# Military I.D. and the LCBO- A "situation"



## AFireinside13 (28 Jan 2006)

Hey guys, I just came back from going to the beer store and the LCBO to stock up for a party I'm having for my good friend who is going away for pre-dep training before he goes to Afghanistan in August. 
I go to the beer store, show my Military ID (which is one of those reserve Temp Cards for now) and have no problems.I never have had problems using it.  I am 20 years old and that is gov ID so obviously there should be no problems, oh and it says on the wall the types of accepted ID and Canadian Forces ID is on there. 
Next to the LCBO. I notice the only cashier on till is this lady that, excuse my language, like to bust my balls everytime I'm in there. She will go out of her way and say " you better be over 19, or I'll call the police" or " I'm really good a spotting fake IDs so don't even try if you have one".  You get the idea. I show her my ID, and right on the wall beside her, long behold there is the same poster that explains the types of IDs you can use, and just like the other; Canadian Forces ID is there.  This lady looks at it and says I've never seen this before. I can't accept this.  

Our conversation went like this:

Me: but it says on the wall, CF id, and this is CF ID.
Her: Yeah, but I've never seen that before, so I'm not accepting it. 
Me: OK, well, its not my fault you don't know, go get your book that shows all the IDs.
Her: (without looking) Oh i cant find it.
Me: Can you please get your manager
Her: (picks up the phone) hey *name* can you please come down here.

So the manager comes down and the clerk goes and talks to her and they have a little discussion. 

Manager: we cant accept this, this can easily be created and it looks fake.
Me: OK, look at the wall, look in your book, its there ma'am.
Manager: oh, I cant find the book.
then a customer standing  2 people back whips out his CF id, which is a permanent one and says, let me see it, I am an officer in the CF. He proceeds to tell her, that is a legit ID.
So i was like, YES! they talk a sec. 
Manager says: No, i cant take your word on it, these IDs are different anyways, it looks like you can make this once easily, and i believe it to be fake. I am going to hold this ID (can they do that if theres no evidence of it being fake?)
I almost hit the roof. " there is no way you are holding that ID, that is government ID and sh*t will hit the fan if you take that away from me. Call the police if you want, but you're not keeping my ID" -  i wasn't yelling or anything, i was pretty calm when talking to her, trying hard to stay polite. 
Manager: well do you have a Drivers license?
Me: its in my car, but that really shouldn't matter because that is legal ID. - But being the nice guy I am, a run out to my car, and grab my DL. I come back in, she compares my DL to the CF ID. 
Manager: Here take them, but don't use it here again. ( i always use it there with the other cashiers, and its never has raise an issue).
Me: I suggest you find out what you are allowed to accept, because this is garbage, there is no reason I should have to suffer because you have never taken the time to do your job properly. I have never had a problem coming into this store, except with this lady. This wonderful cashier is always after me when I come in here when she has no reason to. 
Manager : Do you have Airmiles?
Me: Nope, debit please.
Manager: have a nice day.

Was I wrong with what I did? I don't feel I was. I never once yelled or told her to **** off or anything, or called her a name. 
Has anyone else had problems like this? I use my id to get in bars and to buy booze, never once had a problem. 
I think my inability to grow facial hair helps to lead people to believe in 16 or something. I'll be a baby face until I die, but it helps for morning inspection  ;D


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## Michael OLeary (28 Jan 2006)

Was the temporary ID a photo ID?

Was it identical to one of the ID cards shown on the wall chart?


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## Kat Stevens (28 Jan 2006)

The first time she threatened to call the cops, I would have sat down on my box of beer in the middle of the checkout, and said "please do... in fact, I insist on it."


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## AFireinside13 (28 Jan 2006)

Micheal it was temporary Photo id. The one that is laminated. 
And there was no picture of it on the wall, it was just one that a list of acceptable Ids.


Kat, I thought about it, cause they would have both looked like knobs.


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## my72jeep (28 Jan 2006)

Don't feel bad I once had a teller at a DND Credit Union Refuse my Military ID to cash my pay check back in the 80's.I thought it was going to be a long weekend in the shacks. but lucky for me the base RSM was in the line behind me and he informed the nice teller that that nice red line through my ID meant I was a Reserve.


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## PteCamp (28 Jan 2006)

My buddy and I went to the LCBO once here in Barrie and they did the exact same thing to him. He lost his drivers licence so he didn't have any other ID and I happened to not bring my military ID and only had my licence so I couldn't show them I had one too. They called over the manager and he gave him a lecture on how they don't accept it because it can be faked easily so they tried to get him to get one of those special LCBO ID's. We didn't want to cause a scene or anything but it was a hassle for sure, so I know exactly where your coming from.


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## Spartan (28 Jan 2006)

I've experienced the same with the additional clause that they don't like to accept them because it does not anywhere have the age of the person on it. 
It sucks, but what can we do?


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## Chimo (28 Jan 2006)

I can't believe you don't collect Airmiles!

Seriously, I would talk to your Unit Adjt and see if he/she would write a letter of explanation to the LCBO and explaining the validity of your ID Card. I would also send a letter of complaint to the LCBO head office. Both the Manager and "Lady" displayed poor customer service and appear to go against the LCBO's own policies.


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## PViddy (28 Jan 2006)

AFireinside.

I am pretty sure i have the same ID as you, my is bad as well, looks like it was put together by a 5 yr. old.  On the posters, i am fairly certain that it does show a DND temp. ID either back or front.  Needless to say, i am amazed i have never had any problems with mine so far.  Once at the beer store i had to show them where the birthdate was.  And ya, i would have insisted they call the police, or i would have done so myself.

In my experience those ID's that are done at a base rather than an ASU are a little bit better....quality.

cheers

PV


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## 48Highlander (28 Jan 2006)

Spartan said:
			
		

> I've experienced the same with the additional clause that they don't like to accept them because it does not anywhere have the age of the person on it.
> It sucks, but what can we do?



Eh?  Well, for starters, you could show them the date of birth on the back of the card.  And then help them do the math.

I've never had my military ID refused or questioned.  The strange thing is that one time I had my DRIVERS LICENCE refused, and had to use my military ID as a backup.


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## NL_engineer (28 Jan 2006)

Spartan said:
			
		

> I've experienced the same with the additional clause that they don't like to accept them because it does not anywhere have the age of the person on it.



That is compleat BS, your age is be on the back for both the temp and the permanent cards. If they can't find the spot labled DOB or Date of Birth (have seen both), or Born on the card they should not be holding that job.


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## Sig_Des (28 Jan 2006)

Never had a problem anywhere with my military id.

As far as age, if I see a bouncer concentrating too hoard on my id to find the age, I always just say, "flip it around, top left corner".


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## Lou-Dog (28 Jan 2006)

Sounds to me like the LCBO clerk was completely ignorant  and had a personal beef with you.....obviously she never served in the Forces nor did she ever associate with anyone who did.......I'd write a very nice letter to the head office of the LCBO.......or better yet, get your RSM or CO to write it on behalf of the troops.....they have a very subtle way of telling people like that to go **** themsleves.

