# 23 Jul 10:  CF-18 Crash @ Lethbridge Airport



## The Bread Guy

This from CTV.ca:


> A Canadian forces CF-18 fighter jet has crashed at the Lethbridge County airport Friday afternoon.
> 
> CTV News has learned the jet was was flying at a low altitude before it crashed at the airport. The pilot ejected before the jet crashed, and appears to be OK.
> 
> There is no word at this point on whether anyone was injured on the ground. Emergency crews are now attending to the scene, and highways to the airport have been closed.
> 
> Lethbridge is preparing for the Alberta International Air Show, which begins Saturday ....



CBC Alert on Twitter:


> CF-18 fighter jet has crashed during practice for the Lethbridge International Airshow. Pilot is in hospital; no word on condition.



Here's hoping pilot will be OK....

- edited to add following - 

A bit more detail from Global News:


> A CF-18 fighter jet has crashed in Lethbridge as the International Airshow gets underway.
> 
> Witnesses are reporting that the pilot pulled out of his parachute before the plane crashed. The pilot is the only one reported injured at this time.
> 
> The plane was believed to have been in Lethbridge for the airshow, which runs this weekend.


----------



## Miller97

Hopefully the pilot is okay thank god he got out safely.


----------



## The Bread Guy

A bit more from QMI/Sun Media:


> A Canadian Forces CF-18 fighter jet has crashed in Lethbridge.
> 
> Witnesses tell QMI Agency the jet fighter crashed on airport property at 12:22 p.m.
> 
> *The pilot is believed to have ejected and survived the crash.
> 
> He was taken to Lethbridge hospital with undetermined injuries, said RCMP Insp. Joe McGeough.
> 
> He said the injuries weren't life threatening.*
> 
> The aircraft was in town for the Lethbridge International Airshow, which is to take place this weekend.



Here's hoping for a full and speedy recovery...


----------



## George Wallace

url=http://www.calgarysun.com/news/alberta/2010/07/23/14807006.html#/news/alberta/2010/07/23/pf-14807001.html]A bit more[/url] from QMI/Sun Media:


> A Canadian Forces CF-18 fighter jet has crashed in Lethbridge.
> 
> Witnesses tell QMI Agency the jet fighter crashed on airport property at 12:22 p.m.
> 
> *The pilot is believed to have  ejected and survived the crash.
> He was taken to Lethbridge hospital with undetermined injuries, said RCMP Insp. Joe McGeough.
> 
> He said the injuries weren't life threatening.*



Anyone else find the humour in the "reporting"?  "The pilot is believed to have survived the crash - his injuries were not life threatening"  Duh!

This could be an entry into "The dumbest thing I heard today." thread.


----------



## Retired AF Guy

From the Calgary Herald:



> CALGARY — A Canadian Air Force CF-18 fighter jet crashed at the Lethbridge Regional Airport Friday, as the facility was getting ready for the Alberta International Airshow.
> 
> Lethbridge RCMP said the pilot was taken to Chinook Regional Hospital with undetermined injuries after the crash occured around 12:20 p.m.
> 
> Witnesses say he pulled his parachute and ejected before the plane crashed.
> 
> RCMP and the local fire department have cordoned off the area.
> 
> A military spokeswoman said the cause of the crash is under investigation. It's not immediately known whether the plane ran into trouble during mid-air manoeuvres, or on take-off or landing.
> 
> "I can confirm a CF-18 Hornet has crashed during practice for the Lethbridge air show," said Capt. Nicole Meszaros, a spokeswoman for 4 Wing, based at CFB Cold Lake, Alberta.
> 
> "The pilot, we are very thankful to say, is OK. We believe at this point that his injuries are not life-threatening."
> 
> Authorities have not released the pilot's name, but Meszaros said the pilot is attached to 3 Wing from CFB Bagotville in Quebec. The plane's crew is based in Cold Lake, Meszaros added.
> 
> Global Television contributed to this report


----------



## The Bread Guy

George Wallace said:
			
		

> .... "The pilot is believed to have  ejected and survived the crash" ....


This is what one writes when witnesses tell OTHER media "I saw someone fly out of the plane and come down with a parachute" when one doesn't want to attribute which other media the info came from.  Breaking story, writing in a hurry, saw it in more than one story, so one thinks it must be OK to include.

Also, look at the direct quote from a spokesperson:


> "We believe at this point that his injuries are not life-threatening."



Everyone's in a hurry to write, nobody's got time to wait for the whole picture - nature of the biz.


----------



## belka

From Airshowbuzz.com:



> Captain Brian "Boozer" Bews, the CF-18 Hornet demonstration pilot for the Canadian Forces, was performing a high alpha pass when the aircraft began to yaw right. At low speed, low altitude, he knew he didn't have many options so ejected. He has been transported to a local hospital. Credible ICAS members report he was conscious and did not have any injuries beyond lower back pain.



Sounds like engine(s) failure, either a bird strike or mechanical.


----------



## CBH99

I woke up this morning with a smile on my face, as I heard the distinct sound of a low flying fighter aircraft roaring over my house.  I rolled over, smiled, and remembered "Hey, its airshow weekend!"

Then about a minute later, I heard a big "BOOM!"  But do to all the construction on my block, didn't think anything of it.  Who knew it would be the same plane I had just woken up to, slamming into the ground.  Wow.

Glad the pilot is okay!!


----------



## 40below

milnews.ca said:
			
		

> This is what one writes when witnesses tell OTHER media "I saw someone fly out of the plane and come down with a parachute" when one doesn't want to attribute which other media the info came from.  Breaking story, writing in a hurry, saw it in more than one story, so one thinks it must be OK to include.
> 
> Also, look at the direct quote from a spokesperson:
> Everyone's in a hurry to write, nobody's got time to wait for the whole picture - nature of the biz.



