# Criminal Records Check - CRC (Merged)



## Havok

hello all..i am a newbie to this board....anyways i have done searches regarding this question but couldn‘t really find my answer so here goes....what if you have a criminal record as an adult for which you do not have pardons? will this exclude you from regular forces ? obviously i know you wouldn‘t be able to be an officer or get high security clearance but seeing as i don‘t have apardons will this exclude me from the service altogether ? i am 32 and have had no problems with the law for ten years and no judiciary obligations now... it just sucks that i made some really bad decisions when i was younger and am constantly paying for them...yes i do take full responsibility for all my actions and they were my own fault... but i have already applied thru the dnd website and am hoping for the best.

if anyone knows the answer i would appreciate any info.... thanx


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## portcullisguy

As far as I know, you must have no "obligations to the legal system" to join the Canadian Forces.

To me, this means that you may not have a charge before the courts (and be on bail or release), be on probation or parole, or be wanted - obviously.

This doesn‘t mean that you cannot have a criminal record.  I am guessing you probably need a pardon.  Check with your local recruiter.

Depending on the nature of the conviction, they may or may not accept you.  Again, talk to a recruiter.


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## Fusaki

Your security check might take a little longer then normal, but I don‘t think there would be a problem. They might want job references and a letter or essay from you explaining yourself, but 10 years was a long time ago and the recruiters would probably understand that you‘ve matured since then.

Good Luck!!


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## ProPatria05

I am not the SME on this, but this is what I have been told and have read, and is based on my own personal experience.

Having a criminal record does not preclude you from becoming a member of the Canadian Forces, either Regular or Reserve, as an NCM or an Officer. You do not have to have a pardon, either. The CF simply requires that you are "of good character" and have no outstanding obligations to the legal system, which means a number of things including:
- family court issues
- pending charges
- outstanding fines
- are on probation, parole
- etc.

Having said all that, a criminal record *will* be one of the facts considered when you are being considered for acceptance. If you just got out of prison for attempted murder, your chances of being accepted are likely slim to none. If you were charged with a break and enter when you were 18, and have not been in trouble since, that is a different matter.

My own personal experience: I have a criminal record for impaired driving dating back to 1992, when I was 19. It did not keep me from joining the Reserves as an Officer. In addition, I am currently applying for transfer to the Reg Force, and my file will go before the selection board in May. Now, I was advised that although it will not automatically prevent me from being selected, it will be taken into account with all other facts in my file (education, experience, interview, etc.)

Hope this helps.


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## Michael Dorosh

Murph - just a quick note of admiration for your honesty; it is appreciated.


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## Havok

thanks.....okay well i am going ahead anyways...none of my crimes involved violence or anything like that and my references are a police officer and a customs officer so i guess i will just keep my fingers crossed cause i really want to join and i will just tell it like it is when i go for my appt. i am employed so it‘s not like i am joining cause i can‘t find a job..the army is the job i want !


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## Illucigen

The major issue to remember is that CSIS must clear you for a security clearance. For most NCM jobs this isnt an issue, but a basic officer requires Secret (at least Reg force, not sure about Res, I would assume its the same)

Secret normally requires a pardon for all convictions, but one such as DUI may be acceptable if its not all that recent, since it is fairly non-violent, and no further incidents have occured.

Keep in mind CSIS is now doing credit checks as well for clearances. If they think you are going to defraud the system, or your character is in doubt in any way, CSIS will decline you, and the forces will have to release you.

Sure you may get accepted in, since the forces will probably assume in most cases CSIS will accept. But its not DND that approves your clearance, its CSIS.


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## Illucigen

Best bet would be to look up clearance info on the web, on CSIS‘s home page. Ive looked at it before when I was going through the system.


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## Fusaki

A "pardon" means that you were convicted, but returned to the courts later on to clear your criminal record, correct?

Sorry, I‘m not up on the lawyer lingo...


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## Havok

actually you have to apply to the national parole board for a pardon following five years after you have served the sentence and any probation but it can take up to 18 months to process


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## placersweet

Hello
I was wondering how much it matters if you have a youth record and apply to the forces. I‘m under the impression that 
having a youth record doesn‘t affect you as an adult. But is the army different? For instance I‘m in the process for applying for the 291 trade and was wondering if this might affect my chances. Will I have to state that I have a young offenders record or not? Any help would be appreciated.
thanks


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## klumanth

I don‘t think that would be a problem getting into the forces but it could well be a problem for the 291 trade because you need a top secret clearance.  Depends on the offense(s) I‘m sure.  I am positive that CSIS will have no problem finding out about your record whether you tell them or not.


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## Danjanou

Depending on the offence and when commited, you may be eligible for a pardon or waiver. 

Check her for further info  

Pardons & Waivers Experts

www.waiver.com


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## gozonuts

I applied for direct officer entry program, and of course it‘s taking ages to get any progress. I applied 8 months ago, not long by what I see here. I am finished my finger printing and am waiting for the security clearance. Now here is my problem, I have a criminal record! Nothing fancy, just mischief and a weapons offence(girlfriends pepper spray) and this was all 15 and 8 years ago respectively. How much is this going to affect my chances at becoming an officer? And what exactly would be a ‘deal-breaker‘ in my clearance check results, would it have to be murder or some drastic nonsense?


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## Jug

The weapons charge could be a deal breaker....depending on the details of the case and how deep they dig for those details.

Give them a call if you are concerned. Better to hear from the horses mouth than wait and worry.

Call your recruiting center, then CFB Borden for the security details regarding to your case.

Cheers,
Jug


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## Zoomie

I would also get the ball rolling to start an official Pardoning of your crimes.  You can wipe your slate clean...


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## gozonuts

Yes, I am in the process of getting a pardon, but like getting into the military, I have to wait and wait some more. Thanks for the reply!


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## krugan

Have you had any luck?


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## marc

u have a crminal record?
i got convicted last year for a few charges. im on probation right now but should be off later this year. a pardon is out of the question for at least a few more years. so am i eligible to join once my probation is done?


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## Spartan

theres a certain time limit involved and it depends on the situation, best bet would be talk to people from CFRC...


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## Ender57

I‘m in the same boat as you, I just finished my probation about 3 months ago. What I was told was that I could apply any time after finishing probation and they would decide depending on my record.

The main thing that matters is what you were originally charged with and what you want to go into. Also if you do make it past the background check they will as you about it when you go in for you interview.


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## Bruce Monkhouse

This was a long time ago[78] but at that time I was told the normal period was 6 months but they can[and did] shorten it. I was allowed the privelege of serving 4 months after finishing my probation.      CHEERS


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## portcullisguy

I believe at minimum you must have "no outstanding obligations to the courts".  However, there may be limitations depending on what your record is for.

CFRC will have the answers.  But in general, yes you CAN join the CF with a criminal record, under many circumstances.


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## marc

Yeah I read somewhere where it says you must be free of fines and probation. So I guess it possible.
I‘m going to call them on Monday and find out for sure.
Thanks for the info.


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## James Wood

any news on what you can do? i got a conditional dischage and am off probation, that was 2 yrs ago and i have no probation and fines.


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## Spr.Earl

> Originally posted by CanadianBreed:
> [qb] u have a crminal record?
> i got convicted last year for a few charges. im on probation right now but should be off later this year. a pardon is out of the question for at least a few more years. so am i eligible to join once my probation is done? [/qb]


Go down and ask at the local recuiting office with out giving you name and ask.
State which leagal restriction‘s you have and see what they say.

If you still whant to join don‘t lie about your record,they will find out in the end!!

Hounoustey is a big thing in the Military!!
We don‘t like lier‘s or cheat‘s!!  :threat: 

When you leagal obblication‘s are up,join
But remember be hounest!!


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## xFusilier

If you recieved a conditional discharge and you have complied with the conditions imposed at sentencing then your conviction should be expunged from your record.  If you are convicted of another offence, however, the conditional discharge goes back onto your record, If someone is more familiar with the Identification of Criminals Act, please enlighten me.


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## kory_ca

I wanna join the army im 16 not in school at the moment.. how old do you have to be to join?


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## fleeingjam

This is a thread for criminal records not applicable ages....any ways its 16 for reserves and 17 for reg with parental consent...the only other problem you may have is the fact that you are not in school cuz dude if your not in school they‘ll think your not smart enough for them (no offence) but for 16 year olds they really re-inforce marks and school. ANYWAYS Back to the criminal records crisis


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## pte anthony

You need to be 16 with a grade ten or level one completion for the reserves. 17 with parental consent and high school completion for regular forces.  :soldier:


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## GrahamD

You must be free of any obligation to the courts for a period of 6 months.  That means any obligation, ie fines, probation, conditional sentencing.

In my case, last year I had 1 year remaining on a court ordered 5 year weapons restiction.  I miraculously managed to get a court date within the month and applied to have the restriction lifted.  The judge ordered my restriction recinded for the purposes of employment with the C.A.F.  I took the information to the recruiting center, and was informed that they would have to close my file, and that I was not eligible to reapply for 6 months.

6 months later, I reapplied did my PT and medical (wasn‘t required to redo the apptitude test).  While awaiting some information from my allergist I received a letter for the CFRC stating that since my Enhanced Reliability Status was in question, I had to complete certain requirements in order for the CAF to decide weather or not they could trust me.

The requirements include ALL legal documentation in regards to your conviction, letters of conduct from parole/probation officers, councellors, and all your employers for the past 5 years.  Also a detailed letter from you stating EXACTLY what you did, why you did it, and what you learned from it.

A board convenes and comes to a decision in regards to your Enhanced Reliability Status.  Obviously every member of the CAF is required to have this status, and if they decide no you‘re out of luck.

In my case, I was granted "ERS", and now my application process is back on track.  So I‘m now in the same boat as everyone else, except I already have a -1 to my merit score, which is perfectly understandable.

My advice to anyone who is trying to apply with a criminal record, is to take whatever time you have remaining between the end of your court commitment and the mandatory 6 month interval, and gather all such documentation.  If you‘ve dealt with the court system you know how painfuly slow they can operate.  
That and be honest.  You will only have 1 chance, if you try to hide something, some aspect of what happend and they find out during their follow up, you will never get in.

PS.  I was also told by a recruiter that having a criminal record could potentially hinder promotions.  If I were to to be evaluated for promotion and come out even with the next person, it could potentialy come into consideration.


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## Robert008

I have a few questions that maybe someone can clear up for me. I'm going for Vehicle Technician in the Army fulltime.

1. I have been convicted about 10 years ago for carrying a prohibated weapon, and i wonder whether i still have this on my record. Is it deleted automatically after a certain amount of time. Last time i went to the Police station downtown Toronto, they had no record of me.
I plan to talk to my recruiter about this, but wonder if i should worry or will the military oversee this.

2. I have a debt of about 5g's will i be denied acceptance by the military or will i still be able to join? i plan to pay it off, but wonder if i'll get in with this on my shoulders. Some people told me i should just file for bankruptcy and it'll be done with.

Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance,

R.


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## rdschultz

I think bankruptcy would be a bad option, but I'm not sure.  Bankruptcy will look to them like you just run away from your problems.  If you confront the problem debt head on, and get a letter from them regarding the debt that indicates you and them have an agreement, it should be sufficient (it was in my case, and it was much more than 5g's).   Your credit history is checked on the reliability check, so I can't imagine they view bankruptcy as a sign of reliability.


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## koach

1. Only if a disposition is still in effect will a conviction prohibit you from joining the military.

2. As long as your dept is in good standing, you will have no problems.


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## Robert008

Thanks for the quick replies guys, you've put my mind at ease slightly. 

The criminal aspect of this is what worries me the most, but i guess that is long in the past.

As for the debt, i'm sure i can work something out with a my credit counsellor and military. 

Thanks for your help,

R.


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## casing

Ok, take this as second-hand knowledge only:

For your conviction, unless you applied for a pardon it is likely still on your record.   So when you say the TO police have no record of you... did you have them do a security check (check for criminal record)?   Costs somewhere around $25 to $30 or so and takes about a week to do.   I believe that after 5 years of the legalities of your conviction being done with you can apply for a pardon.   I'm sure a lawyer or police officer will jump in here an comment on this with more authority.

This next part I have personal experience with:

For your debt, $5K might seem like a lot, but it really is manageable.   Just follow hoser's advice and get yourself a written agreement with your creditors that you have set up a repayment plan.   And actually start making regular payments, if you haven't already.   Creditors will be happy with that as well, because at least they'll get their money.   This will show the CF that you have taken control of the situation and are acting responsibly.   They will also want to be assured that you will be able to afford your debt payments on your CF wages.

Sometimes declaring bankruptcy is the necessary choice, but I wouldn't consider doing it over $5K a very wise decision.   Bankruptcy shatters your credit rating for at least 7 years.   If you want to buy a car or house or even a stereo without having to pay cash or get someone to co-sign the loan for you, a bankruptcy will go a long way in preventing that.   

That being said, having a bankruptcy in your history will not preclude you from enrolling in the CF.   It will keep you out of the cF for a few years (from when bankruptcy was declared), though.   If you declare bankruptcy, follow all the rules laid out, and definitely show improvment in your financial maturity after that, the CF won't worry about the bankruptcy.


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## Harrier101

1) If it was an adult conviction, you must tell the recruiter. If it was a youth conviction under the YOA, it will automatically purge after 5 years and be sealed so long as you have had no more convictions. In fact, a section of the YOA, now the YJA, states that a young offender who has met certain conditions, (Too many to list here) can state that they have never been found guilty of a criminal offence after the 5 year time frame has elapsed.

2) I am with the credit counselling service of Toronto. Been with them for 18 months making 130$ payments each month. I was only 9000$ in the whole and had trouble making the minimum payments. So the credit card company's all suggested I approach  the CCS and consolidate everything. And, I called the Kingston recruiting office yesterday regarding this very subject, and I quote..."As long as nobody is coming after you for money, either through phone calls or court action. The CF does not want to get these calls as your employer. Secondly, if you can show that you are making regular payments each month towards your debt you will pass that portion of the background security check." end quote. 

Be honest with them, and you may be surprised. Not every candidate is squeaky clean.


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## Jester

hi, I'm new to this forum.
I know this question has been answered probably a million times, but every situation is different. Here it goes. On my birthdays I decided to be a dumbass and took something from a store - needless to say I got caught. I accept all responsibility for my actions. I will probably get charged with a summary offence, theft under 5000.00 under the Canadian law. I really want to enlist, and I know that having a record is really bad, and does not give me a good start. I was wondering with that kind of offence, what are my chances of getting in?
Thanks in advance for all your help.


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## Guardian

First - if you walk in the recruiting centre, full disclosure. Tell them everything and don't hide anything.

Second - not to diminish the offence (what you did was wrong, and I see you admit that) but that would probably be considered a "minor" offence. When I was in recruiting, the rule was that a person had to be clear of any judicial obligation for at least a year before beginning the recruiting process. Rules might be different now, and so the best advice I could offer is to call the recruiting centre, explain your situation as you did here, and ask them - they'll tell you.

If it still applies, though, in your case this would be a year starting when your fine / community service has been paid, or your probation period is over, whichever is later. So you're going to have to wait a while. It may hurt your chances of getting in, but it may not.

The key will be your attitude:


			
				Jester said:
			
		

> I accept all responsibility for my actions.


As long as you demonstrate this attitude throughout the process, and are completely honest, forthcoming, and open about everything, you'll still have a decent chance. 

All this said, I'm going to be blunt. We're in a life-or-death business here, and the last thing we soldiers want to see is someone coming in who has a problem keeping his hands off others' kit. In certain circumstances, the consequences could be fatal. So before you apply, ask yourself some hard, honest questions about your character... If this is a problem for you, and you have a pattern of doing this (although you may not have been caught in the past), then please do us, the CF, and yourself a favour - and don't apply.

However, if this truly was a unique moment of juvenile stupidity (and we've all had those in various forms   :blotto then pay the fine, do the time, don't do it again, and give the CF a shot when you're clear.

Best of luck, and feel free to ask us any other questions. Hope this helped.


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## Butters

Everyones stolen somthing once in their life... I'm not saying its right to do, but this shouldn't be to much of a problem. I'm sure there are tons of people currently surving in the CF right now who have had worse casing then yours. When i went to apply at the Vancouver branch the recuriter ask if I have any CURRENT criminal offences that I have not be pardoned for, also if you're currently on probation. Say No to these unless they ask if you have ever been convicted before. If it's really bugging  you and you feel they should know, then just let it out at the right time. I don't really see how this would set you back.


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## Scott

Butters, if you have been convicted of a criminal offence for which a pardon has not been granted then you have a criminal record and must disclose this when asked. No and's if's or but's about it. And if you have recieved a pardon it does not mean that your criminal record disappears, there are still certain situations where it can come back to haunt you.

My twelve pesos


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## skura

I don't want to take away from the original question here, but what if you've only had a "talking to" by the police, and now your "on the list" where if you do something again then you will be, I guess punished for it.  Me and some buddies we're hangin' out one night and for whatever reason thought it'd be a good idea to climb on to the roof of Edenwood (a middle school) and just sit.  Cops came, but nothing happened, just got our names, ages and address's.  I don't think there's anything major here, but when the reserves do a criminal record check, will this show up?

Again, my question is secondary to Jesters, so whenever someone is able to answer mine (if they can), then thanks.


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## Sine22

I am also not wanting to take away from the original post but I have a question that is related.  If you get caught for theft under as a young offender and had to do community service (I think the program was called diversion b/c it was my only offence) will I need to now get a pardon as an adult in order to join the forces as a DEO?  Thanks in advance for any help that you may be able supply.


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## Scott

Two avenues to follow here. Talk to your recruiter or someone at your local RCMP/Police Detachment. Recruiters will be able to tell you what is relevant and what is not. The cops will be able to tell you what is considered summary or criminal as far as offences go and should be able to answer your questions about having your name in the black book. All in all, remember to tell the truth, no one can help you fully unless you are completely honest.


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## Tracker

Your best bet is to go to a CFRC or call 1-800-856-8488.  There is already some bad advice here.  be honest with the recruiter that you talk to and they will give an honest answer.  The CFRC will do a criminal records name check (CRNC) on you and find out all about anyway.


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## Jester

hi everyone,

I went to court couple of days ago - seems like I will have to watch a video about what I've done - after that there will be no record - I'm so glad. I guess now or I should say after the 25th of nov I will go to the recruiting office to talk to someone about enroling


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## trebor8301

I know that when they do a crminial check that they will find everything down to tickets. I didn't pay two tickets when i was 18 and now that i'm 21 i paid them off , it wasn't really untill this year that i decided to join and smarten up my act. However it says you have to be 6 months free of any judical problem.
I was wondering if any one had any unpaid tickets and paid them off  and waited at least 6 months .if they had any problems getting in!


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## QORvanweert

they look for serious problems, unless you ever were formally charged for these tickets then you are fine.. and unless you were in jail in the last 6 months then you will be ok on that account also.


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## trebor8301

No i havent been found guilty for anything, i was pardoned when i was 18 when i got arrested at the summit of the americas it really wasn't my fault and i wasn't a trouble maker ,wrong place wrong time even the judge agreed but what exactly do you mean charged for the tickets??
tahnks in advanced!


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## gun plumber

Consider yourself lucky.A lot worse could have happened.
Thank God for giving you a second chance and do yourself and the CF proud.
Good luck.


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## Torlyn

They're looking for a criminal record check.  Provided your tickets fall under the Highway Traffic Act, there's no worries.

T


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## putz

Question for the educated out there 

A friend of mine is R031 and he wants to do a transfer to full time 031.  Straight forward so far....

He has a conviction for Arson (3-4years ago) that happened AFTER he got into the reserves, has since been dealt with served the "Time" and has the criminal conviction on record and a 10 year weapons Prohibition.  However, he is STILL in the reserves and has risen the ranks and been in for almost 7 years now.  Can he do this transfer to regs with a weapons prohibition and a criminal record.  Also, could this effect him going on a tour?  Any input would be appreciated.... (he asked me to post this as he doesn't have the internet).


