# Job training and possible future civilian trade.



## miktsen (14 Jan 2009)

Hey all,

Please forgive me complete ignorance. I have literally zero friends in the Canadian Armed Forces, so I really have no one to ask these questions.

i have been considering joining the reserves for a while now. One thing I have been wondering about is how much of the training for different CF jobs would be directly applicable to a civilian job. I'm considering a pretty broad range of options at the moment and was looking for advice on what to expect. 

For instance, is trying for a position in the MP a logical step towards an ultimate goal of joining the Vancouver PD?

What about other CF jobs involving pluming, power engineering, or structural engineering? Would it make sense to join the Army to learn these skills to get into a trade?

Also, I know there are companies that are very accommodating to the work schedules of people in the reserves, but is there any assistance finding a civilian job that relates to the training you are receiving in the military?


----------



## Kat Stevens (14 Jan 2009)

I would say that if your intent is to join the army in order to gain a useful trade out in the world, forget it.  Any of the building trades you mention are obtainable MUCH faster through a Provincial apprenticeship programme than through the military.  I can't speak to the MP question, as I only have brush contact with those guys.


----------



## miktsen (14 Jan 2009)

Well, getting the training for a job is definitely not the only factor involved, I just wanna make sure I'm not wasting my time.


----------



## Yrys (14 Jan 2009)

miktsen said:
			
		

> Well, getting the training for a job is definitely not the only factor involved, I just wanna make sure I'm not wasting my time.



As you've been registered here :

"Temps total passé en ligne:  	1 heures et 26 minutes."

I will respectfully suggest that you take a bit of your time reading 
some of the threads that are link here :

FIRST OFF - Do you meet the 3 CRITERIA ?.


Good reading   !


----------



## Greymatters (14 Jan 2009)

Actually, these are very good questions, and although they have been asked before on other threads (although I cant recall their titles), it never hurts to refresh people's memories on these subjects.

First off very very few military trades are directly transferable over to civilian occupations.

Many military qualifications are not recognized by civilian trades or academic facilities.  You may get credit for them, but usually only as part of gaining civilian creditation for the same training/qualification.

What the military does offer is exceptional transferable skills development.  You will get training and experience in a vast number of skill areas that are not offered to employees at private enterprises.




			
				miktsen said:
			
		

> I have been considering joining the reserves for a while now. One thing I have been wondering about is how much of the training for different CF jobs would be directly applicable to a civilian job. I'm considering a pretty broad range of options at the moment and was looking for advice on what to expect.



See above.



			
				miktsen said:
			
		

> For instance, is trying for a position in the MP a logical step towards an ultimate goal of joining the Vancouver PD?



If you want to join any police department, the most important thing to do is know someone in that police department who can vouch for your character.  Military service is not as highly regarded as it should be, or as highly as it is in the USA.



			
				miktsen said:
			
		

> What about other CF jobs involving pluming, power engineering, or structural engineering? Would it make sense to join the Army to learn these skills to get into a trade?



I am not familiar with recent trends in these fields, but AFAIK the recognition of qualifications is still an issue.  Electricians and communications trades were said in the past to have fewer barriers due to the same standards and materials being used in both military and civilian environments.  



			
				miktsen said:
			
		

> Also, I know there are companies that are very accommodating to the work schedules of people in the reserves, but is there any assistance finding a civilian job that relates to the training you are receiving in the military?



a) There are some companies that are accomodating to persons in the reserves, but it depends greatly on your position in that company.  An executive who is a Major in the reserves is more likely to get a lot more accomodation than a low-level 8AM-5PM worker employed at minimum wage.
b) There are organizations existing with this goal in mind, but their level of effectiveness and success is debatable.


----------



## kincanucks (14 Jan 2009)

miktsen said:
			
		

> Well, getting the training for a job is definitely not the only factor involved, I just wanna make sure I'm not wasting my time.



Wasting your time?  What by serving your country and making yourself a better citizen?  Please apply at McDonalds.

HA and DA


----------



## Sythen (14 Jan 2009)

> Wasting your time?  What by serving your country and making yourself a better citizen?  Please apply at McDonalds.



yea cause he didn't already say he is deciding between many different positions and the fact some skills might be transferable will help him decide.. Buds think before you talk and keep your ignorant self righteousness to yourself.


----------



## Nfld Sapper (14 Jan 2009)

Sythen said:
			
		

> yea cause he didn't already say he is deciding between many different positions and the fact some skills might be transferable will help him decide.. Buds think before you talk and keep your ignorant self righteousness to yourself.



