# Logistik Unicorp



## Sharpey (26 Jan 2005)

I searched the previous threads and havn't come accross my thoughts on this, so I will post and hope for the best.

Yes it's fine and dandy that we can order DEU items, but why not operational equipment? I'm not talking Gortex Jackets and Iltis tires, but items that wear easily, ie sock system, gloves, gitch, scarves, toques, t-shirts, etc...

Peoples arguments: go to your QM

My argument: you can do the same for DEU items.

Any info?


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## 735_winnipeg (27 Jan 2005)

as far as i know, logistik unicorp has only DEUs.  try going to www.canadianpeacekeeper.com to try getting combat-related stuffs.

i got my name tags thru that site.


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## Fishbone Jones (27 Jan 2005)

Gitch, socks and tshirts can be had at the QM. Reservists are entitled to an issue once a year. I just got mine. Socks have to be exchanged :


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## nULL (27 Jan 2005)

I'd imagine that the reason is that they don't want surplus operational clothing floating around - bad for security.


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## foerestedwarrior (27 Jan 2005)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Gitch, socks and tshirts can be had at the QM. Reservists are entitled to an issue once a year. I just got mine. Socks have to be exchanged :




serious, I was told, one time issue for reservists on those.


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## Da_man (27 Jan 2005)

you can buy t-shirts at the QM for like $3


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## Fishbone Jones (27 Jan 2005)

Why would you buy them, when you can get them issued? And no, it's not a one time thing, someone's screwing with you if they're telling you that. Get them to show you where it's written and put the onus on them. If they keep stonewalling redress it. They may ask for the old ones in exchange, then bin them, but who cares. Why would you want more than your entitlement anyway?


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## Armymedic (27 Jan 2005)

In agreement with recceguy, with exception of what you can buy online, everything else is exchangable at your clothing stores. 

You are not supposed to buy it.


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## 48Highlander (27 Jan 2005)

The QM in Pet as far as I know used to sell things like boxers and t-shirts.  You could get your entitlement re-issued, but when I asked for 5 new t-shirts, they sold 'em to me for $2 each.  Not sure if they were abusing the system or what, but I didn't mind paying $10 for 5 t-shirts....


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## Bomber (27 Jan 2005)

Cost for the OD t-shirts is 3 bucks "ish".  If you got them for 2, that is like money in the bank for you.  I am a little bit unsure about the exchange of the new stuff on a one for one.  I am forever doing a huge stock taking of all my kit to find those black liner socks to satisfy the kit list requirements.  I wear Merino wool in my boots only, and so as of tonight I only have three of those black socks with the red rim.  Now I wish, instead of blowing a couple of hours searching for the other seven, I would love to go into clothing stores and just buy 4 new pairs.  But one for one.  I will just have to fill in the old lost kit report.  I pity the clothing people that have to take back the underpants and liner socks.  Maybe they should have an amnesty box at the entrance of the QM to deposit those things.


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## Sharpey (28 Jan 2005)

So what's the bizarre concept of one for one exchanges anyway? I've seen people turn in their well used long underwear for a new pair. Next to skin items are not reissued from what I understand. So if it's a throw away anyway, what is the reason for showing proof you have the item and bringing it in? Especially for the items we are apparently entitled to each year. I would love to find written proof of that as I am unable to exchange a simple set of combats right now because they arn't see through, but yet they are white as my winter whites and had to sew the pocket almost completly back on. Oh but if I was female, I would have no problem...yes I experienced that one last night! Argh! Ok, that's a different rant, I'll stop right here.


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## ackland (28 Jan 2005)

The reason for bringing in your used T's and Underwear is to stop abuse of the system. soem people like to get more than their alotment and take away from the rest us. If your combats are worn well that's life. we all have three sets one would assume that at least one pair is serviceable. Sewing is part of being a soldier. A ripped pocket is not a good reason for exchange.


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## mudgunner49 (28 Jan 2005)

You should not be able to get more than your allotment as the amount issued to you is tracked by the system and everytime you draw replacement you must sign for it.  My unit does not require turn-in of NTS items for this reason.  Even if you don't require it you should draw the replacement socks/underwear/t-shirts anyhow as they make lots of sense when keeping a bug-out bag packed.

