# General Infantry Questions



## Kev T (26 Oct 2005)

Hi, 

I'm transferring from reserves to PPCLI and I've got a few general questions on the infantry. Hope someone can help me out.

1. Would anybody be able to outline in detail the material covered in SQ and BIQ (the DND website is kind of vague and I can't find the answers on this site)? 

2. Are the new SQ and BIQ courses better than the old QL3 Infantry Battle School especially since BIQ is 10 weeks and the old QL3 was 16 weeks and is the same material covered as in the QL3 or is there more or less?

3. Can anyone outline some of the major changes that have happened, are happening, or are planned to happen in the Infantry especially the light battalions with regards to CF Transformation (I've heard a lot of differing stories/misconceptions from people, the news, internet, etc)? Seems like some major exciting changes are being made to the CF - if someone could also outline the major changes in the Army in general and CF for that matter it would be great i.e. new equipment, training, etc.

4. This may seem like a weird one but it's one that I've been itching to ask for a long while and have never really received a definite answer from anyone I've asked in the reserves so I may as well ask here - is there an actual recognized jungle warfare course or desert warfare course in the Canadian Army? I remember hearing something in the news a while back regarding South America but it wasn't definite. I know there are arctic, mountain, and urban courses but am unsure about jungle and desert. 

Thank you for your help.


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## paracowboy (27 Oct 2005)

> Would anybody be able to outline in detail the material covered in SQ and BIQ (the DND website is kind of vague and I can't find the answers on this site


do you really think it's a good idea to put exactly how we train our soldiers on open websites?


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## darmil (27 Oct 2005)

I think the PPCLI Battle school  was better it thinned out the weak :bullet:


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## Dog (27 Oct 2005)

Just a quick note on BIQ:

During my interview, I was told that BIQ was going to be repackaged as an 11-week course starting in January 2006.


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## Dirt Digger (27 Oct 2005)

Kev T said:
			
		

> 4. This may seem like a weird one but it's one that I've been itching to ask for a long while and have never really received a definite answer from anyone I've asked in the reserves so I may as well ask here - is there an actual recognized jungle warfare course or desert warfare course in the Canadian Army? I remember hearing something in the news a while back regarding South America but it wasn't definite. I know there are arctic, mountain, and urban courses but am unsure about jungle and desert.



The only *regular* opportunities for jungle or desert that I've seen come with a posting to CFSSAT as a SERE Instructor.  However, these slots are few and far between because they're piggybacked on foreign courses.  The ones that I remember included Brit AF desert in California, Brit AF jungle in Belize and Aussie jungle outside of Townsville.

Currently CFFSAT has 2 Sgt billets from the infantry...historically 2 PPCLI has filled them, but with the move to Shilo that may change in the future.  2 PPCLI also provides the enemy force for SERE training exercises.


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## Kev T (27 Oct 2005)

paracowboy said:
			
		

> do you really think it's a good idea to put exactly how we train our soldiers on open websites?



Now that you mention it it probably isn't a good idea but the British Army's website does it. I'm not talking about really the nitty gritty details but more like, for example, what weapons are covered during SQ and BIQ, if there is any OBUA training on BIQ, etc - that sort of stuff. If that is risk to security then I can understand. Interesting to hear that it may be 11 weeks long though.


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## Jimmy_D (10 Mar 2006)

a lil info for you, if you are transfering from reserve to the regs. make sure you have copies of all the training that you have done as a res. most likely you will be givin an sq bypass but you will have to do battle school in waighnright.


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## George Wallace (10 Mar 2006)

I notice you can't spell and seem to be giving a lot of advice for a fellow who is still on SQ.


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## Kev T (10 Mar 2006)

Well just at little update. My transfer finally went through and I'm taking off on 30 March. I had originally requested my preferred regiment to be PPCLI, however, CFRC has given me a job offer that says that I'll be going to the RCR instead. The recruiter said that there isn't any way that I could get out of it and there really isn't any point to wait for another job offer from the PPCLI because it probably won't happen for a very long time. Apparently all the new guys are being sent to the RCR because there are no vacancies for the PPCLI. I'm not sure why but I have a pretty good feeling that it's because 3 RCR just lost a company to form the first DA coy of the new unit. 120 troops is a big chunk out of a battalion so I presume that all the new guys are being sent to Petawawa to replenish 3 RCR. Not sure but I wouldn't be surprised. I remember seeing that video on Army News about the new unit and had a feeling that this would happen. Hopefully it all works out.


