# Crayon gun dad seeks justice



## Sythen (24 May 2012)

http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/sunnews/canada/archives/2012/05/20120523-173017.html



> OTTAWA -- The Ontario family that was put through hell because of a child's kindergarten drawing is back on their feet and ready to fight, while the police department involved still hasn't decided if it messed up.
> 
> Jessie Sansone, a 26-year-old father of four, is speaking with a new lawyer. He says he's trying to get justice after he was arrested, strip-searched, and held in a cell while his home was searched by police and his children taken away by social workers for interviews.
> 
> Their ordeal began after his four-year-old daughter, Nevaeh, drew a picture of him fighting monsters and bad guys in her Kitchener classroom, and it ended with the discovery of a clear plastic toy gun.



More on link. This was discussed a lot in the gun control debate thread, but since it might take a life of its own on, I decided to start a new topic. If mods disagree, just move to that thread.

EDIT: err wrong board. Can it be moved please?


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## dogger1936 (24 May 2012)

This story seriously blows my mind. And while I am not one of those "sue" type people...I think I would in this case if I was the father.

This is beyond disturbing. Sue them and make them pay for an invasion into your life for no just cause.


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## a_majoor (24 May 2012)

Far too many agencies are abusing their powers, especially if they claim to have "zero tolerence", since there is no critical thought filter before acting.

Instead of a lawsuit we might consider riding the perps out fo town on a rail (after tarring and feathering...)


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## Brad Sallows (24 May 2012)

This can probably serve as exhibit "A" for those who fail to understand why I don't automatically hold various public services in high regard.


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## cupper (24 May 2012)

Sythen:

Can you repost the link or find a different one with the same story? I tried it and it came up with an error indicating the article had either been moved or no longer exists.


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## Container (24 May 2012)

While I think this particular incident is COMPLETELY outlandish. Zero tolerance is created by lobby groups and lawyers. Police dont like having discretion taken away- it always winds up stupid. More stupid then we usually wind up on our own (which can be pretty dumb)


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## ModlrMike (25 May 2012)

Container said:
			
		

> While I think this particular incident is COMPLETELY outlandish. Zero tolerance is created by lobby groups and lawyers. Police dont like having discretion taken away- it always winds up stupid. More stupid then we usually wind up on our own (which can be pretty dumb)



A classic case of rule by regulation, rather than law. Self appointed social engineers toil away creating ever more regulations to stifle individual action by the average citizen.


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## Nemo888 (25 May 2012)

Law enforcement  lost all sense of balance after 9/11. I want my damn rights back. The libs just removed freedom of assembly and freedom of association in Quebec. Crayon dad is just the thin end of the wedge.


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## ArmyRick (25 May 2012)

I hope this opens up a can of worms in our borderline communist state!


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## Container (25 May 2012)

Nemo888 said:
			
		

> Law enforcement  lost all sense of balance after 9/11. I want my damn rights back. The libs just removed freedom of assembly and freedom of association in Quebec. Crayon dad is just the thin end of the wedge.



Wait....what? That might be an over exageration- you do realize the "assembly's" in Quebec are throwing Molotov cocktails on police officers right?


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## Bird_Gunner45 (25 May 2012)

Container said:
			
		

> Wait....what? That might be an over exageration- you do realize the "assembly's" in Quebec are throwing Molotov cocktails on police officers right?



Who taught the the BA drop outs how to make Molotov Cocktails? I thought the engineers were still going to classes


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## cupper (27 May 2012)

Bird_Gunner45 said:
			
		

> Who taught the the BA drop outs how to make Molotov Cocktails? I thought the engineers were still going to classes



Apparently now that they are not going to classes, they have lots of time to look things up on the internet.

No self respecting engineering student would use something as rudimentary as a Molotov Cocktail. THey would more likely spend the time and effort to produce a trebuchet, catapult, or ballista. ;D


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## 421_434_226 (27 May 2012)

Link to the story

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2012/05/22/19787246.html


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## Jarnhamar (27 May 2012)

Container said:
			
		

> Wait....what? That might be an over exageration- you do realize the "assembly's" in Quebec are throwing Molotov cocktails on police officers right?



Why aren't police snipers taking the heads off the criminals throwing the Molotov cocktails?


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## fraserdw (27 May 2012)

Nemo888 said:
			
		

> Law enforcement  lost all sense of balance after 9/11. I want my damn rights back. The libs just removed freedom of assembly and freedom of association in Quebec. Crayon dad is just the thin end of the wedge.



