# Kit list suggestions?



## humint (17 Apr 2003)

I‘m going on my first Ex in a week and was wondering if anyone has suggestions for a kit list. I don‘t want to take too much sh!t, so any suggestions for what/what NOT to take would be much appreciated. 

Plus, does anyone have suggestions for kit to purchase. I checked out the canadianpeacekeeper.com website and they have a whole whack of stuff, but what the HE-doublehockeysticks is useful?


----------



## kurokaze (17 Apr 2003)

First ex?  Without having done BOTP?

I just purchased the platypus from CanadianPeacekeeper, looking forward to trying to trying it out, hopefully I doesn‘t burst when I put it under my ruck!


----------



## Pikache (17 Apr 2003)

It would help if you tell us what kind of ex are you going and what are the planned... events.


----------



## Korus (17 Apr 2003)

Kurokaze;

Does the platypus (or at least the bladder) fit inside the top pocket of the rucksack? (the pocket on the flap to close off the main compartment)


----------



## kurokaze (18 Apr 2003)

Korus, I believe that the bladder will fit
in the top pocket of the rucksack (I will recieve
mine on Monday).  I also ordered the modular
hydration pack as well (not in cadpat though,
waste of money).  I‘m curious to see if the
hydration pack is slim enough to fit underneath
my ruck when I put my ruck on.

There have been questions raised as to whether or
not I‘m even allowed to have this thing for my
courses but we‘ll see.


----------



## Spr.Earl (18 Apr 2003)

Huminit, take what you are told to take as to issue.Remember you have to carry it!
 You will get all kind‘s of answer‘s as to the gucci kit from every one even me,you be your own judge.


----------



## Michael Dorosh (18 Apr 2003)

Experience can‘t be gained on the internet.  Take what your section commander tells you to take, and in time, you‘ll get a better feel for what is essential and what you can get away with not taking.

Better to have it and not need it than to not have it and need it.


----------



## humint (18 Apr 2003)

I agree, experience can‘t be gained on the Internet. However, I find it helpful to get as much info first -- so I can be informed -- and to see what works for me as I progress. I know that people will have all sorts of suggestions. I‘m asking everyone, so it‘s not as if I‘m putting all my faith in this chatroom. 

As for the Ex, I am there basically as an observer -- so, just to get my feet wet. I‘ve had other tactical/field training (but not in the CF), so I think that is why they are letting me go in a very limited fashion. Nothing too serious.


----------



## Fader (18 Apr 2003)

Are you in the infantry, engineers, medics, sigs, logs, etc?

The type of ex your going on as well as how long your going to be out for really determines what kit you should bring.


----------



## humint (21 Apr 2003)

I‘m in Infantry. The Ex is your typical ruck-it for a long-time, set-up defensive area, wait for an attack.


----------



## Jarnhamar (21 Apr 2003)

Don‘t put anything under your ruck when your wearing it. The ruck sack is made poorly enough as it is, nuke bags will throw off the weight disturbution and a platypus will pop either the main bag or the nozzel at the end will start leaking if it‘s not very well made. 
If your going on a defensive ex then bringing a platypus might even be extra kit you don‘t need.

If your interested, you might want to see if you can get thrown in with one of the sections for as much of the work as possible. I think the experence (and respect) you‘ll gain from working along side the troops and seeing what things are like on their level during the defensive will far out weight anything you learn as an observer on your first ex. See if you could even carry around the platoon commanders raido and follow him around to get a closer look.


----------



## kurokaze (21 Apr 2003)

> Don‘t put anything under your ruck when your wearing it. The ruck sack is made poorly enough as it is, nuke bags will throw off the weight disturbution and a platypus will pop either the main bag or the nozzel at the end will start leaking if it‘s not very well made.
> If your going on a defensive ex then bringing a platypus might even be extra kit you don‘t need.


I was afraid of something like that happening.
I guess I‘ll have to try putting the platypus
in my top pocket of my ruck.

humint, I agree with Ghost.  As an aspiring
officer it would do you a world of good to shadow
your platoon commander on an ex.


