# Re: Indian treaties



## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Albert King <aking@mb.sympatico.ca>* on *Wed, 24 May 2000 18:05:52  0000*
Dave Kennedy,
In rely to your message on indian treaties.
I reitterate my statement. Are we supposted to make the natives think that their
treaties last forever? The response should be no! This is the year 2000. It
should be time to get over past mistakes and grow up a little bit. Treaties
might of ment something 150 years ago, but in today‘s world they are totally
useless. What purpose do they serve? Native leaders fight so hard for treaties
because if they didn‘t there would be no purpose for native leaders. No more
power and money for them. Because then we would all just be Canadians and we
would all live in Canada. Indians can own private land, exercise rights to free
speech, vote, and live where ever they choose. We don‘t need treaties to ensure
they have enough gunpowder for winter, or adequate amounts of twine to build
their shelters. They can buy twine and gun powder at the corner store, like any
other Canadian.
So if treaties don‘t exist to protect their basic human rights, then why are
they around. Some say that it‘s just. That they were here first. First of all,
natives didn‘t inhabit all of Canada. Nor did they have any sort of national
government. Before the Europeans came it was basically a bunch of tribes roaming
around, hunting and fighting other tribes. They felt that they owned all the
land, most likely because most natives had no permament settlements. Canada is a
overwhelemingly European decent population. We have a government and legal
system based on European traditions and natives have to learn that we aren‘t
going anywhere. They have been duely compensated for our past mistakes and then
some, considering the technological advances brought to them.
Natives are not, nor where they ever sovereign peoples. To be sovereigen
requires a level of statehood to be achived and even prior to contact with
Europeans they had not reached that goal by European standards. Indians are not
a nation, the European concept of a nation does not include tribal communities.
Unless we want to turn Canada into a modern day form of the Ottoman Empire.
There can only be one political community in Canada at nation status, that‘s the
federal government. Provinces, cities, households, tribes, cultural groups,
religious grouos are all subordinate and cannot be nations. Aboriginal‘s cannot
successfully exercise their "right" of self-government oin reserves because time
has showen that native government is riddled with corruption, difficulties
stemming from the small size of the people they govern combined with an overly
ambitious agenda as well as a dependence on transfer payments. It‘s wasteful
familistic factionalism.
When I say that treaties are being re-negotiated I also mean that in Ontario
natives argue that the current treaties mean different things then what they
accually say. They are reinterpretating them for more land and power. Indians
cannot ever be successful on their working solely off their own land base for
many reasons I won‘t go into here today.
While I could sit and write many more pages about this topic I think you get it.
Treaties may have ment something many years ago, now they are stupid and if
naitves want to be this petty about race then mabye we should take back our
cars, computers, electricity, phones, fax machines, and modern clothing. Two can
play at this game.
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"Roland Monague" <roly_61@HOTMAIL.COM>* on *Thu, 25 May 2000 01:40:11 GMT*
>From: Albert King 
>Reply-To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca
>To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca
>Subject: Re: Indian treaties
>Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 18:05:52  0000
>
>Dave Kennedy,
>
>In rely to your message on indian treaties.
>
>I reitterate my statement. Are we supposted to make the natives think that 
>their
>treaties last forever? The response should be no! This is the year 2000. It
>should be time to get over past mistakes and grow up a little bit. Treaties
>might of ment something 150 years ago, but in today‘s world they are 
>totally
>useless. What purpose do they serve? Native leaders fight so hard for 
>treaties
>because if they didn‘t there would be no purpose for native leaders. No 
>more
>power and money for them. Because then we would all just be Canadians and 
>we
>would all live in Canada. Indians can own private land, exercise rights to 
>free
>speech, vote, and live where ever they choose. We don‘t need treaties to 
>ensure
>they have enough gunpowder for winter, or adequate amounts of twine to 
>build
>their shelters. They can buy twine and gun powder at the corner store, like 
>any
>other Canadian.
>
>So if treaties don‘t exist to protect their basic human rights, then why 
>are
>they around. Some say that it‘s just. That they were here first. First of 
>all,
>natives didn‘t inhabit all of Canada. Nor did they have any sort of 
>national
>government. Before the Europeans came it was basically a bunch of tribes 
>roaming
>around, hunting and fighting other tribes. They felt that they owned all 
>the
>land, most likely because most natives had no permament settlements. Canada 
>is a
>overwhelemingly European decent population. We have a government and legal
>system based on European traditions and natives have to learn that we 
>aren‘t
>going anywhere. They have been duely compensated for our past mistakes and 
>then
>some, considering the technological advances brought to them.