 If the clerk and manager would have told me that a CF ID could be easliy counterfitted, I would have said :" Oh Really??? So obviously you've seen fake CF ID's and seized them???". They would have probably responded: "UHM No......" to which you reply :" Oh, so you're speculating......and you don't really know what you're talking about because you haven't  bothered give any of precious free time to serve your country in Her Majesty's Forces, isn't that right???.........". Try that in front of an audience at the LCBO next time......

 Embarrassment is a powerful tool for those who know how and when to use it.....


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## WO2 Gubbels (28 Jan 2006)

I had a question actually, does the LCBO accept the PAL/FAC??? I rarely have a problem, but once in a while the LCBO gives me a problem similar to that above.  It is goverment issued ID of course, but I'm not sure if it is in the book or not, i've never seen the poster or looked through the book.


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## Danjanou (28 Jan 2006)

I just wish I was young enough, or even looked young enough to still get carded. :'(

Seems to me I had this happen more than once in my impressionable youth. Sounds like you handled it ok, firm but not over the wall. I realise their job is to prevent underage drinking and support that. However it sounds likre another case of the general population not understanding the CF again. Better thesed days than say 20 years ago but still an issue.

I alsoagree a nicely worded but polite nastry gram to the LCBO may be in order. Be interesting to see what their response is next time you're in. 

BTW I agree with Chimo you need to be collecting airmiles. They have some really cool stuff intheir catalogue. Still arguing with the domestic niner that we should use our points to get the two man inflatable rubber raft and not a frickin blender. 8)


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## Sig_Des (28 Jan 2006)

Danjanou said:
			
		

> BTW I agree with Chimo you need to be collecting airmiles. They have some really cool stuff intheir catalogue. Still arguing with the domestic niner that we should use our points to get the two man inflatable rubber raft and not a frickin blender. 8)



But you can do so much with a blender! ;D


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## 48Highlander (28 Jan 2006)

Sig_Des said:
			
		

> But you can do so much with a blender! ;D



Hey, get away from those babies!

Oh, sorry, for a second I thought you were an infanteer....


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## PViddy (28 Jan 2006)

This should answerthe question, and ya temp ID is definately on there, this is for Ontario (LCBO) of course.

(PDF file)

 http://www.nottokids.ca/ntkbeta/PDF/ID-english.pdf 


cheers

PV


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## Fdtrucker (28 Jan 2006)

While in a LCBO in Barrie a few years ago I was refused service because I did not the Ont age of majority card or Ont Driver Licence. I had a permanent RegF ID Card and a out of province driver Licence. I was on my QL3 course so I was not required to change my provicial DL. Went to another LCBO to get what I wanted and never went to the first one again.


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## Love793 (28 Jan 2006)

Keep in mind, the Temp ID does kind of look odd, compared to the rest of the Govt IDs issued.  Most are computer generated, and extremely common.  When there is only appx 100 000 CF ID cards in circulation compared to 37+million Drivers licences I can see how she questioned it.  The clerk at the store does have the right to refuse you service, she's just trying to protect herself from lawsuits and criminal prosecution.  However on the same note, I've seen numerous people use the Age of Majority card, that I feel looks even more hokey than the Temp ID card.


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## PViddy (29 Jan 2006)

To further that, i think once they refuse service, they cannot go back for whatever reason (legality reasons-sombody with more provincial legal knowledge feel free to further that).

Well, I had return my ID back to my ASU 3 times because of mistakes, my laminated picture was actually cut out, and re-laminated into the new ID...ya it looks wonky.  Maybe a new temp design should be in order ?, or they should cntralize the process to ensure uniformity?

cheers

PV


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## 3rd Herd (29 Jan 2006)

Chimo said:
			
		

> I would also send a letter of complaint to the LCBO head office. Both the Manager and "Lady" displayed poor customer service and appear to go against the LCBO's own policies.



Be interested in the response you get from the letter to LCBO head office. Let us know what they say.


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## X Royal (29 Jan 2006)

AFireinside13 said:
			
		

> I go to the beer store, show my Military ID (which is one of those reserve Temp Cards for now) and have no problems.
> 
> Next to the LCBO. I notice the only cashier on till is this lady that, excuse my language, like to bust my balls everytime I'm in there. She will go out of her way and say " you better be over 19, or I'll call the police" or " I'm really good a spotting fake IDs so don't even try if you have one".  You get the idea. I show her my ID, and right on the wall beside her, long behold there is the same poster that explains the types of IDs you can use, and just like the other; Canadian Forces ID is there.  This lady looks at it and says I've never seen this before. I can't accept this.
> 
> ...


 
 If the temp ID's are as poor quality as they were in the 80's she had every right to refuse it.

My question is: If you have a valid drivers licence why are you using your military ID as your primary proof of age? The provincial drivers licence is far more recognizable than a temporary military ID & as your objective was not military related why not just use your licence? Over the years I have seen many young soldiers try to use their military ID to bluff their way into bars/beer stores etc. when underage or even in the attempt to use it as "a get out of jail free card".
Using your valid civilian ID is best & easier overall.


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## AFireinside13 (29 Jan 2006)

Royal, 
I agree with what you are saying, I just like to use my CF ID because my picture on my license is the day i turned 16, and they sometime get hesitant because my photo is 4 years old. Of course we all know people change in 4 years, especially in that age category. I also am in the CF so I can't afford the $75 to get my license renewed   >. Like I said, I've never had a problem with my CF id from anyone. 

I'm gonna write a letter basically saying I did not appreciate this service i received, obviously i can't boycott the LCBO, because i don't feel I should be punished  

On a side note, I put that purchase to good use last night  :


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## Cliffy433 (30 Jan 2006)

One day in Winnipeg, I was in full CFs with medals, someone refused to serve me because they "don't accept these here"

 - it was a permanent card - the old one with holographic lamination.  Hmmm... can't deploy without being 18, has medals on, plus a laminated, holographed, permanent federal government ID.  I calmly explained all of this to the lady.  She begrudgingly served me and warned me not to attempt to use such ID in the future.  From that day forth, whether in civvies or uniform, I only ever used my military ID in Winnipeg.  Never a problem.

As for the LCBO, I think their hiring process is specifically designed to cause customers the most grief and aggravation possible.  Starting by hiring people that are so dumb, Forrest Gump would slap them.  In Angus - just outside of CFB Borden - they won't let you give your Airmiles card to a non-collector.  She yelled at me and said I was committing fraud.  I asked her if allowing somebody else to use my card was fraud, why did Airmiles print right on the card that it is "TRANSFERRABLE" and why did they send me two cards indicating I should give one to a friend or spouse to allow me to collect faster?  She insisted it was fraud and if I tried again she'd call the cops.  I shook my head and left.  

Some people are too stupid to reason with.

tlm.


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## COBRA-6 (30 Jan 2006)

tlm said:
			
		

> In Angus - just outside of CFB Borden - they won't let you give your Airmiles card to a non-collector.  She yelled at me and said I was committing fraud.  I asked her if allowing somebody else to use my card was fraud, why did Airmiles print right on the card that it is "TRANSFERRABLE" and why did they send me two cards indicating I should give one to a friend or spouse to allow me to collect faster?  She insisted it was fraud and if I tried again she'd call the cops.  I shook my head and left.



