# HK High Reliability Magazine



## Kal (9 May 2005)

Has anyone used or seen these mags?  Just wondering if they do what they say they will do.  Not that a M16/C7/AR15 will jam that often when clean and with good ammo...  

http://www.hkdefense.us/pages/military-le/special%20applications/sa80mag.html


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## Da_man (9 May 2005)

How about a high reliability C7 now?  ;D   Seriously your rifle will stop working LONG before your mags.  I dont see the point.


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## Kal (9 May 2005)

Well, seeing as many weapon malfunctions are magazine and ammo related and how the current mags are produced _en masse_ and the amount of abuse they take, I'm not sure how you come to that understanding.  Just as anyone who shoots a 1911 will know to use wilson combat mags in it, because of the increased reliability.


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## Da_man (9 May 2005)

Well... thats just from personal experience.  Ive never had any magazine related problems, even when they were full of sand and dirt.   I cant say the same for the weapon itself.


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## NATO Boy (9 May 2005)

The issued mags work fine IMO; rounds stay seated properly, the spot-welding and steel construction is very durable (to think that we used to have thermo mold mags is atrocious), and even when dented (from dropping your rifle) they still function flawlessly. If anything they could be the "No Name Brand" equivalent of the HK mags (look very similar, but there could be internal differences with HK such as stronger springs and/or improved feed ramps.)


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## KevinB (9 May 2005)

Issue (USGI type) versus HK SA80A2 












The HK mag is steel - much more durable, is larger aprox 1/2" longer (it does not fit our mag pouches well).


Our issue mags are fine until they take a little bit of damage and need to be replaced regularily (even though this does not happen usually) 
When doing CQB drills with speed reloads when the mags are ripped from the weapon and discarded quickly if the mags don't have magpuls they tend to get damaged after a few cycles.
 The same happens to the lips after doign tac reloads on a closed bolt again and again and again.

Personally the HK's are nice but not worth the extra $ IMHO.  

Cycle thru your work mags.   # them and mark failures on the mag body - after a mag hits 5, N/S the mag.

I've put the Magpul Ranger Plates and the magpul enhanced selflevelling follower in mine ands they work 100%.


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## Kal (9 May 2005)

The one thing I'm always left wondering is; "Where does Kevin get all of these pictures?"


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## KevinB (10 May 2005)

I mugged an assaulter
 ;D


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## Britney Spears (10 May 2005)

Come on, those Brit mags were made like last year, of course they work better compared to most of ours. ;D


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## 1feral1 (10 May 2005)

HK has engineered these new mags for the UK L85A2 and L86A2. I have one, and yes they are the bees knees for durable, but they are steel, made for steel recievers ( Minimi would be okay), not alloy ones in the M16 FOW. Yes, it is longer.

A bewt follower in the same quality of HK91 mags, and the mag is also marked HK.

I also have the steel mag for the French FAMAS G2 rilfe, and this basically is a steel copy of the US alloy 30rd mags.

Cheers,

Wes


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## KevinB (10 May 2005)

No my pic
 but a better comparrison   (I dont have any HK mags anymore)
HK versus original SA80 mag







Certain USSOC units have adopted them - that said many more prefer the old USGI.

 Wes - given the coating on the mag and the annodizing and coat on the magwell I have not seen any problems from the mag - the only real wear spot is the mag release and it is steel.

*must learn to spell


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## 1feral1 (10 May 2005)

I'll take some pics tonight and post em Kevin. The mags I had and the one I have were used in south Iraq and they had quite a bit of use.

I'll post some pics of the Frog mag also.

Cold beers,

Wes


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## KevinB (10 May 2005)

Thx.

 I have not seen any that hit the desert - I detect a rationale from your above - steel/aluminum comment...


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## 1feral1 (10 May 2005)

Kal said:
			
		

> Well, seeing as many weapon malfunctions are magazine and ammo related and how the current mags are produced _en masse_ and the amount of abuse they take, I'm not sure how you come to that understanding.   Just as anyone who shoots a 1911 will know to use wilson combat mags in it, because of the increased reliability.



Since it was first brought about in the late 1960s, the 30rd mag US generic issue types are unchanged with the exception of funky coloured followers, and the PC lettering 'for law enforcement use only'.

