming through the forum for about an hour and can't seem to find the answer to my question.



Voluntary Occupational Transfer ( VOT ) 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/21109.0.html
31 pages



			
				luttrellfan said:
			
		

> I was hoping to get some advice from some people who've gone through the CT (with OT) process as well as having to redo the CFAT for a second or third try.
> 
> I'm hoping to CT ( with an OT) from the reserves. I've heard stories and did research to see how long CT (OT) take and some of them are quick while others can be dragged out. Do you guys think it would be smart to put in my CT while I wait for my CFAT waiver to go through or am I thinking to far ahead right now?



Component Transfers (Reserve to Regular),
https://milnet.ca/forums/threads/12797/post-1512499.html#msg1512499

Canadian Forces Aptitude Test (CFAT) [MERGED] 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/13076.1950

As always, Recruiting is your most trusted source of official up to date information.


----------



## da1root

luttrellfan said:
			
		

> Hi everyone. I just have a quick question I was hoping someone(s) could answer for me. If a reservist wants to OT into a different reserve trade would it make more sense to just release and re apply considering the CF is doing this new expedited recruiting program where they can get in by 30 days or was that simply a small trial they were doing with one or two reserve units. I realize the complexity of these situations with recruitment times, OT/CT's, so I do apologize if that question has been asked before, but I've been skimming through the forum for about an hour and can't seem to find the answer to my question.



Beyond what mariomike posted I would strongly urge AGAINST releasing to change occupations.  First off a release in the PRes isn't going to happen over night.  Releases are not the priority for an already overworked Orderly Room/Ship's Office.  And in most cases Releases have to go from a Unit to a Brigade to a Division to Area and beyond before your release is official.  Second, if it's found out you only released to change occupations you could be labelled as an administrative burden and not be allowed to rejoin (I've seen that happen).


----------



## Sandboxx

Buck_HRA said:
			
		

> <b>The only release items that require CDS approval are for 3(a), 5(d) & 5(f).</b>






With my understanding a waiver for approval from the CDS  is also required for a 5(e) release item. Correct me if I'm wrong.


----------



## da1root

Sandboxx said:
			
		

> With my understanding a waiver for approval from the CDS  is also required for a 5(e) release item. Correct me if I'm wrong.


A 5(e) release requires a 1 year waiting period and the approval level is the Commander of CFRG HQ.


----------



## MacD001

Quick question, so I released from the army about 2 years ago now, currently in the final stages of getting back in. (Basically waiting for the phone call with the offer/ date to swear back in) So it is relatively safe to say this will all happen in the very near future. Curious as to when I would start getting paid again. If it's based on the next pay date as of the day I officially re enroll (swearing back in) or if it would begin the day I report to my posting in Wainwirght as I'm a MCpl getting back. (That would be my guess)

Any info from anyone who has experienced this would be appreciated, 
Thanks all!


----------



## PuckChaser

Pay system doesn't work that quickly. You have to clear in to get stuff started. Even on CT I had to wait 3 months to get paid properly, OR had to give me physical cheques to cash.


----------



## BrewsKampbell

What PuckChaser said. I re-enrolled Feb last year and it took 3 months before I was in the pay system. I was in Wainwright and they paid me in cash.


----------



## MacD001

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> Pay system doesn't work that quickly. You have to clear in to get stuff started. Even on CT I had to wait 3 months to get paid properly, OR had to give me physical cheques to cash.



Thanks for the reply, kind of figured it wouldn't be right away, makes sense, I'd have to clear into the clerks at my unit etc. So basically once I clear into the base I begin getting paid again except it will be in cheques for the first little while?

Thanks


----------



## BrewsKampbell

MacD001 said:
			
		

> Thanks for the reply, kind of figured it wouldn't be right away, makes sense, I'd have to clear into the clerks at my unit etc. So basically once I clear into the base I begin getting paid again except it will be in cheques for the first little while?
> 
> Thanks



Yes. The day you report in is when your pay will start. You'll have to see the OR for pay as it'll all be done manually by them. I had the option of taking cash or direct deposit. When doing direct deposit it takes 3-5 days so I just went in every payday, took the cash and deposited into my bank account.


----------



## MacD001

TrunkMonkey315 said:
			
		

> Yes. The day you report in is when your pay will start. You'll have to see the OR for pay as it'll all be done manually by them. I had the option of taking cash or direct deposit. When doing direct deposit it takes 3-5 days so I just went in every payday, took the cash and deposited into my bank account.



Thanks


----------



## K1tesurf

Hello,

I am currently in the Military cpl4 rank and considering getting out of the Military so I can finish my degree and re join as an officer. After doing quite a bit of research on the UTPNCM program and reviewing the strategized intake plan on the DIN I found that the intake numbers for UTPNCM are extremely low compared to off the street, which is understandable. I also do not like the fact that there is only one board per year for UTPNCM mostly since I am eager to finish my Degree. After some thought I have decided that I would give UTPNCM 1 attempt and then if not selected release so I can still start school anyway. My question is, how long do I have to be out of the military before I can re apply ROTP? My second question is... if I rejoin ROTP will I get paid the standard OCDT pay or receive the same pay I am currently making as CPL4...similar to how the UTP would work?


