# My chest rig



## tacsit (14 Aug 2004)

Since I mentioned I'd post pics of my chest rig, here they are.







Here is the overall view. The body is a SOTECH mk.3 Hellcat (split front with 2 fastex clips). I went with the mk.3 hellcat because first of all, it can carry 6 rifle mags in the internal pockets before adding on any pouches. Secondly, I like the split front because it makes it very easy to take on or off or to split it when in the prone for a while. Thirdly, it rides high up on my chest, thus there is no interfearence with the waistbelt on my ruck. The stock shoulder straps have been replaced by a custom reccegear yoke in digi-cam, a digital cammo pattern similar in colouration to CADPAT and practically indistinguishable from a few feet away. Attached to the yoke is a pace counter.






Here we have two CADPAT TT zippered utility pouches flanking an Ontario knife company partially serrated RAT-7 in what I believe is 1090 steel. Awesome knife, damn near indestructible. Others on this forum who think a multi-tool and bayonet are good enough for the field are entitled to their opinion. From my experience in the bush I want a blade that I know can step up and take some abuse. I look at this blade as both a tool and a weapon. It's not one or the other. The pouch on the left of the knife carries my 1qt collapsible canteen, canteen cup and stove, and this is the only pouch I've found where it's not a total ***** to remove any of that set from the pouch. I carry some hexi and iodine in the outside pocket. The zippered pouch on the right of the knife is my blowout kit. Carries dressings, tape, gloves, ACS, 1-handed tourniquets, etc. I carry a small ziploc with band-aids and other meds for day to day use, but this kit is only to be used for GSW, massive trauma, etc. I'll be attaching a nice red cross onto it so the medic knows where my crap is. Just to note: I clipped off the metal zipper tails and replaced them gutted paracord. Jingle jangle doesn't go well in the jungle jungle; noise discipline is key.






Here is where I keep the stuff that goes bang. Starting from the left we have 2 CADPAT TT 3 mag pouches. They use shockcord which is adjustable for mag retention, tho I'm thinking of attaching velcro to aid in mag retention instead of just using a fastex clip. Next we have 2 TT small utility pouches, which I use to carry frags. Those two pouches will soon be replaced by another CADPAT TT zippered utility pouch which will carry at the minimum 2 frags and 2 smokes/bangs/WP depending on the mission. Next to that is a Paraclete universal radio pouch. I went with this because it is completely adjustable. Plus I know that it'll hold a 521 set. The reason all this stuff is on my left side is because I'm right handed. You always want the stuff you'll need immediately (which in the warrior's case is ammo and frags) in a place where it's easiest to get to, and you always reload with your weak hand. 






Here's a closeup of the back of the yoke. PALS webbing on the back to attach pouches, an idea which I'm not fond of, I don't want anything there interfeering with my ruck. However, if I'm going into a FIBUA situation or a raid where no rucks are being carried, I might attach a few smoke pouches to the back for bangs or smoke for the guy behind me to grab a hold of.






Here's a front shot of the rig.






And here's a shot of how I store some chemlights. Planning on attaching some gutted paracord lanyards to 'em to aid in retrieval.












Here are pics of my knife. I took these pics after I replaced the stock mircarta scales with paracord. But I eventually went back to the normal scales as they were more comfortable.


This is my current perfect rig (well, it will be once I get another zippered utility pouch for my pyro). I say current because I am constantly looking over and analyzing my loadout, as any good warrior should do. The soldier's load is an exact science, and leadership at every level needs to keep a hawklike watch on what the troops are carrying. The soldier's load is an important part of every PCI and PDI, and leaders should do their utmost best to avoid burdening the troops. Unfortunately there are only so many things leaders can do. The realities of the weight of current issue kit and the realities of combat ressuply can at times totally negate the best efforts at making the combat load one more easily borne. For example, the C6 SF kit. With modern manufacturing techniques could be made lighter. Unfortunately the one in system weighs a ***** and a half. Weight of ammo isn't going to change in the future, and water will always remain the same. Probably the biggest problem with our current combat load that I see is the body armour. Plates that weigh 12 pounds each along with a 10 pound soft armour vest is absolutely ridiculous. It's quite expensive but in a few months I'll be buying my own plates which weigh a fraction of the issue plates, because I don't want the only manuever I can do to be advance to ambush. My chest rig carries the absolute minimum the warfighter needs. Ammo, water, meds, comms, pyro, blade. I'll throw in a theater map into the map pocket along with 1 IMP meal in a heat bag and a bag of hot chocolate or gatorade mix. I'll probably be taking off one of the 3 mag pouches, as 10 mags is, I think, enough for light infanteers and that saves a couple of pounds. In any case, I look forward to hearing some comments and thoughts here, both on my rig, and the soldier's load.


