Author Topic: UVIC threads on Recruiting, Protests & Students against War  (Read 48702 times)

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00334

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UVIC threads on Recruiting, Protests & Students against War
« on: September 21, 2007, 15:27:04 »
http://www.martlet.ca/view.php?aid=39668

UVSS reps say students can’t make up own mind about military.

Offline Jaydub

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2007, 15:31:13 »
I wonder how many UVIC students, that are CF members, pay dues to the UVic Students’ Society...

Is there any way this can be overturned ?

Offline geo

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2007, 15:34:55 »
Quote
The motion was passed to clarify a policy amendment passed 10-1 by the last UVSS board of directors in April.That board amended the society’s policy on military issues to include, “The Society is opposed to the militarization of Canadian Society, and is unsupportive of a Canadian military establishment that violates international law and human rights.

Current UVSS board members felt that motion left it ambiguous as to whether or not the military was banned from the SUB.

The ban voted in on Sept. 10 means that the Canadian Armed Forces will be unable to attend the annual recruiting fair put on by UVic’s Career Services in the SUB every January. The Armed Forces attended last year’s recruiting fair.


Uhhh... please remind me - when did we violate international law and human rigthts? Was I asleep that day? Drat!

Militarization of Canadian Society?  Uhhh.... did we do that?  Can we do that?

Heh - with a bunch of students thinking like that I make a motion that the CF not permit it's officer cadets to study at that school AND that no research grant be provided to the school... don't want them to dirty their hands, dealing with our dirty money.... oh nooooo!
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Offline GAP

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2007, 15:37:58 »
For this kind of crap freedom soldiers die? Kinda makes one want to rethink the whole concept..... ::)
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Offline Greymatters

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2007, 15:51:24 »
F'ing christ, what an embarassment.  Some minority activists have obviously taken over the student council and, as most student dont give a crap or pay attention to their activities, has on its own decided to rewrite the rules to accomodate their beliefs. 

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2007, 16:04:09 »
F'ing christ, what an embarassment.  Some minority activists have obviously taken over the student council and, as most student dont give a crap or pay attention to their activities, has on its own decided to rewrite the rules to accomodate their beliefs. 

It's not that that UVIC students don't care, it's that the UVSS exists in its own world.  This was passed Sept 10 but I didn't hear about it until today when I picked up the latest copy of the Martlet.

Offline charlesm

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2007, 16:16:15 »
I wonder if they know how many student at UVIC are in the Military?

Are these students now second class citizens because they are in the military?
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Offline Guy Incognito

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2007, 16:20:02 »
Believe me, it's worse where I am.

Here's a snippet from an email sent by my student government last semester:

Quote
== Anti-War Protest in Toronto ==

On March 17th the CSA will be sending a bus to Toronto to participate in the cities
anti-war protest. If you are interesting in joining us please email <censored> to
reserve your seat!

For the record, $55.69 is the student fee for this government. Given there are at least 10 OCdt's (that I know of) at UoGuelph, that's $556.90 (if not more) military money spent protesting... the military. From what I've heard, the student government is a little more balanced and level-headed than last year, but we'll see.

Offline George Wallace

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2007, 16:30:52 »
Next question to put forward to these 'wackos' is "How do they justify allowing large Corporations who have large contracts to sell the Militaries around the world with equipment and services to attend?"  Are they also included in the Ban?  Is Freddy Chef being banned from the Job Fair?  They supply Rations to the CF.  Will Bell Canada be banned from the Fair?  It an many of its subsidiaries supply communications devices and services to the CF.  Will the Airline companies who bid for CF contracts be banned also?  I would imagine most, if not all, of the remaining companies attending the Job Fair will have some sort of contractual agreements with the CF, be they large or small in scale.  Even Staples provides office supplies to the CF.  Where will this idiocy end?
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Offline FSTO

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2007, 17:04:33 »
Name any University in Canada (or the world) where the student union isn't full of the leftish crowd. In the 80's when I was at University the student union was full of professional students whose main dream it seemed was to live the rest of their lives in school. Almost all of the other students with an ounce of initative and drive were working their butt off to get through school and get on with their lives. Hence they had no time for the out of this world musings of the student union.

As for U Vic, is it the union or the University itself that decides who comes to fair? I would suspect that it is the latter.

Offline BernDawg

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2007, 17:11:00 »
I suppose that they'll remove all the books they don't agree with from the library and burn them in a big bonfire, after dark (of course) then they can run around and smash the windows out of all the businesses that support, or might support, the CF.  Wow this is starting to sound familiar.....
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Offline chanman

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2007, 17:19:43 »
Speaking of the Student Society, the Simon Fraser one has never been able to meet quorum to change their own bylaws - including the one requiring a 500 student quorum.  Yes, they can't get and keep 500 students at the meeting long enough to do anything at a school with somewhere on the order of 20,000 students.

It's a small wonder they still exist, although it would have been nice if we could opt out of funding them with our student activity fees...

Offline medicineman

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2007, 17:38:00 »
Nice to see UVic hasn't changed any since I went there many moons ago...

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2007, 17:47:13 »
Name any University in Canada (or the world) where the student union isn't full of the leftish crowd. In the 80's when I was at University the student union was full of professional students whose main dream it seemed was to live the rest of their lives in school. Almost all of the other students with an ounce of initative and drive were working their butt off to get through school and get on with their lives. Hence they had no time for the out of this world musings of the student union.

As for U Vic, is it the union or the University itself that decides who comes to fair? I would suspect that it is the latter.

Career Services decides who comes to the fair.  However, the career fair is located in the student union building so the student union dictates who can be in the building and indirectly who can be at the fair unless the Career Services people decide to relocate the job fair.

