# End of era for two Atlantic Area SVC BN's



## Nfld Sapper (28 Mar 2010)

End of an era for two Atlantic Area Service Battalions......

37 Service Battalion

AMALGAMATION OF 37 CBG SERVICE BATTALIONS 

BACKGROUND  

Effective April 1, 2010 as part of the Army’s transformation, each Reserve Brigade will have only one Reserve Service Battalion.

For 37 Canadian Brigade Group, this means that both 31 (Saint John) Service Battalion and 36 (Nfld) Service Battalion will amalgamate into 37 Service Battalion. The stand-up of 37 Service Battalion will be held April 10th.

Combat Service Support plays a vital role in supporting the Army. It is the Service Battalion's mission to provide Combat Service Support (CSS) relating to supply, transport and maintenance services to Land Force Units of Atlantic Canada and to provide individual augmentation to Regular Force units. The Battalion is also tasked to provide a CSS Platoon on short notice in response to any Domestic Operation requirement.


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## TN2IC (28 Mar 2010)

I believe 36 CBG is doing the same thing. IIRC, it's been done in Ont before. And I'm not sure about the Western area yet.

Regards,
TN2IC (Former 33 SVC BN member)


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## Fdtrucker (28 Mar 2010)

41 CBG is also combining 14 and 15 Svc Bns into 41 Svc Bn starting April 2010 as well. 38 and 39 CBG I am not sure of.


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## Bzzliteyr (29 Mar 2010)

51 Svc Bn recently renamed to 34 Svc Bn from what I understand...


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## dapaterson (29 Mar 2010)

Each CBG AOR will have a single Svc Bn, sharing the name of the CBG.  In SQFT it's emrely a renaming, since there is only a singe Svc Bn in each CBG.  In all of the other CBGs, the current Svc Bns will be amalgamated into a single unit.


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## Bzzliteyr (29 Mar 2010)

Which is kind of funny out west.. I hear 12 and 11 are of course doing the same thing though they have 2hrs (at least) by water between them!


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## Nfld Sapper (29 Mar 2010)

dapaterson said:
			
		

> Each CBG AOR will have a single Svc Bn, sharing the name of the CBG.  In SQFT it's emrely a renaming, since there is only a singe Svc Bn in each CBG.  In all of the other CBGs, the current Svc Bns will be amalgamated into a single unit.



One question about that dapaterson....

With the stand down of 36 (NFLD) SVC BN is this going to cause some confusion with the stand up of a 36 SVC BN in 36 CBG?


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## CountDC (29 Mar 2010)

Bzzliteyr said:
			
		

> Which is kind of funny out west.. I hear 12 and 11 are of course doing the same thing though they have 2hrs (at least) by water between them!



31 and 36 have approximately 22 hours between them if you were to drive which includes a ferry ride of I belief somewheres around 5 hours.

Wondering how this one plays out?  Are there positions lost or are both units staying put with just a name change ie 37 Svc Bn B Coy?


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## Maj BS (29 Mar 2010)

WRT to 1 Apr,  26 Svc Bn from North Bay and Sault Ste Marie will be re badged to 33 Svc Bn.
This should prove to be interesting as the HQ and S & T Coy in North Bay had a Maint Coy in Sault Ste Marie which is a 6.5 hr trip by MLVW. Comd and Contl was always an issue. With HQ now in Ottawa I see this as a situation that has been made worse. Quick history of 26 Svc Bn: 26 was a major contributor to the past Milcons with Maint pers and equip and MSEOPS. 26 Svc Bn was the only Svc Bn of the 6 Svc Bn in ON to provide weekly support to northern units (DP), Cadets and charitable organizations. That is until ASU added another layer of bureaucracy to our capabilities. Our community footprint in both cities was extensive.
This newest change is brought about to create efficiency that will never be seen. 
I am a firm believer that if you stick around long enough we will come full circle with the reinvention of the local Svc Bns.


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## dapaterson (29 Mar 2010)

NFLD Sapper said:
			
		

> One question about that dapaterson....
> 
> With the stand down of 36 (NFLD) SVC BN is this going to cause some confusion with the stand up of a 36 SVC BN in 36 CBG?



Yes, there will be confusion - 31 Svc will now be in London, Windsor and Hamilton ON; similar issues will abound since the CBG nomenclature is based on 10 CBGS, numbered 31-39 and 41.

The "old" nomenclature for Res Svc Bns was based on relationships to the Reg F Svc Bns and ASGs, hence the 1x names in LFWA, 2x names in LFCA, 5x names in SQFT and 3x names in LFCA.  The new nomenclature is intended, at least in part, to reinforce the links with the CBGs; unfortunately, in the short term there will be confusion as the former LFAA numbers are recycled, no doubt leading to confusion in the internal mail system - particularly if the Army (as is its wont) moves forward prior to the official documentation being signed off - legally, the old names will remain in force.


