# weight fluctuations (loss) during/after basic



## rjs (6 Jun 2006)

Hi, I've put in my application and I'm in the process of bulking up for the first time in my life. I'm a natural 135lbs @ 5'11' (26yrs old) which is too skinny for army life imo. In the past, no matter how much I've eaten and how sedentary my lifestyle has been, I haven't gained a single pound. I've been reading up on mass-gaining diets, however I'm unsure what will happen once I'm in the military.

For instance, I've just starting eating ~2500 cal/day (in 6 meals) with the calories broken down into 40 % protein, 30% carbs, 30% fat. I'm hoping this diet will allow me to put on a good 15 lbs by the time I go in. I know it can be done because I have a friend that started at the same weight (and same skinny bone structure) as me and he's 180 of solid muscle now. Unfortunately, he's really in to working-out so he's gone way past my goals of a paltry 15lbs, and his experience ceases to be useful because he's maintained the diet and excercise routine that got him the gains in the first place (6 meals a day, supplements, never misses a training day)

What I'm wondering is what will happen when I start doing 5-10km/day of running/ruck marches, etc. Is it just going to eat away my muscle mass, assuming I have very little fat to burn? I've read that I'll need to eat about 3000 calories/day just to maintain my new weight (150lbs). At that point, since the muscle is already built, can I relax with how I take in those calories? By this I mean can I start eating a regular (but healthy) 3 meals a day and forget about getting all that extra protein in the form of supplements? If I stop with the strict diet, is it likely that my muscles will have atrophied back to their current state? 

Once I've got the extra mass I intend to keep it, but I'm wondering if life in the infantry will make that very difficult given how much cardio I'll be doing. What I've learned from a couple guys I've spoken to is that infantry men usually end up losing a lot of weight during their training. Now I think it would be hard for me to go below 135, but I could easily see myself going from my new 150 back down to 140-135... Any opinions, suggestions, or advice? Thanks in advance.


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## geo (6 Jun 2006)

during basic, troops have a tendency to eat like horses and burn lots of calories but, you will be building body mass. over time you will fill out, like all of us.


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## paracowboy (7 Jun 2006)

weight is irrelevent. Don't worry about it. Your body will find the composition in needs to meet the demands you will place upon it.

I know guys weighin' a buck an' a quarter who out-perform muscle-boys, an' I know chubby guys who can out-run skinny li'l grass-snakes. Don't concern yourself with size, or weight, or hair-colour.

This has been addressed numerous times in several threads. They all say the same thing I just wrote. AGAIN.

Show up, do your best, never quit. Everything else will fall into place.


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## George Wallace (7 Jun 2006)

Let's put it this way.....If after ten, and then twenty, years you can still fit into the DEUs that you were first issued, you will be doing fine.


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## geo (7 Jun 2006)

lol.... darned thing was snug for a little while but it's a comfortable fit again


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## punkd (7 Jun 2006)

Almost everyone on my course lost weight. I lost about 12lbs. I only went in at about 165 so it was a fair bit for me to lose. You only eat 3 times a day, no food in the barracks (at least dont get caught, you'll learn the ropes after a few weeks there) So I was use to eating pretty much every 2 hours, that was how i managed to put weight on in the first place, high calorie, high protein diet and eating as often as I could.

Main factors are, you WILL be working 18 hour days for the first week or two preparing all your kit and stuff. Your up at 5am everyday and dont hit the sack till 11pm, working pretty solid in between. This dies down a bit once you have your kit sorted out (hope you can sew ;D) After that, stress plays in as a factor of why people lose weight, and the instructors like to make it a high stress environment.

Also lots of cardio, it starts off slow and runs are about 2k but by the end its common to be doing 6k runs all the time with your instructors and PSP staff. All in all the PT wasnt hard and I feel they could have used some more, but you will burn more calories then you take in for the most part.