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## Horse_Soldier

What I'm wondering about is why he's still in the CF.  A criminal conviction for a serious crime like arson sounds like a 2(a) release to me - especially with a weapons prohibition.  I'd be interested to know if his CO consulted his legal advisor at the time of the conviction.  I'll let the experts talk about component transfer with that kind of background.


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## beach_bum

I have to be honest in that I was wondering the same thing myself.  Was his chain even aware of what took place?  I didn't think you could be (or continue to be) a mbr of the CF with a weapons conviction.


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## putz

I don't know the whole legality of it all and how the forces deals with this (as why I am asking) but, it is stipulated in his weapons prohibition that he is allowed to use firearms in the line of work (i.e. reserves).


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## kincanucks

putz said:
			
		

> Question for the educated out there
> 
> A friend of mine is R031 and he wants to do a transfer to full time 031.   Straight forward so far....
> 
> He has a conviction for Arson (3-4years ago) that happened AFTER he got into the reserves, has since been dealt with served the "Time" and has the criminal conviction on record and a 10 year weapons Prohibition.   However, he is STILL in the reserves and has risen the ranks and been in for almost 7 years now.   Can he do this transfer to regs with a weapons prohibition and a criminal record.   Also, could this effect him going on a tour?   Any input would be appreciated.... (he asked me to post this as he doesn't have the internet).



I don't think so because as soon as they do a reliability check on him the shit will hit the fan and whatever deal, which I find very hard to believe, he has with the reserves will not extend to the Regular Force.  We won't let a civilian serve in the CF with a firearms prohibition why the hell would we let this guy.  But I have seen stranger things.


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## mike

i am going through this identical situation myself right now. just waiting to get my court docs, probation records and have gathered all my reference letters.
 i would like to know if anyone besides GrahamD and i have gone through this and what happened during the rest of their application process and what the final outcome was.
 :skull:


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## JimmyPeeOn

When I joined it was you had to have no obligations for the last 6 months, but again call and confirm that was a little bit ago.





			
				Monger said:
			
		

> You need to be 16 with a grade ten or level one completion for the reserves. 17 with parental consent and high school completion for regular forces. :soldier:


Bull, Im in the regs w/o HS diploma.  Grade 11 was as far as I went.


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## mike

GrahamD, maybe you can answer this best.


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## Loadmaster

If what?? Can you be more specific.........


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## Loadmaster

Sorry, disregard that, I never looked at the first page.


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## kincanucks

_PS.  I was also told by a recruiter that having a criminal record could potentially hinder promotions.  If I were to to be evaluated for promotion and come out even with the next person, it could potentialy come into consideration._

PS. The recruiter told you Bull Crap.


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## neilinkorea

Hi.  I am a 29 year old with a BComm and a bit of a checkered past who wants to go DEO Infantry.  I have a conditional discharge for impaired driving and assult charges which were dropped on my record, have lived in a foreign country for 4 years(South Korea), once had a discectmy to remove a piece of a ruptured disc in my back(however was cleared to go back to heavy manual work by WCB), and stopped the enrollment procedure midway through a few years ago because of an arrest.  Will the Forces even look at me or will I be questionable in too many areas?  I am looking for some opinions of people who know from personal experience as an applicant or recruiter.  Any feedback will be greatly appreciated.


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## kincanucks

neilinkorea said:
			
		

> Hi.   I am a 29 year old with a BComm and a bit of a checkered past who wants to go DEO Infantry.   I have a conditional discharge for impaired driving and assult charges which were dropped on my record, have lived in a foreign country for 4 years(South Korea), once had a discectmy to remove a piece of a ruptured disc in my back(however was cleared to go back to heavy manual work by WCB), and stopped the enrollment procedure midway through a few years ago because of an arrest.   Will the Forces even look at me or will I be questionable in too many areas?   I am looking for some opinions of people who know from personal experience as an applicant or recruiter.   Any feedback will be greatly appreciated.



Read the many threads on pre-assessments or pre-security assessments or pre-sec.  That will be the biggest hurdle for you but nothing is going to happen if you are not in Canada.


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## revolter

I want to join the army but does having a criminal record of breaking and entering at 15 risk that and does going to military school help your chances of joinning

 :skull:


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## MikeL

AFAIK, RMC is the only Military School in the Country, an it is hard too get into. If you get accepted, you join the CF as a OCdt. As for the criminal record, search around the forums, the best thing too do would be too call a Recruiting Centre and ask.


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## Fishbone Jones

MikeL said:
			
		

> As for the criminal record, search around the forums, the best thing too do would be too call a Recruiting Centre and ask.



That's the best advice. First, ask a Recruiter. Second thoroughly 'search' and read all the pertinent stuff here. There's reams of it pertaining to the questions you asked. Lastly:


Army.ca Conduct Guidelines: MUST READ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937.0.html

FRIENDLY ADVICE TO NEW MEMBERS - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937/post-259412.html#msg259412

Recruiting FAQ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/21101.0.html

Infantry FAQ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/21131.0.html

Canadian Forces Aptitude Test - http://army.ca/forums/threads/21101/post-103977.html#msg103977

Fitness requirements at enrolment, see page 12 of this brochure:
http://www.recruiting.forces.ca/media/pdf/physical_fitness_en.pdf

Search page - http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?action=search;advanced


To summarize. Welcome to Army.ca, start reading.


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## kincanucks

Offences under the YOA or YCJA are not relevent to your processing unless there is still a disposition in effect such as probation.


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## mikewalker

If i have a minor criminal record / under investigation will they still accept you or is there no way that you're going to be able to join and with having the 'record' they are all minor offences so do some times they look past it ?


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## Michael OLeary

Recruiting FAQ - Criminal Record - http://army.ca/forums/threads/21101/post-103981.html#msg103981

Welcome to Army.ca, you will find the FAQs and teh search function useful places to start.


----------



## mikewalker

I've read through those posts and they don't really hold the answer i'm looking for i have no legal oblications as it is, i.e conditions court dates etc, and my record as it stands are very very minor charges wich im sure wont pose to be a problem 

The main concern i have is i've been under investigation for the past 3 years for organized crime, though i have not been charged wich the offence or do they have proff of this it's still tied to my name, would this cause a problem with me being accepted, or is it somthing they have to look past because there is no solid "proof" of these alligations.


----------



## George Wallace

You may consider them minor, while someone else just looks at them as being "A Criminal Record"; "Black and White - No Shades of Grey".  If you have applied and received a Pardon, then that is a different story.


----------



## kincanucks

_The main concern i have is i've been under investigation for the past 3 years for organized crime, though i have not been charged wich the offence or do they have proff of this it's still tied to my name, would this cause a problem with me being accepted, or is it somthing they have to look past because there is no solid "proof" of these alligations._

What do you think?

HH


----------



## revolter

I always seem to get into trouble even when im not doing anything like my friend looks into a cars mirror to check his face and some smartass calls the cops and tells them that we were trying to break into a car and it goes into the system that i was suspected in trying to steal a car, also ive been arrested before for paintballing a building but that i really did. And ive also been arrested for breaking and entering but that didnt go on my record but i think its in the system now. with all this what do you suppose my chances of getting into the army are???


----------



## revolter

I forgot to mention i was just looking into a store window at night and a smartass called the cops saying i was breaking into the place because i wasnt really breaking into it


----------



## Fishbone Jones

Try reading from the beginning of the thread. When in doubt, call the Recruiting Centre.


----------



## GAP

Revolter said:
			
		

> I forgot to mention i was just looking into a store window at night and a smartass called the cops saying i was breaking into the place because i wasn't really breaking into it


 
Example of : *Actions have consequences*

I have a seventeen year old who complains of the same thing...hmmm

He also complains that he's not passing because he doesn't like the teachers and they don't like him

Example of : *Inactions have consequences*
 :


----------



## Michael OLeary

Revolter said:
			
		

> I always seem to get into trouble even when im not doing anything like my friend looks into a cars mirror to check his face and some smartass calls the cops and tells them that we were trying to break into a car and it goes into the system that i was suspected in trying to steal a car, also ive been arrested before for paintballing a building but that i really did. And ive also been arrested for breaking and entering but that didnt go on my record but i think its in the system now. with all this what do you suppose my chances of getting into the army are???



Well, it would appear the local cops know you well enough to be your references, so at least we'll be saved from that question from you.


----------



## teddymtl

Hi,

I have exhausted the search feature at this point and haven't found anything that sheds any light on my particular situation. My apologies if I overlooked it.

I am a Canadian who spent a bit of my life in the USA and have criminal convictions there. All obligations have been fulfilled since the start of 2007.

These convictions are not on my Canadian criminal record, though immigration seemed to indicate they will be present as notations on my RCMP file. Will these be an obstacle for the enlistment process? It would be impossible for me to get a pardon as they are not Canadian charges...

My interest is infantry which I do not believe is security sensitive.

If anyone has any insight on this I would appreciate it very much.

Cheers,

-Teddy


----------



## aesop081

teddymtl said:
			
		

> My interest is infantry which I do not believe is security sensitive.




 :rofl:

Please.....if you have no idea, dont say anything.



The recruiting process and pre-screening is the same for everyone.....your US record will undoubtably show up when they do a backgroud check on you.....

Everyone these days has the potentila to be in a security sensitive position, some more than others


----------



## teddymtl

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> :rofl:
> 
> Please.....if you have no idea, dont say anything.
> 
> 
> 
> The recruiting process and pre-screening is the same for everyone.....your US record will undoubtably show up when they do a backgroud check on you.....
> 
> Everyone these days has the potentila to be in a security sensitive position, some more than others



I understand, a recruiter had explained to me that some occupations are less selective in terms of background which is why I say that.

I am not wondering IF the record will show up, but if it will be a problem?


----------



## Michael OLeary

teddymtl said:
			
		

> I am not wondering IF the record will show up, but if it will be a problem?



Since you haven't told us what the crimes were, the answer would be .... maybe.


----------



## teddymtl

Michael O`Leary said:
			
		

> Since you haven't told us what the crimes were, the answer would be .... maybe.



Sorry 

Access Device Fraud and Simple Assault (non-domestic).


----------



## aesop081

teddymtl said:
			
		

> Access Device Fraud and Simple Assault (non-domestic).



Maybe this would be more suitable:


http://www.hcareers.ca/seeker/employer-profiles/tim-hortons-restaurants


----------



## Michael OLeary

teddymtl,

Although those do not seem to be the type of activities we may want future members of the CF to have been convicted of, there are too many possible factors for any of us here to predict how a review of your file on application to join may turn out.  Such things as punishments awarded, your own presentation to the recruiters and any available proof of restitution if required by the courts would all have to be weighed, and we cannot do that on this forum to give you any answer with confidence.  All we can do is recommend that you be completely honest with your recruiter and to accept whatever decision befalls you in the recruiting process.

Good luck.


----------



## kitrad1

teddymtl,

Unless it has changed, and I don't think that it has, you will have to obtain and submit a criminal record/name check/credit check from the FBI.


----------



## Stoker

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> Maybe this would be more suitable:
> 
> 
> http://www.hcareers.ca/seeker/employer-profiles/tim-hortons-restaurants



Hey man, the guy was only asking a question and that's the intelligent response he gets. I'd hate to see you as a recruiter.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

Michael O`Leary said:
			
		

> teddymtl,
> 
> Although those do not seem to be the type of activities we may want future members of the CF to have been convicted of, there are too many possible factors for any of us here to predict how a review of your file on application to join may turn out.  Such things as punishments awarded, your own presentation to the recruiters and any available proof of restitution if required by the courts would all have to be weighed, and we cannot do that on this forum to give you any answer with confidence.  All we can do is recommend that you be completely honest with your recruiter and to accept whatever decision befalls you in the recruiting process.
> 
> Good luck.



Question has been answered. Go see a Recruiter. 

Locked,
*
MILNET.CA STAFF*


----------



## JBoyd

Personally i am worried about my credit. I have 3 credit cards that are in collections, each with smallish amounts. 2 of them are R9. Its not that i dont want to pay them, i do, however due to the fact that i have a family consisting of 2 toddlers, among with other credit card bills and normal bills, i am only able to afford 1 payment a month so i have been consistantly paying off 1 card month by month for the last 2 1/2 years. 

My total debt equals $2000-$2500.   i am hoping this is not an issue. but if it is i will have to find a way to make it a non issue as i am very commited to recruiting.


----------



## Roy Harding

JBoyd said:
			
		

> Personally i am worried about my credit. I have 3 credit cards that are in collections, each with smallish amounts. 2 of them are R9. Its not that i dont want to pay them, i do, however due to the fact that i have a family consisting of 2 toddlers, among with other credit card bills and normal bills, i am only able to afford 1 payment a month so i have been consistantly paying off 1 card month by month for the last 2 1/2 years.
> 
> My total debt equals $2000-$2500.   i am hoping this is not an issue. but if it is i will have to find a way to make it a non issue as i am very commited to recruiting.



Get your financial house in order.  

No matter what the CF may think of your financial situation, you owe your two toddlers more stability than this.

From what you've said, your situation is not (yet) that serious - get some financial assistance/advice and address this problem - regardless the CF thinks it's a problem or not.


Roy


----------



## JBoyd

Thank you for your quick reply, and you are correct it may not be serious yet, and i do not want it to get serious, i am trying to get it taken care of as quickly and efficently as possible so that it wont hurt or harm any future my family may have. I have a prospective solution on how to get a good handle on this debt so perhaps i will investigate that route


----------



## Meridian

JBoyd,

Best of luck to you.  I am considerably more in debt than you, but have R1s across the board and an average-to-good credit rating. I also do not have children, so I suppose I could not ever fully understand your day-to-day dilemmas. That said, R9s are a concern, because they show a general failure to rectify situations that are clearly sliding...  an R2/R4 is one thing, but giving up on credit repayment and allowing an R9 (let alone several), isn't great.   The amount you have failed to pay is of little consequence, and actually, some may even look at not paying a small amount even worse than not paying a large one.

In any event, I would personally suggest meeting with a banker if you haven't already done so, and seeing about what they may be able to do for you.  With R9s, that may not be much.  Your next best bet might be a credit proposal, but if you can at all pay for this debt yourself, right now, all the better, because proposals show on your credit.   One of the things you can do is contact the company you owed money too, rather than the collection agency.   The company in some cases will reverse the bad debt if you promptly pay it back.  An agency never will. Never hurts to try. 

Lots of good threads on this topic all over the place here.


----------



## JBoyd

Well the one collection agency i am paying, is getting paid first because they offered to freeze and remove the interest. so my payments go straight to the principle. I will look into calling the credit company directly and see what i can come to with them as far as an agreement is concerned


----------



## Meridian

Yeah, keep in mind that the original creditor is losing a lot of money by going with a collections group.   A lot.  So if they can recover a portion of their money, its better than writing it all off and getting pennies on the dollar from the collections group.


----------



## JBoyd

Thanx for the tip  i would most definately like to get these collection agencys off my back. It definatly doesnt help my family any


----------



## kratz

Going with a collection agency is not always best for your credit rating though.

My ex-talked with a financial councilour. Those brokered repayment deals ruin your credit during the repayment time plus 5 to 7 years afterwards (adding upwards of 13 years). While declaring bankruptcy is a last resort option, it will only ruin your credit for 7 years. 

As for applying to the CF, being open and honest with all financial dealings is the best way to go. If you have a brokered agreement and can prove it is working or if you had to declare bankruptcy and can prove steps to a stable financial house, you will be better off in the long run.


----------



## Meridian

kratz said:
			
		

> Going with a collection agency is not always best for your credit rating though.
> 
> My ex-talked with a financial councilour. Those brokered repayment deals ruin your credit during the repayment time plus 5 to 7 years afterwards (adding upwards of 13 years). While declaring bankruptcy is a last resort option, it will only ruin your credit for 7 years.



Yes; though Im not sure if you are aware of th difference between a collection agency and a credit counseling organization.  Collection Agencies (generally) buy your debt from creditors, and then try to recover it.  Since by this point most of it is unrecoverable, they dont buy it for very much, and they are quite encouraged to recover the full amount (this is where their profit comes from).    Thus, almost always better to deal with the original creditor than the collection agency.  Plus the creditor has more power with the credit bureaus. If you make a private arrangement with the creditor, it normally WILL NOT show on your  credit history.

Credit proposals do indeed show on your credit history, because normally they are negotiated, last resort type deals that affect all your creditors, and you are more or less giving them no choice - get some cash, or I declare bankrupt.    Most creditors will take some cash vs no cash.

EDITED BY ROY HARDING TO FIX THE QUOTE BOX


----------



## Chef

???

K, here's the deal, I wanna enlist, but am very reluctant because of this enhanced reliabilty check that they perform...simply put, I have a criminal record and bad credit...do I get a chance to explain my reasons?

here's the facts in point form...

Criminal record:
Type:  Assault
When:  1998
Convicted:  2002
Received:  $150 Fine, 6 mths probation
No pardon received as of today

Credit Probs:
Type:  Unpaid child support, student loans, bills
Why?:  Basically, My ex (who has full custody) also has a drug abuse/gambling prob...and I HAVE the kids 100% of the time, she doesn't even see them on weekends for the past 6 yrs!
-She defrauds the government by claiming welfare, and when i try to fight her in court, she has salvation army defending her because she's on welfare.
-I can't work normal jobs cos of the garnishments, so now i fall back on all my other bills such as student loans.
-I have proof from our kids schools sayin that they are in my care.
-Everytime I get a job, I apply for legal aid, they say I can't get it cos I make too much, and then in a couple of weeks, I get garnished...have to quit simply cos I can't pay my bill/rent.
-When I apply for legal aid when I'm outta work, they say I have to wait 6 months b4 applying again.
-Everytime I get another job and put it in the system, I get garnished asap.

What kinda system is this? just trying to raise my kids in a safe environment and join the army so that they can be proud of me...

So what are my chances of getting into the CF?

 ??? :-\ :'( :crybaby:


----------



## Mike Baker

1. Best talk to your local CFRC.

2. Type nice an neat, so we can understand what your saying.

3. Only join if that's what you want.

4. Use the spell check.

5. No need for all the smileys.


----------



## Yrys

> Temps total passé en ligne:  	13 minutes.




I would quote a DS and say  : 



> Welcome, take some time to look around the site and all the FAQ links. Your question has already been answered several times over.
> 
> Here are some reading references that are core to how Army.ca operates. I strongly recommend you take a moment to read through these to give you a better sense for the environment here. It will help you avoid the common pitfalls which can result in miscommunication and confusion. For those that choose not to read, their actions often lead to warnings being issued or even permanent bans.
> 
> Army.ca Conduct Guidelines: MUST READ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937.0.html
> 
> MSN and ICQ "short hand" -  http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/33247.0.html
> 
> Regarding the use of "MSN speak" versus the employment of prose which is correct in grammar, spelling and punctuation, please see: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/34015/post-260446.html#msg260446
> 
> Tone and Content on Army.ca: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/51970.0.html
> 
> FRIENDLY ADVICE TO NEW MEMBERS - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937/post-259412.html#msg259412
> 
> Frequently Asked Questions - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/41136.0.html
> 
> * Recruiting FAQ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/21101.0.html
> * Army.ca Wiki Recruiting FAQ - http://army.ca/wiki/index.php/Frequently_Asked_Questions
> o Canadian Forces Aptitude Test - http://army.ca/forums/threads/21101/post-103977.html#msg103977
> o Fitness requirements at enrolment, see page 12 of this brochure: http://64.254.158.112/pdf/physical_fitness_en.pdf
> 
> * Infantry Specific FAQ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/21131.0.html
> 
> 
> CFAT practice test - http://64.254.158.112/pdf/preparing_for_aptitude_test_en.pdf
> 
> Search page - http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?action=search;advanced
> 
> Google search of Army.ca - http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=+site%3Aarmy.ca+%22search+term%22&btnG=Search&meta= (follow the link then replace "search term" with what you are looking for)
> 
> Army.ca wiki pages - http://army.ca/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
> 
> 
> To summarize. Welcome to Army.ca, start reading.
> 
> 
> 
> Milnet.ca staff


----------



## Pte.Butt

Mike Baker said:
			
		

> 1. Best talk to your local CFRC.
> 
> 2. Type nice an neat, so we can understand what your saying.
> 
> 3. Only join if that's what you want.
> 
> 4. Use the spell check.
> 
> 5. No need for all the smileys.