Come on, Tony, what are we supposed to do with an editor screaming at us through a cell phone? Tell him there appears to have been a plane crash but we're not comfortable writing anything about it until the BOI report is issued in 18 months?


----------



## Rogo

Maybe not 18 months but a few hours until things are confirmed seems reasonable to me.


----------



## 40below

I've only been covering news for 25 years, I wasn't aware there was a golden hour where all the rumours, reports, conflicting eyewitness testimony and supposition disappeared, leaving only facts.


----------



## George Wallace

40below said:
			
		

> I've only been covering news for 25 years, I wasn't aware there was a golden hour where all the rumours, reports, conflicting eyewitness testimony and supposition disappeared, leaving only facts.



Agreed, but the writer and the editor should at least catch and correct some of the "contradictions" as they update a piece.  As seen here, it can become quite comical and detract significantly from a less than humourous report.  As time passes and more and more of these mistakes are made, the media outlet will find that it has lost all credibility.


----------



## 40below

George, take it from me, half the facts reported in the first 24 hours after a major news event are wrong, only because we have to rely on dumbasses we talk to an the lack of first-hand information. 

Here's an example. If you read what you quoted above and made such fun of, it was the *RCMP* who issued the statement that you take such issue with about the pilot _apparently_ ejecting and _reportedly_ not suffering lifethreatening injuries. Feel free to put it your dumb quote file, but do correctly attribute it to a federal civil servant, not a reporter who wrote down the words of the guy the federal government chose to issue an official statement about what occurred.


----------



## 40below

George Wallace said:
			
		

> Agreed, but the writer and the editor should at least catch and correct some of the "contradictions" as they update a piece.  As seen here, it can become quite comical and detract significantly from a less than humourous report.  As time passes and more and more of these mistakes are made, the media outlet will find that it has lost all credibility.



Trust me, I know. But people want to know what went 'whomp' and why their neighbourhood smells like burning jet fuel all of a sudden, and what's that smoke?, so we have to stop what we're doing and go ask. We didn't see it either, so we have to ask people, and hopefully intitial errors are corrected, but as you well know, if you ask five people about what they saw, you're gonna get seven stories. The stuff in the physical papers tomorrow is going to be much more accurate as reporters have had more time to talk to more people. By Monday, it will be something close to correct.


----------



## paulmaster1

Go to global calgary or edmonton for raw video of the crash


----------



## Michael OLeary

paulmaster1 said:
			
		

> Go to global calgary or edmonton for raw video of the crash



http://www.globaltvcalgary.com/Video+Fighter+crash/3315698/story.html

http://www.globaltvcalgary.com/Amateur+Video+Lethbridge+crash/3315746/story.html


----------



## desert_rat

and raw video links here as well:

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/crashes+Alberta/3315220/story.html


----------



## 40below

milnews.ca said:
			
		

> This is what one writes when witnesses tell OTHER media "I saw someone fly out of the plane and come down with a parachute" when one doesn't want to attribute which other media the info came from.  Breaking story, writing in a hurry, saw it in more than one story, so one thinks it must be OK to include.
> 
> Also, look at the direct quote from a spokesperson:
> Everyone's in a hurry to write, nobody's got time to wait for the whole picture - nature of the biz.



And I'm not trying to pile on you Tony, but I do note, when you saw this story, you didn't say to yourself, "I'm *not* going to post this to army.ca, I'm going to wait a few weeks until all the facts are corrected and official statements are released."  >


----------



## belka

desert_rat said:
			
		

> and raw video links here as well:
> 
> http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/crashes+Alberta/3315220/story.html



"Wooo hooo!"
"Is that supposed to happen?"

Are you fucking kidding me?  :


----------



## The Bread Guy

40below:  First off, thanks for coming into the open to help us learn a bit more about the craft.  I know _you_ work hard at getting it right, and try to get your colleagues to do it right, too, but as with cops/soldiers/politicians, the group often suffers because of the mistakes of the few.



			
				40below said:
			
		

> Come on, Tony, what are we supposed to do with an editor screaming at us through a cell phone? Tell him there appears to have been a plane crash but we're not comfortable writing anything about it until the BOI report is issued in 18 months?


Good point - I stand corrected for not providing more context.

The DS solution:  "I've seen a, witnesses tell me b, spokespersons say c, other media outlets (named) say d, and we don't know e yet."  That said, there's also pressure on the reporter from the bosses to get _something_ out.  This part is a structural issue, not an individual reporter issue (although, being human, some reporters and editors take shortcuts).  I've also worked in places where we were told "it's OK if the others get it first, but we will get it right."  

In your example:


			
				40below said:
			
		

> If you read what you quoted above and made such fun of, it was the *RCMP* who issued the statement that you take such issue with about the pilot _apparently_ ejecting and _reportedly_ not suffering lifethreatening injuries. Feel free to put it your dumb quote file, but do correctly attribute it to a federal civil servant, not a reporter who wrote down the words of the guy the federal government chose to issue an official statement about what occurred.


The DS solution would be "The RCMP says...."



			
				40below said:
			
		

> And I'm not trying to pile on you Tony, but I do note, when you saw this story, you didn't say to yourself, "I'm *not* going to post this to army.ca, I'm going to wait a few weeks until all the facts are corrected and official statements are released."  >


Touché, fair enough and I don't feel piled on.  Two critical differences, though:

1) I'm not and don't claim to be a journalist - just an idle _former_ journalist who bakes bread on weekends and armchair quarterbacks critiques MSM and professional communicators from time to time  ;D

2)  I tend to see forums like this as a one-stop "mosaic" where tiles from different media outlets get pulled together until something approximating a picture emerges.  Then, more tiles from people who know the biz get plugged in to make a more nuanced mosaic.  I don't have the editor yelling down the phone at me (anymore, anyway).

