Army Reserve Restructuring

[Remius]

That is literally the concept. everyone on the MRes would be expected to attend a yearly 5 day training event. DAG, update education/qualifications on record, weapons handling, fitness test, handful of other lectures/lessons. Start missing your 5 day event? off the list.

It will take some cooperation from all aspects of government to execute the concept that DG Mob has outlined, but if they get their wishlist from the government, it's a very feasible idea.

And I can see why the PS would be a good target to draw from.

TB could add a leave provision with pay for those five days annually.

 

[Kirkhill]

If the goal is to have a pool of many thousand people available to guard important infrastructure facilities and the like, where would be to stockpile of kit and weapons ready for them to do that? Or is the expectation that they will stand around in their own clothes carrying broomsticks until that is all sorted out?

In a reported five days of training, how much of any one topic could be imparted? While it is true that the basics of weapons handling might be remembered 10 years down the road, I would be concerned with adequate knowledge of the authority to use it. Will so-called 'citizen soldiers' deployed to multiple locations be expected to be under command of Reg/Res members? Where will they come from to babysit essentially green volunteers?

Services like Neighbourhood Watch and VFF are local matters - not national security, and VFFs get a whole lot more training than a couple of days.

What capabilities can they bring with them?

Are they mechanics? Do they work fork Microsoft, or Telus or Hydro Quebec? Suncor?
Do they own or have access to a smartphone or vehicle? Can the operate a boat, quad, snowmobile or chainsaw? Do they have medical or first aid experience? Do they have firearms training? Do they have access to a suitable weapon?

Etc.

If we register people we can organize them and apply them appropriately. We can find out what gaps there are and figure out how the government can cover those gaps.

It is true that many of the skills covered by homeguards in other countries are currently covered off in our 14 jurisdictions (excluding hundreds of municipalities and first nations) by a variety of clubs, agencies, associations and individuals - but how do you get them all rowing together on Day One?

 

[Brad Sallows]

The real issue is communicating all that efficiently. Even here, people think we’ll be fighting ww3 with 5 day trained public servants with diabetes and perfume allergies.

Too much speculation and not enough facts.

What's the age profile of the public service? How many would likely be deemed exempt?

I suppose that if we're scrambling to find people for home duties, we'll be able to turn out the necessary products from zero in not much more time than it takes to build from Royal 5 Days-ers.

I suppose that if we're scrambling to turn people into real soldiers, we'll be able to turn out the necessary products from zero in the same time it takes to build from Royal 5 Days-ers.

 

[Remius]

Too much speculation and not enough facts.

What's the age profile of the public service? How many would likely be deemed exempt?

Exempt? It’s voluntary. The PS is just another area that could be targeted for this.

I suppose that if we're scrambling to find people for home duties, we'll be able to turn out the necessary products from zero in not much more time than it takes to build from Royal 5 Days-ers.

Except how long do security clearances, medicals etc take already? That’s the stuff you avoid adding to the length. Most of your processing would be done.

I suppose that if we're scrambling to turn people into real soldiers, we'll be able to turn out the necessary products from zero in the same time it takes to build from Royal 5 Days-ers.

See above.

 

[Brad Sallows]

but how do you get them all rowing together on Day One?

This is all looking to me like climate change. It's a problem, but it's not THE problem. There are other much more difficult things that need to be achieved: knowing what the force structure should be and having a plan to methodically raise it; knowing what the necessary defence production base should be and having a plan to methodically develop and expand it; having stockpiles of equipment and ammunition and maintaining and cycling them appropriately; keeping national ship-building, and maybe aircraft-building and vehicle-/weapon-building going. All costly, all competing for funds with everything else.

Home guards and draft pre-registrations are just ways to fritter away money to not much effect. Take whatever allegedly small amount of funds are supposed to be needed for that and create a national civil-military mobilization planning cell and give them an actual ongoing responsibility to continuously draft and revise plans. Let them study the question of mobilizing people at length instead of jumping into ideas cooked up by handfuls of people devoting a fraction of their time to thinking about it.

 

[Remius]

This is all looking to me like climate change. It's a problem, but it's not THE problem.

No one said it was.

There are other much more difficult things that need to be achieved: knowing what the force structure should be and having a plan to methodically raise it; knowing what the necessary defence production base should be and having a plan to methodically develop and expand it; having stockpiles of equipment and ammunition and maintaining and cycling them appropriately; keeping national ship-building, and maybe aircraft-building and vehicle-/weapon-building going. All costly, all competing for funds with everything else.

Chewing gum and walking is hard. But we can do hard things.

Home guards and draft pre-registrations are just ways to fritter away money to not much effect.

A lot of what a military does is exactly that.

Take whatever allegedly small amount of funds are supposed to be needed for that and create a national civil-military mobilization planning cell and give them an actual ongoing responsibility to continuously draft and revise plans. Let them study the question of mobilizing people at length instead of jumping into ideas cooked up by handfuls of people devoting a fraction of their time to thinking about it.

Ummmm, that is exactly what they are doing and looking at. And there are people being stood up for that.

 

[Kirkhill]

If I look at this MRES as separate entity but in conjuction with the splitting of training into basic soldiering and then trades training (infantry, crewman or gunner) I see something like this:

60,000
SOF
Regs,
Supp List

100,000
Rangers
Class C
Class B
Class A OFP
Class A EFP

300,000
MRES

...