She was obviously wrong, but refused to admit it. Call her on it, I bet she doesn't call the cops...


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## Milkeyway (30 Jan 2006)

I bounced at a local bar down in Windsor for 4 years and I saw a lot of fake IDs, including temp IDs. Originally this bar had a policy of not accepting US Mil IDs (being a border city) and with time, that was turned into "no Mil IDs - period". After I started working there, I changed the policy for Cdn Mil IDs and when a doorman had a problem, they used me as the "final" decision maker on the ID so it was usually OK.
As for them holding your ID and threatening you with calling the cops, well that's exactly what we did and the reason for that is that if people know their ID is fake, they will normally leave before they wait for the cops to show up (which can take FOREVER) and get in more trouble. Is it legal? Not sure but wen the cops did show up, they never said anything to us about holding their IDs - I think I collected over 300 IDs over time. Other doormen had even more!

One year, right after Xmas, I took an ID away and used the "call the cops" line. The guy actually started to cry and admitted that the ID was fake and also a Xmas gift from his girlfriend... first time using it.

I say if you get told that they will call the cops, tell them "hey, I will even dial the number for you". Once the cops shows up, have your dvrs lic handy just to compare and you'll be fine.
Makes the other party look pretty dumb.


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## Jarnhamar (30 Jan 2006)

> My question is: If you have a valid drivers licence why are you using your military ID as your primary proof of age? The provincial drivers licence is far more recognizable than a temporary military ID & as your objective was not military related why not just use your licence? Over the years I have seen many young soldiers try to use their military ID to bluff their way into bars/beer stores etc. when underage or even in the attempt to use it as "a get out of jail free card".
> Using your valid civilian ID is best & easier overall.



And thats exactly it.
Why use military ID? Cause it's cool.  Someone will say OH your a soldier! yap yap yap.  Young soldiers like to show off their young soldiers.   You can disagree but,

a. You could have just got your drivers licence (which is much easier to be accepted) but you didn't feel like you had to use it.
b. We've all seen soldiers doing it
c. We were all that age too.

And lets face it. The temp IDs are garbage and look fake.  Unfortunately for someone in the reserves to get a perm. ID card you almost need an act of god. I've even had my perm ID card taken away before comming back to Canada because reserves were not supposed to have perm. ID cards.

You should have just used your dumb drivers licence and not wanna show boat.  Baring that when they didn't accept your temp ID you should have offered to get your drivers licence in your car.  IF the teller choose not to give your military ID back then you should have called the police and get them involved.  Loosing your military ID is a security issue.


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## chrisf (30 Jan 2006)

Ghost778 said:
			
		

> Unfortunately for someone in the reserves to get a perm. ID card you almost need an act of god. I've even had my perm ID card taken away before comming back to Canada because reserves were not supposed to have perm. ID cards.



Nonsense. You need two years in the reserve. That's it.


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## Bruce Monkhouse (30 Jan 2006)

Ghost,
Very good points, lets put ourselves in this womans shoes,..... "I am willing to lose my VERY-well paying LCBO job cause someone didn't like the fact that if I have ANY DOUBT whatsoever, and fail to act, I am committing an offense."


Quote from Konrad Rosenkranz,
_I say if you get told that they will call the cops, tell them "hey, I will even dial the number for you". Once the cops shows up, have your dvrs lic handy just to compare and you'll be fine.
Makes the other party look pretty dumb._

...I can't see any of the police I know thinking doing ones job was "pretty dumb".


You got carded...stories over.


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## Jarnhamar (30 Jan 2006)

> Nonsense. You need two years in the reserve. That's it.



Well I'm not gonna argue 

I've been jerked around a lot over my ID card and have seen people jerked around.  Like I said, at 5 years+ in at the time I had my perminate ID card taken away from me and was given a temp.  Had to fight get it back in kingston.  More than once I've been told reserves are not intitled to them. It's a case of miscommunication from one element to the other. Maybe it's getting better lately.

The ID card thing reminds me of guys and girls flashing them around bars. Very cool.


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## Mineguy (30 Jan 2006)

I had a lady pull that one on me too. A sunday night and I presented her with an old version permanent ID for regular force to pick up some beer. This was the pre plastic card type laminated version with the coloured endorsing signature and the CF coat of arms embossed into the plastic. She went on acting the same way and saying it could be faked. So, eventually I after i kept laughing, went home, put my CFs on full medals and all and forge cap,hahah, walked back in. Presented same ID, and she said you could have bowrowed that uniform!

At That point a freind who walked in off a Militia excercise all cammed up still in dirty combats to buy beer and said hi to me as he knew me from whence i explained what was going on and he showed his ID card to her.She knew she made an arse out of her self by that point. The ladies manager from the back then said said, oh let him have it....like i was "earning" it or somthing for my theatrical performance.....idiots.....

I was ready to come back and have a one man kit inspection in her store in front of the bars and chips or have a freind come up with an MLVW from the close base and honk the front door as it was quite the battle i was ready to fight to make her look stupid! 

The perfect monty python skit in the making!........."This parrots dead!!!"


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## chrisf (30 Jan 2006)

Ghost778 said:
			
		

> Well I'm not gonna argue



Contact your local identification section and ask for your permanent ID, you're entitled to it. Any problems, let me know, I'll track down whatever document it is that says you're entitled.


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## rormson (30 Jan 2006)

Dido on Ghost's post. Overcome and adapt for (&*^*&^% sake


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## chrisf (30 Jan 2006)

Not sure why the temp vs permanent would be a major concern anyway, aside from the slight inconvenience of having to get the permanent renewed a little more often... most people have at least a civvie drivers lisense to use as ID, and other then that if the military wants you to show ID, the military will accept a temp.


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## CdnArtyWife (30 Jan 2006)

Well as much as I agree with the "use civvie ID" philosophy, I have a funny little story for ya.

2 years ago, hubby was down in New Hampshire helping his father find a suitable nursing home for hubby's Grandad. My hubby and his dad went into the local pub for supper one night...now keep in mind, the people at this pub have seen my husband grow up...from the numerous trips to New Hampshire and this town...including numerous meals at this particular pub (his Grandad's favorite eating establishment) over the years.

We live in New Brunswick, which, up until the VERY recent past, does not make a photo on your driver's licence mandatory...instead if you chose to have a photo you would fork over an extra $8 for it. New Brunswick was the only province with this practice. Our driver's licence states on it "Valid without photo" in a red box where the photo would be.

