Government hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

I have long said that you could fund the CAF to 4 percent of GDP, but we would still lag behind in NATO and be much the same where we are.

It's never the money, it's politics. It's procedures. It's the pork-barreling in our defence spending that makes us a paper tiger in NATO.

My only hope in all of this for the CAF and the GoC, whatever the political stripe that may be, is that it will rouse them out of the "Peace Dividend" slumber. The world has been unstable since 1945. We have used geography, proximity, and association as a Defence Policy ever since. ICBMs don't care how close to the U.S. or how far from Russia/China we are.

Don't give us a dime more, but let us spend money on defence like it matters. The fact we follow the same rules for purchasing a fighter aircraft as we do for buying office furniture for a Service Canada office is disgraceful. Don't treat defense procurement as a stimulus package for Canadian Industry. There I said it.

We spend so much money, time, and effort trying to get that money to stay in Canada; be it by awarding contracts to companies with no capability to produce items without first "retooling" and"developing the production lines", or by hamstringing perfectly competent and competitive bidders by forcing the project to be made in St. Margaret de Poutain de Champignon, QC because the ruling government either lost the seat in the election, or won it with promises.

We spend so much money and staff hours jumping through TBS regulations that are great for other departments, but are terrible for defence procurement. Some items you have to sole source, because there are technologies and capabilities no one else makes. By doing the bid process, you get companies clamoring for a project they can't deliver on, but because they tick the bright boxes on the score sheet....

I truly and honestly belief we need to split from PSPC and legislate that its not beholden to TBS, only to the PBO/PCO. The guiding principles of this new Defence Procurement department should be "Off the shelf, from somewhere else" if there isn't an industry in Canada.

BOOTFORGEN has demonstrated how well we do when we are able to actually get what we need, instead of lining the pockets of a Canadian company that got lucky.

That, but with tanks, fighters, ships, weapons systems....

 

[ModlrMike]

Yes... like what is their relationship going to be with PWGSC?

Hopefully zero - a completely separate entity for DND.

Unless DPA has direct purchase authority, they're still going to have to go to bat with PWGSC.

 

[MilEME09]

Unless DPA has direct purchase authority, they're still going to have to go to bat with PWGSC.

and TB

 

[Halifax Tar]

Unless DPA has direct purchase authority, they're still going to have to go to bat with PWGSC.

That would take some creative legislative maneuvering and empire breaking.

 

[KevinB]

Unless DPA has direct purchase authority, they're still going to have to go to bat with PWGSC.

That would be the point of creating that entity I would assume. Otherwise you’re just spinning your wheels.

and TB

I don’t see how you can get around the TB in Canada.

But if you had an actual Defense Procurement Agency, it would at least be able to navigate programs to the proper gates.

 

[OldSolduer]

That would take some creative legislative maneuvering and empire breaking.

So what you are saying is that he will add to the bureaucracy and cause even further delays to the procurement of major defense initiatives.

 

[Halifax Tar]

So what you are saying is that he will add to the bureaucracy and cause even further delays to the procurement of major defense initiatives.

I expect that to be the end result, intended or not.

 

[MilEME09]

That would be the point of creating that entity I would assume. Otherwise you’re just spinning your wheels.


I don’t see how you can get around the TB in Canada.

But if you had an actual Defense Procurement Agency, it would at least be able to navigate programs to the proper gates.

Way i would see it is TB authorizes DPA's total budget and thats it, DPA then doesn't need authority to spend it

 

[lenaitch]

Treasury Board is a committee of Cabinet, not robe-wearing ancients ruling from a mountaintop. Treasury Board Secretariat are employees. Procurement rules are written, and can be re-written if the will exists.

 

[Underway]

If anything you could imagine them thinking "why are we doing this here? this guy died over a 100 years ago WTF?"
They have no sense of Canadian military history because it has been glossed over in many schools. Unless its "Peacekeeping"

Not my kids school. They all know about Vimy Ridge.

I think the problem isn't the schools, they cover the topics and provide the information. Kids that are interested grab onto it and do more research.
The problem is the US saturated culture, that doesn't tell Canadian stories. There is no real Canadian equivalent of Saving Private Ryan, The Pacific, Greyhound, Hurt Locker, Platoon, Midway, 1917, All Quiet on the Western Front, Dunkirk and the list goes on.

I was thinking about this quite a bit since the current troubles started. Not telling our own stories with big budgets and proper cinematic and/or international relases should be something we should aspire too.

 

[ytz]

Yes... like what is their relationship going to be with PWGSC?

Hopefully zero - a completely separate entity for DND.

This is the Australian model. Their procurement agency operates independently of normal government procurement. They have more leeway on industrial benefits. But aim to implement a broader industrial strategy over time.

