# How to Be a Medical Officer



## aleferesco

Good Evening, 

My name is Alex, I'm 26 years old, I'm a Canadian Citizen, and an International Medical Graduate (Went to Medical School Abroad). Furthermore, I haven't started or completed a Residency yet, I only finished Medical School with an A-. 

I'm interested in applying to the Canadian Forces for the Medical Officer Profession but, I have a series of questions: 

1. I am currently in the process of getting my Medical Credentials approved by the Medical Council of Canada (MCC). In Canada, before an International Medical Graduate (IMG) can apply for a Residency Spot at any Canadian University, the MCC requires two exams to be writen.
Is this also a requirement for the Canadian Forces in order to apply for Medical Officer? if not, what would be the process for a Canadian Citizen with a non-Canadian Medical Degree who wants to apply for Medical Officer?

2. Let's say I'm not able to apply now, since I have a non-Canadian Medical Degree, if I were to be accepted into a Canadian University for a Residency spot, and after completing the Basic Officer Training, will I then be able to apply for Medical Officer?

3. What are the standards or requirements to be considered for Medical Officer after completing the Basic Oficer training? Is the selection process made during the Training or are there other requirements other?  

4. How many people on average apply for Medical Officer? How many get accepted? In which Institution is the Medical Officer training offered?

5. It is 14 weeks of Basic Officer Qualification Course? If I don't get accepted into the program of my choice, then what happens after?

Sorry if I'm a little off with the questions and the information, any help would be greatly appreciated

Thank you very much for your time and help
Best regards, 

Alex


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## Vimy01

1. I am currently in the process of getting my Medical Credentials approved by the Medical Council of Canada (MCC). In Canada, before an International Medical Graduate (IMG) can apply for a Residency Spot at any Canadian University, the MCC requires two exams to be writen.
Is this also a requirement for the Canadian Forces in order to apply for Medical Officer? if not, what would be the process for a Canadian Citizen with a non-Canadian Medical Degree who wants to apply for Medical Officer?

You must be a fully licensed Canadian physician with the unrestricted ability to practice medicine in any province or territory before applying to become a MO. 

2. Let's say I'm not able to apply now, since I have a non-Canadian Medical Degree, if I were to be accepted into a Canadian University for a Residency spot, and after completing the Basic Officer Training, will I then be able to apply for Medical Officer?

Once you become a fully licensed Canadian physician you can apply to the CF. If accepted, you will then be sent to BMOQ. After that you will receive additional training and then will be posted as a full fledge MO. 

3. What are the standards or requirements to be considered for Medical Officer after completing the Basic Oficer training? Is the selection process made during the Training or are there other requirements other?  

Medical officers are selected by the recruiting process. If you are sent to CFLRS you have already been designated a MO. 

4. How many people on average apply for Medical Officer? How many get accepted? In which Institution is the Medical Officer training offered?

The forces are always looking for Medical Officers. I'm not aware of the numbers. But, applicants with Canadian/US medical degrees are usually preferred. 

5. It is 14 weeks of Basic Officer Qualification Course? If I don't get accepted into the program of my choice, then what happens after?

BMOQ is 14 weeks long. In Canada, you choose your trade before going to BMOQ. If you are accepted as a Medical Officer - you are then a Medical Officer up until you fail training, get kicked out, or are released.


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## Vimy01

Please excuse errors - I'm typing on my phone.


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## aleferesco

Good evening,

Thank you for replying and providing all the valuable information.

Best regards, 

Alex


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## SRS1999

Good Day,

I just wanted to clarify some items on this query.  I am going to give a brief over view vice trying to answer each question as there may be a chance for run on of information if I do it that.

As a resident you can still apply to join the Canadian Armed Forces as Medical Officer.  You would apply to the Military Officer Training Program (MOTP).  If you are recruited for this enrolment plan the military would pay for your residency and give you a salary (range $61,824 to $65,808/year) while you complete your Residency.  For this you would have obligatory service upon graduation of your residency program that equates to roughly 2 months of mandatory service for every 1 month of school/residency paid for.

Please note that for this option, as an International Medical Graduate (IMG) that (1) You have to be licensed to practise in Canada and the province in which you are doing your Residency; and (2) That you have to seek your own Residency program (in family medicine).

This Fiscal Year we are looking for 10 DEO Medical Officers and 13 MOTP Medical Officers.  The numbers change year to year and so do the application numbers.

As a Medical Officer in the CAF you would do 14 weeks of Basic Military Officer Qualification in St-Jean like everyone else. The next course would be the Basic Medical Officer course which is 3-4 weeks in Borden.  Finally there is the Health Services Operations and Staff Officer Course which is 6 weeks in Borden.  These courses are not necessarily done back to back.

If you have any other questions please don't hesitate to let me know.

Cheers,


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## aleferesco

Good Evening, 

Thank you very much for the reply, everything is very clear now.

Kind regards,

Alejandro


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## smsadeed

I am an International Medical Graduate and Canadian citizen. I am willing to write all the tests for Licensure in Canada. After that I will join Candian forces. I want to do residency in Surgery after joining the canada forces. what is the process in the Forces? 
Do we apply for residency through Carms?      
Is it as competitive as the Carms for IMGs?
Someone Kindly Reply.