Then again, maybe I'm bitter & twisted sensitive because of stories other outlets would steal from me without crediting/attribution, or being misquoted or taken out of context by some MSM


----------



## The Bread Guy

CF-18 Hornet crashes at air show in Lethbridge
July 23, 2010

"Winnipeg, Man. – At approximately 12:15 p.m. MDT today, a CF-18 Hornet fighter jet crashed during a practice session for the Alberta International Airshow in Lethbridge, Alta.

Captain Brian Bews, the 2010 Demo Hornet pilot from 425 Tactical Fighter Squadron based at 3 Wing Bagotville, Quebec, successfully ejected from the aircraft and has been recovered. The aircraft impacted on the airfield, and emergency crews have responded. At this time, there are no reports of any additional injuries.

The exact cause of the crash is unknown at this time. A Flight Safety investigation is currently underway."


----------



## PegcityNavy




----------



## Good2Golf

40below said:
			
		

> George, take it from me, half the facts reported in the first 24 hours after a major news event are wrong, only because we have to rely on dumbasses we talk to an the lack of first-hand information.
> 
> Here's an example. If you read what you quoted above and made such fun of, it was the *RCMP* who issued the statement that you take such issue with about the pilot _apparently_ ejecting and _reportedly_ not suffering lifethreatening injuries. Feel free to put it your dumb quote file, but do correctly attribute it to a federal civil servant, not a reporter who wrote down the words of the guy the federal government chose to issue an official statement about what occurred.



40below, maybe the RCMP officers are too used to using legalese phrases such as "reportedly" or "allegedly".  Imagine, 'Constable Jones of the Lethbridge RCMP Detachment was quoted as saying, "the pilot allegedly ejected before the plane impacted the ground." '  

Some pretty amazing pics here courtesy of photographer Ian Martens of the Lethbridge Herald.

Glad to hear that Capt. Bews is okay!

Cheers
G2G


----------



## The Bread Guy

Good2Golf said:
			
		

> 40below, maybe the RCMP officers are too used to using legalese phrases such as "reportedly" or "allegedly".  Imagine, 'Constable Jones of the Lethbridge RCMP Detachment was quoted as saying, "the pilot allegedly ejected before the plane impacted the ground." '


It's not JUST the RCMP that sometimes sounds stilted when speaking to or writing for the media...


----------



## Good2Golf

milnews.ca said:
			
		

> It's not JUST the RCMP that sometimes sounds stilted when speaking to or writing for the media...



Oh, the military can sound pretty bad, too!  :nod:


----------



## punkd

He owe's his rigger beer for that.


----------



## The Bread Guy

Good2Golf said:
			
		

> Oh, the military can sound pretty bad, too!  :nod:


Sadly, LOTS of government writing can sound like, well, "government writing"


----------



## 40below

milnews.ca said:
			
		

> 40below:  First off, thanks for coming into the open to help us learn a bit more about the craft.  I know _you_ work hard at getting it right, and try to get your colleagues to do it right, too, but as with cops/soldiers/politicians, the group often suffers because of the mistakes of the few.
> Good point - I stand corrected for not providing more context.
> 
> The DS solution:  "I've seen a, witnesses tell me b, spokespersons say c, other media outlets (named) say d, and we don't know e yet."  That said, there's also pressure on the reporter from the bosses to get _something_ out.  This part is a structural issue, not an individual reporter issue (although, being human, some reporters and editors take shortcuts).  I've also worked in places where we were told "it's OK if the others get it first, but we will get it right."
> 
> In your example:The DS solution would be "The RCMP says...."
> Touché, fair enough and I don't feel piled on.  Two critical differences, though:
> 
> 1) I'm not and don't claim to be a journalist - just an idle _former_ journalist who bakes bread on weekends and armchair quarterbacks critiques MSM and professional communicators from time to time  ;D
> 
> 2)  I tend to see forums like this as a one-stop "mosaic" where tiles from different media outlets get pulled together until something approximating a picture emerges.  Then, more tiles from people who know the biz get plugged in to make a more nuanced mosaic.  I don't have the editor yelling down the phone at me (anymore, anyway).
> 
> Then again, maybe I'm bitter & twisted sensitive because of stories other outlets would steal from me without crediting/attribution, or being misquoted or taken out of context by some MSM



I know, T, and if I can shed some light my work here is done. But you know, I know, and everyone here knows that unlike civvie world, when something bad happens in mil land, the order goes out that everyone needs to STFU five minutes ago. I'd love to talk to the tech that serviced that plane or the guy's wingman, absolutely love it because I'd get the story right, but guess what? He's not doing interviews and will probably be court martialled if he does. Which is why it's funny to come on here after every significant incident and see people bitching about the press when the press can't talk to the people who know what's going on and then blame the press for trying to do their jobs without the information they can't get from the military.


----------



## belka

Pegcity said:
			
		

>



Looks like the #1 engine was in full AB, while the #2 was still in MIL. A #2 engine failure would explain the yaw to the right. He was just too low to recover unfortunately.  :-\


----------



## DexOlesa

wow nice catch.


----------



## Good2Golf

DexOlesa said:
			
		

> That yaw could have been cause by a mechanical problem (engine or something). I also really don't want to immediately point the finger at the pilot, but as a pilot I have to say that it looks very much like he got too slow, stalled with a wing drop causing a spin which no matter what he would have been too close to the ground to correct. I hope I'm wrong and it wasn't pilot error but thats the way it looks to me.



Ummm...as a pilot, you do know he was flying a sequence called "slow flight", where you slow down to a high-drag profile at low speed and high thrust/high AOA, right?  That's why it was slow.  

People who start sentences with "I don't want to...." usually end up doing exactly that, which you did.

Let's let the Directorate of Flight Safety investigators do the investigating, shall we?  

Cheers
G2G

_*edited to add original post to which I was referring _


----------



## Zoomie

DexOlesa said:
			
		

> but as a pilot I have to say that it looks very much like he got too slow, stalled with a wing drop causing a spin...



