# Help! Confused! Recruiting Woes...Can Someone Please Explain this to Me??



## LowEndTorque (29 Mar 2011)

I put my application in several weeks ago applying as a DEO. I have a Master’s Degree in History and Bachelor’s in Political Science, was born in Canada, I am a proud and patriotic Canadian Citizen, lived here my entire life since birth etc.,  so I know I meet the requirements for DEO.  

I listed Logistics, Aerospace Control and Intelligence as my trade choices. ( I knew going in that Intelligence was basically impossible, but I just put it on the application for the heck of it because there wasn’t really a third choice I was interested in.) 

Today I received a phone call from the Recruiter handling my application. He said that the trade (note: he said “trade” singular not plural, even though I applied for 3) that I was interested in was for “skilled” applicants only, meaning they only hired people who are existing CF members. He asked me if there are any other trades I’m interested in because if not, he would just close my application. 

I then told him that I had in fact listed three trades on my application, not just one. He seemed surprised and disoriented about this and fumbled around over the phone for my application. He then replied “Oh  yes, I see you also listed Logistics and Aerospace Control. Well... those trades are also only for “skilled” existing CF members so you have to pick something else or I'm gonna close your application” ….

I was very surprised by this remark. I already knew after several sessions of speaking with recruiters that they only accepted "skilled" existing CF member applicants for Intelligence. But according to the recruiters I had spoken to before, Logistics and Aerospace Control were open to new applicants. In fact Log and AC were the two specific trades that two other different recruiters explicity suggested that I should apply for! It seems strange that now they are suddenly only open to "skilled" existing CF members...

Is this true? Do they only train people as Log or AC officers if they are “skilled” and existing members of the CF??? I know several people who went into these trades straight out of University as DEO’s so the recruiters comments sounded very strange to me….. I’m not in any way accusing this recruiter of anything. It could very well just be my own ignorance/stupidity. But in the pit of my stomach I got the feeling that he was just in a rush to close my application for whatever reason! 

Anyways I then asked him what if I change my application from full time to Reserves? He then told me to call the head of each unit of the Reserves (intelligence, Logistics, Aerospace Control) and ask them if they are hiring. He gave me three phone numbers to call with the names of different officers. 

Apparently, I am to call and ask each of these officers if they are hiring in their respective trades.  If I get an answer from these officers that they are indeed hiring, I am to fill out a new application “at the Reserves” (he didn’t even tell me where to go to fill this application with them) then bring it back to him at the recruiting center….

I don’t know all this seems very strange especially given all the information I’ve been gathering for months from recruiters and friends/contacts who are in the service. Can anyone shed light on this?


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## Sigil (29 Mar 2011)

Seems wrong to me. You don't have an ideal degree for Log (not sure about AEC) but I believe it's still acceptable. Maybe double check with another recruiter? Those trades might be closed to DEO and are only open to CT/OT...or maybe it was a simple mistake.


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## agc (29 Mar 2011)

There are a number of occupations that will not be accepting new applicants this year, but will consider someone with former service who is fully trained and qualified.  It looks as though you've made a clean sweep in that department.  If Log is your dream job, stick it out (could be a year, could be more).  If you're just looking for a job, you might want to stop in and see your recruiters to discuss your other options in the near future.


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## LowEndTorque (29 Mar 2011)

^ thanks for the replies.

I've been looking around this forum since posting the thread and this appears to be a case of me just being ignorant and uninformed about the current situation with hiring. I wasn't aware that there was such a decrease in the hiring and a scarcity in the number of positions available lately. Seems like what used to be a rather large window of opportunity in the CF may be closed for now. Sucks for me because I was ready to pour my heart and soul into this, but them's the breaks I guess. 

When I spoke to one recruiter during another sessions, they informed me that no applications would be reviewed until April 1. I asked them which trades would be hiring/open when the April 1st round of applications was reviewed. 

They listed all of the trades that were "projected" to be hiring. We had a lengthy discussion about the trades that were projected to be hiring, which of those trades were a match for my degree, and settled on Log and AC. My "dream" job would be as an INT O but that's obviously never going to happen so I settled for the ones that I thought were available. It was just a bit jarring when I received the phone call today since I had already had a very long and detailed discussion with another recruiter about these trades.


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## dangles (30 Mar 2011)

LowEndTorque said:
			
		

> ^ thanks for the replies.
> 
> I've been looking around this forum since posting the thread and this appears to be a case of me just being ignorant and uninformed about the current situation with hiring. I wasn't aware that there was such a decrease in the hiring and a scarcity in the number of positions available lately. Seems like what used to be a rather large window of opportunity in the CF may be closed for now. Sucks for me because I was ready to pour my heart and soul into this, but them's the breaks I guess.
> 
> ...



