# Fiesty old bugger



## Cloud Cover (20 Mar 2006)

Article reproduced under the Fair Dealings provisions of the Copyright Act. 

Ouch!

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060319/police_driver_060319/20060319?hub=Canada



Driver, 81, allegedly attacks police officer


CTV.ca News Staff 
  
Updated: Sun. Mar. 19 2006 11:20 PM ET 

A police officer conducting a routine traffic stop got more than he bargained for when he was allegedly confronted by a violent 81-year-old driver.

Police say the man was pulled over early Saturday morning in the town of Cambridge, Ont. for not wearing a seatbelt.

Despite his advanced age, "the driver became irate and ended up punching the officer in the face," said Supt. Brent Thomlinson of the Waterloo Regional Police.

"The officer was dragged a short distance by the vehicle and fell clear, and ended up breaking his elbow and wrist as a result of the fall."

While officers tracked down the driver's car, he sped away. They followed him for a short distance but decided to call off the chase for safety reasons.

Police then confronted the driver at his home, but the octogenarian was allegedly still angry, and still unwilling to give himself up.

"Officers attempted to arrest the man at that time for the violations that had occurred and he was brandishing a metal bar," said Thomlinson.

"The officers ended up taking him into custody and he was taken to Cambridge Memorial Hospital, as he had some cuts and scrapes to his head."

Percy Turner was released from hospital but now faces several charges, including assaulting a police officer and dangerous driving.

Turner will is scheduled to appear in court on April 6. Police are now looking for witnesses.

With a report by CTV's Lia Rosekat in Cambridge, Ont.


© Copyright 2002-2006 Bell Globemedia Inc.


----------



## Bruce Monkhouse (20 Mar 2006)

From what I heard this morning they ended up pepper spraying him......


----------



## The Gues-|- (20 Mar 2006)

whiskey601 said:
			
		

> "The officers ended up taking him into custody and he was taken to Cambridge Memorial Hospital, as he had some cuts and scrapes to his head."



Old bugger.  I wonder how he got the cuts and scrapes :


----------



## Thompson_JM (20 Mar 2006)

The Gues-|- said:
			
		

> Old bugger.  I wonder how he got the cuts and scrapes :



Obviously he was resisting arrest....

stupid old man, got what he deserved. since lets be honest.. hes 81, hes not gonna see any kind of real jail time...


----------



## zipperhead_cop (21 Mar 2006)

Cpl Thompson said:
			
		

> Obviously he was resisting arrest....
> 
> stupid old man, got what he deserved. since lets be honest.. hes 81, hes not gonna see any kind of real jail time...



He won't get jail time because the judges think it is part of our job to get assaulted.  I would love to know if the initial officer was trying to be respectful of the man's age and ended up having it bite them in the ass.  
It goes without saying, that if they had sorted him out the way he needed it, then there would be poor old pappy in the hospital, holding an enlarged photo of him with his 6 grandkids and a Pomeranian looking all sad with the monster block letter head line "GRANDFATHER OF ALL BEATINGS" or some such jackass comment.  
We need Canada to be like Logans Run, but with red crystal at age 80 that can be appealed on demonstration of useful skills.


----------



## MPIKE (21 Mar 2006)

The Gues-|- said:
			
		

> Old bugger.  I wonder how he got the cuts and scrapes :



Just what are you eluding too? If you trying to take that to where I think you're trying, just come out and state it.    Cut n scrapes do not equate to a Rodney King!


----------



## karl28 (21 Mar 2006)

I hope at the very least this old guy loses his car and licences. Just because your old doesn't give you an excuse to treat the law any old way that you feel like it .


----------



## Pte_Martin (21 Mar 2006)

i think we should be careful of what we say, This guy had no excuse to do what he did, but how do we know he isn't suffering from some kind of mental disorder.


----------



## zipperhead_cop (21 Mar 2006)

Infantry_ said:
			
		

> i think we should be careful of what we say, This guy had no excuse to do what he did, but how do we know he isn't suffering from some kind of mental disorder.



Even if he is, the police are still obliged to protect the public and sort out deranged individuals.  In fact, that is one of the most dangerous parts of the job, next to "routine traffic stops".


----------



## Trinity (21 Mar 2006)

Infantry_ said:
			
		

> but how do we know he isn't suffering from some kind of mental disorder.



Thank you... (thinking along the same lines)


----------



## zipperhead_cop (21 Mar 2006)

Trinity said:
			
		

> Thank you... (thinking along the same lines)



Yet another reason he will do no jail time.


