# Halifax or Victoria? Who's Been to both?



## Cory13 (11 Sep 2010)

Hi guys I'll be going to BMQ in a few months and I would like to know if anyone serving in the Navy has been to both bases (CFB Halifax and CFB Esquimalt) When the time comes I would like to know where I would prefer to go I've never been to either so any information would help (Cost of living, weather, the town itself, people, size, nightlife etc) I've looked up what I can but google and wikipedia can only do so much  

Thanks for all your answers!!


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## SeanNewman (11 Sep 2010)

Very jealous that those are your two choices.


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## Luke O (11 Sep 2010)

I'm hoping I'll be posted to Halifax, mainly because it's only 3 hours from home, but it's also a nice place.

Cost of living would be greater in Esquimalt compared to Halifax.

Nightlife in Halifax is pretty good aswell, as there is 3 universities in the city.  So there will be lots of university girls, depending on your age.  But since you asked about nightlife I'm going to assume you are in that range.


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## northernboy_24 (11 Sep 2010)

What do you like to do? Where is your family and do you want to be near them?  Where is your trade training?  PLD is meant to somewhat take the difference in cost of living out of the picture.

I love Victoria and everything that CFB Esquimalt has to offer.   That being said I am tired of winter and snow.  Hailing from Thunder Bay, I can say I am ready to have winters where I can run along the harbour in shorts.   In January I left Thunder Bay and it was -18, I arrived in Victoria and was running in shorts with cherry blossoms starting to bloom along the harbour.  Halifax has a winter.  I have not lived in either city however, having visited I would say Victoria is where I am going to request to stay after trades training.   I know my trades training is in Victoria and I am not upset about that.

That being said, I know lots of people that love Halifax and want to return after trades training to the east coast. So what do YOU want?


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## Sub_Guy (11 Sep 2010)

If you plan on renting, it would be cheaper in Esq, real estate is the only thing that is more expensive in Esq.  Everything else is cheaper, it all comes down to what you want.  You will probably get to experience Esq before you get posted, because nearly all the 3s courses are run out west.


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## Cory13 (11 Sep 2010)

Thanks for the responses so far  Luke O I'm 23 and single so yeah nightlife would be something to consider. Northernboy_24 That must have been so nice to run in the winter like that! I looked up the temp there and I saw that it's pretty warm year round. As for my trade it's a Marine Electrician and I will be in BC for 9 weeks, my parents are in Alberta but I'm a newfie so i have family on both sides both have pro's and con's I can't get an upper hand on one AHH!! lol


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## roame (11 Sep 2010)

I have never been to Halifax but I'm from Victoria the night life isn't bad but its not a jumbo city with a huge bar street. There is a few clubs downtown and since they built the new arena theres pretty good concerts now. Vancouver is just a 2 hour boat ride away and there is tons of night life there. the weather is amazing if u don't mind the rain and there is many Beach's nice  running trails parks etc.


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## FSTO (11 Sep 2010)

Lived in Halifax from 91-94 and Victoria from 99-08. Halifax was great for a young person and bought our first home there. Weather wise Victoria won out hands down. Now that the fleet is balanced out there is no real advantage career wise being on the east or west coast. Victoria is close to two very large urban areas although you have to go by sea ( 2 hours to Vancouver via BC Ferries where you have the Lions, Canucks and Whitecaps for sports; Seattle is an 1 1/2 via the Victoria Clipper where you have the Mariners and Seahawks).


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## jollyjacktar (11 Sep 2010)

Each coast has it's advantages and disadvantages.  But the two coasts are like two different Navies as well, each has it's own style and ways.  You might, dependent upon your trade get exposure to both sides during the training cycle which might help you to make up your mind.  Of course, the needs of the Navy come first and you will be put where you are needed.  For my trade, we were asked at the completion of our QL5 which coast we wanted to nominate as our Home Port Division.  Mine is the East Coast, I don't want the West, and that selection helps to keep me here.  If you get the choice, choose wisely as it may be hard to move to the other coast later on.  Good luck, and welcome to the Navy.


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## EpicBeardedMan (11 Sep 2010)

I'm assuming you don't get to pick where you go after your ql3? Even though my recruiter told me and a friend that was interested in the Navy that you do


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## aesop081 (12 Sep 2010)

EpicBeardedMan said:
			
		

> I'm assuming you don't get to pick where you go after your ql3?



Once again :

While you can state your preference .....the decision is not yours.


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## Pusser (13 Sep 2010)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> Once again :
> 
> While you can state your preference .....the decision is not yours.