30rd mags here, many of them have been in service since Christ was a Lance Corporal. The HK mag is suburb, and its the Rolls-Royce of 30rd mags.

EDIT: Well its just after 2030 here and I am bagged after a long day. I just got home! When I get home after work tomorow, I'll post some good pics between the HK and the Frog mag. Off to bed, I have a 0530 start.

Out....

Wes

Cheers,

Wes


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## Kal (10 May 2005)

Wesley H. Allen said:
			
		

> HK has engineered these new mags for the UK L85A2 and L86A2. I have one, and yes they are the bees knees for durable, but they are steel, made for steel recievers ( Minimi would be okay), not alloy ones in the M16 FOW. Yes, it is longer.



     Why can't the steel mag be used properly in an alloy receiver, or is that just the L85/L86 mag being used for the M16 series?  I was under the impression that HK developed these mags for the M16 series also, is this a different High Reliability mag?  



			
				KevinB said:
			
		

> I have not seen any that hit the desert - I detect a rationale from your above - steel/aluminum comment...



     Also, looking forward to that..... 

     Kevin, during your criminal escapades I'm surprised that this 'victim' didn't drop you with a 'judo chop'.


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## KevinB (10 May 2005)

He fell for the "Look, an Eagle" routine  

The SA80A2 mag is the "high reliability" mag - just different marketing


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## 1feral1 (10 May 2005)

Kal said:
			
		

> Why can't the steel mag be used properly in an alloy receiver, or is that just the L85/L86 mag being used for the M16 series?   I was under the impression that HK developed these mags for the M16 series also, is this a different High Reliability mag?



It's not that they cant be used, but prolonged (and I mean prolonged) use will cause wear to alloy recievers. Steel is harder than the alloy. I used to have steel Sterling mags for my AR15, and I had them for about 15 yrs, and they worked fine, but 'civvy' use vs military use are two different things.

Cheers,

Wes


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## Cpl.Banks (10 May 2005)

So what happend to those french mags? Ive been doing my C7 training a few weeks ago and we were doing the usual load, unload, prepare for inspection etc... And quite a few times with doing the unload I have heard and seen people dropping the mags on the floor. They dont seem to get banged up, then again this is indoors. But my point is our mags arent bad, in fact i like them, the springs are strong and the outer shell also very strong. The HK mags are nice, a little bit bigger, and alot more expe$ive! Keep ours, wait for the C7 to be phased out(12-16 yr) and get on with your lives! We can leave the bitching to the armchair generals!
UBIQUE!!!!! ;D


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## Kal (10 May 2005)

C7 training, high speed magazines and JTF patrol vests, I wish I had all this stuff back when I was in cadets...  I never said the issue mags weren't good, well, at least the ones that aren't too beat up, but just wanted to see if the HK mags are considerably better.  If something improves your game and may potentially save your life or buddy's, then why wouldn't you use it?  Keep ours?  Sure, if they were kept current and the government procured readily enough to replace the bad ones, but half the mags issued I wouldn't trust to put any more than 27 rounds in them, if that.   What do I know though, I'll just take my AR and go to Blackwater this fall, then maybe I can start the road to being as hardcore as some of the cadets here...


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## 1feral1 (10 May 2005)

Cpl.Banks(Cdt.) said:
			
		

> So what happend to those french mags? Ive been doing my C7 training a few weeks ago and we were doing the usual load, unload, prepare for inspection etc... And quite a few times with doing the unload I have heard and seen people dropping the mags on the floor. They dont seem to get banged up, then again this is indoors. But my point is our mags arent bad, in fact i like them, the springs are strong and the outer shell also very strong. The HK mags are nice, a little bit bigger, and alot more expe$ive! Keep ours, wait for the C7 to be phased out(12-16 yr) and get on with your lives! We can leave the bitching to the armchair generals!
> UBIQUE!!!!! ;D




Mate, I am not smearing shyte on ya, but....

Armchair generals? This coming from a 15yr old who seems to know it all about these mags? What the hell do you know about mags Lad. Unless you have the TI and experience, I suggest you stay in the cadet forums, or at least read and absorb info from certain posts.

