'Fixing' the CFRCs.....

[Meridian]

It has become apparent through many of the threads on here, to me at least, that the CFRC's are not meeting the informational needs of those interested in Joining the Forces.

George Wallace has questioned whether this is to do with the CFRC's primarily being manned by reservists, who by virtue of their component status have in general less knowledge of what it means to be Reg Force, and military fulltime.

I have suggested that our CFRC's modify their approach to me much more conducive to perhaps what can be termed as "customer care". Given that our training systems and the behind the scenes systems in the Recruiting vein (Med, VFS, Boards, etc) are all overburdened (with no clear end in sight) I would argue that over the past few years the Forces have alienated a significant amount of able-bodied, and potentially very apt candidates because of the Forces inability to provide clear, concise information, or at least a semblence of interest when there is information not available.


I suppose this can be argued many ways - Some could say that this is just a reflection of the military as a whole, and if you are unprepared to deal with "hurrying up and waiting" on enrollment, you are ill-prepared for the military life.  I argue this fact by virtue of the whole indoc process - You can't expect a civvy to think military, even if they want to eventually BE military, without any real exposure.

Training videos and flashy advertisements aside, our CFRCs IMHO should much more resemble those Ive seen (via television, so the accuracy may be amiss, I admit) in the States. While I recognize people invariably do not always have numbers, dates, or "when do I get to go" type information readily available, surely somethign can be done to alleviate some of the communications problems here, and instill some sense of commonality in the system. Also, a caring voice can go along way.  I recognize our recruiting staff are overworked, see countless files daily, etc....  and efforts to support them with reservists are well underway....  but I ask you:

If you are a single person, and you walk into an environment where EVERYONE is down, has turned the workplace rather into a drone, suggests to you "not to bother" when you try and go out of your way for someone, etc.... do you not eventually fall into line with the status quo?


Thoughts? Perspectives from those actually recruiting?

 

[lostmuskrat]

In my recent recruiting experience with the CFRC here, three of the four people I dealt with were former regular CF members.  From talking to the recruiter at my (future) regiment, the staff at the local CFRC and friends who work at VAC HQ (here in Charlottetown), some of the recruiting delays are CF-related, some are not.
-The small number of doctors working in Borden who approve medical files.
-The priorities in which files are reviewed.
-Finding archived records (esp. Verification of Former Service and old medical records) from previous CF service.

The first two are CF issues, the third is not.  When someone's records have been deposited in the National Archives, it is taking a long time to get them found, copied and sent to whoever makes the request.  This happens  no matter who is asking for the file, private citizen, CFRC, Veterans Affairs, Access to Information, etc.
As it was explained to me (by a VAC employee), the turnaround time for an Access to Information request BY LAW is 30 days.  Currently they average around 60.  This is because the money to hire the trained archivists (or student gophers) is not there.  As a result, not only do any requests for information from the National Archives take a loooooong time to get done but that the documents and material in the archives are being lost.  eg: Canada is in danger of losing all audio recordings of debates in Parliament because the magnetic tape in the recordings is deteriorating faster than the archivists can transfer the files to a digital format.  There simply aren't enough people to do the job properly because the Federal Government has cut back so much from the nation's heritage funding.

So it's hear-say, but it explains a lot.

 

[Meridian]

Thanks for your input... and I dont mean this as a topic to address the rear echelon issues of boards, files, borden, etc.

What I do mean to address is the day to day handling of files in CFRCs.

Whether I have anything to tell you or not, there are several ways to handle myself. - Ignore you till I have something to say, Give you a call once a month or so to see if you are still interested but still say nothing, or call you weekly, give you encouragement to hang in there, suggest a PT schedule, hook you up with a local reserve unit for some unofficial job-shadowing,  etc.

Im just wondering why we dont do more of the third.

 

[lostmuskrat]

Sorry, I'm not a recruiter at all (I should have made that more clear), I'm a new applicant for the reserves.  My wait hasn't been so long, but I have a friend who applied at the same time I did, and I'm ready to be enrolled in the regiment but the CFRC here hasn't even found all his records yet.  I talked to a few friends I have who work at VAC to find out why it would take so much longer for his records to come through (he'd been in the reserves 7 years ago, I was a new applicant).

I don't know why I couldn't have done some kind of job-shadowing with my future regiment, mabye it has to do with security clearance issues, recruiting priorities, or simply getting work done.
Just to look at it in theory, say a recruiter handles 20 files at any given time, and every Monday they're expected to call every person whose file they're looking after.
Between calling every person, leaving messages, answering questions, taking callbacks, making notes, etc., say they spend an average of 8 min on every file.  This means that almost 2.5 hrs out of every Monday is spent on the phone instead of actually reviewing and handling files.  If there are 5 recruiters in the CFRC, that makes 12.5 hours of every week used up leaving messages.  That's 50 hours of time every month that could arguably be spent doing things that actually get people's applications moving.
Not that the time would be wasted, I would have been much less frustrated if there had been some kind of job-shadowing, but what if three months into the recruiting process my medical file came back with a big red 'x' barring me from joining up?  If there was a job-shadowing program, by that point, I'd have spent 12 evenings at the armouries, wasting the time of whoever was tasked to babysit me.  If I get medically downchecked after a year of waiting, the regiment has wasted two years worth of Thursday-evening training time, mine and the person assigned to train me. 