However, requesting a Home Port Division (HPD) is not the same as putting in choices for a posting.  Yes, the exigencies of the service take priority, but HPD choices are considered more carefully because they're virtually permanent.  Hard sea trades don't move as much as other trades, so you will spend most of your career on one coast or the other.  Then, even if you are posted to Ottawa or as regular support staff at a Reserve unit, chances are you will be returned to your HPD afterwards.  Be prepared and put some thought into your choice.  It is also worth noting that not all Navy trades have HPDs.  The smaller ones do not and that means you can still be posted from coast to coast periodically.  Coast to coast postings for trades with HPDs are rare.  Furthermore, officers do not have HPDs.

Having said all that, I have been posted both ashore and afloat on both coasts and will state this without hesitation:  Canada has two navies.  We dress alike and we paint our ships the same colour, but after that, the differences start to emerge.  There are good thing and bad things about how the Navy works on each coast, but my preference is East.  I find I like the Navy better there.  In my view, the East Coasters seem to have a better sense of what's really important and the West Coast gets too wrapped around the axle about things that really aren't that big a deal.  I had a lot more fun on the East Coast then I did on the West.

I also enjoyed living in Halifax a lot better.  Halifax and Victoria are about the same size, but Halifax is a regional centre of many things, whereas on the West Coast, everything is in Vancouver, which can be a $200 round trip, depending on the size of your family.  I also find Maritimers a lot more friendly than the granola crowd out west.  We moved into a house in Halifax and knew all the neighbours within a week.  In Esquimalt, it took us almost five years to make any friends.  As an aside here, don't poo poo Esquimalt as a place to live - it has a bad reputation it does NOT deserve.  In fact, the "bad" part of Esquimalt is actually Vic West - part of Victoria.  The bar scene in Halifax is definitely superior and the natives are friendlier.

We live in Ottawa now and we really don't miss Victoria.  In fact, in our view we've found that Victoria makes Ottawa look like a warm friendly place.

PS:  The weather in Victoria is overrated.  Average annual rainfall in both Victoria and Halifax is about the same.  The only real difference is that you don't have to shovel rain.  We like seasons though.


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## Lumber (13 Sep 2010)

So far I've spent one summer in Hali and one summer in Vic. My experience is a little limited, but for someone younger my view point may be helpful.

Halifax

_Pros:_

awesome night life
bars open until 330am
friendly people
newfies!
affordable housing
St.John's and Savannah as port visits
Mediterranean Tours 
lower cost of living

_Cons:_

Hurricanes
Snows, lots of snow
OP Nanook

Esquimalt

_Pros:_

Beautiful City
Lots of outdoor activities
Lots of clubs, bars
long motorcycle riding season
Portland Rose Festival

_Cons:_

Ridiculous housing costs
RIMPAC
Terrible, TERRIBLE drivers
Rain, lots of rain
higher cost of living
Suicidal bus drivers
"Clicky" people
"BC is the Best Place in the World" attitude (seriously, it's on their license plates)

Now, I'm from Ontario, and I can drive home from Hali in 15 hours (done it), but you can't do that from Victoria, so there is a little bias there. 

When I say "clicky" people in BC, they may not be that bad; it may just be that people in Halifax just seem so friendly. Everyone is your friend in the Maritimes, or so it seemed when I was there. In BC, people just seem a lot less interested in getting to know you. 

But hey, my experience is limited, so WTFDIK.

Cheers,

 :2c:


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## Sub_Guy (13 Sep 2010)

It actually rains more in Halifax.  The winter months in Vic tend to be cloudy and damp, there have been times where the sun has disappeared for weeks.  Once spring arrives the clouds and dampness disappear, there is a reason why BC is a tinder box every summer.

As for the cost of living, sure Halifax might have houses which are a tad cheaper, but there is a reason why Hali gets PLD.  It is expensive to live in Nova Scotia, I am a big fan of the taxes here, 2nd highest in Canada.


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## aesop081 (13 Sep 2010)

Lumber said:
			
		

> _Cons:_
> 
> RIMPAC



There is absolutely nothing wrong with RIMPAC.



> higher cost of living



My pay jumped up by $200 each pay when i left Nova Scotia. My car insurance droped by 50% and a 4L of milk costs half as much in BC as it does in NS. I can go on......


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## Kat Stevens (13 Sep 2010)

The license plates in Victoria say "Beautiful British Columbia", if you find that not to be true, you never got up to the Malahat or any of a zillion other places.  If a case can be made for a desireable posting by it's proximity to Ontario, I'd take Victoria any time, you can't get any farther away without your hat floating.