----------



## runormal

K1tesurf said:
			
		

> Hello,
> 
> I am currently in the Military cpl4 rank and considering getting out of the Military so I can finish my degree and re join as an officer. After doing quite a bit of research on the UTPNCM program and reviewing the strategized intake plan on the DIN I found that the intake numbers for UTPNCM are extremely low compared to off the street, which is understandable. I also do not like the fact that there is only one board per year for UTPNCM mostly since I am eager to finish my Degree. After some thought I have decided that I would give UTPNCM 1 attempt and then if not selected release so I can still start school anyway. My question is, how long do I have to be out of the military before I can re apply ROTP? My second question is... if I rejoin ROTP will I get paid the standard OCDT pay or receive the same pay I am currently making as CPL4...similar to how the UTP would work?



What about doing a component transfer to the reserves and re applying from the reserves? The numbers are also low, but I was declined off the street and accepted from within the reserves. When I received my offer it was quoted at the Pte 1 rate of pay.


----------



## Green2018

I was enrolled in the CF from 2007-2008. Unfortunately I did not complete Basic Training. I was released with a 5D; I had some personal issues, now resolved. Had an opportunity to go back to College and my children are now mature. 
My son would like to join the Forces (he  will do well completed army cadets with honors). I too would like to return when he puts his application in. However I do have some questions. Firstly, do I have to redo my aptitude test, and start from scratch or will they pull my old file out? 
Any recommendations for an older woman, age 43 hoping to apply in a year or so, to get through Basic once again?
Thank You


----------



## mariomike

Green2018 said:
			
		

> I did not complete Basic Training. I was released with a 5D;



You may find these discussions of interest,

5 ( D ) 
https://www.google.com/search?rls=com.microsoft%3Aen-CA%3AIE-Address&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&ei=rhUOW7PKFev-jwTC0omACQ&q=site%3Aarmy.ca+5d&oq=site%3Aarmy.ca+5d&gs_l=psy-ab.12...0.0.0.92809.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0....0...1c..64.psy-ab..0.0.0....0.Kkf0lbx5x0o



			
				Green2018 said:
			
		

> Any recommendations for an older woman, age 43 hoping to apply in a year or so, to get through Basic once again?



Advice for women on BMQ 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/2420.2175
91 pages.

Am I too old to join/do well/fit in?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/207.0
14 pages.

As always, Recruiting is your most trusted source of official, up to date information.

"Unofficial site, not associated with DND or the Canadian Armed Forces."


----------



## Tyguy35

Hello, I was in the reserves 4 years back, went to supp res because of a new job I took. I am currently still at the job I left the reserves but have recently began the process to go back into the military for armour reg force. 

My job not I can make up to 100k if I really tried but I truly do not enjoy being here in fact I really hate my job haha. The advice I am looking for is from soldiers who have been in a while who are married or were getting married when they joined. Is the pay cut worth it. I’m just looking for that final push to get the process over with. My fiancé knows it’s going to be a challenge for her but also knows the job I’m at now has made me a miserable person. If anyone can lend me some advice that me great. 

Tyler


----------



## mariomike

Tyguy35 said:
			
		

> Is the pay cut worth it.



You may find these discussions of interest,

Options on joining, worried about wages...  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/113447.0
OP: "I don’t know that I can handle the pay cut."

Entering the CF and YOUR Money....  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/26093.200
"Does anyone have any tips for someone having to take a pay cut when joining the forces?" 
10 pages.

Military as a career change...?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/96128.0
OP: "the recruit salary is a big cut in pay!!"

etc...


----------



## BrewsKampbell

Tyguy35 said:
			
		

> Hello, I was in the reserves 4 years back, went to supp res because of a new job I took. I am currently still at the job I left the reserves but have recently began the process to go back into the military for armour reg force.
> 
> My job not I can make up to 100k if I really tried but I truly do not enjoy being here in fact I really hate my job haha. The advice I am looking for is from soldiers who have been in a while who are married or were getting married when they joined. Is the pay cut worth it. I’m just looking for that final push to get the process over with. My fiancé knows it’s going to be a challenge for her but also knows the job I’m at now has made me a miserable person. If anyone can lend me some advice that me great.
> 
> Tyler



That's a hard questions to answer. I left the Army in 2013, went back to school and worked for a company for just over 4 years before deciding to get back in. I took around 24k a year pay cut to get back in as a Cpl 4. I choose a trade I was interested in and that's the only offer I planned on accepting. I have my days where I thoroughly enjoy my new trade and other days where my bitterness comes out and like many people in the CAF question my life choices.