>
>Natives are not, nor where they ever sovereign peoples. To be sovereigen
>requires a level of statehood to be achived and even prior to contact with
>Europeans they had not reached that goal by European standards. Indians are 
>not
>a nation, the European concept of a nation does not include tribal 
>communities.
>Unless we want to turn Canada into a modern day form of the Ottoman Empire.
>There can only be one political community in Canada at nation status, 
>that‘s the
>federal government. Provinces, cities, households, tribes, cultural groups,
>religious grouos are all subordinate and cannot be nations. Aboriginal‘s 
>cannot
>successfully exercise their "right" of self-government oin reserves because 
>time
>has showen that native government is riddled with corruption, difficulties
>stemming from the small size of the people they govern combined with an 
>overly
>ambitious agenda as well as a dependence on transfer payments. It‘s 
>wasteful
>familistic factionalism.
>
>When I say that treaties are being re-negotiated I also mean that in 
>Ontario
>natives argue that the current treaties mean different things then what 
>they
>accually say. They are reinterpretating them for more land and power. 
>Indians
>cannot ever be successful on their working solely off their own land base 
>for
>many reasons I won‘t go into here today.
>
>While I could sit and write many more pages about this topic I think you 
>get it.
>Treaties may have ment something many years ago, now they are stupid and if
>naitves want to be this petty about race then mabye we should take back our
>cars, computers, electricity, phones, fax machines, and modern clothing. 
>Two can
>play at this game.
>I have been reading alot of articles from military personnel for months now 
>since I subcribed to army cipherlogic and was very impressed by those who 
>can provide valuable information to others who need it. Through 
>hardwork,research and just plain old experience and knowledge soldiers such 
>as John Pullman, and Gunner you are of great value to this network.
I am now reading articles that have me very disturbed and thought now is the 
time to have my say. First let me introduce myself as a former Airborne 
Gunner from the Para Bty. I left the service in 1989 as a Sgt. A rank that 
was well earned and my time spent with the military holds alot of valuable 
memories and friendships with many people I still stay in contact with 
today.
I am also a First Nation person residing on a Indian Reserve in Ontario. 
Recent articles from Albert King have me very disturbed about what should be 
written in this military network. King let me introduce who I am and provide 
you with some very valid history on my family. My father was Alfred King who 
passed on into the spirit world 6 years ago. Yes he was a First Nation 
person but little do you know that he was also a proud RCR veteran who 
served this country proud by entering in the Korean War. My father was 
extremely proud of his military heritage and was sent off with full military 
honours. He was also a proud airborne soldier and served his community well 
as a police officer.
To this date I too am very proud of the time I spent serving in the military 
and the experiences gained. I too am now a police officer in my home 
community and also have served my community as a political leader. During my 
stint in politics I provided my community with the knowledge to survive 
without government handouts. I brought the first ever successful Recycling 
program to any First Nation Community in Ontario. I had success in 
kickstarting self sustaining programs to other communiites in Southern 
Ontario and was flown to other Provinces as a guest speaker to provide my 
manual to Environmental enthusiasts.
Through this hard work and determination I have also provided safe drinking 
water to my community as my thoughts were for my people in terms of HEALTH 
not WEALTH.
I feel before you start shooting off your mouth about incidents and debate 
something you have no knowlege about take the time to research your 
material. Further to this debates of this nature do not belong within the 
service provided here as I find it discriminatory and I know with added 
support from the membership on this network it should cease immediately. 
Trained soldiers who are mature about the service they provide to this 
Nation do not stoop so low to criticize Canadians regardless of there race, 
color or creed.
For someone such as youself who thinks he knows it all you have indeed 
shamed yourself as a soldier and the country you serve, as well as shaming 
the KING name.
John Pullman how are you. You probably don‘t remember me but I do remember 
your unfortunate jump on DZ Anzio where your Chute malfunctioned and your 
ability to remember your airborne drills paid off and you still made it off 
the DZ broken leg and all. Cheers to all who provide a good valuable service 
on this network. AIRBORNE!
>--------------------------------------------------------
>NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
>to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
>to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
>message body.