----------



## humint (21 Apr 2003)

I totally agree and have offered to do whatever -- carry the radio, act as a prisoner, partisan, etc. I‘m not too sure what they have in store, but I‘m up for anything. 

Thanks for the advice on the ruck. 

I have a few questions:

1. Does anyone use the cloth liner for the sleeping bags? Is it necessary? 

2. Where should I attach the 2L water bladder? It is US-made, so it doesn‘t fit onto the CDN webbing. 

3. Should I take along the ranger blanket if I have the inner & outer sleeping bags and the bivy? Is the cold weather sleeping hood useful, or is a toque good enough?

4. There‘s no way I can wear the ruck while wearing the butt pack on the webbing -- the ruck frame goes/hangs too far down onto my @ss. How do I remedy this? Do I adjust the ruck, so the bottom pads sits in the lumbar area of the back or do I just take everything out of the butt pack when I am rucking? Suggestions?

5. Is there a prescribed way of attaching the sleeping bags, hooch, air mattress, etc. on the ruck, or can I do it any way that I find works for me?  

6. Should I get an Alice pack to put onto the ruck frame? Is this allowed? 

Any other tidbits of advice?


----------



## Pikache (21 Apr 2003)

I have a few questions:

1. Does anyone use the cloth liner for the sleeping bags? Is it necessary? 
-use the liner. it helps insulation. also keep your sleeping bag less stinky (your sweat)

3. Should I take along the ranger blanket if I have the inner & outer sleeping bags and the bivy? Is the cold weather sleeping hood useful, or is a toque good enough?
-personally, I find sleeping bag inner, liner and bivy bag is warm enough for almost all weather. but bring ranger blankie too.

4. There‘s no way I can wear the ruck while wearing the butt pack on the webbing -- the ruck frame goes/hangs too far down onto my @ss. How do I remedy this? Do I adjust the ruck, so the bottom pads sits in the lumbar area of the back or do I just take everything out of the butt pack when I am rucking? Suggestions?
-being short sucks with 82 pattern ruck.
I try to lower the webbing so that it goes around my waist as tight as possible, then put valise on top of webbing. use the stomach strap to tighten the ruck around the waist as much as possible. ensure shoulder strap is as tight as possible.

5. Is there a prescribed way of attaching the sleeping bags, hooch, air mattress, etc. on the ruck, or can I do it any way that I find works for me?
-air matress between valise and ruck works for me
when packing valise, try to arrange it so that the stuff you‘re going to use first, usually the hooch is on top. whatever you‘re probably not going to use, like bug bar on the bottom.

Any other tidbits of advice?
-don‘t pack anymore than you‘re going to need. don‘t bring extra stuff you won‘t need. like two pairs of fleece


----------



## SpinDoc (21 Apr 2003)

For the being short bit and the ‘82 pattern rucksack, I have this to offer:

No, don‘t go and get ALICE equipment -- I think it would be frowned upon.

What you *could* probably get away with is to find the ‘64 pattern rucksack frame aka "jump ruck" aka "Lightweight Rucksack" from Vietnam War era and mount the ‘82 rucksack pack over the frame.  That way it *looks* like the other ‘82 rucks if seen from the back -- and the frame sits a bit higher.  What I do is I sit the kidney pad (which you will have to jerry rig if you use the ‘64 frame since the straps aren‘t long enough)on top of my buttpack, with my buttpack emptier (if that‘s a word) than usual and sitting relatively high so that it doesn‘t impede my legs.

Yeah, being short sucks... but the ‘64 frame really helps I think (for me anyways).


----------



## Jarnhamar (21 Apr 2003)

1. Does anyone use the cloth liner for the sleeping bags? Is it necessary? 
-If im on an ex where i won‘t get much time to take off my boots and get undressed then i don‘t bring the liner because it just gets in the way, i just jump into the sleeping bag fully clothed. This however is sometimes a bad practice because you won‘t stay as warm in the sleeping bag as if you were just in underwear but it‘s personal choice i guess. If you sleeping and your defensive position is attacked you might catch some flack for having to put all your clothes on in a hurry, add to the fact that your not used to getting dressed in a hurry and you make a sceen infront of your future troops. Good for moral though   

2. Where should I attach the 2L water bladder? It is US-made, so it doesn‘t fit onto the CDN webbing. 
-If im not mistaken the US one has little metal clips on the side. Open them up and clip them on to the strap on either side of your ruck sack.