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## Infanteer (14 Aug 2004)

Nice rig.  Those pouches are Tactical Tailor you say?  I had no idea they had access to real-deal CADPAT.

Your set up is very much like the Arktis Norloose rig, a half vest/half webbing kind of dealie (Is there a technical name for this?).  I've been looking at something like this for a while now.


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## Paras (14 Aug 2004)

Pretty dam nice.You said it holds 10 mags but there were only two 3 mag pouches or am i missing something?Personally ide stick with being able to pack 10 mags if i was on deployment,but in the Militia its definitely not needed.Asides from that its looks pretty comfortable.How compatible is it with the ruck?Also is there a reason you picked Utility pouches with a zipper rather that with fastex clips?

Cool rig tho


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## tacsit (14 Aug 2004)

Infanteer, the pouches are indeed TT. Call up Dave's Surplus in BC and ask 'em what TT CADPAT pouches they have in stock. As far as I know such pouches are only available through Dave's. I believe their website's URL is: www.davesarmysurplus.com. It is kind of like a half vest/half webbing, but regardless the proper terminology is chest rig, as it uses a yoke vise a full coat-like design.

Paras, the actual chest rig itself has 6 single mag pouches built into it. Thus before you attach any pouches to the rig you can carry 6 rifle mags. Add on 1 TT 3 mag pouch and you get 9 mags, then 1 in the weapon = 10 mags. Right now with both magpouches on there I can carry 13 mags: 12 on the rig, 1 on the weapon.

No slight at all intended, but I find your point of view somewhat disturbing, that in the reserves being able to pack 10 mags is not needed. True, 10 mags are not issued to every rifleman, a shameful situation if I ever saw one. Any CO worth his salt could order extra mags through the system and if his troops are still using the 82 pattern webbing then get each soldier 2 or 3 additional C7 mag pouches. This idea of issuing only 5 mags to each soldier is idiocy. The QOR goes a bit further and issues each soldier 6 mags, which is a step in the right direction, but it is still not enough. For soldiers to be combat effective they need to train with realistic combat weights. That means the same number of mags they'd carry on operations, as well as assorted mission essential kit such as 1 M72 per soldier, mortar bombs, jerry cans full of water,claymores, grenades etc. etc. When I go into the field I have my rig set up to carry as many mags as I'd carry on operations. Even though I am not issued that number of mags I take small weights and put them in the mag pouches to simulate the weight. I carry dummy frags in my grenade pouches. Train as you fight. That should be the motto of every single soldier in the CF; unfortunately it is only paid lip service. Having troops carry the same stuff they'd carry on operations is a simple enough matter. Put in the requests for the proper number of mags, dummy grenades, dummy claymores, dummy M72s, etc. Once that's done keep strict control of your stores and you're set for realistic training. Sorry for the rant, lol, just a topic that is near and dear to my heart.

The rig is quite comfy, and it integrates quite well with my ruck. The shoulder straps are nice and thin; thin being the key here. They don't interfeer at all with the shoulder straps of my ruck and as I said, the rig rides high enough to not interfeer with my ruck's padded waistbelt. I picked the zippered utility pouches instead of going with a pouch that used fastex clips for a couple of reasons. First of all, I could find no other pouch that would hold my canteen, cup and stove on the market that was in CADPAT. Secondly, the zipper is infinitely easier to close than a fastex clip when using one hand. I know many people are leery of zippers, but the zippers on the pouches are thick and strong heavy duty zips, and so far I have yet to hear of a single story from the legions of troops using TT zippered utility pouches that their zipper has busted on an FTX or operation, so it's good to go in my book.


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## soldiers301 (14 Aug 2004)

The up of the chest rig is not the real CADPAT, but the pouche is made with the real things.


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## Infanteer (14 Aug 2004)

That was in the review if you bothered to read it.


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## soldiers301 (14 Aug 2004)

Ooops, sorry, i didnt read   :


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## Armymedic (14 Aug 2004)

So why is your chest rig better then the issued TV ( other then the fact its yours)?


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## tacsit (14 Aug 2004)

It is made of stronger materials than the TV (much more durable), it is completely modular so the user can set it up however he/she would like. It does not interfeer at all with a ruck's padded waistbelt like the TV does and it makes more efficient use of space than the TV, forcing the warfighter to carry only what is needed, nothing more.


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## scm77 (15 Aug 2004)

That looks pretty cool, but are you actually gonna be allowed to wear it?  Along with you new ruck?