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## Lumber (13 Sep 2010)

Kat Stevens said:
			
		

> The license plates in Victoria say "Beautiful British Columbia", if you find that not to be true, you never got up to the Malahat or any of a zillion other places.  If a case can be made for a desireable posting by it's proximity to Ontario, I'd take Victoria any time, you can't get any farther away without your hat floating.



I was referring to the other license plates that read "greatest place on earth."

I had as a pro the beautiful scenery, it was the attitude I was referring to.

A young woman on the bus one day said to her friend "BC is the greatest place in the world, it's the only place where people actually say thank you to the bus drivers."

I almost threw up in my mouth.


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## Lumber (13 Sep 2010)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> There is absolutely nothing wrong with RIMPAC.



You're opinion, fly boy.


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## dimsum (13 Sep 2010)

If you want skiing, golfing, surfing, general outdoorsy stuff, go to BC.  Yeah, it's expensive, but there's a reason people generally move out there and don't really want to leave.  

On my last move from a few years of bouncing around Canada (I'm from ON, in case anyone was thinking I'm biased), I grinned like an idiot once I drove across the AB/BC border   ;D


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## EpicBeardedMan (13 Sep 2010)

Lumber said:
			
		

> I was referring to the other license plates that read "greatest place on earth."
> 
> I had as a pro the beautiful scenery, it was the attitude I was referring to.
> 
> ...



That's funny. I lived in BC for a year once and a girl was talking to her friend in the booth next to us at Kelsey's and was going on about how awesometacular BC was. I'm leaning more towards Halifax nowadays.


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## FSTO (13 Sep 2010)

Pusser said:
			
		

> Having said all that, I have been posted both ashore and afloat on both coasts and will state this without hesitation:  Canada has two navies.  We dress alike and we paint our ships the same colour, but after that, the differences start to emerge.  There are good thing and bad things about how the Navy works on each coast, but my preference is East.  *I find I like the Navy better there.  In my view, the East Coasters seem to have a better sense of what's really important and the West Coast gets too wrapped around the axle about things that really aren't that big a deal.*  I had a lot more fun on the East Coast then I did on the West.



And what is that? Or is this the old "Operational Navy vs the Training Navy?'. I found that the East Coast is too set in its ways and not as receptive to new ideas and concepts. For example Naval Boarding Party Training. I found that NOS Halifax was indifferent or even hostile to getting more realistic in our training and in the end we basically forced CEASS down their throat. 

This is only my observation but it has left a lasting effect on me.


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## jollyjacktar (14 Sep 2010)

FSTO said:
			
		

> And what is that? Or is this the old "Operational Navy vs the Training Navy?'. I found that the East Coast is too set in its ways and not as receptive to new ideas and concepts. For example Naval Boarding Party Training. I found that NOS Halifax was indifferent or even hostile to getting more realistic in our training and in the end we basically forced CEASS down their throat.
> 
> This is only my observation but it has left a lasting effect on me.



I'll back Pusser on this one.  I found out in BC they worry about chickenshit stuff.  Are your boots shiny enough? Are your creases sharp enough.  God forbid if the students marching from the school to barracks are not swinging their arms correctly.  It seemed to me that they were more focused on crap than not for starters.  The WC seem to have a large BC Pine inserted where it sohould not be.  You're either Left or Right coast.  I'm  a Westerner and miss the countryside, but would pull pin if they wanted to post me out there.

The WC can be the lead coast for things training/operational wise sure.  But just because it works for you out there does not mean that it works for us here.  The ST(P) and ST(A) are prime examples.  I have done workups under the whip of both gangs.  You would think that we were in two different.


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## Sub_Guy (18 Sep 2010)

And yet the only two times that some CPO picked me up for something dress related have been in Halifax.

I have sailed on both coasts, and now I am in the Air Force, clearly neither one made an impression on me.  Although I did find that the guys out west to be younger and open to newer things, while the guys out east to be old and stuck in the cold war era (things probably have changed now though).  I also noticed the drinking (at the time) was much heavier out east.  I recall port visits (east) where the "cave" was packed with people, then a year later I was out west and the cave would be a ghost town first night in.

Are they different, yes.

Should anyone make a decision on what coast they want from reading this thread, no.


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## gcclarke (18 Sep 2010)

If I was a single hetrosexual male, I would choose Halifax. The locals are "friendlier". being in the Navy generally won't cause a young lady to stop talking to you. This can indeed happen in Victoria. Am I am no longer single, I am quite glad to be in Victoria, with my girlfriend who I imported from Halifax (Well, Dartmouth). The weather is much much much better, imho, as I am really not a big fan of snow. I can deal with it being mostly cloudy for the entirety of the winter months as a trade off. As well, it doesn't get nearly as humid, although it can still get hot in summer. 