A cadet lesson or two on a rifle in a classroom, empty mags dropping onto a floor? Well, this is a far cry from the real world. Don't go accusing me of being a cadet basher either. I fully support the movement 110% in both Canada and here in Australia, but what really gets me is when an individual (in this case you) a mere 15 yr old boy, has an 'attitude' and thinks he knows it all and is the master SME, when in reality he does not have a clue.      


FYI, The pics of the FAMAS G2 steel mag and the L85A2 HK manufactured magazine will be posted when I get home tonight (as per post no.13, para 3, if you read the post you would have known that).


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## 1feral1 (10 May 2005)

The protective finnish on the mags should not be disturbed, as this weakens the structure (makes the alloy actually softer as its hard shell protection has been disturbed), and promotes corrosion. The generic 30rd mags are fine, but they loose their colour (yet the adonised finish remains), and do not absorb shock very well, other words they dent and don't bounce back into shape. At least they are inexpensive, but I can only imagine in the CF system going to the anal extreme (with the firearms legislation on over-capicity mags etc), they would be 'very' accountable (at least at home anyway), and therefore one could be in some sort of strife if lost or damaged. Here it does'nt matter, its not that serious as they are 'just' mags, and they are expendable.   

Cold beers,

Wes


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## NATO Boy (10 May 2005)

2332Piper said:
			
		

> A question, would 'roughing up' the sides of the magazines (not having it so smooth) be a practical addition to the current mag? Because I have noticed (especially when wearing gloves) that the mags are rather slippery when being handled. I know, not a huge problem, but something I have noticed nonetheless.



Maybe for some, but why not try these...







Not only will reloads be easier, you're almost guaranteed to never fumble with crap again.  ;D


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## NATO Boy (11 May 2005)

Ha ha ha ha ha!!!!! ;D

I was expecting Wes to jump on that one. ;D


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## 1feral1 (11 May 2005)

;D I think its just retarded to go   all 'anal' when some poor lad looses a magazine. However loss of kit should never be taken for granted nor lightly, and I am in favour of cracking the whip when needed, or when pure neglegence has been found. Bad attitudes by disgruntled soldiers don't help their cause either. 

Here as I said loosing a mag is not a problem (again it depends on the circumstances on the loss - i.e. deep in the bowels of a typical jungley Aussie training area, say falling from a mag pouch in the heat of a section attack, or theft off your bunk for example - two different circumstances), and your biggest worry is having to pay for it, as I am sure some units do, but at every unit I have been with (4), there is always surplus mags somewhere to make up for a loss.

I have had young inexperienced Diggers fresh in from their IET, trembling and all worried because they loose a mag, and they are as happy as hell, when I produce a spare one for them. Again it depends on attitude and circumstances, but at the end of the day, I look after my Diggers quite well, but there is ALWAYS no 'free rides'. Respect is a two-way street, both for weapons and kit (the responsibility and security of such), and between soldiers and their SNCOs.

Cheers,

Wes


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## 1feral1 (11 May 2005)

Here is some of the mag pictures I just took a few minutes ago, Sam the Siamese cat just would not leave me alone. Seems anything weapons related, facinates him, maybe the smell of the CLP or something.

Anyways, the longer one is the HK mag, which has the HK logo on the bottom, and a red colour coded magazine spring.

The French 30rd magazine is unmarked, but is steel, and is pretty much identical to the US 30rd mag. Both weigh about ther same, and the FAMAS mag is quite robust also.

Cheers,

Wes


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## 1feral1 (11 May 2005)

Pics No. 1 & 2, the French mag, top and bottom...


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## 1feral1 (11 May 2005)

The HK mag's follower and spring.   

Pic No. 1: The follower is of a pollished steel consturction, and is very HK'ish when compaired to other HK mags.

No. 2: One can see some of the red paint which covers the one side of the spring, as not to confuse this spring with the former style of magazine.

No. 3: The base plate for the mag is HK marked, and it disassembles in a very effective 'ergonomic' way, and its quite easy to take apart, without any strain or swearing.