You forgot one Mike!

6. Welcome to Army.ca


----------



## Yrys

ButtA said:
			
		

> 6. Welcome to Army.ca



I can't say +1, can't I  ?

So I will instead write : good one  ...


----------



## Mike Baker

ButtA said:
			
		

> You forgot one Mike!
> 
> 6. Welcome to Army.ca


Whoops 


6. Welcome to Army.ca, start reading.

 ^-^


----------



## Chef

Thanks Yrys for the link, I will be reading the many links in the post you quoted!

Thanks ButtA for the warm welcome!


----------



## zipperhead_cop

Chef said:
			
		

> K, here's the deal, I wanna enlist, but am very reluctant because of this enhanced reliabilty check that they perform...simply put, I have a criminal record and bad credit...do I get a chance to explain my reasons?



It would appear you have much to explain.



			
				Chef said:
			
		

> Criminal record:
> Type:  Assault
> When:  1998
> Convicted:  2002
> Received:  $150 Fine, 6 mths probation
> No pardon received as of today



So, you fought your charge and got convicted?  And that is your only criminal conviction?  When did you apply for your pardon request?  They typically take five years after your last conviction, but there are other factors that are looked at.



			
				Chef said:
			
		

> Credit Probs:
> Type:  Unpaid child support, student loans, bills
> Why?:  Basically, My ex (who has full custody) also has a drug abuse/gambling prob...and I HAVE the kids 100% of the time, she doesn't even see them on weekends for the past 6 yrs!
> -She defrauds the government by claiming welfare, and when i try to fight her in court, she has salvation army defending her because she's on welfare.
> -I can't work normal jobs cos of the garnishments, so now i fall back on all my other bills such as student loans.
> -I have proof from our kids schools sayin that they are in my care.
> -Everytime I get a job, I apply for legal aid, they say I can't get it cos I make too much, and then in a couple of weeks, I get garnished...have to quit simply cos I can't pay my bill/rent.
> -When I apply for legal aid when I'm outta work, they say I have to wait 6 months b4 applying again.
> -Everytime I get another job and put it in the system, I get garnished asap.



So you quit your job to avoid paying child support?  I don't see there being any sort of good way to spin that.  And if the kids are in your care, why are you paying anything?  Go back to court and get the agreement changed.  If you aren't working, you should be able to get legal aid.  
Some of this tale appears to be in conflict.  



			
				Chef said:
			
		

> What kinda system is this? just trying to raise my kids in a safe environment and join the army so that they can be proud of me...
> So what are my chances of getting into the CF?



Having integrity and being 100% honest are a start to being a member.  Just bear in mind that the background check won't just look at your basic criminal record.  They will be speaking to your local police department and will find out about ALL of your contacts with them, good or bad.  
I hope it works out.  It appears you have an uphill road in front of you.


----------



## Pte.Butt

Chef said:
			
		

> Thanks Yrys for the link, I will be reading the many links in the post you quoted!
> 
> Thanks ButtA for the warm welcome!


  No worries. I hope you enjoy your time here.


----------



## kincanucks

_So what are my chances of getting into the CF?_

zero


----------



## Fishbone Jones

Go talk to the people at the Recruiting Centre.

Locked

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## NewIfant

what's the CF's policy on criminal records and new applicants?


----------



## Mike Baker

Try a search, as this has been covered many times over. And you can also phone/visit your local CFRC/D.


Happy hunting.
Beav


----------



## NewIfant

ty man, found it on hereafter your sugg  sorry for re asking a askd qeastion.


----------



## the 48th regulator

Welcome to Army.ca. Here are some reading references that are core to how Army.ca operates. I strongly recommend you take a moment to read through these to give you a better sense for the environment here. It will help you avoid the common pitfalls which can result in miscommunication and confusion. For those that choose not to read, their actions often lead to warnings being issued or even permanent bans.

Regarding the use of "MSN speak" versus the employment of prose which is correct in grammar, spelling and punctuation, please see: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/34015/post-260446.html#msg260446


*Army.ca Conduct Guidelines*: MUST READ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937.0.html

MSN and ICQ "short hand" -  http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/33247.0.html

Tone and Content on Army.ca: http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/51970.0.html

FRIENDLY ADVICE TO NEW MEMBERS - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/24937/post-259412.html#msg259412

*Frequently Asked Questions - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/41136.0.html*

Recruiting FAQ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/21101.0.html
Army.ca Wiki Recruiting FAQ - http://army.ca/wiki/index.php/Frequently_Asked_Questions
Canadian Forces Aptitude Test - http://army.ca/forums/threads/21101/post-103977.html#msg103977
Fitness requirements at enrolment, see page 12 of this brochure: http://64.254.158.112/pdf/physical_fitness_en.pdf


Infantry Specific FAQ - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/21131.0.html

CFAT practice test - http://64.254.158.112/pdf/preparing_for_aptitude_test_en.pdf

Search page - http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php?action=search;advanced

Google search of Army.ca - http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=+site%3Aarmy.ca+%22search+term%22&btnG=Search&meta= (follow the link then replace "search term" with what you are looking for)

Army.ca wiki pages  - http://army.ca/wiki/index.php/Main_Page


To summarize. Welcome to Army.ca, start reading.


----------



## 11ruke1

Will I be able to join the Canadian Armed Forces with a criminal record?Back when I was 16 and stupid I got charged with breaking and entering.I recieved 18 months probation and finished it with no trouble what so ever.I'am now 21 with a clean record because being charged at 16 I was a youth offender.Yet I'am still worried my stupid act I did when I was a teenager will stop me from becoming a soldier.


----------



## agenteagle

Best thing is just go to the local recruiting office and ask a recruiter. I would just apply and let them tell you if it will hold you back or not.


----------



## Double-R

The best thing to do is ask but I'm pretty sure the whole point of the young offenders act is that dumb decisions when we're young don't haunt you for the rest of your life.  I think they ask you if you've been charged with an offence while over the age of 18.


----------



## 11ruke1

So should I reveal the offence in the interview?


----------



## Kat Stevens

No.  Lie about it, because they REALLLLY enjoy that.


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse

From a lawyer website.

Contrary to public perception , Youth Court records are not destroyed at age 18. Evidence of prior findings of guilt under the Young Offenders Act are often used against adults in Court at bail hearings and sentencing. Young persons are never "convicted" but rather are "found guilty" of criminal offences. 

After periods of time, Youth Court records are made not available, i.e. they may be purged from the local police or R.C.M.P. databases. The periods are: 

alternative measures two years
absolute discharge one year
conditional discharge three years
other dispositions summary offences three years after all dispositions complete
indictable offences five years after all dispositions complete


Dispositions other than alternative measures and discharges will not be purged, however, if there is an intervening offence. Notwithstanding these provisions, fingerprints are transferred to the Special Fingerprints Repository and are destroyed after a further five years.


Now you must make a decision.


----------



## Baloo

Sorry, but that ain't what I would call a clean record. 

And thinking about lying, or covering it up, because you had the divine fortune to be charged under what I consider to be a toothless piece of legislature which does not absolve you of said guilt, just compounds the fact that maybe, just maybe, you should think whether or not you've "grown up."


----------



## 11ruke1

Buddy I asked for an advice alright so calm down.


----------



## JBoyd

I agree that you should ask a recruiter this question, they will be able to answer it more clearly.

with that being said, I do believe that the application & security clearance forms ask if you have ever been convicted, or convicted for which you have not received a pardon. From what Bruce said it seems that offences under the youth offenders act are not 'convictions'

When in doubt over disclose. I do not believe you can get in trouble for telling them more than you need to, you will however get into trouble for not telling them something you should have. Personally I would bring it up in the interview, chances are if there is any record of it they already know about it


----------



## FastEddy

11ruke1 said:
			
		

> So should I reveal the offence in the interview?




Most certainly.

Lets face it, theres only two possible outcomes, either you  get in or not.

And the only way you'll find out, is like "agenteagle" said, get your Butt down to your local CFRC, only they can factually answer your question.

Cheers.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

This question has been answered.....................again.

Locked

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## Ibbotson84

Hey guys i just recently completed my aptitude test and was told i passed with flying colours and was eligible for all my trade infantry and artillery..and recruiter the asked which one i wanted i chose infantry...now getting to the point after that he went on to say that they could not scheduale me for my medical (everyone else that i wrote was schedualed)and said that they have'nt gotten my backcheck yet or have even processed it from my understanding...and told me if i do not hear anything in a month to give them a call back...now i do have a youth record and adult record...youth record being theft and mischef...adult being assault possesion of pot..failure to appear and served 56 days in custody..see i had a tough chldhood both my parents died in a housefire when i was a year and a half old and was thrown around from foster home to foster home..so i ended up breaking out of c.a.s at 16 and taking life on by myself...which was a wrong idea and ended up getting into this trouble which which carried over into adult...i learned from every single one the mistakes i made and am a better person now and am trying to get my life back on the right track and am follwing my dream of joining the forces and ecoming a soldier..i have been free of the judicial system for just over 5 years..now do you think i will still be accepted or will i be refused.....i waant to be in the military so bad and won't stop until i am...but as far as my current situation goes what r my chances and what do you think it will involve in getting that ERC??..thatnks in advance


----------



## Fishbone Jones

There's five pages of the same stories, and five pages of the same answers. The first thing you guys have to do, if you want to join, is take some friggin' responsibility for your actions, fess up to the Recruiting Center, and let the chips fall where they may. Before that, read these five pages and let them sink in. 

We can't tell you what your chances are!!! Only the Recruiting Centre can.

We're done running in circles for everyone that can't be bothered to come here and even do some minor research and a modicum of reading.

Locked

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## woodsplinter

Well... the past few years I have been thinking deep and hard about applying for a position in the army as a reserve.. and I REALLY want to join. I have started all the paperwork, but still hesitant about applying because of a number of factors. First, my age. I am just turning 33. I am fit, healthy, active, full of energy and believe I can handle the physical testing without any trouble. I am not worried about the aptitude testing and alike either. As for medical issues, I have one lazy eye and the other is not great but seems fine with contacts. I'm not sure if this will pose much of a problem. 

Now the big issue... in my teenage years I dropped out of high school in grade 10, got into allot of crime and have a lengthy adult criminal record, mostly for theft, up to the age 25. My record has been clean for nearly 8 years but I have not yet applied for a pardon. I am aware that I'm not required to have a pardon as long as my background has been clean and I have no outstanding legal issues... which I don't. I have no negative credit with regards to my finances. I completed my GED in jail (with low 45-47 scores). They were low because I never studied and it was a reason to get out of jail at the time for a short bit. I wish now, with my knowledge, that I could retest tbut that isn't possible. I have regrets, but it's all in the past.

I believe I can pass whatever is thrown at me mentally and physically (excluding my eyesight issue maybe?). I have been employed for about 8 years now as a computer programmer/technician, so I don't think grade 11/12 mathematics will be an issue. I have great references and a excellent track record with my employer, co-workers, friends, etc.

Basically my age, low education, and criminal record seem to pose the biggest problem... at least to me. I really want to know what you guys think my chances are for getting recruited into the army as a infantry soldier or alike. 

Thanks,
Shawn


----------



## TopHatCat

From what I've heard and read, recruiting is really a case by case thing. I'm sure people in a smilar situation have been denied and there are others who were accepted. There is really no one who can answer whether you can get in or not. Your best bet, if you really want to join, is to apply. There is really no harm in it if it's what you really want to do. Even if they reject you, if you can find out exactly why, you might be able to still make it if/when that issue clears up.


----------



## Sonnyjim

I'm no recruiting expert, but pretty much what Tophat said about a case by case basis seems to be the SOP for the recruiting centre. I know guys who have had a past on the same page as yours and I work with them on a daily basis. Don't not apply because you think you may not make it. Your chances right now are 100% until they tell you differently in my mind. Best thing is to be blatenly honest and show them how you've changed.


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse

Only the recruiting folks can give you THE answer.....................there are stories here of people who thought they would be shoo-ins not making it and visa versa.

Apply.


----------



## adammack10

what are the chances of some one with a criminal record getting accepted(without pardon)? my charges were about 7-8 years ago and i was charged as a young offender when i was 16 , does the recruitment office just look at the information provided and judge you on that?


----------



## Loachman

Talk to a recruiter. Nobody here can give you better information, only speculation.


----------



## Occam

It's possible that your youth record may have already been closed.  You might want to check with these people:

National Parole Board

They have a Pardons info line - 1-800-874-2652


----------



## BlueJingo

Loachman said:
			
		

> Talk to a recruiter. Nobody here can give you better information, only speculation.



I agree talk to a Military Career Counselor... 
But, from my experience it has to be looked at by *one * person in Recruiting HQ and they determine if you can join or not based on the nature of the offense (sexual/violent/Grand theft etc...) and on the severity and the type of crime they make a determination of whether you can join or not. It is done on a case by case basis... They take this very seriously even though you were a young offender.

Also, they only look at it once you have applied, and done a Criminal Records Name Check (That security form with the address boxes, and asking about your particulars)

Hope that Helps


----------



## Otis

We will NOT "just rely on what we've been told" ... we do a Criminal Record check and we DO find out about youth records (they are NEVER completely "closed") ... the only way to completely remove a record is to obtain a pardon.

HOWEVER, having said that, everything depends on the offence, how long ago it was, what the 'punishment' was, how long ago the punishment ended, etc. (do NOT reveal any further information here ... I don't want to know)

The BEST thing to do is put in your application, reveal what you can in your application and let us do our job. Very little will cause a complete rejection of an application. When you do your interview with the Career Counsellor, he/she will quite likely advise you if you need to do anything prior to being accepted. When you do your interview, don't try to hide anything.Be honest about what happened and everything and let the chips fall as they may ... usually it will go in your favour (remember, we're trying to find reasons to hire people, not reasons to reject them)

Good luck, whatever you decide to do!

Otis


----------



## Occam

Here's another thought:

All you potential applicants out there with previous youth (or adult) criminal records - I think you're going about things completely the wrong way if you're asking your future employer what effect that record will have on your application.

It would be wise for anyone in this position to seek a legal opinion (from a lawyer), or talk with the people at the Pardon Information Line.  They would be the best people to advise you to what degree your records are sealed, and if it is possible for you to take any actions to minimize the effect of the criminal record on your application.

To me, it just seems silly for someone with a youth criminal record to go to their potential future employer and freely offer up the fact that they have a record, when it's possible that your particular record may be sealed and not need to be disclosed.

In short - be honest, but seek professional legal advice if there is any element of doubt as to how you should answer the question "Have you ever been convicted of a criminal offence?".


----------



## BlueJingo

WOAH WOAH WOAH

Both Otis and I actually work for the Recruiting Centre, the advice as kind as it may be is not going to assist you with getting into the CF

Regardless if a Pardon has been granted we still SEE the criminal activity even if it was though it occured while you were a minor.

The check mark box question is more to allow us to expidiate the process and ask you to provide fingerprints up front as we would have to eventually. There is no going "AROUND" if you do have a blemished record... 

If what you did was "So Bad" then as the military says "take your shit" and you don't get in, but the more you help us determine whether it was "So bad" it looks good on you.

I don't recommend you seeking legal advice for something that we will find out anyway. YOUR CALL.


----------



## jq0342

Hello Everyone

I have made my search of all discusions but have yet to find my answer.

I have done my CFAT and my medical. I had to get my finger prints taken digitally by the comissionaires as I declared my criminal record. After a long wait, they got my finger prints back and shecdualed me for a Interview.

At my interview, I was asked if I was ever convicted ( they allready knew) but I answered yes as I am a very honest person. He asked me if I was cleared of all court Obligations, after I said yes, he simply answered " oh ok good" and countinued on.

Now after he writes his report, he will send my file to Ottawa.

Can I still be denied because of my record?
Do I have to me 6 months free of any judical problem or wait 6 months after court Obligations were done? 

All my Court obligations were done before applying but were only 5 months ago to this day. 

Thank you so much in advance for everyones responce.


----------



## MikeL

Search the forums, been discussed before.

Also, to get info that is related to you call the CFRC you are dealing with and ask.


----------



## supertitanfan1

Hello,

After having a couple of my other trade choices fill up i have decided on Sig op, my interview is coming up on November 12. Now i have looked at some other post's regarding getting the necessary level 3 clearance,  and they mostly deal with people being born out of Canada or having relatives out of Canada.

but my question is what about criminal record? will this prevent me from getting my clearance for Sig op? I have no obligations to the courts and it was over 6 years ago i was convicted on some charges ( theft and fraud), i have gotten my check through the cfrc already so that is fine. 

But my main concerns are i hung around some undesirables and was one myself back then, so getting a neighbour or friend from more than 6 years ago to say a decent word about me might prove challenging and i moved alot .

 i have become a completely different person in the past 6 years, and i have many good references now but will this time in my life hinder me?


----------



## George Wallace

You could read some of the topics on CRIMINAL RECORD, SECURITY CLEARANCES and PARDONS to get a better idea.


----------



## supertitanfan1

George Wallace said:
			
		

> You could read some of the topics on CRIMINAL RECORD, SECURITY CLEARANCES and PARDONS to get a better idea.



Thanks George,

but i have, and it tells me that as long as i have no obligation to the courts that i can get into the cf, which i already know. and as i said in my post, unless i am missing something most of the security clearance topics are not related to criminal record and a security clearance but to other issues like being from a different country and such. and as far as pardons go, i can not get one for another year and a bit. i am just wanting some info on if this criminal and shady past will stop me from getting the clearance i need for Sig op, which i believe is level 3.


----------



## gcclarke

Have a look over this thread. It has 10 pages worth of information and advice.

http://forums.navy.ca/forums/threads/12896.0.html

As for whether it will prevent you from getting your clearance, I cannot speak as to whether or not it would outright prevent you from doing so, but I can tell you that the security clearance application form (Form 330-60E if you would like to do a google search to see what other information is required) specifically asks whether or not you have been convicted of a criminal offence for which you have not been granted a pardon. 

As well, in general, the point of the application forms, as far as I can tell, is to be able to provide information to the government sufficient to prove that you have been an upstanding citizen for the time period during which you're required to outline, which for all security clearances is 10 years. 

In light of this, I frankly think it would be highly doubtful that you would be granted *the highest level of trust that the Government of Canada bestows upon anyone* with an unpardoned theft and fraud conviction on your record a mere 6 years ago.


----------



## George Wallace

gcclarke said:
			
		

> In light of this, I frankly think it would be highly doubtful that you would be granted *the highest level of trust that the Government of Canada bestows upon anyone* with an unpardoned theft and fraud conviction on your record a mere 6 years ago.



This is the important part of all the discussions so far.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

Bottom line is, no one here can tell you with any certainty. All the info is in the other threads. It's going to be a crap shoot and your dice are loaded. Roll 'em and live with the consequenses.

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## ArmoredDuck

I started the whole process in late august. I frequently call the cf recruitment center for an update (every 2 weeks or so) and they tell me the same thing along the lines of "It is still processing, call back in 2 weeks" Now, my frustration grows from the fact that the recruiter says it should be done by now considering when you started the application. Secondly, I read a blog which read "The Enhanced Reliability Check can be completed at local Recruiting Centres with the exception of the criminal records and credit checks, which are conducted by Deputy Provost Marshal Security. If an applicant does not appear on either the Canadian Police Identification Centre or the Credit Bureau of Canada, the Enhanced Reliability Check can be completed in as little as 72 hours. If problems arise with either check, however, this time may be extended considerably"  Now, I know that I do not have a criminal record, never had finger prints taken from me either. So....I'm just wondering, is this normal? Could there be something wrong with my record I don't know about and is essentially holding me back?