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## tacsit (15 Aug 2004)

Scm77, right now I'm a civilian. I'm currently very heavily debating whether to join back up as an officer. I am quite close to making the decision to go ahead and do it. That being said, there are a few other issues here. This rig, along with my ruck, I didn't make for the army. I do work in the private sector that has given me opportunities to do interesting things in interesting places, mostly on the green side thus far (hence why I have no black rig as of yet). This work is quite enjoyable (well, relatively speaking) and also pays more than the army. Why do I want to join back up you ask? Because I love my country and I would enjoy the opportunity to lead soldiers. The CF has a big problem. They lack personel. We always hear about all these recruiting drives and whatnot. I already have some experience in the ranks. I'm already quite knowledgable on various military matters more so than most other officer recruits. My view is that when you're in the field, provided it falls within acceptable parameters, wear whatever you wish that you feel will make your life in the field easier. If I go back in and somebody does not want me to wear my chest rig and ruck they can bring me up on charges if they wish. I am not planning on joining back up to put bar after bar on my arm. I'm joining up to lead men into combat. If the largest formation I ever command is a rifle platoon I will not shed a single tear. If the CF wants to lose an such an officer though that's the organization's loss. Some will accuse me of arrogance, hubris, whatever, but while I know that of course there is so much for me to learn and what I don't know could fill volumes, I have lots to offer the army. If they want to throw that away because I want to wear kit that'll do the job better than the issue stuff in the field, they can go shove their heads up their asses. WAR means We Are Ready, and as a leader I will ensure that my men and I are ready. I am not going to pandy about with idiotic rules in a job when lives are on the line. My job as a leader, as a warrior, is to make sure my men and comrades complete the mission and come back home alive. Full stop. Any regulations which get in the way of those two priorities and that do not aid the troops in some way shape or form I have no time for. I'm sure some people who read this will cry and moan that you cannot pick and choose which regs to follow, others will say I'm not army material. That's fine. The purpose of an army is to kill people and break things, and provided you instill the 3 D's on the parade square you shouldn't have to worry about how that's reflected in dress on the battlefield.

Sorry for the rant


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## scm77 (15 Aug 2004)

My bad, I thought you were just getting into the army.


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## tacsit (15 Aug 2004)

No worries mate.


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## caroline65 (15 Aug 2004)

tacsit said:
			
		

> Scm77, right now I'm a civilian. I'm currently very heavily debating whether to join back up as an officer. I am quite close to making the decision to go ahead and do it. That being said, there are a few other issues here. This rig, along with my ruck, I didn't make for the army. I do work in the private sector that has given me opportunities to do interesting things in interesting places, mostly on the green side thus far (hence why I have no black rig as of yet). This work is quite enjoyable (well, relatively speaking) and also pays more than the army. Why do I want to join back up you ask? Because I love my country and I would enjoy the opportunity to lead soldiers. The CF has a big problem. They lack personel. We always hear about all these recruiting drives and whatnot. I already have some experience in the ranks. I'm already quite knowledgable on various military matters more so than most other officer recruits. My view is that when you're in the field, provided it falls within acceptable parameters, wear whatever you wish that you feel will make your life in the field easier. If I go back in and somebody does not want me to wear my chest rig and ruck they can bring me up on charges if they wish. I am not planning on joining back up to put bar after bar on my arm. I'm joining up to lead men into combat. If the largest formation I ever command is a rifle platoon I will not shed a single tear. If the CF wants to lose an such an officer though that's the organization's loss. Some will accuse me of arrogance, hubris, whatever, but while I know that of course there is so much for me to learn and what I don't know could fill volumes, I have lots to offer the army. If they want to throw that away because I want to wear kit that'll do the job better than the issue stuff in the field, they can go shove their heads up their asses. WAR means We Are Ready, and as a leader I will ensure that my men and I are ready. I am not going to pandy about with idiotic rules in a job when lives are on the line. My job as a leader, as a warrior, is to make sure my men and comrades complete the mission and come back home alive. Full stop. Any regulations which get in the way of those two priorities and that do not aid the troops in some way shape or form I have no time for. I'm sure some people who read this will cry and moan that you cannot pick and choose which regs to follow, others will say I'm not army material. That's fine. The purpose of an army is to kill people and break things, and provided you instill the 3 D's on the parade square you shouldn't have to worry about how that's reflected in dress on the battlefield.
> 
> Sorry for the rant



Nice rig, however you are wrong. the TV is fine with the ruck.I know this cause I wear it. Further, you are the type of person we don't care to have. We are a team and I don't see an "i" in team. Maybe you should join the American Army, we are peacekeepers not peacemakers.Your quote," The purpose of an army is to kill people and break things", question: Are you insane?? If you want to be a good leader then don't be an "indiviual"and give a s**t about the troops and not so much about yourself. Full Stop. Good luck buddy. :


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## Infanteer (15 Aug 2004)

> Maybe you should join the American Army, we are peacekeepers not peacemakers.Your quote," The purpose of an army is to kill people and break things", question: Are you insane??



