# All Things Socks (merged)



## Roger (4 Jan 2004)

Since I like to be prepared, I thought I would purchase some extra socks and underwear. I could not believe it when I was told I could not purchase them, I can purchase the plain grey socks and the green t-shirt but not the underwear or green socks.

Odd, I can buy German, British or US underwear and socks but in Canada I am not allowed. Typical of the Canadian Army.


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## Gunnar (4 Jan 2004)

I just saw a whole bunch of CDN army socks for sale at the MacGregor sock outlet just before Christmas.  That funky green colour you just love to wear...maybe that‘s why you can‘t get any...they‘re all in the stores, not in Stores....  ;-)

In any case, if there‘s a MacGregor near you, maybe you can pick some up.  The one I saw them at is in Lawrence Square, just a hop, skip and jump from Downsview.


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## Staff (5 Jan 2004)

Your socks, permiable shell (the black ones) AND underwear (even the new long johns) are exchangeable. Why do you need more? If you are going on an Op or FTX longer than a few days, there will be a laundry roto. Usually a two day turnaround. You are not allowed to purchase extra items of combat clothing because it is part of your individual scale of issue. The new socks and underwear are part of the clothe the soldier program, which is being issued as an all inclusive scale. Until everyone has been issued their basic scale, there will be no surplus for purchase. 

I know this because you are not the first to make this complaint. When I asked the RQ about it over beers, that was the answer he gave me.

What you saw in the surplus were probably knock-offs or fell off the back of a truck. Even maybe a Big Green Truck. It wouldn‘t be the first time.


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## Gunnar (5 Jan 2004)

They weren‘t surplus, they were in a sock store.  While I don‘t know whether or not they were of the current issue type, they were seconds...socks that were made for the Army, but which, due to minor imperfections such as slubs or something, would never be furnished to the Army.  But of course, advertised as imperfect, the rest of us are free to buy them.  And socks is socks.


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## Roger (5 Jan 2004)

Do they have a web sight....?


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## Staff (5 Jan 2004)

When i said "surplus", I didn‘t mean Army surplus stores . I meant that even if the military had millions of pairs, they would not sell them until everyone had received their basic issue.


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## SoldierBoi69 (11 Dec 2006)

Hi I'm a cadet going into the resurves and I was just wondering about the socks that are being worn over in Afghanistan, because the wool socks are all we get issued.


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## scoutfinch (11 Dec 2006)

They come in sets of twos... :


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## Franko (11 Dec 2006)

What specifically do you want to know about them?

I know the socks cadets get issued, we don't wear them. We have a different system.

Regards


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## 48thOfficer (11 Dec 2006)

On my first weekend of BMQ someone asked the same question. The platoon warrant replied by saying that he didnt care if you wore stockings and red panties under your cadpat as long as he couldnt see it. So I would gather that most of the guys in afghanistan probably went to the canex and picked up a 6 pack of socks. 

Then again, I wouldnt know... just my guess.


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## NL_engineer (11 Dec 2006)

The CF is issued a different sock system then cadets; as mentioned by RBD.  I'll assume that Vern will hop in with an answer soon.  All troops are issued a 3 piece sock system, black inners, green or gray wool outer socks.  I can not say for shore what socks the troops are wearing, as it is personal preference.


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## gaspasser (11 Dec 2006)

The last time I was in a desert environment, I was issued green nylon socks that totally sucked as they wore thru at the toes.  I would say with some uncertainty that the troops are wearing sport socks to help keep their feet partially dry.  The wool socks would just itch and suck.
Any comments from anyone overthere?
GP


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## Fishbone Jones (11 Dec 2006)

I wore the issue desert socks most of the time over there, and our green issue wool when the weather turned cold. Sport socks for PT.

Mudcruncher,

You'll get a whole new scale of issue when you join the Reserves. Besides being told what to take, if and when you get around to deploying, you'll also know what works by that time. Don't worry about these tiny things that will be happening so far in the future, concentrate on the here and now.


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## mysteriousmind (11 Dec 2006)

here is the info...

http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/Chief_Land_Staff/Clothe_the_soldier/hab/2/262_e.asp


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## Arctic Acorn (11 Dec 2006)

For operational deployments, you get issued a few pairs of lightweight, tan-coloured wool socks, known by different names; desert socks, desert region socks, etc.

They're great for hot weather, and as far as I can tell were part of the old Tropical uniform (with the shorts)...so, unrolled all the way, they go right up to the 'ol wedding tackle...

 :dontpanic:


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## gaspasser (11 Dec 2006)

recceguy, I couldn't agree more.  It does seem that someone is sweating the small shyte where he should be worrying about alot more than socks.  8)


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## Fishbone Jones (11 Dec 2006)

Do we really need to continue a thread where a cadet is asking what socks he'll be wearing five years from now...................maybe??


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## Sig_Des (11 Dec 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Do we really need to continue a thread where a cadet is asking what socks he'll be wearing five years from now...................maybe??



Nope. Socks..they go on your feet...you're wearing socks now...you'll be wearing some then..worry about those socks then. That's all he needs to know.


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## RHFC_piper (11 Dec 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Do we really need to continue a thread where a cadet is asking what socks he'll be wearing five years from now...................maybe??



Seems kinda pointless to begin with... it's not like they inspect your socks to see that you're wearing the issued gear... half the guys I was with over there would just wear white sport socks.

Also, they issued new socks for trials to my entire company (perhaps the whole battle group) before we deployed... by the time this young lad gets his kick at the dusty can, the new socks will be in the system.... maybe. :dontpanic:


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## NL_engineer (11 Dec 2006)

RHFC_piper said:
			
		

> Seems kinda pointless to begin with... it's not like they inspect your socks to see that you're wearing the issued gear... half the guys I was with over there would just wear white sport socks.



I was under the impression that the unit you deployed with would do that kind of thing  ;D


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## socksguy (5 Jul 2007)

Hi there,

I am wondering what type of socks you guys and gals wear on a daily basis. Are you supplied with socks, do you have to purchase them, how many pairs do you get etc...

Any info you can get me is greatly appreciated.
I would love to send the helpful people a few pairs of the best boot socks you could possible wear to try, so please help me out, and I will be happy to return the favour.

Thanks

Marty McCaffrey
www.wigwam.com


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## Yeoman (5 Jul 2007)

someone on here from my favourite socks I've got 
those merino wool/silks are the cats meow. I also wear the outlast hikers. pretty good sock, but if you wear them for more then a day, they tend to get really stiff on the bottom and cause some blisters.
not really sure about how it works for issues and what not. we've got a few bin rats on here that'll explain it better then this dumb paratrooper could about how the system works.
I also wear fox rivers. but generally that's with the desert boots. so they don't get worn that often.
but generally, I rock the merino wool/silks. I need more, hook me up  I'm a size ten heh.


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## Bzzliteyr (5 Jul 2007)

The military issues us with 5 pairs of three different sets of socks.. on the clothe the soldier site I believe you might be able to find details.

I personally have tried many different things in my career and have settled with the issue sock system of black polypro liners with the green wool/nylon? mix.

I have also tried (with success) ingenius socks by wigwam.. I have a few pairs of the grey hiking socks they make and have had them replaced for free when they wore through.


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## socksguy (5 Jul 2007)

I am just wondering if and where you are able to purchase additional pairs of socks (the same ones as the issued styles)

Are the issued socks a mandatory part of the uniform or are you allowed to subsitute your own preferences?

Thanks again for all the help...


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## Bzzliteyr (5 Jul 2007)

As I said.. I wore personal socks.. it's kind of like underwear, the army issues them but you are not forced to wear them.

You can order additional dress socks but the ones for field duty are simply 5 pairs, exchangeable..


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## PhilB (5 Jul 2007)

Here is a link to the issue sock system.

http://www.army.dnd.ca/Chief_Land_Staff/Clothe_the_soldier/hab/2/262_e.asp

Basically it comprises a thin black liner sock, an intermediate weight wool sock,and a heavy weight wool sock. From my understanding a soldier is entitled to an issue of socks every 6 months (Sup Techs please correct me if I am out to lunch). Personally I am not a fan of the issue sock system. I find the liner sock to be constricting and not overly adept at wicking sweat. Additionally it falls apart quite quickly. I use ingenious socks on a day to day basis and really like them.That being said I found them much to hot for the desert,and resorted back to the issue desert socks. I am still on the hunt for a good pair of desert socks. The ingenious socks would be great if they  were about half the weight. Hope this helps.


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## socksguy (6 Jul 2007)

Thanks for the info so far and please keep it coming. I am glad to hear that you all seem to like our Wigwam socks. 

PhilB, you mentioned that the Ingenius socks are too warm for the desert and that you still use the issued socks. I assume that is their green Temperate sock. Correct?

Thanks again everyone.


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## 1feral1 (6 Jul 2007)

Whatever happened to those 'socks, wool, grey'?? Are they still around?

Regards,

Wes


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## socksguy (6 Jul 2007)

Wes, are you looking for just the plain thick grey wool socks? Not a lot of companies still make them. There is much more attention paid to moisture wicking materials, temperature controlling materials and comfort nowadays.


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## Keebler (6 Jul 2007)

I use the ingenious for hiking and i imagine they would work well with the issued footwear in the CF. Wondering if anyone knows if recruits get the 3 sock system in basic. Or if i should buy a few more pairs of ingenious to take with me.


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## gore226 (6 Jul 2007)

Wes,

  Yes they are still out there....as a CIC officer all I am entitled to is the socks, wool, grey   ;D  I dont mind them, myself.  I have taken to wearing a polypro liner sock. ( I think the last ones were wigwam    ;D )

Chris


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## socksguy (6 Jul 2007)

Chris, please forgive my lack of knowledge, but as a CIC officer, what type of footwear are you wearing? Our liner socks are great. Glad to hear you have tried them.


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## gore226 (6 Jul 2007)

If I am in my DEU oxfords or parade boots.  If I am out with my cadets,combat boots.  I get a limited issue of field clothing.


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## socksguy (6 Jul 2007)

How does everyone find the issued socks in terms of durability? Do the socks wear out quickly? Do you simply get to return them and get new ones?

You guys are so helpful.

Somwhere along the way here, I will have to find a few samples for you...


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## gore226 (6 Jul 2007)

My limited experience:

wool grey - bomb proof

dress sock - they wear quickly ( I wear my DEU for regular trainning )

Chris


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## I_am_John_Galt (6 Jul 2007)

socksguy,

I hate the gray socks, and I've worn-through a few pairs (back in my mo-litia days when I wore the black cadillacs) ... I never wore a liner sock with them: maybe that was part of the problem ... these days, I do a whole lot less marching, but I like the ingenious socks and I also wear SmartWool (and I still don't wear liner-socks) ... I find that I can't wear the ingenious socks when it gets very warm (my feet sweat like crazy in them), but they are very comfortable otherwise.