Hats off to HK for engineering such a supurb magazine! As for the French G2 one, well it too is good, but as I said, just a steel knock-off of the generic US alloy type. The French Marines I was with were sold on the mags, and their FAMAS, which was the first 'bull-pup' rifle to be adopted and mass produced in Europe, even before the Steyr-AUG. The mag is also used in the French Para-Minimi, which is an FN made weapon with a few French differences than the generic Para versions. Remember, France does not use the SS109 cartridge, but a steel cased version of their own, similar to the US M193 type of ammo, all based 1/12" bbl's. 

Like that AUSCAM poncho liner   8) ? Well as I have said in other threads, its available for trade for a CADPAT one.

Anyways, enough shop-talk, for I'll be dreaming about it. We had another long day, with a 0530 start, and I live 70km out of town, so I am having another early night.

Cheers to all.

Regards,

Wes


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## KevinB (11 May 2005)

Thx Wes.


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## Matt_Fisher (11 May 2005)

I also concur with what Kevin said.  

Most problems that occur with the alloy 'issued' magazines are with the followers becoming unlevelled and jamming against the interior of the magazine as they're moving up at an angle.

Magpul self-leveling followers are an excellent way to alleviate this, as some preventetive maintenance done on the mags.  Once every couple weeks or so you should disassemble your magazine, clean it out with some soap and water and reassemble it.  You'd be suprised at the amount of dust and dirt that builds up on the follower and the interior of the mag.


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## chrisf (11 May 2005)

I'm wondering about the steel mags... do they rust?


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## KevinB (11 May 2005)

They can rust - when they first went out to some USSOC units about two years ago a buddy sent some pics of rusted ones.

Matt -for mags: dishwasher baby -   
   Yeah especially in climates like Afghan (and some what I'm told) Iraq the swirling talcum powder like poo-dust the junk that accumulates in mags is unbeleivable - espeically if you are doing stuff with helo's or lot of driving.


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## 1feral1 (12 May 2005)

No worries  ;D

Cheers,
Wes


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## cpl-cam (12 May 2005)

Cpl.Banks(Cdt.) said:
			
		

> So what happend to those french mags? Ive been doing my C7 training a few weeks ago and we were doing the usual load, unload, prepare for inspection etc... And quite a few times with doing the unload I have heard and seen people dropping the mags on the floor. They dont seem to get banged up, then again this is indoors. But my point is our mags arent bad, in fact i like them, the springs are strong and the outer shell also very strong. The HK mags are nice, a little bit bigger, and alot more expe$ive! Keep ours, wait for the C7 to be phased out(12-16 yr) and get on with your lives! We can leave the bitching to the armchair generals!
> UBIQUE!!!!! ;D


Easy there Banks, just because the reply button is there doesn't mean you have to hit right away and shoot off your mouth. Sure you shot a C7 good for you, that doesn't make you an expert. I've been gliding multiple times but you don't see me posting "The Sea Kings are fine, I've seen them crashing and no one died, just keep them and stop bitching until they phase them out in a couple decades"


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## KevinB (13 May 2005)

Issue Labelle teflons - wolff springs - Mapul Enhanced followers and Ranger plates

and of course gorgeous hair  ;D


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## mudgunner49 (13 May 2005)

KevinB said:
			
		

> ...and of course gorgeous hair   ;D




It's all about "The 'Do" isn't it??   I'm taking your upper out tomorrow to get it dirty - then I'm gonna ship it to you   > >   If I can scrounge a digital camera, I'll even take some pictures...


take care (and make sure nobody messes up that lid)

Blake


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## KevinB (13 May 2005)

Blake - cool let me know how it does.

Sadly my hair fell victim to the Sgt Maj -- I quote "Elvis, you starting a rock band or something..."

 Which led me to believe - and shortly after the O gp it was confirmed that my hair had somehow offended.  

So I went out and got about 1" off the top and a #4 taper.  
 Okay it would not stay off the ears w/o hair care products - but I think I look a lot cooler with good hair  ;D


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## Kal (13 May 2005)

KevinB said:
			
		

> [and of course gorgeous hair   ;D



        I thought the little bit of growth on the face was waaaaay sexier.....


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## KevinB (15 May 2005)

The fact you wrote that, AND your profile says male scares me...


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## Kal (15 May 2005)

:dontpanic: ;D


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