You do realize that most people on this site have more time in uniform than you do walking the earth, they might know a thing or two about what is transferable or not.


----------



## Sythen (14 Jan 2009)

> You do realize that most people on this site have more time in uniform than you do walking the earth, they might know a thing or two about what is transferable or not.



If you've got more then 28 years in the forces, good for you. However, you need to learn some reading comprehension. What does knowing what is transferable have even the slightest thing to do with my post? He was being ignorant and rude and taking a comment out of context and I called him on it.

The knowledge base here is probably why the OP asked here. It makes sense. But to tell someone that they should go apply to McDonalds because they'd rather base their choice of profession on what will benefit them in the long run rather then jumping in blindly is ignorant and stupid.


----------



## PMedMoe (14 Jan 2009)

Sythen, kincanucks' comment was made in regard to the OP not wanting to "waste his time".

Maybe the OP should go look at the recruiting website where related civilian occupations are listed with each trade.


----------



## HeadLamp (14 Jan 2009)

You keep using "then" instead of "than" in your posts Sythen. Not that I personally care, but I just thought you might want to fix that.

 What I gathered from his statement is unless his trade training in the Reserves is going to benefit him directly as a civilian, then the time he put in was a "waste of time". From that perspective Kincanucks response made perfect sense.


----------



## psychedelics07 (14 Jan 2009)

Join the Reg F.

Everything you learn will be directly 'transferable', without a chance of wasting your time.


----------



## Sig_Des (14 Jan 2009)

rjr said:
			
		

> Join the Reg F.
> 
> Everything you learn will be directly 'transferable', without a chance of wasting your time.



Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over!

Unless you have experience on people leaving the military and getting civvy jobs based on military qualifications, you are WAAYYY out of your lane. How about you work on that.

Unrecognized qualifications that you would obtain in the Reserves would more than likely be unrecognized from the Reg Force as well.

As far as "everything you learn", I don't know if Drill or the operation of weapons would be recognized by many civvy employers.


----------



## aesop081 (14 Jan 2009)

rjr said:
			
		

> Join the Reg F.
> 
> Everything you learn will be directly 'transferable', without a chance of wasting your time.



What military qualifications do you have that are directly transferable ?


----------



## Lil_T (14 Jan 2009)

You want something transferable?

clerk 
imagery tech
cook
steward (hospitality portion anyway)

to name a few..

AFAIK the MP trade is somewhat difficult to get into.  

there are a lot of trades that CAN transfer into the civillian world *with some upgrading/ certification*


----------



## psychedelics07 (14 Jan 2009)

I meant,  to consider Reg F as oppose to civvie or reserves.


----------



## aesop081 (14 Jan 2009)

rjr said:
			
		

> I meant,  to consider Reg F as oppose to civvie career.



So.........



			
				CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> What military qualifications do you have that are directly transferable ?


----------



## psychedelics07 (14 Jan 2009)

The OP suggested interest in the reserves and skills obtainable in the CF.  I am merely suggesting he look into Reg F as a full-time career, INSTEAD of transferable skills to civvie.  I know it's not what he specifically asked, but it's an idea.

Find something else to bash me for.  Thanks.


----------



## aesop081 (14 Jan 2009)

rjr said:
			
		

> Find something else to bash me for.  Thanks.



So "none" is your answer then ?

On topic.....

Alot of trades have "directly" transferable skills or training. Almost all trades however have very valuable "indirect skills" that employers seek. The leadership training, work ethics, experience in certain domains are just as attractive to a civillian employer.


----------



## Nfld Sapper (14 Jan 2009)

Examples:

Infantry:
The Infantry Soldier occupation is uniquely military and has no civilian equivalent; however, the experience Infantry Soldiers gain in the use and maintenance of vehicles, communications equipment, weapons and tools of all types is highly applicable to many civilian jobs. More important, an experienced Infantry Soldier has the self-confidence, integrity, loyalty and trustworthiness that good employers want. Infantry leadership skills are also highly desirable to civilian employers.


Combat Engineer:
Highway Construction Foreman
 Blaster (Construction)
 Heavy Equipment Operator
 Carpenter (Rough)
 Construction Engineering Technician
 Construction Millwright
 Civil Engineering Technician


----------



## Sig_Des (14 Jan 2009)

rjr said:
			
		

> I am merely suggesting he look into Reg F as a full-time career, INSTEAD of transferable skills to civvie.  I know it's not what he specifically asked, but it's an idea.
> 
> Find something else to bash me for.  Thanks.



