# VAC Spending/Downsizing (merged)



## GAP

8 Veterans Affairs offices that could be closed
Federal department's district offices to close in early 2014, union says
By Kevin Yarr, CBC News  Feb 21, 2013 
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2013/02/21/pei-veterans-affairs-offices-closed-584.html

CBC News has learned the locations of eight district offices of Canada's Department of Veterans Affairs that could be closed.

There are 32 district offices across the country, set up to help veterans with questions about their benefits.

As part of the March 2012 budget, the federal government announced it would be closing several district offices, including the one in Charlottetown. In January, the department said that process eventually led to the cutting of 78 positions, but did not say where.

The Union of Veterans Affairs Employees told CBC News it has been informed by the department that offices in these cities will be shut:

    Charlottetown
    Corner Brook, N.L.
    Sydney, N.S.
    Windsor, Ont.
    Thunder Bay, Ont.
    Kelowna, B.C.
    Saskatoon
    Brandon, Man.

The union said the offices would close on Feb. 28, 2014.

CBC News followed up by email with the Department of Veterans Affairs, but the department would not confirm or deny the offices were closing.

"With respect to your inquiry regarding closures of VAC District Offices, we would like to indicate we are adjusting the presence of the department across the country to reflect the changing nature of the Veterans population and to serve Veterans in the most efficient and effective manner possible," wrote media relations adviser Janice Summerby.

The department is setting up what it is calling an access centre in Charlottetown for veterans to replace the district office. The department said that with the Veterans Affairs head office in Charlottetown, it seemed logical that veterans have direct access to the department.

It would not say if access centres would be established in other locations.
Corrections and Clarifications
end of article

   Following publication the Union of Veterans Affairs Employees corrected its list of offices that are closing. The district office in London, Ont. is not closing. Feb. 22, 2013|7:12 a.m AT


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## Occam

GAP said:
			
		

> The department said that with the Veterans Affairs head office in Charlottetown, it seemed logical that veterans have direct access to the department.



Well, by that logic, since I live in Ottawa, I should be able to just drop in on the PM at his place on Sussex Dr on the way to work if I have some ideas on how the country should be run.   :


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## Fishbone Jones

The service at my local office was on par with the organization's national service.

Lousy.

Won't be missed.


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## maniac

This is not news.  This was announced sometime ago.  It is not "could" it's "will".  The could and should close Kirkland Lake, it serves no purpose located by Timmins.


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## Sythen

Its funny that I live in Ottawa, but my new case manager is based out of.. either Kingston or Hamilton, can't remember. Either way, its impossible for us to have a face to face meeting, and she has told me its their SOP that they not give out their office phone numbers. I need to sit on hold for 10+ minutes some times with the 1-800 number just to ask them to transfer me to her.

I hope these closures means more money at the offices that will remain open.


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## OldSolduer

What is NOT mentioned is that VAC has an office in CFB Shilo co-located with the IPSC. Shilo is about 20 minutes from Brandon.


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## Rifleman62

As stated above this was announced previously. The office in Shilo should stay open as a satellite of Wpg when Brandon closes.

The anti, the ever evil Harper, CBC stirring the pot.

The Kelowna VAC office would be my selection for the stereotype public service office of the year. So bad, I launched an official complaint against the guy I had to deal with. His supervisor one notch better. 

There is an VAC office in Penticton, 45 minutes away.


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## Remius

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/1-1b-meant-for-veterans-returned-to-federal-treasury-critics-say-1.2841417

Nice.  Saving money at the expense of our vets...have to balance the budget after all...


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## X Royal

Released by Canada Press.
https://ca.news.yahoo.com/over-1-1-billion-unspent-funds-veterans-affairs-230110146.html


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## Colin Parkinson

The reality is that if you follow TBS policy, you can't spend money which they get back to recycle for the next fiscal year to dangle in front of you again. Working in the PS is like running through thigh high TBS generated muck.


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## Rifleman62

Over a seven/eight year period.

The"enablers" are at it again.


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## Shrek1985

is this anything like the army having to give back a bunch of cash a few years back when we were really tight for funds at the same time?


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## Jarnhamar

I wonder how many lives that 1.13 billion could have saved.


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## The Bread Guy

Colin P said:
			
		

> The reality is that if you follow TBS policy, you can't spend money which they get back to recycle for the next fiscal year to dangle in front of you again. Working in the PS is like running through thigh high TBS generated muck.


On a GOOD day ....



			
				Rifleman62 said:
			
		

> Over a seven/eight year period.
> 
> The"enablers" are at it again.


Maybe, but that's still about $137 million per year sent back to the government that's keen on saying how good it is to veterans.


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## X Royal

milnews.ca said:
			
		

> Maybe, but that's still about $137 million per year sent back to the government that's keen on saying how good it is to veterans.


Or how about how much they like to state how they are fighting the national budget shortages.
No mater if balancing the budget is on the backs of our veterans.


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## Old Sweat

I wonder if there is any connection to the change in DMs announced a short while back? Just speculating, and maybe we shouldn't read too much into Uncle Walt's new job.


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## OldSolduer

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> I wonder how many lives that 1.13 billion could have saved.



Not just lives saved but how many soldiers claims were "denied" despite following the process and proving their case. 

I cannot claim to know much about the way senior bureaucracy works, but it seems to me that someone is attempting to curry favour with the GoC.


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## Bruce Monkhouse

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> I wonder how many lives that 1.13 billion could have saved.



Fuckin' none..............

I am really starting to get sick of what I see as the start of the 'military welfare state' that's rising up.  OCAP would be proud..........


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## Scoobie Newbie

Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> Fuckin' none..............
> 
> I am really starting to get sick of what I see as the start of the 'military welfare state' that's rising up.  OCAP would be proud..........



I think you need to expand on that, because as I see it that money could go into hiring the professionals required to treat the troops that need it.


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## Bruce Monkhouse

Because from all the courses and the multitude of suicide attempts/completions that I have been part of in my vocation in the last 25 years I have reached one conclusion. 

 When someone truly, truly has decided to end it then there is nothing, zero, nada that can be done to completely stop it.
You may stop this attempt, and consider that a victory, but the bottom line is a true suicidal person has made a choice, has a course of action and finally things make sense to them..........so much sense they wonder why they didn't see it before.    

Money and so-called 'professionals', etc are not going to change this person.  I actually now think that a good percentage of these folks even start feeling guiltier with the help they receive as they now have another thing on their plate. "Why doesn't my mind feel any different?" with all this attention I'm getting?

I'll use the analogy I have come up with for those who think they can "change thoughts"
[this is no disrespect to any orientation]
"I'm heterosexual. There is no course, counselling or form of punishment that is going to make me a homosexual. What thoughts come into my head, come into my head, and there is nothing to be done about that."

