Quote of the Day from the New Defence Procurment Strategy

[trustnoone73]

"We have had procurement successes" - Robert Nicholson,  Minister of National Defence


I had a Monty Python flashback with that one:

Maybe procurment of this was a success.  These vehicles just won't die:

But they won't start in colder than -10 either, I probably just need a longer view here.

Currently the high water mark for procurment, the 2014 Pattern Mukluk:

Oh wait...2015 you say.  Thankfully, we have mild winters planned for the next 3 to 10 years during roll-out"

The real aim of course is to "...recognize the need to improve. "  Not going for TC here, just "Most Improved." 

Shouldn't be too hard.  Good luck.

 

[Tibbson]

The real aim of course is to "...recognize the need to improve. "  Not going for TC here, just "Most Improved. 

Shouldn't be too hard.  Good luck.

When one strives for mediocrity they leave plenty of room for improvement.  Lets not peak too soon and set the bar so high we can't maintain it in the future.  :   

 

[pbi]

"...recognize the need to improve.

Yes, indeed. A recurring theme throughout history.

Overheard at Lakehurst, NJ (above the crashing sounds): "We recognize the need to improve airship design"

Caught in passing in the Fuehrerbunker in 1945: "Mein Fuehrer we recognize the need to improve our force management models in the near to mid-term horizons"

Well, I'm glad they recognize it. The first step toward redemption is the admission of sin.

But, the great thing is that procurement is now out of the evil slimy hands of the wicked and untrustworthy military, and firmly in the hands of PWGSC and Industry Canada.

But...wait...wasn't it there before?

 

[dapaterson]

No word on any of the current players in procurement giving up people or reforming their internal systems.

So, it appears that the solution to an overly bureaucratic system is to impose more bureaucracy.

I think we can describe this as "Transformation inaction."

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

Dixit Jim Hacker to the B.B.C.: Well, its logical really, You have to take on more staff , in order to reduce staff.

 

[daftandbarmy]

No word on any of the current players in procurement giving up people or reforming their internal systems.

So, it appears that the solution to an overly bureaucratic system is to impose more bureaucracy.

I think we can describe this as "Transformation inaction."

A piece of spaghetti or a military unit can only be led from the front end.

George S. Patton

Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/g/george_s_patton_2.html#yYiQYSrGh4LoLuF6.99

 

[ArmyRick]

The LSVW, a true Canadian success story! (Ducking from rotten fruit being thrown at my head).

Now how about those EH101s we got back '93? Oh wait, right, "no 'elicopters" as promised by a former PM.

At some point, I think we simply stop caring about we are given, issued or procured for us. Maybe someday we will get everything on our Christmas wish list and put the warfighters as a priority.

 

[George Wallace]

At some point, I think we simply stop caring about we are given, issued or procured for us. Maybe someday we will get everything on our Christmas wish list and put the warfighters as a priority.

Or we become one of those 'Militias" that one finds in the back woods of some US States.

 

[OldSolduer]

The LSVW, a true Canadian success story! (Ducking from rotten fruit being thrown at my head).

Now how about those EH101s we got back '93? Oh wait, right, "no 'elicopters" as promised by a former PM.

Loud Squeaky Vehicle Wheeled - yes a true success.  :facepalm:

And they were "Cadillac elicopters"

Backwood Militia - I will start the "Elm Creek Rangers"

 

[The Bread Guy]

Now how about those EH101s we got back '93? Oh wait, right, "no 'elicopters" as promised by a former PM.

And the file hasn't moved appreciably quicker under current management, either .... 

At some point, I think we simply stop caring about we are given, issued or procured for us. Maybe someday we will get everything on our Christmas wish list and put the warfighters as a priority.

Or we become one of those 'Militias" that one finds in the back woods of some US States.

:nod:

 

[Danjanou]

Or we become one of those 'Militias" that one finds in the back woods of some US States.

Well most of them are better armed and clothed than some of our units, and have less paperwork to deal with.  8)

 

[pbi]

...At some point, I think we simply stop caring about we are given, issued or procured for us. Maybe someday we will get everything on our Christmas wish list and put the warfighters as a priority.

Actually, if we're honest, the last ten years were pretty amazing. Before 9/11 I served 20+ years under a string of governments, of both colours, and we never did as well as we did when the Afghan war was on.

We struggled in the pre-Afghan years, and you're going to struggle now.  It's what happens in democracies when the fighting stops. Just remember, no matter what happens, to keep the basics alive and don't let the flame go out. A good model is the German Reichsheer from about 1920 to 1933: they learned to do well with very little. You can too.