Overall, I'm currently happy with my choice. You need to weigh whats more important, money or career satisfaction.

Good luck.


----------



## da1root

TrunkMonkey315 said:
			
		

> career satisfaction.



And with all careers you have good days and bad days.  
I personally weigh the good days vs the bad days - I was previously at a point in my career where the bad days were vastly overshadowing and greatly outnumbering the good days; I made some career changes and now the good days outnumber the bad days by a landslide.


----------



## TerranceTheRabbit

I recently reapplied after 10 years of being out. I applied as infantry in 2008 and hurt my knee 4 weeks into basic. I received surgery but was informed I would need to reenlist as another profession as my knee would never be the same. I VRed as my heart was set  on infantry. 10 years later weapons tech is calling my name as a career. 
I applied June 6th of this year and was told they are waiting for my medical record to come from the archives in Borden. Does anyone have any idea the time frame I should be expecting? Appreciate any help. Thanks!


----------



## da1root

TerranceTheRabbit said:
			
		

> I recently reapplied after 10 years of being out. I applied as infantry in 2008 and hurt my knee 4 weeks into basic. I received surgery but was informed I would need to reenlist as another profession as my knee would never be the same. I VRed as my heart was set  on infantry. 10 years later weapons tech is calling my name as a career.
> I applied June 6th of this year and was told they are waiting for my medical record to come from the archives in Borden. Does anyone have any idea the time frame I should be expecting? Appreciate any help. Thanks!



I don't have a time frame for you but keep in mind that many people are on leave (it is summer), and medical section is short staffed.


----------



## Armystrong94

Hello,

I just switched my application to regural forces after 2 years of waiting to get hired with the reserves. Everything is complete now with my application. What happens now? When is the next selection date for infantry, armoured and combat engineer? Thank you


----------



## da1root

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> Hello,
> 
> I just switched my application to regural forces after 2 years of waiting to get hired with the reserves. Everything is complete now with my application. What happens now? When is the next selection date for infantry, armoured and combat engineer? Thank you



Without knowing what was previously done on your file it is impossible to tell you what happens next (i.e. we don't know if you've written the CFAT/TSD, done your medical, started your security clearance, etc).  Your best bet is to contact your Recruiting Centre and speak with someone about the specifics of your file.


----------



## Armystrong94

Hello 

Thanks for the reply, everything is complete with my file. Will I have to redo anything on my application? Also how long does it take to receive the file from the reserve unit to the regural force recruiting. Thank you


----------



## kratz

I posted this reply in another thread and it generally applies to your questions:



> Your application will be processed (medical, background, CFAT ect…) until you are placed on the competition list.
> The number of positions is not important until you're on the competition list.
> 
> Once on the competition list:
> 
> - option 1: Your application will remain until:
> - result a) You are selected and offered a position, or
> 
> - option 2:12 months have passed and you:
> - result b): do update your file ect...see option 1, or
> - result c): don't update your medical, ect...see option 3
> 
> - option 3: You inform your CFRC you are no longer interested in the CAF...see result d
> - result d): The CFRC will then close your file.



How long this process will take can be weeks or years, depending on how competitive your application is 
compared to all others received. 

Your CFRC should reasonably receive your application back from the PRes unit with the month. Keep in regular contact to ensure your file is current.


----------



## da1root

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> Hello
> 
> Thanks for the reply, everything is complete with my file. Will I have to redo anything on my application? Also how long does it take to receive the file from the reserve unit to the regural force recruiting. Thank you



^ What kratz said 
Best of luck in your process.


----------



## Legz

As anyone been through the re-enrollment process and thought the process just takes forever? Reapplied in april, went through PLAR and am qualified in my trade got an Offer from the CM(position number and unit) Back in June, Passed Medical and interview early July, All the other paperwork(background check and last signature from RMO ) got back Early August. Now the only thing missing is the final Offer that i need to sign to be able to start and still being told that if you haven't heard anything from us in a month call back.

Anyone can explain what takes so long to get an offer put together?


----------



## Armystrong94

I'm on the same boat as you man but even worse. I have to redo everything all over again and wait for approval. The CAF is a joke the way they treat their ex members. I've seen people who think being a soldier is all butterflys and rainbows get in quicker then ones who already know what kind of shit their getting into again. You would think they would respect our service from before.


----------



## mariomike

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> I'm on the same boat as you man but even worse. I have to redo everything all over again and wait for approval. The CAF is a joke the way they treat their ex members. I've seen people who think being a soldier is all butterflys and rainbows get in quicker then ones who already know what kind of shit their getting into again. You would think they would respect our service from before.



Do you feel entitled to go to the front of the Recruiting line?



			
				Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> I've seen people who think being a soldier is all butterflys and rainbows get in quicker then ones who already know what kind of shit their getting into again.


----------



## BrewsKampbell

Legz said:
			
		

> As anyone been through the re-enrollment process and thought the process just takes forever?