Now having said that you can control your actions on your thoughts but it's a life-long struggle that, unlike cheating on your diet, [have we all done that?] only gives you one attempt to get it right/wrong.



But if you were referring to my 'OCAP statement has anyone read a paper in the last 6 months that didn't have a new 'veterans' group screaming about something/somehow they've been wronged?


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## Jed

Bruce M, I agree with you. As much as we want to take action and do something about this all our efforts seem to be going for naught. It is disheartening to to see all these veteran's groups pulling in different directions. All it does is just fuel the ' poor me, I'm a victim ' mentality.


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## blackberet17

Old Sweat said:
			
		

> I wonder if there is any connection to the change in DMs announced a short while back? Just speculating, and maybe we shouldn't read too much into Uncle Walt's new job.



None.


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## blackberet17

Jed said:
			
		

> Bruce M, I agree with you. As much as we want to take action and do something about this all our efforts seem to be going for naught. It is disheartening to to see all these veteran's groups pulling in different directions. All it does is just fuel the ' poor me, I'm a victim ' mentality.



Which is exactly what the Government is happy to see happen. Division makes the fight harder, and all the voices more difficult to discern.

This is nothing new, either...out of the ashes of many vet orgs in 1915-1920 rose the Legion. If the "newer" generation of veterans (Blais et coy) have decided the Legion is no longer the voice of one, they should be careful to realize they are causing more din and smoke and confusion than will be of benefit to ALL veterans (which is also difficult to do).


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## Jed

blackberet17 said:
			
		

> Which is exactly what the Government is happy to see happen. Division makes the fight harder, and all the voices more difficult to discern.
> 
> This is nothing new, either...out of the ashes of many vet orgs in 1915-1920 rose the Legion. If the "newer" generation of veterans (Blais et coy) have decided the Legion is no longer the voice of one, they should be careful to realize they are causing more din and smoke and confusion than will be of benefit to ALL veterans (which is also difficult to do).



Exactly.


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## Scoobie Newbie

Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> Because from all the courses and the multitude of suicide attempts/completions that I have been part of in my vocation in the last 25 years I have reached one conclusion.
> 
> When someone truly, truly has decided to end it then there is nothing, zero, nada that can be done to completely stop it.
> You may stop this attempt, and consider that a victory, but the bottom line is a true suicidal person has made a choice, has a course of action and finally things make sense to them..........so much sense they wonder why they didn't see it before.
> 
> Money and so-called 'professionals', etc are not going to change this person.  I actually now think that a good percentage of these folks even start feeling guiltier with the help they receive as they now have another thing on their plate. "Why doesn't my mind feel any different?" with all this attention I'm getting?
> 
> I'll use the analogy I have come up with for those who think they can "change thoughts"
> [this is no disrespect to any orientation]
> "I'm heterosexual. There is no course, counselling or form of punishment that is going to make me a homosexual. What thoughts come into my head, come into my head, and there is nothing to be done about that."
> 
> Now having said that you can control your actions on your thoughts but it's a life-long struggle that, unlike cheating on your diet, [have we all done that?] only gives you one attempt to get it right/wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> But if you were referring to my 'OCAP statement has anyone read a paper in the last 6 months that didn't have a new 'veterans' group screaming about something/somehow they've been wronged?



It's not just suicides though.  It's treatment to allow these members to cope with day to day business.  It's no different then providing the funding to rehab someone from a back injury for example.


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## Bruce Monkhouse

Please define your version of "treatment" and get back to me. Thanks.


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## Jarnhamar

Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> Fuckin' none..............
> 
> I am really starting to get sick of what I see as the start of the 'military welfare state' that's rising up.  OCAP would be proud..........



I acknowledge the experience you have on this subject with your line of work Bruce but I still can't bring myself to agree.  Yes as you point out if someone really wants to kill themselves they're going to; short of tying them down there is nothing we can do to stop them.

That's not always the case though.  Some people are on the edge, pardon the pun, and with help and resources can be brought back and go on to live a balanced and healthy life.    That 1 billion isn't going to help someone dead set on suicide but it would in my opinion help a lot of people who just need some resources.

Martial counseling, addiction problems,  seminars on writing resumes (probably especially important for someone who has grade 10 trying to find a civilian job).   All that money can go a long way to helping current and former military.


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## Bruce Monkhouse

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> Martial counseling, addiction problems,  seminars on writing resumes (probably especially important for someone who has grade 10 trying to find a civilian job).   All that money can go a long way to helping current and former military.



It could also go a long way towards helping those who didn't serve in the military.  Civies have those issues also........
There will NEVER be enough money for anything the Govt. funds, the moment it [funding] goes up for any program, "new needs" suddenly appear along with the groups gathering like squirrels below the chestnut tree.


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## Jarnhamar

Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> It could also go a long way towards helping those who didn't serve in the military.  Civies have those issues also........
> There will NEVER be enough money for anything the Govt. funds, the moment it [funding] goes up for any program, "new needs" suddenly appear along with the groups gathering like squirrels below the chestnut tree.



For sure, civies obviously have those issues too.   If this money was reallocated to helping other people then that's a good thing, less so if the money found itself being used for a raises for MPs or something.  It would be interesting to learn where this money was sent.


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## Colin Parkinson

Quite a few medical advances came out of the treatment of military causalities in WWII, Korea and Vietnam. MOney invested in treating PTSD and brain injuries due to blast effects, would have a trickle down effect into treatment for all. Thanks to design, people are surviving events which in a Bren Carrier would likely been fatal and now new medical techniques and protocols are required to treat other types of injuries. Showing the politicians that they could be "World leaders in treatment of blast and PSTD injuries" likely is a better long term proposal than beating them over the head with a stick, despite that being short term enjoyable.


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## mariomike

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> That's not always the case though.  Some people are on the edge, pardon the pun, and with help and resources can be brought back and go on to live a balanced and healthy life.



I wonder if the general public is aware of the statistics? 

The department I used to work for calculated that for every homicide we were sent to, more than four times that number died by suicide. For every fatality involving a motor vehicle, more than three times that number died by suicide. 

That's not counting the number of attempts, which if I recall correctly, were estimated at 25:1. 

It would be interesting to know how many were linked to military service.


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## PPCLI Guy

ObedientiaZelum said:
			
		

> For sure, civies obviously have those issues too.   If this money was reallocated to helping other people then that's a good thing, less so if the money found itself being used for a raises for MPs or something.  It would be interesting to learn where this money was sent.



It was "sent" to a) pay society's bills.  The Govt has been sending more money (the vast majority of which is in transfers to individuals) than they have been taking in b) to pay for niche tax cuts like the idiotic income splitting.....