Take care, be safe,

Blake


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## Posthumane (29 Jan 2005)

Next to skin items SHOULD not be re-issued, but I know for a fact that this is not always the case. When I got my initial kit issue a few years ago, I got long underwear (waffle type) with someone's name on them.


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## Da_man (29 Jan 2005)

When i was issued CADPAT everyone got a brand version new air force approuved combats.  Well I got pre-whitened old combats  :'(

[/rant]


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## Forgotten_Hero (29 Jan 2005)

Posthumane said:
			
		

> Next to skin items SHOULD not be re-issued, but I know for a fact that this is not always the case. When I got my initial kit issue a few years ago, I got long underwear (waffle type) with someone's name on them.



You got underwear? I didnt!


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## Fishbone Jones (29 Jan 2005)

Sounds like your Unit has got a serious supply problem. :


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## willy (2 Feb 2005)

Sharpie said:
			
		

> I searched the previous threads and havn't come accross my thoughts on this, so I will post and hope for the best.
> 
> Yes it's fine and dandy that we can order DEU items, but why not operational equipment? I'm not talking Gortex Jackets and Iltis tires, but items that wear easily, ie sock system, gloves, gitch, scarves, toques, t-shirts, etc...
> 
> ...



Actually, I'm starting to kind of dislike the whole website ordering system because it's screwing up the way the established supply system works.  Putting the load for issue of DEU onto a cicvilian company is reducing our ability to easily draw stores from QM.  I went into clothing stores the other day to try and buy a few long sleeve CF shirts.  Not only did they not have a single shirt of my size in stock, but I was told that they wouldn't be able to sell any to me if they did, as it would be infringing on Unicorp's contract for them to do so.  Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I think you should be able to get clothing at clothing stores.


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## someguyincanada (2 Feb 2005)

willy i totally agree with you on what you said.
this is what is taken from logistic unicorps site

Clothing Online is a National Defence initiative to trial the purchase and direct delivery of CF non-operational Clothing Upkeep Allowance (CUA) Items from the supplier to your home or place of work through the Internet. It is designed to bring you the convenience and personalization of Internet shopping, saving you the time and effort of travelling to Clothing Stores. In the process, it will make Clothing Stores more efficient.

i still dont like the idea of a civy company taking over.... whats next?


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## Armymedic (2 Feb 2005)

Alternate Service Delivery at its best.

Actually I find the service quite efficient, I order online at work, and 3 days later its at my door.... no trips to base qm for a item that they may or may not have. You measure yourself, and your last measurements are kept on you profile so there is no doubt on sizing. 

And if you need tailoring, your free to choose a base tailor of pay for one yourself....

Wheres the problem?


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## someguyincanada (3 Feb 2005)

they are taking away from a supply techs job...


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## Inch (3 Feb 2005)

someguyincanada said:
			
		

> they are taking away from a supply techs job...



Hardly, this is the military, we just won't recruit as many supply techs, besides, with all the environmental and operational kit that supply techs deal with, I'm sure they're busy enough.


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## Armymedic (3 Feb 2005)

someguyincanada said:
			
		

> they are taking away from a supply techs job...



yeah, whatever!

Like you don't have enough to do. 



			
				Inch said:
			
		

> Hardly, this is the military, we just won't recruit as many supply techs, besides, with all the environmental and operational kit that supply techs deal with, I'm sure they're busy enough.



Not to mention how the units are short pers because of multiple tours, etc.


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## ex royal now flyer (3 Feb 2005)

Supply Techs at Clothing Stores are not that busy.  I wore the log cap badge for seven years.  Ever wonder why they are always closed for "stocktaking".

Clothing Stores can be operated by civilians.  Lets get our people in uniform back into 1st and 2nd line units where they belong.  Let the 3rd and 4th line work be done by civilians.  This does not just apply to Supply Tech but to all support trades.  The Ops tempo of the CF is very high and we are burning out our members.  Lets get some of these people hiding in Depots and HQs to deploy.

As for Logistik Unicorp: they have never told me they are out of stock.  I can order when I want and am not told Clothing is closed for "stocktaking".  ASD can be a good thing if it is managed and contracted properly.