Unless you are a high performance aircraft pilot - I suggest you keep your opinions to yourself.  You don't see G2G, Strike, Loachman or myself making comments - we don't fly those kind of military aircraft.  You cannot compare a Hornet to a Cessna.  Research Vmca and see if it applies.


----------



## DexOlesa

I know what slow flight is, I TEACH slow flight I also teach Vmc. It IS possible to mess up slow flight and end up in a stall. Unlikely for a seasoned high performance pilot yes, but not beyond the realm of possibility. Yes, you are right Vmc applies, I did not notice the difference in the engines in that picture. I wasn't looking that closely I just went off the raw footage.


----------



## vonGarvin

All I know is that it's great news that nobody was hurt.


----------



## PegcityNavy

Im glad that he didn't drift into that fireball.


----------



## Retired AF Guy

Got to love those zero-zero- ejection seats!


----------



## Trish

desert_rat said:
			
		

> and raw video links here as well:
> 
> http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/crashes+Alberta/3315220/story.html



How ironic, the song ''staying alive '' plays at the beginning of the video, while he's flying just before he crashed !


----------



## DexOlesa

Is all we have that his injuries are "thought to be non life threatening" or do we have confirmation that he's ok/ just some scrapes and bruises. Has he been released yet?


----------



## Occam

belka said:
			
		

> Looks like the #1 engine was in full AB, while the #2 was still in MIL. A #2 engine failure would explain the yaw to the right. He was just too low to recover unfortunately.  :-\



The photos that were linked in reply #22 show an even better view of the aircraft.

I'm guessing you're determining the state of the engine from the chummieyodelers that open and close at the engine exhaust?  (pardon the technical terms  )


----------



## Good2Golf

Occam said:
			
		

> The photos that were linked in reply #22 show an even better view of the aircraft.
> 
> I'm guessing you're determining the state of the engine from the chummieyodelers that open and close at the engine exhaust?  (pardon the technical terms  )



Yes. 

Variable Exhaust Nozzle (wiki ref even uses an F/A-18 for the pic) 

A GE-404 engine's nozzle is wide open when at idle/start or at full afterburner.  When operating in full military power (essentially maximum rpm, but without the afterburner) the nozzle is closed down to maintain working pressure within the engine and optimize thrust from the exhaust.

An important factor in multi-engine aircraft, even those with "close to center-line" thrust like the CF-18, is the minimum controllable airspeed at which the aircraft can still be successfully flown, even with an inoperative engine.  Experienced pilots call this airspeed "Vmca" and it is always in the back of their mind when they are manoeuvering the aircraft in the low-speed portion of the the flight envelope.  

Cheers
G2G


----------



## Zoomie

Thank you G2G - I was cringing to think that some members here might have thought that we were for some reason talking about VMC (Visual Meteorological Conditions) and not the vastly more important critical airspeed.


----------



## Zoomie

DexOlesa said:
			
		

> I know what slow flight is, I TEACH slow flight I also teach Vmc.



Friendly tip - you are having high levels discussions with members of the serving Air Force at this juncture in your life.  While we appreciate the zeal in which you express your knowledge of aviation - speaking as a Flying Instructor at the school in which you will be visiting sometime in the next decade, you must learn to turn off transmit and listen out.


----------



## 57Chevy

a thousand word picture:


----------



## The Bread Guy

More on the pilot's condition, from Postmedia News:


> .... "This is an isolated incident with one aircraft," said Lt.-Col. Midas Vogan, commanding officer of the 419 Moose Squadron based in Cold Lake.
> 
> The jet crashed around noon while Capt. Brian Bews practised a stunt about 10 metres above the runway, according to some witnesses.
> 
> He was able to eject from the twin-engined aircraft and dodge a massive fireball.
> 
> *He was taken to hospital with minor injuries and assessed by a military doctor from CFB Cold Lake.
> 
> As of Friday night, the 36-year-old Bews was "very lucid, and very clear and comfortable," Vogan said.
> 
> Bews is expected to be released from hospital "very shortly."*....


----------



## DexOlesa

Excellent news


----------



## WingsofFury

He was apparantly released last night with just a sore back.

Glad to read that he's ok, and thanks to Martin-Baker seats.

As for why it happened - as others have stated, let the flight safety directorate do it's job.  Anything that we who have never flied a Hornet can suggest is really speculation.


----------



## Loachman

Zoomie said:
			
		

> You don't see G2G, Strike, Loachman or myself making comments



I have seen plenty of accident investigations reveal causes completely different to those espoused by people speculating. This is why I rarely speculate myself, and then only with somewhat more information than a few photos or video clips.

I was one of the two last people to fly Kiowa 136258 and live in June of 1985. On its next flight that night, which I was originally scheduled to fly and could not due to a previous commitment, it crashed in Quebec just north of Pembroke, Ontario, killing two most excellent colleagues. Theories abounded, and mainly revolved around the unforecast crappy weather that they'd run into, certain Kiowa design characterisitics, and the tape of the Mayday call put out by the Observer.

The causes, when finally determined during a painstakingly thorough (which would have made CSI deservedly pale by comparison) nine-month investigation, were a complete surprise. It was a mechanical failure which had never occurred in millions of Kiowa and Jet Ranger flying hours. The part in question was found to be three ten-thousandths of an inch out of spec, and the allowable tolerance was only one. It had been on that helicopter for a couple of hundred hours before finally failing, and at the absolute worst possible time. The symptoms presented to the crew in ther final seconds were also extremely misleading.

And that is only one example out of several.


----------



## Good2Golf

57Chevy said:
			
		

> a thousand word picture:



Great picture, 57.

For those interested, here is the information site for the Martin Baker Mk.10 ejection seat used in CF-18s.


G2G


----------



## cn

Amazing pictures & video.