Then week 8 your off to Farnham, this week is good, you eat at the mess and get a decent amount of sleep. Week 9 is all rations, they are not all that bad... but you will get sick of them pretty quick. You will miss meals, work all day and half the night then your sleep is screwed over by lots of Fire drills , stand-to's and century duties. This is where i lost the most weight.


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## paracowboy (7 Jun 2006)

punkd said:
			
		

> Also lots of cardio, it starts off slow and runs are about 2k but by the end its common to be doing 6k runs all the time with your instructors and PSP staff.


sigh..



> Then week 8 your off to Farnham, this week is good, you eat at the mess and get a decent amount of sleep.


 siiiggghhh


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## SoF (8 Jun 2006)

2500 calories...thats it; are those 6 meals comprised of rice cakes ;D. Add more calories.


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## military granny (8 Jun 2006)

rjs
when my son joined without a word of a lie you could pretty much count his ribs (6'4 and around 145-155) yes he lost a few pounds in the first couple weeks but learned when you get time for a meal EAT.  And hes infantry so they burn lots calories and yes he learned that when its chow, eat fast cause when your training officers are done eating so are you.Now 3 years later he is a very muscular boy not an ounce of fat but now sitting at about 165-170. Still skinny in a mom's eyes buy looks good.


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## Hot Lips (8 Jun 2006)

Well basic sounds like it will be a good weight loss plan for me  ;D  I can't wait...I get all excited when I read these posts  

I agree 2500 cal is not enough for a 26 year old male that is active...I can eat that when I train, cardio and weights daily and I am certainly not 26 or male.

HL


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## rjs (8 Jun 2006)

I haven't been particularly active in years and my eating habits have never been great so that's why 2600 seems like a lot to me. Until recently I skipped breakfast most mornings. I'm still getting used to eating all the time and I hate MRPs but I'll try to increase my calorie intake even more and we'll see how it goes. It's hard to find consistent info on this stuff. Originally I read that I should be eating 18x weight in calories to make gains. Now I've found another source that says more like 25-30x weight. That seems more consistent with what some of you have said.

Anyway, thanks for the info. It gives me a better idea of what to expect.


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## paracowboy (8 Jun 2006)

you MUST eat breakfast.


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## Hot Lips (8 Jun 2006)

Yes, what are you making me paracowboy  ;D

HL


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## paracowboy (8 Jun 2006)

Hot Lips said:
			
		

> Yes, what are you making me paracowboy


makin' you get up and cook some damn eggs, woman!  ;D


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## Hot Lips (9 Jun 2006)

Paracowboy would you like those...scrambled, poached, over easy   or in your lap...lmao

HL


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## paracowboy (9 Jun 2006)

Hot Lips said:
			
		

> Paracowboy would you like those...scrambled, poached, over easy   or in your lap


poached. By that point, you would have been: in my lap, easy, scrambled, and it all would have been over, anyway!
Ba-dum-bum!

Thank you, thank you. Catch my next show tomorrow at 8:00 folks! And remember, you don't have to go home, you just can't stay here.

 --> back on topic: you must eat breakfast. It starts your metabolism working properly. If you haven't in some time, start easy (like Hot Lips! Oooohhhh! Why do I say such hurtful things?) like with a banana, or piece of lightly buttered toast, until your stomach gets used to having food that early.


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## Zertz (10 Jun 2006)

I'm a skinny kid (16, 5'9, 120 lbs, 7% BF) who is trying to gain ALOT of weight and all I can say is eat more, drink more. If you're naturally very lean with a fast metabolism then eat more, you can always cut back if you want to lean out more in the off chance you gain too much. A year ago I was 5'7.5 and 99 lbs and I'm fully confident it is very largely an issue of diet. 

Edit: Increase your carbohydrates also, you want those to be burned as energy as they are intended during your workouts instead of having to break down protein for energy, something like 3.5 grams x Bodyweight with protein 1.5 x Bodyweight.