3. Should I take along the ranger blanket if I have the inner & outer sleeping bags and the bivy? Is the cold weather sleeping hood useful, or is a toque good enough?
-I never use the arctic hood, a touge is good enough unless your actually in the artic. I always bring a ranger blanket. If your in the defensive you can cover your kit (or ground) with it to camoflauge it and if your sitting in a trench you can wrap it around you to keep warm or pull over your head if you or your trench girlfriend is a smoker and hide it.

4. There‘s no way I can wear the ruck while wearing the butt pack on the webbing -- the ruck frame goes/hangs too far down onto my @ss. How do I remedy this? Do I adjust the ruck, so the bottom pads sits in the lumbar area of the back or do I just take everything out of the butt pack when I am rucking? Suggestions?
-I‘d say what bedpan said. Take the stuff out of your butt pack and put it in the top of your ruck. Lower the webbing. Get an older style ruck sack frame. I use a jump ruck and i can have it and my webbing fully loaded with crap and they dont even touch.

6. Should I get an Alice pack to put onto the ruck frame? Is this allowed? 
-I‘d say no.  Working with a regiment before your course is a catch 22 in a way. You learn all kinds of great little tricks to make life easier and be more comfortable BUT when you start course everyone has to be the same so you can‘t use most of the tricks (or equipment modification)


----------



## Pugil (21 Apr 2003)

________________________________________________
If im on an ex where i won‘t get much time to take off my boots and get undressed then i don‘t bring the liner because it just gets in the way, i just jump into the sleeping bag fully clothed. This however is sometimes a bad practice because you won‘t stay as warm in the sleeping bag as if you were just in underwear but it‘s personal choice i guess
_______________________________________________

Taking off your boots before sleeping is a MUST! I have learned in the past that you should always take off your boots before sleeping otherwise your feet will sweat and moisture will acummulate inside your boots and those factors will lead to blisters. Bring ALOT of spare socks and footpowder everything, ALWAYS look after your feet. During exs, I dont care how much wet I am, but as long as my feet are dry and warm I am happy.


----------



## Jarnhamar (21 Apr 2003)

You may be happy but your trench partner might not be happy when his c9 is jamming and it takes you 4 extra minutes to get to the trench when hes under attack because you haven‘t slept in 2 days, can‘t see straight and your trying to tie up your boots fumbling with the laces because your fingers are frozen


----------



## Pugil (21 Apr 2003)

In whatever case you should be able to get up quickly and fight. It shouldnt take more than 25 seconds to put your boots on, if you have the old combat boots, just slide you feet inside the boots and do a quick knot. You dont need to tie up all the way, you can fix it later when things are calm. With the new gore-tex boots, you have the same fast-laces that you find in the jungle boots. With tha system, the time to put on and take off your boots are cut in half.


----------



## humint (21 Apr 2003)

Thanks for the help. 

As for the sleeping bags, could I get away with the inner, the cloth liner, the bivy, and the ranger blanket? If I don‘t need the outer blanket, there‘s no sense taking it. What sort of temps would I need the liner, inner, outer and bivy -- are we talking -20C and more?

Actually, I‘m over 6 feet tall, but I‘m all legs. I think that‘s why the ruck hangs so low on my back -- that, plus the shoulder straps may be framed wrong. I‘m going to take a look at it tonight.

More questions:

1. What about Gortex socks? When do you need ‘em? 

2. Scrim ... do I need it? Where the heck do I get it (other than on CDNpeacekeeper.com)?

3. Wash basin .. where‘s the best place to keep it so it doesn‘t get trashed?

4. Is a shaving kit necessary on the weekend Ex‘s. Do they do inspection? 

5. Camo paint -- I can‘t find the sticks (do we even get issued those in the Res?), is the other (i.e. commercial stuff) alright?  

I think that about does it.


