Author Topic: New boot "system"  (Read 13739 times)

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niceasdrhuxtable

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New boot "system"
« on: October 05, 2007, 17:25:25 »
Does anyone have an indication if the new boot & sock system are air worthy? I've been asking around squadron but everyone can only seem to speculate. I've been sticking with my old boots for now but it'd be nice to know one way or another if I can actually wear these fancy new boots.

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2007, 19:01:29 »
The army WWB is ok for flying - DAR has been test-trialling new aircrew boots built exactly on the same boot design as the WWB, except with steel toes and an Anti-FOD sole.
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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2007, 22:57:30 »
A tad off-topic, but what boots do aircrew wear normally then?  Is there a set of "aircrew boots" that get issued in 17 Wing/Portage/wherever?
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niceasdrhuxtable

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2007, 07:31:13 »
A tad off-topic, but what boots do aircrew wear normally then?  Is there a set of "aircrew boots" that get issued in 17 Wing/Portage/wherever?

Yes, our regular aircrew boots look just like the old Mk IIIs except they have wider eyelets for the laces and the soles resemble that of the parade boot to prevent us from bringing FOD into the aircraft.

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2007, 09:37:52 »
Yes, our regular aircrew boots look just like the old Mk IIIs except they have wider eyelets for the laces and the soles resemble that of the parade boot to prevent us from bringing FOD into the aircraft.

And then they issued us Matterhorns with Vibram Kletterlift soles that attract and keep stones for dispersal later on.

Maybe it's because I'm a helo guy and after FOD walking the ramp on Mondays, I then take a Sea King and land on a gravel helipad or on the grass off level training areas, but I'm really not that concerned with pebbles causing me any undue harm.

I wear what's comfortable.
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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2007, 07:59:08 »
Same here. I've never bothered to draw the aircrew boots. I only have so much space tat home to fill up with unnecessary kit. The standard combat boots work just fine in a Tac Hel environment.

The aircrew boot sole pattern is the same one that was on the original Mk I combat boots, for those who don't go that far back.

niceasdrhuxtable

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2007, 19:10:18 »
Just a heads up to anyone interested. We had an AIF come down through Shearwater saying the boots are approved for all CF aircraft.

Offline Breacher41

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2007, 19:13:32 »
Hux, you got a pic?
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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2007, 19:28:36 »
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niceasdrhuxtable

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2007, 17:25:46 »
I don't have any pictures but they aren't very far removed from the old combat boots.

personally, I think we should have gone with these:


Offline Aden_Gatling

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2007, 21:57:53 »
Just a heads up to anyone interested. We had an AIF come down through Shearwater saying the boots are approved for all CF aircraft.

FWIW, Clothing Stores in the 'Jaw is now issuing us (aircrew) the new CWWB (Terra brand, with steel toes, weird lace eyelets and ridiculously long laces) and sock system: entitlement seems to be 1 pair immediately and 1 pair on "backorder." ::)

Hux, you got a pic?
Photo (looks to me like the ones I got), etc.: http://www.forces.gc.ca/cems/ItemsAndClothing/Footwear/CWWB_e.htm
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2008, 12:32:03 »
FWIW, Clothing Stores in the 'Jaw is now issuing us (aircrew) the new CWWB (Terra brand, with steel toes, weird lace eyelets and ridiculously long laces) and sock system: entitlement seems to be 1 pair immediately and 1 pair on "backorder." ::)
Photo (looks to me like the ones I got), etc.: http://www.forces.gc.ca/cems/ItemsAndClothing/Footwear/CWWB_e.htm

Its a safety toe, but I don't think its a steel toe.  The purpose of the eyelets and the laces the way they are, IMO, is so that you can lace the boots all the way up, then tie a knot on the end of each lace to prevent it from slipping out of the eyelets, and still be able to pull the boots on.  If you have to boot-up in a hurry, 1) you can tie them up very quickly this way and 2) if you CAN'T tie them up, you aren't running and tripping over laces.  Remember, these boots are for more than just aircrew  ::)...from your own link, under "Distribution".  A sufficient quantity will be procured to meet the needs.  CF Air Force standard operational clothing scales will be amended to reflect an entitlement of two (2) pairs of CWWB for air element personnel and CC3 non-air element in support of flying operations. Non-air element personnel will retain this item upon their cessation of support to Air Force operations, although exchange for wear and tear will cease upon departing support to flying operations.