Now, flash back to the pub. Hubby and Father-in-Law order meals, and beers. Waitress asks for ID from my hubby. He hands her his CF ID (regf permanent) as his dvrs lic has no photo. She looks at it, and asks for more ID. Hubby has no other photo ID. She takes the CF ID over to her book and looks through it...page after page...no CF ID...she eventually comes back to tell hubby "sorry, I can't serve you alcohol. This may be a valid ID, but it is not in our book of acceptable IDs. You look old enough, but no ID, no beer"

His grandmother felt so bad for him she offered him the beer that was in the fridge...however, he should have known from the dust on the bottle that the beer inside was no longer palatable. So Gran sends hubby to the garage where there may be beer there...he finds some...again dusty, but this time the bottles are stubby tops...so that coupled with the big chunks of sedement at the bottom indicated to hubby that if he drank this...feeling parched would be the least of his problems.

Hubby went dry that trip...and his dvrs lic expires this month...so he is getting a photo this time...kinda funny, cus it is now mandatory in this province...about time!

Oh, BTW, hubby would have been 27 at the time...and doesn't look like a young 21 year old.


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## Lost_Warrior (30 Jan 2006)

No bar, store, club, pub etc etc I have ever been to where I used my military ID here in Montreal has ever worked.  I don't know if it has to do with so many people in this city being anti military, but I even had one bouncer laugh at me.  Had another who said it was probably real but didn't want to accept it anyway.   

On a side note, I went to the beer store in Toronto last year while I was down visiting some friends.  The guy at the counter wouldnt accept my Quebec drivers licence or Quebec medicare card as proof of ID because it was from Quebec (WTF??) but he did accept my military ID.   Go figure....  :


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## Sailing Instructor (31 Jan 2006)

I carry my mil ID exclusively on my person, and my driver's licence in my car.  Exception is when I am travelling and may need 2 pcs of ID for planes &c., not to mention not needing a driver's licence sitting in a car that I'm not driving.

One has to hate the BC law of 2 pcs of ID.  Once had to walk all the way from the bus stop at the top of Head st (?) by VENTURE back to the barracks to get my driver's licence.


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## 3rd Herd (31 Jan 2006)

Sailing Instructor said:
			
		

> One has to hate the BC law of 2 pcs of ID.  Once had to walk all the way from the bus stop at the top of Head st (?) by VENTURE back to the barracks to get my driver's licence.



Did you mean up that great big hill to the corner of Head and Esquimalt Rd from the Work Point Barracks main gate?


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## Thompson_JM (31 Jan 2006)

I have a question, more for the PRes then the RegF, but how much of the using army ID to buy beer is done for LCF? not to imply that thats why YOU specifically used it. but one thing ive learned is to pick my battles... why get into a big debate over beer with some Dink from the LCBO? is it really worth the effort to just pull out the Drivers License? or play the game and get an age of majority card... that way they will HAVE to accept it... 

remember, most canadians know Squat about the CF. and if youre PRes, especially in the GTA then the people at the LCBO and such are definately not used to seeing army ID... maybe if you were in Owen Sound, or Angus, or Alliston.... but I digress....

Ive used my DND ID, but usually only as a Second piece of photo ID. now I have a PAL(so i dont have to use the DND card), but still have the old red and white ontario Health card... (why get the new one, when the old one still works?) 

and I dont use my army ID anymore.... its gone bad.... the colour wore off so now my hair is bright Pink....... sigh... and yes, ive already addressed the issue with my CoC and BOR... its in the works to get one made up.... but its taking a looooong time.

anyways, this is just my .02

regards
    Josh


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## mover1 (31 Jan 2006)

I have a quick solution for all of this problems that everone has. If you don't want to get ID'd Then just use your credit card when making a purchase.

On my signature block on my credit card I have written in block letters ASK FOR ID. No one ever does. So if you are tired of people not accepting your ID then just produce a credit card. Case closed, problem solved the end.  :-[


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## Jarnhamar (31 Jan 2006)

> I have a question, more for the PRes then the RegF, but how much of the using army ID to buy beer is done for LCF?



I'll guess 97% with the reserves.


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## my72jeep (31 Jan 2006)

I know having the Mil ID. saved me a lot of grief a wile back. Shortly after 9-11 I had to go to Tampa last second do to a death in my wife's family. one way booked that morning. the last second booking with no return sent off all the alarm bells in the computer. they required 2 pieces of ID all I had was my Ont. DL and my Mil ID. Well as it was all reserves on the gates problem solved they in formed the computer I was OK and gave me the brother in arms treatment. not once did I haft to take my shoes off to be bomb checked.


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## Pte_Martin (31 Jan 2006)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> I know having the Mil ID. saved me a lot of grief a wile back. Shortly after 9-11 I had to go to Tampa last second do to a death in my wife's family. one way booked that morning. the last second booking with no return sent off all the alarm bells in the computer. they required 2 pieces of ID all I had was my Ont. DL and my Mil ID. *Well as it was all reserves on the gates problem solved they in formed the computer I was OK and gave me the brother in arms treatment. not once did I haft to take my shoes off to be bomb checked.*




Lucky you! For me i flew from Toronto to Halifax for my PLQ and at the gate they made me take off my Tunic and boots and then something kept setting off the metal detector  in my leg and the guard asked me three times if i have anything in my pocket/pants and each time i told her no, it was funny cause after i finally got though the guy behind me came up to me, laughed and said that's it's funny how much trouble i had to go though when I'm the one "protecting" our country. And he didn't have to do anything.


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## BDG.CalgHighrs (31 Jan 2006)

I have only had prblems with the Temp ID card at BCL storeswhile visiting my brother in Vancouver, and even then I was able to purchase what I wanted after a minor hastle. Usualy I show a civilian ID to aovid this, but I sometimes have my drivers license in my car. At any rate, I find socialized liquor stores to be absolutly ridiculous. They offer generaly poor selction at higher cost, and are unconscerned with customer service.


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## BDG.CalgHighrs (31 Jan 2006)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> I know having the Mil ID. saved me a lot of grief a wile back. Shortly after 9-11 I had to go to Tampa last second do to a death in my wife's family. one way booked that morning. the last second booking with no return sent off all the alarm bells in the computer. they required 2 pieces of ID all I had was my Ont. DL and my Mil ID. Well as it was all reserves on the gates problem solved they in formed the computer I was OK and gave me the brother in arms treatment. not once did I haft to take my shoes off to be bomb checked.


It is a bit sad when you get more preferential treatment from US government agencies then our own.


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## Sailing Instructor (1 Feb 2006)

3rd Herd said:
			
		

> Did you mean up that great big hill to the corner of Head and Esquimalt Rd from the Work Point Barracks main gate?



Yes, that's the one. 

Also, I forgot to mention _why_ I carry my mil ID exclusively (save in BC): I have to have it with me already and it is one card compared to several for my driver's licence.


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## zipperhead_cop (9 Feb 2006)

Liquor stores are private retail outlets that employ civilians.  As a generality, if a civilian does not recognize something as valid, they won't accept it.  No one has a RIGHT to purchase alcohol.  If you get a problem at one outlet, as mentioned, adapt and overcome.  If you are so baby faced that your legit ID makes someone think to themselves "this is fake", then consider a passport.  They cost around $40 and are acceptable identification ALL OVER THE PLANET.   
The other thing to consider, if you are using military ID, then you are identifying yourself as a member of the CF.  Seems redundant, but if you get in a pissing match, and the person knows about the QR&O'S, then here's you looking at a 129 for just trying to get your weekend stash.  For the same reason I never let my guys go out drinking in uniform after a parade night.  There is always some tool that wants to take a poke at a uniform, and even though it makes a great war story to talk about the time your platoon obliterated the Oak Room, it will ultimately bite you in the arse.  
The air guys have it right with the whole concept of "flying under the radar".  Not just good tactics, but a life plan as well!