----------



## Korus (21 Apr 2003)

> Actually, I‘m over 6 feet tall, but I‘m all legs. I think that‘s why the ruck hangs so low on my back -- that, plus the shoulder straps may be framed wrong. I‘m going to take a look at it tonight.


I‘m pretty tall, with long legs too. I find the best is to just lower the butt-pack on my webbing, so that when I put the ruck on, it pushes the butt-pack a bit lower, and below the ruck. It works good for my body-type, but some people could get annoyed with the butt-pack too low.
Just remember that the shoulder straps on your ruck should be very tight when you have it on, and this will cause it to ride higher on your back.

More questions:

3. Wash basin .. where‘s the best place to keep it so it doesn‘t get trashed?

-Put it in your sleeping bag valise, at one of the ends. That‘s the best place to put it, but it can still get trashed.. The only non-trashed one I‘ve seen so far was the brand-new one I was issued..     

4. Is a shaving kit necessary on the weekend Ex‘s. Do they do inspection? 

-Shaving kit is necessary. It‘s very easy to get yelled at for not shaving.     

5. Camo paint -- I can‘t find the sticks (do we even get issued those in the Res?), is the other (i.e. commercial stuff) alright? 

-Ask your QM. They should have some in tube-form, if not you could probably borrow someone elses.


----------



## Pikache (21 Apr 2003)

More questions:

1. What about Gortex socks? When do you need ‘em?
-When you know you are going to go into swamps and wetlands. Helps if you are wearing Mk3 combat boots.
Also, if your boots get wet, put on a new pair of socks and then the goretex socks and you are good to go. 

2. Scrim ... do I need it? Where the heck do I get it (other than on CDNpeacekeeper.com)?
-scrim is part of basic camouflage. you can make your own scrim. make strips of random assortment of green (I prefer two types of green), brown and black. use old t shirts. ALso, do ensure you have a helmet net to put your scrim on.

3. Wash basin .. where‘s the best place to keep it so it doesn‘t get trashed?
-What Korus said. Having said that, I personally don‘t the metal issued one. I use baby wipes to get rid of scrim and for other hygiene needs, I wet the end of a towel and scrub the needed parts. 
Also, you can get black collapsible wash basin. 

4. Is a shaving kit necessary on the weekend Ex‘s. Do they do inspection? 
-must stay clean. no inspection.

5. Camo paint -- I can‘t find the sticks (do we even get issued those in the Res?), is the other (i.e. commercial stuff) alright? 
-bug QM


----------



## Tyler (21 Apr 2003)

As for helmet scrim, get some. When things get close in dense brush, a bare helmet (or something similar) is all it takes to expose you. The helmet cover might be CADPAT but it is still very shiny.

Helmet nets should be standard issue and most QM‘s should have rolls of ‘hessian‘ (coloured rolls of burlap), get some of that if you can and don‘t use black. Tan, brown, and green will do.

Tyler


----------



## Tyler (21 Apr 2003)

Oh, one more thing.

If there is a Canadian Tire or camping supply place near you, get some stuff called "Camp Soap". It‘s green in colour, about $3.50, and comes in a squeeze bottle. By far it‘s the absolute best stuff to use when removing cam paint, nothing that I have used so far can beat it.


----------



## Stinky-Herbie (26 Apr 2003)

Heres two cents,
Pack light, freeze at night, on offensive....
on defensive, if you can truck it,you dont have to ruck it.
In my experience, going with the entire 64 pattern ruck is acceptable, (be prepared for the occasional hack for wearing it from the "jumpers")
then remind them that the ruck is only nicknamed "JumpRuck"and that everyone had them prior to the 82 pattern, I tell people I got mine from my dad when he was in the Navy, that usually curbs the comments.
My rule of thumb for the Fart sack is Biv Bag two halves and flanel liner for below 0 degrees celcius, and remove one half of the bag for above 0 degrees, this frees up room in the valise for extra socks and beef jerky.not to mention, smokes dont usually get crushed when surrounded by the sleeping bag.
Have fun, drink lots of water, and if you need to take a dump, dont put it off for porcelin,Find a tree and get rid of it, you will be warmer and healthier.