FWIW, I wear the same socks hiking (ingenious or smartwool) and the ingenous running (which I do more than anything these days) sock is da bomb!

We get a clothing allowance with which we can replace the gray socks (point system, we can't 'substitute' anything else) but the combat sock system is an issue item.  If we want to wear anything else we generally can (I think it's technically not allowed, but I've never heard of anyone being told to change them, except on basic) but we have to pay for them out of our own pockets.

I'm a flyboy now, so take the above for what it's worth!  ;D


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## PhilB (6 Jul 2007)

In response to your questions, the desert socks are seperate from the 3 sock system that I sent the link to. The desert socks seem to be made out of very lightweight synthetic material, and are ridiculously long (go past your knee, so you have to fold them down). I am not a fan of the desert socks either as I found that they fell apart really quickly,and were much to long,but they are less hot than the three sock system.

I find that the wool outer socks hold up fine ,however as I mentioned above the black liner socks are extremely flimsy and get holes in them quite quickly. Additionally, I found that the green wool outer socks get very matted after long term field use. With my ingenious socks even after wearing them for long periods of time they feel the same. The green wool gets rigid and "crusty", Hope this all helps.


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## Bomber (7 Jul 2007)

PhilB, expect to see a new desert sock coming into limited service in the next few months.  Going to be a more indepth trial of th one conducted last summer with one of the VP units.  The old desert sock, actually a dress sock designed to be worn with Desert/Tropical shorts and ankle boots/ designer styled desert boots, is possibly, going the way of the dodo.


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## Bomber (7 Jul 2007)

Wigwam guy, how come you never came out of the wood work at any of the major shows to present some of your product.  I am wearing a pair of Lorpen's right now, and I got to tell you, I have hung up all my lite hikers.


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## Bzzliteyr (7 Jul 2007)

Bomber, if you tell higher ups to send me some sets for trial, I am heading over in the next month...


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## Kendrick (7 Jul 2007)

Like Bzz said, sign me up!


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## Eric_911 (7 Jul 2007)

Good Day Sockguy,

I'll answer a couple questions which so far have remained relatively untouched. 

Socks cannot be purchased through the military as the supply system has eliminated cash sales. The only exception is selected socks produced by Logistik Unicorp which make up part of a Member's Dress uniform (i'll explain further below)

Military members are issued a multitude of different socks, depending on your duties/postings/or element (Army/Navy/Airforce).

I'll break it down to the different sock systems:

*Goretex Sock System*  : Is issued to Army Personnel, Members posted to Army units, or Members deployed in support of Land Force Operations.
_Initial issue consists of :_ 5 pr Heavyweight Grey Wool socks, 5 pr Midweight Green Socks, and 5 pr Black moisture-wicking liner socks. The Life-cycle of the socks, upon being issued, is probably 6 months as mentioned previously. More info on this Sock System can be found at the CTS Website http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/Chief_Land_Staff/Clothe_the_soldier/hab/2/262_e.asp
_Some DND Clothing Stores will issue a member new socks (or any next-to-skin items) every 6 months or so (depending on the life-cycle of the item) and some DND Clothing Stores want the members to bring in the old worn out socks, and exchange them one-for-one/pair-for-pair_

*Standard "Socks, Wool, Grey" *  : Issued to all CF Members. Initial issue of 5 pr. These socks used to be one for one exchange (I do not know if clothing stores still stocks these socks) Members can now get a free issue of these socks through Logistik Unicorp's Website, utilizing Logistik's point system.

*Black or White Dress Socks* : Issued to all CF Members, Initial issue of 5 pr black socks for all elements, Navy may also sign for 5 pr white dress socks to go with their white dress uniform. Exchanges of these are the same as above, through Logistik Unicorp website using the points system.

*Socks, Deset, Tan* : Issued to members being deployed to arid regions. These socks are one time issue, specifically for deployment (socks may be exchanged in theater of operations if avail.) Worn in conjunction with desert boots or the Tropical Dress Uniform. Initial issue of 5 or 8 pr depending on operation.

*Goretex Liner* : Goretex Shell for Mucklucks (winter boots). Last ones I saw were manufactured by Mustang Survival. Initial issue is 1 or 2 pr (not exactly sure) These socks are one-for-one exchange only.

*please let me know if i missed any, i've issued many a sock, they all start blending together....   *

I have not seen any of these specific socks available commercially (except for the Goretex "Mustang Survival" ones), although I'm sure there is some knock-offs and variants available.

CF Members are told to wear certain socks with certain footwear. Non-issue clothing of any type is usually frowned upon by most units, but is is rare that anybody wearing "non-conforming" socks would get in trouble. With the sand-traps on the combat pants, nobody can see your socks anyways. When Marching, soldiers are usually left alone to use what works.

I personally dont mind the old "socks wool grey", because they come in my size. I'm not all that fond of the Goretex Sock System, because I fall into a size-gap.

Hope that helps,

Eric


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## willy (7 Jul 2007)

Eric_911 said:
			
		

> I'll break it down to the different sock systems:
> 
> *Goretex Sock System*  : Is issued to Army Personnel, Members posted to Army units, or Members deployed in support of Land Force Operations.
> _Initial issue consists of :_ 5 pr Heavyweight Grey Wool socks, 5 pr Midweight Green Socks, and 5 pr Black moisture-wicking liner socks.



There's nothing Gore-Tex about those socks at all.


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## Eric_911 (7 Jul 2007)

Sorry, my mistake, it is the Combat Sock System.....

I erroneously refferred to it as the "Goretex Sock System" because when the Combat Sock System was developped, it was designed for the Wet Weather Boot and Temperate Combat Boot. (According to the Fact Sheet: http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/Chief_Land_Staff/Clothe_the_soldier/hab/PDF/FactSheets/CSS_e.pdf  ) Since the "Temperate Combat Boot" (the cadpat boots) were not in the system, and still are not...... the only boot left is the WWB according to its concept of use....

Thanks for pointing that out....

Eric


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## DirtyDog (7 Jul 2007)

I was issued the grey wool socks and black dress socks at basic.  Never wore them, stuck to my few pairs of Ingenious's.  I was issued the sock system at battle school and have pretty much stuck with them and the ingenious socks but mostly the sock system.  For the record, I've yet to get a blister but my feet do get very hot at times and quite wet which has broke down a lot of my callouses.  

I was never issued the goretex socks, though I really wish I was.


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## socksguy (9 Jul 2007)

Thanks for all the info everybody. So the next step is finding out who handles the CTS program, how I get the right people testing our socks and when the current supplier contract ends...

Our socks are extremely durable, comfortable and popular from what you have written so far. Our newest models are even better, so we really need to get our socks in the trial process here.

It is extremely tough finding out who the buyers and testers are and when the contracts expire.

Thanks in advance to anyone who might have some details...

Marty


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## Bzzliteyr (9 Jul 2007)

And that explains why you were so interested..

If you want to launch me a pair or two (for wife and daughter too) we often go hiking and geocaching so we can put them through a civvy trial for you. I could use some civvy socks for chilling out around camp in Afghanistan..


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## DirtyDog (11 Jul 2007)

The only thing I've noticed with the Ingenious socks is that every time I pull them off after a hard day (or 2 or 3) is that they have left a "waffle" like pattern on my feet.  I'm guessing this results from the design of the inner and can't really say that it's really a problem, but I wonder how tight they might be on my feet.  I think they are thicker then the 2 sock system and fit a little tighter in the old Mark III's.  I like the feel of the black liners of the sock system and they are quite thin, especially after you pull them tight.  Mine are shopwing quite bit of wear however and the crustiness in the heels doens't really wash out.  

I've stuck mainly with the 2 sock system since being issued it because I've been satisfied with it and have been reluctant to switch back to the Ingenious's for something like a big march or field ex simply because the sock system hasn't let me down.  If it ain't broke, don't fix it.  I wore the Ingenious socks in basic at almost all times, but basic isn't much of a test and that was in winter conditions.  

I will start trying to wear the Ingenious socks in garriosn more to get a better evaulation and perhaps see if I'm comfortable wearing them in the field in the summer (or whenever it is I'll see significant amount of time in the field next).


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## Bzzliteyr (11 Jul 2007)

I sit here in my Ingenious socks and I just pulled one off to verify "waffling".  None.  Are you sure you have the correct sized socks?


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## I_am_John_Galt (11 Jul 2007)

I'm with DirtyDog: I get the same "waffling" and mine are very definitely the right size ... doesn't affect comfort or anything, but I have noticed my feet looking a little weird when I take them off ...


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## Greymatters (12 Jul 2007)

Eric_911 said:
			
		

> *Socks, Deset, Tan* : Issued to members being deployed to arid regions. These socks are one time issue, specifically for deployment (socks may be exchanged in theater of operations if avail.) Worn in conjunction with desert boots or the Tropical Dress Uniform. Initial issue of 5 or 8 pr depending on operation.



Wore these for over 15 years (washed after each use of course  ;D), loved em forever.  Hard to replace though...


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## socksguy (18 Jul 2007)

Thanks again for all the helpful info.
I am going to do my best to get our Wigwam socks in the trial processes with the military, but it is a hard process from what I have seen.

I truly believe that we could provide the best 3 sock program possible so that is the next goal.

Thanks

Marty


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## Jager (18 Jul 2007)

I've only ever used the socks issued at basic (the Woll, grey, and the Black 'dress' socks), I've just layered the black ones under the wool and have yet to get a blister, etc. Though I'm intrested in the Wigwam socks, as they look quite useful.


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## BDTyre (29 Jul 2007)

I've only every been issued the grey wool/nylon socks and I've never had problems.  I got short issued (only 3 pr), I bought two or three more and I ordered four or five more through LU so I think now I have around ten pairs.  They tend to fit better when they are newer, but the newer they are the more likely I am to get itchy legs when I take them off.  With the older pairs, I don't have this problem.  Never got any blisters from them.


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## medaid (29 Jul 2007)

I've gone away from the 3 sock system completely, and over all... military socks in general. I don't even wear MkIIIs anymore. I just wear regular white cotton sport socks with my Magnums, and they haven't blistered or anything after my BFT and other walks. 

I found the same flimsy problem with the liner sock. The green socks sort of crustiness is there too. However, I will admit that they were comfortable as hell new when I got them issued at Gagetown on my CAP course. These socks helped a bunch on those marches.