----------



## The Gues-|- (21 Mar 2006)

He has done his time.. he's 81.  If anything, give him house arrest.


----------



## Pte_Martin (21 Mar 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> Yet another reason he will do no jail time.



I don't think he should get jail time, first of all, There are some pedophiles out there that get house arrest or slaps on the wrist. Second if The man does have some kind of disorder why not help him by sending him to get treatment. And think about his age, Put him in prison and I'm sure he'd die before his time was up. If it was your grandpa or dad and he had a disorder and did the same thing would you want him thrown in jail? Or would you try to get him help and sort it out, I think taking his license away will be enough Nobody got seriously hurt and it turned out ok in the end.

Once again I'm not condoing this what he did was wrong but in some circumstances there should be different punishments not just send him to jail.


----------



## karl28 (21 Mar 2006)

Just because he is old and behaved badly doesn't mean that he has a disorder he can just simply be a jerk there are lots of them out there  and don't forget this old man did hurt a police officer  . Some people have stated that what if he was your Grandfather would you want him to be thrown in jail? To simply put it  YES  he broke the law if he does have a disorder than treat him for it in Jail  they can do that . Remember folks the officer has a family to if the hurt police officer was some one in your family wouldn't you want the law to do something to the person who hurt him?


----------



## Thompson_JM (21 Mar 2006)

karl28 said:
			
		

> Just because he is old and behaved badly doesn't mean that he has a disorder he can just simply be a jerk there are lots of them out there  and don't forget this old man did hurt a police officer  . Some people have stated that what if he was your Grandfather would you want him to be thrown in jail? To simply put it  YES  he broke the law if he does have a disorder than treat him for it in Jail  they can do that . Remember folks the officer has a family to if the hurt police officer was some one in your family wouldn't you want the law to do something to the person who hurt him?



or since so many *LOVE* Asking the "what-if" questions.... (what if he has a mental disorder? what if he was your grandfather..)

Heres one to think about... What if he Killed that Police Officer? 

Now would you feel any different?  You shouldnt.... the fact is, the only reason that Cop didnt get killed is luck. Luck and maybe to some degree his training. the fact is, what the old man did was wreckless and extremely dangerous... and he put many peoples lives at risk... If he was my grandfather, I would want him put somewhere where he couldnt hurt anyone again. Kind gentle old ment dont just turn into A**holes overnight. this guy was probabbly either suffering from extreme Dementia or plain and simple, he is a dick. and he was a dick when he was younger, he was dick when he was middle aged, and he has continued to be a dick up to now. 

Hey Zipperhead, I bet you could write a book on the number of people you encounter who prove that Age does not equal Maturity.

the fact is, he almost killed a cop...  Regardless of why, he needs to be taken away from normal society. He has proved to me anyways, that he is incapable of making good choices anymore, to the point where he is now a danger to himself and others.

OMHA, CCC, HTA.. I dont care what they use to get him off the street as long as it works.

and thats my tarnished two cents.

regards


----------



## zipperhead_cop (21 Mar 2006)

Infantry_ said:
			
		

> I don't think he should get jail time, first of all, There are some pedophiles out there that get house arrest or slaps on the wrist. Second if The man does have some kind of disorder why not help him by sending him to get treatment. And think about his age, Put him in prison and I'm sure he'd die before his time was up. If it was your grandpa or dad and he had a disorder and did the same thing would you want him thrown in jail? Or would you try to get him help and sort it out, I think taking his license away will be enough Nobody got seriously hurt and it turned out ok in the end.
> 
> Once again I'm not condoing this what he did was wrong but in some circumstances there should be different punishments not just send him to jail.



You are right.  Too many a$$holes don't get enough time.  So let's see everyone get longer sentences.  As for gramps in the story, I don't have an opinion as to whether he specifically needs some time in jail or if he is a MHA case.  Someone find me a news link, or get me the guys name and I'll see if he is a life long dick.  
As for Cpl Thompson's query, you are quite right.  Jackassery knows no bounds of time, gender race, social status, education level, social connectivity.  A limitless array of fecal matter in the crap rainbow.


----------



## The Gues-|- (21 Mar 2006)

karl28 said:
			
		

> Just because he is old and behaved badly doesn't mean that he has a disorder he can just simply be a jerk there are lots of them out there  and don't forget this old man did hurt a police officer  .


Huh? No one said that and do you know this man well enough to state he doesn't have a disorder?



			
				Infantry_ said:
			
		

> Second if The man does have some kind of disorder why not help him by sending him to get treatment.


