# Nyala



## Sh0rtbUs (21 Mar 2006)

There seems to be a fair amount of mention of Canadas purchase of the Nyala, but nothing official or recent.

Its confirmed (as most of you already know).

http://www.cbc.ca/calgary/story/ca_nyala20060126.html

Soldiers get new armoured vehicles in Afghanistan  
Last updated Jan 26 2006 09:36 AM MST
CBC News 
Canadian soldiers deployed in Afghanistan will be getting a new fleet of military vehicles designed to provide extra protection to troops stationed in the war-ravaged country.

The addition of the 50 armoured patrol vehicles (known as the Nyala) come in the wake of a deadly attack in Afghanistan that killed a Canadian diplomat and seriously injured two soldiers and a medic.

Glyn Berry, political director of a reconstruction team in Afghanistan, was travelling in a Mercedes jeep when he was killed during an attack by a suicide bomber. He was 59.

FROM JAN. 25 2005: Wounded soldiers back home 
Military officials say the new vehicles, en route from South Africa, are tougher than the G-Wagen model currently in use in Afghanistan.

Maj. Daryl Morrell, a spokesperson for the Department of National Defence in Ottawa, says the Nyala is slightly bigger and is outfitted with bullet resistant glass.

"Bearing that in mind we also have to realize that with enough explosive, you're going to be able to hurt any vehicle but these are certainly more robust than the G-Wagen," said Morrell.

The contract for the new fleet is $60 million.

Two Afghan civilians were also killed in the deadly explosion in January and at least nine Afghans were wounded.

The attack was the latest in a wave of suicide bombings that have plagued Afghanistan in recent months, some 15 in the last four months, aimed mainly at the US-led coalition and their NATO allies, but also at Afghan forces.


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## Franko (21 Mar 2006)

They should be getting on the ground...if they aren't already.

Regards


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## Bruce Monkhouse (21 Mar 2006)

I watched Global news at 11 tonight and it appeared to film them coming off the plane.....


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## Sh0rtbUs (21 Mar 2006)

Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> I watched Global news at 11 tonight and it appeared to film them coming off the plane.....



I saw that as well. From what I gathered, they're training on them as we speak, and should be operating in a month.


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## armchair (21 Mar 2006)

There are Photo's of them been off loading in Afghanistan on The Combat Camera Website. Search Caption  Nyala  
It shows General Rick Hillier take one for a test drive 
http://www.combatcamera.forces.gc.ca/common/combatcamera/find_e.asp


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## qjdb (24 Mar 2006)

In regards to these pictures:

http://www.combatcamera.forces.gc.ca/netpub/server.np?find&catalog=photos&template=detail_e.np&field=itemid&op=matches&value=6096&site=combatcamera

got it off of http://www.combatcamera.forces.gc.ca/netpub/server.np?find&defaultjoin=and&field=Keywords&op=contains&value=Afghanistan&field=Keywords&op=contains&value=nyala&field=Description&op=contains&value=nyala&site=combatcamera&catalog=photos&template=results_e.np&sorton=IPTC%20-%20DateCreated&ascending=0

Is it just me, or does the 'turret' (whatever it's called) hole look rather claustrophobic?  How easy is it to stick your body up through that hole?  Especially if wearing armour or even just the TV.

I don't know, I have never seen one before, but that hole just (from that picture, anyways) seems REALLY small.

Were the ones on the G-Wagens that small too?  Or the ones on the American Hummers?

Thanks in advance

qjdb

edit to PS:  note the dates on some of those pics?  Have we had these for a while?  Were we borrowing them from someone else or something?


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## SweetNavyJustice (24 Mar 2006)

I think they're a great purchase but I don't see why this is such huge news.  We had a couple of them in Kabul back on Roto 1!  They're not a new piece of kit for us, we just now have more of them.  

It's not that I'm against the purchase, I support anything that will keep the crews safe; I just don't see what the big deal is.


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## a_majoor (24 Mar 2006)

One reason the turret hole looks so small is a Nyala is extremely large; this is just a scale factor in the picture.

