Author Topic: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers  (Read 39715 times)

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Offline S.M.A.

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Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« on: February 16, 2011, 18:03:25 »
Looks like the Royal Australian Navy's future assault carrier HMAS Canberra is ready for launch in Spain:







link

Quote
"Canberra" Australia's New LHD Ship to be Launched February 17 in Galicia       
Monday, 14 February 2011 

The first of the 2 Australian Navy's all purpose LHD ships, "Canberra" will be launched by next Thursday at Navantia's shipyards in El Ferrol, Galicia 2 months ahead of schedule. The keel for the second vessel " Adelaide" will be laid the following day.For details of this 27.000 ton all purpose vessel take a look at the RAN's web page " Future Vessels for the Australian Navy".

official RAN link

There you will see not only 3 dimensional views of this "state of the seas" multi- purpose vessel based on the Spanish design and vessel currently in operation " Juan Carlos 1" . The LHD not only serves as transport ship, but also provides landing facilities and air support,and has both military and disaster support and humanitarian support capabilities.

On the same page also you can catch a glimpse of the other new vessels such as the 5 AWD destroyers being built for the RAN based on the Spanish Navy's F100 design. Navantia is also playing a key role in this contract

Spain's Navantia has become the key supplier of RAN in both design and supply of the future fleet of the Australian Navy.

Re the launching event see the attached article in the Spanish Galician Press

La Voz de Galicia

Plus an artist's impression of the completed ships, side by side:



« Last Edit: February 08, 2014, 23:06:44 by George Wallace »
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Re: LHD HMAS Canberra on track for handover to the RAN in 2014
« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2013, 09:30:45 »
Thanks for the link.  The two LHDs should provide the Aussies with excellent capabilities for a variety of operations spanning the spectrum of conflict, from humanitarian ops to warfighting.  I especially liked the medical facilities on board. 

Of note, the plankholder CO of this ship is a (?former) Canadian:  "The first Commanding Officer of HMAS Canberra is Captain Jonathan Sadleir. The former Canadian officer has 27 years experience including 12 in the Canadian Navy. His last command job was driving the 3600-tonne Anzac frigate HMAS Parramatta."

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Re: LHD HMAS Canberra on track for handover to the RAN in 2014
« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2013, 10:44:37 »
Just finished the video and wow that ship looks pretty comfy and has a tone of capability!  I only wish the GOC could get something like that for the RCN
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Re: LHD HMAS Canberra on track for handover to the RAN in 2014
« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2013, 18:54:31 »
Too bad Canada didn't have one of these for Haiti. Or any other disaster, Sandy, Katrina Japan. We could add to our already excellent humanitarian rep.  Even for the last big storm in Newfoundland.
One for each coast.
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Offline yoman

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Re: LHD HMAS Canberra on track for handover to the RAN in 2014
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2013, 20:55:09 »
Too bad Canada didn't have one of these for Haiti. Or any other disaster, Sandy, Katrina Japan. We could add to our already excellent humanitarian rep.  Even for the last big storm in Newfoundland.
One for each coast.
Sorry, I was dreaming!

Dreams are allowed. Hope is not...  :P
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Re: LHD HMAS Canberra on track for handover to the RAN in 2014
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2013, 21:02:39 »
Of note, the plankholder CO of this ship is a (?former) Canadian:  "The first Commanding Officer of HMAS Canberra is Captain Jonathan Sadleir. The former Canadian officer has 27 years experience including 12 in the Canadian Navy. His last command job was driving the 3600-tonne Anzac frigate HMAS Parramatta."

The ADF has all sorts of former Canadians in it.  As an example, on my last tour with the RAAF, the Air Component Commander (4-ringer) was a former Canadian Aurora pilot, the 3-ringer RAN Medical officer was a former Canadian MARS officer, and my detachment XO was a former Canadian Aurora TacNav.  The in-joke at my unit is that actual born-and-raised Aussies are the minority in the ADF.
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

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Offline S.M.A.

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2nd Canberra class LHD arrives in Australia
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2014, 22:53:18 »
An update on Adelaide, the 2nd of the Canberra class LHDs being built.



From DEFENSE INDUSTRY DAILY:

 
Quote
LHD02 Adelaide arrives in Australia, as LHD01 Canberra preps for sea trials

Feb 7/14: LHD02 arrives. The heavy-lift ship MV Blue Marlin is back in Australia with another LHD hull, after a 10,000 nmi journey that took 8 weeks.

LHD02 Adelaide arrives in Port Phillip Bay, Melbourne, and will be taken to the Patrick Webb Dock for removal of the sea fastenings and unloading. A tugboat with take her to the Williamstown dockyard in the suburbs for superstructure and fit-out work, and the hull is expected to be there within a week.

Things will be busy in Williamstown. LHD01 Canberra arrived back on Oct 17/12, and sea trials will begin within a few weeks. Sources: Australia DoD, “Landing Helicopter Dock Ship arrives in Melbourne” | Australia Defence, “Second LHD dock arrives in Australia”.
 
