A few anecdotes to provide some context to this discussion. I began my military career in Air Cadets in the late 1960s. Very military-ish and a good foundation for my 32-year military career. In the late 1990s I was the Deputy Regional Cadet Officer for Pacific Region Cadets, the senior regular force officer in the Region. At the time my HQ was 30+ combination of regular force and CIC. At the time we had (approximately) 5000 cadets, 500 CIC officers and 125 cadet corps. Pulling these figures from the depths of my memory. We watched in some sadness as the Army Cadet program was de-militarized. The official reason given at the time was that Canada had signed on to international agreements not to employ child soldiers. You can make your own determination of whether or not the Army Cadet program of that era produced "child soldiers." I don't think so, but it was also increasingly difficult to justify having teenagers firing automatic weapons. So we turned Army Cadets from Army to Adventure (in practice if not name). I also had huge issues with the CIC officers and their desire to be treated like "real" officers but not come anywhere close to meeting even the basic level of expectations of a regular or reserve officer. At one point I proposed that CIC officers would wear a distinctive uniform, or at least very distinctive badges to ensure nobody confused them with "real" officers. That went over like a lead balloon and I was told by the Cadet mafia in Ottawa to get back in my box. My final anecdote involves the challenges we faced with CIC officers. First, the more I got to know them, the more I appreciated their commitment to the program. But it was a youth training program, not the military. We had a corps in a small town that provided pretty much the only organized outlet for teenagers and was well subscribed to. We had huge challenges finding officers. The local parents group final dredged up an individual for our consideration. He had previous military experience of some sort, not sure what type, but was a hopeless alcoholic. The best we could get out of him was a promise not to drink on parade days/nights. So we were faced with the decision: did we let the corps collapse due to a lack of a CO, or did we accept what the parents group had dug up. I honestly don't remember what our final decision was but this was typical of the issues we faced managing the cadet program. My observations since that time was that the CIC mafia was able to totally buffalo NDHQ to the point CIC officers were getting paid the equivalent of any other CF officer and they had sorts of other benefits. Pretty rich for a youth leader. I admire their commitment but also their political acumen in gilding their lily. Back to the rest of you.