Regardless, the hole _is_ a tight fit (particularly for people of the "Large" persuasion) for a number of reasons, the key one being the fewer and smaller openings you have in the armour envelope, the stronger (overall) the vehicle will be. This also explains why you don't see driver side doors in a Nyala, for example.


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## 043 (24 Mar 2006)

WRT the Nyala.

I spent 6 months in one on Roto 0 in Afganistan. Good vehicles.................however..............they are just good vehicles. There are many cons to them just like any other vehicle. While the troops in the back will be able to effectively cover there arcs, there movement within each observation opening (top of vehicle) will be extremely limited due to TacVest, Flak Jacket, etc. Dismounting, in a hurry if the vehicles is on fire will be extremely difficult as well. The tires are very susceptible to damage from the rugged terrain. Fuel is Afganistan is a problem and we had problems with it gelling therefore causing numerous breakdowns. It got to the point where the Nyala had to be stored in a heated structure in order to ensure that it worked the next day. This has probably been sorted because I haven't heard such complaints from any other Roto's. Mobility is another factor...............you are not going to get anywhere fast in a Nyala. Every little speed bump or bump in the road will shake the hell out of everything and everyone.  It is top heavy as well so it is probably a good thing your speed is limited. This vehicle is big!!!!!!!!! It can't turn on a dime and there were many routes within Kabul that it couldn't traffic. 

All this being said, it is another platform that offers the commanders more options which is always good thing!


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## 043 (24 Mar 2006)

SweetNavyJustice said:
			
		

> I think they're a great purchase but I don't see why this is such huge news.  We had a couple of them in Kabul back on Roto 1!  They're not a new piece of kit for us, we just now have more of them.
> 
> It's not that I'm against the purchase, I support anything that will keep the crews safe; I just don't see what the big deal is.



Your right, it's not a big deal.


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## Old FCS (26 Mar 2006)

I spent 2 years on Op Athena.  I've seen the Nyala in operation, it's great.
It's predecessor the Mamba was said to be a widow maker but we haven’t lost any of their crews yet.
The SADF troops that work with me love the Nyala.
 :tank: :tank:
My problem now is, I'm in the Sudan servicing CF supplied equipment and every time I order parts for Nyala, Darfur Region, Sudan the demands are kicked back because someone in Canada thinks I'm ordering parts for a Nyala.

Arte Et Marte


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## GO!!! (26 Mar 2006)

qjdb said:
			
		

> note the dates on some of those pics?  Have we had these for a while?  Were we borrowing them from someone else or something?



The CF has had a slightly older version called the "Mamba" for several (at least 8) years now. 

In the past, they were only used by engineers for proving routes, and occasionally for VIP tpt. 

As far as I've heard, the Nyala will be used for patrolling by infantry and armour types due to the greater survivability of the vehicle if
it encounters an IED. 

Various units in Iraq have operated this veh in Iraq since the invasion.


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## qjdb (28 Mar 2006)

Thank you for the clarification to a newb 

qjdb


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## Journeyman (28 Mar 2006)

Our engineers had one, possibly two, in Kosovo (Roto1: 1999-2000), for proving routes. It was apparently a very good vehicle for that purpose, as no one was to travel off a cleared route - - ever. 

Our snipers had been very useful at moving very slowly, carefully, and surreptitiously into positions of observation. They would stay in loc, reporting on high-value targets like "bad-guy" meeting-places, for several days. Needless to say, they were clearing their route in as they went.

About four months into the tour, OC Engrs heard of this, and leading with a "unionized" mentality, demanded the snipers walk in behind a Nyala/Mamba. Needless to say, useful employment of the snipers came to a halt and they essentially had a two-month vacation awaiting their end-tour date.


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## GO!!! (28 Mar 2006)

Journeyman,

Kingdom protecting? 

Here? 

In the CF?

Surely you jest....


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## ringo (29 Mar 2006)

Does the Nyala have portal axles?


