# IAP/BOTP Vs. BMQ



## Mast (13 Mar 2007)

Most people seem to be asking for imformation on what their upcoming BMQ will be like. I'm wondering what to expect for my IAP/BOTP. Are they fairly comparable for pt, weapons training, and first aid, etc or are the officer cadets expected to do more?


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## Disenchantedsailor (13 Mar 2007)

Indeed the officers are expected to do more,

the reg force write of qual for BOTC/IAP bypass is the CF PLQ (old JLC) that is taken usually after 4 or more years in trade. you can expect alot of material thrown at you, the most important is at the end you will have learned/honed the skills to LEAD others in combat, good luck with the course


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## kincanucks (13 Mar 2007)

How about doing a search and spend some time reading.  Officers are expected to work on their own and doing research to find answers to their questions.  Want to be spoon fed? Try McDonald's.


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## mudrecceman (14 Mar 2007)

Disenchantedsailor said:
			
		

> Indeed the officers are expected to do more,
> 
> *the reg force write of qual for BOTC/IAP bypass is the CF PLQ * (old JLC) that is taken usually after 4 or more years in trade. you can expect alot of material thrown at you, the most important is at the end you will have learned/*honed the skills to LEAD others in combat*, good luck with the course



Not sure where you are getting your info but it isn't correct.  Have you been to, or taught at, or known anyone who has gone thru CFLRS lately?

BOTC is broken into IAP/BOTP.  While most of the CFRs were given IAP bypass, not all were.  Some of the people who were on the BOTP serial last December were Snr NCO is Cmbt Arms units with training above and beyond PLQ, trust me.  I am not sure who and how they decide what each person gets for bypass from their PLAR, but there were folks who were Sgts and WOs that were on BOTP.  So they did not bypass BOTC, just the IAP portion.

Also, stating that at the end of IAP/BOTP you will have learned / honed the skills to LEAD others in combat is not even close to accurate.  They would have learned and been assessed in BASIC leadership tasks, but honed?

While not a complete lie, its definitely stretching the truth I am afraid...

They would have been taught, assessed and passed to the required standard would be more accurate.  

My 2 cents...


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## LittleMagellan (14 Mar 2007)

If you're done your JLC (or PLQ whatever it's called now) you don't have to do IAP but you DO have to do BOTP... only when you get to SM do you get a bypass of BOTP.
On my IAP course (summer 2006) there were many Cpls and a few MCpls who had only completed a few mods of their JLC course.
honed skills to lead others in combat is definitely stretching the truth... doing small party tasks such as building latrines and 3 rope bridges definitely does not prepare you to lead troops through the battlefield.  Even with the new and improved IAP/BOTP that now incorporate patrols/VCPs/UN style camps does not prepare you sufficiently... although that's why they call it BASIC training.  That's what the rest of the phase training is for.


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## Disenchantedsailor (14 Mar 2007)

I'll give you that Recceman, 
what they do is give you the basics, more so than a gmt would, and I was misleading about a BOTC bypass, (which from what I understand is done only for CQ Qual types right out of the RSM's mouth, he's doing a CFR right now) they do run a condensed course for WO and above. The IAP Bypass is given to all CF PLQ qual or equivilant mbrs (JLC/CLC/JR NCO)


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## mudrecceman (14 Mar 2007)

Well, not that this is all encompassing but...the CFLRS site info is:

BMQ:      http://www.cflrs.forces.gc.ca/site/soyez_prets/qmb_e.asp

IAP:        http://www.cflrs.forces.gc.ca/site/soyez_prets/pei_e.asp

BOTP:    http://www.cflrs.forces.gc.ca/site/soyez_prets/peeo_e.asp

Take note of the bottom part of each page, the Distribution of training by subject for a snapshot of the trng differences.

Not that this is the most up-to-date (someone already indicated that IAP is now 11 weeks), but the material taught/assessed is general described in the links.

My understanding before was if you were WO/PO1 qualified in your trade AND had ILQ, you would bypass both IAP/BOTP, but I know of one Inf WO who did BOTP, and is doing CAP and then his Phase (or whatever its called now...DP something or other).

So it looks like there is a "SOP" and not everyone falls into the SOP, so there are exceptions.  The guy I met had his Inf 3B and ILQ, and op experience but did BOTP.

"shrugs"

Who knows.   ;D


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## LittleMagellan (14 Mar 2007)

It probably also depends on who reviews the file too... sometimes there is no logical explanation.


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## Disenchantedsailor (14 Mar 2007)

They redid all the leader courses and whatnot and I guess decided the CWO/C1 course is the line, but hey thats just what the RSM said, and nobody says no Sir to the RSM, not even the Navy officers


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## aesop081 (14 Mar 2007)

We could go on like this all Night "well theres this guy.....yeah but then theres this other guy......."

is this going to go somewhere anytime soon ?

army.ca staff


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## Michael OLeary (14 Mar 2007)

Locked.  If anyone has recent actual experience with the matter at hand, ask a Mod to unlock if you wish to add something.  Further speculation is unnecessary.

Army.ca Staff


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