# France refocusing military on Russia and China



## FJAG (26 Nov 2020)

France is looking at upping budget and refocusing on stronger formations with modernized weapon systems.



> Budget Up, French Army Preps For Major Wargames With US
> After decades fighting guerrillas and terrorists, France is refocusing on Russia and China with increased budgets, intensified training, stronger divisions, and new armored vehicles — much like the US. But the French approach is still very different.
> By   SYDNEY J. FREEDBERG JR. on November 25, 2020
> 
> ...



See article herehere.

Something to think and ponder about.

 :cheers:


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## Colin Parkinson (5 May 2021)

Buying or upgrading the VBL`s?


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## CBH99 (5 May 2021)

The French really do back up their foreign policy with an incredibly capable military.  The rafale, carriers, warships, nuclear subs, troop deployments, etc - France has a pretty big stick it can use, if necessary.


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## Rifleman62 (22 Jun 2021)

What about their Generals?


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## CBH99 (22 Jun 2021)

Rifleman62 said:


> What about their Generals?


I have zero knowledge to back this up, BUT...their force in Mali seemed pretty darn capable with the initial approx. 1000 guys and 6 jets, which steadily expanded into their current mission.

But that initial deployment, while small - seemed to have some real teeth - and they took some solid ground while the force built up.  So I'm guessing their theatre commanders are pretty decent.

Like anywhere though, I'm sure they have their good and their bad...  <cough> Fraser <cough> ...


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## daftandbarmy (22 Jun 2021)

Rifleman62 said:


> What about their Generals?



The Generals are revolting, apparently, in more ways than one....


Anger as ex-generals warn of 'deadly civil war' in France​
*The French government has condemned an open letter signed by active soldiers that said the country was heading for "civil war" due to religious extremism.*

About 1,000 servicemen and women, including some 20 retired generals, put their names to the letter.

It blamed "fanatic partisans" for creating divisions between communities, and said Islamists were taking over whole parts of the nation's territory.

Ministers have condemned the message published in a right-wing magazine.

The letter was first published on 21 April - the 60th anniversary of a failed coup d'état.

"The hour is grave, France is in peril," the signatories said.

Far-right leader Marine Le Pen, a candidate in next year's presidential election, has spoken out in support of the former generals.

But the minister in charge of the armed forces, Florence Parly, tweeted: "Two immutable principles guide the action of members of the military with regard to politics: neutrality and loyalty."

She earlier warned that any signatories still serving in the military would be punished for defying a law that requires them to remain politically neutral.









						Anger as ex-generals warn of 'deadly civil war' in France
					

Ministers condemn an open letter, which claims Islamists are taking over parts of France.



					www.bbc.com


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## YZT580 (23 Jun 2021)

daftandbarmy said:


> The Generals are revolting, apparently, in more ways than one....
> 
> 
> Anger as ex-generals warn of 'deadly civil war' in France​
> ...


Is it being politically neutral to draw attention to a situation that you believe could produce a civil war?  I would more classify it as loyalty to the government currently in power.  One might disagree with the writer's findings but provided the author isn't fomenting rebellion and anarchy they shouldn't be censored.


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## Halifax Tar (23 Jun 2021)

France is due for a revolution isn't it ?

I hear they like revolutions because they always win...


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## daftandbarmy (23 Jun 2021)

YZT580 said:


> Is it being politically neutral to draw attention to a situation that you believe could produce a civil war?  I would more classify it as loyalty to the government currently in power.  One might disagree with the writer's findings but provided the author isn't fomenting rebellion and anarchy they shouldn't be censored.



The French Exteme Right wing, characterized by Le Pen, makes Trump supporters look like a bunch of Salt Spring Island hippies.

They have direct and historical connections to Vichy (Nazi sympathizer) France Vichy France - Wikipedia

It's a real problem if alot of their military support him and his policies.


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## Kirkhill (23 Jun 2021)

FJAG said:


> France is looking at upping budget and refocusing on stronger formations with modernized weapon systems.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So.  France's fleet for the near-peer fight

200x LeClerc @ 56 tons







300x Jaguar @ 25 tons






1872x Griffons @ 25 tons



2038x Serval @ 17 tons



1000x VBL @ 5 tons




If there is one piece of French kit that has always made me jealous it is the VBL.


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## Blackadder1916 (23 Jun 2021)

YZT580 said:


> Is it being politically neutral to draw attention to a situation that you believe could produce a civil war?  I would more classify it as loyalty to the government currently in power.  One might disagree with the writer's findings but provided the author isn't fomenting rebellion and anarchy they shouldn't be censored.



Have you read the letter?  In the original French or a translation?  It takes a little searching to find (_it's probably easier for a red-neck Frenchman_) but the sense I got on reading it (taking into account my facility, or lack thereof, in French) was that the intent was to threaten the French government to take extreme measures or else they (those who wrote/signed the letter) would move to change the government.  While it wasn't specifically in the letter, the author followed it on his blog with the statement:



> Chers amis, l'opération "lettre ouverte" est close. Nous avons enregistré plus de 27 000 signatures d'anciens militaires dont une soixantaine de Généraux et 70 000 soutiens civils.
> 
> Nous passons désormais à l'étape suivante qui va consister à nous organiser sur le terrain.
> 
> Merci de votre engagement à nos côtés.



The highlighted portion is roughly translated to "We are now moving on to the next step which will consist in organizing ourselves in the field".

Just as serving members of the CAF have restrictions placed on them re political activities or making statements, so too do members of the French Armed Forces (Code de la défense  Articles L4121-1 à L4121-8).  As to taking action against "retired" generals who signed the letter, French generals (even retired ones) are treated as a special category of personnel in the Code de la défense (Articles L4141-1 à L4141-7).  To  simplify it, as long as the individual wishes and as long as the government so desires, a French general remains in the military even when he is no longer active and even after he begins receiving his retirement pension.  If one wants the perquisites of being a general, then abiding by the responsibilities that come with it, including the accepted code of conduct, is the price.


_I've deliberately excluded a link to the open letter to the French Government as I would not want to draw more attention to their site._


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## Colin Parkinson (23 Jun 2021)

The VBL would be a perfect piece of kit for our Reserve armoured units


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## YZT580 (23 Jun 2021)

Blackadder1916 said:


> Have you read the letter?  In the original French or a translation?  It takes a little searching to find (_it's probably easier for a red-neck Frenchman_) but the sense I got on reading it (taking into account my facility, or lack thereof, in French) was that the intent was to threaten the French government to take extreme measures or else they (those who wrote/signed the letter) would move to change the government.  While it wasn't specifically in the letter, the author followed it on his blog with the statement:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


thanks for the enlightenment


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