Perhaps you are the kind of person we shouldn't care to have, seeing how you are so obviously unaware of the nature of an armed force.  Tacsit's definition may be a tad crude and unrefined, but at least he doesn't by in to the myth that "Canadian's are Peacekeepers"; a myth that is probably responsible for a good percentage of the militaries problems right now.


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## Jarnhamar (15 Aug 2004)

I've always believed it's important to reinforce the fact that peacekeeping is a task trained war fighting soldiers perform, it's not a trade.


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## Infanteer (15 Aug 2004)

Exactly; professional soldiers should be able to perform missions along the entire spectrum of conflict.  But we must keep in mind that from one end of the spectrum to the other (humantarian aid to high intensity war) soldiers are required primarily for their ability to use violent force in the event that other groups wish to impede our national interests and interfere with the mission; we call them "the enemy."


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## Slim (15 Aug 2004)

Well said and right on the money... 

Slim


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## Infanteer (15 Aug 2004)

As for Tacsit's rant.   I can understand the frustration with having to deal with less then optimal kit for the job but I think you have to reevaluate your outlook on both becoming an Officer and on the profession of arms as a whole.   Your passion for the effort you put into ensuring effective military equipment is commendable; I, as a self professed "kit slut", often look forward to reading what you have to say.   Just don't let that passion give you tunnel vision as there is alot more to being a combat leader then having gucci kit and preparing for war.   The "I'm going to wear what I want, fuck what anybody else says" bravado comes off as both immature and displaying a lack of understanding of some key characteristics required of a combat leader, namely loyalty and trust both up to your superiors and down to your subordinates.   

Loyalty and trust to your superior Officers and their supporting NCO's is essential to maintaining a cohesive and functioning military unit.   By stating that you could care less about what directives your superiors will pass down you are displaying a distrust for your superiors that may be construed as disloyalty.   In that event, you'd most likely be relieved of your command and cashiered; trust me, I've seen it happen before.   I can understand that you wish your troops to have access to the best equipment they can acquire, but the fact that must be remembered is that although as a platoon commander you are responsible for the men and equipment in your platoon, it is not "your" platoon.   It belongs to the Army which chooses to utilize it as it sees fit on behalf of the State.

Naturally the sensible thing regarding the issue is to lobby your C-of-C for permission; if you can present a good enough case some or all of your requests may be authorized.   However, if denied, you have to suck it up and drive on.   This is why I have two sets of kit; my "Ferrari Kit" that I tinker with to my delight, and my "Model T Kit" that is optimized to fit into the designated guidelines.   Yes, I totally agree with the 3VP policy in OP APOLLO, when the time comes you got to do what you must despite what the Department of Helmet Modification says; but that is a matter of picking and choosing your battles.   Adopting a rash, inflexible outlook on kit or any military directive in general is only liable to lead to disappointment and failure.    Remember the principles of "Adapt, Overcome and Improvise".


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## Fusaki (15 Aug 2004)

You're on a roll today, Infanteer. Well said on both issues.


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## tacsit (15 Aug 2004)

Interesting comments. Infanteer, I am in 100% agreement with you. My rant was of course my personal feelings on the matter, and when I swear an oath as either an enlisted man or officer I have sworn to follow the orders of those above me as a matter of course. My point overall was not limited to the usage of non-issue kit. I was trying to use that topic as a vehicle for my overall viewpoint, that as a combat leader it's not just about getting the right kit for my men, but doing literally everything I possibly can to help them kill the enemy and come back safe. I disagree with you on your point that my viewpoint indicates a lack of trust for my superiors or subordinates. If somebody has a point of view that I disagree with, that does not mean I don't trust them or respect them, I just do not share their point of view. When I say I don't care about a directive that will impede and not aid my men in their tasks, that doesn't mean I'll ignore every directive that comes my way, lol. Wouldn't have much of a command relationship there I don't think. As I said, that rant was my personal viewpoint, and of course any orders that come my way that I don't like I'll have to deal with, suck it up, and move on out. Lobbying certain issues is exactly the type of approach I had in mind as an officer, but I also don't mind rocking the boat a little. I appreciate your insight.