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at  http://www.hotmail.com 
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----------



## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Albert King <aking@mb.sympatico.ca>* on *Wed, 24 May 2000 23:22:18  0000*
I agree that the issue of native treaties should be discussed here any furthur.
If anyone wants to continue this discussion they can e-mail me privately.
As for not knowing anything about the subject of First Nations, I must disagree.
I have spent my teenage years growing up in a town in Northern Manitoba which is
basically surrounded my reserve land. The largest portion lies directly north of
my town and is home to about 2,500 people. Both my parents work for the
provincial government and both deal with natives on a day to day basis and have
had their own frustrations with both "racism" and a uncooperative will from
natives and especially their politicial leaders. I have visited other reserves
in Manitoba, Sask., and Atlantic Canada. While not native myself, I take great
interest in natives and their political protests.
I‘m certainly not saying that indians cannot serve their country or community.
If your truely helping your community away from the gov‘t cash flow then I say
good for you. My main criticizms are against the native leadership and political
system their have/are trying to acquire. I have met many outstanding indians as
well as many bad ones, and I won‘t lie, in my experiences, the bad out-weigh the
good. I‘m not criticizing natives just because they are native but because of
their actions.
I don‘t want to get into individual name calling and I also do‘t think this is
the place to discuss this topic, so any future messages should be mailed
privately.
> >I have been reading alot of articles from military personnel for months now
> >since I subcribed to army cipherlogic and was very impressed by those who
> >can provide valuable information to others who need it. Through
> >hardwork,research and just plain old experience and knowledge soldiers such
> >as John Pullman, and Gunner you are of great value to this network.
> I am now reading articles that have me very disturbed and thought now is the
> time to have my say. First let me introduce myself as a former Airborne
> Gunner from the Para Bty. I left the service in 1989 as a Sgt. A rank that
> was well earned and my time spent with the military holds alot of valuable
> memories and friendships with many people I still stay in contact with
> today.
> I am also a First Nation person residing on a Indian Reserve in Ontario.
> Recent articles from Albert King have me very disturbed about what should be
> written in this military network. King let me introduce who I am and provide
> you with some very valid history on my family. My father was Alfred King who
> passed on into the spirit world 6 years ago. Yes he was a First Nation
> person but little do you know that he was also a proud RCR veteran who
> served this country proud by entering in the Korean War. My father was
> extremely proud of his military heritage and was sent off with full military
> honours. He was also a proud airborne soldier and served his community well
> as a police officer.
> To this date I too am very proud of the time I spent serving in the military
> and the experiences gained. I too am now a police officer in my home
> community and also have served my community as a political leader. During my
> stint in politics I provided my community with the knowledge to survive
> without government handouts. I brought the first ever successful Recycling
> program to any First Nation Community in Ontario. I had success in
> kickstarting self sustaining programs to other communiites in Southern
> Ontario and was flown to other Provinces as a guest speaker to provide my
> manual to Environmental enthusiasts.
> Through this hard work and determination I have also provided safe drinking
> water to my community as my thoughts were for my people in terms of HEALTH
> not WEALTH.
> I feel before you start shooting off your mouth about incidents and debate
> something you have no knowlege about take the time to research your
> material. Further to this debates of this nature do not belong within the
> service provided here as I find it discriminatory and I know with added
> support from the membership on this network it should cease immediately.
> Trained soldiers who are mature about the service they provide to this
> Nation do not stoop so low to criticize Canadians regardless of there race,
> color or creed.
> For someone such as youself who thinks he knows it all you have indeed
> shamed yourself as a soldier and the country you serve, as well as shaming
> the KING name.
> John Pullman how are you. You probably don‘t remember me but I do remember
> your unfortunate jump on DZ Anzio where your Chute malfunctioned and your
> ability to remember your airborne drills paid off and you still made it off
> the DZ broken leg and all. Cheers to all who provide a good valuable service
> on this network. AIRBORNE!
> >--------------------------------------------------------
> >NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> >to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> >to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> >message body.
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at  http://www.hotmail.com 
>
> --------------------------------------------------------
> NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> message body.
