Hero inflation

[daftandbarmy]

Hero inflation
CHRIS HAYES, the host of MSNBC's "Up With Chris Hayes", got himself in hot water for saying something completely reasonable, illustrating that the silencing cudgel of "political correctness" is a tool of the right, too. Here's what Mr Hayes said:

I feel…uncomfortable, about the word because it seems to me that it is so rhetorically proximate to justifications for more war. Um, and, I don’t want to obviously desecrate or disrespect the memory of anyone that’s fallen, and obviously there are individual circumstances in which there is genuine, tremendous heroism, you know, hail of gunfire, rescuing fellow soldiers, and things like that. But it seems to me that we marshal this word in a way that is problematic. But maybe I’m wrong about that.

He's not wrong about that. Calling "hero" everyone killed in war, no matter the circumstances of their death, not only helps sustain the ethos of martial glory that keeps young men and women signing up to kill and die for the state, no matter the justice of the cause, but also saps the word of meaning, dishonouring the men and women of exceptional courage and valour actually worthy of the title. The cheapening of "hero" is a symptom of a culture desperate to evade serious moral self-reflection by covering itself in indiscriminate glory for undertaking wars of dubious value. A more confident culture would not react with such hostility to Mr Hayes' admirable, though cautiously hedged, expression of discomfort with our truly discomfiting habit of numbing ourselves to the reality of often senseless sacrifice with posturing piety and too-easy posthumous praise.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2012/05/political-correctness?scode=3d26b0b17065c2cf29c06c010184c684

 

[Sythen]

So much I want to say about this article, but it baffles me that anyone can be this ignorant? Its nothing to do with political correctness. Everyone who serves their country, regardless of whether in war time or peace, that is willing to travel thousands of miles at a moment's notice and make the ultimate sacrifice is a hero. Full stop. Simply because some left wing ideologues don't understand the world outside doesn't make the Iraq war a war of "dubious value".

And for some reason, the author of this particular piece seems to think that if we stopped the "ethos of martial glory that keeps young men and women signing up to kill and die for the state" that there would be peace in the world. Wonder what the world would look like today if men and women of the English speaking world decided fighting wasn't for them 100 years ago? If I was at home, I'd find a video in which Christopher Hitchens outlines the track record of the Anti-War crowd and says if he was a member, he would be a lot more careful considering how often they get it wrong.

Its sad that my first knee jerk thought was this tripe should never be printed, but I constantly needed to remind myself while reading it that free speech only matters if it applies to those you disagree with most. Its a shame some people think this way though.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

So much I want to say about this article, but it baffles me that anyone can be this ignorant? Its nothing to do with political correctness. Everyone who serves their country, regardless of whether in war time or peace, that is willing to travel thousands of miles at a moment's notice and make the ultimate sacrifice is a hero. Full stop. Simply because some left wing ideologues don't understand the world outside doesn't make the Iraq war a war of "dubious value".

And for some reason, the author of this particular piece seems to think that if we stopped the "ethos of martial glory that keeps young men and women signing up to kill and die for the state" that there would be peace in the world. Wonder what the world would look like today if men and women of the English speaking world decided fighting wasn't for them 100 years ago? If I was at home, I'd find a video in which Christopher Hitchens outlines the track record of the Anti-War crowd and says if he was a member, he would be a lot more careful considering how often they get it wrong.

Its sad that my first knee jerk thought was this tripe should never be printed, but I constantly needed to remind myself while reading it that free speech only matters if it applies to those you disagree with most. Its a shame some people think this way though.

Most, if not all, of Europe would be speaking German? OK, dates are a tad off but the point is made.

 

[Sythen]

Most, if not all, of Europe would be speaking German? OK, dates are a tad off but the point is made.

More than that though.. What would China, or Australia or Korea or, or... I mean seriously, the peace and prosperity that the Western world has enjoyed since the end of WW2 (aside from the occassional dust up, but nothing really major like full mobilisation) are 100% because the English speaking world would not sit back and let others be enslaved. To paraphrase the old saying, evil easily triumphs, because those with power don't prevent it. The English speaking world has been the ones with that power, and to not use it in a just way I think would be a greater crime than any war that has happened that we were involved in.

 

[Eaglelord17]

I wonder what his definition of a hero would be if it is not someone who has fought and died well serving there country?

 

[PPCLI Guy]

Whoa.  Are we sying anyone that is in the military is a hero, just because they serve?

 

[Jarnhamar]

I find myself agreeing with the article.

I think a special honour and respect should be afforded to anyone who puts the uniform on travels overseas and falls in the line of duty.
I don't think it necessarily makes them a hero any more than I think it makes a police officer a hero who is killed on duty by a drunk driver.

