# CC-177 Para Drop - PPCLI Para Coy, 25 Nov 12



## Eye In The Sky (29 Nov 2012)

The Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry Parachute Company Group conducted parachute training on 25 November 2012. Approximately 125 personnel using both static line and Military Free fall parachute jumped from the CC-117 Globemaster onto Drop Zone Buxton, the focus of the training was CC-117 Jump Master drills. This was also the first time a mass parachute drop has been conducted using the CC-117.

Youtube Video

DZ Buxton, fond memory of thundering in there as a young Tpr.  ;D


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## Ciskman (29 Nov 2012)

Very Cool! Nothing like watching a mass jump.

The C-17 is getting involved in all sorts of military jumping.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNpI9v7ycP4&list=UUmI170j5bNgK47ajtLPkQZQ&index=12&feature=plcp


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## Ciskman (29 Nov 2012)

Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> DZ Buxton, fond memory of thundering in there as a young Tpr.  ;D



Like the fellow at 42 seconds?  ;D


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## daftandbarmy (29 Nov 2012)

me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next 
me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next
me next me next me next me next me next menext me next me next me next me next me next me next 
me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next
me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next 
me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next me next!

However, to equal the LCF demnstrated by the US Airborne and the C-141, they now need to start selling t-shirts that say "I've been sucked by a C-117"  ;D


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## Eye In The Sky (29 Nov 2012)

HappyWithYourHacky said:
			
		

> Like the fellow at 42 seconds?  ;D



The 5 points of contact are:  balls of feet, left ass cheek, helmet, spine and....


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## MikeL (29 Nov 2012)

Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> The 5 points of contact are:  balls of feet, left *** check, helmet, spine and....



That sounds about right for most of the B Para students during the landing classes...  just throw in a PI saying you're all f*cked up to add insult to injury


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## Old and Tired (29 Nov 2012)

Very nice. And anot a single toes-nose landing to be seen.   :-[


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## Rheostatic (30 Nov 2012)

Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> The Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry Parachute Company Group conducted parachute training on 25 November 2012. Approximately 125 personnel using both static line and Military Free fall parachute jumped from the CC-117 Globemaster onto Drop Zone Buxton, the focus of the training was CC-117 Jump Master drills. This was also the first time a mass parachute drop has been conducted using the CC-117.
> 
> Youtube Video
> 
> DZ Buxton, fond memory of thundering in there as a young Tpr.  ;D


Photos: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lfwapao/sets/72157632112938075/with/8223819099/


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## Journeyman (30 Nov 2012)

Rheostatic said:
			
		

> Photos: http://www.flickr.com/photos/lfwapao/sets/72157632112938075/with/8223819099/


Despite what LFWAPAO call it, for the rest of the CF it's a CC-_177_ 
("CC-117" three times in one paragraph is not a typo)


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## Nfld Sapper (30 Nov 2012)

RCAF website uses both too....

Showing off our second CC-117

CC-177 Globemaster III

 :dunno:


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## Loachman (30 Nov 2012)

Journeyman said:
			
		

> for the rest of the CF


 less QOR of C.


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## Journeyman (1 Dec 2012)

NFLD Sapper said:
			
		

> RCAF website uses both too....


Thank you. I wasn't suggesting that PAO's unfamiliarity with CF nomenclature was limited to LFWA.


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## The Bread Guy (1 Dec 2012)

NFLD Sapper said:
			
		

> RCAF website uses both too....
> 
> Showing off our second CC-117


On this one, it's the headline writer who's apparently taking liberties - every other reference is to CC-177.

 :tsktsk:


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## Armymedic (1 Dec 2012)

Edit to add:It is nice for everyone to realize that parachute insertion is one of those skills that the Army and Air Force let rust while we were all focused on the ATO.

Nice to see the RCAF finally using the CC-117 as the airborne delivery platform the US Army has been for a couple decades now. Even though the it was a "Hollywood" (to use the Americanism) jump.

Someday the Army may put together enough jumpers to fill a CC-117 for a true mass jump:

A full company, full equipment night, utilizing stick commander drills.

Show me that video.


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## -rb (1 Dec 2012)

Rider Pride said:
			
		

> Edit to add:It is nice for everyone to realize that parachute insertion is one of those skills that the Army and Air Force let rust while we were all focused on the ATO.
> 
> Nice to see the RCAF finally using the CC-117 as the airborne delivery platform the US Army has been for a couple decades now. Even though the it was a "Hollywood" (to use the Americanism) jump.
> 
> ...



FYI it was a full company plus attachments, stick commander drills... and a night time drop changes nothing other than your DZ drills on the ground.

Your comment made me laugh as it shows how far out of the loop you really are with respect to Parachute Company Group activities. (At least in the west)

Cheers.