PS: I called the recruitment center today and he told me that they are still waiting and the holidays slow things down, call back in 2 weeks.. I'm feeling the freeze  :snowman:


----------



## mellian

If there is a problem on the criminal records side, and you said never had one, maybe your full name is common enough to include someone that does have a record, and they are in the process of checking that person is not you?

If credit issue, can contact the credit bureau yourself or file for a credit check yourself to see if anything if blocking somewhere. If to young or whatever to have a credit record at all, can be same as above, too common of a name or maybe family?

Apart from that, Holidays certainly slows things down with any bureaucracy.


----------



## Robbie4296

I have just applied for Signal Tech, I do have a criminal record 6years ago going on 7 and have a pardon in the works , ther is a assault on the record , its been 2weeks since I heard anything, should I even bother expecting a call?


----------



## mariomike

Topic: "Criminal Record":  
http://forums.milnet.ca/forums/threads/12896/post-882296.html#msg882296

Topic: "Pardons - Regulations pertaining to Pardons":
http://forums.milnet.ca/forums/threads/92937/post-920989.html#msg920989

Topic: "Pardons":
http://forums.milnet.ca/forums/threads/12874/post-190365.html#msg190365


----------



## Occam

Also, there's no such beast as "Signal Tech".  You're either talking about Signal Operator, or LCIS Tech.

Do a search before asking questions, as your question has most likely been asked before.


----------



## Neolithium

Robbie4296 said:
			
		

> I have just applied for Signal Tech, I do have a criminal record 6years ago going on 7 and have a pardon in the works , ther is a assault on the record , its been 2weeks since I heard anything, should I even bother expecting a call?



Apply and find out.  It all depends on what is on your record and how recently anything has happened.  I have a criminal record from 7 years ago, and will be sworn in this July; it did slow down the application process though by several months because I had to get fingerprinted and wait for the results to be sent through the appropriate channels in Ottawa.


----------



## Robbie4296

Thanks for the info, and your right it is Signal OP, and yes I have read alot of posts regarding "criminal records" and havent really got much info other than pardon info which my papers have already been submitted, I was more asking what kinds of offences almost always dont get you in no matter how long its been i.e. drugs, violence, etc.I hear lots getting in with records but nobody really says what the record is? But thanks to all for there answers you have been helpful.


----------



## boyblue

I also had  a record  that was only a few years from now but went through the process and got in. Start BMQ in September try giving the CAFR, office a call Good luck.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

Go ask the CFRC.

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## Hewhohasnoname

Hey guys, I recently went through majorty of the application process, I completed the CFAT qualifying for all trades and have recently returned to school and completed my high school to look good on my millitary application along with working full time for more then 3 years and gained a trade as a flat roofer.  At the moment I am almost 20 years old and have a young child and a the begging buds of a family but I got a couple bone sin the closet which is gut wrenching.  Whn I was fiften almost sixteen I was hanging out with the wrong crowd and got mingled in with some skinheads which I HAVE distanced myself from now but before I did was was charged and convicited of 4 Aggrivated Assaults, 2 weapons charges, 2 Breachs of a court order, one of a bail condition where I was accused of threatening a material witnss and another breach of probation where I had fleed my home province for over a year and 1 count of damage under 5000$. I have not reoffended since I was sixteen years old and have spend time ina  youth jail, more then a year on deffered custody and more then four years on probation I was released only two months ago.  Keep in mind that was all under the youth criminal justice act and I have not reoffended in a long time and I had my probation lifted early and the judge remarked that he was pleased to release me after seeing how much progress I had made after attending anger mnagement and several other courses.  Anyways I was told youth records don't matter when you join the millitary but one as extensive as mine is is even plausable that I will pass the reliability screen and be able to join.  I am going in for finger printing tommorow to finish my applicatio.  I want to hear from someone with experience in thsi field thank you.


----------



## JMesh

As your offences were all under the Youth Criminal Justice Act, they will not be brought into play with regards to reliability status or anything of that nature. The nature or severity of the offences doesn't come into play when the offences are under the YCJA.

The only way they could affect you would be if a disposition was still in effect, which you already stated is not the case, or if you were working in a position with youth (e.g. CIC), in which case they may show up on a Vulnerable Sector Screening (I'm not entirely certain what exactly shows up on these). However, unless a VSS is required (only for CIC, or PRes or RegF having unsupervised contact with cadets, to my knowledge), it will not come into play, and the CF cannot discriminate based on the youth record.


----------



## agc

Are you sure of this information?  Or is this an educated guess?


----------



## JMesh

Sections 118 to 129 of the YCJA specifically prohibit the disclosure of information relating to youth offences to very specific criteria. In a quick perusal, I found nothing that would permit the disclosure of these records to the CF. Further to that, section 82(3)(c) specifically prohibits it from being used against an applicant to the CF.


----------



## Container

82(3)(c) does no such thing. It only requires that the Canadian Forces application form doesnt have a question on it requiring the applicant to disclose a youth conviction.

The answer is- it depends. Several of those offences require you to have been rearrested (the breaches etc) and the seriousness of the offences (4 aggravated assaults) would suggest you may have a lifetime weapons prohibition. I believe for youthes it may be discretionary. So the answer is- nobody can really tell you without knowing dates, and court orders. Your CPIC and background checks would be extremely convoluted and may or may not cause you issue. For example, a fellow recently was turned away due to his weapons prohibition due to his violence convictions. He had a pardon but his prohibitions were still hangin around.

Also, they may affect your ability to obtain a security clearance. Even reliability so that would also exclude you from the forces depending on the rules governing the clearances that day.

The only way you can know is if you apply- worst thing is they dont accept you. But it wont hurt to try- either way you lose nothing and can possibly gain. Thats not a bad situation.

Also- keep in mind that if you commit another offence over the next few years its going to bring forward all your youth convictions and they'll be on your record permanent. So if you get tempted by the wrong people again- you have alot more to lose than they do. Things that might get other people warned would probably result in charges for you since you've got a track record. I've seen it happen.

If things are the way you say they are I hope it works out for you (genuine)


----------



## JMesh

You are correct on 82(3)(c). My apologies for misreading.

However, at the end of the access period (which after looking again, may not be for a little bit yet - 5 years after completion of sentence on an indictable offence as per 119(2)), the data pertaining to his offences would be purged from CPIC, with the exception of any prohibition order, IAW 128(4). His CPIC check would therefore not be the least bit convoluted after this time period concludes (assuming no prohibition order).

For this part, assume no prohibition order. WRT the security clearance, could you elaborate on how this could affect him (I'm not entirely in the loop on how they work at this time)? Section 128 states that at the end of the access period, all records, both court and police, are to be forwarded to the librarian and archivist of Canada or the province and they cannot be personally identified (126), as even court orders would not permit it (127(4)).

To the OP: as Container said, keep working forward with your application. You have nothing to lose and much to gain. Also, please try to use better spelling and grammar in your next post, as this is part of the guidelines for use of the site.

Edit to fix error with access period.


----------



## MichelCarroll

I'm about to apply for the ROTP program. I have one concern about the interview process :

I picked up a criminal record when I was in high school. It's going to be erased in one month because of its nature, and my age at the time of the crime. Technically, it should literally disappear, and it should never haunt me afterwards.

My thought is that it's a better idea for me to wait until after next month to apply to avoid complications in my application process. However, I might be asked if I committed any criminal offenses in my lifetime.

Considering that my criminal file is going to be completely erased, and wanting to be honest during my interview process, what should I say? I don't want to tell them everything if I don't have to, but I'm also worried that I might be accused of lying in the odd instance that the file somehow pops up in the background check.

Thank you very much


----------



## ballz

Well first off, don't lie.

By the sounds of it, because you were a minor you had a juvenile record, which generally "disappears" when you reach the age of majority. It doesn't actually disappear, but it won't show up on the criminal record check.

Anyway, if you are asked about it, don't lie. Whatever you did, doing it once is a mistake. Lying just proves you're still going to keep making mistakes, and then it's no longer a mistake, it's a problem.


----------



## MichelCarroll

Good point. It's better to be straight about it.

Also, the fact that I've kept my nose clean since then goes to show how much I've changed since then.


----------



## Silverfire

I had a similar issue with my application.  During my interview when I was asked about any criminal history I stated something along the lines of,
"I was involved in an incident when I was 16 years old.  I -" 

And the MCC cut me off and said, 

"If you're under 18, I don't want to know. Thats a tricky area.  If it comes up in your background check we'll deal with it then."

Tell the truth but don't make yourself look like a sadistic killer either.  Pretend you were arrested for vandalism, you don't have to tell the MCC, "Oh yeah, I spray painted swastikas on cars and houses etc.", you can just say, "When I was younger I was arrested for vandalism.  I was hanging out with the wrong crowd and after my arrest I straightened out and got my life back on track etc."


----------



## Neill McKay

Silverfire said:
			
		

> Tell the truth but don't make yourself look like a sadistic killer either.  Pretend you were arrested for vandalism, you don't have to tell the MCC, "Oh yeah, I spray painted swastikas on cars and houses etc.", you can just say, "When I was younger I was arrested for vandalism.  I was hanging out with the wrong crowd and after my arrest I straightened out and got my life back on track etc."



Say that if it's the truth, but don't "pretend" anything.


----------



## Silverfire

Sorry, to clarify, I meant pretend as "For example."  It's late and I type to fast without rereading aha.


----------



## cupper

Definitely be honest when asked. Even though it may not show up on the initial background check, if in the future you need an advanced security clearance as part of your career advancement, they will go back through the records, and also when they are interviewing others.


----------



## brihard

Without looking for details, is this a YCJA conviction?


----------



## roadrunner60

Hey guys so i decided to apply to the cf about two months ago, just waiting for my application to sent to my local cfrc. My qeustion is most likly not easily answered by just anyone. As i read through peoples experiences ive heard "background check" and "criminal record check" and im not sure everyone knows the difference, as ive just learnt through personal experience recently. The difference being that a background check is a list of your name, physical features, tattoos, every place you have ever lived, every number youve had, every job youve had, every friend youve had, every girlfriend, as well as the obviouse criminal convictions, it also has a list of every time you have contacted police and why, and every time someone has contacted police and referenced your name and why. A criminal record check is purely of criminal convictions. The reason for my concern is that if joining the forces is anything like trying to obtain PAL was a year ago concerning this type of check, im worried. As a 20 year old ive now made better choices in life such as friends/aqaintences i associate with as well as women from my highschool years. I was in shock as the firearms officer asined to me began to ask me if i ever fought with my brother as a child or with old girlfriends or that party i was at as a highschool football player, things i even had trouble remembering. Keep in mind a criminal record check is started anew at age 18 once considered a legal adult, where as a background check will never go away as long as you may live. Anyone know anything? And no i have never been convicted, or processed at a police station let alone be handcuffed and placed in a police cruiser but ive accepted i wont have my pal in the near future i just hope to god i wont have to accept that from the cf.


----------



## Pusser

You're getting all worked up over something over which you have no control.  Your past cannot be undone.  The best thing to do now is fill out the form.  Answer all the questions HONESTLY and hope for the best.  If there are issues, you should be given a chance to explain.

Keep calm.  Carry on.

PS:  We really don't care if you fought with your brother (we assume that you did).


----------



## lethalLemon

I made some bad choices when I was young.

Nobody gave a single crap as I had cleaned up my problem areas over 2 years before even touching an RCMP/CBSA or CF application.


----------



## Robert0288

Pusser said:
			
		

> You're getting all worked up over something over which you have no control.  Your past cannot be undone.  The best thing to do now is fill out the form.  Answer all the questions HONESTLY and hope for the best.  If there are issues, you should be given a chance to explain.
> 
> Keep calm.  Carry on.
> 
> PS:  We really don't care if you fought with your brother (we assume that you did).



Make sure it is also complete.  Nothing holds up that kind of paperwork more than having gaps in your history.  Overlapping is fine, giant unexplained holes is not.  Also it isn't exactly like applying for your PAL as that is a lot more cover your arse by the CFO.


----------



## roadrunner60

What am i making sure is complete? Maybe thats a stupid qeustion or i havnt reached that point. I applyed online and still havnt been contacted by the local cfrc, im guessing its some forms there your refering too?


----------



## lethalLemon

During your application, be honest about everything and don't try to hid anything. If you do, they will find out through your Background and Criminal Record checks.

Secondly, when you do the medical questionnaire when the ask what drugs you've done, how many times and how much alcohol you drink and how often... don't bullshit your way through it.

There's two things that everyone in the military hate most - Liars and Thieves.


----------



## roadrunner60

Ok, calmed me a bit. Luckily for me i can say ive never done any drugs, smoked ciggs and only drank twice when i was 15


----------



## The_Falcon

roadrunner60 said:
			
		

> Hey guys so i decided to apply to the cf about two months ago, just waiting for my application to sent to my local cfrc. My qeustion is most likly not easily answered by just anyone. As i read through peoples experiences ive heard "background check" and "criminal record check" and im not sure everyone knows the difference, as ive just learnt through personal experience recently. The difference being that a background check is a list of your name, physical features, tattoos, every place you have ever lived, every number youve had, every job youve had, every friend youve had, every girlfriend, as well as the obviouse criminal convictions, it also has a list of every time you have contacted police and why, and every time someone has contacted police and referenced your name and why. A criminal record check is purely of criminal convictions. The reason for my concern is that if joining the forces is anything like trying to obtain PAL was a year ago concerning this type of check, im worried. As a 20 year old ive now made better choices in life such as friends/aqaintences i associate with as well as women from my highschool years. I was in shock as the firearms officer asined to me began to ask me if i ever fought with my brother as a child or with old girlfriends or that party i was at as a highschool football player, things i even had trouble remembering. Keep in mind a criminal record check is started anew at age 18 once considered a legal adult, where as a background check will never go away as long as you may live. Anyone know anything? And no i have never been convicted, or processed at a police station let alone be handcuffed and placed in a police cruiser but ive accepted i wont have my pal in the near future i just hope to god i wont have to accept that from the cf.



There is a Criminal Records Name Check (CRNC) + Credit Check as part of your reliability screening.  You will do that only if you actually pass the CFAT.  Any criminal contact (Charges/Convictions) you have had in your life (young offender or adult) WILL be flagged for review.  A more indepth background (for security clearance purposes) check ONLY occurs if based on a standardized form filled out with you and recruiter, + a query sent to Ottawa you may be concern based on foreign "ties"  (ie you lived/worked/went to school outside Canada in certain countries, for certain lengths of time, you have close family you contact regularly in certain countries.). 

Depending on resources there is also employment/education verification either done by third party contractor, or your MCC.


----------



## George Wallace

lethalLemon said:
			
		

> There's two things that everyone in the military hate most - Liars and Thieves.




Actually Liars are thieves.  They have stolen your trust.


----------



## roadrunner60

Awsome, thanks for clearing that up


----------



## tanman89

roadrunner60 said:
			
		

> Keep in mind a criminal record check is started anew at age 18 once considered a legal adult, where as a background check will never go away as long as you may live. Anyone know anything?



This is not 100% true if you are convicted of a crime within a year after you turn 18, your young offender record will be braught forward onto your adult record.


----------



## lethalLemon

tanman89 said:
			
		

> This is not 100% true if you are convicted of a crime within a year after you turn 18, your young offender record will be braught forward onto your adult record.



That is also not correct. It's not necessarily 1 year. It could be less, it could be more.



> _Will my record be destroyed when I turn 18?_
> 
> Not necessarily. Your record may be closed before you are 18, stay open after you turn 18, or even become an adult record – which is permanent. How soon your record will be destroyed depends on the sentence, how serious the crime is, and whether you commit another crime while your record is still open. The period during which a record is open is called the *access period*.


----------



## The_Falcon

tanman89 said:
			
		

> This is not 100% true if you are convicted of a crime within a year after you turn 18, your young offender record will be braught forward onto your adult record.



It doesn't matter, all records will be searched YO and Adult, if anything comes up it will be flagged and dealt with.


----------



## j1987

OK so I'm going to start off by saying the question I'm about to ask is for a close friend who has always had his eye on making a difference with the Canadian Infantry, however at the age of 18 he was in a car accident after falling asleep driving home an early November morning that in result claimed the lives of two bystanders resting in their vehicle on the side of the highway.
I'm sure at first thought you must be thinking drugs or alcohol but no, infact neither were involved causing this, he pleaded guilty and was convicted of two counts of criminal negligence causing death then being sentenced to 2 years less a day with 5 years probation.
He was released on parole for good behaviour and working the whole time he was incarcerated, now that the end of his probation is finally coming to an end his family has been asking if he is going to go for it (as again its what hes always wanted).
He still wants it  but doesn't know how the recruiters or panel are going to feel about it.

Any information from anyone who knows about these types of areas would be greatly appreciated

j1987


----------



## aesop081

I hope that your "friend" is not too attached to the idea of joining the CF.


----------



## brihard

Your 'friend' - also born in 1987 judging by the math, I would assume - will very likely never be a member of the Canadian military.

You he will almost certainly not have any luck until and unless a pardon is eventually granted- or whatever the Conservatives have renamed it to.


----------



## mikewalker28

I'm just a citizen, I know nothing about the military. But I cant get in because I decided at a young age education wasn't important, I'm sure that he's going to have a harder time with his record.

http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/goc/pardons.shtml

Might help, man what a shitty deal, it sucks how one bad choice can ruin so many lives. Even when driving!

Hope that helps, keep in mind I don't know a damn thing about the military other than commen sense, and it tells me he's going to be rejected, who knows though. I think he has to have a clean record for 7 years or so before applying.


----------



## dogger1936

mikewalker28 said:
			
		

> I'm just a citizen, I know nothing about the military. But I cant get in because I decided at a young age education wasn't important, I'm sure that he's going to have a harder time with his record.
> 
> http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/goc/pardons.shtml
> 
> Might help, man what a shitty deal, it sucks how one bad choice can ruin so many lives. Even when driving!
> 
> Hope that helps, keep in mind I don't know a damn thing about the military other than commen sense, and it tells me he's going to be rejected, who knows though. I think he has to have a clean record for 7 years or so before applying.



I had a criminal record, got pardoned and joined. He should go try to get a pardon and go from there.

Best of luck.


----------



## 421_434_226

"Legal Obligations

Additionally, you must not have any form of legal obligation. Every CF applicant must complete the reliability screening process and be conferred with Reliability Status (RS) prior to enrolment. Reliability screening is a systematic method of confirming that an individual can be expected to be reliable and trustworthy based on the verification of Reliability Checks (RC) as follows: personal data, employment history, education / professional qualifications and personal and employment references, as well as the completion of a Criminal Record Name Check (CRNC) and a credit background check". 

Assuming that you meet the eligibility criteria listed above, if you have a Criminal Code of Canada or Controlled Drugs and Substances Act conviction (or more than one conviction) as long as you have served your sentence(s) and no longer have a legal obligation then you may apply to the CF. *Please note that you do not require a pardon in order to apply.*

Bold added by myself for emphasis, I too had a record without a pardon and managed to be accepted, your friend will not know until he tries once his legal obligations have finished, in my case I applied the day after my probation ended.

http://forces.ca/en/page/faq-101#link1


----------



## belalugosi

I received a conditional discharge for something I was charged with last year. I'm currently doing 6 months unsupervised probation. 
When can I apply for the CF?


----------



## mariomike

belalugosi said:
			
		

> I'm currently doing 6 months unsupervised probation.
> When can I apply for the CF?



From the CF website:
http://www.forces.ca/en/page/faq-101

Legal Obligations

Additionally, you must not have any form of legal obligation. Every CF applicant must complete the reliability screening process and be conferred with Reliability Status (RS) prior to enrolment. Reliability screening is a systematic method of confirming that an individual can be expected to be reliable and trustworthy based on the verification of Reliability Checks (RC) as follows: personal data, employment history, education / professional qualifications and personal and employment references, as well as the completion of a Criminal Record Name Check (CRNC) and a credit background check. 