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----------



## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"dave" <dave.newcombe@home.com>* on *Wed, 24 May 2000 23:06:43 -0700*
Have you heard about the Indian Act, residential schools, and other methods
to remove indians from thier heritage.  I am of european descent, and I
would be outraged if the government tried to eliminate my heritage.  we did
not defeat the Aborigal Canadians in wars, they were our allies.  In fact
they helped save our country during the war of 1812. Have you heard about
Tecumseh?  He is a genuine hero of our nation.  Why don‘t you give up all
your property and give it to the next boatload of illegal immigrants that
comes here.  The only difference between Jaques Cartier, and the chinese
last summer, is a few hundred years.
>
> While I could sit and write many more pages about this topic I think you
get it.
> Treaties may have ment something many years ago, now they are stupid and
if
> naitves want to be this petty about race then mabye we should take back
our
> cars, computers, electricity, phones, fax machines, and modern clothing.
Two can
> play at this game.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------
> NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> message body.
>
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"John Pullman" <jpullman@bserv.com>* on *Thu, 25 May 2000 08:55:36 -0700*
Hey Roland...
You wouldn‘t believe the people that remember that jump. I‘m doing my dead
level best to forget it!!
I‘m out now and am working as a firefighter for Kitchener. Civvy life is
great. Nothing better then the concept of overtime!
Hope your doing well. By the way, went to Rob Lloyd‘s wedding in
Peterborough a little while ago. He got out and is a firefighter there now
too.
Anyway have a good one.
John
>John Pullman how are you. You probably don‘t remember me but I do remember
>your unfortunate jump on DZ Anzio where your Chute malfunctioned and your
>ability to remember your airborne drills paid off and you still made it off
>the DZ broken leg and all. Cheers to all who provide a good valuable
service
>on this network. AIRBORNE!
--------------------------------------------------------
NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
message body.


----------



## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"William J <andy> Anderson" <aanderson@sk.sympatico.ca>* on *Thu, 25 May 2000 08:34:13 -0700*
on 24/5/00 18:40, my good friend Roland Monague at roly_61@HOTMAIL.COM
wrote:
> First let me introduce myself as a former Airborne
> Gunner from the Para Bty.

Thanks Roland! Very well put. I too, am getting tired of some the threads on
this list. There are far too many forums available on the net for racists to
blow off steam and vent every hateful utterance that their little minds can
think of. I a ‘cease fire‘ is in order and lets get back to the things that
are dear to all of us.... army stuff.
Nice to see a former member of 2RCHA E Bty para is doing well on the
‘outside‘...ubique! ...and of course, ....‘Airborne all the way!‘ :
arte et marte
andy sends:
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Carl DINSDALE <joscol@mb.sympatico.ca>* on *Thu, 25 May 2000 22:59:38 -0500*
While on the topic of dissident factions in Canada, does anyone else think that the
political leaders in Quebec should be arrested and tried for Dissension and possibly
Treason? These ongoing separation referendums are driving me around the bend. I‘ll
bet the Chechyans would love a federal government that could be jerked around as
much as ours is. Perhaps that‘s a poor comparison, but I can‘t imagine any other
country on the face of the earth that would entertain a province or state‘s desire
to separate and break up the country, and expect the feds to pay for it! I agree
with Albert, it‘s time we all got down to the business of being Canadian, period.
Imagine the strength we could have on a global scale if we didn‘t waste so much time
and money with all this internal strife and bickering.
Carl
Albert King wrote:
> Dave Kennedy,
>
> In rely to your message on indian treaties.
>
> I reitterate my statement. Are we supposted to make the natives think that their
> treaties last forever? The response should be no! This is the year 2000. It
> should be time to get over past mistakes and grow up a little bit. Treaties
> might of ment something 150 years ago, but in today‘s world they are totally
> useless. What purpose do they serve? Native leaders fight so hard for treaties
> because if they didn‘t there would be no purpose for native leaders. No more
> power and money for them. Because then we would all just be Canadians and we
> would all live in Canada. Indians can own private land, exercise rights to free
> speech, vote, and live where ever they choose. We don‘t need treaties to ensure
> they have enough gunpowder for winter, or adequate amounts of twine to build
> their shelters. They can buy twine and gun powder at the corner store, like any
> other Canadian.