I haven't tried the WigWam socks yet. But heard nothing but good things about them. Maybe I will after this...


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## willy (29 Jul 2007)

I wear SmartWool religiously, as I find it to be absolutely, hands down, WAY better than anything else I've ever tried when sitting around in a nice safe place like Canada.  I do have a question though:

Do any medics on the board have anything to say about SmartWool or similar fabrics and their use on deployment?  I've had the great fortune to never be on fire before, and I'd be interested to hear what the experts have to say regarding all of the issued and non issued next-to-skin items out there- particularly in regard to FR and possible wearer injury.

Edit: grammar.


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## Trogdor (8 Aug 2007)

So I was just issued eight pairs of khaki desert socks for deployment to Afghanistan.  They say khaki on the tag, even though they are really more like a green.  Anyways I try them on when I get home and the damn things are freaking long as hell.  They go up mid theigh on me and they look more like a woman's nylons than army socks.  My question is why are they soo freaking long and what practical reason is there for this?  Also can any of you who've already been to the sandbox tell me what you would recommend for doing infantry work over there.  What kind of socksare the best over there?  Thanks


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## George Wallace (9 Aug 2007)

Sorry to nit pick; but what colour did you think Khaki was?  It isn't Tan.

We used to paint our vehicles with a standard three colour pattern.  Those colours were Black, Green and Khaki.  

Just wondering.

Now the length of the socks.  Have you seen any pictures from the Second World War, or from any recent time as a matter of fact, of soldiers in the Middle Eastern deserts wearing shorts?  Have you noticed their socks?

I'll now leave you to those who have been wearing them to comment on what are good and what are bad points.


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## Jammer (9 Aug 2007)

Use the socks you were issued, just fold them down. For me thay were the best for my feet.


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## 1feral1 (9 Aug 2007)

Mid thy, as in 'CFM boot mid thy' or do you mean mid lower leg???

AKA, the Rocky Horror Picture Show look   ;D

Ours are long too, but they are folded over, not a problem.

Regards,

Wes


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## Roy Harding (9 Aug 2007)

Wolfe117 said:
			
		

> So I was just issued eight pairs of khaki desert socks for deployment to Afghanistan.  They say khaki on the tag, even though they are really more like a green.  Anyways I try them on when I get home and the damn things are freaking long as hell.  They go up mid theigh on me and they look more like a woman's nylons than army socks.  My question is why are they soo freaking long and what practical reason is there for this?  Also can any of you who've already been to the sandbox tell me what you would recommend for doing infantry work over there.  What kind of socksare the best over there?  Thanks



Sounds like those that I was issued when I went to Iran in '88.  Although we were in combat throughout that tour, we were issued those socks - which I THINK were meant to go with the "hot weather dress uniform" (kharki shorts and short sleeve shirt) worn in Cyprus at the time.  I could be wrong - I was never in Cyprus (except on leave).

Regardless their origin - if those you have been issued are the same as the ones I was issued, they are good next to the skin socks - they wick the moisture away from the foot fairly well.  They're meant to be worn midway up the calf, and folded over on themselves, forming a "cuff".

Seems to me I still have a pair or two hanging around (I don't wear them much).


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## RHFC_piper (9 Aug 2007)

Wolfe117 said:
			
		

> My question is why are they soo freaking long and what practical reason is there for this?



Two words; Sand Fleas... enjoy.  




			
				Wolfe117 said:
			
		

> Also can any of you who've already been to the sandbox tell me what you would recommend for doing infantry work over there.  What kind of socksare the best over there?  Thanks



I used the issued 'stockings' and they worked well for me.... some guys wore white sports socks, some guys used the issued black stockings...  Go with what you find comfortable. But I'd suggest using the issued socks. They're made for a reason.
And like everyone else has said; just roll them down.


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## Franko (9 Aug 2007)

Fold them down like others have said and you won't have a problem. They are comfortable and do a pretty good job of wicking sweat away.

I found the desert socks wore out after about 3 months so I bought tube socks at the PX. 

Their cheap and if they get ratty you can turf them. $3 US for a pack of 8...can't beat that.

Seems to me that a few of the guys were wearing another kind of sock that was popular, but a bit on the pricey side.

Wigwam....I think?

Speaking of ratty, your desert boots are going to get real funky.....Lysol to the rescue.       

Regards


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## MJP (9 Aug 2007)

Wigwam's are the cat's meow.  I wore then exclusively over there and even on the hottest days they fared excellent in comparison the issued desert socks.  Issued ones wear out too fast and are too thin(I find) for any kind of comfort.  I would highly recommend Wigwam (the Merino/silk ones rock) if you are a soldier that will be spending most of your time outside the wire.  They last a whole lot longer than anything issued and are by far some of the most comfortable socks you'll buy.  Lots of stores have them and yes they may be pricey but if ya buy one pair a pay for a few months your collection adds up.


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## geo (9 Aug 2007)

WRT issued things that wear out....

- they can be exchanged - if they are in stock and your RQ is doing his job right....

Problem with "gucci" kit is that, if it's stolen, lost or damaged, it's only going to be replaced on your nickle.
Let the Gov't spend your tax dollars on you


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## RHFC_piper (9 Aug 2007)

geo said:
			
		

> WRT issued things that wear out....
> 
> - they can be exchanged - if they are in stock and your RQ is doing his job right....



Just to reinforce geo's point;  They're fairly well stocked over there when it comes to socks, undies and t-shirts (less on the T-shirts)... at least when I was there they were, and hopefully they're more so stocked now.  

AND;



			
				geo said:
			
		

> Problem with "gucci" kit is that, if it's stolen, lost or damaged, it's only going to be replaced on your nickle.
> Let the Gov't spend your tax dollars on you



Remember too... If there's blood on it, yours or others, it is contaminated and will be destroyed. 

The gucci gear is sometimes more cumfortable/usefull/better in everyway but usually comes at a high price, especially when lost, stolen or damaged.



BTW: besides being a form of shelter, and in reference to the topic at hand; what are Wigwams?


----------



## MG34 (9 Aug 2007)

Wigwam socks are about the best you can buy,the Outlast socks were all I wore over there.


----------



## RHFC_piper (9 Aug 2007)

MG34 said:
			
		

> Wigwam socks are about the best you can buy,the Outlast socks were all I wore over there.



By chance, do you have a link to a supplier/maker? (if they're available online)


----------



## Armymedic (9 Aug 2007)

Harder to find, but better...

Thorlo.

To answer teh original question...The issue desert socks are long to protect your lower legs to your knee. They were designed (now this should not suprise anyone...) and intially procured at a time when Cdn soldiers (read peacekeepers) wore shorts with thier uniforms. The top of the sock is folded down so that the top edge of cloth would be an inch or so below the knee. Worn this way protects against sand and insects while still being fairly cool.

If worn in our current situation with a unbloused pant leg...the sock still provides a bit more protection up the shin than shorter non-issued socks...esp if you are spraying on Permethrin on your lower pant leg to keep Sand Flys and other cooties out.


----------



## PMedMoe (9 Aug 2007)

St. Micheals Medical Team said:
			
		

> esp if you are spraying on Permethrin on your lower pant leg to keep Sand Flys and other cooties out.



Shouldn't have to be spraying Permethrin on, the uniform should already be treated.


----------



## geo (9 Aug 2007)

PMedMoe said:
			
		

> Shouldn't have to be spraying Permethrin on, the uniform should already be treated.



On prior rotos, the stuff was being sprayed on in theatre.  Believe new kit is being treated prior to issue... but, might it not be necessary to "reload" after 6 mths? ( NCE are in theatre for 9 mths )


----------



## McG (9 Aug 2007)

I wore grey PT socks.  They were a little warmer but I found more comfortable & made the boot fit better.  I used the issue socks as boot covers to keep critters out while I slept.  They seemed to do well for that.



			
				geo said:
			
		

> new kit is being treated prior to issue...


Kit was treated by the soldier after issue & before deployment.


----------



## PMedMoe (9 Aug 2007)

geo said:
			
		

> On prior rotos, the stuff was being sprayed on in theatre.  Believe new kit is being treated prior to issue... but, might it not be necessary to "reload" after 6 mths? ( NCE are in theatre for 9 mths )



For long tours, we don't use the spray as it washes out after six launderings.  The permethrin dip treatment is "good" for six months.  Yes, people on longer tours should have their uniforms retreated.  That would be something to bring up with the PMeds on camp.  
I know they have loads of supplies because I had fun stacking it all on a pallet and then wrapping it with the world's largest tube of Saran wrap   prior to the move from Kabul to KAF.  And then, at KAF, I got to sort out the seacan, which, at the time, was also my office!!  :


----------



## Scotty Hortonville (9 Aug 2007)

Wolfe117 said:
			
		

> They go up mid theigh on me and they look more like a woman's nylons than army socks.



Three words, Man-Love-Thursday's. Just try to find an extra long tshirt and throw on a belt.

Seriously though, I tried to keep a couple pairs in reserve for towards the end of the tour. I stayed in KAF the whole time but had my feet in boots upwards of 14+ hours a day and the wore out quick. But the issues ones were a great 'weight' i.e thickness, and I just folded them down.


----------



## chris_log (29 Nov 2008)

Did a search and couldn't find an answer to this question (believe it or not). I'm looking for a good set of cold weather socks, I use the Wigwam base camp fusion (or whatever they call them now) socks for summer, spring etc. I've heard they work well in winter as well, although I can't really wrap my head around the concept of a sock that functions well at +30 and -30. Anyways, does anyone have any recommendations (preferrably from a retailer then I can go to to check them out before I buy them, I'm in SW Ontario near the GTA)?


----------



## Mike Baker (29 Nov 2008)

Check out CP Gear. I think they have good cold weather socks.


----------



## chris_log (29 Nov 2008)

The Beaver said:
			
		

> Check out CP Gear. I think they have good cold weather socks.



I did, and I had their 'cold weather socks' (those wigwam 40 below socks) but I found they didn't pull up high enough to be worn comfortably with boots and kept slipping down and bunching up.


----------



## BinRat55 (29 Nov 2008)

Don't like our sock system?


----------



## Nfld Sapper (29 Nov 2008)

I don't  ;D

I much prefer the sports sock/old grey combat sock (or the ones you get off logistiks) system.


----------



## BinRat55 (29 Nov 2008)

The "sport sock under the grey wooley" was all I ever wore - comfortable as hell. But I found the black / green sock system stopped my blisters. Haven't had one since!!


----------



## Nfld Sapper (29 Nov 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> The "sport sock under the grey wooley" was all I ever wore - comfortable as hell. But I found the black / green sock system stopped my blisters. Haven't had one since!!