Moving right along to caroline65... You're not combat arms I take it.. If you are you need to a.) seriously question what you're doing in the army, and b.) get somebody who has the right mindset to pluck the air from your head and fill it with the necessary viewpoint for a soldier, which is: OUR PRIMARY JOB IS TO KILL THE ENEMY. The TV may be fine with the 82 pattern rucksack which doesn't use a padded waistbelt, but it hasn't worked for me with a ruck with a padded waistbelt, and another forum member has had the same problem as me. So I guess the question would be, has the ruck you've used had a padded waistbelt? Even if it has, myself and another board member have had problems, so I guess that's irellevent. I'm the type of person the army doesn't care to have? Hmm, last I checked we all carried guns and other things that go boom for a reason... oh yes, that's right, our primary job is warfighting... imagine that! :. Regardless of how many peacekeeping taskings we recieve our primary purpose is to fight, and thus we train for war, because peacekeeping, as another member said, is a job that is performed by warfighting trained troops. If you have soldiers who only know how to peacekeep, god help you when the feces hits the rotating blades. Onto your final point. LEARN HOW TO READ. You accuse me of being an individual and not giving a shit about the troops under my command. Here's a quote directly from my post:



> WAR means We Are Ready, and *as a leader I will ensure that my men and I are ready*. I am not going to pandy about with idiotic rules in a job when lives are on the line. My job as a leader, as a warrior, is to *make sure my men and comrades complete the mission and come back home alive*. Full stop. Any regulations which get in the way of those two priorities and that do not* aid the troops * in some way shape or form I have no time for.



Now, after reading through that part could you please enlighten me as to where I have said indirectly or directly that I don't give a shit about the troops? I didn't join this forum or start this thread to start a pissing match, and I extend my apologies to other board members for the direction this thread has gone, partly due to the airing of my personal viewpoint on some of the qualities I feel a combat leader needs.


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## Jungle (15 Aug 2004)

Nice rig, but the problem with this kind of kit is when it breaks during a deployment, you sometimes can't get replacement parts. We should train with what we fight, which is the kit the Army issues us. You don't like it, then it's a personal problem...  
Regarding the "peacekeeping" bit: the last deployment I was on, our mandate was to RESTORE order, with the authority to take all necessary measures to fulfil this mandate.


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## caroline65 (15 Aug 2004)

tacsit said:
			
		

> Interesting comments. Infanteer, I am in 100% agreement with you. My rant was of course my personal feelings on the matter, and when I swear an oath as either an enlisted man or officer I have sworn to follow the orders of those above me as a matter of course. My point overall was not limited to the usage of non-issue kit. I was trying to use that topic as a vehicle for my overall viewpoint, that as a combat leader it's not just about getting the right kit for my men, but doing literally everything I possibly can to help them kill the enemy and come back safe. I disagree with you on your point that my viewpoint indicates a lack of trust for my superiors or subordinates. If somebody has a point of view that I disagree with, that does not mean I don't trust them or respect them, I just do not share their point of view. When I say I don't care about a directive that will impede and not aid my men in their tasks, that doesn't mean I'll ignore every directive that comes my way, lol. Wouldn't have much of a command relationship there I don't think. As I said, that rant was my personal viewpoint, and of course any orders that come my way that I don't like I'll have to deal with, suck it up, and move on out. Lobbying certain issues is exactly the type of approach I had in mind as an officer, but I also don't mind rocking the boat a little. I appreciate your insight.
> 
> Moving right along to caroline65... You're not combat arms I take it.. If you are you need to a.) seriously question what you're doing in the army, and b.) get somebody who has the right mindset to pluck the air from your head and fill it with the necessary viewpoint for a soldier, which is: OUR PRIMARY JOB IS TO KILL THE ENEMY. The TV may be fine with the 82 pattern rucksack which doesn't use a padded waistbelt, but it hasn't worked for me with a ruck with a padded waistbelt, and another forum member has had the same problem as me. So I guess the question would be, has the ruck you've used had a padded waistbelt? Even if it has, myself and another board member have had problems, so I guess that's irellevent. I'm the type of person the army doesn't care to have? Hmm, last I checked we all carried guns and other things that go boom for a reason... oh yes, that's right, our primary job is warfighting... imagine that! :. Regardless of how many peacekeeping taskings we recieve our primary purpose is to fight, and thus we train for war, because peacekeeping, as another member said, is a job that is performed by warfighting trained troops. If you have soldiers who only know how to peacekeep, god help you when the feces hits the rotating blades. Onto your final point. LEARN HOW TO READ. You accuse me of being an individual and not giving a crap about the troops under my command. Here's a quote directly from my post:
> 
> ...




You need to re read what Infanteer wrote. Now him, I would respect. Soldier on Infanteer.... About the comment on weather or not I am combat arms. now that is just silly. Where would the common combat soldier be without support? Explain that one?? All trades are required to get a job done weather it be floods,ice storms or humanitarian duties. Ever here of an NSE before? (National Support Element)

Hope you make the right choice on weather or not to join the service.


