# Russian military slammed over deadly hazing



## pbi (21 Oct 2004)

url]http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/2004/10/20/russia_military_hazing041020.html[/url]



> Russian military slammed over deadly hazing
> Last Updated Wed, 20 Oct 2004 15:20:02 EDT
> MOSCOW - A human rights group is urging Russian authorities to stop vicious hazing of young recruits in the military, which kills dozens of conscripts every year.
> 
> ...



This is obviously something that can't just be laid at the feet of communism. It was going on during the time that the Red Army was in Afghanistan, to the point where some commentators have suggested that it was one of the contributing causes to the fairly poor perfomance of the Soviet forces there. Even at that time, beatings and death were common, and the same reasons were being suggested. Now, post communism, it's still going on. We're not talking about one or two "Code Reds" here-more like a completely sick barracks culture. Part of the problem, in my opinion, is the failure of the Communist system (not just the Russians...) to develop a reliable cadre of professional NCOs, much like the Arab armies discussed below. Or is it just that Russian society itself is sick, and so the military reflects its society? Cheers.


----------



## Pieman (21 Oct 2004)

I used to work with a few Russians and they told me about their time in the Russian army. 

Two of them had to serve in the Russian forces, and did not have anything good to say about it. They never related any stories of abuse to me, but said it was like being a slave. One said he spend his army career loading and unloading trucks and did not get any real training. The other fellow says he spent his time building a new personal house for a General. He also was not actually trained, just given a uniform, a hammer, and told to work. By the sounds of the above article they were lucky. Perhaps Russians who are educated do not have to take the hard positions?

Corruption in the Russian system is pretty rampant all across the board, including the Army. The conscripts are simply being taken advantage of because they don't have to serve for very long. There are certainly those conscripts who are fully trained, but those are probably the guys who are being hazed and abused. Doesn't sound like a fun place at all.


----------



## winchable (21 Oct 2004)

Watched a documentary about russian conscripts.
They go through absolute hell, and it's completely normal to see someone get seriously injured and then they pass that down.

Very similar to the problems discussed in the Arab army thread.
Obviously their motivated, proud, passionate and willing to go to hell and back if they're willing to do all of this even if they're just conscripts. But they're motivated by the wrong things and towards to the wrong things.


----------



## beach_bum (21 Oct 2004)

We were watching an article about this on the news yesterday. They showed the recruits lined up, and this guy went down the line and kicked each of them in the stomach.  He was kicking them hard enough to knock them down.  It was pretty brutal.


----------



## D-n-A (21 Oct 2004)

Che said:
			
		

> Watched a documentary about russian conscripts.
> They go through absolute heck, and it's completely normal to see someone get seriously injured and then they pass that down.



Was the documentry called "Soldat" and aired on the history channel?


I saw that awhile ago, pretty harsh stuff, the senior guys really abuse the new guys when they join the unit.


----------



## pbi (23 Oct 2004)

The Russian Army obviously has a very long way to go before it is anything like a professional force. They are probably good for defense of the Motherland against an invader, but that's about it. Cheers.


----------



## garb811 (27 Jan 2005)

> *State TV Runs Chechnya Ads*
> 
> By Vladimir Isachenkov
> The Associated Press
> ...


----------



## pbi (31 Jan 2005)

IMHO the sad state of their military is just another legacy of that nasty, sick, destructive fiasco called communism. Its terrible effects are IMHO visible in just about every aspect of Russian society, and to a certain extent in some of the former WARPAC countries as well (although they seem to be doing a better job at pulling themselves out of the shyte). If capitalism can be said to exploit human nature, then communism denies it. The sick behaviour in the military just reflects the wretched state of their society.

Cheers


----------



## Shec (1 Feb 2005)

As I understand it the problem pre-dates Communism and has been deeply rooted in the Russian army since Czarist times, which partially accounts for the Russian army's stellar performance during the 1905 Russo-Japanese War and WW1.

Not unlike the rigidly stratified pre-revolution Russian society from which it was drawn,   the Czarist Russian army was a semi-feudal institution in which the other ranks were mal-treated like the slave-like serfs, the landless peasants, that many originated from.   And it is that indifference towards the lower classes that fed the revolutionary movement that culminated in the equally repressive communist regime.

And if a draftee was a religious or ethnic minority his treatment was even worse.   For instance, Jews were drafted for 20 years, a virtual death sentence from which,   fortunately for me,   my Grandfather deserted.

Like any tradition that shapes an organization's mentality and culture this legacy is perpetuated today.   Too bad it is a legacy of indifference and brutality towards the well-being of junior ranks.


----------



## 3rd Herd (30 Oct 2007)

The Usual Disclaimer:
http://uk.reuters.com/article/latestCrisis/idUKL0135503620071001?sp=true

Mon Oct 1, 2007 12:45pm BST
Russian army asks Mothers to help with draft

By Chris Baldwin

MOSCOW, Oct 1 (Reuters) - Russia's military said on Monday it would ask members of the Committee of Soldiers' Mothers, a stern critic of the armed forces and their treatment of conscripted soldiers, to serve on each of its draft boards.

The military has previously been hostile towards the Soldiers' Mothers, accusing the group of deliberately undermining the forces' reputation.

"We want them to be a permanent part of the process, to work on the commission where they will have a decisive voice," Colonel-General Vasily Smirnov, the military's head of recruitment told a news conference.

