Our North - SSE Policy Update Megathread

[Cloud Cover]

CFAD Angus is a bit of a deterrent.

Sounds perfect for Carney Condos. Everything blows up on him anyway.

 

[FJAG]

Been tried over and over, a school is the net result.

Old timer story alert.

There used to be a lovely service detention barracks in Borden with a central core and five, star-shaped wings. When they concentrated prison services in Edmonton, the Borden barracks became surplus and were, for quite a few years, used as temporary quarters for Militia units and personnel coming up from Toronto and the surrounding areas to do exercises or courses.

I've just did a quick Google maps view of the area and I see it has gone the divestment route. Whenever something requires maintenance but doesn't have a full-time (read RegF) use, it tends to disappear.

What is this school of which you speak?

 

[Blackadder1916]

Old timer story alert.

There used to be a lovely service detention barracks in Borden with a central core and five, star-shaped wings. . . .

Old timer response. By the mid-70s (after 14 CFSPDB opened in Edmonton) those in custody were held in cells at the guardhouse down at the Alliston gate for short sentences or until they were escorted to Edmonton. And no, I didn't do time in cells there, though I did escort a detainee.

This was the old Borden DB.

 

[FJAG]

Old timer response. By the mid-70s (after 14 CFSPDB opened in Edmonton) those in custody were held in cells at the guardhouse down at the Alliston gate for short sentences or until they were escorted to Edmonton. And no, I didn't do time in cells there, though I did escort a detainee.

This was the old Borden DB.

View attachment 95079

I think that's a war time pic. I believe it was improved afterwards.

 

[ytz]

I'm not suggesting picking any point in the US. I was trying to understand why North Bay was picked for the location of an 'Arctic' related radar base. I'm aware that its an existing CAF base but as noted, its no where near the north in Canada. Choosing Hearst or Kapuskasing or Cochrane, all aside a major hwy, are further north than North Bay.

Because OTH radars don't actually need to be in the Arctic. And basic logistics like accessibility for maintenance, being able to train technicians and operators on it, etc. also matter. North Bay is not just any CAF base in this context. It's the home of the RCAF's Aerospace Surveillance enterprise. The primary unit using the radar will be there. So if it was feasible to co-locate, it was always going to be high on the list. North Bay is also high on the list for a lot of space infrastructure. For similar reasons.

And likewise, Borden actually makes these lists, just because of relative proximity to North Bay, while having sites under DND control.

 

[ytz]

Dispersion maybe? It might seem more logical to put NORAD assets near CFB Winnipeg where the Canadian headquarters is but maybe they wanted to move some stuff around for targeting purposes?

Realistically though, some MP needed more jobs in their riding.

There's politics. But they actually do substantial siting studies for these. Interference and issues with population proximity really matter on these things.

 

[ueo]

Old timer story alert.

There used to be a lovely service detention barracks in Borden with a central core and five, star-shaped wings. When they concentrated prison services in Edmonton, the Borden barracks became surplus and were, for quite a few years, used as temporary quarters for Militia units and personnel coming up from Toronto and the surrounding areas to do exercises or courses.

I've just did a quick Google maps view of the area and I see it has gone the divestment route. Whenever something requires maintenance but doesn't have a full-time (read RegF) use, it tends to disappear.

What is this school of which you speak?

All techies!

 

[Kirkhill]

Because OTH radars don't actually need to be in the Arctic. And basic logistics like accessibility for maintenance, being able to train technicians and operators on it, etc. also matter. North Bay is not just any CAF base in this context. It's the home of the RCAF's Aerospace Surveillance enterprise. The primary unit using the radar will be there. So if it was feasible to co-locate, it was always going to be high on the list. North Bay is also high on the list for a lot of space infrastructure. For similar reasons.

And likewise, Borden actually makes these lists, just because of relative proximity to North Bay, while having sites under DND control.

IIRC there was a previous OTH Backscatter effort on the East Coast a couple of decades back that was shut down due to radio interference.

 

[PrairieFella]

Old timer story alert.

There used to be a lovely service detention barracks in Borden with a central core and five, star-shaped wings. When they concentrated prison services in Edmonton, the Borden barracks became surplus and were, for quite a few years, used as temporary quarters for Militia units and personnel coming up from Toronto and the surrounding areas to do exercises or courses.

I've just did a quick Google maps view of the area and I see it has gone the divestment route. Whenever something requires maintenance but doesn't have a full-time (read RegF) use, it tends to disappear.

What is this school of which you speak?

You can say something similar about Kapyong. The reservists in Winnipeg desperately need new infrastructure, the SE block with the railhead would have been perfect for a new reserve super-armoury, all units in one spot. Wasn't meant to be.

 

[FJAG]

You can say something similar about Kapyong. The reservists in Winnipeg desperately need new infrastructure, the SE block with the railhead would have been perfect for a new reserve super-armoury, all units in one spot. Wasn't meant to be.

Yeah. I was in Brandon in those days but had been in Winnipeg for 6 years in the early 80s. Minto and MacGregor are barely adequate for parading and terrible for vehicle storage. One of the problems is that with 2 PPCLI leaving in 2004, infrastructure maintenance would continue to fall on the RCAF who are never happy to look after army reserve properties. So divest, divest, divest. The first attempt to sell the land ran into problems from the Treaty One folks. That delayed demolition and a new agreement for quite some time. Not sure where things stand now. Recent air photos show the demolition complete but the land bare.

 

[PrairieFella]

Yeah. I was in Brandon in those days but had been in Winnipeg for 6 years in the early 80s. Minto and MacGregor are barely adequate for parading and terrible for vehicle storage. One of the problems is that with 2 PPCLI leaving in 2004, infrastructure maintenance would continue to fall on the RCAF who are never happy to look after army reserve properties. So divest, divest, divest. The first attempt to sell the land ran into problems from the Treaty One folks. That delayed demolition and a new agreement for quite some time. Not sure where things stand now. Recent air photos show the demolition complete but the land bare.

Its to be developed in its entirety as Naawi-Oodena, a Treaty 1 urban reserve. No land has been held by the CAF. We didn't even need the whole thing, just one of the small blocks on the other side of route 90. Oh well.

McGregor (now Harcus Strachan V.C. M.C.) is...adequate, especially with the new hangar but growth of either 38 CER or FGH will be tough to accommodate with the current layout. There are also only 4 large sheltered vehicle bays and between the two units establishment, ideally there are probably supposed to be 30ish-40 vehicles. Thats a problem, especially if the gwagon replacement is armoured.

Minto should have been divested after the fire in the 70s. It is in rough shape and completely inadequate.

 

[Rifleman62]

There used to be a lovely service detention barracks in Borden...

Housed in the bldg. several times. There was a CF 100 parked nearby surrounded by a frost fence. Story told it was exposed to radiation.

The Minto Armoury fire was 1956.

The drill floor at Minto still has a very big plywood hole cover I believe. Beem like that for years.