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## balkam (17 Dec 2006)

get this, I'm a highlander, my deu's include a kilt. try ordering a kilt on line. the only article i can get is a light green undershirt. even the tunic isnt the same as other deu's


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## old man neri (17 Dec 2006)

balkam said:
			
		

> get this, I'm a highlander, my deu's include a kilt. try ordering a kilt on line. the only article i can get is a light green undershirt. even the tunic isnt the same as other deu's



That's a unit thing, talk to your unit. Your unit QM is the only people that issue your kilt. How do I know? I use to work in a Q at one of those highlander units. 

I don't think your kilt is classified as 'DEU'. From my understanding (someone else please confirm or correct me) your DEU is the same as everyone else's in the army and that you can get online.


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## geo (17 Dec 2006)

Kilts are regimental property.  The unit gets $$$ each year for Highland gear maintenance.... Not a logistik issue.

WRT the DEU jacket, they are all basic DEU jackets.  After you get the basic model, it is taken to the tailor where the tailor "cuts away" same said jacket to Highland standard.

Talk to your Plt WO, CQMS or RQMS .... they will all sing same said verse.

All together now..........


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## Shamrock (17 Dec 2006)

.


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## Dogboy (29 Dec 2006)

recceguy said:
			
		

> Gitch, socks and tshirts can be had at the QM. Reservists are entitled to an issue once a year. I just got mine. Socks have to be exchanged :


this brig up a bigger Issue 
Reservist some times get F*** around when it comes to dealing with QM stores. I never had to return my socks and i was told 6 months betwen issue 
and that may change depending who is behind the counter.


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## armyvern (29 Dec 2006)

1175CMR said:
			
		

> Supply Techs at Clothing Stores are not that busy.  I wore the log cap badge for seven years.  Ever wonder why they are always closed for "stocktaking".
> 
> Clothing Stores can be operated by civilians.  Lets get our people in uniform back into 1st and 2nd line units where they belong.  Let the 3rd and 4th line work be done by civilians.  This does not just apply to Supply Tech but to all support trades.  The Ops tempo of the CF is very high and we are burning out our members.  Lets get some of these people hiding in Depots and HQs to deploy.
> 
> As for Logistik Unicorp: they have never told me they are out of stock.  I can order when I want and am not told Clothing is closed for "stocktaking".  ASD can be a good thing if it is managed and contracted properly.



How did I manage to miss this BS post for over a year?? I'll post anyway because I see that you are still active on the forum. Not busy?? Better make an appointment to get your eyeglasses prescription checked.

Wore the Log cap badge but were you ever a Sup Tech working in Clothing Stores? For some reason I highly doubt it or you would never have made the assinine statement above. Full stop. 3 years as the IC of Clothing here and we closed for 1 week to do a 100% stock-taking (legally required by Treasury Board Canada by the way) and we closed while the Schools were on their March Break just so we caused as little upset to the soldiers as possible.

Apparently you don't deal with Logistik Unicorp that often either. Last fall they experienced many stock outs of all the most popular items. Why? Because every girl & boy in NATO decided to use those "free points" as soon as they got them to get some new DEUs because it wasn't costing them anything. There was a message cut regarding the significant stockouts at Logistik...apparently you missed it.

The longest Logistik back-order we had here was a CAP candidate whose tunic had been on "backorder" from Logistik for 3 months!! Through his basic and into his CAP course. Imagine that and he was not an anomoly last fall although he did have the longest wait.



			
				balkam said:
			
		

> get this, I'm a highlander, my deu's include a kilt. try ordering a kilt on line. the only article i can get is a light green undershirt. even the tunic isnt the same as other deu's



Geo is bang on with his response. Your kilt is not considered DEU as it is not permanently issued to you, nor should your cut-away tunic be. They are both Crown property on charge to your Unit not your clothing docs.



			
				Dogboy said:
			
		

> this brig up a bigger Issue
> Reservist some times get F*** around when it comes to dealing with QM stores. I never had to return my socks and i was told 6 months betwen issue
> and that may change depending who is behind the counter.



No they don't. It's got nothing to do with who's behind the counter. It's got to do with how much time you have in. Sorry to disappoint you. The standard is, for your exchangeable socks and gotch.....6 months. They all have a life-expectancy, just like those purchased boots that a member can only get once every two years...because they should last that long. It's got zero to do with ResF or RegF.


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## Dogboy (29 Dec 2006)

so the guy who posted above who said he was told a year is what???
and the time I was told I don't get new combat gloves set but the next week my buddy in my unit has his from stores is what???
their is sometimes a feeling that theirs  a double standard some times 
yes I know supply is a huge issue but come on 
I was only given One pair of combat boots on my first issue and I was going on course it tulk my course staff a few days to get me my second pair not bad for something that's not suppose to be in stock.