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## sabot41 (29 May 2006)

I understand the terrain is pretty difficult, anyone know or hear how the vehicle is holding up (suspension, etc) and would "tracks" serve better in this terrain vs wheeled?? I agreed with the original concept of using the Nyala for patrolling urban or built up areas, but it seems once again they are using wheeled vehicles for places they were never intended to be used.


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## Armymatters (29 May 2006)

sabot41 said:
			
		

> I understand the terrain is pretty difficult, anyone know or hear how the vehicle is holding up (suspension, etc) and would "tracks" serve better in this terrain vs wheeled?? I agreed with the original concept of using the Nyala for patrolling urban or built up areas, but it seems once again they are using wheeled vehicles for places they were never intended to be used.



The Nyala is a distant cousin to the Daimler-Benz Unimog truck, and the Unimog was designed for offroading (ie. has portal axles for high ground clearance, which is higher than the Humvee, a flexible frame that allows the tires a wide range of vertical movement to allow the truck to comfortably drive over extremely uneven terrain, even over meter-high boulders). 

I would say that the Nyala will hold its own in Afghanistan, due to its design heritage, and the design intent by the engineers.

edit: retracted some of the statements in response to Wallace's post.


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## George Wallace (29 May 2006)

Armymatters said:
			
		

> The Nyala is a distant cousin to the Daimler-Benz Unimog truck, and the Unimog was designed for offroading (ie. has portal axles for high ground clearance, which is higher than the Humvee, a flexible frame that allows the tires a wide range of vertical movement to allow the truck to comfortably drive over extremely uneven terrain, even over meter-high boulders). For the original role the vehicles were used in, namely route proving, tracks are a liability as if you drive over a mine in a tracked vehicle and the track gets severed, you have a mobility kill until engineers get on site to fix the track, while with wheeled vehicles, depending on the configuration (4x4 or 8x8, etc) and the circumstances (what type of mine was hit), it can either drive away or is a quick wheel change that can be done by the crew. Only in the most severe cases does the vehicle need engineers to arrive to remove the vehicle.



OK

Armymatters

I have to call you on this.  Engineers do not have to get on site to 'fix' the track - the crew or Maintainers can do that.  Wheeled vehicles would fair no better, and in most cases will fair worse, than tracked vehicles, and also, it is not a "quick wheel change that can be done by the crew" in the case of a mine strike, IED, VBIED, or whatever.  This time the Maintainers will have to do the repairs.  In all cases of a mine strike, IED, VBIED, or any such occasion, the Engineers will be involved in 'clearing the area' so that the Maintainers can safely recover the vehicle.   The Engineers do not repair or recover vehicles.

Once again, please do not talk about things you know nothing about.


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## Armymatters (29 May 2006)

George Wallace said:
			
		

> OK
> 
> Armymatters
> 
> ...



You called and you are correct. I am retracting most of my statements. I was pre-occupied by writing a report while writing that.


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## armybuck041 (4 Jun 2006)

ringo said:
			
		

> Does the Nyala have portal axles?



Nope.... Straight Axles without Hub Reduction with conventional Spicer Driveshafts and Dual Cardan Front Axle Shafts. 

The Mamba did come with Portals also complete with Torque Tubes similar to its UNIMOG cousin.

Also, the Mamba uses a Coil Spring suspension which is pretty sloppy on the road, whereas the Nyala uses a more conventional and stiffer riding Leaf Spring set-up. 

I've spent a great deal if time in both versions (Recce Driver in Bosnia and Recce Det Comd in Af'stan) and 2023 and I know what it takes to roll one 

Being an off-road savvy in my private time, I contemplated what efforts would be required to install Mamba Portals under my Jeep 

2023 brings up some good points about this platform up top. It has its limitations. The suspension will not handle rediculous speeds over rough terrain. It will either break or turn the occupants into soup. My Nyala went through no less than 5 leaf springs, a complete replacement of the rear spring hangar and we replaced shocks bolts on a daily basis. We also consumed between 10 and 15 tires over the course of 6 months. Keeping all of this in mind, my vehicle was on the road damn near every day and was being taken in places where we would have wrecked almost anything else in the fleet, or it wouldn't have fit. Fuel was less of a problem for my Roto as the mixtures were getting much cleaner than the Roto 0 guys. Actually, although the picture I painted above sounds bleak, keep this in mind. We always made it home under our own power including the episode where one of my leaf springs came apart on Blue Route  Only once was I not able to roll out the gate as planned, because the air system had a stuck valve and wouldn't fully charge. 