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## Zoomie (9 Feb 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> The other thing to consider, if you are using military ID, then you are identifying yourself as a member of the CF.  Seems redundant, but if you get in a pissing match, and the person knows about the QR&O'S, then here's you looking at a 129 for just trying to get your weekend stash.



I don't see the relevance between NDA 129 and this situation.  A troop is not going to get charged for mouthing off at a Liquor store employee.  It's not against the law (military or civi) to express your discontent at any other member of society.


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## Danjanou (9 Feb 2006)

Zipperhead I hate to break it to ya but Passports are $85.00 no plus service charges if you want a rush job and/or to pick it up. ;D


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## Haggis (9 Feb 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> The other thing to consider, if you are using military ID, then you are identifying yourself as a member of the CF.  Seems redundant, but if you get in a pissing match, and the person knows about the QR&O'S, then here's you looking at a 129 for just trying to get your weekend stash.



In order to prove 129, the alleged offence has to be shown to be prejudicial to both good order and  discipline.  Clearly, using your CF ID to legally attempt to buy booze while off duty and in civvies will not fall under this category, regarless of how much of a pissing contest it becomes.


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## zipperhead_cop (9 Feb 2006)

Danjanou said:
			
		

> Zipperhead I hate to break it to ya but Passports are $85.00 no plus service charges if you want a rush job and/or to pick it up. ;D



Okay, it's been a while   Just buy the cheesy provincial ID then.



			
				Haggis said:
			
		

> In order to prove 129, the alleged offence has to be shown to be prejudicial to both good order and  discipline.  Clearly, using your CF ID to legally attempt to buy booze while off duty and in civvies will not fall under this category, regardless of how much of a pissing contest it becomes.


  

Showing the ID is not the offence, it is the pissing match.  And are we talking reservist or reg?  Because if you are reg, you are bound 24/7 to the Code of Service Conduct, despite the Wrangler jeans and Rambo runners.  And there is no pissing contest to be had.  If they don't want to serve you they don't have to.  Pulling a self righteous hissy fit and wheeling around a DND card only makes people (civvies) look at CF members poorly.  I'm just suggesting that if you are going out of your way to identify yourself as a CF member, conduct yourself accordingly.  But remember, that it is the civilians prerogative to complain about anything.  It won't matter if you were pleasant as peach pie, if the individual has had bad contacts or just doesn't like your face, then you just gave them an avenue to jam it up your [orifice].  
I only bring up the point because it is my reality being bound by the Police Services Act and I know of people who have had problems off duty ONLY because it got out that they were officers.  Some of you are also permanently bound by restrictive rules, so just be aware and don't go out of your way to draw attention to yourselves.


----------



## J.J (9 Feb 2006)

Zipperhead....are you speaking from personal experience??????


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## zipperhead_cop (9 Feb 2006)

HAHAHAHA, no, hem, er, it's just, you know, there's this guy, um, who's a buddy of mine, who, uh, got in a jam, that, uh, I heard about.  

I would hate to end up in a 129ish story exchange.  WR?


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## Zoomie (9 Feb 2006)

It is true that members of the RegF are bound by the CSD 24/7 - in all matters that apply to military personnel and military matters.  If I decide to mouth off to a civy (be it a cashier or a cop) - how do they lay a charge?  Short answer is, not very easily.  If that cashier was another RegF member who was of superior rank - then all bets are off...  The NDA is rarely used for civi-military interaction - only in terms of capital cases (ie. Rape, murder, grand-theft) do the CSD apply.


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## J.J (9 Feb 2006)

Mine have all been false accusations  :blotto:....nothing has been tried or currently being discussed by the local media, as some others who shall remain nameless.... ;D


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## Fishbone Jones (9 Feb 2006)

WR said:
			
		

> Mine have all been false accusations  :blotto:....nothing has been tried or currently being discussed by the local media, as some others who shall remain nameless.... ;D



Including your "Dancing with the Stars" imitation


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## J.J (9 Feb 2006)

Recceguy,
Zipperhead does have a colourful past....but you....oh the stories that I could tell    :blotto:


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## Danjanou (9 Feb 2006)

I have to get down to Windsor some weekend to party 8)


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## 3rd Herd (9 Feb 2006)

Interesting, I have a couple of get out of jail free cards too or rather I mean professional courtesy thing a ma bobs. Did I mention the generals pig?


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## zipperhead_cop (10 Feb 2006)

*"It is true that members of the RegF are bound by the CSD 24/7 - in all matters that apply to military personnel and military matters.  If I decide to mouth off to a civy (be it a cashier or a cop) - how do they lay a charge?  Short answer is, not very easily.  If that cashier was another RegF member who was of superior rank - then all bets are off...  The NDA is rarely used for civi-military interaction - only in terms of capital cases (ie. Rape, murder, grand-theft) do the CSD apply." *  

Hmmm, I'll stand to be corrected.  Who is the resident military law SME?  There have been a few times when someone in town was being a particular jackhole;  fights, property damage, fighting with police, threats, threats to bring the rest of the platoon to Windsor and execute a section attack against us, etc, stood out so spectacularly that we took the time to call Borden and spoke to the Duty MP there.  To my knowledge, they are always happy to come down and retrieve an individual conducting themselves in a non-credible manner.  What they did with him afterwards is anyones guess.
Discreditable conduct is a pretty open ticket, and if there were witnesses, I imagine a CO could lay the charge if they felt the need.  One should never "decide" to mouth off at a civy and be identifiable as a CF member.  It just makes everyone look bad.  
If one "decides" to mouth off at a "cop", that tends to have it's own consequence (please see above).



			
				3rd Herd said:
			
		

> Interesting, I have a couple of get out of jail free cards too or rather I mean professional courtesy thing a ma bobs. Did I mention the generals pig?



Y'all come down to our little Sin City, better in the summer, and I think the local Army.Ca patrons could host a pretty good shin dig.  I'll even personally make sure that anyone with military ID that looks like my kid made it in school gets into the bars.  Hell, we can even try the "mouth off at the cop" and you can see how we take care of things...
Not me though, I'm one of the pacifists.   :


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## Zoomie (10 Feb 2006)

I think it's all a matter of perspective and jurisdiction - MP's rarely travel off Crown property as they tend to lack the support of the courts.  A member was caught 1 km outside the base for DUI - dead to rights, good bust.  The court threw it out due to the fact that the MP was on RCMP territory and therefore could not pull over the offending car.  True story...  

I have witnessed members inebriated downtown Owen Sound mouthing off to the local city police - in all reality the police have their hands tied if they have nothing to hold/detain the member on - mouthing off isn't against any law in Canada.  This cop called the MPs and they intercepted our vehicle when it returned to base - all they did was take all our names.