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Offline E.R. Campbell

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2014, 08:59:20 »
A photo posted, today, by VAdm Ray Griggs, Chief of Navy in Australia:


NUSHIP CANBERRA in Port Phillip Bay today on her initial sea trials. Great day for it!
Source: Twitter
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2014, 10:30:59 »
drool, drool.......Imagine what we could do with one of these, 2 Berlin class, plus our C-17 and C130J's. Now if we just had new helicopters to go on the ships....

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2014, 11:53:18 »
drool, drool.......Imagine what we could do with one of these, 2 Berlin class, plus our C-17 and C130J's. Now if we just had new helicopters to go on the ships....

We do: They are called Chinooks. This is an assault ship after all.

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2014, 11:59:59 »
True I forgot about that.... :)

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2014, 12:02:24 »
drool, drool.......Imagine what we could do with one of these, 2 Berlin class, plus our C-17 and C130J's. Now if we just had new helicopters to go on the ships....


It would take the political equivalent of "the end of days" for any Canadian Government, Conservative or Liberal or < shudder > NDP to grow up and make sensible defence procurement policy decisions, which would involve either:

     1. Spending many, many, many of billions more than planned to develop and maintain a real, coherent, stable Canadian shipbuilding strategy; or

     2. Save money and grow capability and buy, mostly offshore, two LPHs/LPDs (whatever ships like Canberra are) and three AORs and 4-6 destroyers (6,000± tons) and 6-8 frigates (4,000± tons) and 8-10 corvettes (2,500± tons)
         and several minor war vessels (submaribes and mine hinters and training vessels, and, and, and ...), probably at the expense of one or two Canadian shipyards.
It is ill that men should kill one another in seditions, tumults and wars; but it is worse to bring nations to such misery, weakness and baseness
as to have neither strength nor courage to contend for anything; to have nothing left worth defending and to give the name of peace to desolation.
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2014, 12:26:05 »
    2. Save money and grow capability and buy, mostly offshore, two LPHs/LPDs (whatever ships like Canberra are) and three AORs and 4-6 destroyers (6,000± tons) and 6-8 frigates (4,000± tons) and 8-10 corvettes (2,500± tons)
         and several minor war vessels (submaribes and mine hinters and training vessels, and, and, and ...), probably at the expense of one or two Canadian shipyards.

Where in the world would we get the PYs to man all of those ships?

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2014, 13:34:25 »
Where in the world would we get the PYs to man all of those ships?


WAG (wild assed guess): 4,000 to 5,500 depending on the number of ships and crew sizes.* Not, I think a big jump from recently when we had 3XAOR, 4XDDH, 12XFFH and 15+ minor war vessels ... or is it?

_____
* Discussions here in Army.ca suggests that new ships will have (much?) smaller crews.
 
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2014, 14:02:54 »
As mentioned in another thread, we could lease one of the USN supply ships to cover the gap until ours our ready and a proper lease means we return the ship to the USN and not stuck with dealing with her afterwards. This is no threat to the yards. We could contract the hull build to the Spanish yard and have the LPD fitted out over here and that would allow sub contracting to various yards as they aren't as restricted to what size hull they can build.
As I recall BAE is involved in some of our current contracts and they appear to be responsible for outfitting the Aussie vessels, so there are efficiencies there I think.

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2014, 14:05:04 »
Where in the world would we get the PYs to man all of those ships?

Move NDHQ lock stock and barrel to the "well deck", then once at sea, open the gate :)

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2014, 14:41:34 »
I wouldn't worry about it.  We won't be needing something like that anytime soon.
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2014, 14:50:57 »
HUGE radar cross sectional profile.

Not that there will ever be another useful combat vessel commissioned into the RCN, but for an LPD the San Antonio class ( not the light version) is a better option as it has somewhat better defensive armament, and is built to take a few missiles and not explode into a misty vapour consisting of metal and flesh.

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2014, 14:57:35 »
That's one BAB (Big *** Boat).   :salute:
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2014, 05:37:49 »

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2014, 08:53:32 »
A landlubbers question...."Nuship" A title used  prior to commissioning?



Thanks
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2014, 09:23:56 »
A landlubbers question...."Nuship" A title used  prior to commissioning?



Thanks
Larry

From what I get from the article "NUSHIP" is actually part of the ships name.
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Offline S.M.A.

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2014, 09:41:49 »
A landlubbers question...."Nuship" A title used  prior to commissioning?



Thanks
Larry

I thought it was another acronym similar to the American acronym PCU (Pre-commissioning Unit) to refer to warships that have not been commissioned? (E.g. PCU Zumwalt)
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Offline Larry Strong

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2014, 10:46:35 »
Ok, I see. :nod:


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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2014, 11:16:17 »
I thought it was another acronym similar to the American acronym PCU (Pre-commissioning Unit) to refer to warships that have not been commissioned? (E.g. PCU Zumwalt)

You thought correctly:

Quote
In Australia, the prefix NUSHIP is used to denote ships that have yet to be commissioned into the fleet.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_prefix

Quote
The ship name “NUSHIP” is used in Australia, to categorize the noncommissioned vessels in the fleet.
http://www.marineinsight.com/marine/marine-news/headline/what-are-ship-prefixes-for-naval-and-merchant-vessels/

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Offline S.M.A.