It will provide a level of protection from IED's and Mines that is second to none. Then again, increased vigilance, studying local habits, and a whole host of other things may do more for your safety than any amount of armour.


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## tomahawk6 (8 Jun 2006)

Saw the other day that the Government has ordered an additional 25 Nyala's.


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## IN HOC SIGNO (27 Jun 2006)

tomahawk6 said:
			
		

> Saw the other day that the Government has ordered an additional 25 Nyala's.



Wow it's interesting how fast we can get kit when someone is convinced that we need it. I had never heard of these vehicles in our inventory till I saw one on TV the other night. It's a pretty slick little piece of kit....and if it saves lives then all the better.

Hopefully we can get some helicopters and other badly needed kit a little faster too.


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## Scoobie Newbie (27 Jun 2006)

Actually to be accurate they are called RG 31's.


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## geo (27 Jun 2006)

Mamba became Nyala - also known as RG 31
have been in service with the CME since the mid 90s
good piece of kit.....

you should listen to your sappers more often


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## George Wallace (27 Jun 2006)

geo said:
			
		

> Mamba became Nyala - also known as RG 31



Are these not two completely different vehicles?  The same family, but different versions, with the Nyala being much larger than the Mamba.


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## Scoobie Newbie (28 Jun 2006)

http://www.army-guide.com/eng/article/article.php?forumID=442

GD Awarded $31M Contract for RG-31 Mine Protected Vehicles for the Canadian Military

Category: Defence Industry

 The Government of Canada has awarded a CAD $31 million (US $28 million) contract to General Dynamics Land Systems-Canada to provide 25 additional RG-31 Mine Protected Vehicles. General Dynamics Land Systems, the Canadian company's parent corporation, is a business unit of General Dynamics (NYSE: GD). 



   
This order is an option to a contract originally awarded in November 2005 that called for the delivery of 50 RG-31 vehicles. Vehicle deliveries were completed in April 2006. Deliveries of the additional 25 vehicles will occur from September to November 2006.

Under this contract, General Dynamics Land Systems-Canada provides program management and engineering and logistics support while BAE Land Systems OMC of South Africa manufactures the vehicles. The vehicles incorporate a Kongsberg Protector M151 Remote Weapon Station equipped with a day and night sighting system, which allows the operator to fire the weapon while remaining protected within the vehicle.

The RG-31 tactical vehicle offers enhanced mine blast resistance as well as protection against both improvised explosive devices and ballistic threats. The vehicles, currently being used by the Canadian Forces in their operations in Afghanistan, have already proven their worth when an RG-31 survived a significant roadside bomb explosion earlier last month.

General Dynamics Land Systems-Canada has also completed deliveries of 148 RG-31 vehicles to the U.S. Army in fulfillment of a 2005 contract. In addition, the vehicles have been extensively used by NATO forces in the former Yugoslavia as well as by the United Nations in Lebanon, Georgia, Syria, Bosnia and Herzegovina, and Kosovo.


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## Scoobie Newbie (28 Jun 2006)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RG-31

The RG-31 Nyala is multi-purpose mine-protected vehicle made by Land Systems OMC in South Africa, based on the same manufacturer's Mamba APC. The vehicle’s V-shaped monocoque welded steel hull and high suspension are designed to resist a blast equivalent to two TM-57 anti-tank mines detonating simultaneously.