Assuming that you meet the eligibility criteria listed above, if you have a Criminal Code of Canada or Controlled Drugs and Substances Act conviction (or more than one conviction) as long as you have served your sentence(s) and no longer have a legal obligation then you may apply to the CF. Please note that you do not require a pardon in order to apply.


----------



## brihard

You will be able to apply. With a very recent criminal record, I'd not be optimistic. We have far more applicants than we need or want for many trades, and other trades simply aren't open. You will be competing against a great many people who are not criminals. I hope for your sake that you have realistic expectations about your trade options, and that other parts of your application really shine in order to over come a very glaring deficiency.


----------



## shogun506

Brihard said:
			
		

> You will be able to apply. With a very recent criminal record, I'd not be optimistic. We have far more applicants than we need or want for many trades, and other trades simply aren't open. You will be competing against a great many people who are not criminals. I hope for your sake that you have realistic expectations about your trade options, and that other parts of your application really shine in order to over come a very glaring deficiency.



But is that really the way it's looked at, or do you think it's more of a check in the box as to whether you'd have legal restrictions? I don't have experience in the area, but I think that the criminal record check might be more of a test as to whether there would be legal problems deploying you in certain areas of the country, world or working with certain populations. While it does say something about your character to have a criminal record, a lot of employers these days put a little disclaimer beside the criminal record box saying "does not necessarily mean disqualification" - meaning it's quite possible they won't hold it against you. I would say do your probation, throw an application in and tell it as it is in the interview.


----------



## Jarnhamar

Reaper-1 said:
			
		

> I think that the criminal record check might be more of a test as to whether there would be legal problems deploying you in certain areas of the country, world or working with certain populations.



More and more this is a bigger issue with the CANSOFCOM side of the house- not sure about just getting into the CF


----------



## brihard

Reaper-1 said:
			
		

> But is that really the way it's looked at, or do you think it's more of a check in the box as to whether you'd have legal restrictions? I don't have experience in the area, but I think that the criminal record check might be more of a test as to whether there would be legal problems deploying you in certain areas of the country, world or working with certain populations. While it does say something about your character to have a criminal record, a lot of employers these days put a little disclaimer beside the criminal record box saying "does not necessarily mean disqualification" - meaning it's quite possible they won't hold it against you. I would say do your probation, throw an application in and tell it as it is in the interview.



You're free to interpret things that way if that's what you choose to believe.


----------



## skyhigh10

Brihard said:
			
		

> You're free to interpret things that way if that's what you choose to believe.




Or you could contribute back to the topic and tell us all what we don't know?


----------



## Journeyman

Brihard, who has worked in recruiting, _has_ expressed how the criminal record is actually viewed.

Reaper-1, who stated quite openly that "I don't have experience in the area," but went on to suggest *without any substantiation whatsoever* that 'maybe it's merely a check in the box, and it may matter for some deployments.'

Brihard, apparently wanting to avoid another toilet-bowl swirl of uninformed posts, simply responded with a "hey, believe whatever you want."


Why are things so fucking difficult in the Recruiting threads?    :brickwall:


----------



## brihard

skyhigh10 said:
			
		

> Or you could contribute back to the topic and tell us all what we don't know?



@skyhigh10 Criminals have a harder time getting into the military. #noshit #yourewelcome




I keep forgetting you need to communicate with people differently these days...


----------



## Jarnhamar

Brihard said:
			
		

> @skyhigh10 Criminals have a harder time getting into the military. #noshit #yourewelcome



That made my day thanks.


----------



## skyhigh10

Journeyman said:
			
		

> Brihard, who has worked in recruiting, _has_ expressed how the criminal record is actually viewed.
> 
> Reaper-1, who stated quite openly that "I don't have experience in the area," but went on to suggest *without any substantiation whatsoever* that 'maybe it's merely a check in the box, and it may matter for some deployments.'
> 
> Brihard, apparently wanting to avoid another toilet-bowl swirl of uninformed posts, simply responded with a "hey, believe whatever you want."
> 
> 
> Why are things so ******* difficult in the Recruiting threads?    :brickwall:



Round of applause.  

I have to manually click to see what it is that you post these days because I find you nothing short of nauseating. Like you somehow feel the need to explain to me why it's harder for those with criminal records to get into the military.  : .  Please try and explain to me further why the CF doesn't want to hire criminals ?  While you're at it, tell me where you receive telepathy lessons.   

Reaper-1  asked a few questions regarding CR processing. I know it is really hard for you to read and comprehend  without reporting, deducting MP points or shouting individuals down like an adult, but back on topic,  the response was "feel free to interpret it that way", courtesy of Brihard. Instead of being abrasive, maybe you should consider telling him he's way out to lunch for such and such a reason. Somehow that translates into a crap shoot. 



			
				Brihard said:
			
		

> @skyhigh10 Criminals have a harder time getting into the military. #noshit #yourewelcome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I keep forgetting you need to communicate with people differently these days...



Reaper asked the question, not me.


----------



## Journeyman

skyhigh10 said:
			
		

> I have to manually click to see what it is that you post these days because I find you nothing short of nauseating.


    :'(

Like everyone else on this site, if you find what you read not to your liking for whatever reason, you can:

1. Use the Report to Moderator function and let them adjudicate;

2. Unlike the several other people who slagged you for your response, you seem to have sand in your ovaries over my posts only.....so don't bother unclicking <ignore> . The people I have on ignore are there for a reason and I'm not the slightest bit curious what they have to say; and/or

3. Go away and start up your own site that's more to your liking.

Anyone of the above will not hurt my feelings. You are hardly the first person to come here believing that they're the only one in step because they misunderstood when their mom said they were "special."


----------



## muskrat89

This:


> You will be able to apply. With a very recent criminal record, I'd not be optimistic. We have far more applicants than we need or want for many trades, and other trades simply aren't open. You will be competing against a great many people who are not criminals. I hope for your sake that you have realistic expectations about your trade options, and that other parts of your application really shine in order to over come a very glaring deficiency.



Locked.

Army.ca Staff


----------



## fanmail

When I was 18 years of age I assaulted someone with a weapon. The weapon I used was a pipe wrench. They charged me as an adult with a summary offence with an assault with a weapon charge. I am almost done probation and I was wondering if I could qualify to join the military. Long story short about the pipe wrench is someone was bullying me for weeks and I just snapped, I barely hurt the person, just a small bruise. I know what I did was wrong but I guess the term paying for your mistakes are here for a reason. Anyway if anyone could help out or answer my question I would appreciate it. Thanks.


----------



## vonGarvin

"Effect" is a noun, "affect" is a verb,  and 18 year olds are adults.  Demonstrate that you know these facts before going to see a recruiter.  A recruiter will be able to answer with facts; here you will only get opinions.  So, my point is this: facts are important.


----------



## fanmail

Yes your are right.


----------



## Occam

fanmail said:
			
		

> When I was 18 years of age I assaulted someone with a weapon. The weapon I used was a pipe wrench.



Like you, I also assaulted someone when I was in my teens, although in my case it was using a candlestick in a library.  I went on to have a successful career in the military.

Regards,

Colonel Mustard

(Come on, I know you were thinking it...)


----------



## fanmail

I guess that give me some hope...


----------



## Occam

fanmail said:
			
		

> I guess that give me some hope...



Oh my - I'm guessing "Clue" is not as popular a board game as when us forty-somethings were kids...

The truth is as Technoviking explained it.  Every situation is different, and they'll have to evaluate your situation on its own merits.


----------



## fanmail

You were playing clue, woa thats some big candle stick.


----------



## mariomike

fanmail said:
			
		

> Anyway if anyone could help out or answer my question I would appreciate it.



You may find this helpful.

"Criminal Record (merged)":
http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/12896.0


----------



## Dylan L

Hi everyone.  I have been creeping around these forums for a few months and decided to join.  I apologize to the staff for not being able to locate a formal introduction thread.  In lieu, this will need to serve as my introduction to these forums for the time being.

Now, onto addressing the reason I came into this topic.

I have dreamed of joining The Canadian Forces since I was, as my profile states, "a snotty nosed kid".  I am going to my local recruitment office tomorrow and will be attempting to join the Canadian (Regular) Forces.  However, back in April 2012 when I was 18 years old I was charged with a DUI, blowing a 0.12.  I have for the most part quit drinking since then because of this and have not been in trouble with the law since.  At this point, it has been 10 months since I was arrested, 8 months since convicted and am now 19 years old.  I have $1,200 owing to the police and $500 owing to SGI.  Will this DUI charge or the $1,700 in fines disqualify me from joining? (I am applying to become an infantry soldier).

-Edit: Fixed some spelling errors.


----------



## Dylan L

I went to the Regina CFRC today and told the recruiter about my DUI.  He told me that having my license suspended (1 year) was a form of legal obligation up until the end of the suspension.  So in the end, after a nice chat about various things he politely told me to come back when my suspension is done in July and put an application in.  

-Edit: Spelling.


----------



## brihard

Dylan L said:
			
		

> I went to the Regina CFRC today and told the recruiter about my DUI.  He told me that having my license suspended (1 year) was a form of legal obligation up until the end of the suspension.  So in the end, after a nice chat about various things he politely told me to come back when my suspension is done in July and put an application in.
> 
> -Edit: Spelling.



The legal obligation is the hard and fast 'can't *apply* until'. On top of that, you can reasonably expect that a very recent criminal record will be a considerable detriment to your competitiveness for whatever you apply to.

At the end of the day, yes, many people make many mistakes. However, most people don't err so seriously as to end up with a criminal record. It's an indication that, at this point in your life, there is real reason to believe that behavioural and/or judgment problems may be present. Issues that are indicative of alcohol abuse are something that often generate particular sensitivity within the institution, as it's a classic 'dumb young male who hasn't got his stuff together' behavioural pattern. The thing is that we need to know that you are a mature, responsible person (or some approximation thereof) NOW, not that you have potential to be.

All this to say- by all means, apply. You have that right and I genuinely applaud your desire to serve. However the serious mistake you made not too long ago will quite likely work against you, especially when many of our trades are so competitive right now. Were I you, I would have other plans in place to see me through the next five years should this not work out.

Keep your nose clean and keep working at it, earn your pardon, and things will look up for you down the road. That's why the pardon system exists. In the short term, if you get in, you will probably be able to consider yourself lucky.


----------



## Dylan L

That is exactly what has me awake at night, the fact that I no longer go about my life as a carefree gadabout but will most likely be seen that way because of this DUI.  Around 6 months ago I went through a pretty "sobering" experience and now pride myself in my new level of maturity compared to how I used to conduct myself.  Sadly I know there will be little hope of proving this to the CF through paperwork.  

As I told the recruiter, I'm going to take this few months to upgrade myself in as many ways as possible, that made him crack a smile.  He said that I could potentially make up for my shortcoming in other fields such as fitness, grades, community service, types of work that i do, ect.  So i'm going to heed these words and do all that I can.  

Sorry for going off topic, but one question.  Would going to a alcohol screening and proving you're not an alcoholic help a person in any way at all during the application process?


----------



## The_Green_Basterd

A recent interesting court case that might have an impact on Criminal Record results and getting into the CF.

http://www.employmentlawtoday.com/articleview/17203-westjet-employees-bid-to-get-job-back-denied-because-of-involvement-in-drug-raid


----------



## The_Green_Basterd

Dylan L said:
			
		

> That is exactly what has me awake at night, the fact that I no longer go about my life as a carefree gadabout but will most likely be seen that way because of this DUI.  Around 6 months ago I went through a pretty "sobering" experience and now pride myself in my new level of maturity compared to how I used to conduct myself.  Sadly I know there will be little hope of proving this to the CF through paperwork.
> 
> As I told the recruiter, I'm going to take this few months to upgrade myself in as many ways as possible, that made him crack a smile.  He said that I could potentially make up for my shortcoming in other fields such as fitness, grades, community service, types of work that i do, ect.  So i'm going to heed these words and do all that I can.
> 
> Sorry for going off topic, but one question.  Would going to a alcohol screening and proving you're not an alcoholic help a person in any way at all during the application process?



Once your prohabition is over and you have paid your fines off, you are eligible to apply.


----------



## The_Falcon

The_Green_Basterd said:
			
		

> A recent interesting court case that might have an impact on Criminal Record results and getting into the CF.
> 
> http://www.employmentlawtoday.com/articleview/17203-westjet-employees-bid-to-get-job-back-denied-because-of-involvement-in-drug-raid



Not really, it basically describes what already happens.  In this instance, she choose to challenge her denial, and lost the challenge.


----------



## cupper

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> Not really, it basically describes what already happens.  In this instance, she choose to challenge her denial, and lost the challenge.





			
				The_Green_Basterd said:
			
		

> A recent interesting court case that might have an impact on Criminal Record results and getting into the CF.
> 
> http://www.employmentlawtoday.com/articleview/17203-westjet-employees-bid-to-get-job-back-denied-because-of-involvement-in-drug-raid



Title of the article pretty much says it all.


----------



## The_Green_Basterd

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> Not really, it basically describes what already happens.  In this instance, she choose to challenge her denial, and lost the challenge.



What I felt was interesting was that she was never charged with the crime yet the court is saying it can still be used to deny reliability status.  It doesn't say, but I think the database she showed up in was PRIME, because the article says her involvement in the case was erased everywhere else, but i am only assuming.


----------



## cupper

Proud_Canadian said:
			
		

> What I felt was interesting was that she was never charged with the crime yet the court is saying it can still be used to deny reliability status.  It doesn't say, but I think the database she showed up in was PRIME, because the article says her involvement in the case was erased everywhere else, but i am only assuming.





> “While there may not have been sufficient evidence to convict the applicant, the facts reasonably support a belief she was either closely connected to this activity or willfully blind to it,” said the court. “A criminal conviction is sustained on proof beyond a reasonable doubt. *Denial of a security clearance requires only a reasonable belief, on a balance of probabilities, that a person may be prone to or induced to commit an act that may interfere with civil aviation.”*
> 
> *The court also found the Minister of Transport has the legal discretion to grant or refuse security clearance, regardless of the reason*.



Remember, this is a reliability check. It is a judgement on how reliable someone is. And part of that is whom the person may be associated with.


----------



## The_Falcon

Proud_Canadian said:
			
		

> What I felt was interesting was that she was never charged with the crime yet the court is saying it can still be used to deny reliability status.  It doesn't say, but I think the database she showed up in was PRIME, because the article says her involvement in the case was erased everywhere else, but i am only assuming.



She was charged, however the charges were stayed.  Doesn't mean she didn't commit any crime or is innocent of any involvement.  



			
				cupper said:
			
		

> Remember, this is a reliability check. It is a judgement on how reliable someone is. And part of that is whom the person may be associated with.



Also IIRC from what the MCC's told me, whomever grants the reliability status, it's their ass on the line, if they saw red flags, but grant the status anyways.


----------



## brandon9367

Hey guys kinda new to this forum, and I know there a bunch of posts asking the same question but I just want to narrow it down to my perspective. 
So I applied for infantry, MP, and Artillary via online registration back in January.
I then got my first charge in april for possession of a weapon for dangerous purpose but it should get dropped since I was defending myself in my own home. A few days after i got charged my recruiter called for an interview, real shitty.  Now the rest of the charges happened just from plain stupidity while I was livingon the streets. I'm trying not to plead on any of the charges but I just want to know if I could join if I do get convicted. Anyways I'll list my charges below. 

Weapons dangerous
2 theft under $5000 ( I stole my own bike and got charged?)
4 possession of stolen good under $5000
3 Recognizance/OIC Undertaking breaches (I got one breach dropped)

But now I am back living at home on bail waiting for all this to go through and i havent gotten into any trouble with the law since. But i was wondering if this would stop me. I've been told by a lot of people the weapon charge will screw me for it. But lets say I atleast get that charged dropped, would the take me once probation is over? What would be the best charges to get rid of? Thanks!

P.S.  I do not have a youth record!


----------



## Bassil_Inf

brandon9367 said:
			
		

> Hey guys kinda new to this forum, and I know there a bunch of posts asking the same question but I just want to narrow it down to my perspective.
> So I applied for infantry, MP, and Artillary via online registration back in January.
> I then got my first charge in april for possession of a weapon for dangerous purpose but it should get dropped since I was defending myself in my own home. A few days after i got charged my recruiter called for an interview, real shitty.  Now the rest of the charges happened just from plain stupidity while I was livingon the streets. I'm trying not to plead on any of the charges but I just want to know if I could join if I do get convicted. Anyways I'll list my charges below.
> 
> Weapons dangerous
> 2 theft under $5000 ( I stole my own bike and got charged?)
> 4 possession of stolen good under $5000
> 3 Recognizance/OIC Undertaking breaches (I got one breach dropped)
> 
> But now I am back living at home on bail waiting for all this to go through and i havent gotten into any trouble with the law since. But i was wondering if this would stop me. I've been told by a lot of people the weapon charge will screw me for it. But lets say I atleast get that charged dropped, would the take me once probation is over? What would be the best charges to get rid of? Thanks!
> 
> P.S.  I do not have a youth record!


Did you mention any of this to the recruiter whilst you did your interview?
Site: http://www.forces.ca/en/page/faq-101


> LEGAL OBLIGATIONS
> 
> Additionally, you must not have any form of legal obligation. Every CF applicant must complete the reliability screening process and be conferred with Reliability Status (RS) prior to enrolment. Reliability screening is a systematic method of confirming that an individual can be expected to be reliable and trustworthy based on the verification of Reliability Checks (RC) as follows: personal data, employment history, education / professional qualifications and personal and employment references, as well as the completion of a Criminal Record Name Check (CRNC) and a credit background check.
> 
> Assuming that you meet the eligibility criteria listed above, if you have a Criminal Code of Canada or Controlled Drugs and Substances Act conviction (or more than one conviction)* as long as you have served your sentence(s) and no longer have a legal obligation* then you may apply to the CF. Please note that you do not require a pardon in order to apply.



Good luck.


----------



## brandon9367

Yes I told him that I would get back to him because I was dealing with stuff in court


----------



## JorgSlice

Honestly, until the courts decide your fate, they won't even entertain an application with your name on it.

Then if you're convicted... Well, you'll have to serve out your sentence/conditions, possibly gain a pardon on top, and very very rare chance of getting anywhere close to MP.

For now, concentrate on going through court. In years time when its all been decided, then you can revisit the option of a military career.


----------



## cole4722

Hello, I understand matters in regards to this are handled on a case by case basis.

I just off the phone with a recruiter from my local recruiting station who has looked at my file, but was not able to offer any consultation in matters of foreign implications.

I am a dual-citizen and have been for the last 10 years, (Canadian and American), I was born in the U.S.. I have resided in Canada now for the last 6 months.

 I have 3 felony warrants in the U.S. issued 7 months ago, 2 of which are bench warrants, and the other an arrest warrant. My criminal background consists of felony drug and theft charges. 

I have absolutely no criminal record in Canada. I moved here to start a new life and have worked really hard to change my life around and have been succeeding in staying clean and working a full time job, and living a healthy lifestyle. 

Does my past exclude me from my dream of the future? Any advice/help would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## DAA

cole4722 said:
			
		

> Hello, I understand matters in regards to this are handled on a case by case basis.
> I just off the phone with a recruiter from my local recruiting station who has looked at my file, but was not able to offer any consultation in matters of foreign implications.
> I am a dual-citizen and have been for the last 10 years, (Canadian and American), I was born in the U.S.. I have resided in Canada now for the last 6 months.
> I have 3 felony warrants in the U.S. issued 7 months ago, 2 of which are bench warrants, and the other an arrest warrant. My criminal background consists of felony drug and theft charges.
> I have absolutely no criminal record in Canada. I moved here to start a new life and have worked really hard to change my life around and have been succeeding in staying clean and working a full time job, and living a healthy lifestyle.
> Does my past exclude me from my dream of the future? Any advice/help would be greatly appreciated.