And I am the opposite black/green = blisters


----------



## PhilB (30 Nov 2008)

I wear my desert socks pretty much most of the year. In winter I wear desert socks with the new issue grey winter sock. Not the old scratchy wool sock, but the new grey sock that you get with the Green/black sock system. Wow too many socks!


----------



## chris_log (1 Dec 2008)

Thanks for the responses folks. Always appreciated.



			
				BinRat55 said:
			
		

> Don't like our sock system?



I'm not a fan of wearing two pairs of socks. But yes, I don't mind the issued system. However, I bought my own socks because my local ASU doesn't have any issued socks in stock in my size. Actually, that's not fair. I just haven't received a new issue of said socks (and never got the grey winter ones) for over two years which means the ones I have are now totally worn out. I have not received any fresh pairs because whenever I go down they are always out. I've gone through a number of different sets of pairs (thorlos etc) and finally settled on the wigwam's (a rather expensive testing process, regrettebly). 

I'll keep trying whenever I drop in on my ASU, but I've resorted to buying my own socks (and boots, and underwear etc) because I can't ever seem to get what I need. I don't really mind, my ASU is pretty low in priority compared to other bases and I'd rather the local 'Mo folks get the kit they need then me. Anyhoo, thanks for the answers folks.


----------



## Leeworthy (4 Dec 2008)

These new socks are the best thing since sliced bread IMO. IM allergic to wool/synthetic grey ones so I would wear em and my legs would feel like they are on fire.

Now, if only I can find a toque that  isnt wool that we are authorized to wear.


----------



## BinRat55 (4 Dec 2008)

FarmerD said:
			
		

> These new socks are the best thing since sliced bread IMO. IM allergic to wool/synthetic grey ones so I would wear em and my legs would feel like they are on fire.
> 
> Now, if only I can find a toque that  isnt wool that we are authorized to wear.



If you were to present your medical chit to clothing stores, they would purchase a toque that you could wear - authorized and all.


----------



## daftandbarmy (4 Dec 2008)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> If you were to present your medical chit to clothing stores, they would purchase a toque that you could wear - authorized and all.



There's that darned log system again... trying to be helpful.  

I'm too tall for the issue sleeping bag by at least a couple of inches. I finally (after a couple of decades) decided to see if I could do something about it and, assuming I'd get the runaround, called local clothing stores to see what they could do. The lady on the phone says "Hey, I've got a sleeping bag just your size right here. I'll put it under my desk. Drop in and pick it up and sign for it when you get a chance". A week later I'm now the proud owner of a Drop Zone bag that fits me perfectly. Now that's customer service...


----------



## Leeworthy (4 Dec 2008)

Thats sweet. If every base had Supp Techs like that who cared about their customers, the CF would be a much better place!


----------



## BinRat55 (4 Dec 2008)

FarmerD said:
			
		

> Thats sweet. If every base had Supp Techs like that who cared about their customers, the CF would be a much better place!



PM inbound...


----------



## DannyITR (26 Oct 2009)

I did a search for "socks" but all I got were equipment and rucksack packing threads. 

I was wondering if you guys could share which socks you wear at which times. On course I'm always wearing regular black socks with wool socks over them to make the boot snugger for less chance of blisters. I'll add my waterproof socks if its wet. This goes for year round. Around the unit on Tuesdays I'll tend to skip the wool socks and just wear the black socks but I've gotten a blister from time to time because the boot is looser. 

What do you guys do as a general rule of thumb?


----------



## MikeL (26 Oct 2009)

Save the wool socks(assuming they aren't the CTS ones) for inspections an get that CF sock system - black liners, green outer socks an wool winter outer socks.

When its warm out I usually just wear the socks we got issued for Afghanistan but if I'm gonna be doin ruck marches, etc I go for the black an green socks. When its cooler/cold I wear the black liners with either the green or wool socks.

Thats what works for me though, not everyone's feet/comfort is the same. Try a few things out an see what works best for you.


----------



## punkd (26 Oct 2009)

Icebreaker Merino wool socks. Mostly the Hiker Lite/Medium Cushion.
They're expensive but well worth it.


----------



## Fusaki (26 Oct 2009)

99% of the time, I only ever wear the issued black CTS socks. 

I find the black/green combo too hot.  Moisture is the enemy and I'm generally more comfortable with one thin, cool, sweat wicking layer.  I think it's because my feet are drier that I rarely have blisters.

On Winter Ex, I'll bring a couple pairs of green socks just in case. It's not often I'll wear them though.  They're more for my piece of mind.  Just knowing that they're there if I need them is good for my morale.


----------



## PMedMoe (26 Oct 2009)

If they made the black/green sock combo in my size, I'd probably like them, but as it is, they are about 2-3 sizes too big so the heel ends up about halfway up the back of my leg.

I just did a BFT a week ago and as I usually have a problem with blisters.  I wore three pairs of socks.  The black nylon ones next to skin (turned inside out so that the seam doesn't cause a blister), then cotton tube socks, then a pair of very snug wool socks.  Sounds weird, but it worked.  I was worried about one of the inside ones sliding down but they didn't.  I had the tops of the black pair and the cotton pair folded over the top of the wool one.

I wish the military would make tube socks instead of socks with heels.   :-\


----------



## navymich (26 Oct 2009)

I tried the black/green combo for a few weeks last year when I first got them.  Liked it at first but then found them uncomfortable as my feet would get too warm and start slipping a bit.  Sticking with what I've worn for my whole career: simple white sport sock (not too thick) and basic issued gray wool socks.


----------



## PMedMoe (26 Oct 2009)

airmich said:
			
		

> Sticking with what I've worn for my whole career: simple white sport sock (not too thick) and basic issued gray wool socks.



I do that for everyday wear, but I don't for rucksack marches as I understand cotton may cause blisters, hence the nylon sock inside.


----------



## Loachman (26 Oct 2009)

The only socks that I wear are the grey woollies, unless I am wearing dress shoes whereupon I wear the black nylon ones over top. I've been doing that for almost thirty-seven years.

I do not walk long distances as much as I used to, but I still do the BFT annually, without blister problems. I use Sole Footbeds (CP Gear, Canex, or Mark's Work Wearhouse) and Magnum Stealth boots (this year) and Mark IIIs previously. Make sure that they fit properly.


----------



## Armymedic (26 Oct 2009)

I will leave you with only one word about the best socks I have ever worn in my boots:

Thorlos


----------



## Danjanou (26 Oct 2009)

Sorry I saw the words socks, configuration, and "general" in the same thread and thought.......well let's just not go there. :


----------



## ajp (27 Oct 2009)

Before I joined the Mo and carried on to my current status I was an avid outdoorsman (I think age is curing that).  I always wore a white cotton sock under a thick wool socvk.  And still do.  I have tried all of the variety of synthetics but they don't seem to work for me...they may wick but they cause me to sweat like a river.  So its cotton, wool and in the odd case I end up in the field and its raining that bad I still use the gore tex socks over that.  I have only had a few BFT type blisters over the years and in those few cases I just suck it up.  I have never been immobilized by part of my foot sloughing off.


----------



## Teflon (27 Oct 2009)

I do my best to always wear a pair on my feet when ever I'm going to work


----------



## OldSolduer (27 Oct 2009)

Whatever I pull out of the drawer in the morning.


----------



## Kat Stevens (27 Oct 2009)

I always went with foot, then sock, then boots.  Pants on before boots makes life easier too.  I'm here to help.


----------



## OldSolduer (27 Oct 2009)

Another tip:

Underwear first, then pants.


----------



## Trinity (28 Oct 2009)

In garrison - issued thin black socks

In the field - "Running Room" dual layered socks.


----------



## tango22a (28 Oct 2009)

OldSoldier;

You only require under garments if you are NOT a closet Commando!!

Cheers,


tango22a


----------



## Greymatters (28 Oct 2009)

PMedMoe said:
			
		

> ...as I understand cotton may cause blisters...



Military myth as far as Im concerned - been wearing white sport cotton sock and then the appropriate color over top for over 25 years and the only time I had problems with blisters was due to new boots that I hadnt had time to break in properly...


----------



## Eye In The Sky (28 Oct 2009)

My sock configuration?

All of mine have one end that is sewn shut, and one end that isn't.

Using the end that is _open_, I pull them on my feet.  Sometimes, I pull more socks over the first pair, using the exact same technique.  

 ;D


----------



## ajp (28 Oct 2009)

EITS - your comment brings to mind the Sgt asking me (as a young Pte) "what end of the broom I used to sweep the floor" to whick I relied " I usually use the big end Sarge> and he laughed his ass off thinking I occaisionally used the small end.  

As for the underwear/pants first issue....do Kilted pers go kilt or socks first....assuming they are going commando?


----------



## helpup (28 Oct 2009)

For myself, I wear the green ones. Prior to that it was the old grey wool type. ( making sure to have the same colored thread to keep certain CO's happy)

For both socks if we were doing a hump or BFT/2by10 I would include a pair of sport socks.  The only time I have had troubles is when I didnt.  everyones foot is differant though.

Mind you for my troops those that have had problems tend to have both black and green socks on thier feet.  Once I tell them to try a sport sock instead of the black one they never had another problem.  I am not saying the black ones do not work.  I just found they dont work for everyone.


----------



## PMedMoe (28 Oct 2009)

Greymatters said:
			
		

> Military myth as far as Im concerned



That's why I used the phrase _"I understand"_.  I have never done it myself as I have had horrible blisters (usually on the botton of the feet) and was practically unable to walk.

See what I got when I used Google for cotton socks blisters.

Maybe your feet don't sweat much. maybe you're just lucky.  Who knows?


----------



## ajp (28 Oct 2009)

I agree cotton is the worst, even though I use it myself under the everyone is different policy.  I used to sell camping gear and footwear and if anyone had issues with synthetic socks I would suggest layered cotton under another wool type, and often (not always) got good results.  THe only times I dont have wool (the old grey ones) and cotton are in sandals - no socks, dress shoes - cotton under a dress sock, and running - cotton only.  Thats just me.  Even my mess kit boots are fit for cottun under a dress sock.


----------



## Eye In The Sky (28 Oct 2009)

Fit for cottun??  Holy crap, what size are those puppies?

 ;D


----------



## ajp (28 Oct 2009)

Always a comedian!!!


----------



## gcclarke (28 Oct 2009)

When wearing my sea boots I typically just wear a pair of thick cheap white Wal*Mart tube socks. At one point I wore the whole thin black and grey wool combo during an A/WUPs (The WUPS is for worksups. I forget what the A part is but it means it wasn't required by our operational schedule, the Captain just asked for it), as I had heard that sometimes doing otherwise can get you in trouble. After the first week went by without hearing about them checking what's in your boots, I went back to the usual.


