Author Topic: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020  (Read 10713 times)

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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #75 on: May 20, 2020, 08:07:24 »
I’m not questioning his decision to turn left, but straight down the runway is a river, with a large island park further up, and to the right is pretty much nothing. Also, had they taken off west there is literally nothing out there but farmer fields.  :(

It sure seems like you are...

« Last Edit: May 20, 2020, 08:58:14 by Eye In The Sky »

Offline Drallib

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #76 on: May 20, 2020, 09:33:12 »
The video that NavyShooter shared of Vincent Aiello from the Fighter Pilot Podcast talking to former CO/Lead of the Snowbirds Robert Mitchell was great.

He shared an experience he personally had when the team was practicing. He had a bird strike and left the formation by gaining altitude immediately. As his engine failed, he was doing the emergency procedure to try and get it going again, at the same time checking his ejection system and also the surrounding area for a runway that was way off in the distance. But, he had altitude and energy (300 knots) on his side and was able to get the engine running just enough to make it to the distant runway.

What Capt Richard MacDougall did in that extremely short amount of time was remarkable in my opinion. Like most of you, I'll be eager to hear exactly what happened in those moments. It goes without saying we'll need patience as he recovers and will have to process what happened.
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Offline Quirky

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #77 on: May 20, 2020, 10:39:14 »
It sure seems like you are...

The ego's on this forum are great representation of what's wrong in the military. They would rather make a snarky comment instead of moving along..
« Last Edit: May 20, 2020, 10:49:21 by Quirky »
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #78 on: May 20, 2020, 10:57:50 »
The ego's on this forum are great representation of what's wrong in the military. They would rather make a snarky comment instead of moving along..

I'd label my comment more an 'observation' that was aimed to help you see the contradiction in your post;  "nothing said before but really matters" as the saying goes...

But, judging by your reaction, I'd say my comment was "on top". 


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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #79 on: May 20, 2020, 11:00:22 »
Take it to the PMs gentlemen.
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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #80 on: May 21, 2020, 19:52:15 »
CBC asked a former Snowbirds Team Lead to analyze the video. He seemed very careful not to speculate on any causes, but the video angle does show a black speck in the sky moving towards the A/C just before Rich pitched up. You can also see when they slow the video down (this isn't mentioned) that whoever the first ejection was had their parachute at least partially deploying in fairly rapid order. The 2nd ejection is out of focus so you cannot see if there is a parachute opening sequence as quickly as the first.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGS3dmuPlPo

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #81 on: May 22, 2020, 01:59:21 »
CBC asked a former Snowbirds Team Lead to analyze the video. He seemed very careful not to speculate on any causes, but the video angle does show a black speck in the sky moving towards the A/C just before Rich pitched up. You can also see when they slow the video down (this isn't mentioned) that whoever the first ejection was had their parachute at least partially deploying in fairly rapid order. The 2nd ejection is out of focus so you cannot see if there is a parachute opening sequence as quickly as the first.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGS3dmuPlPo

Bird strike.... mentioned in this article as a possibility:

“However, again, the investigation will prove whether it was a bird strike or an engine failure or some sort of other emergency,” Stephenson said.

https://globalnews.ca/news/6954775/cf-snowbird-crashes-near-kamloops-during-b-c-stop-of-cross-canada-tour/
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Offline CF_Pilot

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #82 on: May 22, 2020, 09:44:41 »
An analysis by a former Snowbird pilot:

https://youtu.be/Xl7qOY2-o_Y
Much better analysis here, where he points out the stall/spin not seen by former Snowbirds:

https://youtu.be/10Og_7sqU7s


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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #83 on: May 22, 2020, 18:21:16 »
Mods, perhaps this goes to Thoughts and Prayers?

Captain Richard MacDougall: Injured pilot makes first public appearance

per: CFJC today: https://cfjctoday.com/2020/05/22/injured-pilot-makes-first-public-appearance/?fbclid=IwAR3qDCpsf1Tj7zGIcqDMk6KsghqydPwiz1khej5XGooymvMAfPUMuhm3Umw

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KAMLOOPS — Injured pilot Captain Richard MacDougall came out in public last night for the first time since the tragic Snowbirds’ accident Sunday.