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## tacsit (15 Aug 2004)

I think I quite adequately responded to Infanteer's comments actually. Though if he disagress I'm sure he'll tell me. My comment on whether or not you are in the combat arms is due to your comment about how my viewpoint that the purpose of armies is to kill people and break things somehow makes me insane, because no combat arms soldier I've ever met has shared your point of view. I was not commenting at all on the obvious necessity of support pers., so I don't know why you're bringing that into the mix. You still haven't responded to the points I made in my previous post regarding your comments though, nor have you apologied for attacking me after quite obviously not reading through my 2nd last post. What difference does it make what tasking the troops are assigned? Be you infantry or part of a SVC unit the primary reason you train is not to succeed in a peacekeeping mission, but to succeed on the field of battle. All other training is mission specific (i.e. peacekeeping, dealing with a snowstorm, etc.). I think YOU need to pay closer attention to Infanteer's comments on your view of what an armed force is meant for   :.


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## Zoomie (15 Aug 2004)

Nice rig man, but like Jungle alluded to, not very practical when you are deployed overseas.  Try dropping by the CQ and getting replacements for parts that have fallen/rotten away.
I am still a little puzzled at what you could possibly use this setup for in the civilian world - 9 +1 Magazine pouches => pretty intensive duck hunting!  ???
I imagine that the first day you wore that set-up as a newly minted Lt, you would get a few choice words from your CSM.
Not knocking your design, very inventive and gucci.


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## tacsit (15 Aug 2004)

The rig and pouches all come from two tactical gear companies who have some of the best reps in the business for durability. If the nylon does break, then I'll sew it back up, that's what a sew kit is for. If a buckle breaks, I'm 100% sure the CQ will have replacement parts for the TV that will integrate with my rig. I am quite confident in the ability of my rig to handle any abuse thrown at it on any mission. It's already been put through its paces.


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## KevinB (15 Aug 2004)

caroline65 said:
			
		

> Nice rig, however you are wrong. the TV is fine with the ruck.I know this cause I wear it. Further, you are the type of person we don't care to have. We are a team and I don't see an "i" in team. Maybe you should join the American Army, we are peacekeepers not peacemakers.Your quote," The purpose of an army is to kill people and break things", question: Are you insane?? If you want to be a good leader then don't be an "indiviual"and give a s**t about the troops and not so much about yourself. Full Stop. Good luck buddy. :



WTF what trade are YOU?

Peacekeepers not peacemakers - LOL 
Ever been anywhere?

Personally I think tacsit overrates/overvalues his experiences (IMHO) but due to his passion etc I think he would be a valuable member of the CF again reg or reserve.


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## tacsit (16 Aug 2004)

Kevin, thanks for the kind words. I readily admit I still suffer at times from the impetuousness of youth... that what I need you old timers for, to put me in my place . BTW, did you get my e-mail on MWS and barrel lengths? Sent it out about a week or so ago.


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## I_am_John_Galt (16 Aug 2004)

Zoomie said:
			
		

> I am still a little puzzled at what you could possibly use this setup for in the civilian world - 9 +1 Magazine pouches => pretty intensive duck hunting!  ???


 +"carry at the minimum 2 frags and 2 smokes/bangs/WP"


I was wondering about this, too: what kind of civillian job requires you to carry this much ammo?


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## Jarnhamar (16 Aug 2004)

Are civilian security companies allowed to use fragmintation and white phosphorous grenades??


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## Infanteer (16 Aug 2004)

Or have 20/30 round magazines for a restricted rifle?


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## mudgunner49 (16 Aug 2004)

caroline65 said:
			
		

> Nice rig, however you are wrong. the TV is fine with the ruck.I know this cause I wear it. Further, you are the type of person we don't care to have. We are a team and I don't see an "i" in team. Maybe you should join the American Army, we are peacekeepers not peacemakers.Your quote," The purpose of an army is to kill people and break things", question: Are you insane?? If you want to be a good leader then don't be an "individual"and give a s**t about the troops and not so much about yourself. Full Stop. Good luck buddy. :



Welcome to "Fuzzy Bunny, Purple Sky Land"!!!

So now all requirements of the CF are dictated by what works for the Svc Sp types??   Talk   about the administrative tail wagging the operational dog!!!   

Come back and talk to me when you've worn the ruck (with a padded belt over the TV on a walk (cross-country - not on hard-pack) for farther than the distance from your truck to your modular tentage home on the range...