No, what you said was that if you joing the Regular Force, everything you learn is directly transferable. That is an untrue statement.

As others have pointed, a lot of the skill sets you learn, in EITHER element, will be accepted outside of the military, while particular qualifications may not.


----------



## psychedelics07 (14 Jan 2009)

No, that's not what I said.

That is why I put quotations around "transferable".  To show that the skills you learn are directly related("transferable") to the full-time occupation selected.


Anything else?


----------



## Nfld Sapper (14 Jan 2009)

How about you listen to those of us that have been in for awhile, we might know a thing or two about what can and can't be transfered to civilian employment.


----------



## Sig_Des (14 Jan 2009)

This is your statement.



			
				rjr said:
			
		

> *Join the Reg F.
> 
> Everything you learn will be directly 'transferable'*, without a chance of wasting your time.



You tell mean how that reads. I see "Join the Reg Force. EVERYTHING you LEARN will be DIRECTLY TRANSFERABLE"

If you meant related, why wouldn't you just state that? I think you're backtracking, and maybe should just go into Rx mode.


----------



## psychedelics07 (14 Jan 2009)

Sapper, I guess you skipped a bunch of posts.


Beadwindow,  I am not backtracking. You are telling me how you understood my original statement, and I am telling you what I MEANT.  Whether it was a textbook description or not, is not the argument.

If I suggested he join the Reg F, then he would, no doubt, be IN THE REG F.  If he wanted skills obtained from the military, then being in the Reg F would certainly make sure he uses the skills learned.

Who else wants to jump in with their derogatory comments?    Try having something positive to say, instead of disparaging comments towards half the posters on this forum. Another idea is to ignore them.

Thank you.


----------



## aesop081 (14 Jan 2009)

rjr said:
			
		

> Join the Reg F.
> 
> Everything you learn will be directly 'transferable', without a chance of wasting your time.



Listen here sparky.......

The OP was asking about skills from the reserves he could obtain that transfer to a civillian career. He wasnt asking about learning military skills and getting to use them in the military



			
				rjr said:
			
		

> If I suggested he join the Reg F, then he would, no doubt, be IN THE REG F.  If he wanted skills obtained from the military, then being in the Reg F would certainly make sure he uses the skills learned.



So this little comment of yours, no only didnt make any sense, it was irrelevant to the OPs question.




> Try having something positive to say,



Try answering the question i have asked you twice already ? 


Edit :

Besides that, Mr " i dont have a second of experience"........i would say that theres a shitload of reservists out there who are using the skills learned in the reseves. You might have heard of Afghanistan.....


----------



## HeadLamp (14 Jan 2009)

This would probably be a good time to stop completely derailing this guy's thread  .


----------



## psychedelics07 (14 Jan 2009)

rjr said:
			
		

> The OP suggested interest in the reserves and skills obtainable in the CF.  I am merely suggesting he look into Reg F as a full-time career, INSTEAD of transferable skills to civvie.  I know it's not what he specifically asked, but it's an idea.
> 
> Find something else to bash me for.  Thanks.




I already admitted it wasn't what the OP was looking for.

Regarding the question you asked;  it has been answered in several other posts.  And, the OP said he was open to a broad range of career choices. My opinion was from a different angle.


----------



## aesop081 (14 Jan 2009)

rjr said:
			
		

> Regarding the question you asked;  it has been answered in several other posts.



So then its " I have zero military experience or qualifications that are directly or indirectly transferable to a civillian career and am thus grossly unqualified to answer the question of the original poster" ?

Thank you kindly.


----------



## psychedelics07 (14 Jan 2009)

In the original post, he asks:  "One thing I have been wondering about is how much of the training for different CF jobs would be *directly* applicable to a civilian job."

And here, your "experienced" response:


			
				CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> Alot of trades have "directly" transferable skills or training.



Wow! Did military experience and qualifications teach you that?    That advice is moot.

You may have suggested a few *indirect* skills,  but like you said





			
				CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> So this little comment of yours, no only didnt make any sense, *it was irrelevant to the OPs question*.


----------



## aesop081 (14 Jan 2009)

Arent you just the cutest thing ever..........


----------



## Greymatters (14 Jan 2009)

This seems to have turned into quite a hot topic, and just as hotly debated.  Lets try and get back to the starting point on this one.

Can anyone here confirm which current qualifications from the military, and in which occupation, are directly transferable to an equivalent civilian occupation?

Some are obvious (doctor, dentist, etc.), but manual-labour orientated trades would be useful to know...


