# What a find!!!



## Brockvegas (18 Sep 2007)

Well, my wife and I were at her parent's house for dinner tonight, when I happened across a bag belonging to her late grandfather, an Artilleryman in the Second World War. Being the type of guy I am, I asked her father if he would mind me taking a peek inside the bag, of course he said yes. He had been through the bag years ago, but not knowing much about militaria, he was eager to have me shed some light on a few items he was unsure of.

Inside the bag were some of his father's equipment (leg wrap, bracers, a few belt bags, appaulettes (he recieved a field commision to the rank of Lieutenant), a letter sent to him by a friend back home, his wedge cap, a patch from his tunic (6 RCA) etc..) as well as a few treasures that were obviously "liberated" from german soldiers (shoulder flashes, Iron Cross pin, a few SS patches -one with actual silver thread, and marked with a "2" next to the SS insignia-, a rather unwieldly large bayonet, and a LIVE GERMAN 20MMX82 HIGH EXPLOSIVE INCENDIARY TRACER ROUND (115g projectile) still in it's steel link, leading me to believe it was from a MG 150/20 Flak Cannon!!!

My father-in-law had assumed it was a dummy round and thought nothing of it, I (judging by the fairly balanced weight between the projectile and casing) decided to give it a gentle shake, and low and behold--- you could hear the powder shifting inside the casing. He couldn't believe it!

I thought that was a pretty interesting find, especially since I get sworn in tomorrow at 13:00. (quite a coincidence that the man who brought this home trained for their beach landing in Normandy not 10km from where I'm typing this right now)


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## armyvern (18 Sep 2007)

And just what response team did you call in to deal with that live find??

Reminds me of the time this little kid in Germany found a live _treasure_ down by the river winding by our little town ... cost him his hand; he's damn lucky it didn't cost him his life. *Old = Unstable*.

Please do not tell me that you've still got it hanging around and didn't take any action about it ... that's not the smartest call ...


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## 1feral1 (18 Sep 2007)

How about taking some pics of these treasures and showing us?

Don't drop the 20mm  :warstory:.

Are you sure its HE-T and not just T? if it was just T, I would not worry too much, but anything HE, well, I've seen what 25mm can do at the pointy end (for real), and its quiet effective.
Cheers,

Wes


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## larry Strong (18 Sep 2007)

Interesting find. I would be interested in photo's of the "bring back" militaria


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## mysteriousmind (18 Sep 2007)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> Reminds me of the time this little kid in Germany found a live _treasure_ down by the river winding by our little town ... cost him his hand; he's damn lucky it didn't cost him his life. *Old = Unstable*.



Vern did that happen in Langenwinkel?? It rings a bell...but its quite unclear in my head


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## armyvern (18 Sep 2007)

mysteriousmind said:
			
		

> Vern did that happen in Langenwinkel?? It rings a bell...but its quite unclear in my head



Yep. Right out back of the soccer pitch before you hit the quarry.


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## geo (18 Sep 2007)

> The FlaK30/38 and FlaKvierling were issued many types of ammunition, but for anti-aircraft duty they used the high-explosive, tracer, self-destructing (HE/T/SD) 20mm round.  Most were also issued armor-piercing tracer rounds (AP/T) and armor-piercing super-velocity panzergranate 40 (Pzgr.40 or APSV.40) rounds with tungsten cores.



I hope you recommended the right thing to do to the nice gentleman... get rid of it!  Call the police & have them get someone to pick it up.


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## Brockvegas (18 Sep 2007)

Well, we live in a town with an Armoury, (Brockville Rifles), so I told him at the very least he should get in contact with someone there to get a more INFORMED opinion than mine. I know quite a bit about firearms and ammunition, but 60yr old German anti-aircraft rounds are not my specialty.

If it's dangerous he'll obviously do the right thing and have it destroyed, but if it's not he would like to keep it (his father did truck it halfway around the world).

_PS- I'll get some pics of it and post them, maybe someone on here will recognize it too._


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## Old Sweat (18 Sep 2007)

Live ammunition is always dangerous. For Pete's sakes, tell him to phone the police now and report it.


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## armyvern (18 Sep 2007)

Brockvegas said:
			
		

> _PS- I'll get some pics of it and post them, maybe someone on here will recognize it too._



Don't bother ... I'll take it DOWN.

We do not need pics on here of unsafe, unreported, rounds hanging around in someone's basement like it were normal and OK.

To re-itterate the last bit of advice given you in the last response (and at least 3 times already in this thread):

Report it NOW!!!

 :brickwall: 

Cripes almighty.


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## Rusty_Poth (18 Sep 2007)

Something tells me Vern wants you to report this "find"


Me would be calling someone, can you have someone "unload" the nasty stuff from inside? and then you would be able to display it.