Not saying this is a magic bullet. But it's changes like this that have gotten Australia to where they are today.

 

[ModlrMike]

Well, I won't hold my breath. Iron rice bowls etc.

 

[Underway]

No one should, given the fact we've been bitten by this particular varmint before from multiple different governments since the 60's.

I also don't expect Europe to spend to much money here on military industrial solutions. France is already balking a the $150 billion from the Euro budget being allowed to go to such foreign places as Norway, Turkey and the UK (and Canada).

 

[YZT580]

If anything you could imagine them thinking "why are we doing this here? this guy died over a 100 years ago WTF?"
They have no sense of Canadian military history because it has been glossed over in many schools. Unless its "Peacekeeping"

then they shouldn't be standing for office.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Tell me you don’t understand mechanical interfaces without telling me…

The Sig P320 has a fully cocked striker, and the only part blocking it is a small rounded bar. It is a bad design.

I’ll encourage you to watch this video.

Another, allegedly, P320 incident ...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1911403007889092866

 

[GK .Dundas]

If anything you could imagine them thinking "why are we doing this here? this guy died over a 100 years ago WTF?"
They have no sense of Canadian military history because it has been glossed over in many schools. Unless its "Peacekeeping"

What's wrong with our political leadership, seriously at least one of them at least remembered our glorious invasion of Norway during the the last great unpleasantness...Vietnam... wasn't it.?

 

[KevinB]

Another, allegedly, P320 incident ...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1911403007889092866

Clearly impossible (snicker snicker snicker).

Sig put out a a good video on the mechanism.

Unfortunately tolerance stacking, wear of parts of certain materials and questionable QC compound some engineering issues.

 

[ytz]

I don’t see how you can get around the TB in Canada.

But if you had an actual Defense Procurement Agency, it would at least be able to navigate programs to the proper gates.

You don't get around TB. But in other countries, the way that such an agency works is that they are delegated authority and given freedom to execute inside their arcs. So basically, they'd seek out TB approval for a whole portfolio of projects. That approval will come with various reporting limits and financial controls. They don't have to go back to the centre until they risk busting a limit. Should in theory, reduce bureaucracy substantially.

 

[Underway]

Carney summary courtesy of Noah on Substack.

• The Liberal government will establish the Defence Procurement Agency, modernize defence procurement rules and amending legislation and regulations as required, to centralize expertise from across government and streamline the way we buy equipment for the military.
• The Carney government, to this effect, will also commit to buying Canadian whenever it makes sense and prioritizing Canadian raw materials such as steel, aluminum, and critical minerals.
• The liberals will also establish the Bureau of Research, Engineering and Advanced Leadership in Science or BOREALIS. This agency will focus on developing Canadian solutions in areas such as AI, quantum computing, cybersecurity, and other advanced fields.
• The Carney government will also develop a new export strategy for defence, while pushing for Canada's continued participation in ReArm Europe, and pivoting to focus on diversifying from the United States.
• Carney addresses concerns that putting the F35 on the table might put Canadian companies at risk of retaliation. He reiterates that there is no intention to cause that, but that there is a shift in the relationship. He says there is big opportunity to maximize economic benefit. He continues with bringing up plans for comprehensive negotiations on the US-Canadian relationship after the election, and how Canada stands to gain with a Made-In-Canada focus. He calls the situation fluid. He says that there is a path to integration that benefits both of us.
• On the Road to 2%, Carney reiterates as he has said before that he does not look at percentages, but on capabilities. To this effect he says something very interesting, that he believes spending is likely to rise beyond 2% if all comes together.

My thoughts are probably clear on this, like this thinking, proof is in the pudding.

Oddly enough the thing I like the most about this (because we have to wait to see what happens) is the organizational names don't have Canada in the acronyms. Thank god! Why does everything have to have Canada in it. CRA, Canadian Space Agency, Health Canada etc...

DPA - Defence Procurement Agency (not CDPA)
BOREALIS - Bureau of Research, Engineering and Adavanced Leadership in Science

 

[MilEME09]

Clearly impossible (snicker snicker snicker).

Sig put out a a good video on the mechanism.

Unfortunately tolerance stacking, wear of parts of certain materials and questionable QC compound some engineering issues.

Quick search has 200 recorded incidents with the P320, with over 2.5 million units sold since 2014. That's a incident rate of 0.008% over all for the model. With that low of incident rate that's not even a QC failure. It's all about optics, is it bad or are enough people amplifying the incidents to give it a worse reputation then it is?

 

[Fabius]

In terms of the new BOREALIS, why not just expand DRDC?

Most successful defence export nations are underpinned by extensive domestic military expenditure on those very systems that are then exported. Is the LPC intent to massively expand the CAFs procurements and move towards a continuous production model vs boom and bust?