The RG-31 has become the multi-purpose vehicle of choice of the UN and other peacekeeping and security forces. It is finding favour with nongovernmental organisations requiring a vehicle with a non-aggressive appearance to protect their personnel against the threat of landmines.
Production history
[edit]
Variants
RG-31 Nyala - based on Mamba APC 
RG-31 Charger - US Army version with US diesel engine 
RG-31M - new design with reduced vehicle signature, combat weight: 8 400kg, crew of 5 and payload area 
[edit]
Operators
Canada 43 (50 on order with option for extra 25) 
Colombia 4 RG-31 Nyala 
Rwanda 6 RG-31 Nyala 
South Africa 
UN 30 RG-31 Nyala 
United Kingdom 
United States 10 RG-31 Charger (148 ordered) 
Blackwater Security 
[edit]
Combat history
Afghanistan - Canada 
Bosnia / Herzegovina - UN 
Ethiopia / Eritrea - Canada 
Georgia - UN 
Iraq - United States 
Kosovo - UN, United Kingdom 
Lebanon - UN


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## Scoobie Newbie (28 Jun 2006)

Country Of Origin: South Africa 
Designation: Armoured Personnel Carrier 
Configuration: 4 x 4 
Manufacturer: Land Systems OMC 
Length: 6.40 m 
Width: 2.47 m 
Height: 2.63 m 
Wheel Base: 3.40 m 
Ground Clearance: 322 mm 
Angle of Approach: 40° 
Angle of Departure: 35° 
Weight: 7.28 t 
Speed: 100 km/h 
Range: 900 km 
Armament: .50 cal heavy MG 
Power plant: Option 1: Daimler-Benz OM 352A, 6 cylinder diesel, 123 HP
Option 2: Iveco Tector F4AE0681D diesel 
Crew: 11


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## Colin Parkinson (28 Jun 2006)

Armybucko41
You can get portal axles for the Landrover from Australia, can’t remember the name of the company, but come the lottery, I will have a 90 TDI with them attached!


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## geo (28 Jun 2006)

George Wallace said:
			
		

> Are these not two completely different vehicles?  The same family, but different versions, with the Nyala being much larger than the Mamba.


Not completely different.  The Nyala is just a bit longer and wider in the beam, but that was necessary to improve the power train.  The Mamba was as slow as molasses when in the hills of FRY.


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## McG (28 Jun 2006)

qjdb said:
			
		

> note the dates on some of those pics?  Have we had these for a while?  Were we borrowing them from someone else or something?





			
				GO!!! said:
			
		

> The CF has had a slightly older version called the "Mamba" for several (at least 8) years now.


There are actually three types of vehicle:
1. Mamba Mine Protected Vehicle
2. Nyala RG-31 Mine Protected Vehicle
3. Nyala RG-31 Armoured Patrol Vehicle

The first two vehicles were bought in limited numbers for Engineers to use in route recce (Mamba first, then later it was replaced by the Nyala).  The third vehicle is the one being introduced into service over the last few months.

The Mamba is still in the inventory, but it no longer sees operational duty (it has become a trg vehicle passed between CERs).  The Nyala MPV is still in operational service (there were three in Afghanistan long before the Nyala APVs started to arrive) but I have been told they are near the end of their operational lives & will be replaced by the APVs.


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## geo (29 Jun 2006)

Nyala MPV is different from the Nyala APV in that the APV has a remote weapon system.....


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## McG (29 Jun 2006)

geo said:
			
		

> Nyala MPV is different from the Nyala APV in that the APV has a remote weapon system.....


There are other things under thew hood.  The guys we had qualified on the old vehicle were not permitted to drive the new models without re-taking the course.


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## geo (30 Jun 2006)

Interesting.  I knew of the differences between Mamba and Nyala but not briefed on differences between New & Old Nyala (xcept RWS).
Guess that the vehicle continues to evolve as lessons are learnt.


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## McG (30 Jun 2006)

If only we could get them delivered with black-out lights & something to block observation into the troop compartment (no need to leave everyone able to see which vehicle is moving the VIP).


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## Scoobie Newbie (30 Jun 2006)

MCG blackout is coming (right now they are pulling the fuses), along with some other mods.


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## geo (30 Jun 2006)

MCG said:
			
		

> If only we could get them delivered with black-out lights & something to block observation into the troop compartment (no need to leave everyone able to see which vehicle is moving the VIP).


maybe we can get the windows tinted so people can't have a look inside.


