Hamas invaded Israel 2023

[QV]

Just fishing for outrage as usual.

 

[brihard]

Obviously militarily and Hamas within gaza. If Israel wanted to, gaza would be uninhabited on Oct 8th.

Thank you for clarifying.

 

[Jarnhamar]

No, but the forum shows him online and currently viewing this thread, so I’m curious to see if he replies to my questions on its original subject.

I'm waiting to see his response to Dimsum over his multiple questions about Hamas using human shields.

Abduly asking questions, being responded to in a civil manner, then completely ignoring the response seems to fit the bill of trolling.

 

[Remius]

I'm waiting to see his response to Dimsum over his multiple questions about Hamas using human shields.

That leads to uncomfortable truths.

Abduly asking questions, being responded to in a civil manner, then completely ignoring the response seems to fit the bill of trolling.

Correct. None of this in good faith.

 

[OldSolduer]

I'm waiting to see his response to Dimsum over his multiple questions about Hamas using human shields.

A very ME way of doing business. Did the Taliban ever do that?

 

[brihard]

That leads to uncomfortable truths.

Correct. None of this in good faith.

Yup. Not answering my questions on Hamas’ original attack either, despite acknowledging my back and forth with Quirky. He’s not here in good faith.

 

[dimsum]

I'm waiting to see his response to Dimsum over his multiple questions about Hamas using human shields.

Abduly asking questions, being responded to in a civil manner, then completely ignoring the response seems to fit the bill of trolling.

I’m not. I figured they weren’t going to answer.

 

[Eaglelord17]

Deadly West Bank settler attacks on Palestinians follow Israeli boy's killing

Palestinians and the UN demand that Israeli forces stop a rampage across the occupied West Bank.

www.bbc.com

So for those saying why isn’t Gaza like the West Bank, here is what being in the West Bank as a Palestinian gets you. At least 460 Palestinians dead since Oct 7th. Or 2/5 of the death toll of Oct 7th. In comparison there is 13 Israelis dead in the same area.

There is no justice for them, the police and military at best turns a blind eye to them being killed/attacked, and at worst actively aids in it.

If Israel ever wants peace, the West Bank would be a good area to start. Rein in the settlers, dismantle the illegal settlements, and start fairly enforcing the rule of law.

Until they start doing that they are showing the Palestinians that no matter what they do or how much they try to act in good faith it means nothing.

 

[Quirky]

Until they start doing that they are showing the Palestinians that no matter what they do or how much they try to act in good faith it means nothing.

Replace Palestinians with Israel. Same same.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Deadly West Bank settler attacks on Palestinians follow Israeli boy's killing

Palestinians and the UN demand that Israeli forces stop a rampage across the occupied West Bank.

www.bbc.com

So for those saying why isn’t Gaza like the West Bank, here is what being in the West Bank as a Palestinian gets you. At least 460 Palestinians dead since Oct 7th. Or 2/5 of the death toll of Oct 7th. In comparison there is 13 Israelis dead in the same area.

There is no justice for them, the police and military at best turns a blind eye to them being killed/attacked, and at worst actively aids in it.

If Israel ever wants peace, the West Bank would be a good area to start. Rein in the settlers, dismantle the illegal settlements, and start fairly enforcing the rule of law.

Until they start doing that they are showing the Palestinians that no matter what they do or how much they try to act in good faith it means nothing.

WB is a messier situation than Gaza. It's very clear the Palestinians have no intention of accepting any compromise Israel puts forward and will use any concession as a base to extract more concessions. The PA is trying to fight a demographic war in the WB and the only answer the Israelis have is the settlers who have a similar population growth rate to the Palestinians. The WB situation is unsustainable in the long run as there is a very limited supply of land and water. At some point Israel is going to have to evict a bunch of the Palestinians. That is not a unheard of solution in the region as many populations in the ME and Central Asia have been evicted and relocated elsewhere, including Jewish populations. The difference would be that Israel and it's supporters would allow the Palestinians to take their mobile assets with them. Throw in some extra money to compensate and you have about as nice of a possible solution as you can get.

