# Employment Insurance?



## top4u20

Sorry if this is the wrong forum but I was just wondering if anyone has applied for EI benefits after your military contract? Apparently you can get them.

Cheers


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## Occam

If you ended your employment at the end of a contract, or took a voluntary release, then you're considered to have left your employment voluntarily and don't qualify for EI.  You would have to serve the appropriate number of qualifying weeks of EI insurable employment in a civvie job before being eligible for EI.  If you left because you were released under a directed release item, then you won't qualify for EI.  If you retire after 20/25 and entitle to an immediate annuity, you'll likely make more than the EI cutoff income.  The only exception I've heard of is the mandatory 35 day break in service that Reg F annuitants who are employed as Class B reservists must take, and even they have to do the two week waiting period...and even that depends on how much pension income is coming in.

There aren't a whole lot of conditions under which you can draw EI after getting out of the Reg F.  I've yet to hear of one...

edit:  If you aren't offered an IE (or whatever it's called these days) after your VIE, then you would likely be eligible.  That would imply that you're somewhat of a screwup, though....


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## George Wallace

Occam said:
			
		

> ........  The only exception I've heard of is the mandatory 35 day break in service that Reg F annuitants who are employed as Class B reservists must take, and even they have to do the two week waiting period...and even that depends on how much pension income is coming in.



Your CF pension does not factor in in this situation.

As Occam lays it out, on Release from the CF you are not entitled to collect EI.  If you, however, find another job and are laid off, your CF wages and your current job wages may be tallied in the calculation of your EI benefits.


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## top4u20

Thanks for the replies...but
 I did some digging and found these CDN Govt articles specifically talking about this very thing. The last 2 paragraphs in particular. Seems this has been brought up before. 

http://www.ae-ei.gc.ca/policy/appeals/cubs/20000-30000/23000-23999/23828e.html


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## Occam

That's a 17 year old decision, which is referring to an even older decision.

Do you have any case history from this century?


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## George Wallace

topo4u20 said:
			
		

> Thanks for the replies...but
> I did some digging and found these CDN Govt articles specifically talking about this very thing. The last 2 paragraphs in particular. Seems this has been brought up before.
> 
> http://www.ae-ei.gc.ca/policy/appeals/cubs/20000-30000/23000-23999/23828e.html



This is a case of a person leaving a job in Miami, Florida.  What relevance does it have here?  Canadian and American policies and practices are totally different.


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## Occam

George Wallace said:
			
		

> This is a case of a person leaving a job in Miami, Florida.  What relevance does it have here?  Canadian and American policies and practices are totally different.



The contract was with a Canadian employer, to provide services to an American hospital.  There was a lot of headhunting in the nursing profession back then, and the industry has gotten away from doing business that way.

Regardless, it's ages old case history, and every SCAN seminar I've been to for the last 8 years has told us that we should not be expecting to draw EI unless we get laid off from a civvie employer shortly after leaving the CF.  In that case, the EI insurable income from the CF would be counted to determine benefits, as George described.

Why not call the EI people on Tuesday if it's that important?


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## b7197

Hello,
I am a class A reservist now and considering to be employed as a Class B with a six months contract. Will I be eligible to apply EI if my contract is not extended after six months?

Thanks.


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## xo31@711ret

yep; I retired after 24 years to follow my spouse on her last posting to a remote area; went class A there for awhile then picked up some class B. Applied for EI & my class A & B was factored in. Colected EI for almost year...


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## top4u20

I just brought this up under curiosity. A buddy mentioned the possibility. I will call them next week and ask. I wonder if a member's contract ends and they are on IR and decide not to sign. The reason is because the military will not post the member back home so he/she decides to not sign new contract. I bet thats a valid reason to them. I will look into it further.


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## George Wallace

topo4u20 said:
			
		

> I just brought this up under curiosity. A buddy mentioned the possibility. I will call them next week and ask. I wonder if a member's contract ends and they are on IR and decide not to sign. The reason is because the military will not post the member back home so he/she decides to not sign new contract. I bet thats a valid reason to them. I will look into it further.



I wouldn't bet on it, but it never hurts to ask Services Canada.  Don't be disappointed should they say no.


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## top4u20

Here is more info on the subject: Taken from Canadian EI website. I deleted the last 38 reasons for saving space

VOLUNTARILY LEAVING EMPLOYMENT
6.8.0 Checklist

Circumstances to take into consideration when determining if just cause exits for voluntarily leaving employment are not limited to only the situations currently defined in the Act. This is a list of 40 main reasons that the jurisprudence has historically considered in this regard.