Yes. Took me 10 months to get back in. I was told part of the delay is caused by needing to pull my file from archives and Ottawa needing to review it to determine my rank and IPC. The longest wait for me was after writing the TSD to get a medical and interview, which was 7 months.


----------



## Armystrong94

Yes i believe ex caf members should be priority in getting back in!


----------



## PuckChaser

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> Yes i believe ex caf members should be priority in getting back in!


Up to what point? Technical trade skill fade is 5 years. If that person is out for longer, they likely will have to do their QL3/DP1 again. So basically we are only going to recruit someone who gets to bypass BMQ. You also have to slow down former service recruitment so people don't get pissy because they can't VOT, and pull pin to get back into the new trade. Or stop people from pulling pin to avoid a crappy posting only to try to get back in 6 months later to go where they want.


----------



## brihard

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> Yes i believe ex caf members should be priority in getting back in!



Why? You knew what the CAF was about, and in that knowledge you made an informed decision to quit. Now you find yourself regretting that decision, whether civilian life didn’t pan out as you’d hoped, or whatever. What have you done in the time you were out to be a competitive applicant off the street as you once again are? You’re gunning for combat arms, so it doesn’t look like you bring some special high-demand technical skills. You’ve been out for several years, so the skills you do have are likely quite faded. You come across as a quite bitter and jaded former member, and I would guess with pretty brief former service. There are still plenty of keeners who want to join too. You have to prove you’re a better applicant than them.

If you think the CAF is a joke in how they treat you, feel free to apply to other employers. You’re an ex-employee. You aren’t owed anything when you come back hat in hand knocking at the door again.


----------



## mariomike

Brihard said:
			
		

> You come across as a quite bitter and jaded former member, and I would guess with pretty brief former service.



Disgruntled former employees can have a negative influence on others.


----------



## Armystrong94

When the military learns to respect their members, maybe the rest of the country will follow. 

Amen!


----------



## mariomike

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> When the military learns to respect their members, maybe the rest of the country will follow.
> 
> Amen!



The good thing is that they take people back. 

Where I used to work my full-time job, they gave five business days to rescind your resignation. 
After that, they turned their back on you.


----------



## PuckChaser

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> When the military learns to respect their members, maybe the rest of the country will follow.
> 
> Amen!



Respect goes both ways, and respecting the member doesn't mean giving the member whatever they want, whenever they want it.

Since your profile is completely blank, why don't you fill us in on your situation instead of you assuming you're being screwed and us assuming you're just complaining about not being greeted with a red carpet and gold throne?


----------



## kratz

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> When the military learns to respect their members, maybe the rest of the country will follow.



No.

The CAF is a cross-selection of Canadian society.
When Canadians respect their service members.


----------



## brihard

Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> Today's recruits xD



It’s getting to be about time you told us about all the cool and hard stuff you did to be taking shots like that. The difference between you and today’s recruits- they’re actually in. So far as I can tell you did at best a handful of years, got out, changed your mind, spent two years managing not to get back in even with the reserves, and not you’re basically coming across as entitled to a priority hire. Please tell us what makes you so impressive as to justify that.


----------



## Armystrong94

Theirs always great leaders that go down in history as the best in war times. And that my friends will be me, as soon as I get in =)


----------



## garb811

Armystrong94:

Unless you have something constructive to say, or are wiling to engage with the questions you have been asked, please stop.  Further posts of the nature of your last two will be considered trolling and action taken accordingly.

Thanks in advance.

- Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## Legz

Can anyone please explain why a file needs to go through about 20 person to be processed? I mean last week was told by the recruiting center to keep my phone close and check my email they had an update that my offer was on the way and should get contacted by email within a couple of days. A week as passed by and no news so I called and was told : well you file is with our stage 3 approver(or something like that) and when he gets to your file you'll get an email? SO how many stages are there?


----------



## da1root

Legz said:
			
		

> As anyone been through the re-enrollment process and thought the process just takes forever? Reapplied in april, went through PLAR and am qualified in my trade got an Offer from the CM(position number and unit) Back in June, Passed Medical and interview early July, All the other paperwork(background check and last signature from RMO ) got back Early August. Now the only thing missing is the final Offer that i need to sign to be able to start and still being told that if you haven't heard anything from us in a month call back.
> 
> Anyone can explain what takes so long to get an offer put together?



Even if your CM wants you back there are still things required on the recruiting level that are required to be completed.  CRNC (background check), medical are the main two.  Even though you were previously in these are items that still need to be completed and from my experience the Career Managers often give out position numbers before these are done which makes the person wanting to re-enrol "antsy" but the checks and balances still have to be completed by the recruiting system.



			
				Armystrong94 said:
			
		

> When the military learns to respect their members, maybe the rest of the country will follow.
> 
> Amen!



I've always been respected; please don't paint your personal experience on the rest of us! 




