# What your surgeon says VS your actual condition-Knee Related..Med Tech opinion?



## stabmasterarson (30 Dec 2009)

Hey guys, I'm going a bit crazy,  I have 2 weeks off here at christmas and my mind is racing a bit. 

I'm trying to become a stoker. I got my ACL reconstructed (hamstring graft) at the end of August. I applied to the forces in October, got in for my testing and part 1 medical at the end of November. The medical tech wanted me to take my part 2 a week later. I told her that I had a recent knee surgery and had to see my surgeon on December 16. She told me to wait on the part 2 medical and get the surgeon to fill out 2 forms regarding my condition, a request for release of medical information and a generic task statement for the CF. I was to come back in early January and get my part 2 and an interview at the same time.

My surgeon, on the consultation, was extremely happy with my rate of healing, and told me that I could sprint (come to a gradual stop though), run a marathon if I liked, squat heavy (not past 90 degrees), I just had to stay away from football, hockey, kickboxing, tennis, anything that had me changing direction really fast and explosively. This is funny because as part of my physio I have been doing jumping squats and other plyometrics from 8 weeks after surgery.  He filled out my form, and the prognosis for full recovery was excellent, and risk of recurrence minimal. 

The problem is, he said that I can restore full activity _by June 2010_, including PT. As of right now, I can do everything in PT testing with regard to hiking and running, except for the beep test, with the sprinting to a dead stop (not allowed, but could probably do it). I have another appointment in February, where I expect for the surgeon to give me the OK on that. Otherwise every PT related requirement I can find, I can meet (and exceed) right now.

This surgeon is really, really conservative in his treatment. I wasn't allowed to walk without crutches for 6 weeks after the surgery for example. I found online with the same type of hamstring graft surgery, most people would be walking with full weight bearing within 2 weeks of surgery. 

What I'm asking is, do the CF take the surgeon's word as law on these type of things, or do they make their own assesments? I don't want to miss the March 31 deadline, because for all I know the stoker trade may be full for 2010 and I'm not interested in anything else.

sorry about the long post, I searched and couldn't find anything similar to my situation previously discussed.


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## Eye In The Sky (30 Dec 2009)

First off, I am not a Med Tech but I've been around a few years so...I'll give you my opinion:

1.  The MO who looks at your file will likely go off what a qualified Doctor writes in the letter.  Afterall, he is a Dr.

2.  If you think you are farther ahead than the Dr is, speak to him/her about it.  In the end, if you don't heed his/her treatment outline and re-injure yourself further, you'll be waiting longer than June 2010 I'd bet.

3.  The CF establishes recuiting targets for each trade (commonly called the SIP, Structured Intake Plan) yearly based on our fiscal year, which runs from 01 Apr - 31 Mar annually.  So that means, starting 01 Apr, the new SIP will come into play.  Currently, the CF is entering the last quarter of its FY, and alot of trades that are closed now may/will open up again with the new SIP numbers being the ones the recruiting folks will have to play with.

In my opinion, listen to what the Dr says.  Better safe than sorry, but speak to him/her about it and maybe they will reassess  you.  

You yourself are the one that said...



> I can do everything in PT testing with regard to hiking and running, except for the beep test, with the sprinting to a dead stop (not allowed, but could probably do it)



Lets "worst case scenario" this for you.  You aren't ready for the 20 MSR (beep test), which you WILL do at BMQ during Week 0.  You injure yourself, failing the test, and land in PAT platoon for X amount of time.  Or, you injure yourself but it permament, and get released from the CF.  From that perspective, I say go with what your Dr says, full stop.  

I could also be wrong but...I don't know of people breaking the doors down at the CFRCs to become a stoker..but I could be wrong, and it certainly wouldn't be the first time I was.   ;D

Lastly,  I'd say that what your surgeon says IS your actual condition.   :nod:

 :2c:


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## Armymedic (4 Jan 2010)

Trust your surgeon. He saw your ligaments, he know their condition.

And you only have 2 knees...having a total knee replacement is not conducive to entering the CF.

And yes, the CF will take your surgeon's word as gospel.


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## REDinstaller (4 Jan 2010)

Stabmasterson,

From what your profile says you are 35. This type of injury no matter what procedure has taken place to correct it, will get worse with age. With the present length of contracts being 25 yrs full term, I don't think its wise to push the limits and blow your knee out again, and risk a Medical Release. My wife VR'd after a car accident where she got 2 fractured vertabre. Now she has 3 herniated disks in the same area, and she doesn't like following DR's orders too well and she wonders why her back is still bothering her. Just wait it out, time is your knees friend.


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## chrisf (4 Jan 2010)

Let me tell you a story...

I taught a troop on BMQ. Prior to BMQ, he'd injured his knee. Had surgery on said knee. A month later (with the surgeons clearance, though to be honest, in retrospect, I question the surgeon that gave him clearance). A week later, I was in a hospital ER with said troop, who's knee now bent backwards. Moral of the story, listen to your surgeon. If he's conservative in his healing estimates, there's a reason.