There's no dishonour in not labeling someone a hero who has given their life in service to their country (or protecting it's citizens and interests).

Labeling someone a hero should be reserved for the individuals who have truly went above and beyond in their duties- that doesn't take away from the rest who are as equally as brave and devoted. It comes down to circumstance.

*posted with the highest respect

 

[Pusser]

Death and heroism do not necessarily go hand in hand.  Many a coward has died in action and many a hero has lived to tell the tale.  Merely putting on a uniform and deploying overseas doesn't make anyone a hero either.  This can be described as dedicated, committed, honourable or any of many other adjectives and it's certainly worthy of respect, but not necessarily heroic.  Heroism involves going above and beyond what is expected.  Taking up arms and going in harm's way is expected of all members of the CF - it's part of our job.  Heroes do more than their job.

If you go on the Governor General's website and read some of the citations of those who've been decorated for valour, you can see some examples of heroism, but if you ask the individuals themselves, most would not say that they are heroes.  In fact, most would say they were just doing their jobs.

We do inflate the word "hero" too much.

 

[Sythen]

Taking up arms and going in harm's way is expected of all members of the CF - it's part of our job.

And people are forced into the CF, right? No? It takes a special kind of person to serve, and that person deserves all the accolades and praise we can heap on them. When people volunteer to go in harm's way, regardless of whether they end up there or not, they are heroes and should be seen as such. The same goes for a Police Officer or Fire Fighter.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Heroes, like beauty, are in the eye of the beholder.

People have many 'heroes' in their life. Parents, Grandparents, other kin, teachers and others that have made a significant impact on their lives.

I won't define how others look at things, those same others should have the respect to not tell myself, or anyone else, what defines an individual for them.

I'll decide what constitutes a hero to me. That is a personal choice and nobody else's business.

I don't need anyone's input to do that. Nor should they be offering or trying to convince otherwise.



edit-spelling

 

[daftandbarmy]

And people are forced into the CF, right? No? It takes a special kind of person to serve, and that person deserves all the accolades and praise we can heap on them. When people volunteer to go in harm's way, regardless of whether they end up there or not, they are heroes and should be seen as such. The same goes for a Police Officer or Fire Fighter.

Well, I know at least three 'formal' heroes... with medals and things... who joined the army because a) they were starving and needed work b) had a brush with the law and were advised to seek a career in the military or take a berth at the local prison and c) knocked a girl up and were on the run from an angry family.

Of course these guys weren't in the CF, which only hires truly heroic and altruistic folks, right?

;D

 

[Pusser]

Heroes, like beauty, are in the eye of the beholder.

People have many 'heroes' in their life. Parents, Grandparents, other kin, teachers and others that have made a significant impact on their lives.

I won't define how others look at things, those same others should have the respect to not tell myself, or anyone else, what defines an individual for them.

I'll decide what constitutes a hero to me. That is a personal choice and nobody else's business.

I don't need anyone's input to do that. Nor should they be offering or trying to convince otherwise.



edit-spelling

Well said.

 

[cupper]

Heroes, like beauty, are in the eye of the beholder.

People have many 'heroes' in their life. Parents, Grandparents, other kin, teachers and others that have made a significant impact on their lives.

I won't define how others look at things, those same others should have the respect to not tell myself, or anyone else, what defines an individual for them.

I'll decide what constitutes a hero to me. That is a personal choice and nobody else's business.

I don't need anyone's input to do that. Nor should they be offering or trying to convince otherwise.



edit-spelling

:goodpost:

 

[Snaketnk]

I would be a lot more inclined to feel that all members who deployed were "heroes" if we weren't paid so much. We're fairly compensated for a dangerous job, and I think people would be trying a lot less hard to get tours if there wasn't that pay incentive and a heavily discounted vacation as part of your 6 months away from home. I know a lot of guys who'd never go back to Afghanistan if they didn't have serious credit card debt or a mortgage they want to pay off. Definitely not saying that no-one goes for altruistic reasons, but let's not kid ourselves and pretend that tours would be in such high demand if we weren't so well compensated.

 

[cupper]

And people are forced into the CF, right? No? It takes a special kind of person to serve, and that person deserves all the accolades and praise we can heap on them. When people volunteer to go in harm's way, regardless of whether they end up there or not, they are heroes and should be seen as such. The same goes for a Police Officer or Fire Fighter.

Special type of person to serve? Really? And we have such prime examples or really special people posting in the recruiting section.

There are also plenty of examples of people who wore a uniform that were less than stellar in their actions. They obviously did not deserve the hero label simply because the put on a uniform.