----------



## navymich (29 Oct 2009)

//off topic



			
				gcclarke said:
			
		

> ...A/WUPs (The WUPS is for worksups. I forget what the A part is but it means it wasn't required by our operational schedule, the Captain just asked for it...



A = Assisted.  And sometimes it's not just the CO asking for it.  I've seen Sea Training push for it if, for example, the ship continues to fail at non-scheduled exercises etc.


----------



## Greymatters (29 Oct 2009)

PMedMoe said:
			
		

> See what I got when I used Google for cotton socks blisters.



Cant argue with that - maybe some people have tougher soles than others...?

Edit - Maybe not... that study is for one pair of socks, whereas I always wear a pair overtop of the cotton socks...


----------



## PMedMoe (29 Oct 2009)

Greymatters said:
			
		

> Maybe not... that study is for one pair of socks, whereas I always wear a pair overtop of the cotton socks...



Just about all the results state that cotton _next to skin_ will cause blisters.  But, as I said, everyone is different.  I really liked my polypropylene socks but I can't seem to find another pair that fit.   :-[


----------



## helpup (29 Oct 2009)

I use cotton to fill out my boots and remove any of the stretch that has occured in my boots.  They are there to obsorbed the sweat and I will admit they can get wet quickly.  when I am going on a long hump in wet weather or long enough to get the sock soaked I just change socks.  But from my experience it takes a lot of moisture or time wearing it to get to that point.  In sneakers mind you they tend to get wet quicker and hence the blister problem. I have tried the cost more Civi variants and with some success but at heart I am a cheap bugger that selects what snib kit I use. 

The black nylon socks as part of a layer system.  Well it does work for some but not my feet.  And I have enough evidence to convince me that it also causes enough issues with those who continue to get blister.  How many it prevents is up to those who have success with it to argue about.


----------



## ballz (29 Oct 2009)

I liked my goretex more than my combats (Mark IVs), I just wear the black liners in them. In my combats my food used to slide around with the black liners, when I was marching people around me could hear "squeek" everytime my heel hit the ground, that was my heel sliding up and down the boot...

We weren't allowed to wear our goretex for some reason on our BFT, so I had to find a way of stopping my foot from sliding quick. I tried out the greens (no liners) and found my combats way more comfy, snug but comfy like a slipper, and had no foot problems for the 13km. I haven't switched back since.


----------



## VIChris (29 Oct 2009)

ballz said:
			
		

> I liked my goretex more than my combats (Mark IVs), I just wear the black liners in them. In my combats my *food* used to slide around with the black liners, when I was marching people around me could hear "squeek" everytime my heel hit the ground, that was my heel sliding up and down the boot...
> 
> We weren't allowed to wear our goretex for some reason on our BFT, so I had to find a way of stopping my foot from sliding quick. I tried out the greens (no liners) and found my combats way more comfy, snug but comfy like a slipper, and had no foot problems for the 13km. I haven't switched back since.



What the heck are you doing with food in your boots?


----------



## Eye In The Sky (30 Oct 2009)

:rofl:


----------



## helpup (30 Oct 2009)

ballz said:
			
		

> I liked my goretex more than my combats (Mark IVs), I just wear the black liners in them. In my combats my food used to slide around with the black liners, when I was marching people around me could hear "squeek" everytime my heel hit the ground, that was my heel sliding up and down the boot...
> 
> We weren't allowed to wear our goretex for some reason on our BFT, so I had to find a way of stopping my foot from sliding quick. I tried out the greens (no liners) and found my combats way more comfy, snug but comfy like a slipper, and had no foot problems for the 13km. I haven't switched back since.



Umm were you not told that the black socks were meant to be worn as a layer under the green socks to provide "a friction free" layer that will also " wick-a-way" moisture.  They were never meant to be worn just by themselves.


----------



## ajp (30 Oct 2009)

I actually saw a young officer wearing the black socks like knee high dress socks, that kept sliding down apparently.  He assumed that they were because they went so well inside his oxfords.


----------



## Danjanou (30 Oct 2009)

ajp said:
			
		

> I actually saw a young officer wearing the black socks like knee high dress socks, that kept sliding down apparently.  He assumed that they were because they went so well inside his oxfords.



At least he wasn't wearing shorts and open toe sandals with them.


----------



## helpup (30 Oct 2009)

Danjanou said:
			
		

> At least he wasn't wearing shorts and open toe sandals with them.



Mark my words that look will come back into fashion......... can it be worse then the pants hanging down the butt and the gangsta look in Rural Canada?


----------



## Journeyman (30 Oct 2009)

helpup said:
			
		

> *Mark my words that look will come back into fashion.........*



I rely on People of Walmart for all my fashion advice


----------



## Danjanou (30 Oct 2009)

thanks bud a Lunch hour wasted on that site has been the highlight of my day.  8)


----------



## helpup (30 Oct 2009)

and no mater where you live Wal-Mart has similar client's


----------



## NL_engineer (30 Oct 2009)

For the past 6 and a half months I have been wearing the old desert socks, and I think I will continue to wear them.


----------



## Danjanou (30 Oct 2009)

helpup said:
			
		

> and no mater where you live Wal-Mart has similar client's



And that's what scares me. I'm doing a weekend shift shilling poppies for my RCL branch at one  and I don't know if I'll be able to remain sombre and serious after viewing that thread. 


I will bring my camera though.  8)

....and remember to wear socks too.


----------



## Journeyman (30 Oct 2009)

Danjanou said:
			
		

> ....and remember to wear socks too.


....and your sexiest muffin top under that Legion blazer


----------



## ballz (2 Nov 2009)

VIChris said:
			
		

> What the heck are you doing with food in your boots?



Haha nice catch



			
				helpup said:
			
		

> Umm were you not told that the black socks were meant to be worn as a layer under the green socks to provide "a friction free" layer that will also " wick-a-way" moisture.  They were never meant to be worn just by themselves.



Yes I was told that. However the black and green combo is awfully warm, especially in goretex, and especially in May-Aug when I did my BMOQ. I found what worked for me, so I stuck to it.


----------



## helpup (2 Nov 2009)

just checking. I have seen some who just wear the black as they thought that green was for when it got cold out and they couldnt understand why they were getting blisters


----------



## Kevin_M (2 Nov 2009)

I use to always use the black thin socks with the green ones overtop but now just use the green ones alone.

In the field I like to wear some thick moisture "resistant" ones. Keep my feet much drier then the issued socks. Did cost about $10 a pair mind you.


----------



## j_drews105 (12 Aug 2011)

I just got kicked out of the mess for having shoes without socks.

The rules state that bare feet, and bare feet with sandals are not allowed.

I don't see anywhere that says I must be wearning socks when wearing shoes. Is this a rule?
I mean really I could wear combat boots in there without socks and who would ever know, or care.


----------



## medicineman (12 Aug 2011)

Every dining room has the dress regs clearly posted for the diners to read prior to entry, and they're also generally posted somewhere in Base Standing Orders.  I'd suggest re-reading them and if they say you can wear full toed footwear with/without socks, point it out to the duty staff.  If it doesn't or clearly states you must wear socks with low footwear, go and put your socks on and go back...or eat somewhere more accomodating to how you want to dress.

MM


----------



## Bzzliteyr (12 Aug 2011)

What kind of shoes were you wearing?


----------



## Maxadia (12 Aug 2011)

It doesn't state that you're not allowed to pick you WO's nose for him either.  But I _really_ wouldn't suggest it.

If you're going to try and do things just because they're not stated, as opposed to common sense, then you're going to have a rough period here in the next little while, me thinks.


----------



## j_drews105 (12 Aug 2011)

medicineman said:
			
		

> Every dining room has the dress regs clearly posted for the diners to read prior to entry, and they're also generally posted somewhere in Base Standing Orders.  I'd suggest re-reading them and if they say you can wear full toed footwear with/without socks, point it out to the duty staff.  If it doesn't or clearly states you must wear socks with low footwear, go and put your socks on and go back...or eat somewhere more accomodating to how you want to dress.



Amongst the various other rules it said:
Bare feet, or bare feet with sandals is not allowed.

There was nothing else regarding footwear. I pointed this out to the duty staff who told me it was common CF rules that socks are required in all messes. I disagree with this, but I decided not to eat there and went to Subway.




			
				RDJP said:
			
		

> If you're going to try and do things just because they're not stated, as opposed to common sense, then you're going to have a rough period here in the next little while, me thinks.



I was trying to eat dinner in my normal shoes that I chose not to wear socks with. I wasn't trying to do this because it wasn't stated on the rules.

In fact I didn't even know what was stated on the rules but was pretty shocked when I was kicked out, so I read them. And as stated above, it doesn't say that you require socks. It does mention that you can't have bare feet with sandals though. I feel if they wanted to ensure you had socks with all forms of footwear this would have been stated.

Now it could be in the base rso's, which I will examine next week before I talk to the RSM since I gladly gave the duty guy my name.


----------



## Maxadia (12 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> Amongst the various other rules it said:
> Bare feet, or bare feet with sandals is not allowed.
> 
> There was nothing else regarding footwear. I pointed this out to the duty staff who told me it was common CF rules that socks are required in all messes. I disagree with this, but I decided not to eat there and went to Subway.



So do you need a regulation stating that bare feet with any type of footwear is not allowed?  Is that your hill to die on?


----------



## j_drews105 (12 Aug 2011)

RDJP said:
			
		

> So do you need a regulation stating that bare feet with any type of footwear is not allowed?  Is that your hill to die on?



If they go through the effort of saying 'bare feet or bare feet with sandals is not allowed' then why wouldn't they say 'bare feet or bare feet with any footwear' is not allowed if that is what they mean?

So yes that is my hill to stand on.

I would be much more accepting of it if it didn't say anything at all with regards to footwear; or if there were no rules at all in place. But when there are rules, and they are laid out in a way that seems to allow what I am doing, then I am pissed off.


----------



## j_drews105 (12 Aug 2011)

Rules for the jr ranks mess:

4.Footwear; Sandals, w/heel strap, Loafers, Runners, with or without socks.


----------



## REDinstaller (12 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> So yes that is my hill to stand on.



You should pick a better hill to die on. I don't think the Base RSM will give you any chance of swaying this policy. It is for hygiene, not fashion. If this pisses you off then maybe you haven't found the right line of work and should keep looking somewhere else.