			
				Legz said:
			
		

> Can anyone please explain why a file needs to go through about 20 person to be processed? I mean last week was told by the recruiting center to keep my phone close and check my email they had an update that my offer was on the way and should get contacted by email within a couple of days. A week as passed by and no news so I called and was told : well you file is with our stage 3 approver(or something like that) and when he gets to your file you'll get an email? SO how many stages are there?



Because recruiting is done on a national level.  When you first applied online, your file goes to a team at CFRG HQ that makes sure your file passes "ACE", if it does your file gets move to the CFRC where they will review your CFAT/TSD scores from previous - if you need to do rewrites (or write the TSD if you never did before), then you need to do that.  You will need to have a medical done again regardless of when you released, and the same with a background check.  Since you have prior service a Prior Learning Assessment (PLAR) needs to be done; depending on what branch your PLAR is going to depends on the turn around time to get it back (each branch has it's own PLAR cell, and within each branch most of the MOSIDS also have an OA who is responsible for reviewing PLAR's and in most cases these are secondary duties...).  Next is if there are already more people on the competition list than there are positions for your occupation you will not be approved for further processing, or if you're at a CFRC with limited processing and a higher priority campaign is happening (e.g. ROTP) you will not be approved for further processing.  Assuming CFAT/TSD, interview, CRNC, medical all come back as ok then your file will goto the competition list.  If you're coming in as skilled then a further review needs to be done to see if you can come back at the same rank / pay; if you didn't have substantive rank upon release this complicates the file further.  Once you are cleared to get an offer, the selections team has to select you in an official selection (which occurs twice a month for NCM occupations normally, however block leave / etc can delay that), then your file goes to the offers team, once an offer team staff member generates your offer, than another has to review it for accuracy.  Then it's released to the CFRC to contact you.  Then comes the whole enrolment process.

Only 20 people involved in a file is a low number from my experience.  Within your CFRC you will likely deal with a Recruiter, MCC, File Manager among other staff.  At the CFRG Level you have the Intake Team (normally 1 person), National Processing (PLAR) (with Health Services I know there is a total 5 people involved in a PLAR), Intake Management (normally 2 different people), Selections (at least 4 people, as the Selections is a Board, sometimes more than 4), Offers (minimum 2 people), then it goes back to your CFRC to give you your offer and normally multiple people are involved in the enrollment.  Plus you have the Medical (minimum of the med tech/PA, plus the RMO); security checks (could be as low as 2 people, if you have something on your CRNC causing concern than a board sits and up to 10 people can be involved depending the issue).  I'm sure I'm missing people as well; but all this to say there is a great deal of work that goes into someone applying to the CAF - this is part of the reason I don't think ex members should be given preference / front of line treatment (and I served, got out and came back in - when I came back in I didn't feel like the CAF should give me priority treatment).


----------



## SJAP

Hello,

  Just have some questions regarding rejoining the CF.  I served from 2006-2012 in 2RCR including a combat tour in Afghanistan. I was qualified in most vehicles, Airborne jump course qualified, Recce, PLQ qualified. I finished my second term contract and was voluntary released. 

So my question is, what is the likelihood I'd have to redo BMQ and if I would retain previous Corporal Rank. I would be rejoining in a administrative trade not in the Combat arms.



Thanks


----------



## RocketRichard

SJAP said:
			
		

> Hello,
> 
> Just have some questions regarding rejoining the CF.  I served from 2006-2012 in 2RCR including a combat tour in Afghanistan. I was qualified in most vehicles, Airborne jump course qualified, Recce, PLQ qualified. I finished my second term contract and was voluntary released.
> 
> So my question is, what is the likelihood I'd have to redo BMQ and if I would retain previous Corporal Rank. I would be rejoining in a administrative trade not in the Combat arms.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks


With your qualifications and experience it would make sense that you would not have to do BMQ. Good lawd I hope the CF would not have an issue with granting you a bypass for BMQ. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## PuckChaser

Anecdotally there have been people here out longer than you, with less total time in, who have gotten BMQ bypass. You should be fine.


----------



## cgnjeep

I have a question about re-enrolling in the Reserves.

I was in the Reserves from 2006-2013 with the RMR in Montreal and PWOR in Kingston. I left the CF in 2013 because I was moving a lot and couldn't keep transferring from unit to unit. I am now settled in the Okanagan and would like to join the BC Dragoons in Kelowna but am wondering if I will have to redo my BMQ/SQ?
I was released in June 2013 so I am just over the 5 year mark but am wondering if the CF would let me bypass those courses and go straight to the armored recce course (I was Infantry before).
I left a Cpl and did not do any tours.


----------



## da1root

Your file will need to be reviewed by the PLAR cell; all that you can receive here are opinions and best guesses.  Start the application process, you'll go through the PLAR process and be told 100% whether you'll need to do it or not.

This isn't trying not to answer your question; but even as a recruiter I gave someone information based on previous files I saw and their PLAR turned out different.