----------



## BernDawg (14 Jan 2009)

Maybe a bit of an aside but just last year the Alberta trades board has recognized the Engineer school and the TQ5 Construction Tech can apply and receive their Journeymans ticket after their course.  So I would say that that qual is directly transferable (in AB anyway)
I think some of the other trades were recognized as well.


----------



## kratz (14 Jan 2009)

Following BernDawg's idea, I know the Nova Scotia Community College  offers RMS QL5 clerks recognition for their training toward the school's Office Information Technology program.


----------



## aesop081 (14 Jan 2009)

IIRC, the old Field Engineer QL6B could earn you a "Certified engineer technologist" in New Brunswick.

Edited to correct my dumbassness.......


My current MOC doesnt have equivalent civilian qualifications per say, but the experience gained lets you move right into jobs with PAL, Transport Canada and many others.


----------



## PMedMoe (14 Jan 2009)

Ahuntsic College gives credits towards courses/degrees.


----------



## Greymatters (14 Jan 2009)

Going back to what I said about transferable skills, the following are a list of skill sets gained in the CF that can be used in every occupation (there are other subject titles you can use, but this covers the majority that employers are looking for):

Analytical skills 
Coaching and mentoring 
Communication
Computer/IT skills 
Conflict management
Creativity
Crisis and emergency management
Initiative 
Instructing positions 
Inter-cultural abilities
Interpersonal communications 
Language skills
Leading others /Leadership positions/skills 
Liaison and networking
Managing others / Management positions/skills 
Mechanical/Technical skills
Meets deadlines/accomplish tasks
Organization and planning skills
Problem-solving capabilities
Project management skills
Sales and marketing
Self-defence skills
Self-motivated
Success and achievement
Team-building/Team-leading/Team player 
Time management skills
Verbal and written communications
Work in a culturally diverse environment.  

All you have to do with these is demonstrate a level of training, expertise and/or instruction to others for each one, and assess your level of expertise by adding the appropriate descriptive term for each skill set (i.e. good, excellent, master, etc.) and they can be referred to in any resume, interview, or occupation...


----------



## eurowing (15 Jan 2009)

Aircraft Structures Technician (Welding) and Non-Destructive Testing Technician ( Radiography and others)have many civilian tickets involved with their trades.


----------



## EuroCanuck (15 Jan 2009)

Do AESOPs get any specialized training and qualifications which can be used in practical or common civilian jobs?


----------



## aesop081 (15 Jan 2009)

EuroCanuck said:
			
		

> Do AESOPs get any specialized training and qualifications which can be used in practical or common civilian jobs?



Allot of former AES Ops have found work operating airborne sensors for a company called Provincial Aerospace. This company has the contract to provide flights for DFO. Transport Canada also operates air assests in suport of the National Area Surveillance Program which employs operators for their onboard sesnors. Other have found work with aerial maping/surveying companies or in some companies that privide training for foreign aircrews. Some who have spent time working at CFEWC has retired from the military and became civillians but continued to work at CFEWC.

This is not necesarily based on any specialize training or on qualifications that have a coresponding civillian equivalency but more pased on the individual's experience and the fact that the fundamentals of the trade is operating airborn sensors.

Also, the proper way to abreviate the trade name is "AES Op"

My 2 monkey dollars worth


----------



## Journeyman (15 Jan 2009)

NFLD Sapper said:
			
		

> *Infantry:
> The Infantry Soldier occupation is uniquely military and has no civilian equivalent; however..... *


Infantry soldiers quite often become models, actors, or cabana boys by virtue of being so ruggedly handsome. 

Because of this requirement, understand that you may not be accepted during Recruiting. It's not personal.
If you are accepted (quotas  _~sigh~_ -- just setting kids up for heartache)....if you ARE accepted, but wash out of training, your course report may say you were "too weak" or "lack physical coordination and ability," because it's considered less harsh than "you just weren't sufficiently good looking to make it in the Infantry."


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse (15 Jan 2009)

Having said that, if you are "ruggedly handsome" enough for the Infantry, *and* you also have a frontal lobe, you should consider the Artillery.


----------



## Kat Stevens (15 Jan 2009)

Helmets and rubber boots on!  Man the shovels! FEL and dumptrucks on standby!


----------



## eurowing (15 Jan 2009)

Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> Having said that, if you are "ruggedly handsome" enough for the Infantry, *and* you also have a frontal lobe, you should consider the Artillery.



That nearly cost me my laptop!


----------



## BernDawg (16 Jan 2009)

Any trade in the CF will make you fully qualified to become a commissionare and you're immediately employable upon retirement or release.


----------