Offline ivan the tolerable

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2007, 17:59:56 »
Strictly speaking, since they are "unsupportive of a Canadian military establishment that violates international law and human rights", there would be no ban of the CF since it is not a military establishment that has violated international law and/or human rights.

A strict interpretation of what they said renders it null and void.

I wonder if they crafted it that way to appeal to leftists who don't think terribly analytically, but yet won't really cause any change to anything...

But, what do I know...?
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Offline Thucydides

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #15 on: September 21, 2007, 18:49:27 »
Although xena is quite correct with the legal interpretation, I suggest the University administration and Senate should start receiving some letters and phone calls pointing out the fact that their institution is Federally funded, has CF members on campus and that many corporations do business with the CF and Federal Government.

Letter writers should also cc their Member of Parliament and all the various corporations which recruit at these job fairs, since politicians need to know that this University's students apparently do not want government monies or support; and so prospective employers can get a sense of what sort of people they might be hiring.

Lets see what happens when reality intersects the university!
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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2007, 20:26:42 »
Although xena is quite correct with the legal interpretation, I suggest the University administration and Senate should start receiving some letters and phone calls pointing out the fact that their institution is Federally funded, has CF members on campus and that many corporations do business with the CF and Federal Government.

Letter writers should also cc their Member of Parliament and all the various corporations which recruit at these job fairs, since politicians need to know that this University's students apparently do not want government monies or support; and so prospective employers can get a sense of what sort of people they might be hiring.

Lets see what happens when reality intersects the university!

I've actually done some research on the issue and it turns out the the UVSS is in someway contracted out by the university so it is not part of the university so they can do anything they want with regards to students without the approval of the university.  I think the best thing to do in this situation is to petition career services to host the career fair somewhere other than the SUB because the CF isn't banned from the campus; they are banned from the SUB.

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2007, 21:24:27 »
Quote
Director-at-large Christine Comrie said it was important to ban the military from recruiting because some students are ignorant about the issues.

“A lot of students don’t know about the issues and don’t know about the facts,” she said. “We have to make this decision for students.”

I am so freaking fed up with this mentality. "You don't know any better, so I'll decide for you. Bias be damned!"
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Offline BernDawg

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2007, 22:06:46 »
I am so freaking fed up with this mentality. "You don't know any better, so I'll decide for you. Bias be damned!"
That my friend is the entire point of my earlier post.  Big Brother is watching and obviously they know what's best for all of us because we are just a mindless mass, especially the ones fortunate enough to go to an institute of higher learning.  :rage:
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Offline Chad_Sexington

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2007, 23:10:08 »
Who cares if the CF is not welcome there.  It is their loss anyway.

Offline Larry Strong

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #20 on: September 21, 2007, 23:31:15 »
Are there really that many naive/stupid people in University? How did they ever get that far.
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Offline chanman

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2007, 00:14:28 »
Are there really that many naive/stupid people in University? How did they ever get that far.

No, the problem is that there are too many people in University that don't give two hoots about the Student Society, so they can get away with such crap.

Combine the resulting low participation rate in student politics with the power that is actually allocated to the Student Society, and you see why things like this actually get pulled off.  The SFSS at SFU was considerate enough to hamstring themselves with a moderate required quorum that they consistently fail to meet, but not all schools have such considerate Student Societies.

Offline Chris Pook

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #22 on: September 22, 2007, 00:34:10 »
Behold the Word.

There is only One Truth and it is vouchsafed to very few.  We, the few, must protect the many from the Untruth.

Quote
42. From what has been said it follows that it is quite unlawful to demand, to defend, or to grant unconditional freedom of thought, of speech, or writing, or of worship, as if these were so many rights given by nature to man. For, if nature had really granted them, it would be lawful to refuse obedience to God, and there would be no restraint on human liberty. It likewise follows that freedom in these things may be tolerated wherever there is just cause, but only with such moderation as will prevent its degenerating into license and excess. And, where such liberties are in use, men should employ them in doing good, and should estimate them as the Church does; for liberty is to be regarded as legitimate in so far only as it affords greater facility for doing good, but no farther.   ... LIBERTAS, ENCYCLICAL OF POPE LEO XIII ON THE NATURE OF HUMAN LIBERTY 1888
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/leo_xiii/encyclicals/documents/hf_l-xiii_enc_20061888_libertas_en.html

Apparently our friends on the UVSS are of a mind with Pope Leo XIII.   Somethings are just too dangerous to allow individuals free and undirected thought.  I sense some excellent Bureaucrats in the making.
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Offline Thucydides

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #23 on: September 22, 2007, 00:52:57 »
Behold the Word.

There is only One Truth and it is vouchsafed to very few.  We, the few, must protect the many from the Untruth.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/leo_xiii/encyclicals/documents/hf_l-xiii_enc_20061888_libertas_en.html

Apparently our friends on the UVSS are of a mind with Pope Leo XIII.   Somethings are just too dangerous to allow individuals free and undirected thought.  I sense some excellent Bureaucrats in the making.

These future Inquisitioners may be swept away by the next Reformation. (We can only hope).
Dagny, this is not a battle over material goods. It's a moral crisis, the greatest the world has ever faced and the last. Our age is the climax of centuries of evil. We must put an end to it, once and for all, or perish - we, the men of the mind. It was our own guilt. We produced the wealth of the world - but we let our enemies write its moral code.

Offline PatrickO

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Re: UVSS Bans Recruitment in SUB Building
« Reply #24 on: September 22, 2007, 00:55:27 »
I have sent them an email, calling into question their bias and their lack of logic. The very nature of the a career fair is to give students the chance to browse and then CHOOSE their preferred career. Their argument that, "students are ignorant" makes no sense to me. Why deny the already "ignorant" students (of which i am one ::)) the chance to gain at least one side of the story? Whatever happened to the freedom of choice?
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