Young Russian men are required to serve 18 months in the military, but the armed forces' reputation for bullying and abuse mean draft-dodging is rife.

Hazing by older soldiers called "dedovshchina", or "rule of the elders" is commonplace, sometimes resulting in death or serious injury. Last year doctors had to amputate a soldier's legs and genitals after he was punished by drunk sergeants and neglected by military doctors during New Year's holidays.

The Committee of Soldiers' Mothers, formed in 1989, won prominence in 1995 as a persistent critic of the first Chechen war. Since then the Soldiers' Mothers have become the most outspoken advocate for conscripts' rights.
They have received runaway soldiers, called attention to cases of abuse, neglect and corruption, and offered legal advice that has led to criminal cases against senior officers.

A spokeswoman for the Committee of Soldiers' Mothers said that while a few regional military commissariats had reached out to include a Soldiers' Mothers committee member, the 33 Moscow draft boards had so far made no such offer.

"We wouldn't be against sitting on the draft board, we have been asking for this for years. But so far we haven't heard anything," said Lyudmila Vorobyeva of the Committee of Soldiers' Mothers' Moscow office.

REFORM

President Vladimir Putin has made military reform a top priority during his time in office, pouring billions of dollars into infrastructure and weapons systems.

State-run television has created military-themed soap operas extolling the virtues of honourable service, and subway advertisements call on able-bodied men to join the professional ranks while they are still young and strong.

But the prospect of serving any length of time in the army still fills many 18-year olds with dread, with many going great lengths to avoid it. Only about 9 percent of those eligible for conscription answer their draft notice.

Parents pay bribes of up to several thousand dollars to get their sons out of serving, while others seek educational or medical deferments.

In 2004, then-Defence Minister Sergei Ivanov proposed ending student deferrals, saying it would help achieve President Vladimir Putin's goal of cutting military service to one year from two by 2008 and making half the army career soldiers.

Further:

Military Looks to Tackle Draft-Dodging
http://mnweekly.rian.ru/news/20071004/55280364.html
04/10/2007

A new conscription campaign began in the Russian military on October 1, in which the mandatory conscription term was reduced from two years to 18 months; there are plans to reduce it to just 12 months in 2008. But top military brass has said that the move will not affect the strength of the ranks. 

On Monday, Colonel General Vasily Smirnov, the head of the mobilization directorate of the General Staff, told reporters that there was a way out of the complicated situation and rejected the possibility that the 24-month conscription term will return in the future. Smirnov said that simultaneously with cutting the conscription term, the new legislation will reduce the number of official reasons that potential draftees could claim a deferment (from 25 to 21). 

"This way we will get about 100,000 men in the draft... and this quantity is sufficient for manning the Russian military," the general told RIA Novosti. This year, the General Staff planned to enlist 132,300 thousand men, he said. 

Smirnov also said that the reduced conscription term will help to fight against draft-dodging, which re­mains an acute problem for the Russian military. 

According to official statistics,  about 9 percent of young men eligible for military service show up for duty at the conscription offices, even though according to Russian law such behavior is a criminal offence punished with prison term. 

Approximately 12,500 people are currently avoiding the draft and only 1.6 percent of these individuals have been brought to justice. 

Apart from draft dodging, however, Russia's army still faces other problems. While hazing is the most talked about, conscription attorneys point to ongoing violations of the law that they link to legislative confusion. "This year I've addressed the concerned of 596 servicemen," says Anatoly Malyutin, a conscript attorney at a Moscow firm. "Most of their complains? Unlawful disciplinary action, failing to pay the stipend in full, failing to provide housing." Malyutin also cited instances when direct decrees from the Minister of Defense were not implemented. 

But this draft season military officials seem bent on addressing not just draft dodgers, but tackling other problems as well. To this end, they even turned to the Soldiers' Mothers Committee - a public organization which fights against abuses in the army. In the past, military officials did not trust this organization. At one point, they accused it of receiving funds from foreign governments for undermining Russia's defense potential. But this year the attitude has changed. "We want them to be a permanent part of the process, to work on the commission where they will have a decisive voice," Smirnov said. 

The Russian general also mentioned the problem of conscripts' poor health. About 30 percent of all citizens are relieved from the military service for health reasons and half of all conscripts have problems with health that alter their service capabilities, Smirnov told reporters. 

Russian men may legally avoid military service by applying for alternative civil service. But very few people actually use this excuse. 

According to Labor Ministry statistics, only 227 applications for alternative service have been submitted for the autumn draft, and 198 applicants were officially relieved of service requirements in the military forces. 

Along with reducing the number of conscripts, the Russian Military Forces are raising the number of professional servicemen who are enlisted on a contractual basis; in 2007, 19 military units, accounting for 42,000 troops, will be considered professional. Russia also hires soldiers from the former Soviet republics, but the number of such cases is relatively small. 

General Smirnov said that more than 500 applications from CIS citizens were received for the autumn draft. At present, Russia has only 194 military servicemen who are foreign citizens, mostly people from Tajikistan who serve in Russian border guard units stationed in this country. 

By Julia Duchovny


----------



## geo (30 Oct 2007)

Oik... a 12 month draft?
What kind of military service can you provide with only 12 months of service?
Recruit to trade training = +/- 6 months
Service 6 months?
Would assume that "leave" will only be allowed & tacked onto the back of the 12 months...

Cheez! ???


----------