Members of the local indigenous community performed a drum circle at the roundabout in front of the admitting entrance to the hospital last night. MacDougall, surrounded by family members, well-blanketed and in his wheelchair, came out of the entrance to watch the circle and thank the members of the First Nations community for their support and prayers.

There has been little released about MacDougall’s injuries or the long-term prognosis for his recovery, but last night he appeared in good spirits for his visit outside.

Photos at link.

Online MilEME09

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #84 on: May 31, 2020, 17:39:54 »
https://www.thestar.com/amp/news/canada/2020/05/29/snowbirds-were-waiting-for-new-ejection-seats-before-deadly-crash-now-dnd-wont-say-if-gear-was-replaced.html

While there is a bit of speculation in the article, the department seems tight lipped on the issue of the ejection seat, and its replacement.
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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #85 on: May 31, 2020, 21:12:39 »
While there is a bit of speculation in the article, the department seems tight lipped on the issue of the ejection seat, and its replacement.

I'm still a little surprised the media has picked up that Strong, Secure, Engaged cancelled the Snowbird replacement project in favour of a life extension. Both projects weren't going to deliver by the proposed retirement date of 2020, but at least we'd be getting new airframes in 2026 instead of bandaids completed in 2025. Either DND determined we could keep flying them, or politically someone didn't want to spend $1.5B CAD when they could appear to be doing something with a paltry $100M CAD.

http://www.forces.gc.ca/en/business-defence-acquisition-guide-2015/aerospace-systems-347.page Snowbird Aircraft Replacement
http://dgpaapp.forces.gc.ca/en/defence-capabilities-blueprint/project-details.asp?id=1438 Snowbird Beyond 2020 LE

Offline Quirky

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #86 on: June 01, 2020, 01:04:42 »
https://www.thestar.com/amp/news/canada/2020/05/29/snowbirds-were-waiting-for-new-ejection-seats-before-deadly-crash-now-dnd-wont-say-if-gear-was-replaced.html

While there is a bit of speculation in the article, the department seems tight lipped on the issue of the ejection seat, and its replacement.

Or lack thereof. Isn’t hard to compare stock photos of the Weber CL-41 to recent pics, look to be identical. If the engineering is too complex to fit a modern zero-zero seat, that’s one thing. If it’s simply a cost saving tactic not to spend the money, considering the low-level aerobatic performances of the team, it just goes to you how much they value the lives of the aircrew. Still wearing a parachute on your back and waiting for the canopy to open wastes precious seconds, time you don’t have if you punch out low and slow. Let’s hope this incident fast tracks either an upgrade to the ejection seat or airframe itself if the Snowbirds are to continue performing.

Prelim report is out:

http://www.rcaf-arc.forces.gc.ca/en/flight-safety/article-template-flight-safety.page?doc=ct114161-tutor-from-the-investigator/kae62tqg

Quote
On 17 May 2020 the Snowbirds air demonstration team was scheduled to depart Kamloops, BC to reposition to Comox, BC as part of Operation INSPIRATION, an operation undertaken by 431 (AD) Sqn to travel around multiple sites across Canada to support COVID-19 front line workers. Aircraft CT114161 was #2 of a formation of two CT114 Tutor aircraft. Two occupants were on board the aircraft, the pilot and the team’s public affairs officer.

After take-off aircraft CT114161 was observed gaining altitude and departing the formation. Shortly thereafter, the aircraft initiated a left turn, followed shortly by an abrupt steep nose low attitude. Both occupants subsequently ejected from the aircraft.

A detailed analysis of video footage recovered for the investigation revealed one bird in very close proximity to the aircraft right engine intake (see red circle in picture above) during the critical phase of take-off.

The two occupants ejected the aircraft however one received serious injuries and the other received fatal injuries. The aircraft was destroyed on impact.

The investigation is focusing on environmental factors (birdstrike) as well as the performance of the escape system.