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Aussie LHD crippled after electrical meltdown during sea trials
« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2014, 23:36:13 »
Problems already hampering the ship before commissioning...

Quote
Brand new $1.5 billion pride of Australia's fleet crippled after electrical meltdown during sea trials

[dailymail.co.uk]
5 June 2014


A source said the first issue occurred when the electric powered pods at the stern of the ship were operated independently in low-speed mode when the ship was travelling at high speed, when they should have been operated in tandem, which caused serious vibrations across the ship.

« Last Edit: June 06, 2014, 23:47:53 by S.M.A. »
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #28 on: June 10, 2014, 11:30:37 »
Well we had the CCGS Henry Larson down for 6 months after a electric meltdown during sea trials.

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #29 on: July 12, 2014, 19:02:15 »
Hello all,

Been a keen reader of the forum for ages, and finally have something to contribute.

First, the above story about the Canberra being crippled, et al, is a lot of nonsense. There were some issues with the azipods and, as you would expect, she returned to there yard with a list of defects to be corrected before second sea trials. Nothing to get the vapors about.....

On the F-35B front, to date only two articles have appeared by people who have primary knowledge of both the ships and the aircraft. The stories about av fuel bunker and magazine capacity being inadequate are 100 per cent garbage. They have the same capacity as the lead Spanish ship, Juan Carlos Primo. And Hades will be a hockey rink before an F-35B or V-22 melts an LHD flight deck.

Attached in PDF format are pages with a relevant article from the July issue of a reputable Australian av magazine, not otherwise available online. The journalist has excellent sources. Worth reading.

Also, this small but fact-based piece from an Australian think tank is well worth a look. Here  -  http://www.aspistrategist.org.au/author/steve-george/

Hopefully these two articles mark the beginning of fact based reporting and discussion, and the end of woefully ill-informed armchair expertise by stale and painfully ignorant blowhards. That includes some Australian staff college lecturers who are way too fond of their own voices and unapologetic about their own technical ignorance.

I hope these two articles are of help to those here who are following the story.

Again, it's great forum here - my compliments and respect to all. Please believe me with that, as I run an Oz av forum, and fully appreciate some of the difficulties of keeping a forum going ahead on an even keel. Keep it up.  :)
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 19:19:20 by OTR1 »

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #30 on: July 14, 2014, 11:11:13 »
Interesting the RAN is growing short on supply ships, maybe we can build you a Berlin Class one after we finish our own.... :nod:

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #31 on: July 14, 2014, 15:24:32 »
The Oz government have shortlisted the new supply ship to two designs: the Navantia Cantabria-class (approx 20,000 tonnes) and the MARS Aegir 26 (approx 26,000 tonnes). The latter is a smaller version of the new RFAs for the Brits. Canberra recently stated that they will be built in either Spain or South Korea, not Oz. They're expediting this decision. RAN admiral Ray Griggs recently recommneded the brief article at the link as a good summary of how it's going.

 http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/Australias-supply-ships-serious-about-success-024674/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #32 on: August 27, 2014, 12:31:21 »
Handover to the RAN and commissioning  in a few months...

Navy Recognition

Quote
Royal Australian Navy LHD Canberra Completes Sea Trials as Crew Tests Landing Craft
 
NUSHIP Canberra, the first of two Landing Helicopter Dock (LHD) ships being built for the Australian Defence Force, returned from her final contractor sea trials before delivery to the Australian Government. The ship returned to BAE Systems Williamstown today after being away on sea trials for two weeks.
        
Final contractor trials involve testing of the combat and communication systems along with some platform systems trials.

Aboard NUSHIP Canberra for the final contractor trials were BAE Systems and DMO project personnel along with a number of Royal Australian Navy (RAN) officers and sailors who will crew the ship once delivered, as well as BAE Systems subcontractors Navantia, Saab, L3 and Teekay.
             
In the meantime, Canberras' new Landing Craft were tested by RAN personnel on Sydney Harbour and local waterways.

The LHD Landing Craft (LLC) are scheduled to be handed over to Canberra in the coming months. In the mean time, the Canberra teams who will be driving, crewing and maintaining the vessels are undertaking further contractor training based at HMAS Waterhen.

Designed and built by Navantia, the LCM-1E landing crafts are the same type used by the Spanish Navy. With a length of 23.3 meters and a breadth of 6.4 meters they can reach 20 knots and have a range of 190 miles. They are fitted with two water jet propulsion units giving the LLCs a longer range, outstanding manoeuvrability, increase speed and more power compared to current in-service ADF landing craft.
 
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #33 on: August 27, 2014, 16:21:49 »
Indeed.

After handover to RAN, the plan is for +/- 12 months to reach IOC and then another +/- 12 months for FOC.