----------



## combat_medic (27 Apr 2003)

1. What about Gortex socks? When do you need ‘em?

When it‘s wet, or there‘s a good chance that it‘s gonna get that way. Here in Vancouver we should ALWAYS have them, as the only time it‘s dry is when you‘re indoors. Even if it doesn‘t rain, the ground is pretty soggy. Just use common sense on that one. 

2. Scrim ... do I need it? Where the heck do I get it (other than on CDNpeacekeeper.com)?

Never pay money for scrim. You can make it yourself in an afternoon, and every CQ carries around extra t-shirt bits and such for just that purpose.

3. Wash basin .. where‘s the best place to keep it so it doesn‘t get trashed?

At home!!! In my entire military career, I have NEVER EVER seen someone bring one (outside of being told to on basic training). Being in an infantry unit, everyone packs pretty light as you have to carry everything you‘re bringing. 

4. Is a shaving kit necessary on the weekend Ex‘s. Do they do inspection? 

Unless you want to get charged, bring it. Don‘t bring anything super high speed; just a disposable razor and some cream, a small mirror and baby wipes. 

5. Camo paint -- I can‘t find the sticks (do we even get issued those in the Res?), is the other (i.e. commercial stuff) alright? 

The sticks are AWFUL!!! You should get issued the tubes (1 brown, 1 black, 1 green) even in the Res. You may not get them in, say an artillery unit, or rear echlon units unless you‘re going on a particularily tactical ex.

As for wearing boots to bed, that‘s another common sense judgement call. If you‘re sitting right near your trench and have a pretty darned good idea that you‘re going to get bumped, then sleep so that you can be ready to fight within seconds. However, if you‘ve had the time to set up Mod tents, are completely non-tactical, and have hot and cold running water available; chances are you have time to take off and put on your boots at night. 

Yes, from a medical and comfort perspective it sucks to sleep in wet boots, and makes your feet feel crappy, but having a bullet in your head because you didn‘t get to your trench in time is a much poorer medical/comfort judgement call. Just like all kit choices you‘ve been asking about, ask yourself:

1. How far will I have to carry all this, and am I physically able and willing to do so?

2. Do I need this to survive? Can I make do without it?

3. Is there a better alternative?

4. Is this mission essential kit?

Example: a canteen cup can be used to shave in. You have to carry it anyway, it‘s mission essential, and you don‘t have to carry a huge, cumbersome wash basin.


----------



## Stinky-Herbie (27 Apr 2003)

Combat_Medic,
FYI, Artillery is a combat arms Trade, NOT a rear echelon trade, and Unless you have served as a medic with a field unit, and know for sure,What they can and cannot be issued, or how they operate, Maybe try using Field Amb as an example.
I am currently a serving Artilleryman, reg force and do not appreciate being misrepresented,especially by other trades.


----------



## Jarnhamar (27 Apr 2003)

But artillerymen are even father back from the frontlines than the medics    


(j/k)


----------



## Pugil (27 Apr 2003)

A small advice, if you on range exercises or any exercises that you know that youll just sit on your butt, you can bring as much as you can for you own comfort. You can even bring a laptop or even a radio to kill the time. But if you go on a long patrol ex where you have to carry your rucksack, you should pack only the essential, because the ammo and equipment needed for the mission will be distributed later. Also bring small treats that you can store in your pockets, they are energy booster.


----------



## combat_medic (27 Apr 2003)

M.A.W.: I spent quite a while with artilleryman, in Shilo last summer and on many courses, and they were the ones who told me that they don‘t bring cam with them, and almost never have it issued, unless they‘re going on an ex that‘s particularly tactical. 

I‘m sorry if you felt misrepresented. It was by no means my intent, but rather what all the artillerymen I know have told me.

And I‘ve spend my career serving with the infantry, so I know that the artillery is a combat arms unit. I also know that the point of camouflage in the artillery is to cam your position from the air. Short of infantry skills exes, I‘ve never seen or heard of an artilleryman camming their faces on a gun position.