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## Journeyman (1 Dec 2012)

yukon said:
			
		

> FYI it was a full company plus attachments, stick commander drills... and a night time drop changes nothing other than your DZ drills on the ground.
> 
> Your comment made me laugh as it shows how far out of the loop you really are with respect to Parachute Company Group activities. (At least in the west)


Your mocking of the comment by Rider Pride isn't warranted. 

I saw the same bare-ass jump, wandering around the DZ, standing while bundling chutes...is that Para Coy SOP?  If not, you've completely justified his comment.

If you believe that night ops bring no additional changes beyond mere DZ drills, you've obviously never had to deal with ground and air fire support, coordination of boundaries and other control measures, adjusting CSS support..... In effect, your comment shows how far out of the loop you are with respect to parachute ops -- but it didn't make me laugh.


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## -rb (1 Dec 2012)

Not mocking his comments just stating the facts... Para coy group has done numerous fully tactical jumps over the last few years however his comments would lead others to think otherwise... Regardless of the type of delivery method used its just another method of insertion to the fight.  The necessary coordination will always have to be done IOT set the conditions for success.

A bare *** jump is just that, anybody can fall from the sky however aircrew and jm capabilities do need to be tested for future reference under more trying circumstances.

Cheers.


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## Good2Golf (1 Dec 2012)

For my own PME, I'd be interested to know what a (Western) Para Coy Gp composition is? What makes it a Gp?  (vice 120 guys jumping out of a plane)

No offense intended, but it looked pretty administrative...more like practice for manifesting and LM/JM duties than a demonstration of a para coy gp "in action."

Regards
G2G


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## -rb (1 Dec 2012)

Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> the focus of the training was CC-117 Jump Master drills. This was also the first time a mass parachute drop has been conducted



Exactly, focus was as stated in original article.

Cheers.


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## brihard (1 Dec 2012)

Good2Golf said:
			
		

> For my own PME, I'd be interested to know what a (Western) Para Coy Gp composition is? What makes it a Gp?  (vice 120 guys jumping out of a plane)



I'm curious too. I'd take a stab at saying that a 'company' would be the normally composed infantry jump company, whereas when they say 'company group' it denotes that substantial additional assets have been attached; I know there's a jump section within 1 CER, for instance. I would assume there are similar additional 'plug and play' jump qualified assets within other 1 CMBG units outside of the infantry.


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## Infanteer (1 Dec 2012)

Company Group has, officially, been done away with by the Army Terminology Board, yet it still persists in a lot of documentation.  The approriate (and doctrinal) term is combat team.

There are many documents from the Light Forces Working Group concerning a Parachute Combat Team.  It sees an combat team ideally organized as follows:

Infantry Company (115 pers)
FOO/FAC Team (5 pers)
Mortar Group (21 pers)
Engineer Troop (31 pers)
Recce/Pathfinder Section (12 pers)
Sniper Det (4 pers)
Medical Det (6 pers)
Rigger Team (3 pers)
Signals Det (3 pers)
UEO (1)


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## Good2Golf (1 Dec 2012)

Danke.  205 jumpers is quite a robust sub-unit.  By any chance, would there be C16s in that team?

Regards
G2G


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## Infanteer (1 Dec 2012)

Nope, not under canopy anyways.  C-16s can't be jumped; I think it was either 3 RCR of CFLAWC that found this out the hard way...


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## MikeL (1 Dec 2012)

Infanteer said:
			
		

> Signals Det (3 pers)



Curious if this number is the Jump Coy Signallers,  or is this 3x pers det in addition to the Coy Sigs?


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## Old EO Tech (2 Dec 2012)

-Skeletor- said:
			
		

> Curious if this number is the Jump Coy Signallers,  or is this 3x pers det in addition to the Coy Sigs?



I think your confusing Sig Ops which would man the det, as apposed to Inf with the advanced comms course that would be double hatted as inf coy signalers and riflemen.

Jon


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## daftandbarmy (2 Dec 2012)

Infanteer said:
			
		

> Company Group has, officially, been done away with by the Army Terminology Board, yet it still persists in a lot of documentation.  The approriate (and doctrinal) term is combat team.
> 
> There are many documents from the Light Forces Working Group concerning a Parachute Combat Team.  It sees an combat team ideally organized as follows:
> 
> ...



I had 186 under command once upon a time for an airborne exercise. It was a bit of a zoo but it worked not too badly, except for the attached crap hats who couldn't keep up and had to be backloaded with the PWs.  :

I'm all for small airborne companies and big airborne battle groups. Big company groups are pretty much a higher command cop out IMHO.