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## Hot Lips (10 Jun 2006)

Zertz said:
			
		

> I'm a skinny kid (16, 5'9, 120 lbs, 7% BF) who is trying to gain ALOT of weight and all I can say is eat more, drink more. If you're naturally very lean with a fast metabolism then eat more, you can always cut back if you want to lean out more in the off chance you gain too much. A year ago I was 5'7.5 and 99 lbs and I'm fully confident it is very largely an issue of diet.
> 
> Edit: Increase your carbohydrates also, you want those to be burned as energy as they are intended during your workouts instead of having to break down protein for energy, something like 3.5 grams x Bodyweight with protein 1.5 x Bodyweight.


Dear lord someone feed this poor child...
Zertz you could eat a dozen boston cream donuts and never gain an ounce would you?
Hope you are eating a balanced high calorie diet now...
HL


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## 1feral1 (10 Jun 2006)

Hey HL, here for a typical hay box b'fast, an egg, beans & speghetti, a slab of near raw bacon, and two slices of bread. Not my cup of tea sorry. 

Where's my pan cakes?

Wes

PS, I was 66.2kg on enrolment in Canada in 1976, in 1995, 87.5kg on enlistment into the ADF, now hovering about 97kg still at 6 ft. On ex my weight goes +- 2 to 3 kg over say a 2 wk period. Mainly less, due to not ever drinking enough h2o, although I swill up to 9 litres or more in a 12 hr period when it gets warm here. At 40C in 98% humidity, it seems to sweat out faster than it goes in, plus in the heat, I am less hungry.

Cheers,

Wes


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## paracowboy (10 Jun 2006)

Zertz said:
			
		

> I'm a skinny kid (16, 5'9, 120 lbs, 7% BF) who is trying to gain ALOT of weight and all I can say is eat more, drink more.


well, depends on how he's eating, when he's eating and what he's eating, as much as it does how much he's eating.



> A year ago I was 5'7.5 and 99 lbs and I'm fully confident it is very largely an issue of diet.


 it's also an issue of the fact that a year ago you were 15. Now you are 16. Next year, you will weigh even more than you do now. And the year after that, even more. Odd how that works.


FOR THE UMPTEENTH FUCKING TIME, YOUR WEIGHT IS IMMATERIAL! 

It's entirely about performance, not appearance. Focus on the important things.


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## Hot Lips (10 Jun 2006)

k Paracowboy,

I will agree to disagree with you on that one...for reasons other than how you look or performance ability...but let's not pick fly shit out of pepper here  ;D

HL


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## paracowboy (10 Jun 2006)

Hot Lips said:
			
		

> k Paracowboy,
> 
> I will agree to disagree with you on that one...for reasons other than how you look or performance ability...but let's not pick fly shit out of pepper here  ;D
> 
> HL


weight is immaterial and irrelevent. Body mass composition is important. Two people each weight 200 lbs. One is an Edmonton Eskimo, the other is a devout follower of the Church of the Holy Fatass. One is fit, the other is not. They weigh the same.

Weight is immaterial, and the bizzarre obsession with it is what leads to stupid fad diets, chemical abuse, and eating disorders.


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## Hot Lips (10 Jun 2006)

paracowboy said:
			
		

> weight is immaterial and irrelevent. Body mass composition is important. Two people each weight 200 lbs. One is an Edmonton Eskimo, the other is a devout follower of the Church of the Holy Fatass. One is fit, the other is not. They weigh the same.
> 
> Weight is immaterial, and the bizzarre obsession with it is what leads to stupid fad diets, chemical abuse, and eating disorders.


 Now that's what I am talking about but BMC encorporates weight  and that's wherein the flyshit lies...

HL


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## paracowboy (10 Jun 2006)

While related, (sort of) mass is not the same thing as weight. Weight has meaning *only* when an object having a specific mass is placed in an acceleration field, such as the gravitational field of the earth.

Therefore, while someone may have the same mass here, or on the moon, their weight changes drastically.