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## Retired AF Guy

CBC Radio (Ontario Morning) had an interview with Glen McGregor from the Ottawa Citizen who pointed out this is pretty well standard practice for *all* Federal departments/agencies who, at the end of the fiscal year return any unspent money back into the government coffers. 

One of his points was that the budgets for these departments/agencies are really estimates and for various reasons, sometimes at the end of the fiscal year, they have money left over, which goes back into general revenue.

The other point McGregor made is that this is better than the old practice where at the end of the fiscal year we had the "March Madness" spending spree which, I'm sure many of us are familiar with, where any remaining money was spent on new furniture, computers, courses, trips, etc.

Those were the two main points that I remember from the interview, and while I tried to find the actual interview, so far I haven't had much luck.


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## Navy_Pete

For the last several years, we've had big portions of our money held back that was 'allocated' but held 'in reserve'.  I doubt VAC or other big depts are any different.  This way the govt can say they gave so much to each department, then claim an artificial surplus where they made 'efficiencies and savings' by not letting us spend up to allocation.

Pretty nice shell game, but I'm guessing this is mostly a return of money they weren't allowed to actually spend, rather then their typical asshattery of doing things like denying claims the first time, and making claims like blown knees/backs/shoulders were prexisting conditions unrelated to doing CAF work.


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## dapaterson

What was the VAC budget over those years?  What overall percentage of spending does $1.1B represent?

By law, government departments cannot spend more than they are allocated, so most are somewhat gun shy to ensure that they do not overspend.

Ah.  Looking at http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/1364499-qop-rafferty-lapsed-unspent-money-in-veterans.html#document/p2, we can see the amount and percentage lapsed each year.

It looks as if in years when new money was given VAC was not able to spend it all immediately, so the percentage not spent went up, and then in following years consumption increased.  Or, in other words, new program funding is allocated, and new program spending only kicks in a year or two later.

No conspiracy here - just the regular operations of any bureaucracy.


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## ModlrMike

I'll save everyone else the math: average 4.41% year over year. I would submit that's not as bad as people are making it out to be.


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## Rifleman62

Since the last few posts are about mental health, you may be interested in this *upcoming* report:

Planned Reports
*
All topics and tabling dates subject to change*
Reports to Parliament
Fall 2014

Auditor General of Canada Report which includes:

 Mental Health Services for Veterans


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## The Bread Guy

Here's the latest from the Minister:


> Veterans Affairs Minister Julian Fantino said Sunday the department’s $1.1 billion dollars in unused funding over seven years is “not lost money.”
> 
> The department was unable to spend more than $1.1 billion of its budget over seven years, and like other departments that are unable to spend their appropriation within the budget year, Veterans Affairs was required to return its unspent funds to the treasury.
> 
> But Fantino told a news conference in Halifax that the funding is recycled back into programs for veterans.
> 
> “That has taken on a life of its own. It’s totally false in the context that it’s been portrayed,” said Fantino of the lapsed funding at a press conference announcing $200 million over six years to support mental health needs of military members.
> 
> Earlier this week, veterans groups were demanding a detailed accounting of which programs had lapsed funding and why. They also accused Ottawa of using it as a deliberate strategy to balance the federal budget.
> 
> But Fantino said claims that the unused funds were a strategy to balance the budget are false.
> 
> “The funding is allocated and if it’s not spent it’s recycled back into continuing programs and services for veterans. It’s not lost money,” said Fantino.
> 
> He called it a technical budget process that does not hamper services and programs for veterans.
> 
> “If I can put it bluntly, this is a technical kind of to and fro in the budgeting process of government,” he said.
> 
> “That lapsed funding has absolutely nothing to do, in any way shape or form or influence on the services, programs and support that we are committed and continue to be committed to provide to veterans and their families.” ....


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## brihard

Rifleman62 said:
			
		

> Since the last few posts are about mental health, you may be interested in this *upcoming* report:
> 
> Planned Reports
> *
> All topics and tabling dates subject to change*
> Reports to Parliament
> Fall 2014
> 
> Auditor General of Canada Report which includes:
> 
> Mental Health Services for Veterans



I am looking forward to it with great interest.


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## Rifleman62

The AG report will be made public on Tuesday, that's why the government announced today:  





> Feds to spend $200-million on boosting mental health support for soldiers



to get ahead of the report.


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## Colin Parkinson

milnews.ca said:
			
		

> Here's the latest from the Minister:



oh goody according to that, the money we had to return goes right back into our program pockets......yea right.


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## The Bread Guy

Rifleman62 said:
			
		

> The AG report will be made public on Tuesday, that's why the government announced today:
> to get ahead of the report.


 :nod:


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## Remius

I'm guessing teh report will be painting VAC a rather unflattering light.  Not sure if trying to get ahead of the story was a good idea or not.


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## The Bread Guy

Crantor said:
			
		

> I'm guessing teh report will be painting VAC a rather unflattering light.  Not sure if trying to get ahead of the story was a good idea or not.


It only looks like there's no link to the report if you don't know that the department gets a draft to comment on before it's released into the "information wild".


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## blackberet17

Retired AF Guy said:
			
		

> CBC Radio (Ontario Morning) had an interview with Glen McGregor from the Ottawa Citizen who pointed out this is pretty well standard practice for *all* Federal departments/agencies who, at the end of the fiscal year return any unspent money back into the government coffers.
> 
> [...]
> 
> Those were the two main points that I remember from the interview, and while I tried to find the actual interview, so far I haven't had much luck.



Found it: http://www.cbc.ca/player/Radio/Local+Shows/Ontario/Ottawa+Morning/ID/2609849694/?page=2


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## Gimpy

Looks like there's a bit of a catch on that $200 million: Fine print on Ottawa's $200-million veterans fund: It'll take 50 years to pay

Headline Quote:


> But staff in Mr. Fantino’s office confirmed to The Globe this week that the “immediate” investment of $19.1-million in the OSI clinics would be spread over the next six years. And, they said, the remaining $140.1-million would be paid out as needed until the last veteran who is currently in an operational stress-injury program no longer needs funding. Because some veterans of Afghanistan are in their early 20s, they said the last of the $200-million may not be spent for 50 years.


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## PuckChaser

Costing borne of the ridiculousness over the F-35 "total" cost. No longer is the government allowed to say how much something is to buy, they have to say how much it is stretched over x-years. It's still a lot of money even if it's stretched over the timeframe, and if it helps just one member get back on track its well spent.


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## Scoobie Newbie

Maybe they should have given the money back over 50 years


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## krustyrl

Well said.!!


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## Teager

> But staff in Mr. Fantino’s office confirmed to The Globe this week that the “immediate” investment of $19.1-million in the OSI clinics would be spread over the next six years. And, they said, the remaining $140.1-million would be paid out as needed until the last veteran who is currently in an operational stress-injury program no longer needs funding. Because some veterans of Afghanistan are in their early 20s, they said the last of the $200-million may not be spent for 50 years.