I don't know how someone has gotten so many to buy in so mindlessly to the whole"we are peacekeepers, not warriors" line of total horse***, but it is doing our soldiers (and sailors and airmen) a great disservice.   In order for us to KEEP the peace often times we must first MAKE the peace.   This entails, more often than not, imposing our will upon the opposing parties by FORCE OF ARMS.   If I am required to do this I would like to have something more than 4 mags for my rifle and a dull bayonet.

Wake up and smell the damn coffee - the real world ain't Disneyland.   There are sharp edges and people do get hurt - today it's your turn.   Earplugs in, helmets on, watch and shoot, watch and shoot...


'Nuff said,

Blake


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## tacsit (16 Aug 2004)

Truer words Blake, were never spoken. To answer the previous questions, it wasn't in Canada (obviously not, what with the mag restrictions here), and the ammo loadout for this rig is predicated on two jobs that I have done (different rig, my 82 pattern webbing actually) and two jobs that I will be doing, one in 5 months, the other in 12. None have been through actual companies though I still refer to them as civvy jobs because they aren't military (obviosuly). I will readily admit that luckily in neither of the past two greenish jobs was I directly shot at, so I hold no claim to fame or any such thing. That's all I'm going to say on this issue. If anybody wants to know about my upcoming jobs in the interest of learning where you can make some contacts along those lines you can PM me and we can talk.


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## Michael Dorosh (16 Aug 2004)

Extremely interesting thread, and despite some fundamental disagreements, a sense of professionalism and decorum was maintained.  This board has certainly changed in the last year or two.

Caroline's comments seem offensively off the mark; the _raison d'etre_ of the Army - and that includes supporting elements - is to train to kill our nations enemies - speedily, efficiently, legally, and in large numbers as mandated by the government in Ottawa and our commanders in the field.  Everything else - peacekeeping, shovelling snow in Toronto, Rememberance Day ceremonies, etc. - are just "extra duties as assigned."


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## Slim (16 Aug 2004)

*To close with and destroy the enemy, regardless of terrain or weather...*

I don't see Peacekeeping, handing out sleeping bags and cookies, shoveling snow or stopping floods anyplace in the above statement. Taskings are taskings sure, But selection and maintenance of the aim is paramount!

Slim


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## Infanteer (16 Aug 2004)

You still stand by your statement Caroline?


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## Armymedic (16 Aug 2004)

she mentioned on another thread she was heading out to Stalwart Guardian. She prob won't be back for a few days....


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## tacsit (16 Aug 2004)

That starts on Friday. She advance party? In any case I certainly won't miss her... Bloody disgrace to the profession of arms is what that attitude is...


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## Armymedic (16 Aug 2004)

As per,  reg force goes out earlier to prepare it all so that the res don't waste a week in set up.

But lets not let her get us off track...

For what purpose other then section rifleman would the average CF soldier have use for 9 magazines plus grenades, plus, plus.....

Not that 270 rds is excessive for 031, but would be for most other cbts arms/CSS who also have other stores to carry....

So how would you rig for 6+1 mags instead? 

Going back, again what makes your design better then the issued TV.


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## tacsit (16 Aug 2004)

I like this, you force me to justify my choices. Good stuff. A good warrior constantly critiques to find out why something is better or worse. As I said, my chest rig and the pouches are several orders tougher than the TV. The quality of workmanship on every aspect of my rig far exceeds the quality of the issue TV. Everything is at least double and triple (in some cases quadruple) stiched on my rig. Take a look at the TV, and look at the nice single and sometimes doubel stitching. Also the thread used in my rig is tougher than the thread used in the stitching of my rig. I go into the field firm in the knowledge that my rig WILL NOT FAIL. Also as I said, it does not interfeer with a ruck, like the issue TV. As well, I can carry the 521 set on my rig where it won't interfeer with an apack or ruck. Can you do that on the TV? Again, modularity. I can set up my rig for whatever mission I want. If I'm humping an LMG I can swap off the mag pouches shift some pouches over, and put two C9 pouches there and not have 4 useless mag pouches still on my rig. For what purpose other than section rifleman would the average CF soldier have use for 10 mags? Let's see... self-defense methinks? Fine, it may be a bit excessive. I would suggest not issuing anything less than 7 mags to any non-combat arms soldier for the purpose of self-defense. Infanteers have to manpack way more than any CSS/other cbt arms trades do, so saying they have other stores to carry other than their mags, well, I'm not buying what you're selling, lol. How would I rig my rig for a 7 mag loadout? I'd take off any external ammo pouches and keep 6 mags in the internal mag pockets of my rig and keep the 7th mag in the weapon.


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## KevinB (16 Aug 2004)

tacsit said:
			
		

> Kevin, thanks for the kind words. I readily admit I still suffer at times from the impetuousness of youth... that what I need you old timers for, to put me in my place . BTW, did you get my e-mail on MWS and barrel lengths? Sent it out about a week or so ago.