Glad to hear Capt. Bews is alright.   :yellow:


----------



## Lex Parsimoniae

Loachman said:
			
		

> I have seen plenty of accident investigations reveal causes completely different to those espoused by people speculating. This is why I rarely speculate myself, and then only with somewhat more information than a few photos or video clips.
> 
> I was one of the two last people to fly Kiowa 136258 and live in June of 1985. On its next flight that night, which I was originally scheduled to fly and could not due to a previous commitment, it crashed in Quebec just north of Pembroke, Ontario, killing two most excellent colleagues. Theories abounded, and mainly revolved around the unforecast crappy weather that they'd run into, certain Kiowa design characteristics, and the tape of the Mayday call put out by the Observer.
> 
> The causes, when finally determined during a painstakingly thorough (which would have made CSI deservedly pale by comparison) nine-month investigation, were a complete surprise. It was a mechanical failure which had never occurred in millions of Kiowa and Jet Ranger flying hours. The part in question was found to be three ten-thousandths of an inch out of spec, and the allowable tolerance was only one. It had been on that helicopter for a couple of hundred hours before finally failing, and at the absolute worst possible time. The symptoms presented to the crew in their final seconds were also extremely misleading.
> 
> And that is only one example out of several.


Interesting insight into air crash investigations - thanks for relating it.


----------



## WingsofFury

Zoomie said:
			
		

> Unless you are a high performance aircraft pilot - I suggest you keep your opinions to yourself.  You don't see G2G, Strike, Loachman or myself making comments - we don't fly those kind of military aircraft.  You cannot compare a Hornet to a Cessna.  Research Vmca and see if it applies.



Thanks for making the best comment I've ever seen on this matter when it comes to people who know vs. people who might know.


----------



## WingsofFury

Loachman said:
			
		

> I have seen plenty of accident investigations reveal causes completely different to those espoused by people speculating. This is why I rarely speculate myself, and then only with somewhat more information than a few photos or video clips.
> 
> I was one of the two last people to fly Kiowa 136258 and live in June of 1985. On its next flight that night, which I was originally scheduled to fly and could not due to a previous commitment, it crashed in Quebec just north of Pembroke, Ontario, killing two most excellent colleagues. Theories abounded, and mainly revolved around the unforecast crappy weather that they'd run into, certain Kiowa design characterisitics, and the tape of the Mayday call put out by the Observer.
> 
> The causes, when finally determined during a painstakingly thorough (which would have made CSI deservedly pale by comparison) nine-month investigation, were a complete surprise. It was a mechanical failure which had never occurred in millions of Kiowa and Jet Ranger flying hours. The part in question was found to be three ten-thousandths of an inch out of spec, and the allowable tolerance was only one. It had been on that helicopter for a couple of hundred hours before finally failing, and at the absolute worst possible time. The symptoms presented to the crew in ther final seconds were also extremely misleading.
> 
> And that is only one example out of several.



Sad to read, but important to read - thanks for sharing it with us all.


----------



## observor 69

Looks like Capt. Bews is now qualified to be a member of the Martin Baker  "Ejection Tie Club."

http://www.martin-baker.com/Sub-Navigation/Ejection-Tie-Club.aspx

"The club where you have to get thrown out to be allowed in."  

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/the-club-where-you-have-to-get-thrown-out-to-be-allowed-in-1019514.html


----------



## SupersonicMax

Good2Golf said:
			
		

> Great picture, 57.
> 
> For those interested, here is the information site for the Martin Baker Mk.10 ejection seat used in CF-18s.
> 
> 
> G2G



I think all of Bagotville's jet have been upgraded with the NACES already.


----------



## observor 69

The Naval Aircrew Ejection Seat (NACES) seat was developed to take aircrew safety and survival to a higher level of control. Used in the F/A-18, F-14D, and T-45, the NACES is the most advanced seat used in the United States Navy inventory. The NACES uses a digital electonic sequencer along with airspeed sensors and electrically-fired systems on the seat to allow for five separate modes of operation. The various versions of the Mk. 14 NACES are designated SJU-17 with a suffix letter for the different variants. For example, the main picture here shows a SJU-17A seat which is for the F/A-18 single seat or front cockpit seat on a dual seat aircraft. Version differences include mainly seat bucket shape, headrest and canopy breaker configuration, and other changes to accomodate the various cockpit requirements. 

Beyond the computer controlled firing sequence, it uses the same basic frame from the Mk. 10 series of seats including the tubular seat adjustment rails which allow for ease of disassembly. The drogue gun has been replaced with a rocket-deployed system which moves the drogue parachute from the headrest to the large tubular structure on the top right of the main beam assembly. With the addition of the Electronic sequencer, the scissor shackle has been eliminated. The main recovery parachute is housed in the headrest and deployed by a rocket which is located on the left main beam assembly. The sequencer computer module is a flat box which fits under the headrest, just above the shoulder harness. Protruding from the rear on either side of the headrest are the shielded squib cables. The sequencer is actuated by dual thermal batteries which are located on the main beam on the lower left side of the seat. These batteries are in turn actuated by hot gas from the duel initiators located under the seat firing handle at the front of the seat bucket. 

More at LINK


----------



## Good2Golf

SupersonicMax said:
			
		

> I think all of Bagotville's jet have been upgraded with the NACES already.



I was wondering that, Max?  The canopy looked suspiciously like a NACES GC Type 5000 aeroconical.  Does that mean that all R2 birds now have NACES/Mk.14 seats?

Baden, very interesting info.  Danke.

Cheers
G2G


----------



## SupersonicMax

G2G, 

Cold Lake jets have yet to be upgraded with the NACES.  Every Hornet will get the NACES installed.  I believe this initiative was the a direct consequence of the 2003 ejection in the CLAWR.


----------



## dapaterson

Had a family friend who passed away last December who was a member of the Caterpillar club - he bailed out of a Lancaster into Denmark in '44.