By that logic they assume no CAF member is going to have an OSI/PTSD from future missions as they only mention Afghansitan vets.


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## RedcapCrusader

100% maximum bullshite is all I have to say.


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## McG

It seems VAC has the same problem as DND and the CAF; both organizations cut teeth and muscle to meet government imposed cuts while the government publicly declares the cuts will be taken out of fat and tail.  In both cases, I suspect the bureaucracies are at least as culpable as their ministers when it comes to this.


> *Vets disability branch saw deep cuts from 2009-13, budget records show*
> Murray Brewster
> CTV News
> 07 Dec 2014
> 
> OTTAWA -- Some of the biggest job cuts at Veterans Affairs in recent years have been in the disability awards branch -- the division targeted in a recent auditor general's report for taking too long to decide on the benefit claims of ex-soldiers.
> 
> Departmental performance reports stretching back to 2009 show that roughly 897 positions have been eliminated across Veterans Affairs, with 33 per cent coming out of the section that administers pensions and awards.
> 
> Those same records show the health and rehabilitation branches also took a sizable hit -- roughly 372 positions during the same time frame.
> 
> Commemorations, the division that celebrates past wars and maintains memorials, was reduced by 17.2 per cent, while internal services -- Prime Minister Stephen Harper described it last week as "backroom administration" -- lost 71 positions, just 10.1 per cent.
> 
> "We have taken resources out of backroom administration from bureaucracy. We have put it into services," Harper said Wednesday during question period.
> 
> "There are more benefits and more money for veterans than ever before, and more points of service. That is called good administration, good government, and it is good service for the veterans of this country."
> 
> As late as Friday, the Harper government was continuing to insist the reductions, part of an overall effort to eliminate the federal deficit, were not coming at the expense of ex-soldiers.
> 
> "We make no apologies for reducing bureaucratic expenses at Veterans Affairs Canada," said Conservative MP Parm Gill, the parliamentary secretary to the minister, Julian Fantino.
> 
> "The opposition wants to increase government bureaucracy. We are increasing front line support for Canada's veterans. We recently announced eight new front line mental health clinics for Canadian veterans. While the NDP defends the unions, along with the Liberals, we are defending Canada's veterans."
> 
> The majority of the staff cuts in the disability and death compensation branch took place between 2010 and 2013. That section also underspent its budget allotment by $121 million, according to a 2013-14 departmental performance report.
> 
> There's a direct connection between the job cuts, the auditor general's complaints about benefit application wait times and the $1.13 billion in budget allocations that have gone unspent since 2006, said Liberal MP Frank Valeriote.
> 
> You can't spend the money or process the applications if you don't have the staff, said Valeriote, who accuses Harper of misleading Canadians by saying the cuts were administrative in nature.
> 
> "It is indefensible," he said.  "Internal services, the backroom position of which the prime minister spoke on Wednesday when he said they're in the backroom, the cuts were minor in nature. So, let's make no mistake and let's be very clear: He lied."
> 
> The Union of Veterans Affairs Employees confirmed the job loss numbers, but noted that there is a knock-on effect when disability claims are delayed, which can also contribute to lapsed funding. Other benefits, such as health care and re-establishment to civilian life, don't kick in until a disability is approved.
> 
> There was $33 million in underspending on that area in the last budget year.
> 
> In 2013-14, the department did over-spend on financial benefits for the mostly seriously wounded, including $7.9 million in the permanent impairment allowance, which has been the subject of criticism from the veterans ombudsman.
> 
> Despite blowing that portion of their allocation, Veterans Affairs underspent its budget by $133 million in 2013-14, the performance reports show.
> 
> A spokeswoman for Fantino said that the number of clients served by the department declined to 205,213 in 2013, which is about a 13 per cent drop from where it was in 1994. Some of the reduction can be attributed to the passing away of Second World War and Korean War veterans, a trend that's expected to accerlate in the coming years.
> 
> The veterans' employees union has revealed that it filed formal notice on Nov. 18, demanding the government suspend further cuts until an independent third party can analyze the impact the staff reductions have had on services.
> 
> "We want an independent body to determine whether Veterans Affairs is capable of carrying out its mandate," said Carl Gannon, the union's president.
> 
> The union, a division of the Public Service Alliance of Canada, is currently in the midst of contract talks with the federal Treasury Board.
> 
> Fantino faced multiple calls to step down last week, but Valeriote said he expects the Conservative strategy is to run out the clock on Parliament's latest sitting and hope the anger blows over during the Christmas holidays.



http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/vets-disability-branch-saw-deep-cuts-from-2009-13-budget-records-show-1.2136703


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## Colin Parkinson

Pretty much what happened to my program, legislative changes were supposed to create a 40% drop in application, so they cut staff by 40% the applications did not drop as much as they thought and poor legal writing caused other interesting twists that were not expected. Now we are looking to fill some of the surplused positions as industry is complaining about the regulatory lagtime. Of curse the "champion" and his team have long vanished undoubtedly to wreck havoc in some other program and insulated from the consequences of their decisions.


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## blackberet17

And in other news, two internal job postings have come out, one for Client Service Agents, and the second for Case Managers.

Publiservice msgs went out yesterday, far as I can tell.

I haven't found anything on the public jobs bank, just internal.

Psns are open to VAC, VRAB and CAF, at the WP-2 and WP-4 lvls, respectively.


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## blackberet17

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/internal-costs-at-veterans-affairs-jump-while-death-disability-funding-unspent/article22018073/