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## SeanPaul_031 (11 Mar 2006)

When you get to battle school, write a memo stating that you want a re-badge to the PPCLI. Acouple guys in my DP1 are doing it and its going through


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## Armymedic (11 Mar 2006)

Kev T,
I am working at the other end. From what I understand, for the next 18 months, almost every newly qualifed infantryman will be coming into 3 RCR.

The plus on this is if you are intersting in getting a jump course....thats the place to be.


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## Kev T (11 Mar 2006)

Actually I wouldn't mind going to 3 RCR just for that reason. I mean a light battalion is where I want to be and even if I did get PPCLI there's no guarantee that I'll get 3 PPCLI. Personally I would rather be in 3 RCR than 2 PPCLI or even 1 PPCLI - even if it is in Edmonton - simply for the fact that I want to be in a light battalion; my goal of being in a light battalion is greater than being in whatever regiment. Since my chances of getting 3 RCR seem to be pretty good right now I'll probably stick with my job offer. We'll see what happens when I get to battle school.


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## GO!!! (12 Mar 2006)

Kev T

Why are you so hot and horny to get into a Light Bn?

What is the attraction? 

I ask because I'm in one, and we have a horrible attrition problem, which says to me that troops coming to us don't know what to expect. What do you think it is going to be like in a light unit, and why is this preferable to a mechanised one?

(I'm not picking on you, I really want to know!!)


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## Sh0rtbUs (12 Mar 2006)

GO!!! said:
			
		

> Kev T
> 
> Why are you so hot and horny to get into a Light Bn?
> 
> ...



Well, I'll give my .02 seeing as I'm in a similar position. 

First off, I see 3 Bn, and only 1 is Light. Off the bat, in the back of my head I'm thinking that means something (whether it be right or wrong). 

Secondly, C/M Coy, plain and simple. Mech units have no Jump Coys, and it seems everyone joining the infantry, want that. Nobody wants to join the infantry to be mediocre (or at least i hope not), and in 3 Bn, the opprotunity to excel into something seems more of a reality (IE. Jump tasking).

For the most part, my idea of whats to come is likely tainted with some ignorance, but thats why I'm joining. To relieve myself of that ignorance (and CFRC and serving members can only provide so much information, until nothing else but personal experience can suffice).


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## Jimmy C (12 Mar 2006)

Sh0rtbUs, your points are pretty much the same ones I would have written. Just recently I received my job offer to the PPCLI and head out to Wainwright on the 30th March, although I thought for sure they would send me to RCR because of the new regiment being stood up. Whatever battallion I get slotted into doesn't really matter, I'll just be happy to be a member of the regiment.


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## Kev T (12 Mar 2006)

My reasons for joining a light battalion have for the most part been summed up in the last couple of posts. I know this sounds kind of childish but I've always wanted to be a paratrooper or a commando or something along those lines, plain and simple - not saying that I'll get to be that in a light battalion or get in a jump coy but as it stands getting into a light battalion is the closest I'll get right now. It just increases my chances to be the best that I can (in my opinion anyways). I have nothing against mech units - why should I? I understand that light battalions also are involved more with operating in various difficult terrain/environments. You can say that these unique attributes of a light unit also interest me more. In reality I probably would be happy in any battalion but given a choice I would choose a light battalion. Maybe I've seen too many bad action movies or heard too many hero stories but I've been given a shot to see if I've got what it takes so we'll see. I've been in the reserves long enough to know that I'll be in for a tough time if I get into a light battalion. Call me stupid but that's why I'm joining - to be pushed and tested, to try and accomplish something where others have failed; you can say that I am joining because of that high attrition rate. Maybe I'm trying to prove something to myself (I probably am) but unless I at least try I could never be comfortable with myself knowing that I had a chance.


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## mike01 (27 Mar 2006)

Well it is good to see someone full of piss and vinegar but you have to be careful not to step in the bullsh*t. Sounds good from the other side of the fence and not to discourage you since being in the light is a lot better than being a mech f*g. Still the best advice I can give you is not to have such high expectations since the army has an all round gay factor to it. Now that you want to do it full time, good. Better than a part time soldier. Just remember that you're playing with the big boys now. Noe of that "back in the mo" talk. There is a term we have in the PPCLI for those who come from magot to reg force without going through our battle school with the rest of the new guys- QUICK PIC. The worst is the maggots who came in with attitude and think they're hot sh*t with their 3yrs-and-already-a-Mcpl attitude. Just be aware of that. Other than that, have fun where ever you end up. Good on ya if you do get your jump course.