Am advised that the just-completed sea trials went very well.

Pic from BAE attached showing Canberra, now with her warpaint.  :)

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #34 on: September 09, 2014, 16:12:22 »
FYI confirmed handover date to RAN is September 25, and due to commission on November 28.

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #35 on: September 09, 2014, 17:21:05 »
FYI confirmed handover date to RAN is September 25, and due to commission on November 28.

Source link please? Unless you're... in an organization that would be privy to that information?
Our Country
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"A leader is best when people barely know he exists, when his work is done, his aim fulfilled, they will say: We did it ourselves."   - Lao Zi (老子)
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"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm."
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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #36 on: November 02, 2014, 15:27:55 »
Well, SMA, my name appears in the 'thanks' bit at the very end of this Defence White Paper submission. Is that enough?

www.defence.gov.au/Whitepaper/docs/082-Baddams.pdf

Folks here please take note that the linked document is 4,800 words long, so it may be an idea to be caffeinated before having a look. Also note that thanks to the hopeless desk wallah at the Dept of Defence the formatting got stuffed-up, and so page 17 is now blank: just scroll from page 16 to 18 and you'll be OK. It's a detailed account of the F-35B/LHD question.

Fear not, I shan't post any more on that subject here, as this probably marks the end of people's interest and patience.

Some RAN pics attached of the Canberra entering Sydney the other day. Commissions on November 28.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2014, 16:11:05 by OTR1 »

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #37 on: November 02, 2014, 19:26:11 »
Jeez,

Buggers off just when we were getting used to him.

Must be his turn to buy. :)
"Wyrd bið ful aræd"

Offline S.M.A.

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Australia mulls fielding F35Bs on its Canberra class LHDs
« Reply #38 on: November 17, 2014, 01:46:14 »
Australia mulls fielding F-35Bs on its upcoming Canberra class LHDs:

Defense Industry Daily

Quote
Should Australia field F-35B STOVL fighters on its Canberra Class LHD ships?

Nov 17/14: F-35Bs? The Australian Strategic Policy Institute issues a paper that looks at the viability of F-35Bs on Australia’s 2 Canberra Class LHDs, which are based on a Spanish design that expected to carry the fighters at some point. Australia is looking at this possibility, as part of its 2015 White Paper.

“Overall, this report concludes that the benefits would be marginal at best, wouldn’t be commensurate with the costs and other consequences for the ADF, and would potentially divert funding and attention from more valuable force structure enhancements.”

Their rationale is that operating the Canberra Class in escort carrier mode would be vast overkill for most missions, which are better served by the planned combination of EC665 Tiger ARH and NH90 helicopters. On the flip side, “…if the adversary were such as to merit strike operations against targets distant from Australia using the STOVL option, it would be quite capable of posing significant risk to the maritime strike force being used to project power in this way.” Removing much of the ship’s amphibious capability in exchange for 10-14 F-35Bs isn’t seen as enough airpower to both protect the ship, and offer useful offensive help.

(...SNIPPED)

« Last Edit: November 17, 2014, 01:51:48 by S.M.A. »
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Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #39 on: November 18, 2014, 11:13:49 »
That very document by ASPI is not much of an advertisement for their scholarship.

From beginning to end there's barely a single, easily-ascertained fact they got right.

Easiest example regards ATC: they maintain that the LHDs can't do STOVL ATC.

Um......if you can do helo ATC, then you can do STOVL ATC.

If they mean fighter controllers, they'll be in the Hobart destroyers and Wedgetail AWACS.

Further, the LHDs can actually accommodate embarked fighter controllers if so desired.

As for reduced helo a/c if F-35s are embarked, doing as the USN/MC do with the Wasps do - as in all day, every day, as I write this - with permanent deck parking rotations and only one hangar bay optimised for fast air rather disproves this this nonsense.

That pair really, really, have zero primary knowledge of this, and would have been well served by consulting some UK and US sources before sharing their learned conclusions with the rest of us.

Ho hum.

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #40 on: November 18, 2014, 11:30:47 »
Easiest example regards ATC: they maintain that the LHDs can't do STOVL ATC.

Um......if you can do helo ATC, then you can do STOVL ATC.

Quite true. However, one of the discussion I have not seen is wether or not the Canberra's deck is rated for the F-35B.

In theory, of course, if your deck can take a heavy helicopter, it'll take the weight of an F-35B. However, just like a clearing in the woods, the deck must have the "heat resistance" for an F-35B. Here is the analogy: I can land an helicopter in a clearing that is full of dry wood chips and grass. It does not matter. That same clearing will be set on fire by an F-35 doing a vertical landing, though, because you are exhausting the gas turbines straight down onto the clearing from 5 feet above. Same goes for the decks of LHD/A's. They have to have a heat rating sufficient to "absorb" the heat generated by the F-35B's gas turbines without degrading or transmitting that heat to the compartment just below. Not all ships rated for helos are capable of this. I don't know where the Canberra's stand on that point.

