Where are the new jump bags?

[Armymedic]

Now that we have the role 1 vs role 3 medics pissing match done:

How about we go onto the reason why Medical services does not expidite a proper medical bag for dismounted or veh mounted intimate support medics?

The only "ïssued"' bag is still the antiquated airborne medical pouch which is still without proper adjustable straps...definately not easy to get on over ballistic and tac vests.

The ones most medics use are purchased off the shelf and for in country use only.

That should be a bigger issue.

 

[xo31@711ret]

Crissakes, I thought we finally got new bags. On my 6A's at the school (2000) they had numerous med bags and asked various courses throughout the school at the time what the opinions were. We were then suppose to get 'em in a couple of years  :. Never seen them when I left last june, but then again I was a recruiting centre doing medicals last 4 years; don't remember seeing 'em around gagetown either....

 

[Gunner98]

St. Mike's

I think the challenge will continue be to select just one for all tasks.  1 Cdn Fd Hosp is in the process of purchasing one for each Med Tech/PA in the unit with contents to be tailored to task.

 

[Armymedic]

And your unit is purchasing them off the shelf, correct?

Let me guess...Blackhawk Special Operations bags or STOMP bags?

psst-just between you and I, there are better ones out there.

 

[old medic]

9th CTI-DND Conference & Military Textiles and Personal Equipment Trade Show
Thursday, April 20, 2006
Army Presentations: Army Current Product Improvements
http://www.textiles.ca/_static/webUpload/193/143_1.pdf


Specifically page six and seven for section level TCCC pouches and self aid pouches.
No mention of full size jump bags.

 

[Gunner98]

And your unit is purchasing them off the shelf, correct? Let me guess...Blackhawk Special Operations bags or STOMP bags? psst-just between you and I, there are better ones out there.

Between you and me, all users at our end and our pers abroad are quite satisfied with having their own Blackhawk bags, thanks.

 

[Armymedic]

Between you and me, all users at our end and our pers abroad are quite satisfied with having their own Blackhawk bags, thanks.

I used to be quite happy with my STOMP as well.

What do they say...ingnorance is bliss.

But thats is taking away from my original point of the question. 1 CFH, as well as 1 and 2 Fd Amb, has gone out of its way to find a suitable bag for thier medics in a light/veh mounted role. CF H Svc Gp spends millions on health care for the CF, and I don't know how may hundred of thousands of dollars in improving the KAF MMU.

How about CFMG spend a couple thousand and equip thier medics in the shit in Afghanistan properly?

 

[old medic]

I split this off so we can concentrate on the jumpbag subject with it's own thread.

 

[Donut]

I'm not sure there is a "Best Bag" out there, as there is so much variation in the tasks, duration, terrain, pers kit, water, ammo, etc. which ultimately needs to dictate what you carry. 

I THINK modular task specific organization is the way to go, so you have to take out of the bag only  what you need, and there's nothing that has to be stuffed back in before you move.  Then perhaps give the troops a variety of models to choose from, (as per several suggestion in the various tac-vest threads) to fill with what modules they need for their mission.

I've looked at the STOMP, liked it, but it didn't stand out as "the solution", either.  In fact, no one bag has struck me as "the solution".

My 2 cents

DF

 

[riggermade]

I'd have to agree with PMT.  I modified many a jump bag when I was with 3 RCR and normally to the users specifations, what is ideal for one person doesn't work for the next.  A good det of shoulder pads was the big thing and some mods could be done inside depending on what the individual carryed

 

[old medic]

I wonder whatever happened too....  (Just to keep the discussion going):

http://www.forces.gc.ca/health/news_pubs/engraph/CFHS_Bulletin_Mar02_e.asp

New Medical Bag on the Horizon

Infantry medics in the CF could be using the new medical bag as early as next year. The Med bag is currently undergoing testing and evaluation and is expected to be released at the same time as the new small pack system for the Land Force. In line with the Clothe the Soldier project, these new medical bags have been designed to integrate into the small pack system that will be provided to all Land Force soldiers.

To meet the needs of the infantry medic, Bioscience officers at the Operational Human Engineering group at Defense Civil Institute of Environmental Medicine (DCIEM) developed a series of task-specific bags that will easily be integrate into the new load carriage system. This means that it will carry predominately the equipment and supplies required by the infantry medic.