Again this is just speculation, but why not wait until I'm given the green light, however long it takes.  Sure I'm miffed at the delays,  but I'm no less committed to becoming a soldier.  I was always treated with respect by the staff at CFRC Charlottetown.  I was always given honest answers.  I was treated like an adult, like an applicant for a job, not a customer who needs to be placated and soothed.

 

[Griswald DME]

I will reply in further detail when I have more time, but one thing I can reply to is to George Wallace's question about the CFRC "being primarily manned by reservists, who by virtue of their component status have in general less knowledge of what it means to be Reg Force, and military fulltime."

I have given up hope of ever joining the CF - I am QL5 qualified, the trade I am in currently and the trade I am applying (one and the same) is distressed, offering signing bonuses and my application has been in for three years.  I am merit listed and still waiting.  However, the RCMP have offered me a job and I have accepted.

This said, I have dealt with two recruiters, the first one was reg. force (Navy) and basically was a horribly lazy you-know-what.  The recruiter I have dealt with lately (since mid summer) has been very professional and on the ball at all times.  I am very impressed with his work ethic.  He is a reservist.  My point being I feel very strongly, Reservist or Reg Force member makes no difference.  Its the person that makes the difference, as in any job.  Qualifications mean one thing, but qualification/education alone does not make a good employee.

 

[Meridian]

job shadowing is just an example, and could be brought in perhaps once someone is accepted but awaiting a BMQ course... etc...

and not OJT, job-shadowing... go sit at the unit and watch, I dunno. there are tons of little things that could be done.

And while yes, it may take 2 and half hours ever monday morning, the added savings on those recruits that are lost because of innattention and neglect (purposeful or otherwise) is surely enough to make up for time lost out on the floor..

And how much time does a recruiter actually spend "handling files".  Why is there so much "handling" to be done? If I hand in all my stuff, he should jus thave to read through it and send it on up basically....  there are ways to set the system up to be more functional if there is more to it tthan this.

Again, I have no idea if there are already ways to implement this... and maybe it does work well in some CFRCs.....

 

[bluenose_boy]

Just to give my 2 cents worth, and I don't know if you want a centre-by-centre discussion or not, but in my experiences in Winnipeg, most of the people I dealt with at the actual recruiting centre, as far as I know, were regs who knew lots about the regs, and frankly were not that knowledgeable about the reserves at all. Most questions I had got the response "ask the reserve recruiters." That is not to imply that they were rude or lazy(in almost every case :). Conversely, when I dealt with the recruiters at Minto Armoury, they were very knowledgable and answered every question off the top of their heads.

I have nothing but good things to say about the Winnipeg operation. If I hadn't flunked the stupid cardio portion of my test, I might have very well have gone from handing in my application to being sworn in to the reserves in 4 weeks, as I had no medical issues. Now it won't be until January. :crybaby:

 

[LOGO]

Having worked at a recruiting centre, I can tell you that CFRCs are manned by both Reg and PRes pers.   Everyone receives the same training in recruiting procedures and policy regardless of whether they are in the Reg force or Reserves.  

I agree with bluenose_boy.   If an applicant speaks to a recruiter about the Reg force and feels that they require more info, rather than making judgements or complaining, the applicant should take the proactive approach and attempt to speak to another person who is able to provide the info they are seeking.  

Do the research.   It's your career...take responsiblity for it.    

 

[Love793]

Whether I have anything to tell you or not, there are several ways to handle myself. - Ignore you till I have something to say, Give you a call once a month or so to see if you are still interested but still say nothing, or call you weekly, give you encouragement to hang in there, suggest a PT schedule, hook you up with a local reserve unit for some unofficial job-shadowing,   etc.

One of the reasons why recruiter (at least reserve recruiters) use a hands off approach after a file is opened, is to allow CFRC and there respective dets to do their job.   I find that if I call my applicants on a weekly basis, they tend to get annoyed.   This might be a problem just in the Windsor/Chatham area.

By allowing CFRC to do what they have to do and not calling my apps to hassle them, I find that there is less confusion.   The only time I call apps is if I see that a file hasn't moved in a while or if CFRC has sent out a contact letter.

I do encourage my applicants however to come down on parade nights and see the Regiment at work.   This way they do get a understanding of what we do.