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #41 on: November 18, 2014, 11:52:23 »
A good point.  :)

Yes, the LHDs, as delivered, have flight decks rated for STOVL heat and loads. None of the fast jet spaces or engineering were changed from the Spanish lead ship, which was specifically designed for F-35 ops.

Also, sometime after FOC is achieved, about two years from now, Thermion is more-or-less already approved to replace extant flight deck surfacing.

Apart from helping with heat effects, it's also very, very low maintenance: current coatings require much patching.

Neither the USN/MC or RN consider the F-35B deck heat matter to be much of an issue.

And yes, I know there are lots of reports out there - especially with Bill Sweetman's name attached - that claim doom and gloom and melting decks.

To that I say.........yeah, well, everyone's entitled to their opinions.  :P

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #42 on: November 18, 2014, 14:08:55 »
I didn't have any worries about melting the deck, but rather for the maintenance requirements from the "abuse"  compared to helos, and for the transmission of heat under.

I had no worries about the US and the Brits: The American ships decks can almost be considered armoured and the Brits, well they are building aircraft carrier specifically for F-35B's, so I would imagine its all been taken care of.

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #43 on: November 25, 2014, 13:32:55 »
I've sent off your question to a friend with better specific knowledge of that, and await a reply.  :)

A rather lethal riposte to much of the recent published rubbish just went up on the Aust Naval Institute site. Mucho grande fun reading, here  -  http://navalinstitute.com.au/f-35-strike-fighters-from-the-canberra-class/

Kirkhill, I'll happily buy the beer when we stumble into the same pub at the same time.  :nod:

NB: Linked edited to correct.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2014, 15:24:27 by OTR1 »

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #44 on: November 25, 2014, 13:46:53 »
OTR1, your link is broken.

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #45 on: November 25, 2014, 14:29:55 »
Privateer, go to the link.

When the error message occurs, go on "Archive" at the top.

Then, select "F-35 for the Canberra's?" in the "recent articles" section on the right. It is currently the number one article.

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Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #47 on: November 25, 2014, 15:23:32 »
Colin, yup, they're doing intensive media/PR stuff for the next few days. Most of the ship's brass are getting hoarse from answering the same questions, over and over.......

Privateer, thanks for the SNAFU advice. Not sure what happened, but am attaching a PDF of the article here.  :)

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #48 on: November 25, 2014, 17:31:11 »
It would be interesting if the US were to subsidize ships like this to be operated by Allied navies, have the aviation side completely compatible with US comms and procedures and the hangers and deck capable of handling the F35C. The US could bounce around a squadron of aircraft that could land and operate off of the ship in joint operations. The agreements and ROE’s would be harder to write than the operation side I suspect, but certainly a way to increase western power projection and spreading that responsibility around a bit more.

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Years ago, fairy tales all began with, "Once upon a time." Now we know they all began with, "If I'm elected."

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #50 on: November 25, 2014, 19:40:14 »
It would be interesting if the US were to subsidize ships like this to be operated by Allied navies, have the aviation side completely compatible with US comms and procedures and the hangers and deck capable of handling the F35C. The US could bounce around a squadron of aircraft that could land and operate off of the ship in joint operations. The agreements and ROE’s would be harder to write than the operation side I suspect, but certainly a way to increase western power projection and spreading that responsibility around a bit more.

That is exactly how the "ancestor" of the Canberra came to life: The US Navy developed, in the late 60's/early 70's the concept of the "sea-control" carrier, which they sold (as the sole customer who bought the idea) to Spain. It became the Principe de Astoria small aircraft carrier, which in turn was used by the Spaniards to develop their Juan Carlos LHD. The original American idea was that these small carrier would be bought in numbers by their NATO partners and would become effective escort centerpieces using a combination of helicopters and Harrier jump jets. The British and the Italians preferred to develop their own.
 

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #51 on: November 28, 2014, 11:56:41 »
CO Canberra is indeed a former Canadian naval chap.

Pic attached of the man himself, Captain Jonathan Sadleir, receiving Governor-General Sir Peter Cosgrove for the commissioning ceremony of HMAS Canberra at Fleet Base East, Sydney, on November 28.

Two other pics of the ceremony also attached.

All pics ADF official.


Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #52 on: November 30, 2014, 14:25:10 »
A better than average TV news report from the ABC has the Great Man Himself speaking from the flight deck.  8)

Here  -  http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-26/nuship-canberra-ready-to-enter-navy-fleet/5920668

The helo sequence at the end of was the first deck landing on the ship. Later, a Romeo also landed, and both were displayed in the hangar for the festivities.

I say "better than average" at top because one report in allegedly upscale media said, and I quote, "So, scurvy must be a problem in a ship this big?" and "Can you land a Cessna on this?" and "What's a Chinook?" and so on. I am not making this up.  >:(

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #53 on: November 30, 2014, 14:36:39 »
What I found very interesting (and what may have already been mentioned here but I'm not going to go back and look for it) is that her Captain is Canadian (well duel Aus and Can citizen) who originally started out with the RCN. 

https://www.navy.gov.au/biography/captain-jonathan-sadleir

If it's a repeat, sorry.  Well, not really but...