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## CombatDoc

smsadeed said:
			
		

> I am an International Medical Graduate and Canadian citizen. I am willing to write all the tests for Licensure in Canada. After that I will join Candian forces. I want to do residency in Surgery after joining the canada forces. what is the process in the Forces?
> Do we apply for residency through Carms?
> Is it as competitive as the Carms for IMGs?
> Someone Kindly Reply.


Please see reply #4 above. The CAF will only sponsor you for a residency in Family Medicine, through the MOTP. Once you have served as a General Duty Medical Officer i.e. Family Physician (and completed your obligatory service), you would have the ability to compete for a limited number of specialist residency positions, such as General Surgery or Ortho, through the MMTP.


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## Nudibranch

smsadeed said:
			
		

> I am an International Medical Graduate and Canadian citizen. I am willing to write all the tests for Licensure in Canada. After that I will join Candian forces. I want to do residency in Surgery after joining the canada forces. what is the process in the Forces?
> Do we apply for residency through Carms?
> Is it as competitive as the Carms for IMGs?
> Someone Kindly Reply.



Indeed, during training (med school or residency) CAF will only sponsor for Family Medicine. So you're 100% on your own for your surgical training.
If, after training you still want to join the CAF, there may be a possibility - GenSurg and Ortho are both CAF specialties. But that depends on how many spots are open, and whether any CAF GDMOs (family docs) are trying out for those spots. Specialty spots don't have that much turnover.


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## MacKinnon88

Hello, I'm a grade 12 student and would like to be a doctor / surgeon in the forces.... I have already applied for the ROTP and have selected my occupations as medical officer, pilot (second choice and I got my wings from air cadets this summer), and engineer. Could someone please clarify the path that I would need to take to become a surgeon in the forces.


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## DAA

MacKinnon88 said:
			
		

> Hello, I'm a grade 12 student and would like to be a doctor / surgeon in the forces.... I have already applied for the ROTP and have selected my occupations as medical officer, pilot (second choice and I got my wings from air cadets this summer), and engineer. Could someone please clarify the path that I would need to take to become a surgeon in the forces.



http://www.forces.ca/en/job/medicalofficer-50

Medical Officer is not an available option for ROTP as it requires you to already be accepted into a "recognized Canadian University Medical program."

Please see the link above for additional details.


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## MacKinnon88

ok thanks. I knew that I couldn't directly become a medical officer. Because you can't just go directly into medical school.... but how do I get to become a Medical Officer, like what's the route that I need to take in order to achieve this.


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## DAA

MacKinnon88 said:
			
		

> ok thanks. I knew that I couldn't directly become a medical officer. Because you can't just go directly into medical school.... but how do I get to become a Medical Officer, like what's the route that I need to take in order to achieve this.



There are various routes and options to becoming a Medical Officer in the Canadian Forces, none of which can be done quickly.  Here's a general breakdown of the various Entry Plans:

a.  DEO (Direct Entry) - already qualified and licenced to practice Medicine in Canada;
b.  MOTP (Medical Officer Trg Plan) - accepted into a Canadian University Medical program;
c.  MMTP (Military Medical Trg Plan - this is only available internally to CAF members) - already a member of the Canadian Forces and accepted into a Canadian University Medical program.


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## CombatDoc

1.  Finish High School. With good grades 
2.  Get accepted into a suitable Bachelor's degree program at University. Get good grades (especially in 2nd year courses like organic chemistry). Maintain school/life balance. Get your Bachelor's degree.
3.  Apply to medical school. Get accepted. Complete 4 years of medical school to earn your MD. Write your national exams. 
4. Apply to Family Medicine residency. Get accepted. Complete 2 more years of training. Write your national exams. 

At any time during #3 after being accepted at med school, apply through MOTP to be a Medical Officer. 
At any time after #4, apply to join the CAF as a direct entry Medical Officer.

Since you're still at stage #1, work hard and good luck.


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## hailPBJ71

Hi, 

I just graduated from high school and am interested in becoming a Medical Officer in the CAF.  I am a Canadian Citizen, and have offers to undergraduate Medicine courses abroad, as well as undergraduate courses in Canada.  I understand that I will need to obtain a license if I graduate medical school outside of Canada.  I am in the process of choosing where I would study, and would like to ask for some advice as to which path may be better (university abroad while studying Medicine directly, or start with getting a Bachelor’s degree in Canada)?

Any help or advice would be great.  Thank you for your time.


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## CombatDoc

hailPBJ71 said:
			
		

> Hi,
> 
> I just graduated from high school and am interested in becoming a Medical Officer in the CAF.  I am a Canadian Citizen, and have offers to undergraduate Medicine courses abroad, as well as undergraduate courses in Canada.  I understand that I will need to obtain a license if I graduate medical school outside of Canada.  I am in the process of choosing where I would study, and would like to ask for some advice as to which path may be better (university abroad while studying Medicine directly, or start with getting a Bachelor’s degree in Canada)?
> 
> Any help or advice would be great.  Thank you for your time.