----------



## lea

"All of a sudden you could hear 'pop, pop, pop,'" witness Roland Booth told CTV News. "I saw sparks come out of the one engine. The plane started banking over to the side. That's when the pilot bailed out with his parachute."

 http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/pilot-escapes-fiery-cf-18-crash-99162984.html


----------



## SupersonicMax

DexOlesa said:
			
		

> I know what slow flight is, I TEACH slow flight I also teach Vmc. It IS possible to mess up slow flight and end up in a stall. Unlikely for a seasoned high performance pilot yes, but not beyond the realm of possibility. Yes, you are right Vmc applies, I did not notice the difference in the engines in that picture. I wasn't looking that closely I just went off the raw footage.



Tell me, what do you know about High Alpha handling of the Hornet?  What about its critical Angle of Attack?


----------



## DexOlesa

I expressed my opinion. I was wrong. I admitted it and moved on. Feel free to do the same.


----------



## mariomike

dapaterson said:
			
		

> Had a family friend who passed away last December who was a member of the Caterpillar club - he bailed out of a Lancaster into Denmark in '44.



This airman bailed out of a Lancaster, without a parachute, into Germany in '44:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_Alkemade


----------



## Fishbone Jones

mariomike said:
			
		

> This airman bailed out of a Lancaster, without a parachute, into Germany in '44:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_Alkemade



Please don't derail the thread.

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## a_majoor

Another link to pictures: http://photoblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2010/07/23/4739027-pilot-ejects-an-instant-before-fighterjet-crashes

What is really amazing to me is the way the ejection seat is already oriented "up" in the first picture even thought the Hornet is rolling over just before the ejection. That must have been a very rough ride (blasted out of the plane then making a sharp manouevre to achieve correct orientation).


----------



## Loachman

Head's down, too. He'll have a stiff neck for a while.


----------



## WingsofFury

Statement from Capt. Bews



> Statement from pilot of CF-18 demonstration Hornet
> 
> July 26, 2010
> 
> Winnipeg, Man. – Captain Brian Bews, the Canadian Forces 2010 Demonstration Hornet pilot who ejected from his CF-18 in Lethbridge, Alta. Friday has authorized disclosure of his injuries – compression fractures in three vertebrae – and has issued the following statement:
> 
> “I feel extremely lucky considering the magnitude of the accident; Martin Baker is my new best friend! I will be concentrating on rest for the next while, but will make a complete recovery. I would like to thank the Canadian Forces SkyHawks and the other first responders for their quick reaction to the accident, as well as the staff at the Lethbridge Hospital who have taken such great care of me. I would also like to thank my family, friends, my demo team and my air show family for their amazing support since the accident.”
> 
> Martin Baker is the brand name of the ejection seat credited with saving Capt Bews’ life when he ejected from his aircraft seconds before it impacted the airstrip during a practice run for the 2010 Alberta Airshow.
> 
> “Given the incredible amount of force in the ejection sequence, this type of injury is very common in aircrew who eject,” said Major Rachel Morrell, Wing Surgeon at 4 Wing, Cold Lake, Alta. “We can expect a full recovery and return to duty for Captain Bews.” She also added that the time to fully recover in order to return to flying duties varies greatly and is determined on a case-by-case basis.
> 
> “We're extremely relieved to see Capt Bews quickly recovering from Friday's accident,” said Colonel Alain Pelletier, Commander 3 Wing Bagotville, Que. “His timely reactions and successful ejection during the event demonstrate his professionalism and are the outcome of two key elements: thorough training of our demo pilot and survival equipment of our modernized CF-18.”
> 
> The exact cause of the crash is unknown at this time. A Flight Safety investigation is currently underway.
> 
> - 30 -
> 
> Note to Editors: To allow Capt Bews to sufficiently recuperate, he will not be made available for interviews at this time. For more information, please contact:
> 
> Captain Holly Brown
> 
> Public Affairs Officer
> 
> 1 Canadian Air Division/Canadian NORAD Region
> 
> Tel: (204) 833-2500 ext. 6795 Cell: (204) 227-8535
> 
> E-mail: holly.brown@forces.gc.ca



Also an fyi - contacted Public Affairs and they advised that he'd be released from the hospital in the next couple of days and will be taking some RnR afterwords to recouperate.


----------



## WingsofFury

How I'll choose to remember this hornet...


----------



## HavokFour

That right there is one lucky son of a gun, I hope he bought a lottery ticket!

Have they figured out what went wrong?


----------



## SupersonicMax

HavokFour said:
			
		

> That right there is one lucky son of a gun, I hope he bought a lottery ticket!
> 
> Have they figured out what went wrong?



Flight Safety Investigations can take years to complete, especially when most of the aircraft is completely destroyed.


----------



## Loachman

The level of minute detail that investigators go into is pretty incredible. One of many clues used to determine the cause of the Kiowa crash to which I referred earlier was an impression in the back of the Turbine Outlet Temperature (TOT) gauge made by the needle at the instant that the helicopter hit the water. The engine was running at 420C, well below the normal range, and consistent with operation under no load at all; the main drive shaft had sheared due to torque spikes as a result of the freewheeling unit (the part which failed) slipping and grabbing.

During the investigation of another fatal Kiowa crash in Suffield the previous year, one of the clues was the crystalline structure of the broken filament in the HYDR BOOST caution light. The force of the machine's impact broke the filament while it was at a high temperature, which indicated that the hydraulic system had failed, causing the light to illuminate.

It takes time to gather all of these tiny details, analyse them, link them together, test various hypotheses, and reach a conclusion.


----------



## gaspasser

Pegcity said:
			
		

>


WOW, talk about taking the photo "as it happens"  Nice shots and very glad to hear that the pilot lives to fly another day.  Quick thinking on his part...