Everyone gets their initial pair now, and a 2nd pair later, date TBA.  Pretty standard stuff wouldn't you say?
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Offline Aden_Gatling

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2008, 15:58:55 »
Its a safety toe, but I don't think its a steel toe.  The purpose of the eyelets and the laces the way they are, IMO, is so that you can lace the boots all the way up, then tie a knot on the end of each lace to prevent it from slipping out of the eyelets, and still be able to pull the boots on.  If you have to boot-up in a hurry, 1) you can tie them up very quickly this way and 2) if you CAN'T tie them up, you aren't running and tripping over laces.  Remember, these boots are for more than just aircrew  ::)...from your own link, under "Distribution".  A sufficient quantity will be procured to meet the needs.  CF Air Force standard operational clothing scales will be amended to reflect an entitlement of two (2) pairs of CWWB for air element personnel and CC3 non-air element in support of flying operations. Non-air element personnel will retain this item upon their cessation of support to Air Force operations, although exchange for wear and tear will cease upon departing support to flying operations.

Everyone gets their initial pair now, and a 2nd pair later, date TBA.  Pretty standard stuff wouldn't you say?

I'm sure it is ... the supply system is way out of my lane.  I also didn't mean to imply that they weren't for trades other than aircrew: I could only speak of what I knew wrt who was being issued with them.  You are probably right wrt the toe as well (the label says: "CSA Grade 1 Toe Puncture Protection, ESR").  I wrap the laces three times around my ankles (otherwise I'd be tripping over them): not a problem, I just thought it odd ...
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2008, 16:05:10 »
Not sure how you wear your boots (3 times around your ankles?  ;D) but...it sounds like you don't do them up to the top.  Is that common for Plts??  I used to do that when doing ruckmarchs, so I am assuming there is a 'comfort' reason for that?

If so, just go back to supply and get another pair of laces.  Cut one pair down to the size you want and melt the ends with a lighter so they don't fray, and keep one pair for if you ever have to have them laced up all the way?  Not sure of the reg's on Plts and what they are mandated in the cockpits for that sort of stuff.

I am curious if the aircrew folks actually like/dislike the new boot from the CEMS project at all compared to the Magnums/Mk IIIs/Matterhorns/Danners or whatever they were wearing before?
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Offline George Wallace

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2008, 16:20:21 »
Now you have picced my curiousity.  Tie a knot in the end of your lace?  Are you using elastic laces?  Are you lacing in zippers?  You got me on that one.

Not lacing the boot up to the top?  Where are your "Dress Code" and "Safety Regs"? 

I don't think that is what was implied though, as you probably are talking about ankle boots and have been issued Cbt Boot laces as replacement laces.  Although, I have recently had a pair of laces issued for Cbt Boots that would probably do the same.


A point on lacing your boots for the BFT or walking, so as not to get shin splints - don't tie them completely to the top and pull the laces as tight as possible.  Lace them to the top and pull the laces firmly, but not as tight as possible, and at the same time as you are doing this, raise your toes up towards your knees.  This provides the proper amount of 'slack' in your boot so as not to cause stress on your shins when walking.
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Offline Aden_Gatling

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2008, 16:33:41 »
I have them done right up, but I do know of guys who leave out the top one or two, because they feel it gives them better ankle flexion (that might not be a real word) and therefore better rudder control ... I haven't really had a problem, so I just do them the way I'm supposed-to (and wrap the laces) ... my feet are a little weird in that in order to get the length & width to fit, the eyelets are almost on top of each-other (can't really even see the tongue), but the laces are really long, even after taking that into consideration.  The laces aren't really a problem for me (not even worth the trip to supply), and I guess it can't hurt to have a little extra in case they break.  Dunno what the reg. is.