----------



## humint (28 Apr 2003)

You can take a lot of useless cr@p with you -- that‘s for sure. I have found out (from Sgts and WOs with 25+ years experience in infantry) that half of my kit is useless (depending, of course, on the Ex and weather). 

1. The wash basin is useless. It‘s going with me on BOTP, but after that, I‘m using it to store marbles. Shaving is just as easy with your canteen cup. Plus, the basins all look like munched tinfoil after a day of rucking it.

2. The clothe liner for the sleeping bag is cr@p. It tears and bunches up. Yes, it helps to keep the bag clean -- but you can/should wash it down after every Ex anyway. The bivy bag is brilliant. If you expect to get bumped, use the bivy and the ranger blanket instead of the sleeping bag (if possible).  

3. Get rid of the air matress and get a foam one -- at least for winter to put some space between the frozen ground and your body. I‘ve found that, after conducting patrol for nearly 24 hours, I can sleep on rocks and a tree stump.

4. The caramel and apples dessert in the lunch IMP suck! 

5. Baby wipes instead of TP.

6. Bring lots of bungee cords and paracord.

7. Get a camel pack for patrolling.

8. The 82 frame (or whatever it‘s called) is heavy. I‘ll take it on course, but definitely invest in an Alice Pack or something lightweight for Exs. Also, load bearing vests are far better than webbing (much easier to throw your ruck on). However, I‘ve heard that we are all getting new packs and possibly vests in the next couple of years. It will probably take 10 for them to filter down to the Res units.

9. Always bring the Ranger blanket. It is far better than any sleeping bag. It is worth its weight in gold!

No doubt about it, one philosophy stands true: The lighter the better.


----------



## ProPatria05 (28 Apr 2003)

As sure as there are no atheists in foxholes, anyone who has spent the night looking up at the stars in -25C weather carries both sleeping bags in the winter.

No offense, but anyone who suggests otherwise has either (a) never done it, or (b) done it and froze. If you say otherwise, you LIE.


----------



## ArmyAl (28 Apr 2003)

Combat medic
Arty guy‘s do cam up, SOP in my unit, cam up, helmet and webbing worn at all times on the platform. We don‘t serve behind the lines all the time, we have Foo‘s that are attached with the tankers and inf. or are well ahead of the sharp end.
The gun‘s do move forward, and even up to the front, ex. No 1‘s open action, the gun is used like a rifle and you pick off targets in support of the attacking force, really reach out and touch someone, Sniping gun, the gun is hidden out of sight and is deployed like a sniper but with a bigger bang and a hasty retreat as after the 2nd rnd they‘ll know were you are, depending on how close the target is, but with a range of 14 klicks they may just hear you depending on the wind.
We do dig trench‘s for local D, if the gun line is camed but not the faces, kinda defeats the purpose, when a en. recce unit see‘s white face‘s popping out of no where.
One more, once we leave the gun‘s, well we turn into infantry, we do patrols and recce‘s as well, maybe not as eligant as an infantry unit but we can do it.
This is by no means me busting your chops, just giving you some info.


----------



## RCA (28 Apr 2003)

Combat medic

 Are your sure you were in Shilo. I was there last summer (and the summer before that and before that...) and we always cam. except for the safety bob. Outside the goldern trangle (guns and CP, it was hewlmet webbing helmet. Personal cam was put on before we left M101 and it didn‘t come off until we returned. 

 At the home unit its SOP. So you info is very suspect.


----------



## humint (28 Apr 2003)

I‘m not saying that the Ranger blanket replaces the sleeping bag, but rather that it is more versatile (i.e. when wet, etc). So, you definitely need to bring both (i.e. don‘t leave the blanket behind because you think the sleeping bags can do it all). 

Of course, I don‘t know from personal experience -- I‘m only repeating what I was told from the old guys in my Regiment. 

You can bet dollars for donuts that I was all toasty warm in my sleeping bag all weekend, and lovin it too!


----------



## combat_medic (28 Apr 2003)

RCA & ArmyAl: I can‘t speak much from personal experience, but the few gun positions I saw had them with no camp paint, and bush cap instead of helmet. When I asked them about this, they said they almost never wear cam paint on a gun position for all the reasons I mentioned before.