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #54 on: December 02, 2014, 12:45:26 »
Capt. Sadleir speaks during the ceremony in this short vid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qM29ZhqwIuY

Offline S.M.A.

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AH1Z attack helo pitched by Bell for Australia's LHDs
« Reply #55 on: February 25, 2015, 11:00:26 »
AH1Z Cobras/Vipers as another part of the LHDs' air wings?

Avalon 2015: Bell touts AH-1Z as maritime attack platform for Australia

 IHS Jane's 360

Quote
Bob Carrese, regional vice-president for Asia-Pacific, said while there is no formal Australian requirement, Bell Helicopter is briefing the ADF on the Viper's capabilities ahead of an expected decision on whether to upgrade its Airbus Helicopters Tigers to a maritime configuration.

<snipped>

While the Australian Army does currently field 22 Tiger helicopters, a decision is expected to be made under Phase 3 of the Project AIR 87 Tiger Armed Reconnaissance Helicopter (ARH) procurement programme on whether to upgrade these helicopters to be able to operate from the decks of the Royal Australian Navy's (RAN's) two Canberra-class LHDs (HMAS Canberra was recently commissioned, while the future HMAS Adelaide is currently under construction in Spain).

According to Carrese, the case for opting against upgrading the Tiger and instead procuring the AH-1Z is centred around the latter having been designed from the outset to be operated in a maritime environment.


A model of the Bell AH-1Z Viper attack helicopter in an ADF-life camouflage colour scheme being displayed at the Avalon Airshow 2015. Source: IHS/Gareth Jennings
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Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #56 on: March 14, 2015, 20:40:24 »
Above article is interesting, but was no more than some noise and light by Bell at Avalon. Extraordinarily unlikely to appear on any Oz DoD shopping list anytime soon.

Pic attached of initial underway helo trials in HMAS Canberra.

Embarked are one MRH-90 and one Seahawk, doing their thing around Jervis Bay, south of Sydney. From there it's to Townsville, not that far from Dimsum's recent AO.

So far so good, but there's a mother of a tropical cyclone with a most infelicitous bearing not many horizons away.

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #57 on: April 14, 2015, 14:22:28 »
OTR1:  Do you know if the wings fold on the Army helicopters?

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #58 on: April 14, 2015, 17:10:34 »
Manual fold, alas.

I don't envy the flight deck crew fiddling with them in any sort of sea state.

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #59 on: April 15, 2015, 09:05:39 »
Thanks for the info.

Well, it will let the Army/Air Force (I don't know which one operates your army helicopters) ground personnel learn the hard way why aircraft carriers are a most dangerous work environment.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2015, 09:39:23 by Oldgateboatdriver »

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #60 on: April 15, 2015, 14:20:05 »
Navy has six MRHs, Army the remaining 41.

Navy only uses them for Vertrep, Pedro, admiral's taxi, et al, and they're fine for that.

As for Army, they'd quite happily use them as fuel for the biggest bonfire in Oz history.

They are not and never will be the tac battle cabs that Army needs, no matter what fixes they get over the next few years.

Spec Ops guys have successfully got the ear of the PM, and it seems that (Blackhawk) Mikes could be ordered for them, much sooner rather than later.

Please note that there is not - I say again, not - a sole satisfied customer of the NH/MRH-90, and all for the same reasons.

The French must have awesome sales and PR staff.

BTW - HMAS Canberra is now heading south, chasing cold weather and oomphy sea states south of Tasmania. Interesting flying ahead, and I hope they stowed plenty of Dramamine.  ;) Pic attached of initial night flying trials, courtesy of Lt Cdr Paul Moggach.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2015, 16:11:44 by OTR1 »

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #61 on: May 27, 2015, 15:46:16 »
Helo on late finals during recent trials.

Bonus fun fact.....the Seahawk on deck has a nifty Star Wars stormtrooper motif, and a stuffed Yoda frequently scored a ride, overseeing pilot and self-loading luggage from a perch on the control panel.  8)

Offline S.M.A.

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RAN cancels order for F-35B fighters for Canberra class LHDs
« Reply #62 on: August 01, 2015, 00:48:03 »
A belated post from earlier in July: It seems the Canberra class LHDs won't be carrying these anytime soon:

Defencetech.org

Quote
Australian Navy Cancels Order for the F-35B Joint Strike Fighter
by KRIS OSBORN on JULY 10, 2015

F35 Sea TrialsThe Australian military has decided to cancel plans to purchase F-35B Joint Strike Fighter short-take-off-and-vertical landing aircraft and place 12 of the aircraft on two of their larger assault ships, citing the challenges of needing to rework the ships to accommodate the plane, according to published reports.

“Prime Minister Tony Abbott’s proposal to put F-35 fighter jets on the Navy’s two 27,000-tonne troop transport assault ships has been quietly dropped,” writes The Australian Financial Review.

The two assault ships, which are the largest in the Australian Navy, would need a massive amount of modifications in order to host the F-35B, the report said.