"Personally, I’m very enthusiastic about the concept of this new med bag," said Maj Jeannine Cloutier, G4 Medical Plans at Canadian Forces Medical Group Headquarters, who recently attended a DCIEM presentation. "I think it could also greatly benefit the medical personnel in environments other than the just the infantry," said Cloutier.

A prototype system was developed from the input experienced Medics and has evolved into the current design. This most recent design incorporates pouches tailored to meet the needs of the Medic’s replacing the generic pouches on the small pack. The Med bag system includes an external soft frame so that the pouches can be carried independently of the remainder of the load carriage system. The pouches are unclipped from the soft frame and clipped into the small pack for better mobility and to take advantage of the load carriage system.

The current medic bag, in its present form, has been in service since the 1950s. Originally intended as a rope bag, which was never designed for medical use. The large canvas duck bag has very little carrying capacity in relation to its size and weight.

To check out more information the new medical bag and the Clothe the Soldier project click on to www.dciem.dnd.ca/ DCIEM/welcome_e.html or www.army.forces.gc.ca/LF/equip/hab/index_e.html.

 

[medicineman]

I see where SMMT is coming from.  The STOMPII in and of itself is a great kit - problem is it's huge and therefore be prone to overloading and it is a de facto rucksack all on it's own.  It's great if you're mounted, but if you're on a long hump over hill and over dale for a number of days, you have to make a decision about what medical gear goes out and personal kit goes in, because the issue ruck is almost as big as this thing is AND is totally incompatible with it.

As a minor aside, it kind of strikes to me like another UNMO kit - a bit of an over reaction without properly thinking things through and actually doing some proper user trials under a variety of conditions.

My two pennies worth.

MM

 

[medaid]

wow that little link to the bulletins... that bag looks exactly like a Small pack system, and honestly that would make it a POS... in my honest honest honest opinion.

 

[Gunner98]

I wonder whatever happened too....  (Just to keep the discussion going): http://www.forces.gc.ca/health/news_pubs/engraph/CFHS_Bulletin_Mar02_e.asp

What happened was the bullets started flying in theatre, ballistic plates and real trauma became common in the deployed Med Techs daily routine.  As has been indicated no one bag fits the needs, trials continue, opinions vary and so the wait has been prolonged.

 

[old medic]

True enough. Still, it is difficult to reconcile that with 57 years of no adequate bag (or bags).

 

[bisonmedic]

Actually, we do have new jump bags in theater now. It started out as a trial, but we now have enough of them to supply the medics out in the sandbox. The SO Tech bag is a tan modular bag that can be utilized depending on the mission requirements. It has the ability to hold some pers kit as well as your medical equipment. We also got to use another type, but it was like the Blackhawk bag only way bigger, not good for those on foot for long periods. Previous tours to Afghanistan had trialed a bag and was steps beyond the old green monster, but I think someone in Ottawa had to make too many changes to it to be usefull to us. Something with a better harness system that can be adjustable depending on the medics size and equipment worn ( width/height ). Because as it was stated, it is a pain in the butt trying to wear the bag with all the PP/E we have, it takes a toll on the body.

 

[Armymedic]

This SO Tech bag...it is the one with the two pockets on its face?

I am trying to find a pic to upload.

 

[Donut]

Is this the one:


http://www.sotechmed.com/sm/medpdf/SOTechMedicalDoc.pdf

pp 18-19?

I can't cut the pic from the catalogue for some reason.

DF

 

[bisonmedic]

Yes that's the bag we have right now. It's not bad, but the stitching needs to be improved because we are finding that the shoulder straps are coming apart from the bag itself. It is way more user friendly than the old jump bag, but like anything new and improved, people still have their own idea of what a bag should be. I prefer the bag that roto 0 guys were using, velcro inside the bag meant you could use the mini pouches as issued or anyway you wanted. It has good adjustability overall even with body armor and other kit, it compacts well with the straps supplied, and it takes the abuse from mother nature and medics well.

 

[Donut]

Did you get them complete with inserts, or just the outer bags?

Inquiring minds want to know...

DF