250 to 300,000
COATS
Cadets
Junior Rangers.
Scouts
Guides

....

A list of names and addresses known to the government with various skill sets, also known, and terms of service known, that can be accessed in time of need.

Some may be suitable for a tank in Latvia but that is probably not their purpose. Their purpose is probably to backfill less demanding roles to free up the fitter, better trained and better equipped professionals for more demanding roles.

As noted a lot of this is already happening across the country but there is little uniformity and no national co-ordination. This impacts planning for both civil and military crises.

National Defence, National Security, Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness all overlap. Today more than ever.

The government can't afford to discard willing helpers.l

 

[Brad Sallows]

Ummmm, that is exactly what they are doing and looking at. And there are people being stood up for that.

That's not what they're doing. I have in mind what was being done in the US prior to WW II, and this tepid effort is not that.

 

[ArmyRick]

Delete

 

[daftandbarmy]

And I can see why the PS would be a good target to draw from.

TB could add a leave provision with pay for those five days annually.

Because they are so old and infirm?

It will be our new Dad's/Mom's Army, given the prevailing demographics

Demographic Snapshot of Canada’s Public Service, 2024 - Canada.ca

www.canada.ca

 

[Kirkhill]

25,000 St John's Ambulance
20,000 Red Cross
20, 000 SAR volunteers
90,000, volunteer firefighters
How many thousands of Citizens on patrol and block watch volunteers.
How about accessing the Corps of Commissionaires for another 20,000 or so.

Perhaps some of these (all of these could be registered with the MRES)

9000 CATSA
Security Guards?

There is avery large pool of potential registrants.

 

[Remius]

That's not what they're doing.

They have dedicated people working on this. You saying they are not does not make your statement valid.

I have in mind what was being done in the US prior to WW II, and this tepid effort is not that.

This isn’t WW2. Adopting efforts from 80 years ago.

 

[Remius]

Because they are so old and infirm?

No. Because there is still a target group in there that is security cleared, the right age group and might have skills we can employ.

It will be our new Dad's/Mom's Army, given the prevailing demographics


View attachment 96854

Demographic Snapshot of Canada’s Public Service, 2024 - Canada.ca

www.canada.ca

No it won’t. Like the CAF it will have a varied age band with exceptions on various ends of the age group that sign up.

 

[daftandbarmy]

No. Because there is still a target group in there that is security cleared, the right age group and might have skills we can employ.

No it won’t. Like the CAF it will have a varied age band with exceptions on various ends of the age group that sign up.

And if we want a 'whole of nation' approach not just focused on elderly, overweight, security cleared rule followers?

Targeting organized sports programs might be the way ahead....

Statistics Canada's 2023 Survey Series on People and their Communities found that approximately 55% of people aged 15 years or older participated in organized sport, with men participating at a higher rate than women (62% in comparison with 49%). It was reported that just over 80% of sport is played recreationally, outside of a club or league, sometimes in combination with more structured recreational programs, such as group fitness, intramural sports or sport clubs. The most common reasons that Canadians participate in sport are physical health and fitness, fun, recreation and relaxation, mental health, and time with friends.

Why sport is important to Canadians and Canada - Canada.ca

 

[Kirkhill]

And I can see why the PS would be a good target to draw from.

TB could add a leave provision with pay for those five days annually.

How much critical infrastrucure in Canada is government owned and operated by Public Servants?

 

[Remius]

And if we want a 'whole of nation' approach not just focused on elderly, overweight, security cleared rule followers?

Not sure why people think this MRes is only going to be pulled from the PS…it’s only one target group.

Targeting organized sports programs might be the way ahead....

Depends. We’ve tried that before and suspect it’s ongoing but people in organized sports programs are happy there and aren’t always focused on employment prospects like the CAF.

We tried going up varsity sports teams and events. They all wanted careers in sports not the military.

 

[Kirkhill]

And if we want a 'whole of nation' approach not just focused on elderly, overweight, security cleared rule followers?

Targeting organized sports programs might be the way ahead....

Statistics Canada's 2023 Survey Series on People and their Communities found that approximately 55% of people aged 15 years or older participated in organized sport, with men participating at a higher rate than women (62% in comparison with 49%). It was reported that just over 80% of sport is played recreationally, outside of a club or league, sometimes in combination with more structured recreational programs, such as group fitness, intramural sports or sport clubs. The most common reasons that Canadians participate in sport are physical health and fitness, fun, recreation and relaxation, mental health, and time with friends.

Why sport is important to Canadians and Canada - Canada.ca

I wonder if there is a correlation in Denmark between Community Sportshalls, Handball teams and the Homeguard?

 

[Remius]

How much critical infrastrucure in Canada is government owned and operated by Public Servants?

I couldn’t tell you but I suspect it’s significant.

 

[Kirkhill]

Not sure why people think this MRes is only going to be pulled from the PS…it’s only one target group.


Depends. We’ve tried that before and suspect it’s ongoing but people in organized sports programs are happy there and aren’t always focused on employment prospects like the CAF.

We tried going up varsity sports teams and events. They all wanted careers in sports not the military.

But the MRES doesn't appear to be about a career with its commitment. It is more zipless.

 

[Remius]

But the MRES doesn't appear to be about a career with its commitment. It is more zipless.

That is fair.