Either they were lying to me, or that was their SOP. Like I said, it‘s only what I saw and what I was told.


----------



## ArmyAl (28 Apr 2003)

By no means am I saying your a liar, you saw what you saw, we all know some units are weaker then others lol.
I cannot speak for other units, mine just happens to be the best LMAO.


----------



## combat_medic (28 Apr 2003)

HEY, what a coincidence... so is mine!!!


----------



## Korus (28 Apr 2003)

Yikes, my unit is the best too. Maybe we should all form up our own brigade, and leave the others in the dust.


----------



## Stinky-Herbie (28 Apr 2003)

Combat_medic,
As far as I can tell, you might have been on ex with a reserve unit,As a reg force artilleryman, I have never been to the field without campaint,
Washbasin, because yes we actually practice field hygeine...I have been tasked to assist reserve units before, and found they are less stringent
about Cam and concealement, than we are, perhaps so they can utilize the minimal time they have more effectivly on Gun Drills.....who can say...
As a matter of fact, when I spent time in the OP,
I was right in front with I39 and thats fairly close, Not to mention attached to an infantry platoon as part of a fighting patrol.Its amazing how easy it is for people to generalize,Because whether we are on the gunline, or in an OP party, the level of tactical prep is pretty much standard in my Regt.


----------



## humint (29 Apr 2003)

Any suggestions on where I can get a nice super-light weight, ultra high-speed ruck to replace the issued CF ruck? 

Are there any online stores that specialize in that stuff (other than CDN peacekeeper.com)? What are people currently using?


----------



## Pugil (29 Apr 2003)

Civvie rucks are the best out there. Their technology is always 10 years ahead of us. Some people of my unit have bought civvy rucksack to replace the issued one, others have bough bought the green version of the British bergen.


----------



## muskrat89 (29 Apr 2003)

LOL M.A.W - I think I found the opposite, in a way. We always used cam and concealment in 3 RCA. Webbing, rifle and helmet left at a certain spot on the gun platform. Bush caps OK depending on situation, or under the net. Medic - I spent a lot of years as TSM, so cam, concealment, local defense was a big part of my job. On the other hand, I probably had more ex‘s with the regs when I didn‘t necessarily wear cam - but only because sometimes our taskings weren‘t tactical. Especially when firing for the School, in support of certain courses, etc. I did quite a few courses, callouts, etc., with W Bty, and the School, over the years. All, in all, maybe you ran across some guys who came from a less stringent (slack)     Unit, or maybe they mis-spoke. I‘m sure, like anything, different Units stress different things, or are more proficient in some things, than others. I just wanted to agree with MAW, that it isn‘t the norm, even in the Reserves...
  :warstory:


----------



## Pikache (29 Apr 2003)

> 2. The clothe liner for the sleeping bag is cr@p. It tears and bunches up. Yes, it helps to keep the bag clean -- but you can/should wash it down after every Ex anyway. The bivy bag is brilliant. If you expect to get bumped, use the bivy and the ranger blanket instead of the sleeping bag (if possible).


-I don‘t find the liner crap. It works perfectly fine for me.
I air out, not wash sleeping bag. Apparently you are only suppose to dry clean the sleeping bag...



> 3. Get rid of the air matress and get a foam one -- at least for winter to put some space between the frozen ground and your body. I‘ve found that, after conducting patrol for nearly 24 hours, I can sleep on rocks and a tree stump.


-The issued air mattress works fine for me, even though mine doesn‘t inflate as much as it should. I‘ve never had problems in my winter ex of being cold.


----------



## humint (29 Apr 2003)

I find the foam mats easier to use and less bulky than the CF blow-up jobbies. As for the liner, I‘ve found that it really does get in the way. Now, I‘m comparing my very (in fact, I would call it extremely) limited CF experience to my more extensive civvie camping experience. But, after a 24 hours of patrolling, I know that I don‘t want to be fumbling around to make sure the liner is all straight and sh!t.


----------



## Pikache (29 Apr 2003)

Did you attach your liner to your sleeping bag?