The overall issue of optimal  Reserve structures has been beaten about many times on this board.  Ultimately, units need a critical masss to be able to sustain themselves, otherwise churning out one LCol and one CWO every 3 years becomes difficult at best.  However, the large geographic span of control now being imposed on some part-time COs will also be difficult.  Better career management outside unit lines could alleviate some of that problem, permitting unit HQs with mixed sub-units, and removing some of the CO's headaches in tracking training regimes for multiple trades within a unit.


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## TN2IC (29 Mar 2010)

Let's reopen 4 SVC BN!!  :nod:


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## Nfld Sapper (29 Mar 2010)

CountDC said:
			
		

> 31 and 36 have approximately 22 hours between them if you were to drive which includes a ferry ride of I belief somewheres around 5 hours.
> 
> Wondering how this one plays out?  Are there positions lost or are both units staying put with just a name change ie 37 Svc Bn B Coy?



AFAIK....

As it stands for the stand up..... CO will be in NL, RSM will be in NB after their terms pass it will switch....

Again AFAIK there will be no positions lost.... RSM of 36 will now become the DSM of NL Company......and I guess the CO of 31 will now become the OC(?) of NB Company


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## CountDC (29 Mar 2010)

thanks - glad to know they didn't cut anything.


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## Colin Parkinson (29 Mar 2010)

Bzzliteyr said:
			
		

> Which is kind of funny out west.. I hear 12 and 11 are of course doing the same thing though they have 2hrs (at least) by water between them!



If I recall, didn't 11 SVC bat evolve out of 12th? At least the capbadge is the same...


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## Rifleman62 (2 Apr 2010)

38 CBG: 17 (Winnipeg) and 18 (Thunder Bay) Service Battalions came under one CO in Sep 2004. In Dec 2005, 16 (Saskatchewan) Service Battalion, joined the other two SVC Bns, with only one CO. They were tactically grouped, as 38 CBG did previously with the two Arty Fd Regts and one Indep Fd Bty, and subsequently with the two Sask Inf units and the two Wpg Inf units.

All unit OR in each city became a garrison OR's, years previous.

38 CBG was always light years ahead.


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## VIChris (28 Apr 2010)

Colin P said:
			
		

> If I recall, didn't 11 SVC bat evolve out of 12th? At least the capbadge is the same...



Half true: Our units were, and are now again, part of the same BN, but our logos (were) different until 1 April

11 Service history: http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/11SERVICE_BATTALION/history_e.html

and crest: http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/11SERVICE_BATTALION/crest-and-colours_e.html

12 Service crest and history: http://www.12servicebattalion.com/history_bn_crest.htm


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## a78jumper (5 May 2010)

TN2IC said:
			
		

> Let's reopen 4 SVC BN!!  :nod:



Why not 3 Svc Bn?? LOL >

Unless things have changed recently most of these units were Pl(+) or at the most Coy sized units, that had to be amalgamated for MILCONS etc anyways. I think this is worth a try, and if it does not work out try something else, or go back to the way it was. 

I worked extensively with the CMA Service Battalions (the terrible 2's) as a liaison officer with 2 Svc Bn in the mid 80s and there were huge manning problems even then. I was posted to PMA HQ (attached  to 17 Svc Bn  Winnipeg) in 1987 and my welcome letter from the Comd  stated they paraded 35 people(probably ten of which at least were officers). Sorry to say, I did not get posted there and opted to try something different within the Branch for a couple of years, which was definately worth the ruffled feathers, given the experiences and  the posting that followed in 89. I doubt much has changed in the interim.


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## TN2IC (18 May 2010)

a78jumper said:
			
		

> Why not 3 Svc Bn?? LOL >




Ah cough cough... Germany... 4 SVC BN


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## Thompson_JM (4 Aug 2010)

CountDC said:
			
		

> thanks - glad to know they didn't cut anything.



Nothing part time....


There have been quite a few full time layoffs 

which is turning into a hell of a situation within our unit lines...

the assumption that the Detatchment units would do less work and send more to the HQ unit....

lovely theory... but in practice we are doing the same as before the amalgamations, and layoffs, only with half the staff we had before....

To call this a Soup Sandwich would be an understatement.... 

Sadly I dont see this as something as simple as even Growing Pains... It's going to be a giant schmozzle for some time I envision...

Not to mention Unit and Troop Morale is in the Toilet and everyone around here has lost their GAFF...... 

The only advice I can give the New recruits is to grab a surfboard, ride the wave, and try to make the best of it...


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