(...SNIPPED)

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #63 on: August 01, 2015, 11:30:27 »
How credible are the ASPI's analyses in Canberra's political/defence circles?

Diplomat

Quote
Australia Lacks Expertise to Deploy World-Class Amphibious Warfare Capability

A new study by a leading Australian think tank urges reforms


L1001025
By Franz-Stefan Gady
August 01, 2015

As the Royal Australian Navy (RAN) is preparing to commission its second Canberra-class landing helicopter dock (LHD) HMAS Adelaide — at 27,800 tons, the RAN’s largest-ever ship class — by the end of 2015, a new study by the Australian Strategic Policy Institute (ASPI) finds critical gaps in Australia’s amphibious warfare capabilities.

“Australia’s position in the world makes the effort a strategic imperative, but the ADF still has a long way to go and many critical decisions ahead if it’s to develop an amphibious warfare capability that’s ready for future challenges,” the paper notes.

The first ship of the new class, the HMAS Canberra, was commissioned nine months ago. The ship can carry up to 1,046 troops and their equipment, around 110 vehicles and between eight to 18 helicopters that can airlift 220 soldiers at a time.

(...SNIPPED)
Our Country
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Offline S.M.A.

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HMAS Canberra tests out amphibious landing capability in EX SEA RAIDER
« Reply #64 on: October 07, 2015, 08:37:49 »
And speaking of amphibious capabilities:

Asian Defence News blog

Quote
SEPTEMBER 27, 2015
Australian Defence Forces Test Latest Amphibious Capability of HMAS Canberra

The Australian Defence Force is testing its newest amphibious capability ahead of the upcoming cyclone season. Exercise SEA RAIDER in Far North Queensland involves some 1400 troops embarked in HMAS Canberra with medium lift helicopters, landing craft and small boats, trucks, troop carriers and other vehicles.

Conducted by the Brisbane based Deployable Joint Force Headquarters, under command of Major General Stuart Smith, Exercise SEA RAIDER is supported by HMAS Stuart, Air Force assets and Commando forces as well as other Government agencies.


The ADF works closely with the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade as the lead agency for Australian Government responses to overseas emergencies. MAJGEN Smith said inter-agency exercises were designed to help the ADF and DFAT work together efficiently and cooperatively in a crisis.“This amphibious force has been tested in scenarios that reflect tasks the Australian Government may direct in response to local and regional emergencies,” he said.
Commander of the Amphibious Task Force, Captain Jay Bannister RAN, stressed the importance of Exercise SEA RAIDER.

(...SNIPPED)
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2nd RAN LHD HMA/ Adelaide commissioned today!
« Reply #65 on: December 04, 2015, 17:57:04 »
The RAN's 2nd LHD HMAS Adelaide is about to be commissioned today!

News.Navy.gov.Au

Quote
NUSHIP Adelaide prepares for commissioning

Published on 02 December 2015 Ms Natalie Staples (author), LSIS Peter Thompson (photographer)

Location(s): Sydney

Dress rehearsals have started for the commissioning of NUSHIP Adelaide this Friday, as the second Landing Helicopter Dock (LHD) prepares to enter service with the Royal Australian Navy.
 
The 400 crew members of the Amphibious Assault Ship are readying themselves for the historic occasion.
 
Leading Seaman Electronics Technician Hamish Donaldson, whose primary role involves looking after Adelaide’s radars and navigation equipment, will be part of the guard and says he is looking forward to commissioning the ship.
 
“It’s a pretty big honour, I was part of HMAS Betano’s decommissioning crew, but this is the first one I’ve commissioned. It’ll be good to get up there,” Leading Seaman Donaldson said.
 
“Moving from a Landing Craft Heavy (LCH) to a LHD has been pretty interesting. The smaller ships are a little less formal than the majors, but I’m part of a great department. The whole crew is pretty amazing so I’m really happy.”

(...SNIPPED)

« Last Edit: December 04, 2015, 18:02:14 by S.M.A. »
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2nd RAN LHD HMAS Adelaide commissions!
« Reply #66 on: December 04, 2015, 18:21:37 »
And the RAN's 2nd LHD enters service!

news.Navy.gov.au

Quote
HMAS Adelaide enters service

Published on 04 December 2015 Ms Natalie Staples (author), LSIS Nina Fogliani (photographer)

Location(s): Fleet Base East

Members of the ship's company of HMAS Adelaide raise the Australian White Ensign up the ship's mast for the first time, during the Landing Helicopter Dock's Commisioning ceremony.
HMAS Adelaide, the second of two Landing Helicopter Docks (LHDs) built for the Royal Australian Navy, was commissioned into the Fleet today, alongside Garden Island, Sydney.

The Governor-General, His Excellency General the Honourable Sir Peter Cosgrove, together with the Minister for Defence, Senator the Honourable Marise Payne, and Chief of Navy, Vice Admiral Tim Barrett, attended the traditional ceremony held on Adelaide's aircraft hangar deck.