----------



## cgnjeep

Buck_HRA said:
			
		

> Your file will need to be reviewed by the PLAR cell; all that you can receive here are opinions and best guesses.  Start the application process, you'll go through the PLAR process and be told 100% whether you'll need to do it or not.
> 
> This isn't trying not to answer your question; but even as a recruiter I gave someone information based on previous files I saw and their PLAR turned out different.



Thank you for you answer, I'll keep the board posted on the result of my application for anyone who is just over the 5 year mark and wants to re-enlist.


----------



## AlbertaSparky

Hello, bit of an update/question.

Previously posted in this thread (post #924) regarding re-enrolling as an ED-Tech. 

Had an appointment at the local recruiting centre, did the TSD, non prescription drug questionnaire, and had an interview with a Capt.  All is good except I did not meet 1 entrance requirement in that I don’t have an “advanced” high school math credit. I was somewhat taken off guard seeing as how I’m a red seal jman electrician civi side, and I graduated highschool back in the 90’s. 

But the rules are the rules and I accept that. So the Capt. put forth an “entry standard waiver”. My questions are, typically how long does such a request take to be processed and decided on, and do “entry standard waivers” generally get approved?

Also, for the people who are interested about re-doing basic/BMQ... I was told, “not going to happen. DND won’t waste the money”.


----------



## mariomike

AlbertaSparky said:
			
		

> All is good except I did not meet 1 entrance requirement in that I don’t have an “advanced” high school math credit. I was somewhat taken off guard seeing as how I’m a red seal jman electrician civi side, and I graduated highschool back in the 90’s.
> 
> But the rules are the rules and I accept that. So the Capt. put forth an “entry standard waiver”. My questions are, typically how long does such a request take to be processed and decided on, and do “entry standard waivers” generally get approved?



In case you have not seen it, you may find this discussion of interest,

Prior Learning Assessment Review( PLAR ) FAQs  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/42867.75
8 pages.

As always, Recruiting is your most trusted source of official, up to date, information.

"Unofficial site, not associated with DND or the Canadian Armed Forces."


----------



## RCR967

Current member of the Supplementary reserve, released from reg force few years ago. Was wondering what the re enrollment process is like and the steps that needed to be taken to get me back to the regular force, (RCR) thanks


----------



## mariomike

RCR967 said:
			
		

> Current member of the Supplementary reserve, released from reg force few years ago. Was wondering what the re enrollment process is like and the steps that needed to be taken to get me back to the regular force, (RCR) thanks



See also,

Supplementary Reserves to Reg Force 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/105941.0

Sup Res to Reg transfer
https://army.ca/forums/threads/103186.0


----------



## CaptainCookieMonster

First of all, to potential recruits: Op Honour isn’t like the old SHARP training that gave us ammo to back to our barracks to harass each other with, this is a real initiative which, like it or not, has some real teeth. 

I was in the 1 SVC BN years ago and it just wasn’t a great time in my head to be in the forces, I was young and dumb. About 10 years later, which was last year, I reapplied and was shut down for a year. Why? I had a blog which criticized a certain religion in a less than charitable way, which was my first problem. I was a fool and left the link to my personal philosophy blog on one of my emails to CFRG which they did a recce on and as soon as my foot was in the door it was just as soon out. 

Now that my year suspension is up, I have to do some enhanced reliability screening to be considered for readmission, perhaps to demonstrate I am not a yellow vest wearing redneck who will be a public relations nightmare for the CF, which is fair. 

What I want to know is do I stand a chance at this point on getting back in, or should I cut my losses and “learn to code,” as some might say? 

Ps: take that Op Honour stuff seriously for you new recruits. Keep your sociopolitical views to yourselves, or between trusted friends at personal get togethers. I cannot emphasize this enough. It seems designed to make sure members stick to their jobs and do not divide over personal matters.


----------



## Lumber

CaptainCookieMonster said:
			
		

> Ps: take that Op Honour stuff seriously for you new recruits. Keep your sociopolitical views to yourselves, or between trusted friends at personal get togethers. I cannot emphasize this enough. It seems designed to make sure members stick to their jobs and do not divide over personal matters.



I think you might (might) be missing the point of Operation Honour. It's not to scare those with unsavoury world views into keeping their opinions secret/within small trusted groups; rather, it is to educate them to the fact that their world views aren't just a matter of opinion, but that they are actually wrong.

I can't really help you with your question, BUT, if you still have opinions/world views that you believe you need to only express in small groups of trusted friends, then I don't think we want you in the CAF.


----------



## CaptainCookieMonster

Disagreement with other people’s worldview seems unavoidable. By virtue of the content of my belief system, I might put myself in ideological opposition with someone who takes up another. 

It seems to me the initiative in question is to mitigate how we approach the workplace with our respective values so as to not unnecessarily offend others. We all know how easily religion and politics are topics to be avoided in polite discussion, which is why I offer the caveat to keep sensitive talk amongst trusted groups, where it will not erode a workplace. 

