Kemosabe?

[camochick]

Supreme Court rejects hearing 'Kemosabe' appeal
Last Updated Thu, 28 Apr 2005 18:59:48 EDT
CBC News
OTTAWA - Canada's highest court has refused to hear arguments on whether the word "Kemosabe" â “ a term used in The Lone Ranger TV series â “ is a racial slur.

Nova Scotia's Human Rights Commission had turned to the Supreme Court of Canada to clarify the use of the word in the workplace after a woman filed a complaint

Dorothy Kateri Moore complained to the commission in 1999, saying her boss and a co-worker at Play it Again Sports in Sydney discriminated against her by calling her Kemosabe.

The term was the name Tonto gave the Lone Ranger on the 1950s TV show.

The commission appointed a board of inquiry to look into the complaint. In February 2004, the board ruled that Moore hadn't clearly shown she was offended by the remark so discrimination didn't take place.

The commission argued that the board of inquiry erred in placing an undue burden on Moore to prove she found the term offensive, and appealed the ruling to the Nova Scotia Court of Appeal.

The three-member appeal court panel upheld the board's decision, writing that Moore had not shown the word was "notoriously offensive."

But the commission appealed that decision to the Supreme Court of Canada, hoping it would clarify what the term "notoriously offensive" meant.

"We're disappointed," Mayann Francis, chair of the Nova Scotia Human Rights Commission, said in a release. "We thought this case might help establish clearer guidelines for dealing with discrimination and the cultural differences one finds in a diverse workplace."

"This is about much more than the use of one word. It's about establishing standards that are clear to employers and to employees, standards that protect and encourage diversity," Francis said.

Ann Smith, a lawyer for the human rights commission, said that "people need to understand what that phrase means in order to determine what is or is not considered acceptable behaviour in the workplace."

"What I consider 'notoriously offensive' you may not. We wanted some legal standard that would help people," she said.

Since the highest court in Canada will not hear the appeal, she added, the commission will look for other ways to clarify the parameters



Ok is this political correctness gone wild or is this something that others agree with. I personally think this woman is wasting taxpayers money. They just named the local baseball team the Edmonton Cracker cats. Should I sue because cracker is slang for a caucasian. Where does is line drawn anymore between true discrimination and people taking things too far?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

What if you had a Caucasian magazine called Snowball, along the lines of Jet magazine? Or the National Association for the Advancement of White People (NAAWP) as opposed to the NAACP. Or the United Caucasian College Fund as opposed to the United Negro College Fund. Where would that go in court? The Judges would kill themselves rather than try rule on those. Do we all resort to referring to each other strictly by numbers?

We're different, in some ways, but it doesn't change who we are. Certain groups use the "N" word to refer to their own, but scream bloody murder when it's used by anyone else outside their circle. However these are the same people that berate the system for not advancing their cause and "Keeping them down".

The lawsuit happy system we've perpetuated is our own fault, the guy that got $340,000 for a fly in his water bottle is a perfect example. Feel offended (or not)? Sue the bastard. Our courts are to chinckenshit to lead by example and tell someone "You're an asshole! Get a life, and earn a living like everyone else. We owe you nothing, and your court costs for this stupid escapade are $125,000.00. You've got 10 days to pay. No appeal, and the default is thirty years in jail. Rusty, lead him out."

The old saying, "You can't please everyone" comes to mind. It also reminds me of, to paraphrase, "It don't matter the colour on the outside, we're all pink inside."

 

[Infanteer]

+1 to that, Recceguy.

All this stupid lady had to say is "I don't really like that" and I'm sure they would have apologized and that would have been the end of it.  Instead, she makes a legal issue out of it; probably in the effort to find some money.  Now she lost, clogged up the legal system, and wasted taxpayer dollars so we all wear it.

This is classic, Canadian, cult of victimhood at work - if there was a smiley with a middle finger, I'd put it up right now....

 

[mover1]

I find this fourm offensive.  I wish there was a "common sense" law out there where thigs like this can just be dismissed under it.