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## geo (18 Sep 2007)

Hmph,  if you ask me, the ammo tech will look at the thing and take it away for disposal.
They will make no attempt to dissarm the 20mm round.  
Incendiary & tracer = magnesium + phospherous
HE = bang - no fingers left...

Rusty - no point in giving the fella false hopes.


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## Kat Stevens (18 Sep 2007)

ArmyVern said:
			
		

> Don't bother ... I'll take it DOWN.
> 
> We do not need pics on here of unsafe, unreported, rounds hanging around in someone's basement like it were normal and OK.
> 
> ...



So we're going to take down every picture of anything unsafe, then?  There go all the assless chap pictures, Vern.   I think he gets it, report the stupid thing, but where's the harm in a picture of a vintage piece of ordnance?  If anyone on this site really thinks it's okay to hang on to old ammo, well, that's just more fodder for Darwin's theory, no?


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## Rusty_Poth (18 Sep 2007)

geo said:
			
		

> Hmph,  if you ask me, the ammo tech will look at the thing and take it away for disposal.
> They will make no attempt to dissarm the 20mm round.
> Incendiary & tracer = magnesium + phospherous
> HE = bang - no fingers left...
> ...



True enough but I am sure it can be disabled in some way.


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## 1feral1 (18 Sep 2007)

Rusty_Poth said:
			
		

> True enough but I am sure it can be disabled in some way.



No it can't, and only an idiot would try.



Wes


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## Rusty_Poth (18 Sep 2007)

You guys don't think I meant that the individual do it himself?????

God no! I amy not be pretty but I am not that stupid......

That's not what I was meaning. If it is under the right conditions and controlled it can be disabled.


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## allgss (18 Sep 2007)

Brockvegas said:
			
		

> a few SS patches -one with actual silver thread, and marked with a "2" next to the SS insignia-,



The SS 2 tab is worth a substantial amount of money so if you do in the future sell it do not sell it cheap
cheers
Gary


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## 1feral1 (18 Sep 2007)

Rusty_Poth said:
			
		

> You guys don't think I meant that the individual do it himself?????
> 
> God no! I amy not be pretty but I am not that stupid......
> 
> ...



No it cannot, and no professional would even risk it. The rd is almost 70 yrs old!


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## Yrys (18 Sep 2007)

Small hijack of the principal subject of the thread



			
				allgss said:
			
		

> The SS 2 tab is worth a substantial amount of money so if you do in the future sell it do not sell it cheap



To keep it in the family, I understand. To sell it, except to an organization (one not pronazi) for  display
and education on WWII, I would not.

I may be prejudice against Nazi, but it's a prejudiced that I'm proud of. And I presume there is some collectors of
WWII memorabilia (correct word ?) out there that won't understand that.


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## PO2FinClk (18 Sep 2007)

As far as the round is concerned, best to follow the advice above to have it properly disposed of.

As for the rest of it, I doubt any current serving member at any Armoury are well positioned, or qualified, to attribute the proper historical value of the items found. Remember that they serve in the present (like most of us do) and not military historians. 

Rather contact a Military museum as they would undoubtedly be able to detail each item, its history and also how to preserve these items. Exposure to humidity, light etc can seriously damage such items. Besides, there is no better place then a Military Museum to ensure the history of these items are maintained for future generations and not lost in a basement.

Borden Military Museum: http://ipmslondon.tripod.com/museumreviews/id17.html (Unsure if there is another one closer to Brockville)

Listing of WW2 German Patches: http://www.epier.com/store/outpostflags/Category.asp?cat=3835 Maybe point to the one which most resembles it.


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## Rusty_Poth (18 Sep 2007)

Okay believe it or not I do get it.

Jeeze.............


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## dapaterson (18 Sep 2007)

PO2FinClk said:
			
		

> As for the rest of it, I doubt any current serving member at any Armoury are well positioned, or qualified, to attribute the proper historical value of the items found. Remember that they serve in the present (like most of us do) and not military historians.
> 
> Rather contact a Military museum as they would undoubtedly be able to detail each item, its history and also how to preserve these items. Exposure to humidity, light etc can seriously damage such items. Besides, there is no better place then a Military Museum to ensure the history of these items are maintained for future generations and not lost in a basement.
> 
> ...



Rumour has it there's a military museum in Ottawa


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## AmmoTech90 (18 Sep 2007)

Was going to reply and address the some of the points, but it's all been covered before in this and other posts.

Contact the RCMP/OPP/local cops and tell them that you have found some military ordnance from the Second World War and that you would like a military EOD team to come take it away.  Take a nice picture of it and use that as a memory.  Don't handle it anymore if it is in a safe spot (ie no kids or chance of it being disturbed).
Remember kids can and do get anywhere, if it is kept in a house they will find it eventually, play with it, and get hurt or killed.  Now that will be a memory that can be cherished... 

EOC


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## Fishbone Jones (18 Sep 2007)

..........and I think that can be the final word on this. Usual caveats.

Milnet.ca Staff


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