Around 1,000 guests made up of family, industry and government representatives from Australia and Spain watched the proud Commissioning crew of Navy, Army and Air Force members march onboard and saw the Australian White Ensign being raised for the first time, signifying Adelaide's entry into naval service.

Our Country
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"A leader is best when people barely know he exists, when his work is done, his aim fulfilled, they will say: We did it ourselves."   - Lao Zi (老子)
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"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm."
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Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #67 on: December 12, 2015, 17:32:52 »
Motion picture of the festivities, avec Oz's new and generously girthed defence minister.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6w1y1GdSx_I

She departed Sydney a few days after the commissioning, doing shakedown stuff, and whatnot.


Offline S.M.A.

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Australia sends LHD to Fiji for typhoon relief efforts
« Reply #68 on: February 24, 2016, 19:40:47 »
Australia sends an LHD to help in Fiji's typhoon relief efforts:

AustralianDefence.com.au

Quote
Operation Fiji Assist widens - LHD deployed 24 Feb 2016

"In the aftermath of Tropical Cyclone Winston which struck the islands of Fiji last weekend Australia has contributed significant Defence assets and personnel to Operation Fiji Assist, with the Minister for Defence confirming that the LHD HMAS Canberra would be despatched to arrive in the disaster zone by March 1....

..."Yesterday the Government of Fiji requested the deployment of HMAS Canberra to assist in the relief operation and the ADF is undertaking some 'quite detailed preparations' to deploy [the ship] and she is anticipated to arrive on or around 1 March – it is worthy to note that there is a cyclone of varying [strength] between us and Fiji still, so that is a detailed process.

"This will be the first deployment of HMAS Canberra in a humanitarian and disaster relief (HADR) operation overseas. Secondly, a P-3C Orion surveillance aircraft has also been tasked to assist in the damage assessment - I also refer to the work of the NZDF and one of their Orions earlier in the week," Minister Payne said in response to questions in the Senate.   

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Offline S.M.A.

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Chinooks on HMAS Canberra
« Reply #69 on: May 31, 2016, 17:10:34 »
Chinooks on LHDs:

Navy Recognition

Quote
Royal Australian Navy LHD HMAS Canberra in Deck and Handling Trials with Chinook Helicopters
 
Amphibious ship, HMAS Canberra has conducted deck and handling trials with two Chinook helicopters alongside in Sydney recently. The aircraft, from the 5th Aviation Regiment, based in Townsville will go on to conduct first of class flight trials with Canberra's sister ship, HMAS Adelaide.

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"A leader is best when people barely know he exists, when his work is done, his aim fulfilled, they will say: We did it ourselves."   - Lao Zi (老子)
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Offline S.M.A.

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #70 on: June 24, 2016, 12:15:14 »
Australia's 2nd LHD working up:

Naval Techology

Quote
Australian Navy’s HMAS Adelaide participates in tri-service exercise Sea Explorer

The Royal Australian Navy's (RAN) second Canberra-class landing helicopter dock (LHD) ship HMAS Adelaide has participated in the tri-service exercise, Sea Explorer, off the North Queensland coast. An additional 800 personnel besides its crew, including Townsville-based 2nd Battalion, the Royal Australian Regiment and Royal Australian Air Force elements were embarked on the ship.

Amphibious Task Group commander captain Brett Sonter said Adelaide undertook several concurrent activities as part of Sea Explorer. Sonter said: "As part of the exercise, the ship is being assessed against operational capability requirements."

Our Country
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"A leader is best when people barely know he exists, when his work is done, his aim fulfilled, they will say: We did it ourselves."   - Lao Zi (老子)
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"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm."
- Winston Churchill

Offline OTR1

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #71 on: July 15, 2016, 17:56:15 »
Playtime with a USMC Osprey at Rimpac.

https://youtu.be/ZvBdVofqA2c

First non-Oz crossdecker was an RNZN Sea Sprite, about three weeks ago.

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Re: Australia's Canberra class LHDs/assault carriers
« Reply #72 on: July 30, 2016, 15:25:16 »
USN LCACs dock with HMAS Canberra:

Navy Daily (RAN Official Newsfeed)

Quote
US Navy LCAC docks successfully with HMAS Canberra


HMAS Canberra has successfully received a United States Navy Landing Craft, Air Cushion (LCAC) within its internal well dock, marking a world-first for the class of ship.

The docking is the first for Spanish designed Navantia Juan Carlos I-class multi-purpose amphibious ships and the Royal Australian Navy.

The US Navy LCAC is a high speed, "over the beach" fully amphibious landing craft (or hovercraft) capable of carrying up to 75 tonnes of cargo at speeds of over 40 knots.

It is used to transport United States Marine Corps personnel and equipment from ship to shore and across the beach in either amphibious assault or humanitarian and disaster relief operations.

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Our Country
--------------------------------
"A leader is best when people barely know he exists, when his work is done, his aim fulfilled, they will say: We did it ourselves."   - Lao Zi (老子)
-------------------------------------------
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm."
- Winston Churchill