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## foerestedwarrior (10 Feb 2006)

Zoomie said:
			
		

> I think it's all a matter of perspective and jurisdiction - MP's rarely travel off Crown property as they tend to lack the support of the courts.  A member was caught 1 km outside the base for DUI - dead to rights, good bust.  The court threw it out due to the fact that the MP was on RCMP territory and therefore could not pull over the offending car.  True story...
> 
> I have witnessed members inebriated downtown Owen Sound mouthing off to the local city police - in all reality the police have their hands tied if they have nothing to hold/detain the member on - mouthing off isn't against any law in Canada.  This cop called the MPs and they intercepted our vehicle when it returned to base - all they did was take all our names.



MP's(as far as I know) are officers of the peace, which give them arresting rights in all of Canada.

Owen Sound- That is a rough town to be drinking in, most of the civi's there dont respect the military at all(largley thanks to meaford). There are members of the reserves that work around there, some in the bars, and I know myself that they dont stand for people being drunk and stupid telling everyone they are in the military.


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## PViddy (10 Feb 2006)

> MP's(as far as I know) are officers of the peace, which give them arresting rights in all of Canada.



That's what i thought as well?  From what i have heard in past breifings, Base MP's also converse frequently with local law enforcement (OPP, RCMP) and will even train together at times (co-operated RIDE programs etc.).  Perhaps one of our MP friends can elaborate further.

cheers

PV


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## Bruce Monkhouse (11 Feb 2006)

We have had this discussion before, I am also a "peace officer", this gives me no more rights to arrest someone than "Joe citizen". What this does give me is more responsibilities if the local authority or {s]  decide that I am required to do as they request.....


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## zipperhead_cop (11 Feb 2006)

Zoomie said:
			
		

> I have witnessed members inebriated downtown Owen Sound mouthing off to the local city police - in all reality the police have their hands tied if they have nothing to hold/detain the member on - mouthing off isn't against any law in Canada.



Don't agree.  "mouthing off" is a pretty broad comment, and "hands tied" is a horrible mistake waiting to happen.  It is a criminal offence to cause a disturbance in a public place by shouting, swearing etc.  So don't think that "mouthing off" won't get you locked up.  Plus, "mouthing off" probably seems like a better idea when you are drunk, so you also have that against you.  We usually have a customer service approach to public order.  If a citizen, by his actions and attitude, INSISTS that he be arrested, who am I to deny him his demonstrated goal?  Obviously, his night will not be complete without having alternate accommodations in one of our 75 luxurious individual suites.  Pardon me?  A side order of asphalt sandwich for Monsieur?  Absolutely!  Excellent choice!  Bon Soir.


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## Thompson_JM (11 Feb 2006)

Zoomie said:
			
		

> I have witnessed members inebriated downtown Owen Sound mouthing off to the local city police - in all reality the police have their hands tied if they have nothing to hold/detain the member on - mouthing off isn't against any law in Canada.  This cop called the MPs and they intercepted our vehicle when it returned to base - all they did was take all our names.



though I'm not a cop, one thing ive learned working in the security industry is to pick your battles... I imagine the reason the Owen Sound Police probabbly had grounds to arrest him, but decided against it for a variety of reasons. Too busy with more important stuff, too many other people doing it as well... or one of a million different reasons... 

Ive learned something else... Dont BS a BS-er... or in the case of a police officer... dont try and tell him the law... odds are he knows it alot better then the average joe, since hey.. its his job....

cheers
     Josh


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## NL_engineer (11 Feb 2006)

Cpl Thompson said:
			
		

> Ive learned something else... Dont BS a BS-er... or in the case of a police officer... dont try and tell him the law... odds are he knows it alot better then the average joe, since hey.. its his job....



unless you have been called to the BAR

I was told that the MP's can make arrests in other destructions with permission from the police force or the local government. For example one of the bars in NB (now closed) had a parking spot for the MP's and the RCMP


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## a.armstrong (12 May 2010)

this is a common problem in burlington but not with lcbos as much as gas stations, convenience stores , and beer stores i can however confirm that yes the temp cf id is in "the book" as the one time i had the problem at the lcbo i saw that it was infact there. and my suggetion is next time that they do this u should call them out on it and ask for the book and if they cannot find it point out that the temp id (front and back) is on all posters of acceptable id. then point out the fact that had they served they would prolly be more diciplined and have an idea on how to be proffesionaly and not loose there "kit" lol ntm know that it is valid id aslong as it has the proper signatures and unit stamp.


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## Bzzliteyr (12 May 2010)

a.armstrong said:
			
		

> this is a common problem in burlington but not with lcbos as much as gas stations, convenience stores , and beer stores i can however confirm that yes the temp cf id is in "the book" as the one time i had the problem at the lcbo i saw that it was infact there. and my suggetion is next time that they do this u should call them out on it and ask for the book and if they cannot find it point out that the temp id (front and back) is on all posters of acceptable id. then point out the fact that had they served they would prolly be more diciplined and have an idea on how to be proffesionaly and not loose there "kit" lol ntm know that it is valid id aslong as it has the proper signatures and unit stamp.



a.armstrong, let me help you out before the mods jump on you.

Spellcheck, punctuation and formatting.  All of those will help you get your message across much clearer and give you more credibility when you post.


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## Nfld Sapper (12 May 2010)

a.armstrong said:
			
		

> this is a common problem in burlington but not with lcbos as much as gas stations, convenience stores , and beer stores i can however confirm that yes the temp cf id is in "the book" as the one time i had the problem at the lcbo i saw that it was infact there. and my suggetion is next time that they do this u should call them out on it and ask for the book and if they cannot find it point out that the temp id (front and back) is on all posters of acceptable id. then point out the fact that had they served they would prolly be more diciplined and have an idea on how to be proffesionaly and not loose there "kit" lol ntm know that it is valid id aslong as it has the proper signatures and unit stamp.



Holy Batman! thanks for a response to a 4 year old thread...... 

MILNET.CA MENTOR


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## Danjanou (12 May 2010)

Yes boy wonder  but at least he used the search function. 8)


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## a.armstrong (12 May 2010)

Wow I am glad that everyone is more interested in getting on my case for my capital letters than actually following the thread. Thanks for the boy wonder comment too btw.


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## Bzzliteyr (12 May 2010)

BTW, I know for a fact how unfortunately easy it is to replicate one of those "temp" ID cards.  My girlfriend created her own using photoshop when she was underage. It was very convincing and I was sure she had past military service when I stumbled across it.

a.armstrong, the "boy wonder" comment was to NFLD Sapper.  Boy wonder was Robin's nickname when he worked alongside Batman.  Danjajou was actually complimenting you on your use of the search function!


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## Nfld Sapper (12 May 2010)

Bzzliteyr said:
			
		

> BTW, I know for a fact how unfortunately easy it is to replicate one of those "temp" ID cards.  My girlfriend created her own using photoshop when she was underage. It was very convincing and I was sure she had past military service when I stumbled across it.
> 
> a.armstrong, the "boy wonder" comment was to NFLD Sapper.  Boy wonder was Robin's nickname when he worked alongside Batman.  Danjajou was actually complimenting you on your use of the search function!