If you have "judicial" obligations, then you CANNOT be processed, ALL STOP!!!  So as you mentioned above, you appear to have certain commitments south of the border that need tending to.  As a result, you need to deal with those prior to your application to CF going any further.


----------



## PuckChaser

cole4722 said:
			
		

> I have 3 felony warrants in the U.S. issued 7 months ago, 2 of which are bench warrants, and the other an arrest warrant. My criminal background consists of felony drug and theft charges.



I really hope you're just trolling, and don't think someone with open felony warrants will get enrolled in the CF? ESPECIALLY with drug and theft charges?  :facepalm:


----------



## matthew709

hi first time poster on this site. I could use some help regarding my situation. I will keep it as brief as possible but it could take a decent amout of writing to get what I think is the necessary info out.

when I was 15 (18 now) I got charged with x2 attempted armed robbery. I eventually pled guilty to x2 theft. I was given a conditional discharge. no restricted firearms, no check ins etc, just a flat discharge. my record will be dropped in may. the judge took into consideration my wanting to join the army and that's why she decided not to restrict my firearms. id like to add that the "attempted armed robbery" was a joke with a fake gun on someone who I thought wouldn't take it seriously. but that's besides the point now I guess..

i also have some things that could be on my record from when i was like 12-15. just stupid things like warnings and stuff. no actual charges. i haven't had any trouble with the law in over 3 years. im not some criminal i just did some dumb things when i was younger. im super motivated and determined to join and maybe transfer to regular force. 

so will they let me in with this situation. thanks in advance for any replies. not exactly positive if this is the correct section of the forum to post this but it seemed the right place. if any extra info is needed for a solid answer just say so and i will post it.


----------



## PuckChaser

matthew709 said:
			
		

> im not some criminal i just did some dumb things when i was younger.



Canadian law would argue you're still a criminal, you have a record. I wouldn't even bother applying with 2 theft charges on your record still.


----------



## Teager

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> Canadian law would argue you're still a criminal, you have a record. I wouldn't even bother applying with 2 theft charges on your record still.



The OP mentioned there "record will be dropped come May". Would need clarification if that is the same as a pardon or something else?

Matthew709 you are best to ensure that your record is good to go and then speak to a recruiter. Always remember to be honest when asked questions about your past.


----------



## The_Falcon

matthew709 said:
			
		

> hi first time poster on this site. I could use some help regarding my situation. I will keep it as brief as possible but it could take a decent amout of writing to get what I think is the necessary info out.
> 
> when I was 15 (18 now) I got charged with x2 attempted armed robbery. I eventually pled guilty to x2 theft. I was given a conditional discharge. no restricted firearms, no check ins etc, just a flat discharge. my record will be dropped in may. the judge took into consideration my wanting to join the army and that's why she decided not to restrict my firearms. id like to add that the "attempted armed robbery" was a joke with a fake gun on someone who I thought wouldn't take it seriously. but that's besides the point now I guess..
> 
> i also have some things that could be on my record from when i was like 12-15. just stupid things like warnings and stuff. no actual charges. i haven't had any trouble with the law in over 3 years. im not some criminal i just did some dumb things when i was younger. im super motivated and determined to join and maybe transfer to regular force.
> 
> so will they let me in with this situation. thanks in advance for any replies. not exactly positive if this is the correct section of the forum to post this but it seemed the right place. if any extra info is needed for a solid answer just say so and i will post it.



Your record won't be dropped the CF will see it (A person at CFRG HQ anways).  Unless you have a pardon your record is never dropped.


----------



## PuckChaser

Teager said:
			
		

> The OP mentioned there "record will be dropped come May". Would need clarification if that is the same as a pardon or something else?



If its a Young Offender conviction the record should be sealed when he turns 18.


----------



## The_Falcon

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> If its a Young Offender conviction the record should be sealed when he turns 18.



Not for the CAF, I explained this in another thread, the information in a YO record is sent to a very select few at CFRG HQ.  Based on the information they receive, they will simply tell the applicant's recruiting centre, to continue processing or cease processing.  There is a reason the security forms don't exclude YO offences.   And that reason is they do get checked.


----------



## PuckChaser

Good to know, thanks.


----------



## matthew709

thanks for the replys. I think things will go well with it. I will just have to contact the recruiter in may, be honest, and hope I don't get denied.


----------



## Kassam87

Hi everybody,

First time poster here, and wanted to know what the general consensus would be if I applied to the Canadian Forces.

I am 26 years old.  When I was 21, I was convicted of robbery (not armed).  I was sentenced to 18 months probation, and 5 years of weapons restrictions.  My understanding is that because the weapons restriction is imposed after my probation, I cannot apply to join the Canadian Forces until it expires (June of 2014).

That was my only charge, ever.

Once my weapons restriction is lifted, would the nature of my crime prevent me from joining the forces/clearing a security clearance for them?

Thanks for any response!


----------



## Towards_the_gap

Have you read any of the above? You will need a pardon as well as any other judicial restrictions being lifted, and even then you will find yourself with a considerable disadvantage compared to other recruits who carried themselves within the boundaries of the law.


----------



## Occam

You don't _need_ a pardon.


----------



## Towards_the_gap

Absolutely right Occam, my mistake.

The rest stands though. Criminal record? =  pretty well down the list for 'people the CF would like to hire'.

Good luck.


----------



## Phoenix80

Hi every one, 
I read this current thread from the first page and it seems no one asked the question that I have. 
What about arrest(s) records/petty charges/ but no convictions whatsoever? And those arrest records/finger prints have been officially destroyed years ago through proper channels. Court records indicate that no conviction was ever received and the charges were dropped. Can those arrest records possibly prevent a potential recruit from joining the CF? Do they even show up on the background check? 
Thank you.


----------



## CBH99

Phoenix80,

You are good to go on that front.

A stated numerous times in this thread and others, a criminal record will not necessarily affect your ability to join the Canadian Forces - although it may.  Depending on what the criminal record is for, and a variety of other factors, a criminal record may or may not have an affect on someone joining the CF.

Even with a criminal record, a person may make it through the recruitment process and join the CF.  An absolutely critical factor that is looked at is whether or not the person has any "legal obligations" - ie, probation, parole, alternative measures, court ordered fines, etc etc.

So - as someone with no legal obligations, and no criminal convictions, and a confirmed file destruction of your police file - I don't foresee this being any sort of issue in regards to your CF ambitions.


----------



## Phoenix80

Thanks CBH. 
So will they show up on the record check or not??


----------



## CBH99

No.


----------



## Phoenix80

CBH99 said:
			
		

> No.



That'a great. Thanks.


----------



## Jaunthen

I passes my skill test in the 1st third , 
All looks well from here , 
But i have a criminal record , notthing bad , no drugs no alcool
Just a kid mistake  was like 8 years ago , already asked
For Pardon.

I kinda stress with that , im all clean but that ... Anyone knows
If it will affect my admission !?


----------



## RedcapCrusader

If you have legal obligations (court, probation etc.) and have not been granted a pardon, you will be unable to enrol in the CF.


----------



## brihard

It will affect it. We cannot predict whether it will mean you will be unsuccessful. It will depend on the nature of the offence, whether you have outstanding legal obligations (court dates, probation, conditions, firearms prohibitions, etc- all of those are a hard stop on a file).

If it was a youth offence under the YCJA, it will have much less impact, if, as you've said, it's a minor offence.

The only way you will no for sure is seeing the process through.


----------



## Jaunthen

Okay no probation to fulfill , no legal obligation , nottin said about fire arms ..

Pardon is granted but have to wait till its effective !!

So all depends on what it is , and all the stuff

Around it i guess !!!

Well ill wait and see ! 

Gotta still be confident ! 

Lets go FTW !


----------



## MacIssac

I Passed my CFAT yesterday - but was obviously very honest on my past drug use as a teenager/young adult, and my criminal history which subsequently has a damper on my credit file as well. ( two outstanding fines for no insurance while driving to college) Most of my charges stem from youth offenses but have no disposition in place, my Last conviction was in 2009.
 The Sgt I spoke with immediately pulled me into a room and we had a chat about my file. As I expected I would have to wait a little bit longer until booking a time for medical and interview, because of the credit/criminal/ and reference check. That being said if you have a criminal record/bad credit just be prepared to be patient.


----------



## Tibbson

matthew709 said:
			
		

> hi first time poster on this site. I could use some help regarding my situation. I will keep it as brief as possible but it could take a decent amout of writing to get what I think is the necessary info out.
> 
> when I was 15 (18 now) I got charged with x2 attempted armed robbery. I eventually pled guilty to x2 theft. I was given a conditional discharge. no restricted firearms, no check ins etc, just a flat discharge. my record will be dropped in may. the judge took into consideration my wanting to join the army and that's why she decided not to restrict my firearms. id like to add that the "attempted armed robbery" was a joke with a fake gun on someone who I thought wouldn't take it seriously. but that's besides the point now I guess..
> 
> i also have some things that could be on my record from when i was like 12-15. just stupid things like warnings and stuff. no actual charges. i haven't had any trouble with the law in over 3 years. im not some criminal i just did some dumb things when i was younger. im super motivated and determined to join and maybe transfer to regular force.
> 
> so will they let me in with this situation. thanks in advance for any replies. not exactly positive if this is the correct section of the forum to post this but it seemed the right place. if any extra info is needed for a solid answer just say so and i will post it.



If this happened when you were under 18 and you were charged as a minor then that record is sealed.  A CPIC check would show the presence of the youth record but it would also show that it is sealed and would not show what it was for.  Essentially, as far as I have ever seen, the only record the recruiting centers are concerned about are adult in nature.


----------



## Tibbson

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> Not for the CAF, I explained this in another thread, the information in a YO record is sent to a very select few at CFRG HQ.  Based on the information they receive, they will simply tell the applicant's recruiting centre, to continue processing or cease processing.  There is a reason the security forms don't exclude YO offences.   And that reason is they do get checked.



I have never seen that.  My brother works at CFRG HQ in Borden and processes such files.  Even he cannot see a criminal record for a youth and as an MP I know that even I cannot see it when I do a CPIC check.  It is sealed at 18 and remains so.


----------



## Tibbson

Phoenix80 said:
			
		

> Hi every one,
> I read this current thread from the first page and it seems no one asked the question that I have.
> What about arrest(s) records/petty charges/ but no convictions whatsoever? And those arrest records/finger prints have been officially destroyed years ago through proper channels. Court records indicate that no conviction was ever received and the charges were dropped. Can those arrest records possibly prevent a potential recruit from joining the CF? Do they even show up on the background check?
> Thank you.



Yes, your charges and such will show up on a police records check which is the standard check conducted when they look in CPIC.  At the same time however the only things that are considered adversely against you are convictions.  Anyone can be arrested or charged with an offence however the simple principle of "innocent until proven guilty" always applies.  The standard question that gets asked by anyone requesting background when they talk to you is something along the lines of "have you ever been convicted of a crime for which a pardon has not been granted?"  That does not encompass charges so you are good as long as the charges are still not active and not disposed of by the Courts.


----------



## MacIssac

Every time I had to do a check for employment purposes the record came back with my youth offenses on paper but I think that is only because I am the one that requested the document.


----------



## DAA

Schindler's lift said:
			
		

> I have never seen that.  My brother works at CFRG HQ in Borden and processes such files.  Even he cannot see a criminal record for a youth and as an MP I know that even I cannot see it when I do a CPIC check.  It is sealed at 18 and remains so.



One would think this to be the case but it isn't and is slightly more complex than just "sealing" something when an individual turns 18.  Depending on the reason for conviction, there are periods of time which may have to pass before the record reaches the point of "non-disclosure", which can be as long as 5 years duration (beyond the existence of Judicial obligations).  

Also under the YCJA, I believe that if you have a Youth Record which is still in effect beyond the age of 18 and the individual subsequently "re-offends", the Youth Record is automatically converted over to "Adult Status".


----------



## The_Falcon

Schindler's lift said:
			
		

> I have never seen that.  My brother works at CFRG HQ in Borden and processes such files.  Even he cannot see a criminal record for a youth and as an MP I know that even I cannot see it when I do a CPIC check.  It is sealed at 18 and remains so.



That's nice, but I guess your brother isn't one of those select individuals.  I was a file manager in Toronto, and we would initiate dozens of checks every week and some of those would come back as adverse, and that we had to wait for decision from CFRG HQ , because it involved youth offences.


----------



## JoeDos

Just a quick question, I had to do a CPIC for a tour of a medium security prison and was wondering if on the security forms that I have to fill out for when I go to do my CFAT if I should put that I did a CPIC for something other then a job? I don't have a criminal record but I figures this post would sort of be relevant to the thread.


----------



## MacIssac

If you have never been convicted with a crime i would put no. Having a check done is a normal thing for employment purposes, visits to a jail, even traffic stops.


----------



## ready2go

I have briefly skimmed the posts in this topic and have found some hurtful comments and what seems to be SOME misinformed People. There are a few comments I would back up personally in this topic, like " contact your Recruiter". It's the only way to go. As this site has become very helpful in preparation towards my application process and to better familiarize myself with the understanding of Canadian Armed Forces life, I find that there is no significant value in asking more in depth questions pertaining to you personally as a harsh reality seems to be " your a criminal and always will be, the Armed Forces will never let you in" is a shame to hear from what obviously is from an uneducated human being. 

Granted we are all not idiots on here, if your applying and your just got arrested and out on bail. apply in a few years. No recruiter will offer any preparations in you openly tell them you have an outstanding legal obligation. Well were on that topic, talk to your recruiter, be honest and open. Tell them all the information, there going to find out eventually. Why waste both your time and there's, It's the Government moron's, Don't think you can hide things from them.

So if your thinking of heading down, talk to someone, tell them your story, your honestly will be understood and make you both stand out as an individual and show that your ready to face your problems and be an adult. Be proud to be a Canadian and show people that yeah maybe your a F^%$ up, but no mistake in your past will stop you from making your future right.

Cheers!


----------



## Scott

Eh?

So not everyone here is an idiot, but then you generalize all (applicants, I assume, we are talking recruiting) as morons.

I briefly skimmed the thread as well and all I see is people being honest. It seems, more and more, that some people prefer to change "honesty" into something more sinister because they simply cannot handle someone telling them the cold hard truth. It also seems that, as a recurring theme here, the more seasoned members get a little tired of being asked the same question(s) over and over. I can understand that because I get tired of having to reply to posts like yours every now and then as well.

Here it is for all morons and non-idiots alike: with a criminal record you WILL have a harder time gaining entry into the CF. FULL STOP. Hell, I'd venture a guess that there ain't many jobs out there that require one to have a record, and so if you're facing equally qualified candidates of course it's going to hurt your chances - everywhere.

And if you do not like the above: tough shit. Go talk to a recruiter, go through the added steps of the process because of your thudfuck attack(s), wait the time, and see where you land. Simples.


----------



## ready2go

It was more of a generalized comment to the specific few more than anything. I was not indicating that every or all here are idiots. I found it more geared to the others that feel the need to misinform possible candidates soly on there past indiscretions. I was doing this to notify many (what seemed) unsure applicants that certain situations shouldn't limit them. Granted I do have to agree with you in this matter that the process does take longer, but if your not willing to dedicate yourself to it why apply in the first place. I do apologize if I have made you or anyone feel singled out in this or my last post as that was not my intentions. Just felt like my moral obligation to speck my mind in this matter more then anything.


----------



## Traintosucceed

I'd like to just take the time to express my experience for those of you who can use the knowledge I learned from my application process. This is just a general post to cover what I've gone through.

When I started the application process with the Canadian Forces I had, and still do, a criminal record (for DUI). Right off the get go I was told this was not a show stopper. However, it will hinder the speed in which your application goes through the process GREATLY. It took me ten months just to get through the security and background checks. I wish that was the only thing that slowed me down, as I had credit problems as well. I owed close to 10,000 dollars in debt. Which my recruiter advised me to pay off before my application could go any further (which I done).

In closing, I say if you want to apply, do so. There is only one way to find out if you will, or will not, get approval (BE PREPARED TO WAIT). As of right now I am merit listed and waiting for my call. Don't be discouraged by your past. Push for your future and prove you've changed for the better. If all else fails, The Canadian Forces helped me get my life back together, even if I never get the call I'm waiting for.

PS. Sorry in advance for the bump of an old thread.


----------



## Tibbson

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> That's nice, but I guess your brother isn't one of those select individuals.  I was a file manager in Toronto, and we would initiate dozens of checks every week and some of those would come back as adverse, and that we had to wait for decision from CFRG HQ , because it involved youth offences.



No doubt that was the case but that does not mean that CFRG HQ can see the records.  There are mechanisms for them to inquire about the info through proper channels and they still do not see the records.  They only get it confirmed that the youth record was not for a select number of offences that would prohibit enrollment.


----------



## powerrussia

Traintosucceed said:
			
		

> I'd like to just take the time to express my experience for those of you who can use the knowledge I learned from my application process. This is just a general post to cover what I've gone through.
> 
> When I started the application process with the Canadian Forces I had, and still do, a criminal record (for DUI). Right off the get go I was told this was not a show stopper. However, it will hinder the speed in which your application goes through the process GREATLY. It took me ten months just to get through the security and background checks. I wish that was the only thing that slowed me down, as I had credit problems as well. I owed close to 10,000 dollars in debt. Which my recruiter advised me to pay off before my application could go any further (which I done).
> 
> In closing, I say if you want to apply, do so. There is only one way to find out if you will, or will not, get approval (BE PREPARED TO WAIT). As of right now I am merit listed and waiting for my call. Don't be discouraged by your past. Push for your future and prove you've changed for the better. If all else fails, The Canadian Forces helped me get my life back together, even if I never get the call I'm waiting for.
> 
> PS. Sorry in advance for the bump of an old thread.



I too had a conviction for a DUI, the only thing that was different is that it took the application a bit longer to be processed. (about 3 extra months). I got in as Pilot but since then has had a pardon granted.


----------



## tygauthier

I have a question in regards to a criminal charge I was facing. I was recently accepted into the Canadian Forces, but due to an assault charge that was pending with court dates I was unable to accept, as I had a legal obligation to be here. I took what I thought was the right approach and decided to hire a lawyer and fight the charge. I was not convicted or did not serve any time, they offered me a common law peace bond, which is set for a 24 month term in which I must abide by their conditions. ( i.e. No alcohol/substance abuse, keep the peace, be of good behaviour, etc.) My question is, would I be able to reopen my file and join the Forces under these circumstances? If I should have to wait the 24 month period before I reapply, would it be of any interest for me to just enter a guilty plead and serve a short sentence rather than wait 24 months? Thanks for your time and any feedback would be appreciated.


----------



## The_Falcon

tygauthier said:
			
		

> I have a question in regards to a criminal charge I was facing. I was recently accepted into the Canadian Forces, but due to an assault charge that was pending with court dates  I was unable to accept, as I had a legal obligation   to be here. I took what I thought was the right approach and decided to hire a lawyer and fight the charge. I was not convicted or did not serve any time, they offered me a common law peace bond, which is set for a 24 month term in which I must abide by their conditions. ( i.e. No alcohol/substance abuse, keep the peace, be of good behaviour, etc.) My question is, would I be able to reopen my file and join the Forces under these circumstances? If I should have to wait the 24 month period before I reapply, would it be of any interest for me to just enter a guilty plead and serve a short sentence rather than wait 24 months? Thanks for your time and any feedback would be appreciated.



You answered your own question.  You have a legal obligation to fulfill, so no you can't join at the moment.  Futhermore any question as to what is the best course of action is best left, to you and your counsel, as NO ONE here knows the particulars of your situation, and any option you chose will have consequences down the road.  You hired a lawyer, get advice from them, that is in theory what you are paying them for.