Mine are getting broken-in (3 mos.), and comfort-wise they are okay in the a/c: if I were worried about ruck marches or whatever, I'd much prefer Magnums* or even the Mk. III (with Vibram soles and Sole (or Superfeet) insoles).


*Or possibly Danner or a few others, but I haven't worn them, so I can't really say.

I don't think that is what was implied though, as you probably are talking about ankle boots and have been issued Cbt Boot laces as replacement laces.  Although, I have recently had a pair of laces issued for Cbt Boots that would probably do the same.
I don't think I'm entitled to wear the ankle boots anymore (although I've seen other officers wear them in 3B/C), and I'm almost certain that I can't in the a/c (not that I would want to)!
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2008, 16:38:02 »
Now you have picced my curiousity.  Tie a knot in the end of your lace?  Are you using elastic laces?  Are you lacing in zippers?  You got me on that one.

I think you meant that one for me?  I am using the issued laces with the AF CWWB and yes, I have my laces thru all the eyelets, right up to the top, and on each end of the lace, I tie a knot. The laces will never slip thru the eyelets (the eyelets on the AF CWWB are the same as the CTS CWWB) so I don't have to try to feed the laces thru the eyelets every day, which was a PITA to me.  

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2008, 19:22:12 »
Aden_Gatling,

Have you got twigs for legs? I could see how you would have extra laces if your eyelets touch each other when tied up. I however, have never had that problem, my problem is usually the laces being too short since I have about a 1" gap on average from top to bottom when my boots are tied up.

As far as the CWWB boots vs Danners vs Matterhorns. I haven't got my CWW boots yet since I was at sea when the initial sizing was done back in Nov. But I have tried Matterhorns, they're too tall for my liking and the heel cup sucked. I am on my second pair of Danner Acadias and you'll have to take them off my cold dead feet before I ever give them up. I love them, they fit well right out of the box and the more you wear them, the better they fit. They're easily adjustable to wear with 1 pair of cotton socks or the new 2 sock system and even my immersion suit sock over top of the sock system. My only complaint is how soft the Vibram Kletterlift sole is and how easily it marks the floors. They're great for the winter since they don't freeze up and get slippery, but the non-skid on the flight deck sure does wear them down quick.

IMHO, we should have went with Danners CF wide. You can get them uninsulated for summer use, 200g thinsulate for cooler weather and 400g thinsulate for extreme cold.
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Offline ArmyVern

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2008, 19:27:33 »
I think you meant that one for me?  I am using the issued laces with the AF CWWB and yes, I have my laces thru all the eyelets, right up to the top, and on each end of the lace, I tie a knot. The laces will never slip thru the eyelets (the eyelets on the AF CWWB are the same as the CTS CWWB) so I don't have to try to feed the laces thru the eyelets every day, which was a PITA to me.  



I am also a knot-in-the-end-of-the-lace-girl; simple thing ... saves me much angst!!  :D

Edited to add photo of said knot in end of bootlace.

« Last Edit: February 10, 2008, 19:55:01 by ArmyVern (Female type) »
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Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2008, 08:45:35 »
As they say AV, a picture is worth a thousand words  ;D!

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Offline Dimsum

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2008, 12:27:34 »
OK, I must be just having a slow day, but tell me again how knots at the ends of the super-long laces will help with avoiding tying your boots?   ??? 
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Offline geo

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Re: New boot "system"
« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2008, 12:44:15 »
Dimsum...
The know will save you the time of lacing the boots
NOT tightening them up and tying a bow each day....
Chimo!