People fail to understand that weight means nothing in terms of fitness. And therein lies my continuing frustration. Would you care that you weighed 350 lbs, if you could run a marathon with a Volvo on your back, and looked like Jenny McArthy? Probably not. Just as I wouldn't care if I weighed 82 lbs but could benchpress an elephant and outrun a Lamborghini. 

For a soldier, it's about performance, not appearance. Substance, not surface.


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## Hot Lips (10 Jun 2006)

But this thread is about weight fluctuation...there is one about fitness elsewhere  

HL


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## Tyrone_88 (12 Jun 2006)

when I first started my application process I was 6 2", 155 pounds. After months of working out like a lunatic and taking protein powder several times a day I'm up to 175-180. I'm going away to basic in August and am really worried about shrinking back down to my skinny self. I'm willing to bet they won't let me bring my protein with me so I'm just wondering what kind of food they feed you there and whether or not theres a limit on the food.


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## paracowboy (12 Jun 2006)

Tyrone_88 said:
			
		

> am really worried about shrinking back down to my skinny self.


don't. Don't worry. Your body will find the muscle/fat composition ratio it needs to perform. Anything else is just ego-gratification. You can add/lose muscle/fat once you've completed your training. For now, just focus on learning and graduating. Nothing else. Once you're in BN, you can think about putting on muscle, or losing fat.



> I'm willing to bet they won't let me bring my protein with me


 there's a debate on that point, and some troops who have first-hand experience were involved. It's in the training forum, I believe. Run it through SEARCH, and you should find it.



> so I'm just wondering what kind of food they feed you there


 healthy food, and tasty for the most part.



> and whether or not theres a limit on the food.


 not on the food, but on the time available to eat it.


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## Tyrone_88 (12 Jun 2006)

Ok, so once I'm done training I can use Protein and possibly Creatine?


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## Wolfmann (13 Jun 2006)

From a ex-body builder to someone that wants to "put weight on"...

If you want to gain weight, consume at least 4,000-5,000 calories a day, at least a couple weeks before you go off - you'll probably have to work yourself up. And don't worry about "balancing percentages" - you won't have time to do it on BMQ, and it will drive you insane if you do. Just eat...and go for seconds and thirds IF your body says it wants more. Gove for 5 glasses of chocolate milk if it says so.

This will give your body time to also adjust internally as well...you will be consuming food at an awesome rate when you activity level suddenly goes through the roof. It will literally have to re-wire itself, and how it consumes nutrients...something that can give you gas, cramping, headaches, and even leave you fatigued or tired - which you do not want to have to go through, because the change in envirionment in BMQ will be stressful enough both mentally and physically. 

If you're skinny, your body will need a bit extra fat for your muscles. So even if the weight you do put on initially is water and a bit of chub...it probably won't matter for your build (chances are you won't put significant amount of fat on) but you will put enough on that your muscles will have the immediate energy they need when the shit hits the fan and your body is screaming at you to adjust to the new level of physical activity you are subjecting it too. 

You will find that at the end of BMQ the chubby one's will be thinner, and the skinny one's will be bigger. And it's not due to a secret, special combination of foods...what does it is just your body adjusting to it's new environment, and the fuel you give it. 

You will be very fit, though...so when you do get out you can pursue a body building regime during your daily workout time (you will get about an hour a day to hit the gym on company time) to put more permanent weight on. That's the key...

Learn to eat...


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## geo (13 Jun 2006)

For what it's worth, have found that people who are body builders don't always become the best recruits / soldiers.  The special food supplements they take are not always available while in the field ..... and their body mass sometimes limits their flexibility..... they get hurt.

The small wiry guys do just fine!

IMHO


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## Zertz (13 Jun 2006)

Paracowboy, true that about weight not being super important, but its easier than me posting all my lifts if you know what I'm saying. I'm quite exceptionally weak in terms of strength, I have high muscular endurance (pushups/situps) but poor strength objectively (I'm weak compared to my peers).

So, if I were to have this body composition at 30 lbs heavier I would be stronger objectively thereby of course making a better soldier (carry more easier, muscular strength is linked to steadied hands, etcetera).