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## Sig_Des (29 Dec 2006)

Dogboy said:
			
		

> so the guy who posted above who said he was told a year is what???
> and the time I was told I don't get new combat gloves set but the next week my buddy in my unit has his from stores is what???
> their is sometimes a feeling that theirs  a double standard some times
> yes I know supply is a huge issue but come on
> I was only given One pair of combat boots on my first issue and I was going on course it tulk my course staff a few days to get me my second pair not bad for something that's not suppose to be in stock.



Well after some time deciphering your encrypted post (spellcheck, or basic punctuation and grammar, maybe?)

What's the difference in time-in between you and your buddy?

And your first issue, was it done at the same place as you did your course? Different places have different stock. Different Bdes, commands, bases have different allocations.

Instead of whining, and posting something that may be seen as inflammatory by some, I would suggest you sit back and rationally discuss, or just listen to Vern, who just so happens to be a SME in this.


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## George Wallace (29 Dec 2006)

Dogboy said:
			
		

> so the guy who posted above who said he was told a year is what???
> and the time I was told I don't get new combat gloves set but the next week my buddy in my unit has his from stores is what???
> their is sometimes a feeling that theirs  a double standard some times
> yes I know supply is a huge issue but come on
> I was only given One pair of combat boots on my first issue and I was going on course it tulk my course staff a few days to get me my second pair not bad for something that's not suppose to be in stock.



Could you at the very least give it a try and attempt to use correct grammar and spelling?

Deciphering your posts takes forever.

What he heck are you trying to communicate here:


			
				Dogboy said:
			
		

> so the guy who posted above who said he was told a year is what???



and here:


			
				Dogboy said:
			
		

> and the time I was told I don't get new combat gloves set but the next week my buddy in my unit has his from stores is what???



There is a big difference in meaning between these three words:  There, Their, and They're.  Can you at least make it easier for us to understand you and use the correct word.

There is a lot of mistakes with this, but most of them are your inability to convey to us what it is you are trying to say:


			
				Dogboy said:
			
		

> I was only given One pair of combat boots on my first issue and I was going on course it tulk my course staff a few days to get me my second pair not bad for something that's not suppose to be in stock.



What is tulk?
So, as a Reservist, you got issued one pair of boots.  Did you ask if that was the last pair in your size?  Perhaps a new truckload arrived between the time you got your first pair and your Staff went in to investigate.

I see others are having the same problem trying to read your posts.


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## Dogboy (29 Dec 2006)

OK 
1 read my Signature.
"Iv got a learning disability. Iv had to deal with it for years you can deal with it for a min"
2 the buddy has less time in than me.
3 I have a standard size (10) that should be something we don't run out of is it not.
4 yes I do use to much short hand refer to answer #1 and I always use spell check so their.


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## Trinity (29 Dec 2006)

Dogboy said:
			
		

> 4 yes I do use to much short hand refer to answer #1 and I always use spell check so their.



OK..  but that doesn't pick up grammar mistakes  like  I've instead of Iv  or there instead of their

And no one would believe your signature to be true if you didn't tell us.

NOW..  (or however)

You keep trying your best, spelling, grammar, etc...  and we'll try to help
you out as much as we can.  We're not pricks...  OK well Sig_Des has his moments
but that's only if he doesn't take his medication.


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## Ex-Dragoon (29 Dec 2006)

Dogboy....Trinity is correct by saying we will help you but as an adult and a member of the CF its also your responsibility to correct any errors when they are pointed out to you. By fixing those mistakes and not making them again you demonstrate that you are a professional.


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## armyvern (30 Dec 2006)

Dogboy said:
			
		

> so the guy who posted above who said he was told a year is what???
> and the time I was told I don't get new combat gloves set but the next week my buddy in my unit has his from stores is what???
> their is sometimes a feeling that theirs  a double standard some times
> yes I know supply is a huge issue but come on
> I was only given One pair of combat boots on my first issue and I was going on course it tulk my course staff a few days to get me my second pair not bad for something that's not suppose to be in stock.