« Last Edit: June 01, 2020, 13:21:06 by Quirky »
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Offline Drallib

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #87 on: June 01, 2020, 13:21:37 »
Quote
Bird strike on Snowbird engine likely caused fatal crash: report


Canadian air force crash investigators are looking at a bird strike as the probable cause of the crash of a Snowbird demonstration jet in Kamloops, British Columbia last month.

The accident killed Capt. Jenn Casey, the public affairs officer for the aerobatics team.


In a preliminary report issued Monday, investigators say video footage from the crash showed a bird was in very close proximity to the right engine intake during take-off.

It's possible the bird struck the engine's intake, the report suggested.

The jet was climbing at the time, but then turned and went into a steep nose dive before hitting the ground in a residential neighbourhood.

Both Casey and the pilot, Capt. Richard MacDougall, ejected.

The aircraft was destroyed on impact.

"The investigation is focusing on environmental factors (birdstrike) as well as the performance of the escape system," said the report.

MacDougall was injured, but is expected to make a full recovery. The investigation is ongoing and it could be months before a final verdict on the exact cause of the accident is issued.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/snowbird-crash-report-1.5593259
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Offline Drallib

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Re: Snowbird Jet Crashes Into House in Kamloops- May 17 2020
« Reply #88 on: June 02, 2020, 08:16:44 »
Quote
Directorate of Flight Safety Releases Initial Report on CF Snowbirds Accident

The Department of National Defence’s Airworthiness Investigative Authority has issued a preliminary From the Investigator (FTI) report in relation to the Snowbirds accident in Kamloops on May 17, 2020. That accident claimed the life of the team’s Public Affairs Officer, Captain Jennifer Casey.

The FTI report is a brief summary of the circumstances and factual information known at this time. It does not provide full details surrounding the accident, but rather indicates the areas of focus for the investigation, which remains underway.

A detailed analysis of video footage recovered for the investigation revealed one bird in very close proximity to the aircraft right engine intake during the critical post take-off phase. The flight safety investigation will focus on environmental factors (the bird strike) and the performance of the escape system, as is the case in all accidents involving ejections.

“Our thoughts remain with Captain Jenn Casey’s family, the Snowbirds, and the Public Affairs Branch. I’m relieved to see that Captain Richard MacDougall has returned home and we wish him well in his continued recovery. To the City of Kamloops, the first responders, and the surrounding communities, you have shown our RCAF family the goodness of your hearts. We will not forget your support and kindness – my sincerest thanks. The Snowbirds continue to represent the professionalism, discipline and sense of team that are hallmarks of our institution. We are committed to safely returning them to the skies in due course.” Lieutenant General Al Meinzinger, Commander Royal Canadian Air Force

“During any Flight Safety investigation, we focus on completing a thorough, accurate and professional investigation. While we might quickly understand what happened in an accident, the most difficult work of an investigation begins as we peel back the layers to understand why and how this happened. We are laser-focused to understanding everything we can about the accident so we can recommend effective preventative measures to help reduce the risk of future occurrences.” Colonel John Alexander, Director of Flight Safety and Department of National Defence’s Airworthiness Investigative Authority

ADDITIONAL INFO

Flight Safety Investigations are conducted to ensure our personnel can continue to have confidence in our equipment and procedures. One of the aims of the Flight Safety program is to investigate such occurrences with the objective of quickly identifying effective preventive measures that will either prevent or reduce the risk of similar occurrences in the future.

The Canadian Forces Snowbirds were deployed on Operation INSPIRATION, a cross-Canada tour to lift the spirits of Canadians and salute front-line workers during the COVID-19 pandemic. Operation INSPIRATION has been delayed indefinitely.

The CT-114 Tutor fleet has been on an operational pause, which is a temporary cessation of flying operations, since the accident occurred. The RCAF is conducting a thorough risk assessment, with the goal of returning the fleet to flying operations. The aircraft will remain in Kamloops until that established process has been completed.

http://www.canadiandefencereview.com/news?news/2868

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