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## IN HOC SIGNO (2 Jul 2006)

geo said:
			
		

> maybe we can get the windows tinted so people can't have a look inside.



that's what the gun is for! ha ha


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## Kat Stevens (2 Jul 2006)

geo said:
			
		

> maybe we can get the windows tinted so people can't have a look inside.



And maybe some kewl spinner rims, and a lowering kit, maybe a rad airride system.....yo, werd  ;D


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## IN HOC SIGNO (2 Jul 2006)

Kat Stevens said:
			
		

> And maybe some kewl spinner rims, and a lowering kit, maybe a rad airride system.....yo, werd  ;D



and a big a$$ stereo system?


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## geo (2 Jul 2006)

IN HOC SIGNO said:
			
		

> and a big a$$ stereo system?


the idea is to drive people away.... not bring em around, not to give em a reason to wanting to blow us up.... IMHO


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## Retired Lineman (26 Jul 2006)

Does anyone know where I can get videos of the Nyala?


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## McG (27 Jul 2006)

geo said:
			
		

> maybe we can get the windows tinted so people can't have a look inside.


That was done with most of the old Nyala before we got in country, and is the option the BG chose to explore with the new models.


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## Jay4th (28 Jul 2006)

There are a couple other problems that have come to light as the temperature increased between May and now.  When I left 2 weeks ago many RG's were down with overheating problems, as well as electical problems.  Coy Tp told me they are looking at inproved water pumps or something from Africa and larger capacity alternators to handle all the comms gear and magic stuff.
     When the Stab mod arrives, the remote weapon system will be near perfect. As it is RWS is about the most user friendly for training gunners I have ever seen.  The thermal and day cameras rock.
     Troops inside IMHO wear flack vests but tac vests under the seat as you must be sitting properly in the seat to strap yourself in.  And you must be strapped in!!  Otherwise when You get IED'd and all the wheels and engine compartment get blown off and there is just the crew tub sitting on its side on the ground, it will be scrambled eggs when I open the back door.
     Also, everything inside the vehicle must be strapped into a seat.  ie)  Manpack radios.
     Minimize the kit inside that will hinder your getting out or my getting in or that will just plain fly around in there.
     Bottom line, these things save lives big time, you just got to use them right.  my platoon was using 2 to replace a LAV that will never get replaced as was c/s 12 after they had to blow up one of theirs.  Coy HQ had a RG IED'd with 4 AT mines and the injuries were relatively minor (no intention of downplaying the crew's sacrifices)


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## Colin Parkinson (28 Jul 2006)

Wasn’t the Mamba based on the Unimog 404 chassis and the Nyala using a larger truck chassis?


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## Infantree (28 Jul 2006)

Whats the difference between the Nyala, and the APV


http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/lf/English/2_display.asp?product=73  - APV


http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/lf/English/2_display.asp?product=76   - Nyala


The APV can do exactly what the Nyala can do, if they attached the Nyala armour onto the APV.


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## armybuck041 (8 Aug 2006)

I have pictures of the one that struck that IED a few months back.... Am I breaking any rules posting em up?


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## Scoobie Newbie (8 Aug 2006)

PM a mod first if in doubt.


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## Ex-Dragoon (8 Aug 2006)

As long as its properly, credited armybuck041 go for it.


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## McG (9 Aug 2006)

While in theatre I overheard that it was not approved to post battle damage photos (they might give away armour weaknesses that can be exploited).  At the same time, I have seen several publicly available pictures taken by embedded media of battle damaged vehicles.


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## armybuck041 (9 Aug 2006)

MCG said:
			
		

> While in theatre I overheard that it was not approved to post battle damage photos (they might give away armour weaknesses that can be exploited).



Based on this, and an interesting thread in the News Forum, i've decieded not to put these up. I'll leave that to the fellas who were directly involved.


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## McG (10 Aug 2006)

I assume you've inherited the huge photo library that I held for the Fd Sqn?


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## armybuck041 (10 Aug 2006)

EDIT


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