			
				Dogboy said:
			
		

> OK
> 1 read my Signature.
> "Iv got a learning disability. Iv had to deal with it for years you can deal with it for a min"
> 2 the buddy has less time in than me.
> ...



OK Dogboy,

I'm going to try to answer your questions for you based on the info I've got on you and your status.

DEUs: Land ResF (NCMs) are not entitled to issue until they have successfully completed 1 full year or service OR successfully completed their QL3 trades course; whichever comes first. This may explain why someone with 9 months in would not be entitled to something that someone else who only has 6 months in is getting. Many factors come into play in determining entitlement, so to compare yourself to the guy standing next to you at the counter, or your buddy in your Unit does not compute unless you both have the exact same time-in and courses at the same time.

Each different item of kit has it's own unique entitlement requirements. Just because you are entitled to one Clothe the Soldier (CTS) item does not make you entitled to all the CTS items. These "entitlement" factors are the reason why the Sup Techs at the counter need to ask questions when people come in asking for kit:

How long have you been in?
What course are you qualified?
What course are you on?
What Unit do you belong to (otherwise asked as "What is your UIC")?
What trade are you (otherwise asked as "What is your MOC/MOSID")?
When are you deploying?
What is your deployment position number (a hard copy of your tasking message actually brought with you helps tremendously by the way)?

Your individual answers to any and all of the questions above will be used by the Sup Tech to determine your entitlements to items, which changes for each item based on your responses. For example:

Young Pte infanteer comes to the counter looking for safety boots. Infanteers are not entitled to safety boots based on their MOC. However, said young Pte also brings tasking message (or knows his position number in-theatre), or brings Memo from RQ of his Unit advising that he is employed within his UIC as a Cbt storesman, or employed in an in-theatre position listed as "driver." He now becomes entilted to be issued 2 pair of safety boots, just the same as a Sup Tech or Driver employed in the same position would be. Then his buddy comes into clothing the next day and bitchs at the Sup Tech that "my buddy got 2 pair yesterday and he's a Pte infantry in the same Unit as me but you gave them to him you asshats." My response: "Difference is, he's currently being employed in a driver or cbt storesman posn and you are not. Bye bye." We get it all the time.

In response to your remark about your combat boots and being a size 10...



> I was only given One pair of combat boots on my first issue and I was going on course it tulk my course staff a few days to get me my second pair not bad for something that's not suppose to be in stock.



The reasons for this have been discussed fully in other threads on this forum....

I'd wager that you went through your course when the MkIII combat boots were restricted to "Operational deployment only." During the Ops restriction, (fall 03 to summer 06 actually - and _some_ sizes are _still _ restricted) new CF members were restricted to issue of 1 pair only, so that the remaining stocks could be used for personnel deploying into combat theatres. So yes, I believe this happened to you, but your instuctors would should have been fully aware of the reasons behind it as numerous AIGs and even a CANFORGEN message were cut on the inavailability of MkIII cbt boots (and even listed all the restricted sizes) if they even bothered to read those mandatory CANFORGENs (available to them on the DIN). Your instructors and/or your Chain of Command (CoC) should have explained this to you, or at least passed it down through O gps, which are meant for the passage of information. You can probably tell by the length of my post that the Sup Techs at the counter do not have enough time in the day to explain this to 100 people a day showing up looking for boots we can't give them due to an "ops restriction" or other restriction which is exactly why this info is disseminated through official sources via AIGs and CANFORGENs...to ensure it's widest distribution officially through the CoC so soldiers are aware of what is going on with specific items/restrictions. Now if that info is not filtering down to your level, I suggest that you talk to your supervisor. 

Here, we also publish the restrictions and links to messages regarding them in our Base Routine Orders (ROs), mandatory reading, so that when the troops come in and aren't aware we don't have to explain 100 times a day, we just say...read ROs...they are manadtory. What? You don't have access to the DIN and/or ROs? Well someone in your CoC does, and since they are a mandatory read every publication by all serving CF members, perhaps your lowest level supervisor who does have DIN access should be printing a hard copy and distributing with a circ slip (circulation slip) for reading and initialling by all the troops who don't have access. The Orderly room of the local ResF Unit here does that...and it works. Just like the old days when we had no computers.