You speak as if you could never be an Int O...why? You have a suitable degree for it, at a Master's degree level even. Although it is oversubscribed for a couple years, you could still join up as an NCM [they like people from the Combat Arms] and then transfer to Int O [although this poses it's own problems]. But why give up so easily on your 'dream' job? Anyways like agc said just stick it out, if you want it bad enough anything can happen. :2c:


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## Delaney1986 (30 Mar 2011)

Hello,

     I agree with dangles. Don't give up on it if that is your dream. You can either wait until the trade opens or join a trade you think you would enjoy and hope that you can OT one day, the military isn't going anywhere anytime soon. I was in your same position when I went to the recruiting centre a couple of weeks ago. I have a degree in Military History and a minor in Political Science. The recruiter essentially told me that because so many trades are oversaturated right now that even if I applied for something like Log O and it was opening I would not be as competitive because I don't have the ideal degree(he stressed that "not ideal" did not mean undesirable but that meriting is competitive). It isn't opening (from what I was told) so I guess that is a moot point, but we are getting the same information.

     Us History and Political Science people have degrees that work well with Infantry, Armoured, Artillery and Intelligence. If you are like me, I am not hardcore enough to be Infantry, have no interest in Artillery and my husband tells me Armoured is "his" trade, lol. (Secretly I think he just wouldn't want to salute his Mrs.  >), and they don't like taking Intelligence off the street. So I was willing to take my chances and go NCM in a trade that interested me (Ammo Tech), which is not opening either. So I had bad luck this year and so did you but if this is something you want to you wait for find a way to make it happen or wait it out. I have wanted to be in the military or do police work my entire life so I chose to go back to school starting September for Criminology and try the MP route in a couple of years.

   That's my story/advice as a fellow recruit wannabe. I wish you luck, hang in there!


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## Pusser (31 Mar 2011)

The reason the Intelligence Branch likes to recruit from within is that they want their officers to have some credible experience in the operational aspects of the modern battlefield.  Unless he's Patton, no modern field commander is that interested in how Napolean conducted the battle at Austerlitz, unless it can be put into the context of operations today.  This is not to say that a knowledge of history is unimportant (as a History major, I would NEVER say that), but without modern experience to compare it to, it's most useful application is to win bets in the bar.  Therefore, unless you speak five middle-eastern languages fluently, I would say that your desire to be an Intelligence Officer will have to wait, but that doesn't mean it's unattainable.  Even a Log Officer can switch to Int a few years down the road.

I'm surprised that the recruiter was trying to close your file altogether.  Although Log may be closed to DEO at the moment, that will change in near future.  Log is the largest branch the CF and needs to continuously recruit from all sources.  Your degrees are not the "desirable" ones, but they certainly fall within the "acceptable" ones.  I'm a Log O with a history degree.  The reality is that we will teach you what you need to know.  We don't expect your to arrive with a full understanding of our business processes.


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## kemp (8 Apr 2011)

Here is the current situation for the Regular Force DEO occupations you are interested in: AEC has limited positions (2) for skilled applicants only, LOG is closed and INT is closed.

The better Officer occupation options at this time, based on availability, are ARMD and INF as both have limited openings.  If interested, you can discuss these occupations with the CFRC.

Your History degree is "acceptable" for INT, LOG, AEC, INF and ARMD, but not one of the "ideal" degrees recognized for those occupations.  Your Political Science degree is "ideal" for INT and "acceptable" for LOG, AEC, ARMD and INF.

Plan A is to consider ARMD and INF and update your application with the CFRC if you wish, or keep your current choices and wait it out - checking in with the CFRC every few months to see if there are any openings.

Plan B is to consider joining the Reserves part-time.  There are INT and LOG positions with the Naval and Army Reserve.  You would need to contact them to discuss openings.  You do not have to submit a new application to the CFRC if you go this route.  If the Reserve unit has an opening, they would provide a specific referral to the CFRC and you would have to update your application with the CFRC to reflect your component change to Reserve vice Regular Force and specific occupation choice.  Down the road, maybe you component transfer from the Reserves to the Regular Force.


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## dangles (9 Apr 2011)

kemp said:
			
		

> Your History degree is "acceptable" for INT, LOG, AEC, INF and ARMD, _but not one of the "ideal" degrees recognized for those occupation._  Your Political Science degree is "ideal" for INT and "acceptable" for LOG, AEC, ARMD and INF.



I checked the www.forces.ca website for both INF and ARMD and they do not state what degree is "ideal". I am assuming by your above post that you are somewhat in the know, so could you please elaborate as to which degrees are ideal for INF and ARMD Officers?


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## ModlrMike (9 Apr 2011)

Without going into details I don't have a full grasp of, I hear that NavRes IntO is going to be reorganized. My understanding is that History and PolSci will be of significant value after this reorganization. Unfortunately I can't be more specific without breaching OPSEC.

Going NavRes IntO might allow for easier transition to RegF IntO later.


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