 Key word - "if"



			
				karl28 said:
			
		

> To simply put it  YES  he broke the law if he does have a disorder than treat him for it in Jail  they can do that .


You don't know what type of disorder he has... if he has one at all.  To state that the jail will take care of it is laughable.



			
				Cpl Thompson said:
			
		

> the fact is, what the old man did was wreckless and extremely dangerous... and he put many peoples lives at risk... If he was my grandfather, I would want him put somewhere where he couldnt hurt anyone again. Kind gentle old ment dont just turn into A**holes overnight. this guy was probabbly either suffering from extreme Dementia or plain and simple, he is a dick. and he was a dick when he was younger, he was dick when he was middle aged, and he has continued to be a dick up to now.


Thanks for the diagnoses doc. "so what is it old man? according to your actions I have learned from reading a CTV article, I have concluded that a) you're either a dick, or b) you have dementia"



			
				Cpl Thompson said:
			
		

> the fact is, he almost killed a cop...  Regardless of why, he needs to be taken away from normal society. He has proved to me anyways, that he is incapable of making good choices anymore, to the point where he is now a danger to himself and others.



Damn! I'm sure he'll be glad you're not his judge... he'd be guilty until proven innocent.


----------



## zipperhead_cop (21 Mar 2006)

The Gues-|- said:
			
		

> Damn! I'm sure he'll be glad you're not his judge... he'd be guilty until proven innocent.



Yes, how horribly un-Canadian of you to draw a conclusion from a set of stated facts before some lawyer can get in there and throw smoke and mirrors around.  That poor man needs the benefit of medical testimony and impassioned heartfelt pleas from the person who is being paid to make them.  Shame on your disgraceful common sense attitude.  I thought we established in this country that reasonable conclusions have no place in the criminal law system.  

The fact is that the health care system and the laws surrounding the rights of very mentally ill people are pretty bass ackwards and frequently judges end up being in a position where they end up ordering care, and that is the only way the person gets help.  I have dealt with some clearly deranged individuals whom I knew would not get any real penalty for what they did, but I still locked them up.  If not to cover my ass, than to let an "All Knowing Super Brain" judge make the call as to whether they should cut the person loose back on society or send them off to a hospital on a Form.


----------



## The Gues-|- (22 Mar 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> Yes, how horribly un-Canadian of you to draw a conclusion from a set of stated facts before some lawyer can get in there and throw smoke and mirrors around.  That poor man needs the benefit of medical testimony and impassioned heartfelt pleas from the person who is being paid to make them.  Shame on your disgraceful common sense attitude.  I thought we established in this country that reasonable conclusions have no place in the criminal law system.


You're a police officer and you considered that a reasonable conclusion out of common sense?



			
				zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> The fact is that the health care system and the laws surrounding the rights of very mentally ill people are pretty bass ackwards and frequently judges end up being in a position where they end up ordering care, and that is the only way the person gets help.  I have dealt with some clearly deranged individuals whom I knew would not get any real penalty for what they did, but I still locked them up.  If not to cover my ass, than to let an "All Knowing Super Brain" judge make the call as to whether they should cut the person loose back on society or send them off to a hospital on a Form.


I have no problem with that.  Detain all the people you want, but everyone deserves a fair trial, deranged or sane.  That's I'll I'm saying.


----------



## zipperhead_cop (22 Mar 2006)

I guess my point is that this "elderly gentleman" was being a reckless tool with a disregard for the safety of others.  The story is barely out of the bricks, and people are qualifying his actions and making excuses for him.  If the story was of a 25 year old man, everyone would be screaming for blood.   Why does putting in 80 years buy him some sort of a-hole currency?  If he is sick, that is unfortunate.  But we don't get the luxury of feeling bad for him.  The State has to act swiftly to try to ensure he doesn't keep on driving around in a blind white rage mowing people down.  The rest is details.  
Is it so unreasonable to read the information in the story and conclude "this guy is whacked.  Get him off the road"?


----------



## Thompson_JM (22 Mar 2006)

The Gues-|- said:
			
		

> Thanks for the diagnoses doc. "so what is it old man? according to your actions I have learned from reading a CTV article, I have concluded that a) you're either a dick, or b) you have dementia"



Try a couple years of Police Foundations Combined with a couple years of working security, and 7 years of military experience Jacknut...
I'm not a Doc. I never said I was, and I'll be the first one to say that my life experience is nothing compared to what some have. But, I have been around the block a few times.. Hell... living in Hamilton I should get Bonus points.. its the Crazy capital of Ontario... no I'm serious.. ever since Hamilton Psych closed its doors it let TONS of em out onto the streets... And I hear a few stories as well. I have an Aunt who works as a Palliative Care nurse and Social Worker... so she deals with OMHA cases every day. Usually Cases of Dementia where the police have to be called in to remove the person from their home because they are now a danger to themselves and those around them. (normally the police are able to do it without using force.) Do you even know what OMHA Stands for? Go on... Take a shot in the Dark... (Without Using Google) 

 I suppose I could have Clarified my previous Post but i was under the assumption that most people on here are fairly reasonable...