Remember that Kemosabe means "friend"

 

[jmacleod]

The "kemosabe saga" started after a complaint was made to the NS Human Rights Commission that
the term was used by a Cape Breton business to connect with one of their employees. The complaint
should never have gone forward if a modest amount of research was undertaken, but the complaint
was exagerrated by an opinion column in the Halifax Daily News, where the author, Professor Stephen
Kimber, reported that the term originated in the TV Series "The Lone Ranger" circa late 60's. But
in fact the story of the "Lone Ranger" commenced as a radio drama in 1939-1940 emenating from
Chicago, starring Clayton Moore, (picked for his deep baritone voice) - his Indian companion, Tonto
used the term "kemosabe" which in fact was created by scriptwriters of the period - had no connection
with the languages of the Western Plains Tribes of the period in which the adventures were set. An
authority on the languages of the famous fighting tribes, Comanches, Apaches etc. is author Larry
McMurtry, and Alan LeMay (author, "The Searchers"). The entire incident of the "kemosabe saga"
was generated by the profound ignorance of the complainant, her lawyer, and a lazy journalism, and
pointed an unwanted finger at racism in Nova Scotia - totally unwarranted and without merit. MacLeod

 

[RyanNS]

I used to work at this store, but started after this incident had occurred. The store owner/manager became a very good friend of mine after I started working there and  I can tell you that in no way at all is the man racist. The word "kemosabe" was thrown around like slang amongst everyone and in no way at all did it have any negative connotations.

 

[bossi]

I am so deeply offended by this woman's frivolous complaint and resulting lawsuit, I think I'm gonna ... snivel ... whimper ... sob ... finish this post, log off and return to the real world.  Long live Far Side!  ;D

...Remember that Kemosabe means "friend"

Fran Striker, who wrote the scripts,   was also the person who answered the fan letters to the Lone Ranger. He always started his replies with... "Ta-i ke-mo sah-bee" ("Greetings trusty scout").

There have been numerous other suggestions regarding the meaning of this term:

Dr. Goddard, of the Smithsonian Institution, was reported as believing that Kemo Sabe was from the Tewa dialect. He supported his contention by calling on the "Ethnogeography of the Tewa Indians" which appeared in the 29th Annual Report of the Bureau of American Ethnology (1916). It seems that in Tewa, "Apache" equates to Sabe and "friend" to Kema.  

A scholar from the University of California at Berkley thought that Kemo Sabe came from the Yavapai, a dialect spoken in Arizona and meant   "one who is white,"   since the Ranger always wore a white shirt and trousers in the earliest publicity photos.   The Yavapai term is "kinmasaba" or "kinmasabeh"  

Jim Jewell, who directed "The Lone Ranger" until 1938 said he'd lifted the term from the name of a boys' camp at Mullet Lake just south of Mackinac, Michigan called Kamp Kee-Mo Sah-Bee. The camp had been established in 1911 by Jewell's father-in-law, Charles Yeager, and operated until about 1940. Translation of kee-mo sah-bee, according to Jewell was   "trusty scout."

According to Rob Malouf, a grad student in linguistics at Stanford, there's another possibility: "According to John Nichols' Concise Dictionary of Minnesota Ojibwe, the Ojibwe word `giimoozaabi' means `to peek' (it could also mean `he peeks' or `he who peeks'). Rob continued: "There are several words with the same prefix ["giimooj," secretly] meaning things like `to sneak up on someone'.... It is quite plausible that `giimoozaabi' means something like `scout'.... `Giimoozaabi' is pronounced pretty much the same as `kemosabe' and would have been spelled `Kee Moh Sah Bee' at the turn of the century."  

In his book of humour and observation, noted columnist James Smart observes that the New York Public Library defines "Kemo Sabe" as Soggy Shrub. His entertaining collection is appropriately titled "Soggy Shrub Rides Again and other improbabilities."  

An interesting side light comes from the son of Fran Striker, "It is usually assumed that Kemo Sabe is how the Ranger refers to Tonto. However, in many of the early radio broadcasts, the Ranger calls Tonto "Kemo Sabe" AND Tonto also calls the Ranger "Kemo Sabe".  

Another suggestion has been that Tonto, (whose name means "stupid" according to some interpretations) responded by calling the Lone Ranger "qui no sabe"   which roughly translates from Spanish as "he who knows nothing" or "clueless.