 ;D No problem man.

I did not get the email.


 I will point out that most of the recce Pl 031's on Roto II are using aftermarket chestrigs - why - the TV is useless for the role.


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## Righty (17 Aug 2004)

tacsit i don't know what type of job(s) you have but this is what i'm thinking...

"Your an international hitman, and can be deployed anywhere in the world within 48 hours. So you get a call from an unknown man saying that a billionaire oil tycon in texas needs to be taken out. He is vactioning in the deep woods of northern ontario, and needs to be taken out with no evidence. So you choose a HALO entry at night and set up an outpost on a ridge waiting for him to show in the morning. The tycon heads out in the morning and you take one aimed shot and your job is done. Now you have to lug 9 mags minus one round, 2 frags, and two smoke nades 20 k back to your extraction point."

That would be a kicka$$ job


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## Jarnhamar (17 Aug 2004)

and then when you get on the subway to kill your last target for the night some black taxi cab driver shoots you because his girlfriend was in fact, the last hit.


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## tacsit (17 Aug 2004)

Shit people, haven't you heard of OPSEC? ;D


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## 1feral1 (17 Aug 2004)

For Tacist: 
Its obvious you have some talent WRT the kit you make, and you might do better for the US commercial market (a la ebay etc) or take your ideas to the appropiate CF avenue for evaluation as you might get a SF interest generated there, and hence make a name for yourself, along with a bundle of cash.


Regards,

Wes


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## brin11 (17 Aug 2004)

Are you kidding me?  It could only be a HAHO entry, don't want them to hear that canopy opening do we?


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## Righty (17 Aug 2004)

brin11 said:
			
		

> Are you kidding me?   It could only be a HAHO entry, don't want them to hear that canopy opening do we?




Ahhh...  ^-^


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## Armymedic (19 Aug 2004)

Wesley H. Allen said:
			
		

> Its obvious you have some talent WRT the kit you make, and you might do better for the US commercial market (a la ebay etc) or take your ideas to the appropiate CF avenue for evaluation as you might get a SF interest generated there, and hence make a name for yourself, along with a bundle of cash.



Indeed, your talent is being wasted here.


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## Jarnhamar (19 Aug 2004)

Not to hijack the thread but if i can throw in a comment regarding this thread and a few others;

I think it might be important to point out to the new recruits that having the best highspeed kit won't make you a good soldier.
Having good kit makes a good soldier better. You need to effectivly use the stuff your issued first.

Imagine the best running shoes money can buy on an overweight amatur runner.  Not going to make much of a difference eh?

Guys who rely too much on their kit end up being pulled out of the field by it. Guys who have all this highspeed kit hanging off them and don't know how to use it look retarded.


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## KevinB (19 Aug 2004)

Ghost - excellent point.

 I get caught up in kit rants now and then - but I will point out that I have a few years doing this.  (Mo 87-94 then Patrica's...)

Kit is a tool - however w/o the proper skillsets it is useless.  It may make your job/task easier but it will never do that for you - you have to do it yourslf and have both the intestinal fortitude and job knowledge to do it.


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## tacsit (19 Aug 2004)

Definitely a good point made by both Ghost778 and KevinB. Since May till now I've spent about $5000 on training. That's both gunfighting skills and combatives. I've spent maybe $500 on gear. That is the kind of ratio you want to have. A warrior does not rely on equipment as a crutch, he uses what he must to achieve his mission, whatever it may be. A higly trained warrior with a ratty old AK will defeat a half-trained conscript with a tricked out M4 any day of the week.


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## Jarnhamar (19 Aug 2004)

> Since May till now I've spent about $5000 on training. That's both gunfighting skills and combatives. I've spent maybe $500 on gear. That is the kind of ratio you want to have.



This is money you've spent as a civilian right?


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## Michael Dorosh (19 Aug 2004)

Ghost778 said:
			
		

> This is money you've spent as a civilian right?



ahem....Ghost, I believe the term is "warrior" not civilian.  ;D


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## Popurhedoff (20 Aug 2004)

Hello,  there is no substitute for practice...and live firing at the range...after 25 years in and still current I go through approx 20-30000 rounds downrage each year out of my own pocket...ya I am a range whore :dontpanic:

Nice kit you have...now spend your money on bullets and practice some more. ;D

Cheers
Popurhedoff


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## Jarnhamar (20 Aug 2004)

You've been in the army as long as I've been alive Popurhedoff , cheers


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## KevinB (22 Aug 2004)

Ghost778 said:
			
		

> You've been in the army as long as I've been alive Popurhedoff , cheers



Airforce  ;D

Cheers, Pat good to see you here.


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