>
> So if treaties don‘t exist to protect their basic human rights, then why are
> they around. Some say that it‘s just. That they were here first. First of all,
> natives didn‘t inhabit all of Canada. Nor did they have any sort of national
> government. Before the Europeans came it was basically a bunch of tribes roaming
> around, hunting and fighting other tribes. They felt that they owned all the
> land, most likely because most natives had no permament settlements. Canada is a
> overwhelemingly European decent population. We have a government and legal
> system based on European traditions and natives have to learn that we aren‘t
> going anywhere. They have been duely compensated for our past mistakes and then
> some, considering the technological advances brought to them.
>
> Natives are not, nor where they ever sovereign peoples. To be sovereigen
> requires a level of statehood to be achived and even prior to contact with
> Europeans they had not reached that goal by European standards. Indians are not
> a nation, the European concept of a nation does not include tribal communities.
> Unless we want to turn Canada into a modern day form of the Ottoman Empire.
> There can only be one political community in Canada at nation status, that‘s the
> federal government. Provinces, cities, households, tribes, cultural groups,
> religious grouos are all subordinate and cannot be nations. Aboriginal‘s cannot
> successfully exercise their "right" of self-government oin reserves because time
> has showen that native government is riddled with corruption, difficulties
> stemming from the small size of the people they govern combined with an overly
> ambitious agenda as well as a dependence on transfer payments. It‘s wasteful
> familistic factionalism.
>
> When I say that treaties are being re-negotiated I also mean that in Ontario
> natives argue that the current treaties mean different things then what they
> accually say. They are reinterpretating them for more land and power. Indians
> cannot ever be successful on their working solely off their own land base for
> many reasons I won‘t go into here today.
>
> While I could sit and write many more pages about this topic I think you get it.
> Treaties may have ment something many years ago, now they are stupid and if
> naitves want to be this petty about race then mabye we should take back our
> cars, computers, electricity, phones, fax machines, and modern clothing. Two can
> play at this game.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------
> NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> message body.
--------------------------------------------------------
NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
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----------



## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"Dave Kenney" <cao@lf.ab.ca>* on *Fri, 26 May 2000 17:12:12 -0600*
Jay Paton wrote:
>They did and the natives were dedfeated in battles across Canada,
>"The Reil Uprisings Metis, The Battle of Okannawa ? and so on
I believe the difference here is that in the States, there were wars between
nations.
The sovereign nation of the United States declared war on the sovereign
nation of the Souix and the sovereign nation of the Appache etc.  In Canada,
the government did not declare war on any member of the First Nations, but
rather, had to quell uprisings and disturbances, somewhat like the more
recent uprisings in our times.  Just because the police of the Army is
called out to take action, does not mean that there is a declared war and
without war, there are no reparations from a defeated foe.
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"Roland Monague" <roly_61@HOTMAIL.COM>* on *Sat, 27 May 2000 13:43:47 GMT*
Thanks Ande for your kind show of support and I wish others on the network 
would read this and put this "caesefire in effect" on Indian Treaties as 
they don not belong hear on this net to be debated. I know you weren‘t 
mentioned on my original message as sending valid responses to this network 
and only named a few who came to mind, however I have read many of your 
responses and they were good. There are alot more on this net not named but 
my list could go on and on.
Are you aware of where the arty reunion is this year. If so or if any 
gunners out there know please respond. Once again Thanks Ande. God Bless
>From: "William J  Anderson" 
>Reply-To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca
>To: "army@cipherlogic.on.ca" 
>Subject: Re: Indian treaties
>Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 08:34:13 -0700
>
>on 24/5/00 18:40, my good friend Roland Monague at roly_61@HOTMAIL.COM
>wrote:
>
> > First let me introduce myself as a former Airborne
> > Gunner from the Para Bty.
>
>                     
>
>Thanks Roland! Very well put. I too, am getting tired of some the threads 
>on
>this list. There are far too many forums available on the net for racists 
>to
>blow off steam and vent every hateful utterance that their little minds can
>think of. I a ‘cease fire‘ is in order and lets get back to the things that
>are dear to all of us.... army stuff.
>
>Nice to see a former member of 2RCHA E Bty para is doing well on the
>‘outside‘...ubique! ...and of course, ....‘Airborne all the way!‘ :
>
>
>arte et marte
>andy sends:
>
>--------------------------------------------------------
>NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
>to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
>to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
>message body.
________________________________________________________________________
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to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *"Roland Monague" <roly_61@HOTMAIL.COM>* on *Sat, 27 May 2000 13:58:57 GMT*
Wrong response Albert. I think a simple E-mail to your private address would 
have sufficed in this case. I have saved a number of your responses and hold 
these on file. One of which tells of your age being 17 but yet you respond 
spending most of your teenage years living near First Nation territories. 