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## grayman (28 Mar 2006)

Typically the 3rd is "light", but I will have you know that while in Afghanistan, the 2nd  humped the same kit, did the same type patrols, walked over the same ridges and mountains as the 3rd did, so everything you here is not necassary true, or may be slightly tainted. I'll have you know that the second not only can be mounted, but we can also do the same dismounted stuff the 3rd Bn does. The only difference, we have no urge to jump out of a perfectly good airplane, hving said that I know lots of troops from the 1st and 2nd BN's that end up in the third and do just as well. The question to you is are we stupid or smart, because instead of walking everywear, we got ourselves a taxi.
Make up your own minds and dont be brainwashed by other people's biasis.  Having said my peice, no doubt I've pissed off a ton of people, if your offended suck it up, take it with a grain of salt.


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## GO!!! (29 Mar 2006)

grayman said:
			
		

> Typically the 3rd is "light",


Can you provide an example of a 3rd Bn of a Canadian Infantry Regiment that is not Light? 



> but I will have you know that while in Afghanistan, the 2nd  humped the same kit, did the same type patrols, walked over the same ridges and mountains as the 3rd did,


Well, not really. Only one company from 2VP did come, by the way - were you there?



> so everything you here is not necassary true, or may be slightly tainted. I'll have you know that the second not only can be mounted, but we can also do the same dismounted stuff the 3rd Bn does.


Everyone is "dismounted" once they get themselves out of a veh. "Light" refers to a different type of fighting and mentality. I know you do "dismounted" - you just don't do "light".



> The only difference, we have no urge to jump out of a perfectly good airplane, hving said that I know lots of troops from the 1st and 2nd BN's that end up in the third and do just as well.


Or you simply lack the fitness or guts to do so. I guess you could call that "no urge"



> The question to you is are we stupid or smart, because instead of walking everywear, we got ourselves a taxi.


.....and you are posted to Shilo, doing veh maintenance every day - havin' fun? 

Kev T

The above post from grayman is typical of those who are envious of the postings and training opportunities that are often available to the light Bns that are not common in the Mech units. They translate this envy into statements like "anyone can fight dismounted" and "I know lots of guys...." and put the light units down to make themselves feel better, as if they are somehow "smarter" for riding in the back of a vehicle.

It is difficult to get the "cool" courses like the various para courses, and mountain ops in the mech units, and the simple logistics involved with getting a unit of LAVs to different bases in the US very expensive and not often done. Thus, the more versatile unit goes, meaning that elements of the Light Bns have many more opportunities to train with the Marines, Rangers, USAF and use their training facilities that the mechanized units do not have. This, along with being posted to Shilo (like grayman) makes them angry, so they like to put us down.


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## Scoobie Newbie (29 Mar 2006)

GO!!!
there have been instances of light units re rolling into mech for a tour or what have you.

So the 3rd had two coys with augments from the 2nd and the 2nd had 1 coy in the mountains that did the same job more or less from what I am told and no I wasn't there.

Different mindset, well probably.

Perhaps with more slots we could have more guys jump (with relation to fitness and guts) but obviously why waste a slot on someone in a mech unit when the chances of them jumping is unlikely.

Doing vehicle maintenance everyday.  Hardly.  B Coy is overseas right now and A Coy is working up to it and there is no C coy to speak of so vehicle maintenance isn't very high right now.

Don't really see the need for a pissing match.  We all know the 2VP guys are the poor cousins and if that makes us envious then so be it.


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## Kev T (29 Mar 2006)

Well, thanks for all the advice and info. I plan to keep pretty quiet about my reserve stuff if I can help it - just plan to shut up and do as I'm told by being a grey man. The way I look at it is if some troops want to ride around in a LAV - power to ya. If you want to jump out of planes - go for it. Everyone's got their own preference. I just happen to prefer being in a light battalion (see my previous post). I just got sworn in yesterday (again but for real this time). Then I'm taking off for the RCR Battle School in Meaford this Friday - I honestly don't think they're going to give me PPCLI. Little nervous as it's like stepping into the unknown and starting a new chapter in life but I'm looking forward to it and just want to get it on. From there it's a whole new adventure.