----------



## MJP (12 Aug 2011)

Tango18A said:
			
		

> You should pick a better hill to die on. I don't think the Base RSM will give you any chance of swaying this policy. It is for hygiene, not fashion. If this pisses you off then maybe you haven't found the right line of work and should keep looking somewhere else.



Really?  Footwear without socks is unhygienic? Sources or is that blown out your tosh?  Maybe PMedMoe can chime in with a more rationale response but I find that line of reasoning absurd with fully covered shoes.  



			
				Tango18A said:
			
		

> If this pisses you off then maybe you haven't found the right line of work and should keep looking somewhere else.


It pisses me off to apply blanket nonsensical rules with no reasoning as much as should piss off any supervisor that is in charge of troops.


----------



## Bzzliteyr (12 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> Rules for the jr ranks mess:
> 
> 4.Footwear; Sandals, w/heel strap, Loafers, Runners, with or without socks.



I think the answer is right there and all he needs to do is tactfully approach the person who told him "no" and inform him of his error.


----------



## Nfld Sapper (12 Aug 2011)

Question is was he kicked out for the JR drinking mess or the base EATING mess....


----------



## Bzzliteyr (12 Aug 2011)

Very good point.. kitchen vs mess.


----------



## PPCLI Guy (12 Aug 2011)

MJP said:
			
		

> It pisses me off to apply blanket nonsensical rules with no reasoning as much as should piss off any supervisor that is in charge of troops.



Sing it brother!


----------



## PMedMoe (12 Aug 2011)

Okay, the whole footwear with socks is a non-PMed issue, nor is it "unhygienic".  If that's the dress regs, that's the dress regs.  Put on a pair of socks for meals and have done with it.  Unfortunately, every Mess/Base is different.


----------



## mariomike (12 Aug 2011)

NFLD Sapper said:
			
		

> Question is was he kicked out for the JR drinking mess or the base EATING mess....



The title says, "dining mess".

Sounds like it may be an etiquette issue:
http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/1498.0


----------



## the 48th regulator (12 Aug 2011)

Fight the Power brother, and Don't let the man hold you down!

These show how

dileas

tess


----------



## OldSolduer (12 Aug 2011)

:facepalm:

sighhhhhh.......


----------



## Maxadia (13 Aug 2011)

When one isn't enough.....


----------



## Webski (13 Aug 2011)

First off, I would suggest that brothers in Afghanistan have more priority than your socks.
Dress accordingly, and man up to what not the rules are but what is "considered acceptable".
I'm done.
Kim


----------



## Journeyman (13 Aug 2011)

I was going to avoid this whole crisis, but then I recalled the fashion regulations posted at the Base All-Ranks Feeding Facility (or BARFF) in Gagetown. 
It specifically stated that socks had to be worn with sandals by males, but not for females.   ???


Mind you, in that fine grazing facility, my footwear tended to be combat boots...so if I _did_ have a pedicure and painted toenails, it was wasted.


----------



## Pusser (13 Aug 2011)

I've never understood the whole sock issue.  The unhygienic argument is a complete load of crap.  Why are some folks in the CF so uptight about this when no restaurant is?  I understand the dress regulation argument, but folks also need to consider time and place.  If can wear shorts in the mess, why can't you follow current fashion and not wear socks with your deck shoes and sandals?  What would the OP's duty person have done if the OP had been wearing ankle socks that couldn't be seen over the tops of his shoes?  Maybe he should try it just to see?

" You have to leave.  You have no socks."

"But I do have socks."  Remove shoe to show ankle sock.  "See?"

"You still have to leave because if I can't see it.  It isn't there.  Socks must not only be worn, they must be seen to be worn.  If you think I'm going to spend my duty here having people remove their shoes just so I can see if they're wearing socks, you've got another thing coming!"  :facepalm:


----------



## Franko (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> I just got kicked out of the mess for having shoes without socks.
> 
> The rules state that bare feet, and bare feet with sandals are not allowed.
> 
> ...





			
				j_drews105 said:
			
		

> Amongst the various other rules it said:
> Bare feet, or bare feet with sandals is not allowed.
> 
> There was nothing else regarding footwear. I pointed this out to the duty staff who told me it was common CF rules that socks are required in all messes. I disagree with this, but I decided not to eat there and went to Subway.
> ...



You don't know the rules and the NCO is enforcing them. Get off your ass and read the Base Standing Orders/ Routine Orders.

Ignorance of the rules is no excuse either. States it in the QR&O Vol 2 as well.



> Now *it could* be in the base rso's, which I will examine next week *before I talk to the RSM* since I gladly gave the duty guy my name.





From not knowing how to salute/ checking one's arms (re- paying compliments to Officers) and now this.....I believe *you *will be on the receiving end of the conversation.

Regards


----------



## Jammer (13 Aug 2011)

I see a one way conversation coming....and not in your favour.


----------



## Scott (13 Aug 2011)

Stacked said:
			
		

> Are you at the mega? You're one brave guy if you are...



You mean a Private getting ready to jack up the RSM ain't cool?  :nod: Tell him you're acting on the advice of your union rep.


----------



## Gunner98 (13 Aug 2011)

I'm sure if you were wearing a mini-dress with stiletto heels there would not have been an issue.      Give it a try next time and report back to us!


----------



## j_drews105 (13 Aug 2011)

Bzzliteyr said:
			
		

> Very good point.. kitchen vs mess.



this is true. the rule i posted before allowing socks or no socks was for the jr ranks mess. i posted that because it's the only rule i could find. the only rules i've seen for the dining mess are posted outside that mess. in my interpretation, and the interpretation of anyone else with logical sense, would allow for shoes without socks.




			
				Der Panzerkommandant.... said:
			
		

> You don't know the rules and the NCO is enforcing them. Get off your *** and read the Base Standing Orders/ Routine Orders.



my point is that the NCO doesn't know the rules and was making them up because that's what he feels the rules should be. the rules posted outside the dining hall contradict what he thinks. now if it is in the BSO's, then i'm a tool. but i don't think it is, and he never mentioned that it was. i'm going to have a read through them.

---------------------------

Wearing shoes without socks in unhygenic? Not at all.
I can see why they want people to wear socks with their sandals. But with shoes, why?

Do they check everyone's combat boots upon entry to make sure they are wearing socks? No.

This is more about principle than anything. Considering I've worn the same shoes without socks into that dining hall at least 30 times this summer, and one duty nco decides it's not allowed is what pisses me off.

Thank you to the posters on here that have a level head. Too many people on here internet-jack others when they merely ask questions. I find that humourous.


----------



## Fishbone Jones (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> I find that humourous.



As we do you.


----------



## Jammer (13 Aug 2011)

Perhaps you might take the the time to READ all relavant Base Orders....if you're not satisfied with that, take a trot over to see a PMed tech...(feel free the weigh in). Other than that, just do as your told by the duty dude or don't eat in the mess.


----------



## Blackadder1916 (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> Do they check everyone's combat boots upon entry to make sure they are wearing socks? . . . . . .



Don't give them ideas!  The next thing you know, there's a ggggeneral hiding behind the potted plants making sure you're wearing the correct underwear.


----------



## Jammer (13 Aug 2011)

...or checking that your socks in fact do match.


----------



## aesop081 (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> i'm a tool.



I suspect this is the case but, i will offer a simple piece of advice: Pick your battles.


----------



## j_drews105 (13 Aug 2011)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> I suspect this is the case but, i will offer a simple piece of advice: Pick your battles.



Agreeing to leave after asking why, when the rules outside the dining hall state socks are only required for sandals, isn't much of a battle. 

If the crutch the duty NCO chooses to rest on is to try to threaten me by saying he can bring it up with the RSM, I will gladly accept that.
He was trying to use it as a scare tactic. I'm pretty confident he won't even bring it up with the RSM. After I read the BSO's, I may bring it up my chain of command myself.


----------



## Pusser (13 Aug 2011)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> I suspect this is the case but, i will offer a simple piece of advice: Pick your battles.



I would agree for the most part.  On the other hand, there are many examples in the CF where rules get out of hand (call it "rule creep" if you will) and things get incredibly asinine as each level of authority decides to add its own interpretation and "clarification" of the original intent.  Sometimes somebody has to stand up and say this is stupid and should be changed.  Note that the OP is not defying an order.  He did as he was told at the time.  He is questioning and researching the reasoning behind an apparent policy that may  not actually exist anywhere other than in a particularly zealous duty NCO's mind.  There is nothing wrong with questioning policies, as long as it is done properly.  I see nothing in the OP's postings to indicate he is doing anything to the contrary.  

I think the OP makes a valid point and perhaps it is that duty NCO who should have picked his battles.


----------



## aesop081 (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> After I read the BSO's, I may bring it up my chain of command myself.



Hey, whatever floats your boat. You can make a huge deal out of this if you like. Or you could just move on to more important things.

"The toes you step on today might be connected to the *** you'll have to kiss tomorow".



			
				Pusser said:
			
		

> I see nothing in the OP's postings to indicate he is doing anything to the contrary.



This may or may not be, as he himself is unaware of what the rules actualy are. All that being said, sometimes it not worth creating a shitstorm over socks. Its sometimes better to just smile and nod, you might want something ( usualy at a much later time) from the people you piss off in the process. Memories tend to be long.

I'm all for rocking the boat and standing up to stupid rules, i've made a career of it. But i always ask myself what its worth before i do it.


----------



## Pusser (13 Aug 2011)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> This may or may not be, as he himself is unaware of what the rules actualy are. All that being said, sometimes it not worth creating a shitstorm over socks. Its sometimes better to just smile and nod, you might want something ( usualy at a much later time) from the people you piss off in the process. Memories tend to be long.
> 
> I'm all for rocking the boat and standing up to stupid rules, i've made a career of it. But i always ask myself what its worth before i do it.



Fair point.


----------



## Franko (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> Agreeing to leave after asking why, when the rules outside the dining hall state socks are only required for sandals, isn't much of a battle.
> 
> If the crutch the duty NCO chooses to rest on is to try to threaten me by saying he can bring it up with the RSM, I will gladly accept that.
> He was trying to use it as a scare tactic. I'm pretty confident he won't even bring it up with the RSM. After I read the BSO's, I may bring it up my chain of command myself.



Maybe it isn't quite clear enough to you there Pte.

The Duty NCO IS the Base RSM's representative when placed in that position. He is not threatening you. He is enforcing a directive one of which I've known about for the better part of 23 years.

I've ejected troops for doing the same and also wearing PT strip, wife beaters, unshaven, flip flops, wearing earphones, wearing hats etc etc.