Your response was just pathetic and No I will not respond to a immature 
youth about debates he has not researched and only provides his own 
stereotyped opinion about matters painting all parties with the same brush. 
A very poor attitude coming from someone who should show this network you do 
hold a a good attitude should you wish to remain here.
Further to my memo I have given some thought to delivering your messages to 
the Minister of National Defense through the Minister of Indian Affairs and 
let them decide your fate in the military CADETS.
I think you could have responded with an apology and then discussion on your 
private e-mail but did not so therfore I will ceasefire this debate with you 
immediately as it holds no strength on these means.
Enjoy your time on this net as I know you can provide some value to it. Good 
Day to You Albert King....
>From: Albert King 
>Reply-To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca
>To: army@cipherlogic.on.ca
>Subject: Re: Indian treaties
>Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 23:22:18  0000
>
>I agree that the issue of native treaties should be discussed here any 
>furthur.
>If anyone wants to continue this discussion they can e-mail me privately.
>
>As for not knowing anything about the subject of First Nations, I must 
>disagree.
>I have spent my teenage years growing up in a town in Northern Manitoba 
>which is
>basically surrounded my reserve land. The largest portion lies directly 
>north of
>my town and is home to about 2,500 people. Both my parents work for the
>provincial government and both deal with natives on a day to day basis and 
>have
>had their own frustrations with both "racism" and a uncooperative will from
>natives and especially their politicial leaders. I have visited other 
>reserves
>in Manitoba, Sask., and Atlantic Canada. While not native myself, I take 
>great
>interest in natives and their political protests.
>
>I‘m certainly not saying that indians cannot serve their country or 
>community.
>If your truely helping your community away from the gov‘t cash flow then I 
>say
>good for you. My main criticizms are against the native leadership and 
>political
>system their have/are trying to acquire. I have met many outstanding 
>indians as
>well as many bad ones, and I won‘t lie, in my experiences, the bad 
>out-weigh the
>good. I‘m not criticizing natives just because they are native but because 
>of
>their actions.
>
>I don‘t want to get into individual name calling and I also do‘t think this 
>is
>the place to discuss this topic, so any future messages should be mailed
>privately.
>
> > >I have been reading alot of articles from military personnel for months 
>now
> > >since I subcribed to army cipherlogic and was very impressed by those 
>who
> > >can provide valuable information to others who need it. Through
> > >hardwork,research and just plain old experience and knowledge soldiers 
>such
> > >as John Pullman, and Gunner you are of great value to this network.
> > I am now reading articles that have me very disturbed and thought now is 
>the
> > time to have my say. First let me introduce myself as a former Airborne
> > Gunner from the Para Bty. I left the service in 1989 as a Sgt. A rank 
>that
> > was well earned and my time spent with the military holds alot of 
>valuable
> > memories and friendships with many people I still stay in contact with
> > today.
> > I am also a First Nation person residing on a Indian Reserve in Ontario.
> > Recent articles from Albert King have me very disturbed about what 
>should be
> > written in this military network. King let me introduce who I am and 
>provide
> > you with some very valid history on my family. My father was Alfred King 
>who
> > passed on into the spirit world 6 years ago. Yes he was a First Nation
> > person but little do you know that he was also a proud RCR veteran who
> > served this country proud by entering in the Korean War. My father was
> > extremely proud of his military heritage and was sent off with full 
>military
> > honours. He was also a proud airborne soldier and served his community 
>well
> > as a police officer.
> > To this date I too am very proud of the time I spent serving in the 
>military
> > and the experiences gained. I too am now a police officer in my home
> > community and also have served my community as a political leader. 
>During my
> > stint in politics I provided my community with the knowledge to survive
> > without government handouts. I brought the first ever successful 
>Recycling
> > program to any First Nation Community in Ontario. I had success in
> > kickstarting self sustaining programs to other communiites in Southern
> > Ontario and was flown to other Provinces as a guest speaker to provide 
>my
> > manual to Environmental enthusiasts.
> > Through this hard work and determination I have also provided safe 
>drinking
> > water to my community as my thoughts were for my people in terms of 
>HEALTH
> > not WEALTH.