> Veterans Affairs allowed tens of millions of dollars in approved funding on veterans programs – such as death and disability benefits – to go unspent last year while exceeding its budget for internal services like communications.
> 
> A closer look by The Globe and Mail at the department’s line-by-line public accounts shows the biggest source of the gap – or lapse – comes from the department’s two biggest categories: the health-care program and disability and death compensation.
> 
> Last year, the department spent 6.9-per-cent less than its approved budget of $1.2-billion on its health-care program and re-establishment services, a savings worth $82.3-million. It also spent 3-per-cent less than its approved budget for disability and death compensation – a lapse worth $67.6-million. Since 2006, more than $1.1-billion in authorized spending at Veterans Affairs has gone unused.
> 
> In contrast, a separate category last year for “internal services” that covers management, communications, legal services and human resources exceeded its approved budget by 17.1 per cent, coming in at $85.8-million instead of the approved budget of $73.3-million.
> 
> The spending issue is another controversy for Veterans Affairs Minister Julian Fantino who continues to face calls for his resignation. Last month, Mr. Fantino promised $200-million over six years for veterans toward mental-health initiatives – two days before the release of an Auditor-General’s report that said many vets are waiting months or years to access mental-health benefits. Later, the government acknowledged the funding would be spread over decades.
> 
> Prime Minister Stephen Harper told the House of Commons Tuesday that the government is boosting service for veterans while cutting useless bureaucracy.
> 
> “What the Liberal Party and the NDP – what they want to do – is make sure they protect those bureaucratic jobs at Veterans Affairs instead of giving the services to the veterans. That’s what we’re doing,” said Mr. Harper.
> 
> Measured in terms of year-over-year spending last year, Veterans Affairs actually spent 2-per-cent less on disability and death compensation, 2.1-per-cent more on health care and 6.8-per-cent more on internal services.
> 
> Opposition MPs say the Prime Minister’s claims are at odds with the department’s spending figures.
> 
> “It completely contradicts what the Prime Minister said,” said Liberal MP Frank Valeriote. The Liberal MP also noted that another department, Employment and Social Development, announced this week that it is hiring 400 additional staff in response to complaints by Employment Insurance applicants of poor service.
> 
> “Here we have 400 more staff being hired because of complaints of lack of service, delayed processing times and being left on hold on the phone. Is that not exactly what veterans have been experiencing and complaining about for several years? So my question really is why are veterans not entitled to the same service that EI claimants are entitled to?” he said.
> 
> At a high level, Conservative ministers portray large government-wide spending lapses as a sign of prudent financial management that helps Ottawa’s improving bottom line. However, ministers, including Mr. Fantino, have bristled when it comes to questions over the details of those spending lapses.
> 
> Veterans Affairs argues that it is impossible to know exactly how many veterans and their families will request assistance like death and disability benefits in any given year and so estimates are calculated to ensure there is enough money on hand. Unused funds in these areas are then returned to general revenue and produce an improvement to Ottawa’s bottom line.
> 
> The Parliamentary Budget Office has criticized large lapses in federal departments as a form of spending cut that is not explained in a clear and transparent way.
> 
> Veterans Affairs has shrunk from a peak of 4,137 full-time staff in 2009 to 3,188 this year.
> 
> NDP veterans affairs critic Peter Stoffer said the impact of poor service for veterans is that potential claimants get discouraged, allowing the department to save money.
> 
> “It is simply unconscionable,” he said. “We know the government has the ‘no go’ policy, which is you say no long enough and the veteran goes away. There’s also the ‘3D’ policy on older veterans: You delay, you deny and they unfortunately die.”


----------



## Remius

blackberet17 said:
			
		

> And in other news, two internal job postings have come out, one for Client Service Agents, and the second for Case Managers.
> 
> Publiservice msgs went out yesterday, far as I can tell.
> 
> I haven't found anything on the public jobs bank, just internal.
> 
> Psns are open to VAC, VRAB and CAF, at the WP-2 and WP-4 lvls, respectively.



Yep.  Looks like damage control to me.  Lots of positions it would seem.


----------



## Danjanou

blackberet17 said:
			
		

> And in other news, two internal job postings have come out, one for Client Service Agents, and the second for Case Managers.
> 
> Publiservice msgs went out yesterday, far as I can tell.
> 
> I haven't found anything on the public jobs bank, just internal.
> 
> Psns are open to VAC, VRAB and CAF, at the WP-2 and WP-4 lvls, respectively.



Someone was posting details about them on Facebook last night in one of the Veterans groups.


----------



## Rifleman62

Now many Public Servants does it take to repeatedly say NO on form letters?


----------



## Rifleman62

Gosh, the First World War Vets are gone, the Second World War Vets (1 million + served) as well as the Korean Vets (26,000 served) are near the end, VAC biggest "Clients" base, and 40,000 served in Afghanistan. Plus Peasekeeping.

I ask again: How many Public Servants does it take to repeatably say NO on a form letter?


----------



## catalyst

I just got an offer to work at vac (external, after a year of waiting)


----------



## blackberet17

Rifleman62 said:
			
		

> Gosh, the First World War Vets are gone, the Second World War Vets (1 million + served) as well as the Korean Vets (26,000 served) are near the end, VAC biggest "Clients" base, and 40,000 served in Afghanistan. Plus Peasekeeping.
> 
> I ask again: How many Public Servants does it take to repeatably say NO on a form letter?



That would be Adjudicators. They are a different bag from the Case Managers and Client Service Agents, which are the subject of the job posting.


----------



## Rifleman62

I was speaking of VAC as a whole.

If your "Clientele" has declined due to case load, your admin is eased due computers, etc, you don't need as many Clerks, Adjudicators, Case Managers, Client Service Agents, Managers et al let alone that useless piece of self promotion "Salute". 

Salute to whom, VAC? How much does that cost per year?

Salute!
Veterans Affairs Canada: Proudly Serving Canada's Veteran Community

http://www.veterans.gc.ca/eng/news/salute

_*Rubbish.*_


blackberet17, answering: How many Public Servants does it take to repeatably say NO on a form letter?



> That would be Adjudicators.



Implied consent that is the job of the Adjudicators!


----------



## Remius

Rifleman62 said:
			
		

> your admin is eased due to computers,



 :rofl:


----------



## Colin Parkinson

Now any idiot can create a form and build an empire around it to protect almighty form. Whether the form is needed, redundant or wanted is immaterial. the form and process must live on!


----------



## Tibbson

The more I work towards retirement and the more I work to get various issues dealt with the less and less I want to retire.  My wife can't understand that and I know it may not make sense but I just don't have any stomach left to start a whole new round of fights and struggles.  Those issues are what is making me want to retire in the first place, not prep for Round 2.


----------



## Teager

> OTTAWA — The Harper government’s road map to this year’s federal budget suggests it is prepared to pour more money into programs and services for the country’s veterans, while largely holding the line on defence spending.
> 
> Treasury Board President Tony Clement released the 2015-16 spending estimates on Tuesday, even though it’s unclear when the budget will be tabled.
> 
> The Conservative government’s final fiscal plan before this year’s election was postponed until at least April by Finance Minister Joe Oliver, who said he needed the time to assess the impact of collapsing oil prices.
> 
> The government has been under mounting political pressure to improve the suite of benefits and entitlements for ex-soldiers.
> 
> 
> The estimates, which are not the final word on the budget, project modest increases in the amount spent on disability awards and supplementary benefits.
> Despite that, overall spending at Veterans Affairs is expected to decline by 1.5% — or $54 million next year, something federal officials attribute to the declining number of Second World War and Korean War veterans.
> 
> Veterans Affairs Canada spends just over $3.5 billion per year.
> 
> Over at National Defence, another politically-charged portfolio, spending is expected to increase by 1.5% — $280 million — in the coming year, bringing the military budget to $18.9 billion.
> 
> Officials say they will be saving $709.2 million in capital costs, some of which is likely related to the cancellation of the army’s plans for a close-combat vehicle and delays in acquiring maritime helicopters for the air force.



http://news.nationalpost.com/2015/02/25/early-spending-estimates-suggest-more-money-for-canadian-veterans-though-not-for-defence-spending/


----------



## Rifleman62

What about the morale of Veterans who have suffered from VAC deny, deny, etc, etc ?