If this happened when I had the duty, you could be rest assured the Base RSM and the Base Duty Officer would receive the facts from the Duty NCO, along with any and all comments from the individual.

If you were in my CoC and you brought it up you'd be receiving some extras for wasting my time and being condescending to a superior.

Regards


----------



## OldSolduer (13 Aug 2011)

Can one of us make this soldier shut his trap?> Jeeeeezzz :rage:


----------



## j_drews105 (13 Aug 2011)

Der Panzerkommandant.... said:
			
		

> The Duty NCO IS the Base RSM's representative when placed in that position. He is not threatening you. He is enforcing a directive one of which I've known about for the better part of 23 years.
> 
> I've ejected troops for doing the same and also wearing PT strip, wife beaters, unshaven, flip flops, wearing earphones, wearing hats etc etc.



what you fail to consider is that this was unlikely the directive from the RSM. it was something the duty nco felt was the directive. 

ya pt gear, flips, hats, etc. are all quite standard reasons not to be allowed in, and in fact they are even included in the rules. shoes without socks is not one of the directives, which is why i am pissed off.

i'm done with you people on here. you turn a simple question about whether socks are required with shoes into a huge tirade. get a life. go outside and enjoy the weekend rather than constantly trolling this forum.


----------



## OldSolduer (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> what you fail to consider is that this was unlikely the directive from the RSM. it was something the duty nco felt was the directive.
> 
> ya pt gear, flips, hats, etc. are all quite standard reasons not to be allowed in, and in fact they are even included in the rules. shoes without socks is not one of the directives, which is why i am pissed off.
> 
> i'm done with you people on here. you turn a simple question about whether socks are required with shoes into a huge tirade. get a life. go outside and enjoy the weekend rather than constantly trolling this forum.



Are you still here? I'm glad you're done....check your in box. You can't take simple direction.....I'm sure I'd trust you with a C7 next to me....not.

Good bye and good riddance.


----------



## Fishbone Jones (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> i'm done with you people on here. you turn a simple question about whether socks are required with shoes into a huge tirade. get a life. go outside and enjoy the weekend rather than constantly trolling this forum.



You're joking right? You asked, were told, and it was YOU who couldn't follow direction or let it go. Go look in a mirror. I don't see a long career of service in your future, thank goodness.

Go take your own advice. Sign off and go outside.


----------



## Maxadia (13 Aug 2011)

Honestly, this is what you have to do right now?  Complain about socks?


Maybe it's me being older and cranky, but I'd be running you until you couldn't speak the word "socks".  Some senior citizen thought about you not having enough to do right now.....and you're accusing US of being trolls.  :facepalm:


----------



## the 48th regulator (13 Aug 2011)

Hey,

I have a serious question.  What about those really short sports socks, are they acceptable?







dileas

tess


----------



## j_drews105 (13 Aug 2011)

the 48th regulator said:
			
		

> Hey,
> 
> I have a serious question.  What about those really short sports socks, are they acceptable?



depends on who the duty nco is. with 99% of duty nco's they are acceptable. with 1% of duty nco's they are not.


----------



## Maxadia (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> 99% of junior officers  are reasonable. 1% of junior officers they are not.



Fixed that for you.


----------



## Strike (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> Agreeing to leave after asking why, when the rules outside the dining hall state socks are only required for sandals, isn't much of a battle.



The reason the sock thing is likely stated wrt sandals is because most people don't wear socks with sandals.  Much the same reason why they don't specifically state that you have to wear socks with shoes...because MOST people already do this.

Using your same argument, I guess I could conceivably go in to the mess wearing a sheer top that is see-through depending on how the light hits, without a bra.  After all, i bet the regs at the door don't say I have to wear one, right?  Can I get away with walking around without a bra under my clothes under normal circumstances?  You bet.  But would it be appropriate in this case?  Most certainly not.

(And for the record, I would NEVER wear a see-through top without said undergarment, so don't anyone think of asking for photographic proof!)

Seriously, use some common sense!


----------



## Maxadia (13 Aug 2011)

Couldn't agree more.  Similar to what I stated waaaaaaayyyyy back on the first page about picking your WO's nose.....I bet you could, but I really wouldn't advise it.

Strike is correct - there are rules and norms in society.  Norms are the things that you are _expected_ to know and ways that you are expected to act.  Like sitting in the corner of the mess hall, and slathering your belly with peanut butter.  No rule against that, specifically, but I really don't think it would be appropriate.


----------



## j_drews105 (13 Aug 2011)

RDJP said:
			
		

> Couldn't agree more.  Similar to what I stated waaaaaaayyyyy back on the first page about picking your WO's nose.....I bet you could, but I really wouldn't advise it.
> 
> Strike is correct - there are rules and norms in society.  Norms are the things that you are _expected_ to know and ways that you are expected to act.  Like sitting in the corner of the mess hall, and slathering your belly with peanut butter.  No rule against that, specifically, but I really don't think it would be appropriate.



do you think wearing shoes without socks would be appropriate?
or more importantly, do you think it is inappropriate?


----------



## Maxadia (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> do you think wearing shoes without socks would be appropriate?
> or more importantly, do you think it is inappropriate?



Let's see.....how many people in there were wearing shoes without socks?  I didn't say that was inappropriate, I said there were norms in society.  The way that people are NORMALLY expected to behave.  And if you were one of the only ones not wearing socks, well, even kids who watch Sesame Street would be able to figure out which member in there wasn't dressed NORMALLY.  Cause all the members who were dressed NORMALLY would be wearing socks with shoes.

Seriously...did you miss something in Basic about not trying to be an individual?


----------



## j_drews105 (13 Aug 2011)

Couple of facts:

Tons of people wear sports socks. You can barely see them. There is very little differentiation between that, and no socks.

Myself, and a number of others, have been in the dining hall numerous times all summer in shoes without socks, and no one has had a problem. I imagine if it was a hygenic issue or any other sort of issue the duty nco's would be told to look for this. Evidently that is not the case as there has not been a problem before all summer.

You aren't even meant to wear socks with my shoes because they have an inner liner.


----------



## Maxadia (13 Aug 2011)

Yup...hill to die on.   :facepalm:


----------



## Ralph (13 Aug 2011)

When I take my socks off at the end of the day, they smell. I assume that same stink would transfer itself to my footwear if I wasn't wearing socks. Maybe it's just a grossness issue.
All messes are different - the last one I ate in required collared shirts, turtlenecks or ascots...I would have worn an ascot if I had found one on sale...


----------



## SupersonicMax (13 Aug 2011)

I don't know which society you live in, but in mine, socks are not normally worn with sandals.

There are some stupid rules around...   You either live with them or try to change them..  It depends how important the issue is to you vs the implication of trying to change it.  

Being in the military doesn't mean loosing your common sense and your critical sense.  There are times when to ask questions/clarifications.  Garrison is probably the best time for that...  In fact, I have all the time in the world for anybody who have question about why we do business a certain way.



			
				recceguy said:
			
		

> I don't see a long career of service in your future, thank goodness.



I got the same advice from you 5 years ago, I think I'm doing all right despite what you think!


----------



## Romanmaz (13 Aug 2011)

I can't believe this "argument" is still going on. What do you have against wearing socks?  ???


----------



## Strike (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> Tons of people wear bras. You can barely see them. There is very little differentiation between that, and no bras.



Using the same example...maybe you'll getnit this time.

As for you and all your buds going in without socks prior to today, just because you got away with it doesn't make it right.  Maybe someone complained and the duty NCO was told to keep a special eye out for offenders.

Now, enough people have argued your point.  Just because it's not the answer you want to hear doesn't make their posts wrong.  I would suggest you look at the numbers for and against your stance (remember, there are a couple of sarcastic ones that are actually against your post).  You are in the minority.  Suck it up, move on, and where your friggin' socks to the mess!


----------



## the 48th regulator (13 Aug 2011)

j_drews105 said:
			
		

> Couple of facts:
> 
> Tons of people wear sports socks. You can barely see them. There is very little differentiation between that, and no socks.
> 
> ...



Eww.


Yer a filthy little Billy.  Serious, I bet you rank up the shacks with you sweat soaked shoes, that have liners.  Buy a pack of sport socks, and be done with it.

dileas

tess


----------



## Good2Golf (13 Aug 2011)

Jammer said:
			
		

> ...or checking that your socks in fact do match.



Careful, Jammer...a whole litter of kittens will d..d..d..die if you say his n..n..n..name!  :nod:


----------



## Nfld Sapper (13 Aug 2011)

Why are we still talking about this?

BTW if this happened at H-33/Gagetown your school/unit RSM will be getting a nasty gram from the Base RSM.... Seen it happen a few times this year...

Take your lumps and go off....


----------



## j_drews105 (13 Aug 2011)

NFLD Sapper said:
			
		

> Why are we still talking about this?
> 
> BTW if this happened at H-33/Gagetown your school/unit RSM will be getting a nasty gram from the Base RSM.... Seen it happen a few times this year...
> 
> Take your lumps and go off....



For attempting to go into the mess without socks?
For asking for clarification on the rule?
Or for leaving when told to?


----------



## Maxadia (13 Aug 2011)

For not taking a hint?


----------



## medicineman (13 Aug 2011)

Guess the options are: (1) Get an apartment and eat wearing as much or as little clothing as you please; (2) Eat off Base, within the dress regs of whatever establishment you choose to visit; (3) Do as you're told and put some socks on; (4) Get out, since you obviously have an adjustment disorder and can't cope with something as simple as being told what to wear because you don't like it.

I'd suggest finding something more important to get upset about - believe me, there are plenty of things more disturbing about military life than being told to wear socks with your shoes when you eat.

MM


----------



## Michael OLeary (13 Aug 2011)

I think this horse has been sufficiently beaten. Locked, and I can assure you that you can't convince a staff member there's a worthwhile reason to open it.

Milnet.ca Staff


----------



## socksguy (3 Aug 2012)

Hi everyone,
I am in the process of researching the "sock program" provided to the Canadian military.
Any input, opinions, feedback would be extremely helpful.
My company has been making socks for over 100 years and we are in the process of trying to develop socks specific to the needs and requirements of the Canadian soldiers.
Thank you in advance for your help.
Marty


----------



## krustyrl (3 Aug 2012)

Well, not much into socks but I will say from my experience that the newer green wool socks are a million times better than the old grey socks.! 
Just sayin'....

 :2c:


----------



## aesop081 (3 Aug 2012)

krustyrl said:
			
		

> Well, not much into socks but I will say from my experience that the newer green wool socks are a million times better than the old grey socks.!
> Just sayin'....
> 
> :2c:



That they are. Unfortunately, the green ones are now "were" and the "new" grey ones are available.