There are more things to do around Victoria, unless you're talking about drinking. Again, yes, the bar scene is better on the east coast, but let's face it, that gets old real quick, and is a terrible reason to pick where you're living, especially when doing something like choosing home port divisions, which are rather difficult to change. 

I can't really speak much to the "two navy" thing, as I only did my ashore training and something like 9 weeks of sea time on the east coast. 

Hmmm what else? Ahhh, you can actually obtain parking at CFB Esquimalt without having to have an insane amount of time in.


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## BernDawg (18 Sep 2010)

25+ yrs in the CF, lived all over this great country of ours, including both coasts.  I chose to retire in BC.   :2c:


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## jollyjacktar (19 Sep 2010)

The West does have it all over the East beauty wise, I agree.  I grew up at the start of the Foothills in Southern Alberta and miss the mountains and the countryside out to the coast to this day, and I'll always will.  The weather is different here too, but honestly Winter here is not really that bad.  I'll eat some snow for the sunshine that comes here.  The grey skys I experienced in BC for weeks on end made me want to hang myself after a while.

The biggest difference I find between here and there though is the people.  I find people more friendly and receptive here in comparison.  Walking down the boardwalk from the Base to downtown Vic, you come across folks walking the other direction.  I would greet them as custom here and get a WTF are you looking at/speaking to me reaction damn near every time.  Turns you off after a while.

DH is correct though.  One should not make a determination on left or right coast from reading this thread.  As you can see, individual experiences vary and you really need to make up your own mind from being there to be fair to both places.


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## Ex-Dragoon (19 Sep 2010)

The most wonderful posting makes little difference if something occurs to sour you against that base. One bad situation and it will matter little what kind of a nightlife the area has or perks. When you are posted, do your research but come to your posting with an open attitude. I always found asking for opinions will sub consciously make you favour one over the other and in my humble opinion you only make things harder for yourself.


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## CallOfDuty (19 Sep 2010)

Whats the driving situation like in Esquaimalt?  Here in Halifax, we've got the bridges...traffic....minimal parking available in the dockyard etc,etc.
  If you are from Halifax, have a home here, family and everything, do they still ask you where you want your home port division to be?  I've been in Halifax my whole life, but we'd love to move to BC.


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## Pusser (19 Sep 2010)

Most sailors in Esquimalt tend to live in the western communities or up the Malahat and both have horrendous traffic issues to contend with in order to get into the base/dockyard.  However, parking is considerably better in Esqumalt than Halifax.  The only way to really avoid traffic though is to actually live in Esquimalt, which although cheaper than Victoria, can still be pretty expensive.


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## Lumber (25 Sep 2010)

Pusser said:
			
		

> Most sailors in Esquimalt tend to live in the western communities or up the Malahat and both have horrendous traffic issues to contend with in order to get into the base/dockyard.  However, parking is considerably better in Esqumalt than Halifax.  The only way to really avoid traffic though is to actually live in Esquimalt, which although cheaper than Victoria, can still be pretty expensive.



I would also say (and some might disagree, fine), that Esquimalt isn't as nice as some of the other areas in Greater Vic (Oak Bay, Mt. Douglas, Highlands, Langford/Colwood, Sooke). It's not a slum or anything!, but if you don't mind traffic and a bit of commute, I think living outside Esquimalt is the way to go. 

Don't even get me started on traffic/driving habits and ability of victoria/victoria drivers.... :threat:


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## Pusser (25 Sep 2010)

I'm with you Lumber on the driving habits/ability of most Victorians.  However, I do have to say that comparing Oak Bay to Esquimalt is unfair.  Those two worlds are simply too  different.

Esquimalt has a reputation it does not deserve.  Like anyplace there are some parts that are not great, but there are other parts that are gorgeous and there are even a few million dollar homes there (along the Gorge).  For all its faults, the municipality also runs a pretty decent recreation program and the garbage collectors even go into your yard to get the cans (i.e. you don't actually have to put it out on the curb).  It's close to everything (sorry, I hate commuting and traffic), but most services that you want are available locally.  Everything else is just across the bridge in Victoria.

Sooke is fine if you like to drive for everything.  Remember that this a place that bragged for years that it only had one traffic light (now it has at least two).

Langford?  You cannot compare Esquimalt to Langford.  Langford is to Victoria what Spryfield is to Halifax.  You're not allowed to live in Langford unless you drive a pick-up truck, preferably an old one, and wear flannel plaid. ;D


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## FSTO (27 Sep 2010)

I think that it has been quite awhile since you have been to MARPAC Pusser. 