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/veterans-affairs-morale-plunged-alongside-staffing-levels-survey-1.2982470

*
Veterans Affairs morale plunged alongside staffing levels: survey*
'It's just another indication of how deep this government has cut and the effect it has had': Liberal critic

By Murray Brewster, The Canadian Press Posted: Last Updated: Mar 05, 2015 10:28 AM ET

The latest survey of Veterans Affairs employees shows that the number of staff who say the quality of their work has suffered has more than doubled since 2008.

The latest survey of Veterans Affairs employees shows that the number of staff who say the quality of their work has suffered has more than doubled since 2008. (Jason Franson/Canadian Press)

The most recent survey of federal employees shows Veterans Affairs Canada is an increasingly unhappy place with plunging morale and a frazzled workforce.

The evaluation, published by Statistics Canada for the federal Treasury Board, asks dozens of questions on topics ranging from satisfaction with equipment to workplace harassment.

It shows that the number of staff who say the quality of their work has suffered — either because of fewer resources or a lack of departmental stability — has more than doubled since 2008.

That level of dissatisfaction is between 1.5 and two times the rate of the overall federal civil service.

And the surveys, conducted every three years since 2008, show a steady decline in employee satisfaction that appears to mirror Conservative job cuts at Veterans Affairs that began in 2011.

There's a clear connection between the two, said Liberal veterans critic Frank Valeriote — especially since the surveys also broadly track the size of the department through the survey response rate.

"It's just another indication of how deep this government has cut and the effect it has had," Valeriote said.
Steps taken to address concerns: department

The department recognizes the results of the survey and has already taken steps to address the concerns in areas of workload, communication and training, said Veterans Affairs spokeswoman Janice Summerby.

"Senior management is committed to increasing consulting with staff members and taking action so that service excellence for veterans remains paramount," Summerby said.

The survey also found 86 per cent of Veterans Affairs staff were proud of the work that they do, she added.

That may well be, Valeriote acknowledged, but clearly service has suffered, judging from the number of anecdotal complaints from veterans, he said.

Federal government performance reports released last year show that between 2009 and 2014, Veterans Affairs eliminated 897 positions across the department, with 33 per cent of those cuts coming in the section that administers pensions and awards.

The auditor general complained last fall that the department was taking too long to answer and decide on the applications of soldiers who applied for mental health support.
Services for vets 'dramatically affected' by cuts: Liberal MP

The Harper government insists it has only eliminated "backroom administration" and that service has not suffered.

Figures tabled in the House of Commons at the end of January show that 205,213 military and RCMP veterans sought federal assistance in 2014, a decrease of seven per cent from 2006.

That alone is sufficient justification for cuts to the workforce, the government has said in the past.

The workforce survey simply adds to the growing body of evidence that the cuts have gone too far and are impacting the quality of service provided to ex-soldiers, Valeriote said.

"We've got veterans complaining. We've got an auditor general saying it's taking too long to process claims," he said.

"The data is telling you that the front line has been cut, drastically. It is clear that the ability of Veterans Affairs to provide the services our veterans require has been dramatically affected."

The embattled department late last year posted notices saying they were looking to hire dozens of new front-line staff across the country who are willing to start work "as soon as possible."


----------



## ixium

I put in a claim for an injury and had to wait 29 weeks for an answer. This was after waiting about 6-8 weeks for the medical file to get to VAC (the main building I assume) 

Now I have to deal with a branch of VAC and after all that waiting and they came up with that they want one of their doctors to access the injury, but that I'd have to wait for them to request the medical documents again before they even wanted to book my medical appointment. They wanted me to wait an additional 6-8 weeks for the paperwork again.

She couldn't explain why they aren't in a place that is accessible by anyone handling the case.

That is why this system is messed up, everywhere is run like it is a separate entity


----------



## Rifleman62

Make a complaint. You already have the basics of your complaint, just flesh it out a bit more with as much detail as you can think of.

Please WRITE to your MP with the same info as you will do for the following:

http://www.ombudsman-veterans.gc.ca/eng/complaint

Submit a Complaint – Overview

If you are a client of Veterans Affairs and you feel you have been treated unfairly, or you would like information about how to solve a problem, the Office of the Veterans Ombudsman is here to help.

Please note that you must try to have the problem solved using one of the various ways offered by Veterans Affairs before coming to our Office.

For more information on your right to complain, please see the Ombudsman mandate, which is part of the Order in Council.

Four Ways to Submit a Complaint

You can submit a complaint by telephone, mail or fax using the information provided below, or you can file your complaint online by following the easy steps on this Web site.

Note: Please submit each complaint only ONCE to avoid duplication and confusion.

1. Telephone

Toll-free telephone:
    1-877-330-4343
Outside of Canada, call collect:
    902-626-2919
Office hours:
    Monday to Friday, 8:30 a.m. to 4:30 p.m. (Atlantic time)

Note: Please leave a message if you call outside of office hours. An Ombudsman Service Representative will call you back on the next business day.

2. Mail

Print a blank complaint form, fill it out and mail it to the address below:

Print Blank Complaint Form PDF version [Help] (approximately 80 KB - opens a new window)

Office of the Veterans Ombudsman
P.O. Box 66
Charlottetown, P.E.I.
C1A 7K2

3. Fax

Print a blank complaint form, fill it out and fax it to one of the numbers below:

Print Blank Complaint Form PDF version [Help] (approximately 80 KB - opens a new window)

Local:
    902-566-7582
Toll-free:
    1-888-566-7582

4. Online

Follow the four easy steps below to submit your complaint using our secure online system. Once you get to Step 2 you will have approximately ONE HOUR to complete the form before it times out. If the form does time out, you will have to go back to Step 1.


----------



## McG

It looks like staffing levels will be going partially back up.  100 new caseworker positions are to be created.  While the growth will be much less than the cuts were, the union seems to be endorsing the number but worries that action will be dragged-out to make itan election issue.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-to-restore-100-front-line-case-workers-for-veterans/article23909999/


----------



## blackberet17

My thoughts as well, MCG.

Due to the downsizing being rather...unrefined...and indiscriminate...cuts were made in areas where improvements were required instead.

Hopefully, most of the positions can be filled by those who were let go. Otherwise, training time will be needed for the new folks.


----------



## McG

More confirmation that downsizing at VAC directly contributed to reduced support for veterans.  This time, the source is from the department itself.  The numbers show things got even slower through 14/15 FY.