Thank you. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Lumber

CaptainCookieMonster said:
			
		

> It seems to me the initiative in question is to mitigate how we approach the workplace with our respective values so as to not unnecessarily offend others.



If that's what you think is the point of the "initiative" (it is in fact a full fledged operation), then you've definitely missed the mark. The purpose of Operation Honour is:



> Operation HONOUR is the Canadian Armed Forces’ (CAF) mission to eliminate harmful and inappropriate sexual behaviour in the Canadian military.
> 
> Operation HONOUR is based on the principles that:
> •every man and woman who serves their country deserves to be treated with dignity and respect – anything less is simply unacceptable
> •any attitudes or behaviours which undermine the camaraderie, cohesion and confidence of serving members threatens the CAF’s long-term operational success



It's sad that we need a named operation to achieve this goal, because this should just be common human decency.

So, if you have opinions/world views that would be contrary to these goals (for example, perhaps you have an opinion that certain sexes, genders, races, etc. should not be treated with the same dignity and respect as some of the others), then we definitely don't want you in the Forces.


----------



## CaptainCookieMonster

Whoa! 

I definitely don’t disagree with any of what you cited. I take a libertarian position on these issues, where we should all be free to pursue our own idea of health wealth and happiness, so long as we don’t step on each other’s toes in the process. 

All I am saying is we, as humans, will naturally hold views contrary to one another, and the initiative in question here seems to be interested in affording us all dignity no matter what we hold in terms of sexuality, religion, or otherwise. 

I am on board with this, but not if it is to the exclusion of me having opinions and thoughts of my own—just within the workplace we keep certain matters and disagreements to ourselves and act charitably toward one another off campus. 

I hope this elucidates my understanding of this. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## da1root

You're entitled to your thoughts and feelings; however obviously something in your blog went against the intent of Operation Honour (sidenote: thank you Lumber for calling it "Operation Honour" - to CaptainCookieMonster, Operation Honour is not short formed to "Op").  

I have been a member of the CAF for over 20 years and I have my own opinions and feelings, Operation Honour doesn't stop you from having your own opinions.  What it does is make you accountable if you are to say or write stuff that is contrary to the intent of the Operation, thus bringing discredit upon the Member and the CAF.

In your post you even state you criticized another religion.  Why? What was the purpose of criticizing a religion? This is the point of Operation Honour; it's about inclusion, not exclusion.


----------



## CaptainCookieMonster

Buck_HRA said:
			
		

> In your post you even state you criticized another religion.  Why? What was the purpose of criticizing a religion? This is the point of Operation Honour; it's about inclusion, not exclusion.




Yes, I criticized another religion, but as a Christian apologist, although in somewhat of a spicy fashion, but not as bad as you might imagine. Forgive me for not elaborating. I owned up to my words and acknowledge them as against the CF Ethos, I did my time and understand why intended members of certain jobs need to keep quiet and not be outspoken. 
I sought out fellow Christians who were professors for counsel and they suggested I take more of a tentative and charitable approach to these matters, because people are on the end of these ideas, people with feelings of their own. I heeded their wisdom and am ready to move on.


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## CaptainCookieMonster

Also, forgive my abbreviation. I just remember everything in the army being truncated as much as possible, to the point of it almost being unintelligible.


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## ldorgo

I served 7 years in the army P Res and made it to CPL. 

i got out to transfer my pension to my civilian job.  

I applied to re-enrolling and have been waiting for a ToS for over 1.5 years and have been told to re-enroll and they will back fill my promotion. 

when I re-joined they offered me Pte 1 as if I had never served. I was told there is hope that I can get all my time back as I have been out less then 3 year. 

Does any one have any references on polices about this. 

so far i have been able to find CBI 204. Section 5, para 204.50, 204.511(2) Qualifying service


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## dapaterson

Are you going back to the same trade?


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## da1root

CBI 204
https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/corporate/policies-standards/compensation-benefits-instructions/chapter-204-pay-policy-officers-ncms.html


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## ldorgo

dapaterson said:
			
		

> Are you going back to the same trade?



I am changing trades and units and brigades and city.


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## johnsmith555

This is a bit of a long one. I was in the reserves for 4 years and put in a CT waited for 2 years. Released. Tried out for the French Foreign Legion (believe it or not) didn't pass selection so moved home reapplied to Canadian Forces last year in July. 

So I already replied for my posting preferences in February and was told May I would have a job offer by my file manager. But it didn't come and my file manager is still waiting to hear what's on the go. I'm under alot of pressure to get back in by some external things atm.

My posting preferences were asked from me in an email from Borden(not by the individual whose my file manager) so I tried to follow up a few times via email and called today but not sure why the phone number given isn't working.

