# CF Pilot Wings instead of Cadet Wings



## Planecrazy (25 Feb 2007)

Is it possible to wear CF pilot wings as a CIC officer if you have over 500 hours and a Commercial Pilot Licence with a Multi Engine IFR rating? The reason I ask is that on the air reserve website it states:

Quote
"In some cases, the military will grant equivalency credit for civilian training that individuals may have taken on their own.  Based on an assessment of certified qualifications, a candidate could be granted a provisional military occupation and would only be required to complete a portion of the military training before being fully employable.  An example of this is the Skilled Pilot Entry Plan, where an applicant with a minimum of 500 hours logged flying time and an IFR rating in either fixed-wing multi-engine aircraft or helicopter could be considered for enrolment in the pilot occupation"

The above was taken from the Air Reserve Website under "Occupation Training". I realize CIC is a non operational division of the reserve but just wondering if CF Wings pilot wings could be worn.

Just curious, not taking the matter too seriously as I know how well trained the CF Pilots are so civillian qualifications may not wash without some militiary type sprecific training that would not be available to CIC staff.

Rgds.


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## Michael OLeary (25 Feb 2007)

You will have to make a request through your chain of command to see what possibilities exist.  It is unlikely you would be approved to received the 'equivalency' training since it has no bearing on your job as a CIC officer. 

See also this thread - http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/57857.0.html


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## Planecrazy (25 Feb 2007)

I don't have any intention to complete any training just wondering if the full CF wings could be worn. But you are right I should go through the channels and find out.


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## Neill McKay (25 Feb 2007)

Planecrazy said:
			
		

> I don't have any intention to complete any training just wondering if the full CF wings could be worn. But you are right I should go through the channels and find out.



I believe that CIC officers who have appropriate civilian flying qualifications, *and are using them in support of the cadet programme*, may wear cadet-pattern pilot wings.  As a naval officer I'm hardly the best person to ask so I echo Michael's advice to take it up the chain.


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## medaid (25 Feb 2007)

Ah! I remember this when I was an air cadet. It was in the early 2000s when the CIC Air officers who had Cadet Power wings wanted to remove the P from the wings and have just the maple leaf, and change the over all shape to look more like the Air Force pilot wings. This was shot down. REALLY quick, by the Air Force, and all the pilots in the Air Force. Even those who were cadets before who had their wings were strongly against CIC Air officers having wings that were similar to the Air Force ones, or the exact same ones. 

Now, Planecrazy, by your own quote you should be able to answer your question because:

1) Based on an assessment of certified qualifications, a candidate could be granted a *provisional military occupation* and would only be required to complete a portion of the *military training* before being fully employable

2) CIC is a *non operational* division of the reserve

CIC Air will never be allowed to wear CF Pilot Wings, or any other Wings, unless they were earned previously when the member was in Reg Force or PRes. The reason is outlined above. No CIC officer will ever take any military courses that are remotely the equivalent to their brothers and sisters in the Reg Force / PRes, because their mandate is completely different. As you even said so yourself, the CIC is a nonoperational division of the reserves (even this is stretching it, the reserves part). Another things is, the Skilled Pilot Entry Program still requires you to undergo military training. This means flight training with he Air Force which as a civilian you will never get, and even as a CIC officer with a Power Wing, you will never get, because your POWER WING is a CIVILIAN qualification. 

Like I said, when I was a cadet there was a big push by some of the old timer CIC Air with cadet pilot wings, who thinks that they deserve something different. It was, as I said, quickly, if not immediately shut down by their brethren and sisteren (is there such a word?!) who fly for a living supporting missions at home and abroad. Like Michael said, CIC officers' job profile does not include the operation of operational air craft. Saying that your tow plane for a glider is an operational plane is well... really stretching it.


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## Planecrazy (25 Feb 2007)

I understand what your're saying but most (not all)of the CIC guys with the power wings that tow etc (even the old timers) only have Private licences (PPL). A Commercial Pilot licence with a Multi IFR and 500+ hours is different  and requires more skill level than someone with just a PPL. A PPL is too incomplete and doesnt have a lot of depth to it. 

 The CPL with multi IFR and 500+ hours logged is far more advanced and almost equivelant to airforce wings standard according to the airforce(for P.res guys that are entering that MOC).  But like you say, the CIC is far from being any way operational and that equivelency thing would only apply to MOC which CIC cannot even get close to.

Anyways I realize its a long shot but was just wondering if I could get recognition for civillian/airline experience. I don't hold a lot of hope but I will go through the chain later on. I'm a civillian instructor right now going through the CIC application process so one step at a time.


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## Michael OLeary (25 Feb 2007)

Since we're already in a closed loop of repetitive advice and justifications, discussion closed.

Planecrazy, if you want to at the time, ask a Mosderator to reopen the thread  to post the answer you get from your chain of command.

Army.ca Staff


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## Inch (25 Feb 2007)

Why oh why are people always looking for the easy way to get a set of CF pilot wings?


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