----------



## Strike (3 Aug 2012)

I love the knee high tan ones as they've been doubling as compression socks for me lately.


----------



## krustyrl (3 Aug 2012)

> That they are. Unfortunately, the green ones are now "were" and the "new" grey ones are available.




WHAT.???  That's it..last straw, I'm getting out.!!  (Retiring Dec 2012)


----------



## aesop081 (3 Aug 2012)

krustyrl said:
			
		

> WHAT.???  That's it..last straw, I'm getting out.!!  (Retiring Dec 2012)



It just started. The green ones have essential been changed in colour, green to a darker grey and replace both the combat uniform socks and those to be worn with DEU.


----------



## Eye In The Sky (3 Aug 2012)

Some info on the current CSS (combat sock system).

- comes with 3 different socks  (1) a anti-blister type liner sock (2) a temperate sock and (3) cold weather sock.

The liner sock is black, roughly just below the knee in height, and IMO is better fitting than the other liner socks I've had (Gobi liners from MEC, for example).  I don't know the exact fabric % (not marked on the ones I just recieved)

The temperate sock is (darkish) grey, about a 10" height for me over the liner, so 2-4" shorter.  Package says its 60% wool, 40% nylon.  

The cold weather sock is about the same height-wise as the temp sock, a lighter color of grey (nice and easy to tell them apart in the drawer).  78% wool, 21% nylon, and 1% spandex.

Comments on the CSS

- I find the liner socks footbed stretches very easily and doesn't always reshape-size well in the wash (compared to the Gobis I use in my hiking boots, as a comparison).  I like the length, I find the liners don't slide down too easily.

- the temp socks I find very warm in the summer especially.  I can't wear just the liners or my boots bang around on my feet like snowshoes and my orthodics don't fit right with just the liners/too much foot movement.   I also find they go all 'frizzy/fuzzy' easily in the dryer because I don't use dryer sheets (parrafrin wax in them, or so we were taught on AMT).  End result is they wear out easier because of the materials catching inside the boots from the fuzziness.

- Cold weather socks.  I don't mind them, I use them in the winter as socks in my Columbia's, etc as well.  Good mid-range cold sock.  I find th sizes run small.  I wear Medium liners and temps, but I get Large cold weather socks.

The CSS is common to all 3 environments I believe.  However, I believe the Navy added a hot weather sock to their project (N.I.C.E. - Naval Improved Clothing and Equipment). 

Hope that helps some.


----------



## PuckChaser (3 Aug 2012)

We have our desert socks too, which are coyote brown and I believe a wicking-type fabric. I plan on using them once they arrived back in Canada in my UAB as my summer sock. I found them very similar to the Wigwam Lt Hiker socks in comfort and size.


----------



## Fishbone Jones (3 Aug 2012)

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> We have our desert socks too, which are coyote brown and I believe a wicking-type fabric. I plan on using them once they arrived back in Canada in my UAB as my summer sock. I found them very similar to the Wigwam Lt Hiker socks in comfort and size.



Cut the foot off. The resulting sleeve is a good goggle cover.

That was the best use I found for them.


----------



## brihard (3 Aug 2012)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> That they are. Unfortunately, the green ones are now "were" and the "new" grey ones are available.



How do I get out of this chicken***t outfit?


----------



## Fishbone Jones (3 Aug 2012)

Brihard said:
			
		

> How do I get out of this chicken***t outfit?



Apparently, same sock, different colour. Was green, now charcoal grey is all.

Generals don't check what colour your socks are anymore. Don't worry


----------



## PuckChaser (3 Aug 2012)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Cut the foot off. The resulting sleeve is a good goggle cover.
> 
> That was the best use I found for them.



The coyote ones? I'd definitely do that to the thin tan sock I got in 07, but these new ones seemed pretty good. Then again, I wasn't patrolling hours a day with them.


----------



## Fishbone Jones (3 Aug 2012)

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> The coyote ones? I'd definitely do that to the thin tan sock I got in 07, but these new ones seemed pretty good. Then again, I wasn't patrolling hours a day with them.



I never got any new type ones. The only ones I got issued were in 2003.


----------



## PuckChaser (3 Aug 2012)

Yeah, they were junk. There's a newer type that started issue in 09 I believe, just got them for Attention. Lightyears ahead of those tan pieces of crap.


----------



## Strike (4 Aug 2012)

recceguy said:
			
		

> I never got any new type ones. The only ones I got issued were in 2003.



The newer ones are the ones I was referring to.  Like I said, great as compression socks.  They're very thin though so I would never use them for any long hauls, but I know of others who swear by them.


----------



## cupper (4 Aug 2012)

recceguy said:
			
		

> I never got any new type ones. The only ones I got issued were in 2003.



Maybe it's time to put a new pair on. They are starting to get a little funky on here. I can only imagine what they are like in person. ;D


----------



## Fishbone Jones (7 Aug 2012)

cupper said:
			
		

> Maybe it's time to put a new pair on. They are starting to get a little funky on here. I can only imagine what they are like in person. ;D


 : must be dry rot then, as I never used them, except for the use stated above.


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## socksguy (7 Aug 2012)

Thank you all for your input and feedback. It is always very helpful and I am glad to see that some of you are already familiar with our products and using them. Maybe one day we can convince your buyers to give us a chance!


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## lukey8ball (15 Nov 2014)

Not sure if I'm putting this in the right place or if this is a derpy question or not. On the Logistik Unicorp website, which I'm using for the first time, it doesn't say the sizes by colour and I'm not looking to have a shitty time getting the wrong size by accident. My socks have the red rim for those wondering. I'm pretty sure that's a large, but I know the measurements are a little different civie side than they are in the supply system


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## LightFighter (15 Nov 2014)

From the Logistik Unicorp site

SIZE                              FOOT LENGTH
XS/XP (Light Blue band)    215
S/P (Green band)	            235
M (White band)	            255
L/G (Dark Blue band)	    270
XL/TG (Red band)	            350


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## John John (16 May 2017)

Last week at clothing stores, I was told that the reason my boots were to big was that I wasn't wearing "all 3 pairs of socks". Apparently, we are supposed to wear the liner socks, temperate socks, and cold weather socks together at all times. That sounded a little ridiculous to me, so I was wondering if someone could confirm or deny that this is the correct way to wear the current issue sock system.


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## Arty39 (16 May 2017)

John John said:
			
		

> Last week at clothing stores, I was told that the reason my boots were to big was that I wasn't wearing "all 3 pairs of socks". Apparently, we are supposed to wear the liner socks, temperate socks, and cold weather socks together at all times. That sounded a little ridiculous to me, so I was wondering if someone could confirm or deny that this is the correct way to wear the current issue sock system.


Just the liner and the temperate sock for your normal combat boots. If it's cold enough out to need to wear the cold weather socks I probably have muk luks on.


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## Loachman (19 May 2017)

John John said:
			
		

> Last week at clothing stores, I was told that the reason my boots were to big was that I wasn't wearing "all 3 pairs of socks".



Combat boots?

If so, that person was either an idiot, a rectum, or both - the proper term for which is "ignoranus".


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## dimsum (23 May 2017)

Loachman said:
			
		

> Combat boots?
> 
> If so, that person was either an idiot, a rectum, or both - the proper term for which is "ignoranus".



Or a joke that went too far?


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## BinRat55 (24 May 2017)

Loachman said:
			
		

> Combat boots?
> 
> If so, that person was either an idiot, a rectum, or both - the proper term for which is "ignoranus".



And this is how things go from bad to worse for those of us behind the counter - calling a supply tech an "ignorant a**h***" may be a little harsh and premature. I'm not saying there are no dicks at Clothing Stores, however when I read the OP's comment for the reason for the boots being too big, based on experience, I feel there was something lost in translation.

I would have said something similar THIS way - "We size you for your boots a little more meticulously nowadays based on the fact that we have virtually millimeters between sizes. If you come in to size for boots wearing your wife's thin little ankle socks and I size you, when you put those same boots on WITH the sock system it will be too tight on your foot. Conversely if you are sized wearing your sock system and then put on your thin ankle socks, the boots will be too big."

Please understand - someone (not all, but many) comes into Clothing Stores with certain expectations. Often, their expectations are not met to their satisfaction. 99% of the time, the tech on the counter is only following direction and policy. Then, that "someone" goes on a rant to whomever is in earshot about how we are all "ignoranus'" and idiots.


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## Jarnhamar (21 Jul 2017)

Are hot weather socks only issued to members heading out on deployment?  
Specifically the  Socks calf height, hot weather, dark sand 8440-20-003-3316


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## PuckChaser (21 Jul 2017)

Jarnhamar said:
			
		

> Are hot weather socks only issued to members heading out on deployment?
> Specifically the  Socks calf height, hot weather, dark sand 8440-20-003-3316



I would do a lot of unspeakable things to get more of those socks. I never wear the sock system and love those brown socks.


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## BinRat55 (22 Jul 2017)

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> I would do a lot of unspeakable things to get more of those socks. I never wear the sock system and love those brown socks.



Unspeakable you say? Socks you say?? Brown you say?

I may (hey that rhymes with say) know a guy...


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## Jarnhamar (22 Jul 2017)

BinRat55 said:
			
		

> Unspeakable you say? Socks you say?? Brown you say?
> 
> I may (hey that rhymes with say) know a guy...



*cough*9.5 boot size*cough*


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## SupersonicMax (22 Jul 2017)

PuckChaser said:
			
		

> I would do a lot of unspeakable things to get more of those socks. I never wear the sock system and love those brown socks.



I was lucky to deploy twice in quick succession so I got a good supply of those.  I normally wear those with wool socks.


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## BinRat55 (23 Jul 2017)

SupersonicMax said:
			
		

> I was lucky to deploy twice in quick succession so I got a good supply of those.  I normally wear those with wool socks.



It's funny because there are many who absolutley love those socks! I was never gone on them myself. And I had access to thousands! I am a white tube-sock kinda guy.


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## kev994 (23 Jul 2017)

Costco merino wool, whether it's summer or winter works for me


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## Jarnhamar (23 Jul 2017)

So are these bad boys for deployment only?


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## BinRat55 (23 Jul 2017)

Jarnhamar said:
			
		

> So are these bad boys for deployment only?



Yes sir.


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## dimsum (23 Jul 2017)

Jarnhamar said:
			
		

> So are these bad boys for deployment only?



I thought so?  Although during my first deployment, they tried to issue me a few pairs of knee-high tan polyester dress socks.


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## Jarnhamar (24 Jul 2017)

Damn, thanks though.


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