It must be borne in mind that, within the terms of the legislation, just cause for voluntarily leaving employment exists where, having regard to all the circumstances, the claimant had no reasonable alternative to leaving employment.

6.8.1 40 Main Circumstances to take into Consideration 

Adoption–Leave Not Granted
Armed Forces–Failure to Re-enlist for a Further Term (the jurisprudence recognizes the right to not renew one's contract in the Armed Forces when it expires


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## top4u20

George Wallace said:
			
		

> This is a case of a person leaving a job in Miami, Florida.  What relevance does it have here?  Canadian and American policies and practices are totally different.



I agree that Canadian and American policies are different but why would the Canadian EI use this case under Reason No. 2: Armed Forces–Failure to Re-enlist for a Further Term if they did not want it to effect Canadian workers?


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## top4u20

George Wallace said:
			
		

> I wouldn't bet on it, but it never hurts to ask Services Canada.  Don't be disappointed should they say no.



I agree...never hurts to ask. Ya gotta think we pay into EI...should get some benefit at the end. Even if we were only out of work a short time after contract. Maybe they would give us EI while attending education upgrades. Biggest issue I seen is pension implications. If a person is getting no pension or downsized annual annuity it may be worth pursuing.


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## Occam

xo31@711ret said:
			
		

> yep; I retired after 24 years to follow my spouse on her last posting to a remote area; went class A there for awhile then picked up some class B. Applied for EI & my class A & B was factored in. Colected EI for almost year...



That's a different situation.  If you voluntarily release to accompany a spouse who is transferred (such as a posting), then you aren't considered to have quit your job voluntarily.  Many, many CF spouses collect EI when following CF members on posting every year.



			
				topo4u20 said:
			
		

> Armed Forces–Failure to Re-enlist for a Further Term (the jurisprudence recognizes the right to not renew one's contract in the Armed Forces when it expires



If you already knew the answer to your question, then why did you ask it?


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## top4u20

Occam said:
			
		

> That's a different situation.  If you voluntarily release to accompany a spouse who is transferred (such as a posting), then you aren't considered to have quit your job voluntarily.  Many, many CF spouses collect EI when following CF members on posting every year.
> 
> 
> If you already knew the answer to your question, then why did you ask it?



I was aware it was written down in the EI regs but I wanted to know if anyone had ever claimed EI under those circumstances.


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## Pusser

I actually discussed this with somebody from EI once.  The reason members leaving the CF are seldom eligible to collect EI on release has nothing to do with being in the CF.  In other words, CF members are not excluded from EI benefits and in fact are treated the same as anyone else who is leaving or losing a job.  The reason it appears we are not entitled is because we have a very good set of termination benefits.  Any EI benefits that anyone receives are reduced by benefits that are paid by the former employer.  In the case of CF members, this generally exceeds what EI would pay and so we get nothing.  In other words, we're eligible, but we don't qualify ;D 

Another thing that folks sometimes seem to forget is that EI is an insurance plan, not an investment.  If you never need it (e.g. because your severance package is enough to tide you over to the next job), then you never collect it.  That's not necessarily a bad thing.  How many folks are upset because they've paid for car insurance for many years and never had an accident?


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## BK

Hi,

Was just browsing the forums and was just wondering; If a spouse had a permanent job with EI and she left because of a CF member (her spouse) was being posted to a different province, would EI still give her benifits if she quit her job to live with her husband?


cheers


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## chrisf

b7197 said:
			
		

> Hello,
> I am a class A reservist now and considering to be employed as a Class B with a six months contract. Will I be eligible to apply EI if my contract is not extended after six months?
> 
> Thanks.



Yes, provided your unemployed for the requisite amount of time following the contract.... class A employment is considered employed... see your private messages for more details...


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## Occam

BK said:
			
		

> Hi,
> 
> Was just browsing the forums and was just wondering; If a spouse had a permanent job with EI and she left because of a CF member (her spouse) was being posted to a different province, would EI still give her benifits if she quit her job to live with her husband?
> 
> 
> cheers



"A permanent job with EI"....you mean she works for EI??   ;D

I suspect you mean she's employed full time, and would be quitting voluntarily to accompany her spouse on posting.  Yes, that qualifies her for EI at the new location.


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## BK

yup, a little typo there but you seem to have gotten the right idea Occam.

Thanks

Gotta love Canada


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