Bzz that has now changed, there are some "security" features in the temp ones now......and more in the permanent ones.....


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## a.armstrong (12 May 2010)

My appologies bzz.


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## mover1 (12 May 2010)

A. Armstrong Army.Ca can be a cruel mistress just don't let any of the other nerds on here dissuade you from posting and in a while you too will be berating and chastising newcomers too. :blotto:


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## Loachman (12 May 2010)

mover1 said:
			
		

> A. Armstrong Army.Ca can be a cruel mistress just don't let any of the other nerds on here dissuade you from posting and in a while you too will be berating and chastising newcomers too.



And then when you get grumpy enough - really, really grumpy - we might make you a Mod.

But only when you're grumpy enough.


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## aesop081 (12 May 2010)

Loachman said:
			
		

> And then when you get grumpy enough - really, really grumpy - we might make you a Mod.
> 
> But only when you're grumpy enough.



So true........


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## FDO (13 May 2010)

When my wife and I were posted to Toronto we had to change our driver's licence from NS to Ontario. Not a big deal right? Wrong. It says you need to have a "Government issued ID" What better than the CF ID. Apparently not good enough, never mind the fact that we were in uniform when we went in. The reason was that the Ontario DL was supposed to hold a higher level of security so it can be used to cross the border into the US, CF ID and a Secret Clearance didn't do it. Oh did I mention I had my NS DL as well? Yeah again, not good enough!! So we went home and got our passports (can't fake them right?) And back we went. They then asked if ever had a DL in Ontario before. Because both of us lived in Ontario before we got married and moved to NS they asked we said yes. Why lie you only get in trouble. So they did a check and and I got mine no problem. My wife, because she wasn't married before we moved to NS had hers in her maiden name. They then needed proof of name change. Apparently the CF ID, Passport, NS DL weren't good enough to prove that she had a new last name (for over 20 years I  might add) So off she went to get our marriage licence. She was told it wasn't good enough and she would have to go to the courts and get a legal name change. The fact that across the top of the paper, with provincial coat of arms said "Certificate of Marriage from the Province of Ontario"

Not good enough eh? The whole time this is going on we are in our uniforms. The uniform of the country that in order to wear you have to be a Canadian Citizen and have gone through several layers of security checks, the Ontario DL is a "higher form of Security"? While we were going through all this I noticed a young man in the traditional garb of his native country. He had several people in his cheering section. When he came out of the examiner's office he gave an excited yell and everyone in his party did too. When he went up to get his DL he had to have someone translate for him. So a 25 year member of the CF can't get a DL but someone who has been in the country for such a short time that they cannot even speak the language (should make it interesting on the road) had very little problems. On the way home that night my wife and I stopped at a different MOT office and she said she had never had a DL in Ontario showed her passport and walked out 10 minutes legal to drive in Ontario. So much for security!!

On the same topic of Ontario. I have a Sobey's Air Miles card. Every time I went into a Sobey's  in NS I would use it. Did you know that the Sobey's Air Miles card is not valid in Ontario. Apparently you need to have a "Centre of the Universe" Sobey's Air Miles card.


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## armyvern (13 May 2010)

Retired FDO said:
			
		

> When my wife and I were posted to Toronto we had to change our driver's licence from NS to Ontario. Not a big deal right? Wrong. It says you need to have a "Government issued ID" What better than the CF ID. Apparently not good enough, never mind the fact that we were in uniform when we went in. The reason was that the Ontario DL was supposed to hold a higher level of security so it can be used to cross the border into the US, CF ID and a Secret Clearance didn't do it. Oh did I mention I had my NS DL as well? Yeah again, not good enough!! So we went home and got our passports (can't fake them right?) And back we went. They then asked if ever had a DL in Ontario before. Because both of us lived in Ontario before we got married and moved to NS they asked we said yes. Why lie you only get in trouble. So they did a check and and I got mine no problem. My wife, because she wasn't married before we moved to NS had hers in her maiden name. They then needed proof of name change. Apparently the CF ID, Passport, NS DL weren't good enough to prove that she had a new last name (for over 20 years I  might add) So off she went to get our marriage licence. She was told it wasn't good enough and she would have to go to the courts and get a legal name change. The fact that across the top of the paper, with provincial coat of arms said "Certificate of Marriage from the Province of Ontario"



LOL. I think I posted this last summer.

Same old stuff and same old "you need to have these things." By the way, my scenario differed in that when they asked had I previously had an Ontario Drivers Licence - I too said yes, "I've had ODLs twice previously, the first when I lived at address, Petawawa, On from Day X to Day Y and the 2nd when I lived at address Belleville, ON from Day X to Day Y. Now, this was without seeing their screen or anything, but I rattled them off. "Oh, there they are says he. What was your postal code in belleville?" I rattled it off. His further response, "Oh well, I know it is you, but the system does not show you having that licence under the same name as your birth certificate - they do NOt match!!"

I know, says I. I was married then. Here's my birth certificate (I had the "official" government issued one) and my passport and my military ID again. See how my passport matches with both pieces of those identifications? "Oh, that does not matter, because we do not show you as previously having had an ODL under your maiden name, you either need to apply for the legal name change (for a fee of XXX $ of course to the Provincial coffers) or apply for the "New Official Provincial copy of your Marriage Certificate" (for a fee of XXX $ of course to the provincial coffers). Apparently, only the computer generated versions of marriage certificates are "unfake" enough now. My copy with the original signatures, serial numbers etc wasn't worth squat.

Because my NB licence was going to be expiring ... and because the Licence Bureau here ended up on strike for months (going on strike a couple days after my first visit to them) ... I contacted the Ontario Ministry of Transport to ask 'WTF is going on with the runaround?

Apparently, it was simply an 'error' on the Drivers Licence Bureau`s part ... the passport (but not the CF id) should have sufficed. So, I had to drive  all the way in Toronto to the main office where 'emergencies' could still be handled during the strike. The nice lady there asked me the same questions about previous ON licences to which I again said `yes`. Oh, you match ... and here`s your new licence 45 seconds later. She didn`t even ask for the damn passport. 

Oh yeah, just so you know ... it`s a contractor doing this on behalf of the Ontario Provincial Government now, they weren`t provincial employees that you were dealing with.

http://www.drivetest.ca/en/license/ExchangeReciprocal.aspx



> Exchanging a Reciprocal Licence
> Applies to Drivers from the Following Jurisdictions:
> 
> Canadian provinces and territories;
> ...



I'll note that I 'met' their yellow bit.  :

How to Apply for a Driver’s License in Ontario


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## PMedMoe (13 May 2010)

Looking at the quoted (and highlighted) part, it would seem I _didn't_ have to get a copy of our marriage license when I applied for my Ontario EDL, as my ODL was already in my married name.   :

Yes, Ontario is "special".   :nod:


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## armyvern (13 May 2010)

PMedMoe said:
			
		

> Looking at the quoted (and highlighted) part, it would seem I _didn't_ have to get a copy of our marriage license when I applied for my Ontario EDL, as my ODL was already in my married name.   :
> 
> Yes, Ontario is "special".   :nod:



Well, neither should I have had to jump through the hoops as my 2 previous ODLs were in my married named and matched the name of my NB licence.