> *Staffing cuts at Veterans Affairs hit frontline service*
> Lee Berthiaume
> Ottawa Citizen
> 03 Jul 2015
> 
> Injured ex-soldiers are being forced to wait longer for support from the government as the number of employees working at Veterans Affairs Canada has fallen to levels not seen since before the war in Afghanistan.
> 
> The revelation is contained in internal briefing notes for Veterans Affairs Minister Erin O’Toole, poking holes in the Conservative government’s assertions that recent budget cuts and layoffs at the department have not affected frontline service.
> 
> Veterans Affairs Canada spokeswoman Janice Summerby said the department will hire more than 100 new disability benefits staff, “both temporary and permanent, to help ensure veterans receive faster decisions on disability benefit applications.
> 
> “Hiring additional disability benefit employees means better and faster support for military veterans, Canadian Armed Forces serving members and their families at all stages of the disability benefits application process,” she said.
> 
> But critics say the documents prove the government cut too far and too deep at Veterans Affairs, while the new hires are a drop in the bucket of what’s needed.
> 
> “The layoffs have had a detrimental impact,” said NDP veterans affairs critic Peter Stoffer. “They’re scrambling to rehire people now, but you need a lot more people than that.”
> 
> The briefing notes obtained by the Citizen through the access to information law were prepared for O’Toole upon his appointment as veterans affairs minister in January. They provide a historic look at staffing levels within the department, as well as where recent cuts have been made.
> 
> According one to briefing book, the number of people working at Veterans Affairs shrank 21 per cent from a high of 3,904 in 2008-09 to 3,085 in 2013-14 as the government cut spending to balance the federal budget. That left the department with its smallest workforce since 1998-99, when it had 3,037 employees.
> 
> The same book showed that between 2011 and 2014, the number of “service delivery” employees was cut from 1,890 to 1,352, a decline of more than 28 per cent. In fact, of the 668 positions eliminated during that time period, more than 80 per cent were classified as “service delivery.”
> 
> Meanwhile, O’Toole was warned in another document that hundreds of injured veterans were being forced to wait more than four months to hear whether they qualified for disability benefits as the applications were being processed slower than the previous year.
> 
> The note said 68 per cent of applications received between April and December 2014 had been processed within the department’s 16-week target, as opposed to 83 per cent the previous year. Veterans Affairs was also only on track to process about 12,000 applications during the fiscal year, down from 16,000 in 2013-14.
> 
> Officials blamed a “convergence of operational challenges,” including delays obtaining records from National Defence and more priority applications. They also cited “the learning curve associated with digitizing our processes” and a new requirement to call veterans for additional evidence before rejecting any claim.
> 
> That new requirement appears to have coincided with an eight per cent increase in the number of applications approved from the previous year. But critics said that didn’t balance out the fact hundreds more injured veterans are having to wait unacceptably long periods of time before receiving support.
> 
> “The processing is going down because there are fewer people to do the processing,” said Liberal veterans affairs critic Frank Valeriote. “They cut Veterans Affairs to have money to spend during an election year to pander for votes.”
> 
> Veterans issues are shaping up to be a ballot box question for some Canadians heading into the October election. O’Toole has made a series of announcements since January in response to sharp criticism over the government’s treatment of former military personnel.  However, he has not said when the 100 new staff will be hired.
> 
> *Changes in Veterans Affairs staffing*
> 
> 3,753: Total positions on March 31, 2011
> 
> 3,085: Total positions on March 31, 2014
> 
> 668: Total positions eliminated
> 
> 17.7: Percentage of positions eliminated
> 
> 1,890: Service delivery positions on March 31, 2011
> 
> 1,352: Service delivery positions on March 31, 2014
> 
> 538: Service delivery positions eliminated
> 
> 28.4: Percentage of service delivery positions eliminated
> 
> 236: Policy, communication and commemoration positions on March 31, 2011
> 
> 234: Policy, communication and commemoration positions on March 31, 2014
> 
> 2: Policy, communication and commemoration positions eliminated
> 
> 1: Percentage of policy, communication and commemoration positions eliminated
> 
> — Veterans Affairs Canada
> 
> *Disability applications*
> 
> 180,881: Veterans receiving either a disability pension or disability award
> 
> $2 billion: Disability benefit expenditures in fiscal year 2013-14
> 
> 16,758: Disability applications processed in fiscal year 2013-14
> 
> 9,757: Disability applications processed in first nine months of fiscal year 2014-15
> 
> 2,820: Applications at head office awaiting adjudication on Dec. 31, 2014
> 
> 1,151: Number that had been at head office less than 16 weeks
> 
> 1,669: Number that had been at head office longer than 16 weeks
> 
> 83: Percentage of applications processed within 16 weeks in fiscal 2013-14
> 
> 68: Percentage of application processed within 16 weeks during first nine months of fiscal year 2014-15
> 
> 71: Percentage of disability applications approved in fiscal year 2013-14
> 
> 79: Percentage of disability applications approved in fiscal year 2014-15
> 
> * The federal government’s fiscal year runs from April 1 to March 31.
> 
> — Veterans Affairs Canada


http://ottawacitizen.com/news/politics/staffing-cuts-at-veterans-affairs-hit-frontline-service


----------



## The Bread Guy

Funny how vets were supposed to get continued great service via staff cuts, but all of a sudden, now there's a need to add staff - this via the Info-machine:

_*"Government of Canada confirms (83) new hires to support Veterans in Ontario (by March 2016)"*_
_*"Government of Canada hires (43) new staff to support Veterans in Québec (by March 2016)"*_
_*"Government of Canada hires (30) new staff to support Veterans in Western Canada (by March 2016)"*_
You'd think there was an election coming, or something ....


----------



## blackberet17

This is in addition to the announcement made two weeks ago of "new" positions at Head Office in Charlottetown:

http://www.theguardian.pe.ca/News/Local/2015-07-16/article-4216812/VAC-headquarters-in-Charlotttetown-bolsters-staff-numbers/1

And the promise of cutting down on the paperwork:

http://news.gc.ca/web/article-en.do?nid=1008349


----------



## The Bread Guy

The promise:


> To restore access to the support that veterans are due, we will re-open the nine Veterans Affairs service offices closed by Stephen Harper, and will fully implement all of the Auditor General’s recommendations on enhancing mental health service delivery to veterans.