One of Gary Larson's Far Side cartoons shows the Lone Ranger looking in an Indian dictionary and discovering that kemosabe is "an Apache expression for a horse's rear end."

http://www.write101.com/kemosabe.htm

 

[jmacleod]

Fran Striker was a remarkable writer - I used to listen to the Lone Ranger on CHNS Radio in Halifax
Nova Scotia 1939-40 which was on about 8m - the theme music was the "William Tell Overture"
and the Lone Ranger's "hi-ho Silver, away". CHNS sponsored, as many private radio stations did
in Canada and the US, the Lone Ranger Clubs, which focused for one thing, on traffic crossing
safety. There is a great deal of information about author Striker, from Buffalo NY on the Lone
Ranger site, plus an article from the Saturday Evening Post about how the famous Lone Ranger
series was created, plus more information about "kemosabe", and how author Striker "found"
the expression. All of this was available to the Halifax Daily News, prior to their ill conceived crusade
for selected Human Rights in Nova Scotia. Nova Scotia was unquestionably racist in its past, saw it
first hand on a daily basis, but it is not the same place today as it was sixty plus years ago.MacLeod

 

[paracowboy]

speaking as a man with Plains Indian blood in his clogged-up veins (damn the White Man and his tasty, tasty doughnuts!), and as a victim of racism in the past, I'd like to say that this woman needs, very badly, to be slapped in the face with a halibut! Repeatedly.

 

[Island Ryhno]

I believe that the halibut may sue Paracowboy. Seriously, some people will do anything for money. It's a good thing these people don't hang around my hockey locker room or at the gym or playing softball.  8)

 

[winchable]

I'd like to say that this woman needs, very badly, to be slapped in the face with a halibut

"You must cut down the tallest tree in the forest....with....A HERRING"

Or

"I'd like a fish license please, for Eric, my pet 'alibut."


Ah the many everyday monty python references I think of.

Like anything else in life certain people fail to judge individual cases with their own common sense and fail to solve things at the lowest level, I've seen the clog that frivilous and easily fixable cases can put on a legal system (anyone following the trial in Halifax Re:The couple involved in the standoff will know what I mean)

My personal theory is that we've got far too many lawyers and people are conditioned through a mixture of TV ads, television, movies and other media outlets to believe that they should get a lawyer to solve something that might be fixed with an apology and a "I think you're being a dink when you call me kemosabe" "cool, I'll stop."

 

[old medic]

Thank God nobody said "Whatchatalkin'bout Willis" infront of her.

 

[mover1]

Well I don't like being reffered to as a "CF Member"

I am a male in the CF and a Member

That makes me a male member and I find that offensive......  :crybaby:

 

[pronto]

Like anything else in life certain people fail to judge individual cases with their own common sense and fail to solve things at the lowest level, I've seen the clog that frivilous and easily fixable cases can put on a legal system (anyone following the trial in Halifax Re:The couple involved in the standoff will know what I mean)

Hmmm - what is the Halifax couple story? do tell... Sounds "woody"

 

[aesop081]

I find it offensive that you are offended.......

 

[mover1]

Well just looking around the shop here and across the tarmac and I see the 500 series and aircrew guys have some bigger members than we have here. Not that I was checking them out or anything I just wanted to know that other competion was out there.
Now I feel inadequate with some of my members and that makes me sad

 

[JasonH]

Gold diggers, nothing but gold diggers.  People need to grow up.  Bunch of pussy hurt people running around being called something as stupid as Kemosabe and wanting to sue?  For fuck sakes I've herd it all.

Sorry, had surgery yesterday and havn't slept so I'm a little cranky  :rage:

 

[mover1]

Jason H is a full member and I am a new member.....now I am feeling really really self conscious ....

 

[Blue Max]

You must call me BAWANA, or I will be offended.

Translation "great white hunter", NOT.  ;D

 

[beach_bum]

From this day forth I wish to be called "Princess-know-it-all-Queen-of-everything-Boss-of-the-world", if not.....I will be offended!!!!! 

Mover1 - tell me more about the members accross the tarmac.  ;D  LOL