View Royal, Colwood, Western Communities and especially Langford have really cleaned themselves up. The Langford council have pushed especially hard to get retail and business to locate in their area. The downtown is a pedestrian friendly place that I would have no problem living in.
When I was on the coast we lived between Maple Bay and Duncan. I commuted to work with 7 other people using VANPOOL. We all worked at Dockyard so it was very convenient. I would drive in the morning and another fella would drive home. I was usually sound asleep by Esquimalt Graving dock and would wakeup just outside of Duncan. Fantastic!
I was in MARLANT from 91 - 94, is Spryfield still the same or has it changed in 16 years?


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## navymich (27 Sep 2010)

Cory 13,

Home is where you make it.  As mentioned several times already, there are pros and cons to both coasts.  You will only worry yourself sick if you start trying to make too many decisions right now.  It is great initiative on your part to start looking into things, but you have several months still before you need to take a serious position.  

Take what everyone here has said and file it in that back deep corner of your brain.  Concentrate on getting through BMQ and then on to your 3's course.  Take the opportunity of being on course out west to talk to people and explore the town.  Note what you like and what you don't like and figure out exactly what you are looking for (accommodations, nightlife, family, sports etc) .  Then compare your list to Halifax info (talk to people, visit if you can)  THEN make an educated choice.  But always be prepared to accept whatever they tell you.  Being young and single, there is always the chance that you are more likely to go where the numbers are needed vice a married with family who might already be settled one side or the other.

All the best with your future, ready aye ready!


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## Pusser (28 Sep 2010)

FSTO said:
			
		

> I think that it has been quite awhile since you have been to MARPAC Pusser.
> 
> View Royal, Colwood, Western Communities and especially Langford have really cleaned themselves up. The Langford council have pushed especially hard to get retail and business to locate in their area. The downtown is a pedestrian friendly place that I would have no problem living in.
> When I was on the coast we lived between Maple Bay and Duncan. I commuted to work with 7 other people using VANPOOL. We all worked at Dockyard so it was very convenient. I would drive in the morning and another fella would drive home. I was usually sound asleep by Esquimalt Graving dock and would wakeup just outside of Duncan. Fantastic!
> I was in MARLANT from 91 - 94, is Spryfield still the same or has it changed in 16 years?



No actually, I just left.  I don't think it's changed that much in two years!  Sorry if I went off the deep end on Langford.  I just get a little uppity when folks start trashing Esquimalt.  Most folks I've met who tend to trash Esquimalt rarely spend any time there (and yes, I did spend quite a bit of time in Langford - my brother lived there).  I hear you on Langford bringing in all the business, but it's worth noting that a lot of it is big box stores, but I won't get into the debate as to whether that's bad thing or not.


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## The_Unabooboo (28 Sep 2010)

From what I can gather from this thread, I should not find either that bad.  But then I grew up in Oahawa ON, so even Montreal would be charming.


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## Oldgateboatdriver (28 Sep 2010)

For someone from Oshawa to diss Montreal is to like living dangerously, especially when you can't even write the name of your town properly.


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## dimsum (4 Feb 2011)

Dimsum said:
			
		

> If you want skiing, golfing, surfing, general outdoorsy stuff, go to BC.  Yeah, it's expensive, but there's a reason people generally move out there and don't really want to leave.
> 
> On my last move from a few years of bouncing around Canada (I'm from ON, in case anyone was thinking I'm biased), I grinned like an idiot once I drove across the AB/BC border   ;D



After talking up BC, I guess it's time for me to eat my hat.  Word is that I'm going to Shearwater (community change thanks to Aurora course being bumped for KAF deployment; probably the best "silver lining" to happen to me in uniform) and since my military experience has been 90% west coast (except for a month of sailing out of Halifax and some time in Winnipeg), I don't honestly know HRM very well, besides vague recollections of Pizza Corner at 3am.  I hear there's a decent Dimsum place (har har) there, right?

However, the house price difference between Halifax and Victoria is jaw-droppingly shocking.  My box in Comox would be a decent condo in downtown Halifax!


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## h3tacco (4 Feb 2011)

Dimsum, 

Welcome to the community. I grew up in Vancouver but spent the last few years in Shearwater. 

Decent dimsum... that depends... nothing compared to Richmond but there a few places that serve dimsum and are passable. 

Are you coming post 407 tour or pre-OTU?


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## dimsum (4 Feb 2011)

h3tacco said:
			
		

> Dimsum,
> 
> Welcome to the community. I grew up in Vancouver but spent the last few years in Shearwater.
> 
> ...



Thanks.  I've had dimsum from Winnipeg so anything equalling that is fine!  I'm pre-OTU.  I got posted to 407, but as I got there I got detached to KAF; when I got back, I asked to switch.


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