One of my worst qualities in terms of soldiering is of course my lack of physical strength, so to increase my performance I must increase muscle mass and weight is one of the indicators of that. I could post my lifts if anyone wanted to give me some advice.


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## paracowboy (13 Jun 2006)

Zertz said:
			
		

> Paracowboy, true that about weight not being super important, but its easier than me posting all my lifts if you know what I'm saying. I'm quite exceptionally weak in terms of strength, I have high muscular endurance (pushups/situps) but poor strength objectively (I'm weak compared to my peers).
> 
> So, if I were to have this body composition at 30 lbs heavier I would be stronger objectively thereby of course making a better soldier (carry more easier, muscular strength is linked to steadied hands, etcetera).
> 
> One of my worst qualities in terms of soldiering is of course my lack of physical strength, so to increase my performance I must increase muscle mass and weight is one of the indicators of that. I could post my lifts if anyone wanted to give me some advice.


strength is not necessarily linked to size. I know a li'l tiny slip of a girl who squats waaaayyyy more than I. She's a figure skater. I'm over 220lbs.

Now, if you are that concerned with gaining size, as well as strength and power, we have a different situation than the recruits earlier in the thread.

To avoid having them follow the advice given to you, as it would be at cross purposes, I suggest we take it to pms (as well, I strongly suggest anyone else who wants to give you advice on gaining mass and strength *ALSO* keep it to pms. Let's not have the kids concentrating on the wrong stuff, if we can avoid it.) So, pm me, and we can talk muscle-stuff!


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## Zertz (13 Jun 2006)

Sounds like a plan!


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## DirtyDog (10 Oct 2006)

I'm about 5' 8'', 205 and according to the Forces BMI chart, about 40-50lbs overweight.

It's definitely not all fat, I can tell you that, but I do carry a bit of extra padding these days (I was 135lbs until I turned 19).  I expect to lose maybe 30lbs during training but I really have no idea.

I had a person I know tell me he lost 50lbs during Marine boot camp and he went in fit.   That seems a little out there but this guy is a straight shooter as far as I can tell.  He also has said he lost 50lbs in Iraq due to dysentry (I'm assuming after he gained some weight back after basic).


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## TN2IC (3 Nov 2006)

paracowboy said:
			
		

> strength is not necessarily linked to size. I know a li'l tiny slip of a girl who squats waaaayyyy more than I. She's a figure skater. I'm over 220lbs.



Okay so I am not the only one in the same boat...   :rofl:

I admit she was pretty cute.

Cheers,
TN2IC


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## Biggoals2bdone (19 Jun 2007)

Para, i agree and disagree with you as well, in that yes while you are there, its tough noogies deal with it, like everyone else did before you...personally i went in 215lbs at 5'8 (10-13% bodyfat) and i finished at 195lbs and i looked just a lil pudgier. but afterwards i just went back to training and proper eating...and got myself back up to 210.

What i disagree with you in is that weight/mass whichever you chose, is all about ego.  I also disgree with you about the being 82lbs and benching a car thing....if i was that small but that strong...i would definitely get bigger, because 82lbs...geeeez you get blown by a strong wind lol


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## scoutfinch (19 Jun 2007)

Dood:

GIVE IT A REST.  THESE POSTS THAT YOU ARE RESURRECTING ARE OVER A YEAR OLD!

And besides, some of the people whom you are critiquing probably know a HELL OF A LOT MORE THAN YOU ON THE SUBJECT MATTER.  (Paracowboy being one of those people).

You are quickly losing credibility here and really p*ssing people off with your know it all attitude.


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## RetiredRoyal (24 Jun 2007)

when i was still with 1 RCR i used to keep a set of work dress and combats that were normally too small for me. After a long exercize, i'd lose at least 10 lbs and my uniforms wouldn't fit when we we got home. After a few weeks back in garrison, I'd start wearing my size 4 reg mediums again.


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