----------



## gaspasser

Baden  Guy said:
			
		

> Looks like Capt. Bews is now qualified to be a member of the Martin Baker  "Ejection Tie Club."
> 
> http://www.martin-baker.com/Sub-Navigation/Ejection-Tie-Club.aspx
> 
> "The club where you have to get thrown out to be allowed in."
> 
> http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/the-club-where-you-have-to-get-thrown-out-to-be-allowed-in-1019514.html


From what I've heard about punching out...can't say I'd boisterously wish to become a member of that club....However, the alternative....I hear that you end up a tad shorter than before... ???
Luckily a guy named Martin say fit to invent this fantastic life saving devise for flight.


----------



## karl28

I watched allot of the video that was provided by CTV.ca website . All I can say to that is glad that the pilot is alive and hope that the pilot can make a speedy recovery .


----------



## 57Chevy

Baden  Guy said:
			
		

> "The club where you have to get thrown out to be allowed in."



Actually.....one would have to be "punched out" to be allowed in.

Or.....maybe that's another club ;D


----------



## Fishbone Jones

57Chevy said:
			
		

> Actually.....one would have to be "punched out" to be allowed in.
> 
> Or.....maybe that's another club ;D



First rule is....... we don't talk about that club


----------



## WingsofFury

It's official - the remainder of the 2010 CF-18 demo season has been cancelled.



> Remainder of 2010 CF-18 Demo Team shows cancelled
> July 30, 2010
> 
> Winnipeg, Man. – The remainder of the 2010 air show season for the Canadian Forces CF-18 Demonstration Team, which comprises eight air show venues across North America, has been cancelled today.
> 
> Insufficient time to nominate and fully prepare a substitute pilot has made the continuation of the 2010 show season untenable. Air shows at which the Demo Team was scheduled to perform are:
> 
> ■Wetaskiwin Air Show: Wetaskiwin, Alta., August 6-7
> ■Abbotsford International Airshow: Abbotsford, B.C., August 13-15
> ■Windsor International Air Show: Windsor, Ont., August 21-22
> ■Val d’Or Air Show: Val d’Or, Que., August 28-29
> ■Canadian International Air Show: Toronto, Ont., September 4-6
> ■Nova Scotia International Air Show: Shearwater, N.S., September 11-12
> ■California International Airshow: Salinas, CA, October 2-3
> ■San Francisco Fleet Week: San Francisco, CA, October 9-10
> 
> The 2010 Demo Hornet jet crashed and was destroyed on July 23 during a practice session for the Alberta International Airshow in Lethbridge, Alta. Captain Brian Bews, the demo pilot from 425 Tactical Fighter Squadron based at 3 Wing Bagotville, Que., successfully ejected from the aircraft and is currently recovering from the back injury he sustained during the ejection sequence. He is expected to make a full recovery, but is not expected to fly for several months.
> 
> “It is unfortunate we will not be able to finish the season,” said Brigadier-General Richard Foster, Acting Commander 1 Canadian Air Division, “but we simply cannot and will not rush the preparation of another demo pilot. The well-being of our pilots and their safety will always be the deciding factors in such decisions.”
> 
> The exact cause of the crash is unknown at this time. A Flight Safety investigation is currently underway.
> 
> - 30 -
> 
> For more information, please contact:
> Captain Holly Brown
> Public Affairs Officer
> 1 Canadian Air Division/Canadian NORAD Region



http://www.forces.gc.ca/site/news-nouvelles/news-nouvelles-eng.asp?cat=00&id=3493


----------



## The Bread Guy

Initial _"From the Investigator"_ report now out here (also attached):


> During an airshow practice at Lethbridge County Airport, Hornet CF188738 experienced a loss of thrust from its right engine while conducting a high alpha pass at 300 ft above ground level (AGL).  Unaware of the loss of thrust but feeling the aircraft sink, the pilot selected military power on both throttles to the arrest descent.  The aircraft continued to sink and the pilot selected afterburner on both throttles.  The aircraft immediately began to yaw right and continued to rapidly yaw/roll right, despite compensating control column and rudder pedal inputs.  At approximately 150 feet AGL and about 90 degrees of right bank, the pilot ejected from the aircraft.   The aircraft continued to yaw/roll right with its nose descending in a tight right descending corkscrew prior to hitting the ground nose first.
> 
> The ejection and seat-man separation worked flawlessly but the pilot was injured when he touched down firmly under a stable chute.  After landing, the parachute shroud lines became entangled around the pilot’s left leg and the parachute re‑inflated before it could be released, causing him to be dragged several hundred meters.  The pilot was able to release the remaining Koch fittings just as members of the Sky Hawks, the Canadian Forces parachute demonstration team, arrived on scene to provide assistance.  First aid was administered to the pilot who was subsequently transported to the Regional Hospital.
> 
> Field examination of the engines did not reveal any anomalies.  Both engines were sent to the Quality Engineering and Test Establishment for a detailed inspection. Concurrently, photogrammetric analysis is taking place to ascertain certain flight and engine parameters which could not be recovered from the Advanced Memory Unit and other recording devices.  Finally, modeling and simulation has been undertaken to better understand the factors (e.g., throttle splits, altitude) affecting the aircraft’s recovery under various conditions.
> 
> The investigation will be focussing on the loss of thrust experienced by the right-hand engine, the factors that precluded an in-flight recovery of the aircraft, and CF-18 demonstration pilot training.


----------



## TazAwst

Ladies and gents, Capt. Bews ejected from a cf-18 using a Naces seat, SJU-17/B not mk.10 its more of a equivalent of the mk.14....and for those people who feel free to comment on something they think they know something about, but really do not. Leave your flight simulators at home and try and join to fly the real deal. then your opinions and comments may change.