And why should we heap praise on someone who was simply doing the job that they were trained to do? Sure, if they did something well above and beyond what was expected of them, particularly when they had the safer, less "heroic" option available.

 

[Ex-SHAD]

If you have the fortitude and courage to enlist, then you are a hero. A full bird colonel once told me that, those who show the desire to serve, regardless of their motivation are the true heroes.

 

[daftandbarmy]

If you have the fortitude and courage to enlist, then you are a hero. A full bird colonel once told me that, those who show the desire to serve, regardless of their motivation are the true heroes.

Of course... only Heroes need apply when facing the usurpatious Continental Congress:

http://www.flickriver.com/photos/wiless/3829423144/

It's funny how the more they need people to join, the more heroic potential recruits actually are already... since the 18th Century, it appears  :

 

[Jarnhamar]

If you have the fortitude and courage to enlist, then you are a hero. A full bird colonel once told me that, those who show the desire to serve, regardless of their motivation are the true heroes.

I'm two minds. 
On one hand I think anyone who is willing to put the uniform on is above average.

On the other hand we have recruits who go into recruit school knowing how to milk the system, knowing exactly how many days they can miss of training and still pass. Know what phantom injuries to complain about to get them out of PT but not sent home.
Which they carry into the CF once "trained".

I want to believe the former..

 

[Pieman]

If you have the fortitude and courage to enlist, then you are a hero. A full bird colonel once told me that, those who show the desire to serve, regardless of their motivation are the true heroes.

Yes! I always wanted to wear a cape, and now I can! Red or blue? Hmmm....

The English language changes constantly and the word 'Hero' has become one of the most diluted words recently. It used to carry a lot of weight. I suggest this has been caused by the infiltration of super hero movies over the past decade. Seriously, can I go to a movie without a super hero reference please?

Similar to what has happened to the word 'Epic'. Epic used to be something truly Epic..now a 20% off a slurpee is an 'Epic' sale. 

Likely, if the word 'Hero' is continues this path my future kids are going to be 'Heros' for showing up for school on time.

This line of reasoning is not meant to take away from the sacrifice that soldiers have made, with their lives or heroic acts. I just don't think  the word 'Hero' does it justice anymore.

 

[Sythen]

Special type of person to serve? Really? And we have such prime examples or really special people posting in the recruiting section.

There are also plenty of examples of people who wore a uniform that were less than stellar in their actions. They obviously did not deserve the hero label simply because the put on a uniform.

And why should we heap praise on someone who was simply doing the job that they were trained to do? Sure, if they did something well above and beyond what was expected of them, particularly when they had the safer, less "heroic" option available.

I was gonna refrain from posting, as recceguy's point was not lost on me. Until I read this garbage and it actually pissed me off.

On my tour, we were on a patrol.. A reasonably routine one for a quick resup. Where my COP was located, you couldn't drive you had to walk, so we'd take a gator in to the nearest COP and load it up with water, ammo and whatever we could steal from the Pl there. About 200m to our destination, my Sgt got a very bad feeling and had our engineer, a young Sapper go ahead and VPS (Vital Point Search for you WOG's) it. The Taliban had hidden an IED on the opposite side of the wall, so it couldn't be seen. The young Sapper died that day and since I was one of the first TCCC on scene, guess who got to watch it? Now this Hero was doing his job. A VPS is pretty standard faire for an Engineer overseas. Happens pretty much every patrol, several times. He died so that no one else on my patrol would. The bastard with the trigger for the IED was obviously watching, and later we found him, his parts cache and his observation point but that's another story. One of my best friends was driving the gator that day and it doesn't take a lot of imagination to know he was probably going to target it.

This was my first patrol with this young Hero and I had never met him before that patrol started. He died doing only his job, and what he was paid to do. He didn't go above and beyond anything expected of any Engineer there on a daily basis. For all I know he was a terrible person before he joined and was a terrible soldier. I don't believe that he was for an instant, but whatever he did or was before that patrol doesn't mean anything. He died a hero. After looking at your profile cupper, I shouldn't be surprised you're a WOG. If all I did with everyone I knew on tour was sit in KAF or MSG or whatever FOB you were in and drink Tim Hortons, I might have trouble seeing it as well. Less heroic options open to them? Go fuck yourself. Every man and woman in uniform who deployed to that shit hole is a hero.

And in response to whoever said people wouldn't redeploy without the monetary incentives, then maybe you should go to a recruitment center and ask all of those who come in saying they want to go to Afghanistan if they know about deployment pay. Bet the majority say they don't know about it. I sure as hell didn't, and if not for other issues, I would definitely deploy again and again regardless of HLTA and Tour Pay.