I mean hey, if you can come up with any good reason to take off running in your car, from a cop, after pulling over, AND dragging the cop X number of Feet, AND injuring him, AND when finally confronted at his home resists LAWFUL Detention and arrest, forcing the police to use force to bring you in? then hey.... I'll listen.... but I don't know about you, but here in Logic-land (its like Lego-land without all the cool toys) thats called either a mental Disorder, or he's an asshole.... one... or the other.... cause I really cant think of a Third Possibility....

either way, like i said, he needs to be removed.if they can treat him, great, but he cant just keep walking around the way he is. 



> Damn! I'm sure he'll be glad you're not his judge... he'd be guilty until proven innocent.



Actually I wholeheartedly Support Due Process, and the belief of innocence until guilt has been proven. I think where you and I Differ is that I support Real Sentencing and Punishment in the Correctional system as opposed to the "slap on the wrist" type that we usually see...

Believe me, If I were a Judge there would be a lot of really sorry Criminals in Jail, and a lot of Happy Cops, when they find out I'm the one hearing the Case.

Regards.
    The CTV Doctor


----------



## zipperhead_cop (22 Mar 2006)

Cpl Thompson said:
			
		

> Do you even know what OMHA Stands for? Go on... Take a shot in the Dark... (Without Using Google)



Uhhh, isn't that the insurance company that used to sponsor "Wild Kingdom"?  Mutual of OMHA?  I loved that show.  Crazy old man and the young guy that always was the one in danger.  HAHAHAHAH.  Stupid hippos! :blotto:


----------



## Thompson_JM (23 Mar 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> Uhhh, isn't that the insurance company that used to sponsor "Wild Kingdom"?  Mutual of OMHA?  I loved that show.  Crazy old man and the young guy that always was the one in danger.  HAHAHAHAH.  Stupid hippos! :blotto:



Zing..... 

It would appear I have just been served...  ;D


----------



## TCBF (23 Mar 2006)

"Uhhh, isn't that the insurance company that used to sponsor "Wild Kingdom"?  Mutual of OMHA?  I loved that show.  Crazy old man and the young guy that always was the one in danger.  HAHAHAHAH.  Stupid hippos!" - zipperhead_cop

POST OF THE DAY!

 ;D

Tom


----------



## Kat Stevens (23 Mar 2006)

I loved that show! "While I observe from inside the armoured car, Bob annoys the white rhino with his slingshot."


----------



## zipperhead_cop (23 Mar 2006)

Sorry, Cpl T.  That was a bit of a shot, but not at you.  Sometimes my tangent-oriented brain gets too off track.


----------



## Thompson_JM (23 Mar 2006)

No Worries Bud! That was the funniest thing ive read all week!  ;D


----------



## zipperhead_cop (24 Mar 2006)

Cpl Thompson said:
			
		

> No Worries Bud! That was the funniest thing ive read all week!  ;D



Hope your week gets a bit more interesting then ;D


----------



## Slim (3 Jul 2006)

Kat Stevens said:
			
		

> I loved that show! "While I observe from inside the armoured car, Bob annoys the white rhino with his slingshot."



That was Jim...Jim used to wrestle with the lions and tigers and the...

anyway, sorry I've come late to this but...If I stopped someone at the side of the rad and they dragged me down the street with their vehicle I don't think that I'd be too keen on them getting behind the wheel of anything more powerful than a shopping cart to say the least! 

The guy still broke the law and almost killed someone else while doing it!

Draw your own conclusions.

Slim


----------



## Good2Golf (3 Jul 2006)

zipperhead_cop said:
			
		

> I guess my point is that this "elderly gentleman" was being a reckless tool with a disregard for the safety of others.  The story is barely out of the bricks, and people are qualifying his actions and making excuses for him.  If the story was of a 25 year old man, everyone would be screaming for blood.   Why does putting in 80 years buy him some sort of a-hole currency?  If he is sick, that is unfortunate.  But we don't get the luxury of feeling bad for him.  The State has to act swiftly to try to ensure he doesn't keep on driving around in a blind white rage mowing people down.  The rest is details.
> Is it so unreasonable to read the information in the story and conclude "this guy is whacked.  Get him off the road"?