----------



## aesop081

TazAwst said:
			
		

> Ladies and gents, Capt. Bews ejected from a cf-18 using a Naces seat, SJU-17/B not mk.10 its more of a equivalent of the mk.14....and for those people who feel free to comment on something they think they know something about, but really do not. Leave your flight simulators at home and try and join to fly the real deal. then your opinions and comments may change.



Hi Belka....back so soon ??


----------



## Strike

TazAwst said:
			
		

> Ladies and gents, Capt. Bews ejected from a cf-18 using a Naces seat, SJU-17/B not mk.10 its more of a equivalent of the mk.14....and for those people who feel free to comment on something they think they know something about, but really do not. Leave your flight simulators at home and try and join to fly the real deal. then your opinions and comments may change.



That's a great first post there.  Way to make an impression.

If you read through you'll note that the non-18 types have been deferring to the CF 18 pilot for confirmation/further information on the seat used in this specific ejection.


----------



## Good2Golf

TazAwst said:
			
		

> Ladies and gents, Capt. Bews ejected from a cf-18 using a Naces seat, SJU-17/B not mk.10 its more of a equivalent of the mk.14....and for those people who feel free to comment on something they think they know something about, but really do not. Leave your flight simulators at home and try and join to fly the real deal. then your opinions and comments may change.



Perhaps you should take some of your own advice here.  Your attitude in your first (to this username) two posts comes across as less than constructive or informative to the site and its members.

Let's say you are perhaps an ALSE-qualified 514 AVN tech who works the new NACES.  You could explain to the members here how the current CF-18 fleet has in fact both the older M-B Mk.10 seat, generally in the Cold Lake squadrons, and that it is the majority of the Bagotville aircraft that have already received the SJU-17 NACES.  That would have been more informative, wouldn't it?

However, since you note in your profile that you are a 409 TFS technician (you don't specify AVN, AVS or ACS), it would seem as though there is less likelihood of you working daily on the SJU-17....this is the part about your having been better off to provide some generic info on CF-18 ejection seats than taking the snarky attitude you did.

Welcome (back) to Milnet.ca, and hopefully you give consideration to your conduct on the site.  You have drawn attention to yourself in but a few scant hours, and we will oblige in keeping an eye on you.  First and last informal warning.

*Milnet.ca Staff*


----------



## observor 69

"However, since you note in your profile that you are a 409 TFS technician (you don't specify AVN, AVS or ACS),"

Please God not AVS !


----------



## SupersonicMax

Good2Golf said:
			
		

> You could explain to the members here how the current CF-18 fleet has in fact both the older M-B Mk.10 seat, generally in the Cold Lake squadrons, and that it is the majority of the Bagotville aircraft that have already received the SJU-17 NACES.  That would have been more informative, wouldn't it?



In all fairness G2G, all seats are now NACES.  No more Mk.10.


----------



## Good2Golf

SupersonicMax said:
			
		

> In all fairness G2G, all seats are now NACES.  No more Mk.10.



Thanks for the update, Max.  

At the time, there were still a few Mk.10's in YOD, right?

Regards
G2G


----------



## SupersonicMax

G2G, I believe so, but I'm not 100% positive.  All Bagotville Jets were modded at the time.


----------



## The Bread Guy

Next step:  <a href="http://is.gd/i2D01">the clean up</a>


> .... DEFENCE CONSTRUCTION CANADA (DCC) - #AC119506 - Soils Remediation of a CF18 Crash Site, Lethbridge County Airport -- The work includes, but is not necessarily limited to, the supply of labour, material, supervision and equipment necessary to remove, transport and dispose of approximately 900 tonnes of impacted surface soils (&lt;1.0m) at a licensed/permitted facility and the restoration of the site to pre-crash conditions …. *The estimated cost for this opportunity is in the order of $69,000.00* …. The tender closing date is: December 14, 2010 ….”


----------



## The Bread Guy

CBC.ca on the remediation tender call:


> It was an amazing escape. Now for the big clean up. In a government tender posted today, Defence Construction Canada is looking for people to help dig up and replace 900 tonnes of contaminated soil from the site where a CF-18 fighter jet crashed last summer in Lethbridge, Alta. On July 23, Canadian Forces Capt. Brian Bews successfully ejected from his fighter jet seconds before it crashed to the ground and exploded. Bews had been practicing a low-speed, low-altitude pass for the Alberta International Airshow at the Lethbridge Airport when he ran into trouble. Photos and video of the accident show the pilot narrowly missing the enormous fireball as his parachute floated to the airstrip. Bews suffered compression fractures to three vertebrae and was expected to make a full recovery. The government estimates it will cost roughly $69,000 to clean up the crash site.


Remember, you read it here first!


----------



## Rifleman62

http://www.travelchannel.com/TV_Shows/When_Vacations_Attack/Video/Air_Show_Crash_In_Canada

The story of a family visit to Lethbridge for the airshow was shown on the  "When Vacations Attack" program, The Travel Channel 17 Jan 11. The father had a big zoom lens camera. One picture shows the right engine (as posted previously) out.


----------



## Occam

The final report on the Flight Safety Investigation is out - engine malfunction it is.

http://www.rcaf-arc.forces.gc.ca/dfs-dsv/nr-sp/index-eng.asp?id=11159

I've always found these accident investigations fascinating, in a strange way...the level of information that the investigators can gather from whatever parts are left over is astounding.


----------



## jpjohnsn

Occam said:
			
		

> The final report on the Flight Safety Investigation is out - engine malfunction it is.
> 
> http://www.rcaf-arc.forces.gc.ca/dfs-dsv/nr-sp/index-eng.asp?id=11159
> 
> I've always found these accident investigations fascinating, in a strange way...the level of information that the investigators can gather from whatever parts are left over is astounding.


I heard from an imaging tech that one of the cool upshots of the newer digital cameras is the built-in GPS units.  You can take good hi-res shots of the wreckage in place and the camera will geo-tag the location of each shot.  You can use those coordinates to map out the scene faster and more accurately.


----------