(In case anyone is wondering, last I heard, this individual was still in the forces, and giving BMQ another go)


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## Nauticus (4 Jan 2010)

Your surgeon is more qualified than you are. Just saying.


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## stabmasterarson (4 Jan 2010)

Tango18A said:
			
		

> Stabmasterson,
> 
> From what your profile says you are 35. This type of injury no matter what procedure has taken place to correct it, will get worse with age. With the present length of contracts being 25 yrs full term, I don't think its wise to push the limits and blow your knee out again, and risk a Medical Release. My wife VR'd after a car accident where she got 2 fractured vertabre. Now she has 3 herniated disks in the same area, and she doesn't like following DR's orders too well and she wonders why her back is still bothering her. Just wait it out, time is your knees friend.



The 25 year full term issue is one that I'm worried about. If I can make a career out of the forces I would like to. I am afraid, if I have to wait until June to get a job offer, that I may turn 36 (november)by the time I am officially commissioned and not be eligible for a pension. If you pay into your pension for a bunch of years, does it disappear if you don't serve for the full term?


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## George Wallace (4 Jan 2010)

You would get a "Return of Contributions" if you Released.


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## aesop081 (4 Jan 2010)

George Wallace said:
			
		

> You would get a "Return of Contributions" if you Released.



Not necessarily....not anymore.

From :   http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/dgcb-dgras/ps/pen/reg-01/welcome-bienvenu-eng.asp



> ■different options if you leave the CF before you are eligible for an immediate pension:
> •transfer the value of your pension to a locked-in retirement vehicle, to use for retirement income when you are ready to retire; or
> •leave your pension in the pension fund – often called deferring your pension – until you reach an age when you are eligible to receive a pension.


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## Lil_T (4 Jan 2010)

stabmasterson;

In feel for your situation, I do, but please for your own sake, wait until you are 100%.  That means that you can properly perform the CF Expres test (all components), the BFT, and all the other physically demanding activities you'll perform during your course.  Drill, especially, if you have bad knees can be brutal. 

Listen to your surgeon, and physiotherapist if you have one. You'll be that much better off in the end.


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## Ksiiqtaboo (4 Jan 2010)

i feel you as well listen to what the doc has to say... when i played rugby in high school and partially tore my acl my doc said not to play but i was walking fine so i decided to go and play and just did more damage then good... your doc knows best like someone said if you think you are further along than expected go see the doctor and he will re evaluate everything..


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## REDinstaller (4 Jan 2010)

Stabmasterson,

Reference CRA, they will do an adjusted calculation based upon your age. One of my clerks will retire before she hits 20 yrs due to CRA. Your Clerks when you get to either St. Jean or your first unit will outline your pension and employment details due to your age upon enrolement.


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## stabmasterarson (5 Jan 2010)

thanks for the replies

I tried to contact the med tech and recruiting officer in charge of my file today but had no luck. I'll keep trying to get a hold of them and see what they say when I do. It just sucks when you feel good but are held back. I guess if it's meant to happen it will, in the meanwhile I will get myself back into fighting shape. Worst case scenario, I don't get in the navy in the job that I want, but I'll have a sixpack and be able to train mixed martial arts again, just not so hard. ;D


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## FastEddy (5 Jan 2010)

stabmasterarson said:
			
		

> thanks for the replies
> 
> I tried to contact the med tech and recruiting officer in charge of my file today but had no luck. I'll keep trying to get a hold of them and see what they say when I do. It just sucks when you feel good but are held back. I guess if it's meant to happen it will, in the meanwhile I will get myself back into fighting shape. Worst case scenario, I don't get in the navy in the job that I want, but I'll have a sixpack and be able to train mixed martial arts again, just not so hard. ;D




You appear to be quite en thustactic about the CF and a specific trade now and probely some time before.

Just a question, Re; Age, Pensions, Limits, why did you leave enlistment to a later date in life.

Cheers.


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## stabmasterarson (5 Jan 2010)

I honestly never thought seriously about the military until a few months ago. I always assumed the pay and lifestyle were things I couldn't handle. I just got tired of the rat race in a serious way and wanted a change. When I looked into the CF I found a job that I really want to do, and was able to convince my family that it wasn't a bad idea. After 4 years the money is decent, and I could have a career that I don't have to worry about being laid off for no other reason than the company didn't experience 20% growth in their last fiscal year.

I've always been  motivated and I thrive on achieving goals and testing myself. I figure those traits would serve me well in the navy. I do have a temper though and I'm sure haven't had to put up with all the abuse and whatnot I'm going to face if I make it in, but I've worked in construction for years so I could probably handle it.


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## Fishbone Jones (5 Jan 2010)

Good luck. Come back and let us know when you're off to training.

Milnet.ca Staff


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