There are hooks on your sleeping bag that you attach your liners to, so that the liner don‘t move around. (as much)


----------



## humint (30 Apr 2003)

Yep, I attached the liner. 

If the liner is to be used, I find it more effective to get into the liner first (which is not attached to the bags) and then into the sleeping bags, which are attached to each other. 

However, if I can get away without the liner, I will. 

I‘ve heard that the best way to solve the problem is to buy a after market fleece jobbie rather than the CF issued liner.

Any ideas on where to go to buy a good civvie or aftermarket high speed ruck? Stores? Online? Suggestions?


----------



## gk404 (30 Apr 2003)

humint, I would sugggest you check out  Mountain Equipment Co-op they‘ve got lots of great stuff, if you‘re don‘t mind making the trek in from Guelph the "bricks and mortar" store in on King St. W. Downtown.


----------



## Danjanou (1 May 2003)

If you‘re talking about the MEC store on King St. in Toronto, the neat thing about it‘s location is that there are several more similar stores in the immediate are (across the street, next door etc.) If you can‘t find what you need at one, then odds are it‘ll be at th next store.


----------



## humint (2 May 2003)

I looked at some of the rucks online and I can‘t find anything in OD green. Sure, inkblot blue looks nice in the store, but I doubt it‘s very tactical. 

And, the bags are great -- many are 6lbs or less. 

But, does the shape matter? Even if I get a OD green bag, does it also have the have the military look?


----------



## rolandstrong (20 May 2003)

I never got into lots of fancy kit items, but for those in potentially wet weather conditions, I would recommend Gore-Tex socks. A steep price tag (around $80), but what a difference for your feet. It‘s the one gucci item I take.


----------



## Pikache (20 May 2003)

Goretex socks?

That big green weird sock thing? Isn‘t that issued?


----------



## rolandstrong (21 May 2003)

No, these are actual gore-tex socks that go over your woolies in your boot. Ask at MEC at the boot/shoe section. They are a small but pricey item, but in wet weather they rule.


----------



## Pikache (21 May 2003)

I don‘t mean the new socks.

I mean those green weird sock looking thing that goes over socks. I think officially they are called ‘bootliner‘ or something.


----------



## rolandstrong (21 May 2003)

hmm. I didn‘t have those issued to me. I have my goretex from 10 years back. I guess I should chat to the QM.


----------



## Fader (21 May 2003)

Those goretex socks are awesome; they‘re the ones that are black and tight on the bottom, but big and floppy on the top with a velcro strap to synch it around your calves.  I love those things as much as I love the wool scarves.


----------



## Pikache (21 May 2003)

*thinks toque is more valuable than scarf*


----------



## Armymedic (24 May 2003)

Ref sleeping bag liner:

The "new cool thing" is the commercial fleece sleeping bag liners. They have zippers and occasionaly cords on the bottom to attach inside sleeping bags. People fing them warmer and more versitile then the issued liner. They are good for in the bag, alone when on the cot in the Biv or bunk if travelling.

I have, on one fall ex with 3 RCR, went out with just a ranger blanket (with full length zipper) and a fleece liner and biv bag outer in lieu of my sleeping bag. I was cool, but not uncomfortable...
I wouldn‘t suggest anyone to try not bringing atleast one part of thier sleeping bag without considering the risks...


----------



## Jarnhamar (25 May 2003)

I just got the new TAV as well as cadpat windpants, parka, jacket, sweatpants and top etc..
Great stuff but one again they seemed to have tinkered with the sizes a little. The new jackets, parkas and fleece tops seem to be a lot bigger then the olive drag ons of the same size.


----------



## Joel85 (25 May 2003)

So, you have the fleece CADPAT bottoms? Does that mean you‘re pretty much all equiped with CADPAT?


----------



## Jarnhamar (25 May 2003)

Yes top and bottom fleece. The cadtpat jacket and wind pants are pretty awesome, just too warm out to enjoy them.


----------



## timbit (2 Jun 2003)

I thought that the CF gave you all this stuff?
So do you have to go out and buy all this extra gear.


----------