So right now there's no one else I can ask about it or anything else I can do except wait? And I don't believe I should have keep trying to contact the person from Borden repeatedly since they aren't my file manager.

And I'm wondering how long should I wait before just moving on in life because again I'm under alot of pressure right now and some other things in between aren't going real swell either.

I'm not sure what's otg? So basically just asking here because I've run out of people to ask. I won't go into the personal things here but someone else has alot less patience than me and theres no leveling with them as to why I haven't got a job offer yet.


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## da1root

Sorry for the delay in response.

I know the poster has now been in contact.  However for the sake of others who might read this, when someone from Borden contacts you, it's CFRG HQ - if the number they've left isn't working or you're not being able  to get in touch with them always revert back to your CFRC. Worse case scenario your CFRC point of contact can reach out to CFRG HQ for further follow up.


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## johnsmith555

Buck_HRA said:
			
		

> Sorry for the delay in response.
> 
> I know the poster has now been in contact.  However for the sake of others who might read this, when someone from Borden contacts you, it's CFRG HQ - if the number they've left isn't working or you're not being able  to get in touch with them always revert back to your CFRC. Worse case scenario your CFRC point of contact can reach out to CFRG HQ for further follow up.



Thank you for the information I was talking to my CFRC point of contact. Anyways it was all sorted out. Hopefully I didn't come across as venting too much. It's a long story about getting out and getting back in for me ha.


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## Attie3

Hey Buck, 

When I make the transition from PSSA to CAF, do you know what would happen to the vacation and sick time that I accumulated until the formal transition? Does it get moved over?
If not, should I use it all before leaving?

Thanks so much!


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## mariomike

Attie3 said:
			
		

> When I make the transition from PSSA to CAF,



Are you re-enrolling with prior service in the CAF?

From: General CFRC Questions – Regular Forces



			
				Attie3 said:
			
		

> So I am thinking of joining and I am currently employed within PSSA.


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## Attie3

mariomike said:
			
		

> Are you re-enrolling with prior service in the CAF?
> 
> From: General CFRC Questions – Regular Forces



No prior service from CAF. But I have vacation and sick time from public service. 
I thought my questions would be a bit related so I asked here. Sorry if it wasn't related.


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## mariomike

Attie3 said:
			
		

> No prior service from CAF. But I have vacation and sick time from public service.
> I thought my questions would be a bit related so I asked here. Sorry if it wasn't related.



No need to be sorry.

Thank-you for the clarification.


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## dapaterson

On departure from the PS, any banked vacation leave will be cashed out; it does not carry over to the military.

The military does not have banked sick leave; it is given as/when required.  Any accumulated sick leave in the PS, to my knowledge, will be lost on termination.


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## da1root

Attie3 said:
			
		

> Hey Buck,
> 
> When I make the transition from PSSA to CAF, do you know what would happen to the vacation and sick time that I accumulated until the formal transition? Does it get moved over?
> If not, should I use it all before leaving?
> 
> Thanks so much!



CAF "vacation" (leave) is a separate policy from PSSA vacation.  Any vacation that you have with the PSSA will need to be utilized prior to you leaving your PSSA job.
The CAF Leave Manual is the authority for leave in the CAF and sick leave is given/used when needed and cannot be "banked".  Annual Leave in the CAF can no longer be banked/carried forward either (unless for operational requirements).


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## Mirin

The last item pending on my application is a 4C re-enrollment waiver.  It was requested over 2 months ago, and yet, I have heard nothing of the process.  Older posts allude to writing a letter addressed to the CO CFRC, yet this hasn't been communicated to me.  The MCC interviewing me didn't mention it, but when I've checked in with the file manager over the last 2 months, the consensus is that this waiver has been initiated and pending approval.   Can anybody shed any light on this?  I released prior to reaching OFP.  The MCC got confirmation that I would bypass CFLRS which to me would indicate the PLAR process has also been completed.  Medical was approved.  I looked on the online application portal and my file reverted from "ready for competition list" to "final processing".  The file manager claimed it was a mistake, noting that the 4C waiver hadn't been approved, which I believe.  It seems like everything is finished except for the waiver.  Is there anything I should be doing here, or wait it out?


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## Mirin

My MCC got in touch with me in mid-March to write the letter explaining why I should be allowed to re-enroll.  Finished it promptly and returned it.  Granted, with the Covid pandemic, I remind myself that things take time, and CFRCs are still on minimum manning (according to the MCC at the end of June).  Anyway, I checked the online application portal and my file again went from 'final processing' to 'ready for competition list' at the end of July.  I emailed the MCC again yesterday, and the status again was reverted to 'final processing', within the hour and no response from the MCC either.  I'd love to know what's happening, but of course unlikely I'll get an answer.  I'm thinking somebody has moved me over to a new bin by mistake (twice now), or the waiver is in fact approved, and the CFRC is doing one final check of my file before moving me over for the last time.  Oh well, at least I have a job with federal government, so it's all pensionable time


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