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## foerestedwarrior (29 Mar 2006)

mike01 said:
			
		

> Well it is good to see someone full of piss and vinegar but you have to be careful not to step in the bullsh*t. Sounds good from the other side of the fence and not to discourage you since being in the light is a lot better than being a mech f*g. Still the best advice I can give you is not to have such high expectations since the army has an all round gay factor to it. Now that you want to do it full time, good. Better than a part time soldier. Just remember that you're playing with the big boys now. Noe of that "back in the mo" talk. There is a term we have in the PPCLI for those who come from magot to reg force without going through our battle school with the rest of the new guys- QUICK PIC. The worst is the maggots who came in with attitude and think they're hot **** with their 3yrs-and-already-a-Mcpl attitude. Just be aware of that. Other than that, have fun where ever you end up. Good on ya if you do get your jump course.



Is it that bad? I am in the process of CT to the regs. I was told I will get a complete bypass and direct to battalion. Any advise on how to limit this? I was also told I would pretty much get regement and battalion of my choice(i will beleive it when I see it). So pretty much....I am waiting to shoot on this one.


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## Scoobie Newbie (29 Mar 2006)

If you are a direct entry (and there has been quite a few) just keep quite, do your job proficiently and be/stay in shape.  In time you will be accepted.  DO NOT walk around like your the cock of the walk and think you know more then the next guy regardless of how long you have been in reserves or how many tours you've been on.


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## foerestedwarrior (29 Mar 2006)

CFL said:
			
		

> If you are a direct entry (and there has been quite a few) just keep quite, do your job proficiently and be/stay in shape.  In time you will be accepted.  DO NOT walk around like your the **** of the walk and think you know more then the next guy regardless of how long you have been in reserves or how many tours you've been on.



Thanks, just to make matters worse in that department. I was just told that I may get upwards of Cpl 0. Even though I only have 5 years in(i have my PLQ). So, ya, shut up, work my ass off and eventually it will be cool, gotchya.


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## Kev T (30 May 2006)

Well SQ is almost over. So far so good. Nothing like being a Private again. I'm on my last week and we got 3 days left. I was expecting a 10 week course and not 7 weeks. The next DP 1 here in Meaford doesn't start until 21 August. Since I am planning on going PPCLI after Battle School anyways I have submitted my memo saying that I am requesting to have DP 1 in WATC Wainwright, AB. I am wondering if anyone out there knows when the next DP 1 in Wainwright is and roughly how many people are waiting (wondering if I have a chance of getting on it). I've been told by the acting crse officer that WATC only runs 3 reg force DP 1 Inf's a year. What I figure is if I can get onto a DP 1 before 21 August in Wainwright then I'll go because I don't want to wait 3 months to start DP 1 - I can be done the course by then. I also figure that since I plan on being posted out west after training anyways I may as well go and do my training in Wainwright. The main thing is I don't want to wait around for 3 months doing nothing. If anyone out there can help me out on this it would be much appreciated. Thanks.


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## Fusaki (31 May 2006)

Kev T,

With regards to whether or not you are posted to a light batt, after awhile you'll realize that anyone in a unit that isn't your own is junk. If you're 3RCR, then 1RCR will probably be full of hammers. If you're 1RCR, then you'll scoff at the 3rd herd troops. There are those with the better judgement to know that each batt has its ups and downs, but really, I'm not one of them. 1RCR is better then 3RCR for a number of reasons:

1) I'm in 1RCR

2) 3RCR thinks they're better then us, which isn't cool at all.

3) My buddies are in 1RCR, and they're pretty checked out.

4) I'm in 1RCR

Catch my drift? Esprit de Corp, inter-unit rivalry, and god forbid "elitist" mentality is part of our culture. Its the sense of competition that makes one platoon try and pass another platoon on morning runs. The "We're better then them" state of mind is how we maintain a standard and push the limits. The "We're all part of the same team" thing is pure BS. That's what troops who can't compete tell themselves to feel better. This isn't official army policy, but its the way things are. This is how a professional army hones itself into a lean, keen, green machine.

P.S. Engineers are the exception. Everyone loves Combat Engineers. They're like us, but with a hard-on for explosions. ;D


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## paracowboy (31 May 2006)

Wonderbread said:
			
		

> Kev T,
> 
> With regards to whether or not you are posted to a light batt, after awhile you'll realize that anyone in a unit that isn't your own is junk. If you're 3RCR, then 1RCR will probably be full of hammers. If you're 1RCR, then you'll scoff at the 3rd herd troops. There are those with the better judgement to know that each batt has its ups and downs, but really, I'm not one of them. 1RCR is better then 3RCR for a number of reasons:
> 
> ...


all very true, except that 3 RCR is the better unit.