----------



## legalrec

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> You answered your own question.  You have a legal obligation to fulfil, so no you can't join at the moment.  Futhermore any question as to what is the best course of action is best left, to you and your counsel, as NO ONE here knows the particulars of your situation, and any option you chose well have consequences down the road. * You hired a lawyer, get advice from them,* that is in theory what you are paying them for.



Agreed.  As a lawyer, no one here should be providing you with advice regarding what type of plea you should be making.  That is the job of your criminal lawyer.  Even if you provided all the facts and we believed you, it would be wholly inappropriate for anyone to make a recommendation.  Speak to your lawyer and then your recruiter.


----------



## tygauthier

I should be more specific.. Whilst I'm on a common law peace bond, can I join/be accepted into the forces?


----------



## The_Falcon

tygauthier said:
			
		

> I should be more specific.. Whilst I'm on a common law peace bond, can I join/be accepted into the forces?



NO! Stop posting, start reading AND comprehending what is written.


----------



## brihard

tygauthier said:
			
		

> I should be more specific.. Whilst I'm on a common law peace bond, can I join/be accepted into the forces?



'Common law peace bond' is a misnomer. A 'peace bond' refers to a recognizance entered into under S. 810 of the Criminal Code of Canada. It is a legal obligation that you remain under for the duration of the peace bond.

You assaulted someone. You are lucky as hell that the crown is willing to simply impose a two year peace bond, which carries no criminal record, in lieu of prosecuting you for assault- typically not a hard offence to get a conviction on. And you're considering going with the criminal trial and eating a criminal record in lieu of going with the peace bond because you think it might help you in the very early stages of your military career?

You're a bloody fool. The consequences of a criminal record drag on for a long time. However badly you *want* to get into the military, you *need* to sort your life out and grow up. Most people don't get the chance you have to get off scot free by simply promising not to commit any more criminal offences. Give your head a shake.


----------



## unleashex

Hi. Unfortunately today i have been shoplifting to steal a pair of gloves and a lipbalm and got caught. got let off with a copy of my citation and the date of the court. so i kind of wonder what would happen next  because i already got my appointment set up in just less than a month (Canadian Forces Aptitude Test (CFAT) and the Trait Self-Descriptive Personality Inventory (TSD-PI)) and i worry too much if i wont be able to get in. i know i shouldn't have done it but it got the better of me since i dont live such a beautiful,peaceful life in the projects. i planned to say all of this to the recruiter because i want to be as honest as i can possibly be. i figured if actions doesn't win me. my loyalty, honesty and attitude may do me some good.  "this was my first crime ever" do you guys believe i still do have a chance do join the CF?


----------



## The Bread Guy

Only the recruiters can tell you if you can make it in or not - and you _do_ have to tell them.

I've merged this with a whole lot of other advice on similar issues.

*Milnet.ca Staff*


----------



## The_Falcon

unleashex said:
			
		

> Hi. Unfortunately today i have been shoplifting to steal a pair of gloves and a lipbalm and got caught. got let off with a copy of my citation and the date of the court. so i kind of wonder what would happen next  because i already got my appointment set up in just less than a month (Canadian Forces Aptitude Test (CFAT) and the Trait Self-Descriptive Personality Inventory (TSD-PI)) and i worry too much if i wont be able to get in. i know i shouldn't have done it but it got the better of me since i dont live such a beautiful,peaceful life in the projects. i planned to say all of this to the recruiter because i want to be as honest as i can possibly be. i figured if actions doesn't win me. my loyalty, honesty and attitude may do me some good.  "this was my first crime ever" do you guys believe i still do have a chance do join the CF?


Mod note/opinion
You really have two options, withdraw your application as you presently have at least one legal obligation (possibly others until there is final dispostion).  Two, proceed through the process, wasting time and resource, because the minute you point out your pending legal obligations (or the CAF finds out when your background check is conducted), you will be counseled that your file will be closed and you can reapply after you have settle your obligation to the court. 

Personal note/opinion, as I and others have mentioned multiple times in the past, the CAF is NOT an employer of last resort, and is under NO obligation to hire people just because "they" want in, or think "they" deserve a shot/second chance.  This is not the movies.  You WILL be measured against others who have not committed ANY crimes, and quite frankly, being charged for theft indicates your ARE NOT an honest person.  The CAF is full of people who have come from poor backgrounds and rough/tough situations/neighbourhoods, and yet they managed to NOT commit any crimes.


----------



## unleashex

Hatchet Man said:
			
		

> Mod note/opinion
> You really have two options, withdraw your application as you presently have at least one legal obligation (possibly others until there is final dispostion).  Two, proceed through the process, wasting time and resource, because the minute you point out your pending legal obligations (or the CAF finds out when your background check is conducted), you will be counseled that your file will be closed and you can reapply after you have settle your obligation to the court.
> 
> Personal note/opinion, as I and others have mentioned multiple times in the past, the CAF is NOT an employer of last resort, and is under NO obligation to hire people just because "they" want in, or think "they" deserve a shot/second chance.  This is not the movies.  You WILL be measured against others who have not committed ANY crimes, and quite frankly, being charged for theft indicates your ARE NOT an honest person.  The CAF is full of people who have come from poor backgrounds and rough/tough situations/neighbourhoods, and yet they managed to NOT commit any crimes.



Huh, weird i did not get any notification on your reply. Tho i appreciate because you gave me an answer. I think you should keep your personal note to yourself cause i find it rather insulting. laugh if ud like. but theft and honesty are not hand to hand in my book. you can ask me anything you'd like to know and i would be loyal and as honest as i can possibly be to be truthful so how would that determine that i am not an honest person? Hence that makes me believe you don't know anything about the type of life i had lived. Maybe i hadnt been brought up with discipline i shouldve been brought up with. But i am sure as hell i got values that i believe in.


----------



## McG

You are insulted?  If your values have place to allow theft, then your integrity is junk.  Every serving member on this site would prefer to fight beside somebody they can trust.



			
				unleashex said:
			
		

> i have done so foolishly cause i didn't have money to buy it and needed money for food instead.


This is not honest behaviour.


----------



## The_Falcon

unleashex said:
			
		

> Huh, weird i did not get any notification on your reply. Tho i appreciate because you gave me an answer. I think you should keep your personal note to yourself cause i find it rather insulting. laugh if ud like. but theft and honesty are not hand to hand in my book. you can ask me anything you'd like to know and i would be loyal and as honest as i can possibly be to be truthful so how would that determine that i am not an honest person? Hence that makes me believe you don't know anything about the type of life i had lived. Maybe i hadnt been brought up with discipline i shouldve been brought up with. But i am sure as hell i got values that i believe in.



First, your grammar and spelling are atrocious, you will use proper English (or French) grammar and spelling on this site.  That is not a request, we are not your friends here and this isn't your Facebook wall. 

Second, you can find my personal opinion insulting all you want, I don't frankly care, you are the one trying to join the organization that I served for 12 years, and if you think people want to serve beside someone who is an admitted thief, you are mistaken, VERY mistaken. 

Third, while in "your book" honesty and theft can somehow illogically co-exist, well quite frankly, your opinion on the matter is irrelevant.  The only "books" that matter is the National Defence Act, the Criminal Code of Canada, and the "books" of every serving member. As I said in my second point above and MCG in his post, you will NOT find anyone in the CAF that supports your absurd notion that you can maintain your honesty and be a thief.


----------



## Pusser

tygauthier said:
			
		

> I have a question in regards to a criminal charge I was facing. I was recently accepted into the Canadian Forces, but due to an assault charge that was pending with court dates I was unable to accept, as I had a legal obligation to be here. I took what I thought was the right approach and decided to hire a lawyer and fight the charge. I was not convicted or did not serve any time, they offered me a *common law peace bond, which is set for a 24 month term in which I must abide by their conditions. ( i.e. No alcohol/substance abuse, keep the peace, be of good behaviour, *  etc.) My question is, would I be able to reopen my file and join the Forces under these circumstances? If I should have to wait the 24 month period before I reapply, would it be of any interest for me to just enter a guilty plead and serve a short sentence rather than wait 24 months? Thanks for your time and any feedback would be appreciated.



Just noticed thisquestion today and saw Hatchet Man's response implying that the Peace Bond would have to end before the individual could apply.  Why?  Yes, it's a legal obligation, but if it doesn't restrict a individual's mobility, I don't see why it should hamper his ability to join the CF.  After all, child support payments are also legal obligations, but surely we don't prevent non-custodial parents from joining?  I'm just curious if this is a blanket policy or if the actual obligation is reviewed and circumstances considered before a decision is rendered.


----------



## DAA

Pusser said:
			
		

> Just noticed thisquestion today and saw Hatchet Man's response implying that the Peace Bond would have to end before the individual could apply.  Why?  Yes, it's a legal obligation, but if it doesn't restrict a individual's mobility, I don't see why it should hamper his ability to join the CF.  After all, child support payments are also legal obligations, but surely we don't prevent non-custodial parents from joining?  I'm just curious if this is a blanket policy or if the actual obligation is reviewed and circumstances considered before a decision is rendered.



If during the "CRNC" process, there is an indication that an applicant is completing obligations to the judicial system or under the judicial process, then the CF cannot interfere with this and as such they are ineligible for enrolment into the CF until the obligation(s) have expired or been lifted.


----------



## Train2Survive

I am banned from the states and have warrants in florida when I was 19 I am 26 now. Will that effect my chances to become a member of the cf?


----------



## PuckChaser

Train2Survive said:
			
		

> I am banned from the states and have warrants in florida when I was 19 I am 26 now. Will that effect my chances to become a member of the cf?



Yeah, probably. How do you expect to go to or through the US to train/deploy?


----------



## brihard

You're banned from our biggest ally, have an outstanding arrest warrant, and a grade 10 education. I would suggest that yes, you should be lining up other options. I would not expect taht you'd stack up as a particularly attractive recruit.

Finish high school, sort out your issues in Florida, and see if you can get yourself on better terms with the United States. This isn't a 'joining the military' thing, this is a 'life' thing.


----------



## Train2Survive

Once Trump becomes president he'll pardon me. We both share the same views.


----------



## brihard

You're talking in the other thread about facing serious time in prison in the United States if you were to return to Florida. Sounds like you're not who we want. To be facing that kind of prison time suggests significant deficiencies in your judgment and character. It does not appear from what you have disclosed that the Canadian Armed Forces would benefit much from your service.


----------



## Train2Survive

Every CF member has a flaw. I have a lot to offer to the CF. Did you know I can get repeated head shots on flying birds? That is skill and all I want to do is cook.


----------



## PuckChaser

Cook civvie side then, or man up and do your prison time. The CAF doesn't owe you a job. I also looked up some mandatory minimums in Florida, most involve possession with intent to traffic. With that conviction, kiss your desire to serve in the CAF goodbye. You screwed up, and it shut doors for you. Welcome to life.


----------



## Pusser

DAA said:
			
		

> If during the "CRNC" process, there is an indication that an applicant is completing obligations to the judicial system or under the judicial process, then the CF cannot interfere with this and as such they are ineligible for enrolment into the CF until the obligation(s) have expired or been lifted.



Understood, but in the case of a certain peace bonds (e.g. where an individual is not allowed to contact another individual, but no mobility restrictions), how could the CF interfere?  If the peace bond says an individual is not allowed to contact someone and the CF sends that individual to other side of the country, it would seem to me that the CF is actually helping (although that is not our responsibility), not interfering with the obligation.


----------



## DAA

Pusser said:
			
		

> Understood, but in the case of a certain peace bonds (e.g. where an individual is not allowed to contact another individual, but no mobility restrictions), how could the CF interfere?  If the peace bond says an individual is not allowed to contact someone and the CF sends that individual to other side of the country, it would seem to me that the CF is actually helping (although that is not our responsibility), not interfering with the obligation.



That type of instance could possibly be acceptable.  Usually these matters are forwarded for higher level review prior to a decision being made, so it's pretty much a coin toss.


----------



## Leeworthy

How about you call the recruiting center closest to you and ask them these questions. Tell them your situation and see what they say. But I can 100% guarantee you that with you having a criminal record, a warrant out for your arrest in the USA and have not gone to take care of your issues the CF is not going to see you as reliable or a good fit for any position in the CF. 

Don't waste the clerks time at the recruiting center. Man up, do your time, and find a new career.


----------



## mariomike

For reference,

Criminal charges question  
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/124360/post-1459205;topicseen#new



			
				josebot533 said:
			
		

> I have a criminal record but one of them was a federal one. I got caught with some weed and got a fine in 2007. It's been paid and I'm done probation.
> Is this federal criminal conviction gonna mess up my chances of getting in?





			
				DAA said:
			
		

> Shouldn't be that big a deal, so long as you declared your Criminal Conviction at the time of your online application.
> 
> But I'd recommend that you apply for a "Record Suspension" as soon as possible.  You don't have to hire a Lawyer or anything like that, just fill out the forms, submit the required documentation and pay the fee.
> 
> Good luck.
> 
> https://www.canada.ca/en/parole-board/services/record-suspensions.html
> https://www.canada.ca/en/parole-board/services/record-suspensions/official-pbc-application-guide-and-forms.html


----------



## josebot533

Hello.

So I went to the CAF building with my criminal charges papers on the 21st of October and was told that someone will get in touch with me via email or telephone call. My criminal charges are for non violent offenses and I'm done serving everything. No fines. No nothing.

How long does it usually take for someone to get back in touch with you? 

Thank you


----------



## mariomike

josebot533 said:
			
		

> So I went to the CAF building with my criminal charges papers on the 21st of October and was told that someone will get in touch with me via email or telephone call. My criminal charges are for non violent offenses and I'm done serving everything.



For reference, perhaps,

Criminal charges question

will be merged with,

Criminal Record (merged) 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/12896.0
12 pages.


----------



## dbrks88

Try calling the recruiting center. Nobody on here is going to be able to give you an answer.


----------



## dbrks88

Depending on what the offenses were and how long ago it was could also cause you to get declined entirely during the reliability screening. Expect to get fingerprinted as well which will delay your file even more.


----------



## zee1231

Hi there, back in March of 2016, I was charged with dangerous driving, failure to stay at the scene, refusal to blow. All three charges were criminal. I had them all dropped and reduced to a careless driving, but the court did give me a 1 year breathalyzer probation which ends in October of 2017. I have no criminal record from this but i still want to make sure if this will affect my chances to joining the airforce as a pilot or the opportunity to be a MP? I know that you can't join till all probations are over so i don't plan on joining till after October. Advice from those who are experienced in this topic would be much appreciated, thanks so much!


----------



## mariomike

zee1231 said:
			
		

> I have no criminal record from this but i still want to make sure if this will affect my chances to joining the airforce as a pilot or the opportunity to be a MP?



I read the "no criminal record". But, if you have any concerns, you may, or may not, find this of interest,

Criminal Record (merged)
http://navy.ca/forums/threads/12896.250
12 pages.

_As always,_  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.


----------



## RCDtpr

I can't speak to your ability to join the Air Force, but I can safely say you won't make it through the MPAC background process for MP.


----------



## zee1231

Thanks so much guys, does anyone know if this would prevent me from joining the military for all trades? I wouldlike to do the ROTP and get an education and pursue some sort of a trade.


----------



## Pusser

zee1231 said:
			
		

> Thanks so much guys, does anyone know if this would prevent me from joining the military for all trades? I wouldlike to do the ROTP and get an education and pursue some sort of a trade.



Keep in mind that ROTP is for officer candidates.  You'll get an education, but you won't get a trade out of that.


----------



## Ontario1867

Looking for some advice
I have a conditional discharge(not a conviction), and withdrawn charge.
The Record will be purged (destroyed) in april 2017, than I will conduct a record check to make sure it was purged properly.
Once, I have cleared my record, I want to apply but all of this will take much time, It can take up to one year for the fingerprints and record to be destroyed.
Should I wait it out?
Would I still have a chance of being accepted with this record (break and enter).
And if I do wait it out and my record is cleared, and they ask me if i have ever been found guilty of an offence, do I have to reply, yes?
I will be honest with my application to the the recruiters, interviewer etc.
I have no legal obligations, no convictions etc.
thank you in advance


----------



## KS98

Hello, 

So I know there is a merged criminal records topic but I need a specific answer. 

Last year I was arrested for a crime I did not commit, Currently I have been charged and am on bail. The case is not a publicly available one and it does not show up on a criminal records check from the local PD. I started my application today will this stop me? 

Thank you


----------



## mariomike

KS98 said:
			
		

> So I know there is a merged criminal records topic



For reference, perhaps Current Charges

will be merged with,

Criminal Record (merged) 
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/12896.275
12 pages.

_As always,_  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.


----------



## Mudshuvel

The application asks "Have you been charged with a crime for which you have not been pardoned". You will have to select yes. Also, the military will be thorough. It will stop you regardless of whether or not you committed it. Unfortunately, your application will not move forward.


----------



## PandemicStrange

So basically if you have a record expect to get printed am I right?


----------



## RocketRichard

Mudshuvel said:
			
		

> The application asks "Have you been charged with a crime for which you have not been pardoned". You will have to select yes. Also, the military will be thorough. It will stop you regardless of whether or not you committed it. Unfortunately, your application will not move forward.


Unless you are in recruiting perhaps it's best not to state whose application will move forward or not. As MM says speak to recruiting. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## mariomike

PandemicStrange said:
			
		

> So basically if you have a record expect to get printed am I right?



_As always,_  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.

But, you may find these discussions of interest,

Sec. Checks & Fingerprinting
http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/13619.25
2 pages.

Fingerprints/youth criminal record  
https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:OVSZUnJQ8RcJ:https://milnet.ca/forums/index.php%3Ftopic%3D116440.0+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

See also,

Fingerprints
https://www.google.ca/search?q=site%3Amilnet.ca+fingerprints&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&gfe_rd=cr&ei=vtmIWM-IFuGM8QegnpyQBA&gws_rd=ssl


----------



## PandemicStrange

mariomike said:
			
		

> _As always,_  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.
> 
> But, you may find these discussions of interest,
> 
> Sec. Checks & Fingerprinting
> http://milnet.ca/forums/threads/13619.25
> 2 pages.
> 
> Fingerprints/youth criminal record
> https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:OVSZUnJQ8RcJ:https://milnet.ca/forums/index.php%3Ftopic%3D116440.0+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca
> 
> See also,
> 
> Fingerprints
> https://www.google.ca/search?q=site%3Amilnet.ca+fingerprints&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&rlz=1I7GGHP_en-GBCA592&gfe_rd=cr&ei=vtmIWM-IFuGM8QegnpyQBA&gws_rd=ssl



Thanks you're a scholar and a gentlemen. I see you use google and not use the built in search, never find exactly what I'm looking for! Maybe I should give google a try.


----------



## mariomike

PandemicStrange said:
			
		

> Thanks you're a scholar and a gentlemen.



Ha! Tell that to my wife!


----------



## PandemicStrange

mariomike said:
			
		

> Ha! Tell that to my wife!



Hah, yea I could try. I finished everything and was expecting a job offer call, instead I got told I need them finger prints. Hoping it doesn't take long  (hoping)


----------



## FlyLikeAnEagle

Bonjourno. I just talked to my navy/military councilor and she said that their doing the security screening check. Now, ive been arrested locally on very minor stuff (drinking related) and most was a $100 fine. The major hurdle was the time i got caught with some mary jane and magic shrooms and had to go to the real court house. All i got was a $500 fine for that (lawyer could've had it all dropped because cops fed up the investigation) and c'est tout. I owe no $$ to the court, not on any FBI most wanted list, ain't been arrested or summoned on any open cases...what are the chances i go through? If i was ineligible...wouldn't they have already weaned me out when i already brought my court papers back in December? 