And above all, let us not forget that entitlements to items change all the time. An excellent example is the small pack system. One week ResF Units of certain UICs were entitled to be issued them (and some people got them from those Units), then the next week, CTS discovered (due to an announced increase in the number of troops to be deployed overseas to combat ops) that they wouldn't have enough to satisfy the Ops demand. Entitlement to those same ResF UICs was then ceased immediately and no others could be issued to members from those Units (unless of course, that particular member happened to be deploying into an overseas Ops position). Guess what happened at Clothing Stores? "Well my buddy got one a week ago....you Supply people are all f***** up!!" because the info never got passed down to the low level troops. It had nothing to do with us Supply techs at clothing being f***** up. It's a fun job.

Entitlements are a funny thing, and way too much fun to deal with!! Try being a Sup tech at clothing keeping thousands of army, navy and air force kit items (we carry all three don't forget!!) and all the various entitlements/restrictions that go along with them sorted out on an everchanging and daily basis. It's no small feat. Also try to remember that Supply techs don't decide who is entitled to what; that is done by your own specific MOC advisors and ECS' at NDHQ, not the little guy who gets to actually issue/not issue the stuff at the counter.


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## Yrys (30 Dec 2006)

Small hijack



			
				The Librarian said:
			
		

> It's a fun job.



It's look like its should have been taking as a model for the mad house in Asterix & Obelix !

Édith : as in Find Permit A-38 in "The Place That Sends You Mad" , 
           http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twelve_Tasks_of_Asterix


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## geo (30 Dec 2006)

Oooooh.... Vern,  love it when you talk that way

Chimo!


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## NL_engineer (30 Dec 2006)

> DEUs: Land ResF (NCMs) are not entitled to issue until they have successfully completed 1 full year or service OR successfully completed their QL3 trades course; whichever comes first. This may explain why someone with 9 months in would not be entitled to something that someone else who only has 6 months in is getting. Many factors come into play in determining entitlement, so to compare yourself to the guy standing next to you at the counter, or your buddy in your Unit does not compute unless you both have the exact same time-in and courses at the same time.



So this means that my clothing stores doesn't know this or some of the troops in my section lied...HMMM must look this up for next Remembrance day, that way clothing cant give them the your not entitled responce  >


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## Sig_Des (30 Dec 2006)

NL_engineer said:
			
		

> So this means that my clothing stores doesn't know this or some of the troops in my section lied...HMMM must look this up for next Remembrance day, that way clothing cant give them the your not entitled responce  >



IIRC, the was a CANFORGEN on this one end '05, early '06.....1 Year in, or 3's qualified


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## armyvern (30 Dec 2006)

NL_engineer said:
			
		

> So this means that my clothing stores doesn't know this or some of the troops in my section lied...HMMM must look this up for next Remembrance day, that way clothing cant give them the your not entitled responce  >



Actually, in the beginning the CANFORGEN read that NCMs of the CF Res F Land enviornment were only entitled to DEUs upon successful completion of 1 year of service. That was the standard of entitlement for approx 2 months, and then an ammendment CANFORGEN was cut to add in the entitlement of "or after successful completion of QL3 trades training, whichever comes first." Entitlements are never as simple as they sound....that's why the info you provide to us, helps to sort out why and when someone was told no.

So I'd wager again, that the Sup Techs were indeed right and did know what they were talking about and that your troops did not lie to you either. I'd bet your troops went looking for their DEUs prior to the ammendment message being cut, which is exactly what I mean about ever-changing entitlements on a daily basis. If your troops are being told "not entitled," 99 times out of 1 hundred, they are being told the truth....until the next time entitlements change again. When in doubt, ask for the IC Clothing, who will be able to provide you with the written ref if you can't find it on the AIGs, CANFORGENs, or ROs on your own.

Vern


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## armyvern (30 Dec 2006)

Sig_Des said:
			
		

> IIRC, the was a CANFORGEN on this one end '05, early '06.....1 Year in, or 3's qualified



You are very close here Siggy, two CANFORGENs, one for the "year in" entitlement which was followed approx 2 months later to change the entitlement again to "1 year in or QL3 qualified, whichever comes first."


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## NL_engineer (30 Dec 2006)

Thanks Vern,


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## Dogboy (31 Dec 2006)

OK I did not know about the lack of boots thing I was just a littel upset at the time.
and ya Id understand the tired of telling the 100th person whythey cant get...
so ya Ill try and get a hard copy of what I'm entitle too for my training secion, witch is where kit issues show up the most. thanks


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