It depends where you see yourself settling down eventually. If your undergrad medicine is in the US, for example, you will have more success returning to Canada for residency programs or post-residency than if you study medicine in the Caribbean. 

I  recommend that you Google the experiences of those who studied medicine abroad to help inform your decision.


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## ModlrMike

To echo what ArmyDoc has said, the pathway to the full practice of medicine for an IMG (international medical graduate) is very challenging, unless you have studied in one of very few countries (US, UK, AUS, for example). The primary issue is that your education has to be substantively equivalent to the education provided by a Canadian programme, and your residency has to be sufficiently rigorous. In addition, as an IMG many provinces require you complete at least one more year of general residency before you can practice (subject to passing the national exams as well). The foregoing presumes that you achieved the requirements for full license in your country of study, or in another off shore jurisdiction.

If you want a Canadian residency after medical school, then you should look at this table from CARMS, you can see where the various IMGs who were matched for 2017 studied. These numbers represent about 12% of all residencies granted, given that there are about 2950 residencies matched nationwide per year.

I also direct you to this message board, where they discuss the challenges of IMG in detail.

As a PA in ER, I see a great many IMGs come through the department. Many have spent a number of years applying repeatedly to the IMG programme. These are folks who immigrated to Canada with the expectation that they could continue to be employed as physicians at some point. I cannot more strongly state that the success rate for IMGs is dismally low, for many reasons.

I encourage you to do your research, and go into this venture with your eyes open, fully aware of the risks and challenges ahead of you. It could be quite disappointing to spend thousands of dollars, and many years studying medicine overseas, only to never gain a license in Canada.


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## Pusser

Note also that if you go to medical school in Canada, there is a good chance that the CAF will pay for it under the Medical Officer Training Program.


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## tomahawk6

Perhaps being a Physician assistan might be an option ?


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## ModlrMike

AFIK, there is no plan to direct enroll PAs, neither is there a subsidized academic stream outside the CF. PAs are selected from currently serving members who apply to an annual competition. The last time I asked my contact at CFMG this question, the response was that the CF will be able to meet its PA needs internally for the foreseeable future.


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## tomahawk6

Thanks. The US does recruit PA's and I thought I read that the CF does the same. I stand corrected.


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## CombatDoc

tomahawk6 said:
			
		

> Thanks. The US does recruit PA's and I thought I read that the CF does the same. I stand corrected.


The US model for PA production is different than the Cdn model. Although there is the potential to recruit PA graduates from civilian programs in Canada, this has not yet occurred. Furthermore, CAF PAs are oriented towards primary care, whereas many US PAs work in hospital sub specialist areas (eg orthopedics, neuro, etc).


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## hailPBJ71

Thank you all for your help and all the information.  I really appreciate this.


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## Blackadder1916

I came across this interesting programme while researching something else.  It seems that the CAF had a few funded FM residency slots available for medical students who failed to match for residency.  I won't comment on the unusual circumstance of not matching or the individuals who fail to do so.

https://www.cfms.org/what-we-do/education/motp.html


> Medical Officer Training Program for Unmatched Students -MOTP Surge 2018
> 
> The CFMS in collaboration with the Canadian Armed Forces has worked to create supernumerary Family Medicine positions through the Medical Officer Training Program (MOTP). This initiative is called MOTP Surge 2018. If you are interested in exploring the option of becoming a Medical Officer and starting residency in July, please follow the steps below.
> 
> In order to apply you must:
> •be a Canadian Citizen; and
> •be between 17 and 47 years old.
> 
> Unmatched Medical Students
> 
> Regardless of previous interest in the military, any medical student who finds out they are unmatched after the second match iteration on April 11 is encouraged to:
> 
> 1. Send an email with “MOTP Surge 2018” in the subject to: HealthSvcsRecruiting-RecrutementSvcsdesante@forces.gc.ca. This will get them put on an emailing list through which we will communicate any and all updates regarding the military application process and/or PGME application process.



Since a number of the individuals who have sought advice here are IMGs, this programme does not appear to apply to that situation.  This from the uOttawa, one of the schools that has a couple of the slots.

https://med.uottawa.ca/postgraduate/news/uottawa-pgme-dnd-sponsored-training-2018-only


> The University of Ottawa and the Department of National Defence have launched a collaborative effort to offer up to two post-second-iteration CaRMS, postgraduate training positions in Family Medicine for Canadian Armed Forces Medical Officers. This is a joint application process and, as such, your residency application will be viewed by representatives of both the Department of National Defence and the University of Ottawa.
> 
> Each applicant must be either:
> 
> i) a current student in a Canadian medical school with an expected graduation date of June 1, 2018 or earlier, or be a past graduate of a Canadian medical school.
> 
> ii) a previous year Canadian medical school graduate who has not undertaken any postgraduate medical education.
> 
> Additionally, only those applicants who have also concurrently applied to the Canadian Armed Forces will be considered.
> 
> It is important to note that your training position within the University of Ottawa is contingent upon ongoing sponsorship by the Department of National Defence


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