Thanks
JR


----------



## mariomike

FlyLikeAnEagle said:
			
		

> ive been arrested locally on very minor stuff (drinking related) and most was a $100 fine. The major hurdle was the time i got caught with some mary jane and magic shrooms and had to go to the real court house. All i got was a $500 fine for that (lawyer could've had it all dropped because cops fed up the investigation) and c'est tout. I owe no $$ to the court, not on any FBI most wanted list, ain't been arrested or summoned on any open cases...what are the chances i go through? If i was ineligible...wouldn't they have already weaned me out when i already brought my court papers back in December?



Once your online application has been forwarded to your local recruiting centre, they should be able to tell you why your application is delayed. The most common reasons are:
Reliability screening: the reliability screening and security check will take longer if you lived in another country or if you have a criminal record.
http://www.forces.ca/en/page/applynow-100#reasons

Criminal Record (merged) 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/12896.175
12 pages.



_As always,_  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.


----------



## FlyLikeAnEagle

Yeah, court papers. But i should've added that this was back in 2003 and only had a minor blip in 2014 (everywhere else its a fine...here in small town its a "criminal offense"). Non-violent crimes. No theft. Just stupid childish mistakes.


----------



## da1root

The recruiting staff will not tell you that you're ineligible for enrolment for security reasons.  

The CAF has a third-party company that does the background checks; once they have completed their background check if there are issues that are a hard no for entry the company will not grant the reliability status, if it is iffy (i.e. grey area) than it is forwarded to the CFRC Unit Security Supervisor to make a decision along with the CO.  

Because of above your file will be processed and the Recruiter wouldn't say you're ineligible as that is not within their job description.


----------



## Roger123

Good day,

Last night I was in a parking lot waiting for some people to come out from a store. My car door is open and Im leaning up against it minding my own business. The AC in my car was not working and the night air was cool. This guy pulls up on the side of the open door with so many other open spaces near by. My first thought was " Seriously?". Anyway, I close my door and allow him to park. He then proceeds out of the car and starts engaging me verbally. He starts stating that Im this and that, how people in Canada think everything is a joke and how he wanted to punch me. I tell him to chill but if starts trying to make good on what he said I would wreck him. 
     He goes into the convenience store and then my friends walk out. My friends walk out to the car stating there was some crazy guy cursing and acting erratic. He walks out, realizes there are 5 people now instead of just me and begins talking about stabbing me if there were no cameras. Surprisingly, my main concern was how this situation could potentially snowball to affect my application. We verbally spar for the next 5 min.  I have a clean record, never been involved with the law. If this did turn into a 1v1 fight, im sure someone would have called the police and I would be in the back of a police cruiser.
    Safe to say that my application to RCAF would be thrown out the window at that point? 

Regards


----------



## Good2Golf

A police report with your involvement in an incident, whomever the protagonist or victim would be considered, would not a criminal conviction for you make.

You could direct how the incident would be seen by proactively engaging the police and reporting the individual (uttering a threat of bodily harm is itself an indictable or summary offence in Section 264.1 of the Criminal Code of Canada - Uttering Threats).



> *Uttering threats*
> 
> 264.1 (1) Every one commits an offence who, in any manner, knowingly utters, conveys or causes any person to receive a threat:
> (a) to cause death or bodily harm to any person;
> (b) to burn, destroy or damage real or personal property; or
> (c) to kill, poison or injure an animal or bird that is the property of any person.
> 
> *Punishment*
> 
> (2) Every one who commits an offence under paragraph (1)(a) is guilty of:
> (a) an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years; or
> (b) an offence punishable on summary conviction and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding eighteen months.



:2c:

Regards
G2G


----------



## Armstrong

what does the Criminal Record Check for the Canadian Armed Forces consist of when joining.

Just a criminal record name check for conviction and charged laid against you in Canada or as well as Vulnerable sector check. 

Is it as simple as any criminal convictions, charges pending etc or as well as traffic tickets, police reports , Civil Resulation Tribunal etc 

Thanks


----------



## da1root

The Criminal Record check is only one part of the Security Background Check.

While it doesn't always happen, assume that everything about your past is going to be check - including criminal convictions, charges pending, unpaid traffic tickets, police reports, vulnerable sector check etc.

If you have pending legal issues in play while attempting to join the CAF you need to get them resolved before you're able to join.


----------



## amitsnow

i got arrested yesterday for shoplifting and have court in the upcoming month. Now before you call me scum, i know what i did was wrong and i don't intend on doing it on purpose again. So, i was wondering if this will prevent me from joining up/halt my enlistment as i was planning on registering this summer after I'm done highschool. I'm 18 and a dumbass. Please help


----------



## PuckChaser

You need to have no outstanding commitment to the legal system (finish any probation and community service. Perhaps you can speak with your lawyer about pleading guilty and getting an absolute discharge. Criminal convictions MAY also have an effect on your security clearance if you're trying to join a trade that needs Secret or above for your initial trade's training.


----------



## BeyondTheNow

amitsnow said:
			
		

> i got arrested yesterday for shoplifting and have court in the upcoming month. Now before you call me scum, i know what i did was wrong and i don't intend on doing it on purpose again. So, i was wondering if this will prevent me from joining up/halt my enlistment as i was planning on registering this summer after I'm done highschool. I'm 18 and a dumbass. Please help



You also need to use proper capitalization. Many users around here will appreciate posters who present themselves in a professional manner, especially if they’re taking the time to read your post and answer. You’re already humbling yourself by openly admitting what you did was stupid and you’re fully expecting to be judged because of it. So put some extra effort into how seriously you want to be taken.


Site conduct & guidelines:
https://army.ca/forums/threads/24937.0.html


----------



## garb811

amitsnow said:
			
		

> i got arrested yesterday for shoplifting and have court in the upcoming month. Now before you call me scum, i know what i did was wrong and* i don't intend on doing it on purpose again*. So, i was wondering if this will prevent me from joining up/halt my enlistment as i was planning on registering this summer after I'm done highschool. I'm 18 and a dumbass. Please help


The part I've changed to orange font causes me grave concern.  So, although you won't do it on purpose, you are leaving the door open to doing it by accident?


----------



## JesseWZ

amitsnow said:
			
		

> i got arrested yesterday for shoplifting and have court in the upcoming month. Now before you call me scum, i know what i did was wrong and i don't intend on doing it on purpose again. So, i was wondering if this will prevent me from joining up/halt my enlistment as i was planning on registering this summer after I'm done highschool. I'm 18 and a dumbass. Please help



While I don't have a crystal ball, and cannot see the future, let me put it this way:

Lets say for example we have one spot available for whatever position you are applying for. Now, we have two applicants (yourself and someone else - lets say Joe.) applying for that job. You and Joe are exactly the same in every regard, scored the same on aptitude, both physically fit, motivated, with the same qualifications - but you have a criminal record (and a recent one at that) and Joe doesn't. Who do you think is going to be selected? 

Despite the fact we seem to be consistently having difficulty filling positions, we have _*no shortage *_of applicants. The CF can (and should) afford to be picky. The CF has all the power in this scenario and no one is owed a job. 

You may not like this answer, but you also made the choice to shoplift. 

Finally, you cannot have any ongoing court/legal commitments prior to joining. If this saga drags on, you'll likely be politely asked to resolve your outstanding legal issues before applying again. 

I hope you have found some maturity in getting caught realizing your mistakes and how they can set you up for failure later in life. You may get in, you may not. I'd strongly advise not to commit theft again (whether accidently or otherwise). 

If you do get in, remember - *everyone* *hates* a thief in the barracks.


----------



## dapaterson

And if you lie on your application and do not disclose your pending court dates, you will be dismissed, released under item 1D. Not a good thing.


----------



## amitsnow

garb811 said:
			
		

> The part I've changed to orange font causes me grave concern.  So, although you won't do it on purpose, you are leaving the door open to doing it by accident?



The grammar and sentence structure I learned in highschool seems to have left me in my time of need. I'll try and improve on further post and replies I make. Just so its impeccably clear, I will not commit theft under any circumstance from here on out moving forward. You guys can hold me to my word.


----------



## serenamorrow

I was looking into what sort of information a criminal record check entails, and found this:

https://nationalpardon.org/criminal-records-information/

Found it amusing the part that it is somewhat common to get arrested without being charged or fined. It is the part I am wondering about. Does not specifically say 'fine', but fines may be treated as criminal offense charges I am guessing...so likely show up on record too, even if no arrest.

Interesting to note also that it may include whenever you get questioned, and I guess in turn ID'd, about a crime, whether or not you are involved or witness.

So, a reliability check will end up including explaining some of my weird yet mostly cordial relationship with police, despite never being criminally charged or convicted, yet fined but later dismissed.


----------



## CBH99

No.  No no no no no.

A Criminal Record Check is to check to see if you have a CRIMINAL RECORD.

It does not include any internal police databases or intel notes, nor does it include any information about specific police interactions/conversations/times you've had to call the police, etc etc.


*If you don't know WTF your talking about, as someone who isn't even in the CF or emergency services, don't give bad advice to other people.

(This being said, different police agencies do include different types of information on their individual Criminal Record check disclosures, which can appear to be damaging depending on the circumstances.  However, it is a record of criminal conviction - aka criminal record - that will directly affect your application to the CF.  Call up your local PD & ask)


----------



## Pusser

serenamorrowind said:
			
		

> So, a reliability check will end up including explaining some of my weird yet mostly cordial relationship with police, despite never being criminally charged or convicted, yet fined but later dismissed.



A fine is a punishment and you must be convicted in order to be punished.  So, if you were fined, you were convicted.  Even a traffic ticket (for which you pay a fine) is a conviction (read the fine print).  The ticket is the charge and when you sign it and mail it back with a cheque, you are pleading guilty to the offence, acknowledging the conviction and paying the fine all at once.

Having said this, convictions are not necessarily criminal.  You don't necessarily need to tell the Recruiting Centre about your traffic tickets.


----------



## da1root

deleted said:
			
		

> Hello All,
> 
> Just wondering, are summary offenses a damaging thing on the CF Criminal Records Check? I got a $135 Public Intox fine 4 years ago that I paid off and have heard nothing about it since then. I'm applying for Direct Entry Officer now and I was wondering how much of an issue this is on the background check.
> 
> Thank You



Keep in mind that everything in your past could impact your application.

Looks at it this way: You're applying for a DEO Occupation that has 1 spot left.  It's between you and another person, you both have the same degree, you both did the same on the CFAT/TSD and scored the same on the Interview.  The only difference is you have that conviction and the other person does not...

This isn't to say that you will never get it, it's to manage your expectations that the process of joining the CAF is competitive. There are currently somewhere between 15,000 and 16,000 live applications (Reg F) for approximately 6,000 positions; every little piece of who you are and what you've done impacts the selection process.



			
				Pusser said:
			
		

> Having said this, convictions are not necessarily criminal.  You don't necessarily need to tell the Recruiting Centre about your traffic tickets.


Agree with post, just want to add on that if you have a Traffic ticket that you've either not paid yet, or if you're fighting the ticket than you do need to divulge that information.


----------



## Razzar

Hello and thank you for taking the time to read this, Please let me explain my issue...

     I have been selected for further processing by the CAF and asked to come in to the recruitment center in a weeks time for my testing (the trades I choose are in high demand I was told). I have declared that I have a criminal record to them and they have not asked for any further information from me regarding it. Now my criminal record is extensive both Young offender and Adult charges and range from robbery(as a young offender) to breaches of probation, with my only adult charges being breaches of probation and a cultivation for personal use charge.
         I have on the other hand been out of trouble and had zero contact with law enforcement for almost 13 years now. having gotten my last charge in 2006 with any legal obligations ending in 2007 and have since went onto become a different person and have even held jobs as high end managers for large hotel and resort chains as well as been in charge of large sums of money and sensitive financial information.  They asked what my most recent charge was but not about any others so now my question is before going up to the appointment next week since I live several hours away should I disclose my full record or would they of looked it up already. As well will they take into account the major changes I've made in my life since changing my behaviour or will such a record automatically disqualify me from CSIS clearance. Thank you for your help.

Best Regards 
ZR


----------



## mariomike

See also,

Criminal Records Check - CRC (Merged) 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/12896/post-1532296.html#msg1532296
13 pages.


----------



## Razzar

Thank you. I have been reading through that thread and have been slowly coming to the decision that I more then likely wont pass the clearance even though my record is quite old, just do to the nature of the charges and the amount of them. Though I think I will still go to the appointment and see what happens and possibly I will be given a chance to explain my self and the amount of effort I put into changing. I am slightly worried though because I raise 2 children and support a disabled spouse, so im wondering now if I did get accepted and left my current position could I a month or two down the road be discharged when the security clearance is finally completed? thank you again

ZR


----------



## mariomike

Razzar said:
			
		

> Thank you.



You are welcome.  Good luck.


----------



## 211RadOp

Razzar said:
			
		

> ... could I a month or two down the road be discharged when the security clearance is finally completed? thank you again
> 
> ZR



I have not seen this happen unless you commit a serious offence while serving.  Prior to enrollment, they will complete an Enhanced Reliability Check (ERC) and depending on your trade you will need a much higher clearance.  ERC basically covers you to rumor.  I think you need at least a level 2 clearance for any trade in the CAF these days.


----------



## winds_13

Razzar said:
			
		

> Thank you. I have been reading through that thread and have been slowly coming to the decision that I more then likely wont pass the clearance even though my record is quite old, just do to the nature of the charges and the amount of them. Though I think I will still go to the appointment and see what happens and possibly I will be given a chance to explain my self and the amount of effort I put into changing. I am slightly worried though because I raise 2 children and support a disabled spouse, so im wondering now if I did get accepted and left my current position could I a month or two down the road be discharged when the security clearance is finally completed? thank you again
> 
> ZR



Razzar, if you are looking to join the Regular Force you should be giving significant consideration to the impact that it will have on your family. You didn't specify but if your spouse requires your physical support (opposed to just financial) this may be an issue. 

A career in the CAF more often than not requires frequent and lengthy periods of time away from one's family for courses, exercises, taskings, and deployments. Whether or not you can meet these conditions of service is an eligibility requirement to serve and will be asked in the interview.


----------



## garb811

Have you looked into obtaining a record suspension if you qualify?  Who is eligible for a record suspension?


----------



## Jonezy76

I was told by my recruiter that I need a record suspension for my enrollment. My DUI charge is from 1995. I really didn't think that a 24 year old charge would matter, since I have been a "good boy" ever since. If I have to have one, I will get it. Is that something new or does it vary recruiter to recruiter?

Ironically, the processing fee for the record suspension is $631.00 and my fine back then was only $500. Go figure.


----------



## mariomike

Jonezy76 said:
			
		

> I was told by my recruiter that I need a record suspension for my enrollment. My DUI charge is from 1995. I really didn't think that a 24 year old charge would matter, since I have been a "good boy" ever since. If I have to have one, I will get it. Is that something new or does it vary recruiter to recruiter?



For reference to the discussion,

DUI - Effects on Joining? 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/22214.125
6 pages.


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## Jonezy76

Mike, I've read that one and several other threads related to this one. Unfortunately, many aren't current and some date back a decade or more. I posted here because it is the most current. I've emailed my recruiter and await his response. 

Thanks for your response.
Cheers,
Brad


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## Humphrey Bogart

Jonezy76 said:
			
		

> Mike, I've read that one and several other threads related to this one. Unfortunately, many aren't current and some date back a decade or more. I posted here because it is the most current. I've emailed my recruiter and await his response.
> 
> Thanks for your response.
> Cheers,
> Brad



The answer is of course..... It depends.

If it was a long time ago, I would recommend seeking out a pardon.

Hire a lawyer to do it for you, it will cost more but they will get it done right.

https://www.pardons.org/pardons/faqs/


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## mariomike

Jonezy76 said:
			
		

> Unfortunately, many aren't current and some date back a decade or more.



"DUI - Effects on Joining?" was active as recently as last year.

I use this Sticky as my guideline when posting to merged topics of discussion on specific subjects such as this,

Necroposting - Not always a bad idea  
https://army.ca/forums/threads/87278.0.html

As always, Recruiting is your most trusted source of official, up to date, information.

"Unofficial site, not associated with DND or the Canadian Armed Forces."



			
				Jonezy76 said:
			
		

> Thanks for your response.



You are welcome. Good luck.


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## brihard

Humphrey Bogart said:
			
		

> The answer is of course..... It depends.
> 
> If it was a long time ago, I would recommend seeking out a pardon.
> 
> Hire a lawyer to do it for you, it will cost more but they will get it done right.
> 
> https://www.pardons.org/pardons/faqs/



Formerly “pardon” now = “record suspension”, just FYI.


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## Jonezy76

Thank you for the responses Humphrey, Mike, and Brihard. 

I have all the forms needed, along with the guide, and have started the ball rolling toward my record suspension already. As it will cost over $1000 as is, ($631 application fee + CRC fee + court fees + time off work) I was hoping not to have to do it to enroll. I understand, at the very best, that it would delay my enrollment. A record suspension takes 6 months to process AND costs a fair chunk of change, so a delay would happen either way.

It seems, though, that without it, my enrollment may be halted altogether. 

My Recruiter, who is aware of my record, (because I had brought in a recent CRC with my enrollment package) has decided to continue with enrollment despite this "hiccup", as he called it. 

I go for my CFAT, FORCE, medical and interview next week. Wish me luck!

Cheers,
Brad


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## Pusser

Remember that a recruiter's job is to get people into the CAF, not keep them out.  If there's a good chance of enrollment, they will continue the process (as they should).  Rely on them to provide you with the best advice and best course of action.

As far as I know, your young offender record is of minor importance (if any at all) and if your adult record is suspended, then that too should not be a big issue.  Note, however, that I am NOT a recruiter.  I do remember though that the old security clearance personal history forms asked something along the lines of, "do you have a record of criminal offences for which you have not been pardoned?"  To me, that means that once pardoned (now "record suspended"), your criminal record is no longer an issue.


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## da1root

Sorry for the late post; I've been on course/TD/leave and haven't been the best at keeping up with my social media accounts.
In this event please note that it'll be the PSO (possibly RPSO) that will review your past and make recommendations.  
As Pusser said "a recruiter's job is to get people into the CAF, not keep them out"; recruiters are there to inform you along the way of the recruiting process and assist you along the way.


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## SoItWas

Buck_HRA said:
			
		

> Sorry for the late post; I've been on course/TD/leave and haven't been the best at keeping up with my social media accounts.
> In this event please note that it'll be the PSO (possibly RPSO) that will review your past and make recommendations.
> As Pusser said "a recruiter's job is to get people into the CAF, not keep them out"; recruiters are there to inform you along the way of the recruiting process and assist you along the way.



Hey,

Quick questions

For  an MP, can you / will you be hired if you have past police history but no convictions? I was granted a conditional discharge 2 years 20 months ago for mischief; it'll be completed in March 2020 and wiped off my record. I have the required education for it, college diploma in police studies. I am a 30+ applicant in terms of age.  The mischief charge relates to events in 2011, but it took years through the court system. I was very through in regards to my previous issues related to my back round with my file manager and officer.  

Prior to applying I spoke to multiple recruiters and a Captain indicated to me in email that he has never seen an applicant with police history be hired as an MP, Feedback and thoughts on this would be appreciated? 

I currently have a application in for Intel Operator; My file is with medical right now, and my file manager just communicated to me that my background has come back and they are just waiting for approval on it. When I applied there were fifteen spots open on it, but they look like most of them have been selected. My thoughts  are I might not be merit listed until April 1st,2020 and at such time I can then add MP to the selection list of occupations; hopefully I'll have a valid medical / clearance on file and then be short listed?

Curious as well; I've been told my CFAT scores are "average". I wrote the CFAT back in 2010. I spoke to my file manager and asked to rewrite as my academic ability has increased since I last wrote it and this time I can be more prepared. I wish to also "increase" my competitiveness and have a "higher" score for selection purposes. I got an email back from the detachment commander wanting to speak with me in regards to my rewrite request, he specified he wanted to "provide me with the most up to date information" before submitting the request. Good Sign / Bad sign?  Curious.

Info appreciated - Thanks.


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