# recruitment contracts



## furyofmojo (28 Jan 2004)

Is it true that when you accept a contract for officers that they are for 9 years?


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## Michael OLeary (28 Jan 2004)

Yes, in the Regular Force the initial "Short Service Engagement" (SSE) for officers is a nine year contract. That doesn‘t mean you cannot request release, but that that term of service must be almost completed before you will be offered an "Intermediate Engagement" (IE) which takes you to 20 years. Service past 20 comes under new terms of service offers.

Mike


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## furyofmojo (28 Jan 2004)

When you request release, do you have to have a good reason like a medical issue or something? Can I simply request release if I find that the life in the canadian armed forces becomes ill suited for my life? For one reason or another.


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## Michael OLeary (28 Jan 2004)

You can request a release at any time. Military requirements may dictate how quickly it is actioned. For example, if you have been warned for an operational tour, release proceedings may be withheld until you complete that tour. Similarly, if you have received an education at the Crown‘s expense, you may have a period of obligatory service that must be completed before your release will be actioned.

During your basic training, either as a soldier or an officer, you can request to cease training and voluntarily release. Although you will be removed from course almost immediately, the release process could take months.

Mike


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## Garbageman (31 Aug 2004)

I'm curious as to what the likelyhood is that voluntary releases are granted for DEO types.  I've read the policies, and I know that you definitely won't be granted a release if you're about to be deployed, just received an education, etc., but how common is it for someone who's got 2, 3, 4 years in and is MOC qualified to be granted a VR simply because they aren't enjoying military life?  I'd just like to hear from personal experiences, not the by the book explanation.

This is my biggest hurdle in convincing myself that I want back in full time - nice to have an escape route (even if only a mental one)!


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## Catinthehat2 (18 Jan 2007)

Hi, I'm currently a 25 year old NCM in the reserves and am considering applying to be a DEO Infantry officer.  I'm aware that the Initial Engagement for Infantry Officers is 9 years.  IF I passed all the required training and finished my first IE, I'd be 34-35. 

There are a number of other jobs that interest me, and starting at 34-35 may be detrimental to that.  You never know how things turn out, and maybe I'd enjoy it so much that I'd want to stay in the forces for the rest of my career, but I can more easily see myself serving for 5 or 6 years and then moving on to other things.

I'm aware that one can request a voluntary release at any time as a DEO, and that this may take a long while due to operational commitments, or be up to 6 months in other cases.  

What I'm wondering is how VRs before one's IE is finished is looked upon by battalions.  Does it have a strong negative impact upon your name and reputation in the military?  After perusing QR&O Ch. 15, I don't see any, but are are there any financial or other obligations that I should be aware of with regard to VRs?


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## EPF (15 Jun 2009)

Well, I'm going to revive this thread, as I've read the ADM(HR-MIL) Instruction 05/05, read different threads on this topic on this board and called my recruiting centre about it, and I'm still confused as I get somewhat contradictory information.

The ADM(HR-MIL) documents do not mention any obligatory service time for DEO, something that was confirmed here. However, I just called the recruiting centre and I was told that everyone is obligated to stay at least 3 years, regardless of their VIE. Three years doesn't phase me, but I just want to be certain of what I'm getting into... so who's right? Who should I call?

Thanks in advance!

- A little confused but keen recruit  :camo:


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## Eye In The Sky (15 Jun 2009)

If you go to the link below (ADM(HR-MIL) INSTRUCTION 05/05 ANNEX A Appendix 1 and scroll down to 
"TOS SEQUENCE BY OCCUPATION - OFFICERS" you should be able to find the info you are looking for.  It lists the TOS for DEO and ROTPs (if you didn't read this Annex before...)

http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/pd/pi-ip/05-05-ann-a1-eng.asp

Unless someone has another ref, the only one I know of for Obligatory Service is DAOD 5049-1, link below:

http://www.admfincs-smafinsm.forces.gc.ca/dao-doa/5000/5049-1-eng.asp

As for 'who is right', the *current* published directive or regulation is.  Lots of people don't look at those though


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## EPF (15 Jun 2009)

I have read the annex, but thanks! At first I got TOS and obligatory service confused, but I got it now. So what I understand from the DAOD, there is obligatory service only if someone has had uni studies subsidized, pilot training or a recruitment allowance (docs and dentists). Got it!

Now I got to figure out if I'm sticking with my Reserve application or if I'm switching to Regs... well, for the moment I'll just go to my PT test. 

Cheers!


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## templeton peck (18 Jun 2009)

Michael O'Leary said:
			
		

> During your basic training, either as a soldier or an officer, you can request to cease training and voluntarily release. Although you will be removed from course almost immediately, the release process could take months.
> 
> Mike



Hey Mike, I was told in my interview a couple of weeks ago that a recruit could not release until he/she completed a minimum 5 months - this was put into effect as of late to insure people were not leaving before they had a good taste of it.


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## Otis (18 Jun 2009)

templeton peck said:
			
		

> Hey Mike, I was told in my interview a couple of weeks ago that a recruit could not release until he/she completed a minimum 5 months - this was put into effect as of late to insure people were not leaving before they had a good taste of it.



You may no longer release during the first five WEEKS of BMQ / BMOQ ... in order to prevent people leaving just due to the culture shock of their first exposure to the CF.


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## templeton peck (18 Jun 2009)

5 weeks? My mistake! I thought the 5 months was a little draconian.


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## gcclarke (19 Jun 2009)

From what I have seen, the release process, at least outside of places like CFLRS, can take up to 6 months. I"m not sure if this is due to a particular policy, or just because shuffling that much paperwork takes a while. I know at least one person who decided to pull the plug, and spent part of the time he was waiting looking at his opportunities outside of the forces, and didn't quite like what he saw. He was such a quitter that he quit at quitting. 

I also enrolled as a DEO, and received a recruitment bonus (Back when they were still offering them to engineers). 

One of my compatriots decided he wanted out before he completed his obligatory service, and was able to do so. It added a few months to the release process, as it required the higher-ups to decide how to handle his recruitment bonus, either to make him pay back the full amount, to pro-rate the debt, or to forgive the debt entirely. I'm not entirely sure, but I believe that he ended up having to pay back the pro-rated rate, which I think worked out to about $10,000 of the $40,000 he was initially given.


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