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## MikeL (2 Dec 2012)

Old EO Tech said:
			
		

> I think your confusing Sig Ops which would man the det, as apposed to Inf with the advanced comms course that would be double hatted as inf coy signalers and riflemen.
> 
> Jon



Platoon Signallers are Infantry, and on some occasions there have been Sigs doing it.  Sig Ops(now ACISS) are the Coy HQ Signallers(and are part of the Coy).

As well,  not sure what you mean by an advanced comms course.  Some Platoon Signallers haven't had a comms course,  others have had the basic course that Sig Pl runs.


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## dangerboy (2 Dec 2012)

A long time ago there used to be an Advanced Comms course that MCpls and Sgts could go on. I can't remember when they stopped running it, probably in the mid 90s.


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## brihard (2 Dec 2012)

dangerboy said:
			
		

> A long time ago there used to be an Advanced Comms course that MCpls and Sgts could go on. I can't remember when they stopped running it, probably in the mid 90s.



What was on it? ATCIS Basic and Intermediate are pretty comprehensive for what a dismounted conventional element is likely to actually have, at least that's the impression I get...


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## Old EO Tech (2 Dec 2012)

Brihard said:
			
		

> What was on it? ATCIS Basic and Intermediate are pretty comprehensive for what a dismounted conventional element is likely to actually have, at least that's the impression I get...



Yes that is what I was referring too just using older terms.  I realize that units also conduct TCCCS refresher/inhouse training as part of the IBTS/PCF cycle, but those are not functional replacements for the formal training in the ATCIS course.

Jon


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## Bruce Monkhouse (2 Dec 2012)

Brihard said:
			
		

> What was on it?



A LOT of drinking,...............oh, you mean content??
My bad........


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## PanaEng (5 Dec 2012)

how many full eqpt troops can be dropped from these beasts?


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## FEEOP042 (5 Dec 2012)

102 fully loaded Paratroopers
http://www.military.cz/usa/air/in_service/aircraft/c17/c17_en.htm


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## Eye In The Sky (15 Dec 2012)

Another video, from _Pegasus Spear_.
CFCombat Camera video link:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPrLtYYmRZ4&feature=youtu.be


Who says the Army and the Air Force can't get along?  

Published on Dec 13, 2012 

Members of The Third Battalion, Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry (3 PPCLI), along with 429 (Transport) Squadron, participate in an airborne exercise called Pegasus Spear.


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## Journeyman (15 Dec 2012)

*OMG!! *   anic:


0:52 into the vid -- that's not an issue toque!! rly:    RSMs everywhere are having seizures!


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## Kirkhill (15 Dec 2012)

OK,  I get the sarcasm .... 

But 

You have to have an RCR soul to even spot that discrepancy on one frame of a 3 minute video.   ;D

What's next?  Rock paint for fun and profit?


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## Ciskman (15 Dec 2012)

Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> Another video, from _Pegasus Spear_.
> CFCombat Camera video link:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPrLtYYmRZ4&feature=youtu.be
> 
> 
> ...



Wicked video. Man, there is nothing pretty about a round landing! ;D


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## medicineman (15 Dec 2012)

Kirkhill said:
			
		

> What's next?  Rock paint for fun and profit?



I'm sure if some of us came up with blue, black and gold paint made especially for rocks, the respective RQ's for each battalion would be paying our mortgages for years to come  ;D

MM


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## PanaEng (15 Dec 2012)

Here is another one that a friend loaded:
http://youtu.be/fWrunqgyw-w


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## downinOZ (19 Dec 2012)

Rider Pride said:
			
		

> Show me that video.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=IiYABkFwOxw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7dgHInTy8M

Capability 'exists' now, but is definitely on the back-burner.

Hooray, T-11s!


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## daftandbarmy (19 Dec 2012)

downinOZ said:
			
		

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=IiYABkFwOxw
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7dgHInTy8M
> 
> ...



Was there any 'heavy drop'? That's the thing that tend to differentiate heavily armed hiking clubs from an airborne battlegroup! ;D


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## MikeL (19 Dec 2012)

downinOZ said:
			
		

> Capability 'exists' now, but is definitely on the back-burner.



By back burner do you mean non existent?  At least for everyone not part of SOF?  I was under the impression that the Army no longer has any Airborne forces outside of the Commando Regiments and SASR.


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## downinOZ (19 Dec 2012)

-Skeletor- said:
			
		

> By back burner do you mean non existent?   I was under the impression that the Army no longer has any Airborne forces outside of the Commando Regiments and SASR.



Correct for both statemements.  Disappointing loss of a conventional capability.

And yes, heavy drops and door bundles were dropped on both exercises (two years ago).  ORBAT was similar to that described above.


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## legionnaire (7 Jan 2013)

I am in Para coy, but missed this jump because I was away on course. The only issue I have with this is that due to limitations, the sticks were still broken into something like 8-10 people per side, which really takes away from the awesomeness of having 100+ guys in the air at the same time.


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