In the very unlikely event that this was to become a wider problem, it is the members of this board, and you I assume, that would likely be assisting in the removal of those rights of yours.  AND, if so, it will likely be a lawful command.  Are ya gonna strip your uniform and join the mob?  In South Africa the Apartheid supporters believed the army would go over to their side, but, as the SA C of C said the army officers and NCOs choose to follow the path of their pensions and stick with the government.


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## The Bread Guy (27 May 2012)

Container said:
			
		

> Nemo888 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ah, welcoming back the Black Bloc....


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## aesop081 (27 May 2012)

Nemo888 said:
			
		

> The libs just removed freedom of assembly and freedom of association in Quebec.



They have done no such thing.



> I want my damn rights back



I want my right not to be subjected to your tripe. Come to think of it, i have it. You're going on ignore.


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## my72jeep (27 May 2012)

CDN Aviator said:
			
		

> They have done no such thing.
> 
> 
> You're going on ignore.



We have ignore capability?


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## aesop081 (27 May 2012)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> We have ignore capability?



Indeed.

Profile > Modify profile > Buddies/ignore list > edit ignore list.


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## Journeyman (27 May 2012)

my72jeep said:
			
		

> We have ignore capability?


Indeed we do. Several of us have made use of it for some time.


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## NSDreamer (28 May 2012)

Nemo888 said:
			
		

> Law enforcement  lost all sense of balance after 9/11. I want my damn rights back. The libs just removed freedom of assembly and freedom of association in Quebec. Crayon dad is just the thin end of the wedge.


 Alright not going to carry this any further, but wanted to point out: 

1. The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms guarantees the rights and freedoms set out in it subject only to such reasonable limits prescribed by law as can be demonstrably justified in a free and democratic society.
Fundamental Freedoms

Fundamental freedoms

2. Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms:
(a) freedom of conscience and religion;
(b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication;
(c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and
(d) freedom of association.

 Once your organization/situation devolves into the point where you endanger life and limb and thus violate another persons every other fundamental freedom by doing violence to them, it is no longer reasonably justified to allow you to continue with your 'freedom of peaceful assembly' and many of the protests in quebec were anything but peaceful. Maybe the Governments bill 78 is a short stick response, but is it just....you know what no I'm just not going there. How about them Leafs this year eh?


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## Journeyman (28 May 2012)

NSDreamer said:
			
		

> Alright not going to carry this any further, but wanted to point out:


As soon as you say "...but wanted to point out," you _are_ carrying it further and encouraging more inane comments.

My ignore list has only six names on it, and it's interesting how the tin-foil hat topics draw them out -- quick to self-righteous but habitually light on evidence.  When someone cites them I see their babbling in the quote, otherwise their 'wisdom' is displayed as You are ignoring this user.

It's actually pretty funny when you get two or three of them all worked up into a frenzy of "oh...oh _ya_?!"....and I (and others ignoring them) see only a whole page of You are ignoring this user.   ;D


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## The_Falcon (28 May 2012)

Umm...I believe there are already threads out there about the stupidity in Quebec right now, lets focus on the stupidity that happened here.


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## NSDreamer (28 May 2012)

Journeyman said:
			
		

> As soon as you say "...but wanted to point out," you _are_ carrying it further and encouraging more inane comments.
> [/quote
> 
> You misunderstand my intent. I was attempting to say that I wanted to add this point, but wasn't looking to continue the conversation beyond that point AKA I have no real interest in starting a long discussion on the subject.


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## armyvern (30 May 2012)

Nemo888 said:
			
		

> Law enforcement  lost all sense of balance after 9/11. I want my damn rights back. The libs just removed freedom of assembly and freedom of association in Quebec. Crayon dad is just the thin end of the wedge.



Bullshit; what I lost was the ability (my right??) to go into the park that I damn well pay taxes for in Montreal ... and for my next door neighbours' kids to do the same.

All thanks to some students (already paying the lowest tuition rates in Canada) pushing for a communist education template to further their ultimate goal of being able to make capitalistic millions upon their convocations.  :  (Free post secondary education so we can get higher paying jobs!)

Can't see the irony through your rose coloured glasses?

I want my streets back; they sure as fuck don't own them.


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## Brad Sallows (31 May 2012)

But then there will be soldiers in our streets...


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## Sadukar09 (31 May 2012)

I don't get it. Two years ago in my high school, the rules weren't followed to the letter. i.e. common sense prevailed. From what what I hear from current students, it's by the books only.

Common sense is a super power now days...