+1`


----------



## zipperhead_cop (4 Jul 2006)

Well, he has court on Thursday, so we'll stand by to see the "Wheel 'o' Justice" in action.   :


----------



## JackD (13 Jul 2006)

Since I'm way away in Poland, could you tell me how this one works out? By the way i have a brother in the ambulance service out your way - From what he's said, you have my sympathies being in the police in those parts...


----------



## zipperhead_cop (14 Jul 2006)

JackD said:
			
		

> Since I'm way away in Poland, could you tell me how this one works out? By the way i have a brother in the ambulance service out your way - From what he's said, you have my sympathies being in the police in those parts...



Depends what city or town your brother is in.  I personally feel we have a good time here in Windsor, as compared to other cities.  However, it is well acknowledged that we have the worst judges in the country.  
I won't be back to work until next Tuesday.  I'll try to see if there was any head way.  
By the way, the "poor little confused grampy" is 6'1" and 235 lbs.


----------



## paracowboy (14 Jul 2006)

maybe the onset of some sort of dementia brought on by a stroke or Alzheimer's? This dude should have been forced to see a medical specialist of some type. If he's like this with LEO, he's probably entering a stage where he'll be a danger to himself and others.


----------



## JackD (16 Jul 2006)

Thanks for the reply. A darn frustrating life - being in the police. Mind you, some of the gentle-men/women I have met or dealt with can be frustrating - I moved in once to an apartment in Saskatoon and found vials of cocaine and needles hidden in various locations (who stores their insulin under carpet, underthe radiator?). Carefully making sure nothing would be touched by my daughter, I phoned - only to get a lecture on drug use. In the end I hung-up and dumped the bloody stuff - which pissed off the previous occupants when they came looking for it all. I'm afraid I cannot rate the efficiency of the Saskatoon Police force (of some ten years' ago) very high... By the way in your work areas, do you have an "enquiries" number? In Saskatoon, there was only the 911, a call like mine isn't an emergency - nor were calls I've made to report break-ins (which were quite frequent in that area) - but none-the-less, are good to report. What suggestions could you make  about making the service better for you, and better for the public?


----------



## zipperhead_cop (17 Jul 2006)

JackD said:
			
		

> Thanks for the reply. A darn frustrating life - being in the police. Mind you, some of the gentle-men/women I have met or dealt with can be frustrating - I moved in once to an apartment in Saskatoon and found vials of cocaine and needles hidden in various locations (who stores their insulin under carpet, underthe radiator?). Carefully making sure nothing would be touched by my daughter, I phoned - only to get a lecture on drug use. In the end I hung-up and dumped the bloody stuff - which pissed off the previous occupants when they came looking for it all. I'm afraid I cannot rate the efficiency of the Saskatoon Police force (of some ten years' ago) very high... By the way in your work areas, do you have an "enquiries" number? In Saskatoon, there was only the 911, a call like mine isn't an emergency - nor were calls I've made to report break-ins (which were quite frequent in that area) - but none-the-less, are good to report. What suggestions could you make  about making the service better for you, and better for the public?



This is ranging a bit towards a hijack, but every service has a non emergency number.  It should be fairly easy to find in the phone book.  The number for OPP for all of Ontario is 1 (888) 310-1122.  I won't be able to help you out with anything in Poland, though.


----------



## JackD (17 Jul 2006)

Thanks for that - Poland for emergency service it's 999 - incidently they do alot of foot patrol etc here - and as it is garrison town, the MP's in training are out there too. By the way, the Scots are so short of police that they are importing them from Poland - probably because the Poles and Scots speak the same language.... may be a good go for ye out there your way. Hijacks. My first name is Jack.. my brother got into serious manure once in Saskatoon for greeting me at the airport...


----------



## zipperhead_cop (17 Jul 2006)

JackD said:
			
		

> Thanks for that - Poland for emergency service it's 999 - incidently they do alot of foot patrol etc here - and as it is garrison town, the MP's in training are out there too. By the way, the Scots are so short of police that they are importing them from Poland - probably because the Poles and Scots speak the same language.... may be a good go for ye out there your way. Hijacks. My first name is Jack.. my brother got into serious manure once in Saskatoon for greeting me at the airport...



If you are talking about the language of alcohol, then I can believe they speak the same.   :cheers:

Hi, Jack.  I get it.  Har.


----------