Their reasoning was because `when I got those previous two licences, the `new`rules were not in effect. Their rules changed in 2006. So, if you get posted out of Ontario and then posted back in to Ontario ... you too may get smacked by their 'if name DL name doesn't match birth certificate name, must provide X, X, and X as proof.' Your DL from whatever that other province may be is only good as 'proof of signature'.  :


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## PMedMoe (13 May 2010)

Well now I have the "official" Ontario marriage certificate, so I should be good to go.  Besides, I don't plan on leaving Ontario if I can help it.


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## armyvern (13 May 2010)

PMedMoe said:
			
		

> Well now I have the "official" Ontario marriage certificate, so I should be good to go.  Besides, I don't plan on leaving Ontario if I can help it.



Your career manager just read that.  >


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## PMedMoe (13 May 2010)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> Your career manager just read that.  >



Probably.   ;D


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## vonGarvin (13 May 2010)

The lesson here?  Keep your maiden name, ladies!  Just like they do in the belle province!  ;D



(Or, just don't get married!)   >


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## Bzzliteyr (13 May 2010)

I didn't want to chime in on this but yes, I was pleasently surprised by the Quebec people that served me recently for both my licence changeover and my plates.  Courteous, kind and talkative.  I called to make an appointment and ended discussing recruiting potential with one lady, her daughter is in cadets...

Anyhow, just as frustrating is going to Purolator to pick up a parcel (while on imposed restriction) and being dressed in uniform, with military ID, with the paper that came from the front door of the house and being told "too bad" that they can't help as you have no proof of address!! I was living in a fully furnished apartment with all utilities inlcuded!  I had no way of proving I lived there except my lease, which I don't drive around with in my car!


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## a.armstrong (14 May 2010)

Bzz, thats as simple as bringing any piece of mail that you recieved when u lived there. Canada Post did the same to me, but the funniest part is that it was actually registered mail from Ottawa. Go figure, can't get military registered mail with a military id and the delivery slip.


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## mover1 (14 May 2010)

Yes in Ontario I too needed my Passpoert  to get my ODL  apparently my NSDL or my MIL ID  card was good enough. MY Daughter needed her health card, school card, and birth  certificate and citizenship card and citizenship papers (My Lahr Baby)
Nova Scotia, Alberta Manitoba were no problems. Not like this place. 

Oh yeas and please ladies keep your maiden name. Its easier for us guys to creep you on Facebook.


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## Retired AF Guy (15 May 2010)

mover1 said:
			
		

> Yes in Ontario I too needed my Passpoert  to get my ODL  apparently my NSDL or my MIL ID  card was good enough. MY Daughter needed her health card, school card, and birth  certificate and citizenship card and citizenship papers (My Lahr Baby)
> Nova Scotia, Alberta Manitoba were no problems. Not like this place.



I've on three separate occasions needed to get a ODL and never had a problem. The first time was back in '88 when I was posted from Cold Lake to NDHQ. Second time was in '99 was when I was in Winnipeg and posted to Italy. To get a valid Italian license you require a valid Canadian DL, unfortunately, Manitoba does not allow drivers to use their license overseas. So, I headed across to Lake of the Woods and changed my license from Manitoba to Ontario. The third time was just a few years ago when I was posted from Winnipeg to Kingston. All three time I showed up at the Motor Vehicles office with my out-of-provincial license and had them changed over in no time flat. As far I remember I was not asked for any documents except for out-of-provincial license, possibly insurance and personal ID.


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## armyvern (15 May 2010)

Retired AF Guy said:
			
		

> I've on three separate occasions needed to get a ODL and never had a problem. The first time was back in '88 when I was posted from Cold Lake to NDHQ. Second time was in '99 was when I was in Winnipeg and posted to Italy. To get a valid Italian license you require a valid Canadian DL, unfortunately, Manitoba does not allow drivers to use their license overseas. So, I headed across to Lake of the Woods and changed my license from Manitoba to Ontario. The third time was just a few years ago when I was posted from Winnipeg to Kingston. All three time I showed up at the Motor Vehicles office with my out-of-provincial license and had them changed over in no time flat. As far I remember I was not asked for any documents except for out-of-provincial license, possibly insurance and personal ID.



But you're guy.

Not likely that you'll ever change your last name to one that doesn't match your birth certificate now is it?? Also has women having to fork out the bucks to get the "new official" government birth & marriage certificates because the "old official government issued, serial numbered, certified certificates" are no longer considered valid or accepted .... even though those women have previously had ODLs in their married names (and had to prove who they were THEN too).

Just another f'n money grab by the current Ontario government, this time on the backs of women.

This "new" rule by Ontario for ODL ... quite rather impacts ONLY females who dared get married 99.999% of the time.


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## gcclarke (15 May 2010)

Might I suggest a complaint to the human rights commission?


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## armyvern (15 May 2010)

gcclarke said:
			
		

> Might I suggest a complaint to the human rights commission?



There's the glitch ... .01 % are men who change their names ... not many, but a few.


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## zipperhead_cop (17 May 2010)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> There's the glitch ... .01 % are men who change their names ... not many, but a few.



Probably corresponds to the same number that change their gender.


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## Bzzliteyr (17 May 2010)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> Probably corresponds to the same number that change their gender.



Technoviking in the UK at his "conference"?


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## zipperhead_cop (17 May 2010)

Bzzliteyr said:
			
		

> Technoviking in the UK at his "conference"?




Shhh!!!!  Dude!!  Opsec!!


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## Retired AF Guy (18 May 2010)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> But you're guy.



Sorry, my bad. I didn't catch that it was a specific problem for women. 



> Just another f'n money grab by the current Ontario government, this time on the backs of women.



I think you hit the problem on the head. And its just not driver's license. To renew my security guard license it costs me $80.00 *every year!* If you happen to be a security guard *and *private investigator its $160.00. Just another money grab.


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## vonGarvin (19 May 2010)

Bzzliteyr said:
			
		

> Technoviking in the UK at his "conference"?


:rofl:
That, my friends, is comedy!


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## Yrys (19 May 2010)

Technoviking said:
			
		

> :rofl:
> That, my friends, is comedy!



Prove it!

(picture  )


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## Danjanou (19 May 2010)

Yrys said:
			
		

> Prove it!
> 
> (picture  )



Well he did say he was a attending a "mortar conference" in the UK  8)
http://www.arrse.co.uk/wiki/3_Para_Mortar_Platoon


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## vonGarvin (19 May 2010)

Don't ask, won't tell!   8)


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## vonGarvin (19 May 2010)

PS:
For 2 RCR Mortar Platoon when I was Mor Pl Comd, the "motto" was "it's better to give than to receive".  Take it for what you want.  :rofl:


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