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## GO!!! (3 Jun 2006)

paracowboy said:
			
		

> all very true, except that 3 RCR is the better unit.



....as long as by "better" you mean sub - patricia. Kind of like the "least worst", right?


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## Mortar guy (3 Jun 2006)

OK, driver halt! I'm posted to 3 RCR this fall and I can guarantee you it is among the top 9 infantry battalions in the entire regular army. Of course, when I was in 1 RCR we always called 3 RCR the "C Team" or the "Junior Varsity Team" but I have since seen the light. Now I just have to think of clever titles for 1 RCR as they will no doubt be junk compared to the super soldiers I will work with at 3 Cluck.

Or not...



MG


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## vonGarvin (3 Jun 2006)

Mortar guy said:
			
		

> OK, driver halt! I'm posted to 3 RCR this fall and I can guarantee you it is among the top 9 infantry battalions in the entire regular army. Of course, when I was in 1 RCR we always called 3 RCR the "C Team" or the "Junior Varsity Team" but I have since seen the light. Now I just have to think of clever titles for 1 RCR as they will no doubt be junk compared to the super soldiers I will work with at 3 Cluck.
> Or not...
> 
> MG


But, of course, 2 RCR wasn't even mentioned, because, as we all know it was THE BEST (regular) infantry battalion this side of Levis, QC: bar none!  1 RCR was referred to as a bunch of "Gara-troopers" when they were in London, and we just collected relief funds for them once they moved to Peta-wee-wee.  3 RCR?  Used to be the BEST collection of hockey players ever, but then the Soviets ruined all our cool postings and decided to "tear down this wall".  Now they are, well, I dunno, they are up in Pet as well, but Airbone Regiment (light)?

(Please take with salt, as appropriate)


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## Armymedic (3 Jun 2006)

vonGarvin said:
			
		

> But, of course, 2 RCR wasn't even mentioned, because, as we all know it was THE BEST (regular) infantry battalion this side of Levis, QC: bar none!



This is the first statement by you I can concur with 100%.


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## paracowboy (3 Jun 2006)

GO!!! said:
			
		

> ....as long as by "better" you mean sub - patricia. Kind of like the "least worst", right?


well, of course! Everyone in the CF realizes that!


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## Yeoman (5 Jun 2006)

ah breadboy is just jealous cuz some of us get paid more then him 
hey which units companies got first and second in the march and shoot competition last year? hmmmmmmmmm  ;D
take that you one junker!
Greg


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## Kev T (9 Jun 2006)

Well good news. Found out there is a DP1 in Wainwright starting later this month, they're taking guys from Meaford, and I'm slated for it. Don't know when I'm going over but it's definitely working out. Everything is coming together.


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## Kev T (21 Jun 2006)

Well this is it. My last day at LFCA TC Meaford. Myself and some others are leaving super early tomorrow morning (more like tonight) at O'Dark Stupid and heading over to WATC Wainwright. Never been there before but it works out great for me as I'll be closer to home and be trained by my regiment of choice. Perhaps it worked out better that I was sent out here in the beginning. It's actually good that it worked out this way for me as in the end I'll have traveled to a place I've never been, have been trained in Meaford and Wainwright, and will have a perspective of both. I also get a nice break in between courses not too long and not too short. Everything has worked out the way I wanted which is great. I believe our DP1 starts next week. I'm glad that SQ is over and I can progress to the next and final phase of my initial training. Now all I have is 10 weeks of solid pain and dedication to deal with. Not too sure if battle school is run much different at WATC than it is compared to here in Meaford. Anyways it should all work out and at the end of the summer/early September I should be good to go.


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## Kev T (14 Sep 2006)

Well it's finally over. All my basic level training is complete. DP1 - BIQ ended at the end of August and I've been in 3 RCR for about 2 weeks now. Things are going well. My entire course was slated for 2 VP so I went back east and joined 3 RCR. It was a tough choice for me as I wanted to be a Patricia but at the same time I wanted to be in a light battalion. Location doesn't really matter as Shilo and Petawawa are both too far away from home to make any difference. In the end I decided on 3 RCR. Since I didn't take any summer leave because I was in battle school I'm taking it right now. In fact today is my first day of leave and my first time back home in like 6 months. It feels great! It's been a long road but I'm glad to be getting on with life and my career. As I'm now in a battalion that pretty much ends this thread. Thanks again for all the help and the answers to my earlier questions.


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