The details, once the Minister's been briefed:


> While the Liberal government will re-open nine veterans affairs offices that were closed under the previous Conservative government, the offices might not be in the same locations, according to newly named Minister of Veterans Affairs Kent Hehr.
> 
> "We're going to look to where [the offices] do the most good for the most people," Hehr said Wednesday in an interview with Rosemary Barton on CBC News Network's Power & Politics.
> 
> "It might not be the same exact nine. If we're going to find areas in this country where more veterans are now settling, why wouldn't we take the opportunity to move those veteran support centres there?"
> 
> (....)
> 
> The nine offices closed by the Conservatives in an effort to cut costs were in Kelowna, B.C., Prince George, B.C., Saskatoon, Brandon, Man., Thunder Bay, Ont., Windsor, Ont., Sydney, N.S., Charlottetown and Corner Brook, N.L.
> 
> "We're going to ensure veterans have the supports they need with the opening of many new veterans affairs offices, and put them in the places where they're most utilized," Hehr said ....


----------



## Eye In The Sky

Charlottetown and Sydney seem like no-brainers.


----------



## The Bread Guy

Parochial as I may seem, Thunder Bay not only serves the city but neighbouring communities as well - besides, we have a cabinet minister @ the table (even if she serves under the "leadership" of another cabinet minister)  ;D

It'll be interesting to see how this unfolds now.


----------



## blackberet17

Eye In The Sky said:
			
		

> Charlottetown and Sydney seem like no-brainers.



http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/veterans-affairs-canada-charlottetown-jobs-announced-1.3158102

With the hiring of a Case Manager psn at the Charlottetown head office, the district office has essentially been reopened...just shy of an actual physical space, anyway, at this time.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

I'd like to see the office re-open in Windsor, but I'm not holding my breathe. Once again, as with provincially, the union driven vote turned the whole county NDP orange. We have no seat at either table now. :

On another note, the Trudeau Liberals campaigned on re-opening offices. They gave the sole outward impression that it would be those that were closed. Once elected, they are starting to show that was never the intention. And so, we can expect to see the vacuous, niggardly and contradictory details in the rest of their promises.


----------



## The Bread Guy

recceguy said:
			
		

> I'd like to see the office re-open in Windsor, but I'm not holding my breathe ....


Here you go, then ....


> Windsor will have a veterans affairs office once again.
> 
> Veterans Affairs Canada spokeswoman Kate Murphy says Windsor is one of nine locations set to reopen, as promised in the Minister of Veterans Affairs' mandate letter.
> 
> The letter to Veterans Affairs Minister Kent Hehr from Prime Minister Justin Trudeau promises to "Re-open the nine Veterans Affairs service offices recently closed, hire more service delivery staff, and fully implement all of the Auditor General’s recommendations on enhancing mental health service delivery to veterans." ....





			
				recceguy said:
			
		

> .... the Trudeau Liberals campaigned on re-opening offices. They gave the sole outward impression that it would be those that were closed. Once elected, they are starting to show that was never the intention. And so, we can expect to see the vacuous, niggardly and contradictory details in the rest of their promises.


Well, the bureaucrats may have spoken, but it is there in the mandate letter - bullet #8:


> Re-open the nine Veterans Affairs service offices recently closed, hire more service delivery staff, and fully implement all of the Auditor General’s recommendations on enhancing mental health service delivery to veterans.


----------



## The Bread Guy

Coming (back) to Sydney by November - from the info-machine:


> The Honourable Kent Hehr, Minister of Veterans Affairs and Associate Minister of National Defence, joined Veterans and their families in Sydney, Nova Scotia, today to announce that the previously closed Veterans Affairs Canada office will reopen in November 2016.
> 
> The new Sydney office will be located at 1st floor, 70 Crescent Street, Sydney NS, and once opened, will employ approximately 15 staff who will serve approximately 2,200 Veterans. Staff at the Sydney office will answer questions about VAC services and benefits; arrange pension medical examinations; and, assist Veterans to complete and submit applications and receipts. Case-managed Veterans will also be able to meet with their case manager ...


Stand by for an announcement in Charlottetown tomorrow ...


----------



## blackberet17

Et voilà:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-veterans-affairs-1.3698462


----------



## Eye In The Sky

Good news for the Island and vets in PEI (my father being one of those vets).  Was PEI the only province with not even 1 office prior to this?


----------



## blackberet17

We had a district office, IIRC, on the ground floor of the Jean Canfield Building (when it opened). When it closed as per the previous government's intent, it was no more - clients were directed to the Service Canada office (in the same building).

With the uproar following the closures, a small service office was opened in the Daniel J. Building, but I personally didn't see it as _as functional_ (one staff member, not clearly indicated where in the building, etc.) as the previous district office.



> Hehr said 10 front-line staffers will be hired to provide services.



Now, just my  :2c:, but I think ten staffers is a little more than required. The previous office had five, I believe, so I expect a reduction down the road, or a reassignment/additional duties.

I am interested to see if the intent is for ten completely new pers to be hired, or if it will be staffed internally through a competitive process, or a mix of some form.


----------



## Fishbone Jones

IIRC, they said the wanted a max caseload per Case Manager of 15-20 vets. If so, it would be smart to start with that many Case managers. It shouldn't be based on how many Vets, now, have open claims/ rehab/ etc, but on the amount of Vets that the centre may have to deal with in the near future. Smaller caseload = better client service.

I can see a mix. Some older CM to help guide the new. The process will likely take lateral/ promotion transfers into account and then new hires. Just shuffling vested CMs will not fix the client service problems. New blood is required.


----------



## Journeyman

blackberet17 said:
			
		

> .....I think ten staffers is a little more than required.


One of the problems identified in a JCSP review (and possibly applicable to VAC), is that the numbers are only part of the equation;  there was also a serious quality issue.  Many were simply not trained adequately for the job, and soon became overwhelmed, burnt-out, and quit.

Are these VAC staffers provided with the competencies needed to provide the necessary service?   :dunno:


----------



## Old Sweat

Journeyman said:
			
		

> One of the problems identified in a JCSP review (and possibly applicable to VAC), is that the numbers are only part of the equation;  there was also a serious quality issue.  Many were simply not trained adequately for the job, and soon became overwhelmed, burnt-out, and quit.
> 
> Are these VAC staffers provided with the competencies needed to provide the necessary service?   :dunno:



Pretty hard to issue competence. It's not like a morale patch or something, but your point is well-taken. What kind of qualifications and experience are required, and how easy is it to recruit people that fit the job description?


----------



## Journeyman

Hey, I'm just here to point out problems.... you know, to benefit those who think everything has a simple solution.  

I'd hate to waste all this negativity by ignoring multiple factors, second- and third-order effects.....  ;D


----------



## The Bread Guy

recceguy said:
			
		

> I can see a mix. Some older CM to help guide the new. The process will likely take lateral/ promotion transfers into account and then new hires. Just shuffling vested CMs will not fix the client service problems. New blood is required.


I know several who used to work in the Thunder Bay office who moved laterally to other fed PS jobs when it closed that would be aching to go back, especially if the promises of "better staff:client ratios" is fulfilled, so you'd likely get SOME continuity there to mix with the newest blood.


----------