> > I feel before you start shooting off your mouth about incidents and 
>debate
> > something you have no knowlege about take the time to research your
> > material. Further to this debates of this nature do not belong within 
>the
> > service provided here as I find it discriminatory and I know with added
> > support from the membership on this network it should cease immediately.
> > Trained soldiers who are mature about the service they provide to this
> > Nation do not stoop so low to criticize Canadians regardless of there 
>race,
> > color or creed.
> > For someone such as youself who thinks he knows it all you have indeed
> > shamed yourself as a soldier and the country you serve, as well as 
>shaming
> > the KING name.
> > John Pullman how are you. You probably don‘t remember me but I do 
>remember
> > your unfortunate jump on DZ Anzio where your Chute malfunctioned and 
>your
> > ability to remember your airborne drills paid off and you still made it 
>off
> > the DZ broken leg and all. Cheers to all who provide a good valuable 
>service
> > on this network. AIRBORNE!
> > >--------------------------------------------------------
> > >NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > >to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > >to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > >message body.
> >
> > ________________________________________________________________________
> > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at  http://www.hotmail.com 
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > message body.
>
>
>
>--------------------------------------------------------
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________________________________________________________________________
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Albert King <aking@mb.sympatico.ca>* on *Sun, 28 May 2000 21:33:00  0000*
I know that I shouldn‘t respond here but I can‘t take personal attacks.
No one here is yet to rebut my arguement, so I‘ll wait. In the meantime I have
spent about 6 years living in northern manitoba. Anyway, Ronald, go ahead and
mail my messages to the defense minister and the indian affairs minister. In
fact mail them to Phil Fontaine, I‘m sure he‘ll get a kick out of them. My
writings are not racist or bigoted. You can go to your local bookstore or pick
up a copy of the National Post and find many similar arguements. The government
hasn‘t said a word about these publishings yet, so I think I‘m o.k.
Roland Monague wrote:
> Wrong response Albert. I think a simple E-mail to your private address would
> have sufficed in this case. I have saved a number of your responses and hold
> these on file. One of which tells of your age being 17 but yet you respond
> spending most of your teenage years living near First Nation territories.
> Your response was just pathetic and No I will not respond to a immature
> youth about debates he has not researched and only provides his own
> stereotyped opinion about matters painting all parties with the same brush.
> A very poor attitude coming from someone who should show this network you do
> hold a a good attitude should you wish to remain here.
> Further to my memo I have given some thought to delivering your messages to
> the Minister of National Defense through the Minister of Indian Affairs and
> let them decide your fate in the military CADETS.
> I think you could have responded with an apology and then discussion on your
> private e-mail but did not so therfore I will ceasefire this debate with you
> immediately as it holds no strength on these means.
> Enjoy your time on this net as I know you can provide some value to it. Good
> Day to You Albert King....
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## army (21 Sep 2002)

Posted by *Albert King <aking@mb.sympatico.ca>* on *Sun, 28 May 2000 21:38:48  0000*
Natives were our enemies in many cases too. Have you heard about Louis Riel?
"He was a genuine hero of our nation." Or so the P.C. rhetoric goes. He was
nothing more then a murderous thug. Certainly not a hero.
A lot can happen in 500 years. Comparing the two is stupid, as is comparing
Canada 500 years ago to Canada today.
dave wrote:
> Have you heard about the Indian Act, residential schools, and other methods
> to remove indians from thier heritage.  I am of european descent, and I
> would be outraged if the government tried to eliminate my heritage.  we did
> not defeat the Aborigal Canadians in wars, they were our allies.  In fact
> they helped save our country during the war of 1812. Have you heard about
> Tecumseh?  He is a genuine hero of our nation.  Why don‘t you give up all
> your property and give it to the next boatload of illegal immigrants that
> comes here.  The only difference between Jaques Cartier, and the chinese
> last summer, is a few hundred years.
>
> >
> > While I could sit and write many more pages about this topic I think you
> get it.
> > Treaties may have ment something many years ago, now they are stupid and
> if
> > naitves want to be this petty about race then mabye we should take back
> our
> > cars, computers, electricity, phones, fax machines, and modern clothing.
> Two can
> > play at this game.
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > NOTE:  To remove yourself from this list, send a message
> > to majordomo@cipherlogic.on.ca from the account you wish
> > to remove, with the line "unsubscribe army" in the
> > message body.
> >
>
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