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## Tyson Fox (31 May 2012)

It seems odd to me you would ignore people on an internet forum. Even if you habitually dislike what a person says, you can just gloss over it, instead of having to literally hide what they say. Anyway, I've said it before and I'll say it again: "I may not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it". That quote actually applies quite well to this board and to the situation in Quebec.  I'm inclined to agree with Nemo's and Vern's statements about the freedoms being taken away. While I don't actually know anything about the issues with the public assembly they are having...I do know that it is against the charter in this country to put limits on public assembly such as they have, and especially the ban on masks. Not that I support those idiotic students, but if a person wants to put on a mask and say something in Canada, no one can stop him. It doesn't matter why he wants to. Now if he starts a garbage can on fire, then you can do something, but...


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## Bruce Monkhouse (31 May 2012)

Shipwreck said:
			
		

> It seems odd to me you would ignore people on an internet forum. Even if you habitually dislike what a person says, you can just gloss over it, instead of having to literally hide what they say. Anyway, I've said it before and I'll say it again: "I may not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it". That quote actually applies quite well to this board and to the situation in Quebec.  I'm inclined to agree with Nemo's and Vern's statements about the freedoms being taken away. While I don't actually know anything about the issues with the public assembly they are having...I do know that it is against the charter in this country to put limits on public assembly such as they have, and especially the ban on masks. Not that I support those idiotic students, but if a person wants to put on a mask and say something in Canada, no one can stop him. It doesn't matter why he wants to. Now if he starts a garbage can on fire, then you can do something, but...



That post hurt my head trying to follow............




			
				Shipwreck said:
			
		

> I'm inclined to agree with Nemo's and Vern's statements about the freedoms being taken away.



Umm,...........I'm not sure it's possible to agree with both,...ouch,..there's that pain again.


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## Journeyman (1 Jun 2012)

Bruce Monkhouse said:
			
		

> Umm,...........I'm not sure it's possible to agree with both,...ouch,..there's that pain again.


Well, we do tend to keep coming back to that "opinion versus _informed_ opinion" problem -- everyone's got opinions.  :


Although, to be fair, he _did_ say.......


			
				Shipwreck said:
			
		

> I'm inclined to agree with Nemo's and Vern's statements about the freedoms being taken away. While I don't actually know anything  about the issues...


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## Fishbone Jones (1 Jun 2012)

Let's not lose sight of the original post\ problem. 

Let's stick to what is happening to this particular family vice social services, the police and the nanny school board. 

There's opportunity and threads to speak to all that other Quebec student crap. 

Keep it out of here.

Milnet.ca Staff


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## PMedMoe (6 Jun 2012)

Police apologize to crayon gun dad

Four months after arresting and strip-searching a man because his four-year-old daughter drew a picture of him shooting monsters and bad guys, police in Kitchener-Waterloo, Ont., have apologized to the young family. 

In their internal review of 26-year-old Jessie Sansone's arrest, Waterloo Regional Police said they did everything right — except their method of search. 

“The results of this review have determined that Waterloo Regional Police officers acted in accordance with the law by arresting Mr. Sansone and made every effort to preserve his dignity and the safety of this community,” said Chief Matt Torigian.   

“However, the review also found that due to a miscommunication in the processing of Mr. Sansone, he was subjected to a Thorough Search instead of a less intrusive Frisk Search— an oversight which we regret.” 

More at link


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## TN2IC (6 Jun 2012)

From what I'm understanding, is that I need to talk to my children. Tell them that drawing guns in class is a bad thing. Yet, every boy in class goes on about the lastest XBox game. Even if trying to prevent "condition training" the media will leak out, no matter what. So was the police right to do that? Yes and no. Since 9/11, things have changed, period. And with this "touchy - feely" generation, everyone is on the high alert looking for the clues. Thinking they are their own investigator. Saving the world, one tissue at a time.

Sorry for the rant,
Regards,
Macey


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## ArmyRick (7 Jun 2012)

From what I have read and my interpretation of the event, I believe this was an over reaction on the police's part. Funny in the above link there is also an article at the bottom talking about how teachers must crack down on Sex offenders amongst their own....

REALLY? Didn't this BS concerning the Sansone family start at the school level? We need to focus our efforts in the right direction!!!

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2012/06/07/19851006.html


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## DBA (16 Jun 2012)

Waste of resources and a very poor showing for what is after all a professional police force that is expected to be competent. The public loses a lot of respect for them when 'professional' public workers act so stupidly from the teachers, administrators, police officers on up to the police Chief. The "apology" makes them even less worthy of respect as they lack the professionalism to even admit they overacted and they won't even try to act any more competently in the future.


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