I know that sounds like a smug Old Retired Guy talking, but what realistic choice is there?

The world will  come calling again. It always does, when we least expect it to. And when it does, the Canadian government of the day will do what it always does: open the money tap.

 

[armyvern]

...
It's what happens in democracies when the fighting stops. Just remember, no matter what happens, to keep the basics alive and don't let the flame go out. ....

Well, I don't know about you, but as a citizen of an Arctic nation with a military whose primary role is to defend Canada's sovereignty, I consider Arctic mukluks (ie:  winter boots!!!) pretty darn basic.  Everyone should have a set and we should have spares to back up loss, damage and disposal of such basic necessities.  If we can't get even that basic necessity correct ... ooopps; Jesus wept.

 

[pbi]

Well, I don't know about you, but as a citizen of an Arctic nation with a military whose primary role is to defend Canada's sovereignty, I consider Arctic mukluks (ie:  winter boots!!!) pretty darn basic.  Everyone should have a set and we should have spares to back up loss, damage and disposal of such basic necessities.  If we can't get even that basic necessity correct ... ooopps; Jesus wept.

You're right.

I'm not saying there isn't going to be stupidity and irrational penny-pinching: there will be. What I am saying is that despite all the idiotic BS that is happening now (and is coming, I'm quite sure...), somebody has to keep the lights on for next time.

Because, if we know just one thing, there will be a "next time". And we won't see it coming any better than we ever have.

 

[Journeyman]

And we won't see it coming any better than we ever have.

Given the Int empire's growth, I'm sure we'll have plenty of accurate, timely forewarning.  :nod:

/sarcasm

 

[pbi]

Given the Int empire's growth, I'm sure we'll have plenty of accurate, timely forewarning.  :nod:

/sarcasm

As ever....

 

[ArmyRick]

Thats the scary part when i think on recent history. The next time is??? God only knows.

In 1999 or 2000, if someone said the CF would be heavily involved for more than a decade in Afghanistan, I would thought "yeah right". Ultimately, one terrorist attack, changed everything.

Middle east? South America? Asia? Europe? Our own land? next year or ten years from now? Only time will tell and PBI is right, we must carry the torch as best we can (even if its with the torch made from the lowest bidder)

 

[pbi]

Thats the scary part when i think on recent history. The next time is??? God only knows.

In 1999 or 2000, if someone said the CF would be heavily involved for more than a decade in Afghanistan, I would thought "yeah right". Ultimately, one terrorist attack, changed everything.

Middle east? South America? Asia? Europe? Our own land? next year or ten years from now? Only time will tell and PBI is right, we must carry the torch as best we can (even if its with the torch made from the lowest bidder)

Or a bombing campaign in Europe (Kosovo)? Or another bombing campaign in North Africa? The one thing that always makes me laugh is when I hear people pontificate about what the future security environment will look like. Nobody ever gets it right.

 

[brihard]

Any reference in the new strategy to the 'self divestment' of older vehicle stocks? That one had me in stitches when I saw it...

 

[Navy_Pete]

Actually, if we're honest, the last ten years were pretty amazing for the army . Before 9/11 I served 20+ years under a string of governments, of both colours, and we never did as well as we did when the Afghan war was on.

We struggled in the pre-Afghan years, and you're going to struggle now.  It's what happens in democracies when the fighting stops. Just remember, no matter what happens, to keep the basics alive and don't let the flame go out. A good model is the German Reichsheer from about 1920 to 1933: they learned to do well with very little. You can too.

I know that sounds like a smug Old Retired Guy talking, but what realistic choice is there?

The world will  come calling again. It always does, when we least expect it to. And when it does, the Canadian government of the day will do what it always does: open the money tap.

Amended slightly...

Don't get me wrong, happy the folks in relish got what they needed when things hit the fan, and sure it saved a bunch of lives, so it was money well spent.

But did come at the expense of other things, and the navy and airforce could really use some new (read supportable) equipment.  FELEX is pretty big deal, but not having dependable tankers makes us severely dependent upon allies, who are also shrinking their navies.  FELEX only touched the combat suite though, so aside from some minor upgrades to support the whiz bangs, and a new control system, the propulsion plant and power generation is largely untouched. Given that the hulls are not as overengineered as the older ships, not too confident there won't be significant metal fatigue related cracking issues on the hulls over the next decade.

Unfortunately it just happens to coincide with some political BS so they are doing everything they can to delay any and all actual spending on new ships, but they don't want to hear that the 40+ year old ships are just done.  Despite the most optimistic predictions, they are doing a pretty good job of 'self-divesting' ahead of schedule.