 

[jackamela]

WB is a messier situation than Gaza. It's very clear the Palestinians have no intention of accepting any compromise Israel puts forward and will use any concession as a base to extract more concessions. The PA is trying to fight a demographic war in the WB and the only answer the Israelis have is the settlers who have a similar population growth rate to the Palestinians. The WB situation is unsustainable in the long run as there is a very limited supply of land and water. At some point Israel is going to have to evict a bunch of the Palestinians. That is not a unheard of solution in the region as many populations in the ME and Central Asia have been evicted and relocated elsewhere, including Jewish populations. The difference would be that Israel and it's supporters would allow the Palestinians to take their mobile assets with them. Throw in some extra money to compensate and you have about as nice of a possible solution as you can get.

The only solution I can see at this point is for the Palestinians to be resettled en masse, and with reasonable compensation in Jordan.

As per the original settlement.

Status quo has been tried, and doesn't work. The Palestinians have repeatedly broken it by attacking Israel and on Oct 7th broke it permanently.

A blended, shared State is also obviously unworkable.

I doubt this will be an overly popular opinion - but if someone has a better one I'm all ears.

For my money, the WB & Gaza need to be returned to Israel.

 

[Brad Sallows]

For my money, the WB & Gaza need to be returned to Israel.

WB and Gaza were never intended to be part of Israel, so they can't really be "returned".

An underlying problem was the unrealistic partition plan which tried to create two indefensible states.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

WB and Gaza were never intended to be part of Israel, so they can't really be "returned".

An underlying problem was the unrealistic partition plan which tried to create two indefensible states.

WB makes sense to be part of Israel and makes the country more defensible. That is with the majority of the palestinian population removed. Gaza has little strategic value to Israel. Without it's current population, it would be useful, but not critical to Israel like the WB or Golan is.

 

[OldSolduer]

WB is a messier situation than Gaza. It's very clear the Palestinians have no intention of accepting any compromise Israel puts forward and will use any concession as a base to extract more concessions. The PA is trying to fight a demographic war in the WB and the only answer the Israelis have is the settlers who have a similar population growth rate to the Palestinians. The WB situation is unsustainable in the long run as there is a very limited supply of land and water. At some point Israel is going to have to evict a bunch of the Palestinians. That is not an unheard of solution in the region as many populations in the ME and Central Asia have been evicted and relocated elsewhere, including Jewish populations. The difference would be that Israel and it's supporters would allow the Palestinians to take their mobile assets with them. Throw in some extra money to compensate and you have about as nice of a possible solution as you can get.

You could say similar things about certain demographics here. They negotiate until they don’t like the way negotiations are going….

 

[TacticalTea]

The only solution I can see at this point is for the Palestinians to be resettled en masse, and with reasonable compensation in Jordan.

Jordan is the Islamic country that's doing the best in the south-eastern Med region.

Why so eagerly send it to slaughter?

It already has the 2nd highest amount of refugees per capita, after Lebanon. Adding 5 million Palestinians would easily kick that up to #1, increasing the country's population by 40% with a people that is 70% in support of terrorism (Hamas).

Seems like a great plan to ruin yet another country and generate another ISIS 5-10 years down the road.

 

[jackamela]

Jordan is the Islamic country that's doing the best in the south-eastern Med region.

Why so eagerly send it to slaughter?

It already has the 2nd highest amount of refugees per capita, after Lebanon. Adding 5 million Palestinians would easily kick that up to #1, increasing the country's population by 40% with a people that is 70% in support of terrorism (Hamas).

Seems like a great plan to ruin yet another country and generate another ISIS 5-10 years down the road.

Ok, fair point on Jordan - but how would you recommend the Palestinian issue be resolved?

 

[QV]

Palestinians need to take the L and peacefully integrate into existing societies. If they want to keep raging then life will continue to suck.

 

[Quirky]

Palestinians need to take the L and peacefully integrate into existing societies.

Who's going to take them?

 

[QV]

Nobody right now, I assume because no country wants to import an insurgency.

They basically have to surrender and want to live peacefully and integrate - and demonstrate this over time. Then maybe they can migrate where they want to go and be welcomed and live the good life.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Ok, fair point on Jordan - but how would you recommend the Palestinian issue be resolved?

At which point, everyone excuses himself to go to the bathroom.